Welcome to the CMO Chapter Podcast, where we dive deep into the dynamic world of Chief Marketing Officers. Join us as we explore the careers, insights, and strategies of top marketing executives who shape the brands we know and love. Whether you're a seasoned marketer, aspiring CMO, or simply curious about what it takes to step into the shows of a CMO. This podcast is your backstage pass to discovering what it’s like to lead and innovate in the ever-evolving landscape of business and consumer engagement.
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This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!
https://www.newchaptertalent.com.au/contact-us
lucy@newchaptertalent.com.au
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From Scrappy Scale-Up to Global Growth: Leadership, EQ & Marketing That Actually Matters with Penny Elmslie
Season 3 · Episode 5
Monday, June 15, 2026 • Duration 42:24
In this episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Penny Elmslie, CMO of Affinda and former Global GM Brand at Xero, for a refreshingly honest conversation about what marketing really looks like behind the scenes.
From starting her career in media sales to helping scale Xero from a little-known challenger brand to a global powerhouse, Penny shares the realities of building marketing functions from scratch, navigating hyper-growth, and leading through constant change.
This is a grounded, practical conversation that cuts through the fluff. Penny unpacks the difference between “doing marketing” and driving real business impact, why EQ is fast becoming a leader’s greatest advantage, and how marketers can stay relevant in a world that’s shifting faster than ever.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:
Why marketing is more commercial than most people realise: Penny breaks down the myth that marketing is just creativity and campaigns. At its core, it’s about clarity, execution and driving measurable business outcomes.
The reality of scaling a brand like Xero: From launching campaigns with zero assets to building global playbooks, Penny shares what it actually takes to grow from scrappy startup to international scale.
How to balance bold ideas with business priorities: Not every good idea should live forever. Penny talks about knowing when to push, when to pause, and when to let go.
Why vanity metrics are holding marketers back: A clear take on why impressions and clicks don’t cut it, and what leaders should really be measuring instead.
The role of EQ in modern leadership: In a world full of smart people, emotional intelligence is what sets great leaders apart. Penny explains how understanding people drives better outcomes across teams, stakeholders and customers.
What actually matters for aspiring marketing leaders: From finding your strengths to building the right environment around you, this is practical advice for anyone looking to step up into leadership.
Key Themes & Insights:
Marketing = business impact, not activity: The best marketers connect everything they do back to commercial outcomes. If it doesn’t move the business forward, it’s noise.
We’re all just marketing to humans: B2B, B2C… it doesn’t matter. Strip it back and you’re speaking to people with emotions, pressures and motivations. That’s where the real connection happens.
Timing matters more than the idea: There’s rarely a “bad” idea, but there is bad timing. Knowing when to execute is where experience really shows.
Your environment shapes your career: Finding “your people” can be the difference between surviving in a role and genuinely thriving in it.
Careers aren’t linear, and that’s the point: Penny’s journey is a reminder that progression isn’t about titles. It’s about impact, growth and putting yourself in the right rooms.
This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!
(00:53) Penny’s career chapter in AI and tech marketing
(01:45) From media sales to marketing
(03:00) What marketing really turned out to be
(05:09) Joining Xero before anyone knew the brand
(07:15) Building from scratch vs scaling globally
(10:46) Finding the next scale-up chapter
(14:01) Lessons from failures and knowing when to let go
(17:42) Marketing to humans, not job titles
(19:59) Ambition, influence and becoming a CMO
(24:14) What separates a good CMO from a stellar CMO
(28:04) Career advice, networks and the leadership skill that always matters
Purpose, People & Progress: Leading Modern Marketing with Libby Hodgson
Season 3 · Episode 4
Monday, June 1, 2026 • Duration 37:01
In this episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Libby Hodgson, Chief Marketing Officer at UNICEF Australia, for a thoughtful and refreshingly honest conversation about what modern marketing leadership really looks like.
Libby shares her non-linear career journey across financial services, the UK, and purpose-led organisations, and reflects on the moments that shaped her leadership style. From navigating workplace conflict to building confidence over time, this is a grounded look at what it actually takes to grow into a CMO role.
The conversation also dives into one of the biggest shifts facing marketers today, the rise of AI. Libby unpacks how UNICEF has approached adoption in a practical, human-first way, and why culture, not just tools, determines success.
A must-listen for marketers at every stage, especially those thinking about leadership, relevance, and how to build a career that lasts.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:
Why career paths aren’t always planned: Libby reflects on how her early career wasn’t mapped out for leadership, and how stepping outside the “expected path” helped shape her trajectory.
The reality of leadership and conflict: One of the biggest lessons in her career has been learning to sit with discomfort, manage conflict, and lead through ambiguity.
The skills marketers need at different stages: From execution and delivery early on, to strategy, financial literacy, and people leadership at senior levels, the skillset evolves more than most expect.
How AI is actually being implemented in marketing teams: A practical look at how to introduce AI without overwhelming teams, starting with guardrails, empowering individuals, and focusing on real business problems.
Why soft skills are becoming the differentiator: As AI accelerates capability, it’s emotional intelligence, curiosity, and critical thinking that will set marketers apart.
Specialist vs generalist – what really works: Early specialisation can accelerate growth, but long-term leadership requires breadth, adaptability, and a willingness to step into the unknown.
Curiosity, Commercial Thinking & Growing Your Bubble with Mohit Bhargava
Season 3 · Episode 3
Monday, May 18, 2026 • Duration 38:39
In this episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Mohit (Mo) Bhargava, a seasoned marketing leader with over 20 years’ experience across media, entertainment and global markets.
From an unexpected start behind a university bar to leading marketing across Southeast Asia, Mo shares a career shaped by curiosity, relationships and a willingness to step into the unknown.
This is a refreshingly honest conversation about what the CMO role really looks like, how careers actually unfold (hint: not in a straight line), and why the best marketers today blend creativity with commercial thinking.
Mo also opens up on the harder side of leadership, what he looks for when hiring, and why “growing your bubble” might be the most important career advice you’ll hear this year.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:
Why the CMO role isn’t what you think: No two marketing leadership roles look the same. The expectations, remit and impact of marketing change dramatically depending on the business.
How curiosity can shape your entire career: Mo’s first role came from a conversation at a bar. A simple reminder that how you show up outside the job description often matters more than what’s on your CV.
The reality of leadership (beyond the title): Leadership isn’t a promotion, it’s a skill built over time. And often, the hardest parts of the role have very little to do with marketing.
What great hiring really comes down to: It’s not just about capability. It’s about chemistry, self-awareness and whether someone’s style fits the role marketing plays in that business.
Why soft skills are becoming the differentiator: Technical skills get you in the room. How you think, communicate and collaborate is what sets you apart.
How to stay relevant in the age of AI: AI can improve speed and efficiency, but creativity still needs human energy. The best marketers will know how to balance both.
The importance of commercial thinking: If you’ve never had to sell something, you’re missing a key piece of the puzzle. Understanding revenue changes how you approach marketing.
From Execution to Strategy: Building Influence, Community & Modern Marketing Leadership with Jarrod Purchase
Season 3 · Episode 2
Monday, May 4, 2026 • Duration 32:47
In this episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Jarrod Purchase, a seasoned marketing leader with over 17 years’ experience spanning startups, scale-ups and global brands.
Jarrod shares his journey from hands-on email marketer to CMO, and why working closely with founders shaped the way he thinks about marketing, leadership and impact. He also opens up about building Club CMO Australia, the realities of today’s job market, and how AI is quietly reshaping teams, roles and expectations.
This is a grounded, honest conversation about what marketing really looks like behind the scenes. Less theory, more reality.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:
Why the best marketers balance creativity and commercial thinking It’s not just about great campaigns. The ability to connect activity to outcomes is what earns trust and influence.
How working with founders changes your perspective Closer to decisions, faster pace, less politics. But it also demands adaptability and accountability.
The real value of community at CMO level Why Jarrod built Club CMO Australia and how peer conversations often beat any course or podcast.
What’s actually happening in the marketing job market right now Fewer roles at the top, pressure at the bottom, and a growing shift towards fractional and flexible leadership.
How AI is changing team structures (without the hype) Not a wipeout of roles, but a shift in how teams are built, where senior thinking matters more and execution becomes leaner.
Why personal brand is often a byproduct, not a strategy Focus on connecting people and adding value. The rest tends to follow.
The biggest career mistakes marketers make Not trusting your gut on roles, and not properly assessing whether a business truly values marketing.
Key Takeaways:
Marketing is both creative and commercial. You need to be comfortable in both worlds.
The closer you are to decision-makers, the more impact you can have.
Community and peer learning become critical as you step into senior roles.
Storytelling That Sticks: Influence, Trust & Standing Out in a Noisy World with Gabrielle Dolan
Season 3 · Episode 1
Tuesday, April 21, 2026 • Duration 40:43
In the Season 3 opener of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with storytelling expert Gabrielle “Ral” Dolan for a refreshingly honest conversation about why storytelling isn’t just a “nice to have” - it’s a core leadership skill.
From leaving corporate to build a business around storytelling (long before it was fashionable), to unpacking how stories drive emotion, trust and decision-making, Ral shares what actually works - and what doesn’t.
They explore how storytelling cuts through in a world of AI and content overload, why most leaders get it wrong, and how marketers, candidates and executives can use simple, human stories to connect, influence and stand out.
If you’ve ever been told to “tell your story” but weren’t quite sure how - this episode makes it feel a whole lot clearer.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:
Why storytelling is one of the most underrated leadership skills
The real reason stories influence decisions (hint: it’s not logic)
How to make your message land - and actually be remembered
The difference between telling a story and just talking for too long
How CMOs can use storytelling to bring values and culture to life
Practical ways to use storytelling in job interviews
Why personal stories often carry more weight than professional ones
How to avoid sounding like everyone else in a world full of AI-generated content
The simple structure that keeps your stories clear, sharp and impactful
Key Takeaways:
Emotion drives decisions - not logic alone
We like to think we’re rational, especially in business. We’re not. Stories tap into emotion, and that’s what people remember and act on.
Stories build credibility in a way words can’t
Anyone can say “I value collaboration” or “customer experience matters.” A story proves it - and that’s what people trust.
Bold Moves, Retail Reinvention & the Power of Resilience with Ryan Gracie
Season 2 · Episode 14
Monday, October 13, 2025 • Duration 36:32
In the Series 2 finale of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Ryan Gracie, Chief Customer & Revenue Officer at BIG W (Woolworths Group), for a candid conversation about bold brand building, customer-led growth, and leading through change.
From agency beginnings to senior retail leadership, Ryan shares the wins, the missteps, and the mindset that’s powered his career—plus why backing yourself and taking calculated risks still matters most.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode
How to make bold, commercial creative that cuts through in retail
Why resilience is a modern C-suite superpower (and how to build it)
Balancing brand, performance and revenue without losing focus
Navigating complex stakeholder environments and earning trust
Lessons from scaling teams through transformation and integration
Practical ways to keep your customer promise front and centre
Resources & Mentions
BIG W – One of Australia’s most iconic retailers.
Case studies from Ryan’s standout marketing and retail campaigns.
Lessons from creative agency beginnings to executive leadership.
Scott Galloway – referenced for his perspectives on business, marketing, and leadership.
Chapters:
(00:00) Introduction to the CMO Chapter Podcast
(00:44) Meet Ryan Gracie: Career Highlights
(03:22) Ryan's Early Life and Education
(04:51) The Drive Behind Success
(07:38) Transitioning Roles: CMO to Chief Customer and Revenue Officer
(10:24) The Future of the CMO Role
(13:39) Balancing Art and Science in Marketing
(15:40) Ryan's Principles for Success
(18:16) Embracing Discomfort for Growth
(18:42) Creating Value in Business
Purpose, Play & Marketing that Matters with Dan Ferguson
Season 2 · Episode 13
Monday, September 29, 2025 • Duration 37:09
In this energising episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Dan Ferguson, ex-Chief Marketing Officer at Adore Beauty, to explore the intersection of purpose, play, and performance in marketing. With a career spanning retail, eCommerce, and digital transformation, Dan shares his candid views on leadership, building teams, and why the best marketing balances commercial outcomes with creativity and fun.
Dan opens up about his own career journey—from working across iconic retail brands to leading marketing at one of Australia’s most loved online beauty destinations. He discusses what it takes to stand out in a crowded category, the role of customer insight in shaping bold brand campaigns, and why empathy, curiosity, and humour are underrated leadership superpowers.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:
Why brand purpose must translate into meaningful action, not just words.
How to create marketing that cuts through in crowded, competitive categories.
The importance of play and creativity in driving team performance.
How to use customer insights as the foundation for bold brand moves.
Why empathy and curiosity are game-changers for leaders.
Lessons from scaling and transforming retail and eCommerce marketing.
Resources & Mentions:
Adore Beauty – Australia’s leading online beauty retailer.
Key retail and eCommerce learnings from Dan’s career journey.
Case studies on customer insight-driven campaigns.
Chapters:
(00:00) Introduction to the CMO Chapter Podcast
(00:44) Meet Dan: A Journey from Psychology to Marketing
(01:52) The Sliding Doors Moment: Choosing Marketing Over Psychology
(04:07) The Role of Psychology in Marketing
(06:34) The Impact of AI on Marketing
(13:53) Dan's Career Journey and Ambitions
(15:21) Leading Adore Beauty: Challenges and Successes
(19:03) Defining a Vision and Achievements
Non-Linear Careers, Resilience & Authentic Leadership with Stacey Maher
Season 2 · Episode 12
Monday, September 15, 2025 • Duration 32:31
In this episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Stacey Maher, a Melbourne-based marketing and business leader whose career has been anything but traditional.
From discovering marketing while living overseas to stepping into senior leadership and general management roles, Stacey has built a career defined by curiosity, resilience, and authenticity.
She shares candid reflections on navigating non-linear career paths, the value of saying "yes" to unexpected opportunities, and the importance of balancing strategy with execution.
Stacey also opens up about her leadership philosophy, the role of resilience in long-term success, and why being authentic and vulnerable as a leader creates stronger, high-performing teams.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:
Why a non-linear career path can be an asset, not a setback.
How overseas experiences can shape independence, resilience, and career direction.
The importance of understanding both the official and unofficial org charts.
Why balancing strategy and execution is key to effective leadership.
The role of curiosity, continuous learning, and saying "yes" to new opportunities.
How vulnerability and authenticity strengthen teams and leadership impact.
Themes and Advice:
Insights from Stacey’s global career experiences.
Reflections on navigating digital, product, and commercial leadership roles.
AI, digital transformation, and evolving leadership skills.
Chapters:
(00:00) Introduction to the CMO Chapter Podcast
(00:44) Meet Stacey Maher: A Non-Linear Career Path
(01:32) Early Career and Discovering Marketing
(04:26) Navigating Career Challenges and Building Resilience
(13:18) The Importance of Strategy and Execution
(16:03) Embracing AI and Future Skills
Transformation, AI & Leading with Purpose with Louise Cummins
Season 2 · Episode 11
Monday, September 1, 2025 • Duration 35:37
In this inspiring episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Louise Cummins—Co-Founder of the Australian Centre for AI Marketing and former CMO of World Vision. With over 30 years’ experience across tech, telco, entertainment and not-for-profit, Louise shares her remarkable journey of reinvention, leadership, and driving transformation in fast-changing industries.
From starting out in mathematics and psychology to leading major global marketing teams, Louise offers candid insights on how to embrace disruption, build resilience, and balance creativity with commercial impact. She also dives into the evolving role of AI in marketing, and why human-centred leadership and purposeful work matter more than ever.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:
Why diverse career experiences give marketers a unique edge.
How to navigate reinvention and stay relevant in disruptive times.
The role of AI in removing admin and unleashing creative capacity.
The importance of building authentic, supportive professional networks.
How to lead with purpose, resilience, and humility.
Why focusing on the next 90 days is key to growth and adaptability.
Resources & Mentions:
Australian Centre for AI Marketing – Co-founded by Louise.
World Vision – Where Louise led marketing transformation.
Research on AI in marketing and creative productivity.
Chapters:
(00:00) Introduction to the CMO Chapter Podcast
(00:44) Welcoming Louise Cummings
(01:22) Louise's Career Journey
(02:51) Insights on Marketing and Career Transitions
(07:43) Leadership and Innovation at World Vision
(19:05) The Australian Center for AI
(22:54) Advice for Aspiring Marketers
(28:17) Personal Branding and Networking
(32:28) Legacy and Impact
(34:49) Conclusion and Final Thoughts
Portfolio Careers, Personal Branding & Doing Work on Your Terms with Penelope Barr
Season 2 · Episode 10
Monday, July 21, 2025 • Duration 37:23
In this insightful and energising episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan chats with Penelope Barr, portfolio career strategist, executive coach, writer and interim leader across innovation, tech and product.
With a career spanning decades in digital transformation and executive leadership, Penelope now empowers others to design fulfilling portfolio lives that align with their values, energy, and lifestyle.
Together, they dive into what a portfolio career really means, how marketers can diversify their income, and the steps to building your personal brand and community before you need it. Whether you're a CMO navigating uncertainty or a marketer ready to explore more flexibility and purpose, this episode is your blueprint.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:
The difference between fractional, interim and portfolio roles.
How to build a portfolio career while still in full-time work.
Steps to design a “life by seasons” model that fuels you.
The mindset shifts required to build on your strengths and say yes to your own path.
How to create offers, test ideas, and monetise your skills—without a website.
What it takes to thrive financially and emotionally outside the 9-to-5.
Why personal brand and community matter more than ever in a shifting job market.
Resources & Mentions:
Pomodoro Technique – Penelope’s tool of choice for focused, deep work.
Career On Your Terms Program – Penelope’s flagship course for portfolio professionals.
Monetise Fast Weekends – Learn how to go from idea to offer in 48 hours.
LinkedIn – Penelope posts daily on topics from leadership to personal growth.
What makes a great CMO today: Strategic thinking, strong communication, curiosity, resilience, and the ability to connect marketing to real business outcomes.
Resources & Mentions:
UNICEF Australia – Purpose-led organisation focused on protecting children’s rights and wellbeing globally.
AI in Marketing (ACAM) – Practical frameworks around governance, experimentation, and adoption within teams.
This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!
“Grow your bubble”: One of the standout moments of the episode. Broaden your perspective, challenge your environment, and actively seek different experiences. It’s critical for leadership.
Key Takeaways:
Careers are rarely linear. Follow themes, not titles.
Relationships matter, but credibility matters more.
Don’t wait for a leadership role to start leading.
Marketing leaders today need both depth (a “superpower”) and breadth.
Staying close to culture isn’t optional, it’s part of the job.
The best opportunities often come from what you do consistently over time, not one interview moment.
This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!
This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!
This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!
This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!
This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!
This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!
This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!
This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!
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