The Messy Parts – Details, episodes & analysis

Could getting fired be the best thing that ever happened to you? In this deeply personal episode of The Messy Parts, journalist Brooke Baldwin sits down with Maryam to discuss her journey from heartbreak to healing after she was let go from her dream job at CNN. Brooke talks about speaking truth to power, walking through fear, and redefining success on her own terms. The two explore what happens when your identity is tied to your career — and how to rebuild when it all unravels. Whether you’re facing a layoff, a breakup, or a life transition, Brooke’s story will help you remember: sometimes losing it all is how you finally find yourself.

Key Moments:

Trusting Your Gut: When You Know Something’s Off
Brooke shares how that inner “spidey sense” told her something wasn’t right at work—and why we so often ignore it.

Kill Them with Kindnes💄
How politeness and perfectionism can hold women back and the high cost of always saying yes.

When Your Dream Job Stops Feeling Like One 💔
Brooke reflects on how the news industry changed, and how her joy slowly faded at CNN.

Being Sidelined and Staying Silent 🤐
What it feels like to be removed from your own job and how masking pain becomes a survival skill in corporate culture.

Speak Up (Before It’s Too Late) 🗣️
Brooke reveals what she wishes she’d done differently and how to find the courage to speak up with both grace and strength.

Fired but Not Free Yet 🔒
The truth behind her on-air goodbye, the NDA that silenced her, and the emotional toll of pretending everything was fine.

The Charade of the Perfect Life 🎭
Brooke connects her workplace silence to her childhood, where appearances mattered more than truth.

When It All Unravels: Career + Marriage 💥
Two major endings collide, and Brooke learns that sometimes losing everything can be the start of becoming yourself.

Make Your Own Money 💲
Brooke explains how saving money over the years gave her the freedom to bet on herself after she was fired and her marriage fell apart.

Healing at the Hoffman Institute 🌿
A week of deep emotional work helps Brooke find clarity, courage, and connection after loss.

Living Without the Armor ✨
Brooke embraces her natural self, her truth, and the “messy middle”—and reminds us that the mess is life, so we might as well surrender to it.

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Is your biggest mess also your best teacher? Broadway veteran Michael McElroy tells Maryam about his remarkable journey from rejection at Carnegie Mellon to leading Broadway casts and founding the award-winning Broadway Inspirational Voices. He and Maryam explore how to find purpose after burnout, the power of community and service, and what happens when you finally stop waiting for permission to begin. Michael opens up about identity, faith, and the messy truth behind resilience — reminding us that the hardest lessons can help us develop our greatest strengths.

01:30 – 🙏 The Son of a Preacher: Growing Up in a Life of Service
Michael reflects on his Cleveland roots, family faith, and how service shaped his art and leadership.

06:30 – 💔 From Golden Child to Rejection at Carnegie Mellon
Michael shares the painful story of being cut from his college program — and what it taught him about resilience and self-worth.

09:30 – 💪 The Do-Over That Changed Everything
With his mother’s support, Michael fought his way back into the program, learning how to turn pain into purpose.

14:00 – 🔄 Stop Reacting, Start Acting
Michael’s breakthrough moment — learning how to reclaim power by responding with intention, not reaction.

17:30 – 🎭 Teaching Life Through Art
 How Michael teaches young artists resilience, failure, and courage in an age of perfectionism.

19:30 – 💡 Breakthroughs and Busts
As Michael’s star climbs in NYC, he is also reminded how unpredictable the business can be and that he can’t attach his identity or his worth to his job.

26:00 – 🚀 Say Yes Before You’re Ready
Michael explains how leaning into side projects and passion work opened doors he never expected.

29:00 – ❤️ Healing Through Helping — Founding Broadway Inspirational Voices
The story behind his award-winning gospel choir and how service became a form of healing.

37:00 – 🔮 The Little Voice That Changes Everything
Michael describes the quiet inner voice that guided him to teaching — and how to trust your intuition when it’s time to pivot.

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Tony Awards, Grammys, a Pulitzer Prize, Emmy Awards. Next to Normal, If/Then, Hell's Kitchen, and NY State of Mind. Tom Kitt traded a Wall St. job offer (and paycheck) to follow his passion, a life making music, but that decision didn't come without great cost. He spent five years developing his first Broadway show, "High Fidelity," and it closed after just 10 days, sending him into months of depression and self-doubt. In this raw conversation, Kitt reveals how creative heartbreak became his greatest teacher, why collaboration and his relationships saved his career, and how saying "yes" to risky projects—including an epic pandemic Times Square performance—keeps him creating against all odds. From getting fired from his first music job to creating Next to Normal. Kitt's story is a masterclass in resilience. He shares hard-won wisdom about navigating brutal Broadway reviews, managing creative input overload, and why failure at any age can still become your greatest launching pad.

Topic Covered (with timestamps):

05:27 – The Morgan Stanley choice: Nine interviews and choosing art over finance 

07:19 – Early career struggles: Getting fired as a pivot moment 

09:49 – Meeting collaborators: Brian Yorkey and Rita's introductions 

12:18 – High Fidelity development: Five years from BMI workshop to Broadway 

16:41 – The garage band approach: Cabaret performances and producer discovery 

18:38 – When things go wrong: Boston reviews and Broadway closure after 10 days 

20:00 – Recovery and community support: Friends reaching out after failure 

21:14 – Next to Normal beginnings: Getting back on the horse 

22:16 – Saying yes during pandemic: Times Square performance and Billy Joel collaboration 26:05 – Billy Joel impact: Childhood hero and Emmy-winning "New York State of Mind" 

27:52 – Collaboration challenges: Working with long-time partners like Brian Yorkey 

29:32 – Managing creative feedback: Trusting audience reactions over individual opinions 

31:03 – Continuous learning: From SpongeBob to Shakespeare, staying curious 

33:03 – Artistic purpose: Creating physical reactions and inspiring others 

34:41 – Starting later in life: It's never too late, Billy Porter's example 

36:03 – Future dreams: Film scoring and musical television series 

36:24 – Rapid fire: Karaoke songs, reading list, and life advice

Mentioned: 

Hell's Kitchen, Jagged Little Pill, High Fidelity, American Idiot, Next to Normal, If/Then, “New York State of Mind”: https://www.nycnext.org/ny-state-of-mind

Brian Yorkey, Billy Joel, Billy Porter, Amanda Green, Jeffrey Seller, Kevin McCollum, Robin Goodman, Walter Bobbie, Green Day, Alanis Morissette, Times Square, 

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Feel like you're on the “wrong” path? Negin Farsad  (comedian, filmmaker, writer, actor, and activist) went from steady job as a NYC policy advisor to chasing laughs on lonely standup stages across the country.  As one of the few Iranian-American Muslim women in comedy, she’s built a career blending sharp political satire with deeply personal storytelling—using humor to tackle racism, sexism, and Islamophobia. From touring conservative towns with The Muslims Are Coming! to hosting Fake the Nation, Negin shares the messy leap from public policy to punchlines, turning passion into a paycheck, what it means to be a “social justice comedian,” and why she believes laughter is one of the most powerful tools for change.

Topics Covered: 

• Growing up Iranian-American in times of political hostility, and how early exposure to diversity while in Palm Springs shaped her worldview and comedic voice
• The leap from dual master’s degrees and a NYC policy advisor role to full-time comedy 
• Navigating initial disappointment from parents over career pivots before earning their understanding and support
• The pressures and trade-offs of turning a passion into a paycheck—and how that changes your relationship with the work you love
• Balancing motherhood, marriage, and career success while she and her husband both navigate “unstable,” gig-based artistic careers
• Using humor to challenge stereotypes, defuse protests, and reframe Muslim identity in American culture
• Diversifying her creative work across stand-up, film, writing, voice acting, activism, and unexpected gigs (including a psilocybin retreat)

Mentioned: 

• The Muslims Are Coming! (Documentary): https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2788710/
• Once Upon a Mattress (Musical): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Once_Upon_a_Mattress 
• Comedy Central: https://www.comedycentral.com/ 
• Homeland (TV Series): https://www.sho.com/homeland 
• Wait Wait… Don’t Tell Me! (NPR): https://www.npr.org/programs/wait-wait-dont-tell-me/ 
• TED Talks: https://www.ted.com/speakers/negin_farsad 
• The Longest Table: https://www.longesttablecommunity.org/ 

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Ever feel like everyone else has it figured out while you're drowning in chaos? Sarah Personette's journey through Facebook, Twitter, and now Puck as CEO reveals the messy reality behind big-name success. She shares brutal truths about workplace bullies who wanted her gone, the isolating loneliness of leadership, and making gut decisions that horrified her father. From losing student elections repeatedly to navigating public failures at major tech companies, Sarah exposes how kindness became her secret weapon—not weakness, but a "structural force" that brought her back to three different companies. This raw conversation proves messiness and compassion can lead to extraordinary breakthroughs.

Show Notes: 

Guest: Sarah Personette, CEO of Puck

Follow Sarah on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sarah-personette-4b71125/  

Topics Covered: 

• The childhood challenges that shaped her resilience and risk tolerance
• Why losing multiple student elections didn’t stop her but from chasing leadership roles
• The career move her father called “the worst decision ever,” and why she took it anyway
• How trusting her instincts guided her from job to job 
• Navigating workplace hostility and choosing to lead for the many, not the few 
• Taking a “gap year” to explore, connect, and clarify her goals. 
• The importance of boundaries in balancing C-suite leadership with motherhood and marriage 
• The importance of having a strong value framework 

Mentioned: 

Puck: https://puck.news/ 

Writers at Puck: John Heilemann, Dylan Byers, Julia Ioffe, Matthew Belloni, Baratunde Thurston, and more

Starcom MediaVest Group: https://www.starcomww.com/ 

Facebook (Meta): https://www.meta.com/ 

Twitter (X): https://x.com/ 

Hidden Potential by Adam Grant: https://adamgrant.net/book/hidden-potential/ 

Rotary International: https://www.rotary.org/en 

Whispering Angel Rosé: https://www.esclans.com/ 

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What do Prince, The Secret, and Colleen Hoover have in common? They all worked with Judith Curr to publish their books. Judith's career has been quite a trip: from selling her brother's engine block to a junk dealer in a very small Australian town. to selling Dior to pharmacies door-to-door, to revolutionizing book publishing—founding Atria Books, discovering tomorrow's bestsellers today, and now steering HarperOne into uncharted territory.  From Sydney to New York, Judith has made a career of calculated risks and bold bets. Ready to peek behind the curtain of modern publishing? Judith spills on talent-spotting, industry shake-ups, and why the future of books is more exciting than ever.

Show Notes: Guest: Judith Curr, President and Publisher of HarperOne Follow Judith on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/judith-curr-a72b80/ Follow Judith on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/judithcurr/?hl=en

What You'll Discover:

• The career pivot that changed everything—from selling Dior lipstick to selling million-copy bestsellers
• How a gutsy move from Australia to New York launched her American publishing empire
• Inside the creation of Atria Books—the Simon & Schuster imprint that became a cultural force
• Her secret sauce for spotting breakout authors (hello, Colleen Hoover!) before they explode
• Why she fights for underrepresented voices—and how it's reshaping the industry
• Her vision for HarperOne's future in our AI-powered, globally connected world

Mentioned: 

Christian Dior: https://www.dior.com/en_us/beauty 

Simon & Schuster: https://www.simonandschuster.com/ 

Atria Books: https://www.simonandschusterpublishing.com/atria/ 

HarperOne: https://www.harpercollins.com/pages/harperonegroup 

HarperCollins: https://www.harpercollins.com/ 

The Secret by Rhonda Byrne: https://www.thesecret.tv/products/the-secret-book/

Countdown to Riches by Rhonda Byrne: https://www.thesecret.tv/countdown-to-riches/ 

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Irina Novoselsky landed her first CEO gig at just 32 years old. She’s now CEO of Hootsuite, a social media management platform with 16 million users in 175 countries. Even though her career has been a rocket ship, she’s had a lot of messy parts and pivots that’s shaped who she is and how she operates. That includes being out of work for months at a time and really questioning whether she was ever going to get a job again. If you’ve ever felt like you were on the wrong path entirely, this episode is a must-listen. 

Show Notes: 

Guest: Irina Novoselsky, CEO of Hootsuite

Follow Irina on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/irina-novoselsky/

Follow Irina on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/irinanovoselsky/ 

Topics Covered:

• Growing up as a refugee in NYC and embracing immigrant hustle
• Cold-emailing her way into investment banking at 19
• Leaving prestigious finance roles to find her passion
• Becoming a first-time CEO at 32—and the identity shift it required
• The power of relentlessness, self-belief, and learning out loud
• Why she leads with authenticity (and uses emojis unapologetically!)
• How social media became her leadership superpower
• Finding balance her way—and why she prioritizes sleep over everything

Mentioned:

Hootsuite: https://www.hootsuite.com/
Outlive by Peter Attia https://peterattiamd.com/outlive/

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Discover the real story behind Another Tomorrow with Vanessa Barboni Hallik, who left Wall Street for a mission in sustainable luxury fashion. In this candid interview with Maryam Banikarim on "The Messy Parts Podcast," Vanessa reflects on career pivots, making meaning from hardship, starting a business during COVID, and how purpose and authenticity drive her leadership. If you’re looking for a boost of inspiration, lessons for entrepreneurship, or an inside look at sustainable fashion, this conversation is unmissable.

Show Notes: Guest: 

• Vanessa Barboni Hallik, Co-CEO, Chair, Another Tomorrow
• Follow Vanessa on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/vanessabarbonihallik/
• Follow Vanessa on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/vanessaanabarboni/
• Follow Another Tomorrow on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/anothertomorrow/

Topics Covered: 

• Introduction & Vanessa’s early life: growing up in the Midwest
• Coping with family mental health & loss; the impact on resilience
• Shifting from architecture to economics & landing on Wall Street
• Facing imposter syndrome, self-editing at work, and defining success
• Quitting (three times): career pivots, asking for what you want, and lessons learned
• Discovering sustainability and building Another Tomorrow
• Launching a brand as the pandemic hit: how to survive a sudden crisis
• Meditation, slowing down, and evolving as a leader
• Redefining success, working with partners, and closing advice
• Rapid fire: favorite songs, reading list, surprising facts

Mentioned: 

• Another Tomorrow
• Morgan Stanley
• B Corp
• TM (Transcendental Meditation)
• Berkeley
• Cornell's program
• Farm to Closet model

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What happens after the dream job ends? In this deeply honest conversation, Maryam sits down with Fede García, who (in a matter of a few weeks) went from an award-winning Global Chief Creative Officer at one of the biggest agencies in the world to writing a vulnerable LinkedIn post about being fired. Together, they unpack the reality of ego, identity, burnout, and reinvention after “success.” Fede opens up about imposter syndrome, health battles, the creative grind, career pivots, and what it means to let go of titles and begin again—with joy, humility, and courage.

Guest: Fede Garcia

Follow Fede on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/fedegarcia/ 

Topics Covered:

• Why he went public about getting fired
• LinkedIn’s performative culture vs. real storytelling
• Creativity and ego: navigating praise, loss, and self-worth
• Health, dialysis, and the impact of chronic illness on a creative career
• Global creative life: Buenos Aires → Tokyo → NYC
• Building vs. winning: What awards don’t tell you
• Starting over mid-career (and taking a ⅓ pay cut to do it)
• Beginner’s mindset: boxing, motorcycles, learning Japanese
• Leaving the agency world without bitterness
• Redefining success and finding joy beyond the title
• Advice for Gen Z creatives navigating a chaotic market
• The importance of taste, perspective, and patience in the age of AI
• The power of reflection, vulnerability, and owning your story

Mentioned:

Read Fede's original LinkedIn post (search under “Posts”)

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Saturday Night Live, Wicked, American Auto, Sugar & Booze, many lifelong friendships, and close family relationships are just a few of Ana's string of incredible accomplishments. It turns out none of it was easy.  As she says, "It's not for the faint of heart." Even though creating and preforming for a living is "intoxicating and beyond fun" it's also "miserable and challenging."

In this episode, Ana talks about how she gets over rejection in one night; how she's felt like an outsider her entire life (and used that to her advantage); why her best auditions were the ones where she was incredibly prepared and left everything on the table; how learning not to be afraid to talk about her own goals and aspirations seemed to make everything feel and work better; and the way the life balancing system she learned from none other than Martin Short helps to put everything in perspective for her.

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