Contract Heroes – Details, episodes & analysis

Key Points:

1. Introduction to Richard Robinson:
   • Background in legal tech and litigation support.
   • Career journey from law firms to corporate in-house roles, including JC Penney and Toyota.
2. Transition to Toyota:
   • Inherited a mature legal operations team at Toyota.
   • Initial challenges and the impact of COVID-19 on operations.
3. Core Competencies of CLOC:
   • Discussion on the 12 core principles of CLOC.
   • Emphasis on technology and business intelligence.
4. Strategic Approach to Technology:
   • Importance of aligning technology with business strategy.
   • People, process, and technology as the three pillars of legal operations.
5. Stakeholder Engagement:
   • Identifying and involving the right stakeholders.
   • Importance of communication and emotional intelligence in managing change.
6. Power Skills in Legal Operations:
   • Collaboration, emotional intelligence, problem-solving, communication, and leadership.
   • Listening and understanding root causes before implementing solutions.
7. Mentorship and Industry Engagement:
   • Richard's commitment to mentorship and building up others in the industry.
   • Encouragement to connect on LinkedIn for further conversations.

Key Points:

Introduction to Tiffany Hamilton:

• Director of Legal Innovation, Analytics, and Technology at DHL Supply Chain.
• Eight and a half years at DHL, starting as the sole legal ops resource.

Building the Legal Ops Team:

• Initial challenges and strategic growth of the legal ops team.
• Aligning team resources with the CLOCK Core 12 pillars.

Legacy CLM System Migration:

• Issues with the in-house legacy CLM system and the need for a new solution.
• Gathering stakeholder feedback to identify pain points and requirements.

Data Cleanup and Governance:

• The messy process of data cleanup and the importance of data governance.
• Collaboration with the vendor to ensure clean data migration.

Integrating AI in Contract Management:

• Combining a repository with AI capabilities for contract drafting and data extraction.
• Ensuring human oversight at every step to confirm accuracy.

Lessons Learned and Key Takeaways:

• Importance of understanding data and stakeholder needs.
• The role of information governance in system implementation.
• The significance of user adoption for the success of new systems.

Final Thoughts and Contact Information:

• Tiffany’s enthusiasm for data and information governance.
• Invitation to connect with Tiffany on LinkedIn or at industry conferences like CLOCK.

• [00:22] - Introduction to Laurie Erhlich
• [00:41] - What is Datadog?
• [01:42]- Education as a Common Contracting Pain Point
• [08:43] -The risks and mitigations of contracts
• [10:02] -Automating contract review
• [11:18] -Standardizing NDAs and using technology for review
• [17:58] - The category of contracts for business stakeholders
• [18:35] - Enabling teams to focus on their preferences

• [01:40] “I think it's education. I think it's making sure that everybody actually understands what we're contracting about... this lack of understanding really makes it impossible to close the contract when the parties aren't coming from the same position " - Laurie
• [05:06] “We have a contracting effort, you on our website and it's actually attached to our standard form contract that explains what our business is so that the procurement or legal person receiving the contract understands in more like not business speak, but in legal procurement speak what it is that they're buying in legalese, exactly.”- Laurie
• [09:01] “You don't need perfect contracts. Most contract disputes don't happen in court" - Laurie
• [13:46] “I try not to change things for the organization as a whole. I try to change things for my team in a way that benefits everybody in the organization.” -Laurie

• Data Dog Website
• Laurie Erhlich on LinkedIn
• The Contract Heroes Podcast
  • on Apple Podcasts
  • on Spotify
• The Contract Heroes Official Website
• Marc Doucette on LinkedIn
• Pepe Toriello on LinkedIn

• [00:02] - Introduction to Mark Ross and his role at Deloitte
• [06:37] - The importance of involving stakeholders for successful contract management technology implementation
• [10:57] - Readiness and preparation for CLM implementation
• [14:05] - The value drivers of process efficiencies in contracting
• [15:32] - Quantifying the savings from risk avoidance in contract compliance

• [10:58] - “It's crucial that organizations take a moment to actually take stock of the people that they employ, the processes that they leverage today, and legal business services at Deloitte is laser-focused on helping our legal departments focus on those areas and then, of course, enjoy the benefits of that promised land of technological utopia as well.” - Mark

• Deloitte Website
• Mark Ross on LinkedIn
• The Contract Heroes Podcast
  • on Apple Podcasts
  • on Spotify
• The Contract Heroes Official Website
• Marc Doucette on LinkedIn
• Pepe Toriello on LinkedIn

WHAT WE DISCUSS:

• [00:33] - How procurement can improve their relationship with legal
• [04:50] - The concept of a negotiation playbook
• [09:40] - The importance of standardizing templates and intake protocols
• [10:16] - The role of lawyers in template selection and the impact on the procurement process
• [11:17] - Dynamic template creation
• [13:26] - Triage and work queue management
• [20:43] - The importance of a robust contract repository
• [22:44] - Creating a negotiation playbook
• [28:57] - The importance of readiness and preparation for CLM implementation
• [32:08] - Training newer folks on legal terms
• [34:00] - Collaboration between sourcing and legal departments
• [37:55] - Challenges with control from general counsel
• [41:51] - The challenges of implementing Agiloft  in the healthcare industry
• [42:43] - The importance of getting stakeholders excited and involved in the implementation process
• [43:43] - Resources for Agiloft implementation

• [02:50] - “A lot of contract management has been focused on indirect procurement and the buy side. The sell-side has also been a focus. But historically we've noticed that it's actually born from the buy side.” - Prashant
• [03:43] - “The relationship between procurement and legal sometimes has bordered on adversarial because business drivers for procurement organizations are not just how do I get the best price and consolidate vendors, but it's really about managing categories from a strategic perspective .” - Prashant
• [08:51] - “Most CLM systems of basic functionality will have the ability to have a playbook in place with a clause library, fallback provisions that you can select a way to tag those particular provisions with different levels of risk or desirability from a company's perspective.” - Prashant 
• [11:36] - “Sometimes intake can drive that dynamic creation of a template using clauses that are ultimate provisions that you can use having a base template and then using alternate provisions based on the intake requirements to create something that's purpose-built for the transaction.” - Prashant
• [21:00] - “It takes a pretty high degree of maturity as an organization to have a robust single source of truth repository that's high integrity that people rely on.” - Prashant
• [30:52] “If there's a degree of preparation that involves these kinds of collaborative discussions, it creates a good foundation for trust between the organizations.” - Prashant

• Agiloft Website
• Prashant Dubey on LinkedIn
• The Contract Heroes Podcast
  • on Apple Podcasts
  • on Spotify
• The Contract Heroes Official Website
• Marc Doucette on LinkedIn
• Pepe Toriello on LinkedIn

• [00:00:31] - Nikki's journey to becoming CEO of Legaltech Hub
• [00:02:47] - Notable changes in legal technology and their impact on enterprise legal teams
• [00:06:56] - The role of AI in contract management
• [00:13:06] - The inevitability of AI integration in contract products
• [00:16:15] - Enhancing self-service workflows and integrating AI
• [00:19:39] - Anticipated technological advancements for organizations investing in AI
• [00:21:25] - Upcoming events hosted by Legaltech Hub

• [00:03:00] - “We're really moving from the very large systems that do absolutely everything across the contract lifecycle and need to be implemented across all phases of the contract lifecycle to more modular, nimble solutions that are available for teams.” - Nikki
• [00:06:01] - “I think a CLM platform has to be nimble enough in order to be able to accommodate the different feature configurations or customizations for the particular industry into which it's being implemented.” - Nikki
• [00:13:54] - “AI doesn't necessarily lend huge efficiency at all stages of the contract lifecycle. It's a ‘nice-to-have’ in a lot of areas rather than a ‘must-have’.” - Nikki
• [00:18:05] - “You have to have thought out the user journey and have an established interface in order to make it easy to integrate AI and for the user to see the benefit of that.” - Nikki

• Legaltech Hub Website
• Nikki Shaver on LinkedIn
• The Contract Heroes Podcast
  • on Apple Podcasts
  • on Spotify
• The Contract Heroes Official Website
• Marc Doucette on LinkedIn
• Pepe Toriello on LinkedIn

• [00:00:40] - Introduction to Alistair and his company SYKE
• [00:01:15] - The birth of a contracting Solution
• [00:02:32] - Reducing contract cycle time
• [00:11:53] - The importance of investment and implementation
• [00:13:09] - The potential pitfalls of underestimating implementation efforts
• [00:19:33] - Benefits of a centralized contract repository
• [00:22:37] - The value of engaging a reputable consulting firm
• [00:25:00] - Reputation and changes in the market
• [00:30:34] - The transformative impact of AI in the legal sector
• [00:34:35] - Disruption in legal advisory services
• [00:35:56] - The role of AI in migrating and extracting legacy data

• [00:03:44] - “We managed to reduce the average contract cycle time down from over 50 days to five and a half days, and it was really impactful, had a big commercial benefit, and I kind of just fell in love with it really.” - Alistair
• [00:07:17] - “I saw just the power of how, you know, for a few simple questions, you could put together a robust contract.” - Alistair
• [00:21:30] - “We don't want to be associated with failed projects and products. Reputation is hugely important.”- Alistair 
• [00:30:34] - “It's moving super fast and I am incredibly excited about what we're going to be able to achieve in short order through this new technology.”- Alistair
• [00:35:42] - “I really do, I don't think it will be long before the answers are as good as the lawyers or better, and that's going to be hugely disruptive to the legal market.” - Alistair

• SYKE Website
• Alistair Maiden on LinkedIn
• The Contract Heroes Podcast
  • on Apple Podcasts
  • on Spotify
• Marc Doucette on LinkedIn
• Pepe Toriello on LinkedIn

In this episode of the Contract Heroes Podcast, we are delighted to have three distinguished guests with us - Mary O'Carroll, Chief Community Officer at Ironclad and former Google Director Legal Ops and CLOC President; Laura Frederick, founder of How to Contract and ContractsCon, and a Lawyer; and Debbie Hoffman, previously Managing Associate General Counsel at Western Union, and currently a board director and executive leader with expertise in fintech, real estate, mortgage lending, and blockchain.

During our conversation, we discuss contract management implementations and finding a successful system with Mary. We emphasize the importance of taking a phased approach and starting small with pilot projects. Our discussion also covers the decision of whether to start with the legal department or procurement contracts, the role of consultants in the pre-implementation process, and effectively monitoring and managing contracts for compliance and value maximization. Laura joins as an expert in negotiating contracts, discussing the concerns of commercial lawyers and the trend of over-contracting. The episode concludes with Debbie sharing her experience with implementing a new tool at Western Union and the challenges faced. 

• [01:15] - The importance of phased approaches for successful implementations
• [03:06] - Starting with legal or procurement in implementing contract management solutions
• [03:22] The importance of finding the right starting point for implementing contract management solutions
• [04:53] - The role of consultants in the pre-implementation process and the need for well-defined processes
• [05:38] - Recommendations for organizations to ensure effective monitoring and management of their contracts
• [06:56] - AI and its impact on contract management
• [08:44] - Laura Frederick's recent event and her work as the founder of “How to Contract”
• [09:51] - Commercial lawyers’ frequently asked questions regarding CLM
• [11:01] - Strategies to reverse the over-contracting trend
• [11:35] - The importance of training for effective contract negotiation skills
• [13:34] - Automation of contract negotiations and the need for human decision-making in complex contracts
• [19:43] - Debbie’s background and involvement in CLM implementation while at Western Union
• [20:52] - The CLM vendor selection process
• [22:07] - Debbie’s challenges with the current tool
• [25:08] - The importance of building playbooks and understanding client needs 

• [00:01:19] - “The idea of getting all your stakeholders aligned at the same time and trying to roll out one solution and saying, hey, this is going to be good for everyone is honestly a bit unrealistic. You're never going to have everyone on the same page.” - Mary  
• [00:01:44] - “Change management is hard. This is something that affects so many parts of the company. So, instead of trying, I think to get everyone aligned and to spend a year doing stakeholder alignment, the requirements gathering change management process is to just start small.” - Mary
• [00:16:24] - “If you can, train the people who are doing the contracts and negotiate them on those real risks, not the academic risk, but what is this company with these products and services? What do we really worry about then that's going to be such an important step towards enablement and getting to shorter contracts?” - Laura

• Ironclad Website
• Mary O'Carroll on LinkedIn
• Laura Frederick on LinkedIn
• How to Contract Website
• Contracts Con Website
• Debbie Hoffman on LinkedIn
• Western Union Website
• The Contract Heroes Podcast
  • on Apple Podcasts
  • on Spotify
• The Contract Heroes Official Website
• Marc Doucette on LinkedIn
• Pepe Toriello on LinkedIn
• Pepe Toriello on Twitter

During our conversation, Roma shares her journey from law school to becoming a contracts manager and eventually a general counsel. She explains how she started her own contracts tech company, CrushContracts, and developed tools like the Global NDA, ICE, and Zoey to address contract management pain points. Roma emphasizes the importance of solving problems and adapting to changing times. We also discuss the challenges of getting buy-in from team members and ensuring adoption of contract management tools. 

WHAT WE DISCUSS:

• [00:19] - Introduction to Roma Khan, CEO of CrushContracts 
• [00:52] - Roma's background and journey to becoming the “contracts queen”
• [02:57] - The main issues Roma faced as a general counsel and recommendations for contract management
• [06:32] - Overview of the tools developed by CrushContracts, including Global NDA, ICE, and Zoey
• [09:14] -  Challenges in contract management
• [10:13] - Approach to contract management: understanding the purpose of contracts as business documents 
• [16:14] - Importance of organizing contracts
• [17:05] How to optimize workflow processes and conduct an internal audit for legacy contracts
• [19:05] - Getting buy-in from team members and utilizing existing resources for project implementation
• [21:12] Challenges of adoption and change management when implementing new technology
• [24:45] Recommendations for addressing adoption and change management challenges in CLM implementation

• [00:03:44] - “I built a global registry called Global NDA where we sat down with several other attorneys and created a universally acceptable mutual NDA, and it's online now and people can just opt in and start talking to the active members.” - Roma
• [00:11:11] - “A lot of times legal departments will create instruction manuals that look like novels. They look like law school briefs. There are too many bullet points, and it's like everything I can add to it, I will add. I work the other way around. I look at it as the most simplest user in the company and if they have to execute this contract, I want them to understand the process, I want them to understand the risk, and I want them to negotiate most of this on their own. So they come to legal for the last thing, for this final approval.” - Roma
• [00:10:34] - “My overall process and ideology and contracts comes from the core belief that contracts are not legal documents. They are business documents. They have to be lawful and legally and legally binding. But with anything, you can start any business, and it has to be for a lawful purpose.” - Roma

• CrushContracts Website
• Roma Khan on LinkedIn
• The Contract Heroes Podcast
  • on Apple Podcasts
  • on Spotify
• The Contract Heroes Official Website
• Marc Doucette on LinkedIn
• Pepe Toriello on LinkedIn
• Pepe Toriello on Twitter

During our conversation, we gain valuable insights into Intel's journey of successfully implementing a contract management tool. We emphasize the importance of clean and organized data as the foundation for effective contract management. We delve into the significance of data-driven decision-making and involving attorneys in the process. The team from Intel highlights the importance of metadata and prioritizing active contracts. They also give us insights into some of the challenges they faced during implementation and the importance of data cleanliness and integrity. We also touch on scoping the project, engaging internal teams, and involving end users in the design process. Finally, we discuss the flexibility and challenges of the chosen CLM solution by the Intel team, as well as the future phases and the potential of AI in contract management.

• [00:14] - Intel’s journey of implementing a contract management tool
• [03:16] - Establishing a solid foundation for contract management through data-driven approach
• [07:13] - Analyzing and prioritizing data during the foundation stage
• [08:49] - Data integration and prioritization of contracts in a system implementation.
• [10:41] - Importing legacy documents and mistakes in implementation
• [12:07] - Building the contract repository and data cleaning
• [16:41] -Scooping process and the importance of prioritizing features and functionalities based on business value and user population 
• [24:14] -The role of a dedicated project manager and their experience with legal technologies during CLM implementation
• [26:07] How processes were established and whether diagrams were created during the foundation stage
• [27:49] Handling change requests during CLM implementation
• [32:43] - Importance of conservative resource planning and transparent communication in business operations
• [34:45] - Prioritizing and future phases in consulting, including authoring and AI for contracts
• [35:36] - Excitement about the future phase of AI in contract management.
• [37:20] - Integration with company's data domains

• [00:01:44]  - “Having a firm foundation of understanding what our data is and making a data centric mindset approach towards how we solve our challenges when it comes to contracts is of utmost importance.” - Donovan
• [00:04:00] - “Data is going to be king in terms of understanding how we can then make a business decision. At the end of the day, the data should produce the ability to make a decision in regard to where you are taking your business and the approach you're going to take with it.” - Donovan 
• [00:15:51] - “You need to maintain the data and make sure your data continues to be clean, through the years. And so that's why when you are doing this repository design implementation, take into consideration the business rules. Ideally, you should have those also implemented into the system validation.” - Kuan
• [00:19:22] - “Our first implementation failed largely because we didn't partner with our IT organization like we did with our second implementation. And so, that was the chief reason why we failed. We, as a legal department and legal operations department, felt we could do it on our own without bringing in a big intel IT organization.” - Gerald

• Intel Website
• Kuan Yu Liu on LinkedIn
• Donovan Bell on LinkedIn
• Gerald Wright on LinkedIn
• The Contract Heroes Podcast
  • on Apple Podcasts
  • on Spotify
• The Contract Heroes Official Website
• Marc Doucette on LinkedIn
• Pepe Toriello on LinkedIn
• Pepe Toriello on Twitter