The CX Iconoclast – Détails, épisodes et analyse

Richard Owen hosts a conversation on the future of the telecommunications industry with Marc Anné, Chair of the World Communication Awards judging panel, and Harry Baldock, Editor of Total Telecom. The discussion covers key industry trends, including the rise of 5G, the growing dominance of hyperscalers, and the challenge of telcos transforming into technology companies.

They address the persistent revenue struggles of telecom operators despite increasing data consumption, the role of AI in network optimization and customer experience, and the competitive pressures from China and US tech giants. Marc highlights AI-driven efficiency improvements in telcos, from predictive maintenance to hyper-personalized customer interactions, while Harry reflects on the sector’s identity crisis—caught between innovation and commoditization.

The conversation ends with predictions for the next five years, emphasizing AI-powered services, private 5G networks for B2B, and the telcos’ need for strategic partnerships to remain relevant.

Harry Baldock is the Editor at Total Telecom, writing daily news stories and feature articles on a broad randge of topics within the telecoms industry. He is also an experienced interviewer, having interviewed numerous executives from throughout the industry, including the CEO of Three and the UK Minister for Digital Infrastructure. Prior to his telecommunications role, Harry was an Editorial Assistant for the European Medical Journal.

Marc Anné has held a variety of executive global leadership positions in business development, M&A implementation, and customer experience leadership, mainly in the B2B telecommunications and software industries, notably at Orange Business, Equant, and SITA. He has been a judge for the World Communications Awards for a number of years. He is passionate about the subject and has extensive expertise in designing, orchestrating, implementing, and progress monitoring of global transformational programs to a variety of B2B and B2C telecommunications companies.

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In this podcast, Richard Owen and Brian Curry tackle the provocative question, “Is NPS dead?” While acknowledging the clickbait nature of the question, they argue that the traditional Net Promoter Score (NPS) program has become outdated—not because the metric itself is useless, but because the way companies implement it has failed to evolve. Surveys, once the backbone of customer experience (CX) programs, are increasingly unreliable due to response bias and their inability to provide real-time, comprehensive insights. Instead, Owen and Curry advocate for a new approach—leveraging AI and operational data to create “generative CX analytics” that provide a more accurate, always-on view of customer sentiment and behavior.

They emphasize that the shift isn’t about replacing NPS outright but transforming how CX programs function. Traditional survey-driven programs are losing credibility with executives, who see them as delivering little actionable value. AI-driven analytics, which integrate survey insights with broader customer data, offer a path forward by providing predictive, real-time intelligence. Owen and Curry predict that companies that embrace this transformation will gain a competitive edge, while those clinging to outdated NPS programs risk irrelevance. The key takeaway: it’s not about whether NPS is dead—it’s about whether your CX program is keeping up with the future.

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In this special 8-minute episode, Richard Owen, CEO of OCX Cognition, shares highlights from 2024's CX Iconoclast podcast series, showcasing how top companies are embracing customer-centric transformation to drive retention and loyalty.

Featured Guests:

Simon Paris (Finastra): Explores how open finance shifts focus from products to personalized customer journeys.

Chris Bishop (Conga): Explains how embedding customer success into every role drives growth and celebrates customer-focused achievements.

Chris Adlard (Author of The Customer Catalyst): Discusses his C-Change diagnostic tool, enabling organizations to assess and implement customer-centric strategies.

From rethinking banking services to fostering company-wide customer obsession, this episode is packed with actionable insights to inspire your business transformation.

Watch now and take the first step toward putting your customers at the center of your strategy!

👉 Don’t forget to like, comment, and subscribe for more insights on CX innovation and transformation.

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Richard Owen and Amir Hartman explore the challenges companies face in adopting AI, particularly the high failure rates of AI projects. Owen compares the current AI landscape to previous technological waves, where early excitement led companies to invest in sandbox projects with little return. These projects are often ill-conceived or difficult to scale, resulting in wasted resources. Hartman agrees and points out that while most companies are investing in AI to "keep the lights on," few are focusing on truly innovative projects that could provide a competitive edge. The conversation touches on the disproportionate attention given to large language models like ChatGPT, which may overshadow more practical AI applications, such as embedding AI in physical assets like wind turbines and HVAC systems.

 
Hartman emphasizes that enterprise leaders face a tightrope walk between experimenting with AI and over-investing in unproven technology. While it’s essential to explore AI's potential, leaders must avoid waiting too long, as late adopters risk falling behind competitors. The key, according to Hartman, is finding a balance between innovation and practicality, ensuring that AI investments are thoughtful and focused on long-term value. Both speakers recognize the fast pace of AI development, driven by major tech players like Microsoft, Google, and Oracle, and agree that this wave of innovation presents both unique opportunities and significant risks for businesses.

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As President of Enterprise Solutions at Praxis AI, Amir drives market adoption and scales AI solutions for Praxis AI customers. He also leads AI strategy research with senior leaders at Dasteel Consulting, Experience Alliance and Fidere.ai. Previously, Amir was Managing Director of Customer Success at Oracle, enhancing digital strategies for cloud investments. Before Oracle, he co-founded Mainstay Company, improving sales and customer success for top tech firms. Earlier, Amir was a founding member at Cisco’s Internet Business Solutions Group, developing strategies for top customers.

Amir is passionate about building high-performance teams and fostering innovation. He is a keynote speaker and author of bestselling books “Net Ready,” “Competing for Customers,” and the upcoming “AI Ready”(2024). Amir has taught at Berkeley’s Haas School of Business and Harvard Business School. 

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Richard Owen and Jean-Christophe Barland discussed the complexities facing the pharmaceutical industry, particularly in relation to healthcare delivery and the aging population. Barland emphasized the diversity among physicians in terms of their engagement with new technologies and their competence, which can lead to varying patient outcomes. A more data-driven, scientific approach could help address these inconsistencies. Internally, pharmaceutical companies must ensure a strong corporate culture to support a better external customer experience.

Barland used the "IKEA effect" as a metaphor, suggesting that when customers are actively involved in complex healthcare processes—just like when they are assembling furniture—they become more invested in the outcomes. This was particularly relevant in the context of cellular therapies, where the precision required is immense, especially in cultures like Japan, where expectations for flawless execution are high. Barland’s experience leading teams in Japan revealed the importance of framing healthcare challenges as collective efforts, fostering deeper customer engagement

 The conversation also touched on the economic and societal implications of an aging population. While older adults often become viewed as a financial burden on healthcare systems, Barland suggested that we need to rethink their potential contributions to the workforce. Shifting cultural attitudes, particularly in countries like France, where early retirement is deeply ingrained, is crucial for enabling older adults to remain economically active. Innovations in healthcare are exploding, with AI playing a significant role in accelerating progress. The COVID-19 pandemic highlighted the power of collaboration and transparency in driving vaccine development, showing the potential for similar approaches in the future. Both Owen and Barland expressed optimism about the future of healthcare, noting that the combination of technology and trust could lead to even greater advancements in improving quality of life, especially for aging populations.


Jean-Christophe Barland is a seasoned executive with over two decades of international experience in the pharmaceutical industry. Most recently, he served as the President and CEO of Bristol-Myers Squibb K.K. in Japan, where he played a pivotal role in the company’s strategic transformation and integration with Celgene. Known for his visionary leadership and commitment to innovation, Jean-Christophe has been instrumental in advancing immuno-oncology research and fostering industry-academia collaborations. His tenure at Bristol-Myers Squibb was marked by significant contributions to the company’s growth and its mission to develop life-saving therapies.

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In the latest CX Iconoclast conversation, Michel Claassens and Richard Owen dive into AkzoNobel's journey of digital transformation, demonstrating how a traditional paint company is innovating and continuing to grow in a rapidly changing landscape. Claassens shares insights on how AkzoNobel strategically targets specific business units to harness digital initiatives, driving both revenue growth and cost efficiency. One fascinating takeaway is the discovery that hybrid customers—those who engage both online and offline—generate the highest revenue, sparking a concerted effort to transition more offline customers to digital platforms, and vice-versa.

The discussion highlights the real challenge: transforming the organizational mindset to fully embrace digital tools and data-driven decision-making. As Claassens outlines the company’s vision for a future where service-oriented and data-rich product offerings redefine the paint industry, listeners will gain valuable perspectives on navigating their own digital journeys. This podcast is a must for anyone interested in how traditional industries can successfully adapt to the digital age and unlock new growth opportunities!

Michel Claassens is the Global Head of Digital at AkzoNobel, a leading global paints and coatings company. With a strong background in digital transformation and marketing, Michel has been instrumental in driving AkzoNobel’s digital initiatives and strategies

Before joining AkzoNobel, Michel held significant roles at Signify (formerly Philips Lighting), where he served as Vice President of Digital Marketing and E-commerce. His expertise in digital solutions and e-commerce has been pivotal in enhancing the company’s online presence and customer engagement.

At AkzoNobel, Michel leads the Global Digital Center of Excellence, managing projects that intersect technology and business impact. He has played a key role in harmonizing the company’s MarTech landscape and driving its global digital and e-commerce strategy. Michel’s work is characterized by a deep understanding of both the technological and business aspects of digital transformation, making him a valuable asset to AkzoNobel and a leader in the field of digital marketing.

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In this episode of the CX Iconoclast podcast, host Richard sits down with Bob Cooper, a leading expert in AI and business strategy, to explore the true impact of AI across various industries. Bob and Richard note the contrast between the highly visible, consumer-facing AI applications, such as robo taxis and smart devices, and the less glamorous but profoundly impactful uses of AI in engineering, product development, and back-office automation. Bob shares real-world examples from industries like pharmaceuticals and chemicals, where AI is being used to discover new molecules and drive innovation, highlighting the quiet yet transformative power of AI in these sectors.

The discussion also touches on the trend of "AI washing," where everyday products are labeled as AI-enabled for marketing purposes, often without any real technological innovation. Despite this, Bob remains optimistic about the future of AI in business, noting that while challenges exist, the potential benefits are significant for companies that implement AI correctly. He underscores the importance of learning from early adopters, avoiding common pitfalls, and applying best practices to ensure successful AI integration. The episode concludes with practical insights for businesses looking to harness AI's power effectively, making it a must-listen for anyone interested in the future of AI in the enterprise.

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Dr. Robert G. Cooper is ISBM Distinguished Research Fellow at Pennsylvania State University’s Smeal College of Business Administration, Professor Emeritus at McMaster University’s DeGroote School of Business (Canada), and a Crawford Fellow of the Product Development and Management Association (PDMA). 

Bob is the creator of the popular Stage-Gate® process model,  now the most popular idea-to-launch NPD process globally (for physical product firms). He also developed Stage-Gate-TD for internal technology projects, and co-developed the Agile-Stage-Gate process. In terms of project selection models, Cooper developed the original NewProd™ scoring model and the Value-Based Model for NPD projects.

 More recently Bob has been heavily engaged in research in to the field of AI adoption for NPD by firms in the USA and Germany, and its impact on NPD performance. He has published seven articles on AI in NPD in peer-reviewed journals in 2023-2024.

Over his career, Bob has published 12 books – including the “bible for NPD”, Winning at New Products, and more than 160 articles on the management of new products, most in refereed journals. He is noted as being the #2 cited Marketing Professor globally, after Dr. Phil Kotler, by Resarch.com. He has won the IRI’s (Innovation Research Interchange) prestigious Maurice Holland Award three times for “best article of the year”. Bob has also helped hundreds of firms over the years implement best practices in product innovation, including companies such as 3M, BASF, Bosche, Danfoss, Dow Chem, DuPont, ExxonMobil, Glaxo-Smith-Kleine, Guinness, HP, ITT Industries, LEGO, and P&G.

Cooper holds Bachelor and Master’s degrees in Chemical Engineering from McGill University in Canada; and a PhD in Business and an MBA from Western University, Canada. Website: www.bobcooper.ca 

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In this episode of the CX Iconoclast Podcast, Richard Owen hosts Joe Pine, thought leader, academic, and author of The Experience Economy and several other influential books including Mass Customization, Authenticity, and Infinite Possibility. The conversation with Joe Pine covers the evolution of The Experience Economy over the past 25 years, the impact of digital technology, the shift in consumer preferences, and the role of AI in creating transformative experiences. It also explores the challenges and opportunities for companies in embracing the experience philosophy and the importance of customer co-creation. Here are some of the main points they cover.

• The Experience Economy has evolved significantly over the past 25 years, with the rise of digital technology and the shift in consumer preferences towards meaningful and transformative experiences. They note how the recent pandemic accelerated the digital trend.
• AI plays a crucial role in the design and customization of experiences, but companies must be cautious not to dehumanize their offerings and instead focus on augmenting human skills and abilities. Effective leadership is crucial in leveraging technology to augment rather than automate human roles, ensuring that the transformation drives value creation rather than mere cost reduction.
• Experiences are not confined to premium markets. Joe illustrates that consumers across all income levels seek valuable experiences, tailored to their specific economic circumstances.
• Customer co-creation is essential for creating value and engaging the most valuable customers, allowing them to participate in the creation of products and experiences. Joe uses his new collaborative book-writing process as a great example of co-creation.
• Richard highlights that even in commodity markets, innovation in customer experience can differentiate a brand and create profit opportunities. He shares how Pine’s concept of the experience economy has influenced his career, emphasizing the importance of viewing products as experiences to unlock new value.

 Join Richard and Joe as they explore these themes and consider how businesses can strategically harness the power of experiences to thrive in today's economy.

About Joe Pine: Joseph Pine is an internationally acclaimed author, speaker, and management advisor known for his pioneering work on the experience economy. He co-authored the groundbreaking book The Experience Economy with James H. Gilmore, which introduced the idea that businesses should engage customers through memorable experiences rather than just providing goods and services. Pine's work has significantly influenced how companies approach customer engagement and value creation. He is a co-founder of Strategic Horizons LLP, a thinking studio dedicated to helping businesses conceive and design innovative experiences. Pine is also a frequent keynote speaker and has written several other influential books on mass customization and customer experiences.

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In this episode, Richard Owen speaks with Eric Tagliere, Chief Technology Officer at Humana, about the challenges and opportunities present in the healthcare industry. They emphasize the importance of a customer-focused approach and the convergence of technology and consumer expectations, highlighting the potential for significant progress in the industry over the next five to ten years. Additionally, they explore the influence of external companies like Amazon on shaping consumer expectations in healthcare and discuss the potential for consumer-driven change to act as a catalyst for industry transformation.

The interview also covered the impact of industry consolidation and market dynamics on the healthcare sector, the enduring impact of, the challenges of engaging and deploying the correct healthcare resources, as well as the impact of AI on the business. The conversation touched on the delicate balance between cost and service in healthcare, the need for high-quality data and effective governance in AI adoption, and the responsibility of preparing the next generation for leadership roles.

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In this episode, Richard Owen sits down with Don Peppers, a global authority on marketing and business competition, to discuss the intricacies of customer behavior, customer-centric companies, and the evolving landscape of customer experience (CX). Don, renowned in the world of CRM for co-authoring the landmark book "The One to One Future," shares his invaluable insights on the challenges and opportunities facing CX professionals today. Here are some of the main points they discussed:
 

• The challenge of communicating the importance of customer behavior to business leaders lies in the measurement of future customer value and the shift from short-term thinking to long-term value creation. In that context, Don and Richard discuss the financial concept of customer lifetime value and how CX and sales leaders should align with their CFO on how to measure it. , the shift from tangible to intangible assets, and the need for businesses to align with customer expectations.

• The impact of both the shift from tangible to intangible assets (“moving from atoms to bits”), and of technology on product customization and customer satisfaction is driving businesses to focus on individual customer interactions, leading to a shift in marketing and sales processes.

• The need for businesses to align with customer expectations and create lifetime customers is driving a shift in the way products are marketed and sold, emphasizing the importance of customer delight and long-term value creation. Customer expectations about things like speed of delivery are constantly rising, so some things that used to cause customer delight have become business basics.

Tune in to this episode to gain deep insights into the future of customer experience and learn practical strategies to align your business with long-term customer value. Don't miss out on the opportunity to hear from one of the pioneers of the CRM revolution, Don Peppers.

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