In this episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Penny Elmslie, CMO of Affinda and former Global GM Brand at Xero, for a refreshingly honest conversation about what marketing really looks like behind the scenes.
From starting her career in media sales to helping scale Xero from a little-known challenger brand to a global powerhouse, Penny shares the realities of building marketing functions from scratch, navigating hyper-growth, and leading through constant change.
This is a grounded, practical conversation that cuts through the fluff. Penny unpacks the difference between “doing marketing” and driving real business impact, why EQ is fast becoming a leader’s greatest advantage, and how marketers can stay relevant in a world that’s shifting faster than ever.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:Why marketing is more commercial than most people realise: Penny breaks down the myth that marketing is just creativity and campaigns. At its core, it’s about clarity, execution and driving measurable business outcomes.
The reality of scaling a brand like Xero: From launching campaigns with zero assets to building global playbooks, Penny shares what it actually takes to grow from scrappy startup to international scale.
How to balance bold ideas with business priorities: Not every good idea should live forever. Penny talks about knowing when to push, when to pause, and when to let go.
Why vanity metrics are holding marketers back: A clear take on why impressions and clicks don’t cut it, and what leaders should really be measuring instead.
The role of EQ in modern leadership: In a world full of smart people, emotional intelligence is what sets great leaders apart. Penny explains how understanding people drives better outcomes across teams, stakeholders and customers.
What actually matters for aspiring marketing leaders: From finding your strengths to building the right environment around you, this is practical advice for anyone looking to step up into leadership.
Key Themes & Insights:Marketing = business impact, not activity: The best marketers connect everything they do back to commercial outcomes. If it doesn’t move the business forward, it’s noise.
We’re all just marketing to humans: B2B, B2C… it doesn’t matter. Strip it back and you’re speaking to people with emotions, pressures and motivations. That’s where the real connection happens.
Timing matters more than the idea: There’s rarely a “bad” idea, but there is bad timing. Knowing when to execute is where experience really shows.
Your environment shapes your career: Finding “your people” can be the difference between surviving in a role and genuinely thriving in it.
Careers aren’t linear, and that’s the point: Penny’s journey is a reminder that progression isn’t about titles. It’s about impact, growth and putting yourself in the right rooms.
Connect with Our Guest:Penny Elmslie on LinkedIn
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This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!
Website: https://www.newchaptertalent.com.au/contact-us
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Email: lucy@newchaptertalent.com.au
Chapters:
- (00:00) Introduction to CMO Chapters
- (00:53) Penny’s career chapter in AI and tech marketing
- (01:45) From media sales to marketing
- (03:00) What marketing really turned out to be
- (05:09) Joining Xero before anyone knew the brand
- (07:15) Building from scratch vs scaling globally
- (10:46) Finding the next scale-up chapter
- (14:01) Lessons from failures and knowing when to let go
- (17:42) Marketing to humans, not job titles
- (19:59) Ambition, influence and becoming a CMO
- (24:14) What separates a good CMO from a stellar CMO
- (28:04) Career advice, networks and the leadership skill that always matters
