CMO Chapters Podcast with Lucy Bolan – Détails, épisodes et analyse

In this episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Penny Elmslie, CMO of Affinda and former Global GM Brand at Xero, for a refreshingly honest conversation about what marketing really looks like behind the scenes.

From starting her career in media sales to helping scale Xero from a little-known challenger brand to a global powerhouse, Penny shares the realities of building marketing functions from scratch, navigating hyper-growth, and leading through constant change.

This is a grounded, practical conversation that cuts through the fluff. Penny unpacks the difference between “doing marketing” and driving real business impact, why EQ is fast becoming a leader’s greatest advantage, and how marketers can stay relevant in a world that’s shifting faster than ever.

Why marketing is more commercial than most people realise: Penny breaks down the myth that marketing is just creativity and campaigns. At its core, it’s about clarity, execution and driving measurable business outcomes.

The reality of scaling a brand like Xero: From launching campaigns with zero assets to building global playbooks, Penny shares what it actually takes to grow from scrappy startup to international scale.

How to balance bold ideas with business priorities: Not every good idea should live forever. Penny talks about knowing when to push, when to pause, and when to let go.

Why vanity metrics are holding marketers back: A clear take on why impressions and clicks don’t cut it, and what leaders should really be measuring instead.

The role of EQ in modern leadership: In a world full of smart people, emotional intelligence is what sets great leaders apart. Penny explains how understanding people drives better outcomes across teams, stakeholders and customers.

What actually matters for aspiring marketing leaders: From finding your strengths to building the right environment around you, this is practical advice for anyone looking to step up into leadership.

Marketing = business impact, not activity: The best marketers connect everything they do back to commercial outcomes. If it doesn’t move the business forward, it’s noise.

We’re all just marketing to humans: B2B, B2C… it doesn’t matter. Strip it back and you’re speaking to people with emotions, pressures and motivations. That’s where the real connection happens.

Timing matters more than the idea: There’s rarely a “bad” idea, but there is bad timing. Knowing when to execute is where experience really shows.

Your environment shapes your career: Finding “your people” can be the difference between surviving in a role and genuinely thriving in it.

Careers aren’t linear, and that’s the point: Penny’s journey is a reminder that progression isn’t about titles. It’s about impact, growth and putting yourself in the right rooms.

Penny Elmslie on LinkedIn

*****

Follow the Podcast & New Chapter Talent:

Instagram: @NewChapterTalent

LinkedIn: New Chapter Talent || CMO Chapters Podcast

This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!

Website: https://www.newchaptertalent.com.au/contact-us

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/new-chapter-talent/

Email: lucy@newchaptertalent.com.au

Chapters:

• (00:00) Introduction to CMO Chapters
• (00:53) Penny’s career chapter in AI and tech marketing
• (01:45) From media sales to marketing
• (03:00) What marketing really turned out to be
• (05:09) Joining Xero before anyone knew the brand
• (07:15) Building from scratch vs scaling globally
• (10:46) Finding the next scale-up chapter
• (14:01) Lessons from failures and knowing when to let go
• (17:42) Marketing to humans, not job titles
• (19:59) Ambition, influence and becoming a CMO
• (24:14) What separates a good CMO from a stellar CMO
• (28:04) Career advice, networks and the leadership skill that always matters

In this episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Libby Hodgson, Chief Marketing Officer at UNICEF Australia, for a thoughtful and refreshingly honest conversation about what modern marketing leadership really looks like.

Libby shares her non-linear career journey across financial services, the UK, and purpose-led organisations, and reflects on the moments that shaped her leadership style. From navigating workplace conflict to building confidence over time, this is a grounded look at what it actually takes to grow into a CMO role.

The conversation also dives into one of the biggest shifts facing marketers today, the rise of AI. Libby unpacks how UNICEF has approached adoption in a practical, human-first way, and why culture, not just tools, determines success.

A must-listen for marketers at every stage, especially those thinking about leadership, relevance, and how to build a career that lasts.

• Why career paths aren’t always planned: Libby reflects on how her early career wasn’t mapped out for leadership, and how stepping outside the “expected path” helped shape her trajectory.
• The reality of leadership and conflict: One of the biggest lessons in her career has been learning to sit with discomfort, manage conflict, and lead through ambiguity.
• The skills marketers need at different stages: From execution and delivery early on, to strategy, financial literacy, and people leadership at senior levels, the skillset evolves more than most expect.
• How AI is actually being implemented in marketing teams: A practical look at how to introduce AI without overwhelming teams, starting with guardrails, empowering individuals, and focusing on real business problems.
• Why soft skills are becoming the differentiator: As AI accelerates capability, it’s emotional intelligence, curiosity, and critical thinking that will set marketers apart.
• Specialist vs generalist – what really works: Early specialisation can accelerate growth, but long-term leadership requires breadth, adaptability, and a willingness to step into the unknown.
• What makes a great CMO today: Strategic thinking, strong communication, curiosity, resilience, and the ability to connect marketing to real business outcomes.

UNICEF Australia – Purpose-led organisation focused on protecting children’s rights and wellbeing globally.

AI in Marketing (ACAM) – Practical frameworks around governance, experimentation, and adoption within teams.

Libby Hodgson on LinkedIn

*****

Follow the Podcast & New Chapter Talent:

Instagram: @NewChapterTalent

LinkedIn: New Chapter Talent || CMO Chapters Podcast

This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!

Website: https://www.newchaptertalent.com.au/contact-us

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/new-chapter-talent/

Email: lucy@newchaptertalent.com.au

Chapters:

• (00:00) Introduction to CMO Chapters & Libby Hodgson
• (01:25) Libby’s Career Journey: From Financial Services to UNICEF
• (02:09) Early Career Ambition & Finding Direction
• (04:21) Career Reflections: Decisions, Regrets & Purpose
• (05:53) Hard Lessons: Navigating Conflict as a Leader
• (08:31) Advice for Aspiring CMOs: Skills That Matter
• (11:46) AI, Soft Skills & Staying Relevant in Marketing
• (15:14) Inside AI Adoption at UNICEF: Where to Start
• (22:05) Building a Personal Brand as a Marketing Leader
• (25:36) What It Really Takes to Be a Successful CMO
• (27:46) The Reality of Leadership: Pressure & Loneliness
• (31:09) Specialist vs Generalist: Career Strategy Explained
• (34:10) Legacy, Impact & Supporting Others’ Careers

In this powerhouse episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Liana Dubois, former Chief Marketing Officer at Nine and an industry leader with over 25 years in media, marketing and advertising. 

From her early days reading stolen copies of B&T and AdNews to leading one of Australia’s biggest media portfolios, Liana shares candid insights on leadership, reinvention, the future of marketing, and what it really takes to thrive at the top.

This conversation goes deep on how to manage high-performing teams, navigate change, harness AI without losing your brand identity, and lead with empathy in a world that demands more human-centred leadership. A must-listen for marketers navigating growth, leadership, or reinvention.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

• How to lead marketing in a matrix organisation across multiple brands.
• Why CMOs must align their strategies with business growth, not just brand goals.
• Tips for leading teams of 250+ without burning out.
• What not to assume when communicating your marketing strategy.
• How to manage career transitions with optimism and resilience.
• The real impact of AI on creative distinctiveness—and how to avoid the sea of sameness.
• Why human behaviour, ethics and empathy are the future of leadership.

Resources & Mentions:

• AdNews & B&T – Industry publications that sparked Liana’s early career curiosity.
• Australian Institute of Marketing (AMI) – Upskilling for marketers.
• ADMA – Training and development for data-driven marketing.
• Cannes Lions Festival of Creativity – Where marketing meets innovation.
• Generative AI Tools – The opportunities and risks in creative automation.

Connect with Our Guest:

• Follow Liana Dubois on LinkedIn: Liana Dubois

Follow the Podcast & New Chapter Talent:

Instagram: @NewChapterTalent

LinkedIn: New Chapter Talent || CMO Chapters Podcast

This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!

Website: https://www.newchaptertalent.com.au/contact-us

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/new-chapter-talent/

Email: lucy@newchaptertalent.com.au

In this special episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan welcomes Edan Haddock, Head of Talent at Movember, for a powerful and practical discussion about what it really takes to get hired in today’s competitive job market. While not a CMO, Edan brings a wealth of knowledge from years in talent acquisition and leadership, offering fresh, real-world advice for marketers at all levels.

This conversation is packed with honest insights into how to stand out, the importance of personalisation and storytelling, and how AI is impacting recruitment. If you're job hunting, considering a move, or supporting someone who is—this one’s essential listening.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

• How Movember has reshaped its employer brand to focus on purpose and connection.
• What candidates really need to do to stand out in a sea of applicants.
• How AI is changing the hiring process (and how to stay human in a digital world).
• The importance of building your personal brand and online presence.
• Why recruiters value storytelling over perfectly formatted CVs.
• The power of meaningful networking and finding “your Lucy.”
• What success looks like in a saturated job market—and how to stay sane through it.

Resources & Mentions:

• Teamtailor – Recruitment platform helping personalise the candidate experience.
• Movember Careers Page: careers.movember.com
• New Chapter Talent – Your partner in career growth and marketing leadership hiring.

Connect with Our Guest:

• Follow Edan Haddock on LinkedIn: Edan Haddock

Follow New Chapter Talent and the Podcast!

Instagram: @NewChapterTalent

LinkedIn: New Chapter Talent || CMO Chapters Podcast

This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!

Website: https://www.newchaptertalent.com.au/contact-us

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/new-chapter-talent/

Email: lucy@newchaptertalent.com.au

In this refreshingly honest episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Liam Loan-Lack, Chief Commercial & Strategy Officer at Match and Wood. From his beginnings as an intellectual property lawyer in the UK to leading major marketing teams in Australia, Liam shares his non-linear journey into marketing and what it really takes to grow as a leader.

Liam discusses emotional intelligence, agency vs client-side experience, personal branding, and why the future of marketing may look very different from what we know today. A must-listen for ambitious marketers ready to break the mould and lead with empathy.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

• Why emotional intelligence is a marketer’s most powerful asset.
• How to build a personal brand without the props.
• The upsides (and downsides) of starting your career in agency land.
• What it really means to leave a legacy—and how to start building one now.
• Leadership lessons that go beyond job titles and team size.
• How to challenge outdated career narratives and redefine success.
• Why simplicity is underrated, and how to communicate for real impact.

Resources & Mentions:

• Obliquity by John Kay – Why the best outcomes are often achieved indirectly.
• The Marketing Academy – A leadership journey that changed Liam’s perspective.
• Emotional Intelligence in Leadership – A recurring theme in this episode.

Connect with Our Guest:

• Follow Liam Loan-Lack on LinkedIn: Liam Loan-Lack

Follow the Podcast via New Chapter Talent:

Instagram: @NewChapterTalent

LinkedIn: New Chapter Talent || CMO Chapters Podcast

This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!

Website: https://www.newchaptertalent.com.au/contact-us

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/new-chapter-talent/

Email: lucy@newchaptertalent.com.au

In this forward-thinking episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan chats with Tony Gruebner, former CMO of Pepperstone and author of AI for CEOs. With a background in data analytics and senior marketing leadership, Tony brings a fresh perspective to the future of marketing, the rise of AI, and the evolving skill sets marketers need to succeed.

Tony explores what AI really means, how it’s impacting marketing teams, and why CMOs must now become orchestrators of people, platforms, and possibility. Whether you’re leading a team or looking to future-proof your career, this episode will leave you feeling smarter, clearer, and ready to adapt.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

• What AI is (without the jargon) and how to think about it commercially.
• Why CMOs need to become the “conductor of the orchestra” in a world of rapid tech evolution.
• The impact of AI on marketing team structure, roles, and workflows.
• How to avoid the trap of “25 AI tools replacing 8” and create real integration.
• What it takes to be an effective leader in the age of AI (spoiler: EQ matters more than ever).
• The importance of broad skillsets and learning how to learn.
• Advice for early-career marketers and how to future-proof your role.

Resources & Mentions:

• AI for CEOs by Tony Gruebner – The least technical book you'll read on AI (and one every marketing leader should pick up).

Connect with Our Guest:

Follow Tony Gruebner on LinkedIn: Tony Gruebner

Buy the book AI for CEOs: https://www.amazon.com.au/AI-CEOs-least-technical-youll/dp/B0DJ1XRG7V

Follow the Podcast via New Chapter Talent:

Instagram: @NewChapterTalent

LinkedIn: New Chapter Talent

This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!

Website: https://www.newchaptertalent.com.au/contact-us

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/new-chapter-talent/

Email: lucy@newchaptertalent.com.au

In this deeply inspiring episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Anna Samkova, founder of Albany Advisory and former GM of Digital & Loyalty at Brand Collective. 

Anna shares her remarkable journey—from migrating to Australia and learning English as an adult to overcoming a life-changing accident and building a successful career in marketing and digital transformation.

This episode is packed with insights on leadership, personal growth, loyalty and CX strategy, consulting, and staying resilient through change. If you’re a marketer thinking about your next move, or someone exploring the world of consulting and personal brand-building, this is a must-listen.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

• Why resilience is one of the most underrated leadership traits.
• How Anna broke into loyalty and digital by saying “yes” and figuring it out later.
• Advice for marketers looking to transition into consulting or fractional leadership.
• The mindset shift required to build and maintain authentic networks.
• How to manage your time and energy effectively as a consultant.
• Why your personal brand matters—and how to build it with authenticity.
• The power of reflection, gratitude, and intentional living.

Resources & Mentions:

• Atomic Habits by James Clear – For building high-performance routines.
• The Miracle Morning by Hal Elrod – The morning routine that helped Anna transform her mindset and focus.
• The 5AM Club by Robin Sharma – Building discipline and purpose.
• Albany Advisory – Anna’s consultancy practice: https://albanyadvisory.com.au/

Connect with Our Guest:

• Follow Anna Samkova on LinkedIn: Anna Samkova

Follow the Podcast via New Chapter Talent:

Instagram: @NewChapterTalent

LinkedIn: New Chapter Talent

This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!

Website: https://www.newchaptertalent.com.au/contact-us

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/new-chapter-talent/

Email: lucy@newchaptertalent.com.au

In this episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan chats with the insightful and straight-talking Martin Kelly, Director of Field Marketing - APAC, at Brandwatch (appearing in a personal capacity). With over 20 years of marketing experience across multiple industries and regions, Martin shares his views on leadership, career growth, taking risks, and building a meaningful legacy.

From navigating the Australian market as a newcomer to mentoring future leaders, Martin opens up about the lessons he's learned (and unlearned) along the way—plus why networking might just be the most underrated superpower in your career.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

• How to approach networking with intention—and why it’s essential to your career success.
• Why building a team around you is key to stepping up as a leader.
• How to strike the right balance between art and science in marketing.
• Tips for managing and motivating teams through transparency and collaboration.
• How to cultivate your personal brand (even if public speaking isn’t your thing).
• The importance of feedback and how to use it to grow.
• Why playing it too safe can kill innovation—and how to take calculated risks.

Resources & Mentions:

• StoryBrand by Donald Miller – Understanding how to make your message resonate.
• The First 90 Days by Michael D. Watkins – A must-read for anyone stepping into a new role.
• The Leaky Funnel by Hugh Macfarlane – On aligning sales and marketing.
• Marketing Warfare by Al Ries & Jack Trout – Timeless lessons in brand positioning.
• Atomic Habits by James Clear – A modern guide to behaviour change and personal growth.
• Rory Sutherland – Behavioural economics meets marketing strategy.

Connect with Martin Kelly:

LinkedIn: Martin Kelly

Follow the Podcast via New Chapter Talent:

Instagram: @NewChapterTalent

LinkedIn: New Chapter Talent

This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!

Website: https://www.newchaptertalent.com.au/contact-us

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/new-chapter-talent/

Email: lucy@newchaptertalent.com.au

In this episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with Shannon Barnes, an experienced marketing leader who is Head of Marketing & Communications at Aware Super, to discuss the ever-changing role of the Chief Marketing Officer. Shannon shares insights on the biggest challenges CMOs face today, the importance of adaptability, and how marketing leaders can drive impact in an increasingly complex business environment.

Key Topics Covered:

• Shannon’s Career Journey: From her early days in marketing to becoming a CMO.
• The Modern CMO Role: How it has evolved and the key skills needed to succeed.
• Balancing Brand and Performance Marketing: Finding the right mix for long-term success.
• Leadership and Team Building: Strategies for leading high-performing marketing teams.
• Data-Driven Decision Making: How to leverage insights to influence business growth.
• The Future of Marketing: Predictions for the next decade.

Notable Quotes:

• “Marketing isn’t just about creativity; it’s about commercial impact and data-driven storytelling.”
• “The best CMOs are those who can blend strategic thinking with agility in execution.”

Resources Mentioned:

• The Long and the Short of It by Les Binet & Peter Field – A must-read on balancing brand and performance marketing.
• Playing to Win by A.G. Lafley & Roger Martin – Essential for understanding strategic decision-making.
• CMO Survey Report – Insights into the latest trends in marketing leadership.
• Forrester’s Marketing Predictions – A look at what’s shaping the future of marketing.

Follow the Podcast via New Chapter Talent:

Instagram: @NewChapterTalent

LinkedIn: New Chapter Talent

This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!

Website: https://www.newchaptertalent.com.au/contact-us

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/new-chapter-talent/

Email: lucy@newchaptertalent.com.au

In this episode of CMO Chapters, Lucy Bolan sits down with brand strategist and fractional CMO Gabrielle Sheehan. With a career spanning media, global brands, and entrepreneurship, Gabrielle shares insights on brand positioning, leadership, and the shift towards fractional CMO roles. Whether you're an aspiring CMO, a brand leader, or exploring the world of consulting, this episode is packed with wisdom on making bold career moves and crafting brands that truly resonate.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

• How Gabrielle’s early career experiences shaped her passion for brand strategy.
• The importance of gaining global marketing experience early in your career.
• Why networking is a critical skill for marketers—and how to do it effectively.
• The evolving role of brand in today’s marketing landscape.
• What it means to be a fractional CMO and how to transition into this career path.
• Essential advice for senior marketers considering consulting or fractional leadership.
• The balance between performance marketing and brand-building—and why brands need both.

Resources & Mentions:

• Eat the Big Fish by Adam Morgan – A must-read on challenger brands.
• Understanding Brands by Don Cowley – Essential reading for brand strategists.
• Keeping It Real Podcast – Marketing insights from top industry leaders.
• Jack Trout’s Big Brands – Classic marketing fundamentals that still apply today.📚

Connect with Our Guest:

🔗 Follow Gabrielle Sheehan on LinkedIn: Gabrielle Sheehan

📍 Learn more about her fractional CMO and brand strategy work: [Website Link]

Join the Conversation:

• Got thoughts on this episode? Drop us a message ~ lucy@newchaptertalent.com.au
• Don’t forget to subscribe and leave a review if you enjoyed this episode!

Follow the Podcast via New Chapter Talent:

Instagram: @NewChapterTalent

LinkedIn: New Chapter Talent

This podcast is brought to you by New Chapter Talent recruitment. If you're hunting for a fulfilling new role or seeking the right talent for your company, contact Lucy Bolan today!

Website: https://www.newchaptertalent.com.au/contact-us

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/new-chapter-talent/

Email: lucy@newchaptertalent.com.au