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In this episode of Cloudlandia, we explore how weather predictions and media sensationalism influence public views, especially regarding storms like impending Tropical Storm Debbie. Drawing on past hurricanes and climate patterns, we examine the normalized perceptions of living with these events. 

Additionally, we delve into the evolution of creativity through technology and mind-altering substances. From early stone tools to therapeutic uses of psychotropics today, innovation is traced alongside historical cultural explosions. Comparisons are drawn between eras like the 1960s and perceptions of creativity now. 

These chapters emerge from a common thread of challenging assumptions, spanning climate activism, human creative drives, and digital changes.

SHOW HIGHLIGHTS

<li>Dan and I discuss preparing for Tropical Storm Debbie in Florida and the normalization of living with hurricanes.</li> <li>We delve into how media influences public perception of weather events and examine Bjorn Lomborg's critique of climate activism, discussing resilient polar bears and the myth of the Maldives sinking.</li> <li>We explore the evolution of technology and creativity, from early stone tools to the influence of mind-altering substances on human history.</li> <li>We question whether the creative explosion of the 1960s was an anomaly and consider if today's society is experiencing a creative drought.</li> <li>Insights from a recent Joe Rogan and Jordan Peterson podcast are shared, focusing on the impact of psychotropics on human culture and creativity.</li> <li>The conversation transitions to the benefits of the carnivore diet and personal experiences with diet changes, including the use of air fryers for cooking meat.</li> <li>We highlight the importance of critical thinking and self-interpretation in navigating the abundance of unfiltered information available today.</li> <li>Platforms like Real Clear Politics and Perplexity are discussed as valuable tools for accessing diverse perspectives and balanced information.</li> <li>We note that major corporations have yet to profit from AI investments, despite substantial funding, and discuss the potential reasons behind this trend.</li> <li>The episode concludes with a reflection on the importance of discerning what information to allow into our thinking, emphasizing the responsibility we have in the age of information unfiltered.</li>

Links:
WelcomeToCloudlandia.com
StrategicCoach.com
DeanJackson.com
ListingAgentLifestyle.com

TRANSCRIPT

(AI transcript provided as supporting material and may contain errors)

Dean: Mr Sullivan, mr Jackson, welcome to Cloudlandia.

Dan: And I hope you're enjoying all the extraordinary benefits of your own four seasons.

Dean: I really am. We're battening down the hatches. We're just getting ready for Tropical Storm Debbie, which is making its way through the Gulf of Mexico, beating towards the coast of Florida.

Dan: And it's so funny, yeah, yeah.

Dean: So it won't be. It's apparently it's going to be a lot of rain and wind and stuff for us. You know I'm so I'm very close to the highest point in peninsular Florida, so we're not going to get flooding, we're on high dry.

Dan: That puts you at about 60 feet above sea level. Right, you know it's so funny. It is funny I think I can see.

Dean: Let's see sea level reading. There's, yeah, the highest point in.

Florida is three feet above sea level, which is Bock Tower, which you've been to, and so, yeah, so we're sitting here ready to go. But you would never know, dan, what's coming, because right now it's still. It's slightly overcast, but it's still. Yesterday was beautiful, today slightly overcast. You'd never know what was coming if it wasn't for the big. You know buzzsaw visuals in the news right now, but seeing it marking its way and with a huge, wide swath of the path of the potential storm, you know.

Dan: When you first moved there, did it take you a while to get to normalize the fact that, yes, we get tropical storms, we get hurricanes.

Dean: Yeah, Exactly Did it take you?

Dan: two or three times before you said oh well, I guess it's just normal.

Dean: It is normal, that's exactly right, and every year you know what I would say. It's so funny that there's never a year in memory that I can remember somebody saying, or the news media saying should be a light year for hurricanes, this year Doesn't sell newspaper or drink advertising.

Dan: I remember, after Katrina, but Katrina didn't really hit it for it. It hit Louisiana.

Dean: Yeah right.

Dan: But I remember the alarmist saying well, every year it's going to get worse. Now and then there was almost a year, maybe two years, when they didn't have any hurricanes at all.

Dean: Yeah, exactly that's what's so funny, right? It's like the things like you know, and it is funny how the whole, how it all has cycles you know, because California, you know, had the. You know everybody's talking about the water levels in California. Now you just it's all reported right now that you know Lake Tahoe is at the highest maximum allowable level for Ever, ever, yes, exactly, it's at its peak, it could be poor flooding.

Yeah, exactly, it's like 15 feet off of the highest level allowed and because of all of the snow cap melting and all the stuff. But anyway, it's just so. You know, I definitely see those. It's all part of the balance for our minds, you know yeah, it was really interesting.

Dan: Did you ever read bjorn lawnberg? He's, uh, danish. He started off as a you know you know a card carrying climate. You know, I don't know what you call them. I guess they're called climate activists.

Dean: Okay, yeah.

Dan: I feel that I'm very activated by the climate, so I don't know, what the distinction is there. Are you activated by the climate? I am, you know. When the climate is this way, I'm activated this way, and when the climate's a different way, I'm activated a different way. He wrote an amazing article in the Wall Street Journal.

I think it was Wednesday and this past Wednesday, and he just points out that, first of all, the whole climate activism movement is an industry. There's a lot of jobs that are financed by the climate. It might be in the millions the number of people who make money off of doomsday predictions about the climate. So whenever a movement, someone once said everything starts off as a cause and it's just the people emotionally involved. In other words, they said we're not paying attention to this, we have to pay more attention to this. But then when government gets involved, it becomes a movement because large amounts of government money start flowing in a particular direction and then it becomes an industry.

The fourth stage is it becomes a racket. I think we're in the climate racket period right now. Yeah, but Bjorn Lomborg was going back to 20, 25 years ago when he had a revelation that the climate does change. But he says that's the nature of the climate. The very nature of the climate is that the climate changes. But he said the first, if you'll remember this, with Al Gore, this was right around when he lost.

Dean: Yeah, it was right around 2001.

Dan: Yeah, yeah, he was right after the 2000 election Right 2000 election and I suspect he needed some money. So he started the movement and he used the polar bear as an example. There was this one polar bear who was just floating on a very small ice sheet, you know.

And they said, you know the bears will be gone within 20 years because of the warming. It turns out the population in the last 20 years has doubled. The number of polar bears has doubled, even though it's gotten warmer. According to the climate racket people, it's gotten warmer, but the polar bears, you know, have been around forever. I guess they know how to adapt to changing conditions.

Dean: They were all grizzly bears.

Dan: They were all grizzly bears at one time. I don't know if you know that.

Dean: I did not. That's where they started.

Dan: Yeah.

They found the white yeah, they rebranded it as polar bears, I guess extended their territory and that was it, so they've doubled since Al Gore's warning. And then the other thing was that the let's see, there's two more. Well, I'll mention number three. Number three is that all the low islands in the Indian Ocean were going to sink below sea level. The sea level was going to flood the Maldives and some of the other things, and for the most part, all of them have expanded their landmass in the last 20 years. They've actually gotten bigger. They've increased their height above sea level by possibly six inches.

Dean: Oh man.

Dan: You'd appreciate that. Living in Florida, so it hasn't happened. The other one was the deaths from warming. Last year in the United States I don't know if it was last year or the year before, I don't know if it was last year or the year before 25 times more people died of extreme cold than died of extreme heat. So if you're a betting man, I call it the Gore factor, that if Al Gore says something, bet the other way.

Dean: Ah right.

Dan: Yeah, yeah, this is you know.

Dean: The man is impossibly rich because of his creating a movement, creating an industry, and now it's a racket. Yeah, I mean, it's amazing how invisible he is now. I mean he really is like I haven't seen or heard anything from Al Gore. I can't remember the last time.

Dan: Well, it's passive income now.

Dean: Right, just stay quiet, stay low.

Dan: Just stay quiet, just stay quiet. The dollars just keep rolling in yeah, yeah. But it's interesting. My suspicion is I've been thinking about this because I'm writing my next quarterly book. We just wrapped up Casting Not Hiring, which will come out in September this one with Jeff Madoff, this one with Jeff and it really really worked. This book really worked the Casting Not Hiring but the next one is going to be called Timeless.

Technology, and the idea here is that technology is a way of thinking. It's not so much particular technology, but it's a way, and my been that it's actually one of the crucial factors. Technological thinking is one of the crucial factors that differentiates humans from the other species, and what I mean by that it's the intentional and yet unpredictable utilizing stuff from our environment to enhance our capabilities.

Dean: And.

Dan: I did a search on perplexity what would be reckoned from perplexity doing a search of what would be sort of the 10 early breakthroughs, the technological breakthroughs, and one of them was just stones that you could throw. You could pick up a stone and throw it and it actually changed how the human body evolved. Is that the ability of using our hand and our arm and getting that tremendous arm strength that you can throw a stone and, you know, kill something. Right Kill an animal or kill it. Kill another human yeah, and everything.

Dean: I wonder even about that, the evolution of technology, like that, like thinking a rock and then realize that, hey, if I just chisel this away now I make this sharp on this end.

Dan: And now all of a sudden we got an axe, you know yeah, and then actually they think that glue was an early adaption, that you could take sticks and stones and put them together. You could glue things together and you could actually. So they looked for probably really sticky saps or something from trees you know that they would use. Then pottery, of course, and it's interesting with pottery that the very earliest samples that we have.

clearly they took clay and made it into some sort of cup or yeah, a bowl of some sort, but whenever they find it and it goes back hundreds of thousands of years they can detect alcohol. They can detect that there was alcohol, which kind of shows you how early that must have been. Consciousness transformer that's what I call alcohol. It's a consciousness transformer, would you not say?

Dean: Yeah, I mean I was listening to Joe Rogan. I had Jordan Peterson on his podcast just recently.

Dan: That's a good podcast partnership.

Dean: Yeah, yeah, and he was talking about the, you know psychotropics and the things that are. You know that psilocybin and all the all of those things, marijuana was all what was sort of responsible for the revolutionary change that happened. You know the difference from the fifties to the sixties and his thing was, you know, in the mid to late 60s. You know that's what started the whole. Every single one of those things was made schedule one, narcotic and illegal and completely controlled right, and that his thing is that we haven't seen anything revolutionary, like any kind of change happening from since then, since the 60s, into now.

Dan: Which kind of indicates that it's good enough?

Dean: Well, it's just kind of funny. You know, like that, you wonder what the you know where he was kind of going with that, but he was using as an example like the creativity in the 60s, like he talked about the difference of the car.

Even the cars and the things, the designs of things that were being made in the 60s are iconic and desirable and different than, like you compared to, you know, a camaro or the muscle car, this, the corvette, and the things in the 60s compared to like nobody wants your 19 camaro. That's not desirable at all, not in the the way that the 60s, Except maybe NASCAR.

Dan: Except NASCAR, I think Camaros have a very niche use because they're really souped up. Mark Young, his team has won. At the latest count, his team had won three races this year so far. Discount this team had won three races this year so far and he was talking about it at the podcast dinner that we had after doing the podcast, the four-person podcast.

But Camaros always play a very active role. They establish themselves as this amazing niche, you know, souped up, NASCAR type of car. But I really take what you're saying there that there's been no blockbuster new designs of cars that have really you know that you think that they'll still be around. In other words, these are real breakthrough cars. Yeah, Just going a little deeper into the Joe Rogan, Peterson, the Jordan.

Dean: Peterson conversation.

Dan: Did they go any deeper into why the creativity was then? But the creativity hasn't gone any further.

Dean: Well, I think it was Joe's sort of. You know, I'm halfway through the podcast right now, but his basic assertion was that those access to those drugs or those not I will call I use the word drugs those, those we could say technologies are new. Access to those things opened up the part of the brain that is creative linkers, like that that's really they're saying all the way back, like going, if you take it all the way back evolutionarily, that they believe, like what you just said, back in, as far back as they go, there's access. You know they're seeing alcohol in, yeah, as mind-altering things. They would revere mushrooms, mushrooms were abundant and things that were mind-altering. And you think through all of these things, even in Indian or Native lore, that the peyote and the things that were, that part of a trip out of reality is a rite of passage or a thing that activates another part of your brain. You know, makes the connections that aren't otherwise accessible.

Dan: Yeah, I'm totally, you know, I'm convinced that's probably true.

Dean: And I think that we're starting to see now that these hallucinogenic what do we call it? Not hallucinogenics, but psychotropics. What's the right word for?

Dan: it Psychotropic, I think.

Dean: Yeah, so whatever now in treatment of PTSD and addiction and all of these beneficial things that are coming as part of using it therapeutically and but because it's just now starting to become more accessible or more active, it used to be like you've always heard we you and I both know a lot of people that have gone down the Iowa or the you know version and have had, you know, all sort of mind altering experiences doing that. I've never done it, yeah.

Dan: I mean, I mean, it was very interesting. I was at Richard Rossi's Da Vinci 50. This was the last one I was I think it was february and scottsdale and two or three there. We had two or three coach clients there who were just doing a look.

See, you know if they wanted to join the previewing and they were having a conversation about psychotropic drugs and they asked me if I had experimented and I said you mean, right beyond dealing with my own brain every day? You mean I said I have to tell you I don't have time for that stuff. Just dealing with my own brain every day is sure, you know, it's a full-time job. You know, because it's switching, it's switching channels continually and it takes a full-time job. You know, because it's switching channels continually and it takes a lot of work to get it focused on something useful. Yeah, I just wonder about that because it's when one of the political parties went really strange. I noticed the Democrats, since, well, kamala seems to me to be a sympathetic candidate for the president.

Dean: Unbelievable, this is all craziness.

Dan: Yeah, yeah, but they're using the word weird to describe the Republicans.

Dean: Yeah.

Dan: If there was ever a weird party. I mean, this is sheer projection, this is psychological projection. You know of weird, you know.

Dean: Yeah, but it's amazing.

Dan: That's when the Democratic Party changed, and it changed quite radically. I remember speaking about you know, psychedelics. I was in the army in Korea for two years. Us Army.

Dean: And.

Dan: I came back to the West Coast. When we flew back, we went into Seattle. I had a brother who was a professor at University of San Francisco, so I took a jump down to San Francisco before I flew back to my home in Ohio and he said I'm going to show you something really interesting. And he took me to Haight-Ashbury. This is the summer that Haight-Ashbury, San Francisco, became really famous and it was the beginning of the whole hippie movement. And he walked me around and I could tell by interacting with him that he wasn't just an observer, you know that, he was actually a participant.

And he didn't do him any good, because he eventually dropped out of, you know, being a professor and became more or less a vagrant.

Dean: Tune in turn on drop out.

Dan: Yeah well, he dropped out. He dropped out and then, about I would say, 12 years later, he committed suicide. Oh, no, and yeah, I mean, he's the one real casualty in my family. But I remember him how unreal his conversations were starting to become when I talked to him about this. You know this, and he was never and he was very smart. He was very smart I mean before that he was very bright and he was sort of practical and he became a professor, a university professor.

Dean: That says something right there. Yeah, yeah.

Dan: Yeah and anyway. But that was my first awareness, that was my first introduction to it. I mean, I mean I didn't drink alcohol until I was 27 years old. I never drank until I was 27. Wow, I'll have a glass of wine, that I'll do anything, but I've never I've never actually enjoyed. I had pot a couple of times back in the early 60s, 70s and I found it disconnected me from other people. Alcohol does just the opposite. Alcohol kind of connects you. It does just the opposite. It kind of disconnects you and so it's very definitely.

it's a reality since that period of time. But the one thing I want to say is that there's a really interesting thing the Democratic Party, up until the late 60s, was the party of the working class you know, working class, blue collar workers, and they had a real disaster in 1968 because they had huge riots in Chicago.

So it's interesting In two weeks they'll be in Chicago and I think they've done one previous convention in Chicago. I think one of Obama's conventions was in Chicago. But anyway, they made a decision that they were no longer the working class and I think it was the result of all the tremendous growth of the student population as a result of the baby boomer generation. So between between, I think, 1940s, when the baby boomer generation starts to 64. Ok, and that would be 18 years there were I think it was, I don't know the exact number, but there was like 75 million babies who were born during that period and the front end of them were going to university in the 60s boomer generation. And so they saw the party start looking.

Well, these are our future voters. They're not blue collar workers, they're college students and graduates and professors, and then the entire new working cadre. They're all going to be professionals. They're going to be professionals. And they changed their entire focus in 1960. I think it was in 1969 or 70. George McGovern, who was a senator at that time, did a commission and said we're no longer the party of the working class.

And and so they're not, you know, 65 years later. And it's funny because the Republicans were always considered sort of the Pluto class, they were the class of the rich people, and now they've just shipped positions. So 60 years later, it's the billionaires and it's the college professors and media people and the bureaucratic class the government bureaucrats they're the Democrats. And the working class class the government bureaucrats they're the Democrats and the working class is the Republicans.

Dean: Yeah, the Midwestern. Yeah, that's true, yeah yeah, yeah yeah.

Dan: And Trump is the working class billionaire.

Dean: Yes, that's true.

I wanted to say it is kind of I'll use the word weird. What is kind of weird about this increased use of the word weird to describe the Republicans now is that it's so widespread. It's like the it's the Democratic talking point now. Like I love the videos now that kind of expose, the, you know, the Democrat party line sort of thing, and it happens on both sides actually. But I mean this idea of that, you know, with the media, all the soundbites are, you know, planting that thought that Republicans are weird, that this is weird.

Dan: They're testing it. It's just that it's. I think it's hard for them to say it plausibly. There's no traditional values that the Democrats represent. Yeah, but it's interesting. And now I'm especially interested in your Joe Rogan, Jordan Peterson podcast.

Dean: And I'm going to watch that after.

Dan: Watch that and Jordan Peterson I think I mean the two people together is a very interesting partnership for a podcast, because I think Jordan Peterson is, you know, came out of the university class. He was a professor here in Toronto and where he became. He became very famous for his book, which was basically very popular Rules for life you know, like before you leave your bedroom in the morning, make your bed and, yeah, stand up straight.

You know, stand up straight and when you visit with your, your friends and meet their parents, be the sort of person that their parents would like to have come back as a guest. Pretty basic, fundamental rules of life. But then he really became infamous, if you want to call it that here in Toronto, because he had a real objection to the whole university class saying that people could be whatever gender they wanted to be, and they could self-identify, and they were opposed to the he and her or he and she thing, and he said no, he said I'm not going to do that.

He said if it's a female, I'm going to call her she. And they said oh, this is an attack. This is an attack on equality. This is an attack on diversity. This is an attack on inclusion. So he became very famous and it actually ultimately had forced him his hand to leave the university. He was called up and they said we're going to take away your professional degree and everything like that. Right, right, okay, which you know. I think there's something weird about that.

Dean: I mean just my own opinion here, but yeah and I think Joe knows him.

Dan: I think he's had Joe's had conversations. Joe Polish has had conversations with Jordan Peele. But all his videos where he's being interviewed by people who obviously don't like him, he comes off really well. He comes off as the sort of sane, rational person in all the you know, in all his interviews. I enjoy watching him. He strikes me as being kind of on the depressed side. You know he seems not to. I think he's a psychologist. I think that by training.

And anyway, but I think it's interesting because this all started with the conversation of alcohol on the ancient pottery.

Dean: Yeah.

Dan: You know our thing here, but I think that probably throughout history, generation by generation, place after place, they found substances which can alter their consciousness, and I think it's probably been with human beings forever.

Dean: Yeah, these whole. You're absolutely right, that whole yeah.

Dan: It's not as good as steak for breakfast.

Dean: No, I'll tell you what Dan.

Dan: I have Steak for breakfast. Steak for breakfast. I just started it 12 days ago and it makes a big difference.

Dean: You've started Carnivore.

Dan: Well, not Carnivore, but I just don't have Cheerios for breakfast.

Dean: Ah, right, right, Protein for breakfast. Yeah, I've been this week has been because I've been leaning more and more, as you know, working with jj on prioritizing pro no, babs was telling me about your call, abs was telling me about your call yesterday yeah and your air dryer.

Dan: Your air, my air fryer.

Dean: Yeah, and I'll tell you your air fryer and I made yesterday, yesterday for the first time, the most amazing ribeye in the air fryer. That was so juicy and delicious it was and so easy. I mean literally. I took the ribeye, I put salt and pepper and just a little bit.

Dan: Yes, came out just like so your adventures get around you. Now I know, yeah, you're absolutely right.

Dean: But I mean that's just, it's so good, who knew?

Dan: Yeah, I mean yeah, it was I texted that.

Dean: Well, we've got the whole. I'm very fortunate that you see second hand through, babs, but you know there's been a real support network, a gathering of what we're lovingly calling Team Dean on a text thread, and so I texted a picture of that last night to the group.

Dan: Let's keep Dean in the mainland for a while, right?

Dean: We don't want him drifting off into Glanlandia for eternity At least until we can get my mind melded up there somehow, right, but this week has been a breakthrough. Like this week I've been, this is the first week of full carnivore, like only meat. Oh so I started on Monday and it's been, you know, an interesting thing. But I had my highest weight loss week since we've been doing this by by this and I actually feel great. It took a couple of days to kind of get through the Van Allen belt of carbohydrate craving, you know. But now that I'm in, I'm through, I'm out of the atmosphere, I'm kind of floating that I think I can do this, you know, perpetually here for a while, and one of the reasons yeah, yeah Well.

Dan: yeah well, I mean you talk about the air fryer, but there's a direct connection between the management of fire and your air fryer.

you know, I mean hundreds of thousands of years and the human, the first humans who got a handle on fire. You know, it happened, probably accidentally, it was a lightning strike or something. But then they began to realize once we have fire, let's find a way of keeping it going. So we have access and that was a huge jump, because eating raw meat almost uses as many calories as you're getting from the meat, In other words you really have to work to digest.

Let's call it steak. You know the steak. It takes a lot of calories to digest it. You really have to work to digest it but once they added fire to the mix and you could cook the food it made it much easier to digest and you got your calories much easier, yeah, but the other thing is that it's filling it's very filling, I mean the more carnivore you are, the less you're attracted to the sugar. That's the truth, easy caps. I mean, I don't feel particularly hungry.

I had breakfast around 8 o'clock this morning Steak. I have steak and avocado. Okay, it's ribeye, but we're going to get. As a result of your yesterday information, babs is going to get an air fryer. We're going to get an air fryer, and then Stephen Poulter had even more.

Dean: I saw that. He put up a fancy thing, exotic thing you would know that Stephen tracked it down, because that's what Stephen does.

Dan: Yeah, but it's very interesting this getting enough calories to do interesting mind work. It's about if you're going to. I read a report that one of the great advantages of North America is right from the beginning. Right from when the first people came to the East Coast, they had a lot of protein right from the beginning.

There was lots of game. There was lots of fish, you know. They had a lot of game and Americans have. Except for two periods of history, during the Revolutionary War and, I think, great Depression, americans have always had as many calories as they wanted. But there's a reading that high-level mental work requires roughly, you know, in the neighborhood of above 2,000 calories a day. You have to have 2,000 calories to be doing mental work.

Dean: That's interesting.

Dan: Yeah, yeah. And North America, the US and Canada have always had enormous amount of calories, protein calories, you know. So you can do hard labor, you can do high level of mental work. Makes for an industrious, you know, makes for an industrious population.

Dean: Yeah, yeah, that's really you know. Jordan Peterson has been carnivore for five years.

Dan: He's been carnivore for five years, yeah to save his life really.

Dean: Right.

Dan: And he mentioned that.

Dean: you know he looks at when the that everything got shifted when they came out with the food pyramid in the 70s, that was not by any nutritionist but by the agriculture department to get people getting grains and breads and stuff as the foundation of a healthy lifestyle, healthy nutrition plan.

Dan: That sounds like a four-stage cause movement, industry, racket. Racket yeah, I think it's now at the racket stage yeah, you know I mean halfway when we go. We were at the cottage for the last two weeks and halfway to the cottage is tim hortons. Tim hortons, okay, and I will tell you, based on your present heading in life, dean, you've probably been to your last Tim Hortons, because there's nothing in there that's actually good for you.

Dean: Right, right, right, right. Yeah, that's true, isn't it?

Dan: I mean that's something I call it Tim Hortons, where white people go to get whiter.

Dean: Oh man, Do you go up 400 when you go to the cottage, Like do you go past? No, we go 404.

Dan: We go 404.

Dean: Okay, so you don't go by Weber's.

Dan: No, weber's is good, weber's is a high-protein, but that's what I mean. You don't pass that on your way to your cottage.

Dean: You're one freeway over on your way to york, got it, you're one. We go one freeway over right, right, right. Yeah, I got it. Yeah, that's interesting, but that you know there's a great example what a canadian institution you know tim horton's corner, really it's, uh, it's funny, yeah, but I had a thought about, you know, jordan Peterson being. You know like I think that where the revolution has really discussion of is this the best of times or the worst of times? My thought was that the battle for our minds is the thing.

Yes, you're absolutely right, but just like cancel culture, I think we're in a period where our access to more information that's not being just packaged and filtered for us.

We have access to unfilled information, and I think that you're seeing a resurgence, that we're moving towards in big swaths of categories, that the consensus, things that actually make a difference, and that we have access to more and more people who can do that, plus the diagnostic tools that we have support and show which methodologies are the most. And we're starting to see that in. You know, just like cancel culture was able to, the reason that we brought on cancel culture is that the consensus we were able to, everything was being exposed. You know that more people had a voice to say to, to the checks and balances kind of thing of being observed, and that when people find out things, you know you've got access to that. So I see things like nutrition, like it's like I'm noticing a trending, you know, more examination of christ, of Christianity as a thing that's becoming more mainstream as well, and that's just an observation of you know, seeing all these things. You know.

Dan: yeah, One of the things that's really interesting is the variety of choices that you can make that actually cancel out a whole other part of where the information or news is coming out.

You know, for example, I haven't as I mentioned, I haven't watched television at all for now more than six years, and so what ABC thinks, what CBS thinks, what NBC thinks, what NPR, public television, msnbc, cnn think about anything I'm not the target here anymore because I don't know what they're saying about anything but I found all sorts of sites on the internet that I find really interesting. Real Clear Politics is my go-to. First thing in the morning I always look at Real Clear Politics, and what they do is they just aggregate headlines for the entire spectrum. So if you want to go to all the other sites, you can go there. But what they find, you know. I find that they're making pretty widespread choices of what goes on there. In other words, if you're left wing politically, you'll find articles on RealClearPolitics. If you're right wing, you'll find real clear. But one of the things I find really interesting is when they mentioned the most popular articles for the last seven days, for the last 24 hours. They're all right wing, they're not left wing. So interesting.

Although, yeah, I've never seen a left wing article be most watched or most read during the last seven days or the last 24 hours. They're all using the definitions of what would be left-wing or right-wing in today's setting. So it means that the people who are going to RealClearPolitics are mainly right-wing and they're interested in knowing what the left is saying, wayne, and they're interested in knowing what the left is saying, but they're not really. They're not really reinforcing themselves with the articles.

I mean a and you can tell just by the nature of the headline, which where the bias is whether it's left or right and in any way. And but the interesting thing is how much I'm using perplexity now.

Dean: Me too.

Dan: Yeah, and I just got this format Tell me the 10 most important aspects of this particular topic. Five seconds later, I got the 10. And what I find is it's having an effect on my mind that there's never one reason for anything. There's always. I mean, I use 10 reasons, but if I did 20, they could probably do 20, you know but what it does? It gives you a more balanced sense of what's true, okay, but I've discovered this on myself.

I mean, if you talk to 100 people, maybe three of them are using perplexity and perplexity. You know I may. I know there's other sites but it does for me what I want it to do. It gives me a background to think about things, and is that? What you're talking about is non-controlled?

Dean: Because it's my question. Yeah, like that's what I think is that we've got access.

Dan: It's my probes my probes that are revealing the information.

Dean: Yeah.

Dan: No one is packaging this for me. It's that I'm asking clarify me on this particular subject and bang you know within a matter of seconds I have clarification.

Dean: Yeah, yeah.

Dan: Is that what you're saying here?

Dean: and I, but I think that the onus is on us to do our own interpretation and, you know, measuring whether this fits with what we think. Whereas, you know, we were sort of when we were exposed to information like all of our whole adult lives, up until the last say, you know, 10 years has really been filtered through the lenses of the mainstream media, like I think about curators, often curators, curators.

Yeah, they were the curators. Yeah, or the guardians, local minority. You remember, I mean, even in the closest thing was I remember when City TV came out with Speaker's Corner.

Dan: You remember that they would have a little booth set up and you could go in and speak your mind.

Dean: Yeah you could go in and speak your mind and that's how you got to think, see what other people were thinking. Otherwise, you had to go to Young and Dundas and you know, on the corner there and hear everybody up on their soapbox or whatever it was. That's always been. You know, that's kind of where everybody's megaphone now is. You don't have to go out to the corner where all the people are. You can sit in your basement and you've got a megaphone to the whole world.

Dan: Yeah, you know, this probably helps explain something. I read an article Friday, I downloaded it and I read it about three or four times, and that is that none of the big corporations are making any money on AI. Right, they're investing enormously in it, but they're not making any money on it, and I think the reason is that it wasn't designed for them.

Dean: Ah right.

Dan: It was designed for individuals to do whatever the hell they wanted to do. And if anything, it works against the corporations, because if people are using AI to pursue their own interests, that means it's time and attention that they're not giving to the corporations. Yeah, yes.

Dean: And I would say there's a real panic.

Dan: I would say there's a real panic setting in, because it's when ChatGPT came out. Everybody said, oh, now this is going to enhance our ability to get our message across. Well, that's only true if people are paying attention. But what if the impact of AI is actually to take people's attention away from you?

Dean: Yeah, it is changing so much. So I mean yeah, it is changing so much, you know.

Dan: I mean. Dean if you're going carnivore, Tim Hortons' messaging isn't getting to you.

Dean: Yeah.

Dan: I mean All that money they're spending on Tim Hortons' advertising is wasted money on you. Wasted on me.

Dean: That's exactly it. Yeah, it's so amazing how to waste your money on Dean Jack.

Dan: How to waste your money on Dean Jack. How to waste your money on Dean Jack Uh-huh.

Dean: Man so funny. Well, yeah, I should. This would be great, though, to get a. You know, start spreading the word about the air fryer. Get an air fryer deal. I mean, the salmon and the steak are amazing.

Dan: And apparently JJ thinks pork chops are good. That's right. So you got the whole good. That's right, exactly.

Dean: So you got the whole scoop.

Dan: I love it that you've got a buffer between you and the technology. Well, she controls the checkbook, so she might as well get the information, because she controls the checks. Yes, and Babs has been my authority on eating since I've met her. I mean that's one of the great benefits of being in relation she's always been good about that. You know, my life is two parts, before Babs and after Babs.

Dean: Yeah, I know Absolutely. I'm much healthier since I've met her.

Dan: I'm much healthier since I met her. Yeah, Anyway, yeah, but it's really interesting. You know that what you're introducing here to the Cloudlandia conversation is that we now have the opportunity to be much more discerning than we were before.

Dean: Yeah, we have not only the opportunity but the responsibility, and that's what I think we wrestle with is that we can't just take all of the information and take it at face value to realize that that there's a level of building your own internal filters. Timeless Technology is that we're looking for advantage.

Dan: That's what.

I established right at the beginning is that you're looking for an advantage that, for a while, other people don't have, because that improves your status. That improves your status that you have an advantage, and it creates inequality. One of the things that people don't realize is that every time you create a new advantage, it creates inequality in your surrounding area, okay, and then other people have to respond to that, either by using your advantage, like imitating your advantage, or they canitating your advantage, or they can create their own advantage, or they can try to stop you from having your advantage, and I think that depends on your framework. So I think a lot of cancel culture is people not wanting you to have that advantage, so they won't let you talk about it, they won't let you do certain things and I think the cancel culture has probably been there right from the beginning, it just takes different forms.

She's a witch, yeah, yeah, there's a witch, yeah, yeah. Can I tell you something about? That the salem, and also the ones that happened in Europe the witch thing, was. It was moldy grain, so usually the witch seasons happen to do happen when there was a lot of rain. Okay, and the grains got moldy and my sense is they created, they created, and so that a lot of the Fermenting. Yeah, there was a fermentation, but also it drove people a little bit crazy and there's a lot of investigation now of the which periods.

Dean: Okay, salem is the most famous US.

Dan: But it didn't happen. It didn't except for Salem Massachusetts. But they had several really wet seasons where the grain got moldy and my sense is that people were getting fermented grain on a daily basis and it drove me kind of crazy, yeah that made him weird.

Dean: Weird it made him weird. I saw james carville. James carville said that the democrats should stop saying they're weird and start calling them creeps. Weird Weird is creeps as a label. They're creeps, you know yeah.

Dan: Yeah.

Dean: Yeah, yeah.

Dan: I think it's funny to see. I would love to hear.

Dean: I'd love to hear a podcast or a panel interview between you. Know, luntz the. I forget what his first name is Jeffrey Luntz? Is it the Republican wordsmith guy? I think it's Jeffrey.

Dan: Luntz, I don't know him oh.

Dean: Luntz yeah.

Dan: Jeffrey Luntz. He's the one who does the panel discussions, that's right.

Dean: And he gets the messaging, for he's the Republican wordsmith and James Carville is essentially that for the Democrats. I'd love to hear that.

Dan: Yeah, I think James Carville is essentially that for the Democrats. I'd love to hear that.

Dean: Yeah, I think James Carville is now. He's like the crazy ant upstairs. Yeah, I think so. Right, right, right.

Dan: Because the last couple of weeks he said you know you better get over this mania real fast that you're having with Kamala Harris and he says, because he said you have no idea what's coming back against you. It'll take the Republicans three or four weeks to figure out what the target is here, and he says you better get over this real fast. He says it's going to be incredibly hard work over the next three months to get to the election, make sure your grains are dry here, don't get that fermented grain brain.

Make sure your powder is dry too. Yeah, yeah, but it's an interesting thesis. This is where we've added a new dimension to Cloudlandia the psychotropic part of Cloudlandia yeah, I agree.

Dean: There was a.

Dan: Greek player, one of the Greek writers, playwrights. He talked about a place called Cloud Cuckoo Land.

Dean: Okay, that's funny.

Dan: Yeah, and he was talking about people who would just go off and make up new stuff and everything like that had no basis in current reality and he called it cloud cuckoo land. You know well, you know we've had a lot of that over the last 50 or 60 years yeah, I think what we're really introducing.

Dean: Dan is the intersection you know the venn diagram of the mainland cloudlandia and Danlandia or Deanlandia. That's the one that we can actually control. Is Danlandia, yeah.

Dan: Well, the big thing is, if you truly want to be a uniquely creative individual today, the resources are available for you to do it.

Dean: Yeah.

Dan: But you got to be really discerning about what gets allowed in across the borders into your thinking that's it exactly.

Dean: Yeah, All right Dan.

Dan: Yeah, I mean, yeah, I have to jump too. One thing about it is I'm going to watch that Joe Rogan church because I think that's interesting.

Dean: I have to watch that Joe Rogan George because I think that's interesting.

Dan: I have to laugh when Joe Rogan had.

Dean: Peter Zion for a loop.

Dan: I've never seen Joe Rogan thrown so much for a loop, because Peter Zion is nothing if not confident about his point of view. I mean, he's a very confident guy about his point of view and Joe wasn't ready for it and about every you know, every 90 seconds he said holy cow, oh wow. Oh yeah.

Dean: Oh, I got to watch that one too, jesus Christ yeah.

Dan: And you can see Joe sitting there. He said yeah he said next time I have this guy on no pot for 24 hours beforehand. This is moving, this is moving. I'm too slow here. I can't keep up with this you know, Peter Zion is like a jackhammer when he starts going you know he does a whack, whack, whack. Yeah, that would be Actually Jordan Peterson and Peter Zion would be an interesting one. Two brains, yeah, yeah, for sure. Maybe Elon Musk as a third person, jordan Peterson and Peter Zion would be an interesting one.

Mm-hmm, Two brains yeah yeah for sure, Maybe Elon Musk as a third person.

Dean: Imagine a panel. Yeah, exactly, there was a great. There was a show called Dinner for Five and it was a. It was an entertainment like movie one, where they'd have different directors and actors at dinner, just a mix of people and having just recording their conversation. No real thing. Jon Favreau did that show it was really great.

Dan: No curating really. Yeah, anyway.

Dean: Okay Dan.

Dan: Very entertaining. We'll be here next week, yes, I always enjoy these.

Dean: They go so fast. Yeah, thanks a lot. Okay, thanks, dan, I'll talk to you soon. Bye.

In this episode of Welcome to Cloudlandia, we have a thought-provoking discussion around AI and its future implications. We introduce Juniper, an advanced voice-based AI capable of tasks from writing to coding, giving insight into emerging technologies.

We explore impacts like the attention economy, where value emerges without physical costs. Success stories like Mr. Beast showcase uniqueness and AI's potential to tackle real issues.

The episode delivers a well-rounded look at AI capacities and societal changes. References to early smartphone adoption phases parallel today's AI capabilities.

SHOW HIGHLIGHTS

We discuss the potential of voice-based GPT-4.0 AI, specifically highlighting "Juniper" with a Scarlett Johansson-like voice, and its various applications from writing to coding.

We compare the current adoption of AI to the early days of smartphones, emphasizing that we are only beginning to understand AI's full capabilities.

We explore historical productivity trends, noting a decline since 1975, and question whether modern technology truly enhances productivity or just alters our perception of it.

We debate the role of technology giants like Mark Zuckerberg and Tesla in shaping productivity and economic measurement.

We reflect on the mid-20th century advancements such as electrification and infrastructure, and compare them to today's computing power and its economic impact.

We discuss the concept of the attention economy and the creation of value from digital products without physical production costs, using digital creators like Mr. Beast as examples.

We consider the potential of AI in solving real-world problems such as city traffic congestion and climate understanding, rather than just creating new opportunities.

We emphasize the importance of practical solutions and specific use cases to fully leverage the capabilities of advanced AI technologies.

We touch on the economic shifts in the digital era, including the rise of digital transactions and the non-tangible realm of digital innovation.

We highlight the unique nature of success in the digital world, using examples like Mr. Beast and Taylor Swift, and discuss the challenges and opportunities presented by new technologies.

Links:
WelcomeToCloudlandia.com
StrategicCoach.com
DeanJackson.com
ListingAgentLifestyle.com

TRANSCRIPT

(AI transcript provided as supporting material and may contain errors)

Dean: Mr Sullivan, who is that person that gives the directions when we start the podcast?

Dan: Well, I'm not sure the one that says this podcast this call may be.

Dean: You are the first one on this conference phone call, oh my goodness, who is she?

Dan: Who is she? She's a bot. She's not real. She's a bot. She's not real. She's not real. She's not real, she doesn't sound.

Dean: I've heard worse sounding bots.

Dan: Dan, I have been experimenting, playing around with chat GPT-4.0. And I use it primarily in voice mode, meaning, you know, I just say things to it and it has an amazing Scarlett Johansson-like voice that has zero, not at all like Siri or Alexa. You know where those voices definitely sound like. They are bots. This, my GPT-4O I think her name's Juniper is the voice that I chose. She sounds like a real person, I mean, and has like real tone, real inflection, real like conversational feeling to it and I realized that I don't think we really understand what we have here. I mean, I look at it and I think, imagine if that was a real person.

Dean: Now, when you say we, who are you talking about?

Dan: I mean the collective royal we I I'm sorry I've never been around yeah, I just think we as a when I say we, we as a society or we as the people collectively using this, it reminds me of this Seinfeld episode where Kramer got this or Jerry got his dad, this wizard organizer, and they always use it as a tip calculator, like the least of all the functions that it has. They're just excited that it's a tip calculator, and I feel like that's the current level of my adoption of Juniper.

Dean: Yeah, I think the big thing is what you let's say, a year from now, level of my adoption of Juniper, you know, yeah, I think the big thing is what you let's say a year from now. You're using Juniper for a year. What do you think will be different as a result of having this capability, new capability?

Dan: Well, I think it's operator, you know, I think it's operator dependent, you know, I think it's up to me what I think if you said to me. You know, I think it's up to me what I think if you said to me listen, I'd like to introduce you to Juniper. She's going to come here and she'll be within. She's going to follow you around. She's going to be here within three feet of you or discreetly out of sight, whatever you, but whenever you call she'll be right there. She is a graduate level.

She is a graduate level student. She could pass the bar. She knows everything that's ever been recorded, she speaks every language. She never sleeps, she can write, she can draw, she can do graphics, she can do coding Whatever you like, and she's yours 20 to a month. Have fun, yeah, do you think you'd use it Well?

that's my question is that it feels like I'm not using it and I have it. That's essentially what I have. I've got it in my pocket. You know how they said. You know the iPod was launched with the promise of a thousand songs in your pocket. Well, I think this is really like. You know, an MBA or a PhD or whatever you want in your pocket is essentially what we have, and I find it very interesting.

Dean: No, I think it's unique, you know, and it's brand new. But what problem did you have that this solves?

Dan: Well, I think that it's not per se a problem, but I think that we're I really have been observing and thinking, and I've said it you know in lots of our conversations, that I think that 2020, you know, if we take the 50-year period from 1975 to 2025, that we've pretty much set the stage now for a new plateau launch pad kind of at the same time. I don't. I think that once we understand and people you know, I think it's almost like the iPhone had the app store, that became what Peter Diamandis called the interface moment.

Right, that was the you know, that allowed, once people realized that the capabilities of the iPhone to both measure geographically where you are at any precisely at any moment, the gyro thing that can detect movement, the sound, the camera capabilities, the touch screen, all of those things, Well, people realized what the baseline capabilities of the phone were.

They were able to architect very specific, you know, starting with games very specific ways to use the capabilities that are very specific ways to use the capabilities that are built into the phone and I think that right now it's almost like it can do anything, and I think that we need to figure out the very specific use cases and I think we'll see people.

Dean: You keep saying we, but I don't think we is going to do it. I think you know, who we are. Do we have a cell phone number? Do we have a street address?

You know, I think you're having a very interesting personal experience with the new technology. Yeah, I don't know, I don't know if anybody else is going to be in on this, but the big thing is, how are you going to set it up so that you can prove that this is valuable? I mean, let's say, three months from now the time you come back to.

Toronto for your next strategic coach pre-zone workshop things you're going to test out and see if the inclusion of this spot with a very sexy Scarlett Johansson voice. This isn't the issue that she sued somebody for.

Dan: I think it's, I don't know actually this voice is. It's not exactly her, but it's, you know, it's that tone and things.

Dean: So yeah, so.

Dan: I don't know that. It's a pleasing voice, much more pleasing and personal than Siri or Alexa, for instance. Yeah, but yeah, I think you're absolutely right it does come down to and I think that's where the paralysis of you know the it can do anything, but you know what would be you know where my mind goes.

Dean: It's which, how that I already have, but am I going to assign this capability to so that I don't have to spend any time whatsoever interacting with this bot? But my who's a you know who's a live human being working for a strategic coach would that person actually work? Do this, you know, and actually and I tested out for three months what are you getting done faster?

So, for example, we have an AI newsletter that rewrites itself every two weeks and chooses new content, designs it and goes out and it uses up one hour of my Linda Spencer, who's one of my team members on the marketing team, and it's very interesting, I mean we have about 2000 people who read it and they grade it and everything like that.

But the only thing I have to do every two weeks she said here's the news, here's the results from the last newsletter, here's the design and contents of the next newsletter, yes or no? And I'll go through. I say, yeah, looks good, send it out, right. Yeah, now, that's not freeing me up, because we never had this capability before. It's a new capability, right, and it's been going for about nine months now and people will talk to me about it and you know everything like that and everything like that.

But I haven't seen that it's made a huge difference in the crucial numbers of strategic coach, which are marketing calls. Are we generating great leads that people are talking to us about? Are they signing up for the program? Are they whatever? So the normal measurements.

So I think, with any technology, the first thing I would establish before I got interested in the technology is what are the crucial numbers that we have that tell me that our business and myself are moving forward? And then, whatever I'm going to use the new technology for, it has to have an impact on those numbers. Yeah, I think that's yeah, because you know the amount of productivity. I'll use the United States as an example. You mentioned 1975 to 2025, 50 years of individual productivity in the United States was much higher in the 50 years before 1975, since it has been for the last 50 years since 1975. Even though there are these amazing books and that about how productivity is going through the world with the microchip. But the actual numbers which are gathered by the US government, the US Treasury Department, us Department of Labor, indicates that the level of individual productivity has actually gone down in the last 50 years even though the excitement level of productivity has gone through the roof.

Dean: By what measurement? What are they deciding? Is product?

Dan: Dollars of economic activity per hour per worker. Okay, that's how productivity is measured.

Dean: The number of workers.

Dan: You have the number of hours they work and the amount of economic dollars that their hour of activity produces. The productivity was much higher total for the entire all workers.

Dean: But is it all productivity or personal productivity? Like are you saying no all?

Dan: productivity? No, the entire GDP of the economy, measured by the number of workers. Yeah, okay by the number of workers it's going down, it's down. No, yeah, since 1975, it's not as great as it was from 1925 to 1975. So that 50-year period the productivity levels in the United States were bigger than the last 50 years.

Dean: Wow, that seems. That's surprising. What do you think that means?

Dan: Well, a lot of people are really excited and involving themselves in technological activity that produces absolutely no productivity. Yeah, they're very excited, they're very excited and they're getting very emotionally connected to this activity. But you know, I'm not saying that's not a great thing, I'm not. Maybe they're having more fun, Maybe they're you know, maybe they have.

Dean: What actually counts as GDP.

Dan: Well, GDP is amount of sales amount of sales.

Dean: Okay, so would the advertising sales that Mark Zuckerberg makes for Facebook count as GDP, or is it only in physical, like you know, shippable goods, or whatever?

Dan: Well, whatever, uh, you have a dollar spent on something that constitutes a sale to sale.

Dean: Okay, so advertising, so Google and Facebook and Netflix and all of those things count as GDP? Sure, okay, all right, then that seems impossible.

Dan: It seems impossible, but it's true.

Dean: That's pretty wild.

Dan: Yeah yeah. I'm not saying that Mark Zuckerberg isn't making a lot of money. I'm not saying Mark. Zuckerberg isn't productive. My feeling is that the technology is created, makes a lot of other people non-productive.

Dean: Yeah, and I wonder I mean that's a do you think you know if you measured that in terms of the total population versus the workforce? Is that what? In terms of the total population versus the workforce, is that what you know? I'm just looking for some explanation of this right.

Dan: Somewhere along the line, there has to be an economic transaction for it to constitute and everything else. See, this is the difference. Yeah and everything else See this is the difference? China talks about its GDP, but they don't use the same term that everybody else in the world uses. They use the economic value of what they've produced. So they can produce a million machines and they're sitting in a warehouse and they count that as GDP gross domestic product. But there was no sale, it's, you know, they spend it, it was an economic activity.

There was a transaction there, but there was no sale. So I think that's the big thing. It doesn't count unless there's a sale.

Dean: GDP, doesn't it?

Dan: doesn't count as GDP unless there's a sale. Somebody makes money, yeah.

Dean: Okay, money Okay, yeah, yeah, I mean, it's pretty.

Dan: No, I'm not saying it's not exciting. And here's the.

Dean: Thing.

Dan: Maybe it's an A&I, it's what I would R&D stage. The last 50 years have been R&D stage. For the next 50 years, which are going to be 100 times bigger of GDP. Okay, that may happen, but it's not happening yet.

Dean: Yeah, yeah, I mean it's pretty, yeah, it's pretty wild. I mean you can definitely see, like the capabilities of you know, you can definitely see this replacing many customer service interactions, for sure. For instance, it's like a you can definitely see that going away, that there's not going to be a need for humans manning a customer service telephone center, for instance you know, yeah, I mean if it's good, I mean if it's good you know, and it depends upon the service that's being talked about, but if it's good, you know, maybe it does See, efficiency is not effectiveness.

Dan: You know, and effectiveness is that you made a sale. Efficiency is we took all the activities leading up to a sale and we made them more, faster and easier. Yeah, the question is did you get a sale out of it?

Dean: Mm-hmm.

Dan: Mm-hmm, yeah, so. I don't know, but I think there's a bit of a magician show going with a lot of different kinds of technology, you know. I mean, it was like somebody was saying, you know, they were talking about EVs and specifically they were talking about a Tesla, and specifically they were talking about a Tesla. And he says do you know how much faster zero to 60 is in a Tesla than any gas-powered? Or you know, and I said, to tell you the truth, I don't know.

Dean: To tell you the truth. You know.

Dan: Geez, you know All the things I've been thinking about since last Monday. I'm sorry, I just didn't get to that one Anyway. And he says well, it's easily a second faster. I said good. I said now, where do you do this? There isn't any way. We're in greater Toronto, the area of greater. Toronto 6 million people, where you can go from 0 to 60 on a city street in two seconds. You know and everything like that.

He said, yeah, but boy, you know, I mean, just think of that, how much faster you can go. And I said, yeah, but Teslas don't go any faster in Toronto than any other car, that's true, and usually they're stopped.

Dean: Yeah, that's exactly right yeah.

Dan: So I think the Tech Magic Show, I think it multiplies people's imagination, but it doesn't multiply their results. You know, I think there's something about it. And I think this is great. I mean what you're telling me. I've had some really boring people on the other end of a phone call and Scarlett Johansson would really liven it up a little bit.

Dean: Absolutely yeah, yeah, exactly.

Dan: Yeah, I was noticing that Cleveland hired Jack Nicholson and they still use it. It must have been 20 years ago. All the announcements, the regular announcements like don't leave your bags unattended, and things like that, oh right. There's a whole bunch of just what I would call airport announcements, and they have Jack Nicholson doing it and you stop and listen every time it starts. You know it's very effective and I'm sure and I'm sure Scarlett, I'm sure Scarlett Johansson would do a good job too.

Dean: Absolutely. Yeah, yeah, it's so, it's so funny. I mean, that seems. I'm just dumbfounded by the fact that productivity has decreased in the 50 years that we're talking about here.

Dan: Yeah Well, think of the 50 years, though, and you gave me that great book.

Dean: Yeah, you gave me the book that was 1900 to 1950, 1925.

Dan: But 1925 to 1975, the entire country was being electrified. They're laying in lines and everybody was the farm that I was on. I was born in 1944. That farm was electrified in 1928. So it was only 16 years that they had electricity. Right, and you know they were putting in the entire water systems. The Tennessee Valley Authority was putting in all these dams and the electric plants. You know Lake Mead as a result of the Hoover Dam.

They were putting in all those dams and that just produced enormous jumps and the cars were going in, the gas systems, all the infrastructure for gasoline was going in. It was just a monstrously productive period of time. And then all the production that went into the second world war, which they then had as productive capability after the war stopped and so they had all the manufacturing capabilities you know and you know and so. But there's to see the thing is, the real jump that's happened is the jump in computing. There's no question.

Dean: There's been a monstrous jump.

Dan: It's a billion times since 1970. It's a billion times. That doesn't translate into money, and money is what productivity is based on. How much more money are you making per hour of human labor? How much more money are you making for our human labor? Now maybe somebody will say well, we got to start counting the robots in our GDP. Something is doing work. Yeah, Just I mean wow, wow, wow, the only problem with you know the only thing about robots, though they're shitty consumers.

Dean: Yes, exactly that's so funny. Yeah, they don't buy anything you know.

Dan: Yeah, A computer is a good worker, you know. It doesn't take breaks, doesn't get sick you know doesn't form unions anything. You know it doesn't go home, it doesn't have a house, doesn't have furnishings doesn't need furniture doesn't go out to eat.

Dean: Right, right. We're definitely in a stage right now where there's opportunities more than ever for economic alchemy, creating money out of nothing, seemingly compared to 1975.

I'm not sure how that happened, I think, since in the digital world we're essentially creating money out of ether, you know, out of attention, even in a way that if we just take the attention economy or the portion of the money that is derived from the advertising world in, where it was print ads, television ads, radio ads those were things that were kind of happening in 19, right and, but they were selling sort of physical goods, whereas now I remember having a conversation with Eben Pagan about this, when I did a book Stop your Divorce in 1998, when it was when PDFs were just coming to be a thing where you could create a digital document that didn't require printing a physical book and you could email that or somebody could download it.

And I just realized that you know, in that we've literally sold $5 million of a picture of a book not physically printing. These thousands and thousands of books, it's literally no zero physical good. That's why I wondered about whether the GDP is only measuring you, because we're definitely in a time where you can create money from nothing and the way that was driven was from Google AdWords.

Dan: You can't create anything from nothing. No, I mean nothing physical, any. You can't create any. I don't think you can create anything from nothing there. No, I mean okay, nothing physical. Okay, that's what I mean.

Dean: Yeah, like you look at it, that the book, you know we created the book and turned it into a pdf that was put on a website that there's no physical manifestation of it's, only digital. You can only see it online. People would search on Google for save my marriage or how to stop a divorce, or any of the keywords we could magically get in front of those people on their screen. They could click oh, stop your divorce, how do I do that? They click on that. They read this digital.

It didn't cost anything other than what was paid for was that we paid google for the, you know, for sending that, you know the ability to display that person, that opportunity to somebody. We paid google every time somebody clicked on that ad and then they would buy the book and it would automatically take them to a page to download the book. There was no inter, no human interaction and no physical exchange. It was all 100 digital and that was where, you know, I started referring to that as alchemy, really like creating money out of of bits. You know, yeah, yeah, that's so that.

Dan: Yeah, I think there's no I think there's uh no question that we've moved into a what I call a non-tangible realm of creating value, creating property and everything else, but at the end of the day it all adds up somewhere where this constitutes an economic transaction and as far as the accountants care, they don't care whether it was something physical or sold or everything. There's taxes that are taken out of that. I don't see the remarkable difference. You're using a different medium, but there is work that goes into that.

And you had a big payoff with one, but there were another thousand people right at the same time you were doing that and their results? They put in a lot of work, they put in a lot of effort and it didn't produce any money whatsoever. Efforts go into GDP, your efforts go into GDP and there's way more of them than there is of you. So it brings you the overall results down and you know so and we kind of know. We kind of know that. You know productivity numbers. You know, like, on a year I know people talk about well, that productivity is going to go up by 20% as a result of that.

Well, that may be true for a single company, but that's not true for the industry they're in, because their new thing going up by 20% may actually make obsolete 5 or 6 or 20 other companies who have had productivity that a year before, but now they have no productivity at all. So their loss of productivity is balanced against the gain of productivity.

Dean: Yeah, that's interesting. I guess you think about that. That could be true in all the casualties of the digital transition here, right Like, what do you look at?

Dan: Well, certainly the advertising world, certainly the advertising world, I mean before Mark Zuckerberg and before Google, newspapers like the New York Times.

Dean: Daily.

Dan: Edition was very thick.

Dean: Yeah.

Dan: And half of it was advertising. Now it's very thin okay because, they don't have the same. Yeah, but there's winners and losers, you know, in this, and you have a technological breakthrough, you have far more losers than you do winners.

Dean: Yeah, I'm looking at like I was just listening to an interview with that Tucker Carlson did with someone I forget who, some former CBS correspondent you know, and they were talking about the new. You know what's really changed now is the reach capabilities you know, like Tucker really primarily being on his own platform but using the reach of x has, you know it's the audience is accessible to everybody, as opposed to him in the beginning of their careers, the only way to get reach was to be signed to a, a digital, or assigned to a traditional network where the eyeballs were.

But, now the eyeballs are accessible to everybody and it really becomes these are my words, but it's more of a meritocracy in a way that you're you know that it's available for everybody. The cream definitely can rise to the top if you've got a voice that people resonate with.

Dean: Yeah, I mean, and Tucker's a star, tucker's a star. He's got his following, he's got probably a couple million followers. Whatever he was big when he was on Fox and he had the top numbers on Fox and everything like that, but there aren't two of them.

Dean: Right, and you can't replace him with an AI either.

Dean: No, but what I mean is we pick out the winners. It takes a lot of losers to get to a winner, you know and I think this is more extreme in the Cloudlandia world than it is in the physical world- you know. I mean, I think there's a thing called network effect and the network effect is you can only have one Amazon. Basically, you can only have one Amazon. Because, the nature of Amazon is to suck everybody's customers up into one destination.

There aren't five Amazons competing with each other, and that's what digital does. A person like Taylor Swift couldn't have existed 20 years ago. They wouldn't have had the reach. Yeah, that's true, and she's got the reach today.

I mean she's coming along and she's got a lot of things going for her. She's very attractive, she's very productive, she pumps out songs all the time and the songs seem to resonate with a mood in the public right now. And everybody's got their cell phones and everybody's got that. And what I'm saying is, if you have one Taylor Swift, you can't have two. Well, yeah, that's.

Dean: I mean it's, I wonder you start to see that she's just a, she's one voice, right Like I look at, I've been following rabbit holes like up the chain. You know and I start so Taylor Swift is a good example that many of her biggest hits and biggest success have been in collaboration with Max Martin, who is a producer who I often talk about and refer. Second, he's got the second biggest number of number one songs to his credit, right behind. He just passed Paul McCartney or John Lennon, and only Paul McCartney is ahead of him. Now he's about five songs behind Paul McCartney.

What I realized is, you know, there's a way that it's kind of like you get max martin's voice is really what is, you know, behind most of the the most popular music, or much of the most popular music, and yet not many people could pick him out of a lineup. And then then I went another layer up. It just dawned on me, like in the last couple of weeks here, that the real catalyst to Max Martin's success was Clive Davis. Who is? Do you know who? Clive Davis is the former, or still, record executive.

Dean: He was the head of so far, your records so far. So far, you're introducing me to a lot of new people.

Dan: Okay, great well, I, I just love this that. You know, max martin, I've been saying, as that's the thing, like you think about one thing Max Martin's one thing has been making hit records. Right, that's all he's done. Making pop songs since 1996, or what is first number one. But if you trace it all the way back, the catalyst to it because he was in Sweden, there was a group years ago called Ace of Bass and they had a number one song.

But when you go all the way back to how that happened, it was because Clive Davis, who was the head of Columbia Records and all its subsidiaries, arista and Jay Records, and all its subsidiaries, arista and J Records and all of these things, he found that song. He's like a guesser and better. He was guessing that song is going to be a hit and he signed Ace of Base to bring them to America. So he plucked this obscure Swedish band out of and brought them to America and on the wave of that, created the opportunity for Max Martin to work with all these great artists that happened to be under the direction of Clive Davis. And if you go even one layer beyond that, the guy that owns Bertelsmann, you know G Music Group in Germany. They own almost all the record labels, kind of thing. It's him seeing Clive Davis and putting up a million dollars for Clive Davis to start this record label. It's amazing that it all, kind of you know, goes back to capital allocation.

Dean: But the big thing is none of that has to do with any productivity.

Dan: Yeah, that's the thing I wonder, you know, I mean that really.

Dean: No, well, what you're talking about is. You mentioned a name. Yes, and he does this and he's very successful and he's famous for being successful. But at the same time that he was doing what he was doing, there were 9,999 who were waiting on tables and doing this on weekends and nights, yeah, okay, and they weren't making any money at all. So what.

I'm saying is when you pick a winner out and you see, see how productive they are using new technology you also have to account for the people who are using the new technology and not making any money at all, and therefore it's not more productive. Yeah.

Dan: Yeah.

Dean: And I mean, you know we haven't talked about him for a while, Mr Beast. Yeah, and people say, see what you can do when you're 18? You won't see anything because he's so unique. And he has such a set of circumstances that there's nothing that he does that is repeatable by another person.

Dan: I mean, yeah, he just became just in the last, I haven't heard anything about him.

Dean: Is he still doing stuff? I don't know. Is he still doing stuff? I don't know. Is he still doing stuff? Yeah, yeah, he just became. Or is he retired at 28?

Dan: No full steam ahead.

Dean: He's got a 300-foot.

Dan: He just became the number one subscribed channel in the world. He was the number one individual but there was this T-Series channel in India, which wasn't a person a different thing. Now he's the number one thing. He's now working on an Amazon show. He's taking his stuff to to amazon still full steam ahead with his, with his videos, but he's doing a big game show series in uh with under the amazon banner yeah, yeah, yeah.

Dean: it's really interesting because you know again I go back that it seems to me that a lot you know and I've made this statement before is that a new technology comes out, or a new form of a new technology comes out. A whole series of people say I'm going to create a new company based on this technology and I want you know, I need some early investors.

I need investors to get there, and so there's a whole industry for doing that in Silicon Valley and other places, and so billions are raised, not just for the one you know, not one investment, but for let's say 50 investments. And none of them go anywhere, none of them go anywhere.

Dan: You know, nothing happens, okay, but people did make money because it's based on a Ponzi scheme kind of thing that the early investors get paid out by the late investors who end up pulling nothing and everything else.

Dean: None of that represents productivity. Right A lot of action, a lot of excitement, a lot of money, but no productivity. And we're seeing that with AI. Goldman Sachs, the big investment bank, came out that, going on two years since open AI, we just don't see that there's any money to be made with this, except if you're like the chip maker, NVIDIA.

They make a lot of money and they're very productive, and I think the reason is that I think that AI, if I look at the next 10 years, I think it's going to be very effective, it's going to be very useful and it's going to be very important for solving complexity problems that we already have on the planet. Okay, and you know, a great example is just large city congestion complexity, like Toronto, I think, may have the worst traffic congestion in North America.

Dan:
I did notice a big difference in that, even in the five years since I was there.

Dean: Yeah. And the main reason is that they're making new cars, but they're not making new roads.

Dan: Yeah, and I noticed that they've actually added a lot of bike lanes too, which have taken out some of the actual lanes.

Dean: Yeah, Actual lanes, yeah, yeah, so without some new kind of solution to congestion and I think AI is the perfect tool for this and that all the traffic lights, all the traffic lights in the city are a single system and you're just changing the frequency of the lights changing and everything around the car changing the frequency of the lights changing and everything around the country, and there's a sort of a master view, how you know you can reduce the amount of people just stuck in the city by 40% if we just get all the lights. That's a complexity problem.

Dan: You know and for example.

Dean: The other thing is they haven't. You know, for all. The study of weather is probably the most complex system that we have on the planet and to this day they have no notion what effect clouds have on climate. You know they don't. They really. Clouds are just very complex. So if you had the ability to, I mean, they know different types of clouds and different things that happen when you have different types of clouds. They know that, but there's no unification of their understanding of the cloud system.

And so you'd have to apply it to that. Now, you're not creating anything new with this. You're solving an existing problem. With this, you're solving an existing problem. My sense is that the best use of technology is always to solve some problem that you already have not create a new opportunity that's interesting.

Dan: So maybe that's how I mean yeah, go ahead. I was just saying maybe that's how I should be thinking about my relationship with juniper yeah, what?

Dean:what complexity problems do you have?

Dan: Exactly what complexity problems do I already have that Juniper could solve for me?

Dean: Yeah, like getting out of bed in the morning. That's a complexity problem. When does my first coffee arrive? Exactly yeah, why am I still thinking about this? Why at this late date.

Dan: Oh man, that is so funny.

Dean: It is funny.

Dan: The funny thing is I posted up on Facebook right before we got on our podcast today. I took a picture of my. I have these. I have these Four Seasons Valhalla coffee cups and I took a. I made a coffee before our here and I posted up a picture of it right Pre-podcast caffeination, prior to the prior to our podcast here. So I'm fully caffeinated. I'm on the, I'm on the juice.

Dean: Yeah, I will tell you this. Chris Johnson, great thinker in the FreeZone program he's got it's not his system, he's licensed his system from someone else but he had 32 callers to set up meetings with their primary salespeople for his company and he's in the placement business. He finds really good high-level people to go into construction companies and engineering companies. And he was telling us that his 32 human callers could make 5,500 phone calls and produce a certain result in a day of phoning.

And since he's brought in his AI system, they can do 5,500 in an hour and produce a better result of people agreeing to phone calls. Well, that's productivity.

Dan: Yeah, I guess. So yeah, pretty amazing huh.

Dean: And he let go his 32 humans. Oh, my goodness. Wow, so this is AI making outbound phone calls? These are all AI and they've got complete voice capability of responding to responses and everything else. And then they get better every day. They have sort of upgrades every day for it. And that's productivity, that's productivity.

Dan: Yeah, there's, yeah, that's a. That's an amazing story. An amazing story, I mean, you start to see, I just look at the things, even when we had the AI panel at FreeZone in Palm Beach. You're just seeing the things, even what Mike Kamix is able to create and the things that Lior is doing. You just think, man.

Dean: I think we're early.

Dan: Yeah, absolutely, we're early.

Dean: Yeah, I mean I think we're in the first or second year of the internet with us, right?

Dan: Exactly, I agree. That's why I say, that's why, in my summation here, I'm kind of thinking you know 2025, give it another 18 months. It's only 18 months old now when you really think about it. Right, this is it's 18 months, and give it another 18 months and we'll see that people you're already starting to see that people are taking the AI capabilities and they're honing it into an interface. That is, a logo maker, for instance, or AI. You know that it's already honed into the ability to specialize in making logos based on your prompts, or and I think that's where that's what I meant by the interface moment is people are going to start carving out, packaging very specific outcomes from the capabilities. Like, if we have these capabilities, what can we do and just deliver that specific outcome, rather than the capability to create that outcome that's why it's funny that that's kind of parallel to what I've been saying.

I've seen people that are taking and training large language models based on your you know, all of the you know let's call it all the Dan Sullivan content that's been out there and then touting it as you know, having Dan Sullivan in your pocket, that you can ask Dan anything of it in your pocket, that you can ask Dan anything. But I think the ability to ask you anything isn't as useful as the ability to have Dan ask you things. Yes, I think that's the question.

Dean: So in the last quarterly book, and the one we're finishing right now. So it was everything is created backward, where the tool we featured was the triple play, and then the next one is called casting, not hiring, where the tool is the four by four casting tool. We call it the four by four casting tool, and this is where I'm asking them questions.

Dan: Right, okay.

Dean: I don't see any value whatsoever of them asking me questions.

Dan: Right.

Dean: Because I'm not getting the benefit of the question. Some software program is handling it, so I'm not learning anything and I've got a rule that I don't involve myself in any activity where I don't learn something new.

Dan: Okay.

Dean: So there's getting the benefits, but plus we'd be competing with ourselves.

Dan: I love it All, right Well off, we go.

Dean: I will phone you next week I'll be at the cottage. I'll be looking out at a mystic blue lake while I'm talking.

Dan: Oh, wow.

Dean: It's really good yeah.

Dan: Awesome. Well, have a great week, okay, and I'll talk to you next week. Thanks, thanks, dan. Bye.

In today's episode of "Welcome to Cloudlandia", Dan and I discuss the unexpected cold weather that recently swept through Florida and Ontario. We talk about how the weather can affect our moods and the emotional connection between climate and architecture. We share personal stories about winters and pay tribute to oak trees that stand steadfast throughout the seasons.

We also consider community planning and how neighborhoods can either embrace nature or ignore natural elements. Additionally, we explore innovative housing, such as modular and 3D-printed designs, while considering ideas on population growth. The future of shelter looks promising.

Finally, we wrap up by examining the impact of advertising on media polarization and the changing news landscape.

SHOW HIGHLIGHTS

<li>Dan and I discuss the unexpected cold in Florida and Ontario, touching on Seasonal Affective Disorder and the psychological impact of weather on mood.</li> <li>We pay tribute to the significance of oak trees and their presence through the seasons, exploring how community planning can integrate with nature.</li> <li>Dan reminisces about the grandiose architecture of the Gilded Age and contrasts it with the simplicity and utilitarian focus of modern home designs.</li> <li>We explore the historical context of Craftsman-style homes and the influence of income tax and antitrust laws on architectural styles.</li> <li>We delve into the topic of U.S. population growth predictions and Peter Zeihan's perspective on the country's capacity to double its population without feeling more congested.</li> <li>The conversation shifts to the current political landscape, analyzing the dichotomy between Biden and Trump, and the challenges faced by third-party candidacies.</li> <li>We examine the accuracy and influence of betting markets on political forecasting and their reflection of public sentiment.</li> <li>Dan describes the impact of the pandemic on education and considers potential long-term effects on future generations.</li> <li>We discuss the shift from advertising to subscription models in media, considering the New York Times as a case study and touching on media polarization and the influence of digital giants.</li> <li>The episode concludes with reflections on the concept of climate as a statistical average of weather and historical climate patterns, challenging the narrative of global warming.</li>

Links:
WelcomeToCloudlandia.com
StrategicCoach.com
DeanJackson.com
ListingAgentLifestyle.com

TRANSCRIPT

(AI transcript provided as supporting material and may contain errors)

Dean: Mr Sullivan.

Dan: Mr Jackson Well well, well. Is it hot or cold? Didn't forward that to me.

Dean: Well, it is middling. I would say it's a little bit of a cast, but I think it's on its way. We had yesterday like the first day in several weeks that I felt a warmth in the air. There's been. We've had a bit of a cold overtone to everything.

Dan: Yeah, I think cold in Florida in January is worse than cold in. Ontario. Yes In your brain yeah.

Dean: And especially disappointing for people who come from Canada expecting.

Dan: I was contemplating this on the plane flight we flew it to Chicago yesterday afternoon and I was complaining at how oblivious I am generally to weather. Like I know, there are people who I don't know what the exact term is, but they have seasonal, seasonal mood disorder or something like that.

Dean: Seasonal affective effective disorder. Yeah, Sad.

Dan: Seasonal affective disorder. Right, yeah, and you know I don't exactly know what goes on there, but the only thing I can say I don't have it, yeah, exactly.

Dean: I don't mind overcast either. That's funny, but you know I am 24 years now into a snow free millennium with only two asterisks, and those asterisks are both because of you. The only time I've seen snow in this whole millennium is on the occasions when I've been in Toronto in the winter because of the cold In the winter, because of going to 10 times when you started the 10 times program, and then I believe there was one time in Chicago that there was some snow, usually three out of the four dates you get away with no snow, but there's always that December till, you know, april time when it somewhere in there you might end up with some snow.

Dan: Yeah, well, we have snow on the ground, I mean fresh to overnight, but the sidewalks are already dry, naturally, and I already arranged.

Dean: I already arranged, with the powers that be, to put the asterisks beside my thing, because although I've seen snow and been in the presence of snow, I've not had snow touch me, so the purity of it is intact, although the technicality of it is.

Dan: I've been in snow, so yeah, I remember our very first client from Australia mid 90s, from Sydney, and he came to his workshop in Toronto one winter and his wife came with him and he got a call from her while he was at the workshop that she had gone outside in a snow head fell on her.

Dean: In Australia or in no. In in Toronto, all right, a snow head falling on her.

Dan: It's the first time in her life that a snow she was talking about a flake.

Dean: She was talking about a flake yeah yeah, I got it A snow. Yeah, usually you can have as many as you want.

Dan: Front all you want, yeah. But I have very memorable childhood winters of hiking through fields and woods in the snowy season, and you know, and of course when you're six years old, the snow is deeper than it is when you're 80.

Yeah, but I, so my I have a real warm spot in my heart about snowy treks, you know, and imagining that you're a member of, you know, an arctic exploration, everything things that you do, you make up, you know, you make up, you know romantic images based on your reading regarding snow. But I like the forest seasons. I'm a real fan of the change from one season to the other. And then, you know, we have these massive oak trees in our lawn.

We have seven that are you know well over 100 feet and and they're real friends because we've had them now for you know, for at this particular spot, we've had them for 20,. This is our 22nd year. And you know and I just you know they're kind of friends, you know they're kind of dependable friends. Oaks tend not to disappoint, you know they're not they're never late, they always show up, you know that's exactly right.

Yeah, and but, it's just interesting to watch the change of the scenery and our lawn based on what happens to the oak trees over the course of an entire year.

Dean: Well, you, you have not yet been to the four seasons, Valhalla but we are surrounded by 150 year old oak trees. It's like a park. Right out in front of my house. I have a big one that spans over the driveway. It's beautiful.

Dan: I think these are called they're in the south there's this variety. They're called pin oaks. I don't know what the actual name Live oak. Well, live oaks are the best.

Dean: That's what I think we have, because they're they spread. You know, they've got quite a nice canopy.

Dan: When an oak tree is alive, that's the best.

Dean: Oh, I see, oh, yes, that is.

Dan: You know, You're always a bit worried about the dead ones, the dead oaks are the best yeah, oh my goodness you crack me up.

Dean: I'm constantly amazed that they come and so that tree in front of my house. We've got them all throughout the whole neighborhood here and they come and they'll like lop off entire branches, like entire, not just the little things but big things, and they'll just keep going and grow right back and shape the way, because often it'll they have to trim around because the limbs will come over my house right and if it were to fall it would be a problem. So they always keep it outside the perimeter of the roof.

Dan: Well, it must have been interesting because, to you know, the zoning in your place must have taken into account that you can't cut down the oak trees.

Dean: Yeah, that's true, that's everything is built around them and our H away takes care of all of the landscaping. So everything it's all uniform. It looks like a park so you don't have, you know, different levels of care being taken. Everybody's at the whole, the whole place looks great.

Dan: So no opportunity for status right.

Dean: That's exactly right and they owe that tightly deed restricted. Like you're, absolutely right, Like it's. You know, every house is the same brick. There's approved tile, they're all tile roof. You have to have a tile roof, you have to have copper flashings, you have to have this Valhalla brown as any exterior paint the windows, everything. It's all you know. They started in the late 80s building in here and they've, you know, as recently as two years ago. The last, the last home was, was built in here, but there's only 50 homes in here but you wouldn't be able to tell. You couldn't tell which ones are new and which ones are from, you know, 1980s, and that's. It's kind of nice, it's cool, but we've had you know I say it's funny.

You say it's an interesting thought that no opportunity for status in here. Because so when I moved in here 22 years ago now 2002, I was by far the youngest person in here and thought I was would joke that 20 years from now I'll be old enough to live in here. And this is a my neighborhood like. Right beside me, three of the four houses to my right were referred to at the time as Citrus Barron Row, where these guys were, all you know, in their 70s and 80s and had built the Citrus. You know they were all sort of competitors in the Citrus business in Polk County. At one time Polk County produced more Citrus than the entire state of California and so so these guys were all there.

My neighbor across the street was the guy who started Steak and Shake, the restaurant chain, and when he died he he left $20 million to Indiana University for the Kelly School of Business Wing there, and the my neighbor who moved in there is now the own company called Colorado Boxed Beef and they are like an Omaha Steaks type of thing. So anyway, fascinating people but very like low key. You never know about any of them that they're who they are, and I think that was part of the intention of the community, you know when they built the community. But it's very interesting.

Dan: Yeah, it's really interesting the reason I brought up the status thing, relationship to a, you know, a design community, you know just use the word design community and the first one actually was in. I think it was in New Jersey. And it was called Levittown and it was designed by a man by the name of Levitt, and that was the first design community that was where individuals could buy homes. I mean there were sort of during the industrial age, growing you know in the 1800s there was, there were company towns.

you know where the corporation, the company, would design all the homes and you know, they would do it on the cheap. They would do it on the cheap, and they're actually. There's a town outside of Chicago called Pullman.

Dean: And.

Dan: Pullman was the cars. Oh yeah, pullman cars right. Pullman.

Dean: Pullman cars, Rail rail cars, right yeah.

Dan: And the railways. Yeah, and that was a design company town and all the businesses were owned by the company and the only people who could live there were people who worked for the Pullman. So you've had that type of thing. You've had that type of thing, you know. You know it's probably from the beginning of industrialization, hershey, Pennsylvania, kind of that way too.

Dean: Yeah, Kohler, Wisconsin yeah.

Dan: Kohler, wisconsin. Yeah, and so the. But I think Levittown was actually. It's worth it for people to look it up. It's a very interesting thing.

Dean: Yeah, I remember seeing some documentary about it.

Dan: And it was huge. I mean it was huge, it was in the thousands of homes.

Dean: Yes.

Dan: And yeah, and then you know, the idea caught on.

Dean: Yeah, well, that was what, as the evolution of you know, as cars became the big thing in the highway system, you know you could have. That was where the suburbs really began. That was one of the first suburbs of Firecall. Yeah, yeah, very interesting that actually started that really started in.

Dan: I read the history of the Victorian age and Great Britain which, last you know, is basically from the beginning of Queen Victoria, which was, I think, 1820s, 1830s, right up until she died and she was in for more than 60 years. And but the big thing was the expansion of the London rail system. You know it kept going further and further out and you know London Americans who have no idea of what you know a city train system looks like, because London has seven that I visited. They may have more, but they had seven major railroad stations and these are huge. These are as big as you know. They're like Grand Central Station but there's seven of them.

And then the lines go out like the, you know like the, like a clock face that go out, you know and, but they kept pushing them further and further out, and one of the big things was that you could live right on the rail system and they started building these suburban towns, not with the uniformity that you're talking about with you know, with your, your community, but but that whole idea of the suburbs became a big thing, you know, and and that it changed things economically, it changed things politically, changed things culturally.

Dean: And that's.

Dan: That's very interesting thing. And you know and contrast that with where we have our home in Chicago, that right after the war it was sort of a factory or it's right near the airport and they built all these boxes you know, and they were just streets and streets. Yeah, yeah, and they were the same. They were, you know, not big but completely uniform, and I think around that happened probably for a period of 10, 15 years, straight up till the 60s, and then the. Park Ridge, the town that I live in, passed a law that if you build the house, it couldn't be.

It had to be different from the two houses on each side of you.

Dean: Oh, wow, that's interesting. I wonder about that, Like the. This evolution would be an interesting, like you know, seeing the architectural journey because, if you go back to, have you ever been to Newport in in Rhode Island? Yeah, newport, rhode Island, have you ever been to see the? Vanderbilt mansions and all those things.

Dan: Well, they were called cottages.

Dean: They were called Newport cottages, exactly. I love that yeah.

Dan: Yeah, they had 40 rooms, you know yeah.

Dean: So when you look at it in a world pre-income tax and pre-antitrust all of those things- I think income tax probably made a difference. Probably.

But, you look at that, that gilded age of where opulence was the thing, that's where you get all those, you know, huge mansions, in New York City even, and the whole thing. People were, they were big and there's nowhere. You know, across the street from me there is a new development. So one of the Valhalla was kind of out, you know, surrounded by 350 acres that one Citrus family owned for years, right there's almost a mile on Lake Eloise of Lakefront, and there was no houses on it, it was all just orange groves. And so recently, you know, a few years ago, they sold the land and now they're starting to develop this neighborhood, this new, you know, giant subdivision called Harmony, and the houses they start the first phase, like in the last, in the last year, they've, you know, made quite amazing Headway on it.

But damn, the houses that they're building have as much character as the houses in the board game monopoly. They're just little Boxes that they're putting right beside each other on all of these things. And the two-story houses look like the hotels In monopoly, you know, and there's no, they're just boxes with windows and a two-car garage and a driveway and Zero Character. You look at the homes that were being built in the, you know, in the 20th year. They 1800s, 19, 120s. The homes were all Craftsman style homes, you know, like there was some artistry to them. Now, in every way, it's really come full circle to pure Utilitarian. You know, utility, just what's the?

yeah right angles with very little, you know very little.

Dan: Yeah, it's really, really interesting because you know there's kind of a Van vanity that goes along with the times. You know another yeah well, we do things better than people did a hundred years ago. Well it was very interesting that a hundred years ago you could go to the Sears and Roba catalog. Yeah and you could go, where you could buy a house of the and, and they would have pages and pages of different styles, and, and what you would do is you would order it you know, yeah, and you had to pay.

You had to pay for it. You know you had to send a money order. You had to Western Union that you know you had to send a telegram and then the money would be secured at the other end and about five days later, by train and truck, your house kit would arrive, and then you had to engage with a local builder and the local builder would just follow the manual and would put up a house, and some of these houses were 10, 12 Room houses, you know yeah yeah, they had big porches and everything else.

And then you could modify them. I mean, you could modify them, you could paint them whatever color you wanted it. There's actually a town in Michigan, frankenmuth, which is sort of a German theme. It's sort of one of those theme towns. You know where. It's a German town, so they have a big October fest there every year and you know they have German restaurants and I suspected happened because there were a lot of German immigrants to that area of Michigan. But they have more intact lived in Sears and Roboc houses than any other community.

Dean: Oh, wow and and.

Dan: But if you go to, you know, if you go to Google and you just put in Sears and Roboc houses images, you'll see the bit, you'll see all the pictures of these houses in there. It would be considered sort of lavish today, these houses, you know. But it was just you know it just arrived by train. You know it was big curtain after curtain. Everything Funny that we've kind of come.

Dean: We've kind of come full circle on that. Now. The biggest trends are, you know, pre modular manufactured manufactured homes yeah, that they deliver, and even now 3d printed homes and I think it's probably gonna be a combination of that of 3d printed and Modular yeah, interior things that's gonna be. But you know, you look at it, it's like we're still have you seen in any? I don't haven't followed it, but population projections for the United States over the next 50 years. Have you seen what's the projection?

Dan: So they're three, you know, they're mid is probably, you know, and that's a lot of illegal people who became legal you know, so there's a ton of illegal People in the country right now right and everything. But they estimate. You know that the US is going to grow pretty much at. You know, if you look back 30 or 40 years probably, you know probably the same rate of growth to you know, one or two percent per year that population grows and but they're the Peter Zion in his books and I thought about him a lot on the pre bird podcast.

Yeah, but he said that the United States still has so much land. Oh yeah not, that's not settled. I mean it's. You know, it's geographically established. And everyone but he said the US could. This was. He was using three 330 million as the base number there and he said if you doubled the population 660 million the country wouldn't feel any more crowded than it does now.

Dean: Yeah, that's very interesting and I can attest to that for Florida in itself, yeah, but we was Hard.

Dan: As for it is like 30 million now, I think it is.

Dean: No, it's on its way to 30 million in by 30. By 2030 it should be 30 million. Yeah, it's 20, 24 million or something right now, but we're the fastest growing. They are alternating between Texas and, but we grew last year at 1200 people a day, you know. So we're growing a city the size of Orlando every year. Yeah, and there's plenty of part of the reason.

Dan: Part of the reason, I think, is the retiring baby boomers.

Dean: Oh, yeah, yeah.

Dan: And in other words, that I may be an anomaly, that I'm 80 and I'll be 80 in May and I don't feel the cold doesn't bother me. You know, right, cold weather, but there's a lot of people, you know, I mean if you have arthritis. You know the cold bothers you, you know and other things. But you know, I know I have no thought of ever and Babs would be with me here. No thought of ever living as our permanent home anywhere but Toronto right and.

But we visited, our favorite is Arizona, so we go to. Arizona a lot during the year, yeah, and. But I have no, you know, I mean there wouldn't be anything under. Well, one day We'll be able to go and you know they'll spend.

Dean: You know, spend you know, six months, yeah, some warm, and that doesn't really. That's playing into Florida's hand in that it's still part of the dream for many people.

Oh yeah, it's you know you when we were talking about guessing and betting, that you know I think that's a pretty certain guess that from you know what's not going to change in the next 20 years, that you know right now still we're in the middle of the, the baby boom, baby boomers turning 65, there's going to be 10,000 people a day turning 65 right now, which will be 2028.

Dan: 2028 is the year when all people born during the baby boom era are now older than 65. Yeah, 2028.

Dean: Yeah, so you look at that and it's like in the Northeast that is almost like you know. It's almost like mandatory military requirement. Back it up. This is where you get shipped to.

Dan: This is where you get shipped to yeah, yeah, yeah and, of course, the Northeast is by far the most expensive from a government standpoint is the most expensive part of the country. Yeah regulation and taxes.

Dean: Yeah, you know.

Dan: I would say from New Jersey right up to the Canadian border. You know that there's a movement south. I mean, obviously Florida has great attractions. You know, other than, but even economically, that your tax and regulations are way more tolerable than in the. Northeast. Yeah, you know I kid people who are from California, you know I. You know who are in the plant base. New York not so much New York, but California.

It's easier to pick on New York than it is, or pick on California than it is. New York, california was the dream place. You know, you went to. California. That was the great dream, and I said so at some point. Are you thinking about moving to the United States?

Dean: That's funny. Yes, exactly.

Dan: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I've got a client who's from Montana Bozeman, and he's. I said why is Bozeman so popular? And they said it's, it's. It's the closest place in Montana that you can be near the United States.

Dean: Okay, it's so funny, those places, there are lots of those like. We've got a client in Miami, in South Beach, and they said that's the refrain, that's their clients. What they like about South Beach is that it's so close to America. You know, you can certainly be in it, but not of it there.

That's the truth, you know, yeah, yeah, I think that's kind of what you know every, that's what's kind of buoying. You know Ron DeSantis, his, you know his polling is. You know, the only reason he's even in the running is because of you know people looking at what he's done for Florida. His whole campaign was make America Florida.

Dan: But that would be, you know, that would be candidate who just has had no United, no experience outside of Florida.

Dean: Absolutely Right, I think that's it.

Dan: Each of the states is a country and people. You know people have their. You know the whole notion that everything should be like one place.

Dean: Yeah Right, that's not it.

Dan: I mean, there were a lot of rookie mistakes that he made. You know you, yeah. The other thing is that he's running up against somebody who's done two complete national campaigns before this one. He's a great organizer I mean President Trump is.

Dean: I think everybody is. I think everybody is baffled by his. I mean, it's not even close the lead that Trump has over everybody else in the polling and in the you know the things. It's just what a year this is going to be, you know, to see how this all plays out. Yeah, and I think some cases.

Dan: some cases are going to, especially at the level of the Supreme Court, and one of them is, of course, the appeal to the Colorado move.

Dean: Oh yeah.

Dan: Trump can't be on the ballot and I think if the justice the justices, I mean it'll the Supreme Court will overturn it, but I think the justices would be smart to make it 9 to 0. Yeah, because this is and it's just an interpretation of one of the amendments the 14th Amendment, and that's you know, and, and they're going to establish that, and then that becomes the precedent. So all the other states, like Maine or anybody else is thinking about it can't do it you know, and that's the role of the Supreme Court are to interpret the Constitution.

Dean: Yes.

Dan: But that'll be seen as a big win. And then there's another one that he has where there's a special prosecutor who's after him and there's he appealed the special prosecutor that he needed to ruling and they said, no, this is your issue, you have to go through the court system. And that was a win for Trump. And and the whole point is everybody's desperately trying to get the actual trials because he's been indicted in before the election. But there's all sorts of ways that you can delay it into the future. You know, and anyway, so I was reading that the whole notion of January 6 and the insurrection, you know that's the key issue here, that January 6. And insurrection, but none of the charges against him are mentioned. The word insurrection, you know they mentioned. You know it's tax things that he hit documents with him, you know you know when he left the White House and everything like that.

But I don't think they're going to stand up to scrutiny and but everyone that he wins now is like his poll numbers go up when he's indicted. His polls numbers go up when the retirement is overturned his poll, numbers go up.

Dean: Yeah.

Dan: But he's 24 seven. The thing that the media know is that when they have anything about Trump, they get higher viewership and there's more advertising dollars and so they're caught because they'd like to take him down. But everything they do to take him down increases his poll numbers. Crazy, yeah, but it's interesting. But it's interesting like the. You know, my Jeff Maddoff and I did a podcast last Sunday and we were comparing the phenomenon of Taylor Swift, the phenomenon of Trump. Oh, wow.

Completely different. You know completely different world and everything but but each of them has created a movement that people feel that they can participate in. Yeah this is. Nobody in the music industry has what she has as a movement and nobody in the political realm has what he has in the. You know it's a nationwide movement. Yes that you feel you can participate in, and but it's amazing to me how heavy the field is.

Dean: You know, in terms of like, it's really only Biden and Trump. There's no real viable, no candidate. I mean even as much of a. You know we saw Robert Kennedy in Genius Genius network and you know they as running as an independent, which is, you know, that's a non-starter and there's no, that's not a difficult. That's not a difficult bet to guess. Even if he is a reasonable, you know it has some things and you start to see now even know there's nobody coming Behind, is not even any alternatives.

You know like you look at Vivek Ramaswamy and yeah, you know, although he kind of has Obama Undertones to reminds me, like as a speaker and articulator, communicator, but I don't know, for me he it's just the tone, that it's more important to him to be right, that he was a win. The argument you know through, yeah, clever Elecution yeah.

Dan: I don't know how that win the battle, but lose the war.

Dean: That's what it feels like to me. Right like that is just kind of that. It just has.

Dan: It's more important to him the real motivation is to prove that he's smart enough, or whatever you know yeah, and you know, I mean first of all the times we're in dictates whether people think that somebody's viable or not. And I mean this is a time of tremendous change. I mean, it's probably the Most change since the second world war. I would yeah that, the overall changes that we're going, and and everything gets Shaky and unhinged just when you have a big, when you have I just looked at like last night.

Dean: It was so funny. I looked at the you know the odds Makers, the. I found a cumulative thing and it's it's all trump. Trump is the the Betty market.

Dan: the bedding, yeah, the bedding market is all on trump, and that's yeah.

Dean: Yeah, and the betting markets.

Dan: They were wrong with trump the first time. They you know they were they. I mean they had Hillary, like Day before the election they had heard like at 85, 90 percent, you know, yeah. So so people say yeah, yeah, but that was a fluke, that was a look and I said, yeah, but what if the candidate candidate himself, is the fluke?

Dean: Right, exactly.

Dan: No, but I did.

Dean: Of all of the field. It wasn't. It's not like an 80 percent thing there, I think it was like 40 percent Likely, which is the top of all of the.

Dan: That was against the field, including everybody including, but what you go head on head, they all have trump Biden and it's like 60 versus 60 40, you know oh, wow, okay that's interesting and yeah, and that's what people are betting on, but that those, the betting markets, can be gained and and I'll give you an example was brexit, which happened, you know, in the may, in may or june, I think of 16 before the presidential election, and the interesting thing is that debates are a big thing in Great Britain and they're televised and there were 10 of them in the six months leading up to the actual vote on brexit Britain leaving the European Union and

and I watched them and with every debate the Leave side had all the emotional issues. The Stay side had a lot of intellectual, intellectual arguments and they were you know, they're British, they're very articulate. It was, you know, it was well said on both sides. But the the thing that really cracked the back against the stay side Was the european union decided, about three months before the campaign started, that they were going to regulate the electrical, electrical charge of teapots in Great Britain and everybody had to get rid of their teapot because they were using not too much. And this was coming from Brussels, you know, from the European union. You just lost it. You screw around with her because every If you have to change your tea cup, then every every day at three, three to five o'clock. You're talking right, get out of the european. You're not talking about.

Dean: You're talking about the football players.

Dan: You're saying let's leave Britain those suckers. They can't tell us, you know. So it's always like the bud light. One thing in the united states I said that was a crack, that was like an earthquake you know, that you're fooling around with our beer, can't you know you can't yeah you know, you can't fool around with our beer, can't I so funny you know and I think it's always comes down to a gut issue very emotional that everybody gets like everybody gets they're pulling around.

It's like you know, when they closed down all the schools, all the states that closed down the schools for it, they didn't close down the schools, they, they closed, I mean the individual schools for one reason or another. Can you know? Could you know have special reasons or anything? Else yes there wasn't coming from the top. There was no really on the schools and they did enormous damage.

We now know that there was enormous damage Done to those people right at the early stage, when they're starting to learn how to socialize or, you know, and I think we're going to see a damaged generation, maybe two damaged generations in the future, who, you know, had too much time on their hands alone. Yeah, my, my feeling is, and it strikes me right now, that trump just has a monopoly on all the gut, emotional issues.

Dean: I agree, like you look at, it's pretty amazing how Cloudlandia has really shaped the way we think about these elections, like I think, as cloudlandia has really become the primary place that the elections have. Probably you know, it seems they've become more contentious or more divide, dividing, and I don't know how to clear enough Remember you know what that happened.

Dan: Yeah, no way that happened. Yeah, and there I had a really good article on this and I had to do with how the media gets its advertising dollars. Right, okay and, first of all, the media got their advertising dollars taken away. Okay, because facebook and google have 70 percent of the ad money. Now just those two companies. Yeah, okay, so a lot of the media had to turn to a Subscription model so for example, let's take the new york times.

Yes and you know not my, you know it's not a paper that represents my political interest, but I always found it an informative paper. There were always good articles up until I would say, probably 10 years ago, okay, and and the reason was they made their money from newspapers that went to the street every day. Know that and whoever wanted to buy the new york times would buy the new york times. Yes but they were very thick papers.

The daily new york times was a paper and you know a lot of the pages. I mean 40 percent of the space was. Advertisers you know, yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, what happened then? When the, the advertising dollars went away, they had to go to a subscription model and therefore they just moved to the part Of the population whose politics agreed with the new york times, and they lost everybody. His politics didn't agree with the new york times.

And the same thing happened on on the other side of the political spectrum. So, for example, great bark, which is now a powerhouse On the, you know, on the internet that a strictly an internet. That's strictly an internet media company.

Dean: Yes, town hall.

Dan: Yeah, news news max town hall. These didn't exist. They really didn't exist. You know, 10, 15 years ago but, what people going to drift from the you know the media sources that they used to go go to because it just favored one side of the political spectrum. Look for new opportunities and these other, these other real, clear politics is another one real court pox has as emerged, and so that's what polarized things was the disappearance of advertising dollars.

Dean: Or the. You know, it's really interesting that you just brought something up that I thought about, that. You know the New York Times print edition, you were any. You had to get the whole newspaper and so you're getting all of the things, but when you're online, it's all parsed out to the individual articles the clickbait and who they're attracting, and then it made more sense to lean into the audience that you are attracting, right, that's.

So the bias became more pronounced, I think right or evident. You couldn't, on balance, balance it out in the entirety of a print edition of the newspaper, because it's only individual articles and pages that are getting attracting the traffic, you know.

Dan: Yeah.

Dean: That's something.

Dan: Yeah, so I mean there's many other reasons besides that particular one. But from an economic standpoint that was the main economic reasons why polarization has happened, and you know, and it's become much more subjective to the reporting has become much more. You know, they're not reporting on the facts, they're interpreting the facts and commentating on the facts. So you don't have reporters anymore, you have commentators. You know. You know the reporters are building them the political message into the reporting of the facts.

You know, and I mean, for example, you can't get any reporting on global, on weather you know weather, you know extreme weather without somebody interpreting as just another sign of global warming, which is, global warming is not a scientific issue, it's a political issue, right, right, right, yeah, yeah, the science doesn't support it. I mean, yeah, it's going up, but we're coming out of an ice age.

Dean: You know, we've been coming out of an ice age for 10,000 years, and that's what I meant, that's what I always fall back on that, dan, that somehow we lifted ourselves, the planet somehow lifted itself out of an ice age without the aid of combustible engines and fossil fuels. Yeah, so somehow that was the it was possible. You know it was happening before.

Dan: Yeah where I live in Toronto. I was under about 500 feet of ice Right.

Dean: Right, right. So, the big thaw.

Dan: Yeah, it takes a while, you know, for glaciers to actually, you know, and it's just a gradual warming up and then there's periods when it, you know it dips down. You know that you got ups and downs and you know the temperatures. You know the temperatures, you know, and there's fluctuations. You know the the heat. Climate doesn't actually exist. Climate is a statistical average. All the weather, like, yeah, where Valhalla, where you are, the climate in Valhalla is totally determined by 365 days of temperate. You know of weather and they're just measuring it and they call that the climate. But, nobody experiences. Nobody experiences climate.

Dean: We experience weather.

Dan: Yes, climate is just, it's just an abstract term to measure. You know, all the weather in one place and climate change Even, yeah, even, in Valhalla, probably, where you, where you are, are you shaded by the oak trees?

Dean: We not particularly. I mean it's, they're there. No, it's not. The whole house is not shaded by oak trees, but there is shade in the neighborhood, yeah.

Dan: Yeah, but it's really interesting that if you where you go for coffee. It might be an annual average. It might be one degree warmer where you're getting your coffee than where people live.

Dean: Oh, global warming.

Dan: Yeah, well, you know, it's kind of like I was thinking about all these yeah.

Dean: It's like you know Deming I was sort of in rereading Deming lately and you know one of his, his, the funnel experiments, where they would, you know, move and adjust the funnel based on the last result. So it's kind of, and that created the greatest variation by you know adjusting with each data point, as opposed to you know adjusting the system.

Dan: Yeah, well, here's the thing, that one of the you know you had the polar bears as one of the symbols of global warming. Remember the polar bearer thing? This was Al Gore. He got on the. You know the polar bears, the actual, actually the population of polar bears, and there aren't a lot of them, but you know, they're in a particular latitude, above a certain latitude line, going or going around the world, and their populations actually increased since he started making a prediction that they would be gone right now. So they've actually increased.

But the other thing, that the other thing is really interesting are the Maldives. The Maldives about a thousand islands in a cluster in the Indian Ocean and the Maldives have been petitioning the UN that they need to get a lot of money because you know they're sinking in the sea.

The average height of the islands. You know, and there's, you know, there's a thousand, I think there's a thousand in the what's called the Maldive Islands, and you know, it's about two feet above sea level. So they said well, you know, in 30 years we'll disappear. So we have to have massive money to redirect our population. And but actually the the geography of the Maldive Islands, maldives, has actually increased over the last 30 years. They've got now more land than you know, than they had. You know. And all of a sudden you say, well, why'd that happen?

Well, they said, we're trying to figure out why it happened, you know, and what about the problem we're? Trying to. We're trying to figure out why it happened. You know which? One is that everything that we were saying before was based on ignorance.

Dean: That's a good explanation. Exactly.

Dan: Yeah, but what I was going to say? I was just thinking about this the other day. When you look at every cause, you know political cause, you know whatever cause you have, it's about money. Okay.

Dean: Yes.

Dan: And every movement is a money making machine.

Dean: Yeah, that's. It's pretty cake or wrong really following the money.

Dan: It all comes down to Jerry McGuire. Show me the money. I'm going to explain any movement on the planet. Where's the money moving? Is the money coming in or is the money going out?

Dean: Yes.

Dan: Yeah, it was so funny because the Israelis, I think, 10 days ago, killed, I think, the number three Hamas guy who was living in Beirut. Wow, he was worth four billion a year. You know he made like four billion a year. And they've got the top six and they said you know we're going to find you and we're going to. You know we're going to kill you, but the top guys who don't live in Gaza, they live in Qatar.

Dean: Yeah.

Dan: Qatar. The pronunciation is Qatar. They're living in Istanbul, they're living in Beirut and I bet these are nervous people.

Dean: I bet yeah, yeah, could you imagine? I mean, that's kind of. It's an interesting. I had dinner with Leigh, or Weinstein, the other night, two nights ago, and you know we were talking. I didn't realize this, but you know he said there's only 15 million Jews in the world, the world, yeah, I would have thought it was way more. I mean, that seems such.

Dan: Well, it tells you the impact of the Holocaust or the Second World.

Dean: War yeah.

Dan: Without the Holocaust, there'd be now 35 to 40 million 40 million Jews. I saw a projection once. That's how devastating.

Dean: It was, yeah, at one point. Yeah, the Holocaust was probably 40% of the Jews. Which, yeah, if you implicate, I mean track that out. It's just like you were saying, yeah, probably 30 or 40 million, that would have. That would have been. I mean it's pretty, it's crazy, and the eight of them are in Israel or whatever, right, so that's.

Dan: No, it's not that high.

Dean: No, it wasn't it.

Dan: Actually Israel, just to surpass the United States, had six for the, you know it's not a fast growing a population.

Dean: Israel matters.

Dan: And I think they're at. The Jewish population now is could be maybe seven. It's on the way to seven, yeah.

Dean: Okay, so I wasn't that far off, yeah.

Dan: I think New York City itself has, New York City itself has two million.

Dean: Wow.

Dan: Two million. Yeah, yeah, that's wild. Yeah, you know they have a lot of history, you know. I mean, you want to know about what's happened to them over 3,000 years. Yeah, they've got a lot of history to talk about, you know, and what a self-granted is, and so so, anyway, yeah, it's really interesting, but they're not confused about who their enemies are.

Dean: Right, yes.

Dan: Anyway, I think it's meal time for you.

Dean: Yes, that is exactly right. I have wonderful.

Dan: What are today arriving?

Dean: Well, today Dan today, Dan, I have the Tuscan grilled pork chops arriving today with some broccoli, it's so good, it's very good and so yeah, I'm excited this so far this has been a really good. You know, removing of discretion in the pricing.

Dan: Row number one do not give Dan Dean Jackson discretion.

Dean: Right, exactly so. It allows, it allows rational Dean to make decisions for future team.

Dan: Yeah, and I get to enjoy them and it's projected into the future.

Dean: Yes.

Dan: We're into the future.

Dean: Yes, which is great, and so that, just for people listening, have discovered with in collaboration with Jay Virgin, we discovered we've chosen 10 power meals for me that are available on Grun Uber eats, and, using the pre order feature, I'm able to establish these deliveries at 12 o'clock and six o'clock and so bookend my days with these pre healthy meals. So so far, so good. Personal wisdom, yes, fantastic. So stay tuned.

Dan: Yeah, anyway, this was really good and this is about weather and location and dwellings.

Dean: And very interesting discussion. I love it. Well, have a great day, dan. A week, great week in Chicago, and then are we on for next week. Yeah, yeah.

Dan: I'm back in Toronto next week. Okay great, I can try. Yeah, all right. Okay good Thanks, bye, bye, okay.

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