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EPISODE SUMMARY

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, Jim Colassano, Senior Vice President at The Clearing House, joins host Joe Casali to discuss the transformative impact of the Real-Time Payments (RTP) network. He explains how RTP is revolutionizing how businesses manage payments, particularly on the send side. Jim highlights the shift from traditional batch processing to instant payments, emphasizing the network's ability to handle various transactions, from payroll and refunds to emergency funds and cash flow management.

Jim details how RTP's speed, finality, and 24/7 availability are key advantages over older systems. He addresses common misconceptions and objections, assuring listeners that RTP offers solutions for businesses of all sizes. Jim also dispels the myth of a single "killer app," demonstrating how RTP's versatility allows for diverse applications tailored to individual needs.

Finally, Jim discusses the network's growth and the increasing demand for real-time payment capabilities. He encourages businesses to explore the RTP network and its potential to solve their payment challenges. Jim emphasizes the importance of embracing new technologies to improve efficiency and customer experience.

GUEST-AT-A-GLANCE 

Name: Jim Colassano 

What he does: SVP, Product Development and Strategy 

Company: The Clearing House

Noteworthy: Payments expert with experience spanning from lockboxes to real-time innovations.

Where to find him: LinkedIn

KEY INSIGHTS

The Power of Real-Time Payments Extends Beyond Speed

While speed is a significant advantage of RTP, the benefits extend to transparency, finality, and 24/7 availability. These features address long-standing challenges with traditional payment systems, like clearing delays and revoked funds. This creates a more efficient and reliable payment experience for businesses, allowing for better cash flow management and improved customer satisfaction. The always-on nature of RTP also enables businesses to handle time-sensitive transactions and emergencies effectively, regardless of traditional banking hours. This shift towards real-time information and settlement creates a more robust and responsive payment ecosystem.

Moving Beyond the "Killer App" Mentality

The RTP network isn't about finding one perfect use case; it's about solving a multitude of payment problems. Its flexibility allows for customization across diverse industries and business sizes. This adaptability eliminates the need for a one-size-fits-all approach, allowing businesses to tailor solutions to their specific needs. Whether it's streamlining payroll, expediting refunds, or managing large-dollar transactions, RTP offers a versatile platform to address various pain points within the payment process. This approach focuses on solving practical problems rather than searching for a single, elusive "killer app."

Early Adoption and the Power of Experience

Getting started with RTP is key to unlocking its full potential. The network's value becomes clear with repeated use, as businesses discover new applications and efficiencies. Starting with internal processes, or "eating your own dog food," allows banks and organizations to gain firsthand experience and understand the benefits before offering services to clients. This approach not only improves internal operations but also provides valuable insights to tailor solutions and address client needs effectively. The high rate of repeat usage demonstrates the network's value and encourages wider adoption.

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Episode Summary Mid-market banks and credit unions are trapped between agile FinTechs and mega banks, held back by internal silos. On Wrestling Payments, host Elyssa Morgan explores how these institutions can break barriers and leverage their unique strengths.

Randy San Nicolas (Braid CEO) and Daryn Barney (Role FinTech Partners founder) reveal how to overcome self-imposed limitations. "To break through silos, you must step outside to see the world differently," Randy explains. They discuss Stripe's stablecoin move and its impact on traditional banking.

The conversation shows how mid-market size becomes an advantage, not a limitation. Guests share practical steps: inventory existing capabilities, foster innovation leadership, and recognize you already have the charter and foundation to compete.

Host-at-a-Glance

Elyssa Morgan - VP of Membership at NEACH  

Guides payment professionals through modernization challenges 

Find her on LinkedIn

Guests-at-a-Glance 

💡 Randy San Nicolas - Co-founder/CEO, Braid

💡 25 years in payments, empowering smaller institutions to compete 

💡 Find him on LinkedIn

💡 Daryn Barney - Founder, Role FinTech Partners
💡 25 years in payments/banking, builds FinTech strategies for mid-market banks 💡 Find him on LinkedIn

Key Insights

Self-Imposed Silos Are the Real Enemy Banks create barriers by over-depending on core vendors. Most obstacles are mental, not technical. Banks have the infrastructure—they need perspective shifts and smart risk-taking leadership.

Community Banks Hold Undervalued Advantages Mid-market institutions possess what FinTechs can't copy: banking charters, community trust, regulatory frameworks. Even Stripe needs this infrastructure. Decades of relationships position banks as essential infrastructure providers.

Innovation Is Closer Than Perceived Banks underestimate existing capabilities. ACH operators have technical knowledge matching startups—the difference is presentation. Small partnership steps, not complete overhauls, create momentum for bigger transformation.

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In this episode of Wrestling Payments, Joseph Casali launches a three-part "SmackDown Rules Violations in the Ring" series, examining ACH rule violations through wrestling metaphors. He analyzes two critical NACHA case studies that payment professionals should understand to avoid costly compliance mistakes.

The first case involves Glenn Transportation's unauthorized $50,000 reversal attempt against KJN Storage, earning them a warning letter as a first-time offender. The second, more severe case examines a complex arrangement between Macklan Development, Workforce Assist, and Processing for You Inc., where improper payroll reversals led to a substantial $100,000 fine.

Joseph details how the third-party payment processor initiated unauthorized reversals when their customer failed to fund payroll credits, causing consumer accounts to be debited multiple times. This "nested third-party" arrangement lacked proper oversight and controls, resulting in widespread harm to employees, businesses, and financial institutions.

"Just like in wrestling, when you try to reverse the outcome after the match is over, you'll find yourself facing the regulatory referee," warns Casali. "In the NACHA ring, proper reversals require proper cause, not just a desire to take back what you've already given."

Prevention Beats Correction in Payment Operations
The root of most improper reversals isn't misunderstanding rules—it's inadequate front-end controls. Rather than focusing on when reversals are permitted, payment professionals should strengthen transaction validation before payments enter the network. Organizations eliminate the scenarios that tempt improper reversals by implementing proper authorization checks, sufficient funding verification, and receiver confirmation processes up front.

Prevention not only avoids NACHA enforcement but creates more efficient operations overall. Smart payment managers know that building guardrails before transactions occur costs far less than attempting corrections after funds have moved.

Clear Accountability Is Essential in Third-Party Relationships
When payment services involve multiple providers, responsibility becomes dangerously diluted. The "nested third-party" arrangement in the payroll case demonstrates how quickly problems cascade when accountability chains break down. Financial institutions must establish explicit contractual requirements defining precisely who bears responsibility for compliance at each processing stage.

Regular audits, performance monitoring, and transparent communication channels between all parties are essential. The most successful payment operations leaders create relationship maps that establish clear lines of authority and ensure visibility across the entire transaction lifecycle.

Consumer Impact Elevates Regulatory Response
What regulators might treat as minor procedural issues in B2B contexts become major enforcement priorities when consumers feel the impact. Payment operations teams need separate, enhanced control frameworks for transactions touching consumer accounts. Payroll processing, direct debits, and other consumer activities demand heightened verification steps, stronger reconciliation processes, and faster exception handling. 

The immediate financial hardship consumers experience from improper transactions—and the resulting reputational damage—justifies investing in these stronger safeguards. Smart operations leaders recognize this regulatory reality and allocate resources accordingly.

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EPISODE SUMMARY

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joseph Casali draws surprising parallels between professional wrestling and the evolution of payment systems. After watching WrestleMania 41, he experienced an "aha moment" recognizing that successful payment transformations follow the same narrative structure as compelling wrestling storylines.

The episode explores Donald Miller's StoryBrand framework, breaking down how every story, including payment innovations like check conversion to ACH and the digital transformation journey, features a character who faces challenges and needs guidance to achieve success. From the National Automated Clearinghouse Association (NACHA)'s early rules for check conversion to today's AI and crypto developments, each payment evolution represents its own hero's journey.

Listeners are challenged to identify their role in the payment industry narrative: Are you the hero navigating change, or the guide helping others transform? The host suggests that recognizing your place in the story can help financial professionals better navigate the continuous evolution of payment systems and build meaningful payment stories.

KEY INSIGHTS

Every Industry Evolution Follows a Classic Story Structure
The payment industry's evolution, from paper checks to digital transformation, follows the same narrative arc as classic storytelling. Just as Donald Miller's StoryBrand framework outlines, payment innovations begin with a character (organization) facing a problem (inefficient processes), meeting a guide (industry experts or associations like NACHA), receiving a plan (new technology or methodology), and taking action that leads to success or avoids failure. Viewing payment evolution through this lens gives professionals a framework to anticipate challenges and recognize their role in the larger industry story.

Identifying Whether You're a Hero or Guide Changes Your Strategy
Your role in the payment industry story—hero navigating challenges or guide helping others succeed—fundamentally changes your approach to innovation and problem-solving. Heroes face obstacles directly, implement solutions, and undergo transformation. Guides offer wisdom and experience to help others navigate challenges. Many payment professionals mistakenly position themselves as heroes when they could create more impact as guides. Being a guide—like Yoda in Star Wars—often creates more lasting impact than heroic action, especially for those with extensive industry experience who can mentor others through digital transformation or regulatory changes.

Success Stories in Payments Are Never-Ending Narratives
Payment innovation represents a continuous narrative where each success leads to the next challenge, unlike traditional stories with definitive endings. Innovations like check digitization and ACH systems solved immediate problems but created new storylines and challenges. Completing one transformation doesn't provide a permanent "happy ending" but instead opens the next chapter. This perpetual evolution requires viewing projects as episodes in an ongoing industry saga. Embracing this never-ending narrative perspective helps maintain adaptability, avoid complacency after successes, and stay prepared for constant changes driven by technology, regulations, or market demands.

Recognizing When You're the Guide, Not the Hero [00:15:40]
"If you look around the room and you don't see the person who's doing this, you are that person. Maybe you're a guide. Maybe you're a guide in the story. And that's not a negative. You're Yoda. How can you get better than Yoda? You are Paul Heyman in wrestling, you are the guide. You're the advisor, the wise man."

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EPISODE SUMMARY

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali sits down with Travis Dulaney, CEO and Co-founder of BalancedTrust, to unpack the ongoing friction between fintech startups and their bank partners. From missing compliance standards to misunderstandings around regulatory risk, Travis explains why so many good ideas hit a wall.

Travis shares lessons from his time launching and selling PayFi, where inconsistent feedback from sponsor banks highlighted a significant problem: no standard process for compliance approval. That frustration led to the birth of BalancedTrust, a platform helping fintechs and banks align risk tolerance, automate onboarding, and scale safely.

They also discuss why early-stage fintechs often fail to prioritize compliance—and how Travis's team offers a free tool to change that. This episode is a must-listen for anyone looking to grow responsibly in today's complex financial environment.

GUEST-AT-A-GLANCE
Travis Dulaney
CEO and Co-founder
BalancedTrust
LinkedIn 
Noteworthy: 25+ years in fintech, building scalable, compliant solutions for banks and startups

KEY INSIGHTS

Lack of Standardization Is Slowing Fintech Growth

Compliance challenges aren't just technical—they're human. One of the biggest bottlenecks for fintechs trying to scale is the lack of standardization in how sponsor banks evaluate risk and onboard new partners. As Travis explains, different banks—and even individual BSA officers—interpret and apply compliance rules inconsistently. This leads to wildly different outcomes for the same applicant, creating confusion and wasted effort. The core issue isn't always regulation but the subjective way it's enforced. Fintechs often get rejected not because they're too risky but because they don't speak the bank's language or follow an expected format. This inconsistency drags innovation, limits access, and leaves founders guessing how to move forward. A more structured, transparent process would benefit banks and startups by aligning expectations and removing friction.

Compliance Isn't Optional—It's a Growth Enabler

In the startup world, speed often wins. However, regarding financial services, speed without compliance leads to dead ends. Travis argues that compliance isn't a box to check—infrastructure helps fintechs grow. Too many early-stage companies treat risk management like a burden rather than a foundation. That mindset leads to breakdowns when securing a sponsor bank or raising capital. BalancedTrust was built to address this gap by giving fintechs a more precise roadmap: show where the risk lies, understand the rules that apply and know what actions to take. Travis points out that banks won't tell you how to fix your gaps—they're not liable for your mistakes. That's why having a structured, proactive compliance plan helps startups build trust, gain partnerships, and move faster with fewer surprises.

Stablecoins - The Missing Link in Cross-Border Payments?
While stablecoins are often discussed through the lens of crypto speculation, Travis highlights a more practical role: solving the long-standing pain point of the international money movement. Stablecoins, backed by fiat and supported by wallets on both ends, offer a fast, transparent, and secure alternative. They can bridge traditional banking and decentralized finance, creating a unified standard for moving value across jurisdictions. But Travis emphasizes that the real value isn't just technical—it's compliance-driven. If regulators and banks can confidently trace the source and destination of funds, then stablecoins will become more than a crypto

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EPISODE SUMMARY
This episode of Wrestling Payments tackles the critical topic of exposure limits in modern payments. Host Joe Casali and guest Sean Carter, President & CEO of Neach Payments Group, dissect an article by Jordan Bennett of Nacha, which focuses on payment modernization and digital transformation. Sean highlights a common misconception: viewing exposure limits solely through the lens of credit risk. He argues for a broader perspective, emphasizing operational risks like account takeovers and business email compromise.

Sean explains how current exposure limit practices often focus on the unlikely event of a business's complete failure, rather than the more frequent occurrences of chargebacks and return items. He advocates for a more holistic review process, considering IT security practices and overall risk management. Sean also discusses the challenges financial institutions face with third-party senders and the importance of consistent due diligence.

Finally, Sean challenges the common practice of assigning uniform exposure limits. He urges listeners to consider the unique risks of each originator and leverage available tools for efficient limit monitoring and enforcement. This episode provides valuable insights for financial institutions looking to strengthen their payment processes and mitigate risk.

Sean Carter
President & CEO
Neach Payments Group and NEACH
Payments risk expert advocating for holistic exposure limit reviews.
LinkedIn 

KEY INSIGHTS
Rethinking Exposure Limits 

Exposure limits are often mistakenly viewed solely through the lens of credit risk. This narrow focus overlooks the significant operational risks prevalent in today's digital payment landscape, such as account takeovers and business email compromise. A more comprehensive approach considers a company's IT security practices, overall risk management, and the potential for fraud, ensuring a more robust and effective risk mitigation strategy. Shifting the focus from the unlikely scenario of complete business failure to the more frequent occurrences of chargebacks and returns offers a more practical and relevant assessment of risk.

Third-Party Sender Oversight 

Financial institutions must extend their rigorous risk management practices to third-party senders. While institutions may have robust internal controls, neglecting the oversight of third-party partners creates a vulnerability. Ensuring these partners adhere to the same level of due diligence and risk assessment is crucial for maintaining a strong security posture and protecting the institution from potential fraud and operational failures. This includes implementing agreements and monitoring processes to guarantee consistent security practices across the payment ecosystem.

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EPISODE SUMMARY
It happens to the best of us. This session was recorded last year, but got lost in the shuffle. It may be a crime as the interview was with law enforcement and a member financial institution (at the time) on the topic of fraud... the show notes below.

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali engages in an insightful discussion with Matthew Hogan, CAMS, a detective with the Connecticut State Police and a Task Force Officer with the USSS Financial Crimes Task Force, and Ryan McKinnon, Senior Deposit Operations Fraud Analyst at South Shore Bank. The conversation dives into the complexities of fraud detection and prevention in the financial sector, highlighting the collaborative efforts required between financial institutions and law enforcement.

Matthew Hogan shares his experiences investigating white-collar and cryptocurrency crimes, emphasizing the critical need for timely reporting and effective communication between banks and law enforcement to combat fraud. He underscores the challenges of prosecuting financial crimes, particularly those involving international actors and the increasing use of cryptocurrencies for money laundering.

Ryan McKinnon discusses his role at South Shore Bank and the importance of education and community outreach in fraud prevention. He highlights the need for financial institutions to stay vigilant and adaptive to evolving fraud tactics. 

GUEST INFORMATION

Matthew Hogan
Detective
Connecticut State Police
(23) Matthew Hogan, MS | LinkedIn

Ryan McKinnon
Assistant Manager Fraud & Recovery
Charlesbridge
(23) Ryan McKinnon, CAMS | LinkedIn
(formerly Sr Deposit Operations Fraud Analyst with South Shore Bank)

KEY INSIGHTS
Financial Institutions and Law Enforcement Must Collaborate

Effective collaboration between financial institutions and law enforcement is crucial in combating financial fraud. Banks often detect scams but need proper communication to address the full impact. Law enforcement relies on detailed reports from banks to investigate and prosecute fraud cases. However, there's often a communication gap, with banks unaware of the outcomes and law enforcement not providing feedback. Bridging this gap can enhance fraud detection and prosecution, ensuring both sides work together more efficiently. Regular interactions and feedback loops between these entities can significantly improve the response to financial fraud.

Cryptocurrency is a Major Vehicle for Modern Financial Fraud
Cryptocurrency is a significant tool for laundering money and committing fraud due to its anonymity and ease of transfer. Financial institutions and law enforcement face scams involving cryptocurrency, from thefts to Ponzi schemes. Understanding cryptocurrency transactions and fraud tactics is crucial for developing countermeasures. As fraudsters innovate, staying informed and vigilant is vital. Preventative measures and investigative techniques must evolve to keep pace with the changing landscape of financial fraud involving digital currencies.

Fraud Tactics Evolve but Core Elements Remain Constant

Fraud methods evolve, but the core elements remain the same: urgency, a problem or prize, and a specific payment method. This consistency helps financial institutions develop effective detection and prevention strategies. 

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EPISODE SUMMARY 

Sarah Stapp, Chief Commercial Officer at Aeropay, joins Joseph Casali to discuss the evolving payments landscape, focusing on Pay by Bank. Sarah shares her unique journey into fintech, from Craigslist job ads to leading global expansion at Braintree, and dives into ACH rails and real-time payments. 

Why Pay by Bank Matters: It offers fast, secure payment options directly from bank accounts, bypassing card networks. Sarah highlights how RTP and FedNow are shaping user expectations around speed and control across industries like gaming and insurance. 

Key Topics: 

• Evolution of payment orchestration
• Understanding “guaranteed ACH”
• Signals of Pay by Bank's growth in the U.S.
• Consumer-driven adoption over regulation

GUEST-AT-A-GLANCE

Sarah Stapp Chief Commercial Officer, Aeropay LinkedIn

Noteworthy: Spent 12 years at Braintree, leading global expansion.


KEY INSIGHTS

Pay by Bank Is Here: Sarah explains how direct bank-to-bank payments using ACH rails and mobile authentication are gaining traction, especially in gaming. She emphasizes the importance of education for both merchants and consumers.

Instant Payouts: RTP and FedNow are changing consumer expectations for receiving money. Sarah discusses the impact on gaming, insurance claims, contractor payments, and rent reimbursements.

Guaranteed ACH: Sarah introduces “guaranteed ACH” to mitigate risks associated with traditional ACH, offering merchants fewer chargebacks and better cash flow.

Payment Orchestration: Sarah unpacks payment orchestration, highlighting its role in optimizing transactions, centralizing customer data, reducing costs, and enhancing user experience.
 
 

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Episode Summary

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joseph Casali breaks down three timely developments in the payments world. First, he tackles the slow adoption of faster payments among smaller financial institutions. Despite strong growth in RTP and FedNow, integration costs and a lack of clear pricing models continue to hold many back.

Next, Joe explores Square’s move to offer consumer loans through Cash App. With FDIC approval in hand, Square—under its parent company Block—is entering the credit space with small, short-term loans. Joe weighs the pros and cons of fintechs stepping into traditional banking roles, especially as regulators start paying closer attention.

Finally, the discussion shifts to stablecoins. The OCC has relaxed its stance, making it easier for banks to engage in crypto-related activities. Joe walks through proposed legislation and asks the big question: who should regulate stablecoins, and what does that mean for banks and consumers?

KEY INSIGHTS

Small Banks Lag in Real-Time Payment Adoption

Despite the growing infrastructure behind faster payments like RTP and FedNow, smaller financial institutions continue to trail their larger peers. Joe points out that big banks are six times more likely to offer real-time payments. The reasons? Integration complexity, unclear pricing strategies, and rising deposit costs. About 30% of hesitant institutions lack a pricing model, and 35% cite tech integration as a barrier. While over 70% of regional and national banks allow consumers to send real-time payments, only 44% of credit unions do the same. The opportunity is there—but hesitation remains.

Square’s Cash App Loans Signal Fintech’s Banking Ambitions

Square, now operating under parent company Block, has secured FDIC approval to offer small-dollar loans through Cash App. Joe unpacks how these short-term, low-cost loans are aimed at underbanked consumers facing steep fees from payday lenders or overdrafts. The average loan is under $100, repaid within a month, and has a default rate below 3%. With nearly $9 billion originated already, this product has clear demand. Joe raises important questions around regulation, noting that while fintechs offer convenience, they aren’t held to the same standards as banks—yet.

OCC Opens the Door to Crypto Activity in Banking

The Office of the Comptroller of the Currency (OCC) has issued new guidance making it easier for banks to engage in crypto-related services like stablecoin issuance and blockchain verification. This removes the previous requirement for individual “non-objection” letters, streamlining the process. Joe explains how this policy shift reflects growing acceptance of crypto in financial systems and reduces compliance hurdles for banks. But he also warns: without consistent regulation across fintechs and banks, consumer trust and financial stability could be tested.
 
 Stablecoin Legislation Could Reshape the Payments Landscape

Congress is actively working on several stablecoin bills, including the Stable Act and Genius Act. Joe reviews draft proposals that would require stablecoin issuers to hold liquid reserves—like short-term Treasuries—and submit to state or Federal Reserve oversight. One provision caps stablecoin issuance at $10 billion per entity, which Joe questions as being too low to make real market impact. With PayPal and other major players eyeing this space, the legislation could set the tone for how digital currencies coexist with traditional money movement.

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In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joseph Casali unpacks Project 2025 and its potential impact on banking regulations, community banks, and credit unions. The discussion focuses on regulatory shifts, compliance adjustments, and how financial institutions should prepare for possible changes in payment systems, digital assets, and risk management. While details remain uncertain, the conversation highlights key areas that could see significant updates, including FFIEC guidance and financial technology regulations.

Joe explores how Project 2025’s goal of reducing federal regulations may conflict with new policies surrounding cybersecurity, anti-money laundering (AML), and Know Your Customer (KYC) rules. He also examines the evolving role of digital currencies and stablecoins in financial transactions. Financial institutions must assess their technology infrastructure and compliance strategies to stay ahead of potential regulatory updates.

With sweeping changes on the horizon, banks and credit unions need to stay informed and proactive. Joe emphasizes the importance of monitoring regulatory developments, investing in updated compliance frameworks, and adapting risk management practices to ensure stability in a shifting landscape.

KEY INSIGHTS

Project 2025 Could Reshape Financial Regulations

Joe Casali outlines how Project 2025 could introduce sweeping regulatory changes affecting banks and credit unions. While the specifics remain unclear, the initiative seeks to streamline compliance, reduce bureaucratic oversight, and potentially open opportunities for financial institutions. However, there are concerns about how these changes might align—or conflict—with existing frameworks like FFIEC guidance, AML, and KYC regulations. Casali notes that while easing compliance burdens may benefit smaller institutions, it could also introduce new challenges, particularly for risk management and cybersecurity. Financial institutions should prepare by evaluating their compliance structures and staying informed on legislative developments to navigate these evolving regulations effectively.

The Evolving Role of Payment System Regulations

Joe discusses potential updates to payment system regulations, including the need for clearer guidance on digital assets and emerging payment technologies. He highlights how institutions may need to reassess their risk management strategies and technology investments in response to changes in regulatory expectations. Faster payments and real-time settlement solutions, including stablecoins and digital transactions, could become more mainstream, but this also introduces new risks related to fraud prevention and security. Joe advises banks and credit unions to evaluate their current payment infrastructures, ensuring they have the necessary safeguards in place to comply with potential updates. Institutions should also anticipate revisions to FFIEC guidance on retail payments, which could affect operational policies and compliance standards.

Community Banks and Credit Unions Face Unique Challenges

Community banks and credit unions may experience both relief and added pressure from Project 2025. On one hand, reduced compliance requirements could free up resources for innovation and customer service. On the other, adapting to new regulatory frameworks—particularly those governing digital assets, cybersecurity, and fintech partnerships—may require substantial investments in technology and compliance. Joe warns that smaller institutions should not assume deregulation means less oversight; instead, they must proactively assess their risk exposure and prepare for potential shifts in compliance expectations. He encourages these orga

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Check fraud is skyrocketing, and financial institutions are scrambling to keep up. In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joseph Casali sits down with Sean Carter, President & CEO of NPG, to unpack why fraudsters are winning—and how banks and businesses can fight back. Carter explains the alarming rise in fraudulent checks, the organized crime networks behind them, and why simply “not writing checks” isn’t a realistic solution for many businesses.

The conversation dives into Positive Pay, a tool designed to prevent check fraud before it happens. Carter shares firsthand experience with fraud prevention, including how NPG caught a fraudulent check that would have cost years’ worth of fees. The discussion also highlights the surprising gaps in adoption—many banks assume businesses won’t pay for fraud prevention, while businesses often don’t even know the service exists.

Casali and Carter wrap up with key takeaways from a recent fraud prevention survey, revealing why businesses hesitate to adopt protective measures and what banks can do to improve adoption. Tune in for expert insights on keeping your business’s payments secure.

GUEST-AT-A-GLANCE
Sean Carter, President & CEO
Neach Payments Group
Leads fraud prevention, audits, and risk assessment for banks and fintechs.
LinkedIn  

KEY INSIGHTS
Check Fraud is Organized Crime, Not Random Theft

Check fraud isn’t just small-time criminals altering checks—it’s a sophisticated, organized effort. Criminals steal checks through targeted mailbox break-ins, sometimes even at gunpoint, and use advanced methods to wash, alter, and deposit fraudulent checks. Many businesses still assume check fraud is a rare occurrence or that it won’t happen to them, but fraudsters are systematically exploiting weak security measures in the payment system. Sean Carter emphasizes that stolen funds aren’t just lost money—they fuel activities like drug trafficking and other criminal enterprises. This highlights the urgent need for businesses and financial institutions to take proactive security measures rather than waiting until fraud happens to take action.

Positive Pay Works—But Many Businesses Don’t Use It

Positive Pay is a proven fraud prevention tool that helps businesses verify checks before they clear. According to Carter, companies using Positive Pay see a significant reduction in fraudulent transactions. Despite this, many businesses either aren’t aware of it or believe they won’t be targeted by fraud. The episode reveals a disconnect: financial institutions assume businesses won’t pay for fraud prevention, while businesses often don’t even know the service exists. The data supports Positive Pay’s effectiveness, yet many companies only adopt it after experiencing fraud firsthand. Carter argues that banks should be more proactive in educating clients and even consider requiring a waiver if businesses opt out, ensuring they understand the risks.

The Hidden Costs of Check Fraud Go Beyond Stolen Money

When fraud occurs, it’s not just about losing money—it creates disputes, damages bank-client relationships, and leads to costly legal battles. Carter explains that fraud victims often face unexpected costs beyond the stolen amount, including time spent investigating fraud, reputational damage, and potential double payments if a vendor’s check is altered. Financial institutions that fail to offer strong fraud prevention tools also risk losing business, as companies may seek banks with better security measures. The episode underscores the need for a mindset shift: fraud prevention should be seen as an investment, not an expense.

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In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali uses a unique metaphor—the spinning plates act from the Ed Sullivan Show—to explore the complexities of compliance, risk management, and operational efficiency in financial institutions. He shares insights into how organizations must continuously monitor and adjust their processes to stay in alignment with evolving regulations, emphasizing that compliance is not optional but a foundational part of doing business.

Joe examines high-profile cases, including Robinhood’s $30 million fine and Cash App’s $175 million penalty, to illustrate the consequences of neglecting a "culture of compliance." He highlights the need for clear risk assessments, robust fraud prevention measures, and proactive training to avoid regulatory pitfalls. These examples serve as cautionary tales for financial institutions striving to maintain trust and stability.

The episode underscores the importance of ongoing education and vigilance in financial operations. Joe’s engaging discussion invites listeners to rethink compliance as an opportunity to excel rather than a burden to endure.

To hear this episode and many more like it, listen here or subscribe to Wrestling Payments on Apple Podcasts,  Spotify, or anywhere else you listen to podcasts.

For show notes, transcripts, and other resources visit www.wrestlingpayments.com.

Host: Joe Casali, EVP, NEACH

#wrestlingpayments #wrestlingpaymentspodcast #paymentspodcast

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Episode Summary

Financial institutions struggle to identify and monetize revenue opportunities through FinTech partnerships while justifying upfront costs to leadership. Wrestling Payments host Elyssa Morgan speaks with Scott Goldthwaite from FinTech Futures, who breaks down where banks can find immediate revenue streams and build compelling business cases.

Scott explains that banks must develop strategies to enhance transaction fee income through sponsorship, acquiring, issuing, and faster payments like RTP. The key is understanding complete money movement needs—both inbound and outbound—rather than siloing into separate strategies.

Addressing cost concerns, Scott emphasizes plotting break-even points and understanding transaction thresholds. He explores emerging opportunities in cross-border payments, AI-powered solutions, and stable coins, providing actionable frameworks for banks ready to move beyond cost concerns and generate real revenue from FinTech relationships.

Guest-at-a-Glance

💡 Name: Scott Goldthwaite
💡 Role: Founder & Consultant
💡 Company: FinTech Futures
💡 Expertise: FinTech Operator and Payments Strategist with 24+ years experience, NEACH board member
💡 Connect: LinkedIn

Host-at-a-Glance

💡 Name: Elyssa Morgan
💡 Role: Vice President of Membership
💡 Company: NEACH
💡 Expertise: Payments strategist and growth leader driving member growth and advising financial institutions
💡 Connect: LinkedIn

Key Insights

Calculate Before You Partner
Banks must plot break-even points before entering FinTech partnerships. Understanding transaction economics upfront—implementation costs, staffing, compliance expenses—transforms uncertain investments into calculated revenue opportunities with measurable success metrics.

Think Holistic Money Movement
Successful partnerships require comprehensive infrastructure supporting funds flowing in multiple directions. Earned wage access needs both funding and disbursement; B2B solutions require receiving, holding, and sending capabilities. Banks understanding complete cycles monetize multiple touchpoints.

Prepare for AI-Driven Automation
Agent AI, stable coins, and automated payments will reshape partnership models within 18 months. AI agents will negotiate autonomously while stable coins execute complex payment logic automatically. Banks exploring these technologies now through manageable steps avoid future disruption.

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Episode Summary
Join us for this final episode of season 2. In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joseph Casali is joined by Sean Carter, President & CEO of NEACH, and Mary Mumper-Morrison, NEACH’s Education Director, for an insightful discussion on the evolving landscape of payments. The trio dives into the significant changes from 2024, including NEACH rule updates and the growing adoption of AI in financial systems. They reflect on the year’s challenges and how fraud has escalated, demanding innovative responses from the industry.

Mary shares her expertise on regulatory shifts, such as the CFPB’s personal financial data rights rule, while Sean highlights the importance of collaboration between operational and compliance teams to tackle fraud effectively. Both guests emphasize the need for clearer fraud definitions and better public education to combat scams and deception.

Looking ahead to 2025, the conversation explores emerging opportunities with FinTech partnerships, embedded finance, and AI-driven innovation. The episode wraps with hopes for reducing fraud and improving industry resilience.

 Guests-at-a-Glance
Sean Carter
President & CEO
NEACH
A payments industry veteran passionate about fraud prevention, NEACH rule evolution, and fostering collaboration within financial institutions.
LinkedIn  

Mary Mumper-Morrison
Education Director
NEACH
An experienced payments expert with 25+ years in banking & fintech, specializing in operations, audit, and regulatory guidance for payments systems.
LinkedIn  

Key Insights
AI's Role in Payments Innovation and Security

 Mary Mumper-Morrison explores the transformative potential of AI in the payments industry, from improving security to streamlining operations. She highlights how AI tools are already being leveraged to enhance fraud detection and support regulatory compliance. However, she also warns of the challenges in change management, urging financial institutions to involve employees in conversations about AI’s integration to avoid resistance and fear of job displacement.
 

The Growing Importance of Embedded Finance

Mary Mumper-Morrison discusses the rapid expansion of embedded finance and its implications for financial institutions. As embedded finance continues to grow, it will likely redefine how consumers interact with financial services and how institutions design their offerings to remain competitive.

Fraud Education Requires a Public-Private Approach

Sean Carter highlights the need for a collaborative strategy to combat fraud effectively. He explains that financial institutions alone cannot shoulder the responsibility of educating the public about scams and fraudulent activity. Drawing parallels to successful public service campaigns like Smokey Bear, Carter argues for impactful, guilt-inducing messaging that ties consumer behavior to the negative outcomes of fraud. By involving regulators, social media platforms, and telecom providers, the industry can drive meaningful change in fraud prevention and public awareness.

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Welcome to another episode of Wrestling Payments.

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, Joe Casali speaks with Bill Sullivan, Associate Managing Director for Government and Industry Relations at Nacha, about the post-election political landscape and its implications for the payments industry. Bill analyzes the Republican control of the Senate, House, and Presidency, noting the unusual opportunity despite the narrow margins. He focuses on changes in the Senate Banking committee leadership, highlighting Tim Scott's likely ascension to majority leader. This creates a noteworthy dynamic with Senator Warren as the minority leader.

Bill suggests potential common ground between Scott and Warren on housing and anti-money laundering legislation. The discussion then moves to the House Financial Services Committee, where French Hill is poised to succeed the retiring Congressman McHenry. Hill's expertise on the ACH network is seen as a positive for Nacha and its members.

Finally, Bill addresses presidential appointments. He discusses the potential Treasury Secretary nominee Scott, emphasizing his focus on deficit reduction, economic growth, and support for the crypto industry. Bill also speculates about a possible "crypto czar" and other key roles. He concludes by noting the limited time for legislative action given the 2026 elections.

For show notes, transcripts, and other resources visit www.wrestlingpayments.com.

Guest: Bill Sullivan, Associate Managing Director for Government & Industry Relations, Nacha

Host: Joe Casali, EVP, NEACH

#wrestlingpayments #wrestlingpaymentspodcast #paymentspodcast

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EPISODE SUMMARY
In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joseph Casil talks with Steve Wasserman from Photon Commerce about the growing importance of ISO 20022 and its impact on the global payments landscape. Wasserman delves into how this emerging standard is transforming instant payments and financial messaging by providing a more structured and data-rich approach to payment transactions.

Wasserman explains the benefits of ISO 20022, including its ability to support more detailed payment information and enable faster, automated processing. He highlights how this standard is being adopted across payment systems worldwide, such as FedNow and RTP, and how it improves interoperability between financial institutions, paving the way for global payments integration.

The conversation also covers the future of instant payments, the role of AI in fraud detection and compliance, and how businesses can leverage ISO 20022 to streamline their processes. Wasserman encourages payment professionals to embrace the standard to stay competitive in the evolving financial landscape.

GUEST-AT-A-GLANCE
Steve Wasserman
Technology Architect
Photon Commerce
LinkedIn  

Noteworthy: Specializes in ISO 20022 and instant payment innovations, with years of experience in fintech.

KEY INSIGHT
ISO 20022 is Revolutionizing Global Payments

ISO 20022 is transforming how payment systems operate globally. Steve Wasserman explains that this emerging standard allows for a more structured and data-rich messaging format, which enables better automation and transparency in financial transactions. ISO 20022 is being adopted by systems like FedNow, RTP, and SWIFT, helping institutions streamline operations and enhance interoperability. The added benefit of detailed remittance information means businesses can automate straight-through processing, reducing errors and manual intervention. 

Request for Payment Solves Key Payment Issues

One of the key features of ISO 20022 is its support for "Request for Payment" functionality. Wasserman explains that this capability allows businesses to request payment from a payer without needing to rely on traditional debit mechanisms. The payer can schedule or approve payments, providing more control and reducing the risk of failed transactions. This innovation is especially useful for businesses that need flexibility in payment timing, making it easier to meet deadlines without incurring late fees or dealing with business interruptions. 

AI and ISO 20022 Enhance Fraud Detection

Steve Wasserman highlights how ISO 20022’s structured data format works seamlessly with AI to boost real-time fraud detection and compliance capabilities. Because ISO 20022 includes rich, detailed data fields, AI tools can analyze transactions more effectively, identifying patterns that signal fraudulent activity. This integration of AI helps financial institutions respond faster to potential threats while enhancing their ability to comply with regulatory requirements. Wasserman underscores that as the financial ecosystem grows more complex, the combination of AI and ISO 20022 will become increasingly important for maintaining secure, efficient payment systems.

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EPISODE SUMMARY

The U.S. payment system stands on the verge of a monumental shift. The Federal Reserve is proposing 24/7 operations for the National Net Settlement System (NSS), the backbone of payment finality. This means no more "lights out" on weekends; wires, ACH, and other payment types could flow around the clock.

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, Joe Casali wrestles with this complex topic alongside Sean Carter, President & CEO of NEACH. Sean acknowledges the upsides: reduced settlement risk, increased liquidity, and alignment with global standards where 24/7 payments are becoming the norm. However, he also points out significant concerns, particularly for financial institutions.

Staffing for round-the-clock operations, ensuring downstream applications like online banking and core systems are ready, and bolstering fraud prevention measures in a faster-paced environment are just some of the hurdles. Sean highlights the potential impact on smaller institutions, questioning their ability to adapt without significant burdens. Will this proposal revolutionize payments or leave some players struggling to keep up? Tune in for a crucial discussion.

KEY INSIGHTS
24/7 Settlement: A Game Changer with Growing Pains
While round-the-clock payment processing offers advantages like reduced risk and global consistency, it presents a massive operational challenge. Smaller financial institutions, in particular, face concerns about staffing and technology upgrades to handle the constant flow of transactions. The industry needs to address potential burdens and ensure a smooth transition, not a mad scramble to keep up.

Beyond the Network: Downstream Readiness Is Crucial
Successfully implementing 24/7 settlement goes beyond connecting to faster payment networks. Financial institutions must ensure their core systems, online banking platforms, and customer-facing applications are all equipped to reflect real-time transactions accurately. Otherwise, businesses and consumers could face confusion, errors, and a lack of clarity about their finances.

Optional Participation, Inevitable Pressure
The Federal Reserve proposes making 24/7 settlement optional for financial institutions. However, competitive pressures could render this option meaningless. To avoid falling behind, institutions may feel compelled to participate, even without adequate preparation. This highlights the need for industry-wide collaboration and support during the implementation process.

EPISODE HIGHLIGHTS
The ACH Question: Will Faster Settlement Mean Weekend Transactions?
Timestamp: [00:16:00]
While the initial focus is on National Net Settlement, the potential impact on specific payment systems like ACH is a key consideration. Sean notes that 24/7 settlement could open the door for weekend or late-night ACH processing, which presents its own set of challenges. NACHA, the governing body for ACH, will need to address rule changes, return timelines, and the definition of a "banking day" in an always-on environment.

"So we've been trying really hard to tell our members this is not an ACH piece. Right. This would be something that the ACH network could then entertain and would have to go through their own rulemaking process, which NEACH would be a part of obviously, as a direct member and voting member of NACHA."

A Tale of Two Coasts: Time Zones and the Same-Day Settlement Puzzle
Timestamp: [00:20:00]
This shift could potentially level the playing field and offer greater flexibility for processing transactions.

"The same happens with the same-day windows today. And those would be pushed back. There would be potential if the hours are expanded, where

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[Podcasters note: In this episode we show our real passions for payments and appear not as CEO & EVP, but more as "two guys from Boston" as we tackle the alarming rise of scams and financial fraud.]

Joe Casali and guest Sean Carter, President & CEO of NEACH, dissect the recent "Chase Bank Glitch" where individuals fell prey to check kiting schemes. They discuss the importance of financial literacy, especially among younger generations, to combat scams that fund harmful activities like human trafficking.

Sean and Joseph emphasize the need for impactful awareness campaigns that connect fraudulent actions with real-world consequences. They explore the effectiveness of campaigns like "Don't Drink and Drive" and "Smokey the Bear" as models for conveying the gravity of falling victim to scams.

The episode concludes with a call to action: Listeners are urged to contribute ideas for combating financial fraud and to educate themselves about common scams. They highlight the availability of resources like the Federal Reserve Bank's Scam Classifier as a starting point for understanding and preventing scams.

Guest-at-a-Glance
Name: Sean Carter
What they do: President & CEO
Company: NEACH
Noteworthy: Sean has worked with NEACH for over 30 years. He is an accredited AAP and NCP advocating for financial institutions in the payments space.
Where to find them: LinkedIn  

KEY INSIGHTS

The "Chase Bank Glitch" Exposes a Need for Basic Financial Education

The recent "Chase Bank Glitch" scam, where individuals attempted to exploit a non-existent banking error for financial gain, underscores a critical need for basic financial education. This event revealed a lack of understanding surrounding check kiting, a simple yet illegal practice. Educating individuals, particularly young people, on fundamental financial concepts can empower them to identify and avoid such scams. By equipping them with this knowledge, we can disrupt the cycle of fraud that preys on financial naiveté.

Successful Awareness Campaigns Connect Actions with Real-World Consequences

To combat scams effectively, awareness campaigns need to move beyond simple warnings and instead draw a direct line between fraudulent behavior and its real-world consequences. This connection resonates more deeply than simply stating facts or urging caution. Just as "Don't Drink and Drive" highlights the tragic results of drunk driving, scam prevention campaigns must effectively communicate the devastating impact of fraud on individuals, businesses, and society. By understanding these tangible repercussions, potential victims are more likely to internalize the message and protect themselves.

Financial Institutions and Consumers Share Responsibility in Preventing Fraud

While financial institutions play a crucial role in fraud prevention, consumers must also take responsibility for protecting themselves. The conversation highlights a potential imbalance where banks often bear the brunt of reimbursing victims while individuals may not always face consequences for their actions. Finding a balance between consumer protection and accountability is crucial. Financial literacy empowers consumers to make informed decisions, while clear communication from institutions can help prevent them from falling victim to fraudulent schemes.

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Episode Summary

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali from NEACH sits down with Rusiru Gunasena, the head of the RTP network at The Clearing House, to dive into the evolution and current state of real-time payments in the U.S. Rusiru highlights the journey of RTP since its launch in 2017, emphasizing its growth and the increasing adoption among financial institutions. He shares insights on the network’s milestones, including handling billion-dollar days and expanding its reach to over 650 institutions, primarily community banks and credit unions.

Rusiru also discusses the various use cases that are driving RTP's success, such as B2B transactions, account-to-account transfers, and instant wage access for gig economy workers. He explains how RTP's real-time settlement and 24/7 availability offer significant advantages over traditional payment methods, making it an essential tool for modern financial transactions.

The conversation touches on the importance of interoperability with other networks, including the newly launched FedNow, and the ongoing collaboration with the Federal Reserve. Rusiru concludes by encouraging financial institutions not yet on board with RTP to start with a receive-only approach to experience the benefits of real-time payments.

Guest-at-a-Glance
Guest: Rusiru Gunasena
What he does: Vice President, RTP Product Management & Strategy
Company: The Clearing House RTP
Noteworthy: Rusiru Gunasena: Leader in real-time payments, overseeing the RTP network at The Clearing House, with extensive experience in payments and fintech.

 Where to find Rusiru: LinkedIn

Key Insights
Real-Time Payments Transforming Financial Transactions

Real-time payments (RTP) are revolutionizing how businesses and consumers handle transactions. With its 24/7/365 availability, RTP allows for instant settlement, eliminating the delays and uncertainties associated with traditional payment methods like checks or ACH. This immediacy benefits both businesses and consumers, ensuring that funds are transferred and accessible in real time. The RTP network’s ability to support high-value transactions, now up to $1 million, opens up new possibilities for various sectors, including B2B transactions, insurance payouts, and instant wage access for gig economy workers.

The Growing Importance of Interoperability in Payment Networks

As new payment networks like FedNow enter the scene, the need for interoperability between these systems and established networks like RTP becomes crucial. Interoperability ensures that institutions and customers can transact seamlessly across different platforms, enhancing the efficiency and reach of real-time payments. While RTP was the first to market, ongoing collaboration with the Federal Reserve and other stakeholders is vital for aligning features and ensuring that the benefits of real-time payments are universally accessible, regardless of the network.

Request for Payment: A Game Changer for Bill Payments

The introduction of the Request for Payment (RFP) feature within the RTP network is set to transform bill payments. Unlike traditional methods where payments might be delayed or susceptible to fraud, RFPs allow consumers to receive and authorize bill payments securely through their bank’s channels. This feature not only enhances security but also gives consumers greater control over their payments, allowing them to authorize transactions only when they are ready. As this feature evolves, it is expected to bring significant improvements

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EPISODE SUMMARY
In the latest episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali is joined by Kevin Olsen, the Senior Vice President of Innovation and Strategy at Pidgin. They dive into the intricacies of onboarding the FedNow payment system, emphasizing the challenges and strategies involved. Olsen highlights the essential steps for a successful onboarding process, including the importance of knowing one's OAL (Officer Authorized List) and the significance of thorough testing to ensure a seamless transition. The conversation touches on the rapid adoption of FedNow, with Olsen noting the impressive number of institutions already onboarded.

Olsen also explains the operational and strategic considerations for financial institutions adopting FedNow. He discusses the necessity of involving key personnel such as IT, treasury, and authorized contacts from the outset to streamline the onboarding process. The discussion extends to the practical aspects of managing exceptions and ensuring continuous operations, even during weekends and holidays. Olsen reassures that while the system is designed to minimize exceptions, institutions must be prepared to handle rare cases without disrupting service.

The episode concludes with a look at the broader implications of instant payments and the potential for future developments in the payments landscape. Olsen provides insights into managing liquidity and security concerns, especially for high-value transactions. He emphasizes the flexibility of the FedNow system in accommodating various use cases and operational needs. Casali and Olsen's engaging dialogue offers valuable perspectives for financial professionals navigating the evolving world of instant payments.

GUEST-AT-A-GLANCE
Guest: Kevin Olsen
What he does: SVP Innovation & Strategy
Company: Pidgin
Noteworthy: Kevin Olsen, Senior Vice President of Innovation and Strategy at Pidgin, is known as the Payments Professor. He has extensive experience in onboarding financial institutions to payment systems like RTP and FedNow.
Where to find Kevin: LinkedIn 

#wrestlingpayments #wrestlingpaymentspodcast #paymentspodcast

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Welcome to another episode of Wrestling Payments.

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali dives into the transformative world of faster payments, focusing on the development and implementation of instant payment systems in the U.S. and globally. Casali discusses the journey from traditional ACH payments to the more advanced Real-Time Payments (RTP) and FedNow systems, highlighting the technological advancements and the growing adoption of these faster payment methods.

Joe explains the benefits and challenges of implementing faster payments, emphasizing the need for financial institutions to educate themselves and their teams about the nuances of these systems. He shares insights into the regulatory environment, technological requirements, and the critical role of understanding standards like ISO 20022 in ensuring seamless payment processing.

The episode also explores the practical implications for consumers and businesses, illustrating how faster payments can enhance liquidity, reduce settlement times, and improve overall financial efficiency. Casali's engaging storytelling and expert insights make this a must-listen for anyone interested in the future of payments.

To hear this episode and many more like it, listen here or subscribe to Wrestling Payments on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, or anywhere else you listen to podcasts.

For show notes, transcripts, and other resources visit www.wrestlingpayments.com.

Host: Joe Casali, EVP, NEACH

#wrestlingpayments #wrestlingpaymentspodcast #paymentspodcast

Other Resources:

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In this episode of "Wrestling Payments," host Joe Casali welcomes back Nanci McKenzie for a follow-up discussion on third-party relationships within the financial industry. Nanci, an independent consultant with extensive credentials in banking and risk management, shares insights from her session at PMC 2024. She emphasizes the evolving nature of third-party relationships, particularly the regulatory changes and guidance updates from agencies like the OCC, FDIC, and the Federal Reserve Board of Governors.

Nanci and Joe dive into the specifics of interagency guidance approved in 2023, which now includes fintechs and offers consolidated advice for banking organizations. They discuss the critical aspects of these regulations, such as consumer data protection, compliance requirements, and the implications of third-party relationships on risk management. Nanci highlights the importance of identifying and managing risks associated with third-party vendors, stressing the need for comprehensive information security programs and regular audits.

Towards the end of the episode, the conversation shifts to data privacy and the potential complications arising from the CFPB's new rule under the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act. Nanci points out that financial institutions must ensure their third parties comply with these regulations to safeguard against data breaches and financial crimes. Joe and Nanci conclude by acknowledging the increasing complexity of compliance and the ongoing need for vigilance in managing third-party risks.

To hear this episode and many more like it, listen here or subscribe to Wrestling Payments on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, or anywhere else you listen to podcasts.

For show notes, transcripts, and other resources visit www.wrestlingpayments.com.

Host: Joe Casali, EVP, NEACH

#wrestlingpayments #wrestlingpaymentspodcast #paymentspodcast

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In this episode of Wrestling Payments, Joe Casali and Kevin Olsen continue their discussion from the International Payments Alliance meeting by Nacha, diving into various topics surrounding payment systems and regulations.

They start by addressing the move in Germany to eliminate checks and explore how the reduction of paper transactions could simplify banking systems. Kevin points out that while checks have been a long-standing payment method, most use cases for checks can be replaced by instant or recurring payments, except for scenarios where checks are deliberately not meant to be deposited.

The conversation then shifts to comparing the regulatory frameworks and roles of service providers in the US and Europe. Kevin highlights that in Europe, service providers often have more direct regulatory oversight and higher requirements compared to the US. He discusses the implications of such differences on the efficiency and responsibilities of these providers.

Finally, they dive into the concept of Central Bank Digital Currencies (CBDCs) and the digital euro, reflecting on the controversies and discussions around privacy, technology adoption, and regulatory challenges. They note the contrasting approaches and advancements in digital payment systems between the US and other countries, emphasizing the potential and complexities of moving towards a more digital financial ecosystem.

To hear this episode and many more like it, listen here or subscribe to Wrestling Payments on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, or anywhere else you listen to podcasts.

For show notes, transcripts, and other resources visit www.wrestlingpayments.com.

Host: Joe Casali, EVP, NEACH

#wrestlingpayments #wrestlingpaymentspodcast #paymentspodcast

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Episode Summary

Many financial institutions feel stuck, believing technology myths hold them back from innovation. In this Wrestling Payments episode, host Elyssa Morgan talks with Brian Anderson, VP of Banking Transformation at Finzly, about busting these myths and competing in today's payments ecosystem without waiting for core systems to catch up.

Brian explains how institutions can shift from core-reliant to core-complimentary thinking, transforming payments from cost centers into strategic revenue drivers. He details how API-driven platforms create flexibility and new customer opportunities, helping smaller institutions build stickier relationships and compete with larger banks and fintechs.

The conversation emphasizes that technology decisions are business strategy, not IT projects, requiring C-suite buy-in to reframe investments as essential for competitive advantage.

Guest-at-a-Glance

Name: Brian Anderson
Role: Vice President, Banking Transformation
Company: Finzly
Expertise: Helps institutions innovate through best-of-breed money movement strategies
Connect: LinkedIn

Key Insights

Core-Complimentary Revolution
Stop waiting for core providers. Build ecosystems using APIs to integrate specialized solutions, enabling rapid fintech capability deployment without system overhauls.

Payments as Profit Centers
Transform payments into revenue drivers. One bank generated 40% of income through payment services, creating sticky relationships and non-interest income streams.

Middleware Magic
Gain ultimate control with middleware solutions that prevent vendor lock-in while providing deeper money movement insights and switching flexibility.

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In this episode of "Wrestling Payments," host Joe Casali sits down with Kevin Olsen, also known as the "Payments Professor." The discussion kicks off with Kevin's signature introduction and his enthusiasm for making payments engaging. They delve into their experiences at the Nacha Payments Alliance international meeting in Berlin, where both were deeply impressed by the city's historical significance and the intense professionalism of its business community. Kevin shares his personal experiences of exploring Berlin with his son, highlighting the city's rich history and its mix of architectural styles.

The conversation shifts to the core of the episode: the insights and learnings from the Nacha Payments Alliance meeting. Joe and Kevin reflect on the valuable networking opportunities the event provided, allowing them to connect with key decision-makers in the global payments industry. They discuss the significance of the meetings, particularly the discussions on fraud prevention, and the innovative approaches being taken to tackle fraud globally. Kevin emphasizes the importance of the Payments Innovation Alliance meetings and how they bring together leaders from various countries to share their approaches and solutions to common problems in the payments landscape.

Finally, Joe and Kevin explore specific topics discussed during the meeting, such as the implementation of the Legal Entity Identifier (LEI) and the concept of verification of payee. They express their admiration for the collaborative efforts seen in Europe to enhance payment security and efficiency and ponder the potential challenges and benefits of adopting similar measures in the United States. The episode wraps up with reflections on the importance of such international collaborations and the shared goals of improving the payments industry worldwide.

To hear this episode and many more like it, listen here or subscribe to Wrestling Payments on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, or anywhere else you listen to podcasts.

For show notes, transcripts, and other resources visit www.wrestlingpayments.com.

Host: Joe Casali, EVP, NEACH

#wrestlingpayments #wrestlingpaymentspodcast #paymentspodcast

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Today, June 15, is National Elder Abuse Awareness Day.

The Wrestling Payments podcast was started to discuss "wrestling" with payment topics. Topics like technology implementation and AI, but perhaps we've become so numb to the problems of Elder Financial Abuse and Human Trafficking, that the issues have faded into the background. I ask the Industry, how can we do better?

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, Joe Casali talks with Andrea Higgens, a Criminal Elder Abuse Investigator from the San Mateo County District Attorney's Office, and Patty Presta, Director of Education at NEACH. Andrea shares her 25 years of law enforcement experience, focusing on elder financial abuse and the critical role of financial institutions in preventing these crimes. Patty adds her insights from decades of advocacy and education on elder abuse prevention.

Andrea discusses the importance of suspicious activity reports (SARs) and how they can help law enforcement track and prevent elder abuse. She emphasizes the need for financial institutions to educate their frontline staff on identifying and reporting suspicious activities. Patty highlights the significance of cross-reporting to Adult Protective Services (APS) to ensure timely interventions.

Throughout the conversation, Andrea, Patty, and Joe explore real-life examples of how collaborative efforts between financial institutions and law enforcement have successfully protected elders from financial exploitation. This episode sheds light on the complexities of elder financial abuse and the continuous efforts needed to safeguard vulnerable seniors.

GUESTS AT A GLANCE

• Andrea Higgens, Criminal Elder Abuse Investigator
• San Mateo County District Attorney's Office
• LinkedIn
• Noteworthy: Over 25 years in law enforcement, specializing in elder abuse cases. 

• Patty Presta, Director of Education
• NEACH
• LinkedIn
• Noteworthy: Passionate advocate for elder abuse prevention since 1994

KEY INSIGHTS
The Role of Financial Institutions in Elder Abuse Prevention

Andrea Higgens emphasizes the crucial role financial institutions play in preventing elder financial abuse. She highlights the importance of suspicious activity reports (SARs) and cross-reporting to Adult Protective Services (APS). By identifying unusual transactions and collaborating with law enforcement, banks and credit unions can help protect vulnerable seniors. Andrea stresses the need for frontline staff to ask open-ended questions and be vigilant in detecting signs of abuse. She also suggests financial institutions host educational events for customers and their families to increase awareness and preventive measures. Empowering bank employees with knowledge and tools to identify potential abuse can make a significant difference in safeguarding elders from financial exploitation.

The Power of Cross-Reporting to APS

Andrea discusses the impact of cross-reporting suspicious activities to Adult Protective Services (APS). When financial institutions notice unusual transactions, they can trigger an investigation by APS, leading to timely interventions. She shares a success story where a bank's prompt cross-reporting helped uncover a significant financial abuse case. The abuser had liquidated large sums of money and taken ownership of the victim's home. Thanks to the bank's quick action and collaboration with APS and law enforcement, the victim's assets were recovered, and the abuser was

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Episode Summary
In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali sits down with Jaime Shapiro Berg from Alkami - ACH Alert to discuss the rapidly changing payments landscape and the critical role of fraud prevention. Jaime shares her extensive career journey, from starting in treasury management at KeyBank to her current role at Alkami, emphasizing the importance of adapting to new technologies and staying ahead of fraudsters.

The conversation highlights the innovative Positive Pay & ACH Reporting solutions provided by Alkami to address the need for automated fraud prevention tools in the financial sector. Jaime explains how Alkami's Positive Pay solutions have evolved to help banks and credit unions combat check and ACH fraud, reducing losses and enhancing customer trust.

Joe and Jaime also dive into the broader challenges facing the banking industry, including the need for better education and training in banking operations and treasury management. They stress the importance of financial institutions investing in comprehensive fraud prevention strategies to protect themselves and their customers in an increasingly digital world.

Guest-at-a-Glance

• Guest: Jaime Shapiro Berg
• What she does: Director - ACH Alert Sales
• Company: Alkami - ACH Alert
• Noteworthy: With over 25 years of experience in the banking and FinTech industries, Jaime Shapiro Berg has a deep understanding of treasury management and fraud prevention. Jaime's background includes transitioning from traditional banking roles to leading innovative solutions in digital banking.
• Where to find Jaime: LinkedIn

Key Insights
Payments Are Rapidly Evolving
The landscape of payments is continuously changing, particularly driven by consumer demands for the latest and most efficient technologies. Consumers always seek the newest and shiniest innovations, pushing businesses to adapt quickly to stay competitive. While businesses also desire cutting-edge solutions, their primary goal remains to generate profit effectively. This dynamic environment necessitates that companies stay updated with technological advancements to meet consumer expectations and achieve their financial objectives.

Fraud Prevention Requires Continuous Innovation
Fraud prevention in the financial sector demands innovative and seamless solutions to combat increasingly sophisticated fraudulent activities. Traditional methods, often manual and error-prone, are no longer sufficient. ACH Alert's Positive Pay solutions automate fraud detection, minimizing human error and resource expenditure. By integrating these automated solutions, financial institutions can significantly enhance their ability to prevent fraud, thus safeguarding their operations and maintaining customer trust.

Education in Banking Operations Is Essential
There is a growing need for comprehensive education and training in banking operations and treasury management. Many financial institutions struggle to hire individuals with relevant experience due to a lack of specialized training programs. Enhancing educational opportunities in these areas can help bridge the skills gap, ensuring that banks have the necessary expertise to manage operations efficiently. Institutions should consider revamping management training programs to focus not just on lending but also on critical areas like treasury and operations management to maintain a robust talent pipeline.

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Episode Summary

In this episode of "Wrestling Payments," host Joe Casali dives into the details of National Small Business Week. He emphasizes the importance of utilizing available resources, such as the SBA’s virtual summit and educational programs, to help small businesses thrive. Joe highlights key sessions on AI, cybersecurity, and marketing strategies that are crucial for business growth and stability in today’s dynamic environment.

Joe also discusses the practical aspects of running a small business, including managing cash flow and leveraging e-commerce. He underscores the significance of tools like positive pay for fraud prevention, sharing real-life examples to illustrate its benefits. His insights provide actionable advice for small business owners to navigate challenges and secure their operations.

Throughout the episode, Joe reminds listeners of the critical role small businesses play in the economy. He encourages owners to utilize community banks and credit unions for support and stresses the importance of staying informed about the latest industry trends and solutions. This episode is a valuable resource for any small business owner looking to enhance their operations and safeguard their future.

Key Insights
AI Can Drive Small Business Growth

Artificial Intelligence (AI) offers numerous benefits for small businesses, from generative AI to automation and pattern recognition. Generative AI can create content, such as business stories and marketing materials, efficiently and effectively. Automation and pattern recognition help businesses spot trends and anomalies, enhancing risk management and decision-making processes. AI's potential to streamline operations and improve accuracy makes it an invaluable tool for small businesses looking to grow and stay competitive in a rapidly changing market.

Cybersecurity is Critical for Remote Work

In the current landscape where remote work has become prevalent, securing business operations is more crucial than ever. Small businesses must prioritize cybersecurity to protect sensitive data and ensure smooth operations. This includes implementing robust security protocols and educating employees about best practices. With the increasing threats of cyber-attacks, having a strong cybersecurity framework helps businesses safeguard their assets and maintain trust with their customers and partners.

Positive Pay Prevents Fraud

Positive pay is an essential tool for small businesses to prevent fraud. It involves the business providing a list of authorized checks to their bank, which then cross-checks any checks presented for payment. This system helps detect and stop unauthorized transactions before they can cause significant financial damage. The use of positive pay can save businesses time and resources by preventing fraudulent activities, thereby maintaining the integrity of their financial operations and protecting their bottom line.

Link to Positive Pay Survey: Positive Pay Market Survey (neachgroup.com)

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Episode Summary
In this episode of "Wrestling Payments," Joseph Casali dives into the often-misunderstood realm of government benefit payments and their reclamation process. Highlighting a new course he's developed; Joe explains the crucial difference between the Nacha Rules and those dictated by government agencies when a beneficiary passes away. His insights illuminate the complex interactions between the law, the "Green Book" guidelines, and real-world banking practices, emphasizing the practical implications for those managing such funds.

Joe also introduces the concept of constructive knowledge, explaining its vital role in determining financial institution liability. Through compelling examples, he outlines how seemingly simple knowledge can trigger significant financial responsibilities, stressing the importance of being proactive and informed.

The episode wraps up with a call to action, inviting listeners to engage with the course that not only educates but also equips financial professionals with the tools to navigate these intricate scenarios effectively. Joe's approachable discussion aims to enhance understanding and help institutions limit their financial risks associated with government benefit reclamation.

Key Insights

• Government Benefit Payments Are Bound by Dual Regulatory FrameworksNavigating the realm of government benefit payments demands understanding the distinct yet overlapping rules set by federal agencies and the Treasury. While agencies may deem a person "eligible" for certain payments, financial institutions must adhere strictly to the regulations, which only recognize allow benefit payments if the recipient was alive on pay day. This discrepancy creates a complex scenario, especially in situations the deaths of beneficiaries is unknown to their financial institution, leading to significant operational challenges for banks and credit unions as they reconcile these obligations and liabilities.
•  Constructive Knowledge Determines Financial Liability
• The concept of constructive knowledge plays a critical role in managing the liability associated for government payments. Financial institutions are expected to act upon any commercially reasonable information indicating a beneficiary's death, which sets their liability from that point forward. This encompasses various scenarios where knowledge can come from direct notifications like letters from nursing homes or even more informal sources like local knowledge of a death. Ignoring such information can significantly increase the institution's financial risk and legal exposure.
• Effective Training Reduces Risk in Payment Reclamations
  Proper training in handling reclamations is essential for reducing potential liabilities. Financial institutions must implement robust procedures to manage and respond to death notifications and other signals of beneficiary status changes. Through well-structured courses and tools, institutions can ensure their staff is equipped to adhere to both the legal framework and operational best practices, thereby minimizing financial losses and enhancing compliance with regulatory requirements.

31 Code of Federal Regulation Part 210
The GREEN BOOK
NEACHU - "Notified of Death, Now What?"

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Episode Summary

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, Joe Casali sits down with Charlie Kelly from Remedy Consulting. They dive into the evolving landscape of payment systems. Charlie shares insights from his vast experience, focusing on core conversions, contract negotiations, and the challenges community banks and credit unions face.

Charlie emphasizes the importance of navigating the complexities of payment system upgrades. He highlights how Remedy Consulting aids institutions in understanding their core provider's language and the broader ecosystem. This support is crucial for making informed decisions during core negotiations or considering conversions.

The conversation also explores the intricacies of connecting traditional banking systems with emerging fintech solutions. Charlie discusses the hurdles in integrating new technologies with established banking infrastructures. He stresses the balance between innovation and maintaining security and reliability in payment systems. This episode offers a glimpse into the critical role of consultancy in simplifying and guiding financial institutions through technological transitions.

Guest-at-a-Glance
Charlie Kelly
Partner at Remedy Consulting and Host of BankTalk Podcast
Remedy Consulting
Charlie Kelly brings a wealth of experience from his tenure at one of the nation's leading core providers, focusing on project management, pricing, and contracts. Now at Remedy Consulting, he specializes in helping community banks and credit unions navigate complex payment system conversions and negotiations.
LinkedIn

Key Insights
Navigating the Maze of Payment System Upgrades

Charlie Kelly discusses the intricate process involved in payment system conversions, emphasizing the common pitfalls financial institutions encounter. A significant challenge highlighted is the misalignment between digital providers and core systems, which often lack seamless integration. This disconnection can lead to costly mistakes, such as the cancellation of nearly finalized contracts due to unrecognized incompatibilities. Kelly’s expertise shines as he guides institutions through these complex negotiations, ensuring they make informed decisions that align with their technological and financial goals.

Modernizing Financial Systems: A Delicate Balance

The episode dives into the difficulties of integrating cutting-edge fintech solutions with legacy banking systems. Charlie Kelly points out the vast gap between the innovative ideas emerging from fintech startups and the reality of incorporating these into the established infrastructure of traditional banks. The biggest hurdles are the entrenched systems of larger providers, which are not easily adaptable or open to prioritizing new fintech integrations. This insight underscores the crucial role of consulting services like Remedy Consulting in facilitating this integration, ensuring that banks can innovate while maintaining the reliability and security of their payment systems.

The Crucial Link: Consultancies in Payment Innovations

Charlie highlights the essential role of consultancies in assisting community banks and credit unions with navigating the complexities of payment system upgrades and core conversions. By acting as an intermediary between these institutions and their core providers, Remedy Consulting plays a pivotal role in deciphering the jargon and technicalities of contracts. This service is invaluable for smaller institutions that might otherwise struggle to understand

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Episode Summary
Welcome to our 25 Episode. Before we get to the official description, this was such an enjoyable episode to record and catch up with an old "Ring" veteran. What started out as a catch-up session, turned into an amazing valuable episode, check below for some resource links.

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali welcomes Patty Presta, AAP, NCP, the Director of Education at NEACH. Patty shares her unique journey from aspiring to be a nurse to becoming a pivotal figure in the payments industry. Her transition highlights the unexpected paths that lead to rewarding careers in finance.

Patty and Joe discuss critical topics like elder abuse and human trafficking. They emphasize the importance of education and vigilance within financial institutions to prevent exploitation. Patty’s experiences from teaching to working on the front lines against financial crimes offer invaluable insights into the evolving challenges in payments.

The conversation also covers the evolution of payment systems, from direct deposits to modern AI and P2P technologies. Patty's return to NEACH marks a full circle, bringing her expertise back to where her journey in payments began. This episode sheds light on the ongoing fight against financial crime and the importance of continuous learning in the payments industry.

 Guest-at-a-Glance
Patty Presta, AAP, NCP,  Director of Education NEACH
Over 20 years in payments, passionate about elder and financial abuse education.
LinkedIn  

Key Insights
The Unplanned Journey into Payments

Patty’s career path serves as a fascinating example of how life can take unexpected turns. Originally aspiring to be a nurse, Patty’s journey into the payments industry began with a temporary job that unexpectedly evolved into a significant role in education within NEACH. This story highlights the unpredictable nature of career paths and the importance of being open to new opportunities. Patty's transition from a secretary tasked with web development to becoming a pivotal figure in payments training underscores the role of adaptability and learning on the job in achieving professional success.

 Addressing Elder Abuse and Human Trafficking in the Financial Sector

Patty brings to light the critical issues of elder abuse and human trafficking, underscoring the financial industry's role in combating these problems. With a deep-seated passion for protecting the vulnerable, she has dedicated a significant part of her career to educating financial institutions on recognizing and preventing financial exploitation. Patty’s work in creating awareness and training materials for detecting signs of abuse and trafficking within financial transactions reveals the power of education and vigilance in making a difference. This insight underscores the importance of the financial sector's proactive engagement in societal issues.

Links
https://polarisproject.org/
https://www.thorn.org/

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Episode Summary

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali dives into the complexities of the modern banking sector, focusing on the dynamic between risk management and innovation. Joe, an expert in the field, shares insights on how banks are adapting to regulatory changes and the increasing importance of cybersecurity.

The conversation shifts towards the challenges and opportunities presented by digital payments and consumer protection. Joe emphasizes the need for banks to evolve while ensuring customer safety in an increasingly digital world.

The episode concludes with a look ahead, as Joe discusses the future of financial services. He highlights the balance between embracing technological advancements and maintaining robust security measures to protect both banks and their customers. This episode provides a comprehensive overview of the current state and future direction of banking and payments.

Guest-at-a-Glance
Joseph Casali
NEACH
LinkedIn

Key Insights
The Risk of Complacency in Banking

Governor Michelle Bowman's speech highlighted the inherent risks of complacency within the banking sector, emphasizing the large regulatory burden faced by financial institutions. Bowman articulated the dual challenge banks encounter in balancing risk management and compliance efforts while striving for innovation and growth. This insight underlines the need for constant vigilance and adaptability in the face of evolving financial landscapes and regulatory expectations.

Innovating Consumer Protection in Digital Payments

The episode discusses a report from the Federal Reserve Bank of Atlanta on credit push fraud, underscoring the necessity for banks to update their approach to consumer protection. This includes adapting mitigation techniques to counteract authorized push payment fraud more effectively. It points to the importance of shifting strategies in consumer protection to keep pace with the changing nature of digital payments and the innovative tactics employed by fraudsters.

The Call for Regulation in Payment Apps

District Attorney Alvin Bragg's letter to payment apps like Venmo, Zelle, and Cash App, following a series of fraudulent scams, calls for immediate actions to enhance consumer protection. Bragg's recommendations, including multi-factor authentication and setting default lower limits on transactions, emphasize the urgent need for regulatory measures to address vulnerabilities in digital payment platforms. This insight reflects the ongoing challenges in balancing the convenience of instant payments with the security measures necessary to protect consumers from fraud.

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Episode Summary

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali talks with Sean Carter, President & CEO at NEACH, about the significant changes in ACH rules. They dive into the recent ballots passed with over 93% approval, focusing on the new risk management framework. This framework aims to protect the payment network from fraud, a challenge all payment systems currently face. Carter emphasizes the collective effort required to combat fraud, highlighting that the changes affect not just one party but all involved in the ACH network.

The conversation then shifts to specific rule changes, particularly the ACH credit monitoring by RDFIs. This new concept asks receiving financial institutions to do more in spotting and preventing fraud, marking a departure from the traditional focus on originators and ODFIs. Examples of past fraud incidents are discussed to illustrate the potential impact of these rules in preventing future fraud. Carter points out the importance of collaboration between RDFIs, ODFIs, and originators to effectively use these rules.

Finally, Carter stresses the urgency of implementing these changes well before the 2026 deadline. He suggests that financial institutions should not wait to adapt, given the serious implications of fraud on society, including funding for trafficking, drugs, and terrorism. The discussion concludes with the importance of keeping information up to date in the NACHA registry and leveraging technology like AI to enhance fraud detection efforts.

Guest-at-a-Glance
Sean Carter
President & CEO
NEACH

Key Insights
A United Front Against ACH Fraud

 Sean Carter emphasizes the importance of a collective effort in combating fraud within the ACH network. The new ACH rules, passed with overwhelming approval, reflect this approach by not singling out any one party but rather distributing the responsibility across RDFIs, ODFIs, originators, and third-party senders. This strategy acknowledges that fraud is a complex issue that no single entity can address alone. By mandating contributions from all sides, the aim is to fortify the entire payment system against fraudulent activities, demonstrating a shift towards a more inclusive and collaborative defense mechanism within the financial ecosystem.

Enhanced Role of RDFIs in Monitoring ACH Credits

The episode dives into one of the major changes in the ACH rules: the requirement for RDFIs to monitor ACH credits more closely. This significant shift tasks RDFIs with identifying and addressing potential fraud more proactively. Previously, the focus was predominantly on the originators and ODFIs. By extending this responsibility, the new rules aim to leverage the unique position of RDFIs to spot unusual activities, such as unexpected large deposits, that might indicate fraud. This change underscores a holistic approach to fraud prevention, recognizing that effective detection requires insights from all parties involved in the transaction process.

Immediate Action Required to Combat Fraud

Despite a 2026 deadline for implementing the new ACH rule changes, Sean Carter stresses the importance of starting now. He highlights the critical nature of fraud prevention, not just for the integrity of the payment system but also for societal concerns, as fraud often funds illegal activities. By encouraging financial institutions to adopt new measures promptly, Carter underscores the notion that waiting is not an option when it comes to safeguarding against fraud. This urgency is a call to action for all entities involved in ACH transactions to review and update their processes, utilize new technologies, and ensure compliance

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Episode Summary

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, Joe Casali shares insights from the MIT Fintech Conference, focusing on the rapid evolution of fintech. He discusses how artificial intelligence and blockchain technology are driving change in the payments industry. Joe also highlights the importance of navigating regulatory landscapes to foster innovation while ensuring security and trust.

The conversation shifts to the impact of digital currencies and payment platforms on traditional banking systems. Joe emphasizes the need for financial institutions to adapt to these changes to remain competitive. He provides examples of how fintech startups are challenging established players by offering more efficient and user-friendly solutions.

Lastly, Joe offers advice for entrepreneurs entering the fintech space. He stresses the significance of understanding customer needs and regulatory requirements. The episode concludes with Casali predicting future trends in fintech, including further integration of AI and personalized financial services.

Guest-at-a-Glance
Host: Joseph Casali
Company: NEACH
Where to find Joe: LinkedIn

Key Insights

Navigating the Future: Fintech's Leap into AI

Joe Casali discusses the significant strides in artificial intelligence (AI) within the fintech sector, particularly emphasizing AI's potential as an underlying operating system for financial platforms. This concept heralds a transformative approach to handling financial transactions, where AI's integration could lead to more informed decision-making processes and a new era of financial services innovation. The conversation sheds light on the cautious yet optimistic embrace of AI in fintech, highlighting the balance between leveraging cutting-edge technology and ensuring reliable, garbage-free outputs.

The Real-time Payments Challenge: Finding a Use Case

A significant part of the discussion centers around the excitement and subsequent skepticism surrounding real-time payments (RTP). Despite the technological achievement of developing RTP systems like FedNow and RTP, Casali underscores a pivotal concern: the need for compelling use cases that justify the adoption and widespread use of these systems. This insight delves into the industry's quest to demonstrate how RTP can meaningfully change the financial landscape, reflecting a critical juncture where potential meets practical application.

Fintech's New Frontier: Making Regulatory Compliance a Core Competency

In the fintech industry, where innovation races ahead, regulatory compliance emerges as a key area of focus. Joe highlights how fintech companies are now prioritizing knowledge about banking regulations, transforming compliance into a valued skill rather than a cumbersome obligation. This shift reflects a broader understanding that navigating the complex regulatory environment is essential for sustainable growth and innovation in fintech. It marks a maturation of the fintech sector, acknowledging the importance of aligning cutting-edge financial solutions with regulatory standards.

Episode Highlights
AI as Fintech's Backbone: The Next Revolution
Timestamp: [00:14:07]

Joe Casali discusses the pivotal role of artificial intelligence (AI) in shaping the future of fintech. He emphasizes AI's potential to act as the foundational operating system for financial services, transforming decision-making processes and enhancing service delivery. Casali highlights the dual nature of excitement and caution in adopting AI,

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Episode Summary

Financial institutions face a critical challenge: modernizing payment operations through FinTech partnerships without compromising compliance. On Wrestling Payments, host Elyssa Morgan explores practical strategies for balancing innovation with regulatory requirements.

Mark Forbis (former Jack Henry CTO) and Stephen Coburn (Avalo Labs CEO) reveal what works when banks and FinTechs collaborate. Mark explains why most institutions approach partnerships wrong, while Stephen discusses cultural mismatches that doom relationships. Both have witnessed spectacular failures and quiet successes.

The conversation reveals hidden complexities of third-party risk management and why traditional due diligence overlooks critical warning signs. From fourth-party vendor oversight to recent industry shake-ups, this episode provides frameworks payment leaders won't find in regulatory guidance.

Guests: 

• Mark Forbis - Former CTO, Avalo Labs | 32 years at Jack Henry, multiple bank boards LinkedIn 
• Stephen Coburn - CEO, Avalo Labs | Built compliance-focused treasury platform LinkedIn 
• Mary Mumper-Morrison - Director of Education, NEACH | FinTech veteran specializing in risk management LinkedIn 

Key Insights:

1. Cultural alignment determines success more than technical capabilities
2. Fourth-party risks create hidden vulnerabilities requiring expanded due diligence
3. Early compliance integration prevents costly partnership failures
4. Contingency planning for FinTech failure requires clear data ownership protocols

Smart institutions prepare for scenarios most never consider, including partner failures and customer relationship transfers.

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Episode Summary

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali engages with the intricate world of payment systems. He dives into the evolving landscape, highlighting the shift towards faster and more secure transactions. Joe sheds light on the technological advancements driving change, from blockchain to AI, emphasizing their impact on both consumers and financial institutions.

Primarily, this episode reports on the responses to our listeners responses of the areas of interest they would like to hear more about in 2024. It also includes a thank you for named respondents.
 

1. Faster Payments – Operational Considerations
2. Faster Payments – Strategic Considerations
3. AI and Fraud
4. Payments Modernization – Payment Choices

Joe concludes with insights into the future of payments, including the potential of FedNow and other real-time payment solutions. Casali's expert commentary provides listeners with a comprehensive understanding of the payment industry's current state and dynamic future, making this episode a must-listen for anyone interested in financial technology and innovation.

Key Insights

The Rise of Faster Payments and Operational Considerations

 The episode dives into the rapidly evolving landscape of faster payments, highlighting operational considerations that businesses face. With faster payments, questions around functionality, error handling, and unexplored details come to the forefront. The push for speed in transactions offers benefits but also introduces complexities in implementation and management. This insight underscores the need for financial institutions to adapt to new technologies while ensuring reliability and security in their operations.

Strategic Implications of AI and Fraud in Payment Systems

 AI's integration into payment systems marks a significant shift towards combating fraud more effectively. Joe explores how AI tools enhance fraud protection by analyzing patterns and identifying anomalies in transaction data. This technological advancement is not just about preventing unauthorized transactions; it's also about streamlining processes and improving operational efficiency. The episode emphasizes AI's role in shaping future payment security strategies, illustrating its potential to mitigate risks in an increasingly digital financial landscape.

Payment Evolution: From Barter to FedNow

 Tracing the history of payment systems from barter to the introduction of FedNow, the episode provides a comprehensive overview of how payment methods have evolved. It highlights the persistence of older payment systems alongside the adoption of new technologies. The focus on FedNow's launch and its adoption by financial institutions showcases the industry's movement towards instant payment solutions. This insight reflects on the diverse payment mix available today and the strategic decisions businesses must make to accommodate consumer preferences and technological advancements.

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Tilled, to discuss the evolving world of payment processing. Caleb shares his journey from door-to-door sales to pioneering innovative payment solutions. He reflects on the complexities of the industry, highlighting the nuances of competing and partnering within the same space.

Caleb dives into the intricacies of payment facilitation, explaining how companies like Stripe and Square have revolutionized the field. He emphasizes the role of software-led payments in reshaping the industry, offering a glimpse into the future of payment processing. His insights reveal how technology and strategic partnerships are key in navigating this dynamic landscape.

The conversation also touches on the importance of adapting to industry changes and leveraging emerging opportunities. Caleb's expertise offers valuable lessons for aspiring entrepreneurs in the fintech space, illustrating the balance between innovation and practical business strategies.

Guest-at-a-Glance
Guest: Caleb Avery
What he does: Founder, CEO
Company: Tilled
Noteworthy: Caleb Avery: Started in payments at 19, door-to-door sales, evolved to angel investing and consulting.
Where to find Caleb: LinkedIn

Key Insights

The Evolution of the Payment Facilitator Model

 Caleb Avery discusses the complexities and the evolution of the payment facilitator (PayFac) model. Traditionally, becoming a PayFac involved a lengthy, costly process, often taking years and significant investment. This challenge inspired Caleb to innovate and create 'PayFac as a Service,' streamlining this process for businesses. 

Developing Product Management Skills

 Caleb reflects on the importance of honing product management skills in the technology sector. He emphasizes the complexities in decision-making, from feature prioritization to system design. Relying on customer feedback, intuition, and experience, Caleb underscores the pivotal role these skills play in achieving product-market fit. 

Adapting to the Competitive Payments Landscape

 Caleb observes the increasing competitiveness in the payment space, particularly noting the shift among traditional financial players. He points out that banks and acquirers are now more attuned to the vertical software landscape, recognizing both threats and opportunities in the evolving payments ecosystem. This insight showcases the dynamic nature of the industry, where established entities must adapt to remain relevant amidst the rise of new, agile competitors in the software-led payments world​​.

Episode Highlights
Caleb's Early Career and Introduction to the Payments Industry
Timestamp: [00:01:13]

 Caleb Avery shares his journey into the payments industry, starting at 19 with door-to-door sales, then progressing to angel investing and consulting in vertical software businesses. This experience allowed him to understand the payments landscape deeply, from direct merchant interaction to broader industry insights. His journey highlights the importance of grassroots experience in understanding and innovating in the payments sector.

"I started my career in the payment space at 19 years old going door-to-door selling payment processing services to small business owners... over time skilled up that first business and really between that first company until I started doing a lot of angel investing and consulting with vertical software businesses."​​

Role of ISOs in Payment Distribution
Timestamp: [00:15:59]

Caleb discusses the historical role of Independent Sales Or

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Episode Summary
In the Season 1 Finale show of Wrestling Payments, Joe Casali delves into the dynamic world of financial technology and seeks audience input or crowdsourcing of the critical issues for 2024.

Joe discusses a list of important, interesting and pressing issues with a request of the audience suggest how the Association should direct resources and energy in 2024.

The episode closes with a call to action for listeners to participate in shaping the future content of the series. Casali encourages audience engagement through a survey, emphasizing the collective effort in navigating the complexities of modern payment systems. The episode sets the stage for continued exploration and discussion of financial technologies in the next season. Visit https://www.neach.org/podcasts to submit your ideas.

Key Insights
Rise of Fast Payment Systems: FedNow's Impact

Joe Casali discusses the rapid growth and adoption of FedNow, emphasizing its role in expanding payment options. With over 300 participants quickly joining, FedNow represents a significant move towards faster, more reliable transactions. The dialogue revolves around the operational and strategic implications of adopting such technologies. Casali questions how institutions should adapt their policies, risk management, and compliance in response to these faster payment systems, urging listeners to consider their impact on the broader financial landscape.

Navigating Payment Innovations Amidst Risks

The episode highlights the double-edged sword of technological innovation in the payment sector. Casali points to a recent ransomware attack affecting several credit unions as a case study for understanding the intertwined relationship between emerging technologies and their inherent risks. He calls for a robust understanding and preparation for these risks, emphasizing the need for proactive risk assessment and management strategies. The discussion extends to the broader implications for regulatory compliance and operational resilience in the face of these emerging threats.

Regulatory Landscape: A Moving Target

Addressing the ever-evolving nature of regulations, Casali speaks on the necessity of staying informed and adaptable. With regulatory frameworks constantly shifting, organizations must be vigilant and proactive in understanding and preparing for these changes. The conversation delves into how regulations impact various aspects of payment strategies and risk management. Casali encourages listeners to stay engaged with regulatory developments to effectively navigate the complexities and ensure compliance in a dynamic environment.

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Episode Summary

In this insightful episode of Wrestling Payments, Joe Casali dives deep into the complexities and challenges of payment operations. He emphasizes the critical role of problem-solving in the industry, highlighting how essential it is for professionals to understand the rules and mechanisms of different payment systems. Joe narrates a real-life story, maintaining anonymity, to illustrate the intricate process of payments, particularly focusing on the Real-Time Payments (RTP) system.

Joe begins by explaining the fundamental flow of an RTP transaction, involving the sender, sending bank, network, receiving bank, and receiver. He details the rapid and efficient process, emphasizing the speed and precision of these transactions. The episode takes an interesting turn as Joe introduces a third-party service provider in a transaction scenario, exploring how their involvement can complicate the payment process.

The heart of the episode lies in a case study where a transaction goes awry due to a mismatch between the receiving bank's system and the RTP network. Joe explains how a seemingly straightforward RTP transaction gets complicated by additional checks and balances introduced by the receiving bank. This leads to an insightful discussion on the importance of understanding payment network rules and the pitfalls of automated systems in handling exceptions.

Key Insights

The Importance of Problem-Solving in Payment Operations

In the rapidly evolving world of payments, problem-solving emerges as a crucial skill. Joe Casali discusses the changing landscape of payment operations, emphasizing the need for professionals who can navigate complex scenarios. He points out that understanding the rules and mechanics of payment systems, such as Real-Time Payments (RTP), is vital. This insight highlights how problem-solving goes beyond technical knowledge, requiring an adaptable mindset to address unforeseen challenges in payment transactions.

Navigating Complexities in Real-Time Payments (RTP)

The episode dives into the intricacies of the RTP system, illustrating its operational flow involving senders, banks, and receivers. Joe Casali explicates the speed and efficiency of RTP transactions, but also sheds light on potential complications. A key insight is the complexity introduced by third-party service providers in the payment process. This discussion underscores the necessity for thorough understanding and coordination among all parties involved in RTP transactions, highlighting how a single mismatch can lead to significant operational challenges.

Handling Exceptions and Automated Systems in Payment Networks

A compelling segment of the podcast revolves around a case study where an RTP transaction is disrupted by additional security measures. The episode reveals how automated systems, while efficient, can falter in handling exceptions, especially when they don't align with the payment network's protocols. This insight stresses the importance of balancing automation with human oversight. It serves as a cautionary tale about the pitfalls of over-relying on technology in payment systems, advocating for a more nuanced approach that considers the unique aspects of each transaction.

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Episode Summary

In the latest episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali and guests Dennis Walker and Stephen Dillon engage in a candid conversation about the complex world of third-party sender relationships in the realm of banking and ACH payments. Drawing from their extensive experience in the industry, Dennis and Stephen share valuable insights and practical wisdom that can help financial institutions navigate this intricate landscape effectively.

The discussion kicks off with an exploration of the key factors that define third-party sender relationships. Dennis and Stephen highlight that understanding and educating the entire workforce within a financial institution is paramount. They stress the importance of being proactive in risk management, recognizing red flags, and implementing preventive measures to maintain the integrity of ACH transactions.

Throughout the conversation, they emphasize the significance of regular annual reviews and check-ins with customers, especially the larger ones. These reviews serve as a crucial opportunity to assess any material changes in a customer's business, their sophistication level, and their evolving risk profile. By staying engaged and informed, financial institutions can adapt their risk management strategies to meet the evolving needs of their customers effectively.

Guest-at-a-Glance
Names:
Stephen Dillon, APRP, AAP, CTP , Eastern Bank
Dennis Walker, CIA, CISA, CRCM, CFSA, CRMA

Noteworthy: Stephen Dillon boasts a career in banking and treasury services, with a keen understanding of the intricacies of ACH payments and risk management. / Dennis Walker possesses a diverse background in banking and financial services, bringing extensive experience and knowledge to the discussion on third-party sender relationships.

Key Insights

Proactive Approaches to Spotting Third-Party Senders in Banking

Dennis and Stephen discuss strategies for identifying third-party senders in the banking industry. They highlight the importance of keyword analysis, company name checks, and reviewing client portfolios to spot potential third-party senders. Additionally, they stress the need to leverage annual reviews and customer engagement to stay vigilant in risk management.

Balancing Risk Mitigation and Customer Engagement with Third-Party Senders

Dennis, Stephen, and Joe underscore the significance of robust risk management practices and consistent customer engagement in dealing with third-party senders. They emphasize conducting risk assessments, due diligence, and maintaining open communication with clients. These practices help banks and financial institutions safeguard their interests and build trust with customers.

Deciphering the Gray Areas: Classifying Third-Party Senders in Banking

Stephen and Joe explore the complexity of classifying entities as third-party senders in the banking sector. They dive into scenarios where the distinction may not be straightforward, particularly in cases involving common ownership or management. The discussion highlights the need for institutions to make informed decisions and apply due diligence when determining third-party sender status.

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Welcome to another episode of Wrestling Payments.

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali delves into the evolving landscape of real-time payments. He highlights the recent developments at The Clearing House, emphasizing the organization's efforts to enhance transaction speeds. Casali also discusses the integration of new hires in the payment industry, underscoring their role in bringing fresh perspectives and innovative approaches to traditional financial systems.

The conversation shifts to regulatory changes, focusing on the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau's (CFPB) new rules for digital wallets. Joe explains the implications of these regulations for consumers and businesses, outlining the balance between security and convenience. He also discusses Zelle's recent challenges with fraud, detailing their strategies to increase reimbursements and implement additional safeguards.

Lastly, the episode features insights on Keith Melton's contribution to the RTP network. The host explores Melton's strategies for future growth and the potential impact of these plans on the payments industry. He also touches on CFPB's proposals concerning technology companies in the financial sector, highlighting the need for a nuanced understanding of these new regulations.

Episode Highlights:

● Keith Melton's Joining the Clearing House
● New CFPB Regulation for Digital Wallets
● Zelle's Response to Increased Fraud
● Improvements in Zelle’s Fraud Control Measures

To hear this episode and many more like it, listen here or subscribe to Wrestling Payments on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify, or anywhere else you listen to podcasts.

For show notes, transcripts, and other resources visit www.wrestlingpayments.com.

Host: Joe Casali, EVP, NEACH

#wrestlingpayments #wrestlingpaymentspodcast #paymentspodcast

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Episode Summary
In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali sits down with Mark Dixon, the Vice President of Education at NEACH. Mark dives into his journey in the banking and payment sector, highlighting his passion for the industry and the intersections of technology, disruption, and the future of banking. He emphasizes the importance of payments in various business sectors and the excitement of navigating the ever-evolving landscape.

Mark introduces "NEACH U," a reimagined educational platform designed to cater to various professionals in the payment space. From operational roles to treasury management, compliance, and risk management, NEACH U aims to provide individualized learning paths for all. The platform's goal is twofold: to benefit organizations by enhancing their employees' knowledge and to foster professional development for individuals.

Set to launch in 2024, NEACH U promises to be a transformative tool for payment professionals, guiding them towards the next steps in their careers and offering valuable insights into the world of payments.

Guest-at-a-Glance
Guest: Mark DIxon
What he does: VP of Education
Company: NEACH
Noteworthy: Mark Dixon: Vice President of Education at NEACH, passionate about payment evolution.
Where to find Mark: LinkedIn 

Key Insights
Mark Dixon's Passionate Journey in Payments

Mark Dixon's professional trajectory in the banking and payment sector is both intriguing and inspiring. Starting his career in banking, he didn't initially envision a future in the sector. However, as he dived deeper, especially into electronic banking, he discovered a fervent passion for payments. Mark's enthusiasm is not just about the technicalities of payments but also about understanding their intersection with various business sectors and the role of technology. 

Headline: Introduction of NEACH U: A Game-Changer in Payment Education

NEACH U is Mark's ambitious project, aiming to revolutionize payment education. This platform is not just another educational tool; it's designed to offer individualized learning paths for professionals in the payment space. Whether one is in operational roles, treasury management, compliance, or risk management, NEACH U promises a tailored learning experience. 

NEACH U's Vision: Individual Growth and Organizational Excellence

Mark emphasizes that NEACH U is more than just a learning platform; it's a roadmap for professional growth. Recognizing the diverse paths in the payment space, from operational to strategic roles, NEACH U is designed to guide professionals based on their unique needs and aspirations. The platform will not only serve as a knowledge hub but also as a catalyst for career advancement. 

Contact: info@wrestlingpayments.com

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Episode Summary

​​In this episode, Joe Casali sits down with Sean Carter, the top man at Neach Payments Group. They dive deep into the world of risk management in payments. Sean emphasizes the power of interpersonal skills and the value of curiosity in the industry.

The talk shifts to the intricate dance between Enterprise Risk Management (ERM) and Strategic Risk Management (SRM). Both play pivotal roles in shaping the future of payments. Sean shares insights on how these concepts intertwine and their impact on the broader payment landscape.

Tune in to grasp the nuances of risk management from an industry leader. It's a conversation packed with expertise and actionable insights.

Guest-at-a-Glance
Name: Sean Carter
What he does: President & CEO
Company: NEACH
Noteworthy: Sean Carter: Newly minted Accredited Payment Risk Professional (APRP).
Where to find Sean: LinkedIn

Key Insights
The Power of Imagination in Risk Management

 Sean Carter emphasizes the importance of operations personnel in risk management. These individuals possess a wealth of institutional knowledge, allowing them to predict potential issues based on past experiences. Sean suggests that a combination of strong communication skills and the ability to envision various scenarios (imagination) can be invaluable. This imaginative foresight helps in anticipating challenges, especially those not immediately obvious.

The Role of Interpersonal Skills in Operations

 Sean highlights the significance of interpersonal skills in preventing blindsides in operations. Building good relationships across departments and consistently asking questions can prevent unexpected challenges. Being inquisitive and maintaining open channels of communication can preemptively address potential issues. Moreover, making others feel important can lead to more open sharing of information.

Understanding Risk Appetite vs. Risk Tolerance

 The distinction between an organization's risk appetite and risk tolerance is crucial. While risk appetite is the overall level of risk an organization is willing to accept, risk tolerance pertains to the degree of risk they're willing to take for a specific goal. Effective communication is essential to ensure everyone understands these concepts, aligning individual actions with the organization's broader risk strategy.

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In this episode, Joe Casali from NEACH dives deep into the world of ISO 20022, the international standard for payments messaging. While ISO 20022 might be a fresh face in the US, its significance can't be understated. Drawing a unique parallel, Joe likens the fervor for ISO 20022 to that of a "mark" in wrestling - someone deeply passionate and invested in the industry's narratives. As the conversation unfolds, it's clear: Joe is all in on ISO 20022, seeing its potential to reshape the payments landscape.

Guest-at-a-Glance
Name: Joe Casali
What he does: Host
Company: NEACH / Website
Key Insights

The Rise of ISO 20022 in Payment Systems

 ISO 20022, an international standard for payments messaging, is gaining traction globally. While it's not entirely new, it's becoming more prominent in the US. Various organizations, from SWIFT to the Federal Reserve, are adopting ISO 20022 for their messaging systems. The Clearinghouse's RTP and the Federal Reserve's Fed Now both utilize versions of ISO 20022, showcasing its versatility and widespread acceptance.

The Debate Over "Rich Data"

There's a buzz around ISO 20022's ability to include "rich data" in its messages. However, Joe Casali challenges this notion. While ISO 20022 can carry additional data, the depth and richness of this data are up for debate. For instance, while it can include a URL or a 140-character message, questions arise about the security and practicality of such features.

ISO 20022 vs. EDI: A New Era of Messaging

Comparing ISO 20022 to Electronic Data Interchange (EDI), Joe highlights the evolution of computer-to-computer communication in payments. While EDI had its challenges, ISO 20022 offers a more streamlined approach. Companies can send payment messages directly to financial institutions, ensuring smoother transactions and reducing the need for manual interventions.

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In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali sits down with Kevin Olsen, the Payments Professor. Kevin shares his unexpected journey into the payments field, sparked by a job loss during the dot-com bubble. His path led him to become a leader in the industry, teaching others about the intricacies of electronic payments.

The conversation shifts to the creation of Kevin's podcast, the Payments Podium. Kevin reveals how a casual comment from a colleague led him to start recording his discussions about the payments industry. He shares his approach to finding guests, focusing on individuals with years of experience and knowledge to share.

The episode wraps up with a discussion about the future of payments, particularly the importance of instant payment capabilities. Kevin emphasizes the need for the U.S. to compete globally in this area. This episode is a must-listen for anyone interested in the evolution of the payments industry and the power of lifelong learning.

Guest-at-a-Glance

Name: Kevin Olsen
What he does: The Payments Professor
Company: Payments Professor
Noteworthy: Kevin Olsen, a tech graduate turned teacher, found his way into the payments industry by accident during the dot-com bubble burst.
Where to find Kevin: LinkedIn / Podcast

Key Insights

The Birth of Payments Podium 

Kevin Olsen shares the story behind his podcast, the Payments Podium. A casual comment from a colleague inspired him to record his discussions about the payments industry. He began by inviting people he knew to be guests and then expanded his network by asking each guest to recommend others. This approach has led to a wide variety of guests, each with their own unique experiences and insights to share. The podcast has become a valuable resource for anyone interested in the payments industry.

The Importance of Fun and Joy in Learning

Kevin discusses the importance of making learning fun, especially when it comes to complex topics like electronic payments. He emphasizes the effectiveness of 'edutainment,' a blend of education and entertainment, in facilitating learning. He also highlights the importance of bite-sized, easily digestible content that busy professionals can revisit and relearn at their own pace.

The Future of Payments 

The conversation concludes with a discussion about the future of payments. Kevin underscores the need for the U.S. to develop instant payment capabilities in order to compete globally. He believes that staying abreast of changes in the industry is crucial for success and that financial institutions must strive to be more than just 'afloat' – they should aim to lead.

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EPISODE SUMMARY

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, Host Elyssa Morgan talks with Dr. Angela Murphy from Pidgin about the shift from competition to collaboration between financial institutions and fintechs. They explore why partnership is a critical strategy for shaping the future of financial services and meeting rapidly evolving customer expectations.

Angela addresses the common fear among institutions of losing control. She argues that fintechs like PayPal and Venmo have already changed the landscape. Instead of being a threat, the right technology partners can help institutions provide better digital experiences and augment the customer relationships they have already built.

This conversation provides a playbook for moving forward. Angela shares how institutions can analyze their payment strategies, find opportunities in the B2B space, and leverage technology to reduce risk. For any institution looking to innovate, this episode offers a clear path to seizing opportunity while maintaining control.

GUEST-AT-A-GLANCE

💡 Name: Angela Murphy
💡 What she does: Vice President of Marketing and Solutions
💡 Company: Pidgin
💡 Noteworthy: Known as the "Payments Elsa," with deep expertise in payments innovation and AI.

💡 Where to find her: LinkedIn

KEY INSIGHTS

Financial Institutions Must Embrace Fintech Partnership to Survive

Wrestling Payments host Elyssa Morgan interviews Dr. Angela Murphy (Pidgin's VP Marketing) about why banks and credit unions must shift from competing with fintechs to collaborating with them.

Key Takeaways:

Partnership Over Competition Customer expectations for seamless digital experiences now extend to financial services. Institutions can no longer provide everything in-house. Strategic fintech partnerships enable rapid deployment of innovative solutions while maintaining competitive edge.

Control Through Collaboration Many institutions fear losing customer relationships to fintechs, but services like PayPal and Venmo already changed the landscape. Smart partnerships strengthen relationships by adding necessary digital tools under trusted institutional brands, keeping institutions as central financial advisors.

B2B Payment Opportunity While consumer payments get attention, B2B payments remain inefficient and outdated. This creates massive revenue opportunities for institutions willing to partner with specialized fintechs to solve commercial client pain points.

Practical Innovation Steps

• Analyze existing payment flows and costs
• Target top 20% of check users driving 80% of volume for digital transition
• Leverage AI partnerships to automate processes and combat fraud

Angela, known as "Payments Elsa," provides a clear roadmap for institutions to innovate while maintaining control, emphasizing that collaboration isn't surrender—it's strategic survival in rapidly evolving financial services.

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Episode Summary
In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali, along with guests Sean Carter and Mark Dixon from NEACH, dive into the world of payment systems. They tackle the pressing issues of misinformation and conspiracy theories in the payment industry. Carter, NEACH's president, views these as outside interference, while Dixon, Vice President of Education, sees them as a pulse of public sentiment.

The trio also discusses the concept of banking as a service, the role of financial institutions in supporting FinTech, and the importance of understanding disclosures when dealing with apps like Venmo and Cash App. They debunk the rumor of the government switching all benefits to FedNow and forcing every institution to join the platform.

Lastly, they address the theory of FedNow being the government's new cryptocurrency set to eliminate cash. They clarify that FedNow transactions are in US dollars, not digital dollars and that laws would need to change before a digital dollar could be implemented. Tune in for a deep dive into these topics and more.

Guest-at-a-Glance
Name: Sean Carter and Mark Dixon
What they do: President & CEO / Vice President-Education
Company: NEACH

Noteworthy: Sean Carter, President and CEO of NEACH, is a seasoned leader in the payment industry. He's known for his keen insights on misinformation and its impact on the payment system. Mark Dixon, Vice President of Education at NEACH, is a thought leader in the payment space. He's recognized for his understanding of the evolving landscape of banking and financial services.

Where to find them: Sean: LinkedIn / Mark: LinkedIn

KEY INSIGHTS
Misinformation as a Pulse of Public Sentiment

Misinformation in the payment industry is viewed differently by our guests. Sean sees it as outside interference, a tool used by some to confuse and scare the public for their gain. Mark, on the other hand, perceives it as a pulse of public sentiment, a reflection of what people are thinking and feeling about the payment space. This difference in perspective highlights the complexity of dealing with misinformation and the need for a nuanced approach.

The Role of Financial Institutions in Supporting FinTech

Mark discusses the concept of banking as a service. He highlights how proactive institutions are entering this space, backing FinTech partners and providing support. He emphasizes the importance of understanding disclosures when dealing with apps like Venmo and Cash App. This insight underscores the evolving landscape of banking and financial services and the need for consumers to be informed.

Debunking the Rumor of FedNow

The podcast addresses the rumor of the government switching all benefits to FedNow and forcing every institution to join the platform. The hosts clarify that FedNow transactions are in US dollars, not digital dollars and that laws would need to change before a digital dollar could be implemented. This insight dispels misconceptions about FedNow and emphasizes the importance of accurate information in the payment industry.

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Episode Summary
In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali welcomes Nanci McKenzie and James Rowe from Affirmative Technology. They dive into the challenges of creating a risk rating for originators in the payments industry.

The conversation highlights the importance of risk management in financial institutions. Nanci and James discuss the need for automated solutions to handle the increasing volume of transactions. They emphasize that manual methods and spreadsheets are no longer sufficient. The discussion also touches on the role of regulators and the pressure they put on institutions to have robust risk management systems in place.

The episode concludes with a look at the broader economic landscape. James, an economist, shares his insights on the potential impact of rising interest rates and the debt ceiling issue on financial institutions. He also offers his perspective on the current state of the economy and its implications for banks. This episode is a must-listen for anyone interested in the intersection of risk management and the payments industry.

Podcast Experts
Name: Nanci McKenzie and James Rowe

What they do: Executive Vice President of Compliance and Product Strategy and Chairman of the Affirmative Technology Board

Company: Affirmative Technologies

Noteworthy: An industry veteran, Nanci McKenzie is known for her expertise in risk management and compliance in the payments industry. / An economist by training, Rowe specializes in leveraging data analytics to solve key business problems in the financial sector.

Where to find them: Nanci: LinkedIn｜James: LinkedIn


Key Insights

Automated Risk Rating for Originators

Wrestling Payments delves into the need for automated risk rating for originators in the payments industry. Nanci and James discuss how their tool, Navigator, can provide accurate ratings for originators based on their transaction history. This system allows financial institutions to prioritize their focus on high-risk originators, enabling efficient risk management. The tool also allows for monitoring originators' risk transition, providing valuable insights into their business activities.

Embracing Data Analytics
James, an economist by training, emphasizes the importance of embracing data analytics in financial institutions. He demystifies terms like AI, machine learning, and big data, explaining that these are simply automated statistical techniques that have been around for decades. James encourages financial institutions not to be intimidated by these terms but to leverage them to make effective decisions.

Regulatory Pressure and Risk Management
The podcast also highlights the increasing regulatory pressure on financial institutions to have robust risk management systems. Nanci points out that regulators are asking institutions how they are risk grading their customers and are taking enforcement actions based on their findings. This underscores the importance of efficient risk management systems, such as the one provided by Affirmative Technologies.

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Episode Summary
It's hard to imagine life without a smartphone, as it has integrated into every aspect of our personal and professional lives. Let's take a look at banking. No one writes checks anymore. Instead, we use mobile banking apps; even our credit and debit cards are tap-and-go or tap-to-pay. We understand it's all technology-driven, often forgetting that there have always been, and probably will always be, people behind all these solutions.

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, Linda Cooper, the VP & senior operations manager at Gorham Savings Bank, joins our host Joe Casali to discuss innovations in banking from the perspectives of FIs and customers. They also touch upon banking in general and the reasons for its bad reputation. Finally, Linda lists what skills are needed to thrive in the field. 

Podcast Expert
Guest name: Linda Cooper

What she does: Linda is the VP & senior operations manager at Gorham Savings Bank.

Company: Gorham Savings Bank

Where to find Linda: LinkedIn

Noteworthy: Linda covers various areas, working with the data processing, loan servicing, and content management teams.

Podcast Insights
Banking has earned a bad reputation, and it's on us to carry that burden. That's because banks take responsibility for any money-related issue, regardless of the level of control they have in a given situation. Linda explains. ''If anything happens, we take the rap for it, whether it is interest rates going up or IRS checks not getting there quickly enough or no matter what. We are on the front end, and it's our problem whether we can control it or not. So it requires large shoulders because that's just the way it is.''

Modern banking means faster banking. But, convenient as it may sound, enjoying the shiny objects of today's banking may have some side effects. ''We go on and on about faster payments in all of their forms, and it just means it's faster to be wrong or fraudulent. You can make mistakes faster. You can have problems faster and with less time to react. So there's that side of it.''

Relying on technology requires you to have plan B. Digital tools are the present and future of any industry, including banking. But one thing we must bear in mind: technology can break, and depending on how severe the breakage is, we must have a recovery strategy. ''You need to be able to create and have manual procedures so that in the case of failure — it's like insurance. The idea is that you would never have to use it, but you still need to have it.''

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This is the third and final episode that was recorded live at the Annual Payments Management Conference, this year NEACH celebrated its 50th Anniversary. The last but definitely not the least. we could have easily kept talking about risk and payments.

Episode Summary

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali engages in a rich conversation with Nanci McKenzie, Executive Vice President of Compliance and Product Strategy at Affirmative Technologies. Nanci shares her extensive experience in the payments industry, highlighting the importance of risk management in payment processing. She emphasizes the need for financial institutions to scrutinize their payment processors and FinTech partners as closely as they do their vendors, given the potential impact of security incidents.

The conversation then shifts to the evolving landscape of electronic payments. Nanci provides her insights on the future of the industry, particularly the rise of faster payments and app-based solutions. She also discusses the role of third-party payment processors in catering to the banking needs of the younger generation.

Finally, Nanci underscores the importance of consumer education in mitigating financial fraud. She advocates for a collective approach to risk management, where everyone from operations to customer service representatives plays a role in identifying and mitigating risks.

Guest-at-a-Glance
Nanci McKenzie
Executive Vice President of Compliance and Product Strategy
Affirmative Technologies
LinkedIn

Noteworthy: Nanci holds an AAP, an APRP, and a Juris Master's degree in Financial Regulation and Compliance. She is currently pursuing a Master's in Legal Studies with a focus on financial regulatory compliance and cybersecurity and data privacy at Thomas R. Kline's College of Law, Drexel University. Nanci has a rich history in the payments industry, starting as a part-time teller and transitioning into FinTech. She is passionate about risk management and emphasizes the importance of consumer education in preventing financial fraud.

Key Insights
The Importance of Risk Management in Payment Processing

 Nanci emphasizes the importance of risk management in payment processing. She explains the cycle of risk assessment, policies, procedures, audits, reviews, and monitoring. She likens it to a rinse-and-repeat process, similar to shampooing. This insight underscores the need for financial institutions to scrutinize their payment processors and FinTech partners as closely as they do their vendors, given the potential impact of security incidents.

The Future of Electronic Payments

 Nanci provides her insights on the future of the industry, particularly the rise of faster payments and app-based solutions. She discusses the evolution of electronic payments, the ACH developments in app-based solutions, and the introduction of real-time payments. This insight highlights the changing landscape of the payments industry and the need for financial institutions to adapt.

The Role of Consumer Education in Mitigating Financial Fraud

 Nanci underscores the importance of consumer education in mitigating financial fraud. She advocates for a collective approach to risk management, where everyone from operations to customer service representatives plays a role in identifying and mitigating risks. This insight emphasizes the need for continued consumer education and the role of various stakeholders in preventing financial fraud.