Explore every episode of the podcast With All Due Respect
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| You Asked For It | 21 Nov 2024 | 00:52:26 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. In our season finale, our hosts answer questions from the audience and give their hot takes on some thorny issues.
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| Lausanne | 07 Nov 2024 | 00:56:09 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. In the aftermath of the 2024 Lausanne Congress - at which Megan was a delegate - our hosts take stock of what went on, review the Seoul Statement (and other alliterative faith declarations of past conferences), and mull over the insights of other attendees. They also discuss a documentary on the first Lausanne Congress, held way back in 1974.
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| Childlike Theology | 04 Jul 2024 | 00:59:17 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Theology. It's a term often associated with old professors and dusty books. But theology is actually crucial for the church. So, why don't more Christians take an interest in it? Why has it become so .... stale? These are the questions our hosts (and resident theologians) grapple with. Speaking of childlike - Michael and Megan are joined this week by author Kaitlyn Scheiss, host of the Curiously Kaitlyn podcast where she fields questions about theology from children! Finally, our hosts cast an eye over the coming-of-age film adaptation of Are You There God? It's Me, Margaret | |||
| Which is more important: your family or church family? | 03 Oct 2019 | 00:45:11 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. For argument's sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out Are family values biblical? What's more important, our nuclear family or our church family? Do we idolise marriage in the church and in society at the expense of other relationships? Megan and Michael decode the cosy phrase "family values" and look at what the Bible actually says on the topic. Mentioned in this segment:
Glossary: Megan and Michael sometimes like to use big words, so here's a glossary of particularly lofty terms in this segment.
Be our guest Dani Treweek and a theology of singleness Our guest this episode, Dani Treweek, has spent a lot of time thinking about singleness and the church – as a single Christian woman, a minister and in writing her PhD on a theological and pastoral ethic of singleness. "Part of the problem with singleness is that we see it as a problem because it's not marriage," she explains. Michael and Megan chat with Dani about the biblical view of singleness and marriage, and how the church can better relate to singles. Mentioned in this segment:
Further reading/ listening:
Marg and Dave: reviews from two people obsessed by stories, but not always the same ones ABC TV's Old People's Home For 4 Year Olds This heartwarming ABC documentary raises a key social issue: our treatment of older people. "This is a bit of a weeping sore for us in the West," says Michael. Megan points out that it also highlights the social isolation and lack of intergenerational contact in our society – experienced by both young and old. Cue the church: "one of the only institutions left where we do have people of all ages coming together." While the final live episode of Old People's Home For 4 Year Olds recently aired, you can watch all episodes in the series on ABC iview. Warning: box of tissues needed. (And stay tuned for Michael's suggested new series: Old People's Home For Teenagers. ABC, are you reading this?) Further reading/ viewing:
Fact check: Michael mentions a few statistics in this segment. Here's the research:
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| Abortion law, Christians and The Handmaid's Tale | 17 Sep 2019 | 00:44:05 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. For argument's sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out As the NSW Parliament considers whether or not abortion should be legalised, Megan and Michael discuss the broader issues raised by the abortion debate:
And what about the hot-button topics of gender selection and disability. Who determines whether or not a life is valuable? Megan and Michael draw on the wisdom of a parent of a child with a disability, With All Due Respect listener Alison Preston, in debating this life-and-death issue. One thing is clear: the law alone is inadequate in addressing a topic that requires a whole community response. Mentioned in this segment:
Further reading:
You did WHAT now? Looking at what the other M has been up to Michael, always prepared to put himself on the line, has been stepping into the charged abortion debate on social media and in the press in an attempt to change the tone of the conversation. A descendant of "backyard abortionists", Michael is aware of the "real human cost of an unregulated abortion industry", as well as the moral complexity of the abortion issue. He makes this vital point for everyone in the church: In a society where one-quarter of women will experience an abortion, "If you don't think you have women in your congregation who have had an abortion, think again." So how can Christians respond graciously instead of aggressively to this polarising issue? Listen up to how Michael and Megan are doing it. Mentioned in this segment:
Further reading:
Now we're squarely in Megan's domain: discussing Season 3 of the dystopian TV series The Handmaid’s Tale – in particular episodes 8, 9 and 13 (the final). Why has this show become so connected to the abortion debate (so that just wearing a red cloak signals a pro-choice stance)? Megan guides Michael, and listeners, through the undercurrents of death-happy Gilead, exploring the nuances of values, conflict, faith and society. Here's a taste of just one of the profound revelations Megan uncovers: "Looking after children is more than just getting them born; it is about giving them good lives." Further reading:
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| Women, ministry and the church | 05 Sep 2019 | 01:00:34 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Welcome back! Season two of With All Due Respect starts with a bang ... For argument's sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out It's game on as Megan and Michael address the elephant in the room: the issue of gender in the church. This topic marks one of the deepest divides among evangelical Christians, and the church in general. It's also one of the biggest disagreements between Megan and Michael personally (and the discussion that Michael's been avoiding because of the painful responses it can provoke). So what should women do in the church and why does it matter anyway? It's time for Megan and Michael to tie their colours to the mast: exactly what do they think about the "c word" (complementarianism) and the "e word" (egalitarianism), what's the biblical basis for these positions and how do they play out in the life of Christians and the church today. While on opposite sides of the debate, both Megan and Michael agree that this is not just a "women's issue". Further reading:
Also mentioned in this segment:
Q&A: you ask us questions, and we answer without the spin You can’t ask that! Oh but you did, and Megan and Michael asked you to. The pair field a handful of some 600 questions about gender identity and the church thrown at them by members of With All Due Respect Facebook group – a community of Christians committed to respectful public conversation. Megan goes into bat for the "feminist egalitarian" team and Michael the "moderate complementarian" team. Here's just a taste of some of the curly questions they address: Isn't egalitarianism just about women seeking power? Does complementarianism always lead to abuse? Mentioned in this segment:
Time to get personal. Michael asks Megan, "Am I a misogynist?" Megan asks Michael, "Do you think I'm called by God?" After this epic first ep for season two, our co-hosts may not have solved the issues around gender roles in the church but hopefully we've reached a starting point for mutual respect, understanding and further conversation. | |||
| Almost one year on, are we any better at respectful conversation? | 01 Aug 2019 | 00:45:51 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. ** With All Due Respect is taking a short break over August and will be back in the first week of September. First episode back with be about ... GENDER. ** For arguments sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out It's been almost a year since the the first episode of With All Due Respect, and we're coming back to the question that started it all: Can we agree to disagree? Megan says this has become even more crucial since the WADR project began. But it's confession time and Michael jumps straight in: There's one topic that Megan and Michael (and Michael in particular) have been avoiding so far: Gender and the church. It's a topic that marks a deep divide among evangelical Christians, and Christians more generally. It's one of the biggest disagreements Megan and Michael have personally, too. And Michael says he's been avoiding the issue on the podcast because of the painfulness and difficulty that discussing it can often invoke. So how do we tear down those barriers with other Christians who feel so strongly and differently to us? We may never get to common agreement, but trying to find common ground and to understand where each other is coming from should be the aim. Megan says one of the ways she tries to interact with people is remember that that person has just as rich an internal world as she does - with all their life experiences, hurts and joys. So labelling someone (Megan is often labelled as a "progressive feminist") flattens them. And she says assuming someone else's intentions is just as bad in this. Cue: virtue signalling Megan says one way you can assume someone else's intentions - especially online - is by saying they're "virtue signalling". That is, when you are expressing values in a way that people say you're doing it so that you can be seen to be a good person. In Megan's experience, it's often something the right accuses of people on the left. "It's a destructive thing to say to another person and deeply cynical," she says. "The place for dialogue is not where we draw out the worst in people, but where we address the best in people." But telling someone that they're virtue-signalling is essentially shutting down the conversation and refusing to see that there might be other reasons for what they're saying. Michael wonders if the same can be said when someone dismisses his opinion by saying, "You would say that, you're a white male." Both Megan and Michael refer to the With All Due Respect Facebook group, where they are trying to moderate the discussion in a way that reframes conversations and doesn't shut down discussion by the terms and phrases we use. The duo take a look at other Christian podcasts out there who have attempted to frame their conversations in different ways and wonder if often our fences are too high. Is there a place for fences that discourage those who disagree with us? The secret life of us: what makes the other one tick Megan and Michael talk about how they've experienced the With All Due Respect journey and what's come up personally for them. The WADR Facebook Group has been an interesting experiment to see how things in the podcast play out in real (or atleast social) life. And Michael and Megan reminisce about how they first met and their first responses to each other. Marg and Dave: reviews from two people obsessed by stories, but not always the same ones. This episode, it's Megan's choice: Won’t you be my neighbor? (2018) documentary on Mister Rogers. Fred Rogers (March 20, 1928 – February 27, 2003) was an American television personality, musician, puppeteer, writer, producer, and Presbyterian minister. He was known as the creator, composer, producer, head writer, showrunner and host of the preschool television series Mister Rogers' Neighborhood (1968–2001). Rogers would end each program by telling his viewers, "You've made this day a special day, by just your being you. There's no person in the whole world like you; and I like you just the way you are." Megan thinks there are real connections in what they're trying to do with With All Due Respect. | |||
| What good is beauty in an ugly world? | 18 Jul 2019 | 00:40:50 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. For arguments sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out While beauty can be an abstract subject, it's also something that cuts into our everyday lives. Megan and Michael wanted to talk about this subject because they both feel the evangelical world can feel a bit confining when talking about beauty. Megan says her experience of baptists in particular is that they have a strained relationship with beauty. "There's a suspicion of the beautiful, which goes back to the church fathers," says Michael. Something also happens during the Reformation, when Protestants want to get away from the visual, smash the statues and go back to the verbal. Luther even said that the ears are the organ of the Christian, not the eyes. Evangelicalism is quite a pragmatic faith. "We're not cathedral builders," says Michael. "We want to things to make a difference," says Megan, so the feeling is that there's no time for "frippery". Michael and Megan explore what beauty is - is it just 'high art' or is it broader than that? What can nature teach us about beauty? And is there a commonality of the experience of beauty that might be objective truth? Megan has been reading Culture Care by Makoto Fujimura - an artist, academic and Christian -which issues a call to feed our culture's soul with beauty, creativity and generosity. As many Christians become more embattled in culture wars, Fujimura is asking how Christians can be people who draw others into beauty. Also mentioned in this segment:
Where credit's due: the influences that form and move us It's Megan's turn to pick a book that was meaningful to her: Surprised by Joy by CS Lewis - the story of Lewis being converted to belief in God and then eventually to belief in Christianity. Lewis' experience of beauty - which he calls experiences of joy - resonated with Megan, particularly when Lewis talks of creating imaginative worlds with his brothers as a child. Michael says he picked up on the sense of longing through Lewis' work - deep in the heart of humans there is something that longs for the eternal. Beauty, says Megan, shows us that things are significant, special. As the poet Gerard Manley Hopkins writes, "The world is charged with the grandeur of God." Further reading:
Marg and Dave: reviews from two people obsessed by stories, but not always the same ones. We're talking transcendent music and faith. And Michael wants to talk about Bach: "The Christian who has done more to advance the cause of beauty than anyone is Johann Sebastian Bach," he says. Megan, on the other hand, says the music that makes her think of beauty is African American spirituals: "there's a beauty in the sadness, but yet the hope ... there's a beauty that comes out of a the experience of humanity." One song in particular featured in season 3 of The Handmaid's Tale during a scene of infant baptism, 'Down to the river to pray'. Also mentioned in this segment:
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| Religious experience - do we need it and how to find it | 04 Jul 2019 | 00:45:57 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. For arguments sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out Do you need to 'experience' God in order to have real faith? Michael says he suggested this question because in his pastoral experience there are often questions about whether people should have had a spiritual or religious experience and whether you're a Christian if you haven't had one. What if you don't ever have that feeling some describe as an "immediate, powerful, palpable experience of the spirit" that can be of great encouragement to those who receive them? Megan offers the flipside to this, in that she believes that some in a more intellectually-based faith tradition are often questioned about their spiritual experiences in a way that makes them feel like they're in some way "dodgy". The way different faith communities deal with spiritual or religious experience can make this subject fraught. Michael says his views have changed and he hopes 'matured'. He believes God can give us religious experiences from time to time: they are individual and meant to encourage us. But because they are experiences we must be very careful, he says. We shouldn't normalise those experiences to the extent that those with different ones don't feel like they're Christians or don't feel like they have the Holy Spirit. Megan has a different perspective, coming from her observations of those who don't 'experience God'. "Without experience, faith is ailing," she says. "The experience of God must be present ... but whether we're noticing it is another thing." The way we talk about those experiences and how we teach people to understand them is sub-par in the church today, Megan says. How can we help people to be attentive to God in their lives. Megan believes a pastor must first be attentive to God in their own lives. "There needs to be more room for the contemplation part of the pastoral role," she argues. If you're also immersed in Scripture, you come to understand better how God speaks and acts. Michael says it's also about teaching people to pray. Bible study should also be a place for spiritual direction. It doesn't have to be just about reading the word and understanding the word, but about how to take that understanding into our lives to see the hand of God at work. Listening to others' experiences of God might also make us more attune to the work of God in our own lives, says Megan. It doesn't always have to be listening to God at the top of a mountain or in a cave - it's seeing God in your every day experience, how he meets needs. There is an attentiveness required. A lot of the time the people who say they haven't had an experience of God just need help with the vocabulary to use. Michael warns against the dangers of making experience so much in the foreground that we forget to parse it through Scripture. "We don't have a fresh revelation that overturns scripture." Also mentioned in this segment: The secret life of us: in which we try to figure out what makes the other one tick Megan and Michael discuss their own religious experiences and how they've affected their faith. They look back at how such experiences were spoken about in their families of origin. Michael says he grew up in a Christian household often trying to deal with the tension of being treated as a Christian for as long as he could remember but also waiting for that moment of 'conversion'. He says he certainly had an intellectualised sense of the faith especially in later teens and university. Megan, on the other hand, says her mother is a person who has had many supernatural experiences and so she grew up talking a lot about those experiences and having some of her own. The duo also open up about when they've felt spiritually dry and how they've managed to come back to God. Also mentioned in this segment:
Marg and Dave: reviews from two people obsessed by stories, but not always the same ones. Les Murray (17 October 1938 – 29 April 2019) was a prize winning Australian poet, anthologist, and critic. His career spanned over 40 years and he published nearly 30 volumes of poetry as well as two verse novels and collections of his prose writings. He was rated in 1997 by the National Trust of Australia as one of the 100 Australian Living Treasures. Murray's poetry is full of his religious experience. He said it was because that was his experience. "The true god gives his flesh and blood. Idols demand yours off you." That quote, says Michael, which is from Murray's poem Church, should be on church signs everywhere. "It points to the significance of Christ in this consumer economy that sucks us dry," says Michael. Poems mentioned in this segment: Further reading:
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| Competing tribes and troubled community | 20 Jun 2019 | 00:42:03 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. For arguments sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out Can we (Christians, that is!) do politics without being partisan? There's been a storm since Australians discovered the outcome of the Federal election, particularly within the Aussie Christian community. Some Christians seem unable to believe that there are others of their faith who would have voted the opposite of them. And because the outcome of the election was so unexpected, there was a lot of "unvarnished" gut reactions on social media. Megan and Michael discuss whether it's possible to remain a 'Christian community' when we are so tribalised. And what part should prayer play when it comes to praying for our leaders, especially for those with whom we strongly disagree? Both Megan and Michael agree that Christians don't need to be apolitical. We are told to have a drive for justice. But how can we do it better? Megan suggests acknowledging real emotions on either side is a good place to start. The pair candidly share how they personally voted, discussing the reasons for their choice and try to model how to respectfully disagree on political priorities while holding to core truths of the gospel. Also mentioned in this segment:
Discomfort Zone: ever think someone might think differently if they step outside their comfort zone? This is where we make the other do just that. Michael gets to choose the book this episode and it is ... The Second Mountain: The quest for the moral life by David Brooks. Brooks is a Canadian-born American centre-right political and cultural commentator who writes for The New York Times. Everybody tells you to live for a cause larger than yourself, but how exactly do you do it? Brooks explores what it takes to lead a meaningful life in a self-centred world. Megan says she certainly wouldn't have read the book had Michael not suggested it. But she really liked it. "It's like the book that I would have written if I was a conservative dude," she says jokingly. But Brooks' emphasis on joy and community also captured her attention. Michael says he sees this book as one that he can use in pastoring people, especially those in their 40s who are looking to disentangle from their individualism and look to something greater. In his book, Brooks argues that such individualism makes people so disconnected that they flock to their "tribe", and contributes to the 'us' and 'them' issues we have in politics. Read more on Christian discussion of David Brook's book:
Marg and Dave: reviews from two people obsessed by stories, but not always the same ones. We're looking at Derry Girls this week. You can watch the first season on Netflix. Derry Girls is a comedy set in Derry, Northern Ireland. It’s about the lives of ordinary people living under the spectre of the Troubles in the early nineties, all seen through the eyes of 16 year old Erin and her friends. Writer Lisa McGee bases the story on her own experiences of growing up in Northern Ireland as a normal sixteen year old girl amidst civil conflict. How does a community with those deep divisions go about living in it? | |||
| How to be people, with other people | 06 Jun 2019 | 00:42:45 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. For arguments sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out Empathy has become immensely popular. Why? We have a desire to be understood. We want empathy to be shown to us. And we want to be able to stand in other people's shoes so we can communicate to them. Empathy is something Megan and Michael have been speaking about together for quite some time. And it may or may not surprise you that they disagree. Megan is pro empathy. Michael is not. Michael has been reading Against Empathy by Paul Bloom which argues that empathy has become a substitute for morality. And while it has its uses, there are problems with empathy including:
Megan, on the other hand, says the way she views empathy has a Christian basis which may not necessarily be how the rest of society views it. There's an other-centred empathy that tries to get across difference, rather than an empathy that ends up directed just towards others in your own group - which is one of the critiques of empathy in modern times. Megan and Michael grapple with the definitional problems with empathy: what is it, exactly? Also mentioned in this segment:
Discomfort Zone: ever think someone might think differently if they step outside their comfort zone? This is where we make the other do just that. Megan asks Michael to watch Brené Brown's Netflix special on courage. His initial reaction was to say, "I thought that was a girl thing." Perhaps you can imagine Megan's response? Michael says he enjoyed watching it and learning more about Brené Brown, partially because she's funny, but also because she can be very insightful. Both Michael and Megan draw connections between Brené Brown and Jordan Peterson, though they come to very different opinions on both. Brené Brown also talks a lot about shame, arguing in broad strokes that shame for women is around body issues and shame for men is showing weakness. Megan and Michael reflect personally on whether they agree with her analysis. Also mentioned in this segment:
Marg and Dave: reviews from two people obsessed by stories, but not always the same ones. Megan's choice this episode: The Darkest Hour, the 2017 war drama film about Winston Churchill. Churchill and Brené Brown might seem to be an odd couple for this episode, but actually The Darkest Hour brings out a lot to talk about empathy in leadership. The common perception of Churchill is all around the strength of his leadership. But Megan says what surprised her in this movie is his vulnerability and doubt. Megan and Michael discuss what it takes to be a good leader, using Churchill and his experiences as their guide. Is having empathy enough? | |||
| Can you love the church and think it sucks, too? | 23 May 2019 | 00:44:46 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Can you both love the church and think it sucks at the same time? Well, it's probably what Jesus thinks, says Michael. So we think yes, it's possible! This topic, says Megan, is inspired by the With All Due Respect Facebook group and members (if you'd like to join, click here). In a thread where members introduce themselves, Michael and Megan realised there were a lot of people who've been really hurt by the church. Michael suggests reading Paul's letters to the Corinthians in the New Testament, where Paul calls the Corinthians 'saints' and yet is pretty scathing of some of their behaviour. In the Bible, there is never a perfect church. It's about the people of God living out their relationship with God as sinners. That doesn't mean we're happy with that, but it does tell us there's a normality about it - tragic as that is. Megan points to a movement called "Ex-vangelicals", a reaction against the church mainly in the United States, after evangelicals got tied up in support of Donald Trump. There are also plenty of memoirs about those exploring their faith and 'coming out' of conservatism. See Rachel Held Evans and Sarah Bessey, as examples. Megan and Michael discuss the cultural stereotype that has arisen around the word 'evangelicals' and whether a similar movement of ex-vangelicals might be seen in Australia. As an evangelical himself, Michael is not so sure. The duo also discuss how to respond to those people who have had a bad experience of church in a local community setting versus those who take broader issue with the church as an institution. Michael encourages people to keep up their search for a good church, and not to give up on meeting with other Christians because churches can fail very badly. There can also be great healing in the local church with fellow believers, he says. And how should we deal with critiques of the church? Megan suggests that members of the church, and leaders in particular, need to be critiquing themselves as well as listening carefully to others. More on that in the Marg and Dave segment this week. Also mentioned in this segment: Where credit's due: talking the influences that form and move us This is a new segment, where Megan and Michael get to share things that they really like! Michael get to choose this week: Life Together by Dietrich Bonhoeffer. Bonhoeffer was writing this book in the 1930s while he was in charge of a small underground seminary that had broken away from the German Christian mainstream movement because of its allegiance to Hitler. The seminary was set up on a farm and he was training pastors there, while trying to find new footing for the church. "It's a very intense book. But I think it's amazing," says Michael. Megan's impression was that Bonhoeffer is writing from a place of disappointment in the church, which makes it quite appropriate for this episode. There's plenty in this discussion about what good community as church really means. But also, says Michael, he appreciated what Bonhoeffer says about solitude. While we do need our alone time with God, that's part of being in community. Our relationship with God is something we share with each other, says Megan. What is some advice on returning to church for someone who hasn't been to church for a while? Megan suggests asking whether there is someone in their lives who they think, 'Wow, I'd love to have that person in a Christian community.' That might be a good place to start. Connect with them first. Marg and Dave: reviews from two people obsessed by stories, but not always the same ones. It's cartoon time! Megan and Michael take a look at The Naked Pastor cartoons. Michael is less familiar with them than Megan, who says there is a lot of take up of these cartoons by people who are feeling dissatisfied with church. The artist was a pastor who has moved out of pastoring and it's not clear where he stands on Christianity. "I help people lose their faith without losing their minds," the artist says. The cartoons themselves is pretty much all critique, which Megan finds amusing often but Michael isn't sold. Here are some of the cartoons talked about in this segment: https://nakedpastor.com/warning-questions-will-lead-you-astray/ https://nakedpastor.com/becoming-my-most-popular-women-and-the-resurrection/ | |||
| Are we a persecuted people? | 09 May 2019 | 00:44:58 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Notes on episode 16 Are we a persecuted people? For arguments sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out Do Christians have a persecution complex? And are we being persecuted here in Australia? Discussion around persecution has heated up since the Christchurch shootings where 50 Muslims were killed by a gunman who entered two mosques in March. The conversation has ramped even further since Rugby player Israel Folau posted a message on Instagram with a list of people - including homosexuals - who would be going to hell if they didn't repent, and has been found in high-level breach of the Rugby Australia code of conduct, which means he could lose his job (and $4 million contract). Megan and Michael delve into the complexity of persecution, looking at the news reporting of Christian and Muslim persecution in different parts of the world and asking questions about whether there's more to persecution than just other people not liking Christians. And they set about answering the question: how can we show solidarity with the persecuted church while at the same time not playing the victim-hood game? Mentioned in this segment:
You did WHAT now? Looking at what the other M has been up to This episode, it's Megan's turn to read a few articles written by Michael. The first is an article from 2013 on martyrdom (a subject on which Michael did his PhD) for ABC titled Christian martyrdom and modern identity: Against Candida Moss and Salman Rushdie. The second, written for the Sydney Morning Herald was about the missionary John Chau, titled Like Jesus, US missionary accepted death as the price of reaching out. John Allen Chau who a young missionary who was killed by the North Sentinelese people on the isolated North Sentinel Island, seven hundred miles off the coast of mainland India in 2018. Unfortunately, martyrdom has become tied up with suicide bombings, but Michael says Christian martyrdom isn't just about dying for your group. It's also about dying for your enemies. Christians died with words like 'we honour and emperor and pray for him'. Megan questions our use of the word 'martyr' and how we decide who is a martyr. Some in the media have called Israel Folau a martyr, for example, though not as much in Christian circles, observes Megan. "Sometimes we use the idea of martyrdom' in order to justify actions which may not be necessary, or may be unwise, or just wrong," says Megan. Michael reflects that what sometimes happened in the ancient church was people would look for ways to become a martyr. But that's not right, says Michael. Martyrdom is not something we bring down on ourselves, it's something that is in God's sovereignty. So what about John Allen Chau? Was he a martyr or did he just do something silly? Tune in to find out what Megan and Michael think. Mentioned in this segment:
Marg and Dave: reviews from two people obsessed by stories but not always the same one Megan and Michael watch Silence, a Scorsese film (you can stream it on SBS On Demand). Martyrdom and persecution is at the heart of this story. Silence is a 2016 historical period drama film directed by Martin Scorsese with a screenplay by Jay Cocks and Scorsese, based on the 1966 novel of the same name by Shūsaku Endō. Silence is the third of Scorsese's films about religious figures struggling with challenges of faith, following The Last Temptation of Christ and Kundun. The film follows the story of two Catholic missionaries (Andrew Garfield and Adam Driver) who travel to Japan in search of their missing mentor (Liam Neeson) - at a time when Catholicism was outlawed. Michael has reviewed the film for the IFES Journal. | |||
| Gendered Violence | 20 Jun 2024 | 00:57:01 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. This week, Megan and Michael look at the epidemic of gendered violence sweeping through both the church and society at large. Our hosts look at what the Bible has to say on the issue and are then joined by expert consultant Carolyn Cousins for a discussion about what the church can do to help stamp it out. They then turn their attention to the program Asking For It, a look at the impacts of gendered violence, hosted by journalist and author Jess Hill who wrote the seminal See What You Made Me Do. | |||
| Anzac Special: War - what is it good for? | 25 Apr 2019 | 00:50:37 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Notes on episode 15 War: what is it good for? We're talking about the God of the Anzacs + Australian war songs. For arguments sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out War is a controversial topic among Christians. We have been divided in the past over whether war is something Christians should endorse. And there have been historical instances where religion was responsible for "whipping up" war, as Michael says, recalling the Pope and the Crusades. In this contemporary world we live in we still see a connection with religion and violence. So what do we do with this aspect of our faith? Megan and Michael discuss whether there is ever justification for Christians to not be pacifists? Might there be a case, thinking through the 'Just War' theory, where it is absolutely necessary to go to war? And then there's the Anzac tradition and the dangers of romanticising war. Michael says that while he believes it is important to honour those who went to war on our behalf, we should question whether we are glorifying bloodshed rather than bemoaning it. Megan wonders whether the Anzac tradition has changed now to be more like myth or legend. Did you know? Much of the Anzac Day commemoration events were started by a Christian minister, Canon David John Garland? Megan and Michael say they have observed that much of the Christian 'commemorative' aspects of Anzac Day services have been stripped away, to become more about Australia and our national character which has been formed through bloody sacrifice. Megan also questions the male emphasis of Anzac, saying in her research Australian nurses were originally very involved in Anzac commemorations, but seem to have been sidelined now. "It's an exclusionary myth, and not just for women," she says. Also mentioned in this segment:
Be our guest: opening up the conversation For this episode, Megan and Michael invite Daniel Reynaud, Associate Professor of History at Avondale College of Higher Education. David wrote Anzac Spirituality: The first AIF soldiers speak. Reynaud is also working on a follow-up book, tracing individual Anzac stories and their journeys of faith through the war. Daniel told Megan and Michael that God is big part of the Anzac story: "an unrecognised part". Daniel says that in his research for the book he was "shocked" at how often Anzac soldiers spoke about their faith in letters and diaries. Mentioned in this segment:
Marg and Dave: reviews from two people obsessed by stories but not always the same one Megan and Michael dissect four war 'conflicted' songs:
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| Our first live episode on #election2019, the 'Christian vote' and West Wing idealism | 12 Apr 2019 | 01:00:29 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Notes on episode 14: Live and in person, it's 'With All Due Respect!' At least, it was last night when Megan and Michael recorded their first live episode at the invitation of PEACEtalks, an initiative of Paddington Anglican Church in Sydney. And... how handy that the federal election was called for the day of our live podcast, all about ... the election! For arguments sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out Megan kicked off with a quote from Franklin D Roosevelt's inaugural address as President of the United States in 1933: “The only thing we have to fear is fear itself — nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance. In every dark hour of our national life a leadership of frankness and of vigor has met with that understanding and support of the people themselves which is essential to victory. And I am convinced that you will again give that support to leadership in these critical days." Last year, Michael wrote an opinion piece for Eternity asking: What are we worrying about?In it, he writes: “What we need is to become a non-anxious presence in our chronically anxious world. Christians of all people have reason to be non-anxious. We believe that God is sovereign, the mighty Rock who is a stronghold against every threat. We believe we have even our sins dealt with, so that we need not worry about them any more. We have the resources in our faith to be an island of peace in a world that seems to be constantly in turmoil.” The two quotes set the scene for Megan and Michael's discussion of our current political landscape. So, should we be afraid of fear in politics and is it a valid tactic? The pair offer examples of fear-driven politics, including Donald Trump in the United States, and more recently the actions of Senator Fraser Anning in Australia in the aftermath of the Christchurch shootings which tried to instill fear of Islam (by the way, confirming Megan's statistics: Muslims make up 2.6% - 604,200 people - of Australia's population, according to the 2016 census). Megan and Michael chat about the role of emotion more generally in politics including anger, pointing to political actions like the climate change protests by school students. "One of our deep fears is being powerless and not heard," says Michael. Moving beyond ourselves Michael and Megan move on to talking about how to reach "across the aisle" and "speaking the language of the person you may be opposed to", which they feel is sadly lacking in today's political discourse. They talk about what they believe the role of Christians should be in this political climate. "Of all people," says Megan, "Christians shouldn't be using [fear] ..." And yet the pair can point to many occasions where fear is driving Christians and their political engagement, particularly when it comes to religious freedom. Michael says he believes it's getting harder to be a Christian, but Megan says she just doesn't feel that in her personal experience and argues that it's the same people advocating for religious freedom who didn't want to give freedom to other people on issues like same-sex marriage. Also mentioned in this segment:
Further reading on these issues:
The secret life of us: in which we try to figure out what makes the other one tick Megan and Michael talk about the issues that move them and impact their vote, based on author Jonathan Haidt's moral foundations survey. Megan scored high on care, equality, and autonomy; low on equity, authority, loyalty and purity. Michael scored high on care, authority and purity; low on equity, loyalty low on autonomy. (Pssst... their viewpoints on authority in particular cause some friction) With their moral foundations scores as the foundation, the pair discuss what experiences have impacted their voting and what they believe to be the role of government and politicians. Mentioned in this segment: Discomfort zone: ever thought someone might think differently if they went outside their comfort zone? This is where we make the other do just that. Michael asked Megan to read a piece he wrote in 2015 for The Guardian titled, We shouldn't trust orators, visionaries and dreamers to lead us which he wrote about Malcolm Turnbull becoming Prime Minister. Michael says he wanted Megan to read this article to draw out the differences in their perspectives on the role of politicians. Megan calls herself an idealist. Michael says he is much more pragmatic and believes the job of casting a vision for a nation is a dangerous thing to give to politicians because it can produce nationalism. | |||
| The Church in damage control: the Royal Commission, Pell and Spotlight | 28 Mar 2019 | 00:48:47 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Hey guys! We're doing a live podcast in April in Sydney. You should definitely come along. More details here. For arguments sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out Megan and Michael get straight into discussing child sexual abuse within the church in the wake of Cardinal George Pell's conviction and sentencing earlier this month on several counts of child sexual abuse while he was Archbishop of Melbourne in the 1990s. They consider whether there is something particular about churches that "makes us more prone to this kind of problem?" Megan suggests clericalism is one of the big problems, not just in the Catholic church but all denominations - putting pastors on a pedestal and expecting more of them. Megan and Michael talk about their own experiences as pastors, and what has started to change in the training and formation of ministers to avoid the abuse of power. Megan also suggests that the fact that most pastors are male also contributes to the problem of abuse in the church. And while Michael says he doesn't necessarily disagree, he has had trouble getting an answer on what specifically would be solved by having more women in the priesthood, and in positions of leadership in churches. Tune in to hear the discussion. If this episode has brought up any issues for you, Lifeline provides all Australians experiencing a personal crisis with access to online, phone and face-to-face crisis support and suicide prevention services. You can call 13 11 14 any time – it’s open 24 hours. Mentioned in this segment:
Look - a new segment! Megan wrote an opinion piece for Eternity seeking to bring together some similar issues that have arisen from the support by many Christians and Christian leaders of the Australian visits of Canadian psychologist Jordan Peterson and evangelist Franklin Graham and then the response of some within the church to the conviction of Cardinal Pell. The piece attracted a lot of comments on social media, from Christians on both sides. Michael notes that in writing the piece Megan was applauded by some and accused of being a heretic by others. Megan says she was trying to get across the problem of adulating particular people to the point where it is difficult to question them, and how important it is to not shut down questioners. Michael gives his own verdict on Megan's piece and the issues she was addressing. This is a good example, says Megan, of the lack of respectful conversation among Christians (particularly online) when people disagree with a dominant view. Mentioned in this segment:
Marg and Dave: Reviews from two people obsessed by stories. But not always the same ones. Michael and Megan watch Spotlight, the 2015 award-winning movie following the Boston Globe's investigation of child sexual abuse within the Catholic church in Boston. It is based on a series of stories by the "Spotlight" team that earned The Globe the 2003 Pulitzer Prize for Public Service. Mentioned in this segment:
We're going LIVE this April With All Due Respect will be recording a live podcast special as part of Paddington Anglican's PEACEtalk series, on Thursday 11th April from 7pm. It will be a federal election special: a political and personal conversation minus the polarisation. Join us at PEACEtalks with Megan Powell du Toit and Michael Jensen as we explore some Christians perspectives as we approach the Federal election. Potential segments will include: The event will commence at 7pm with a light dinner followed by the Live Podcast commencing promptly at 7:30pm. Supper will be served after the event. Parking can be tricky, so consider public transport or arriving early. | |||
| Is it a sin to talk about sin? | 14 Mar 2019 | 00:45:29 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Notes from Episode 12: Is it a sin to talk about sin? For arguments sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out Megan and Michael dig into the giant topic that is: SIN. What is it? And what effect does it have on human beings? Christians have plenty of hang ups about using the word 'sin'. Megan says in some Christian tribes, it's not a popular word at all. Yet despite the wariness around the word, Megan says she likes it. "I find the word 'sin' is one where my evangelicalism and my feminism intersects." Tune in to find out how these "strange bedfellows" (as Michael puts it) come together. Meanwhile, the duo discuss the differences between individual and social/systemic sin and the traps in talking about one more than the other, looking specifically at #MeToo as an example. When the discussion inevitably gets to 'Agency' and 'Liberty', Megan and Michael address one of their key differences. Michael is a Calvinist, Megan calls herself "a particular kind of Arminian" (don't worry - they give a quick crash course on those terms!) And so ... bring on the arguments about free will. Mentioned in this segment:
Q&A: You ask us questions, and we answer without the spin. Megan and Michael pick two questions to tackle:
Marg and Dave: Reviews from two people obsessed by stories. But not always the same ones. Michael and Megan take a look at Kendrick Lamar's Pulitzer-winning album, Damn, though both say it's not what they would have chosen to listen to personally. However, Lamar is open about his own faith and the album has many references to sin, pride, lust and also humility and love. Looking specifically at the song Fear, Megan and Michael discuss what a 'fear of God' means and why Lamar chose to emphasise the fear over the love of God. | |||
| Ep 11: Should we not worry and just be happy? PLUS: Russian Doll | 28 Feb 2019 | 00:40:11 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Notes from Episode 11: If you're happy and you know it ... For arguments sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out Are we as Christians expected to be happy all the time and, if not, do we have a lack of faith? Michael posits that we measure things by 'happiness' but, says Megan, there are still different social narratives on how we think happiness is achieved and what kind of happiness is valuable. They discuss Paul Dolan's book Happy Ever After, which they both read for this episode. So what exactly is happiness? And what about the recent claims that religious people are happier people? Megan and Michael take a look at happiness vs joy, dig in to what the Bible says on happiness and wonder over its temporal and eternal nature. Mentioned in this segment:
The secret life of us: in which we try to figure out what makes the other one tick Are we shiny happy people? Megan and Michael share their experiences of happiness and what they have meant in their lives. Megan shares candidly about her experiences of joy and depression. Is life worth living when we're not happy? How do we retain faith without happiness? And, if not to offer happiness, what is the point of faith? Mentioned in this segment:
Marg and Dave: Reviews from two people obsessed by stories. But not always the same ones SPOILERS AHEAD! Megan and Michael are talking Netflix and Russian Doll. If you haven't got to episode three of that show yet, you are now warned. Here's the premise: In Russian Doll, Nadia keeps dying and reliving her 36th birthday party. She's trapped in a surreal time loop - and staring down the barrel of her own mortality. Tune in to here what Megan and Michael think of the show that's been dubbed "the best show all year" (and it's only February!) Mentioned in this segment: | |||
| On how to read the Bible, Harry Potter and, well, all the books really | 14 Feb 2019 | 00:41:16 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Happy Valentine's Day, listeners! "Give your loved one a book this Valentine's Day," suggests Michael Jensen in this episode dedicated to the love of books: The Good Book, other books and a book on good reading. For arguments sake: where we take a debate, cut out the party politics and try to talk it out How should we read the Bible today? Megan and Michael ponder how the Bible is different to any other book. What in the world does a "plain reading of the text" mean when we're talking about the Bible? What part does church play in how we read it? Can you be a better Bible reader than someone else? And what about the Holy Spirit's role in showing us the truth? (Pssst ... heads up ... they also touch on the role of women in the church and the varying biblical interpretations. Deep breath.) Mentioned in this segment: Graeme Goldsworthy's Gospel and Kingdom The Suffering Servant, Isaiah 53 QandA: you ask us questions, and we answer without the spin. Megan and Michael try and answer a listener question from Rachel: “Should children be allowed to read fiction that is non-Christian in some way, specifically thinking about things like ‘Harry Potter’? And if not, why is it different to other fantasies like ‘Narnia Chronicles’ or ‘The Lord of the Ring’ trilogy? Both agree that stories of all kinds can be enriching and helpful to our understanding of the gospel. The duo also outline how they attempted to direct their own respective children towards some stories over others. And, sigh of relief, they both declare Harry Potter as having some pretty big implicit Christian themes. Tune in to find out more, particularly about the Sorting Hat and to hear their discussion on whether Harry Potter is a celebration of witchcraft and the occult (and whether that should be problematic for Christians). Mentioned in this segment: · J.K. Rowling, Harry Potter series · Phillip Pullmann, His Dark Materials series Marg and Dave: Reviews from two people obsessed by stories. But not always the same ones This episode, Megan and Michael review Karen Swallow Prior's On Reading Well: Finding a good life through great books and discuss the politicisation of books, what that means for how we read and why it matters for how we talk to each other. Mentioned in this segment: · Karen Swallow Prior, On reading well | |||
| Ep 9: The culture war: universities, the Gillette ad and The Book of Mormon | 31 Jan 2019 | 00:42:35 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here.
Michael puts Megan into the Discomfort Zone by asking her to read the enormously titled 'The Coddling of the American Mind: How Good Intentions and Bad Ideas Are Setting Up a Generation for Failure' by Greg Lukianoff and Jonathan Haidt. Perplexed by the choice of title and how it fuels the culture war, Megan also has some issues with the solutions offered to the problems raised by Lukianoff and Haidt. But what 'Coddling' opens up is a meaty discussion about resilience, morality and always placing your feelings or experience above everything else. Finally, in Marg and Dave, Michael finally convinced Megan to see controversial musical The Book of Mormon (finishing in Sydney but about to go to Brisbane). With both stressing that it's a shocking show - "the most profane production I've ever seen," reports Megan - Michael upholds the other surprise factors on offer. Turns out you can get lessons on belief, suffering and Western stereotypes from the potty-mouthed creators of South Park. | |||
| Ep 8: Franklin Graham, angry women and Black Mirror | 17 Jan 2019 | 00:43:17 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. In For Argument’s Sake, Megan and Michael tackle the upcoming visit to Australia by evangelist Franklin Graham (son of legendary preacher Billy). They focus upon the controversy surrounding Franklin Graham's visit and how he doesn't have the same ability to unite Christians as his father. With Franklin Graham's vocal support for President Trump stirring widespread debate, Megan explains she has other concerns about his relationship with the politics of power and sexuality. Both Michael and Megan ask: should you attend a gospel event led by a person you disagree with? In Discomfort Zone, Megan asked Michael to do something outside his usual sphere - read Rebecca Traister's book Good and Mad: The Revolutionary Power of Women's Anger (particularly one lengthy section about President Trump). Michael has questions for Megan about solidarity between women around the world before our duo dive into the biblical concept of vengeance. Oh, and whether anger is only associated with men. And how can anger be responded to. Then, in Marg and Dave, Megan and Michael dare to enter Netflix series Black Mirror, a near-future commentary about humanity's misuse of technology. Megan and Michael watched the episode Nosedive - about one woman (Bryce Dallas Howard) experiencing a harsh rating system - and marvel at its clear parallels with our world. But what does judging each other have to do with Christianity? Oh, wait ... | |||
| Ep 7: Getting Christmassy with the theology of presents and carols | 20 Dec 2018 | 00:41:44 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. We revisit episode 7 of With All Due Respect: In For Argument's Sake, Megan and Michael tackle some holiday-themed sticky questions: Is Easter better than Christmas? Should we really be giving Christmas presents? Megan points to an essay by G.K. Chesterton on the theology of Christmas presents. Find out why the duo think material gifts can be quite an important tradition, with a theological basis. Michael suggests that Christmas is a display of God's abundance. It's also an ideal that can often be a terrible judge on those who don't match that ideal. And so, says Megan, "our abundance must not be a selfish abundance ... it should flow out onto the lowly, the unloved ... the lonely." In a new Q&A segment, Megan and Michael answer a listener question: As two leaders in conservative denominations, how does the Holy Spirit move in your own lives? How open are you both to the prophetic and to signs and wonders? -- asked by Kirsty Farrugia (who also has her own podcast!) Megan and Michael unpack what 'conservative' might mean in that question, running through their own denominations (Megan: Baptist, Michael: Anglican) and the variety of 'types' you can find in those denominations. Then they get straight into speaking in tongues, dreams and visions. Have either of them experienced such things? And do they think it matters if they haven't? Tune in to find out. Check out some of the other suggested questions, here. Then, in Marg and Dave, Megan and Michael review Christmas carols! What is the theology and background of the carols we sing every year. Hint: they're not sure about Away in a manger ... of course Jesus cried as a baby! They've created a Spotify carols playlist, for your listening pleasure. Check it out here. And here a few helpful resources to get deeper into the background of some of the most popular carols:
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| Ep 6: What *really* happens after we die? | 06 Dec 2018 | 00:40:54 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. In For Argument's Sake, Megan and Michael delve into the depths of confusion about what happens after death. They note that most Christians - well, most people actually - are pretty fuzzy on this topic. It was politicians answering Greg Sheridan's questions on what happens when we die, for his book God is Good For You, that prompted Megan and Michael to explore this more. Both agree that our culture continues to have a "cartoon-like" understanding of heaven and hell, and they try to uncover what we do know from the Bible about the afterlife, and what remains a mystery. Then, in the Secret Life of Us, Megan and Michael escape from the theoretical and delve into their personal experiences with death and grief. "This is where the rubber hits the road in living the Christian life, with these experiences of grief," says Michael. In this segment, Megan shares about her miscarriage on Good Friday and experiences of suffering through depression. Megan and Michael grapple with the "sadness" and "badness" of death, and examine what a good response to death and suffering might look like. Continuing the afterlife theme, on Marg and Dave, our dynamic duo check out the super popular Netflix series The Good Place. Warning: spoilers! | |||
| Grief | 06 Jun 2024 | 00:48:09 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. With All Due Respect returns for its ninth season with an episode especially brought to you by Living Hope Funerals. Grief is a universal experience. We all face it at some point in our lives. So, what's a Christian framework for walking through grief? How can we grieve well? Dr Kit Barker joins our hosts to tackle these questions. Our hosts then turn their attention to the Apple TV comedy-drama Shrinking - a program that explores the variety of experiences people have when it comes to grief. | |||
| Ep 5: Public vs private schools, religious freedom and *that* letter on gay teachers | 22 Nov 2018 | 00:42:53 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. In For Argument's Sake, Michael and Megan talk about the "real blow up" that is the religious freedom debate circling around whether Christian schools should be able to discriminate in the hiring of staff and selection of students. Triggered by a bill from the Greens, there has been heated debate about a letter from 34 Anglican schools in Sydney, organised by the Anglican Archbishop Glenn Davies which supported the schools' right to uphold the Christian ethos of their school in their choice of teachers. Read more about the backlash, which included protests and apologies, here. Also, here is the letter from Anglican Principals, a letter in response from school alumni and the apology from the Archbishop. Phew. What a mess (and check out this Media Watch about the whole saga as it was reported in the media) "It really went feral, didn't it?" Michael says. In the discussion, Michael and Megan try to get to the bottom of what it is that Christians are actually arguing for in this latest iteration of the religious freedom debate? And ... is it a fair thing to be seeking to protect? Then, Michael and Megan get into The Secret Life of Us, a new segment in which they try to figure out what makes the other tick. The topic? How their school experiences have shaped their worldview. Just FYI: Michael went to North Newtown Public then Trinity Grammar (an Anglican boys school). Megan went to Loftus Public, Ferncourt Public, Campbelltown North Public, Kent Rd Public and Peter Board High. So, let the arguments begin about private vs public schooling. Moving on to Marg and Dave, Megan chose the much-hyped Boy Swallows Universe by Trent Dalton and called it "one of the great Australian novels". While the novel takes a good look at the "underbelly of Brisbane society", Megan said she found it "quite a joyful novel". Does Michael agree? Listen in to find out. The book, says Megan, asks questions like, What is it to be a good person? How can I redeem myself? What motivates someone to be good? Listen to Trent Dalton talk about the book's connection to his life on ABC's Conversations podcast. | |||
| Episode 4: Apologetics | 08 Nov 2018 | 00:39:10 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. For Argument's Sake Michael wrote a response to an article by Stephen McAlpine, an evangelical pastor and blogger in Western Australia, on apologetics, which argued that the era of nice apologetics is over. What is apologetics? It's nothing to do with saying sorry but it's giving a defence of the Christian message in the public square. Michael and Megan discuss Stephen's contention that artful persuasion doesn't work because it's perceived as a mask for power. The Discomfort Zone Michael persuaded Megan to read God is Good For You by The Australian's Greg Sheridan (Read Greg's profile here). Marg & Dave For The Love of God, a documentary by the Centre For Public Christianity, by contrast, is very honest about the stuff that the church has done badly historically. Megan says it answers a lot of the things she had problems with in Greg Sheridan's book but she has a quibble about the film's coverage of women ... | |||
| Episode 3: Social justice and the gospel | 25 Oct 2018 | 00:37:35 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. In For Argument's Sake, Megan and Michael argue over the validity of a new statement delivered from the US called The Statement on Social Justice and the Gospel, which suggests social justice movements are leading people away from Jesus. It's a topic Megan is particularly passionate about: she's doing her doctoral research on it, in fact. The pair discuss the huge controversy over the statement, including amongst people you'd think would have agreed. So ... is social justice the gospel? And if it's not, how do you distinguish the two? Tune in to hear the arguments. Here are a few other commentators that Megan and Michael refer to in this discussion: Al Mohler. Ryan Burton King. Russell Moore. Tim Keller. John Stott. In the Discomfort Zone, Megan suggests reading Lisa Sharon Harper's book, The Very Good Gospel, which Megan says gives a very 'social justice flavour' to the gospel. Then, in Marg and Dave, Michael and Megan listen to Hozier, and talk about the lyrics that can get under your skin, the visceral anger the artist has against the Catholic church and what Hozier, and the Bible, have to say about sex. | |||
| Episode 2: Emotion, prayer and comedy | 11 Oct 2018 | 00:35:51 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Michael and Megan disagree about the role emotion plays in theology (Michael edited a book on emotion, which you can find here). They argue about whether emotions are a source of theology, why (and if) evangelicals place so much emphasis on reason over emotion and Megan asks if it might be to do with the traditional view that men are more rational and women are more emotional. If you weren't already uncomfortable, in the Discomfort Zone, Michael challenges Megan to read a section of John Calvin's Institutes on prayer which he says "transformed" his prayer life ... but Megan isn't too fussed with what she read. Instead, she offers a few books of her own on prayer that had a similar transformational effect (Prayer: finding the heart’s true home, Richard Foster and The Transforming Friendship: a guide to prayer, James Houston. She's also currently reading A Praying Life, Paul Miller) Then in Marg and Dave, Megan suggests they watch Nanette, Australian comedienne Hannah Gadsby's stand-up performance for Netflix which has been heralded around the world. | |||
| Episode 1: Politics | 26 Sep 2018 | 00:31:53 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Rev Dr Michael Jensen, rector at St Mark’s Anglican Darling Point, author, public commentator. Rev Megan Powell du Toit, ordained Baptist minister, Publishing Manager of the Australian College of Theology, editor of the journal Colloquium. Episode 1:
The Handmaid’s Tale TV series, The Handmaid’s Tale book, Margaret Atwood Megan’s articles on The Handmaid’s Tale: Ethos Season 1, Ethos Season 2, FHE Season 2 | |||
| With All Due Respect - Trailer | 25 Sep 2018 | 00:00:29 | |
Look forward to new episodes every second Thursday. | |||
| Fandom | 23 May 2024 | 00:40:34 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Welcome to another season of With All Due Respect! Megan Powell du Toit and Michael Jensen embark on another series of podcasts tackling some potentially divisive elements of culture with nuance, grace, and - of course- respect! This week, our hosts look at the phenomena of fandom and ask - is it possible for fandom to go far? Can a Christian engage in fandom in good faith? Both our hosts share what they're fans of (this episode is a judgment-free zone!) before casting their eye over Tabitha Carvan's book This Is Not A Book About Benedict Cumberbatch, a work which explores how an ordinary person can become obsessed by a certain middle-aged British actor. | |||
| Generations | 29 Feb 2024 | 01:11:22 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Welcome to the final episode of Season 8 of With All Due Respect! This week, Minister Jeri Jones Sparks and former Sydney Archbishop (and Michael's Dad!) Peter Jensen joins the show for a panel discussion on different church generations. The team look at the highs and lows of recent Australian church history, as well as what different generations of Christians today can learn from one other. Our hosts then discuss the TV series Pachinko, a critically acclaimed show that follows the stories of four generations of a Korean Family, between 1915 and 1989. | |||
| The Christian Org | 15 Feb 2024 | 00:58:52 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. This week, Michael and Megan are joined by Stephen Judd, the former CEO of HammondCare, to discuss how - if at all - an organisation can be "Christian". Our hosts then discuss whether the broader church is an organisation, and if ministers can gain anything from the world of corporate wisdom. Finally, they turn their attention to the hit drama Propser, a new show that follows a family as they build a super-powerful, super-wealthy megachurch. | |||
| Peace in the Middle East | 01 Feb 2024 | 00:58:09 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. This week, Megan and Michael hash out one of the most controversial issues currently ruling the discourse; the conflict in the Israel and Gaza region. Our hosts think through how the Bible can guide Christians’ response to the conflict. A Palestinian Christian and peacemaker joins the show to discuss the challenges facing faith groups in the conflict zone. Finally, our hosts discuss the film Women in Sink, which documents conversations with women of different faiths in the region. | |||
| Lies and Statistics | 18 Jan 2024 | 00:52:42 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Mark Twain once famously said, "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics". Our hosts this week are chatting about this third lie - statistics. With the age of social media now dictating how people access statistical data, are we literate enough to understand what we are reading when it comes to statistics? How does this affect trust in official information more broadly? And in a fallen world, where sin distorts everything, how much can we truly trust human knowledge? Statistician Alan Brnabic joins Michael and Megan to discuss these questions, and why we need statistics more broadly. Finally, our hosts cast their eye over Moneyball, a sports film that, against the odds, Megan quite enjoyed. | |||
| Reforming Evangelicalism | 04 Jan 2024 | 01:06:08 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Michael and Megan are kicking off 2024 by checking in on the state of Evangelicalism. Karen Swallow Prior returns to the show to discuss her new book The Evangelical Imagination, which provocatively claims to take stock of a "culture in crisis". Our hosts then hash out the question: does Evangelicalism need another Reformation? Finally, the pair discuss the 17th-century classic The Pilgrim's Progress and take stock of its influence and legacy. | |||
| Is There Something About Mary? | 21 Dec 2023 | 00:52:20 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. It's the 2023 Christmas episode of With All Due Respect, and we're talking all things Mary this year! New Testament scholar The Rev. Dr Sarah Harris joins the show to discuss the mother of Jesus, and makes some big calls about her place in theological history. Michael and Megan then discuss the place of Mary in Protestant tradition. Should the evangelical Christian church reclaim Mary? Is she in need of a "rediscovery?" Finally, our hosts turn their attention to the hit TV show The Chosen and discuss its portrayals of the Holy Matriarch. | |||
| Masculinity | 24 Oct 2024 | 01:04:36 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Is there a masculinity crisis? Or have we fundamentally misunderstood what being a man in the 21st century means? Our hosts spend some time discussing their understanding of masculinity, how they’ve seen it shift around them, and what a Christian vision of masculinity really looks like. Executive Director of the Centre for Public Christianity Simon Smart joins the show to discuss this tricky topic. Finally, Michael and Megan turn their attention to the comedy-drama series Barry. | |||
| Is the Bible 'plain'? | 07 Dec 2023 | 00:58:34 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. It's the 100th episode of With All Due Respect! To mark their century our guests chat with Mike Bird, Academic Dean of Melbourne's Ridley College, discussing the question "Is the Bible clear in what it tells us?" They also discuss the differences in church tradition when it comes to interpreting scripture. Later, our hosts discuss Sarah Polley's confronting film Women Talking, which explores the consequences of misunderstanding - and abusing - The Bible. | |||
| Home | 23 Nov 2023 | 00:58:24 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Home - it’s an evocative word and one that has instant access to our emotions, whether that’s when Dorothy knocks together her shiny red heels and says there’s no place like home or when angelic children’s choirs sing I still call Australia home on a Qantas ad. The Bible culminates with an image of God at home with humanity. Home speaks to us of familiarity, safety, welcome, love. Yet home doesn’t just have positive associations. Some are home less while many have found their homes to be anything but safe. This episode Megan Powell du Toit and Michael Jensen begin by discussing whether human beings are actually any good at making home for themselves or others. Then the WADR team speak to former NSW Liberal Minister and newly appointed chair of the Faith Housing Alliance, Rob Stokes about the current housing crisis. And to finish, continuing 'the whole vibe' of the episode, they hang out with the Kerrigans in The Castle. | |||
| Civic Religion | 09 Nov 2023 | 00:44:29 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. This week, Megan and Michael discuss the place of "civic religion" in Australian society. Defined as the implicit "religious" values of a nation - expressed through public ceremony, symbols, and rituals - our hosts ask if Australia even has a civic religion in the first place. They then turn their eyes to the place of the Welcome to / Acknowledgement of Country in Australia: specifically in the church. What does it mean that some churches have pushed back against this now largely normal part of public procedure? Finally, they take stock of a recent episode of Bluey and discuss why a children's show (of all things) brought Michael to tears. | |||
| Hope | 26 Oct 2023 | 00:50:29 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Leisa Aitken joins Megan and Michael to discuss her dissertation on the psychology of Hope, and why the clinical definition of the word is missing the mark. On 'For Arguments Sake', our hosts discuss whether there may be a lack of hope within the church. Have Christians in the global west lost their eschatological hope? Finally, our hosts cast their eye over Christopher Noaln's blockbuster Oppenheimer. In true WADR style, they don't necessarily see eye-to-eye on its message. | |||
| Only Human | 12 Oct 2023 | 00:50:03 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. In light of the Barbie movie phenomenon, our hosts take stock of Greta Gerwig's divisive blockbuster, ponder its themes on humanity, and whether it will become an essential existential text. Old Testament expert Dr George Athas then joins the show to discuss the film, its relationship to the book of Ecclesiastes, and how death plays a role in our understanding of being human. | |||
| The Voice: Reconciliation | 05 Oct 2023 | 00:21:21 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. As the voting time for the referendum approaches, Michael and Megan are joined by Bundjalung woman Karen Mundine, CEO of Reconciliation Australia, and Peter Morris, General Manager of the Reconciliation Action Plan program of Reconciliation Australia. They talk through what a 'yes' vote might mean for Australian society, its citizens, and the church. | |||
| The Voice: The Constitution | 28 Sep 2023 | 00:52:33 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Welcome to season 8 of With All Due Respect! As Australians prepare to vote in a referendum on an Aboriginal Voice in parliament, Michael Jensen and (newly Reverend Dr) Megan Powell du Toit speak with constitutional law expert Dr Joel Harrison about what it might mean, legally speaking. They then discuss whether or not the church should be involved with politics at all - a thorny issue that Michael has had some recent experience with. Finally on 'Through the Wardrobe', our hosts cast their eye over the controversy surrounding ABC journalist Annabel Crabb's Kitchen Cabinet program, and her decision to have some rather divisive guests on recent episodes. WADR is hosted by Megan Powell du Toit and Michael Jensen. It is part of the Undeceptions podcast network. | |||
| The Voice | 20 Apr 2023 | 00:52:08 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. In the season finale, Megan and Michael sit down with First Nations Christian leader Uncle Pastor Ray Minniecon to discuss the upcoming referendum in Australia concerning The Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice (also known as the Indigenous Voice to Parliament, or simply 'The Voice). Our hosts also sift through the responses from various groups to The Voice, casting a spotlight on who has - and hasn't - voiced support. Finally, on 'Through The Wardrobe', Michael and Megan keep things political with a look back at the 2017 ABC documentary Counted, hosted by Stan Grant to commemorate the 1967 Referendum which saw Australian First Nations people counted as part of the Australian population. They compare this with an episode of Derry Girls, unpacking the complexities of referendum and nationhood. And, as promised, here is a link to the Christian denominational responses to the Voice to Parliament that the WADR team collected. bg3j8ete | |||
| Easter Special: Radical Grace | 06 Apr 2023 | 00:43:08 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. This week on WADR, our hosts are living up to the aim of the show (conversations with respect and grace) with an Easter special on ... GRACE! 'The Secret Life of Us' then makes a return, with Michael and Megan sharing episodes in their life when they had grace shown to them. Finally, on 'Through The Wardrobe' our hosts give their take on The Engish, a grizzly western reboot about an aristocrat bent on revenge in the new world. Can grace be shown to those who've taken everything from us? WADR is hosted by Megan Powell du Toit and Michael Jensen. It is part of the Undeceptions podcast network. | |||
| The Adventure of Time | 23 Mar 2023 | 00:42:06 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. This week, Megan and Michael delve into the mystery of 'time', and ask the question ... is time cursed? And how are eternity and time-related? On 'Through the Wardrobe', the pair cast their critical eye over the now cancelled Amazon series Paper Girls, a time travelling adventure drama that looks at how we might feel if we met our future selves. Plus, our hosts take some time to answer audience questions. Does pineapple belong on pizza? Do Michael and Megan actually disagree on anything? And what should we do with the work of now-disgraced theologians? Tune in to find out! WADR is hosted by Megan Powell du Toit and Michael Jensen. It is part of the Undeceptions podcast network. | |||
| Offence | 10 Oct 2024 | 01:06:50 | |
This episode is brought to you by Anglican Aid. Your gift will strengthen churches and help transform communities. You can donate to With All Due Respect's featured causes here. Do we live in a culture that thrives on offence? Is it ever okay to intentionally offend? Michael and Megan are joined this week by Presbyterian Minister and writer Nathan Campbell to think through these questions. Our hosts also discuss the theology behind offence, and what offends them. Finally, the 2022 Psychological Thriller Tar - starring Cate Blanchett - comes under the WADR microscope. It's a film all about the destructive consequences of offending. But is it any good?
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