For the practitioner who’s never stopped being curious. Til Luchau and Whitney Lowe bring together leading researchers, master clinicians, and big questions from across bodywork, massage, and manual therapy — exploring not just what we do with our hands, but why it works and how to do it better. Smart, grounded, and genuinely useful conversations for the somatic arts and sciences.
For professional practitioners in bodywork, massage therapy, structural integration, chiropractic, myofascial and myotherapy, orthopedics, sports massage, physical therapy, and osteopathy — as well as yoga, strength and conditioning, and allied professions.
This podcast is not medical or treatment advice.
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126: Fascia: A Deep Dive (with Dr. Antonio Stecco, Rebroadcast)
Episode 126
Wednesday, September 4, 2024 • Duration 01:09:33
Til and Whitney speak with fascial researcher, anatomist, and manual therapy teacher Antonio Stecco MD PhD about his research in to fascial properties, pain, and the effects of hands-on work, in this audience-favorite episode from our archives, where it originally ran as Ep. 53.
Key Topics:
Introduction to Dr. Antonio Stecco and his background in fascia research
The role of the Stecco family in advancing fascia research
Differences between superficial fascia and deep fascia
The concept of fascial densification vs. fibrosis
How manual therapy affects fascial lubrication and gliding
The relationship between fascial stiffness/thickness and pain
Mechanisms for long-lasting effects of fascial manipulation
The importance of restoring proper biomechanics, not just treating pain
The role of retinacula in proprioception and joint stability
New MRI techniques for imaging fascial properties
Molecular structure of hyaluronan in fascia
Use of hyaluronidase injections for treating spasticity
Resources for learning more about fascial manipulation
Gerber et al., “A Systematic Comparison Between Subjects With No Pain and Pain Associated With Active Myofascial Trigger Points.”
Langevin, Helene M. et al. “Reduced Thoracolumbar Fascia Shear Strain in Human Chronic Low Back Pain.” BMC Musculoskeletal Disorders 12, no. 1 (December 2011): 203. https://doi.org/10.1186/1471-2474-12-203.
Stecco, Antonio at al. “Ultrasonography in Myofascial Neck Pain: Randomized Clinical Trial for Diagnosis and Follow-Up.” Surgical and Radiologic Anatomy 36, no. 3 (April 2014): 243–53. https://doi.org/10.1007/s00276-013-1185-2.
Sponsor Offers:
Books of Discovery: save 15% by entering "thinking" at checkout on booksofdiscovery.com.
(The Thinking Practitioner Podcast is intended for professional practitioners of manual and movement therapies: bodywork, massage therapy, structural integration, chiropractic, myofascial and myotherapy, orthopedic, sports massage, physical therapy, osteopathy, yoga, strength and conditioning, and similar professions. It is not medical or treatment advice.)
125: Moving with Grief (with Til Luchau & Whitney Lowe)
Episode 124
Wednesday, August 21, 2024 • Duration 44:34
🎙️ Grief affects everyone: every person, every practitioner, and every client will lose something important to them, whether it’s their youth, ability, dreams, or a loved one. And so, everyone will grieve.
In this episode, Whitney interviews Til about how the recent loss of his wife has given him a new perspective on grieving, and being with others in grief: what helps, what’s important to know, and how to move with grief, as we feel what needs to be felt, and do the things that need to be done. 🔍🗣️👥🔊
Key Points in the Podcast
Introduction to the podcast and sponsors (0:00-1:20)
Til Luchau's personal experience with grief and loss (1:20-5:30)
The importance of self-care for caretakers (5:30-8:30)
Lessons learned from the grief process (8:30-14:55)
Balancing work and personal life during grief (14:55-18:00)
The importance of acknowledging grief in client interactions (18:00-21:00)
Understanding the stages and timeline of grief (21:00-23:30)
Strategies for supporting others dealing with loss (23:30-26:30)
The impact of grief on cognitive function (26:30-31:51)
Final insights and reflections on grief (31:51-37:00)
Closing remarks and sponsor acknowledgements (37:00-39:00)
🎙️This episode of the Thinking Practitioner podcast features an in-depth interview with Tom Myers, author of the influential book Anatomy Trains. Host Til Luchau and Whitney Lowe discuss Tom's bodywork background, and how his goal of providing a holistic framework for understanding the body's fascial connections lead to the development of his "Anatomy Trains" concept. They explore Ida Rolf's legacy and influence on developing a model of structural integration, and Tom shares his evolving views on topics like exercise, fascia, and the potential for sustainable posture changes. The interview provides fascinating perspectives on the history and future of bodywork models, and listeners will enjoy learning about Tom's current projects (as well as Til Luchau's contributions to his upcoming Anatomy Trains summer program). 🔍🗣️👥🔊
Watch the video and get the full transcript of their conversation on Til or Whitney's sites:
[0:00-10:00] - Til Luchau interviews Tom Myers about his background and experience in bodywork. They discuss Tom's origins in the field and how he was influenced by teachers like Ida Rolf.
[10:00-20:00] - Tom explains the development of the "Anatomy Trains" concept and how it provided a holistic framework for understanding fascial connections. He shares Ida Rolf's impact on developing structural integration models.
[20:00-30:00] - The conversation explores evolving views on exercise, fascia, and the potential for sustainable posture changes. Tom discusses insights from his long career in hands-on practice.
[30:00-40:00] - Whitney Lowe asks questions about fascial contractility and the role of myofibroblasts. Tom provides perspectives on fascia and potential causes of shortening.
115: New Evidence: Can Massage Spread Cancer? (with Cathy Ryan & Erika Slocum)
Episode 115
Wednesday, April 3, 2024 • Duration 55:34
🎙️Two new studies are re-opening the age-old discussion about whether massage is safe with clients with cancer. Til and Whitney review the new evidence, the implications, and discuss best practices with expert guests Cathy Ryan and Erika Slocum. 🔍🗣️👥🔊
Watch the video and get the full transcript of their conversation on Til or Whitney's sites:
Introduction to The Thinking Practitioner Podcast (00:00-01:30)
The history of recommendations about massage and cancer (01:30-07:30)
The benefits of massage therapy for people with cancer (07:30-12:30)
The possible effects of massage on tumor sites (12:30-17:49)
Discussing Freidl study on massage and tumor cells migration (17:49-23:00)
Discussing Karda study on massage and osteosarcoma progression (23:00-30:00)
Red flags and referrals for potential cancer screening (30:00-37:00)
The importance of communication and partnership with clients (37:00-41:00)
Resources for further information on massage and cancer (41:00-45:00)
Closing remarks and contact information for the guests (45:00-47:30)
Resources:
[Dr. Peter Friedl's study is pending publication, but his 2016 presentation on this topic is at 9:45 here]
Karda, I.W.A.M., Wan Ismail, W.F. & Kamal, A.F. Massage manipulation and progression of osteosarcoma, does it really correlate: a combination of prospective and retrospective cohort study. Sci Rep 13, 18541 (2023).
114: Movement Optimism (with Greg Lehman)
Episode 114
Wednesday, March 20, 2024 • Duration 47:56
🎙️When we treat our client’s “problems,” are we really helping them? Or, would a more fundamental reframe yield better results? How do we help our clients (and ourselves) shift the usual viewpoints about pain, injury, and recovery? Whitney and Til catch up with physiotherapist and chiropractor Greg Lehman about the evolution of his influential “Reconciling Biomechanics with Pain Science” course, and his thinking on specifics like SI Joint pain, “flat arches,” and more. 🔍🗣️👥🔊
Watch the video and get the full transcript of their conversation on Til or Whitney's sites:
- Introduction to The Thinking Practitioner Podcast (0:00)- Opening Sponsor: ABMP (1:00)- Introduction of Greg Lehman (2:00)- Greg's background and expertise (3:00)- Greg's approach to reading and translating research (5:00)- The concept of Movement Optimism (7:00)- Shifting from a pessimistic view of the body to a more optimistic view (9:00)- Explaining pain to patients (11:00)- The importance of building healthy systems and ecosystems (13:00)- The fundamentals of treating people with pain (15:00)- The role of faulty firing patterns in muscles (17:00)- The concept of alignment and its importance (19:00)- The role of alignment in pain and function (21:00)- The debate between different perspectives in the field (23:00)- The importance of individualized care and patient-centered approaches (25:00)- The role of biomechanics in treating pain (27:00)- The influence of research on clinical practice (29:00)- The overselling of the need to stay updated on research (31:00)- The importance of fundamentals and common threads in treatment (33:00)- Greg's eBook "Recovery Strategies" (35:00)- Greg's views on flat feet and when they matter (37:00)- The limitations of isolating variables in research (39:00)- The need for humility and openness in the field (41:00)- Greg's upcoming teaching schedule and website (43:00)- Conclusion and thanks (45:00)
113: What Did Esalen Ever Do for Massage? (with Peggy & Lucia Horan)
Episode 112
Wednesday, March 6, 2024 • Duration 53:40
🎙️It's no exaggeration to say that in the history of massage and bodywork, there was "before Esalen," and "after Esalen." Til & Whitney talk to Peggy Horan (senior Esalen Massage teacher) and her daughter Lucia (who grew up at Esalen) about their stories, the Esalen Institute, and its influence on how massage and bodywork are practiced and taught today. 🔍🗣️👥🔊
Watch the video and get the full transcript of their conversation on Til or Whitney's sites:
- Introduction and background on Esalen Institute (0:00-5:30)
- Peggy Horan's experience and role at Esalen (5:30-12:00)
- Lucia's experience and role at Esalen (12:00-18:00)
- The influence of Esalen on the massage and bodywork field (18:00-23:00)
- Changes in the practice of Esalen Massage over time (23:00-28:00)
- The importance of boundaries and trauma-informed practices in massage (28:00-34:00)
- The cultural relevance of Esalen Massage in the digital age (34:00-38:00)
- The future of Esalen Massage and its impact on personal development (38:00-42:00)
- Peggy Horan and Lucia Drummond's contact information (42:00-43:00)
- Closing remarks and sponsor information (43:00-48:00)
🎙️ Ten years ago, massage therapist Rajam Roose was curious about pain science. Seeing a need for an interdisciplinary conference focusing on the clinical applications of this emerging field, and took a leap and created what has become a regular event. The San Diego Pain Summit has continued to grow, and gets outstanding reviews from the many people, from so many different fields, that it brings together each year. 🔍🗣️👥🔊
Watch the video and get the full transcript of their conversation on Til or Whitney's sites:
Introduction and background of Rajam Roose (0:00-4:00)
How Rajam Roose started the San Diego Pain Summit (4:00-9:00)
The focus of the San Diego Pain Summit on topics not typically covered in other conferences (9:00-14:00)
The interdisciplinary nature of the summit and the importance of collaboration between different professions (14:00-19:00)
Challenges faced by the summit, including limited resources and the need for nonprofit status (19:00-25:00)
The motivation behind organizing the summit and the passion for sharing important information (25:00-29:00)
The availability of past summit talks on the San Diego Pain Summit YouTube channel (29:00-32:00)
The upcoming San Diego Pain Summit in March 2024 and the changes in format (32:00-36:00)
Trends and changes in pain science education observed through the summit (36:00-40:00)
How to find more information about the San Diego Pain Summit (40:00-43:00)
Closing remarks and contact information (43:00-46:00)
111. How Bodyworkers Can Explain Pain (with Lorimer Moseley)
Episode 111
Wednesday, February 7, 2024 • Duration 53:56
🎙️Twelve years ago, Lorimer Moseley’s TEDx talk “Why Things Hurt” helped to catalyze profound changes in how pain is conceptualized, in our field and in many others. If we think about pain as protection, rather than as damage, it changes how we explain the improvements we see in hands-on work. Professor Moseley joins Til and Whitney to update us on his thinking, and to offer bodyworks and massage therapists practical advice on working with our clients with pain.🔍🗣️👥🔊
Watch the video and get the full transcript of their conversation on Til or Whitney's sites:
Introduction to The Thinking Practitioner Podcast (0:00)
Sponsorship by Books of Discovery (1:30)
Introduction of Lorimer Moseley (3:00)
Lorimer Moseley's TEDx talk and its impact (6:00)
Description of pain to those experiencing chronic pain (9:00)
Historical context of pain education (13:00)
Three historical phases of pain education evolution: (15:30)
ancient pain education,
old school pain education, and
current pain science education
Four essential pain facts: (19:30)
pain protects us and promotes healing,
persistent pain is also a protective function,
many factors can influence pain, and
110: Hands-On the Nerves (with Gil Hedley)
Episode 110
Wednesday, January 24, 2024 • Duration 54:28
🎙️ Anatomist extraordinaire Gil Hedley stops by to talk with Til and Whitney about nerves, dissection, bodywork, and what hands-on therapists can learn from his most recent project, the Nerve Tour. 🔍🗣️👥🔊
Watch the video and get the full transcript of their conversation on Til or Whitney's sites:
0:00 - Introduction to The Thinking Practitioner Podcast
0:30 - Introduction of hosts Whitney Lowe and Til Luchau and sponsor ABMP
1:57 - Introduction of guest Gil Hedley and discussion of his nerve tour
7:00 - Gil Hedley's background and introduction to integral anatomy
12:00 - The importance of understanding the nervous system in manual therapy
16:00 - The unique aspects of dissecting nerve tissues
20:00 - The impact of nerve tissues on texture and pain in the body
24:00 - The importance of the state of the practitioner when working with nerve tissues
28:00 - The personal connection to the donors in Gil Hedley's projects
34:00 - The future of Gil Hedley's nerve project and availability of the content
38:00 - Gil Hedley's upcoming tour schedule and accessibility of his content
43:00 - Conclusion and thanks to sponsor Books of Discovery
45:00 - Closing remarks and contact information for hosts and guest Whitney Lowe
🎙️ Join us as we revisit the key moments of The Thinking Practitioner’s fourth season. This year, our esteemed guests shared both the latest research, and historical insights into the legacies that continue to shape our field. A heartfelt thanks to our amazing guests, sponsors, and to you, our audience—your support continues to drive the Thinking Practitioner community. Subscribe now for a condensed dose of practical wisdom and discerning reflection. 🔍🗣️👥🔊
Watch the video and get the full transcript of their conversation on Til or Whitney's sites:
(The Thinking Practitioner Podcast is intended for professional practitioners of manual and movement therapies: bodywork, massage therapy, structural integration, chiropractic, myofascial and myotherapy, orthopedic, sports massage, physical therapy, osteopathy, yoga, strength and conditioning, and similar professions. It is not medical or treatment advice.)
[40:00-50:00] - Tom's views on exercise evolution are discussed, along with the importance of movement education. He emphasizes different types of fascial elasticity.
[50:00-1:00:00] - The importance of the fascial system, current projects, and upcoming teaching opportunities are covered. The podcast concludes with thanks to sponsor Books of Discovery.
About Whitney Lowe | About Til Luchau | Email Us: info@thethinkingpractitioner.com
(The Thinking Practitioner Podcast is intended for professional practitioners of manual and movement therapies: bodywork, massage therapy, structural integration, chiropractic, myofascial and myotherapy, orthopedic, sports massage, physical therapy, osteopathy, yoga, strength and conditioning, and similar professions. It is not medical or treatment advice.)
About Whitney Lowe | About Til Luchau | Email Us: info@thethinkingpractitioner.com
(The Thinking Practitioner Podcast is intended for professional practitioners of manual and movement therapies: bodywork, massage therapy, structural integration, chiropractic, myofascial and myotherapy, orthopedic, sports massage, physical therapy, osteopathy, yoga, strength and conditioning, and similar professions. It is not medical or treatment advice.)
About Whitney Lowe | About Til Luchau | Email Us: info@thethinkingpractitioner.com
(The Thinking Practitioner Podcast is intended for professional practitioners of manual and movement therapies: bodywork, massage therapy, structural integration, chiropractic, myofascial and myotherapy, orthopedic, sports massage, physical therapy, osteopathy, yoga, strength and conditioning, and similar professions. It is not medical or treatment advice.)
Sponsor Offers:
Books of Discovery: save 15% by entering "thinking" at checkout at booksofdiscovery.com.
About Whitney Lowe | About Til Luchau | Email Us: info@thethinkingpractitioner.com
(The Thinking Practitioner Podcast is intended for professional practitioners of manual and movement therapies: bodywork, massage therapy, structural integration, chiropractic, myofascial and myotherapy, orthopedic, sports massage, physical therapy, osteopathy, yoga, strength and conditioning, and similar professions. It is not medical or treatment advice.)
About Whitney Lowe | About Til Luchau | Email Us: info@thethinkingpractitioner.com
(The Thinking Practitioner Podcast is intended for professional practitioners of manual and movement therapies: bodywork, massage therapy, structural integration, chiropractic, myofascial and myotherapy, orthopedic, sports massage, physical therapy, osteopathy, yoga, strength and conditioning, and similar professions. It is not medical or treatment advice.)
therefore, there are many ways to reduce pain and recover.
Challenges of explaining complex concepts in a short period of time (26:00)
Importance of validation and empathy in pain education (30:30)
Role of optimism and encouragement in pain education (34:30)
Lorimer Moseley's upcoming courses in North America (39:00)
About Whitney Lowe | About Til Luchau | Email Us: info@thethinkingpractitioner.com
(The Thinking Practitioner Podcast is intended for professional practitioners of manual and movement therapies: bodywork, massage therapy, structural integration, chiropractic, myofascial and myotherapy, orthopedic, sports massage, physical therapy, osteopathy, yoga, strength and conditioning, and similar professions. It is not medical or treatment advice.)
Books of Discovery: save 15% by entering "thinking" at checkout at booksofdiscovery.com.
Advanced-Trainings: try a month of the amazing A-T Subscription free by entering “thinking” at checkout at a-t.tv/subscriptions/.
About Whitney Lowe | About Til Luchau | Email Us: info@thethinkingpractitioner.com
(The Thinking Practitioner Podcast is intended for professional practitioners of manual and movement therapies: bodywork, massage therapy, structural integration, chiropractic, myofascial and myotherapy, orthopedic, sports massage, physical therapy, osteopathy, yoga, strength and conditioning, and similar professions. It is not medical or treatment advice.)
Advanced-Trainings: try a month of the amazing A-T Subscription free by entering “thinking” at checkout at a-t.tv/subscriptions/.
About Whitney Lowe | About Til Luchau | Email Us: info@thethinkingpractitioner.com
(The Thinking Practitioner Podcast is intended for professional practitioners of manual and movement therapies: bodywork, massage therapy, structural integration, chiropractic, myofascial and myotherapy, orthopedic, sports massage, physical therapy, osteopathy, yoga, strength and conditioning, and similar professions. It is not medical or treatment advice.)
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