Just before the Toronto NABC, John sat down with Ladawna Parham, executive director of the ACBL Educational Foundation, and Bronia Jenkins, executive director of the ACBL. Jenkins, "one year in," still has the energy and vision she started with, if not more. Parham, who took the position in November, has had to start from the ground up, with no bridge experience (although she did do her own research prior to getting the job). She is amazed at the depth and vitality of the bridge world.

Listen to how these two women are working together within their organizations to engage and empower those who want to bring bridge to the masses.

John welcomes back his first-ever guest, Gavin Wolpert, a seven-time NABC winner, including the 2021 Soloway Knockout and the 2005 Blue Ribbon Pairs with his wife, Jenny, and a two-time bronze medal winner in Open World Championships. Gavin is one of the internet's favorite Bridge teachers, using interactive problems to allow students to make mistakes and learn from them, emphasizing practice as an essential component in becoming a better bridge player, and implementing technology to provide opportunities for targeted practice.

Gavin shares his thoughts on the need for more structured and accessible bridge programs for kids and families at national tournaments. He discusses the importance of enticing kids to play bridge and creating a fun environment for them, and that bridge can help kids develop respect for older people and learn how to interact with them better.

Ever wonder about the theme music that accompanies The Setting Trick and Double Dummy? Listen to this bonus episode, the first of John telling stories about the genesis of his bridge media. 

The Setting Trick
Episode 68
Game On – The Card Game Bridge Needs More People Like Steve Raine
John McAllister talks with Steve Raine, a bridge player, vlogger and gaming café owner who
lives in Nottingham, England. His video blogs about attending bridge tournaments and
subsequent board review have earned him fans across the globe.
You're going to want to stick around to hear the new end-of-show question as suggested by
Steve's partner at the Atlanta NABC, Adam Hickman, aka Gizzy. We're planning on making it a
staple of the show going forward. Listen to Steve's surprising and inspiring answer. Hint: it
wasn't about himself!

The North American Bridge Championships are truly an experience that brings people together. Walt Shafer, who runs an eponymous, invitation-only game online, hosted a party for the participants at the Atlanta NABC. John, who plays in the game, attended and met Bonnie Gellas, who was there because her partner, Erez Hendelman, plays in the game. The two hit it off and now Bonnie, who is a bridge teacher, is a guest on the show. 

Bonnie lives in NYC and is responsible for teaching bridge to hundreds of players. 

Alex Kolesnik: Bridge Dad +

Move over, Soccer Moms, there's a new game in town. Alex Kolesnik and his wife, Sharon Beynon, are California-based professors who play bridge. Somehow, they got both of their children interested in playing bridge too. Now ages 25 and 19, Emma and Finn are top-ranked players.

Alex, a Platinum Life Master, describes his journey as a husband, professor, player and father, encouraging his kids in all their endeavors, maintaining balance and keeping perspective. 

The Setting Trick

Episode 65: Nathan Gong – A Junior Ambassador for New Bridge Players

Seattle-area teenager Nathan Gong has distinguished himself as an excellent bridge player at regionals, NABCs, and, this summer, his first World Youth Championships. He's also getting noticed as a teacher, having started bridge clubs in middle and high school. With his family and the support of the bridge-playing community, Nathan has helped to teach and mentor a group of kids – and even get some of their parents to learn bridge.

Amber Lin has already achieved a lifetime of success at age 26. A national champion and two-time world champion medalist (including gold in Morocco just a few weeks ago), Amber has found the time to develop as a bridge player, mentor and coach others, intern with the ACBL Educational Foundation, and work full-time as an energy consultant at Bain & Company. Listen to Amber's amazing trajectory via the USBF Junior Training Program and the benefits of mentorship and learning together with friends.

TST Episode 63: Katie Sullivan is not pumping the brakes

Katie Sullivan, as a second-year student at the University of Virginia, has infused her love of bridge with her college experience, starting an officially recognized student organization and recruiting other college kids into competitive bridge. Hear about her meteoric rise in the game and her plans for UVA world domination. 

3:47 "Chalk it up" – how creative marketing got Katie needed contacts to create a bridge club.

10:50 Obtaining CIO status and how the club fair was a game-changer.

12:26 Trumpet players and bridge. Who knew?

17:09 Hoos Playing Bridge on Instagram.

18:50 Trying to teach the fundamentals, struggling with supplies. Creating slide presentations.

28:21 A shout-out to any UVA alumni who might want to help. Many students have branched out to playing sanctioned events at clubs. Katie is proud.

32:51 Katie, in her first year of college at Amherst, meets Michael Xu.

38:41 Recovering from a painful misbid by partner.

49:06 After success at the World Youth Teams Championships, Katie plans to get "seriously serious."

53:40 Loving the postmortem.

1:05 Katie encourages all youth bridge players to plan on attending UVA when it's time for college.

Katie's article on Bridge Winners about starting a bridge club at college.

Hoos Playing Bridge on Instagram.

Katie's first BW post: a love letter.

Katie in the New Orleans NABC Daily Bulletin.

Like cards? Play bridge!

The Setting Trick

Episode 62: Patty Tucker, Youthful Enthusiast.

Patty Tucker might be responsible for creating more new bridge players than anyone on the planet. From developing teaching materials and running a non-profit to her new endeavor - getting bridge to be part of the curriculum in schools - Patty channels her love of the game into energy to keep it alive.

How bridge changed Patty's life at age 11, finding her niche.

The origin of Atlanta Junior Bridge, how the camps became the Youth NABC.

The challenges of school systems and connecting with teachers.

A teacher in Lebanon KY inspired Patty's new endeavor, Jump Start Bridge, resulting in 40 kids learning bridge via an afterschool program.

Patty's amazement at the lack of knowledge of what bridge is; finding a way to spread the word via conferences, including the International Society for Technology and Education, which included tech giants like Microsoft and Google, reaching over 12,000 attendees and raising visibility.

Patty keeps learning: What to do differently for future conferences.

On feeling overwhelmed or "out of her element" with the enormity of the tasks of marketing her plan.

Don't tell Patty, "It can't be done."

How bridge can connect people, creating lifelong friendships, even if you only see one another three times a year at NABCs. Kids deserve that too.

Patty's three wishes (OK, only two).

How Patty learned to play bridge, and a story of a defining moment in her bridge life.

Why John will never be Goodwill Member of the Year.

Patty's legacy.

How not everyone is cut out to be a bridge teacher.

Patty's third wish.

Patty's pre-game ritual and advice.

Links:

Atlanta Junior Bridge

https://atlantajuniorbridge.org/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFmp595UdNs

Jump Start Bridge

https://atlantajuniorbridge.org/jumpstart/

The Power of Bridge in Schools

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1J8A-za2Wpc

The Setting Trick

Episode 61: Sartaj Hans Keeps Getting Better

This week's guest is many-time Australian national champion Sartaj Hans. Originally from India, Sartaj has several high finishes in NABC events, including making the semifinal of the recent Spingold Knockout Teams in Chicago, where he played four-handed with partner Andy Hung and teammates Nabil Edgtton and Michael Whibley. 

John had his first big knockout match win in the 2014 Spingold teaming with Sartaj to beat the then 7th- seeded Cayne team.

Sartaj's book, Battling the Best, won the 2107 IBPA Book of the Year award. He also won the declarer play of the year in 2019. On top of all that, he has a successful career and is married to fellow tournament bridge player Sophie Ashton; they have two young daughters.

Sartaj discusses the psychology of bridge and how belief can make you a better player.

The need for developing a way to categorize bridge mistakes because bridge problems have so much variance.

Why postmortems are "rubbish."

Sartaj hits upon a hot-button issue: playing top-level events on computers.

A couple of book recommendations from Sartaj.

Sartaj's belief that focusing too much on system in a casual partnership is not effective.

In bridge, everyone has a chance to win. 

Working on improving and how even experts have coaches and mentors.

Finally, Sartaj philosophizes on enjoying the process.

Read Sartaj's post on Bridge Winners about playing on tablets:

https://bridgewinners.com/article/view/the-case-for-tablets/

Sartaj Hans' book, Battling the Best:

https://www.baronbarclay.com/battling-the-best/

Sartaj Hans wins Declarer Play of the Year:

https://www.abf.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/2020_IBPA_Declarer_Play_of_the_Year.pdf

Today, my guest is in-demand tournament player, winner of one of Bridge's crown jewels, the 2022 Vanderbilt, club owner, multiple club owner, and Junior Bridge mentor extraordinaire, Aaron Silverstein.

Aaron played in the first ever Junior World Championships in 1987, and his daughter, Avery, playing on a team that he mentored, won a silver medal in the 2023 Junior World Championships. See just how much has changed when it comes to Junior Bridge. 

Getting Aaron's perspective as a club owner was really insightful for me, and I think you'll be surprised at who Aaron wants to partner when he plays in one of his own club games. 

Finally, Aaron is very candid about what it's like to have his main tournament partner win a mixed world championship without him, and playing in tournaments at the highest level, and I think provides some great insight into how to think about your own partnership and teammates.

Play in the SPARK Pro-Am with and against your favorite Setting Trick guests.

The Setting Trick

Episode 58

Olivia Schireson - Next Gen

Olivia and John talk about how they met and the opportunity to play on a last-minute team together at the Providence NABC.

Olivia's mantra, "the two C's," confidence (and competence) – "never play bridge scared."

The Cinderella Mixed Team at the US Team Trials.

Bay Area Junior Bridge, the Rosenbergs, Will Watson, rooting for friends.

Getting the best out of oneself. 

John and Olivia discuss having their plays written up on Bridge Winners.

Playing "What Are The Odds" at the World Championships in Poland.

Can you guess Olivia's favorite dance move?

Plans for the future. Starbucks?

More US Trials.

The best dad ever.

Olivia's brother and the case of the mistaken identity. 

Today, my guest is Selena Pepić. She is a computer science graduate from ETH Zurich, a rates trader at JP Morgan in Paris, and a member of the Serbian national mixed, women's, and junior teams. She won the gold medal at the World Youth Open Championship in Opatija 2015 (girls U26), the bronze medal at the World University Championship in Lodz in 2016, and also won an event at the Junior World Championship in 2016. Join us as we talk about Selena's background, playing bridge in Paris, her thoughts on the American bridge community, winning women's events, and more.

[04.11] Missing bridge – Selena shares the reason behind quitting bridge for 2 years at university.

[21.03] Problems – Selena shares why she loves talking about bidding problems in bridge playing. 

[25.10] First partner – We talk about the relationship between Selena and her first partner Giovanni. 

[47.19] Playing blackjack – Selena dives into the story of playing blackjack for the first time.

[1:01.19] Novi Sad Bridge Festival – We talk about the Novi Sad Bridge festival happening between April 28th to May 2nd of 2023. 

Resources

Connect with Selena

LinkedIn - linkedin.com/in/selena-pepic/ 

                 bridgewinners.com/profile/selena-pepic/ 

bridgescanner.com/event/novi-sad-bridge-festival-2023 

web.facebook.com/novisadbridge/

Today, my guest is Selena Pepić. She is a computer science graduate from ETH Zurich, a rates trader at JP Morgan in Paris, and a member of the Serbian national mixed, women's, and junior teams. She won the gold medal at the World Youth Open Championship in Opatija 2015 (girls U26), the bronze medal at the World University Championship in Lodz in 2016, and also won an event at the Junior World Championship in 2016. Join us as we talk about Selena's background, playing bridge in Paris, her thoughts on the American bridge community, winning women's events, and more. 

[04.08] Selena's background – We start the conversation with a brief bio about Selena and her first junior world bridge championship in 2016.

[10.27] Bridge in Paris – Selena talks about playing bridge in Paris and how the division system works.

[20.51] American Sponsor – Selena shares the story of how she met Steve, her American sponsor.

[23.37] Expectations – Selena's thoughts on the American bridge community as national champions

[31.55] Women's Event – We talk about Selena's thoughts on winning a women's event in New Orleans.

[35.20] Professional Events – Selena talks about the professional bridge events & culture in Europe before the USA

[41.13] Playing with Family & Friends – Selena talks about how she played card games with her grandparents and later with high school friends.

[50.09] Catan – A multiplayer board game

Resources

Connect with Selena

LinkedIn - linkedin.com/in/selena-pepic/ 

                 bridgewinners.com/profile/selena-pepic/

Greg Humphreys, a talented software engineer and accomplished bridge player features in this episode of The Setting Trick. He is the winner of the Mott-Smith Trophy at the recent spring North American Bridge championships, a three-time North American champion, and the best bridge player in Charlottesville, Virginia. He got hooked on Bridge in 1998 and quickly joined a local club, where he found success playing with Walter Miller's 49er club. Greg studied computer science at Princeton and Stanford before moving to Charlottesville, VA, to teach at the University of Virginia. Also, Greg has since left academia and worked for several startups and major tech companies like Nvidia, Google, and Twitch.

[07:00] Improving Your Bridge Game -  Greg emphasizes the importance of immersing oneself in Bridge and discussing hands with better players.

[12:48] Recursive Diamond - Advantages of playing a solid diamond system and the benefits of opening with one club instead of one diamond.

[18:50] Streaming Bridge on Twitch – Greg mentions his experience of streaming himself playing Bridge on Twitch.

[28:16] Partner Support in Bridge - Importance of supporting your partner in Bridge and dealing with bad results.

[32:54] Competitive Bridge Strategies and Performance – Greg outlines his experience playing Bridge in a competitive event, including strategies, gameplay, and the desire to perform well and achieve a high ranking.

[57:04] Teaching beginners in Bridge - Frustrations and challenges

Resources:

Connect with Greg:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/greghumphreys/

Twitter: twitter.com/humper

Mentioned in the episode:

Physically Based Rendering: From Theory to Implementation: amazon.com/Physically-Based-Rendering-Theory-Implementation/dp/0128006455?redirectFromSmile=1

Greg Humphreys, a talented software engineer and accomplished bridge player is featured in this episode of The Setting Trick. He is the winner of the Mott-Smith Trophy at the recent spring North American Bridge Championships, a three-time North American champion, and the best bridge player in Charlottesville, Virginia. He got hooked on bridge in 1998 and quickly joined a local club, where he found success playing with Walter Miller's 49er club. Greg studied computer science at Princeton and Stanford before moving to Charlottesville, VA, to teach at the University of Virginia. Also, Greg has since left academia and worked for several startups and major tech companies like Nvidia, Google, and Twitch.

In addition to his impressive career in computer science, Greg has also made a name for himself in the world of bridge. He has succeeded in various tournaments, including the Mixed Pairs, Platinum Pairs, Mixed BAM, and Fast Pairs. Greg and Jenni Carmichael typically play together once a year in the Mixed Pairs, which they won in 2016 and have also finished second, third, fourth, and fifth. In 2018 they made it to the finals of the World Open Pairs. This spring in Reno, they finished second in the Mixed Pairs. Greg also finished 11th in the Silodor Pairs and won the Fast Pairs, playing with Adam Parrish. 

On the other hand, when not playing bridge, Greg enjoys spending time in his woodshop, playing video games, and traveling. He also enjoys watching RuPaul's Drag Race. Also, Greg streams his bridge games on Twitch, where he plays against friends and robots on BBO.

In this conversation, Greg shares a wealth of insights and experiences about his journey in the world of Bridge. He discusses his best-ever result in a tournament, the pressure of leading, and the impact of small mistakes. He recalls an unusual game where the opposing team doubled their bid and made a strange opening lead. Greg explains how miscommunication about a bridge bidding system leads to confusion and the importance of immersing oneself in bridge and discussing hands with better players. He also talks about his accidental discovery of bridge on Yahoo and how he fell in love with the game through books and local clubs.

Additionally, Greg discusses his unique relay precision system with Jenni and the advantages of playing a solid diamond system. He mentions his experience of streaming himself playing Bridge on Twitch and the importance of supporting your partner in Bridge and dealing with bad results. Lastly, he shares his experience playing Bridge in a competitive event, including strategies, gameplay, the desire to perform well and achieve a high ranking, and the frustrations and challenges of teaching beginners in Bridge.

[06:37] Best Result Ever – Greg discusses what he considers to be his best-ever result.

[10:11] Pressure: The pressure of leading in bridge tournaments and the impact of small mistakes.

[19:53] Unusual Tactics – Greg recalls a bridge game where the opposing team doubled their bid and made a strange opening lead.

[23:27] Bidding Confusion and Resolution – Greg explains how miscommunication about a bridge bidding system leads to confusion.

[25:50] Discovering Bridge – Greg tells how he accidentally discovered Bridge on Yahoo and fell in love with the game through books and local clubs. 

[34:03] Non-Standard Homebrew System-  Bizarre Bridge System Leads to Unforeseen Victory

[43:43] UVA - Reasons for choosing UVA for an academic career

[52.48] Partnership with Jenny – Greg talks about playing Bridge with Jenny and the frequency of playing together. He also discusses their effort to practice online before a tournament and their unique relay precision system, which requires some study.

Resources:

Connect with Greg:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/greghumphreys/

Twitter: twitter.com/humper

Mentioned in the episode:

Physically Based Rendering: From Theory to Implementation: amazon.com/Physically-Based-Rendering-Theory-Implementation/dp/0128006455?redirectFromSmile=1

In this episode of The Setting Trick, you are in for a treat as you get to hear from Olin Hubert, an exceptional American bridge player who has made a mark in the world of bridge. He has achieved the coveted title of American Contract Bridge League Grand Life Master owing to his impressive achievements in the game. Olin's exceptional skills as a North American champion bridge player have earned him accolades and recognition from the bridge community worldwide.

His extensive experience in the game has led to some remarkable accomplishments, including winning the Grand National Teams in 2022 and the North American Bridge Championships. Additionally, Olin has been a runner-up in the Nail Life Master Open Pairs competition in 2021, proving his mettle as a consistent and formidable player.

Apart from his impressive career in the bridge, Olin has also served as a retired tournament director for the American Contract Bridge League. He currently resides in the vibrant city of Atlanta, where he continues to inspire and influence the bridge community through his expertise and passion for the game. 

As Olin shares his story, you will learn about his journey to becoming a professional bridge player. Although he faced financial challenges along the way, his dedication and passion ultimately paid off, and he is now a highly sought-after pro. Olin shares his experience, learnings, thinking, and tips throughout the discussion. Also, Olin recalls his triumph at the North American Bridge Championship, hosted by the American Contract Bridge League last summer, and his achievement of Grand Life Master ranking by winning the GNT Championship Flight. In a nutshell, you will be inspired by Olin's story and impressed by his accomplishments and experience in the world of bridge. Hence, he will surely be a memorable guest on this episode of The Setting Trick.

[08:39] Olin's Story – Olin shares how he started learning to play bridge.

[16:26] Tournament Director – We discuss how Olin became a tournament director. Moreover, we explore what the tournament environment was like back then.

[26:36] Keep the Skill – Olin explains how he maintains his skill when not playing. 

[28:30] GNT – Winning Grand National Teams and receiving the "Grand Life Master" ACBL ranking. 

[45:47] Bridge – Olin's favorite thing about bridge.

[01:00:30] Tips – Use Olin's insights and playing expertise to raise your bridge game.

Resources:

Connect with Olin:

Website: bridgewinners.com/profile/olin-hubert-2-7fnpfuvmb2/

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/olin-hubert-89409a250/

This week's episode of the Setting Trick: Conversations with World-Class Bridge Players turns the tables and features professional player Greg Hinze interviewing host John McAllister. In this conversation, we cover John's background, his favorite bridge books, his experiences at the national and world championships, his documentary movie about bridge, the reasons why he started the podcast, and more. 

 [01.29] John's background – Starting the conversation, John discusses his Virginia roots, where he lives, where he went to college, and why he wants to stay there. 

[08.40] Books – John and Greg talk about some of the best books about bridge. 

[20.43] The summer nationals – We talk about John's experience with mixed board-a-match teams in Providence at the summer nationals and the open BAM at the fall NABC. 

[23.31] The movie – We talk about the movie called 'Double Dummy' produced by John, about bridge. 

[32.10] The podcast – John shares the reasons behind starting his podcast and continuing until now. 

[33:48] Meeting Migry – John remembers meeting partner Migry Zur Campanile and playing mixed teams at the world championships.

[43.50] Bridge conventions – John chooses his desert island bridge convention.

Transcript

[00:00:00] Greg Hinze: Hello everybody. Welcome to the Setting Trick. Uh, I'm your guest host, uh, Greg Hinsey. Uh, our normal host with the most will not be available today as a host. So without further ado, let me introduce our special guest star today. Creator of the Setting Trick Podcast, producer of the new movie, double Dummy and newly crowned N A B C Champion, my friend, John McAllister.

[00:00:36] Hi John. Hey 

[00:00:36] John McAllister: Greg . Thanks for having me. , should I think I cut you off there at the end, . 

[00:00:43] Greg Hinze: So how you feel being on the other side of 

[00:00:45] John McAllister: you? Nervous? I am, I'm definitely nervous. I didn't know what to expect and I, I definitely like, probably 20 minutes before I got home I was. And I was definitely like, okay, this is, uh, I get nervous before I host the show.

[00:00:59] But, uh, to be this is a real honor to have you do this, uh, to have you do this for me. I feel a great honor for 

[00:01:06] Greg Hinze: you having me, uh, do this. Uh, so, uh, I, I'm nervous too, so , so we just dive right in? Yeah, sure. Okay. Uh, yeah, just tell me a little bit about yourself. Cause I like, where are you from? Where'd you grow up?

[00:01:19] And uh, okay. 

[00:01:20] John McAllister: How, how'd you, I'm gonna start, I'm gonna go back. This is where you're now just a brief, so in Phoenix, the, the way this conversation came to pass is in Phoenix, after we won the Mitchell Board of Match, my first N A B C victory, you, Greg offered to, to flip the script here on the setting trick and to interview me.

[00:01:39] And so that's how this conversation came to pass. And when I texted you about, You were like, I wasn't sure if you were totally committed to it, but you sent me a list of questions and you and you, you know, you had your intro planned, so I really appreciate that. I, um, it says a lot about you and just to go from there, I grew up, and I still live in Charlottesville, Virginia.

[00:02:05] I went to college at the University of Virginia, which is here. My mom is originally from Charlottesville and. It's a great place to live. I've thought about living elsewhere, but haven't really found a compelling reason to, uh, to move just yet. I get a lot of travel playing bridge, so I, I get to vi see the world through bridge tournaments, which is, I think is a, as you probably would attest, a great way to, to see the world.

[00:02:33] Greg Hinze: Yeah. I haven't seen much of the world myself. Uh, mainly just America. I've seen . But, uh, so what, you mentioned you gave 'em to college there, uh, as well. What, what did you study? Study 

[00:02:43] John McAllister: when you, I like to joke when people ask me what I studied in college, that I was in a fraternity, , because I really, I was a good student in.

[00:02:54] Like I went to a very academically rigorous high school, a boarding school, all, all male boarding school, about an hour from here called Woodbury Forest. And the, the teachers there really challenged me to work hard to learn the material. And then by the time I got to U V A, I sort of crapped out on school.

[00:03:12] I was technically a history major. I tried to get into the undergraduate commerce school and my, uh, they didn't accept me and. Yeah, so I was technically a history major, but I had worse grades in history than I did in other subjects. It was sort of a last minute thing. My, one of my best friend's dad was a history professor, and so he could be my advisor and it was sort of the easy, easy thing to do when it was time to declare a major at the end of my second year.

[00:03:42] And so 

[00:03:42] Greg Hinze: outta school, you went, I had read that you were on involved in the hedge fund company or something. Yeah. You did that for, 

[00:03:50] John McAllister: yeah. So. There's this guy named Jeffrey Woodruff, who is a hedge fund manager here in Charlottesville. And my parents, my, were actually friends with Jeffery's parents when, when we were younger.

[00:04:06] And so I got interested in trading because I played a lot of backgammon after I graduated from uva. My roommate and I in New York City would play backgammon all the time, and we played for pretty decent stake. And so through backgammon I heard a, uh, I heard a recording where somebody was talking about trading, and that really appealed to me from like the same sort of thinking logic as backgammon.

[00:04:34] And so I got a. The reason I brought up Jeffrey's name is because three different people, my mother, my piano teacher, and then a woman that my piano teacher had set me up with all suggested they knew I was interested in trading, that I should reach out to this guy, Jeffrey Woodruff, and I didn't do it. I never reached out to any of those through any of those people suggesting it.

[00:04:56] Only when he, his company, appeared on the U V A. Uh, job site looking for interns. Did I actually reach out? And then I had a seven and a half year career working there, which ended in, in, in 2012. And, uh, I just got, I just was tired of working for, uh, doing that at that time. Had you, uh, played bridge yet?

[00:05:19] Yeah, so I played, I started playing bridge when I was 18. My parents knew how to play and my aunt suggested it and. I loved it immediately, but I didn't really have an outlet for it. Like in New York City, for example, I lived, after I graduated U V A, I lived probably two blocks from honors, and it never even occurred to me to seek out a bridge game in, in, uh, in the city.

[00:05:46] You didn't know it existed, but you were right nearby it. Yeah. Yeah. There was a backgammon club that I never went to, but I was, I wanted to try to go there to play backgammon for money against other players, and I never got the courage up to do it, but it didn't even occur to me to think like I loved bridge.

[00:06:03] Like it, it was something I did with my parents when I came home and it didn't, like I played spades with co, with friends in college, but I didn't actually occur to, to explain bridge. To them, how, how did you 

[00:06:18] Greg Hinze: find the Bridge Club or whatever to get into the A C B L? 

[00:06:21] John McAllister: So, my older sister had three friends that were looking for her fourth for bridge classes when I moved back to Charlottesville.

[00:06:29] And she knew I loved it and she suggested it. And then that woman took me to the, uh, to the local Bridge Club for the first. And have you, uh, 

[00:06:41] Greg Hinze: thought about making a movie at this point yet at 

[00:06:43] John McAllister: all, or no? No. Podcast or No, no, no. This is probably, this is, this was in like 2000. And 

[00:06:49] Greg Hinze: so you learned, you learned from your, your, your 

[00:06:51] John McAllister: sister, you said?

[00:06:52] So my sister would be our fourth. So my parents kind of knew how to play and my sister would be our fourth, but she wasn't, she never really got into it. She was just willing, a willing participant. And then she had friends that were looking for a fourth, for a, like a weekly bridge class. Oh, 

[00:07:09] Greg Hinze: that's good.

[00:07:10] And, uh, what did you start reading about Bridge? Like, uh, do you read books? Did you play online? So 

[00:07:17] John McAllister: we had a Bridge for Dummies book that I bought and we would, when I played with my parents, we would sort of have that out. They had like a two page cheat sheet maybe. And I had bridge books, uh, that I would read.

[00:07:32] Yeah, I don't exactly remember what, what my first bridge books were or how it all, but I mean, I like, I like consuming information about bridge. Like that is one of the things I, I love playing Bridge. Like to this day I love playing bridge. I love consuming information about Bridge and reading Bridge books is a big part.

[00:07:56] What's your favorite, 

[00:07:57] Greg Hinze: uh, couple 

[00:07:58] John McAllister: Bridge books? Uh, well, that's a good question. I'm reading right now Bridge with Another Perfect partner, which I think was the I B P A book of the year. And so that's by John Caruthers, who I don't actually know. I don't think I know him. I, I don't know if he plays tournaments or not.

[00:08:17] He's Canadian. And it's like a at the table book where, you know, they give you the deal and he's got this partner who is a real, like a real expert. And so that guy explains the, uh, how the deal should be played or how he did play it, or how he created an illusion to, you know, to beat the contract. It's not something that you can read.

[00:08:46] I'll read, you know, a couple of deals at a time and then like, do something else cuz it's Bridge Books are not like Rare. Is the Bridge book, uh, um, what's the name of that book? Uh, with the unlucky expert. Oh, uh, the, the Men. Oh. Why You Lose a Bridge? Why You Lose a Bridge? That's probably the, that is a rare bridge book and that you can read it.

[00:09:11] Like I can read that book all the way. Without, I've always enjoyed 

[00:09:16] Greg Hinze: like, uh, the Bridge and the Menagerie series. Uh, and they had the carpa, I think he was a unlucky expert or whatever. Uh, he was labeled as such. But, uh, that was always fun to read. Uh, they, they could, you could read through those things. Uh, just kind of, I just enjoyed the characters and it was a good bridge.

[00:09:33] Uh, like a lot of non bridge stuff 

[00:09:35] John McAllister: at the same time. Yeah, yeah, exactly. And hilarious. So well written Victor Ma. . So, uh, 

[00:09:42] Greg Hinze: you just got into the A C B O and then you started, uh, going to tournaments. 

[00:09:47] John McAllister: Uh uh so, uh, traveling the world, playing bridge everywhere. No, no, no. So shook the, my first Bridge teacher was a woman named Shook, and she was pretty eccentric French woman, and she could play with me once a month at the local bridge.

[00:10:04] And so then she found this guy who was younger than me who was a UVA student, and she started playing with him. And then I started playing with him. His name's Jason Holderness, and he was better than I was. And we then went, uh, Jason and I, when the D Nationals were in DC in like 2009, I think Jason and I went up there and we played in like a two session.

[00:10:30] 1 99 or pair game that we won. And so we got little trophies from that, which unfortunately I threw away, I think. I think I threw away the photo that they took too. . But I forget what your original question. Just like, 

[00:10:43] Greg Hinze: you know, when you started playing tournaments and, you know, traveling a bit more, uh, as, as opposed 

[00:10:48] John McAllister: to just going to the local.

[00:10:49] So like, uh, my first national was in 2012, so I quit my job at Quantitative Investment Management and I gave, like, they said, will you give us two weeks? And so the last day of my two weeks was, Like that day, literally that day I left for Memphis to play in my first national, that was in spring of 2012.

[00:11:12] And there was a sectional the weekend before and I hired this kid named Rob Brady, who was a UVA student who was a, a pro to be my partner. And I forget who our teammates were, but we won the Swiss and that was my first time winning a sectional Swiss. And winning the Swiss made me a life master. Oh wow.

[00:11:36] That's 

[00:11:36] Greg Hinze: a, that was a good timing for everything. pretty, pretty fun. Pretty fun. So, uh, so, so then after that you were just like hooked on nationals? Uh, I mean cuz nationals are pretty fun experience. Uh, I mean, if you haven't been to one, I think they're really fun things to go to. 

[00:11:54] John McAllister: So, Yes. I mean, essentially yes, I, before I played my first national, I was in at a conference for work in February of 2012, and it was in Palm Beach and Gavin Wilpert lives near there.

[00:12:10] And so I knew about Gavin from Bridge Winners and I messaged him on B B O and asked him if I could play with him. And so I played two days with him in the sectional. And he said, which I think is a great piece of advice that I like to give out to people is play against the best competition that you can play against, and that's playing at the Nationals.

[00:12:31] So, uh, I've been fortunate to, I've gone to every national but won since then. And I've also played in, uh, one, two, played in four World championships now. Very good. Uh, where was your favorite place to play Bridge? I think Tromso Norway, I played in the European championships there, and it's inside of the Arctic Circle.

[00:12:58] So it's, it was in the summer and literally the sun didn't go down. Um, that was a pretty unique, a unique experience. So how is 

[00:13:10] Greg Hinze: bridge over there like, uh, run differently than it is here? Like, uh, is cuz it feels like it, you know, we may be a little bit outdated in, uh, some of the technology available. is when you played like in the world championships, uh, over 

[00:13:25] John McAllister: how did, well I think the first time I played behind screens was at a bridge tournament in a Bulgaria.

[00:13:31] And the top seven tables were behind screens, and they had like plastic boards. And I remember the, the further that we got in down in the table ranking, we had never seen this before. We had like these leather, little leather sleeves that had the cards in them, but the European championships. And the world Championships, as I imagine, you know, are like, they're all screens, all the tables are screens.

[00:14:01] You're playing the same deals at the same time. Everybody's playing the same deals. It's, uh, it's cool because there's a lot of people there that I, that are new to me. So, you know, the national, the US nationals tends to be, tends to be a lot of the same people. But in Europe it was like a whole new, whole new crew of people.

[00:14:24] More, uh, uh, 

[00:14:25] Greg Hinze: foreigners come to America than Americans go to the foreign countries. It seems, um, there's not very many Americans that really do much traveling to play bridge over there as, as far as, as over here seems. Do you find it that way or do you know a lot of Americans that are going all over 

[00:14:42] John McAllister: these?

[00:14:42] Uh, you know, the, the, the Americans that are hiring real, like good teams for the nationals tend to probably play over there. , I would think like there's a tournament. The European Open is this summer in Strasberg, uh, which I think is in France, and the head of the E B L was telling me that he wants to get 200 teams in the open, which would be amazing.

[00:15:09] I would really like to go for it, but I don't have firm plans yet for planning that. Also, it feels like in Europe that the. The main events are really the main events like the, the A C B L does a good job of making the events that are going on concurrent to the soloway, like the Board of Match that we won.

[00:15:29] They make a good, they do a good job of making those like standalone. Whereas I feel like when you get knocked out in Europe of an event, it's, it's not really a title and an event like that doesn't really carry the same magnitude of that. It might in the A C B L. I see. So, 

[00:15:48] Greg Hinze: What kind of, uh, systems do you like to play?

[00:15:50] John McAllister: Um, . I like to play pretty basic, uh, two over one natural bidding. Not a lot of complexity. I don't have a, like, I don't have a strong long-term partnership with one individual, so I've noticed over the years 

[00:16:09] Greg Hinze: you do play with a lot of, a lot of different, uh, players, and I think that's a good thing. What do you feel.

[00:16:16] You learn like a little bit of something from, you know, everybody 

[00:16:19] John McAllister: you play with. I mean, one thing I'll say about Bridge, I think I really like to play with people that I enjoy their company and I feel like that we're a good, I feel like, like it's important for me to be able to discuss like the, the, my partner has the right mentality and that we can discuss the boards that we didn't do well and not get, not get angry with each other.

[00:16:45] Greg Hinze: So, uh, yeah. Okay. We've been mentioning, uh, the Mitchell Border match, which you just recently won. Yeah. There you were playing with a, a relatively new partnership. Yeah. I 

[00:16:53] John McAllister: was playing with, uh, spinny Erickson, who I met. I played the Icelandic, uh, the VEC Bridge Festival a couple years ago, and I met s Spinny there and he was playing with this guy named Neils, who's Danish.

[00:17:10] And the two of them were just pure comedy. Like Neils had tried to rent a car for the tournament and it had all gone haywire. And he had gone through all these, all this effort to get this car that eventually really just sat in a parking garage in vec. Like he didn't even use it after spending all this energy and time trying to get this car.

[00:17:33] And so that story, being told that story over the course of like the days of the event, really, I mean, we laughed so hard about. So much. And so I really enjoyed him. And then in Austin, uh, the first N A B C Post Covid, he was there and I needed a partner for the Swiss. And so we got to talking and we did pretty well in that.

[00:17:59] And then we played the Swiss again in Providence and we did well on that. And so, We played the same teammates this, uh, whole time. Uh, the teammates for the Swiss and Providence and, and for Phoenix were the same. Uh, Jovi, uh, Jovi Smatter of, uh, and Sasha Warn, they're Austrian a mixed pair, Jovi's a woman.

[00:18:26] Greg Hinze: And uh, so was that, uh, everybody, everybody's first, uh, been there on your team? Yes. That's pretty exciting for you all to experience it at the same time. So like how, how long were you just on the moon? 

[00:18:39] John McAllister: Uh, you know, probably like a good, good 10 days through the rest of the nationals for sure. Yeah, definitely.

[00:18:45] definitely it, it's, I, I mean I playing with Jovi and Sasha in a mixed board of Match in Providence, the summer national, we came in second and we were leading after every segment of the, of the event. But the last one, And that was the first time I'd ever come in second and the first time I'd ever really even been close to winning in one of these events.

[00:19:08] And so we had a really good session in the, on the second day of the board of Match, the Mitchell's a two day event. And I had been in the position before and I really wanted to win this time. And then during the session, spinny and I, we just didn't seem like it was going well. We got to probably. Third from Final Round and we played against Curtis Cheek and we got to Issa and Curtis's table and they're like, how's it going?

[00:19:41] And Spinny is like, no, we don't have a chance. . So, but yeah, I mean we just didn't, but you know, Jovi and Sasha play this canape system, strong club, so. I don't know how we won, but we won comfortably. It, it was, it was like, uh, yeah, when, when the woman from the A C V L told, told me that we had won, she goes, John, you won.

[00:20:09] And I went like, like I had to cut myself off from really squealing like I wanted to. I think a lot of people. I think a lot of people did hear you. And that was, that was like probably one half or one third of what I like if I really had Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:20:32] Greg Hinze: I just remember seeing you that, uh, day right afterwards and uh, whenever to say, look, and you were just like beeping, like, I mean 

[00:20:38] John McAllister: it was like, you still 

[00:20:41] Greg Hinze: happy?

[00:20:43] So you went from first National 2012 to winning national like 10 years later. Um, but it's somewhere in between there. You decided that you were going to produce a movie about Bridge called Double Dummy. So 

[00:21:00] John McAllister: why, what happened there? So my first national event was the IMP pairs in Memphis, and I played with a local guy from Charlottesville named Greg Humphreys, who I'm sure you know.

[00:21:13] And Greg, he has a Emmy, right? He has a, he has a Academy Award. He has like an Academy award, I think for create, for writing a book about motion graphics or something like that. So Memphis was my first national, I didn't know anybody, and he invited me to this brainstorming session on how do we get new players?

[00:21:42] Uh, young people playing bridge and I, I really didn't even know what the event was, but he said, there's a free dinner, there's gonna be people there. And so I thought, I thought, okay, great. I, I need to meet some people. I want to make some friends and free dinner sounds okay. I mean, maybe it won't be the best food, but whatever.

[00:22:00] And so that was, I had just quit my job. I did marketing for the hedge fund, so I knew, like I knew how to sell things or what. . And so that was kind of the, that was the free dinner. 

[00:22:14] Greg Hinze: I see. So, but the no experience or anything, you just up and like this is gonna be brand new, like the whole movie industry, uh, outta nowhere.

[00:22:23] Like, I mean, you didn't go to school for this and you just, so, I mean it just a lot involved, I, I'm sure in, in ma like finding the right people and making a 

[00:22:33] John McAllister: movie. So it wasn't, it wasn't at that brainstorming session that I had the idea for the movie. But it was at that brainstorming session. I didn't have another job lined up.

[00:22:43] I just knew that I wanted to stop, I needed to stop doing what I was doing. And so I thought I could be involved in helping introduce Bridge to more young people. And then I came home and two of my friends were making a movie about a, a scripted film. And we, they took me out to dinner and they, one of 'em said, I think we're, you're the only person we know that plays bridge.

[00:23:08] And so I told him about some of the statistics from this brainstorming session, and he said, that sounds like a documentary movie. And then that was, that was where that, that came from. And so you 

[00:23:20] Greg Hinze: just began filming, was it? Uh, just pretty much all, all at one. Uh, Youth World Championships, right? Uh, most of it.

[00:23:29] Or is there There was a lot of, 

[00:23:31] John McAllister: uh, outside, so I had, I had met Adam Kaplan through Greg at the, uh, at the N A B C, the spring 1, 20 12. And he really, I was really impressed with, in spite of him being 20 years younger than Greg, Greg's my age, and Adam was 16 at the time, and. That the way he was making fun of Greg, talking about how Greg thought about these bridge deals that we were playing, that we were, you know, talking about after the round.

[00:23:59] And I knew about Adam from Bridge winners and so he was already like kind of a star to me when I first met him. I'm like, oh, that's Adam Kaplan. And so he became the focal point of the film and he was, he was kind of the leader of a group that included the gross X. And the Jeng brothers and his partner Zach Brisco of like an under 21 team playing the junior world championships that took place in, in August of, uh, of 2012.

[00:24:30] So yeah, that's the focal point of the film. Where are these, uh, world World Championships? It was in, uh, in Ta song China, which is about two hours from Shanghai. And this is a, like a, 

[00:24:43] Greg Hinze: a really long tournament, right? With a big round robin phase and everything similar to like 

[00:24:47] John McAllister: the B removal. Yeah, there was, uh, I think there was 17 teams in their, in their division, and you play all 16 other teams and then you have, uh, full day knockout matches.

[00:24:59] And the finals actually a day and a half. So it was 12 days, 12 days of filming that we were 12 days of play. So you 

[00:25:07] Greg Hinze: took a lot of this footage and you, you made it, made a movie of it. And, uh, you're trying to, uh, attract some young people. That's, uh, that's really nice. So, uh, the Gross Act also in this, uh, movie, they've done really phenomenal since then as well.

[00:25:22] So they've, uh, really had quite a lot of success together and, and even, uh, part and, uh, particularly Zach Groza, uh, just recently cover the Bulletin for winning a Player of the Year. Um, so what. Think about how that is gonna impact the movie. You know, like cuz Zach is in this movie and then now here he is proving himself again later.

[00:25:45] You know? I mean, what do you think? 

[00:25:47] John McAllister: What are your thoughts on that? So the movie's now freely available on pbs.org. If you search for Double Dummy, it'll come up. You can watch it anywhere in the world. It's not geo blocked, obviously, as a filmmaker to have for the, the kids team in the tournament itself.

[00:26:06] The way that went down was really great for us. I don't wanna spoil it for anybody. We can't. We can't, don't worry. I'm not, I'm not gonna spoil it. But it was really a great event from the kid standpoint. And then when I originally Adam Kaplan was like, Zach has really turned into what I hoped Adam Kaplan would, would become.

[00:26:26] I didn't even know Zach before we got to China and. I was hoping that Adam Kaplan would be the next Jeff Max Troth. Really? And Zach has really, I mean, you know, as you said, like he's player of the year. Like, you know, that's, I mean, 

[00:26:45] Greg Hinze: it's such a young age. I mean, uh, just really such a great 

[00:26:48] John McAllister: accomplishment.

[00:26:48] Yeah. But it's hard. Like it, one of the things about this film is we send an email out to everybody that is on like a board, like a unit board. Or a district board or that owns a club, or is it a member of the A P T A and I probably got like 20 emails back from, you know, maybe, I don't know how, I don't even know how many emails that was that we sent out.

[00:27:13] So if like getting people to actually pay attention to the film is challenging and I'm really grateful that it's on P B s. So it's airing on specific P B S stations. And you can find that on our website, doubled dummy movie.com, but it's also freely available. I'm just glad that it's like that we have this p b s distribution arm cuz, you know, having spent 11 years working on this project, I just want people to see it.

[00:27:42] I want, and it, it, it's beyond me at this point. And hopefully it'll be me. It'll, there'll be a meaningful impact. You know, like, uh, there was a post on bridge winners today by somebody talking about the Nebraska airtime. It's, it's, but it's been frustrating, like doing this and not always feeling like people are taking, you know, taking the reigns like, of the film.

[00:28:08] So, uh, 

[00:28:10] Greg Hinze: I remember many years I would always come up to you go like, how's the movie going? How's the movie going, , how's the movie going like year after year? And then, uh, to finally he, and then to finally get to, I saw, uh, you put, you did, uh, some kind of thing at a Nationals, I think where we aired it in.

[00:28:26] There was a group of people, I mean, I don't know, maybe 50 to a hundred people, something 

[00:28:30] John McAllister: in Toronto that was a longer version of the, this is actually a shorter version than if you ask my mother, she would say it's much better, which I agree with a 

[00:28:38] Greg Hinze: shorter version's better. Okay. I hadn't seen the new, I, I just saw the one, uh, at the, at the time, uh, where you put it.

[00:28:44] Uh, yeah. Okay. Toronto Nationals, I don't remember. So 11 years in the process. And, uh, podcast. Podcast now. So sometime, and now you're like, a movie wasn't, I'm going to also make a podcast. And is it, is it, is it the same type of a deal trying to draw a bridge into, to the world? Expand a bridge, or what, what's the reason for the, so the 

[00:29:06] John McAllister: original reason, rationale for the podcast was to spread the word about the movie, and then it just became fun.

[00:29:13] Like I, I enjoy the opportunity to have conversations like this. It's fun, it's challenging. It's a great way to share my passion for bridge. One consistent piece of feedback I've gotten though is from non-player that listen to the podcast is they don't really know what we're talking about. Like it's too high level bridge.

[00:29:33] There's too many specific 

[00:29:34] Greg Hinze: names of people and Yes. Like things that, uh, we take for granted. Like we talk about a Vanderbilt Yes. Or whatever, and they're like, what's the Vanderbilt? Yes. You know, something like that. 

[00:29:43] John McAllister: Yeah. I underst. And I've tried at points to, to be more inclusive and it's challenging. Like it's, it's definitely challenging and I don't necessarily wanna water it down.

[00:29:57] Like, uh, I enjoy the high level of it and we definitely have our fans, you know, like, I'm gonna give a shout out to, uh, one of your partners, Josh Dunn's dad, cliff. Is a regular listener. Hope you don't fall off your mountain bike when you hear this reference. Uh, we actually started doing a segment cuz Josh told me that Cliff listens to all the shows and then he, if Josh has ever mentioned, he'll send him a, a like thing from the transcript.

[00:30:26] And so we started doing a Cliff Don, where somebody had the Cliff don segment where somebody would tell a story about Josh. So my story about Josh, not that you asked. Was at my first nationals playing in the Vanderbilt for the first time, cuz Gavin suggested it. We, it was a three-way and we lost in the, uh, afternoon.

[00:30:49] So we were playing Josh Dunn's team in the evening and it was, I think Kit Wooey was on the team. Perhaps. I don't remember who Josh was playing with. I think Josh was playing with Roger Lee. And I remember thinking after the second segment that we won and they beat us by like 40 in that segment.

[00:31:25] Greg Hinze: So anyway, uh, yeah. So you had a lot of, you ended up having a lot of, uh, you know, great people on, uh, on your, your podcast, uh, you know, great players, uh, like, you know, or even early on you had like Chef Maroth and some. Who are your, some of your favorite, uh, episodes? Do you have standout episodes where it's just like, you know, wow, this is like, you know, bridge on a, on another level.

[00:31:48] Like, I just getting to know somebody this like, is 

[00:31:50] John McAllister: just like, I think the three people that come to mind are Gavin because it was the first one and I've been wanting to do the podcast for a long time, probably three years. And so when I actually recorded the conversation, I thought, wow, this is, you know, it was just cool to actually finally do it.

[00:32:07] And he tells a great story about ducking with King in one offside, and I mean, that was just why I wanted to do it. And then Hammond, you know, probably the most recognizable bridge name and then troth because he just was great. Like he told great stories and. You know, Jeff has really, uh, helped me become a, like, get more out of my bridge ability by challenging me to, to be a better player.

[00:32:41] And, uh, so Jeff is always a very, uh, 

[00:32:47] Greg Hinze: like fierce competitor. I mean, he is like, yes, I mean, but he's always so friendly and helpful away from the game as well, you know, but. He is, uh, always at the table. It's like nothing. He doesn't miss anything. He is never phased. It's just like, how, how does this guy ever, never do anything wrong?

[00:33:03] John McAllister: he was my partner for a regional last year in Hilton Head and at Fir it went from like being elated that I'm playing with Jeff Maxy. And so frustrated with him cuz he was frustrated with me and it took me a while. I was driving back to Virginia after the second day we played together, and I was listening to these podcasts and I thought, man, this, you know, eventually it got through to me that the reason that he was upset with me is I wasn't getting the best outta myself.

[00:33:32] And that led me to have my best year of bridge ever last year, which, uh, yeah, was a really, really good 

[00:33:38] Greg Hinze: year. Capping it off. still, you still see you glowing, . Yeah. Uh, okay. Well, uh, some of your other favorite bridge 

[00:33:48] John McAllister: memories. Well, I'll tell a story. So, I played my first World championships in Sonya in 2014, and the way that I ended up doing that was Christina Lund Madson had emailed me and she said that her and Dennis Bilda, who's one of the, you know, great players, great young players, uh, in the world, they were looking for a partners for the mixed teams.

[00:34:14] and that sounded like fun. I really liked Christina. I didn't know much about her, her playing, uh, but I knew Dennis was a really like a rising star, and so I needed to have a female partner. I said, I don't have a female partner, and she suggested mre, uh, MRE Campanile who's, who's also been a guest on the show.

[00:34:37] And I remember when, when mcg. So I went up and met her in New York City. We had lunch on her birthday and we hit it off and we're like, let's do this. And, and then I remember when we talked on the phone or we tried to talk on the phone for the first time. Riss originally from, uh, well she immigrated Israel, but she's originally from Romania.

[00:34:56] And I remember I couldn't understand her and I was like, I don't think this is gonna work. . So, uh, are you speaking English? Miri introduced me to a lot of her friends. . I think just, that's one of the things about Bridge is like, it's, it's kind of a strange dynamic because we're playing against the other people.

[00:35:19] So there are more often than not, you know, people are your opponent, but at the same time there's a lot of, there's a lot of kinship and, you know, spirit and, uh, You know, like for example, you congratulating me in, in Phoenix for winning the national, for winning the event. Like so many people were so excited for, for me.

[00:35:41] And, uh, 

[00:35:43] Greg Hinze: yeah, it, it, it's nice. I mean, uh, yeah, it's a lot of camaraderie, you know, it's, it's bitter competition at the table, but then away from it at the parties at night or whatever afterwards, you know, the drinking at the bars and going over the hands and so, Speaking of hands that you're like most 

[00:36:03] John McAllister: nightmare hand ever.

[00:36:04] Uh, well, there was a hand at the, I played in the mixed world championships this year with, uh, Olivia Sheen as my partner and we were playing in the Paris. We didn't make it to the, uh, heads up matches for teams when we're playing in the pairs. And I had like, uh, a six of diamonds. Queen 10, double 10 of clubs, Jack, fourth of hearts.

[00:36:33] So I had ace, queen jack, six of diamonds, queen 10, double 10 jack, fourth of hearts. So they opened a, I was fourth and they opened a Polish club on my right and every, nobody's vulnerable. So I bid three diamonds and it goes, What happened? I forget what happened, but they got to seven eventually, lefty did six hearts.

[00:37:00] So Polish Club, you don't get, it's like a strong club in that you don't reveal your suit at first, or the fact that you, so I, I didn't have Jack fourth of hearts. I had, I had like 10, I think I had ten fourth of Harvey anyway now. So now the guy bids five hearts, then lefty bids six hearts, and then they bid seven.

[00:37:22] and I'm kind of rooting for them to bid Seven Hearts . So I lead the ace of diamonds cuz I'm thinking, you know, there's no way that they're bidding this grand slam with the king of diamonds. You know, they're not valuing that. But lo and behold, lefty had King Fourth of Diamonds, . So now declare has a chance to make it.

[00:37:44] And I'm like, shit. I was rooting for that and now I'm get about to get burned. So Dummy had Ace start of clubs and declare had King Jack nine fourth, and if they, so I'm like, am I gonna play the Queen of Clubs on the first round of clubs? So he drew Trumps and now he plays. I think I had three Trumps. I don't know I'm telling the story terribly, but he, on the first round of clubs, he plays club to the Ace and I played the Queen

[00:38:18] And now 

[00:38:20] Greg Hinze: did he have like nine of 'em and 

[00:38:21] John McAllister: now he played No, no. It actually worked. He played, he played back and he thought, and he thought, now I played the nine and I won the 10. I was like, yeah. So it went from being a nightmare to. It was all, both your nightmare and your 

[00:38:36] Greg Hinze: first favorite hand All. Yeah.

[00:38:39] John McAllister: Yeah. Nightmare hands. I mean so many nightmare hands. I remember a hand mire in the world championships. We were on the verge of qualifying for the finals of the world pairs in 2014. My first world championship, the World Bridge Series, and there was a hand where I had like, uh, king in one sp. and we had a two over one auction and then she bid two.

[00:39:03] No. And now I just bid three. No, cuz you know, that was just the right thing to do. And they lead a spade through my king and it goes queen. And then the, and then my lefty plays the ACEs spades and mires. Jack Doubleton comes. Now they got the whole space suit and I'm like, God damn it nigger, why are you hogging the hand?

[00:39:30] Oh, . 

[00:39:31] Greg Hinze: That's funny. Funny. So, uh, most important bridge convention if 

[00:39:37] John McAllister: you can only have one. Oh, wow. Probably negative double. I think. Uh, I played in London, used to talk about the bridge in the Menagerie series. I played rubber bridge for the first time over there and I felt like I was a character. I felt like I was in that.

[00:39:52] when I was play. Which one were you? Well, I wasn't nec, I just felt like I, I didn't have a character myself, but I just felt like I was like playing with the characters in that book. And we, they don't let you play negative doubles there. They don't let you play. Don't 

[00:40:07] Greg Hinze: they all play like usually the same?

[00:40:08] Everybody plays the same thing 

[00:40:09] John McAllister: like that. They don't play, they don't. You play Roman keycard. You can only, you can't find out about the King of Trump or the queen of Queen of Trump. Bobby, uh, Wolf was 

[00:40:20] Greg Hinze: a big, uh, advocator of, uh, not playing key card. He wouldn't mind being on, uh, in a slam on the finesse of the King of Trump.

[00:40:28] So he would always know, although you may know you're off a key card, he would know that it was the king cuz he would know about the number of ACEs cuz he didn't count the king as a key card, counted that later in the Kings or whatever. So, so he would know that he would be on a finesse and he wouldn't mind.

[00:40:46] Is it better than like, being there and like, oh, am I off the Ace ? It's not even on the Finesse, it's off the Ace. You lose the Ace . 

[00:40:54] John McAllister: Is he someone that's been a mentor to you? Like I know he is from Texas. I think we got to play with Bobby one 

[00:40:59] Greg Hinze: time and uh, I just remember that was like we, we, we wrote down like four things on the commissioner.

[00:41:04] We had those, uh, the white com, the old fashioned white convention card. I think we wrote down like four things, like 15, 17 real big with transfer or something, and. We wrote down, you know, ACE asking, it was like not, it was not . We, and we wrote down carding or something. And, uh, so we, we played, uh, we played that one time.

[00:41:24] And, uh, I played as a teammate of his, uh, a few times. He had some, uh, of his regular older partners, uh, that he played with some, some long ago. And, and I played against him many times from, uh, the area that I was playing in. Uh, I think he eventually moved to Vegas and, uh, I don't 

[00:41:43] John McAllister: dunno what's happening. I don't even know.

[00:41:44] I, I'm sure I've played against him, but not, uh, I only have a couple more questions by the way. I just, who, I wanna say that Greg sent me a full list of questions, including like, the best hand. I, I don't know if the best hand was in there, but I wanted to be spontaneous. It would've been something like the best hand would've been good to think, or worst hand would've been good to think.

[00:42:05] Before, uh, but you did send me like a full list. Yeah, that one. 

[00:42:08] Greg Hinze: I, I, I'm not even sure I included that. I did throw, I, I did have some questions that it weren't on your list that I asked you. So anyway, like this one who's faster, you or Justin Law, 

[00:42:21] John McAllister: were you at that tournament? No, but I heard about it. So you're referring to at the Williamsburg Regional some years ago.

[00:42:31] We had a, a race in the hotel conference area and it was probably a 50 yard dash and Justin smoked me . Sad but true. 

[00:42:46] Greg Hinze: And question from my wife. You like pineapple on your 

[00:42:51] John McAllister: pizza? I used to like a Hawaiian pizza. I used to, that used to be on my order, but, uh, it's been a while. Why? Why is your wife asking? I don't know.

[00:43:02] She 

[00:43:02] Greg Hinze: knew I was gonna be doing this interview and, uh, she just thought, uh, that was a, some silly question. Thought I would ask. 

[00:43:11] John McAllister: You can cut back out , cut out the pineapple pizza, . You got it. 

[00:43:18] Greg Hinze: Anyway, I don't, I don't have anything else. Okay. John, I going through my list of questions. 

[00:43:25] John McAllister: How, what do you, what is your setup there?

[00:43:27] Do you have like a sheet of paper with all the questions on 'em? Do you have 'em like, uh, yeah, I, 

[00:43:32] Greg Hinze: I, I'm looking at my little questions here. Yeah. And then some of 'em, you know, I had to skip over cuz you kind of covered them already. You know, they were gonna be questions, but That's okay. I mean, that's great.

[00:43:42] You know, it's great. I don't have to ask questions. You just knew what I was gonna ask you. Well. As if you knew, like, so somebody may have fed you the questions. 

[00:43:50] John McAllister: No, he did, but I mean, I really appreciate it. When I saw that list of questions, I wasn't sure if you were like, how committed you were to it and if, what if it was more like me saying, oh, you know, you offered to do this, but maybe, anyway, when I got that list of questions from you, I was really, it really touched me like that you were.

[00:44:08] You were thinking about it so much. Well, I'm glad. 

[00:44:10] Greg Hinze: I mean, this went, I, I was a little nervous about how this may go cuz it's, you know, not so easy to just, to be, you know, talking and you're, you're used to it. I'm, I'm not, I'm not so used to it. . 

[00:44:21] John McAllister: It's funny how I'm used to it. It's funny how it's something that is so natural just to do.

[00:44:28] Like me and you, for me and you to talk, but then when it becomes a Yeah, that's what made it 

[00:44:33] Greg Hinze: easy for me. Cuz I mean, you know, we're looking at each other on the camera or whatever, so we can see each other and it's just like, to me, it's not like really doing an interview at all. I mean, you know, it's more like just talking to a friend, you know, just like, tell me more about you tell me something.

[00:44:47] John McAllister: Didn't know. Mm-hmm. , what was the most surprising? Like, what was the depth? What was the depth? Can you. Is there a way for you to explain the depths of the research that you did or ? Like what the depths, what do you think was like the most down a rabbit hole you went? I didn't 

[00:45:06] Greg Hinze: go that far, really. I was like, uh, you know, I, I, I, I just, yeah.

[00:45:11] I found your police profiles and your mugshot. That, that was, that was the most surprising to me was when I found your mug. 

[00:45:21] John McAllister: I have never been arrested, by the way, for all my loyal listeners out there. I, I have not. Well, they should take that off 

[00:45:28] Greg Hinze: the internet 

[00:45:28] John McAllister: then, . Um, well, thank you. No, I, 

[00:45:32] Greg Hinze: I, I, I, seriously, I, I didn't, I didn't do that much research.

[00:45:35] Um, and you know, I mean, just, I, I, I know a lot about you already, , you're a great guy and, and a lot of people, a lot of people know a lot about you. 

[00:45:46] John McAllister: Well, it's, it is, it is. I'm flattered and I really appreciate it and, uh, thank you so much. Oh, you're 

[00:45:52] Greg Hinze: quite welcome. And, uh, yeah, thanks. Thanks for having me once more.

[00:45:57] I really enjoyed it. We'll see you again on the circuit. 

[00:46:00] John McAllister: Are you playing any tournaments next nationals? I, so here's your, here's your team. The next national. I've got some possibilities out there, but nothing is confirmed. Yeah. Okay, well, the intrigue, we'll see you there in New Orleans. We're going though, for sure, right?

[00:46:15] Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. No, I'm definitely playing. You playing with Vinnie or, I don't think so. You don't know? They, nothing's 

[00:46:21] Greg Hinze: confirmed. Okay. 

[00:46:24] John McAllister: All right, man. I'll see you in New Orleans. I'm, I'm actually playing in the North American Paris. Are you gonna be there for that? No. No. Have you won that 

[00:46:33] Greg Hinze: Platinum Pierce?

[00:46:34] No. I've, I've, I. I think I only entered one time to the national level. We made it and we got knocked out first day or something. What 

[00:46:45] John McAllister: was your first national win? Yeah. I've never done well in that event. 

[00:46:48] Greg Hinze: My first national win was in New Orleans where we're going now, and in 2004 we won the North American Swiss, but that was in the fall of 2004.

[00:47:00] This is spring of 

[00:47:01] John McAllister: 2020, whatever. Had you been close before that? 

[00:47:06] Greg Hinze: I was fourth in the LMS once, uh, before that, the three day LM pair, like basically lost in the last round. Mm-hmm. , , it was pretty 

[00:47:17] John McAllister: close. Who is your partner? 

[00:47:20] Greg Hinze: Uh, guy with, uh, I don't play with him, haven't play with him long time, but Nagi came out from, uh, he's from Texas also.

[00:47:28] He's one of my original players that I used to play with learning back in the day. Played a lot of bridge with. But not, not so much. In the last 15 

[00:47:36] John McAllister: years, if you could, if you could teach bridge to one person on the planet, who would it be to teach to one person on the planet? You got to choose your bridge student.

[00:47:47] Who would it be? 

[00:47:49] Greg Hinze: Yeah, it would be like he's my, yeah, so like somebody famous, like, uh, I don't know, maybe, uh, yeah, I don't know. That's too tough of a question. Something like famous actor 

[00:47:58] John McAllister: or something. That would be pretty cool. All right, well you gotta gimme an answer in New Orleans. Okay, I'll give you an answer.

[00:48:03] New Orleans, 

[00:48:03] Greg Hinze: um, he put me on the spot 

[00:48:05] John McAllister: now. All right, man. Thanks.

Resources

Connect with John

LinkedIn - linkedin.com/in/johnmca/ 

Website - thesettingtrick.com/ 

Book by John Carruthers

Bridge with Another Perfect Partner – 

goodreads.com/book/show/60495965-bridge-with-another-perfect-partner 

Book by S.J. Simon

Why You Lose at Bridge – 

goodreads.com/en/book/show/1141603 

Movie - Double Dummy

imdb.com/title/tt3531224/ 

doubledummymovie.com/ 

This week's episode of the Setting Trick podcast features Kevin Rosenberg, a professional bridge player, and a full-time software engineer. Kevin comes from a family of professional bridge players, with Debbie and Michael Rosenberg as his mother and father. Kevin won the Soloway Knockout Teams in Phoenix and he also earned second place in the Reisinger at the Fall 2022 Phoenix NABC. He is a multi-time winner of the Youth World Open Championships (2022 Salsomagiorre, 2019 Opatija, 2017 Lyon). In this episode, we discussed getting stars from BBO, teaching bridge for beginners, Kevin's thoughts on having parents who are world-class bridge players, impressive partnerships that Kevin came across, and more.

[02:12] BBO Star – Starting the conversation, Kevin shares how he got a star on Bridge Base Online (BBO). 
[13:42] Teaching Bridge – Kevin explains what he mostly focuses on when he teaches bridge. Further, he shares why engagement among beginners is not a huge issue in bridge playing. 
[33:35] Junior Trials – Kevin started junior trials in 2014. He shares some of his junior trial experiences with us. 
[45:46] Experiences in Australia – Kevin shares why he likes Australia and how he met a lot of bridge players while he was there. 
[57:11] Impressive Partnerships – We discuss Kevin's most impressive partnership that he played against in the recent bridge tournament. 

Connect with Kevin

bridgewinners.com/profile/kevin-rosenberg

My guest is Simon de Wijs from the Netherlands. Simon has a great bridge resume. He has won the Bermuda Bowl, the Olympiad, the mixed World Championship, and multiple European championships. He is a mainstay on the Dutch national team, always one of the favorites in open competition.

At the recent Louisville NABC, Simon showed up with his twin 19-year-old daughters, who are budding experts. Find out how his relationship with them has changed since they got the bridge bug (by the way they made the Dutch mixed team for the upcoming European championships).

Recently at the NABCs, Simon has been playing on the Goodman team. They are one of the hottest teams in the world, having made it to the semifinals of the last two Vanderbilts and the last Soloway. 

This episode of The Setting Trick: Conversations with World-Class Bridge Players features John Kranyak. John is a professional Bridge and Poker player from the United States of America. He is a highly accomplished and respected member of the Spectre team, widely considered one of the bridge community's most successful and competitive teams. John's skill and expertise in the bridge are matched only by his exceptional character and integrity. In this episode, we shared several experiences that we had gained from competing in tournaments, playing with a number of other players, and accumulating the most memorable memories, along with the wonderful learnings and experiences that we had gained. 

[00:40] Background – John fills us in on what's new in his life, including details about his family and what it's like for him to be in a new city. 

[05:00] Regionals -  Will the current trend in regionals is going to continue, or are people starting to return? 

[11:32] Memories – John reflects on playing against the Swiss team and some of the interesting memories.

[22:06] Changes in Bridge -  John discusses the changes in the world of bridge. He elaborates on the most underappreciated aspect of the game.

[47:31] Levels of Players -  What is the most critical factor separating top-level players from those who are not top-level?

Resources:

Connect with John:
bridgewinners.com/profile/john-kranyak/
bridgeinstructors.com/profile/30/info

"The secret to winning a world championship is great teammates, a good partnership, and good team spirit." 

Kitty Munson Cooper is a bridge blogger, genetic genealogist and world-champion bridge player. She has won eight North American Bridge Championships and the Venice Cup in 1989. She currently lives in San Diego, CA. Today we talked about her background, the secret to winning world championships, sexism in bridge, and more. 

Kitty has won NABCs with two different husbands. Playing with someone close to you is a different feeling; they see what you don't see, and you see what they don't see. 

[18.26] 1987 – forcing her way onto the British ladies' team in the 1987 European championships. 

[23.11] The dream team – winning a world championship with the help of a good partnership between teammates. 

[27.35] The keys – Willing to play up, having a good partnership, and having the killer instinct are the keys to having success in open bridge for women. 

[35.50] Stories about playing with the great players in the old days. 

[42.02] Teaching bridge – talks about how satisfying it can be to teach kids bridge and designing a beginner curriculum. 

[47.03] The 70s – walks us through the story of meeting her late husband in the 70s, then re-meeting and marrying him in 2000.

[51.49] Thoughts on what makes a serious partnership.   

[57.39] Playing with your spouse – the difficulty of playing bridge when emotions get involved. 

Resources

Connect with Kitty

LinkedIn - linkedin.com/in/kittycooper/ 

Website - openskywebdesign.com/ 

                blog.kittycooper.com/ 

                bridgeteaching.com/ 

Twitter - twitter.com/openskyweb 

Today I have an abbreviated conversation with my good friend Joe Grew, who is one of the best bridge players in the world. This is my first in-person conversation and it took place at Congressional Country Club in September.  It got cut short because, frankly we had to get on the tee!

Susan Morse is my kind of person, well humored and a lover of bridge. In one of her Bridge Bulletin articles she introduced me to the concept of the Bridge Base Online "hamburger". This conversation came about based on a chance encounter at the Austin NABC. We've since gone on to break bread during the Hilton Head regional. In a just completed phone conversation Susan tells me she will talk to her team about playing the Spingold for the first time in Providence.

Episode highlights:

1:10- 'Good Evening Memphis'

14:55- How she began playing bridge

25:00- The all-too-familiar story of frantically pursuing masterpoints

48:35- New bridge book coming out soon?

53:10- The awe of meeting Meckstroth

1:03:27- The Migry (TST Guest #3) Hand

1:16:56- The tables are flipped and John gets interviewed

1:27:34- The Cardturner movie???

Returning from my hiatus, I am pleased to welcome Milan Macura to kick off our next season on The Setting Trick. Milan is a professional player and teacher. He is also a Youtube streamer and was previously president of the Czech Bridge Federation.. 

In 2009, through a series of amazing, fortunate events, Milan won the 1st World Youth Congress. Listen for the full story!

Milan Macura's Youtube Channel

Episode highlights:

5:06- His pathway in becoming a streamer

13:25- The story behind his improbable win in the 1st World Youth Congress

19:30- Milan can't be intimidated

26:05- "Full-service pro"

28:47- How Milan learned bridge

37:58- Youth bridge

48:55- Streaming details

52:08- Blue shirt red shirt

59:40- Milan loves playing bridge on tablets

1:05:25- Celebrating the World Youth Congress victory

We have saved today's guest to appear once the next in-person Nationals loomed near. Meet Jenni Carmichael, our first tournament director on the show and spouse of TST Guest #24 Tom Carmichael. A fine storyteller, Jenni finds the humor and draws out the drama.  

Episode Highlights:

1:20- Chances of Austin Nationals happening

5:23- Requirements to become a director

11:15- 3SXX making is clearly an average board

15:00- "I just have four cards left to play"

17:05- How Jenny got into directing

24:00- "The only law we care about is God's law"

28:46- "Does he have his bid?"

40:44- Bridge camps

46:30- Mixed Pair stories of absurd scores, intense pressure, and momentum

53:26- If no Greg, maybe no Double Dummy

55:20- Jenni once held a long grudge against her current director idol

1:11:12- It is useless to psych against Jenni

1:14:13- But her psychs are deadly

The Rimstedt family of Sweden is among the strongest bridge-playing families of all-time. Twins Mikael and Ola are the youngest players ever to win the World Pairs, and their sister Cecilia won the 2019 Venice Cup, sadly with their sister Sandra no longer on the team after having emigrated to the US. Today we have the pleasure of speaking to Mikael and Ola. In addition to being my friends and I've even been lucky enough to have them on my team on occasion.

Watch the video version here: https://john-mcallister-s52b.squarespace.com/episode-44-ola-and-mikael-rimstedt

Episode Highlights:

7:35- Mikael and Ola almost didn't play in the world pairs they ended up winning

13:17- How Mikael got angry at Ola on a board where their side got a complete top late in the finals of the World Pairs

18:02- Rim job on Vugraph

20:12- Making the Swedish Open team

34:42- Rimstedt brothers better than the Grossack brothers???

38:48- Why they split and came back together

46:12- Their dad previously played for Sweden

1:04:28- How Ola and Mikael got into bridge

1:12:08- Dating status

We are informally designating Susan Bricken as the Chief Enthusiasm Officer for the ACBL Educational Foundation's new program, BridgeWhiz. We hope she'll be an inspiration to all who want young people to learn the game. After finishing this episode, make sure to tell three people about BridgeWhiz, and feel free to copy me at john@thesettingtrick.com! To date 1,250+ students have signed up.

WATCH THE VIDEO VERSION HERE: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxAmqb_pKWw&t=3s

Episode Highlights:

0:50- BridgeWhiz details

6:48- The bridge version of Queen's Gambit

13:45- Immediately jumping into the deep end

20:20- Learning bridge from TST Guest 41 Robert Todd

23:08- Never play bridge with your spouse??

25:00- Doubling the size of her local bridge club

31:10- The interviewee becomes the interviewer

32:50- The history of Double Dummy

45:25- Saving Lives Susan

50:10- Swimming Susan

Shan Huang (technically Huang Shan) is a budding bridge legend. His frequent successes at tournaments earned him multiple Richmond trophies, the Canadian masterpoint race, before he immigrated to the US' greener bridge pastures. He is in a formidable partnership with Floridian Kevin Dwyer.

Link to Video Version: https://youtu.be/yAMvFrjPfp0

Episode Highlights:

1:40- Huang Shan

11:33- Why Shan moved from Canada to USA

19:30- His experience at a Chinese monastery

24:10- Descriptions of Justin Lall (RIP)

28:45- How Shan's partnership with Kevin Dwyer came to be

32:35- The power of preempts against precision players

35:30- The biggest advantage of strong club systems

41:45- Shan's mentors

49:54- A tragic hand

1:02:45- Another minus 1660 hand that costed John $1600+

1:07:27- Who does Shan most want to partner with?

1:13:22- How rating bridge hands is like rating peoples' attractiveness

1:19:00- Shan hates squealing

Robert Todd is becoming a force in the bridge teaching world and has been called "the next generation of great bridge instructor and entertainer." Having taught in 48 States, lectured at countless regionals, nationals, and cruises, Robert is following the path of his mentors Audrey Grant, Larry Cohen, or Barbara Seagram—some of the world's most renowned bridge teachers.

Besides teaching professionally, Robert is heavily involved in promoting youth bridge. Using his knowledge and expertise as a top-tiered educator, Robert is helping spearhead the new ACBL Education Foundation program, Bridge Whiz. If your child is interested in learning bridge online, this 20-week long class is perfect for their needs! Learn more here.

WATCH THE VIDEO VERSION ON YOUTUBE: https://youtu.be/5SKv693j0L0

Episode Highlights:

1:20- The history of the ACBL Education Foundation 

5:50- How to make learning bridge enjoyable

7:15- Robert's teaching style and method

11:57- ACBLEDF peddling Tricky Bridge

15:10- Robert was brainwashed into loving bridge

• His unique upbringing in the social bridge community influences his perspectives

22:05- Robert led a study to discover how many bridge players there are in America

27:05- Why the ACBL Education Foundation's goal is different than the ACBL's

32:35- Different bridge-playing communities

35:59- Professional teaching administrative details

43:52- Professional bridge and promoting bridge

50:53- Funny stories about TST Episode #31, Adam Kaplan

1:00:32- Robert's analysis on the Meckwell partnership

1:02:44- The administrative thinking behind BridgeWhiz

Today my guest is Brian Platnick. He's a world champion (1991 World Junior Teams and 2010 Rosenblum Cup) with six NABC+ titles, including two Spingold wins (2010, 2017) and a victory in the Blue Ribbon Pairs (2012).

Brian is a perfect example of what inspires this podcast: the opportunity to have longer-form conversations with fascinating bridge players. The genesis for this episode was getting eliminated from the United States Bridge Championships, by Brian's team, for the second year in a row. I had too much fun talking with Brian and wasn't focused enough on winning!

If you've ever wondered if you're a world-class player, Brian has a formula for deciding (Hint, I'm not.) He also speaks candidly about where he sees himself amongst some of the best in the game. 

We talk about EDGAR (Everyone Deserves a Game Above Reproach), the anti-cheating software that he and Franco Baseggio have created that is now in use, testing an incredible number of online deals.

Anyone who likes hearing me laugh will greatly enjoy this episode. Brian kept cracking me up!

Ever since my conversation with Jeff Meckstroth, I began asking a standard question to Setting Trick guests, "are you better than (Jacek) Kalita?" It was a fun or tough question, depending on the guest, which got a wide variety of responses in spite of Jacek being ranked 2nd in the World Bridge Federation's rankings.

Hailing from Poland, Jacek is our first European based guest. Astute listeners will have noticed that I stopped asking the are you better than question when Jacek's partner Michal Nowosadzki confessed to self-kibitizing in multiple online events last year. The partner with whom Jacek won two Bermuda Bowls and also his good friend.

Find out what Jacek had to say about all of that and see his fine sense of humor for yourself.

Episode highlights:

3:58- Are you better than Kalita???

6:35- Michal Nowosadzki (Kalita's partner) cheating case

10:04- The aftermath reaction

15:00- Kalita's pathway to becoming a professional

23:35- When a frequent opponent becomes a partner

27:40- For the system nuts

31:50- Why Kalita is pro-kibitzing

36:20- The secret sauce behind Kalita and Nowosadzki constant success

41:00- Bridge and traveling the world

44:20- When Kalita got to play with his childhood bridge heroes

46:15- Kalita's former client helped create the stock market in Poland!

50:28- Kalita's family and bridge

53:35- Michal Klukowski and Kalita

In 2017, there was no bridge club at the University of California, Santa Barbara. Then Andrew Rowberg, a recent PhD graduate in computational material science, came along. Four years later, during which bribery cookies were baked, practice sessions held, and talent developed, the UCSB Overbidders Anonymous emerged victorious in the 2021 Online North American Collegiate Bridge Championships. We're excited to showcase the journey that this UCSB team took from having nothing to winning it all.

Episode Highlights:

2:40- The formation of the UCSB Bridge Club

4:05- How Danning learned bridge

5:34- The pieces of the champion team

12:20- COVID can't stop dedicated college students

13:42- Defeating TST Guest 32 Richard Jeng the Georgia Tech bridge giants

19:10- Freshman clutching it up in the wild Finals match

23:29- Andrew's teaching philosophy

28:00- Now is your perfect chance to hire a collegiate champion with a PhD in computational material science!

33:07- The overbidders in "Overbidders Anonymous" are no longer anonymous

39:30- The universally dreaded Berkeley monsters

45:35- Proof that playing bridge increases your job prospects

48:10- Danning plays the precise system and likes to take fitness

51:23- The expert's advice on forming a collegiate championship team

56:00- The secret ingredient in bridge success: sugar

Our first ever sponsor to be featured on The Setting Trick is Mike Levine. As many bridge players know, a match up against the Levine Team should be dreaded, unless one enjoys being demolished. In tow with his ultimate dream team, which includes two partnerships considered by many to be the greatest pairs of all time, Mike recently won the first 3 North American Online Bridge Championships in a row, a feat of absolute dominance.

In life, Mike Levine has somehow managed to top his massive successes at the bridge table; he is one of the world's most illustrious inventors, holding more than 60 patents. Through his shared insights on topics like population control, I got to see the creative force behind his many inventions. I am excited to share my conversation with this fascinating man.

Episode Highlights:

2:28- The progression to the inception of Mike Levine's current team

8:34- Mike isn't the weakest player on his team???

11:25- Mike's approach to bridge is understanding concepts logically, rather than memorizing

15:50- Mike's recipe analogy to bridge

18:10- Mike doesn't fully subscribe to the common wisdom for pros that "Your job is not to win. Your job is to not lose."

19:00- Why Mike is willing to spend so much money to hire top players

25:10- Why Mike's physical disability does not hinder him

29:04- The Lake Trail that Mike brought to existence

34:30- Mike's education

36:05- One of Mike's joke patents

39:52- Mike's solution to global warming: prevent overpopulation

44:05- More thoughts on population control

48:00- "All things complicated are not useful"

53:40- Is Stayman really a convention?

58:35- An example of Mike's "wonder bids"

1:03:15- Take a glimpse into Mike's mind as a bidding theoretician

We continue our popular series of "The Youngest Life Master" with long-ago former record holders Bill and Dough Hsieh, along with their older brother and inspiration David Hsieh. In this episode, they taught me just how much our game has changed. From the abolition of smoking at the table to masterpoint inflation, and to the resurgence of youth bridge, bridge has evolved. However, one thing continues to be the same: its power of leaving happy memories that survive over the span of decades.

Episode Highlights:

1:50- Be the once in a blue moon and pronounce their last name with "C"

4:05- How the Hsieh brothers got started on bridge

7:00- Imagine being interviewed by the local newspaper for every tournament you go to

7:55- 6-year-old-Doug's opponents thought Doug was a joke and refused to play

10:20- The masterpoints inflation is real

11:05- Bill's dad was the original engine behind his pursuit for the record

13:24- An unlucky split costed Doug beating the record by an additional 10 months

14:44- Bridge can consume you

15:48- The past versus the current state of youth bridge

18:50- The Hsieh brothers' current exposure with bridge

22:40- David's favorite partner

25:15- It was inevitable that Doug will beat Bill's record

26:50- Ron is a great role model!

30:35- The Hsieh brothers' influential mother

33:05- Back when everybody smoked at the bridge table

36:00- People still remember stories from Midnight Swisses that happened 40 years ago

40:15- Bridge opens up connections in the work place

In June of 2019, I asked now 17 year old Michael Xu to help me prepare for my interview with his bridge mentor/hero, Michael Rosenberg. This sparked his progression from The Setting Trick helper, to The Setting Trick intern, and finally to The Setting Trick guest.

One year after I first reached out, Michael co founded the Youth Bridge Association, a nonprofit organization based on the idea of youth teaching youth bridge. As co president, Michael has helped host multiple classes as well as a tournament that drew 140 juniors! 

Michael has generously agreed to share the below letter, which upon reading, Kevin Rosenberg, Michael Rosenberg's son said, "it sounds like you're trying to date my dad!"

Fabled "dating" email

Dear Michael,

A few months ago, when asked by my college counselor who would be the best person to write a letter of recommendation, the first and only person that came to mind was you. Before bridge, before SiVY, before you, I never thought I would come to identify so strongly with a community. If you asked me back then whether I believe that I will have such a robust relationship with a non-family member, I would have scoffed at that idea. Yet, over the span of 4 years, I have developed a truly extraordinary connection with you. From our first encounter in Toronto, to the first bombardment of emails, to the first in-real-life post mortem (@Atlanta), to the first dinner together (@Dennys), to the first time playing against you, to the first time hearing a "well-played" from your lips, and finally to the latest email, you have seen my growth from a completely clueless youngling to a now still slightly clueless and learning adolescent who knows some things.

Michael, you are the only one. You saw me at the Trials, going past midnight to review boards. You saw me at WuJiang, China, where even at the World Youth Team Championships, I was more preoccupied with learning than sleeping/eating. You saw me flood your inbox with emails, and when you think you answered them all, I 'rewarded' you with countless follow ups and more new emails. In short, you saw my relentless pursuit to learn, my unprecedented level of insanity, my unrestrained intellectual vitality. Throughout my journey, you were my ultimate mentor, answering my plethora of questions, elucidating mysteries, and even providing me with life advice. 

Given our lengthy, special history, I feel that you are unique in your capability to vouch for me. Genuine intellectual curiosity is highly coveted by colleges, and I think you are most suited to testify about that on my behalf. Just as you had strongly advocated for me back in 2018 for the U16 team, I hope you will be able to advocate for me for college.

Would you be willing to write me a strong and unique letter of recommendation for my college application? If you have any follow up questions or need any further information, please don't hesitate to let me know.

Sincerely,

Michael

Episode highlights:

1:50- Is YBA for college application resume stacking???

3:20- How the YBA came to be

4:40- YBA class details

14:00- YBA is about advanced youth players paying it forward and giving back to the community

19:15- Michael Xu = Michael 1(?)

23:10- How Michael came to partner Finn Kolesnik

25:50- The Setting Trick internship = ultimate girls attractor

30:35- Michael's work with Professor Samantha Punch and BAMSA research project

33:10- Michael Rosenberg gets bombarded by Michael Xu with thousands of emails full of questions 

36:50- MEAT and Kevin Test

39:30- Michael's attempt at dating Michael Rosenberg

46:20- How Michael learned bridge through SiVY

50:15- How listeners can help out the YBA

54:45- Michael is getting beat in the Life Master race by the younger SiVY generation

The third and possibly final episode of the Youngest Life Master series has touched down! In this episode, we caught up with four former youngest Life Masters: Joel Wooldrige, brothers Sam and Dan Hirschman, and Steven Cochran. Joel is now a world-class expert and is one of the world's best players. Sam and Dan continue to celebrate their former record with the annual "The Party". Steven was an absolutely wild teenager; he once woke up in the ocean while traveling across the country to play bridge, without his parents. At the age of 14. It really amazes me how different are the paths that people take!

Episode Highlights:

2:55- 11 year old Joel Wooldrige

3:55- How Joel learned to play bridge

5:25- How Sam Hirschman's father played a role in getting his son's record beaten

8:55- Joel was in the Guinness Book of World Records!

11:15- The real reason why Dan had to take back the YLM record for the Hirschman family

18:15- Sam and Dan Hirschman

20:30- Father Hirschman = Most Valuable Motivator

26:25- Sam was featured in Sports Illustrated magazine!

28:10- Bridge lost Dan to Magic: the Gathering

28:49- Dan was featured on the Leno show, the People Magazine, and NYT

32:19- The last times Sam and Dan can flex their former record

34:05- The annual "Dan Hirschman Youngest Life Master KO Teams" where 25 teams onced showed up to play at the Hirschman house

40:35- How Sam ended up on Sports Illustrated magazine

44:30- The decline of bridge's cultural relevance

46:50- Meet Steven Cochran

49:25- Steven learned bridge at NASA

52:35- Steven taught his entire college fraternity to play bridge

- 14 year old Steven spent a whole summer traveling US and Canada to play bridge

59:48- Steven excels at declaring

1:01:35- Unfortunately, Steven couldn't measure up for the attractive girl

1:02:35- Waking up in the ocean

1:07:40- Steven once was a professional soccer player

1:09:09- No fanfare for Steven becoming part of the first two-person ACBL Kings and Queens of Bridge

1:12:50- Played against a typical nobody: Omar Sharif

Andrew Robson is a giant, in both height and bridge; he is 6 feet 6 inches tall and has won a slew of titles, including back to back Reisingers in 1998 and 1999. On top of all his bridge accolades, he has met the Queen of England, received the prestigious "Other Buggers' Efforts" award, and survived a 100 foot fall.

If you want to learn more about Andrew and his bridge adventures, there is a great page on his website called Andrew's Life in Bridge, where I learned many of the stories I asked Andrew about today. 

COVID finally got Andrew to start presenting a daily video series, where I've learned a lot of card play nuances in the advanced section https://andrewrobsonbridgecast.com

Subscribers to The Setting Trick email list may access Andrew breaking down Adam Kaplan's play on a deal featured in Double Dummy here.

Episode Highlights:

1:42- A horrible accident that broke his legs

9:22- He's not a model student

12:27- Andrew's education

• Imagine doing worse on a test than a monkey would

15:37- The tournament that was vital to Andrew's confidence as a bridge player

18:52- A wildly successful psych

22:10- How Andrew met one of his partners, Rita Shugart

24:20- Andrew is an "Other Buggers' Efforts" award winner!

27:42- When your team sucks at losing IMPS

29:52- The pain of losing in the semi-finals of a Bermuda Bowl by 1 IMP and then losing again by 1 IMP in the third place playoff

31:37- Amazing bidding by Andrew and his partner, David Gold

• David Thompson's quote from Bridge Winners, "The video of auction is quite interesting: https://youtu.be/diMipYWGr3c?t=20293

The auction took 12 minutes including 3 minutes for the 7♦ bid and 5 minutes for David Gold's final pass. Whilst 7♦ was certainly a brilliant bid by Robson, Gold's pass was pretty impressive also having diagnosed the sorts of hands Robson could be holding and successfully determining the inferiority of a ♠ contract."

38:07- Andrew Robson Bridge Club

41:27- John's mother might have a crush on Andrew

45:12- The members of the popular rock band, Radiohead, went to Andrew's school!

49:07- The future of bridge and youth teaching

53:07- Andrew's memories of September 11, 2001

58:07- "Oh, you farted" ~Zia Mahmood

1:02:02- Andrew had to track Simon Stockten down in the Himalayas

Al Bender is an extraordinarily dedicated teacher for Bridge For Youth, a nonprofit organization that promotes youth bridge in the Seattle area. After the pandemic struck, Bridge For Youth and Al switched from a face-to-face teaching model to solely virtual instruction. He caught my attention through this Bridge Winners article on the benefits of teaching online. To say the article brightened my day would be a massive underbid. Read it! 

The most important takeaway from Al's experience is that virtual instruction is an incredibly effective teaching model. We want to see this model duplicated across the country!

Episode Highlights:

2:20- The many flaws of teaching face-to-face

4:25- Advantages to virtual teaching

5:05- Bridge For Youth's journey in learning how to teach online

7:55- How Bridge For Youth got a staggering 110 students

9:50- Interesting gender discrepancy

12:40- The power of the Shark Teaching Console

• "I no longer have to watch my partner make stupid mistakes"

16:10- Testmoz and the allure of competition

18:55- A serendipitous success

20:40- The dedicated student

23:40- Summer camp will be taught by former Setting Trick guest, Tom Carmichael

25:35- Collaboration to on youth tournaments

29:20- SharkBridge is free for teachers who teach youth bridge for free

30:05- Teachers must be good with youths

32:10- Bridge For Youth is in search for teachers!

37:50- The important thing is having FUN!

40:35- A big weakness is the lack of social interactions when using Shark Bridge

45:00- Al warns you to not use the word "kid"

47:00- Al wants to make a difference in his students' life

Meet Greg Hinze: Three time North American Bridge Champion, world champion and he also has a world class sense of humor! After first hearing there was such a thing as a professional bridge player, Greg made it his five year goal. He played a lot, read lots of books, practically went broke and now is a highly desired pro. 

Episode Highlights:

1:35- How Greg first decided to pursue his goal of becoming a professional

3:15- How Greg got hooked onto bridge

6:10- Greg and his poker job

7:55- How Greg quickly improved into an expert

9:40- Live bridge and RealBridge

12:50- Greg's favorite event

15:20- Reject those who rejected you

18:50- Strong club vs natural system

21:45- Greg's 2D opening system

24:10- Winning a world championship on a team formed the night before the event

26:50- Greg, his wife, and fun midnight knockout deal

29:30- Broke North American champion 

31:35- An interesting strategy to pick between two close calls and a happy accident

35:20- His prediction on the future of live bridge

40:50- "Swiss Master" ~ Justin Lall

43:55- Bridge connects

48:30- Greg's biggest bridge tip

At the age of 10 years and 43 days Adam Kaplan set the record as the American Contract Bridge League's youngest ever life master. A subsequent article in the ACBL Bridge Bulletin, commemorating Adam's achievement, inspired his successor Richard Jeng who broke Adam's record with ease at the age of 9 years, 6 months, and 12 days.

Both Richard and Adam are members of the USA1 Under 21 team whose journey in the 14th World Youth Team Championships we chronicle in Double Dummy. A film which Adam largely inspired. Here are two brief conversations about Richard and Adam's quest to become the youngest life master and what the title meant to them.

2:16- The event where Adam won his last needed masterpoints

4:04- Two club games per day—the dedication needed to get those masterpoints

6:39- The fame ensuing after his achievement

7:46- What the achievement means to him

9:14- "I was a terrible partner" ~ Adam

12:14- Adam's current level of bridge involvement

14:04- The story behind Adam's nickname

15:39- Adam's partner in Double Dummy

19:54- An optimistic grand bid by Adam

24:09- Adam's current career plans

26:30- Richard's first reaction on hearing about Andrew Chen's achievement

27:05- How Richard first started playing bridge

28:40- Richard's inspiration on becoming the Youngest Life Master

29:50- Richard's meeting up with the teen whose record he planned on beating

30:35- This record is meant to be broken!

31:35- Life Master is a title given only to those who mastered life

31:55- The event where Richard won his last needed master points

Today, we're debuting a new format called Event Review, where my partner and I get together and discuss some of the most amusing incidents and some of the best and worst plays from a recent event. It's going to be shorter than my typical long-form interview and also, hopefully, just kind of fun. 

I'm speaking with my partner for the District 6 Grand National Teams Qualifying sessions, Sophia Baldysz, a champion player from Poland with many medals in world events, and also my teammate from the 2023 NABC+ Mixed Swiss.

Our latest guest, Andrew Chen, is our youngest ever, by a lot! 8-year old Andrew is the ACBL's youngest ever Life Master, a feat many spend decades striving for. In May 2020, Andrew, at the age of eight years and three days, smashed the previous record holder's mark by more than a year. He also was the first to set the record since the requirements for being a Life Master moved from three hundred to five hundred Masterpoints.

All four members of Andrew's immediate family, his mother Sarah, his brother Charlie and his father Steve, are bridge players. He is also a product of Silicon Valley Youth Bridge, whose pizza parties are helping introduce many young people to the game. Steve also joins us, to whom Andrew gives a lot of credit for his amazing achievement.

Episode Highlights:

1:40- Andrew's favorite bridge player—and no, it's not his dad :)

4:20- Andrew enjoys punishing his opponents

6:43- How Andrew decided to pursue the youngest Life Master title

9:15- The players who helped Andrew in obtaining the title

12:35- A glimpse into Andrew's bidding system

14:34- Andrew the ambassador

16:35- How Andrew's parents met

17:05- How Andrew's family plays bridge.

19:15- Andrew doesn't neglect his reading

20:43- Video games that Andrew enjoy playing

22:35- Andrew's height

25:08- Andrew as the narrator for Double Dummy???

27:45- Andrew's language fluencies

Didn't get enough of Ronnie? He's back! Ron Smith returns to the show, bringing with him more hilarious stories.

Episode Highlights:

6:05- Ron's opinion on Real Bridge

12:30- When your teammates go for minus 4600 in 4Cxx down 8 so you lose 24 IMPS, but you still win the match

15:35- Ron learns from his teacher who went minus 5800.Twice

16:05- Story of the only person to win the Vanderbilt while also losing two matches in the same tournament

18:30- Never give up during a match

25:05- Bobby Levin is so good looking, his partner needs to play with his head down lest he loses his focus

28:40- More hilarious Baby Levin stories

34:40- Ron believes in the great joys of having the social connections through playing bridge

38:10- Speculations on the future of bridge—will things ever be the same again?

40:15- Mahaffrey stories

44:35- Peter Weichsel's most embarrassing moment

47:15- Reese stories

53:05- Ron's worst three hands

59:48- Leo Lasota: the world's greatest online player

1:03:05- Oren Kriegel is an upcoming super star

1:06:35- "Here comes the damn diamonds again" story

Among US Juniors, few adults' names are as well-recognized as Ron Smith. But don't let his title of "Honorary Junior" fool you; Ron began playing bridge back in the Roth Stone era, when he only would open the bidding with 14 points—3 points more than what he needs to open today. A true perennial all-star, Ron stands out for his work in fostering the rising young stars of our game. He's also a pretty entertaining and genuinely good natured fellow.

Episode Highlights:

1:50- Ron's mother used to think he was going to hell for playing bridge

3:40- Ron's sister = ultimate bridge wing-woman

5:15- How Ron became hooked on bridge

12:05- Seymon Deutsch could get away with anything

16:00- The legend of Zia Mahmood

21:30- "I've got a partner for you" = Bobby Levin

23:00- Don't cheat

32:20- Al Roth Stoned

36:55- A Justin Lall story

40:50- Ron + Juniors = win Midnight Zip KO

42:40- Ron is an honorary junior

44:30- How to get Bobby Levin to agree with your bidding

48:30- Bob Hamman's unique perspective on Justin Lall

52:10- Brad Moss bamboozled Joe Grue with a legendary psyche 

54:50- Ron believes in preempting aggressively when favorable

1:05:00- Edgar Kaplan and his diplomacy

1:14:40- Rubber bridge stories

1:23:40- "You're not playing for anything either?"

1:35:28- How Joe Grue got his nickname "Joe Boo"

While Scott Hoffer professes to be the worst player yet to appear on The Setting Trick, he caught my attention as the developer of an iOS app called Tricky Bridge. Presently only available on iPhones and iPads, Tricky Bridge has become my go to destination for anyone who is interested in learning the game. The ACBL Education Foundation helped make the app's series of 37 beginners lessons free. Hat's off to both the Ed Foundation and Scott, you've answered one of my prayers!

Episode Highlights:

2:00- Tricky Bridge and how it came to be

9:48- Tricky Bridge's retention rate with users

11:53- Apple's massive stamp of approval

• Contest - Who is the Apple Editor playing Tricky Bridge???

19:33- Scott's company Forklift Studios

• Meadowlark Bridge - Rodney Ludwig, the AI engine behind Tricky Bridge

21:18- Computer Bridge World Championships

26:03- Idea behind the Bots in Tricky Bridge

31:03- Grant from the ACBL Education Foundation founded the learning portion of the app

33:38- Please advertise the app to any young person interested in learning bridge

43:23- Thanks to BridgeWinners for helping provide feedback on bugs and crashes

48:43- Scott's ideas about the best way to stream bridge

50:03- Scott's acting career

50:46- Yale student, Reese Koppel, is a Tricky Bridge Intern

53:13- Robert Todd from ACBL Foundation

58:08- Double Dummy Film