Explore every episode of the podcast The Operations Room: A Podcast for COO’s
Dive into the complete episode list for The Operations Room: A Podcast for COO’s. Each episode is cataloged with detailed descriptions, making it easy to find and explore specific topics. Keep track of all episodes from your favorite podcast and never miss a moment of insightful content.
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Title
Pub. Date
Duration
49. How To Stop Your Company From Drowning In Information
27 Jun 2024
00:47:34
In this episode we discuss: the challenges of asynchronous communication in a remote-first organisation. We are joined by Jeremy Slater, COO at Bob W.
We chat about the following with Jeremy Slater:
How to do asynchronous communication well
Managing information overload
Why you need to invest in robust knowledge management -- hint: impacts customer service, operations, and scalability
After an extremely brief foray into finance in the US and the UK and a short stop in India to work for a solar energy social enterprise, Jereny spent the majority of his career in the heavily operational world of property management and hospitality. He’s helping Bob W become the most loved hospitality brand in Europe.
To learn more about Beth and Brandon or to find out about sponsorship opportunities click here.
Summary
The conversation delves into the challenges and strategies of knowledge management, asynchronous communication, and the use of specific tools within a company. It highlights the importance of knowledge management and the impact it has on various aspects of the business, including customer service, internal operations, and scalability.
Chapters:
Chapter 1: Knowledge management systems (0:00-10:27)
Chapter 2: Using tools like Notion and Slack (10:27-16:19)
Chapter 3: Information overload on Slack (16:19-21:12)
Chapter 4: Tips for using Slack productively (21:12-25:10)
A creative and commercial leader with an extensive career in high growth technology companies, e-commerce and marketplaces across UK and Europe. I started out my career as a screenwriter, living and working in Los Angeles. This was the foundation of my learning to connect stories with an audience. After a decade, I took that experience and returned to the UK to start a retail brand, Mungo & Maud. The first of its kind high end dog and cat accessory store with a physical shop in London and other major outlets around the world. Opened the online store in 2006 in the very early days of e-commerce. Following my exit, I continued my narrative thread into my role as International Multichannel Director at Etsy, helping to build and scale all International markets outside of North America. Following the IPO, I went back into startup as Chief Commercial Officer for eve Sleep, a disruptor in the sleep wellness space which I helped build and scale through to IPO. I now work as an Operating Partner for Forme Partners working with founders and CEO's across the European tech landscape, aiding them with their commercial hires at all stages of growth.
To learn more about Beth and Brandon or to find out about sponsorship opportunities click here.
Summary
Career goals, creativity, and personal growth. 0:05
Brandon and Bethany discuss their career goals and personal growth.
Bethany realizes she needs to take advantage of not working and prioritize personal development.
Bethany expresses frustration with lack of passion and purpose in her life, feeling unfulfilled despite various projects and hobbies.
She longs for a major project that consumes her and stirs her imagination, but nothing has yet emerged.
Effective storytelling and pacing in business presentations. 6:09
Brandon and Bethany discuss narrative structure in business context, focusing on conflict and pacing.
They emphasize the importance of actively listening to the audience and adjusting the narrative in real-time based on their reactions.
Bethany scripts an opening for high-stakes meetings to set the tone and manage nerves.
She tailors her approach based on the meeting's purpose and audience energy levels.
Public speaking, authenticity, and vulnerability. 11:21
Bethany uses narrative techniques to engage and motivate her team, including owning her energy and projecting enthusiasm.
She also practices or rehearses her delivery beforehand to ensure authenticity and effectiveness.
Bethany shares her approach to authenticity, vulnerability, and relatability in presentations, emphasizing the importance of self-discovery and confidence-building through therapy.
Brandon seeks advice on how to be more authentic in his presentations, with Bethany suggesting starting with self-work and building confidence before attempting to connect with audiences.
Brandon's son lied to fit in, but realized it didn't make him feel better or gain acceptance.
By sharing small truths, Brandon's son learned that his friends accept him for who he is, lies or not.
Storytelling and its importance in business leadership. 19:34
Brandon M. learns to connect with audiences by sharing personal stories living company values.
Jonathan: Conflict is necessary for business success, but resolution is key.
Bethany: Storytelling vs. narrative: both are important for communication and leadership.
Authentic storytelling and connecting with audiences. 23:49
Bethany and Jonathan discuss the importance of making a memorable takeaway in a presentation, such as a "lemon in the eye" that makes the audience feel something.
Jonathan suggests making something human and vulnerable to connect with the audience, using personal stories or moments that are relatable.
Bethany observes that people can write about mundane things but make it compelling when writing from their authentic voice.
Brandon M agrees, noting that authenticity is difficult to achieve, especially in corporate settings where people are often uncomfortable sharing their true feelings.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
38. Life Lessons
11 Apr 2024
00:53:44
In this unique episode, Bethany Ayers and Brandon Mensinga share their personal stories. This episode is simply titled: Life Lessons. Bethany and Brandon are experienced scale-up COO’s and the co-hosts of the Operations Room.
We chat about the following lessons:
Know where you want to go
Lean into the fear
Don’t try to be somebody else
Focus on the job that is in front of you
Know your superpower
Accept critical feedback for what it is
Leadership is about serving others
Find people who stretch you
Take opportunities when they present themselves
Don’t be a victim, take responsibility for your life
Brandon and Bethany discuss their sleeping difficulties, with Bethany experiencing a bird phobia-related insomnia and Brandon going to a quiz night with his wife.
Bethany struggles to fall asleep due to her bird phobia, while Brandon enjoys a UK-centric quiz night with his wife.
Bethany Ayers shares her lesson learned from her career journey: know where you want to go, but be open to opportunities.
Brandon Mensa adds to the discussion, emphasizing the importance of being clear on one's goals while remaining flexible and open to new experiences.
Brandon shares his experience of struggling to land a job during an internship programme, despite applying for 10 marketing roles and interviewing 10 times without success.
Brandon overcame his anxiety related to telephone interviews by taking small steps, such as practicing with friends and using positive self-talk, to build his confidence and land a job as a marketing specialist.
Brandon leaned into his fear and ambition to secure a job, despite a long commute and initial discomfort.
Leveraging his motivation and ambition, he drove himself to fulfill the potential of the company, learning to manage his fear along the way.
Bethany emphasizes the importance of embracing discomfort and being the best version of oneself, rather than trying to be someone else.
She encourages individuals to focus on their unique strengths and skills, rather than comparing themselves to others.
Brandon recognizes the value of his own strengths and weaknesses, and stops comparing himself to extroverts.
Brandon takes inspiration from others' ways of working and incorporates them into his own toolkit, rather than mimicking them exactly.
Bethany prioritizes becoming a domain expert and a practitioner in her field, focusing on the job she has and building her skills to take advantage of opportunities as they arise.
Brandon emphasizes the importance of focusing on the job and becoming a craftsperson, with opportunities for advancement and job security following suit.
Embracing unique strengths and work ethic for career success. 17:09
Bethany struggles with imposter syndrome and feeling unimportant in a leadership role due to her lack of a specific functional expertise.
Bethany highlights the importance of identifying and embracing one's unique strengths and specializations, rather than trying to be a jack-of-all-trades.
Brandon agrees, emphasizing the value of focusing on a specific area of expertise and becoming a subject matter expert.
Leadership lessons learned and the importance of serving others. 21:11
Brandon was put in a leadership role he wasn't qualified for, struggled in meetings, and was told he was "terrible" by the CEO.
Brandon took 3-4 months to accept critical feedback, work with an external coach, and rebuild himself as a leader.
Brandon and Bethany discuss the importance of leadership being about serving others, not just personal achievement.
A new head teacher at a primary school transforms the school's morale and engagement with their leadership, showing the power of effective leadership.
Brandon and Bethany discuss the importance of leadership and career progression, with Brandon emphasizing the value of taking feedback and continuously improving.
Bethany shares her experience with giving and receiving feedback, highlighting the importance of self-awareness and continuous improvement.
Bethany has had two mentors in her career who provided specific feedback to help her improve, including a former BCG analyst who gave her BCG training and a sales leader who pushed her to think more critically.
Bethany is currently seeking out mentors who will challenge her and help her reach her full potential, as she feels she doesn't have anyone in her life currently who will push her as hard as she needs.
Career growth, responsibility, and self-reliance. 31:37
Brandon became a market analyst for IDC and loved it, but then got a call from the CBC to talk about BlackBerry live on TV, which he initially doubted but then saw as an opportunity to showcase his skills.
Brandon took the opportunity and did a credible job, leading to more TV engagements and growth as a communicator, highlighting the importance of seizing opportunities and taking initiative.
Brandon and Bethany emphasize the importance of self-reliance and responsibility in personal and professional growth.
Leadership, resilience, and decision-making in business. 35:58
Bethany emphasizes the importance of taking responsibility for one's function and solving problems upstream and downstream, rather than just complaining about them.
Brandon agrees and adds that a CEO should be concerned with motivating everyone to achieve the vision, which requires taking responsibility for the team's success and working with other teams to move the ball forward.
Brandon faced challenges in his role as VP of Product at a company in Las Vegas, feeling unhappy and undermined, but he chose to stay and turn things around, leading to a successful run at the company.
The lesson learned from this experience is the importance of resilience, as throwing in the towel is not always the right choice, and Brandon was able to turn things around by rethinking his approach and figuring things out.
Bethany emphasizes the importance of resilience and perspective in business leadership, and seeks outside counsel or coaching to navigate challenges.
Bethany emphasizes the importance of cultivating a network based on genuine relationships and introducing people to each other, rather than just seeking personal gain.
Brandon shares an example of how his mentor's network has led to valuable opportunities and serendipitous connections, highlighting the power of building meaningful relationships.
Bethany emphasizes the importance of treating people with respect and kindness, even if they're not someone you necessarily like or want to spend time with.
She shares a lesson she's learned about being aware of how our actions and words can impact others, and not excluding people unnecessarily.
Leadership, respect, and dealing with difficult colleagues. 48:34
Brandon had a difficult relationship with a sales leader, initially disliking them due to personality clashes, but later recognizing their professional skills and respecting them.
Brandon had preconceived notions about another individual, leading to a disrespectful interaction, but later developed a positive relationship after getting to know them.
Brandon and Bethany discuss the importance of respecting colleagues, even if you don't personally like them, and how this can lead to better business outcomes.
They emphasize that leaders should be rooted in sound principles and values, even if some people may not like them for different reasons.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
37. Which HRIS do I need?
04 Apr 2024
00:45:42
In this episode we discuss: Which HRIS do I need? We are joined by Matt Bradburn, Founder & CEO of the People Collective.
We chat about the following:
What are our views on Rippling? Personio? Factorial? BambooHR? HiBob?
What is a good vendor choice for a scaling company of a few hundred people that wants something that is very customisable?
What is a good all-in-one vendor choice that is good at employee engagement and for UK companies supports international expansion into the US?
What are the “gotchas” when buying an HRIS?
What is the hidden, dark secret of all employee engagement tools?
What is a good vendor choice for a mid-market ATS?
Matt is a globally recognised People and Talent leader. Through his work as the founder at People Collective, he's helped over 150 companies shape forward thinking people and talent strategies to scale sustainably.
Passionate about how talent shapes business outcomes, he loves to discuss the best ways to help employees reach their full potential.
He previously led People Ops at Peakon prior to their exit to Workday.
Summary:
Healthy eating habits and vegetable subscriptions. 0:05
Bethany is trying a new vegetable subscription service called Odd Box, which delivers a random mix of fruits and vegetables each week.
Bethany is not excited about the included cauliflower and tuna, but is looking forward to trying new vegetables during the summer.
Bethany is frustrated with the lack of great options for HRIS systems, especially for smaller companies.
Brandon has a utilitarian experience with Rippling, with a cluttered drop-down menu and limited performance review functionality compared to other HRIS systems.
Brandon and Bethany discuss their experiences with Rippling, a HR platform founded by former Zenefits employees.
Rippling's sales process was qualified and thorough, but the product did not appeal to Brandon due to its utilitarian nature.
Bamboo HR's reporting and custom field functionality was frustrating for the speaker, with delayed responses from the customer success team and limited flexibility.
Bethany suspects a churn issue at a company, possibly due to Hi Bob's functionality and Personnel's focus on being an all-in-one solution.
Personnel aims to differentiate themselves from Hi Bob and other competitors by offering a modern and progressive product with a focus on employee experience.
Brandon and Bethany discuss HR software options, with Persona and Factorial being the main focus.
Factorial is positioned as an all-in-one solution with a focus on finance and operations, while Persona is seen as a more utilitarian option with a better user experience.
Bethany and Brandon discuss HR tech stacks, with Brandon providing insights on various products and their pros and cons.
Bethany describes her experience with bamboo HR, expressing frustration with its limitations and lack of good analytics, and Brandon agrees that it's not the best option for scaling companies.
HR software for mid-market companies with limited options. 22:38
Matt Bradburn is frustrated with Bamboo's prescriptive performance module, wanting more flexibility in choosing what to assess.
Matt recommends Humans for an employee data layer that's easy to manipulate and connect to other software, making life easier.
Matt Bradburn recommends using Hi, Bob as a mid-market HR platform due to its ease of use, reasonable performance, and ability to download Excel files for analysis.
Matt Bradburn advises reducing HR tools to the bare minimum to achieve a loved stack, citing Lattice and Deel as examples.
Matt Bradburn is impressed with summer laps' learning creation landscape, particularly their multi-threaded approach to onboarding and sales.
He also appreciates Panda's performance development, which connects employee journey to career growth, and Harriet HR's ease of access to HR information through Slack.
Matt Bradburn notes that Rippling, a CRM system, is great for US-focused companies with international employees, but lacks customization for US benefits.
Matt Bradburn hears anecdotal evidence of frustration with Rippling among European users, including those who experienced difficulty with European SAS compliance.
Matt Bradburn discusses the challenges of creating a comprehensive HR platform that meets the needs of various countries and legal requirements, while also providing customization options for users.
Matt Bradburn and others discuss the Goldilocks problem of finding an HR platform that is not too rigid or too fluid, but rather just right for the user's needs.
Matt Bradburn: Too many Workday implementation consultants on LinkedIn, making it hard to find accurate data.
Bethany: Consolidation is needed in the compensation space, but no one has a good product vision for a single tool that does everything.
In this episode we discuss: What does a good COO framework look like? We are joined by Simon Wakeman, former COO of TPXimpact and creator of the B3 Framework.
We chat about the following:
Are investment bets the responsibility of the COO?
What is an operating model?
What is minimum viable governance? How much process is too much process?
How to best manage a risk register to make it useful
I help founders in post-seed and series A technology businesses to scale their operations and create resilient organisations.
I’ve created and used the B3 framework® to enable businesses with 25 to 250 people to successfully grow at pace.
Before becoming an independent interim COO, consultant and advisor I held senior operational leadership roles in two scaling technology businesses. The first - a digital business - I led from 15 people / £1.6m revenue to 40 people / £3m revenue. The second - a technology and design business - grew from 361 people / £31.5m revenue to 700 people / £83m in around three years.
My career experience includes co-founder, MD, COO and non-exec director roles in growth companies, including successful exits across listed and privately held businesses.
Summary:
Creating high-performance companies with a CEO framework. 0:06
Brandon and Bethany discuss their spouses' reactions to their podcast, with Bethany's husband being surprised by her comment that being married is not part of her identity.
They welcome Simon Wakeman, former CEO of TI px impact, as their guest to discuss his B three framework for building highly performant organizations.
Brandon M: Foundation layer of CEO framework includes why do we exist, what do we do, and how do we do it.
Bethany: Operating model definition lacks clarity, with inconsistent examples across companies.
Brandon M: Building the organisation layer, decision making is hard due to changing business structures and roles, but it's critical for scaling companies to codify decision-making processes and delegate responsibility.
Bethany: Finance models are useful for making calculated risks and investment bets, but they need to be holistically thought through with the CEO and leadership team to ensure the right forecast model is created for cash burn and expectations management.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the importance of data ownership and security in business, with Bethany emphasizing the need for a "Source of Truth" and data security foundations to support data-driven decision-making.
Bethany highlights the importance of data in decision-making, emphasizing that even small amounts of data can be valuable for directional insights.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the four layers of their framework, including cadence and communications, leadership, performance, processes, systems, and standards.
Operating models and their importance in business. 11:32
Simon Wakeman defines operating model as a blueprint for turning strategy into reality, focusing on how to source customers, deliver value, and partner with others.
Bethany seeks clarification on operating model, which Simon explains as a high-level summary of how a business creates value, turning strategy into a functioning business.
Simon Wakeman emphasizes the importance of creating a clear and concise operating model for businesses, which should describe how the company creates value on a single page.
He suggests using a template to help structure the operating model, but notes that the level of detail and complexity will depend on the type of business and its stage of growth.
Organizational governance and decision-making. 16:02
Simon Wakeman: Distributed team was deliberately chosen for tech business to address resourcing challenges.
Minimum Viable Governance means legal duties of directors, policies, and risk management processes for coherent functioning.
Simon Wakeman: Governance should push autonomy and decision-making to the edges of the organization, with appropriate safeguards to ensure competency.
Bethany: Too much process can stifle innovation, emphasizing people's brains and good decisions over rules is key.
Governance in scaleups, risk management, and crisis communications. 21:11
Brandon M and Bethany discuss governance in scaleups, focusing on risk management and crisis communications.
Risk management, systems ownership, and data quality in business. 22:58
Bethany suggests identifying the right people to engage in risk management, such as critical thinkers like herself and structured thinkers like the CFO or ops director.
Simon Wakeman agrees that these individuals are often the ones who take the lead in risk management and convene groups to do the hard work.
Simon Wakeman emphasizes the importance of understanding and owning technology in a business, particularly in the early scaling phase, to avoid messy systems architecture and inconsistent data.
He highlights the need for a clear data model to underpin the business and integrate systems effectively, particularly as AI and augmentation technologies become more prevalent.
Simon Wakeman suggests a more decentralized approach to ops, with greater autonomy for people, but also a governing framework to ensure coherence and value creation across the organization.
Simon believes tech leadership should own providing data and capabilities, while CFO should define user needs and bring together quality information for decision-making.
Creating a cohesive business system through meetings and alignment. 29:16
Bethany and Simon discuss the importance of cadence in organizations, including recurring meetings, to align teams and create a sense of unity.
Simon Wakeman emphasizes the importance of understanding how different parts of a business are linked together and making deliberate choices about how to structure and run the business.
He encourages listeners to regularly review and adjust their business systems as the company grows to maintain balance and coherence.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
35. Is wellbeing a complete waste of time?
21 Mar 2024
00:52:36
In this episode we discuss: Is wellbeing a complete waste of time? We are joined by Gethin Nadin, cited as one of HR’s Most Influential Thinkers and author of the bestseller “A Work In Progress: Unlocking Wellbeing to Create More Sustainable and Resilient Organisations.”
Bethany and I discuss:
What is the COO’s role in solving workplace stress?
What can a COO do to optimise employees and support their mental health?
We chat about the following with Gethin:
What is wellbeing? In the context of a company, what are we talking about?
What is the view on the Guardian article that suggests wellness programmes are a waste of time?
What is the impact of DE&I on mental health?
How has the social contract changed between employee and employer?
Where does corporate responsibility end and personal responsibility start?
How does an organisation optimise employees to achieve the biggest shareholder return?
I am a leading psychologist and author with over 20 years of experience in HR tech, employee wellbeing, and engagement. As a Fellow of the Royal Society of Arts and a Member of the British Psychological Society, I have been recognised as one of the world's most influential HR thinkers and a top global employee experience influencer.
Currently, I serve as the Chief Innovation Officer at both Benefex and Zellis, two of the UK's leading providers of employee benefits and payroll solutions. In this role, I leverage my expertise in wellbeing, employee experience, and financial wellbeing to create innovative and sustainable solutions for organisations and their people. I am also a member of the All Party Parliamentary Group on the Future of Employability, where I advise on policy and practice for improving the employability of the UK workforce.
I am passionate about sharing my knowledge and insights with others through speaking, writing, and teaching. I have published two bestselling books, 'A World of Good' and 'A Work in Progress', which explore the best practices and emerging trends in improving the employee experience and wellbeing across the globe. I have also contributed to various media outlets, such as Forbes, The Financial Times, and The Guardian, and co-hosted a UK tour with Ruby Wax OBE to campaign for better mental health in the workplace. My mission is to help organisations and individuals thrive in the changing world of work.
Summary:
Walking in London, exhaustion, and appreciation for the city. 0:06
Bethany talks about her recent walk in London, mentioning the Thames and a noodle shop in Greenwich.
Bethany quotes Samuel Pepys, saying "when you're tired of London, you're tired of life," reflecting on her previous exhaustion with living in London but now re-appreciating it as her children have grown older.
Workplace well-being and its impact on employee mental health. 2:24
CEO has significant influence on employee mental health by creating a stress-reducing work environment.
Brandon M and Bethany discuss the importance of financial security in creating a positive work culture, with Bethany noting that even with the right policies in place, a fear-based culture can still exist if the CEO is insecure or paranoid.
The pair also highlight the danger of CEOs presenting one image and picture for the company while undermining it with their actions, creating a sense of double talk or gaslighting.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the five levels of organisational leadership, ranging from a pessimistic view of the world to a transcendent one focused on the betterment of society.
They agree that level three, where most people operate, is characterized by ego-driven politics, while level four involves a common enemy and level five is a state of flow and collaboration.
Workplace wellness programs and their benefits. 9:33
Brandon M and Bethany discuss the importance of investing in personal well-being and mental health support for employees, with examples of successful implementation in their company.
They highlight the benefits of using a platform like Slack for on-demand therapy and coaching, and how it can help remove the stigma around mental health support.
Brandon M and Bethany discussed the importance of investing in employee wellness programs, including mental health support and financial planning.
They agreed that wellness programs are often inexpensive and can provide significant benefits for employees, but may require more holistic approach to budgeting and prioritization.
Brandon and Bethany discuss the importance of well-being in the workplace, particularly for line managers, and how it can be supported through coaching and other means.
They debate whether well-being is a waste of time, with Bethany expressing skepticism about the effectiveness of training and the importance of coaching for personal growth.
Gethin Nadin discusses the importance of workplace well-being, citing research showing 90-99% of people experience extreme stress at work.
Employers must support employees' well-being, despite not causing the cost of living crisis or pandemic, and must move away from the idea of "do no harm" to create an environment where employees' lives are better off for working with them.
Workplace wellbeing and its impact on employee happiness and productivity. 19:39
Gethin Nadin agrees with the Guardian article that wellness programs can be ineffective if workplace stress is caused by poor management practices.
He believes that wellness initiatives are only effective when companies prioritize employee well-being and address the root causes of stress, such as unclear expectations and too much pressure.
Gethin Nadin argues that wellbeing initiatives like mindfulness are important but not a replacement for organizational structure and culture changes.
He believes that high performers are at high risk of burnout and that a combination of structural and mindfulness interventions is necessary for effective wellbeing management.
Gethin Nadin highlights the importance of inclusive policies and structures in workplaces, particularly for marginalized groups, to address mental health issues and promote a safe and supportive environment.
Bethany emphasizes the need for policies that address the DI (diversity, inclusion) side of things, including sexual harassment policies, to create a culture where women feel safe to speak up about their experiences in the workplace.
Gethin Nadin highlights the UK police force as an example of a workplace where women face systemic barriers and discrimination, with a culture of "laddish behavior" and a lack of support for mental health.
Nadin emphasizes the need for institutions to take concrete actions to address these issues, such as holding perpetrators accountable and creating a more inclusive work environment.
Diversity, inclusion, and activism in the workplace. 28:12
Organizations must create a safe and welcoming environment for diverse employees to thrive, including policies and benefits that address gender identity and expression.
Bethany and Gethin discuss the power of the workplace in shaping society, with examples of employers taking a stand against government decisions that negatively impact their employees.
Gethin highlights the business drivers for diversity,...
34. How do you build an organisation to compete with Google?
14 Mar 2024
00:43:58
In this episode we discuss: How do you build an organisation to compete with Google? We are joined by Omid Ashtari, ex-COO of Streebees and President of Citymapper.
We chat about the following with Omid:
How do you think about organisational structure?
How proactive should you be in anticipating organisational challenges?
What is the highest impact communication challenge you helped resolve?
How do you prevent drift from the customer as the company scales?
I have two decades of experience in tech and worked in sales, business development and strategy roles for Google across the Dublin, London and San Francisco office during his 7 years there. As the first international employee, I set up Foursquare in Europe as Managing Director. I subsequently joined Citymapper for 6 years as President running the non-engineering side of the business. I then joined Streetbees as COO running operations, international expansion, finance and legal. Throughout my career I have raised north of 100 million dollars of funding for businesses I have worked for.
I am an angel investor in more than 45 businesses and advise many of them in all manner of things including strategy, operations, business development, fundraises etc. I am also part of the Mayor of London's Business Advisory Board, and a Mentor at Seedcamp and Entrepreneur First.
I am also an aspiring writer for my blogs startuppragmatism.blog and thefullspectrum.blog.
Brandon reflects on his past solo travels and how they relate to his current life.
Brandon M reflects on his past self-absorption and lack of empathy, now prioritizing supporting others' success and empathy in personal and professional life.
Brandon M recounts a 2011 incident where he carried a biscuit tin full of Canadian coins and sat next to a homeless person, now recognizing the importance of empathy and caring for others.
Organizational structure and skills for a business. 4:09
Bethany: People often create an org structure that prioritizes making their existing team happy, rather than starting fresh and building a structure that works for the business.
Brandon M: Bethany suggests starting with a blank slate and building an org structure that works for the business, rather than trying to fit existing team members into a pre-existing structure.
Bethany and Brandon M discuss the importance of defining the skills needed for a business to succeed, rather than simply morphing structures around people.
They agree that it's better to have a flexible approach to organizational structure, recognizing that roles may evolve as the business grows and changes.
Organizational design and hiring for a scaling startup. 9:57
Brandon M. faced pushback on hiring 2 product marketing managers, but believes it was necessary for success in both self-serve subscribers and enterprise sales.
Brandon M. emphasizes the importance of clear go-to-market strategy and collaboration between product marketing manager and go-to-market manager.
Bethany identifies the need for a "thinker" in early-stage businesses to analyze and gather information, which is perceived as a luxury role but essential for product market fit and growth.
Bethany highlights the importance of having a thinker and a strategic salesperson in a scaling organization, as they provide valuable insights and help navigate challenges.
Bethany identifies signs of organizational design issues, including unhappiness, confusion, and a lack of managers or promotional opportunities, which can lead to restructuring.
Omid Ashtari discusses the importance of adapting organizational structure to the scale of the problem being solved, as the number of employees grows.
Ashtari highlights the challenges that arise when an organization expands, such as natural breaking points and lines of communication, and the need to adjust operational systems accordingly.
Communication and decision-making challenges in scaling startups. 18:37
Omid Ashtari explains how companies can proactively address problems by embracing chaos and redesigning systems after hiring new employees.
Omid Ashtari highlights the importance of clear communication and decision-making processes in startups, particularly in scaling businesses.
He shares an example of a company experiencing success bias, where they lose humility and become less secure, leading to bottlenecks in decision-making and communication.
Product-market fit and organizational structure for startups. 22:39
Omid Ashtari highlights the importance of addressing user complaints and recalibrating employees' understanding of the product's performance in different cities.
Citymapper encourages engineers and employees to travel to different cities for exploratory trips to better understand user needs and improve the product.
Omid Ashtari discusses the importance of understanding customer needs and maintaining product-market fit in scaling startups.
Hiring for various roles in a business, focusing on cognitive ability and adaptability. 26:49
Omid Ashtari discusses the importance of hiring the right person for the job, particularly in scaling problems, where high roller related knowledge is crucial.
Ashtari highlights the challenge of figuring out the business model for a problem like city mapper, where role related knowledge is less important than adaptability to the organization's synchronous ease.
Omid Ashtari emphasizes the importance of hiring people with high cognitive flexibility and entrepreneurial mindset for a specific business unit within a company.
He describes a cross-functional team structure where team members sit in different rooms and communicate ad hoc to solve problems quickly, with a central table for impromptu meetings.
Omid Ashtari emphasizes the importance of adapting to changing business needs by creating separate units with different operating systems to address specific problems.
In Citymapper's case, the main focus was on retaining organic growth in London, with a myopic focus on product innovation and weekly updates to address user feedback.
Omid Ashtari describes the challenges of scaling a transport app, including competing with Google Maps and Apple Maps, and the need for a sustainable business model.
Ashtari highlights the importance of resilience and entrepreneurial spirit in overcoming these challenges, and the need for tooling to enable non-engineers to launch cities.
Entrepreneurship, product market fit, and organizational design. 37:48
Omid Ashtari emphasizes the importance of asking questions and reorganizing as needed in the face of uncertainty.
Citymapper's team has adapted to changing needs by reassigning personnel and launching new initiatives like smart ride, a cab-based ride-sharing service.
Omid Ashtari emphasizes the importance of being "confidently insecure" as an entrepreneur, constantly reassessing and adapting to changing circumstances.
Bethany agrees, highlighting the need to be emotionally intelligent, flexible, and humble in the face of uncertainty and criticism.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
33. How do you scale from 100 employees to IPO?
07 Mar 2024
00:46:03
In this episode we discuss: How do you scale from 100 employees to IPO? We are joined by Mark Logan, ex-COO of Skyscanner and currently Chief Entrepreneurial Advisor to the Scottish Government
We chat about the following with Mark:
What are the foundations of scale?
How do you prevent command and control from creeping in?
What goes wrong with organisational alignment over time?
Why doesn’t OKR cascading work?
What are the three golden processes of an organisation?
Why do things break when you scale? What do you need to look out for?
What are the three golden processes of an organisation?
How do you get the innovation process to work?
When does it make sense to go cross-functional across the organisation?
What is expected from a C-level role?
Biography:
I have over 25 years' experience in highly successful startups and 1st-tier internet tech companies. I have been instrumental in the success of multiple award-winning start-ups, including Skyscanner, one of Europe's most successful tech companies, where I joined in 2012 to take on the general management of the business, culminating in a £1.5billion acquisition in 2016.
My experience spans consumer internet economy startups, executive management, organisational development, change management, strategy development, contract negotiation and delivery, software development, growth science, sales and marketing , HR, large scale programme delivery and operations management, including lean agile techniques.
Currently mainly focused on helping to nurture the start-up community in Scotland and the UK as an investor, non-executive director and advisor.
Summary:
Scaling a business from 100 employees to IPO with ex-Skyscanner CEO Mark Logan. 0:06
Bethany: Investing in individual competence is essential for setting up employees for success within their roles.
Brandon M: Mark Logan prioritized this by focusing on developing the skills of each employee at Skyscanner.
Bethany highlights the importance of career development and line management effectiveness in retaining staff, rather than allocating budget to wellness programmes.
Bethany suggests that companies need to carve out time and give permission for employees to think and learn at work, and celebrate their efforts to create a learning environment.
Brandon M. shared his experience with OKRs, highlighting the importance of practical application and alignment with business strategy.
Bethany agreed, emphasizing the need to balance structure with flexibility and contextual understanding, citing Nike as an example of a company that executes OKRs effectively.
Resource allocation and technology adoption in business. 8:17
Bethany highlights the challenge of resource allocation in product development, particularly when it comes to balancing the need for new technologies with the reality of limited resources.
Bethany emphasizes the importance of having a clear understanding of how new technology will improve processes and outcomes before investing in it.
Scaling organizations and maintaining agency. 11:03
Bethany: Friend's security company has accidentally implemented decentralized decision-making, leading to no bottlenecks as they scale.
Mark Logan: Foundation of scale is agency, as company grows, founders' urgency decreases, and staff takes over.
Mark Logan: As company scales, agency of frontline staff drops rapidly, leading to productivity crisis.
Bethany: How to keep agency alive as company grows? Contrast agency with autonomy, and define agency as consisting of basic competence and other factors.
Mark Logan emphasizes the importance of competency and ownership in a growing company, citing examples of incompetent leaders and lack of clear ownership boundaries.
He uses the analogy of a book club to illustrate how founders should not assume that everyone is on the same page and should actively push ownership to the frontline.
Mark Logan: Alignment issues can lead to loss of agency, where employees feel disconnected from the company's strategy and lack access to necessary resources.
Mark Logan: Best practices for maintaining agency include regular check-ins, clear communication, and providing employees with the necessary tools and resources to do their jobs effectively.
The challenges of implementing OKRs in a rapidly scaling organization. 21:00
Mark Logan describes the evolution of his company's goal-setting process, from initial alignment to cascading objectives across teams, to eventually hiring a project manager for alignment.
The company realized that the goal-setting process had become cumbersome and was hindering progress, leading to the creation of a new role to manage alignment.
Mark Logan and Bethany discuss the challenges of scaling OKRs (Objectives and Key Results) in businesses, particularly in terms of losing alignment and control as companies grow.
They believe that the solution lies in enabling and influencing employees, rather than controlling them, and that this approach should be reflected in the contract between managers and employees.
Mark Logan argues that neglecting certain aspects of agency can lead to poor management and creation of barriers within an organization.
He suggests that over-reliance on functional hierarchies can hinder the implementation of key business processes such as customer acquisition and maintenance.
Mark Logan: Functional hierarchy can hinder innovation, as it creates walls and silos that slow down scaling.
Brandon M: Innovation needs wiggle room and clashing of different skill sets, which can be encouraged through informal relationships.
T-shaped skills, hybrid working, and team collaboration. 31:12
Mark Logan emphasizes the importance of T-shaped skills in a fast-growing startup, where individuals should have a deep specialism and adjacent knowledge to innovate holistically.
Bethany and Brandon discuss how to enable individuals to gather and make an innovation difference, with Bethany highlighting the need for informal collaboration and Brandon focusing on the importance of encouraging T-shaped skills.
Brandon M suggests creating hybrid teams with diverse skills to foster innovation and collaboration.
Mark Logan advocates for embracing the squads and tribes model in organizations to promote ownership and productivity.
Implementing cross-functional teams and tribes in a business. 36:37
Mark Logan emphasizes the importance of cross-functional collaboration in product development, citing Skyscanner's success with squads and tribes.
Mark Logan explains how Skyscanner's product engineering efforts evolved to better serve diverse international markets by creating growth tribes with local engineers, commercial people, and marketing teams.
This approach led to improved performance in markets like South Korea, with a 300% increase in performance, as the team was able to adapt the product to the local business case and handle code bases more effectively.
Mark Logan emphasizes the importance of taking a thoughtful and structured approach to organizational change, rather than simply implementing new processes or structures without proper enablement and support.
Bethany agrees, highlighting the need for CEOs to be transformational and think about how to make things dramatically better, rather than just focusing on incremental improvement.
Mark Logan emphasizes the importance of optimizing for agency in organizational change.
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32. What can VC and PE backed operators learn from each other?
29 Feb 2024
01:00:38
In this episode we discuss: What can VC and PE backed operators learn from each other? We are joined by Sam Smith, the founder & MD of PepTalks, a training provider for private equity backed CEOs and their management teams.
We chat about the following with Sam:
What are the types of PE companies?
How are company valuations determined?
How does the commercial model work between PE companies and LP’s?
Can you shift track and move from VC-backed to PE-backed?
How does a PE firm structure funds when they invest in an organisation?
How does that structure impact the ability for the management team to make money?
How do share options work in VC-backed companies?
What happens to the management team's equity when a second PE company buys the company?
What does a successful COO look like in PE-backed companies? How does that contrast versus VC-backed?
How do VC-backed companies successfully ramp up headcount so quickly?
How do you engage and motivate employees in PE-backed companies versus VC-backed?
Sam Smith is the founder of PepTalks, a peer to peer training provider for private equity backed CEOs and Management teams. Founder of Marble Hill Partners an exec search and interim management consultancy which was sold to Henley Insights Group in September 2021.
Summary:
Career relevance and identity after unexpected death. 0:05
Bethany struggles with processing unexpected death of a friend, leading to a difficult weekend.
Bethany and Brandon discuss feeling less relevant in their careers as they age, with millennials taking over management positions.
Bethany: Realized identity wasn't tied to work after leaving peak role, causing discomfort & self-reflection.
Brandon: Ambiguity of mattering in work life vs. personal identity, with age & finite time, leads to essential questions.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the importance of financial freedom and its impact on their lives, including the ability to think long-term and prioritize personal growth.
Brandon highlights the importance of allocating time for networking and learning, even when not directly relevant to work, to maintain personal direction and growth.
Entrepreneurship, private equity, and networking. 9:02
Bethany and Brandon discuss networking and success in business with Sam Smith of pep talks.
Private equity fundraising and investment strategies. 11:07
Sam Smith explains the commercial models of private equity, including the need for return on investment and the importance of valuation based on EBITDA multiples.
Bethany asks about the recurring revenue of a 20-500 million enterprise value business, and Sam provides examples of private equity funds for different transaction sizes.
Sam Smith outlines a plan to raise £500 million for a private equity fund, highlighting the importance of having a clear investment strategy and track record of success.
The fund aims to secure commitments from 20-30 institutional investors, with the remaining £450 million coming from the general partners' own pockets.
Sam Smith and Bethany plan to manage a private equity fund for 10 years, investing and returning money to investors over that time.
The fund will have a lifecycle of 11 years, with 3-5 exits within the first 5 years, and then raising another fund in transition.
Brandon: Has seen venture-backed companies transition to private equity ownership, but rare due to cash generation and profitability requirements.
Sam Smith: Private equity investors expect at least a two times return, unlike venture capital which takes a higher risk for potential astronomical returns.
Private equity investing and debt structures. 20:41
Management teams in private equity firms can make significant sums of money if they deliver growth and meet targets, while VC firms have a higher risk of failure and lower potential returns.
Sam Smith discusses raising £500 million for private equity deals, with £40 million going to banks or debt funds and £59 million structured as a loan note with compounding interest.
Smith explains the importance of capturing senior debt and structuring loan notes to minimize interest payments and maximize returns.
Sam Smith explains how private equity firms structure deals to incentivize management teams, typically offering a sliver of equity worth 10-20% of the total valuation.
Four years later, the business has grown EBITDA, improved its multiple, and paid down some senior debt, increasing the valuation to 170 million.
Sam Smith explains how private equity firms can generate returns through investments, highlighting the importance of valuation and cash generation.
Brandon expresses interest in joining private equity, but Sam cautions that returns may not be stellar and management equity may erode in value.
VC-backed business growth strategies and employee incentives. 29:37
VC-backed businesses prioritize market creation and share options for management teams.
Bethany explains that employee stock options are typically structured as a percentage of salary with a vesting schedule, and employees must exercise their options within 90 days of leaving the company to avoid paying the strike price.
The strike price varies depending on the set of shares or option grant, and employees must decide whether to hold onto their shares or pay the strike price as part of the sale.
Bethany and Sam Smith discuss the importance of vesting for management teams in private equity deals, with Bethany highlighting the need for incentives and Sam Smith explaining the benefits of rolling equity into subsequent transactions.
NewVoiceMedia raised money every year, with a focus on deploying and returning funds in a 3-5 year cadence.
Bethany: Valuation increases with each funding round, providing opportunities for early investors to cash out or continue investing.
Sam Smith: Private equity firms look for entrepreneurial leadership teams with strategic strength and psychological resilience to drive growth and capture market share.
Private equity talent acquisition and growth strategies. 38:51
Sam Smith emphasizes the importance of operational expertise in CEO candidates for a mid-market company.
Private equity firms often overlook experienced VC executives as potential hires due to cultural fit concerns.
Private equity firms prioritize hiring experienced executives for faster growth.
Talent acquisition and onboarding in private equity firms. 44:33
CEO emphasizes importance of talent acquisition and onboarding to ensure aligned focus on value creation.
Entrepreneurship, strategy, and talent acquisition. 46:06
Venture businesses struggle with identifying and sticking to focus due to market disruption and entrepreneurial excitement.
Bethany and Sam discuss talent acquisition strategies for scaling startups, including building a talent team, leveraging referrals, and preparing managers for growing teams.
Brandon emphasizes the importance of effective line management to ensure new hires are set up for success.
HR strategies for scaling businesses.
31. How do you build a business that is smarter than you?
22 Feb 2024
00:36:53
In this episode we answer the question: How do you build a business that is smarter than you? Our guest is Jennifer Sundberg, the co-CEO of Board Intelligence and author of Collective Intelligence.
We discuss the following with Jennifer:
Why is it so hard to get great conversations in business review meetings?
How do you get good at asking the right questions?
How do you develop the habit of asking good questions in the organisation?
How do you create phenomenal meetings?
How do you cut through obfuscation of underperformance when it comes to KPI’s?
What are the two types of conversations in management meetings?
Are written documents the elixir for creating better meetings?
Jennifer is the founder and co-CEO of Board Intelligence, a mission-led technology firm that helps transform boards and leadership teams into a powerful driver of performance and a force for good.
Jennifer has won numerous awards, including EY Entrepreneur of the Year for London & South East and The Times Young Business Woman of the Year, and has held regular columns with Management Today and the Financial Times.
Together with co-CEO Pippa Begg, Jennifer has authored a book published in November 2023, titled ‘Collective intelligence: How to build a business that’s smarter than you are’.
Bethany Ayers discusses her concerns about her appearance, particularly the jowls and lower face area, and how she has been using microcurrent therapy to address these issues.
Brandon Mensa responds to Bethany's concerns and provides his own thoughts on the topic, including his belief that face exercise is important for maintaining a youthful appearance.
Bethany discusses her use of electric currents on her face to reduce the appearance of jowls and improve her appearance, despite being a feminist who questions the societal pressure to conform to beauty standards.
Bethany mentions the zip Halo, a product she uses for its anti-acne and nano current features, which she believes have helped reduce her breakouts and improve the appearance of her skin.
Effective questioning and meeting strategies. 5:20
Bethany highlights the importance of asking simple and open-ended questions that encourage critical thinking and problem-solving, rather than complex and leading questions that can limit the conversation.
Brandon shares how he has shifted from a more directive and challenging approach to a more curious and why-focused line of questioning, which has led to better results in his conversations.
Bethany prefers meetings with a clear purpose and aligned attendees, avoiding unnecessary or unproductive gatherings.
Bethany suggests opening meetings with a clear agenda and checking alignment among attendees to maximize productivity.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the importance of periodically reviewing the purpose and format of meetings to ensure they remain useful and productive.
Preparing pre-read materials for substantial topics to be debated in leadership meetings can help align everyone and lead to better decisions.
Bethany highlights the importance of clarity in pre reads, emphasizing that without it, people may interpret the document differently and have a harder time having a productive conversation.
Brandon agrees and adds that pre reads can be used for more than just making a decision, such as for awareness or understanding the background of a topic.
Improving board meeting quality through skills development. 14:11
Jennifer Sundberg highlights the importance of critical thinking, communication, and focus on what matters most in board information.
She emphasizes that these skills are not unique to boards and have far-reaching implications for management teams and organizations as a whole.
Asking the right questions in a structured manner. 16:21
Bethany and Jennifer discuss the importance of asking the right questions in a framework, with Bethany sharing her experience of iteratively refining questions over time.
Jennifer Sundberg suggests using a set of pre-defined questions, called QDs, to help employees think critically and structure their thoughts before writing a report or presentation.
She recommends limiting the number of major questions to 5-7 to maintain clarity and avoid overwhelming the receiver with too much information.
Improving performance reports by asking simple yet effective questions. 19:25
Jennifer Sundberg highlights the importance of addressing the "so what" question in performance reports, as it helps to identify the risks and opportunities on the horizon.
Bethany shares her experience of working with teams who struggle to provide meaningful commentary on data visualizations, despite the importance of contextualizing the information.
Jennifer Sundberg shares a story about EasyJet's CEO Carolyn McCall, who prioritized employee well-being by asking "how do our people feel?" in every meeting and report, shifting the organization's focus to people and ultimately improving profits.
Effective questioning in meetings and leadership. 23:37
Jennifer Sundberg emphasizes the importance of asking the right questions in meetings to ensure accountability and precision.
She suggests using a software platform or knowledge management system to cascade questions across the organization and update them easily.
Jennifer Sundberg emphasizes the importance of asking questions in meetings to encourage open conversations and address underperformance.
Bethany raises concerns about politics and lack of clarity in meetings, and suggests addressing cultural issues to facilitate open communication.
Brandon observes that a casual coffee chat with colleagues leads to more open and organic discussions, resulting in valuable insights and revelations.
Jennifer suggests grouping agenda items into steering and supervisory categories, with separate meetings to accommodate different modes of thinking and responsibilities.
Effective communication through visual aids and self-explanatory reports. 31:42
Bethany raises an issue with the assumption that reports must be written in prose, citing her own dyslexia and preference for visual aids.
Jennifer agrees, emphasizing the importance of preparing self-explanatory materials that can stand on their own without a verbal narrative to support them.
Jennifer Sundberg emphasizes the importance of critical thinking in report production, suggesting that the process of creating these documents can lead to valuable insights and improved outcomes.
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30. Why is hybrid working an inclusivity issue?
15 Feb 2024
00:45:31
In this episode we unpack the topic of: Why is hybrid working an inclusivity issue?. We talked with Brian Elliott, he is the co-founder of Future Forum, author of the bestseller How the Future Works: Leading Flexible Teams to do the Best Work of Their Lives
We then discuss the following with Brian:
What does the data say on return to work and the push back from employees?
What is the connection between inclusivity and remote working?
What do you do when the CEO blames missed targets on remote working?
Is Thursday the new Friday?
Why is there resistance to remote working from senior execs?
What are the right policies or tactics one can take?
Prior to Future Forum, Brian spent 25 years building and leading teams and companies as a startup CEO, and as an executive at Google and Slack. Brian got his MBA from Harvard Business School and BA at Northwestern and started his career at Boston Consulting Group, where he’s now a Senior Advisor.
Brian is also the proud dad of two young men and one middle-aged dog. You can find Brian on LinkedIn.
Bethany discusses the challenges of hybrid working versus remote working, particularly for women dealing with intersectional issues such as discrimination and microaggressions.
Bethany shares her personal experience of lounging in bed doing crossword puzzles while working from home, highlighting the importance of work-life balance and personal preferences.
Bethany believes hybrid working and remote working are inclusion issues due to the disproportionate burden of child and elder care on women.
Microaggressions and lack of privacy in the workplace make it difficult for women to consistently attend in-office days, despite inclusive work environments.
Hybrid work and its impact on gender and privacy. 6:12
Brandon M highlights the disproportionate impact of hybrid work policies on women, particularly in childcare and eldercare responsibilities.
Bethany agrees, emphasizing the need for privacy and inclusivity in addressing health issues, suggesting that employees should not be required to share personal medical information with managers.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the future of work with Brian Elliot, co-founder of the Future Forum and author of "How the Future Works," focusing on hybrid working and the importance of trust and connection in the new work environment.
Brian shares his insights on the challenges and opportunities of hybrid working, including the need for leaders to adapt and learn how to manage and lead in a new way, and the importance of making connections and meeting people outside of work.
Remote work and its future in the workplace. 11:45
Brian Elliott agrees with Bethany's hypothesis that hybrid working is here to stay, and people will choose to leave jobs that don't offer flexible work arrangements.
Brian provides data from various sources, including his own research with Future Forum, to support the idea that more companies are adopting flexible work policies and fewer people are returning to the office.
Remote work and inclusivity in the workplace. 14:21
Brian Elliott: Companies are now open to hiring remote workers, leading to more distributed teams and a need for new management techniques.
Bethany: Inclusivity is key in hybrid work environments, with flexibility desired by historically marginalized groups.
Brian Elliott: 59% of working moms want to work from office 2 days a week or less, strongest in US and UK.
Data shows that people across race and ethnic boundaries prefer working from home, with greater flexibility for neurodiversity and disability.
Remote work, productivity, and culture in the workplace. 19:12
Brian Elliott highlights the importance of focusing on outcomes rather than visual signs of activity, such as showing up to the office.
Brandon M. addresses concerns from a CEO perspective, suggesting that instead of attributing working from home as the culprit for missed targets, the focus should be on building systems that reward people based on outcomes.
Brian Elliott suggests that CEOs should participate in digital tools and social conversations to build deeper connections with their teams and understand their emotional perspective.
Brian also shares that a flexible work policy can help build trust between employees and management, leading to increased motivation and productivity.
Bethany and Brian discuss the resistance to hybrid working, with Bethany identifying two elements: fear of control and fear of not being able to see people.
Brian suggests that senior leaders can use their own experiences to lead effectively in a new world, by having others around the table who live different lives.
In a group of chief financial officers, one member speaks up about the challenges of balancing work and family responsibilities, highlighting the need for empathy and understanding.
Work-life balance and inclusivity in a hybrid work setup. 28:19
Brian Elliott emphasizes the importance of representation and coaching in a hybrid work format to unlock potential and improve communication.
Brian recommends policies such as flexibility, short form video, and interactive communication to encourage inclusivity and bolster message delivery.
Brian Elliott highlights the importance of creating a level playing field in hybrid meetings by setting rules and encouraging equal participation, such as using one laptop per person and keeping virtual meetings virtual.
Slack's approach to hybrid meetings involves disassembling the traditional C suite floor and giving executives offices in different locations to avoid power dynamics and create a level playing field for all participants.
Brian Elliott suggests using asynchronous communication tools like Slack or Teams to address immediate work-related issues instead of relying on 30-minute video calls.
Brian Elliott recommends blending asynchronous and synchronous communication to improve productivity in hybrid teams.
Effective communication strategies for distributed teams. 35:18
Brian Elliott suggests using pre-reads to compress presentation time and increase engagement (35:18)
Brandon M. notes that in a hybrid Zoom setting, leaders may struggle to maintain engagement due to multitasking or disengagement (36:37)
Brian Elliott emphasizes the importance of internal communications in distributed teams, citing the example of Atkins, Slack's head of internal comms, who was "amazing" at building culture and...
29. What is it like being COO of a private equity backed business?
08 Feb 2024
00:52:28
In this episode we unpack the topic of: What is it like being COO of a private equity backed business?We are joined by Pete Harris, COO of Pipedrive.
Bethany and I discuss:
When are we at our best? Our worst?
What are we passionate about in a business context?
What is our why?
We then discuss the following with Pete:
Why the title COO versus CRO or CCO?
How are you being evaluated by your PE investors?
How do you motivate employees given you are not founder led?
What does a board meeting look like in PE backed companies?
What is the approach to compensation in a PE backed company?
As Chief Operating Officer for Pipedrive I am responsible for a broad range of value creation activities, including business strategy, execution, and Pipedrive’s approach to global markets - determining which markets we are in, why and associated investments. I work closely with our Board from Vista Equity Partners and Bessemer Partners.
Previously I led Global Business Development and Global Partnership team at Intuit - supporting our customers across the US, UK, Australia, France, Brazil, Mexico and our expansion markets. I also spent 12 years at Deloitte with roles including risk consulting in Financial Services, UK Innovation Lead and UK Ventures Lead. The latter involved managing a £25m fund to invest in external start-ups but also internally in those ideas that might change Deloitte from within.
Summary:
Lung health and private equity CEO experience. 0:06
Bethany Ayers discusses her experience with chest X rays and doctors' appointments after being diagnosed with COVID-19.
Brandon Mensa shares a story from his time at SwiftKey about ignoring chest discomfort and eventually getting an X ray after realizing it wasn't going away.
Brandon M experienced a spontaneous pneumothorax, where one of his lungs collapsed into his chest cavity, and was pumped back up with a tube inserted through his clavicle.
The medical team used a rudimentary method to insert the tube into Brandon's lung, and he was able to recover quickly.
Brandon and Bethany discuss the concept of "Y" or starting with why, as discussed by Simon Sinek, and how it relates to their discussion on the purpose of the company and its impact on the organization.
Bethany: feeling inauthentic or unwilling to express views can be at worst, hating having to do that.
Brandon M: tiredness can make him less present and less effective in leadership roles.
Bethany passionately advocates for gender equality and personal growth, reflecting on death and regret.
Unlocking potential and creating a fulfilling life. 10:27
Brandon M recognizes immense potential in individuals, both personally and professionally, and finds it exciting to work with companies to unlock this potential.
He believes that exercising these muscles through activities like acting helps him understand the human experience and apply it to his work in companies.
Brandon M: Why? To help teams fulfill their potential.
Bethany: Why? To create a fun life and inspire others.
Leadership roles and AI initiatives at Pipedrive. 15:32
Pete Harris oversees sales, partner, customer success, and customer support teams at Pipedrive, while also leading AI initiatives.
Pete Harris discusses his role as CEO of Pipedrive, focusing on AI initiatives and commercial growth.
CEO role, value creation, and long-term growth. 18:45
Pete Harris, CEO of Pipedrive, focuses on value creation plan to deliver success, with key metrics including net revenue retention and churn numbers.
PE investors evaluate Pete's success through delivery of value creation plan outcomes, with specific focus on revenue and retention numbers.
Entrepreneurs often prioritize short-term growth over long-term sustainability in their business strategies.
Growth vs margin in private equity investing. 22:32
Panelists debate whether growth or margin is more valuable in today's private equity market.
Pete Harris emphasizes the importance of balancing growth rate and margin in business, citing the "rule of 40" as a benchmark for success.
Bethany asks Pete if he still follows the "rule of 40" in private equity, and Pete confirms that it is still relevant and important for their business strategy.
Leadership, culture, and motivation in a 1000-person business. 26:47
Pete Harris: Founder lead plays a role in a company's culture and values, even after they leave. Holding on to that legacy can attract top talent and be a unique selling point.
Bethany: Charismatic leaders, whether founders or not, can play a significant role in shaping a company's culture and values.
Pete Harris emphasizes the importance of understanding one's "why" and purpose in work, citing it as a key factor in motivation and job satisfaction.
Harris believes that founders can play a significant role in shaping a company's culture and values, but acknowledges that not all founders are equipped to lead a business through its entire lifecycle.
Leadership, purpose, and private equity involvement in a business. 32:36
Brandon M emphasizes the importance of purpose and charismatic leadership in a company, citing it as a motivating factor for himself and others.
Pete Harris agrees, highlighting the need for alignment between personal purpose, mission, and what the business is doing. He believes that being a charismatic leader without being the founder is crucial for scaling up a company.
Harris also stresses the importance of authenticity in conveying the company's purpose and mission to employees and stakeholders.
Pete Harris describes the experience of working with a private equity (PE) firm, emphasizing the importance of confidence and alignment on the company's goals.
The PE firm has a formal agenda for board meetings, which can go in unexpected directions, focusing on metrics and growth.
Bethany asks about the frequency and rehearsal process of these meetings, with Pete Harris highlighting the importance of preparation and alignment as a team.
Board meetings and investor dynamics in a startup. 38:45
Bethany highlights the value of board meetings for VC-backed startups, where investors provide strategic support and challenge.
Board dynamics, compensation, and talent attraction in a PE-backed company. 40:31
Brandon M. emphasizes the importance of confidence in the founder and leadership team for the board to effectively contribute to the business.
Pete Harris highlights the value of having operating partners and investment partners on the board, bringing different perspectives and expertise to the table.
Pete Harris emphasizes the importance of attracting the right talent in a PE firm, with compensation being a key factor in doing so.
Brandon M asks about the approach to compensation in a PE company, with options being a common incentive for top management.
Pete Harris emphasizes the importance of understanding one's "why" and mapping it out to achieve success in their career.
Harris recommends using a blank sheet of paper to draw a "circle of why" to identify one's purpose and goals.
Pete Harris believes that understanding one's "why" can serve as a navigation system for both career and life decisions.
Harris encourages others to identify their "why" and use it as a guide for making decisions and setting goals, even in unrelated areas like volunteering or hobbies.
Pete Harris suggests asking "What's your why?" to uncover personal...
47. What are the priorities for COO's in 2024? Part 2
14 Jun 2024
00:47:17
In this episode we discuss: The Future COO in Tech Companies. We are joined by Tony Olvet and Andrea Siviero from IDC.
We chat about the following:
How do COOs navigate the evolving landscape of digital transformation while ensuring organisational stability?
What are the key priorities for COOs in 2024, and how do they drive strategic thinking beyond technology?
What role do COOs play as the connective tissue of organisations, orchestrating digital initiatives and driving innovation?
How can COOs transition from being protectors of the organisation to digital disruptors, driving new revenue models and ESG initiatives?
What skills are essential for CEOs and COOs to thrive in today's digital age, and how do they communicate the future state of the organisation effectively?
Tony Olvet, Group Vice President at IDC, leads global research on the intersection of business transformation and digital investments. With extensive experience advising organizations worldwide, Tony provides fact-based insights to inform technology strategy and digital business decisions. A sought-after speaker, he delivers keynote presentations at conferences and virtual events. Based in Toronto, Canada, Tony holds degrees from the University of Waterloo and the University of Toronto.
Andrea Siviero leads IDC's European Digital Business and Future of Work Research group, providing insights to drive purposeful technology adoption. He also co-leads IDC's Worldwide MacroTech Research program, analyzing the impact of key macroeconomic factors on the digital landscape. With extensive experience in strategy and go-to-market projects, Andrea advises IT players on building forward-looking digital strategies. He holds a joint PhD in mathematics and is fluent in English, French, and Italian.
To learn more about Beth and Brandon or to find out about sponsorship opportunities click here.
Summary:
Cricket and personal life, including death and ex-fiance. 0:00
Bethany shares her struggles with grief after an unexpected death of a teenager, while Brandon listens and offers support.
Bethany and Brandon discuss their past relationship and reasons for reconnecting.
Career changes, life lessons, and tech CEO priorities. 3:08
Bethany and Brandon M discuss their experiences working with Tony Elvet at IDC.
Brandon M reflects on his decision to leave London and return to Toronto, and how it impacted his career.
Brandon M shared his experiences as a tech CEO with a research report, discussing new priorities and future orientation.
Bethany asked Brandon about his insights on CEO priorities, which were included in the report, with little fundamental change observed.
CEO role, digital transformation, and AI adoption in businesses. 7:13
Brandon M: CEO role in 2024: partnering with finance leaders, making investment bets.
Bethany: High performance culture: how to make it happen, translate into business.
Brandon M: Digital transformation is not always transformative, but AI is a real transformation for all companies.
Bethany: AI is the top priority for businesses in the next 5 years, but digital transformation has been on agendas for years without being transformative.
CEO qualities and skills, with a focus on storytelling and operational abilities. 12:25
Bethany shares her thoughts on the qualities of a successful CEO, mentioning the importance of both vision and execution.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the contrasting views on the path to becoming a CEO, with some arguing that it's more common for CEOs to come from within the company.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the importance of storytelling in business, with Brandon highlighting the founder's ability to communicate the company's vision and mission in a compelling way.
Brandon recognizes his own limitations in storytelling and acknowledges that there's a time and place for different types of leaders, including those with strong communication skills.
Storytelling, leadership, and CEO responsibilities in 2024. 17:01
Bethany shares her insights on storytelling for senior leaders and execs, emphasizing authenticity and bravery in communication.
Bethany reflects on her own storytelling capacity, recognizing the importance of being true to oneself and sharing uncomfortable thoughts with others.
Bethany: Became braver over time, prioritizing connection over fear of consequences (0:19:19)
Brandon M: Unlocking skills in CEOs is fundamental, but role of COO unclear (0:20:33)
COO roles, priorities, and partnerships in digital transformation. 21:30
Brandon M: SaaS software for career progression frameworks is emerging, addressing the need for simplified and clear frameworks.
Bethany: CEOs should be aware of the tendency to over engineer, especially in scaled companies, and take a step back to assess if too much is being expected.
Bethany and Speaker 4 discuss the importance of partnership between CEO and CLO in digital transformation.
Speaker 4 highlights the difference in priorities and impact between scale-up companies and larger corporations.
The COO is the right-hand person to the CEO, providing capable partnership and support.
COOs partner with various C-suite executives, including CIOs, to drive growth and innovation.
CEO roles, responsibilities, and evolution in 2024. 28:29
CIOs are increasingly seen as essential for organizational success, with 85% of CEOs having risen through the ranks to their position.
Andrea highlights the evolution of the CEO role, from protector to enabler and digital disruptor.
Brandon M. asks about the hottest new function for CEOs in 2024, with a focus on ESG and customer success.
Roles and responsibilities for AI adoption in enterprises. 32:31
CEOs prioritize responsible AI leadership, COO involvement in decision-making.
COO will play a crucial role in buying committee for operational technology in manufacturing.
CEO role in driving sustainability and social impact initiatives. 36:33
CEO and COO prioritize sustainability and ESG initiatives.
Bethany asks about tools for measuring social impact, and Speaker 4 explains the complexity of defining and measuring social impact.
Brandon M discusses the evolving skills of CEOs, including their role in driving transformation and partnering with other senior executives.
Leadership skills for tech industry CEOs, focusing on communication and adaptability. 41:14
Communication skills crucial for motivating through change.
Tony and Andrea discussed the importance of communicating the future state of an organization and being able to adjust to unexpected events.
They emphasized the need for CEOs to dedicate 70% of their time to traditional tasks and 30% to unexpected events.
Martyn Fagg is a seasoned CTO with 20 years experience in software engineering and fintech leadership - passionate about fostering innovation, collaboration, and continuous learning. Currently COO at Tillo, a B2B embedded rewards & incentives platform working with some of the world’s top brands to deliver real-time digital gift & prepaid cards.
Matt Jones recently served as the Group Chief Operating Officer at ParentPay, a leading provider of payments and MIS solutions for schools in the UK and Europe. He joined the company in 2017 and initially held responsibility for Product Management, Software Engineering, IT, Service Operations, Customer Implementation, and Customer Support across several early Group businesses (ParentPay, Schoolcomms, Cypad, WIS, and nimbl). Additionally, Matt oversaw the group Security function, ensuring the protection of the company's and customers' data assets.
Prior to his tenure at ParentPay, Matt briefly served as COO at IRIS Software. He also spent six years as Senior Vice President of DevOps at NewVoiceMedia (acquired by Vonage) and held previous roles at Mimecast and MessageLabs (acquired by Symantec).
Summary:
Product development in CEO role with Twilio and Parent Pay leaders. 0:06
Brandon and Bethany discuss their cultural heritage for a school event, with Brandon dressing as a tech bro from Silicon Valley and Bethany dressing as a Canadian with a hockey jersey and maple syrup.
The hosts joke about stereotypes and cultural representations, with Brandon accidentally saying "boot" instead of "boot" and Bethany pointing it out.
Brandon M. questions the importance of good product leadership, emphasizing the need for a clear product vision and strategy, as well as effective team building.
Martin Fag, Matt Jones, and Brandon M. discuss the role of product development in the CEO role, with a focus on product leadership, strategy, and team building.
Product leadership and CEO roles in tech companies. 4:50
The CEO and product leader roles require different skills and perspectives, with the CEO focusing on the overall vision and strategy, and the product leader translating that vision into a tangible product.
The product leader must be empowered to take ownership of the vision and make it a reality, while the CEO can evolve their role to focus on other aspects of the business.
CEO and product leader have different visions for product strategy, leading to potential conflicts.
Brandon M highlights the importance of product managers understanding users, market dynamics, and stakeholder management to ensure a product's success.
Bethany agrees, noting that product managers often focus too much on technical details and not enough on validating with customers and stakeholders.
Brandon M discusses Marty Kagan's philosophy of product development, emphasizing the importance of empowered teams with autonomy, resources, and scope to solve problem areas.
Bethany agrees and adds that being given a problem to solve, rather than features to build, is crucial for product development teams to make a difference.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the role of a good product person and CEO, with Bethany highlighting the importance of being able to pull oneself up and out of the weeds.
Martin fell into the role of CEO as an opportunity after growing the company from six to 50 people and wanting a new challenge.
Martin, a former software developer and CTO, now CRO, has been managing people for 15 years and enjoys the people side of things, working closely with Briney, VP of people.
Martin took on the people function as CRO, bringing a unique perspective as he has the largest proportion of the company reporting into him, and he works closely with the executive team to bring a commercial and business perspective.
Managing people and teams in a cross-functional environment. 21:53
Matt Jones highlights the importance of managing people as individuals, not just roles, in a cross-functional organization.
Using data to inform people policies in a business setting. 23:18
Matt Jones and Bethany discuss the importance of data in people policies, with Matt agreeing that data can provide insights into people's performance and wellbeing, while Bethany struggles with getting people teams to own and use accurate data.
Both Matt and Bethany agree that there needs to be a clear owner of people data, such as a business ops team, to ensure accuracy and better decision-making.
Data governance, culture, and retrospectives in a company. 26:22
Martin emphasizes the importance of data-driven decision making in people operations, with a focus on employee happiness and retention rates.
Brandon and Martin discuss the importance of collaboration and continuous learning within the product development team, with a focus on embedding retros and learning outside of product.
Martin highlights the need for a champion within the team to drive initiatives and ensure ongoing adoption, with regular check-ins and feedback to gauge effectiveness.
Using "5 Whys" to identify root causes of problems in business. 30:05
Matt Jones shares his experience with using retrospectives to drive improvement in teams, emphasizing the importance of psychological safety and a simple five whys process.
He faces challenges in implementing retrospectives across different functions and cultures, citing a lack of buy-in and psychological safety.
Product-dev collaboration, agile methodologies, and software engineering. 32:19
Bethany and Martin discuss the challenge of different departments within a company not sharing knowledge and resources, despite being in the same industry.
Martin and Matt discuss the challenges of measuring productivity in software development, with a focus on the differences between short-term and long-term goals, and the need to prioritize creativity and outcomes over process productivity.
Matt argues that software engineering is a creative undertaking, and that agile methodologies can help align development with personalities and produce better outputs by focusing on outcomes rather than in-process productivity.
OKRs, product development metrics, and trust in the CFO-CEO relationship....
27. How do you tame a visionary CEO?
25 Jan 2024
00:45:46
In this episode we unpack the topic of: How do you tame a visionary CEO? with Rob Liddiard, B2B SaaS Founder (acquired 2022); Reformed Lawyer.
Bethany and I discuss the following:
Forecasting in 2024
Simplifying performance management
Surfacing issues in leadership
Documenting the processes of the company
We then discuss the following with Rob:
Is the Entrepreneurial Operating System (EOS) just another OKR styled book?
I previously founded a software company called Yapster. Although we had 100,000 licensed users, amazing customers like Next plc, Brewdog, Krispy Kreme and Caffe Nero and the business looked healthy to outsiders, we secretly struggled internally to execute plans and hit our financial goals. I worked and stressed 24/7. I was a qualified Corporate Lawyer and experienced Businessperson, but I didn’t feel a success. All I could feel was the underlying tension in my leadership team and investor base.
Then I read Gino Wickman’s Traction and it was like someone turned a light on. I realised that I hadn’t been leading my organisation to its potential. By adopting EOS’s simple habits and frameworks we quickly achieved Traction. Suddenly I was more successful at work and more relaxed at home.
In late 2022 I sold Yapster to a company backed by Google. I’ve since qualified as a Professional EOS Implementer® and now my personal Mission is to help other UK business owners achieve their goals more quickly, with less frustration.
Summary:
Golf inclusivity and personal experiences with the sport. 0:06
Bethany Ayers and Brandon Mensa discuss golf and inclusion with guest Rob, with Ayers sharing her experience at a virtual driving range and appreciating Rob's proactive approach to inclusivity.
Bethany Ayers shares personal experiences with golf and her grandfather's intense passion for the sport, despite exclusion of women in the family.
Entrepreneurial operating system and vision alignment. 4:18
Brandon: Book provides a prescriptive set of steps for non-experienced companies to run their businesses efficiently.
Bethany: Book offers a structure for strategy days, with exercises and time allocations for each area, saving time and effort.
Bethany Ayers discusses the importance of aligning to a vision and creating a three-year plan, with regular revisions to ensure accountability and profitability.
Ayers highlights the challenges of budgeting in a changing world where cash is no longer free, and the need to focus on cache management across multiple years.
Brandon and Bethany agree that the "right people in the right seats" framework is simple and effective in evaluating employee performance (10 words)
Traction recommends using a scorecard and weekly pulse to track leading indicators of KPIs (20 words)
Bethany Ayers emphasizes the importance of tracking key metrics, such as ticket clearance times and pipe Gen, to identify and address issues in a timely manner.
She believes that having a weekly scorecard with 5-10 metrics can help the team stay disciplined and proactive in addressing problems, leading to better customer experiences and overall success.
Leadership, processes, and accountability in a business setting. 15:09
Bethany Ayers highlights the importance of understanding the interconnectedness of different functions within a company, and how this knowledge can help resolve issues more effectively.
Brandon emphasizes the value of documenting processes between functions to avoid siloed thinking and improve collaboration.
Brandon and Bethany discuss the book "Traction" by Gabriel Weinberg, which emphasizes the importance of meetings for accountability and using OKRs (Objectives and Key Results) to set goals.
Rob Leyard, CEO of Eos, shares his "come to Jesus moment" when he realized the importance of operations after almost failing due to neglecting it.
Challenges with global rollout of software product. 20:50
Rob struggles to explain why his company's global rollout failed despite initial success.
Entrepreneurship, leadership, and managing visionary CEOs. 22:30
Rob shares his personal story of struggling with his tech startup, including not getting paid for 7 months and experiencing marital problems.
Bethany Ayers commends Rob for his honesty and openness, and shares that many entrepreneurs can relate to his challenges.
Rob recognizes that working with visionary CEOs can be challenging due to their unique perspective and potential lack of clarity on their company's identity and goals.
Rob's approach to taming visionary CEOs involves recognizing the problem, understanding their perspective, and using practical tools like EOS to help them achieve their dreams while aligning with reality.
Business strategy and operations for startups. 26:35
Rob is frustrated that his business is not growing despite his charisma and support, and he suspects that he may be doing something wrong.
The book "Excellent Entrepreneur" provides a framework for businesses to run coherently, with six components: vision, data, process, traction, issues, and people.
Brandon and Rob discuss the importance of a clear vision and traction plan for startups, including creating a one-page business plan and setting quarterly strategic initiatives.
They also emphasize the need for data-driven decision making and consistent processes across the organization to drive accountability and good habits.
EOS framework for entrepreneurs and operators. 31:51
Rob emphasizes the importance of identifying and solving root causes, rather than just discussing them.
Bethany Ayers agrees and adds that there are two roles in EOS, and taming comes into play.
Rob: EOS model requires visionary to identify integrator, who is CIO and essential for success.
Bethany Ayers: Using EOS playbook can help find common language between operator and visionary, elevating professional operator to center of organization.
Entrepreneurship, EOS, and the role of operators. 36:07
Rob, a passionate advocate of EOS, shares insights on how individuals can help visionaries in stuck organizations by taking control of their own careers and self-esteem.
Rob suggests creating a personalized explanation of EOS components and how working with Brandon can help organizations move forward.
Rob is open to creating his own operating system after finding success with EOS and reading other business books.
Rob believes that finding a system that works and elevating operators to their rightful place in the entrepreneurial community is enough for him, and he now preaches the gospel of operation excellence to others.
Effective meetings and organizational alignment. 41:13
Brandon and Rob discuss creating an L10 meeting, which involves starting with a segue, reviewing rocks, looking at the scorecard, and addressing issues.
The meeting agenda includes a fixed agenda, and issues are reviewed and prioritized for solving in the next week or quarter.
Rob emphasizes the importance of finding a workplace where you are appreciated and implementing a system to manage growth and issues effectively.
Rob encourages listeners to explore different systems and not settle for a company that is happy living in chaos, and to give them the opportunity to come meet them where they are.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
26. The COO Role: Why Would You Ever Want the Job?
18 Jan 2024
00:46:14
In this episode we unpack the topic of: The COO Role: Why Would You Ever Want the Job? with Chuck Orzechowski, CEO of the COO Forum.
Bethany and I discuss the following:
How do you avoid being the dumping ground for things that others don’t want to do?
Why would you want the COO job?
We then discuss the following with Chuck:
What are the most common issues you see across your COO membership?
What is the best approach to clarifying decision-making authority with the CEO?
Why is “pace of change” a common frustration for COO’s?
What do you do when the CEO relationship is not working for you?
What is the key criteria for determining a good COO-CEO match?
What are the rewarding elements of being a COO?
References
The COO Forum® has been delivering on the mission of helping Operations Executives achieve more since 2004. Our members tackle the most pressing challenges facing their businesses and those that shape their careers. Join the best Operations Executives in the world as we celebrate our 20th Anniversary. Don't go it alone in 2024.
Launching this February, Find Your COO™ will provide CEOs/Recruiters a one-stop source for finding talented COOs. The platform is built on top of the CEO-COO Alignment Index™ scoring system. It uses 25 key questions to create profiles for both the hiring CEO and COO candidates. These questions cover areas such as preferred communication frequency, speed of change, role relationship, delegation, trust development and more. Then, both parties can see each other's scoring reports to better assess potential fit or mis-alignment. This sets the stage for improved recruitment, interviewing and alignment post hire, which leads to better performance and COO job satisfaction.
Biography: Chuck Orzechowski serves as CEO of the Chief Operating Officer Business Forum® (COO Forum®.) Since 2004, the COO Forum’s mission has been to support operations executives in achieving more in their business and professional lives. As a peer-based professional development organization, the COO Forum has helped 1000’s of executives navigate the challenges of their roles and improve business outcomes.
Over the past 28 years, Chuck has spent most of his career leading operations in a wide variety of industries and company sizes, ranging from start-up through Fortune 500s. Chuck has a passion for improving operations, scaling businesses, and the professional development of others.
It’s what gets him out of bed each morning...that and coffee!
Brandon and Bethany discuss Bethany's husband's illness and their celebration with whiskey advent calendars.
Brandon attends a Danko Jones concert at the Garage in North Islington, describing the band as a fusion of rock, punk, and jazz.
Brandon mentions a mosh pit at a concert where he was the "enforcer" to push back, but he was not tempted to join due to his age and past experiences.
Bethany has been reflecting on her values and purpose in life, realizing that having fun is her guiding principle, and she's looking for innovative and energizing experiences that bring her joy.
Bethany was approached to become a CEO but lacked passion and interest in the domain, leading to her rejection in the final interview.
Despite feeling relieved to not have to present, Bethany's lack of enthusiasm was picked up on by the only woman on the board, who ultimately decided not to move forward with her candidacy.
CEO roles, delegation, and avoiding unnecessary work. 7:21
Bethany shares her realization that she doesn't want to leave her children a large inheritance and instead wants to prioritize their education as their inheritance.
Brandon questions the appeal of the CEO role and why Bethany would want the job, given her newfound priorities and interests.
Brandon and Bethany discuss how operations professionals can avoid taking on tasks that nobody else wants to do, such as ISO certification or back-office work.
Brandon suggests delegating tasks to others or hiring someone to handle them, while Bethany agrees and shares her own experience of successfully pushing off ISO certification to others.
Both Brandon and Bethany emphasize the importance of owning your role and delegating tasks to others to avoid taking on too much work that you're not passionate about.
Bethany highlights the variety and problem-solving aspects of being a CEO as a source of enjoyment.
Bethany desires the CEO role for the authority and accountability it provides, as well as the opportunity for a deep relationship with one person.
Brandon enjoys connecting the dots to make a company successful, and he finds it fascinating to analyze data and trends to inform go-to-market motions.
Brandon also enjoys coaching others, whether it's helping them rise in their careers or gain confidence, and he finds it both altruistic and selfish.
Chuck identifies the top 2 challenges faced by operations executives: misalignment between the CFO and CEO, and scaling the business while dealing with people challenges such as decision making. (20 words)
Bethany asks Chuck about the most common complaints and challenges she hears from new members, and Chuck shares his own war stories and insights. (10 words)
CEO makes decisions differently than operations executives, with a unique perspective that's difficult for others to understand.
Communication is key to understanding CEO decision-making process and partnering with them to offload some decisions.
CEO role, decision-making, and pace of change in organizations. 26:09
Brandon and Chuck discuss the challenges of decision-making as a CEO, including the need to balance facilitating the leadership team with making decisions as a group.
Chuck mentions the importance of documenting the decision-making process to avoid confusion and ensure consistency, particularly when it comes to the pace of change within an organization.
Chuck shares his personal story of joining a startup as COO and making changes despite the owner's return from sabbatical.
Navigating a business with a non-alignment CEO. 29:47
Chuck wanted to analyze financials to understand business growth and make decisions to improve the CEO's life.
Chuck saw the profit and loss statement but not the balance sheet or forecast, despite requests, and struggled to align goals and decision-making with the CEO.
Chuck emphasizes the importance of communication and decision-making in a CEO-peer relationship, particularly when the CEO's expectations are not aligned with reality.
Brandon advises peers to assess their ability to operate in the CEO's environment and make decisions based on their own needs and goals.
Leadership hires, values, and styles in business. 34:25
Bethany observes that 50% of leadership hires fail, and hypothesizes that this is due to leaders' inability to adapt to different situations and cultures.
Chuck believes leadership assessments are less important than alignment in a CEO-CFO relationship, focusing on communication, decision-making, trust, and growth expectations.
Chuck is developing an CEO alignment index to help organizations identify the right CFO fit, based on a candidate's desire for change and growth, and alignment with the CEO's vision.
CEO matchmaking platform assesses alignment between CEO's preferences and role requirements.
Chuck highlights the importance of people skills for COOs, who often serve as a buffer between the CEO and rest of the organization.
Brandon asks an unconventional question about the CEO forum, which includes CEOs from various industries, emphasizing the people-based nature of software development and collaboration.
Chuck emphasizes the importance of communication and alignment among...
25. Do COO's have a two year shelf life?
11 Jan 2024
00:37:30
In this episode we ask the unpack the question of: Do COO's have a two year shelf life? We discussed this topic with Casey Woo, CEO @Operators Guild.
We discuss the following with Casey:
What is the role of the COO?
Why does the COO have a two year shelf life?
If that is the reality, how should one think about their career?
What does this mean for 4 year option grants?
What are the key terms every COO should negotiate?
Casey Woo is a seasoned multi-stage operator and 7x CFO with over two decades of experience in business operations and finance from investment banking on Wall Street to Silicon Valley tech start-ups.
Casey now leads 800+ CFOs, COOs, and Biz Ops company builders as the co-founder of Operators Guild, a community for professionals in strategic finance and operations roles. He believes strongly that community is what makes the difference for start-ups and professionals.
When he’s not working, Casey is spending time in California’s Bay Area with his wife and three children.
Brandon and Bethany discuss their least favorite piece of software, with Brandon naming Microsoft Teams as his least favorite and Bethany agreeing due to its poor performance on Macs.
Both agree that the entire Microsoft suite, including Word, has always been problematic and frustrating to use.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the pros and cons of Google Docs and Microsoft 365 for collaboration, with Bethany preferring Google Docs for its ease of use and collaboration features.
Brandon shares his experience of transitioning from Microsoft to Google Docs, finding it difficult to adjust to the new platform but ultimately appreciating its collaboration capabilities.
Bethany: Transition from growth to optimization occurs around 50 million in revenue and 250 employees.
Brandon: First two phases of growth and commercialization are enjoyable, but third phase of optimization is less enjoyable and happens around 50 million in revenue and 250 employees.
Communicating option value to employees and talent acquisition teams. 7:57
Bethany suggests using a product like Lecce to help employees understand the value of their options and how they vest over time.
Brandon agrees that communicating the value of options as part of compensation is important, and notes that their company could have done a better job of this in the past.
Brandon and Bethany discuss the importance of educating employees on option grants and their value, including providing a clear framework for career progression and regular updates on the terms and benefits of option grants.
Casey Woo, founder of the Operator's Guild, shares his experience of implementing option grants for employees, including tying them to job role and seniority, and providing awards for top performers to increase their options.
Casey Woo shares insights from 35,000 hours of listening and talking to CEOs, highlighting the diverse reasons why people want to be CEOs, including wide impact and not being a CFO or salesperson.
Woo challenges the common view of CEOs as a single role, emphasizing the various perspectives and responsibilities held by CEOs in different companies and stages of growth.
Casey Woo argues that a CEO's role is not just one person, but rather a complement to the CEO and a gap filler.
CEO roles, decision-making, and power dynamics. 16:53
CEOs face unique challenges, including rapidly changing roles and delicate power dynamics with other executives.
Casey Woo emphasizes the importance of clear decision-making roles and responsibilities in a CEO-founder relationship, avoiding confusion and undermining the CEO's authority.
Bethany agrees, citing decision-making power as a common challenge, particularly with founder CEOs, and discussing strategies to address it.
Bethany and Casey discuss the role of a CEO in a scale-up company, with Bethany advocating for a two-year vesting schedule and Casey suggesting a step-two approach to becoming a CRO or CFO.
Casey emphasizes the importance of understanding the expectations and limitations of a two-year CEO role, and how it can lead to a more successful transition to a permanent position.
Stock options in the UK and US, with insights on vesting schedules, taxes, and exercise windows. 24:01
Bethany learned that cliff vesting options, where only a portion of options vest after a certain time, was common in the UK 10-15 years ago but is no longer used.
Bethany and Casey Woo discussed the challenges of stock options, including high exercise costs, limited time windows, and uneven vesting schedules.
Options for early-stage companies in the UK and US. 26:33
Brandon and Casey discuss the differences in UK and US options laws, with the UK offering lower strike prices and longer exercise windows.
Casey argues that it's employee-friendly for companies to offer longer exercise windows, as early-stage companies need time to reach value.
Bethany and Casey Woo discuss the importance of negotiating options and understanding the terms, including strike price, vesting, and good lever provisions.
They emphasize the value of having a clear understanding of these terms to protect one's interests and maximize the potential of options.
Equity compensation and career growth for scale-ups. 31:18
Brandon recommends revising the Articles of Association to ensure board discretionary ownership doesn't affect an entrepreneur's livelihood.
Casey Woo agrees and adds that double trigger or single trigger acceleration of vesting is important for operators and senior operators in the event of a change of control.
Casey Woo emphasizes the importance of understanding the stage of a company and its evolution when negotiating compensation and setting career goals.
Casey encourages listeners to be realistic about their expectations and to transform and exit the company within a set timeframe, rather than staying for an extended period without achieving goals.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
24. Leadership Transitions: Uncompromising Strategies for Success
04 Jan 2024
00:45:38
In this episode we unpack the topic of: Leadership Transitions: Uncompromising Strategies for Success with Andrew Duncan, Talent @ Atomico (ex-UpGroup) and Maddy Cross Partner @ Erevena (ex-Notion Capital)
We discuss the following with Maddy and Andrew:
Given the average tenure of senior execs in scaleups, what advice would you give execs and what should companies that are hiring consider?
How uncompromising do you need to be to get the right leaders in place?
What is the difference in leadership skills needed between early and late stage?
Do we need someone that has been there and done that?
What is the right mix of experience needed for a leadership team?
Maddy Cross is a Partner at Erevena, an Executive Search firm focussed on investor backed businesses, where she leads the European Technology and Engineering practice for B2B. Previously she was Talent Director at Notion Capital, a $1bn B2B SaaS focussed VC, and she holds an MBA from London Business School.
Andrew is a Talent Director at Atomico, one of Europe's largest venture capital funds. He supports portfolio companies in finding and hiring elite executive talent and is responsible for advising founders on the evolution of their leadership teams. Previously, he spent time building executive teams while at Kindred Partners (San Francisco) and The Up Group (London).
Bethany Ayers discusses her frustration with the UK's lack of progress in legalizing cannabis, citing the ease of access and variety of strains available in the US.
Brandon Mensing agrees, noting that alcohol is often used as a stress reliever in the evening but can have negative effects on the body.
Bethany researches cannabis for blood sugar control and weight loss, finding limited evidence but potential benefits for women.
UK legalized cannabis for medical use five years ago, but limited access and high costs for patients.
Bethany and Brandon discuss leadership transitions with Andrew Duncan and Maddie Krause, with a focus on the ideal tenure for executives (2-4 years) and how to handle executives with shorter tenures.
Maddie shares advice on how to handle executives who have experienced a shorter tenure than they would have wanted, emphasizing the importance of empathy and support.
CMO tenure and leadership in enterprise software companies. 8:03
Duncan notes short tenures for CMOs in tech, but highlights successful cases.
Executive tenure and its impact on career growth. 9:45
Maddie Cross and Andrew Duncan discuss the nuances of being asked to leave a business, with Maddie sharing examples of sensitive departures where people have stayed in the company for years after being asked to leave their original role.
Andrew adds that for senior execs, especially those later in their careers, market timing can play a role in their ability to find new opportunities, and talent professionals should consider this when evaluating candidates.
Both Maddie and Andrew emphasize the importance of handling departures with sensitivity and respect, and providing support to help people move on to new opportunities.
Maddie Cross highlights the importance of considering tenure in the context of each function, as marketing and people roles tend to have shorter tenures in high-growth b2b software companies.
Andrew Duncan asks if the same tenure standards apply across functions, with CFOs having shorter tenures due to their specific roles and responsibilities.
Leadership decisions and ruthlessness in business. 15:49
Andrew Duncan and Brandon discuss the importance of assessing someone's background and experience to determine their fit for a business, and the potential for short tenure in leadership positions.
Maddie Cross emphasizes the need for ruthless decision-making in leadership positions, but also stresses the importance of being direct and constructive in those decisions.
Founders, investors, and executives are having harder conversations about business performance and course of action.
Bethany and Maddie discuss the challenges of making difficult decisions as a founder, including sequencing and taking advice from trusted individuals.
Maddie suggests breaking down the decision-making process into smaller, more manageable steps to avoid feeling overwhelmed and making no decisions at all.
Leadership skills and expectations at different stages of a company's growth. 22:31
Andrew Duncan notes that companies have had to develop internal communications plans to effectively communicate sensitive decisions to their organizations, particularly in the last 12-18 months.
Bethany asks Andrew about fundamental changes in skills and expectations at the BC-D to IPO stage, and what leaders bring to the table.
Andrew Duncan: Executives in later stages may prioritize process management over working in the business.
Bethany: Communication and delegation become more challenging in later stages, with many layers between leaders and those doing work.
Maddie Cross suggests having a mix of experienced leaders and up-and-coming talent on a leadership team for a healthy balance of perspectives and skills.
Brandon agrees and adds that a mix of both types of individuals can provide a more well-rounded leadership team, with the caveat that everyone needs to know their role and responsibilities.
Maddie Cross analyzed two groups of b2b software companies: unicorns (valued at over $2B) and less successful ones.
Key differences between the two groups include the range of years of prior experience (tighter delta in less successful companies) and educational background (more people from top universities in successful companies).
Leadership team gaps and hiring decisions in early-stage companies.
23. Cracking the Code: Exploring Emotional Literacy and Embodiment Part 2
28 Dec 2023
00:49:10
In this episode we unpack the topic of: "Cracking the Code: Exploring Emotional Literacy and Embodiment” This is Part 2 in our emotional literacy and embodiment series. Our special guests are returning alumni with Divinia Knowles, Founder of the COO Roundtable and Maddie Fox, a leadership development coach across venture-backed organisations. We are also joined by Pippa Richardson, Somatic Therapist, Educator, Speaker and Clinician.
We discuss the following with Pippa, Maddie and Divinia:
Our personal journey’s into embodiment
What do we disconnect from our body?
What is dysregulation?
How do you manage through a day of back-to-back meetings?
How do you bring embodiment into the day-to-day?
Biography:
Pippa is a highly regarded Somatic Therapist, Educator, Speaker and Clinician. She has lived experience and clinical expertise in the areas of trauma, eating disorders, addiction, recovery and healing. With over 10 years experience of working and studying in the field of embodiment, body-centred therapies and psychosomatics, both in clinical and non-clinical settings. Her work lies at the intersection of psyche (mind) and soma (body) and she is passionate about supporting her clients to live an embodied, meaningful life.
Alongside her clinical work, Pippa leads talks, retreats and workshops both in the UK and abroad. She has a broad range of experience working with individuals, groups and organisations including the US Military, Save The Children, Bamford, Manolo Blahnik - as well as with leadership executives and professional athletes. Her work aims to provide thought provoking environments to explore the human experience with curiosity, kindness and compassion.
Divinia was COO, CFO & a director at both Mind Candy and Pact Coffee, where she also served as interim CEO. She has held or still holds chair and board seats at too many companies to list and is occasionally an angel investor. Divinia re-trained as a coach in 2017 and combined it with her previous experience to become the COO Coach, working with start up/scale up COOs/CEOs to help guide them through successfully starting up, scaling up and exiting. And in addition to all that, she is also the Founder of the London COO Roundtable, a community that brings operations professionals together to define what it means to be a highly effective startup and scale up Chief Operating Officer.
Maddie has over 20 years experience in HR and Learning & Development working with various organizations from corporate to fast growing tech, in Europe, the US and Australia. She is an ICF accredited executive coach, leadership and HR consultant with a wide range of experience, however specialising in developing leaders from emerging leaders to seasoned CEO’s, building high-performing sustainable teams and helping clients successfully navigate change. Her style is eclectic, using research, theory and direct experiences to ensure individuals find ways to effectively embed new behaviours, build resilience and deliver results. More recently she has been working in VC backed start-ups, series A-B, working for mostly founder led businesses as a Chief People Officer, Leadership Coach and Advisor. Clients include Blippar, Lantum, Trint, Mixcloud, amongst others.
Bethany shares her experience at an EQ event for people and talent, feeling like an imposter among mostly women in leadership roles.
People and talent leadership, strategic conversations, and IT budgets. 2:13
Bethany highlights the importance of the people team being involved in strategic decision-making and having a seat at the leadership table.
Brandon agrees, emphasizing the need for people leaders to be proactive in thinking through the implications of choices made by the leadership team, particularly in terms of human resources and operations.
Brandon and Bethany discuss the importance of people leaders having control over their IT budgets and understanding people ops and analytics to run the business effectively.
Bethany suggests that combining thinking and feeling perspectives can create a powerful combination for business success.
Embodiment and acting techniques for emotional connection. 7:00
Brandon struggles with abstract concept of embodiment, citing communication issues in his career.
Brandon discovered that traditional communications training was ineffective and found acting classes to be more helpful in understanding the human condition and connecting with others.
The Meisner technique, which includes the repetition exercise, was instrumental in Brandon's acting development and ability to connect with others on stage.
Brandon describes Meisner technique as "mesmerizing" and "emotionally difficult" but ultimately "spectacular" for connecting with others.
Bethany shares how she discovered her body through acting and wants to hear others' experiences to inspire new ways of embodiment.
Somatic practice and its connection to leadership and emotions. 14:10
Divinia bumps into Nick Kitchen, an executive coach with a somatic practice, and learns about the disconnect between people's words and body language during team coaching supervision.
Maddie's curiosity about the body and mind led her to explore somatic coaching, which she found helpful in connecting with her body and sensations.
Maddie notes that while Pilates can be a helpful exercise practice, it's possible to do it in an objectified way that's disconnected from the body, and that somatic coaching offers a more embodied approach to movement and self-awareness.
Therapy, embodiment, and yoga for body positivity. 21:01
Bethany finds solace in yoga after years of therapy, feeling more grounded and centered.
Bethany discovers joy in embodiment through PIPA, undoing years of yoga conditioning.
Disconnection from body and its impact on society. 24:48
Pippa argues that disconnection from the body can limit connection and joy, and is reinforced by systemic factors.
Maddie and Divinia discuss the importance of recognizing and addressing unregulated stress in the body, which can lead to physical sensations like pain or anxiety.
Divinia explains that unregulated stress can manifest in various ways, including physical sensations, behaviors, and emotions, and that it's important to identify and release this stored trauma to move forward.
Autonomic nervous system and stress regulation. 29:22
Pippa references autonomic nervous system, explaining sympathetic (accelerator) and parasympathetic (brake) states, and how body signals can indicate stress or anticipation.
Dysregulation occurs when the body's stress response system becomes overloaded, leading to difficulty regulating emotions and behaviors.
Maddie suggests incorporating intentional pauses between meetings to improve presence and productivity.
Brandon and Maddie discuss the challenges of maintaining energy and focus throughout the workday, particularly for senior executives.
Maddie suggests practices outside of work, such as yoga or exercise, can help increase resilience and presence in meetings.
Categorizing daily tasks based on energy levels....
22. Cracking the Code: Exploring Emotional Literacy and Embodiment Part 1
21 Dec 2023
00:49:06
In this episode we unpack the topic of: "Cracking the Code: Exploring Emotional Literacy and Embodiment” This is Part 1 in our emotional literacy and embodiment series. Our special guests are returning alumni with Divinia Knowles, Founder of the COO Roundtable and Maddie Fox, a leadership development coach across venture-backed organisations.
Bethany and I discuss the concept of “reading the room” and “the pause”.
We discuss the following with Maddie and Divinia:
How far can you push as a challenger COO to the CEO?
What is emotional literacy and embodiment?
How do you move from your head and into your body
Can you have emotional literacy without embodiment?
Is embodiment a personal journey? If so, what does that mean?
How do you stop yourself from taking on other people's emotions?
What was your personal journey to embodied leadership?
Divinia was COO, CFO & a director at both Mind Candy and Pact Coffee, where she also served as interim CEO. She has held or still holds chair and board seats at too many companies to list and is occasionally an angel investor. Divinia re-trained as a coach in 2017 and combined it with her previous experience to become the COO Coach, working with start up/scale up COOs/CEOs to help guide them through successfully starting up, scaling up and exiting. And in addition to all that, she is also the Founder of the London COO Roundtable, a community that brings operations professionals together to define what it means to be a highly effective startup and scale up Chief Operating Officer.
Maddie has over 20 years experience in HR and Learning & Development working with various organizations from corporate to fast growing tech, in Europe, the US and Australia. She is an ICF accredited executive coach, leadership and HR consultant with a wide range of experience, however specialising in developing leaders from emerging leaders to seasoned CEO’s, building high-performing sustainable teams and helping clients successfully navigate change. Her style is eclectic, using research, theory and direct experiences to ensure individuals find ways to effectively embed new behaviours, build resilience and deliver results. More recently she has been working in VC backed start-ups, series A-B, working for mostly founder led businesses as a Chief People Officer, Leadership Coach and Advisor. Clients include Blippar, Lantum, Trint, Mixcloud, amongst others.
Summary:
Emotional intelligence and leadership in the workplace. 0:05
Brandon and Bethany discuss emotional literacy and embodied leadership with guests Devaney and Maddy, focusing on reading the room in tense team situations and galvanizing the wider organization around new initiatives.
Bethany and Brandon discuss leadership skills in meetings, with Bethany focusing on reading the room and Brandon using a surprising tactic to get teams to work together.
Participants in a meeting shared their emotions using a "vibe check" technique, allowing for a more empathetic and understanding atmosphere.
Emotional preparation for presentations and leadership. 4:47
Brandon emphasizes emotional preparation for presentations to connect with audience.
Actors tap into true emotion by embodiment, leading to powerful connections with others.
Brandon and Bethany discuss the concept of creating a pause in emotional situations to think about new options and respond thoughtfully, rather than react impulsively.
Bethany shares her personal journey of discovering how to pause and choose her responses, rather than reacting instinctively, through therapy and embodiment practices.
Bethany felt angry and frustrated about a decision made by her company's head of marketing, and she expressed her feelings by pacing and feeling her physical sensations.
Bethany eventually realized that her anger was not about the specific decision, but about feeling disempowered and unheard in her role.
Bethany shares her experience of self-imposed torture due to misinterpreted emotions in a board meeting.
Giving feedback to founders in a supportive manner. 14:33
Maddie and Bethany discuss the best approach to giving feedback to founders, including waiting for the right opportunity and being perceptive to the founder's needs.
Bethany shares her experience of observing and waiting for the right moment to give feedback, rather than scheduling a specific meeting.
Divinia emphasizes emotional literacy as a crucial aspect of leadership, highlighting the importance of understanding one's own emotions and being able to articulate them in a constructive manner.
Emotional literacy is key for leaders to read the room better, as they often don't know how to name their own emotions or understand others'.
Bethany shares her personal experience with embodied leadership, mentioning she went to a yoga class religiously for a year and a half but hasn't done yoga since.
Maddie shares a conference example where she incorporated embodied practices and received positive feedback from some attendees, highlighting the importance of setting seeds for future understanding.
Divinia notes that many leaders live in their heads and struggle to connect with their own feelings, leading to a lack of emotional intelligence in leadership teams.
Divinia uses embodied practices and emotions wheels to help leaders articulate and understand their emotions, creating a common language for the team.
Maddie highlights the importance of embodied leadership, where a leader's commitment is reflected in their body language and actions.
Personal growth through embodied leadership. 26:28
Bethany shares her personal journey of embodied leadership, from impatience to patience and calmer environments.
Embodiment and emotional literacy in a work environment. 28:19
Divinia and Bethany discuss the challenge of embodiment without emotional literacy in a work environment.
Embodiment and emotional literacy in leadership development. 30:02
Maddie discusses the concept of embodiment in leadership, highlighting the importance of being fully present and aware in high-pressure situations.
She argues that practicing embodied leadership allows individuals to pause and make conscious choices in response to challenges, rather than defaulting to habitual reactions.
Maddie provides an example of a leader she coached who improved their emotional literacy and relationships by practicing somatic practices, becoming more curious and open to others.
Embracing body leadership and emotional expression in business. 34:17
Bethany shares her personal journey of embracing her body and emotions in leadership, finding abundance and presence in meetings.
Divinia notes the complexity of being an embodied leader, open to others' emotions while maintaining effectiveness.
Empathy and emotional...
21. Transitioning Roles: From COO to CEO
14 Dec 2023
00:41:40
In this episode we unpack the topic of: "Transitioning Roles: From COO to CEO". This is Part 2 in our transitioning roles series. Our special guest is John Saroff, CEO of Chartbeat.
Bethany and I discuss what a CEO does, and how a COO can build competence in these areas:
Vision
Fundraising
Board relationships
Setting the tone for the culture
We then discuss the following with John:
What is the role of a CEO and how does it differ to the COO role?
Do you have a COO now? Why not?
How does the stress of the CEO role differ to the COO?
As someone who has suffered from depression, how has that influenced your time as CEO?
What do you wish you would have known when you transitioned from COO to CEO?
When you transitioned into the CEO role, did you struggle with role definition?
When is a COO ready to take the CEO role?
How do you become emotionally available to employees?
John Saroff is Chief Executive Officer of Chartbeat, Inc., an ecosystem of enterprise solutions that enables media companies to grow reach and revenue. Chartbeat serves more that 1,000 brands globally, including The New York Times, BBC, ESPN, BuzzFeed, Paramount, Warner Bros., Hearst, and McClatchy. The company brings together Chartbeat, the industry-leading content analytics software for digital publishers; Tubular Labs, a comprehensive analytics solution that delivers a unified view of social video audiences; and Lineup Systems, a bespoke tool for providing media companies with revenue management software. John has worked on the cutting-edge of media and technology for 24 years, at companies ranging from Google to NBC. He holds a joint degree in law and business from Columbia University and is a graduate of Haverford College.
Bethany shares how she spent her 20s experimenting with different identities and careers, feeling less ashamed about her lack of progress.
Brandon: Inspired by Pierre Trudeau's career path, he pursued various manual labor jobs in his 20s without a clear career goal, focusing on enjoying life and graduating from university.
John Saref: As CEO of Chartbeat, he transitioned from Google and NBC Universal, discussing how a CEO can build competence by galvanizing the organization and stakeholders around the company's vision, mission, and purpose.
Leadership, vision, and communication skills for CEOs.3:32
Bethany emphasizes the importance of having a clear and compelling vision as a leader, which she believes is essential for inspiring others to work towards a common goal.
Brandon agrees that vision is crucial, but also acknowledges that it can be challenging for ordinary people to articulate a powerful storyline in a way that is both competent and charismatic.
Brandon: Product background helps with vision and storytelling (black slide technique)
Bethany: Keep presentations simple and focused on the future (no bullet points, no visuals)
Bethany and Brandon both played key roles in fundraising rounds, learning investor thinking and complementing the CEO's strengths with their own areas of expertise.
Fundraising is like another sales cycle, requiring collaboration and pairing off with different people to add value and secure investment.
Bethany emphasizes the importance of communication and empathy for CEOs in investor relations and customer meetings.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the importance of building relationships as a CEO, with Bethany emphasizing the value of having a strong relationship with key stakeholders.
Bethany and Brandon also touch on the topic of setting the tone for the company culture, with Bethany noting that as CEO, you are setting the tone rather than just toeing the party line.
Career transition from corporate lawyer to content acquisition at NBC.14:19
John Saroff transitioned from corporate lawyer to content acquisition at NBC after feeling unfulfilled and depressed in his law career.
He networked extensively and interviewed with 26 people for the job, eventually getting hired by Mike Stipe, who is still a close friend.
Saroff emphasizes the importance of finding a career that aligns with one's passions and values, rather than simply chasing the "brass ring" of partnership.
John Saroff, former COO, describes the difference between the CEO and COO roles as "enormous" and "really different," respectively.
John Saroff does not currently have a COO, having taken over as CEO after his predecessor left to start a company sold to Twitter.
John Saroff describes the stress of being a CEO, comparing it to being the "least bad choice" with a small team and limited resources.
CEO stress, depression, and mental health resources.21:00
John Saroff highlights the stress-reducing aspects of being a CEO, such as having ultimate decision-making authority and being accountable for the company's success or failure.
Bethany agrees, noting that the lack of authority to make decisions without the CEO's approval can be immensely stressful for team members.
John Saroff discusses his struggles with depression as a corporate lawyer and how he found support through therapy and medication.
He emphasizes the importance of mental health resources for employees and stigmatizing mental illness in the workplace.
Saroff shares his success story of managing depression and anxiety, encouraging others to seek help.
Bethany shares her struggles with perfectionism and feeling like she didn't measure up in her 20s, despite being high achiever.
Brandon contrasts their backgrounds, sharing how he didn't have a full-time job until age 28 and didn't have traditional experience, but found success as a CEO.
John Saroff reflects on his early days as CEO, realizing the importance of having a clear vision and mission for the company.
He emphasizes the need to identify what the company is the best in the world at, and how it can move the economic engine and fire up employees.
John Saroff describes his CEO role as a "very involved coach" drawing on experiences from college leadership roles.
John Saroff emphasizes the importance of coaching and communication as a CEO, using examples from his experience as a Liverpool fan and a New York Giants fan.
Saroff believes that meddling can be healthy if employees understand why the CEO is involved, citing the example of a client who only tells the CEO the truth.
CEO mindset, emotional intelligence, and self-care.34:45
John Saroff emphasizes the importance of self-awareness and emotional reserves for CEOs, citing it as a key trait for success in the role.
Bethany highlights the need for CEOs to be able to operationalize and inspire their teams, while also taking on ultimate accountability.
John Saroff emphasizes the importance of taking care of oneself holistically to be successful in any field, especially as a CEO.
He practices active listening and reminds himself that his opinions are just that, while acknowledging the feelings and opinions of others.
John encourages listeners to take action and make the transition to their desired career, emphasizing that it only takes one "yes" to make it happen.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
20. Transitioning Roles: From COO to Venture Capitalist
07 Dec 2023
00:44:48
In this episode we unpack the topic of: "Transitioning Roles: From COO to Venture Capitalist". This is Part 1 of a two-part series. Our special guest is Cleo Sham, Venture Partner at StrideVC. We discuss the following:
Why did you decide to move from operator to investor?
How did being an operator inform your role as a VC?
Where did you find joy in the COO role? As a VC?
Which role is more stressful: COO or VC?
When you received critical feedback as a leader, how did you deal with it?
How do you carve out quality thinking time with so many diverse opportunities?
How would a COO make the move to VC?
Biography:
Before joining Stride as an investor, I had built and led teams as a scale-up operator across China and EMEA.
I joined Uber as one of the first GMs on the ground in China in 2014, building the Guangzhou business into Uber's largest city by volume globally and led China National Operations up until Uber China's $35B merger with Didi Chuxing in 2016. I subsequently moved to Amsterdam as EMEA Director of Operations to lead the platformization of Uber's ridesharing business across 45 countries.
Relocating to London in 2019, I took on the COO role at Spotahome after their $40M Series B, led by Bond Capital. Spotahome is a b2b2c mid-term rentals marketplace, and there I transformed and led a ±200 person team across sales, marketing, operations, strategy, and customer support.
I love building and working with startups, having been a 3x founder earlier in my career and an active angel investor along the way. Originally from Hong Kong, I began my career at McKinsey in Asia and started investing as a proprietary trader at Bank of America Merrill Lynch.
Bethany discovered she's highly reactive to sugar through a Zoe diet test, meaning she must avoid it for the rest of her life.
Bethany can process fats easily but struggles with sugars, including fruits like raspberries and lemons.
Bethany struggles with an abnormal obsession with food, which has led to medical anxiety and a fear of fatty liver disease.
She has realized that her anxiety is not related to diet but rather a combination of her upbringing, personal experiences, and a lack of understanding about preventative medicine in the UK.
Career transitions and personal growth after recognizing mortality.5:44
Bethany reflects on her father's death and its impact on her perspective on life and work.
Bethany wants to use her inherited money to pursue her passions and explore new experiences without worrying about financial constraints.
She is considering how to use her next decade to make the most of her life and career, with a focus on fun and exploration.
Brandon and Bethany discuss their goals and motivations, including starting a community for ambitious people and advocating for cannabis legalization in the UK.
Bethany is taking a writing course and a pottery course to improve her skills and push herself outside of her comfort zone.
Vulnerability, self-expression, and career growth in one's 40s.11:57
Bethany shares her insights on the importance of vulnerability and self-expression, citing Brene Brown's work on shame and the need to share feelings with safe people to build support.
Clea Sham joins the conversation and adds her perspective on the value of being true to oneself, even in the face of criticism or rejection from others.
Transitioning from operator to investor with Cleo and Speaker 3.14:33
Cleo is an outstanding senior woman who has held various leadership roles, including COO at a home and partner at stride.
Speaker 3 transitioned from operator to investor due to a desire for tangible businesses and working with teams, and joined Uber as CEO to think through business drivers and prioritize resources.
Investing background informing operations roles and vice versa.16:54
Speaker 3's investment background informed their operations roles, including building models and making decisions based on financial data and business drivers.
Speaker 3's experience as an operator reinforced their investing role at Stride VC, allowing them to apply their knowledge of building businesses and assessing companies.
Speaker 3 learned to regulate their emotions and make decisions based on data in a high-pressure environment, which helped them perform as an investor.
Speaker 3 received feedback from their team on being too emotionless and impenetrable, which could impact their ability to connect with others.
Leadership, teamwork, and investment strategies in the tech industry.22:12
Speaker 3 shared a personal experience of receiving feedback from a direct report during a one-on-one meeting, which led to a valuable learning moment for them.
The feedback was presented in a supportive manner, with the direct report acknowledging the speaker's humanity and vulnerability, and the team having the speaker's back.
The speaker chose to stay and lead the team through the challenging moment, ultimately resulting in the team staying at the top for over six months.
Bethany emphasizes the importance of building trust with founders, tailoring communication styles to each founder's needs, and prioritizing their comfort level in the investment process.
Speaker 3 highlights the people side of the VC role, including sourcing, selecting, winning, and supporting founders, and how their operational leadership experience informs their approach to these tasks.
Speaker 3 highlights the differences between operating a business and being a VC, with the former providing more tangible results and the latter offering a wider range of people to learn from.
Speaker 3 finds personal growth and meeting new people satisfying aspects of being a VC, with the opportunity to learn from a diverse range of founders and investors.
Speaker 3 highlights the benefits of VC, including more control over time and the satisfaction of supporting founders.
Both identifying the next investment and making non-reversible decisions are stressful aspects of VC work.
The challenges of time management for venture capitalists.33:29
Speaker 3 discusses the challenges of managing multiple boards and sourcing new investments while also prioritizing thinking time.
Brandon adds that quality thinking is crucial to understand the legs of a product opportunity in a rapidly changing market.
Speaker 3 describes their role as a "lone wolf" investor, responsible for researching and deciding on investments, while also being part of a team that looks at things together on designated days.
Speaker 3 highlights the need to create time for both solitary work (developing a thesis, drilling down into an industry) and social work (meeting founders, going to events) to be successful in their role.
Becoming an investor, including self-reflection and networking.39:24
Speaker 3 suggests starting small by investing with your own money and building a network of investors, founders, and operators.
Speaker 3 advises spending time understanding the different types of VC firms and their approaches to investing, rather than rushing into a decision.
Reflect on your energy sources and strengths to determine if investing is the right career move (42:47)
Making a switch to investing is not irreversible, and people can switch back and forth in mature venture markets (43:53)
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
19. The Wartime COO
30 Nov 2023
00:37:30
In this episode we discuss: "The Wartime COO”. Our special guest is Huw Slater, COO of Oliva Health, formerly COO of TravelPerk and Bella Riemer, Head of Operations at Joblift. We discuss the following with Huw and Bella:
What is a Wartime COO? How does this impact how you operate the business?
How do you surface existential threats to the organisation and inject a sense of focus, without scaring folks?
What have been some of the worst storms you’ve weathered? Lessons learned?
More broadly, what are risks the COO should always be vigilant about?
What would you recommend tactically in a wartime setting?
How do values pragmatically inform your decision-making process in wartime?
Huw Slater, COO and Co-founder @Oliva. With >10 years of experience in scaling tech companies in Europe, Huw Slater is the COO and co-Founder at Oliva. Prior to this, Huw was the Chief Operating Officer of TravelPerk, helped Box through their IPO by globalising their growth, scaled Typeform’s expansion from Europe to the US and drove the series B funding, and has 10 additional years’ experience as the Finance Director of a $5bn turnover division in a FTSE 10 company. A passionate leader, Huw is excited by making an impact and instilling a growth mindset in his people where transparency and clarity are key.
Bella Reimer, Operational Leader | Strategy Growth | Speaker & Mentor. With over 14 years of experience in various roles and industries. I am a passionate operational leader with a proven track record of driving efficiency, strategic growth, and cross-functional collaboration. I specialise in overseeing end-to-end processes, optimising operations, and aligning teams to achieve impactful results.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
46. The Secret Life Of Boards
06 Jun 2024
00:34:26
In this episode we discuss: Board Relationships. We are joined by Helen Hopper and Joy Harcup, authors of book, The Art and Psychology of Board Relationships.
We chat about the following:
Unravelling Boardroom Dynamics: What's Really at Stake?
The Power of Psychological Safety: A Boardroom Imperative?
Self-Awareness: The Boardroom Game Changer?
Mastering Conflict Resolution in the Boardroom: Strategies Unveiled
Trust, Collaboration, Success: The Boardroom Trifecta?
HELEN HOPPER trained in management consultancy with Accenture, and in occupational psychology with SHL, before co-founding the leadership consulting firm hCubed in 2010, where she is a Partner. h3’s mission is to stimulate growth through learning and Helen pursues this with individuals, teams and organisations as a coach and facilitator. She is an active supporter of mental health charities, most recently as COO of The Listening Place, and Trustee at The Mix.
JOY HARCUP is an executive coach with international coaching firm Praesta LLP, working with individuals, top executive teams and boards. She has 20 years’ leadership coaching experience with clients including the FTSE 100, professional services, public and not-for-profit sectors. Joy was President of the UK Board of the International Coaching Federation. A former lawyer specialising in dispute resolution, she’s also sat on boards in the education and charitable sectors.
To learn more about Beth and Brandon or to find out about sponsorship opportunities click here.
Summary:
Bullying in board meetings and its impact on individuals. 0:06
Bethany Ayers experienced issues with her phone number porting and international roaming, leading to a frustrating conversation with Oh Two customer support.
Despite being told her case was closed, Bethany was able to get her number back after waiting for a couple of days.
Bethany acknowledges being a potential bully in the past, recognizing behaviors that could be harmful to others.
Brandon M. questions the use of the term "bullying," suggesting that it can be subjective and context-dependent.
Effective board meetings, leadership, and conflict resolution. 5:18
Brandon M. and Bethany discuss ways to address unhelpful behavior in meetings, including intervening, redirecting, and parking the issue for later discussion.
Effective chairperson engagement is critical for maintaining a functional board, according to Brandon M. and Bethany.
Bethany emphasizes the importance of having a pre-agreed contract, such as a team canvas, to establish expectations and prevent conflicts within teams.
Bethany criticizes traditional board dynamics, citing a lack of modernization and unrealistic expectations of chairs, and argues for more inclusive and empathetic approaches to leadership.
Effective board meetings, including setting a strong chair, providing clear agendas, and making an ask of the board. 10:36
Brandon M suggests setting a strong chair, creating a safe environment, and starting the meeting with positivity.
Bethany shares her personal experience with self-reflection and realizing she may be projecting her own issues onto others.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the importance of formalizing asks and understanding board dynamics.
Boardroom dynamics, bullying, and effective leadership. 14:40
Helen and Beth discuss the importance of self-awareness in boardroom dynamics, identifying seven difficult dynamics and providing questions for individuals to reflect on their contribution.
The book "The Art and Psychology of Boardroom Relationship Dynamics" offers practical strategies for improving relationships, including getting clear on roles and agreements, and using the "tears tactic" to resolve conflicts.
Helen suggests dealing with bullying by understanding it's often unintentional and lacking awareness of impact.
Brandon M. shares a scenario where exiting board members was the fastest way to address toxic dynamics.
Helen emphasizes the importance of self-awareness and empathy in avoiding bullying dynamics.
Joy stresses the value of authentic leadership and role modeling in creating a productive board culture.
Leadership roles and responsibilities in a board setting. 22:43
Bethany struggles with power dynamics in a growing team, feeling like she's overstepping or under-utilizing her skills.
Joy's research highlights the importance of working at the right level of work to avoid losing opportunities.
Joy: Facilitate conversations, surface concerns, and make decisions (Joy)
Bethany: Share knowledge from other boards, have one-on-one with chair (Bethany)
Board dynamics, psychological safety, and effective communication. 27:23
Helen suggests conducting a board evaluation every 3 years to identify areas for improvement.
Joy emphasizes the importance of transparency and openness in board dynamics.
Helen and Joy share insights on creating psychological safety in board meetings, inviting contributions, and addressing conflicts.
They emphasize the importance of open communication, active listening, and taking small steps towards change.
In this episode we discuss: "Efficiency Unleashed: NoCode Revolutionising Operations”. Our special guest is Philip Lakin, Co-Founder & CEO of NoCodeOps. He is the ultimate MacGyver and an ambassador for reimagining the future of internal innovation. We discuss the following with Philip:
What is NoCode? Why does it matter?
What is a tangible example of business impact?
Should ops professionals report into the COO or the functional lead?
How do you get buy-in to internal operations initiatives?
How do you manage dependencies and scale no-code automations?
What is the impact of AI on NoCode? What should we do in ops to get prepared?
Philip Lakin is the co-founder and CEO of NoCodeOps, a community and automation management platform (Operator) dedicated to supporting operations professionals that are reimagining the future of internal innovation with no-code. He was previously the Solutions Architect for National Operations at Compass where he built the onboarding program for over 15,000 real estate agents across the United States. He has more than 8 years of experience in operations, internal system implementation, field marketing, and onboarding.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
17. Surfacing the COO's Crucial Role in Revenue Generation
16 Nov 2023
00:41:23
In this episode we discuss: "Surfacing the COO's Crucial Role in Revenue Generation". Our special guest is Pete Crosby a coach, lecturer & advisor, focussing on the successful design & execution of SaaS revenue & growth strategies. He is a 4x successful scale up revenue leader, most recently as CRO at Ometria.
We discuss the following with Pete:
What kind of focus helps enable revenue generation?
How should the COO’s “system thinking” be leveraged?
Where should revenue operations live?
What are the types of revenue ops leaders? How does that define their relationship with operations?
How important is it for the COO to have a good understanding of revenue ops?
What responsibility does a COO have in financial forecasting?
How do organisations get more commercially efficient?
References:
revenue.ghost.io (Pete’s weekly newsletter & deep dives on revenue topics each Sunday)
Biography:
Pete is a coach, lecturer & advisor, focussing on the successful design & execution of SaaS revenue & growth strategies.
He conceived, wrote & teaches The Definitive Guide to Revenue Leadership syllabus at Sales Impact Academy with Mandy Cole of Stage 2 Capital. Guest lecturers on his course include Mark Roberge, Zoom’s Greg Holmes, and Tableau’s Elissa Fink.
He is a 4x successful scale up revenue leader, most recently as CRO at Ometria, who Deloitte placed in the Top 10 growth businesses in the UK with revenue acceleration above 3000%. He took Ometria to its $21m Series B in just 18 months.
Prior to Ometria, Pete ran revenues at Viadeo from Series A to IPO, and took Triptease from $2m to $10m ARR and a successful Series B, also in just 18 months.
Now the Founder of Pete Crosby Revenue, he has managed revenue teams in Beijing, Singapore, Moscow, Mexico City, Dakar, Casablanca, San Francisco, Boston, New York & in most major cities across Europe.
Currently he is a board advisor to 5 of Europe’s most exciting B2B SaaS scale-ups. He also coaches revenue leaders at a further 50+ start-ups & scale-ups.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
16. The COO's Endless Battle: Navigating Legal and Enterprise Contracts
09 Nov 2023
00:45:51
In this episode we discuss: "The COO's Endless Battle: Navigating Legal and Enterprise Contracts". Our special guest is Ahmed Badr, COO of GoCardless. Ahmed also worked for Microsoft, where he supported multi-billion pound licensing deals.
Bethany and I discuss the following:
The importance of a generic contract template
Empowering sales to get contracts done
Default and deal-breaker positions on indemnity and limitation of liability
We discuss the following with Ahmed:
What did Microsoft do well and what could be reused at GoCardless?
What did the empowerment playbook look like with contracts?
What is a deal desk and how was it used?
What is the COO role at GoCardless?
When should organisations transition from outside to inhouse legal counsel?
Why is taking a reasonable, mid-point position on default terms so important?
What is a sensible approach to indemnity and limitation of liability?
What is the best way to roll out “contract empowerment” programs to sales?
Ahmed is Chief Operating Officer GoCardless, where he is responsible for all core operational teams, as well as being functionally responsible for legal, risk and compliance. GoCardless believes that bank payments are the best way to pay and get paid, and helps businesses collect both recurring and one-off payments, without chasing, stress or expensive fees. Before joining GoCardless, Ahmed worked for Microsoft, where he supported the multi-billion pound UK licensing and developer support organisations. Before this, he was a project finance lawyer at Allen & Overy. In 2015, he became GoCardless’ first lawyer and has since supported the business in its rapid expansion across legal, compliance, risk and operations. Ahmed also sponsors the company’s BEAM (Black, Ethnic and Asian Minority) group, and likes to use his experience to support young fast growth companies, help shape regulation, and open up access to legal careers to a wide range of individuals.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
15. Revolutionising Workplace Honesty: The Radical Candor Experiment
02 Nov 2023
00:51:07
In this episode we discuss: "Revolutionising Workplace Honesty: The Radical Candor Experiment". Our special guest is Ben Gateley, CEO at CharlieHR. Ben is an outspoken champion of positive workplace culture and is a passionate advocate for all things “people”.
Bethany and I discuss the following:
Praising publicly and criticising privately
Giving criticism within 24 hours
Killing the “shit” sandwich
What to do with moaning
The synergy between asking for feedback and giving feedback
Coaching vs. Evaluation feedback
We discuss the following with Ben:
What made you decide to implement Radical Candor?
How did you implement Radical Candor? What were the learnings?
How do you now build and operationalise a strong culture of feedback?
What is the cultural difference between the UK and US styles? Why does it matter?
To what degree do values matter in developing a strong culture of feedback?
Legal law firm for scaleups that Brandon used: Harper James
Biography:
Ben is the CEO and co-founder of CharlieHR: an HR software used by thousands of small businesses worldwide. He has started and grown a number of successful companies since his teenage years — including BORN SOCIAL, one of the most successful social media agencies for challenger brands in the world.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
14. Nurturing High-Performance Leadership Teams
26 Oct 2023
00:40:01
In this episode we unpack the topic of: Nurturing High-Performance Leadership Teams. Our special guest is Becca Sweetman, a leadership team coach who has worked across leading VC backed organisations like Kano, MOO and Babylon Health. We discuss the following:
What is a high performing team? How do you achieve it?
What is the PERILL framework and why is that a good one to use?
How do you do an audit of leadership team performance?
How do you work through areas of tension between two leadership team members?
How can psychometric or behavioral analysis tools help in understanding team members' preferences and work styles?
With limited time for leadership to “gel” in a scale-up, how do you accelerate that process?
What is your view on the PERILL and Lencioni approaches to team performance? Which approach do you think would be more effective in a startup environment?
Can you share any strategies or techniques that can foster a safe and productive environment for team discussions?
Becca works with Founders and Exec teams to support the successful transition from Series A to Series B. Combining her experience in executive coaching, strategy at McKinsey and operational leadership in startups (Kano, MOO, Babylon Health) she is uniquely positioned to provide both high level support and get into the practical details of what it takes to succeed. Becca works mostly with impact driven companies as an Executive & Team Coach, Advisor or NED.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
13. Navigating Leadership Team Success and Transitions
19 Oct 2023
00:39:59
In this episode we unpack the topic of: Navigating Leadership Team Success and Transitions. Our special guest is Maddies Fox, a guru in leadership development across venture-backed organisations including Blippar, Lantum and Mixcloud. We discuss the following:
How do you set-up a COO for success when they join the organisation?
Do job titles matter and how important is transparency around levels in early stage companies?
What does good look like in exiting a leadership team member? How should you approach the conversations? What are the potential snags?
How should you communicate a leadership exit to the organisation?
How can an organization balance its obligation to support employee growth with the individual's responsibility to be proactive in their own development?
How can organizations ensure that their values and actions align when hiring a new leadership team member?
Why is self-awareness a critical determinant of leadership success?
References:
For leaders who are interested in doing the work, this book is something I would definitely recommend -
Maddie has over 20 years experience in HR and Learning & Development working with various organizations from corporate to fast growing tech, in Europe, the US and Australia. She is an ICF accredited executive coach, leadership and HR consultant with a wide range of experience, however specialising in developing leaders from emerging leaders to seasoned CEO’s, building high-performing sustainable teams and helping clients successfully navigate change. Her style is eclectic, using research, theory and direct experiences to ensure individuals find ways to effectively embed new behaviours, build resilience and deliver results. More recently she has been working in VC backed start-ups, series A-B, working for mostly founder led businesses as a Chief People Officer, Leadership Coach and Advisor. Clients include Blippar, Lantum, Trint, Mixcloud, amongst others.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
12. Decoding the CEO-COO Relationship: Strategies to Thrive
12 Oct 2023
00:46:16
In this episode we discuss the topic of: Decoding the CEO-COO Relationship: Strategies to Thrive Our special guest is Scott Gellman, COO of Nowsta. We discuss the following:
How do you think the role of a COO differs from that of a CFO in terms of responsibilities and dynamics with the CEO
How do you think the power dynamic between CEO and COO can affect decision-making and the overall functioning of an organization?
How can effective communication positively impact the working relationship between a CEO and a COO?
How do you think gender dynamics can influence the working relationship between a CEO and a COO?
Why do you think managing the relationship with the CEO during difficult times or crises is particularly crucial in maintaining an effective working relationship?
What interview questions do you think would be important to ask to assess compatibility and potential challenges in the working relationship?
What do you think are some key principles for establishing and maintaining a successful working relationship between a CEO and a COO?
References:
The First 90 Days, Updated and Expanded: Proven Strategies for Getting Up to Speed Faster and Smarter. https://amzn.eu/d/0YDQcpH
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
11. Why licensing 170 SaaS tools is a great idea!
05 Oct 2023
00:46:32
In this episode we discuss the topic of: Why licensing 170 SaaS tools is a great idea! Our special guest is Joe Aurilia, Jr., Senior VP Operations at Cyware. As a former CIO, Joe comes at the COO role from a really interesting angle. We discuss the following:
Why 170 SaaS applications in an organisation with 270 employees?
What does best practice look like in the procurement process? What should it look like in a smaller organisation?
How do you ensure ownership ensuring the organisation is receiving the expected value from a given tool?
How do you ensure you don't miss a critical feature or integration requirement?
What are your pet peeves when it comes to vendor support?
How has your previous role as CIO informed your thinking as COO?
How do you not slow down by putting so much process in place?
Do suppliers need to have both SOC 2 and ISO certification?
What tools do you like in the cross-functional space?
When would you recommend getting an organisation wide orchestration tool?
How are you handling renewals and the increase in costs?
If you had to cut your SaaS spending by 20% tomorrow, what would you do?
What do you think about sales tools where there is often a lot of overlap in functionality but they also tend to do one thing quite well?
How do you ensure data integrity from a COO lens, if you don’t have direct ownership of the rev ops data stack?
What are your favorite SaaS apps that you can’t live without?
References:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/josephauriliajr/
Biography: Joe is a seasoned operations executive with over 20 years dedicated to technical and operational leadership. He has served in a wide variety of roles in both corporate and startups all focusing on core technology and operational excellence. Throughout his career Joe has executed operational and technical strategies key to business expansion, successful funding rounds, and extensive company growth.
While a technologist at heart, Joe’s most recent ventures have placed him in core roles responsible for enabling operational scalability. A focus on successful team alignment has resulted in explosive people growth and international expansion.
Joe has led a variety of Operations teams including Technology Operations, Contract Operations, Revenue Operations, People Operations, Security Operations, PMO, and Talent Acquisition. Key to success of each has been the empowering of teams to reach beyond expected boundaries and achieve higher limits.
When not working you will find Joe enjoying the exploration of new places, hiking local trails, and chasing his little one around. He is also a firm believer there is no such thing as rewatching Marvel movies too many times.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
10. What are the five traits of successful COO’s?
28 Sep 2023
00:39:06
In this episode we unpack the topic of: What are the five traits of successful COO’s? Our special guest is Charlene Chen, a key figure in the startup operations community and former COO of Lantum and AZA Finance. We discuss the following:
How do different personalities and styles of Ops leaders contribute to the overall success of a company?
In what ways do Ops leaders act as the connective tissue of a company?
How can communication breakdown be addressed as a company scales and teams become siloed?
What are the key responsibilities of Ops leaders in terms of internal communications?
How does the performance of teams who don't directly report to a COO reflect on their success and failure?
Why is it challenging for COOs to measure their value and articulate their impact in an OKR format?
How do consultants-turned-Ops leaders approach problem-solving differently from those without a consulting background?
Why is self-awareness important for COOs and operations leaders in identifying their strengths and weaknesses?
How does resourcefulness play a significant role in the success of COOs, especially in times of crisis or limited resources?
References:
Ops Fest 2023 brings together operations communities from all corners of the globe.
Generalist - Jacks and Jills of all trades covering multiple functions
Hourglass-Shaped - Ability to zoom out to do strategy but zoom in to design minute processes
Gluey - The connective tissue of a company, filling the gaps in and between cross-functional teams
Resourceful - Making do with little human or financial capital
Humble - Work hard behind the scenes with little credit given (not as glorified as engineers and salespeople)
Biography: Charlene Chen has over 15 years of operational leadership experience working with a variety of organisations ranging from tech startups to international non-profits to Fortune 500 companies. She began her career as an IT consultant at Deloitte Consulting, but spent 8 years focused on operational leadership of socially impactful venture-capital backed businesses in the fintech and healthtech industries. Charlene was co-founder and COO of AZA Finance (formerly BitPesa), former COO of Lantum, and is Co-Founder of Operations Nation, a community-led digital hub for Ops-specific content, resources, and training.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
9. Generative AI & the Impact on the COO role
21 Sep 2023
00:28:14
In this episode we discuss the topic of: Generative AI & the Impact on the COO role. Our special guest is Aarti Samani, an experienced executive leader with a fascinating career in AI, spanning investment banking and high growth technology businesses. We discuss the following:
How does a smaller, tech-enabled company get started?
Who should own the quality of data ingested into a generative AI model?
Is it good enough to throw a bit of policy around the use of chatGPT and how SaaS tools with generative-based features should be used?
Is it realistic to think more broadly around orchestration of organisational data and insights for the business right now, given where these products are at?
Are we talking about a Snowflake - Looker type solution for generative AI?
What is a sensible, phased approach?
How should you think about internal communications and training
What would you say to the COO that is heads down on the business and feels guilty about not spending enough time thinking about how to leverage AI?
Fiverr AI Services for cost effective, on-demand experts to help you integrate Generative AI in your products or leverage Generative AI productivity services for business efficiency: https://www.fiverr.com/cp/ai-services
Runway Finance to consolidate all inputs for more precise and easier financial modelling and forecasting : https://runway.com/
Biography: Aarti is an experienced executive leader with a fascinating career in AI, spanning Investment Banking and High growth technology businesses. She has successfully scaled three venture backed organizations, two of which exited to Microsoft and Medtronic. The third is a global category leader in the biometrics and identity verification sector.
Aarti’s innate ability to connect disparate macro and micro data points, has allowed her to align all business functions to accelerate growth. Founder of Shreem Growth Partners, Aarti works with visionary founders bringing innovative AI based solutions to market.
Aarti’s acumen and industry success led Cranfield School of Management to name her a Woman to Watch for board positions. A meditator, traveler and cancer survivor, Aarti’s journey continues to inspire.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
44. Does performance management work?
23 May 2024
00:47:50
In this episode, we discuss performance management and getting the most from your teams. We are joined by Jessica Zwaan, Author of the best-selling book, Built for People, and COO of Talentful.
We chat about:
Can traditional performance reviews truly capture an employee's value?
Are OKRs just a trendy buzzword or a real strategy for driving company success?
How can organizational network analysis uncover the real influencers in your team?
What does it take to measure true employee performance in today's remote work era?
Your company is building three products: A financial instrument, a customer product, and an employee experience. I advocate treating employees as customers purchasing an experience of work, and I encourage us to work like Product Managers in order to iterate and improve on that product. This paradigm shift positions work itself as the focal point of our strive for success, not just optimising the individuals as "human capital". Like the idea? I wrote a book all about it, called "Built for People" which you can buy basically anywhere books are sold.
To learn more about Beth and Brandon or to find out about sponsorship opportunities click here.
Summary:
Choosing a life partner and nannies as a "wife hire." 0:05
Bethany discussed tips for choosing a partner for career success, including finding someone whose mother worked outside the home.
Bethany values hiring a nanny for the mental load relief and organization.
Performance management effectiveness and its various components. 4:40
Brandon and Bethany discuss the ineffectiveness of performance management, with 64% of workers viewing it as a waste of time and 47% considering it a failure in their company.
Jessica Swann distinguishes between performance assessment and management, highlighting the importance of individualized growth and development in the latter.
Bethany expresses concerns about goal-measuring and its practicality in the workplace.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the importance of organizational network analysis and its impact on problem-solving.
Performance management and leadership development. 10:06
Bethany suggests rolling out OKRs gently, learning along the way, and avoiding command and control.
Brandon agrees, emphasizing the importance of measuring marketing and sales performance collectively and connecting it to business outcomes.
Brandon and Bethany discuss the importance of effective performance management and leadership skills for line managers.
Bethany questions the feasibility of performance management, citing potential biases and limitations in the process.
Performance management and assessment in organizations. 15:27
Jessica emphasizes the importance of understanding employee performance, citing it as the most critical question in HR.
Bethany agrees, highlighting the need for effective performance management frameworks to assess employee productivity.
Jessica argues that traditional performance assessment methods are inadequate for understanding team dynamics and impact on revenue.
She provides an example of how organisational network analysis can reveal hidden high performers in a team, even if their direct impact is limited.
Building employee lifetime value algorithm, identifying superstars, and optimizing team performance. 20:22
Jessica and Brandon discuss building an employee lifetime value algorithm, with Pete Fader and Dan McCarthy as experts in the field.
Jessica explains the importance of identifying team members who are most valuable to the organization based on their network analysis.
Jessica highlights the need to evaluate the effectiveness of individual team members and determine their total available current value creation.
Goal setting and performance measurement in organizations. 24:46
Jessica and Brandon discuss goal setting and the importance of involving the right people in the process.
Jessica provides a framework for setting effective goals, starting with top-line objectives and working down to individual levels.
Jessica and Bethany discuss the challenges of measuring performance in a large organization, including the time and effort required to gather feedback and set goals.
Jessica's team uses a lightweight model to track progress and identify areas for improvement, with a focus on individual and team effectiveness.
Performance management approach at a professional services company. 29:31
Jessica prioritizes systemic management over individual performance management.
Jessica emphasizes the importance of individual performance assessment in a calibrated exercise.
Performance management and goal setting, with a focus on organizational network analysis. 32:49
Bethany questions the effectiveness of performance management systems, suggesting they may not be tied to valuable outcomes.
Jessica emphasizes the importance of goal setting and connecting employee work to company success.
Bethany reveals surprising insights from organizational network analysis: weak managers, strong teams, and misaligned goals.
CEO discovers high-performing team members through network analysis, despite low manager performance, highlighting potential for growth.
Performance management, OKRs, and calibration exercises. 37:15
Jessica highlights the limitations of individual performance assessments, advocating for a more systemic approach.
Brandon discusses calibration exercises as a way to connect pay to performance, but Jessica questions their effectiveness.
Jessica and Bethany discuss the importance of context in decision-making, rather than just measurable goals.
Jessica advocates for fewer, more impactful goals, rather than many goals with little impact.
Measuring employee performance and accountability in a changing work environment. 41:55
Jessica aims to simplify goals, prioritize impact, and hold team members accountable.
Brandon and Jessica discuss the importance of measuring employee performance and accountability in a more autonomous workforce.
Jessica advises CEOs to focus on employee lifetime value and return on investment to enable people operations teams to do their work effectively.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
8. How does a co-founder COO survive and thrive?
14 Sep 2023
00:30:55
In this episode we discuss the topic of: How does a co-founder COO survive and thrive? Our special guest is Tom Mundy, is the COO of Goodlord which has scaled to over 350 employees, raising more than £50m in capital and turning over tens of millions of pounds.
How did you end up being COO? Why was that the right title?
What were the inflection points for your growth?
How did you manage to survive for the last 8 years given the ups and downs?
What is your view on mentorship?
What is a good investor and what does it matter?
What is the role of the COO when it comes to unit economics?
How have you dealt with burnout?
Given you were learning on the job, how did you think about ownership of functions?
What happened in that first conversation when the new CEO entered the business?
Biography: Tom started his first business when he was 14 selling fudge at a market stall. He carried on starting businesses throughout university and finally found his calling in tech at the age of 24 where he co-founded Goodlord. During his time at Goodlord as COO he helped the business scale to over 350 employees, raising more than £50m in capital and turning over tens of millions of pounds.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
7. How does a COO work effectively with the board?
07 Sep 2023
00:45:09
In this episode we discuss the topic of: How does a COO work effectively with the board? Our special guest is Keith Wallington, the former COO of Mimecast and currently Chairperson working across five B2B SaaS organisations. Keith lays out “what good looks like” in board stewardship for growth stage businesses. He also lifts the hood on expectations for the COO.
What do you know now that you wish you had known as a COO?
What do you want from a COO in board meetings
How much do you tow the line if you are disagreeing with your CEO when in front of the board?
If you see a CEO and COO always agreeing in board meetings is that a red flag or do you assume they are simply well aligned.
What's the role of the board in the hiring process for a COO?
Should the entire exec team be a part of the board and what role should the COO play?
How should the COO prepare for a board meeting, without killing themselves in the process?
Do you feel like COOs should have a close relationship with the chairperson?
What's your advice to the COO’s dealing with an old skool board?
To minimise board reporting effort can you simply re-purpose reporting you already do with the exec team and wider company?
Keith has led strategy and execution in technology businesses since the 1990’s, driving growth in Europe, the USA and Africa: His experience in driving online business models spans Retail Banking, Telecommunications, Online Live Broadcasting, Software and Software as a Service (SaaS): he has led online initiatives at businesses including Microsoft, Standard Bank, Omnicom/TBWA, MTN Group, Truphone and Mimecast.
From 2008 – 2014 Keith spent 6 years driving growth at Mimecast, best in class and global leader in SaaS based email security, archiving and continuity: Here he assumed a number of C Level roles, including COO, spanning most of the business from Marketing to Customer Experience to Technical Operations as he championed scalable, efficient growth during this phase of hyper growth (from $6m to over $110m Annual Recurring Revenue) and global expansion from the UK base.
After preparing Mimecast for IPO Keith refocused his attention to support businesses on their growth journey. Keith invests in and assumes board roles with Series A to Growth stage companies. He engages directly and also collaborates with Venture Capital and Private Equity teams to co-invest and add depth to portfolio company boards.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
6. Growth mindset and the COO role
24 Aug 2023
00:36:36
In this episode we discuss the topic of a growth mindset and how that informs the COO role. Our special guest is David Norris, a three time COO for venture-backed organisations. David talks about managing critical feedback, personal growth and the transition to Chief Growth Officer.
How has studying theology informed the type of COO you are?
Is there a playbook for COO’s?
What does the transition from COO to Chief Growth Officer look like in an 800-person company?
What does the transition from a 16 person company to an 800 person company look like as COO?
What is the connection between personal growth and organisational growth?
How do you manage critical feedback?
Biography: David is a seasoned internet leader, having worked in online operational, product, marketing and strategy roles since the turn of the century, mainly in travel and hospitality, including 4 stints as Chief Operating Officer, 3 of which were scaling fast growth venture capital (VC) backed scaleups. He was later a venture capital investor at Forward Partners incubating idea stage startups and now focuses on strategy and marketing in his role as Chief Growth Officer at Holiday Extras. David is also Non-Executive Director at The Sports Trust and mentors startup founders. He is a fellow of the COO roundtable, a community for startup and scaleups to come together and learn.
He has a degree in Theology and Religious Studies from the University of Manchester and a Diploma in Company Direction from The Institute of Directors. He lives with his family in Deal, Kent, UK.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
5. Efficiency vs. Growth: What does the new world look like?
10 Aug 2023
00:42:21
In this episode we discuss a topic that is one everyone’s agenda: Efficiency vs. Growth: What does the new world look like? Our special guest is Reece Howe, CFO at C TWO. Reece tells it like it is when it comes to efficiency, ownership and organisational impact.
How do you shift the culture of a company used to “growth at all costs” to one of capital efficiency and prudence?
How should one think about the value and risks attached to sharing the cash burn and cash runway with the organisation?
What does it mean to get “more from less?” and does this make sense?
What is the best approach to budget ownership and responsibility?
What do you expect from the COO in driving efficiency?
Does it make sense for the COO to own operations across the organisation?
How do you approach ownership of SaaS software spend across functions?
Reece Howe qualified as an accountant and started his career at Deloitte, working in Audit and Corporate Finance. After a move to Innocent Drinks, where he assisted with the exit to Coca Cola, he founded two of his own startups, in elderly care and digital marketing, seeing them through to exit.
Prior to his current role as CFO at C TWO, an Enterprise B2B SaaS company that develops an Automation Management Platform, he led finance at Signal AI (another Enterprise B2B SaaS startup) from Series A to Series D. Reece has a degree in Astrophysics from University College London and is a Fellow of the Institute of Chartered Accountants in England and Wales.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
4. Do OKR's work?
27 Jul 2023
00:56:59
In this episode we address the elephant in the room: Do OKRs work? Our special guest is Jenny Herald, Vice President of Product Evangelism at Quantive which delivers better business outcomes for companies providing a strategy execution platform based on the OKR methodology.
In this episode we get her experiences on the following questions:
What are we doing wrong and how can we do it better? (we sneakily asked this twice!)
If you have a good strategy, a series of solid plans and well understood KPI’s, what is the incremental value of OKRs?
How do you avoid the conflation of business as usual KPI’s and change with OKRs when a lot of organisations simply transpose their ARR target as the topline OKR.
If OKRs are simply a framework to help you do the right stuff, why not use any number of other goal frameworks?
Should OKRs involve all functions in the organisation? Should OKRs be cascaded down to every level?
We’ve all read Measure What Matters and Radical Focus and are still rolling it out wrong. If you want to make it work in practice, where do you start?
As Vice President of product evangelism, Jenny Herald champions Quantive's vision and shares how customers achieve better business outcomes with the world's most powerful Strategy Execution Platform based on the OKR methodology. Jenny also hosts the Dreams with Deadlines podcast where she interviews business leaders on aligning teams and organisations around a common purpose, the ups-and-downs of goal management, strategy execution, and everything in between.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
3. How do you scale from 50 to 500 employees?
20 Jul 2023
00:48:13
In this episode we tackle the question of: How do you scale from 50 to 500 employees?
Our special guest is Kristen Shannon, founder and CEO of Highliner a consultancy that helps high-growth businesses scale across people, systems and processes.
In this episode we get her experiences on the following questions:
What was the lesson in hiring 800 people in one year?
How do you get out of your own way when it comes to structure and process?
What are the scaling inflection points?
How do you fight against the silos that develop in organisations?
What are those hires that you're just like, oh my god, how did we survive without it?
How do you minimise the mini-celebrity status you have as COO in an organisation, where employees massively read things into what you say and do?
How much of your time is spent on rolling out processes versus helping people become better leaders and managing change?
How do you make an organisation more accountable? How do you hold a team to account in an OKR check-in?
Kristen is a results-driven executive with over 10 years of experience in strategy development, operational execution, and organisational scaling. Her career focus has been working in high-pressure companies going through periods of significant and fast-paced growth.
She has worked for ambitious organisations that have doubled in size year on year, leading both recruitment of over 800 FTE a year as well as leading and scaling teams in multiple functional areas.
Kristen is the founder and CEO of Highliner. At Highliner, we are passionate about helping companies design and implement practical, scalable solutions that are the highest leverage to the organisations. We work with companies both on codifying their organisational culture and strategy to support growth as well as auditing and designing the operational systems, processes and tools needed to accomplish their key business objectives at scale. Some of our clients have included iProov (raised £70m growth round), Oxford Ionics (raise £30m Series A), Cisco Meraki (post acquisition) and Sonantic (acquired by Spotify).
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
2. How do you hire a COO?
13 Jul 2023
00:30:58
In this episode we tackle the question of: How do I hire a COO? Our special guest is James Mitra, Founder of JBM, an executive search firm that specialises in placing COO’s.
In this episode we get his experiences on the following questions:
When a CEO comes to you and says “we need to hire a COO”. What is your approach?
What is your take on “assignments”?
What does that salary equity ban situation look like right now?
What advice do you give to women or to others who might not, who might be accepting less than they should?
Chief of Staff hiring guide - https://mailchi.mp/jbmc/the-chief-of-staff-role-uncovered
Ravio (real time comp data) – https://ravio.com/partners/jbm/
JBM have partnered up with Ravio, Europe's first real-time compensation benchmarking platform for Tech Startups (backed by Northzone). You can connect your HR systems to see what the market is paying today, including salary, equity and benefits.
Our partnership gives free access to Ravio’s core benchmarking solution (and 15% off Ravio Pro for the 1st year). Apply to Ravio using the below landing page and entering the discount code; https://ravio.com/partners/jbm/ - WBGRDX.
James Mitra is the Founder of JBM, an award-winning executive search firm that specialises in placing COO’s and GM’s.
He’s also the Host of one of the UK’s most popular business and career podcasts, 40 Minute Mentor. It’s approaching 1 million downloads and features inspiring career stories and mentorship from world class business leaders, entrepreneurs and sporting legends.
James has been recognised as a LinkedIn Top Voice for Careers and sits on the Board of 3 organisations: Foundrs, Ivy Rock Partners and Unrest.
JBM - https://jbmc.co.uk/
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
1. What is a COO?
06 Jul 2023
00:45:12
In this episode we tackle the question of: What is a COO? Our special guest is Divinia Knowles, Founder of the London COO Roundtable.
In this episode we get her words of wisdom on the following questions:
What is a COO? What does a COO do?
What are the differences between: COO, Chief of Staff and Operations Lead?
Which COO is more successful, those that are promoted internally or those people who have joined externally?
How do you measure the success of a COO?
What is your advice for COO’s struggling with their CEO?
Divinia was COO, CFO & a director at both Mind Candy and Pact Coffee, where she also served as interim CEO. She has held or still holds chair and board seats at too many companies to list and is occasionally an angel investor.
Divinia re-trained as a coach in 2017 and combined it with her previous experience to become the COO Coach, working with start up/scale up COOs/CEOs to help guide them through successfully starting up, scaling up and exiting.
And in addition to all that, she is also the Founder of the London COO Roundtable, a community that brings operations professionals together to define what it means to be a highly effective startup and scale up Chief Operating Officer.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
Welcome to the Operations Room
21 Jun 2023
00:01:12
We are the COO coaches to help you successfully scale in this new world where efficiency is as important as growth. Remember when valuations were 3-10x ARR and money wasn’t free? We do. Each week we share our experiences and bring in scale up experts and operational leaders to help you navigate both the burning operational issues and the larger existential challenges.
Beth Ayers is a seasoned Chief Operating Officer and has helped raise over $200m from top funds - Softbank, Bessemer, TCV, MCC, Notion and Oxx. She’s built the GTM engines at Peak AI, NewVoiceMedia and Codility.
Brandon Mensinga is a veteran Chief Operating Officer and has successfully ramped four VC-backed startups, two of which successfully exited; one to Nuance Communications and the other to Microsoft.
Between us, we have over 30 years of experience building SaaS businesses with extensive FP&A, HR and operating model experience.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
43. Is usage-based pricing the answer?
16 May 2024
00:34:06
In this episode, we discuss usage-based pricing, seat pricing, maximising margin and customer expansion. We are joined by Mark Stiving, Founder of Impact Pricing.
We chat about:
What exactly is usage-based pricing?
How do we correlate pricing metrics with how customers are using the product?
What are the criteria and considerations when choosing the value metric?
How do you choose between true usage-based pricing and tiered usage-based pricing?
How do we work around the pricing mechanisms that our clients or vendors are giving us?
Is there more of a move towards straight usage or is tiered pricing here to stay?
How do we expand our customers?
Who should be responsible for pricing and packaging within the company?
Mark Stiving, Pricing Educator, Coach, Podcast Host & 2x Author. He has driven business initiatives worth hundreds of millions of dollars. He is sought after for his superpower of finding invincible profits in every company he works with.
He is an award-winning international speaker known for helping audiences find hidden value and more profit, immediately.
Mark started and successfully sold three powerful companies in the tech sector.
His forthcoming book is "Invincible Profits: How to Lead a Value Revolution and Dominate Your Market"
To learn more about Beth and Brandon or to find out about sponsorship opportunities click here.
Summary:
Usage-based pricing with a focus on personalization and avoiding seat-based pricing. 0:05
Bethany shares her recent haircut experience with Brandon, including the surprise of finding a large amount of hair after cutting it.
Brandon discusses usage-based pricing, highlighting its potential cleverness and limitations.
Pricing strategies for SaaS companies, including usage-based pricing and subscription packages. 4:02
Brandon: Value metric should be clear, easy to understand, and tie to usage (e.g., transcription files, contacts in HubSpot)
Brandon: Finding a single value metric to scale can be challenging, as customers may not understand usage outside of vendor-supplied calculators
Brandon discusses challenges in customer success with usage-based pricing, including unhappy customers who want to downgrade and the potential for unused value.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the importance of commissioning based on usage and actual money being seen, with a focus on driving the right behavior and predictability.
Brandon: Great product + late professionalization = risk (bankruptcy)
Brandon: Sales reps should focus on signing contracts, not just selling
Pricing metrics for SAS companies, focusing on value-based pricing and customer willingness. 11:53
Mark discusses pricing metrics in SAS businesses, highlighting user base pricing as most common but not always best option.
Ideal pricing metric is outcome-based, charging customers a portion of incremental profit created, like credit cards or PayPal.
Mark: Dropbox charges by amount of memory used, maintaining margins despite decreasing storage costs.
Mark: Pricing metric should be highly correlated with value, accepted by customers, and measurable.
Pricing strategies for software companies, including usage-based pricing and tiered pricing. 17:38
Bethany: Pricing with customers often, despite seat-based pricing not being best way.
Mark: Metering every feature from beginning helps understand market segments and value.
Mark considers tiered vs direct usage-based pricing for software, weighing customer perspective and revenue impact.
Pricing strategies for software companies, including usage-based pricing and land-and-expand models. 21:41
Mark advises companies to focus on solving specific problems for specific market segments, rather than trying to be a platform for everything.
Mark suggests that even in straight usage models, there are good, better, best options, and the goal is to find the right SLA (service level agreement) for each customer.
Mark recommends considering good to better to best packaging for both subscription and non-subscription businesses.
Companies should monitor usage and drive usage to expand customer accounts, with compensation depending on the situation.
Pricing and packaging strategies for SaaS companies. 26:48
Mark argues that SAS companies should pay salespersons based on lifetime value of clients, rather than just initial sign-up.
Mark believes that commission structure should incentivize salespersons to win deals, rather than just maintain existing clients.
Mark emphasizes the importance of understanding value to customers in pricing and packaging decisions.
Consultants can be hired to run numbers and provide pricing recommendations, but it's important to consider the cost and potential impact on internal decision-making.
Mark recommends a usage-based pricing approach that prioritizes client comfort and transparency.
Buyers trade money for value, so it's essential to demonstrate the value of your product.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
42. Is it possible to pivot to profitability?
09 May 2024
00:47:38
In this episode, we discuss: Is it possible to pivot to profitability? We are joined by Libby Penn, she is the COO of Improbable.
We chat about the following:
What's the COO's role in the pivot to profitability
Libby Penn has experience in various business development and operations roles across a number of high-growth technology businesses on SaaS and enterprise models, B2B and B2C, in both the UK and the US. This has given her an in-depth insight into the complexities that come with the role as COO.
Summary:
Gender roles and microaggressions in the workplace. 0:05
Bethany Ayres discusses the challenges of being a woman in leadership positions, including societal expectations and performative ally ship.
Bethany launches a series of free webinars to support first-time female executives and aspiring executives, focusing on topics such as taking a seat at the table and choosing the right life partner.
Brandon and Bethany discuss the challenges of navigating gender roles and microaggressions in their personal and professional lives.
Bethany shares an example of a leadership team meeting where a male colleague's swearing and apologies towards her created an uncomfortable work environment.
Pivoting to profitability for a B2B SaaS company. 4:55
Bethany: Analyzes company's strategy, identifies unprofitable areas for cuts.
Bethany: Looks at lease and office expirations, considers cost-cutting measures.
Bethany and Brandon discuss strategies for improving profitability, including renegotiating cloud contracts, focusing on profitable channels, and optimizing GTM motions.
They also discuss the importance of tracking data properly to make informed decisions about spend and identify areas for improvement.
Brandon and Bethany discuss partner strategy, testing, and doubling down on successful partnerships.
They emphasize the importance of hiring quality people who are well-respected within the partner company.
Pivoting to profitability, focusing on market strategy, operations efficiency, and automation. 12:42
Brandon and Bethany discuss the importance of qualitative analysis to validate data-driven insights for profitability.
Brandon and Bethany discuss the importance of operational efficiency and automation in a company's shift to profitability.
Balancing growth and profitability for startups. 15:55
Libby highlights the importance of balancing risk and innovation in investments.
Libby emphasizes product development as key to profitability, while Bethany focuses on balancing growth and profitability.
Data analysis, product development, and customer focus in tech companies. 20:03
Analyze cost of delivering product, profitability of product sets, and customer profiles to make informed decisions.
Prioritize bets on most profitable products and customer segments, layering up over timeframe (18 months).
Libby and Bethany discuss the importance of data-driven decision making in marketing, with Bethany expressing frustration at the lack of data sophistication in internal systems and the need for more rev ops professionals.
Brandon and Libby discuss the importance of understanding customer CV values and go-to-market motion.
Libby emphasizes the need for a solid customer base with a sticky product that provides value.
Customer success teams and their impact on product development and profitability. 26:19
Bethany: Customer success teams can eat into gross margin, especially when product is not user-friendly.
Libby: Good customer success teams can help with customer adoption, but implementation is also important.
Libby: UX teams struggle to deliver due to engineering and sales leaders' lack of time and willingness to listen to user research.
Using AI to improve product adoption and financial management in startups. 30:36
Companies prioritize user experience to drive commercial success.
Libby emphasizes the importance of financial acumen in business leaders, including understanding cash flow and opportunity cost.
Brandon highlights the challenge of accountability and controls in a company with a tight runway, and the need for transparency and financial literacy across the team.
Financial transparency and empowering employees to make better decisions. 34:48
Libby emphasizes the importance of financial education for teams, citing her experience at Blippo where transparency and knowledge-sharing helped employees stay motivated during difficult times.
Bethany expresses interest in learning more about financial education resources, and Libby suggests exploring pre-made materials or seeking help from professionals.
Libby suggests building financial literacy into onboarding processes to ensure employees understand how the business makes and spends money.
Brandon emphasizes the importance of VPs of Finance being leaders and communicators, not just number crunchers.
Libby emphasizes empowering employees to help build the business.
Employee X presents a new pricing strategy, improving gross margin.
Investing in people, understanding company finances, and empowerment in the workplace. 42:32
Bethany shares her experience of feeling empowered in some organizations but not in others, and highlights the importance of giving people access to power and information to contribute.
Libby encourages leaders to create opportunities for people to connect with them, such as monthly drop-in lunches or cross-functional working groups, to foster a culture of inclusion and empowerment.
Libby emphasizes the importance of understanding a company's finances to make informed decisions.
Unlocking the state of a business through data analysis can lead to clearer conversations with investors and improved profitability.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
41. The life-ruining power of routines
02 May 2024
00:40:20
In this episode, we discuss: The life-ruining power of routines. We are joined by Markham Heid, he is a Journalist with TIME and New York Times.
We chat about the following:
How do we optimise our lives without falling into the trap of routine?
Do we need routine and structure to be productive?
Are you busy because it’s necessary?
What’s the right balance between routine and creative space?
How can companies get involved in breaking routine and encouraging creativity?
Markham has worked as a staff writer at both a major metropolitan newspaper and a national magazine, but for the past 12 years he’s worked as an independent (freelance) journalist.
Markham has written about England's Jurassic Coast for Travel & Leisure, covered workplace culture for an HR quarterly mag, and explored Germany's transition away from nuclear energy for Vox. But most of his writing has been in the health and science space.
Between 2014 and 2018, he wrote a weekly health column for TIME.com, which was called You Asked. Since 2018, Markham has done something similar for Medium, where he’s followed by ~350k subscribers. He’s still a frequent contributor at TIME, and he also writes regularly for the New York Times. His work has received awards from both the Society of Professional Journalists and the Maryland, Delaware, and D.C. Press Association.
He’s originally from Detroit, but right now he lives in southeast Germany with his wife and two kids.
Summary:
The negative impact of routines and habits on personal optimization. 0:05
Bethany aims to increase income by securing one more board seat.
Markham Hyde argues in Financial Times article that routines lead to suffering, not personal optimization.
Routines, productivity, and spontaneity in adulthood. 3:15
Brandon: Routine-oriented, wants to package boring tasks for productivity.
Bethany: Automate, eliminate tasks to free mental load, not create routine.
Bethany and Brandon have different approaches to exercise and structure in their lives.
Brandon has lived in different countries and jobs, categorizing his life by chunks of time, while now as an adult with a family, he questions whether that's possible anymore.
Routine, spontaneity, and finding balance in life and work. 8:21
Bethany suggests finding balance between structure and unstructured time to pursue interests and passions.
Moderation is key to happiness, rather than being too rigid or spontaneous.
Bethany suggests creating a routine to overcome fear and find inspiration (0:11:02)
Bethany and Brandon discuss the balance between routine and spontaneity in business contexts (0:12:41)
Innovation weeks in companies, with a focus on structure and culture. 14:04
Innovation week at a company led to employee-generated ideas like preserving endangered languages using machine learning.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the success of innovation weeks at a previous company, with Bethany expressing interest in replicating the concept at her current company.
Finding balance between routine and novelty for productivity and mental well-being. 17:31
Markham recognizes the limitations of routines and habits, advocating for balance in life.
Bethany appreciates Markham's contrarian perspective on habits, finding common ground in the need for balance.
Markham: Habits can limit creativity, need variety to open up new perspectives.
Markham: Balancing routine and novelty depends on individual comfort levels and life stage.
Finding balance between routine and novelty in life. 22:41
Markham: Happiness is a byproduct of engagement, not the goal of life.
Bethany: Routine gives us a sense of control, but can lead to compulsive habits.
Markham shares his thoughts on how to avoid boredom and stay engaged, including trying new things and mixing up his work routine.
Markham has taken steps to address boredom by meeting with friends, working in different locations, and incorporating creative activities into his day.
The importance of questioning routines and habits for fulfillment. 26:39
Bethany values fun and exploration, leaving her previous career for a year of discovery.
Markham highlights the importance of mindfulness in identifying what brings joy and fulfillment.
Bethany: Questioned life after realizing habits were controlling it.
Markham: Brain's engagement with new experiences creates fulfilling time.
Brandon: Outsourcing routine tasks to free up time for high-value activities.
Markham: Filling extra time with productive or healthy habits, rather than exploring new things.
Work-life balance, prioritizing memories, and finding meaningful experiences. 32:51
Bethany and Markham discuss the concept of "time travel" and how our lives are a series of experiences that we may not remember in the long term.
They reflect on the importance of figuring out what choices to make in life to lead to a happy and fulfilling existence.
Organizations prioritize work over personal growth, leading to employee dissatisfaction.
Markham suggests taking breaks to give brains time to put pieces together (0:37:38)
Markham advises focusing on what matters, bringing forward what led to joy and satisfaction (0:38:07)
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
40. Why does community matter for organisations?
25 Apr 2024
00:33:00
In this episode, we discuss: Why does community matter for organisations? We are joined by Jaclyn Pascocello, she is the founder of Fabrik.
We chat about the following:
What are the trends in people and the connections they are building and want to build?
Where should the L&D budget be spent?
Is it part of the company's responsibility to help foster connections that are not within the company?
Are we at the top of a community-building hype cycle?
What are the optimal conditions for the hybrid worker?
Mom + Founder of Fabrik. A driven leader with a passion for hospitality and customer experience and a proven track record of building and scaling startups. Building an IRL solution to uplift our communities and create more serendipity. Expert in creating unique and memorable consumer experiences in DTC, brick-and-mortar, hospitality, and F&B.
Summary:
Homophobia and the story of a forgotten fashion photographer. 0:06
Brandon and Bethany discuss life stages, London, and the BFI's LGBTQ+ film festival.
Bethany and Brandon discuss the documentary "Stonewall" and the experiences of LGBTQ+ individuals in the past.
Loneliness in remote work and its impact on employees' well-being. 3:40
Brandon: Loneliness crisis affects individuals, organizations, and communities.
Bethany: Hybrid work is here to stay, but it may lead to more loneliness.
Brandon and Bethany discuss the impact of remote work on employee loneliness and the responsibility of organizations to address it.
Software developer quit previous job due to lack of pre-existing relationships, highlighting the importance of social connections in the workplace.
Combating loneliness in the workplace through professional connections. 9:20
Bethany shares her personal experience of feeling unseen and lonely in her marriage, despite being physically present with her husband.
Bethany finds it freeing to make deeper connections outside of work due to reduced risk and potential for misinterpretation.
Brandon suggests providing financial support for individuals to join professional organizations, such as the CEO roundtable, to combat loneliness and provide emotional support.
Building communities for professionals, both internally and externally. 13:25
Bethany and others discuss the importance of community and connection in the workplace.
Speaker 3: Internal community building should be supported by L&D budget, but external communities can also be fostered.
Bethany: External communities can be monetized to help employees feel less lonely, but internal connection is also important.
Workplace community building, employee resource groups, and customer advocacy communities. 17:40
Organizations should focus on supporting community within the employee base through programs like mental health subsidies and employee resource groups.
Employee resource groups provide a safe space for employees to discuss certain topics without feeling uncomfortable, and companies should prioritize this within their organizations.
Speaker 3 highlights rise of customer communities for brands, with goals of support, feedback, loyalty, and advocacy.
Hybrid work and community, with a focus on connection and wellness. 21:25
Speaker 3: Hybrid work requires rethinking team gatherings, budgets for productive spaces.
Speaker 3: Companies should provide options for employees to work in inspiring, connected places.
Speaker 3: Being lonely is like smoking 15 cigarettes a day, and companies must address this by providing wellness programming, mindfulness, and community spaces.
Speaker 3 recommends starting small by providing a budget for employees to join communities that resonate with them, and tracking the data to see the impact on productivity and well-being.
Work-life balance, mental health, and community connection. 27:05
Brandon: Importance of work-life balance for Gen X and Gen Z.
Bethany: Mental health and balancing work and community for younger generations.
Speaker 3: Connecting with others can combat loneliness, even for introverts.
Bethany: Seeking meaningful connections can lead to a boost in energy and vibration.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
39. What are the priorities for COO’s in 2024?
18 Apr 2024
00:44:18
In this episode we discuss: What are the priorities for COO’s in 2024? We are joined by Cameron Herold, he is the founder of the COO Alliance and author of the Second in Command.
We chat about the following:
What are the priorities for COO’s in 2024?
How should we think about budgets this year?
How is the COO role changing?
What are the commonalities across COO’s?
How do you work with a controlling CEO?
How should a COO think about their relationship with the CEO?
Founder of the COO Alliance & Invest In Your Leaders Course
Author of Vivid Vision & The Second In Command
Meet Cameron Herold, the mastermind behind the exponential growth of hundreds of companies. As the founder of the COO Alliance and the Invest In Your Leaders course, Cameron is a dynamic consultant who has coached some of the biggest names in business, including Sprint Telecom and a monarchy in the Middle East. Known as the "CEO Whisperer", Cameron has a reputation for guiding his clients to double their profits and revenue in just three years or less.
Cameron's entrepreneurial journey began at a young age, and by 35, he had helped build his first two $100 million dollar companies. But his greatest achievement came as the COO of 1-800-GOT-JUNK?, where he engineered the company's spectacular growth from $2 million to $106 million in revenue and from 14 to 3,100 employees - all in just six years.
Cameron is not just a successful business leader, but also a captivating speaker. The current publisher of Forbes magazine, Rich Karlgaard, stated "Cameron Herold is the best speaker I've ever heard...he hits grand slams”.
When he's not on stage, Cameron continues to teach through his Second In Command podcast and his bestselling books, including Vivid Vision, Meetings Suck, Free PR, Double Double, and The Miracle Morning for Entrepreneurs.
Cameron is a top-rated international speaker and has been paid to speak in 26 countries and on all 7 continents, including Antarctica in early 2022. He is also the top-rated lecturer at EO/MIT's Entrepreneurial Masters Program and a powerful and effective speaker at CEO and COO leadership events worldwide.
Summary:
Budgeting, forecasting, and scenario planning for businesses. 0:05
Bethany Ayers is considering running for MP to advocate for cannabis legalization.
Cameron Herold, CEO of several companies, joins the podcast to discuss priorities for a CEO in 2024.
Brandon and Bethany discuss the importance of linking budget, revenue, and GTM assumptions in a financial model to make informed investment decisions and communicate effectively with leadership.
Bethany agrees that this model is essential for aligning leadership with the company's situation and setting budgets based on financial forecasts.
Bethany emphasizes the importance of a scorecard in tracking key elements of low cash flow and ensuring data integrity.
Brandon discusses his experiment with a client, using a financial p&l tool for scenario planning and live data flow, and evaluating its effectiveness in serving three purposes.
Leadership development, confidence building, and skills growth. 7:47
Bethany and Brandon discuss the importance of skills development and confidence building in organizations.
Brandon shares a study on how CEOs are investing in generative AI and no-code automation within companies.
Bethany praises employees for speaking up, learns to deliver constructive feedback.
Brandon and Bethany discuss how to build confidence in oneself and others, with Brandon sharing his process of reinforcing positive qualities and achievements to build confidence.
Cameron Herold offers insights on how to convince a controlling CEO to let go of some power, emphasizing the importance of building trust and confidence.
How to approach CEOs with tough feedback while building trust and credibility. 14:00
Cameron Herold suggests appealing to a CEO's sense of greed, need for praise, and avoidance of conflict to help them see the negative impact of their controlling behavior.
Bethany waits until the CEO is ready for the conversation, using a metaphor of waiting for them to trip and fall before offering help.
CEO priorities in a rapidly changing business environment. 16:19
CEOs must adapt quickly to fast rate of change in business or risk being left behind.
Cameron Herold emphasizes the need for CEOs to adapt quickly to change and grow their people's skills faster than ever before.
Herold visualizes employees climbing two ladders simultaneously, growing their skills and confidence while expanding their network.
Leadership development, praise, and core values. 20:36
Cameron Herold emphasizes the importance of developing leadership skills in employees, including delegation, situational leadership, coaching, and time management.
Herold suggests leveraging resources, such as hiring a consultant to train managers on interviewing skills, and sharing the training session with other leaders.
Bethany asks Cameron Herold about tips on giving good praise.
Cameron suggests leaders should catch people doing something right and praise them regularly.
Leadership styles, CEO roles, and communication between CEOs and CFOs. 25:04
Cameron Herold emphasizes the importance of delegating tasks to others and providing specific praise to reinforce desired behaviors.
Bethany agrees, noting that growing a business and growing relationships share similarities in communication, collaboration, and prioritizing core values.
Cameron Herold: CEOs and CFOs have different leadership styles and perspectives.
Herold: Different types of CFOs emerging, matching entrepreneur's personality profile and stage of business important.
CEO leadership, profitability, and the importance of building real businesses. 30:16
Cameron Herold notes that CEOs tend to be strong leaders, managing multiple areas and leading other leaders effectively.
Cameron Herold emphasizes the importance of focusing on profitability in tech companies.
Bethany agrees and highlights the need for companies to grow real businesses with real financials.
AI adoption, CEO evolution, and leadership skills. 34:26
Cameron Herold: AI will create winners and losers, leverage AI to drive growth and profitability.
Cameron Herold: CEO communities will rise, collaborate and grow like entrepreneurs did with YPO, EO, and Vistage.
Cameron Herold, a former COO, transitioned to entrepreneurial CEO with ease due to his entrepreneurial upbringing and DNA.
Most CEOs lack the entrepreneurial DNA and desire to be CEOs, focusing instead on growing a bigger company or a better brand.
Leadership roles, responsibilities, and priorities in business. 39:12
Cameron Herold: CEOs must release traditional roles, focus on vision & culture.
Herold: CEOs have 4-5 direct reports, oversee legal, board, & culture.
Cameron Herold emphasizes the importance of caring for employees as humans, not just as workers.
He encourages leaders to focus on people, not just tasks, to build a successful company.
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis:
Podcorn - https://podcorn.com/privacy
50. How to be a COO
05 Sep 2024
00:37:00
In this episode we discuss: how to be a COO in today's complex world. We are joined by Jennifer Geary, Seasoned C-Suite executive across multiple industries and roles from fractional COO to Managing Director. Author of bestselling books How To Be a COO, CRO, CPO and CSO.
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We chat about the following with Jennifer Geary:
The role of a COO involves being the second-in-command and bridging the gap between strategy and operations.
Can AI enhance the efficiency and creativity of the COO role, with human judgement and decision-making remaining essential?
Should COOs prioritise efficiency and creativity when implementing AI, while also considering sustainability and ESG metrics?
Why should we consider suppliers, supply chain, software suppliers, facilities, power consumption, and social context in sustainability efforts?
How important are flexibility, choice, in-person collaboration, and open communication in creating a positive work environment?
Jennifer Geary is a former MD, COO and CRO with over 25 years of experience in finance, technology, risk and legal, across diverse industries from financial services to not-for-profit.
She is also an author, speaker, board advisor and mentor to emerging businesses. She has attained qualification as a chartered accountant, PRINCE 2 practitioner, CISA and CISSP, with recent certifications in Sustainable Finance and ESG Investing and Ethical AI.
To learn more about Beth and Brandon or to find out about sponsorship opportunities click here.
Summary
00:00 Introduction and Overview
01:02 Defining the Role of a COO
07:28 Implementing AI: Efficiency and Creativity
12:25 Prioritising Sustainability and ESG Metrics
16:30 Considering Suppliers and Supply Chain
18:00 Creating a Positive Work Environment
20:50 Respecting Privacy in the Workplace
22:53 The Next Step: CEO or COO?
29:15 What CEOs are concerned about now
31:38 Post IPO resources
32:44 Wrap up
This podcast uses the following third-party services for analysis: