In this special crossover episode, we launch The Way Between Podcast from within The Living Conversation.

Adam introduces The Way Between as a more flexible, long-form space to explore East–West philosophy in a story-driven way: how thinkers like Socrates, Confucius, Laozi, and Hui Neng emerged, how their ideas shaped cultures, and how their influence still reaches our lives today.

From there, Adam, Anthony, and guest Dr. Nick Egan dive into:

• Socrates’ image of the wise sea captain and why philosophy is the “art of navigation” in life
• How Adam’s Philosophy 101 class planted the seed that led him to change his major and devote his life to this work
• The Tibetan Buddhist framework of view, path, and result—and how “view” quietly shapes everything we do
• Dr. Yi Wu’s integral life philosophy and his triangle of reality, practice, and theory
• Zen stories of Hui Neng and how a single exchange between teacher and student can become the most important moment in the universe
• Nick’s experience of a Zen Roshi responding, “This is Nirvana,” and how that answer cracked ordinary thinking
• Tibetan pointing-out instructions on the nature of mind, and why we may glimpse it many times without recognizing it
• How our “story” about reality locks us into patterns—and how Socratic questions can loosen that story
• Adam’s time teaching freshman philosophy, planting the first seeds of “examining your life” in students who may not even know what philosophy is yet
• Jung’s sense of the hero’s journey and the challenge to actually cultivate the soul in ordinary life

Along the way, they explore Zen, Tibetan Buddhism, Confucianism, and Western philosophy as different ways of pointing toward the same question:

How should I live?

And they return again and again to the idea that philosophy is not just a subject—but a daily practice of view, conversation, and self-cultivation.

Connect with our guest:

• Dr. Nick Egan – nickeganphd.com
• Shift Leadership Group – shiftleadership.group

Connect with the hosts:

• Adam Dietz – “The Way Between” on Substack (search: The Way Between Substack)
• Email Adam: dietzadam@gmail.com
• Anthony Wright – theonaut.com

If this conversation resonates, you can follow The Way Between Podcast on your favorite podcast app and keep listening to The Living Conversation on 'Attunement' on KWMR and wherever you get your podcasts.

In this episode of The Living Conversation, Adam Dietz and Anthony Wright sit down with members of the Sonoma State University Philosophy Club to explore how philosophy lives through real experience.

From Lao Tzu’s image of muddy water settling into clarity, to personal stories of anxiety, creativity, and healing, the discussion ranges from Daoism to Buddhism to Socratic thought; all grounded in lived experience. Together with Colette, Haley, and Andrew, they examine how logic and emotion, feeling and reason, art and philosophy, all belong to the same search for wisdom.

Themes: anxiety and awareness, Daoist clarity, creativity and emotion, the Middle Way, the Eightfold Path, philosophy as a living practice.

🎓 Featuring the Sonoma State University Philosophy Club.

🌿 Hosted by Adam Dietz and Anthony Wright.

The central theme of this podcast episode revolves around the enduring relevance of philosophy in contemporary life, akin to the warmth of the sun that persists despite its distance. We engage in a profound discussion about the teachings of Confucius and the importance of integrating ancient wisdom into our modern existence. Our conversation delves into the concepts of sincerity and humility as foundational aspects of Chinese philosophy, emphasizing their significance in fostering harmonious relationships and personal growth. We also explore the distinction between fate and heaven's destiny, encouraging listeners to actively seek growth in unfamiliar territories rather than resigning themselves to predetermined paths. Ultimately, our aim is to invite our audience to reflect on their experiences and the practical applications of philosophical principles in their daily lives.

Delving deeper into the philosophical teachings, the conversation transitions to the critical examination of the dual concepts of sincerity and humility, as articulated within the framework of Chinese philosophy. The hosts reference their mentor, Dr. Yi Wu, highlighting the importance of these virtues as foundational to harmonious living. They discuss the energetic interplay between sincerity, representing Yang, and humility, embodying Yin, and how these principles manifest in everyday interactions. The dialogue further elucidates the intricate relationship between these concepts and the overarching principles of Daoism, wherein the harmony of opposites is essential for personal and communal well-being. This aspect of the discussion serves to underscore the importance of balance in one’s approach to life, suggesting that the cultivation of both attributes fosters a more profound connection with oneself and others. The hosts also draw on the insights from their studies to encourage listeners to explore how these philosophical tenets can enhance their own lives, thereby transforming abstract concepts into practical applications that resonate within the fabric of daily existence.

Takeaways:

• Philosophy serves as a warm guide, continually relevant in helping individuals navigate the complexities of life.
• The essence of Confucius's teachings lies in transmitting the wisdom of ancient sages to enrich contemporary understanding.
• Understanding heaven's destiny involves recognizing the opportunities for growth that life presents, rather than succumbing to a fatalistic outlook.
• The dichotomy of sincerity and humility reflects the balance required in both personal and philosophical pursuits, embodying the principles of yin and yang.
• Engaging with philosophy should not be viewed as a luxury, but rather as a fundamental necessity for personal development and societal harmony.
• The interconnectedness of existence suggests that by nurturing our own growth, we contribute to the peace and harmony of the greater universe.

Links referenced in this episode:

• dietzadam@gmail.com
• theonaut.com
• thewaybetween
• substack.com
• youtube.com

Companies mentioned in this episode:

• California Institute of Integral Studies

This podcast episode delves into the essential role of philosophy in public discourse and its enduring relevance in contemporary society. We assert that philosophy has historically served as a forum for communal engagement, promoting wisdom and virtue among individuals and within societies. We explore the significant contributions of both Eastern and Western philosophical traditions, highlighting figures such as Socrates and Confucius, who sought to disseminate knowledge to the public. Our discussion further emphasizes the importance of critical thinking as a tool for navigating the complexities of modern life, particularly in the face of manipulative tactics that exploit vulnerability. Ultimately, we invite listeners to reflect on their own philosophical journeys and consider how cultivating wisdom can enrich their lives and the broader community.

The discourse presented in this episode revolves around the profound significance of public philosophy and its inherent role in fostering communal wisdom. Both speakers engage in a thought-provoking exploration of historical philosophical figures, such as Socrates and Confucius, emphasizing their commitment to disseminating knowledge and virtue amongst the populace. This reflection elucidates the essence of philosophy as a communal endeavor rather than an isolated pursuit, underscoring the necessity for philosophical dialogue in contemporary society. The episode further delves into the practical implications of philosophy, particularly in the context of critical thinking and self-awareness, as the hosts share personal anecdotes about the challenges posed by modern manipulative tactics, such as scams, that exploit cognitive biases. The conversation serves as a clarion call for listeners to cultivate their critical faculties and remain vigilant against the encroachment of manipulative influences, thus reinforcing the episode's central thesis: philosophy is not merely an academic exercise but a vital instrument for navigating the complexities of life. Through this examination, the hosts invite the audience to reflect on their own practices of self-cultivation and the importance of philosophical inquiry in enhancing personal and communal well-being.

Takeaways:

• This podcast emphasizes the public nature of philosophy, highlighting its accessibility and importance for all individuals.
• Philosophy serves as a means of cultivating wisdom and virtue, which positively impacts society as a whole.
• The conversation discusses critical thinking in the context of recognizing and avoiding manipulative techniques and scams.
• Listeners are encouraged to reflect on how they cultivate their own self-awareness and clarity during challenging times.
• The hosts explore the significance of education as a tool for liberation from ignorance, akin to the allegory of the cave.
• Ultimately, the podcast advocates for the integration of philosophical discussions into everyday life to enhance understanding and personal growth.

Links referenced in this episode:

• dietzadam@gmail.com
• 
  
• thewaybetween@substack.com
• theonaut.com
• theonaut2nr.com

The narrative presented in this episode elucidates the profound journey of Hui Neng, the first patriarch of Zen Buddhism, whose extraordinary life trajectory defied the conventions of his time. Initially an illiterate and impoverished laborer, Hui Neng's serendipitous encounter with the recitation of the Diamond Sutra catalyzed his instant enlightenment, marking a pivotal moment in the evolution of Zen thought. This episode delves into the intricate interplay between Buddhism and Taoism, expounding upon the philosophical underpinnings that shaped Hui Neng's experiences and teachings. We further explore the ensuing contest within the monastery, where Hui Neng's unorthodox insights challenged the established paradigms of enlightenment and knowledge. Through a detailed examination of his life and the implications of his teachings, we aim to illuminate the enduring legacy of Hui Neng and his revolutionary approach to spiritual awakening.

The narrative encapsulates the remarkable journey of Hui Neng, the sixth patriarch of Zen Buddhism, who emerged from obscurity to become a pivotal figure in the spiritual landscape of China. Born into a family that faced political ostracism, Hui Neng lived in Guangdong province, distanced from the cultural and intellectual heart of the country. Despite his humble beginnings as an illiterate wood gatherer, his life took a transformative turn upon hearing the Diamond Sutra, a text revered for its profound insights. This moment of revelation catalyzed his enlightenment, allowing him to perceive the essence of mind without formal education or prior study. His subsequent journey to a monastery to further explore Buddhism is marked by both physical and metaphorical challenges, emphasizing the theme of perseverance in the quest for spiritual understanding. Hui Neng's story serves as a poignant reminder of the potential for enlightenment irrespective of one's social status or educational background, ultimately culminating in his recognition as a leader in Zen Buddhism, where he challenged established norms and advocated for a direct, personal experience of enlightenment beyond scholarly pursuits.

Takeaways:

• Huineng, the first patriarch of Zen Buddhism, emerged from a humble background marked by adversity and ignorance.
• The Diamond Sutra played a pivotal role in Huineng's enlightenment, signifying its profound impact on Buddhist philosophy.
• The story of Huineng illustrates the concept of sudden enlightenment, challenging traditional beliefs about intellectual attainment in Buddhism.
• Buddhism and Taoism share a deep connection, as evidenced in the teachings and practices that influenced Zen Buddhism's development.

Links referenced in this episode:

• theonaut.com
• dietzadam@gmail.com
• thewaybetween.substack.com

The central theme of this podcast episode revolves around the notion of attunement and the necessity of revitalizing stagnant ideas within our society. We delve into the metaphor of decay, illustrated by an image from Chinese philosophy depicting a bowl of food that has become infested, symbolizing the stagnation of both creativity and political thought. We advocate for the urgent need to "clean the bowl," which entails acknowledging the current state of disarray and the prevalence of unhelpful ideas that pervade public discourse. Through our discussion, we emphasize the value of independent thinking and the importance of fostering a humane society that embraces diverse perspectives, particularly in the context of our nation’s immigrant heritage. Ultimately, we contend that a commitment to deep reflection and a collective effort toward humanity can lead us toward a more vibrant and just society.

This image of “cleaning the bowl” comes from the I Ching…a root text of both Taoism and Confucianism.

We talk about how ideas decay, and how the Way calls us to renew them: not with outrage, but with alignment.

This clip is from The Living Conversation, our ongoing dialogue on clarity, rhythm, and return.

#taoism #iching #stillness #philosophy #culturalrenewal #clarity

Get full access to The Way Between at thewaybetween.substack.com/subscribeTakeaways:

• The conversation emphasizes the necessity of refreshing stagnant ideas to foster creativity and progress.
• We discussed how acknowledging problems is essential to address and improve societal issues effectively.
• Immigrants are portrayed as vital sources of innovation and resilience within our evolving society.
• The podcast highlights the importance of broad education as a foundation for independent and humane thinking.
• Stagnation in societal ideas can lead to decay, necessitating a concerted effort to revive them.
• Humanity and the acknowledgment of historical injustices are crucial for a more united and compassionate society.

The discussion commences with Anthony Wright and Adam Dietz sharing their reflections on the current societal climate, characterized by a sense of stagnation and discontent. Wright introduces a potent metaphor derived from Chinese philosophy, specifically a hexagram signifying decay. The imagery of a stagnant bowl of food corrupted by maggots serves as a profound analogy for the ideas and creative energies that have become stagnant within contemporary discourse. Rather than attributing blame to individuals, Wright emphasizes that it is the ideas themselves that have failed to evolve, leading to a cultural malaise. He posits that just as one must clean a decayed bowl, we too must refresh our ideas to rejuvenate our collective consciousness and foster a more humane society. Through this lens, the conversation invites listeners to reflect deeply on the nature of our political and cultural landscape, urging an acknowledgment of the decay present in our ideologies and the necessity of renewal.

As the dialogue unfolds, the hosts explore the historical context of immigration in the United States, recognizing it as a vital source of vitality and innovation. Dietz underlines the resilience and determination of immigrant populations throughout history, suggesting that their contributions have been instrumental in shaping the nation’s character. This leads to a broader discussion on the need for a comprehensive educational framework that promotes independent thinking and a well-rounded understanding of the world. The hosts assert that a liberal education, encompassing the humanities, arts, and sciences, is essential for nurturing engaged and thoughtful citizens. They advocate...

In this closing segment of The Living Conversation, Adam and Anthony reflect on how to stay grounded when trust breaks down, institutions collapse, and cultural conversation becomes incoherent.

They explore Confucius’ warning about those who only seek profit, the modern loss of good-faith discussion, and how Lao Tzu’s teachings help us sort through confusion…like letting sediment settle in muddy water.

You’ll also hear about Plato’s cave, the Marx Brothers’ “sanity clause,” and why treating ourselves as “wastewater professionals” might be the most spiritual practice of all.

Featuring:– The fallacy of false equivalence– The social cost of abandoning trust– Taoist clarity as inner filtration– An invitation to rebuild wisdom together

—🎧 All episodes at thewaybetween.substack.com📍 Instagram: @the.waybetween

In this segment of The Living Conversation, we explore the tension between conformity and individuality, between the illusion of belonging and the truth of who we are.

Drawing from Confucian and Taoist thought, we reflect on how real unity doesn’t erase our differences, but honors them. Adam and Anthony discuss why walking your own path is not just courageous…it’s essential.

Through the lens of Eastern philosophy, critical thinking, and classroom experience, we look at the subtle manipulations that shape identity, the pressure to trade insight for approval, and the quiet rebellion of becoming fully human.

Featuring:– Confucius on destiny and “walking bits of Heaven”– Lao Tzu on being and non-being– The fallacy of ridicule and the story of chess with a pigeon

This episode is a meditation on real belonging, the kind that arises not from agreement, but from deepening our insight, our humanity, and our true selves.

—🎧 Listen to all episodes at thewaybetween.substack.com📍 Follow on Instagram: @the.waybetween

In this segment of The Living Conversation, we explore Lao Tzu’s vision of contentment: a village where sharp weapons are never used, where carriages sit still, and where people live fully without needing to go anywhere.

This is not minimalism. It’s a radical teaching about presence, about realizing the Tao is already here, not somewhere else, not after effort.

We also reflect on the tension between logic and experience, the role of critical thinking in spiritual inquiry, and the Eastern philosophical approach to truth that can’t be grasped, only lived.

Featuring a story about teaching students who resist “wordless wisdom,” a passage from Heinrich Zimmer on enlightenment, and a conversation on what happens when we stop trying to chase the sacred and start recognizing it in our ordinary lives.

🎧 Find all episodes at thewaybetween.substack.com📍 Follow on Instagram: @the.waybetween

In this episode of The Living Conversation, we talk about what happens when the world feels too loud. From Taoist metaphors to YouTube algorithms, we explore how staying still…rather than grasping…becomes an act of clarity.Whether you’re dealing with media overload, political despair, or daily FOMO, this is a reminder that you don’t have to get pulled in. The Tao is always present; not in what’s next, but in what’s already here.

In this final part of The Living Conversation Episode 2, we explore what it really means to cultivate the mind, not just once, but again and again. From sports and teaching to philosophy and daily life, we reflect on how clarity and critical thinking become second nature not through perfection, but through consistent practice.

We also talk about social hypnosis, media influence, and the need to re-examine what we’re being told…and what we’re telling ourselves. This episode closes with an invitation: to stay human, stay clear, and stay engaged.

If something here resonates, we’d love to hear from you. You can comment below, subscribe to join the conversation, or reach Adam directly at dietzadam@gmail.com.

In this episode of The Living Conversation, we reflect on how to live wisely in a world that often feels broken. From Confucian teachings on harmony and propriety to the Taoist return to stillness, this conversation touches on what we can actually control and what no system, ideology, or moment in history can take away.

Through stories of the I Ching, personal awakening, and a daughter's wisdom, we explore the quiet, continual path of self-cultivation and why it may be the most important work we ever do.

What happens when philosophy students turn their attention to emotion, technology, and mindfulness? In this episode of The Living Conversation, hosts Adam Dietz and Anthony Wright sit down with Colette, Andrew, and Haley from the Sonoma State University Philosophy Club to explore how social media shapes emotion, how grounding and Qigong restore balance, and how ancient wisdom, Confucian, Daoist, and Zen, meets modern anxiety.

Together they ask: How do we stay present in a distracted world? How can we cultivate the mind as a living practice?

philosophy, mindfulness, emotion, grounding, Tai Chi, Qigong, Confucianism, Zen, Sonoma State Philosophy Club, Adam Dietz, Anthony Wright, The Way Between, student conversation, presence, social media and mental health, living philosophy

What if the mind doesn’t need more stimulation, but less?

In this episode of The Living Conversation, we explore what it means to let the mind settle. Drawing from Confucian and Taoist teachings, we reflect on sincerity, stillness, and the quiet strength that emerges when we let go of force.

From The Great Learning to Lao Tzu’s muddy water analogy, this is a conversation about clarity, presence, and the kind of peace that doesn’t need to be pushed.

If this resonates, you can:

* Comment below to join the conversation

* Subscribe to stay connected

* Or reach out directly at dietzadam@gmail.com

Your reflections help this project grow. Thanks for listening.

What if clarity doesn’t come from trying harder…but from letting things settle?In this episode of The Living Conversation, we talk about the kind of wisdom that begins with sincerity, moves through stillness, and ends in clear seeing.Drawing from Confucian and Taoist traditions, we explore what it means to cultivate a steady mind in a noisy world, and why it might be the most radical thing we can do right now.

Episode 2 of The Living Conversation aired today on KWMR.

This segment moves from Confucian self-cultivation to Taoist stillness, tracing the path from making your thoughts sincere to letting muddy waters settle. We talk about The Great Learning, inner harmony, and how to begin living well today, not someday.

🎧 Listen at KWMR.org

If you’ve ever felt called to slow down, clarify your mind, and live with integrity, this conversation is for you.

More to come soon, including full recordings and highlights. Grateful to be walking this path with you.

Welcome — this is the place I’ll be adding video and audio moments from The Living Conversation.

Some clips are short, some longer. All are meant to be shared in the spirit of a quiet conversation — not polished, not packaged, just real.

I’ll keep returning to this post as new clips and segments are ready. If one speaks to you, feel free to pass it along, drop a comment, or just sit with it.

▶️ To help support the show, watching the clip here does count as a YouTube view — but if you’re open to it, clicking through to YouTube to like, comment, or subscribe makes a huge difference.

Thanks for being part of this space. I’m glad you’re here.

In this episode of The Living Conversation, Adam Dietz and Anthony Wright speak with Nick Egan PhD, a philosopher, traveler, and executive coach who bridges the worlds of Tibetan wisdom and modern leadership.

Nick shares stories from his years in Nepal, Bhutan, and Tibet, and the lessons learned from living among monasteries rather than merely studying them. Together, they explore Milarepa’s idea that “leaving home is half the dharma,” the value of discomfort, and how authentic practice shows up in daily life; whether in a Himalayan village or a corporate boardroom.

🧭 Topics include:

• Zen and Tibetan approaches to practice and presence
• 
  
• How “leaving home” transforms perspective
• 
  
• Integrating spirituality and leadership
• 
  
• Why everything, in the end, might be “all right”

Conversation Highlights:

• 
  
• 
  
• (00:02:00) Nick’s first journey through India, Japan, and Nepal
• 
  
• 
  
• 
  
• (00:04:30) Adam & Anthony reflect on Japan, Taiwan, and lived philosophy
• 
  
• 
  
• 
  
• (00:06:10) Milarepa’s teaching: “Leaving home is half the Dharma”
• 
  
• 
  
• 
  
• (00:08:50) How Tibetan culture honors serious practitioners
• 
  
• 
  
• 
  
• (00:09:56) Advice for finding a teacher and staying present in daily life
• 
  
• 
  
• 
  
• (00:11:00) The joy of teaching and shared awakening

About the Guest:

Nick Egan, PhD, is an executive coach and leadership consultant whose background in Eastern philosophy and years of fieldwork in the Himalayas inform his work with global leaders. He is the founder of Shift Leadership Group and the author of Shift: The Art of Transforming Limitations.

🔗 www.nickeganphd.com | LinkedIn

Connect:

🎧 The Living Conversation is hosted by Adam Dietz and Anthony Wright.

📬 Contact Anthony at Theonaut.com

Adam at dietzadam@gmail.com or visit thewaybetween.substack.com

#TheLivingConversation #NickEgan #Philosophy #Leadership #Tibet #Mindfulness #Dharma #Coaching #LivedPhilosophy

In this episode of Attunement and The Living Conversation, hosts Anthony Wright and Adam Dietz welcome guest Nick Egan, PhD; a leadership coach and scholar with a background in positive psychology and Asian philosophy. Together, they explore the crossroads of philosophy and psychology, diving into themes of authority and authenticity in coaching, flourishing and positive psychology, Buddhist and Daoist perspectives on consciousness, and the unity of wisdom across traditions.

The conversation ranges from Martin Seligman’s call for a psychology of flourishing, to James Hillman’s critique of psychotherapy, to Tibetan Buddhism, Zen practice, and Daoist teachings; all pointing toward the timeless question: how do we live and flourish in a “crazy world”?

Nick reflects on coaching as mirror-work, the dangers of “Deadwood Zen,” and why wisdom traditions across East and West ultimately converge on the same mystical truth. Adam and Anthony bring in insights from Dr. Yi Wu, William James, Deepak Chopra, Alan Watts, and B. Alan Wallace, weaving a dialogue between science, psychology, and spirituality.

Connect with our guest: nickeganphd.com | shiftleadership.group

Connect with us: Adam — The Way Between on Substack | Anthony — theonaut.com

Apologies for the technical difficulties. It has been fixed but the episode, we felt, was well worth posting for the content.

In this episode, philosopher and leadership coach Nick Egan, PhD joins Adam Dietz and Anthony Wright to explore Buddhism, meditation, and what it means to practice wisdom in everyday life.

We dive into:

• Shamatha vs Vipassana — the two classic forms of Buddhist meditation.
• The American Dharma experiment — how U.S. practitioners engage Zen, Dzogchen, and Taoism in unique ways.
• The paradox of non-attachment and the trap of spiritual bypassing.
• The tetra lemma and Buddhist insights into emptiness.
• How ancient wisdom applies to business, leadership, and coaching today

⚠️ Note on audio: Due to technical issues, Nick’s and Adam’s voices are not as clear in this recording (Anthony’s audio came through clean). Thanks for your patience — the conversation is rich, and we’re working to ensure future episodes meet a higher sound quality.

📌 Connect with us:

• Adam Dietz → The Way Between on Substack
• Anthony Wright → theonaut.com
• Nick Egan → nickeganphd.com

What does it mean for a leader to let go?

In this episode of Attunement and the Living Conversation, Adam Dietz and Anthony Wright sit down with Nick Egan, PhD – an executive coach, scholar of Tibetan Buddhism, and student of Daoist leadership – to explore how Buddhist and Daoist wisdom can transform modern work and life.

Nick shares his journey from studying Indo-Tibetan Buddhism, including time in Nepal and training under Tibetan teachers, to coaching founders and executives in Silicon Valley. Along the way, we talk about:

• Lojong (Buddhist mind training): shifting mindset as the heart of leadership
• 
  
• Daoist leadership principles: wu wei, delegation, and “effortless effort”
• 
  
• Letting go in business and life: why clinging undermines leadership
• 
  
• Meeting the Dalai Lama: and how presence itself can be transformative
• 
  
• Meditation in modern coaching: shamatha (calm abiding), vipashyana (insight), and daily practice

Nick weaves together Buddhist philosophy, Daoist wisdom, and positive psychology to show how leaders can face uncertainty, let go of attachment, and create conditions where others thrive.

🎧 Whether you’re a leader, a seeker, or simply curious about how ancient practices apply today, this conversation offers practical insights into the art of living, and leading, with clarity and compassion.

Resources & Links:

• Nick Egan, PhD → shiftleadership.group
• 
  
• Adam Dietz → The Way Between Substack
• 
  
• Anthony Wright → Theonaut.com

In this Along the Way installment of our interview series, Adam Dietz and Anthony Wright speak with Drea — Sober Herbalist — about recovery, illness, and finding a new path through plants, wellness, and spiritual practice.

Drea shares how she challenged the herbal world’s dismissal of non-alcoholic medicine, developing new ways to prepare remedies without alcohol. We explore her journey through sobriety, chronic illness, and research, and how traditions like Ayurveda, Buddhism, and Taoism shaped her approach to healing.

The conversation also dives into the world of Noah Levine (Dharma Punks, Against the Stream), punk rock Buddhism, the Esalen Institute, and the commercialization of wellness. Drea reflects on two-spirit healers in indigenous traditions and offers a deeply embodied practice: conscious bathing, massage, and even “touching your pain” as ways to reconnect with self and heal trauma.

✨ Topics in this episode:

– Sobriety as spiritual practice and renunciation

– Creating strong, alcohol-free herbal medicine

– Buckminster Fuller’s challenge: building new systems

– Fungi, indigenous wisdom, and plant consciousness

– Noah Levine, Dharma Punks & punk rock spirituality

– The Esalen Institute and the wellness industry

– Two-spirit healers and non-binary traditions

– Embodiment, trauma, and healing through touch

📬 Essays & reflections: https://thewaybetween.substack.com

🌿 Learn more about Drea’s work: https://soberherbalist.com

The primary focus of this discourse revolves around the transformative journey of Drea, the sober herbalist, who recounts her profound personal experiences that led to her current vocation. Drea elucidates the significant challenges she faced, particularly her battle with Lyme disease, which catalyzed her exploration of alternative healing practices after conventional medical avenues proved insufficient. In her narrative, she details the pivotal moment in an herb garden where a connection with the natural world prompted a reconsideration of her path, ultimately leading her to embrace herbalism without reliance on alcohol-based tinctures. This episode serves not only as a testimony of resilience and recovery but also as an invitation to contemplate the intricate relationship between healing, nature, and sobriety. Through Drea's insights, we are encouraged to reflect on our own journeys and the myriad forms of healing that exist beyond traditional frameworks.

Takeaways:

• Drea's journey to becoming a sober herbalist was catalyzed by her profound experiences with Lyme disease, which necessitated an exploration beyond conventional medicine.
• As a newly sober individual, Drea faced significant health challenges that traditional doctors struggled to diagnose and address effectively.
• The pivotal moment in Drea's healing came when she encountered Ayurvedic practitioners who offered her compassionate care and alternative remedies.
• Despite her struggles, Drea discovered that herbalism could be integrated into her sobriety, leading to a unique approach to healing without alcohol.
• Drea's transformative experience in the herb garden highlighted the profound connection she felt with the plant beings, emphasizing their supportive role in her healing journey.
• The conversation shed light on the importance of understanding addiction within holistic practices, underscoring the need for awareness among herbalists and practitioners.

Links referenced in this episode:

• theonotnau t.com
• thewaybetween@substack.com
• 
  
• soberherbalist.com

Companies mentioned in this episode:

• Ayurveda
• Rosemary Gladstar
• Sober Herbalist

The principal focus of this podcast episode revolves around the timeless relevance of philosophy, particularly as it pertains to the teachings of Confucius and the broader implications of philosophical inquiry in contemporary life. We delve into the notion that philosophy serves as a warm, guiding light, akin to the sun, illuminating our paths through the complexities of existence. The discussion emphasizes the importance of sincerity and humility in our interactions, drawing from ancient wisdom to enrich our current experiences. Furthermore, we explore the distinction between fate and heaven's destiny, encouraging listeners to recognize their agency in choosing paths that foster personal growth and harmony. Ultimately, this episode invites a contemplative engagement with philosophical principles, urging listeners to consider how these ideas manifest in their daily lives and contribute to a more profound understanding of their own existence.

Takeaways:

• The discussion emphasizes that philosophy, much like the warmth of the sun, remains a relevant and beneficial aspect of our lives, illuminating our understanding of existence.
• Confucius, in his teachings, intended to transmit the wisdom of ancient sage kings, thereby ensuring that their harmonious culture persists in contemporary society.
• The distinction between fate and heaven's destiny serves as a profound reminder that we have the agency to choose our paths, rather than resigning ourselves to predetermined outcomes.
• The conversation highlights the essential qualities of sincerity and humility within Chinese philosophy, suggesting that these attributes foster a harmonious existence.
• Through the lens of fractal geometry, we recognize that patterns of existence repeat across different scales in nature, revealing the interconnectedness of all life forms.
• The podcast ultimately invites listeners to engage with philosophy as a living practice, encouraging them to incorporate its principles into their daily lives for personal and communal growth.

Links referenced in this episode:

• 
  
• theonaut.com
• thewaybetween.substack.com
• 
  
• youtube.com

In this episode of The Living Conversation, we’re joined by Banya Lim—a spiritual acupuncturist and energy coach based in Sedona—who bridges Traditional Chinese Medicine with a more holistic view of healing: body, mind, and soul.

We explore why symptoms often return when the deeper pattern underneath them hasn’t changed, and how the Five Element theory maps emotions to organs (like fear and the kidneys, anger and the liver/gallbladder, sadness and the lungs). Banya shares how intuition can be felt in the body (not just thought in the head), how food/color/taste cravings can be energetic signals, and why “going within” matters when the outside world feels loud.

We also talk about desire—not as something to crush, but something to understand—by tracing the feeling behind what we think we want, and learning how inner alignment becomes outer change.

Guest: Banya Lim (Spiritual Acupuncture + Energy Coaching)

Website: banyalim.com

Free clarity session: available via her website

Topics include: spiritual acupuncture, energy coaching, Traditional Chinese Medicine, yin-yang, five elements, meridians, emotions + organs, intuition vs desire, mindfulness without forcing meditation, inner peace.

In this episode of The Living Conversation, we’re joined by Dean Graves, who shares a framework drawn from his ongoing contact with a non-incarnate teacher described as a social memory complex. We explore the Law of One (“all is one”), the idea that consciousness is “creativeness intoxicated with free will,” and how the spiritual path is a gradual sobering back into unity.

We also move into practical terrain: emotional baggage as “unfinished lessons,” why meditation is the inversion of awareness, and how to take the meditative mind “back into the village” — real life, relationships, and responsibility.

Guest: Dean Graves

Website: deangraves.org (DeanGraves.org)

1. What a social memory complex is, and how “individuality” changes as consciousness evolves
2. The Law of One and why “all of consciousness is conceptual”
3. “Free will intoxication” (the whiskey metaphor) and the enlightenment path as sobering up
4. A provocative take on emotion: one spectrum (like/dislike), applied thought-by-thought
5. Awakening as turning awareness inward and seeing how the “false self” perpetuates unhappiness
6. Service to others vs service to self as a critical evolutionary choice
7. Why meditation works, why it’s hard, and how motivation shifts from “running from the stick” to “chasing the apple”
8. Bringing practice back into the village: maintaining inner freedom while living ordinary life
9. Closing takeaway: “Be the change you want to see in the world.”

1. 00:00 Intro + Dean’s ongoing contact with his teacher
2. 01:05 Social memory complex + archetypes / structure of the universe
3. 05:20 “Intoxicated with free will” + Creator / subject-object framing
4. 10:03 Emotional baggage + what “emotion” is
5. 12:07 Awakening = inverting awareness inward
6. 15:46 Service-to-others vs service-to-self (polarization)
7. 20:46 Meditation + “bite of the apple” + healing
8. 23:11 Bringing meditation “back into the village”
9. 25:39 One thing to practice: Gandhi / be the change

Law of One, social memory complex, free will, consciousness, meditation, mindfulness, awakening,...

We recorded this rapid-response conversation on January 15, 2026, in the immediate aftermath of the police shooting of Renee Good in Minneapolis and new threats to invoke the Insurrection Act.

Psychotherapist and author Phyllis Levitt (America in Therapy: A New Approach to Hope and Healing for a Nation in Crisis) joins hosts Anthony Wright and Adam Dietz on The Living Conversation to ask a hard question:

Drawing on decades of work with trauma, family systems, and abuse dynamics, Phyllis maps what we’re seeing in the U.S. onto patterns we’d recognize instantly inside a violent household: power without accountability, normalized cruelty, and victims who are retraumatized just by witnessing events—even when they’re not the direct target.

We talk about:

1. How to answer a child who asks, “Where’s mommy?” after a politically charged killing
2. Why Phyllis sees current U.S. politics not as “left vs right,” but as an escalating mental health emergency phyllisAudio transcript
3. The psychology of aligning with the “bully on the playground” and how unhealed victims can become abusers
4. Secondary trauma: why you don’t have to be directly attacked to be deeply affected by constant violence and threats
5. Cult dynamics, double binds, and what it means to “deprogram” people without dehumanizing them
6. Anger vs hatred: how to turn righteous anger into constructive action instead of burnout or vengeance
7. The difference between belonging and safe belonging—and how wounded people can be pulled into movements that feed on fear and division

Adam and Anthony bring in their background in Chinese philosophy and Confucian family ethics—including the image of “outlaws of the marsh” who withdraw when government becomes unsafe, and the I Ching’s reminder that history moves in cycles of rise and decay.

They also connect Phyllis’s work with:

1. Gandhi and Martin Luther King Jr., and the refusal to answer hatred with hatred
2. The idea of seeing the “goblin” of projection instead of the human being in front of us—and what it takes to reverse that
3. The claim that spirituality is the one thing that can’t be co-opted, and why tending your own inner life is a form of resistance

Throughout, Phyllis returns to a simple, difficult standard: holding compassion and accountability together—recognizing the deep wounds behind abusive behavior and insisting on limits, consequences, and a collective commitment to healing.

If you’re feeling overwhelmed, enraged, or just numb watching the news, this conversation is meant as a kind of group session: an attempt to name what’s happening, protect your sanity, and point toward ways of acting that don’t simply repeat the cycle.

In this episode of The Living Conversation, hosts Anthony Wright and Adam Dietz sit down with Dean Graves—author, podcaster, keynote speaker, mental health counselor, and meditation/mindfulness guide—to explore his map of awakening and the evolution of consciousness.

Dean begins with what he calls an awakening experience: that moment when we realize that conventional success isn’t making us happier. From there he unfolds a cosmology in which our enduring self is a metaphysical consciousness pattern that lives through thousands of incarnations, evolving across different “densities” of consciousness. According to Dean, humans currently inhabit third density, learning responsibility and awareness in a particularly intense range of consciousness.

He describes how chakras function as “assessment points of consciousness” at both the metaphysical and incarnate levels, and why stages like the terrible twos and the turmoil of adolescence are so chaotic: new levels of awareness open before we have the information or maturity to meet them.

Dean also reframes free will as the perception of separation—the originating “distortion” that allows creation to unfold and beings to experience themselves as autonomous. Over many lives, he says, the evolutionary path is a gradual surrender of that separation into a sense of unity, ultimately moving toward what he calls a “social memory complex,” where many once-separate beings share one consciousness.

Along the way, Adam connects these ideas with Confucianism and modern science—heaven, star-stuff, and our destiny to bring harmony into our particular web of relationships. They compare Dean’s view of incarnation to John Lennon’s “instant karma” and the hero’s journey, and Anthony draws out implications for trauma, illness, and the way the mind shapes the body.

Dean also touches on:

1. The idea that our metaphysical self has already lived thousands of incarnations with specific learning purposes
2. First and second “densities” as the consciousness of inorganic matter, fire, plants, and animals, laying the foundation for human experience
3. The archetypical mind as a blueprint of how we process thought and build a sense of self
4. Why different children in the same family can be so radically different, based on their metaphysical development
5. The feeling that humanity is in “Groundhog Day” and his claim that this is actually our fourth planetary cycle

Throughout, Dean returns to awakening not as a one-off mystical event, but as taking responsibility for our own evolution—stepping out of automatic repetition and actively participating in the path of awareness, love, wisdom, unity, and stillness.

Connect with Dean Graves:

Website: ddeangraves.org — books, podcast, and contact info

Dancer-turned-healer Fran Bailey joins hosts Anthony Wright and Adam Dietz to explore how the Enneagram, the chakra system, and energetic grounding can help us stop apologizing for where we are in life and come back into our bodies. She talks about working with head, heart, and body types, guiding clients to ground their energy, and why “encouragement without apology” is at the core of real healing.

In this follow-up conversation, Fran Bailey joins Anthony Wright and Adam Dietz on The Living Conversation to go deeper into her energetic work with individuals and groups. Drawing on the Enneagram, the chakra system, and her own intuitive seeing, Fran shares how she helps people move out of self-judgment and back into grounded presence.

We start with the Enneagram’s roots in Gurdjieff’s movement work and the idea of head, heart, and body types arranged in a circle. Fran explains how she uses this map in her healing practice—especially with “head types” whose energy and attention can get stuck in the sixth chakra, looping through anxiety and overthinking.

From there, she describes guiding people to move energy beyond the edge of the aura, then down through the chakra system to the first chakra to ground into the earth and come back into their bodies. In groups, she’ll invite everyone to “watch the energy” around one person so they can begin to see and feel for themselves, dissolving some of the “woo-woo factor” and recognizing that working with energy is another way of working with the emotional and mental patterns we all live inside.

A big theme of this segment is permission and non-judgment. Fran talks about telling clients, “Don’t apologize for where you are. I’m not judging you.” That simple stance creates a breath of space where people can begin to imagine actually loving themselves, instead of clinging to external expectations of who they “should” be.

In this episode, we explore:

1. Gurdjieff’s movement work and the Enneagram as head/heart/body types
2. How Fran uses the Enneagram and chakras together in her energy healing
3. Guiding “head types” out of mental loops and back into embodied grounding
4. Group work, collective energy, and teaching people to see and feel energy for themselves
5. The importance of “encouragement without apology” and why self-judgment is a root of disconnection
6. Grounding as a living relationship with a changing Earth, and Fran’s evolving sense of Mother Gaia’s energy
7. Flow states, forgetting ourselves, and being at one with something larger than the isolated ego
8. How Fran measures healing: clients becoming more upright, unapologetic, and simply okay with themselves

Along the way, Adam connects Fran’s work with Daoist emptying of the mind and the idea that forgetting ourselves allows a clearer, higher view of our own thoughts and energies, while Anthony reflects on validation, holding space, and inviting students and clients into their own highest vitality.

Connect with Fran Bailey:

In this episode of The Living Conversation, hosts Anthony Wright and Adam Dietz sit down with Fran Bailey, a lifelong dancer who became an energy healer, to explore how movement, intuition, and subtle awareness can become pathways to healing.

Fran shares how dance was her first language: a way to “speak through the body” without words, growing up in a musical and metaphysical Christian Science home with ballet classes in the barn. From there, she trained in dance at Ohio University, then gradually realized she could sense and work with energy in others, a realization that eventually led her to study with healers like Rosalyn, John Friedlander, and Gloria Hemsher, and to twelve years at the Alliance Institute for Integrative Medicine.

In this episode, we talk about:

• How dance and movement opened Fran’s awareness that “everything is energy”
• Working at the Alliance Institute as an energy healer alongside MDs and acupuncturists
• Seeing and feeling energy in clients: cords, resistance, and patterns in the field
• Using the Enneagram to understand “head types,” “body types,” and how people disconnect from their own felt sense
• How stored memories and fear patterns show up not just in the mind, but in the energy field—and how to gently work with them
• The importance of permission in healing, and why clients have to do their own inner work for changes to stick
• A striking story of a therapist with a herniated disc whose pain and diagnosis unexpectedly shifted after an energy session
• Navigating the “woo-woo factor” with physicians and psychologists, and staying humble about where people are on their journey

Fran also introduces The SHEVA Method, developed after receiving the word “SHEVA” in meditation as an acronym for Seeking Harmony in Energy, Voice, and Action: and she shares how this method has continued to refine over years of teaching and client work.

Connect with Fran Bailey:

• Website: franbaileyhealer.com (free meditations, her book, and more resources)

In this episode of The Living Conversation, hosts Anthony Wright and Adam Dietz sit down with Colette, Andrew, and Peter from the Sonoma State University Philosophy Club for a grounded, student-first conversation about the technologies shaping modern life.

We start with Frederick Brown’s 1950s sci-fi micro-story “Answer” — where a galaxy-wide computer is asked, “Is there a God?” and replies, “Now there is.” From there, the conversation opens into real questions facing students today.

We explore:

• AI as efficiency tool vs cultural force
• The ethics of AI in defense and autonomous weaponry
• Student frustration with AI’s impact on writing and learning
• When professors encourage ChatGPT over human tutoring
• Whether AI mirrors human consciousness or represents a different kind of “mind”
• Smartphones, adolescence, and the problem of unprepared attention
• How COVID reshaped social habits and comfort with in-person life
• Why small groups and real dialogue still matter for forming identity and community

This is part of our ongoing collaboration with the SSU Philosophy Club, bringing lived philosophy into public conversation; not just theory, but the everyday reality of staying human in a high-tech age.

Grit vs. Good Fortune: College, Careers, and Who We Become

In this episode of the SSU Philosophy Club series, Sonoma State philosophy students join hosts Anthony Wright and Adam Dietz to talk honestly about work, school, and the stories we tell ourselves about “making it.” Colette, Andrew, and Peter share real experiences from jobs and internships, some great, some pretty rough, and explore how those moments shape character, confidence, and direction.

Along the way, we keep circling one live question:

We don’t land on a simple answer, but we do try to name what feels true from the inside of college life right now.

In this episode:

• Why certain jobs and internships feel “character building” (and when that’s just code for bad conditions)
• How grit, persistence, and showing up actually play out in real student lives
• The role of luck and opportunity: who gets access to which doors, and when
• How our stories about being “self-made” affect the way we see ourselves and others
• What philosophy can offer when you’re trying to choose a path that’s not just about money or status
• The tension between gratitude for what you’ve been given and the desire to claim your own effort and growth

This conversation is part of an ongoing collaboration with the SSU Philosophy Club, exploring what philosophy looks like when it’s lived, not just studied.

In this crossover episode of The Living Conversation and The Way Between Podcast, co-hosts Anthony Wright and Adam Dietz continue their conversation with Dr. Nick Egan, exploring what AI means from Buddhist and philosophical perspectives. Starting from the very contemporary anxiety around “AI as threat or opportunity,” they return to a classic theme: how human beings have always had to integrate new technologies—from fire and the wheel to radio, TV, and the internet—through something like a middle way.

Adam brings in Confucian and Buddhist language to ask how we might “harmonize” AI rather than demonize or worship it, suggesting that our real task is to cultivate ourselves so we use the tool without letting it use us. Nick takes up Anthony’s koan-like question—“Does AI have Buddha nature?”—and responds from Tibetan Buddhist philosophy: why inanimate systems, however powerful, still lack sentience and will, and why consciousness arises from a stream of previous moments of consciousness rather than from mere complexity of code. Along the way they touch on nature spirits, projection (does the tree really “speak” to us?), and the limits of the human mind in grasping exponential change.

From there, the conversation widens into the nature of mind itself. Adam describes the danger of attaching even to “non-attachment,” and the need to let desires, ambitions, and identities settle so that the “true self” can emerge and be integrated in everyday life. Nick contrasts Zen’s stripped-down focus on realizing the nature of mind with Tibetan Buddhism’s vast toolbox of tantric cycles and practices, warning about spiritual materialism and the reification of emptiness itself. The episode closes with Adam introducing The Way Between Podcast as a space for deeper, longer-form explorations of philosophy East and West, and with all three sharing how listeners can stay connected to their work.