Explore every episode of the podcast The Evolving Leader
| Title | Pub. Date | Duration | |
|---|---|---|---|
| BONUS EPISODE - "Innovate Into The Unknown" with Atif Rafiq | 08 Nov 2025 | 00:16:10 | |
In this bonus episode of The Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Scott Allender and Arjun Sahdev talk to Atif Rafiq, the first Chief Digital Officer in Fortune 500 history and former senior executive at McDonald’s, Volvo, and MGM Resorts. Now CEO and co-founder of Ritual, an AI-powered workflow platform, Atif shares how leaders can build decision-making systems that are faster, fairer, and more adaptive in an age of complexity. He explains his core principle of “exploration before alignment” and why premature agreement kills curiosity and weakens problem-solving. Find out more about Atif Rafiq: https://www.linkedin.com/in/atif1/ https://www.linkedin.com/newsletters/re-wire-6765332215867031552/ Other reading from Jean Gomes and Scott Allender: Leading In A Non-Linear World (J Gomes, 2023) The Enneagram of Emotional Intelligence (S Allender, 2023) Social: Instagram @evolvingleader LinkedIn The Evolving Leader Podcast The Evolving Leader is researched, written an Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| 'Leading From The Heart' with Mark Crowley | 05 Nov 2025 | 00:52:42 | |
In this latest episode of The Evolving Leader podcast, Jean Gomes is joined by Mark Crowley, author of Lead from the Heart, to explore how emotion, belonging, and authentic care are redefining leadership for the modern world. Mark shares his remarkable personal journey, from an upbringing shaped by trauma to a career built on leading through compassion. We hear how what began as an instinctive way to give others what he never received became a philosophy now backed by neuroscience and organisational research. Jean and Mark unpack why traditional engagement models are failing, how the science of emotion is reshaping our understanding of performance, and why belonging and care are now the greatest predictors of organisational health. This is a powerful conversation for leaders seeking to create cultures that elevate both human well-being and business results. Further materials from Mark Crowley: “Don’t Measure Employee Engagement—Support Employee Well-Being” (2025, Porchlight Book Company) “5 Leadership Strategies To Help Teams Thrive Amid Uncertainty” (2025, Fast Company) “Leaders don’t really care about employee engagement. Here’s why” (2024, Fast Company) “How leaders can address the human energy crisis” (2023, Fast Company) “Lead From The Heart: Transformational Leadership For The 21st Century” (2011, Balboa Press)
Other reading from Jean Gomes and Scott Allender:
The Enneagram of Emotional Intelligence (S Allender, 2023) Social: Instagram @evolvingleader LinkedIn The Evolving Leader Podcast Twitter @Evolving_Leader Bluesky @evolvingleader.bsky.social YouTube @evolvingleader
The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| ‘Why We Believe’ with Alister McGrath | 18 Jun 2025 | 00:52:31 | |
In this episode of The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are joined by renowned philosopher and theologian Alister McGrath to explore one of the most timeless and urgent questions: Why do we believe? Drawing on insights from his new book, Why We Believe: Finding Meaning in Uncertain Times, McGrath reflects on the nature of belief, the human need for meaning, and how our convictions shape who we are and how we lead. The conversation takes us from McGrath’s early journey through science and Marxism to his later embrace of faith, to the cultural forces shaping our beliefs today from post-truth politics to techno-optimism. The episode explores how leaders can navigate complexity and uncertainty with grounded beliefs, curiosity, and empathy without succumbing to dogma or paralysis. Whether you consider yourself a person of faith, reason, or somewhere in between, this episode invites you to reflect more deeply on what sustains you and how those beliefs can help you thrive in a rapidly evolving world. Referenced during this episode: Why We Believe: Finding Meaning In Uncertain Times (McGrath, 2025) Other reading from Jean Gomes and Scott Allender: The Enneagram of Emotional Intelligence (S Allender, 2023) Social: Instagram @evolvingleader LinkedIn The Evolving Leader Podcast Twitter @Evolving_Leader Bluesky @evolvingleader.bsky.social YouTube @evolvingleader
The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Eight Principles for Transforming Your Business In A Time of Disruption with Will Page | 22 Feb 2023 | 00:32:02 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-host Jean Gomes welcomes back former guest Will Page. Will is the former chief economist at both Spotify and PRS for Music, visiting fellow at London School of Economics and his widely acclaimed book ‘Tarzan Economics’ has just been published in paperback under the slightly different title ‘Pivot: Eight Principles for Transforming Your Business In A Time Of Disruption’. Pivot: Eight Principles For Transforming Your Business In a Time of Disruption Jo Caulfield ‘Supermarket loyalty card’
0.00 Introduction 2.14 Why has the title of the book changed for the paperback? 3.04 A quick summary of the eight principles. 5.39 You say in the book that these principles give us cause for optimism and even confidence. Can you talk about why that it? 11.38 Which is the principles would be most salient for our audience? 1. Big data, big mistakes. 17.27 How can we stop ourselves making a snap judgement or challenge the contradictions around data, and how do you hold that in your head in other forms of decision making? 19.42 2. The growing gig economy 23.57 Given the Tarzan Economics predictions, what do you think are the most likely few things that will change this year? 27.20 How are these principles changing your life and mindset? How is it shaping your world?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| The New Definition of Mindset with Jean Gomes and Scott Allender | 15 Feb 2023 | 00:35:58 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Scott Allender and Jean Gomes take some time to discuss and reflect on a new definition of mindset. Scott also gets Jean to road test a new set of questions that (in future episodes) our two co-hosts will be asking guests about how they think, feel and see the world. ‘Leading In a Non-Linear World’ by Jean Gomes 0’00 Introduction 3’27 We’re going to be questioning our guests on how they make sense of the world by building intentional mindsets to confront challenges that they face 5’22 Remind us what you mean by feel, think and see 10’16 How can people build the connective tissue between all of these things? 14’29 Testing the new questions on Jean : Q1. What have you learnt about your mindset as you have developed as a leader? 18’11 Q2. When and where have you seen others or yourself hold up the wrong lens to a situation? 21’44 Q3. Can you recall any situations in your career where you and others made significant breakthroughs by challenging fundamental assumptions about what was possible, feasible or desirable? 26’03 Q4. What is the primary way that you tune into you body to determine what’s happening? 30’37 Q5. Of all the mindsets that we build and need, what is the single biggest mindset challenge that you personally struggle with the most? Social:
The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| The New Science of Human Connection with Oscar Hutton and Emma Sinclair | 01 Feb 2023 | 01:22:13 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, we’re pleased to welcome back our occasional host and friend of the podcast, Emma Sinclair. This week Emma is in conversation with consultant neuroscientist and researcher Oscar Hutton. Oscar is also part of the Greater Human community, with whom in 2022 he explored (and made sense of) the neuroscience research designed to answer the question “Does listening to your body help you become more empathetic?”. Part of the findings from this research paint a picture that challenge our understanding around how we understand others and how we build empathy as human beings. 0.00 Introduction 4.04 Introducing Oscar and his research. 5.21 Let’s think about the concept of empathy. 10.56 Why do we need empathy? 13.02 What evolutionary benefits has empathy brought us as human beings? 19.04 Where do we start with this, in terms of how we build empathy? 21.10 How does interoception help us to more empathetic? 23.08 So this is literally raising our awareness of what’s going on inside? 26.42 Is this a part of what helps us identify what we’re feeling? 28.12 So rather than trying to ignore what the body is telling us, we should all learn to identify how we’re feeling and then work with it? 29.00 How new is interoception as an area of study and what have you started to find during your research? 32.49 Where have you started to go with your findings? 35.49 So when we are around people who we are very close to, you’re saying that there is a good chance that we could be experiencing what they are experiencing if we raise our awareness to it. 37.33 Is this suggesting that the more we know someone, the greater the likelihood is that our bodies will feel the same as a result of an external stimulus? 40.32 Is it possible for anyone to switch on interoception accuracy? 41.52 Is it also something that can get lost if you don’t keep using it? 42.34 So where is the connection between interoception and empathy? 45.48 So how can we can begin to start to use this awareness? 52.37 Considering the amount of time we all spend interacting with others on the screen, is there anything that could be built to help us in that environment with those social cues? 55.06 Is there anything else related to teamwork that you are starting to draw connections on? 57.53 How can someone who might not have heard of interoception before today begin to work on this new super skill? 64.09 So what have you done in this area for yourself? 67.30 So if more people were aware of this, could we avoid those difficult encounters? 69.48 Is there more that you can share from your research? 79.09 What can we leave the listener with? Social: The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allend Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Challenging the Assumptions of Innovation with William Kilmer | 25 Jan 2023 | 00:50:41 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Scott Allender and Jean Gomes are joined by entrepreneur, venture capital investor and author William Kilmer. A product and innovation strategist at heart, William has spent his career working with hundreds of companies as a start-up leader, coach, investor and board member. He has been founder and CEO of several cybersecurity and data analytics companies, formed a wireless operator in the UK, and has served on the board of over twenty five technology companies and other organizations. He was previously the managing director of Intel Capital, a corporate venture capital fund where he managed worldwide investments and formed a targeted venture fund to invest in the Middle East and North Africa.
Transformative: Build a Game Changing Strategy, Retool Your Organisation and Innovate to Win
0.00 Introduction 3.10 Can you tell us a little about how you got to where you are today? 4.28 What attracted you into working in technology and leadership? 5.18 Can we talk about innovation and the challenge that it poses for many organisations? 7.37 Some organisations may sometimes lose perspective on why they are innovating. Why might that be? 9.53 In many organisations, innovation sits on the periphery rather than being central to the core business. Is that what you’re seeing? 12.09 What’s the difference between innovation and transformation? 16.50 If you were sitting with a CEO who wasn’t successfully transforming their organisation, what high level advice would you give to that individual? 22.59 Can you tell us about the ‘confidence bubble’? 27.57 Why do you think primary business model innovation isn’t happening at the same level as the technological innovation? 31.03 When was the last time you witnessed a pitch where you thought, ‘yeah that idea could really be transformative’? 33.33 Are there any currently under represented emerging technologies that you think might come to the fore in the future? 37.42 How have you evolved as a leader? 42.17 What mindset shift is required for an individual who is prone to defending ideas as opposed to challenging them? 43.34 If we fast forward three years, what are the things that we should be looking at in terms of combining new technologies and business models in order to solve some of the big challenges facing organisations? 47.08 Is there anything else that we should ask you?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Disruptive Thinking with Emma Sinclair and Emily Clements | 11 Jan 2023 | 01:00:01 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, Jean and Scott hand the mic to Emma Sinclair who talks to cognitive neuroscientist Emily Clements. As part of her PhD at Kings College, London Emily is currently leading one of the world’s first studies into the neuroscience of entrepreneurship. She aims to uncover what might be different within entrepreneur’s brains and how we might develop our mindsets to become more entrepreneurial? Sit back and listen to this fascinating conversation during which Emma and Emily explore a key foundation for tomorrow’s leaders, building mindsets to navigate uncertainty and improve their capacity for disruptive thinking.
0.00 Introduction 2.47 Emily, could you please begin by introducing yourself and what you are currently working on? 5.53 What is disruptive thinking? 8.00 What brain mechanisms are coming in to play when we go against the grain? 8.35 Could you give us a quick summary of what you mean when you refer to brain networks? 11.26 So are we focussing in on networks when we refer to disruptive thinking? 12.58 How often are we using our multiple demand network? 14.31 What would you define as being a hard task? 17.08 What’s the flipside to this? 20.05 I’d love to understand more about self-referential thought. 24.20 If you were in deep meditation, which network are you operating in? 26.14 What have these brain networks got to do with disruptive thinking, why are they important? 29.30 Is it true to say that highly creative individuals are actually changing how their brain is operating? Is it possible to make your brain more creative? 32.02 How can we consciously build a mindset that enables us to be more creative? 39.52 How can we all be more disruptive? 44.49 How important is environment for us to recognise that we might be in the wrong state to address a particular problem solving task? 49.43 We’ve talked about the constant demand on people. Is this current demand for our attention meaning that it’s harder to stay in either mode? 54.09 What can leaders take away from this?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| The Expectation Effect with David Robson | 04 Jan 2023 | 00:54:14 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender talk to award winning science writer David Robson. David has previously worked as a features editor at New Scientist and as a senior journalist at the BBC as well as writing countless articles for The Guardian, the Psychologist and many others. Sit back and listen as our co-hosts explore David’s life and work 2.51 What gets you excited about your work? 3.51 Your work spans many different scientific disciplines including neuroscience and psychology. How do you bring those two things together to understand how human beings operate? 5.04 Can you give us the pitch to your first book, The Intelligence Trap? 7.18 You have said that intelligent people are more susceptible to fake news and conspiracy theories. Can you elaborate on that? 12.55 Is this problem getting worse? 14.31 Can we dig into a few of the mechanisms that are at work, such as over claiming and earnt dogmatism? 17.38 How do you build cognitive inoculation? 21.10 You’ve written that unconscious bias training may not be as straightforward and you present a more nuanced view about it. Could you talk to us a little about this? 23.56 Your second book is titled The Expectation Effect. Can you tell us what the expectation effect is and is not? 26.19 You have written how it’s possible to create different levels of change in your body for a long period of time that creates general conditions for good things to happen. Your research into the effect of the placebo is probably the most significant in this regard. Can you tell us a little more about that? 30.01 You also talk about the opposite which is the nocebo. Tell us about this. 33.40 The research by Alia Crum on fitness and eating is exciting in terms of giving us practical potential solutions for rethinking our mindset around these things. 39.03 You list some practical things that the reader can do to harness the expectation effect. Could you give us some examples of things that our listeners could start doing right now? 42.35 There are some potent takeaways around the expectation effect and its influence on longevity. Could you talk us through what you’ve learnt there? 46.45 What else should we be asking you? 51.29 What are you working on now?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phi Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Leading In A Non-Linear World with Jean Gomes | 14 Dec 2022 | 01:04:32 | |
In this special 100th episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Scott Allender and Emma Sinclair talk to one of our usual co-hosts on the podcast, Jean Gomes. As many listeners will know, Jean is a leadership expert, trusted advisor to CEOs and senior leaders, and New York Times bestselling author. During this conversation, Jean talks about his new book ‘Leading in a Non-Linear World, Building Wellbeing, Strategic, and Innovation Mindsets for the Future’. 0.00 Introduction 2.48 Why did you write ‘Leading In A Non-Linear World’? 6.16 Why is this important now? 8.54 We often hear that we should simplify things, but you’re saying that we should meet complexity with complexity. Can you tell us more about that? 11.10 Can you give us some examples of the kinds of mindsets that you’re talking about building? 14.48 When writing about mindset, you refer to the interplay between feeling, thinking and seeing grounded in own self-awareness. This feels like something that is accessible to everyone. How did that idea start to form for you? 22.18 When we talk about self-awareness or mindset, nobody thinks that they’re not self-aware. Is it easier for some people to be more connected to what’s going on in their body and mind, and for those people who find it harder, how can they start to build these skills? 29.34 Can you tell us about your sixteen months of experimentation? What did you actually do during that time? 35.20 Understanding and knowing how to manage our internal physical resources is something that is often bypassed by leaders. How could you encourage them to make a shift in how they approach their wellbeing? 40.11 Now that we’ve done a deep dive into the body, could you delve deeper into the emotional centre? 46.14 You refer to negative uncomfortable emotions, and how some people may externalise that rather than getting curious about why they might be feeling this way. How could they get practically curious while in the middle of a very uncomfortable feeling? 52.36 So the idea of feelings and emotions as a means of accessing mindset may be route that a lot of people may not have thought about before. How have you taken that and built it into this interconnection between thinking and seeing as well? How do they all interact together in your definition? 57.04 What mindsets can we build for our future?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Joined Up Thinking with Hannah Critchlow | 30 Nov 2022 | 01:02:22 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Scott Allender and Jean Gomes are joined by neuroscientist Dr Hannah Critchlow. Hannah is best known for demystifying the human brain on regular radio, TV and festival platforms as well as through her three books, the most recent being “Joined-Up Thinking, The Science of Collective Intelligence” (Hodder & Stoughton, August 2022). In 2014, Hannah was recognised as a 'Top 100 UK scientist' by the Science Council and one of Cambridge University's most ‘inspirational and successful women in science’. In 2019 Hannah was named by Nature as one of Cambridge University's 'Rising Stars in Life Sciences'.
Joined-Up Thinking, The Science of Collective Intelligence
0.00 Introduction 3.29 Tell us about your background and what led you into neuroscience and your passion for public engagement? 9.01 Tell us about collective intelligence. 12.07 Can we explore the research that you share in your book around collective intelligence and particularly how amongst neurodiverse groups this leads to more creative thought? 19.09 You talk about the genetic predisposition, was there any research around epigenetic’s role in this predisposition? 36.02 You talk about synchronisation of brainwaves amongst groups helping with collective intelligence and the importance of their emotional state in this regard. Can you tell us a little more about that? 41.56 You talk about listening in fostering collective intelligence and you suggest a game that families can play to get better at it. Can you tell us about that? 45.17 You’ve also written about sitting in silence at the start of a meeting. 46.30 There is a lot of pressure and uncertainty facing teams, and you talk about the need to cultivate curiosity rather than fear in that environment. What advice do you have to help us achieve that? 49.13 What have you come to understand about interoception in the context of social intelligence? 53.29 How do you envisage our collective intelligence developing over time with advances in technology? 58.32 What’s next for you in the coming year?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| What the Poet’s Mind Can Teach Leaders with Pelé Cox | 16 Nov 2022 | 00:59:35 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Scott Allender and Jean Gomes talk to poet Pelé Cox. Formerly the poet in residence at Tate Modern, the Royal Academy, Keats-Shelley House and British School at Rome, Pelé now takes her art into companies such as PwC, Nielsen and a variety of hedge funds tutoring leaders and employees in creative innovation. ‘Chelsea Barracks Frieze’ https://pelecox.com/
0.00 Introduction 0.54 POEM: Spectacle (Pele Cox) 3.53 Can you give us the edited highlights of your journey as an artist? 4.50 Was there a moment when you thought ‘I want to be a poet’? 5.39 Who are some of your favourite poets? 7.05 What is your creative process? 12.09 POEM: Afterwards (Pele Cox) 13.59 It’s not obvious to most people that poetry can be used in so many different ways. How did you get to that? 15.59 What happens when you take your experience in to the hedge fund audience? 18.23 When you are working with a leader, what does that process look like? 21.42 Help us understand how we can best appreciate this art form? 31.58 POEM: Snake (D.H.Lawrence) 39.10 Can you talk to us about your relationship with your emotions and how that’s changed as you have developed? 43.39 Can the utterance of a poet have any more relevance than the extraordinary impact of social media? 46.31 POEM: Death and the politicians (Ian Crichton-Smith) 47.30 Can we turn to some of your more recent work particularly some of the things that you’ve done during lockdown including the film ‘Life Me Up I am Dying’ with Damian Lewis? 52.45 Can we talk about Frieze as well? 56.23 POEM: Swelling (Pele Cox) 57.14 How might someone get in touch with you?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| How Can the Fool Help You Become a Better Leader? with Paul Glover | 02 Nov 2022 | 00:54:18 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Scott Allender and Jean Gomes talk to the no B S coach Paul Glover. Paul is a former attorney who went on to serve time having been found guilty of white collar crimes. He describes himself as a “recovering” trial lawyer, an unabashed Starbucks addict, and the author of Workquake™, a book dedicated to those in the work environment seeking to not only survive, but also to thrive in the Knowledge Economy.
0.00 Introduction 3.36 Can you tell us about the concept of having a fool in your life? 6.26 What’s the contract that you’re striking when you invite someone in who might not be open to feedback that you might be getting? 10.44 Tell us more about your story. As you were coming out of prison, how did the role of the fool change you? 19.08 What did you find hardest to accept in yourself when receiving feedback from your wife and your friends when they were allowed to see you? 30.26 When coaching, how do people feel about you and feel about themselves in your presence? 34.00 You talk about daily windows of opportunity. What are they and how do you find them? 38.02 In 2012, you wrote ‘Work Quake. How organisations can successfully make the seismic shift to the knowledge economy’. I’m curious to hear what you’ve been observing in the last 10 years since you published that book. 41.11 Based on the coaching conversations that you have had over the last 2 years, what do you think is going to happen as a result of Covid and the lessons that leaders have gained from that experience? 46.07 You talked earlier about your daily gratitude practice. What are you feeling most grateful for today?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| ‘Why Character Matters’ with Dr Edward Brooks | 04 Jun 2025 | 00:56:14 | |
What if leadership isn’t just about performance, but about character? In this episode of The Evolving Leader, we’re joined by Dr. Ed Brooks, Executive Director of the Oxford Character Project and co-editor of the new book The Arts of Leading. With hosts Jean Gomes and Emma Sinclair, Ed explores how cultivating human character, hope, courage, humility, and clarity, can provide the deep stability today’s leaders urgently need. We discuss the difference between optimism and hope, why virtues like kindness and creativity are underrated in leadership, and how the arts and humanities reveal untold stories of leadership that challenge traditional views. From Plato’s cave to the quiet leadership of community organisers, Ed shares how rethinking what (and who) we value in leadership can reshape organisations and ourselves. Referenced during this episode: Good Leadership in UK Business Report Other reading from Jean Gomes and Scott Allender: Leading In A Non-Linear World (J Gomes, 2023) The Enneagram of Emotional Intelligence (S Allender, 2023) Social: Instagram @evolvingleader LinkedIn The Evolving Leader Podcast Twitter @Evolving_Leader Bluesky @evolvingleader.bsky.social YouTube @evolvingleader
The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| What Leaders Must Know About the Written Word with Rob Ashton | 19 Oct 2022 | 01:00:10 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Scott Allender and Jean Gomes talk to author, entrepreneur and former scientist Rob Ashton. Rob’s work encompasses cognitive and social neuroscience, cognitive and social psychology and behavioural and neuroeconomics, giving him a unique perspective on why so much of our written communication simply doesn’t work. 0.00 Introduction 4.32 Given your background as a scientist, how did you become fascinated in how we communicate? 9.51 Why is it that so much of our written communication doesn’t work? 18.26 What are some of the things that we can do to overcome those limitations? 24.36 If somebody wants or needs to communicate (perhaps with a large group) quickly, how can they reduce the chance that their message may be misinterpreted by individuals who receive the message? 30.34 What’s the easiest way of getting people to open their minds to what they are about to read? 36.45 if we switch to the reader or recipient of emails and texts, what can we do to avoid misunderstanding the written word? 42.30 When you think about writing, how do you get into a more empathetic headspace? 48.02 When we write something and then read it back we may sometimes find flaws in how our writing could be interpreted. From a neurological perspective, how do those different processes work? 53.50 Do younger generations read and write differently? 56.20 How can our listeners get in touch with you?
Social: Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Creating Psychological Safety with Stephan Wiedner | 05 Oct 2022 | 00:50:54 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Scott Allender and Jean Gomes talk to psychological safety expert Stephan Wiedner. Stephan’s work focusses on developing sustainable high performance leaders, teams and organisations. He is cofounder of Noomii.com, Skillsetter.com and most recently Zarango.com with a published mission to ‘unleash the collective potential of people with the power of psychological safety’. Here's a link to the free Psychological Safety Assessment mentioned by Stephan during this episode: https://zarango.com/freepsi/ 0.00 Introduction Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Conscious Capitalism with Anna Anderson | 21 Sep 2022 | 00:54:43 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Scott Allender and Jean Gomes talk to social entrepreneur Anna Anderson. Anna is the founder and CEO of Kindred, an independent members club in West London, and Cellar at Kindred, a public café, counter and bar; dedicated to bringing the ethos, spirit and values found in the members club to the wider community. 0.00 Introduction Social: The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Reclaiming Sensitivity with Ciela Hartanov | 07 Sep 2022 | 00:51:43 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Scott Allender and Jean Gomes talk to human behaviour expert Ciela Hartanov. Ciela is a former Head of Innovation and Strategy at Google and is founder of Hum Collective where she consults with leaders who are overwhelmed by the pace of change and need help creating the time, tools, and innovation models to create a new paradigm of work.
0.00 Introduction 4.05 A little more about Ciela’s background and work. 5.46 How do you build a mindset to face uncertainty? 9.07 How do you help individuals become cognisant of the kind of mindset that they’re currently holding? 17.19 Can you give us an example of the sort of thing that you’ve done to move people who might have a more sceptical mind into a position of acceptance? 21.46 What’s the starting point where you can try to bring more sense making when maybe you can’t find the component parts to start engaging with that story? 24.44 How have you grown and developed through the work that you’ve done? 26.42 This speaks to the need to embrace vulnerability in an uncertain situation where you as a leader are expected to be certain. Have you thought about that and what it means? 29.35 Talk to us about the importance of sensitivity as a leader. 34.27 Can you tell us a little about the book? 38.36 What can our listeners do to reclaim their sensitivity? What are some of the practices that you’ve found most helpful for yourself? 41.14 Leaders are expected to know the answer and to know the truth. 45.32 Which organisations are you seeing that are moving along down this path and adopting some of the things that you’re talking about?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Highlights from Season 4 with Jean Gomes and Scott Allender | 03 Aug 2022 | 00:30:12 | |
Join co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender as they close season 4 of the Evolving Leader podcast by sharing some of our favourite moments from the 20 incredible episodes as well as previously unheard bonus material from the Evolving Leader vulnerability interviews. The Evolving Leader podcast will return in September for the start of season 5, but in the meantime sit back and listen to conversations with Caroline Williams, Oliver Burkeman, Steve Fleming, Amy Herman, Susan Neiman, Ranjay Gulati, Dan Toma, Rob Cross, Annie Murphy Paul, Simon Roberts, Tony O’Driscoll, Azeem Ahzar, Rita McGrath and Todd Kashdan.
The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| The Pivotal Generation with Professor Henry Shue | 20 Jul 2022 | 00:58:34 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Scott Allender and Jean Gomes talk to Professor Henry Shue, Professor Emeritus of Politics and International Relations at Merton College, Oxford and author of the book Basic Rights (Princeton 1980; 2nd edition, 1996; 40th anniversary edition with new chapter on climate change, 2020). Today, Henry’s focus is the moral responsibility that we have in slowing and reversing climate change, arguing that ‘we are the pivotal generation, the time is now’.
0.00 Introduction 2.38 Can you take us on a quick tour of your life’s work and ideas? 5.28 Which thought leaders and ideas have most informed your thinking? 10.32 Why are we the pivotal generation? 14.13 How can we be sure that we don’t underestimate the intelligence, foresight and determination of those who want to prevent the policy changes that need so desperately? 19.29 Can you give us an insight into the kind of questions that you are putting to leaders of organisations who might be impacting the problem? 25.03 The moral imperative is that we should be taking responsibility for the solution to this, so why aren’t governments forcing organisations to divert profits into developing new cleaner technologies? 27.14 How could we educate more people to accept the realities before them and put more pressure on companies who exacerbate climate change? 32.17 You’ve talked about the relationship that we have time and how it effects our sense of urgency. Can you talk to us a little about that? 37.17 How do you think (particularly) younger generations who are feeling angry about poor leadership are feeling about it? 41.23 Are there any tangible/practical pieces of advice that you can give to our listeners who are thinking that they want to do their part? 47.28 How are we deceiving ourselves around climate change? 54.36 What’s your next area of focus?
Recommended listening from the Evolving Leader archive: Always Day One with Alex Kantrowitz
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Resilient Grieving with Dr Lucy Hone | 13 Jul 2022 | 00:46:32 | |
This week on the Evolving Leader podcast, host Jean Gomes talks to Dr Lucy Hone. Lucy is an adjunct senior fellow at the University of Canterbury (NZ) and author of Resilient Grieving: Finding Strength and Embracing Life After a Loss that Changes Everything. In 2020, she also delivered the TED talk 3 Secrets of Resilient People, which to date has over five million views and is one of the Top 20 TED talks of 2020.
0.00 Introduction 1.20 Can we start with your story, and how the journey that you’ve been on has led you to discover new things about yourself and the ideas of resilience? 6.48 Many people will have read about the Kübler-Ross model which describes the five common stages of grief. How does that model sit with you? 13.13 Can you run us through some of the highlights of the ideas that you shared during your TedX talk? 21.31 You describe three stages which are all thought processes. Where does the meta emotional part play into this? 26.41 What have we learnt about resilience through the pandemic? 28.47 Where do you think people fall into thinking traps around resilience, misinterpreting what it really is? 31.41 What have you learnt about how parents can be best support children with grief while also allowing themselves the capacity to grieve? 35.27 What are doing next? 37.31 You mentioned earlier what some organisations might be getting wrong around resilience. Can we talk about the importance of psychological safety?
Recommended listening from the Evolving Leader archive: What Makes a Pioneer with Philip Clarke? Social:
The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Product-Market Fit with Dan Olsen | 06 Jul 2022 | 00:58:09 | |
This week on the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender talk to Dan Olsen. Based in Silicon Valley, Dan is a consultant, speaker, host of the monthly Lean Product & Lean UX Meetup and author of bestselling ‘The Lean Product Playbook’.
0.00 Introduction 2.28 Tell us about your background and what fuels your passion for product development? 3.50 Why do products fail and why do organisations keep on building things that we may not want? 5.14 Can you give us your definition or poor product fit? 6.45 Talk us through the layers of the product-market fit model. 12.02 How do you build the awareness to recognise when you’re sliding into the solution before you have an understanding of the problem? 15.26 Can you tell us the story of the space pen? 19.28 How do you help people to change their mindet around being able to avoid the immediate gratification? 24.28 Tell us what you’ve learnt about the idea of the MVP. 30.00 What’s the most extraordinary pivot that you’ve seen? 32.24 Can you say more about when it’s time to listen to the customer as opposed to when it’s time to take an alternative approach? 36.04 How should we be using data to better understand consumer behaviour? 38.16 The other problematic part of this is pricing. What have you learnt about approaching that? 43.20 What have you learnt about how to help leaders make better decisions and make good bets? 51.54 Given everything that’s happened in the last two years, how do you think that’s going to play out in terms of how people think about creating great products in the future?
Recommended listening from the Evolving Leader archive: The Art of Insubordination with Todd Kashdan Social:
The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Beyond Collaboration Overload with Rob Cross | 29 Jun 2022 | 00:56:52 | |
Is it time for organizations to start hiring chief collaboration officers? In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Jean and Scott talk to Rob Cross, Professor of Global Leadership at Babson College in Wellesley, Massachusetts, author of ‘Beyond Collaboration Overload’ and consultant. Rob explains that while collaboration can be the answer to many business challenges, leaders must learn to recognize, promote, and efficiently distribute the right kinds of collaborative work, or their teams and top talent will bear the costs of too much demand for too little supply. Beyond Collaboration Overload (Harvard Business Review Press, 2021) 0.00 Introduction 3.02 Can you give us some background to your work and approaches, particularly in network analysis that led you to the ideas you write about in Beyond Collaboration Overload? 5.35 Can you give us an overview of the two parts of the book and tell us what the payoff is for those who read it? 8.20 What do you mean by identity triggers? 10.40 How can someone identify their particular identity trigger, that gets them stuck in patterns of behaviours and responsiveness that are counterproductive for them? 11.49 Can you give us a snapshot of what a day in the life of ‘Scott’ (a character in your book) might be? 15.59 How are the command and control fanatics that still exist in some organisations coping with collaboration overload? 18.26 When you go into a C-suite, how do you help them better understand this strategically? 20.03 What have you observed about the different types of collaboration? 25.44 Can you share some of your other ideas around how we might avoid other forms of overload and/or other recurring microstressers that impact on us? 32.41 Is all of this reliant on your getting to grips with your identity trigger first? 34.22 What have you learnt about how high performers are now spending their time, especially those who might get back 18-24% of their time by incorporating these tactics? 39.44 Can you talk to us about the cumulative effects of microstressers? 45.43 The point you made earlier about understanding your needs requires a certain type of self-awareness because as we get busier, we run the risk of being cut off from what we’re feeling. What have you learnt about high performers and their ability to tune into those needs? 49.08 What happened to the character ‘Scott’ who we mentioned earlier in the interview? 52.26 In ten years time, what could an organisation that embraces more of this understanding look like?
Recommended listening from the Evolving Leader archive: The Science of Seeing Differently with Dr Beau Lotto
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Improve your Visual Intelligence with Amy Herman | 22 Jun 2022 | 00:46:23 | |
This week on the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Jean and Scott talk to Amy Herman. Amy is a lawyer, art historian, author and founder and president of The Art of Perception Inc. a New York-based organization that conducts professional development courses for leaders around the world, from Secret Service agents to prison wardens. By showing people how to look closely at paintings, sculpture, and photography, she helps them hone their visual intelligence to recognize the most pertinent and useful information as well as recognise biases that impede decision making. Fixed.: How to Perfect the Fine Art of Problem Solving smART, Use Your Eyes to Boost Your Brain
0.00 Introduction 2.59 Tell us how you combined your skill as a lawyer with your passion for art to form what is a pretty unique job. 5.21 Where does the term visual intelligence originate? 8.59 What’s the take away for people who attend your course? 10.56 Can you give us a deeper explanation as to what visual intelligence is? 13.18 So how do you learn to see what’s not there? Can you talk us through your process? 16.36 Many people coming on to your course will be out of their comfort zone. Can you tell us what they’re going through? 19.09 Tell us about their emotional response to this situation. 20.49 Can you give a bit more about distinguishing between objective and subjective conclusions? 23.02 How do these experiences with art help to confront and maybe even resolve some biases? 26.05 You have the opportunity to be quite provocative with people in some of the things that you do. What does that create in people? 29.36 How do you help people come to terms with making the distinction between thinking and seeing? 32.23 Is important to also ask ‘what are we not seeing’? 36.05 Towards the end of Fixed, you suggest that you may have reached the limits of what you could achieve using art and open ended questions. However, talking to you today it sounds like you’ve overcome that. 40.45 Tell us about your new book smART. 42.45 As we draw to a close, what’s the biggest take away here?
Recommended listening from the Evolving Leader archive: Distinguishing Risk and Uncertainty with Sir John Kay
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| ‘Certainty: How Great Bosses Change Minds’ with Mike Mears | 21 May 2025 | 00:59:52 | |
In this compelling episode of The Evolving Leader, we sit down with Mike Mears, former CIA leadership head and author of "Certainty: How Great Bosses Can Change Minds and Drive Innovation." Mike shares powerful insights from his extraordinary career – from his days as a combat platoon leader and nuclear missile commander to his transformative work at GE and the CIA. Discover how his relentless curiosity led him to question conventional leadership practices, the pivotal moments that reshaped his approach, and the lessons he's learned about inspiring teams in a world driven by uncertainty. How can leaders inspire and motivate in a world driven by uncertainty? Join us as we explore the habits, mindsets, and actionable insights that can transform how you lead and connect with your team. Further reading from Mike Mears: Certainty. How Great Bosses Can Change Minds and Drive Innovation: https://www.certaintyleadershipbook.com/
Mike Mears’s Website:
Mike Mears’s Leadership Newsletter: https://landing.mailerlite.com/webforms/landing/i5b5t0
Other reading from Jean Gomes and Scott Allender: The Enneagram of Emotional Intelligence (S Allender, 2023)
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| How Movement Can Free Your Mind with Caroline Williams | 15 Jun 2022 | 00:42:56 | |
During this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender talk to Caroline Williams, whose latest book ‘Move’ explores the emerging science of how movement opens up ‘a hotline to our minds’. Caroline is also a public speaker (including her 2014 TedX titled ‘Pimp My Brain’), consultant and writer for New Scientist and is the editor of two of New Scientist’s Instant Expert Guides, How Your Brain Works: Inside the most complicated object in the known universe (John Murray, 2017) and Your Conscious Mind: Unravelling the greatest mystery of the human brain (John Murray, 2017). Move: How the New Science of Body Movement Can Set Your Mind Free 2.33 What drew you into studying movement? 4.50 What are the implications of living a sedentary life? 7.26 In your book you write about the evolutionary internalisation of movement. Can you elaborate on that? 11.35 You write about how breathing and related exercises aid decision making, and also cite a 2016 study that shows that we can synchronise our breathing with our brainwaves. Can you talk to us about that? 14.17 What have you learnt for yourself through this work, what have you taken on board? 15.55 What advice would you give to leaders about how to ensure that their team are adopting movement practices in order to get the most out of them? 18.19 Was there anything that surprised you whilst researching the book? 20.18 You mention (in particular) one study about First Responders and 9/11. Can you talk to us about that? 23.31 What are we learning about elderly physical movement? 25.36 What are your favourite movements? 27.10 What else is catching your attention right now? 32.24 What did you learn about osteocalcin? 36.01 What’s the ideal amount of exercise and how should people be approaching that with intentionality? 39.43 What’s your next project?
Recommended listening from the Evolving Leader archive: The Next 15 Years with Kevin Kelly
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Redesigning Work with Lynda Gratton | 08 Jun 2022 | 00:50:11 | |
This episode of the Evolving Leader podcast features a conversation between co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender and future of work thought leader Professor Lynda Gratton. As professor of management practice at London Business School, Lynda Gratton designed the human resource strategy and transforming companies programme, which she has since led for over 20 years. She is founder of the global research advisory practice HSM Advisory and has written ten books exploring the changing relationship between people strategy and business performance. Lynda Gratton is also a fellow of the World Economic Forum. Redesigning Work: How to Transform Your Organisation and Make Hybrid Work for Everyone
0.00 Introduction 1.48 Can you give us a pen portrait of your career and the key areas of your focus? 3.37 What’s your assessment of what’s currently going on in the workplace? 7.10 Can you take us through the four steps that you believe organisations need to make in order to make the most of the global shift? 11.54 Who are you seeing getting this right? 18.07 Seeing as this was the first time that so many people around the world went through the same experience, our value sets and world view may have changed. What are you observing on that front? 23.39 Is the doubling of the number of meetings because we’ve lost the ability to pop in on each other and have the ‘water cooler’ conversations? 27.05 Going back to your ‘Hybrid Working’ article in HBR, what do we take forward from what we’ve learnt through this intense experiment and what do we let go of do you think? 32.12 So as organisation’s experiment, and employees are looking at the realities of working longer and the added complexities of their lives, what should companies be doing to support the wellbeing of their teams? 37.13 Do you think organisations should reconsider freezing again and what do you think are the most dangerous assumptions that we might be making right now to leave untested? 39.41 I love what you’re saying about baking in agility. 41.12 If you could guess, what do you think the world of work is going to look like in 20 or 30 years time? 46.50 How can people get in touch with you? 47.53 Can we plant a question in our audience’s mind about how to think about the future of work?
Recommended listening from the Evolving Leader archive: Heritage and Innovation at Wimbledon with CEO Sally Bolton
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Rethinking our Relationship with Time with Oliver Burkeman | 01 Jun 2022 | 00:53:05 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader, co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender talk to author and former Guardian journalist Oliver Burkeman. For more than 10 years, Oliver Burkeman wrote the weekly ‘This Column Will Change Your Life’ column in the Guardian newspaper providing readers with ideas for a better life. In his latest book 4000 weeks, he rejects the obsession with 'getting everything done,' and introduces readers to tools for constructing a meaningful life by embracing rather than denying their limitations. Four Thousand Weeks (Vintage, 2022) 2.40 Could we have a brief tour of your world and how you became a chronicler of ideas about living a good life. 5.20 When you look back at your Guardian column, what were some of the ideas and people that most stood out to you? 8.11 Tell us why you wrote 4000 weeks. 10.41 How has our concept of time changed through the ages? 15.43 Can you tell us about the paradox of limitation? 18.09 You describe how the German philosopher, Martin Heidegger argued that our finite existence is bound with time and that most of us spend our time denying this fact either through distraction or denial – what can we take from his thinking by flipping the constraints of mortality? 23.24 How are we using distraction as avoidance, and how could positive distraction be useful? 28.30 Let’s turn to the benefits of procrastination. 32.34 In the context of organisational life, how should leaders think about the idea of inevitable limitations? 37.45 How can the mindset shift that underlies 4000 weeks be applied in an organisation? As a leader, what steps can be taken to normalise a change in philosophy whilst at the same time preventing it from being misused as an invitation to stop making plans for the future? 42.25 This is where we hobbies and family life makes such a difference to our lives – how we’re almost embarrassed to confess we have such a thing as a hobby. Can you talk about paying yourself first? Social:
The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Being An Everyday Superhero with Tony O’Driscoll and Gary Zamchick | 25 May 2022 | 00:56:11 | |
“Meet a stressed young manager, Mae B, whose teams are being led by an authoritarian CEO. We join her on her mission to overhaul the outdated leadership systems obsessed by power, profit and process and fight for central leadership that prioritises people, purpose and principles.” Talking to Evolving Leader hosts Scott and Jean, Tony O’Driscoll (professor at Duke University's Fuqua School of Business and a Research Fellow at Duke Corporate Education) and Gary Zamchick (illustrator, innovation strategy consultant and co-founder of start-up Words-Eye) explain their novel approach to writing ‘Everyday Superhero – How You Can Inspire Everyone And Create Real Change At Work’, a book that one reviewer refers to as ‘an entertaining tale with a serious message’. ‘Everyday Superhero – How You Can Inspire Everyone And Create Real Change At Work’ (Penguin Business, 2022)
0.00 Introduction 2.46 What’s the single most purpose driven aspect of your work? 4.42 Why did you decide to move away from writing a traditional business book? 8.28 Give us your pitch for the book. 11.23 What was it for you personally that led you realise that ‘the human piece is really missing’? 14.14 If businesses move to competing based on imagination, what’s the environment that would give them a competitive edge? 16.28 Talk us through the story behind the book. 22.34 How did you meet? 26.00 How does your creative partnership work? 29.41 Can we focus a little deeper on the issue of change? 35.41 Who is getting this right? Where are you seeing evidence of the kind of change that you’re talking about? 39.27 As markets and communities are coming together to drive change (as opposed to organisations), how does that influence your thinking? 45.06 In your book, the character Mae B is trapped in a bureaucratic system and is the person we all end up wanting to associate with. Tell us a little about this character.
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| The Confident Mind with Dr Nate Zinsser | 18 May 2022 | 00:51:55 | |
This week on the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are joined by Dr Nate Zinsser. Dr Zinsser is an expert in the psychology of human performance and has worked at the forefront of applied sports psychology for over 30 years. His research has been published in several journals and in the widely used textbook ‘Applied Sport Psychology: Personal Growth to Peak Performance’. Dr Zinsser is the director of the performance psychology programme at West Point (The United States Military Academy) where he has been the lead performance psychologist since 1992, personally conducting over seventeen thousand individual training sessions and seven hundred team training sessions for cadets seeking the mental edge for athletic, academic, and military performance. Nate Zinsser’s book ‘The Confident Mind, a Battle-Tested Guide to Unshakable Performance’ was published in 2022.
0.00 Introduction 2.29 Could you give us a picture of what West Point is? 5.46 How has the field of performance psychology evolved during your 30 years as director at West Point? 11.15 Can you take us through some of the building blocks of the skills that you have brought from the world of sports psychology into the military? 13.49 Can you give us an example of something that you did that would have been quite counterintuitive to the culture at West point at the time? 16.15 Have the values and culture at West Point changed as a result of the work you’ve been doing? 19.18 How do you help somebody who feels that they don’t belong here? 24.03 What do you mean by confidence, and what can we do to help ourselves and others become more confident? 27.45 From a practical perspective, what do you do to help people who are at an inflection point in their career to build confidence? 31.35 During your time at West Point, have you seen a change in the self-awareness and the knowledge around psychology and performance science in the cadets who come into the college? 34.40 Tell us about your new book ‘The Confident Mind’ 39.19 What would you say to a leader who is struggling to help someone on their team increase their confidence? 42.02 How do we bring up confident children? 46.32 What is exciting you right now? Where is your attention at the moment?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| How Our Mindset on Mental Health is Changing with Geoff McDonald | 11 May 2022 | 00:49:50 | |
"My purpose is simple; I want to create a world where everybody in every workplace feels they genuinely have the choice to put up their hand and ask for help when they are suffering from mental ill health" (Geoff McDonald, LinkedIn Profile). This week on the Evolving Leader podcast, host Scott Allender talks to Geoff McDonald. Former Global VP of HR at Unilever, Geoff is now a speaker and a business transformation consultant who inspires leaders to embrace mental health and empower organisations to put purpose at their core and play their positive role in the world. Listen as Geoff shares his very personal inspiring journey. https://www.mindsatworkmovement.com/ The acronym that Geoff describes: CAN DO
0.00 Introduction 1.25 Could you start by telling us about the event that changed the course of your life? 5.50 I’d like to understand more about your first anxiety fuelled panic attack, and the support that you received. 14.17 What can leaders do with their teams to normalise the mental health conversation? 26.25 Could you tell us about your charity Minds At Work? 31.23 What are your thoughts on the accountability and responsibility that social networks are taking around the mental health of their users? 36.33 How can parents help their children with regard to their mental health and the external pressures that they face? 39.07 How can people who are listening to this podcast get more connected with their inner experience before their bodies sound the alarm?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Why Purpose Really Matters with Ranjay Gulati | 04 May 2022 | 00:50:15 | |
Are you clear as to what your personal or organisation’s purpose is? In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender talk to Harvard Business School Professor Ranjay Gulati. Professor Gulati’s research around purpose focusses on why it has become increasingly important for organisations. In his book ‘Purpose, the heart and soul of high performance companies’, Ranjay Gulati argues that a deeper engagement with purpose can serve as a radically new operating system, enhancing performance while also delivering meaningful benefits to society. ‘Deep Purpose, the Heart and Soul of High-Performance Companies’ (Ranjay Gulati, Penguin, 2022)
0.00 Introduction 2.17 Could you start by giving us a brief tour of your career and tell us what sparks your curiosity? 5.43 Why do you think purpose has become such a key focus for organisations in the last decade? 8.26 How do you define purpose and how might some people be misconstruing what purpose is? 12.31 You’ve said that pursuing a purposeful course means maintaining a difficult balance between meeting the expectations of old and new stakeholders, something that you refer to as walking the razor’s edge. Can you describe what that entails? 16.32 How might organisations that do not have an embodied sense of purpose start to build that? 19.16 Can you talk us through the ‘four levers that you need to pull’ in order to align purpose with performance? 24.58 You talk about purpose being rooted in organisational history. How does having this connection with the past give people more clarity about the future, especially in a world that is changing so quickly? 27.50 How can purpose help an organisation face quite considerable disruption more ethically? 33.39 When you start talking in these terms, you are inviting greater scrutiny on your organisation, and that can be really helpful can’t it? 36.32 Have there been any companies that you’ve spoken to that have left you deeply inspired? 38.15 Do you see (in your students particularly) a shift in interest towards this area? How has the values of the generations you are working with influenced the future in this respect? 40.07 You also say that purpose is fragile…. 43.16 What impact has this work had on you personally, how has it changed your sense of purpose? 46.47 What’s next for you?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Putting Innovation on the Balance Sheet with Dan Toma | 27 Apr 2022 | 00:42:49 | |
Can you measure and track how successfully your organisation is innovating? This week on the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Scott Allender and Jean Gomes talk to Dan Toma, co-author of ‘Innovation Accounting‘, who says that the traditional management tools available to leaders wanting to understand investments in innovation are lacking, instead proposing a new set of frameworks and tools that go beyond just financial indicators. Innovation Accounting – A Practical Guide for Measuring Your Innovation Ecosystem’s Performance (BIS, 2021)
0.00 Introduction 2.05 Could you start by sharing your journey? 4.55 Could you tell us why it’s important for an organisation to develop its own innovation ecosystem? 7.24 Is that approach being adopted by organisations or are many sticking with the traditional ‘small innovation team’ approach? 9.23 What are the biggest pitfalls for corporates when they start to adopt this? 13.40 Could you give us a working definition of innovation accounting and also some of your ideas around the different types of innovation and what they look like? 16.34 Can you take us through an example of how an innovation accounting system could be built using the tools and frameworks you provide in your book? 19.42 What mindset shifts does an organisation need to make in order to embrace innovation accounting? 24.30 What is the most useful starting point in order to establish the common ground between finance and innovation teams? 27.09 How do people who are prone to big picture large innovation thinking take those ideas forwards in pragmatic, not over romanticised ways? 30.45 When you go into an organisation that might be lacking creativity and imagination (where the focus is on maintaining past success), what can you do to start them valuing that from an innovation accounting perspective? 33.43 What single piece of advice can you give to our listeners, whether or not they are in formal innovation roles? 35.37 What’s next for you, what are you working on now? 37.25 If an organisation adopts innovation accounting, what looks different and what’s happening in the organisation that’s not happening today? 38.24 How did Covid impact innovation in organisations?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Know Thyself - the Neuroscience of Self-Awareness with Professor Stephen Fleming | 20 Apr 2022 | 00:55:39 | |
This week on the Evolving Leader, co-hosts Jean and Scott talk to Professor Stephen Fleming, one of the world’s leading neuroscientists whose life’s work is the study of metacognition (the ability to think about thinking). How does this influence our self-awareness and our ability to make good judgements? Find out in this fascinating episode. Know Thyself - The New Science of Self-Awareness (Hachette, 2021) 0.00 Introduction 2.35 Could you start by giving us a definition of metacognition? 4.38 What’s the difference between conscious and unconscious metacognition? 7.11 In your book Know Thyself, you write about how our brains are constantly trying to solve inverse problems, trying to understand the root causes of things. Can you help us understand this concept? 11.08 How might we sense metacognition? 15.46 What kinds of experiments are you looking at that help to see when unconscious awareness and explicit awareness are at odds? 19.14 Can you talk to us about how metacognition (as an attribute) can be developed? 21.50 You’ve said that recognising people with low metacognition can be one of the best predictors in identifying people who are more dogmatic. Can you tell us about some of the work that you’ve done around this and what you’ve learnt? 28.52 How can metacognition help us to understand other people more? 32.51 What are the breakthroughs that you are making and how might they inform artificial intelligence? 36.32 When we start to embrace more embedded technology in human beings, how does metacognition work when it’s directly integrated into our bodies? 40.20 What’s really exciting you right now? What are the standout things that you are working on? 44.17 Can you paint a picture for us as to what it’s like to work in your lab. What’s going on? 49.06 What are the important take-aways from your work for leaders to consider?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Leadership Within, Between and Among Us with Ron Carucci | 06 Apr 2022 | 00:45:13 | |
This week on the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender talk to Ron Carucci, experienced strategy, organization and leadership transformation expert, co-founder and managing partner at leadership consultancy Navalent and author of eight bestselling books. To Be Honest: Lead with the Power of Truth, Justice and Purpose (Kogan Page, 2021)
0.00 Introduction 3.04 Can you give us an overview of your approach to helping grow and develop leaders? 4.47 You talk about the language you use at Navalent, specifically within, between and among. Can you give us some context or an example of what it looks like to go in and raise awareness around those three components? 7.39 In a situation where people are deeply embedded, but when forced to change both the individual and organisation find themselves facing a crisis as they are out of step with the market reality, what’s your learning from that situation? 12.56 What’s the biggest trap that you find yourself in that might actually reinforce the problem? 14.58 In your 2014 book ‘Rising To Power’, you state that 50% of leaders rising up to new formal levels of influence within the organisation fail within 18 months. From your perspective, why is this and what can someone do to avoid becoming part of that statistic? 21.31 In your latest book ‘To be honest’, you identify four factors that have a profound impact on honesty, justice and purpose within an organisation. However if these factors are missing or are dysfunctional, the organisational conditions compel employees to choose dishonesty and self-interest. Can you unpack that for us? 28.41 What’s the delta between organisations that think they have these attributes and are living them versus organisations that actually do have them? 33.55 You’ve referenced your research in neuroscience, and both Scott and I are particularly interested in the science of mindset and self-awareness. What have you learnt that’s changed your thinking in recent years? 36.47 What’s your next big project? 40.19 Who has inspired you as a leader or organisation?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| ‘Ego Flip’ with James Woodcock | 07 May 2025 | 00:52:24 | |
It's no secret that the world is changing rapidly (perhaps faster than many of us appreciate) and this demands a new kind of leadership. But is your ego holding back your ability to evolve and lead effectively? In this episode, co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are in conversation with business philosopher, consultant and author of ‘Ego Flip: How to Reset Your Leadership Life’, James Woodcock. The conversation goes beyond theory, exploring practical ways to understand your own perspective and offers simple, actionable ideas like the ‘one breath rule’ and ‘noticing thinking’. If you're interested in understanding how ego shapes not just individuals but also organizations and how leadership can evolve for the future, this episode offers valuable insights on how to potentially reset your leadership life. Referenced during this episode: Other reading from Jean Gomes and Scott Allender: Leading In A Non-Linear World (J Gomes, 2023) The Enneagram of Emotional Intelligence (S Allender, 2023) Social: Instagram @evolvingleader LinkedIn The Evolving Leader Podcast Twitter @Evolving_Leader Bluesky @evolvingleader.bsky.social YouTube @evolvingleader
The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Moral Clarity with Susan Neiman | 30 Mar 2022 | 00:46:17 | |
This week on the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender talk to one of the world’s leading moral philosophers Professor Susan Neiman. Professor Neiman is currently the director of the Einstein Forum in Potsdam, and the former professor of philosophy at Yale and Tel Aviv Universities. Her books include ‘Moral Clarity, A Guide for Grown-Up Idealists’ and ‘Why Grow Up, Subversive Thoughts for an Infantile Age’. 2.02 Can you start by sharing some of the experience that shaped your world view, and the role that they played in forming the central ideas that sit at the heart of your work. 6.16 Can we turn to ‘Moral Clarity’, which centres on the failure of our culture to meet our moral needs and the problems that this creates in society. Can you take us through some of the central arguments. 15.08 I’m really interested in this loss of moral language in the progressive parts of society. Is there something else that was going on with relativism etc that started to make it hard for that group of people to talk about it? 23.58 Since you wrote moral clarity we’ve had a number of shock points including the Trump Presidency, Brexit and the growing influence of social media. How have these moments evolved your thinking? 37.19 In your book ‘Why Group Up’ you address the widespread infantilism that you feel pervades so much of society. Why do you think that’s happened?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| The Power of Not Thinking with Simon Roberts | 23 Mar 2022 | 00:56:03 | |
This week on the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender talk to business anthropologist Simon Roberts. In addition to being a co-founder of Stripe Partners, Simon founded the UKs first dedicated ethnographic research company in 2001, he’s run an innovation lab at Intel and is currently board president of the EPIC community. In 2020 his book The Power of Not Thinking: How Our Bodies Learn and Why We Should Trust Them was published. The Power of Not Thinking: How Our Bodies Learn and Why We Should Trust Them 2.27 How are you feeling? 3.22 Can you start by telling us about your background? 5.59 Can you explain what an anthropologist involved in ethnographic research does and how you do it? 8.29 Can you give us some of the practical techniques that you might use to actually uncover what’s going on? 12.17 In your book you break down the idea of embodied knowledge. Can you give us an overview of what that is and why we should trust our bodies more? 14.05 How do we delineate between the brain’s ability to create habit vs the body knowledge? 18.34 Could you talk us through the context for your book? 26.07 In your book you list five features of embodied knowledge. Could you give us a high level overview of what those are? 32.27 How would somebody get more connected to the embodied sense of an empathetic experience in their daily lives? 36.39 An increasing number of industries are relying more and more on proxies because data is so attractive, but you talk about the dangers of building businesses in that way. What are we missing when we do that? 41.09 Which organisations have you seen that are best at maintaining that continuous connection with the world in the way that you are describing? 44.15 Can you share your thoughts on embodied knowledge for policy makers? 47.50 How do you enhance your own ability to trust and apply embodied knowledge? 52.04 You’ve talked about discomfort. What’s the experience that created the most discomfort in you?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| The Ukraine Crisis with Monika Bielskyte | 16 Mar 2022 | 00:50:23 | |
This week on the Evolving Leader podcast, Jean Gomes talks to Monika Bielskyte. Monika previously appeared on the podcast back in season 3, episode 10 and we invited her back to get a picture beyond the news feed about Ukraine. In this very special episode, Monika provides a visceral picture of what’s currently happening to the country and its people and why.
0.00 Introduction 1.25 What are your connections to Ukraine? 11.12 What are we (in the West) missing regarding the situation in Ukraine? 23.43 What’s the shared hope held by many of the generation who have never grown up under an authoritarian regime? 34.08 What’s your take on President Zelenskiy and his leadership?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| The Art and Science of Pattern Recognition with Marcus du Sautoy | 09 Mar 2022 | 00:56:35 | |
This week on the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are joined by Professor Marcus du Sautoy. Marcus is Simonyi Professor for the Public Understanding of Science at the University of Oxford, Fellow of New College, Oxford, author of multiple popular science and mathematics books and he is a regular contributor on television, radio and to both The Times and The Guardian. He is also passionate about public engagement on topics that include creativity and artificial intelligence.
0.00 Introduction 2.23 Where does your love of mathematics originate? 6.11 What is mathematics really about for you? 8.35 Can you explain what zeta functions are, and why symmetry and the function of groups is important to learn more about. 12.24 What did you draw from the moment that DeepMind’s AlphaGo beat Lee Sedol? 16.12 What are your thoughts around the possibility that AI can be creative, so taking us down a path where consciousness may not be the thing that actually happens, but we might actually get something totally new that doesn’t exist in our minds or reckoning at the moment? 18.35 How do we prevent ourselves from having something that we don’t understand governing our lives? 20.44 In your book ‘What We Cannot Know’, you explored if there are questions that we may never have the answer to, and therefore our living with the unknown. Could you elaborate on that idea for us? 25.52 You’ve written about the conflict between physics and mathematics, and also your idea that mathematics exists outside of humans so it’s not a human construction and would exist without us. Could you elaborate on those two points? 33.13 Tell us about your latest book ‘Thinking Better’ where you search for short cuts, not just in mathematics but also other fields. 36.14 A lot of people think of maths as being hard. However, you can use maths, the concepts and frameworks without being an expert mathematician. Can you bring that to life for us? 43.09 Tell us about the work you’ve been doing to bring Douglas Hofstadter’s life story to the Barbican in London. 48.28 You’ve said that we can’t fully know something when we’re stuck in a system whether consciously or unconsciously. What is the leadership lesson or opportunity that we can take from that? 53.06 When was the last time you had a real ‘aha’ moment, and what’s the biggest challenge that you are working on at the moment?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| The Imagination Machine with Martin Reeves | 02 Mar 2022 | 00:56:10 | |
Kicking off season 4 of the Evolving Leader podcast is a discussion that co-hosts Scott Allender and Jean Gomes had with BCG Henderson Institute chairman and author Martin Reeves. The Henderson Institute is BCG’s think tank dedicated to exploring and developing new insights from business, technology, economics and science by embracing the powerful technology of ideas. Sit back and listen as Martin unpacks how imagination works and how organisations can keep it alive and harness it in a systematic way. ‘The Imagination Machine – How to Spark New Ideas and Create Your Company’s Future’ (Jack Fuller and Martin Reeves, 2021, Harvard Business Review Press) Please complete the Evolving Leader listener survey. Thank you. 0.00 Introduction 2.22 Can we start with your background, and what inspired you to write ‘The Imagination Machine’ 4.01 Why do you think there appears to be an absence of imagination in so many large organisations? 5.55 It’s easy to think about imagination as being solely a psychological process, but your research has revealed something else. What have you found and what does it mean in terms of how that notion should be challenged? 8.23 Can we delve into some of the neuroscience and research that you have uncovered that underpins your thinking. 15.50 Are organisations set up (almost) as surprise mitigation machines, so repressing new mindsets that would potentially unlock new business models? 17.55 Can you outline the six step process that you describe in your book around harnessing and scaling imagination and creativity in a systemised way? 24.41 How can we get better at this? What could a listener do in their organisation to adopt some of these strategies? 30.43 You talk about play as being de-risked accelerated learning. Talk to us about the importance of play and where you are seeing it being adopted. 37.27 You have mentioned that crisis can be an inflection point for reimagination. What have you observed during the pandemic? 42.34 Is there a link between capacity for imagination and sense making? 45.56 What role will/does technology play in organisations that are reimagining themselves? 52.11 What should leaders be prioritising? What are the specific things that they should be doing more of that they’re not to imbue their organisations with a greater sense of imagination at both a cultural and capability level?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Highlights from Season 3 with Jean Gomes and Scott Allender | 02 Feb 2022 | 00:36:08 | |
As we close season 3 of the Evolving Leader podcast, it’s time to reflect on some of our highlights from the last 18 episodes. We continue to learn so much from our incredible guests who not only give us their valuable time, but are also so willing to share their expertise and current thinking which in turn helps us to develop our own thinking around what being an evolving leader really means. The Evolving Leader podcast will return in March with the start of season 4, but in the mean time sit back and listen as we talk to Rita Gunther McGrath, Kevin Kelly, Tim Lomas, Will Page, Todd Kashdan, Steve Ingham, Leanne Infante, Monika Bielskyte, Anil Seth, Rob Murray, Steve Killelea, Azeem Azhar and Annie Murphy Paul.
0.00 Introduction
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Thinking Outside the Brain with Annie Murphy Paul | 26 Jan 2022 | 00:40:43 | |
When you face a difficult situation, how often have you heard someone say, ‘just use your head’? This week on the Evolving Leader podcast, Jean and Scott talk to acclaimed science writer Annie Murphy Paul who turns that around and says that in fact we ‘think outside the brain’, suggesting that the people, things and space around us have a profound effect on how we think, feel and develop. Published in 2021, her book ‘The Extended Mind, The Power of Thinking Outside the Brain’ has been awarded the New York Times Editors Choice and Washington Post Best Nonfiction Book of 2021.
0.00 Introduction 2.26 Can we start with your background, and how you became interested in the biological and social sciences. 4.46 Can we look at what the components are of the extended mind and could you give us some examples of the research that you have uncovered when talking to neuroscientists and psychologists that bring this to life. 10.17 Can you tell us a little about how ‘the body knows before the mind’. 13.35 What other thoughts and ideas could you share about how we could build greater awareness of our interoceptive processes? 15.49 Could you talk to us about emotional reappraisal? 19.30 What happens to our thinking when we are moving and what is the ideal amount of movement? 24.02 How do gestures impact our thinking? 27.14 Can we move to thinking about how extending the intelligence out of the mind to our surroundings 29.47 What has been most surprising in all of this for you? 31.47 How has it changed you? 33.36 Thinking about the challenges that are facing leaders, particularly around Covid and the decision to bring people back, when to work at home and when to work in a collaborative physical space. What are your insights there? 35.50 What’s next for you? 37.34 Is there anything else that you would leave us with today?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Solving the Imagination Crisis with Gerard Puccio | 19 Jan 2022 | 00:50:39 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, Jean and Scott talk to Gerard Puccio, author, creativity researcher, TEDx presenter and Chair and Professor at the International Center for Studies in Creativity, Buffalo State. Gerard helps individuals, teams, and organizations reach their greatest potential by tapping into and expanding their capacity to imagine new possibilities and to creatively address complex problems. He states that in a world defined by complexity and change, creative thinking has become the number one survival skill and on the back of that his mission is to help individuals, teams and organizations ignite and fully maximize their creative potential – not just to survive, but to thrive.
0.00 Introduction 2.33 Please start by giving us a sense of your research into creativity and areas that currently most excite you 5.18 In a much cited piece of research published by IBM as far back as 2010, creativity was selected as the most crucial factor for future success. In 2022, why are so many businesses still prioritising what they have now with a focus on ways to prevent risk and deviation? 14.48 In an organisation where there are a lot of good ideas at the top, but they repeatedly fail to become commercial realities (in other words creativity breaks down), what needs be developed in the team so they are able to take the ideas through to becoming a reality. 18.45 Tell us a little about the FourSight tool 26.29 Do you have a view on the best ideation techniques 29.15 What have you learnt about yourself in terms of being in a social environment and generating ideas? 34.38 How do you prevent yourself from falling in love with an idea and potentially stalling when in fact you should be detaching yourself from that originally idea allowing yourself to create more and more alternatives? 38.49 Who is doing well in the creativity space? 42.01 Do you share the view that there is a problem nurturing creativity in education?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Learning to Flex with Jeffrey Hull | 12 Jan 2022 | 00:38:02 | |
This week on the Evolving Leader podcast, Jean and Scott talk to author, educator, and consultant Jeffrey Hull PhD. In addition to his writing and consultancy, Jeffrey is a clinical instructor in psychology at Harvard Medical School and an adjunct professor of leadership at New York University. Flex, The Art and Science of Leadership in a Changing World
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| New Realities of an Exponential World with Azeem Azhar | 05 Jan 2022 | 00:58:01 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender talk to entrepreneur, investor, and the creator of highly-regarded newsletter ‘Exponential View’ Azeem Azhar. Much of the world is witnessing radical societal change driven by exponential technologies that are transforming how we live and interact with one another and disrupting our economic and social norms in highly unpredictable ways. In his recent book ‘Exponential: How to Bridge the Gap Between Technology and Society’, Azeem Azhar describes the widening gap between technology and society and its ramifications.
0.00 Introduction 2.30 Tell us about your journey and how that influenced your views regarding how new technologies are accelerating change and as a result creating an exponential gap between the impact they have on the world and the scope of our institutions and policies. 11.33 What is the central message in your book from a leadership perspective? What could business leaders learn from the book? 17.06 How do you start the conversation with a CEO who hasn’t started to consider the use of exponential technologies within their organisation? 20.17 At a time when mankind’s biggest challenge is tackling climate change, can you share what you’re seeing in terms of the conflict of technology, political will and capability. 24,45 Another huge risk to our future is AI enhanced warfare where (for example) humans could be excluded from making decisions which could lead to catastrophic escalations. Could you give us your view on how this is developing? 30.47 In your view, how is remote working transforming the world? 37.57 If we pause to think about the future Metaverse (with Facebook having recently rebranded to Meta), how do we prevent it from deepening the problems with mental health and wellbeing that are dogging social media at the moment? 43.39 Thinking about some of the other major players in the techspace (including Apple, Amazon and Microsoft), what do you think their evolution is going to look like in the next ten years? 46.57 As leaders, how are we going to manage the exponential gap? 53.52 What has excited you during the last 6-12 months?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| BONUS: Working in AI with Damian Lowe | 02 May 2025 | 00:42:36 | |
In this bonus episode of The Evolving Leader, host Jean Gomes speaks with Damian Lowe, a senior software engineer at Symphony AI. They discuss how many of us have moved beyond the initial reactions to services like ChatGPT towards a current phase focused on experimenting, learning, and building. Damian shares that for programmers, AI tools like large language models (LLMs) are already providing a tangible 10-20% productivity gain for tasks like code suggestions and reviews, noting that both the technology and human adaptation are still maturing. However he adds that while AI excels at basic or medium tasks, its performance degrades quickly at higher complexity levels, often producing "nonsense," and he emphasizes that effective adaptation requires not just better prompting, but a crucial understanding of the difference between how machines "think" (based on probabilities) and how humans think. Looking ahead, Damian is optimistic that within 3-5 years AI could make many jobs significantly easier, potentially reducing "grunt work" and fostering more creativity through effective human-machine collaboration. He underscores the importance for leaders in helping teams understand AI's capabilities and limits, encouraging experimentation, and stresses the need to maintain critical thinking and human skills alongside AI adoption. Other reading from Jean Gomes and Scott Allender: The Enneagram of Emotional Intelligence (S Allender, 2023) Social: Instagram @evolvingleader
The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| Creating a Land of Hope with Anja Lovén | 15 Dec 2021 | 00:59:24 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, Jean and Scott talk to Anja Lovén. Anja founded the Danish ngo Land of Hope in 2012, and is a human rights activist dedicated to protecting and rescuing children in Nigeria accused of being witches. She gained media attention when in 2016 a photo from one of her rescue actions went viral and later that year was named as the world’s most inspiring person (ahead of out-going US president Barack Obama and the pope).
0.00 Introduction 3.04 Tell us about your background prior to starting Land of Hope 10.35 What did you experience when you went to Africa? 22.03 You became widely known when in 2016 you were photographed rescuing a small boy who you subsequently named Hope. How is Hope doing today? 27.44 Tell us a little about ‘witch children’ 34.20 What personal risks do you encounter in communities where you might find yourself confronting fear and sometimes corruption? 37.36 Is the ultimate goal with the education reunification? 43.44 What’s next for you? 50.06 How do you deal with the trauma associated with some of the situations you find yourself confronted by? 55.29 How can our listeners get involved with your organisation?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| The Future of World Peace with Steve Killelea | 08 Dec 2021 | 00:54:10 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender talk to Steve Killelea. Steve is the founder and executive chairman of the global think tank the Institute for Economics and Peace and Steve’s funding and thought leadership behind the Institute have seen him recognised as one of the World’s 100 Most Influential People on reducing the onset of armed violence. 2.57 Tell us your story. How did an IT entrepreneur find himself championing peace? 4.57 Can you tell us about the paradigm shift that you are working to create. 7.45 What are people’s biggest misconceptions about peace 9.42 In your book you say that in the past peace may have been the domain of the altruistic, whereas now it’s everyone’s self-interest because peace is central to a safe and productive society. Can you tell us more about that? 10.47 In the book, you also say that most of our leaders are trapped in an early age, a kind of Darwinian race to complete, and that dominates how they think about international relationships. In our increasingly interconnected world, how should leaders be evolving? 14.32 Tell us what your thinking is around the need for leaders to think at a systems level. 20.26 What would have to happen to for different organisations to integrate/un-silo? 22.26 From a systems perspective, what was your analysis of the last five years, the increase in popularism, what happened at Capitol Hill etc? 27.23 When you look at the world through the index of the eight pillars of positive peace, which countries are most vulnerable to being destabilised at the moment? 29.43 What are your thoughts or reactions to the formation of a world government? 32.04 How has the US faired on the index over the last five years culminating in the attack on Capitol Hill? 35.22 How did your entrepreneurial background influence the way you conceptualised and manage the IEP and actually created the international peace index? 39.11 Tell us a little bit about how you have developed yourself in relation to your own world view and the things that you do to sustain the level of energy that you must have to be driving all of this. 49.09 How can our listeners get involved with the work that you’re doing?
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The Evolving Leader is researched, written and presented by Jean Gomes and Scott Allender with production by Phil Kerby. It is an Outside production. Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||
| The Heart of Leadership with Rob Murray | 01 Dec 2021 | 01:04:46 | |
In this episode of the Evolving Leader podcast, co-hosts Jean Gomes and Scott Allender talk to Rob Murray. Rob is a co-founder and CEO of Transformed Leader and a leadership thinker who strives for a deep level of authenticity whilst at the same time being supremely pragmatic in the realities of organisational life.
0.00 Introduction 2.34 Let’s start with your story. Tell us about the work that your organisation does, and what motivated you to start the business in the first place? 6.16 What do you mean when you say that you were lonely with yourself? 7.39 What can this loss of identity be attributed to? 11.09 So having had time to reflect on this, what was your first move? 16.34 Exploring the relationship that we have with our partners, and the effect that this has on our leadership. 29.16 How have these scenarios influenced the work that you’re doing today, your writing and your research? 33.59 So if ‘how are you feeling?’ is a heart question, what is a soul question? What’s the difference? 40.45 On this show we’re fascinated with emotions, not as this hard-wired thing but as a sense making mechanism. You’re currently doing some research in this area for your PhD, can you tell us a little about that? 44.25 What are the most prevalent emotions that people are running away from, avoiding or suppressing that are governing their behaviours? 49.40 You mention that showing weakness is counter cultural in many business settings, so many people feeling this way supress it resulting in resentment. 53.09 Can we talk about anger, the emotion that is repressed in a lot of organisations, sometimes resulting in a feeling of false positivity. 57.22 Thinking through the lens of intentionality, of recovering the heart and soul of leadership, what is something specific that you could encourage our listeners with right now?
Social: Send a message to The Evolving Leader team After more than 5 years of hosting The Evolving Leader, Jean Gomes and Scott Allender are launching their new show The Mindset Economy in January 2026. The new show will explore how to live better, work smarter and be connected in a more uncertain world where machines can think. Available wherever you get your podcasts. | |||