The Breakup Theory – Details, episodes & analysis

In this episode, Caroline and I respond to a letter from a listener who is trying to navigate a tricky relationship. It is a relationship with a lot of fuzziness, moving from romantic and sexual to friends. There are also attempts at real conversation, though they aren’t always clear, producing a difficult dynamic to understand and find bearings. They know they need to end it—or at least take space from it—but they also are tied into the queer anarchist community in a small town that centers around this person’s house. As they say, they are trying to put the ghost back in its grave, because all of their attempts at clarity and space get lost in confusing communication and signals.

This letter really brings up dynamics that are probably familiar to you all: the relationship where one person chases and the other person distances (then flips), the feeling that the end of the relationship will damage your relationships with other people, and of course deep personal connection and history that is hard to let go of, even if it is clearly part of the past.

The listener seems to know what they want (they work it out in the letter pretty clearly), but all of these ties and ghosts keep them bound. Caroline and I try to discuss the dynamics from many angles, perhaps not coming to a simple solution, but hopefully giving a helpful perspective for all of our listeners who may be caught in similar situations.

I do want to note that when I was listening back to the conversation, there are points where I am not sure I gave enough space to relationality. In other words, I give credence to many of those relationship truisms about centering yourself in a breakup, but feeling yourself can’t really be done without others. You can choose whom to share yourself with, but we are made up of all of these relationships and depend upon them to see and understand ourselves.

To check out more of my work head over to CAW Journal, the writer-worker collective I started with carla joy bergman, Dani Burlison, and Vicky Osterweil. You can subscribe for free to get access to our newsletter, podcasts, advice column, and zine/sticker library. If you pay for a membership, you get access to all of our projects, including writing workshops, book clubs, movie nights, and a thriving Discord community. 

The Breakup Theory is a member of the Channel Zero Network of anarchist podcasts. Check out Channel Zero for more shows including interviews, analysis, news, reportbacks, stories, and more.

Today I’m sharing a conversation I had with one of my favorites, Dean Spade, about his recent book Love in a Fucked Up World out with Algonquin Books. Dean has been an inspiration for a long time with his commitments to abolition, anti-Zionism, and trans liberation, among other things. His previous book, Mutual Aid, came at a perfect moment when people were getting together in response to COVID-19 and the George Floyd Uprising. This new book has also appeared right when we need it, when we feel worn down and scared, and need to find better ways to connect with each other. His thinking here lines up very closely with the things that concern me, namely thinking beyond politics and anarchism as relationships, building bottom up. Dean starts from the idea that all of our movements and struggle are based on our relationships, and if we can’t get those right, how can we expect to work together to end this world and build another. Love in a Fucked Up World finally gives us a self-help book for queer anarchists: it contains so much insight matched with practical suggestions to help guide you through your own stories and the ones you project on others that get in the way of real connection. It really moved me in moments and gelled certain ways to understand myself in relation to others.

Our conversation goes into nitty gritty relationship issues and zooms out to the ways these affect our collective work. We talk about how anarchists and leftists deprioritize and avoid doing this internal and interpersonal work, only to find that all of the problems appear in every place you go. It is so important to talk explicitly about our social needs and how our collective work fits into them. We can’t separate politics and love. Meetings are social spaces and our search for political direction is completely enmeshed in our search for intimate connection.

But I’ll let Dean tell you more about this—he wrote the book on it.

First, I want to announce the official launch of CAW, the writer worker collective that I belong to along with carla joy bergman, Dani Burlison, and Vicky Osterweil. It is a subscriber based platform where we will share all of our projects, a discord server, and offerings like writing workshops, book clubs, movie nights, as well as a zine and sticker library. If you sign up for free you get access to our weekly newsletter, our advice column, our podcasts, and the zines and stickers. If you subscribe to a paid membership, you have full access to everything. We have various subscription tiers, but everyone who subscribes has the same access. Please go over to https://www.cawshinythings.com to check out what we are doing there, and join if you want!

The Breakup Theory is a member of the Channel Zero Network of anarchist podcasts, which brings together important shows with news, analysis, reportbacks, and culture. Check it out at https://www.channelzeronetwork.com

(Note: I incorrectly say thechannelzeronetwork.com. There is no THE in the URL!)

On today’s episode, I am presenting the talk that Cindy Barukh Milstein and I did at the Another Carolina Anarchist Bookfair, which we called An Anarchism of Despair. When we planned to collaborate for the talk, we checked in on where we were mentally, emotionally, and politically in relation to the specific moment, filled with frustrations around anarchists’ involvement in movements, and the walls that we run into time and time again. We wanted to lean into the despair, to look it in the face, and to learn from it how we might consider acting from this position. This is the description we wrote for the talk:

After October 7, the upswell of Palestinian solidarity has been heartening. But in the mechanics of the movement itself, we have found ourselves stuck in outdated forms of protest, marching in circles, making demands that will never be heeded. It feels like each iteration of rebellion meets its end at the blatancy of power: we are shown again that those who govern won’t help us. And all this while watching a genocide in real time, feeling desperate and powerless. We have the energy and will, but not the means. What can we do, then, with this spike of liberatory urges? This discussion will interrogate anarchism at this particular moment from the position of despair. Where does it meet its limits? Where does it show up to keep the energy going? Are we endlessly hitting our heads against the wall ? Or does our effort need to be seen in the long view? When faced with the impossibility of liberation and action, where do we go?

We organize the talk around three central provocations, which essentially point to the ways our political actions, ideas, and horizons are circumscribed and therefore commit us to walking in circles. We then offer some thoughts about what anarchists actually do well and how we can use those practices to try to leave behind the useless forms of protest. I have included comments from two comrades who attended, Bonn and Jubilee V Debs, who made important contributions to the ideas.

I keep coming down to anarchism as something that creates the possibility of action: it doesn’t guarantee the consequences, but drives us to the edge where we can do something, rather than nothing. We turn away when there are no guarantees, stuck in our miserable comforts in this world, whether through the tired tropes of resistance or individual consumption as solace for work. While the state looks at us as if we are already dead, we can instead find a way to act like we are living, in the bursting of a moment that cannot be contained.

If you like this show, please share with your friends and rate and follow us wherever you get podcasts. You can also support the project and my writing by subscribing to my patreon patreon.com/thebreakuptheory. If you have any extra cash, you can sign up for $5/month, though nothing there is paywalled. On my patreon, I regularly post both short and long written pieces, along with episodes, and other conversations I’m having. I am so grateful for all of you supporting me and this project!

As always, We have an online submission form at https://form.jotform.com/thebreakuptheory/stories and a phone line at ‪(917) 426-6548. Please write and call us, to share your break up stories, your questions about ending things, and your hopes for liberation!

The Breakup Theory is a member of the Channel Zero Network of anarchist podcasts. CZN brings together a slew of amazing audio projects, so check them out at https://channelzeronetwork.com/

 And now for some despair . . .

In today’s episode, Caroline and I respond to a couple of listener’s letters. As I was editing the episode, I thought about the common theme, and came to this idea of getting over things. The first letter asks about how much work we are supposed to put into our relationships and ourselves, and what are the ethics of leaving someone in a crisis. The second letter asks for support around a relationship from years ago that is still able to wound, especially based on the ex’s perceived success. Before the letters, I talk a bit about where my thoughts are currently in terms of how we deal with our wounds and where our power might lie. I apologize for some segments of noisy audio! 

As always, please rate and follow us on your podcasting things, share our show with your friends and exes, and subscribe to the patreon (https://www.patreon.com/thebreakuptheory)—nothing is paywalled and you’ll get notified of all the different things I’m putting out there. You can also add some financial support if you wish!

Finally,i f you want to submit your own question or breakup story, write us at https://form.jotform.com/thebreakuptheory/stories or call ‪(917) 426-6548

In this episode, I talk with a student from the New School about the encampments there and what we can learn from the experience. Students at the New School set up their encampment in the lobby of the University Center in April a few days after the encampment was established at Columbia University and over 100 students were arrested. The New School student encampment last for over two weeks and eventually took the Parsons Building across the street, before President Donna Shalala had the students arrested early one morning. A few days later, faculty at the New Schools set up another encampment at the University that also lasted a couple weeks and eventually took the Welcome Center, holding it a few days before disbanding on the promise of a vote on divestment (which has not been delivered). In this conversation, we talk about the way the university administration dealt with the encampment, using less brute force than many of the other schools, and how this altered the organization of the encampment. In going through the whole experience, we discuss how our groups start mirroring bureaucracies, the use of divestment as a goal, the changing experience of study of revolutionary texts in the context of an encampment as opposed to the classroom, and more. Ultimately, we don’t know where the energy that was invigorated by the encampments will turn up next in resistance to genocide and control. But it is important to look at our actions and name their consequences.

If you like this show, please share with your friends and rate and follow us wherever you get podcasts. You can also support the project and my writing by subscribing to my patreon https://www.patreon.com/thebreakuptheory. If you have any extra cash, you can sign up for $5/month, though nothing there is paywalled. On my patreon, I regularly post both short and long written pieces, along with episodes, and other conversations I’m having. I am so grateful for all of you supporting me and this project!

As always, We have an online submission form at https://form.jotform.com/thebreakuptheory/stories and a phone line at ‪(917) 426-6548. Please write and call us, to share your break up stories, your questions about ending things, and your hopes for liberation!

On this episode, Caroline and I respond to a listener letter that really gets at the heart of the breakup experience: A fundamental question of how do you survive a devastating break up, and how to relate to yourself afterwards. We take the opportunity to look at this situation from all the angles. The main issue is coming to accept that you live with ghosts.  And then we turn to a new a new segment where we discuss what we are currently breaking up with. Here we talk about the pressures of individualism both in the sense of therapeutic advice and career or professional expectations and the questions of joining things or letting yourself off the hook while the world is falling apart. There is a real pleasure in doing nothing!

Thank you to everyone who shares their stories and let us consider them. Please keep writing and calling us! As always, we have an online submission form at https://form.jotform.com/thebreakuptheory/stories and a phone line at ‪(917) 426-6548. Please write and call us, we can’t wait to hear from you!

And finally, you can support the project and my other work by subscribing at patreon.com/thebreakuptheory. If you have some extra money, you can sign up for $5/month, though nothing is paywalled. On the Patreon, I regularly post both short and long written pieces, along with episodes, and other conversations I’m having. I am so grateful for the people supporting me and this project! I’m developing extra things for subscribers, like real time discussion sessions or reading groups. You can also rate and follow us wherever you get your podcasts, and of course share with your friends and exes.

On this episode Shuli talked to Aidan Khamis, a Palestinian student at Indiana University Bloomington, about the student encampment established on the campus in solidarity with Gaza (and still existent as of the recording of this episode). Aidan gives a rundown of the initial stages of setting the camp up, the waves of violent repression from the administration and police, as well as the positive experiences of worldbuilding, collective study, and solidarity they experienced. The conversation continues with a deep and wide-ranging discussion about the tactic of encampment, the parallel of police repression and the apartheid state in occupied Palestine, the left’s colonial reservations about resistance, the different fronts of decolonial struggle, and the possibilities of solidarity in the heart of empire. Aidan shares brilliant insights and makes really beautiful connections. This solidarity movement is now in a turning point as most encampments have been packed up or evicted and we move into summer, where life on campus slows down. There is much to learn from the experiences that students and faculty had together, and we don’t know yet how the seeds planted in these experiences will sprout in further forms of resistance to genocide, empire, capital, and the police state. Hopefully this conversation will help spark more fires!

CW: mention of violence and sexual assault

Aidan shared two forms of possible support: 

A GoFundMe for Aidan's close friends and family:

https://www.gofundme.com/f/help-my-family-and-i-evacuate-out-of-gaza

A friend’s epoetry site that he’s using to help evacuate his family:

https://mizna.org/product/a-gaza-of-siege-and-genocide/

Please share and send material support!

If you like this show, please share with your friends and rate and follow us wherever you get podcasts. You can also support the project and my writing by subscribing to my patreon patreon.com/thebreakuptheory. If you have any extra cash, you can sign up for $5/month, though nothing there is paywalled. On my patreon, I regularly post both short and long written pieces, along with episodes, and other conversations I’m having. I am so grateful for all of you supporting me and this project!

As always, We have an online submission form at https://form.jotform.com/thebreakuptheory/storiesand a phone line at ‪(917) 426-6548. Please write and call us, to share your break up stories, your questions about ending things, and your hopes for liberation!

This episode was slightly delayed by the amazing work students around the world have been doing in the encampments! In today’s episode, Caroline and Shuli hit the mailbag again to respond to listener’s relationship problems! They talk about three situations: the first deals with breaking up with Christianity, Mormonism in particular, and what spiritual remains we can hold on to. The second is about having a rich girlfriend who isn’t out to her family. And the last is a return to the triad situation from the last agony letters episode. The listener responded with more details and raised a new question about being in a relationship with someone who is just starting to explore their queerness. What do the straights owe us? What do we owe them?

Thank you to everyone who shared their stories. We really love doing these episodes, so please keep writing in. As always, we have an online submission form at https://form.jotform.com/thebreakuptheory/stories and a phone line at ‪(917) 426-6548. Please write and call us, we can’t wait to hear from you!

And finally, you can support the project and Shuli's other work by subscribing at https://www.patreon.com/thebreakuptheory. If you have some extra money, you can sign up for $5/month, though nothing is paywalled. On the patreon, Shuli regularly posts both short and long written pieces, along with episodes and other audio. You can also rate and follow us wherever you get your podcasts, and of courses share with your friends and exes.

And now for your letters!

Content warning: we talk about sexual assault and rape, though not in detail.

On today’s show, I talk with my dear friend Girl Cock about the breaking up of Femboys Against Fascism. We had previously spoken about the group on an episode of The Final Straw Radio in May of 2023. The group was formed to counter anti-migrant rallies taking place in Liverpool. However, the group decided that it was better to end itself than to continue just for the sake of it, allowing the former members to pursue new actions. We use this breakup to get into deeper conversation, including the continuity of fascism into transphobia and assault and groups protecting themselves over listening to victims or holding anyone accountable. We talk about failures of the left, trans separatism and self defense, the use of violence, and the respectability politics marginalized or oppressed people are asked to do. At the end we discuss adult supremacy as well. I think this conversation is provocative and generative. Girl Cock is eloquent and speaks of her own experiences organizing, and she has a keen sense of autonomy and contributes a great deal to our understanding of breaking up. I hope you like it! At the end of the episode, I’ve included two Femboys Against Fascism songs as a treat!

Remember we have set up an online submission form at https://form.jotform.com/thebreakuptheory/stories and a phone line at ‪(917) 426-6548, for you to share your break up stories. We will record regular episodes discussing your situation and sharing our political and personal perspectives. Our first episode got a lot of great feedback, so I’m excited to keep growing this project.

You can support this podcast and my writing at https://www.patreon.com/thebreakuptheory

I really appreciate the support! Also feel free to share and rate and follow us on any podcast platform. 

Welcome to the Breakup Theory Agony Letters. This is our first episode where we respond to listener submissions over phone and through our online form. We talk through four submissions in today’s episode, all dealing with different issues. The first letter deals with a relationship going long distance and poly at the same time. That starts at 3:44. The second call deals with a confusing break up in a triad. You can jump there at 24:00. The third submission asks about breaking up with organizing groups and movements and embracing despair. That starts at 46:45. And a content warning for the final submission, there is mention of stalking and sexual assault and childhood sexual assault. This was a delicate submission, dealing with a classmate who is pushing boundaries and our listener’s attempts to navigate how to feel and be safe. That response begins at 1:04:10.

In all of our discussions, we try to approach each situation through different angles to imagine all the different permutations of response and feeling. We always want to validate our listeners’ feelings and experience foremost, while trying to offer perspectives that might help you in the process of breaking up. We hope the people who submitted their stories find these reflections helpful—and feel free to update us and continue the conversation. I also hope this will be generative for other listeners in their own situations, since these stories touch on conflicts and experiences that many of us share.

We plan for this to be a regular series of our podcast, so please submit your stories! Our phone lines are open at (917) 426-6548, our encrypted submission form is still live at https://form.jotform.com/thebreakuptheory/stories! Can’t wait to hear from you. Now enjoy the show!

As always you can support us and follow us at https://www.patreon.com/thebreakuptheory

You can also rate us and follow us on any podcasting app, and tell your friends.