Explore every episode of the podcast Texas School ”Off the Record” Podcast
| Title | Pub. Date | Duration | |
|---|---|---|---|
| The Relationship Economy: Texas School Off the Record with Lindsay Walden | 07 sept. 2026 | 00:32:24 | |
Luxury as Ease: Newborn Photographer Lindsay Walden on the Relationship Economy Host Cris Duncan interviews award-winning Colleyville, Texas fine art newborn photographer Lindsay Walden about what “luxury” means in her business and how she attracts high-end clients. Walden defines luxury primarily as ease: a high-touch, expensive, stress-free experience where she anticipates and removes parents’ pain points from first contact through delivery, emphasizing trust, empathy, and authentic relationships. She explains how most of her bookings are now referral-based through long-term relationships with past clients and aligned businesses like OBGYNs, birth centers, midwives, and doulas, noting Google inquiries are down while referrals are up as clients become more selective. Walden shares practical ways she nurtures partnerships—regular touchpoints, bringing treats, strategic blogging, and providing headshots or behind-the-scenes imagery—and previews her Texas School 2027 class, “The Luxury Newborn Studio,” covering newborn techniques, client experience, pricing, and marketing.
00:51 Defining Luxury as Ease 02:33 Designing a High Touch Experience 07:18 Referral Circles and Partnerships 09:22 Mapping Pain Points with Empathy 13:24 Relationship Economy Explained 21:54 Practical Referral Relationship Tactics 26:45 Authentic Networking That Fits 30:17 Texas School Class and Wrap Up https://texasschool.org/the-luxury-newborn-studio/
Website: www.lindsaywaldenphotography.com Instagram: https://instagram.com/www.instagram.com/lindsaywaldenphotography
Bio: Lindsay Walden is an award-winning fine art photographer based in Colleyville, Texas, known for her signature newborn imagery and seamless luxury client experience. With over 17 years in the industry and international features including People Magazine and The Wall Street Journal, she blends artistic mastery with a deeply service-driven approach. Lindsay has mentored photographers around the world and specializes in teaching how to elevate both your art and your business to attract high-end clients.
Texas School of Professional Photography: Most photography workshops give you a quick splash of ideas, and then you’re right back in your studio, totally on your own. Texas School is built differently. It’s an entire week where you don't just scratch the surface—you master your craft under one world-class instructor. You're surrounded by a community of creators and entrepreneurs who are all actively building, sharing ideas, and pushing each other to level up. You don’t just leave with new skills; you come home re-energized, with a thriving business and your’e part of true creative family that wants you to win!
With 30+ world-class classes, hands-on learning, and the best gear deals of the year, you’ll sharpen your craft in lighting, posing, business, and more. Stay sharp. Stay inspired. Stay ahead—join us at the 2027 Texas School of Professional Photography for a week of growth, connection, and unforgettable fun! Texas School 2027 is April 25-30, 2027 Learn more at Texasschool.org #learnphotography #txschool #dfwphotography #photographyeducation #texasschool
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| Today is the Day for Growth! The Art of Creating Meaningful Work. Off the Record with Jerry Ghionis | 31 août 2026 | 00:55:04 | |
Jerry Ghionis on Meaningful Photography, AI, Competition & Evoking Emotion | Texas School Off the Record Cris Duncan interviews world-renowned portrait and wedding photographer Jerry Ghionis on Texas School Off the Record. Ghionis reflects on three decades in photography through the digital and AI eras, arguing there will always be a market for meaningful work while modern tools can also make photographers lazy. He breaks success into art, craft, business, and personal development, stressing mindset, confidence, and avoiding comparison. Ghionis describes proactive practice, including monthly personal shoots, and shares an elaborate Dita Von Teese project focused on creating client-centered meaning beyond effects. He explains how image competition drove his growth, led to innovations, and inspired the Icon Awards with strict rules and raw-file vetting. The episode previews his Texas School 2027 keynote on empathy, posing, and techniques for evoking authentic emotion in portraits. Jerry Ghionis is widely regarded as one of the world’s top portrait and wedding photographers. Known for his fusion of vintage glamour and contemporary fashion, Jerry brings soul, drama, and elegance to every frame. With the creativity of a fashion designer and the precision of an architect, he creates visual stories that are both emotionally powerful and technically masterful. He is the most awarded photographer in WPPI history and was the first to earn their Grand Master title. He has been named among the top five wedding photographers in the world by WPPI and among the top ten by American Photo Magazine. He also received the United Nations Leadership Award from the International Photographic Council and was named AIPP Australian Fashion Photographer of the Year. A Nikon Ambassador, Jerry has fronted global campaigns for the D850, Z6, Z8, and Z9 cameras. He was also named by PDN magazine as one of the world’s top photography educators. As an inventor, Jerry created the Ice Light and the Omega Reflector, tools now used by photographers worldwide. Throughout it all, the Jerry Ghionis brand has become synonymous with excellence, innovation, and a deep love for people and for the craft of photography. 00:50 Meet Jerry Ghionis 02:01 Photography in the AI Era 04:32 Tools vs Laziness 06:03 Art Craft Business Mindset 10:38 Confidence and Comparison 17:30 Practice for 1% Gains 19:48 Dita Von Teese Project 22:39 Designing the Ultimate Deliverable 26:57 Why Personal Projects Matter 28:12 Client First Creativity 29:38 Beyond Gear And Effects 31:09 Meaning That Lasts 32:29 Texas School Promo Break 33:13 Impact And Competition 34:19 Why Compete To Grow 37:20 Building The Icon Awards 38:21 Meaningful Album Milestones 41:17 Fear The Sting Then Enter 43:52 Pain Process And Mindset 47:57 Keynote Preview Evoking Emotion 51:33 Maternity Prompt Magic 53:56 Final Invitation And Farewell
Most photography workshops give you a quick splash of ideas, and then you’re right back in your studio, totally on your own. Texas School is built differently. It’s an entire week where you don't just scratch the surface—you master your craft under one world-class instructor. You're surrounded by a community of creators and entrepreneurs who are all actively building, sharing ideas, and pushing each other to level up. You don’t just leave with new skills; you come home re-energized, with a thriving business and a true creative family that wants you to win! With 30+ world-class classes, hands-on learning, and the best gear deals of the year, you’ll sharpen your craft in lighting, posing, business, and more. Stay sharp. Stay inspired. Stay ahead—join us at the 2027 Texas School of Professional Photography for a week of growth, connection, and unforgettable fun! Texas School 2027 is April 25-30, 2027 Learn more at Texasschool.org #learnphotography #txschool #dfwphotography #photographyeducation #texasschool | |||
| Visual Literacy - Erica Manning Shares Her Journey from Mediocre to Masterful | 24 août 2026 | 00:30:38 | |
Storytelling Senior Photography: Awards, Mindset, and Building a Profitable Creative Portrait Business | Erica Manning Host Cris Duncan interviews Ohio-based portrait artist and educator Erica Manning about using creative storytelling imagery to stand out in high school senior photography. Manning shares how she began by pricing cheaply and taking all work, then reassessed her approach after her mother became ill in 2016, discovering the power of storytelling and the need to run a sustainable business. She explains how investing in education, entering print competitions, and seeking judge feedback improved her skills, confidence, and editing, while storytelling tools like lighting, composition, and expression make images more compelling. Manning describes using a senior model team as a talent pool for competition-style composites that function largely as a marketing differentiator, with options as paid add-ons, while still serving traditional clients. She discusses mindset, finding success in the process, avoiding AI in her work, and previews her Texas School 2027 Saturday class on storytelling, senior teams, and business processes.
Erica Manning is an Ohio-based portrait artist and educator. She incorporates creative storytelling imagery into her business to set herself apart and is an industry leader in her genre of High School Senior Photography. Her creative images have garnered many international awards, including IPC Diamond Photographer & 2024 and Platinum 2026, and PPO’s 2024 Photographer of the Year. Her work has been featured in Professional Photographer Magazine
00:00 Welcome and Guest Intro 01:09 Origin Story and Turning Point 03:50 Pricing Mindset and Self Worth 05:09 Competitions and Storytelling Focus 07:26 What Makes an Image Tell a Story 09:21 Practice and Judge Feedback 12:01 Senior Team and Marketing Strategy 16:33 Inclusive Packages and Real World Work 17:38 Mindset Resilience and Loving Process 21:49 Creative Workflow and No AI Approach 25:42 Community and Photography Organizations 28:24 Texas School Class and Closing
Most photography workshops give you a quick splash of ideas, and then you’re right back in your studio, totally on your own. Texas School is built differently. It’s an entire week where you don't just scratch the surface—you master your craft under one world-class instructor. You're surrounded by a community of creators and entrepreneurs who are all actively building, sharing ideas, and pushing each other to level up. You don’t just leave with new skills; you come home re-energized, with a thriving business and a true creative family that wants you to win! With 30+ world-class classes, hands-on learning, and the best gear deals of the year, you’ll sharpen your craft in lighting, posing, business, and more. Stay sharp. Stay inspired. Stay ahead—join us at the 2027 Texas School of Professional Photography for a week of growth, connection, and unforgettable fun! Texas School 2027 is April 25-30, 2027 Learn more at Texasschool.org #learnphotography #txschool #dfwphotography #photographyeducation #texasschool
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| Building Success by Doing What Others Don't with Michael Anthony | 17 août 2026 | 00:27:48 | |
How Michael Anthony Built a Multi-Studio Photography Business with Paid Ads, Systems & AI Host Cris Duncan interviews wedding and portrait photographer Michael Anthony, who has studios in Los Angeles and Dallas and is planning a third in Austin. Anthony explains how COVID forced his wedding-heavy studio to diversify into portraits and commercial work, and why transitioning required new portfolio work, slower session pacing, and systemizing operations with photographers and sales teams. He argues social platforms and SEO are unreliable for growth because they are pay-to-play advertising platforms, and says paid ads with strong sales processes turn growth into a controllable math equation. Anthony outlines reinvesting early revenue into marketing, scaling ad spend over time, and notes his studio now spends about $20,000/month to book roughly 50 sessions per week across two studios. He also discusses using AI to speed up marketing tasks and promotes his Elevate education and mentoring programs. Michael Anthony is a working wedding and portrait photographer with studios in Dallas-Fort Worth and Los Angeles. He has spent more than 15 years behind the camera, photographed weddings in nine countries, built a multi-seven-figure a year photography company, and earned a PPA Master of Photography degree with more than 200 international print awards. He teaches the same lighting, posing, business, and marketing systems he uses in his studios today, with a direct, practical approach focused on stronger images and a more profitable business. https://www.michaelanthonyphotography.com https://www.instagram.com/michaelanthonyphotography
00:00 Welcome And Guest Intro 01:12 Early Career Reflections 01:58 Expanding Studios Post COVID 04:21 Switching From Weddings To Portraits 05:57 Why Social Alone Fails 08:40 Funnels Leads And Sales 12:23 Paid Ads Versus Organic Balance 14:02 Reinvesting First Profits 17:06 Scaling Volume With A Team 19:23 Mentoring And Staying Current 22:53 AI As A Business Tool 25:53 Elevate And Texas School Details https://texasschool.org/wedding-photography-better-images-better-systems-better-profit/ Texas School is the country's largest hands-on education event. ! With 30+ world-class classes, hands-on learning, and the best gear deals of the year, you’ll sharpen your craft in lighting, posing, business, and more. Stay sharp. Stay inspired. Stay ahead—join us at the 2027 Texas School of Professional Photography for a week of growth, connection, and unforgettable fun! Texas School 2027 is April 25-30, 2027 Learn more at Texasschool.org #learnphotography #txschool #dfwphotography #photographyeducation #texasschool | |||
| Building a Business Ecosystem: Sharon Benton on Santa’s Enchanted Workshop, Disney-Inspired Design & Oliver Pippin | 10 août 2026 | 00:40:35 | |
Building a Business Ecosystem: Sharon Benton on Santa’s Enchanted Workshop, Disney-Inspired Design & Oliver Pippin Host Cris Duncan interviews Sharon Benton, who with her husband Scott has run a family photography business for 21 years and created Santa’s Enchanted Workshop, a private commissioned Christmas experience in Northern California now in its 10th season. Sharon explains her hobby of studying memorable businesses like Disney, In-N-Out, and a premium local shop to understand why customers return, and how she applies those lessons to build an “ecosystem” where every detail—messaging, phone greeting, website, scents, sounds, and Santa’s script—supports the experience and the art. She shares insights from Disney World’s “bubble,” a bakery whose purposeful branding inspired a new add-on product, and new ecosystem expansions including the character-and-book gift Oliver Pippin and a legacy paver project.
For more than 21 years, Scot and Sharon Benton have built a photography business centered on creating meaningful experiences for families. They are also the founders of Santa’s Enchanted Workshop, a private, commissioned Christmas experience in Northern California celebrating its 10th season, where an hour with Santa is transformed into timeless commissioned artwork.
Together, they blend storytelling, craftsmanship, and thoughtful design to create experiences where every detail has purpose and every family feels genuinely welcomed.
As partners in marriage and partners in business, Scot and Sharon have discovered that their greatest strength isn’t thinking alike—it’s thinking differently. Sharon dreams it. Scot builds it. Together, their different strengths have allowed them to create something neither could have built alone. Sharon previews her Texas School class on April 24, 2027, and directs viewers to santasenchantedworkshop.com.
00:00 Welcome and Guest Intro 01:13 Studying Great Businesses 05:20 Disney Bubble Lessons 11:47 Building an Ecosystem 18:02 Ecosystem in Practice 20:46 New Ideas for Season 10 21:20 Oliver Pippin Story 25:47 Beyond the Camera Box 27:49 Gold Dust Inspiration 30:00 What If Mindset 30:46 Legacy Pavers Project 33:35 Why Christmas Memories Matter 36:45 Texas School Class Preview 38:32 Where to Follow and Closing https://texasschool.org/santas-enchanted-workshop/ Texas School is the country's largest hands-on education event. ! With 30+ world-class classes, hands-on learning, and the best gear deals of the year, you’ll sharpen your craft in lighting, posing, business, and more. Stay sharp. Stay inspired. Stay ahead—join us at the 2027 Texas School of Professional Photography for a week of growth, connection, and unforgettable fun! Texas School 2027 is April 25-30, 2027 Learn more at Texasschool.org #learnphotography #txschool #dfwphotography #photographyeducation #texasschool Follow Texas School Instagram.com/txschool | |||
| Clone Yourself with Automation and Workflows. Texas School "Off the Record" with Jeff Poole | 03 août 2026 | 00:28:37 | |
Photography Studio Automation: Booking Links, Transactional Emails & Long-Term Nurture Sequences (with Jeff Poole) In this episode, Cris Duncan interviews Jeff Poole of Indigo Silver about putting a photography studio “on autopilot” with scheduling and lead automations. Jeff explains why giving prospects self-scheduling links improves booking, and recommends choosing an automation-capable platform like Go HighLevel while keeping invoices/contracts in tools like Tave for long-term data. He outlines a two-part email strategy: short plain-text “transactional” follow-ups that feel personal and land in inboxes, plus a genre-specific, value-driven nurture sequence with graphics that addresses objections over time. Jeff shares a suggested cadence (initial email within minutes, follow-ups over a week, then “close the loop”), using only transactional SMS, and tapering nurture frequency from weekly to monthly. He discusses list hygiene for deliverability, keeping emails focused, using AI to draft sequences, avoiding seasonal offers, and notes a HighLevel snapshot product and where to find his work and Texas School class details. Jeff and his wife, Lori, operate Indigosilver Studio located in Wilmington, NC, specializing in boutique boudoir portraiture, Headshots, and luxury wedding photography. Their passion for capturing timeless moments extends beyond their studio through Photo Insight, their dedicated educational platform for photographers. With over 15 years of experience in wedding and portrait photography, Jeff understands one fundamental truth—the industry is constantly evolving. Success isn’t just about taking great photos; it’s about adapting to change. Through the power of digital marketing, Jeff and Lori have consistently grown their business year after year, regardless of economic shifts. instagram.com/myphotoinsight myphotoinsight.com 00:37 Why Scheduling Automation Matters 03:13 Choosing an Automation Platform 04:52 Plain Text Transactional Emails 08:30 Personalization by Genre 13:30 Timing and SMS Follow Ups 16:12 Long Term Nurture Sequences 18:38 List Hygiene and Unsubscribes 20:51 Keep Emails Short and Focused 22:50 Set and Forget Best Practices 25:44 Templates and Where to Find Jeff 27:19 Texas School Class Promo Wrap Up Texas School is the country's largest and best hands-on education event. ! With 30+ world-class classes, hands-on learning, amazing social engagement and the best gear deals of the year, you’ll sharpen your craft in lighting, posing, business, and more. Stay sharp. Stay inspired. Stay ahead—join us at the 2027 Texas School of Professional Photography for a week of growth, connection, and unforgettable fun! Texas School 2027 is April 25-30, 2027 Learn more at Texasschool.org #learnphotography #txschool #dfwphotography #photographyeducation #texasschool | |||
| Practice, Patience and Persistence. Texas School "Off the Record" with Michelle VanTine. | 30 juil. 2026 | 00:33:25 | |
From Weddings to Major Brands: Michelle VanTine on Commercial Photography, High-End Retouching & AI Compositing . Consider listening and watching on YouTube for full visual experience. https://youtu.be/47xPN0HQXJA Texas School director Cris Duncan interviews Miami-based commercial photographer and retoucher Michelle VanTine, a 2026 Saturday Texas School instructor, about her path from fine arts and teaching into full-time photography starting in 2008. Michelle describes building a wedding business with a distinctive creative style, then rebuilding after moving to South Florida by taking varied jobs, second-shooting, and discovering product photography through an early Creole Essence shoot. She explains how commercial work is highly competitive and success came through incremental credibility rather than a single “big break,” noting that social media attention didn’t directly translate to jobs. Michelle shares retouching work such as replacing Pacifico beer cans shot in Mexico, and details a Kai Trump energy drink campaign where she used AI-generated elements, compositing, and hand-painted color bounce to create a movie-theater-themed scene that was cut from the budget, then leveraged it for portfolio and marketing. Michelle VanTine is a commercial photographer specializing in consumer-packaged goods (CPG) and sports. She also works as a professional retoucher for national advertising campaigns including brands such as Coors Light, Miller High Life, and Pacifico. Her commercial client roster includes products found on shelves at ULTA Beauty, Sephora, Target, and Whole Foods Market. She works across sports and product photography and has photographed multiple Olympic and professional athletes. She served as Senior Staff Writer for Fstoppers, where she covered gear reviews and creative processes. Texas School is the country's largest hands-on education event. ! With 30+ world-class classes, hands-on learning, and the best gear deals of the year, you’ll sharpen your craft in lighting, posing, business, and more. Stay sharp. Stay inspired. Stay ahead—join us at the 2026 Texas School of Professional Photography for a week of growth, connection, and unforgettable fun! Texas School 2027 is April 25-30, 2027 Learn more at Texasschool.org #learnphotography #txschool #dfwphotography #photographyeducation #texasschool #kaitrump 00:00 Meet Michelle Van Tine 01:20 From Painting to Film 03:40 Wedding Hustle Years 07:14 Breaking Into Commercial 11:26 No Big Break Myth 13:02 Kai Trump Campaign 16:48 AI Movie Theater Composite 20:47 Practice to Stay Sharp 26:16 Portfolio and Marketing Play 31:18 Where to Follow Michelle 32:05 Wrap Up and Texas School | |||
| A Life of Connections through Photography. Tony Corbell and Texas School | 30 juil. 2026 | 00:35:26 | |
On this episode of "off the Record", we visit with Tony Corbel. Tony has been a household name within the photographic industry for almost 5 decades and has the record for attending the most Texas School events--As a student, volunteer and instructor. Sit down and enjoy the conversation between Cris and Tony as they discuss the changes to the industry, what hasn't changed, what it takes to survive and what is next. With 30+ world-class classes, hands-on learning, and the best gear deals of the year, you’ll sharpen your craft in lighting, posing, business, and more. Stay sharp. Stay inspired. Stay ahead—join us at Texas School of Professional Photography for a week of growth, connection, and unforgettable fun! Learn more at Texasschool.org #learnphotography #txschool #dfwphotography #photographyeducation #texasschool | |||
| From Hobbyist to Multi-Six-Figure Studio: Allison Russell’s Journey | 30 juil. 2026 | 00:20:37 | |
Photographer Allison Russell of Twisted Wire Design shares her 15-year journey from hobbyist to multi-six-figure studio owner. She discusses in-person training at Texas School, the importance of intensive education, balancing family and work, improving craft through competitions, and planning for a sustainable, sellable business. Allison emphasizes the value of hands-on learning, strategic instructor selection, and the hustle required to replace corporate income—plus tips for photographers at different stages of growth. Learn where to find her work and how Texas School helped shape her career. Allison Russell is a full time photographer and understands the challenges of running a successful studio. She has operated her boutique studio in rural South Dakota for 15 years, as the sole income provider for herself and her three children. She is passionate about having a financially sustainable business and helping other photographers to experience the same success. Her accomplishments include degrees (Certified Professional Photographer, Master Photographer, Craftsman Photographer), awards (Gold, Silver, & Bronze Photographer through IPC), and her images have been selected for the Loan Collection images in International Print Competition. She specializes in family and children photography, rounding out her business with commercial, senior, and sports portraits. Learn more about Texas School at texasschool.org | |||
| PPA’s New CEO on AI, Community, and the Future of Photography | 30 juil. 2026 | 00:24:12 | |
In this episode, Cris Duncan interviews Angela Kurkian, the new CEO of Professional Photographers of America, about the state of the industry, the rise of AI, and the enduring value of human creativity. They discuss education, community, storytelling, and practical ways photographers can adapt and thrive. Angela shares PPA initiatives like Photo Vision and Imaging USA, stresses collaboration and valuing your time, and offers encouragement for photographers navigating disruption while preserving authenticity and connection. As the first female CEO of Professional Photographers of America (PPA), Angela Kurkian leads the organization with a strong “members first” philosophy, guiding its strategy, growth, and operations. Founded more than 158 years ago, PPA exists to support the photography profession and empower photographers to thrive as both artists and entrepreneurs. Angela joined PPA in 2012 as Director of Education after successfully operating a wedding and portrait photography studio in Cincinnati for 25 years. A passionate educator and industry advocate, she has spent more than two decades teaching and mentoring photographers across the country. One of her most impactful contributions at PPA has been the development and expansion of the organization’s photography and business education platform, now known as PhotoVision on PPA.com. Angela is a Certified Professional Photographer (CPP) and holds both the Master of Photography and Photographic Craftsman degrees from Professional Photographers of America. Under her leadership, she remains committed to helping photographers build sustainable businesses, strengthen their creative skills, and elevate the value of professional photography. Texas School is the country's largest hands-on education event. ! With 30+ world-class classes, hands-on learning, and the best gear deals of the year, you’ll sharpen your craft in lighting, posing, business, and more. Stay sharp. Stay inspired. Stay ahead—join us at the 2027 Texas School of Professional Photography for a week of growth, connection, and unforgettable fun! Texas School 2027 is April 25-30 Learn more at Texasschool.org #learnphotography #txschool #dfwphotography #photographyeducation #texasschool | |||
| Thoughts into Stories into Images. Texas School "Off the Record" with Corey McDonald | 30 juil. 2026 | 00:27:04 | |
BEST viewed as a video podcast, watch on Youtube at https://youtu.be/-Jn4GA8ATCM One day Corey McDonald was mowing his lawn and began crafting a story full of complex characters, a storyline of good and evil, of kings and kingdoms and of conflict and resolution. That day, all he had was a vision in his mind's eye. Fast forward a few years, with photographic skills, wizardry in Photoshop and some help with Ai tools, Corey has been able to bring these characters to life and in this conversation, he shares the process and the story of his characters with you. Photographer and artist Corey McDonald discusses his award-winning career, his specialty in seniors and wildlife, and a lifelong fantasy world he began writing in 2010. He explains how he uses AI to generate character faces, then combines photography, Photoshop and digital painting to bring those characters and scenes to life. Corey McDonald is a Master Photographer, Master Artist, Photographic Craftsman, Certified Professional Photographer, and Accredited Professional of Animal Imagery, dividing time between Alabama and Dallas, Texas. Corey is also a 2026 Best of Nation recipient and a medalist in World Photographic Cup. https://www.macwildlifeart.com https://www.coreymcdonaldphotography.com Instagram: https://instagram.com/macstudioteaching Texas School is the country's largest hands-on education event. ! With 30+ world-class classes, hands-on learning, and the best gear deals of the year, you’ll sharpen your craft in lighting, posing, business, and more. Stay sharp. Stay inspired. Stay ahead—join us at the 2027 Texas School of Professional Photography for a week of growth, connection, and unforgettable fun! Texas School 2027 April 25-30, 2027 with an optional Saturday Class on April 24th. Learn more at Texasschool.org #learnphotography #txschool #dfwphotography #photographyeducation #texasschool #descript | |||