Explore every episode of the podcast People vs Algorithms
| Title | Pub. Date | Duration | |
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| Hyperpunditry | 18 avr. 2025 | 01:09:56 | |
This week we dig into the spread of hyperpunditry and why the Information Space rewards those who confidently switch lanes with abandon. Plus: AI’s bottoms-up adoption curve, Anonymous Banker on golf media’s strength and the crazy life of sea turtles.
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| Loro Piana Populism | 11 avr. 2025 | 01:14:49 | |
The tariff wars kicked off and confirmed that we are in a post-expertise era where your bona fides matter less than your confidence. Plus: celebrating GDPR’s impending demise. what to do with Vanity Fair, and Shopify’s AI manifesto.
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| Media, narratives, markets with Nick Denton | 04 avr. 2025 | 01:17:51 | |
Gawker Media founder Nick Denton joins the show to discuss how narratives and memes run the world, and why it’s better to trade on them than run the old media playbook of the attention economy.
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| The Taste Premium | 28 mars 2025 | 00:57:35 | |
We dig into the idea of taste—how it’s formed, how it signals identity, and where it fits in media and business today. We also unpack how taste once defined media gatekeepers, how it’s now being democratized (or commodified), and why developing taste is less about money and more about intentionality. We are then joined by sociologist and brand strategist Ana Andjelic to debate the merits of European taste vs American taste. Plus: Anonymous Banker has a cameo on how to get a “taste premium” in M&A.
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| The Abundance Agenda | 21 mars 2025 | 01:12:51 | |
The media industry, like politics, has been stuck in a scarcity mindset—managing decline instead of building for the future. In this episode, we dig into The Abundance Agenda, the new book by Ezra Klein and Derek Thompson, and explore what a pro-growth strategy could look like for media. Plus, TheSkimm exits to Ziff Davis, the rise of AI-driven advertising, and Anonymous Banker joins to explain why second-tier comedians might be the next big media arbitrage opportunity.
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| Oral Exams | 14 mars 2025 | 01:03:19 | |
AI is giving rise to vibe coding while old conventions fall away. Thinking on your feet is now more important than rehearsed, polished presentation, which soon can be done with the push of a button. It’s time to find your inner Rick Rubin. Plus: How to build an enterprise brand. Show Notes: ----------------------------------------
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| Getting Chegged | 07 mars 2025 | 01:11:29 | |
Online education company Chegg is suing Google for AI Overviews and might become the first major company felled by AI. We go over the hitlist of others at risk of getting Chegged, including SEO-dependent publishers, SaaS companies and even the email newsletter industrial complex. Plus: Why Lenny Rachitsky has succeeded, the case against all-inclusive resorts and a debate on whether reading is dying or just in a format transition.
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| Arbitrage Media | 28 févr. 2025 | 00:44:14 | |
Troy’s at “advanced” tennis camp, so Brian and Alex discuss the shifting dynamics of the newsletter and video game markets. Newsletters are entering into bubble territory, while parts of the video game market are losing ground after a long run of robust growth. Plus: an urban redevelopment good product.
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| Messy Media | 21 févr. 2025 | 01:24:51 | |
Media has never been neat, but it’s getting messier. This week, Brian and Troy explore how AI is reshaping the creative process, how different personality-driven brands thrive on particular platforms, and the developing messy aesthetic of modern media that’s spreading to earnings calls and product launches. Troy shares how OpenAI’s Projects feature changed his workflow, turning AI into a true research assistant. Anonymous Banker joins to break down AI’s irrational valuations and why X’s debt selling on par means Elon’s won. We also debate whether Substack will inevitably embrace advertising and how creators are navigating capital investments. Plus: a yacht rock documentary and Masa biography as dual good products.
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| The Great Realignment | 14 févr. 2025 | 01:05:01 | |
This week, we examine the great realignment as tech and government unite to assert US tech dominance over ideas of digital sovereignty. Meanwhile, BuzzFeed plans its own social platform, despite toothpaste rarely going back into the tube. Plus: assessing OpenAI’s grandiose Super Bowl ad.
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| Does AI need an iPhone moment? | 07 févr. 2025 | 01:08:29 | |
This week, on the heels of OpenAI releasing Deep Research, we assess whether AI has caught on with regular people beyond kicking the tires on ChatGPT. Maybe the AI Super Bowl ads will make it more appealing. Plus: the memeification and financialization of everything, volatility as the norm, X shows signs of a financial turnaround and alarm clocks with apps and a subscription program.
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| Decentralized Work | 31 janv. 2025 | 01:12:38 | |
The nature of work and careers is undergoing profound changes that are often obscured by debates over return-to-work mandates. This week we consider the rise of decentralized work that’s networked and elevates autonomy over outdated command and control approaches developed in a different century. Plus: a celebration of Data Privacy Day and Deepseek’s cannonball into the Big Tech AI pool party.
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| Tech Oligarchy | 24 janv. 2025 | 01:03:14 | |
Our tech overlords reported for duty to Washington while Troy perused the powder at Davos. This week, we go beyond first principles to consider the second-order impact of a politicized tech elite. Plus: The Washington Post gets a BHAG and CNN plots a post-TV future.
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| The Gospel of Productivity | 17 janv. 2025 | 01:07:33 | |
Economic growth requires labor productivity. We all aspire, in our own ways, to be productive, if only because our productivity is directly tied to our rewards. Yet American labor productivity has stagnated since the first decade of the internet coming to business. AI is now held out as the latest savior to productivity. Modern productivity culture is an outgrowth of optimization obsession. We can measure more than ever, so we gravitate to squeezing out incremental gains and sometimes lose sight of the direction we want to go. We chase productivity growth hacks like the Pomodoro Method and lean on apps like Notion. The quest for productivity has become a secular religion. This week, we discuss why we are constantly searching for productivity, our own approaches to productivity, why AI isn’t the silver bullet, and why what we really need is better prioritization.
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| Zuckerberg’s Capitulation, Rabbit Holes and the War on Attention | 10 janv. 2025 | 01:03:42 | |
This week, we discuss Mark Zuckerberg’s craven capitulation on content moderation, even if it was an inevitable decision; the upside of algorithmic rabbit holes vs the downside of the commodification of attention; and how creator culture is reshaping trust in media institutions. Plus: why the Ninja Creami and IVs are good products.
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| The Information Space in 2025 | 03 janv. 2025 | 00:55:47 | |
This week, we discuss the outlook in 2025 for legacy media (not great), alternative media (much better), chat as a new media mode, X emerging as a critical power center, and culture wars morphing into class wars.
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| The End of Artifice | 20 déc. 2024 | 01:11:24 | |
Podcasting challenges late nite, lying in media, shopping as content, super consumers and Alex rediscovers America at Disney.
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| The New American Power Center | 13 déc. 2024 | 01:08:27 | |
Tech has swallowed media, and is increasingly swallowing other industries and accruing power along the way. Plus: why adding a chatbot won’t save the article page, the real message of the big ad holding company merger, and an introduction to the new PvA companion product.
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| Poly News | 06 déc. 2024 | 01:09:09 | |
Prediction market + news; media’s bifurcating star system; media’s management-labor divide; AI + browsers; car talk; LinkedIn cringe
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| Age of Spectacle | 29 nov. 2024 | 01:08:53 | |
This week: The internet comes to life as spectacle, Elon proclaims you are the media, why publishers need to get to the transactional level, and an assessment of a new MAGA cultural aesthetic.
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| Neutering Google | 22 nov. 2024 | 00:51:19 | |
This week on People vs. Algorithms, we unpacked London’s charm, the shifting dynamics of media and search, and why Google’s dominance feels both indispensable and fragile. Troy and I contrasted American and British publishing cultures—bigger isn’t always better, as UK publishers adapt to constraints with scrappy innovation. Search’s transformation, fueled by AI and shifts in Google’s strategy, dominated our discussion. While it offers consumers better tools, publishers are left scrambling, questioning their survival amid frictionless AI-driven content.
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| The Art of Modern Persuasion & The Manosphere | 15 nov. 2024 | 01:00:18 | |
The election in many ways confirmed what many had suspected: the information space has superceded and subsumed the traditional media world. Traditional media is now just one node, and perhaps more alarmingly its influence – and ability to persuade – has drastically declined. We talk in this episode about the implications of this shift, particularly with the spotlight now on what’s being called the manosphere, a chaotic loose confederation of podcasters and YouTubers who have seemingly broken through to be a key node of persuasion for young men. Plus: Is CNN fixable?
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| Winners and Losers | 08 nov. 2024 | 01:08:44 | |
We run through the implications of the return of Donald Trump to the presidency after an election that saw the mainstream news media making way for new power brokers in unusual guises. The podcast election proved to be real – and a harbinger of changes to come as the Information Space subsumes the Fourth Estate.
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| Complex’s Next Chapter | 01 nov. 2024 | 01:22:44 | |
Complex is a digital media survivor. It has lived many lives, including as a magazine, a dot-com, an ad network, Go90 (RIP) provider, YouTube showrunner, events organizer, hot sauce merchant, neglected BuzzFeed brand, and now in its latest iteration as a commerce engine. Complex President Moksha Fitzgibbons joins the show to discuss his return to Complex, where he was an integral part of the founding team going back to its Marc Ecko days, and how the youth culture brand is betting on combining its reach and engagement with the live shopping platform of NTWRK, which bought Complex for $108 million in February. Moksha discusses how the brand plans to focus increasingly on driving commerce and far less on selling advertising. Plus: Brian and Troy discuss the news industry’s current meltdown at the prospect of Donald Trump returning to the White House.
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| The New Media Consensus | 25 oct. 2024 | 00:53:37 | |
There’s a new consensus about the media business that is emerging. The past is not coming back, that much is for certain. The challenges are well known, and the bright spots — and they exist — tend to be smaller and harder to scale.
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| The End of Text | 18 oct. 2024 | 01:10:03 | |
Mass media’s extinction event has come first for text content. Text is increasingly being "pushed down the stack" and commoditized due to AI's ability to generate, manipulate, and reformat text content. This shift is forcing media companies that primarily deal in text to adapt or risk becoming obsolete. While text isn't disappearing entirely, its role is changing. It's becoming more of an input for other forms of media rather than the primary output. Meanwhile, other parts of media are gaining in influence. This will turn out to be the podcast election, as Kamala Harris prepares to make her closing case to… Joe Rogan while continuing to snub mass media like Time and the New York Times. We also discuss the power of Fortnite, which points to a future of media where content is a means to an ends. In the case of Fortnite, that ends is a combination of a place to hang out, a hub for commercial events like virtual concerts, a competitive environment premised on participation rather than inert consumption, and a communication medium. Plus: Bill Gates is apparently a good product.
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| Bad Bets | 11 oct. 2024 | 01:06:04 | |
This week, we take a look at making bets that go wrong, and how it’s often difficult to tell if a bet is a bad one in the short term. Was Meta’s bet on VR a bad bet? Maybe in the short term, but perhaps not in the long term. Media companies have made their fair share of bad bets over the years, although there weren’t many options available. Will the parade of AI deals join the pile of bad bets? Plus… Good Product with a VERY special guest Steve Katelman.
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| Above-the-Line Media | 04 oct. 2024 | 00:51:29 | |
This week, we discuss a new framework for the media industry that separates content into two distinct categories: "above the line" and "below the line" media. The line in question represents the threshold of human uniqueness in content creation. Above it lies the territory where human creativity, insight, and expertise still reign supreme. Below it, we find the realm increasingly dominated by AI-driven processes and automation. Plus: Taylor Lorenz and the question of whether packaged media can retain talent; AI dwindling the value of curation; synthetic social networks; and praise for bullshitters.
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| Productive Tension | 27 sept. 2024 | 01:11:16 | |
The heart of organizations is tension, which when productive can lead to great outcomes. If it goes to extremes, disaster. This week, we discuss tension at OpenAI between its non-profit mission and massive ambitions, the tensions of hacking attention to sell products, the Trump tension between the truth and making a valid a point, and the tension between tech changing consumer expectations and media business models. Episode links:
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| Parasitic Ad Tech | 20 sept. 2024 | 01:08:37 | |
We discuss the Department of Justice’s antitrust case against Google as a classic case of fighting the last war. And even if Google’s monopoly is dismantled, history shows to be careful of what you wish for because what comes next could be worse. Plus: Airmail’s weird business, the struggles at Food52 and why chicken parm is a great American product.
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| 100th Episode with Emily Sundberg | 13 sept. 2024 | 01:13:44 | |
This week we’re joined by Emily Sundberg and celebrate our 100th episode, talking about classic topics like X vs Threads and is Silence the best product.
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| Founder Mode | 05 sept. 2024 | 01:00:07 | |
Founders can force change that managers (call them operators) can’t, at least as efficiently. Plus: AI land grab update, Gannett’s commerce play goes away, and the Sicilian tonnara and summer books.
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| The Recalibration to Normal | 22 août 2024 | 01:03:16 | |
This is shaping up to be a TikTok election where relatability is at a premium. The successful rollout of the Harris-Walz ticket is moving authenticity from loudly telling the truths others dare not to something softer and more familiar. Plus: the recalibration of remote work, AI backlash and the difficulty of deciding level of spending on content as the weight of many publisher models shifts to indirect monetization paths.
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| The Olympics and the Future of TV | 15 août 2024 | 00:43:23 | |
This week, we discuss conversations vs interviews, why social networking has been replaced by algorithmic content, YouTube’s pivotal role in the emerging media space, and why the Olympics were a great media product.
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| Monopolies and Memes | 08 août 2024 | 01:02:10 | |
A federal judge has ruled Google a monopoly for locking up distribution with Apple. We discuss the percent and likely impact. Also, memes as the media format of the moment, as they become how big events like the Olympics and presidential election become participatory. Meanwhile, YouTube is becoming modern TV.
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| The Future of Search | 01 août 2024 | 00:48:00 | |
OpenAI is readying a new search engine, Meta is pushing further into search with Llama, Perplexity is cutting deals with publishers. This week, we look to what the future of search looks like. Plus: why Nike ended up in Wall Street’s doghouse, why Tucker Carlson is a podcast star, and why Pulp Fiction still works.
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| The Dark Side of Performance | 25 juil. 2024 | 01:11:59 | |
This week, we’re joined by Joe Marchese, operating and build partner at Human Ventures and veteran media exec. We discuss why the obsession with performance marketing has created incentives for many intermediaries to focus on giving the appearance of being responsible for a sale rather than actually contributing to the sale, and how that’s led to short-term approaches that skips the basics of building lasting brands. Plus: What the meting of Kamala Harris says about the direction of news and political campaigns, why Netflix points to a shrinking TV ad market and the perils of operating content and commerce businesses as part of one company.
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| The Network is the Media | 18 juil. 2024 | 01:10:04 | |
The assassination attempt on Donald Trump was a stress test for the Information Space, and a reminder of just how much the media has changed. You had mainstream news outlets jockeying with individuals holding forth with a collection of expertise, conspiracies, jokes, memes and partisan potshots. Some of it was informative, some of it was hilarious, some of it was infuriating, and much of it was… entertaining? We unpack yet another crazy plot twist and look forward to what it means as the media business girds for what looks very likely to be a return to power of Donald Trump and an ascendent political movement that’s to a large degree successfully vanquished the packaged news media.
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| Rules of The Information Space | 11 juil. 2024 | 01:00:02 | |
The tidal wave of crap is a reality in the Information Space. This week, we discuss the rules of winning in the Information Space, including why it helps to get into fights, present as authoritative and authentic, and above all else to be willing to be shameless.
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| "Embrace The Chaos" | 04 juil. 2024 | 00:51:10 | |
In this July 4th episode, Alex, Brian and Troy chat about whether life will ever get back to 'normal,' Threads vs. X, gamer saints and AI dogs.
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| Banana In the Smoothie | 27 juin 2024 | 00:49:22 | |
Troy and Brian discuss the realist mood in Cannes, the key to good brand events, why hotels need a good playlist and Perplexity serving as an AI boogeyman.
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| War on Friction | 13 juin 2024 | 00:58:14 | |
Apple has entered the AI fray with a compelling view of using it to remove friction that gets in the way of people want to get things done. The issue arises for those who create that friction by serving as intermediaries.
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| Compression | 06 juin 2024 | 00:57:42 | |
Technology acts as a compressor. AI is the latest pressure point. This week, we look at compression in software development, marketing and publishing. We then go into the difficult challenge of change management at the Washington Post and The Wall Street Journal.
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| Everyone is Hallucinating | 30 mai 2024 | 00:53:33 | |
In this episode Brian, Troy, and Alex talk about AI hallucinations, and how they mirror human misperceptions. Troy believes the open web and traditional media will still hold value, while Alex thinks AI and platforms like Google and social media will take over. They also touch on the future of ad-supported AI services and SEO, Vivek Ramaswamy’s anti-BuzzFeed campaign and a genius idea about electing presidents.
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| AI Time Machine | 23 mai 2024 | 01:08:41 | |
What do tech and media look like in five years? Plus: Sam Altman as slippery character and AI comes to search and devices.
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| Maybe the AI Hype is Real | 16 mai 2024 | 00:57:25 | |
Brian, Alex, and Troy get into the new AI updates from OpenAI and Google. They unpack how these big changes might shake up industries like media and advertising, and what that means for our daily tech interactions.
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| Transforming Time with Jess Sibley | 09 mai 2024 | 01:05:12 | |
Jess Sibley, CEO of Time, joins Brian and Troy to discuss adapting Time to today’s digital challenges. Jess shares her strategies for navigating algorithm changes and AI, shifting Time’s focus from consumer to business-oriented models, and the implications for digital content and monetization.
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| Can the “Fediverse” Save Us? | 02 mai 2024 | 01:09:10 | |
Brian, Troy, and Alex discuss the commercialization of the internet and the impact of AI on media. They explore big media-tech partnerships, the evolving role of AI in content distribution, and the potential benefits and challenges AI brings to our digital lives.
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| Omnicom's Jonathan Nelson on Agencies & AI | 25 avr. 2024 | 01:14:25 | |
Omnicom digital chief Jonathan Nelson joins the show to discuss why ad agencies, forever under threat, will adapt to AI. We go into Omnicom's purchase of Flywheel Digital, a software company for digital commerce -- a further sign that the next phase of what we used to call the internet will be defined by commerce rather than advertising.
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| Sex, AI and Advertising | 18 avr. 2024 | 01:01:36 | |
In this episode Alex, Brian and Troy dive into topics like how AI is changing advertising, the ways tech meets human needs, and the big shifts society might see because of tech. They chat about everything from AI taking over creative jobs to why we still need a human touch in things like art.
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