Welcome to People in Insurance: Changing the Conversation
Join us as we delve into the dynamic intersection of diversity, culture, and technological innovations within the insurance industry. Listen in as Host, Sarah Myerscough, Chief Ideas Officer at Macaii, sits down to talk with trailblazers, thought leaders, and innovators who are reshaping the very fabric of insurance.
Here, we bring you stories that not only redefine the narrative but also offer a fresh perspective on the evolving landscape of insurance. From ground-breaking initiatives to transformative insights, we’re your trusted guide through the winds of change.
Tune in to People in Insurance, brought to you by Macaii, and stay ahead of the curve in the ever-evolving world of insurance.
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S2 E7: Courting a ‘Corporate Marriage’ With Your Software Vendor – with Andre Symes
Episode 129
Sunday, December 1, 2024 • Duration 38:47
Why is it crucial to curate and maintain a good relationship with your software vendor?
How do you go about selecting the right vendor for your business, and when is the right time to jump ship to a new platform?
Is our industry’s rapid entanglement with AI necessarily fraught with danger, and how can we exploit it to drive efficiency and enhance customer’s buying experience?
As our access to and experimentation with data continues to fuel rapid changes to our industry’s broader infrastructure, it’s high time for many insurers, brokers and MGAs to adopt software to better manage their systems and products. This can feel like a minefield, with an ever-expanding array of Insurtech providers on the market, and with digital transformation projects frequently failing due to miscommunication between customers and software vendors. In this episode, we’re privileged to be speaking with Andre Symes, Group CEO of Genasys Technologies, about how to navigate these risks and curate a collaborative and long-lasting relationship with your chosen software provider. He describes the need for compromise in what will become a ‘corporate marriage’, and also explores the risks and opportunities that AI will present the insurance industry for years to come.
Quote of the Episode
“We need to start appreciating the fact that tomorrow's buyers are not buying insurance in the way that today's buyers are buying insurance… They don't own cars; they don't own homes. They just live in the gig. Unless we start shaping insurance to accommodate that, I think we're going to be disrupted, and we're not going to be disrupted internally. We're going to be disrupted from outside.”
Our industry’s current architecture is contingent on a vision of modern society that is quickly slipping away. With car ownership, house ownership and pet ownership all declining, the next generation of insurance customers will be seeking cover to accommodate for a lifestyle entirely different from that which our industry is currently equipped for. This is accentuated by the advent of new technologies that are certain to radically transform the way we conduct our daily lives; not least self-driving vehicles which already are capable of 0% accident rates. Our industry has always been reluctant to adopt change; but those companies, and indeed sectors which fail to heed the warnings on the horizon are sure to be left in the dust.
Key Takeaways
The technology that will reshape our future has already arrived. For the insurance market to remain sustainable, it must adapt to the advent of AI and incorporate it into our everyday practices. Genasys is already using AI to make its platforms more user-friendly. If its customers, in turn, wish to incorporate AI to enhance their own clients’ purchasing journey, Genasys can facilitate this via an API connection. It is clear that AI and software, more broadly, will be key to building the insurance industry of tomorrow.
However, software should always be an enabler, to allow businesses to function and provide the personal journey that will always remain front-and-centre of what we do as an industry. As such, when beginning a transformation project to adopt a new software for your business, you don’t want to end up stuck with a monolithic platform for the next several years that can’t evolve alongside you. Andre outlines two major steps to take before selecting a software vendor for your business. Firstly, he argues that you must meticulously interrogate the platform’s capability – via demonstrations, proof of concepts, and ideally, access to a digital sandbox. You need an in-depth understanding of what a platform is, and how it can be modified to suit your business’ needs. Secondly, it is also crucial to understand the capital structures of the platform provider. Is it sustainable in the long term – and will they exist for as long as you intend to use the platform?
Selecting a software provider is the first step in what will become, hopefully, a five-to-ten-year long relationship – a ‘corporate marriage’. As such, there must be a culture fit between both businesses before the engagement takes place. Is this vendor a partner willing to have an open conversation about their platform’s capabilities, and how it can (and cannot) be modified to suit your business? Furthermore, when engaging in initial discussions with vendors, you must remember that compromise on both sides will be both inevitable, and key to a sustainable and healthy business partnership.
Best Moments/Key Quotes
“I was at an event recently, and I was listening to a couple of reinsurers talking about the fact that the data that they receive is sometimes 18 months old. If you're working with data that is 18 months old, your modelling is going to be impacted on that. So, what we need to try and do as an industry is get the data to the providers as quickly as possible. Link the platforms up via APIs. Get that data across to the carriers in real time so they can understand what the exposure is, and can understand what the loss ratios are. That way, there’s higher confidence, and with higher confidence comes more capacity.”
“When you sign up for a platform, you're not doing it for a couple of years. You're doing it for hopefully 5 to 10 years. So that organization still needs to be around in ten years’ time. If they can't carry on raising at the valuations that the previous year raised, they're going to be ripe for acquisition in a couple of years.”
“Genasys currently has 30 customers. And every single one of those CEOs of those customers has direct phone access to me. They phone me up if they've got a problem, or if they want to potentially acquire another business [and see] if can we accommodate it. Having personal relationships with your customers is really important, and you can't do that if you have to scale exponentially. You can't have a CEO-to-CEO relationship with 150 customers. And that's what we want to be in the short term.”
‘Any CEO telling you that they've had a perfect implementation history is lying to you.’
“It's effectively a corporate marriage because, you're going to be partners, a vendor and customer, for ten years. If you want that to be a happy relationship, you have to concede on either side and find a middle ground on implementation, pricing area, functionality, et cetera.”
Andre Symes is the Group CEO of Genasys Technologies, which develops bespoke end-to-end software platforms for insurers, MGAs, and brokers. During his thirteen years with the company, Andre has overseen its expansion into the UK and US insurance markets.
Sharon Brown is a Board Advisor to Macaii and Genasys Technologies. She is also a Board Director for the MGAA and CEO of Nutshell Consultancy, which helps business leaders to develop innovative and strategic product distribution. With over 30 years’ experience in the industry across a host of businesses and roles, Sharon is well-equipped to interrogate the major issues and ideas challenging our industry today.
S2 E6: From Finance to Fine Wine: Becky Glover’s Approach to Leadership and Innovation
Episode 128
Sunday, November 17, 2024 • Duration 37:17
In this episode of 'People in Insurance,' host Sarah Myerscough sits down with Becky Glover from Yutree Insurance. Becky shares her unique journey from co-founding Elizabeth Rose Wines to becoming a Financial Director, navigating both the worlds of finance and entrepreneurship.
The conversation delves into her rapid career progression, balancing non-traditional educational paths, and the importance of leveraging social media and personal branding. Becky also offers insights on supporting women in the workplace and the significance of celebrating professional milestones with the same enthusiasm as personal life events.
Quote of the Episode
“You can have it all, but you can't do it all. And neither should we expect people to do it all.”
Key Takeaways
"You can have it all, but you can't do it all." This powerful statement encapsulates Becky's philosophy on work-life balance, especially for women in the workplace. The importance of building robust support systems and delegating tasks both at work and in personal life.
Becky's journey from leaving school at 17 without A-levels to becoming a Finance Director at 29 demonstrates that there are multiple routes to success. Becky advocates for apprenticeships, continuous learning, and proactively seeking opportunities.
Technology and adaptability are crucial for business growth. Drawing from her experience in the tech sector, Becky highlights the importance of embracing technology, particularly in traditional industries like insurance. Becky highlights how technology and AI can improve efficiency, employee satisfaction, and overall business performance.
Key Quotes
“You can have all of that, but you won't do all of it yourself. So, start delegating some bits out, at work, if you get to a senior position, you're not expected to do that senior position at all. and do all of the roles underneath it. So why is it that in the home, we still expect ourselves to do the senior position and do everything underneath it that we used to have time for.”
Macaii S1 E011: Global Perspectives and Innovations in the MGA Market with Mike Keating
Episode 119
Tuesday, July 2, 2024 • Duration 28:54
In this episode of Changing the Conversation, we sit down with Mike Keating, CEO of the Managing General Agents’ Association (MGAA), to explore the dynamic world of MGAs and their evolving role in the global insurance landscape. Mike shares insights into the growth and challenges within the MGA sector, the importance of strategic partnerships, and the exciting innovations driving the market forward. We also delve into the MGAA's rebranding efforts and their annual conference, which highlights the theme "The Power of Partnerships." Additionally, Mike discusses the critical role of the next generation in the industry and the importance of attracting young talent to the world of insurance.
Quotes:
"The MGA community is truly global and continues to grow at a very fast pace, with significant developments in the US, Canada, UK, and Australia." Mike Keating
"We've seen excellent insure tech MGAs launching worldwide. However, the challenge often lies in balancing investment in technology with effective product distribution strategies." Mike Keating
"Never take partnerships for granted. Understanding and aligning the objectives of all stakeholders is critical for success in the MGA ecosystem." Mike Keating
"We have a moral obligation to showcase how exciting and dynamic the insurance industry is. From insuring sports stadiums to Formula One, there are endless opportunities for young professionals." Mike Keating
Resources:
Managing General Agents’ Association (MGAA): www.mgaa.co.uk
Macaii S1 E010: Sustainable Insurance: Balancing Risk, Regulation and Opportunity with Gillie Fairbrother and Michael wrathall
Episode 118
Tuesday, June 25, 2024 • Duration 29:41
What responsibility do small insurance firms have to implement sustainable practices, and encourage their clients to do the same? What initiatives can SMEs put in place to cut down on their carbon footprint without compromising their bottom line? Or is a transition towards sustainable efforts ultimately commercially beneficial?
At Macaii we believe that podcasting is the best way to learn, and this episode of Changing the Conversation is a testament to that endeavour. We are thrilled to be speaking with Gillie Fairbrother and Mike Wrathall in a highly engaging and informative episode covering the importance of embracing sustainable practices as an industry, and the practical steps smaller firms can take to do so. This conversation cuts through the buzzwords and vague broad strokes discussions about a need to create change, highlighting the profound responsibility and the various opportunities that sustainability represents for our industry.
Quote of the Episode
“The insurance industry as a whole has a massive role to play in sustainability. It's an investor. It's one of the biggest investor groups in the world. It's an enabler of business. So, whether you're an oil rig or a new wind farm, you need insurance to get that project off the ground. What the insurance industry chooses to insure is what happens, effectively. So, if the industry moves away from insuring so-called ‘dirty economy’ things over a period of time and moves towards insuring new areas that are breaking ground, it can really enable those new areas, new climate technologies to get off the ground, and it can help phase out the other areas.”
When assessing our sustainable responsibilities as an industry, it is key that we examine not only the direct, first-hand carbon footprint of our own businesses, but also those of our clients. By insuring our clients’ businesses, we are effectively interconnected with their sustainable efforts, or lack thereof. By insuring businesses that deploy or harvest fossil fuels, we enable them and must take some responsibility for the damage they cause to our environment. Equally, this presents an opportunity. If we can encourage our clients to transition towards new practices and green technologies, we can precipitate extensive, sustainable change across an array of businesses, industries and economies.
Macaii S1 E009: Protecting Clients and Preventing Knowledge Loss From the Insurance Marketplace with Donna Robertson
Episode 117
Tuesday, June 11, 2024 • Duration 32:52
Has the Consumer Duty really changed the insurance landscape to protect customers’ best interests? Are any poor practices still slipping through the cracks? What changes can we implement as an industry to maintain a rich ecosystem of knowledge even as people retire?
In this episode of Changing the Conversation, we are thrilled to be speaking with Donna Robertson, Managing Director of Squared Insurance Brokers! She discusses the challenges of balancing personal responsibilities with your career ambitions, and how the industry needs to reformulate its approach to hybrid and remote working solutions. Furthermore, Donna is deeply interested in treating clients fairly. She elucidates her frustrations with the Consumer Duty which, she argues, has failed to institute many practical changes for customers.
Quote of the Episode
“Although there have been the technology advancements, I wouldn't say on a whole that the industry has evolved very much. I think we're still getting caught out by practices that we should have left in the dark ages. I know that the AFC are doing a huge piece on Consumer Duty. Has it actually changed anything in the landscape? I would say probably no, other than not selling GAP insurance anymore. I wouldn't say there's been other changes. The changes that I would like to see are on a more practical level.”
For Donna, beyond the more superficial shifts to our working practices and the transmission of data, generally our industry is little more efficient or accommodating to clients than it was when she began her career 25 years ago. She argues that clients continue to be subjected to unfair treatment via various unsavoury practices (notably in motor fleet and liability insurance) that need to be struck out.
Key Takeaways
A key area of concern highlighted by Donna which Consumer Duty has failed to address pertains to motor fleet insurance. She argues that it is very difficult for clients to switch their cover provider as the holding broker can retain the client’s information for a five-day period before releasing it, and thereby limit their options. This can create very challenging circumstances for business owners. For example, Donan cites an incident from within the last six months when she was approached by a client who had been put on an extension by their existing broker, and the terms of their cover had increased from £100,000 to £400,000. They had only two days to find an alternate solution, and the holding broker refused to release the confirmed claims experience to the client. Thus, the client was unable to get a hold of their own data to pursue alternate cover. Given that they had a fleet of over 100 vehicles, and the business couldn’t function without insurance, the client was forced to accept these terms, a deeply compromising position given the cost-of-living crisis. Insurance brokers should never be adding to the problems of clients, but the current state of motor fleet insurance effectively facilitates, or even encourages this.
Macaii S1 E008: Critical Pillars for Stimulating Innovation with Ed Gaze
Episode 116
Tuesday, June 4, 2024 • Duration 25:20
How will Insurtech continue to reshape the industry in the coming years?
What factors, material and psychological, continue to curtail the insurance market from innovating at a steadier pace?
In this episode of Changing the Conversation, we are thrilled to be speaking with Insurtech trailblazer Ed Gaze! Whilst Insurtech is having a substantial impact on the wider market and facilitating innovation more broadly, many insurance businesses remain steeped in archaic traditional processes. Ed argues that this, along with considerable red tape around gaining capacity and distribution for new ideas, drains momentum from the market’s efforts to innovate. Ed suggests that businesses that wish to do so must assemble diversely minded teams who share a unanimous passion for experimentation and are motivated by the prospect of trying new ideas and alternative approaches.
Quote of the Episode
“I think, generally, we need to get everyone on better data. The better the data, the easier it is to move and change things, and understand what's going on. But the core thing [behind fuelling innovation] is having people [who are] motivated to make change happen and are not motivated to hold back. Sometimes we can be a bit risk averse. Insurers are in the business of risk, but they're also super risk averse. Trying to help them take a bit more measured risk in certain places would be really helpful.”
Ed observes that insurers’ attitude towards risk is somewhat oxymoronic – whilst we work to manage and evaluate the risks of our clients, we are very reluctant to take any risks to assist in this process. He notes that while there is a general need across the industry for greater access to and examination/implementation of data, the primary obstacle curtailing innovation is one of attitude.
Key Takeaways
The insurance industry is steeped in history, and as such, it is underpinned by an array of seemingly cemented processes. The digital revolution poses a significant challenge to this, as other financial services transition to data-first approaches, so too must insurance. Innovation is also often stymied by a reluctance to justify change. Profitable businesses may see no reason to innovate given their present success, and non-profitable businesses may lack the necessary funds to try something new. As such, for innovation to become more firmly cemented, there needs to be motivation within a given business to pursue change.
Macaii S1 E007: The Psychology Behind the Insurance Sector’s Poor Public Perception with Sam White
Episode 115
Tuesday, May 28, 2024 • Duration 46:53
Why does the insurance industry continue to be plagued by a reputation that it is untrustworthy, exploitative and profit centric? What can we do internally and via our communications with the public to reorient this perspective and thereby foster a healthier relationship between customers and insurers?
An array of deep-rooted psychological factors continue to inform negative public attitudes towards insurance. The ramifications of these are multifaceted – active pursuit of a career in the industry is a rarity, hence our current recruitment crisis, and there are generalised misconceptions of what we really do. In this episode of Changing the Conversation, we are very pleased to be speaking with the prolific Sam White: entrepreneur, podcast host, and CEO of Stella Insurance! Sam dispenses her wisdom regarding the need for better communication both within insurance teams internally, and between the industry overall and the general public.
Quote of the Episode
“Everything is about relationships. Everything is about communication. When you have bad relationships with bad communication, it doesn't matter how smart you are, you won't solve problems because you'll be sat in a siloed box, and you won't be able to get engagement from other people. So, that piece around getting people to tap into their emotions and then communicate from a position of emotionality and not rationality [is crucial].”
For Sam, we must identify the emotional crux behind every issue our customers may face. Historically, insurance communications have been characterised by a tendency towards clinical, ‘rational’, thinking, which fails to acknowledge and respond to the real issues at hand. As a people-facing industry, we must embrace the human side of what we do. Thus, in our external engagements with the general public, it is paramount that we recognise when we make mistakes, and the efforts we are implementing to correct them.
Key Takeaways
As a frequent guest on Morning Live and BBC Radio 4, Sam uses this public platform to try and bridge the gap between presiding misperceptions of our industry, and what we really do. She argues that more people need to follow her lead and explain how the industry is responding to public frustrations and demands in universal terms. She notes a defensive tendency on behalf of the industry at large to avoid taking accountability of our failings. Sam suggests that, if we can openly acknowledge the errors we make as an industry, people may be more willing to listen as we strive to address and overstep them.
Macaii S1 E006: How the Insurance Museum Aims to Inspire the Next Generation of Industry Professionals with Howard Benge
Episode 114
Tuesday, May 21, 2024 • Duration 31:00
What is the Insurance Museum and who is it for? Can it help to reconstitute public perceptions of the industry and to educate children and young people about what we really do?
Given the rapidly evolving nature of our industry today, it’s easy to forget that our work rests on the shoulders of a centuries-old legacy rooted in the heart of London. The founders of the Insurance Museum intend to cultivate a renewed interest in this history and heritage amongst both industry professionals and the general public. In today’s episode of Changing the Conversation, we are thrilled to be speaking with Howard Benge, Director of the Insurance Museum, about the project’s creation, its intentions, and long-term ambitions.
Quote of the Episode
“When I first came into this [project], the first thing that that really hit me was how much sandstone, how much history there is. The history and heritage of the insurance sector is so broad and so deep.”
The Insurance Museum was established as a charity in 2020, with the intention of becoming a physical space in London SE3 to tell the global story of insurance from its birthplace. During his research for the project, Howard uncovered an immense array of fascinating material charting the expansion and development of Lloyds and the industry more generally, into what it has ultimately become today. Matching the primarily digital nature of insurance itself in 2024, the museum currently uses digital platforms (linked below) to bring the history of the sector to life.
Key Takeaways
The Insurance Industry aims to be inclusive in its outreach, and be suitable both for insurance professionals and the general public: anyone with an interest in the interest, but particularly children and young people. To this effect many components of its digital presence are targeted towards this demographic, with the intention of unlocking an early interest in the insurance industry. Howard notes that roughly 36% of us have chosen our career by the age of seven. The proportion of those children who would consider insurance as their future profession is slim to none – most likely do not know what insurance is, nor the profound extent to which it underpins the global economy.
Macaii S1 E005: A Horizontal View of Transformational Change with Gary Burke
Episode 113
Tuesday, May 7, 2024 • Duration 31:17
We are very pleased to be speaking with Gary Burke, Founder of Rabbits From Hats, about the distinction between transformation and change, and how businesses can smoothly implement transformation projects. In conversation with Sarah Myerscough, Gary highlights the importance of adopting a ‘horizontal view’ of change if transformation projects are to achieve their intended goals for a given business.
Quote of the Episode
“Companies look at this stuff far too narrowly, far too vertically. They really need to just pause and look sideways, so they get more of a horizontal view. The organization does not exist in a bunch of disparate silos. It's all connected.”
When contemplating transformation projects, Gary postulates, it’s very easy for business leaders to view their organisations in terms of their composite parts, rather than as a cohesive whole. This misperception can lead to disaster; if a given transformation is not considered on a broader, company-wide basis, certain considerations may be left forgotten. As such, throughout the episode, Gary emphasises the need for a ‘horizontal’ view of change which considers how it might affect the business from every conceivable angle.
Key Takeaways
Gary pinpoints two fundamental issues typically encountered when insurance businesses implement transformational change:
A lack of understanding about what transformation will involve
Insufficient capability and expertise to deliver it
For Gary, both of these issues are generally derived from there being no overarching, wholesale, holistic view of the business and its innerworkings. This is further underpinned by a common misconception that ‘change’ and ‘transformation’ are functionally synonymous. Businesses adopt small-to-medium-sized change projects all the time, be it the adoption of a new software or the restructuring of a team. Such projects can impact how the business operates, hopefully to drive efficiencies, but without fundamentally altering it. Conversely, transformation projects impact the business at every conceivable level. As such, to tackle a transformation project with the mindset of a change project can never be successful.
Macaii S1 E004: Can MGAs Succeed When Supported by Fronting Solutions with Paul Jewell
Episode 112
Tuesday, April 30, 2024 • Duration 24:19
What are ‘fronting’ and ‘hybrid fronting’? How do they differ? And what unique opportunities can these solutions afford MGAs and the wider UK insurance market?
In this episode of Changing the Conversation, we are thrilled to be speaking with Paul Jewell, CEO of Bridgehaven Insurance, the first hybrid ‘fronter’ in the UK. At the forefront of this alternative distribution solution’s introduction to the UK market, Paul is well-placed to discuss the disrupting influence of fronting, having already made a sizeable impact across the pond in the US. He elucidates why fronting presents such a powerfully unique and profitable option to MGAs, and its benefits to the wider market.
Quote of the Episode
“Simplistically, [fronting] is just a term for capacity or an insurance solution… An insurance company acts on behalf of somebody else, usually a single, or multiple reinsurers. it’s very common for international companies, [such as] Pepsi Cola, a US-based company who may want an insurance solution in the UK, but they may have their own insurance solution provided by a US company. So, what they do is they have a ‘fronting partner’, a ‘fronter’, in the UK that ‘fronts’ for that business, i.e., issues the insurance policy, and they reinsure back to the US under the master agreement. That’s traditional fronting. It’s most common for multinationals and those types of organisations.”
Fronting is a hugely beneficial market solution, enabling multinationals to streamline their insurance provisions to ensure a continuity of cover across the various markets they operate in. Equally, this presents a big opportunity for those insurers, namely MGAs in the UK, who can provide this solution, as it grants them access to unique capacity derived from alternative markets they wouldn’t otherwise have operated within.
Key Takeaways
Hybrid Fronting slightly differs from the traditional approach outlined above. In contrast to the Pepsi example, in which the fronting company would reinsure 100% back to the US, a hybrid fronter would retain a variable amount of that risk themselves. Thus, through this model, the insurance company issuing the policy retains risk to their balance sheet. Furthermore, the hybrid fronting model is more focused on underwriting profit. Fronting for Pepsi and issuing a policy to reflect their US-based cover is a matter of compliance, as you’re not allowed to issue American policies in the UK. Meanwhile, a hybrid fronter retains some amount of that risk, so premiums and claims stay in the UK with that insurance company. Thus, hybrid fronters can benefit from hugely diversified portfolios, and a focus on profitability through partnership with a broad range of reinsurers.
“Always say to people, businesses are just a group of people hopefully doing the same thing in the same direction to grow that business and to make it more valuable. So, what are you as an individual bringing to the table? So, for young people, it should be amazing for them to go and get some work experience somewhere, doing something interesting for them.”
About the Guest
Becky Glover is the Finance Director at Yutree Insurance, and she is known for her rapid career progression and significant contributions to the finance sector. She left school at 17 to pursue a direct path into finance, completing her AAT and ACCA qualifications through an apprenticeship. By 29, she became a Finance Director, demonstrating her ambition and strategic learning. Becky advocates for diversity in finance, serving on various boards such as AAT and GENCFO, and actively promotes the use of technology in business operations.
Yutree Insurance is a specialist insurance broker and underwriting agency based in the UK. The company provides a range of insurance solutions tailored to the needs of businesses and individuals. They specialise in offering insurance products for commercial enterprises, including liability insurance, property insurance, motor fleet insurance, and professional indemnity insurance.
Yutree also operates as an underwriting agency, designing and distributing insurance products on behalf of insurers. This dual role allows them to offer bespoke insurance solutions tailored to their client's needs.
About the Host
Sarah Myerscough is the Chief Ideas Officer at Macaii, formerly Boston Tullis. She hosts/co-hosts several podcasts and is known for her knack in connecting with people. Sarah excels in bringing out the best for video, podcast, and live events, helping clients showcase the human side of their business.
Sarah is passionate about the evolving dynamics of the insurance industry and enjoys conversing with innovators, trailblazers, and long-term advocates of change.
Mike Keating is the CEO of the Managing General Agents’ Association (MGAA), where he leads efforts to support and promote the MGA sector within the insurance industry. With a career spanning over three decades, Mike has a wealth of experience in insurance, having held senior roles at various prominent organizations. Under his leadership, the MGAA has grown to represent over 230 members, placing billions of pounds into the UK and Irish markets. Mike is passionate about fostering innovation, building strategic partnerships, and advocating for the next generation of insurance professionals.
About the Host
Sarah Myerscough is the Chief Ideas Officer at Macaii, formerly Boston Tullis. She hosts/co-hosts several podcasts and is known for her knack in connecting with people. Sarah excels in bringing out the best for video, podcast, and live events, helping clients showcase the human side of their business.
Sarah is passionate about the evolving dynamics of the insurance industry and enjoys conversing with innovators, trailblazers, and long-term advocates of change.
As an industry, we have the power to nudge the business community in the right direction with regards to sustainability. We can use policy terms to behaviourally transition clients away from outdated practices, ratcheting premiums up and down in response to sustainable endeavours. Yet, whilst we undoubtedly hold significant power in the sustainability conversation as an industry overall, our economy is primarily comprised of small businesses (99%) which may feel somewhat powerless to contribute anything significant beyond compliance with sustainability regulations. The same is true for small insurance firms. Both Gillie and Mike affirm that firstly, it is key to identify what your business’ exposure is, and identify where to play in the sustainability space. Could your business cover a new or growing area, such as climate tech or wind farms? Can you incorporate sustainable efforts into your policies to encourage good behaviours in your clients?
Ultimately, our industry aims to make its clients’ businesses more viable and successful. If we are to encourage sustainable efforts in our clients, it is key to identify and illuminate the demonstrably positive impact of such practices on their bottom line. There will always be a range of client needs with regards to sustainability, with some simply wishing to comply with regulations, and others aiming to positively impact the planet through their work. Wherever our clients fall on that gradient of ambition, articulating the opportunity for their bottom line will always help to push them up that curve. Not only is sustainability ultimately a profitable enterprise. We are now at a stage economically where sustainable practices cannot simply be considered a tick-box ethical business practice exercise. A failure to implement these broadly across insurance and into the businesses we support as an industry will lead to catastrophic economic consequences in the not-too-distant future. As Mike argues, ‘the only real growth story for the economies and businesses of the century is going to be a sustainable one’.
Mike notes that we ultimately need to create a circular, regenerative global economy which forefronts sustainability. This will be highly reliant on digital connection, supplanted by an array of climate technologies that will become increasingly significant in years to come. In 2018, 9.1% of the world’s economy was circular, but in 2023, this had fallen to 7.2%. We cannot afford to go backwards. Ultimately, the insurance industry will bear the brunt when climate disaster strikes. We have a responsibility and a clear business incentive to be ahead of the curve and encourage our clients towards sustainable practices, today.
Best Moments/Key Quotes
“We [Davies Group] are actually rebranding to responsible business. But I'm very much keeping that in the background. Like our pillars don't change. We've always aligned with people, planet, and our purpose which aligns with ESG. But it's still everything we're doing as a business and our commitments aren’t changing. Let’s just get rid of the noise and get on with the work.”
“We have an opportunity as an industry to drive change. But it's hard for businesses to go ahead of regulation. And are we getting the right regulation?”
‘Digital connection is absolutely essential for the move to anything like a circular economy.’
Mike Wrathall is an independent consultant working across sustainability and digital. His background is in digital transformation and sustainability strategy, having previously worked in Monitor Deloitte’s sustainability and climate strategy team.
Sarah Myerscough is the Chief Ideas Officer at Macaii, formerly Boston Tullis. She hosts/co-hosts several podcasts and is known for her knack in connecting with people. Sarah excels in bringing out the best for video, podcast, and live events, helping clients showcase the human side of their business.
Sarah is passionate about the evolving dynamics of the insurance industry and enjoys conversing with innovators, trailblazers, and long-term advocates of change.
Donna suggests that this cynical type of poor broking practice is becoming much less common, but the onus is on the FCA and other broking institutions to intervene and prevent further client mistreatment. Donna empathised deeply with this client and their powerlessness in this predicament. This is exemplary of what previous guest Sam White terms ‘right brain’ thinking. This is an empathy-led, creative approach more typically associated with women, which the industry would hugely benefit from a more active incorporation of. As a people-facing industry, everything we do is reliant on relationships rooted in trust, which Donna’s empathetic approach is more likely to honour than purely analytical, numbers-led ‘left-brain’ thinking.
Yet, due to the industry’s current flexible working infrastructure, it is incredibly difficult for women with children to balance this responsibility with their career ambitions. There are countless tales of women forced to leave their workplace as it failed to offer part time, remote, or flexible working solutions. While the pandemic led some companies to become more accommodating in this respect, there is still much work to be done. This departure of talent constitutes a significant loss of knowledge for the industry.
This is accentuated by the rapidly aging nature of the insurance workforce. As people retire, swathes of knowledge are further detracted from the industry. Donna advocates for new apprenticeship programmes to create a new foundation of insurance knowledge, but argues that the age limit for such schemes should not be capped. What if someone wants to try a new role or industry in their forties or fifties? These schemes would enable us to bring in such people and let their prior experience and expertise facilitate new ideas and alternative decision-making.
Best Moments/Key Quotes
“Just because you've got children, you still have your own career goals that you want to get. And it would blow my mind that I would speak to some women, and they’d say, ‘well, I've had to leave this workplace because they can't offer me part time or flexible working’. And what a loss! What a loss of that knowledge and talent.”
“[Our industry] is built on relationships and you build that trust with your clients. It can be a numbers game, but I do believe it's much wider than that. It's getting to know clients, and know what's going on in their world, to be able to then service them properly.”
“I think a lot of men have the stronger voice, and we [women], think that we don't have an opinion, or we don't have a good enough opinion. But women can sometimes look at it and see a different perspective, and see other things that maybe the other side, the more analytical brain, isn't seeing. So, speak out more often, your thoughts are good, and you might come up with something that nobody else has thought of.”
“If somebody wants to start a new role in their 40s or 50s, they've got transferable skills. So, let's make it easier for businesses and bring them in, especially when we know we’re going to have that loss of talent at the other end.”
Donna Robertson is the Managing Director of Squared Insurance Brokers, which she launched in late 2019. She has 25 years of industry experience, and advocates for greater flexible working accommodations and fairer treatment for clients.
About the Host
Sarah Myerscough is the Chief Ideas Officer at Macaii, formerly Boston Tullis. She hosts/co-hosts several podcasts and is known for her knack in connecting with people. Sarah excels in bringing out the best for video, podcast, and live events, helping clients showcase the human side of their business.
Sarah is passionate about the evolving dynamics of the insurance industry and enjoys conversing with innovators, trailblazers, and long-term advocates of change.
Ed notes that innovation must be underpinned by a passion for new ideas, a motivation to pursue them, and a no-judgement attitude towards mistakes when they happen. Innovation should be allowed to unfold quickly and fluidly, so that lots of new ideas can be tested and embraced or abandoned in quick succession. It’s key, therefore, to get the right people on board in a business, who are all motivated in the same way.
However, Ed highlights that diversity of thought is also crucial with regards to innovation. This can manifest in many different ways – for example, people from different cities or countries may therefore have contrasting life experiences, for example. Alternatively, people who studied radically different subjects at college or university will be equipped with unique skillsets and knowledge. When placed in a team of uniquely minded people, all inspired to innovate, great new ideas and approaches will emerge. Innovation, ultimately, is about applying ideas in new ways that are commercially viable. A diversely minded team will be far more equipped to pursue this end than a room of people who have all vaguely pursued the same path in life.
Ed’s long-term vision for the future of insurance is to make it easier for Insurtechs to innovate and for innovative ideas within corporates to be tested. There are considerable roadblocks to quick experimentation of ideas from capacity and distribution. Ed’s fast-paced approach to innovation is underpinned by a desire to learn more – even if an idea fails, so much can be gleaned from the attempt, hence why innovation in insurance is never wasted effort.
Best Moments/Key Quotes
“Sometimes if you don't give yourself a deadline and you just let things tick along, you just don't get that kind of drive to finish it. When we're all so motivated and pushing and working hard to do it, we then get that passion across to the other people within the insurer that need to approve it.”
“Culture is hugely important. You take a person in one business who's not able to get stuff done, put them in another business – same person, same skills – and they could be super successful because of the culture, because of people being willing to listen to what they've got to say, or being willing to experiment and learn.”
“Innovation is about applying the applying ideas in new ways that are commercially valuable. Innovation isn't necessarily about creativity. It's not about creating something brand new, necessarily. It's about taking things that are right there already, and applying them in a new way. And doing it in such a way that's commercially valuable.”
Ed Gaze is a paragon of Insurtech innovation. Having managed the Lloyd’s Lab for four years, Ed has since become the CEO of Innovative Risk Labs (IRL), a broker which helps to launch new Insurtech MGAs in the UK. He is also the CEO of JustParent, the UK’s first parental leave insurer.
About the Host
Sarah Myerscough is the Chief Ideas Officer at Macaii, formerly Boston Tullis. She hosts/co-hosts several podcasts and is known for her knack in connecting with people. Sarah excels in bringing out the best for video, podcast, and live events, helping clients showcase the human side of their business.
Sarah is passionate about the evolving dynamics of the insurance industry and enjoys conversing with innovators, trailblazers, and long-term advocates of change.
Using the public platform in this way to alter public perceptions of insurance may also facilitate our recruitment efforts. To get future generations engaged with the notion of a possible insurance career, we need to cultivate excitement, thrusting insurance into the mainstream. For example, Sam has partnered with former Married at First Sight cast member Jules’ shapewear brand – every time a customer purchases a Stella Insurance policy, they will receive an item of shapewear. This subtly draws insurance into the mainstream and creates a positive association for Stella and the industry overall. Sam is wary of the insurance industry’s efforts to communicate with the public about what we do. These are typically sallied by an alienating rhetoric only comprehensible to those already in the industry, which has no resonance for the general public.
Sam’s championing of the human side of insurance is not only geared towards our need to alter our public perception. She argues that the mass exodus of top talent from FTSE 100 companies is entirely unsurprising, and attributes it to toxic, dehumanising work environments which fail to recognise the psychological impacts of blame culture and dictatorial hierarchies. For Sam, the culture in corporate insurance environments is scaffolded by a clinical proclivity towards profit above all else, de-sanctifying the psychological safety of team members. Ultimately, people are finding themselves unwilling to continue working in such environments irrespective of how much they might be paid. As an industry we must learn how to foster psychologically safe environments, particularly as the next generation of insurance professionals, who have entirely different expectations regarding wellbeing in the workplace, begin to rise the corporate ladder.
Best Moments/Key Quotes
“I want us [as an industry] to be much more engaged with the public. When the BBC comes to me and asks me for comment, one of the most common things they say is, ‘We couldn't get anyone else to speak’.”
“I think people want to understand what's going on. I think if we can open up that conversation and be a bit more open to the criticism, then we'll do a lot better generally.”
“We do have a big job to do to make insurance a bit more fun, and sexy, and interesting. Despite the fact that it is in so many different areas, it has a really negative association with it. We're not coming together enough as an industry to go, ‘Okay, how do we tackle that?’”
“What I see in these large corporates is over the last couple of years, they've been under massive pressure… People have got to a point where they've gone, ‘I don't care how much you pay me, you cannot pay me enough to go into an environment where my humanity is completely ignored, where I get screamed at by somebody who has no emotional regularity’.”
“When you're under stress and you've got lots of stuff going on, that's when most teams have less contact, less communication. Everybody goes off into their silos. That's the exact opposite of what should be happening. That's the time that you have to double down on spending time together, on understanding each other, on having the hard conversations, because that's where you get to a better space.”
book – about tribal instincts. you have a tribe of people that are like you – and a natural distrust of people that are not like you. hierarchies that are accepted and self-hierarchies that are not.
I Am (2010) – dir. by Tom Shadyac
About the Guest
Sam White is the CEO and founder of Stella Insurance, a financial services business offering insurance products tailored to women's needs. Sam is the co-host of BBC Radio 4’s ‘Toast’, and a regular on BBC One Morning Live, where she shares her insights into the current state of the insurance industry.
Sarah Myerscough is the Chief Ideas Officer at Macaii, formerly Boston Tullis. She hosts/co-hosts several podcasts and is known for her knack in connecting with people. Sarah excels in bringing out the best for video, podcast, and live events, helping clients showcase the human side of their business.
Sarah is passionate about the evolving dynamics of the insurance industry and enjoys conversing with innovators, trailblazers, and long-term advocates of change.
Thus, the museum aims to inspire, educate, and in the long term, support the industry’s recruitment efforts, by making insurance a career that is actively chosen rather than one that it simply fallen into. If we can positively reinforce children or young people’s interest in insurance, we can begin to shift the tides regarding our industry’s ongoing reputational crisis.
To do so, the museum aims to explain the multifaceted nature of our industry through explorations of an interesting angle. Every child in England is taught about the Great Fire of London at the ages of 6/7, thus providing an ideal springboard with which to explore the importance of insurance, and the applications of numerous subjects through it. Howard emphasises that it is key to emphasise how insurance infiltrates everything we do – it is a fundamental, if typically unseen, facet of our daily lives, which is a very exciting prospect for children to consider. Meanwhile, amongst young adults, Howard suggests a need to tap into their interest in inequality and injustice. For example, presenting the industry from the angle of how the big insurers aim to tackle climate change could facilitate engaging discussions which may enlighten young people about a career they hadn’t previously considered or known about.
The museum ultimately intends to cultivate a deep level of engagement in insurance; to make it fun and compelling for young people, and also enriching and informative for older people and insurance professionals seeking to learn more about the history of their industry. It will not be a museum of policies and fire marks, but an inspiring space where stories are told.
Best Moments/Key Quotes
“The reason for the existence of the insurance museum… is to inspire and educate and support the recruitment process; bringing the really young kids to make insurance a career you choose, not one that you fall into.”
“What do we do with insurance today? When we grow up. we all have insurance. In fact, you could even extend that to ‘Insurance underpins our lives. From the moment you're born, you're covered by insurance.’”
“Don't think of it as a collection, but more of a space… that’s all about engaging. A real deep level of engagement, whether that is just having fun, understanding a bit more, spending valuable time, trying to understand other people's opinions. All of that…. It's going to be museum where we're going to tell all the stories: marine, aviation, fire, life insurance. We're going to look at those difficult stories as well… it’s a place where we’re going to celebrate insurance, and promote insurance, and get everybody in.”
Howard Benge is the Director of the Insurance Museum, appointed in 2021. He has worked as a heritage professional for 25 years; in nine of which he took up several roles for the City of London Corporation, managing the Guildhall Library, various museums, Billingsgate Roman House and Baths, and the City of London Police Museum, amongst many others.
Sarah Myerscough is the Chief Ideas Officer at Macaii, formerly Boston Tullis. She hosts/co-hosts several podcasts and is known for her knack in connecting with people. Sarah excels in bringing out the best for video, podcast, and live events, helping clients showcase the human side of their business.
Sarah is passionate about the evolving dynamics of the insurance industry and enjoys conversing with innovators, trailblazers, and long-term advocates of change.
Gary suggests that the senior leadership team must set the tone for how the company must behave throughout the transformation process. If several groups, perhaps with conflicting views and ideas, are to be involved in this process, a collective consensus on the intended outcome of the transformation project must first be reached. This establishes a base goal which everyone across the company can defer to. Subsequently, each team can collaboratively work backwards from this goal, to understand the key things needed to achieve it. Once the points of uncertainty about the nature of change have been smoothened over, this can be a non-contentious process – what will be the most effective way to achieve this transformational outcome given the resources held by the business?
To determine the success of a transformation project, a wide array of metrics must be consulted. A holistic approach to measuring success must also be adopted. This must be derived, first and foremost, from the baseline of what the business already has, prior to the implementation of the project. The success of transformational change can only be understood by reference to how the business previously used to function. There is a lot of hesitance, particularly in insurance, to attempt transformation projects. Gary argues that there is no empirical evidence to suggest that such programs inevitably lead to failure. Instead, he suggests, businesses must always understand in detail what exactly they are getting involved in by undertaking them, and consider how their innerworkings will be fundamentally altered as a result.
Best Moments/Key Quotes
“As long as you know the outcome, then that's the thing to focus on. The technology is an enabler. It enables you to do something in the best way possible, the most efficient way possible. So, as long as you can agree what needs to be done, then you can have conversations about how it needs to be done.”
“If an organization's doing anything, the whole point of doing it is for a reason. The specific outcome that you want from doing the stuff you're doing. So, if you've got a dozen people or a dozen different groups involved, you should be able to all agree on the outcome you want.”
“Calling something that's quite small… a transformation project gives the wrong impression, because it creates the idea that transformation is easy; you just do this and this and this. So ‘transformation’ is badly used [as a term].”
“There's a lot of stuff that companies can do and should do themselves to put themselves in a really much better position to actually start any transformation, rather than getting an army of consultants in from day one. The things that they [consultants] ask to be done, the organization should be able to do themselves at a fraction of the cost. They are just not aware that they are good things to do beforehand.”
Resources
A Transformation Lens: The Savvy Business Leader's Approach to Transformational Change by Gary Burke
Gary Burke is the Founder of Rabbits from Hats, a transformational change advisory and consulting firm. He has been working on projects in this space since the mid-90s, primarily in insurance but also in other sectors. In the last decade he has been focused first and foremost on general insurance and the London market, and in 2023, his book ‘A Transformation Lens’ was published.
Sarah Myerscough is the Chief Ideas Officer at Macaii, formerly Boston Tullis. She hosts/co-hosts several podcasts and is known for her knack in connecting with people. Sarah excels in bringing out the best for video, podcast, and live events, helping clients showcase the human side of their business.
Sarah is passionate about the evolving dynamics of the insurance industry and enjoys conversing with innovators, trailblazers, and long-term advocates of change.
Paul anticipates that fronting and hybrid fronting will become an increasingly powerful disruptor in the UK market. He argues that MGAs are particularly well-suited to operate in and benefit from this space by providing unique services and distribution in a more flexible and agile manner to traditional insurers, which aligns with the aims of prospective fronting partners such as Bridgehaven.
Additionally, he suggests that reinsurers themselves can also benefit from this type of distribution. If a reinsurer has relationships in other jurisdictions, and wishes to provide capacity to a particular customer group in an alternative market whilst remaining compliant in the UK, a partner can front for and retain risk on their behalf. Paul also notes that captives may be interested in this solution, particularly given the government’s recently asserted interest in making the UK a jurisdiction of choice for those subsidiaries.
Paul anticipates that many more fronters are likely to emerge in the UK in the next few years. The profitability of this approach has enormous potential in bringing new, diverse capacity to the UK market. He dismisses the notion that hybrid fronters will compete with one another for this capacity; by contrast, the disruption they will cause to the broader market through this solution will more powerfully hit the traditionally big insurance players.
Best Moments/Key Quotes
“MGAs are growing at a much faster pace than the traditional insurance sector because they're providing unique services, unique distribution, unique products, they're meeting customer demands, they're much more flexible and agile... So, we feel that over time, the hybrid fronting solution will actually be a quite an interesting disruptor for the UK market in providing different solutions that will fit some of the partners in the UK, particularly MGAs, which is growing space.”
“We have a dedicated model that supports MGAs. We are not attracting or targeting customer groups directly. We don’t service brokers directly, we only support through MGAs, so there’s a reduced conflict of interest.”
“I think hybrid fronting can bring alternative capital [and] advantages from additional commission profit shares. I think it gives much more flexibility to enable [MGAs] to grow the alignment of interest because there's reduced conflicts of interest with other distribution. I also think there's a potential better of transparency… Each party sees the same level of information. There’s no mystique.”
“Talk to us or talk to other fronting partners directly. There's nothing wrong with direct engagement. We don't have a prescribed way of doing it. The only thing I would encourage your listeners to understand is that there is a process to go through. Often, there needs to be things like business plans, data sharing, and information… [so] they need to be prepared for the conversation.”
Paul Jewell is the CEO of Bridgehaven Insurance, with 35 years’ experience across various roles both UK-based and internationally.
About the Host
Sarah Myerscough is the Chief Ideas Officer at Macaii, formerly Boston Tullis. She hosts/co-hosts several podcasts and is known for her knack in connecting with people. Sarah excels in bringing out the best for video, podcast, and live events, helping clients showcase the human side of their business.
Sarah is passionate about the evolving dynamics of the insurance industry and enjoys conversing with innovators, trailblazers, and long-term advocates of change.
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