Messy Social Work – Details, episodes & analysis

In this episode, Rich and Tim: How to Succeed at Failing, we reflect on the times we’ve got it wrong — professionally and personally — and explore why failure isn’t just inevitable, but essential. From missteps to lessons learned, we talk about how embracing failure can lead to growth, insight, and even unexpected success.

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/

Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme

Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/

Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

Rich Devine LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-devine-181763177/

In this thoughtful and research-informed conversation, Rich and Tim speak with Professor Rick Barth about his influential article, “Ten Common Child Welfare Misconceptions.” The episode explores how widely held beliefs about child protection and foster care often diverge from evidence and practice realities.

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/

Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme

Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/

Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

Rich Devine LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-devine-181763177/

In this conversation, Rasheed Nicholas John Pendry shares his journey into social work, highlighting the transformative impact of systemic ideas and personal experiences on his professional practice. 

He discusses the importance of relationships in social work, the need for cultural change within organisations, and innovative practices in family therapy. Rashid also reflects on the complexities of adoption and the significance of kinship care, emphasising the role of curiosity and emotional availability in effective social work practice.

Takeaways

• Rasheed Pendry chose social work to make a difference.
• Transformative ideas in social work can change practice.
• Personal experiences shape professional identities.
• Systemic approaches help navigate complex family dynamics.
• Cultural change in organisations starts with kindness.
• Family therapy can be creatively applied in practice.
• Understanding risk requires examining personal responses.
• Adoption systems need to be re-evaluated for effectiveness.
• Curiosity is essential for social workers.
• Social work is fundamentally a therapeutic profession.

Chapters

00:00 Rasheed's Journey into Social Work

14:22 The Impact of Systemic Ideas

18:16 Critique of Social Work Training

21:36 Personal Transformation through Systemic Ideas

25:36 Navigating Adoption and Its Long-term Effects

28:54 Understanding Relationships and Attachment

32:42 Systemic Interventions in Practice

34:47 Navigating Identities and Relationships

39:18 Transforming Institutions with Systemic Ideas

47:28 Reimagining Adoption Practices

49:57 Essential Systemic Ideas for Social Workers

53:09 Understanding Risk in Social Work

54:51 The Role of Lived Experience in Practice

57:03 Introduction to Relational Activism

58:31 The Poem of Compassion

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/

Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme

Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/

Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

Rich Devine LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-devine-181763177/

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/

Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme

Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/

Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

Rich Devine LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-devine-181763177/

In this episode of "Messy Social Work," hosts Rich Devine and Tim Fisher engage in a profound conversation with Clarissa Stevens, a seasoned youth worker and relational activist. Clarissa shares her journey from a challenging upbringing to becoming a pivotal figure in youth advocacy. She delves into the emotional landscape of teenagers, offering insights into how professionals can connect with young people. Clarissa's story is one of resilience and transformation, highlighting the importance of building trust and providing genuine support to empower the next generation. Tune in to discover valuable lessons for social workers and anyone passionate about making a difference in the lives of young people.

Clarissa Stevens: https://www.linkedin.com/in/clarissa-s-4b7438132/

Peer Power Youth: https://www.peerpower.org.uk/

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/

Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme

Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/

Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

Rich Devine LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-devine-181763177/

In this conversation, Kevin Campbell discusses the profound impact of family separation policies, particularly in the context of child welfare and legal action against the Trump administration. He emphasizes the importance of family connections, innovative approaches in child protection, and the role of social workers in supporting youth. The discussion also covers the significance of understanding child development, building support networks, and the future of kinship care in community involvement.

Other key takeaways from Kevin: 

• Family connections are crucial for child development.
• Aging out of care presents significant challenges for youth.
• Social workers play a vital role in supporting families.
• Building support networks can enhance youth resilience.
• Understanding the science of child development is essential.
• Practical strategies can empower social workers in their roles.
• Kinship care is a critical component of child welfare.

Kevin Campbell; https://www.familyfinding.org/

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/

Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme

Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/

Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

Rich Devine LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-devine-181763177/

Mithran's articles: 

https://www.communitycare.co.uk/2025/06/12/4bn-a-year-more-available-for-adult-social-care-by-2028-29-in-spending-review/

https://www.communitycare.co.uk/2025/06/12/spending-review-childrens-services-cash-boost-means-labour-delivering-on-care-review-macalister/ 

https://www.communitycare.co.uk/2025/06/17/casey-dfe-must-urgently-investigate-fall-in-number-of-child-sexual-abuse-cases-recorded-by-councils/ 

https://www.communitycare.co.uk/2025/06/19/commission-reviews-law-on-kinship-care/

We’re joined by the brilliant Professor Jill Derrick from the University of California, Berkeley, for a compelling and thought-provoking conversation on the complexities of child protection practice.

From the competing tensions social workers navigate to the moral distress they often face, Jill offers deep insight into the impossible decisions that define the field. We examine the moral implications behind these choices and the challenging task of evaluating different forms of alternative care.

Jill was a generous, articulate, and deeply thoughtful guest. While we only scratched the surface—touching on just one of her books—we’re left inspired by her extensive body of research and writing.

Buckle in for a wide-ranging discussion that will leave you reflecting long after the episode ends.

Jill Berrick: https://socialwelfare.berkeley.edu/people/jill-duerr-berrick

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/

Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme

Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/

Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

Rich Devine LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-devine-181763177/

In this episode with speak with Duane Phillips, Senior Social Worker at Coventry City Council. We talk about: 

•  Duane's experience growing up mixed heritage
•  working with children, families and community
• Duane's experience working as a family support worker and running groups for men
• Being a male social worker
• And much more...

We hope you enjoy this episode as much as we did.

Connect with Duane: https://www.linkedin.com/in/duane-phillips-0656b7180/?originalSubdomain=uk

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/

Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme

Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/

Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

Rich Devine LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-devine-181763177/

This week, we have our first-ever return guest, Terri Anne, who shares the important work of the Care Leavers Association and delves into her exploration of the emotional rollercoaster of retrieving and reading her care files. 

Tim interviews care leaver Liana Karim and Jo about their National Voice Project, and some stark findings from a massive study involving care-experienced adults. Liana reads out a spectacular poem that Tim first heard at the inaugural One Voice Summit in London last month. Her powerful message to children in care, care leavers and policymakers – and her heartfelt thanks to social workers – is other worldly and we were so grateful for her coming on to share it with us. 

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/

Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme

Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/

Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

Rich Devine LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-devine-181763177/