Who is Jeff?

Jeff Standridge is a seasoned business strategist and consultant with a strong focus on innovation and strategic growth. He is the founder of a company that serves two distinct customer segments - startups in the state of Arkansas, and larger companies worldwide. With sponsored funding from the federal and state government, he provides resources and support to startups in Arkansas. For larger companies, he helps them challenge the status quo through innovation exercises and assists in creating and implementing strategic growth plans. Standridge is dedicated to helping businesses of all sizes achieve their goals and drive success.

Key Takeaways

00:00 We serve startup and larger company markets.

03:42 Transformed insurance group achieved significant growth.

09:25 Team commitment, empowering communication, accountability, organizational agility.

13:26 Subscribe for podcast updates, transcripts, and resources.

Some free resources at https://jeffstandridge.com/free-resources

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

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Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Innovation Junkie, strategic growth, business operation, start up segment, larger companies, federal government, state government, revenue growth, profit growth, business growth, sustained growth, systematic approach, growth plan, strategic planning, cultural fit, accountability, leadership, organizational behavior, mergers and acquisitions, global operations, organizational success, corporate troubleshooting, organizational agility, business owners.

SPEAKERS

Jeff Standridge, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:22]:

Hi and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science 5 questions of a coffee. Get my hand into the camera properly so you can see the 5 questions. I'm Stuart Webb, the the host, and I'm here today with Jeff Standridge. Jeff is an Innovation Junkie. He's founder of Innovation Junkie. He's helping his customers to to be more innovative and to help them to produce innovation in their businesses. I'm really looking forward to this conversation. Welcome to, It's Not Rocket Science 5 of question 5 Questions Over Coffee.

Stuart Webb [00:00:54]:

Jeff, I hope you're there with a drink in front of you.

Jeff Standridge [00:00:56]:

Yes. Thank you so much, Stuart. It's great to be here today. I appreciate it.

Stuart Webb [00:01:00]:

No problem. So, Jeff, tell me a little bit about, the sort of customers you help and how you help them to be more innovative, but how you also help them to sort of, you know, standardize that as part of their business operation?

Jeff Standridge [00:01:13]:

Sure. So we we actually serve 2 different segments of of, customers. 1 is the start up segment, and and we do that in a specific geography, the state of Arkansas, within the United States because we have sponsored funding to be able to provide that, that types of resource to them, funded for federal government and the state government, to be able to provide that kinds of work. We work with larger companies, call it 5,000,000 to 500,000,000 independent of location all around the world, and we help them challenge the status quo through some very focused innovation exercises, but also to help them build out a a, strategic growth plan and implement a system around the actual execution of that plan.

Stuart Webb [00:01:59]:

Mhmm. Mhmm. And and what are the things that some of your customers I mean, let's let's look at those those people that you have to to challenge the standard, the the status quo at the moment, Jeff. What is it they tried before which which maybe hasn't worked and that you bring as a different way of thinking to them and make them, look at things in a different way?

Jeff Standridge [00:02:21]:

Well, generally, you know, everyone says they want to grow, and they either wanna grow their revenue or they wanna grow their profit or they wanna grow their cash flow. But many times, they don't have a system to actually execute on that growth. And and so that's one of the challenges is is they wanna generate sustained growth, but they don't they don't really know where to start.

Stuart Webb [00:02:43]:

Yeah. It's often a problem, isn't it? I do a a lot of that sort of work with customers as well, and, not only do they not know where to where to start, but but some of them have this belief that somehow it's it's it's magic. It just happens when it happens, and and, actually, it it it doesn't just happen when it happens. You have to be systematic about it, don't you?

Jeff Standridge [00:03:02]:

You you absolutely do have to be systematic, and and, you know, if if we're not planning for that growth, the likelihood that we're gonna be successful in spite of ourselves is not very great.

Stuart Webb [00:03:13]:

Yeah. Deliberate deliberate strategic action is is really important, isn't it?

Jeff Standridge [00:03:18]:

For sure. For sure.

Stuart Webb [00:03:20]:

And and sometimes that deliberate deliberate action is is very often sort of founded on people sort of maybe not knowing where they're going, but deciding they're gonna go somewhere anyway.

Jeff Standridge [00:03:33]:

That's right. I completely agree with you.

Stuart Webb [00:03:35]:

Can you can you give us an example of somebody you've helped to, who's been in that situation and how you've how you've helped to move them forward?

Jeff Standridge [00:03:42]:

Sure. So, worked with an insurance group, an insurance agency, and, independent agency representing multiple insurance carriers. I actually became an investor in this group. And, you know, the the organization had been in existence for over a decade, when we first started working with them, and, but they really haven't hadn't hadn't grown. They were really just paying the bills, paying the people, and continuing to kinda trade sideways, so to speak. We implemented a strategic growth system with them, and, they now have 3 locations. They're growing at double digits. They own the real estate under all three of those locations, and they also just over the course of the last, oh, I don't know, probably 2 years, they have been able to transform their employment environment such that they've got, multiple top talent in the industry coming to them saying, I wanna go to work for you.

Stuart Webb [00:04:38]:

Yeah. And that's a really important part of anybody's growth strategy, isn't it? It's having access to those people that are gonna help you to grow. They've got the behaviors that have got the got the the the the attitude. And I often think that's one of the things that as business owners, we fail to do often. We we hire for skill, whereas we should be hiring for attitude and behavior

Jeff Standridge [00:04:59]:

That's right.

Stuart Webb [00:05:00]:

And training and for skill because skill can be taught, but behaviors, attitudes can't be taught that easily.

Jeff Standridge [00:05:06]:

You know, it's interesting. Jack Welch, who who headed up GE a number of years ago, said that if you've got someone who is a cultural fit for the organization, but they're struggling to be successful, then you probably have the wrong combination of skills and job role. But if you've got someone who is successful in their job, but they're a cultural mismatch, you never should have hired them in the 1st place, and you're gonna have to get rid of them because they'll go bad at point, and they'll take a lot of people with them.

Stuart Webb [00:05:34]:

Yeah. Yeah. You're absolutely and and he was a he was a great he was a great thinker in that way. So, Jeff, I I know and I'm hoping that I've got this right. You've got some you've got some great resources that we can pull up on. So so talk to us a little bit about some of that free resource that we can get. And I'm gonna put the link here at the moment, and it's it's just simply your name, Jeff standridge.com/freehyphenresources. To to tell us a little bit about what we can Yeah.

Jeff Standridge [00:06:00]:

So we've

Stuart Webb [00:06:00]:

got a

Jeff Standridge [00:06:00]:

get there and how

Stuart Webb [00:06:01]:

to use that.

Jeff Standridge [00:06:02]:

We've got a description of our strategic growth system there, and, and they can download the the the strategic growth system that we use with clients, that to really take them from where they are to where they ultimately wanna go. It's not just a planning document. It's an actual implementation of a system. It systematizes the execution against that strategic growth. Be glad for them to pick that up.

Stuart Webb [00:06:24]:

Terrific. Jeff, there there must have been something in terms of a a course, or or something which started you down this journey. What was that what was that that that course or that journey that actually sort of made you realize that you could help companies become more strategic about their innovation and about their growth?

Jeff Standridge [00:06:45]:

You know, years ago, I read a book by Jim Collins called Good to Great.

Stuart Webb [00:06:49]:

Oh, great book.

Jeff Standridge [00:06:51]:

That book, Good to Great, and the the rigor of the research behind that book, was really impactful to me. So I, you know, I have an, a a doctorate in in leadership and organizational behavior, and and, and so I kinda come at things a little bit academically or I used to, not so much anymore. But the the the science behind his research really, really impressed me, and, and so, I began implementing some of those things in the in the work that I do. And, over the years, it kind of evolved. You know, 25 years of doing mergers and acquisitions and running global operations, for a publicly traded US technology company in the UK, across Europe, and Asia, the Middle East, etcetera. And, you know, just I decided about 8 years ago that I'd spent the first half of my life making a living. I wanted to spend the second half making a difference, and so I stepped out on my 50th birthday to do what I do today and have it looked back one day.

Stuart Webb [00:07:50]:

That's brilliant. I love I love that. And it really takes me to what I think is probably the best and last question that I can ask you, and that is, what's the question I've currently failed to ask you to now that mess must be the burning one that you think I just need to get this out of? So what is the question that I should have asked you? And, obviously, once I've asked you that question, you really do need to answer it.

Jeff Standridge [00:08:14]:

Sure. So, you know, what are the patterns that you see in organizations that do achieve sustained strategic growth? So that's the question that that, I would say that that we should have asked. And we talked a little bit about culture a few moments ago. And one of the things I've had the privilege of doing is working with with hundreds of companies over the years. And my my colleagues and I have identified 6 specific components that organizations that do achieve sustained strategic growth demonstrate, and those components really we've organized those into a framework we call the culture of excellence. You wanna hear about them?

Stuart Webb [00:08:51]:

I certainly do. I was hoping that you were gonna say that.

Jeff Standridge [00:08:54]:

Very good. Very good. You know, it starts with strong leadership. Strong leaders, a team of strong leaders who are committed to the direction of the company, who are committed to systematizing the actual strategic growth plan that they have, and who are committed to surrounding themselves with people who are also bought into that direction. Yeah. Number 2, they ensure clarity and focus in the organization. Yeah. They know precisely where they're going, who they are, where they're going, how they're going to get there, and they make sure that their employees also understand how they contribute to that direction.

Jeff Standridge [00:09:25]:

They surround themselves with engaged and committed teammates, and and number 4 is they engage in empowering communication. Empowering communication is communication that helps people become the word empower stronger and more confident in dealing with the circumstances they're facing. So they may have to have tough conversations, but they don't stop just at tough. After they have the tough conversation, they then try to convert that conversation into helping someone feel stronger and more confident in dealing with how to move forward. The 5th element is 100% accountability. In other in other words, everyone knows what they're responsible for, and they are 100% held accountable and submit themselves to being held accountable to deliver it. And then finally, the last item, really comes from a a, comment by the great management philosopher, Mike Tyson, who said everybody has a plan until I punch him in the mouth. Organizational agility is the 6th element of a culture of excellence where an organization can be knocked down, but they can get up more times than they've been knocked to the mat.

Stuart Webb [00:10:29]:

Jeff, those are some really powerful messages there. I mean, the those six things are I absolutely identify with those. The the number of organizations that I've come across who, you know, the the leadership might wanna sort of embed a culture of of excellence, but when it comes to the accountability, they shrink away. It just destroys everything unless you have all of those 6, and I think you're absolutely right. Although, I must admit, I use a different planning, a a plan which is no no plan survives for his contact with the enemy, which I guess is what Mike Tyson is telling us.

Jeff Standridge [00:11:03]:

That's exactly right.

Stuart Webb [00:11:05]:

But, you know, it's that accountability and clarity and communication. And those are the things that I've always thought are absolutely critical to every organization. And unless you get accountability, clarity, and communication, no plan is ever gonna work and nobody's ever gonna be agile because nobody's gonna tell you something's gone wrong, and you're gonna carry on working as if everything was okay. That's the secret to organizational success, isn't it?

Jeff Standridge [00:11:29]:

It really is. And and, a lot of leaders make a mistake of assuming that clarity exists in the organization.

Stuart Webb [00:11:36]:

Yeah. They do. They do. I spent a lot of time, like you in sort of corporate troubleshooting, and nearly every organization I walked into to try and understand where things have gone wrong, somebody somewhere hadn't been clear. Somebody somewhere hadn't told somebody else what was wrong. And as a result, somebody was either not being held accountable for something or being held accountable for something where the planner drastically changed and nobody could work out what was going on. And in every single case, all that needed to start the process was for somebody to actually start the well, can we be clear about what we're trying to do? And it's those conversations which eventually lead to great growth and great innovation, isn't it?

Jeff Standridge [00:12:19]:

Yeah. I've, you know, I've seen so many times where someone came up with a great idea in an organization, and and they rallied throngs of people around that idea to try to implement it. And no one took the no one took the step to say, what's the problem we're trying to solve here, or what's the opportunity we're trying to seize? And and and if they did answer that, they didn't really try to quantify it to see if it was going to be worth the effort.

Stuart Webb [00:12:43]:

Yeah. Absolutely. Oh, I love that. Jeff, we could and probably should spend many, many hours talking about this, but I have a feeling that, business owners need to actually just go back and reflect upon some of this. And then, obviously, they can go back to jeffstandridge.comhyphen sorry, slash free hyphen resource, resources and pull that information down to start doing that. And, obviously, we'd we'd welcome further conversations from anybody who's watching at the moment that wants to actually sort of get in and understand how that, that their organization can take advantage of some of those resources to grow. Jeff, thank you so much for spending just a few minutes with us talking us through that stuff. It's been brilliant.

Stuart Webb [00:13:26]:

I just wanna just point us towards one thing. If if you want to get on to the, the mailing list, which allows us to tell you about when we have such brilliant guests like Jeff coming up and to, to make sure that you can get the transcript that's gonna be coming out of this podcast, in the future, please go to this link, which is httpscolonforward/forward/link.thecompleteapproach.co.ukforward/newsletter. Get on to that. You will then get notification of when this comes out as a transcript. You can read some of the great stuff that Jeff's just given us. You can find out once again where that resource is and go to that resource and pull it down and read some of the great ideas that Jeff has got. Jeff, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. Really appreciate you spending a few minutes today, and I sincerely hope that we've got a few people out there that have rethought what they're trying to do with their business because they haven't got clarity or they're not holding somebody accountable for something which has gone wrong in the organization.

Jeff Standridge [00:14:27]:

I appreciate it, Stuart. It's been a pleasure. And if any of them wanna reach out to me, I'm very active on LinkedIn as well. So thank you so much. It's been an honor.

Stuart Webb [00:14:35]:

I will make sure that we get that LinkedIn, that LinkedIn that the LinkedIn link. Yeah. I think that's a word. Yeah. That LinkedIn link in the in the show notes. Jeff, thank you very much.

Jeff Standridge [00:14:45]:

Yes, sir. Thank you.

Who is Julie?

Julie Guegan has spent the last two decades dedicated to understanding and promoting sophisticated collaboration. She has observed the challenges and complexities that arise when genuine collaboration is required, and has worked to navigate and overcome them. With a deep understanding of human nature and culture, Julie has led the way in finding solutions for effective collaboration, drawing on her own experiences in marriage as an example of the difficulties that can arise when multiple individuals come together. Her expertise and dedication have made her a leading figure in the field of collaboration.

Key Takeaways

00:00 20 years consulting led to founding Global Collaboration Institute.

04:33 Embrace diversity for collaborative and impactful solutions.

09:35 Revelation of nature's strength prompts relearning behavior.

11:59 Encourage collaboration, step out of comfort zone.

14:54 Avoid doubts, pioneer, and create global collaboration.

20:02 Anna awakened me to societal inferiority complex.

22:20 Julie, pursuit of dream through listening, innovation.

28:06 Julie promotes positive cultural change and collaboration.

29:48 Follow Julie, subscribe to the newsletter. Exciting guests.Valuable Free Resource or Action

Some free resources at https://tinyurl.com/3p8pnpnz

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

global collaboration, books, citizen empowerment, participatory democracy, systems dynamic theory, Global Collaboration Institute, diverse perspectives, collaboration framework, innovation, diversity, storytelling techniques, well-being, empathy, change, nature, European dream, humility, curiosity, Alfred Adler, human behavior, inferiority complex, youth, COVID-19 pandemic, meta collaboration framework, social needs, humanistic values

SPEAKERS

Julie Geugan, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:19]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science 5 questions over coffee. This is my coffee which I have in front of me. I know Julie has a drink with her as well, and I'd like to welcome Julie Gegan who is a fellow of the Royal Society of Arts and a recipient of 2 European Commission Awards and she's really passionate about citizen empowerment and participatory democracy and collaboration, and she's got work, which has been enriched by systems dynamic theory to do that. We're gonna have a really fascinating discussion about how she's doing this and things she's written about it. And, Julia, I'm really delighted to welcome to it's not rocket science, 5 questions over coffee. Thank you for making the time.

Julie Guegan [00:01:02]:

Thank you so much, Strat. And I will warn you that maybe my my dog will sparkle, with with Bobby during the conversation, but, you know, it's my dog. It's fine. And my cats my cat also may appear, so you know.

Stuart Webb [00:01:15]:

Okay. We we have had dogs. We have had cats. We have had many interruptions during these and they're always delightful. I'm always pleased to see them come in and say hello, so that's really wonderful. Judy, tell us a little bit more about, you know, the people you help in terms of the the collaborative processes and the and the the methodologies you use to to enable that.

Julie Guegan [00:01:35]:

Mhmm. Thank you so much. So over the past 20 years, I, I led the journey, to, understand the conditions for collaboration, but sophisticated collaboration. When faced with the need to collaborate, things get tricky. And we could see that over the past years when we face complex issues that require genuine collaboration. It's like we forget everything about human nature, culture, and how to navigate the complexity of collaboration. You know, just being married is difficult with 2 people. So imagine when you have more people around the table.

Julie Guegan [00:02:23]:

And so over the past 20 years, I had the great chance to contribute to the European project as a consultant and to identify, to learn from all my experience, the critical ingredients, what was needed to apply collaboration when collaboration is must needed. As an outcome of, of this, 20 years adventure, I created the Global Collaboration Institute a year ago. For this, I gathered experts from all over the globe in different disciplines, different areas, but also, ways of loving and thinking. So real diverse diversity in practice, people that don't necessarily think the same as me. And we started to, work on the basis of my findings and to elaborate a framework that can be applied in any system, any project to amplify its potential and to, make sure that the system in itself would, would be in calm, in well-being. And so having the condition to catalyze innovation. So that's the result of this work and that's the reason why I'm here today with you to explain you a little bit, what is this main outcome. It is in a book, in a vision, and I'm happy to to answer your questions, Charles, about

Stuart Webb [00:03:58]:

this. Julie, I think you said one thing there which is really critical, and that's something that I think a lot of the the people you work with have tried to do. They've tried to find ways to collaborate but as you said, sometimes you need to gather people around you who are different, who don't think the same as you and that's a critical and key aspect of of ensuring collaboration actually succeeds. What what what can you share us in terms of insights into into how that helps if people have tried collaborations or they've tried ways of sort of getting diversity, but they failed because they haven't recognized that as one of their key problems.

Julie Guegan [00:04:33]:

You you you have so many examples, you know, in our history where we embarked into main initiatives without taking the cultural diversity into account. Actually, in collaboration, diversity unites us. You don't do collaboration if you already have the answers to your question, if you already have the a position, if you prefer. So when you enter collaboration and when, in this case, we are talking about big dreams in a way. We are talking about solving the most impossible problems of our times because when collaboration is actually needed, it means that you cannot solve the problem yourself alone. So it means that the problem is too big for you. And so the dream is also too big. And that's why you have to take into account this diversity within the room because this diversity is the key to your solutions.

Julie Guegan [00:05:32]:

And what you need to, to do to embark people in this collaboration journey, taking account their different ways of thinking but also loving. Because the starting point is we all have a positive intention toward this world. We all have it. And following all my experience and my empirical research where I went as far as I could into the periphery, I started to listen attentively to our stakeholders. If we prefer if we are serious about achieving global collaboration that is empowering people all over the world to, to to to if you prefer to embrace the complex issues we face such as climate change or mobility, general, economy, any topic. You have to, equip them. You have to prepare them to the shock and the agony that diversity will represent.

Stuart Webb [00:06:38]:

I think that's a really interesting sec thing you said. It is a shock. It is not it is not easy. It's not comfortable.

Julie Guegan [00:06:47]:

It's absolutely not comfortable. But to solve our issues, I said it at the beginning, you need well-being. You need calm. Because to lead to harmony, people will need to feel calm. They will need to feel that they master. And this is why it's so important our role at the Global Collaboration Institute to equip people for sophisticated collaboration. So that in this collaboration, you won't burn out. You will feel well along the journey and you will master, and this is how you will make impossible possible.

Stuart Webb [00:07:27]:

Brilliant. Brilliant.

Julie Guegan [00:07:28]:

Because he will be like, oh, sorry. I could I told you I could talk during hours.

Stuart Webb [00:07:33]:

No. Please carry on. Please carry on.

Julie Guegan [00:07:37]:

It's just as part of my journey, I developed a number of tools and storytelling techniques and things like this, and it's very, easy for people to forget about, this diversity aspect and to get stuck when they are shocked, Right? When they are shocked by others' view on the world, and and they wait to love. It's it's it's the basis. You know? It's NLP. I I don't know if you know a little bit about NLP. Everyone is okay. That's how you start a collaboration journey. Everyone. What you need to understand is in I mean, when you need to develop is empathy.

Julie Guegan [00:08:22]:

Your ability to listen to what feels wrong. Yeah. And well, it's it's just that as part of the the storytelling techniques, I, I I I, for instance, feed people with narratives, like the narrative of the eagle. You know? The eagle that takes distance on the dream, that takes distance on the project. Because if you put too much pressure on yourself, you increase the risk of being shocked. Because the more you want a project to succeed, the more you want something impossible to become possible, the more you increase the pressure on the show on your shoulder and the less competent you will be to address it. So it's very important that people, you know, visualize themselves as animal, and I use the laws of nature because we need to complete to contemplate nature when nature shows us that it's far more complex than we thought it was because, you know, women beings, we have this inferiority complex toward nature. We always need to find the ways to control it.

Julie Guegan [00:09:35]:

And now that we are faced with this, terrible, you know, revelation that nature is stronger than us, we seem even more lost and and and it's like people lose their everything they learned. You know? They panic and, it's like we have to to relearn everything, you know, about what is a good behavior, what is wrong about our beliefs. We we are like turtles. You know, I mentioned the eagle that needs to take distance and has strategies to make sure the dream at the end of the day will work because there's no other choice. Not the change is happening. Anyway, the question is, do we want this change to be like the way we want it? Do we let this change, you know, happen without us? And I think we all have in our world the tools, the competencies, you know, everything we need to, to make the right, benevolent change happen for this world. So let's do it. You know? And that's why also when I started with my new European dream for a caring culture and innovation and and hope and faith because we've never needed more hope than today.

Julie Guegan [00:11:07]:

And this, you know, knowing that, yes, we can. Of course, we can. You know? We have everything. And and and when I started, you know, the only reason I could wake up every day with this huge dream of on my shoulder, you know, the turtle with this huge burden of this huge dream that, yes, we can do it. The only reason why I could keep going is because I knew there were people in this world like you. People in this world that have fantastic expertise, they can bring to the table so that we make happen what we thought was impossible. And so I'm I'm naming this force, if you prefer, the force for good.

Stuart Webb [00:11:59]:

Yes. Yes. Is there a is there a particular thing that you would like people to is there, you know, one piece of advice that you could leave? And I I'm gonna put up at this stage, your LinkedIn profile, which I will I will include in the in the show notes for the episode because I think it's important that people can follow what you're doing with with with your collaboration institute. But but is there one piece of advice? You talked a little bit about sort of storytelling techniques. You've talked about some of the techniques you've used to help people sort of understand how collaboration can help them move their business, their personal life forward. Is there one piece of advice that you would leave them with to enable them to sort of, today, start taking that approach, move their collaboration forward in a way which, yes, will make them uncomfortable, will help them, to to move out of their comfort zone, but will enable them to sort of move forward, that they don't need a lot of time to learn?

Julie Guegan [00:12:57]:

Mhmm. There are you have to know, I wrote, probably one article per day in, 3 years on my blog, which is now closed because it was mainly for my experience, the empirical research, to understand, as I said, the conditions for global collaboration. From there, we have this framework, structural and behavioral framework. The pillars, if you prefer, of collaboration contain 11 ingredients, and there is this behavioral framework that is the process, to move from impossible to mission possible. As part of all these these resources that that we created, I'm thinking about one very simple thing that people can do when they have so many years. So I'm thinking about 1 in particular, but There are 3 mistakes that people do when they have a big dream. The first one is, lack of humility. No.

Julie Guegan [00:14:10]:

Yep. It's, the second one is, lack of curiosity. So you say, you know, the being ignorant. You have to be like an unborn. You, when you enter collaboration, you have to forget everything you know, basically. Because if you really want to have the power of collaboration on the table, you have to forget where you come from or your beliefs or your bias or your assumptions because you need to be at the disposal of the crowd because collaboration is 1 plus 1 equals an infinite number of possibilities. But for this, you need to forget all about yourself. You need to be unborn.

Julie Guegan [00:14:54]:

The third mistake is to be overwhelmed by doubts Because along the journey, you will be like a scoot. It's a friend, Stefan Baigi, who taught me about this, that when you are pioneer and, of course, Global Collaboration Institute is pioneering a new well, it's like we open the door to next generation because we saw that the system was becoming absurd and change needed to happen whether we want it or not. And so we opened the door to make it familiar for all generations that there is a possibility that one day global collaboration will happen with a maximum of people around the globe ready, equipped to solve all the complex issues we face in all the areas because we see there is crisis after crisis The or in all the domain, in all the areas, we need to change the rules of the game. So we opened this door and we invented these frameworks. So, really, one resource I would say is to face these 3 mistakes. So lack of curiosity, lack of humility, and the the the feeling of, you know, of being overwhelmed by doubts. Contemplation contemplation, looking for the signs that you are doing the right things, Being as much as you can unborn unborn, it's it's really like the second life. You know? You when you prepared your first life, and you spend your first life preparing the second life.

Julie Guegan [00:16:45]:

So it's we need this civilization to prepare its second life. So we need to look at it like this. So far we have been quite individualistic. We have been quite self centered. You say comfort, over our comfort. We need to accept the stretching. We need to accept that we need to unlearn everything we learned because now we have a mission all together and it is to prepare a better world for the next generation.

Stuart Webb [00:17:23]:

Yes. Yes.

Julie Guegan [00:17:25]:

Does it make sense to you?

Stuart Webb [00:17:27]:

It does. It does. And and you're right that that that that often these these big initiatives don't yield results for many years, but that shouldn't put us off from actually looking for how to make that I mean, we talk about the sustainability that the world needs to adopt at the moment and there's no point in pertaining that sustainability is to benefit the people who implement the change now. It's to it's to benefit generations to come, and we need to have that ability to look long term instead of in quarters years to look in terms of decades so that people can see the approach beginning to take through in 5, 10, 15 years from now. Is there is there one, it was there one type one thing or a a series of things which brought you a a course book or experience that brought you to your understanding that these things need to be addressed and started your your thinking about this, this this this big vision about collaboration?

Julie Guegan [00:18:35]:

Yeah. Thank you for for asking this question because I I did an academic research, followed by empirical research. I mean, everything in the same time, actually. I read tons of books, because it's it's a very serious journey. You know? You don't come unequipped to a dream like this. Right? The the the key to me to the main door has been Alfred Adler. Alfred Adler was an Austrian philosopher who lived at the same time, as But, he was far less notorious. Adler.

Julie Guegan [00:19:19]:

Do you know Adler, Stuart? No. Well, you see, it's not very notorious. But when I read it and I read all his books, I got this shock because you know what he says basically, but it's awful to summarize the thoughts of someone like him. What he says is that human beings have a very deep inferiority complex toward nature. Mhmm. And this is translated by behaviors of superiority complex. We need to control nature. We don't like the unpredictability of nature, the uncertainty.

Julie Guegan [00:20:02]:

Right? And so Anna actually wake woke me up to a reality which I knew already that we had a problem with our inferiority complex that were initiated in number of behaviors inside our society. But he equips me on how to solve that main huge hurdle. It's a bit like I mean, I will I will make a parallel resume. You know, it's also when you when he tells you that the first thing you need to master is your dark side, it means you human beings, you are a bunch of monsters. So when you wake up in the morning instead of thinking that you are god, do your best to calm down the monster within you because when times become complicated, it should be your first task right in the morning. Master the devil within you because it's big and it's gonna be very big as times will gonna be tougher and tougher in particular for the western world because I think and that that's it's part of all the things I learned because because as you mentioned when you started journey with a dream like this, like Global Collaborations 3 years ago, I could not expect learning so much. Can you imagine the number of people I met from my little office at home? The conversation I had with people from all over the globe, living very different lives as me, having different dreams, etcetera, it's incredible. When when I just want everybody to join this journey now.

Stuart Webb [00:21:56]:

Yes. Yes. The passion is important. And and that leads me to my final question for you, Julie, and that is there must be one question that you think I haven't yet asked and that I should ask in order to better understand how collaboration is gonna help us all move forward. So what's the question I should have asked? And, obviously, once you've asked that question, you're the best person to answer it. So what is that question?

Julie Guegan [00:22:20]:

It's your dream, Julie. How is your dream going? You know? I shared a dream 3 years ago for it was a script I wrote for the European Commission. It was full of wisdom from coming from all my, conversation I had with people from all over the globe during 2 years, during the COVID. And, and, basically, I had to pursue the script on my own. And this is how I understood that we cannot change we cannot make the right change if we don't listen to the peripheries because it's at the center, that we find the comfort in our current system, in the status quo. So I had to go, as I say, far as far as I could in the peripheries to listen to people, to, because it is them who have the solutions to the problems that they face. You know, it it's a bit like the water crisis. You solve it with people that suffer from the water crisis and have to be innovative to find solutions, you know, to find water every day.

Stuart Webb [00:23:32]:

Yes.

Julie Guegan [00:23:34]:

And we don't do that. We don't really have this culture of going it's our end. We were saying that the solution, they lie in the periphery. We don't have this culture. So I had to do it myself. I I had to take all the risks if you prefer alone. But so how is my dream after 3 years? It's very promising. Now we are asked from leaders, worldwide leaders, to make presentation about the meta collaboration behavior and structural framework.

Julie Guegan [00:24:04]:

It's unbelievable that experts from around the globe seem to validate the framework. I mean, we spent a year focusing on, making labs, making experiments, showing the benefits of our framework in domains like education, health, activism, economy, etcetera. The the the outcomes we get surpass really surpass our expectations. Because as I said, at first, we thought we will ensure the well-being of each amplified by the collective. So we will invest in your potential to art with the meta collaboration framework, we'll add it to you and instead of having a cap on your head that makes it impossible for you to achieve a new dream, we we instead of the cap, we give you, you know, all the things you needed. The we we fill it, you know, with all the ingredients that you need to fill well, find harmony, and at the end of the day, co create. Got it. And so from there, we understood that actually that one of the benefit is to catalyze any innovation when you make a tea bag.

Julie Guegan [00:25:25]:

But you you tell me when I have to stop. But meta collaboration is basically a tea bag, and you respect the ceremony of the tea because it's very important. But you you put a tea bag in a in a in a cup of water and you see what it will happen what what will happen. You just follow. You observe. You are a researcher. You observe. And and we saw how bubbling people become.

Julie Guegan [00:25:50]:

They're they have a wall in front of them. It's impossible. We'll never get there. You put the key bag and it becomes like, how we could do that? And, yes, we were not doing that, and and it's, like, incredible. It's incredible to see. It's it's magic. Because nowadays, I think people are overwhelmed with negativity. They don't they don't have hope.

Julie Guegan [00:26:17]:

I mean and and why did I start also? Because I realized during the COVID times that the first victims to a global pandemic was our youth because we forgot, completely forgot about the social needs of our youth during this COVID time. You know? Because they don't vote. Yes. Yes. They don't vote. They they don't have a voice. And so we we we set up I mean, it's it's not as as clear as that, but I think those would what have privilege. And, this was very clear for me, during these COVID times.

Julie Guegan [00:26:55]:

And so, yes, the reason why I just couldn't hold myself, you know, and I had to open the door to my sons because we have the promise of a world that is worse. I can't accept this even one second. When I when I meet people in, my conversation in Iran, etcetera, when they tell me Europe is dead, I wanna tell them it's the opposite because it's our humanistic values. It's our humanistic values and it's, I I remember it's Emmanuel Dweiss. In one of my conversations in together, Hansan, during the COVID tag, she reminded me of this humanistic values of Europe. And and and never forget the the common values we have in Europe and and and why I think the the the promising future will come from Europe.

Stuart Webb [00:28:06]:

Julie, I think disturbing culture. Julie, we've gotta draw it on that because that I think it's a brilliant way to end this on a note which is positive, remembering that as humans, we can address these issues if we want to. So often we don't want to, so we need to we need to find ways of working with each other, supporting each other, and thinking for the future, not just for today, rather than thinking just about what we get from getting out of and we have difficulties we need to get through today, but we definitely need to get through to the future. We definitely need to collaborate in order to bring that bright future. Julie, thank you for spending a few minutes with us talking about this. It's it's a fascinating subject. I I I'm gonna I'm gonna draw it and and really encourage people, please go follow Julie at linkedin, dot com. She's Julie Guegan at 189-5a21.

Stuart Webb [00:29:03]:

You'll find her if you look for her. There's not many people out there with quite such a profile as Julie. Please follow her. Please look at some of the stuff that she's doing. She's doing some really interesting things. She has she has that blog that she's talked about. She has written a book, which

Julie Guegan [00:29:19]:

is Yeah. The blog is closed, but yeah. Sorry, Scott. I can, I can invite people to to read my book, the following one, which is the vision? It's called Europe, the Next Chapter, a story of collective innovation, and the second book is about, to get released. It's it's about all the experience we led, all over the globe with the meta collaboration framework, during the past year and what we learned about the framework.

Stuart Webb [00:29:48]:

Julie has some brilliant thoughts. Please follow her and and and look out for those books. And and and, you know, also following her, please subscribe to the newsletter so that you can get notification of when we have such fantastic hosts coming up on the podcast. If you go to, link.thecompleteapproach.co.ukforward/newsletter, that's a link Dot the complete approach dotco.ukforward/newsletter. That will take you to a form you fill in, and you will get notified every couple of weeks with who's coming up on the podcast so that you can join in and ask questions and listen to some of the wisdom that you get from such a really interesting guest like Julie. Julie, thank you so much, for spending just a few minutes with us, and I really appreciate you giving us such such wisdom, so much, so much to pack in and I I really look forward to, catching up when that second book is out, and we'll talk more about what that book is telling us about global collaboration.

Julie Guegan [00:30:49]:

Thank you so much, Strat.

Who is Tracy?

Tracy Borreson has a background in corporate marketing but found that the industry lacked authenticity. Determined to change that, she left the corporate world and started TLB Coaching, a business centered around having real conversations and helping companies find their unique DNA. Tracy believes that the standard approach of giving easy instructions and expecting success doesn't work, and instead focuses on helping people figure out what they would do in any given situation. Whether it's through in-person networking events or marketing advisory services, Tracy's mission is to bring authenticity back to the marketing industry.

Key Takeaways

00:00 Marketing professional seeks authenticity and unique approach.

06:49 Choosing convenience over joy can diminish experiences.

10:30 "Need for communication and understanding client problems."

13:16 Target niche markets efficiently to save money.

16:41 Personal brand campfire: audio meditation experience.

18:23 Book recommendation: "The One Thing" - Focus

22:37 Trade show success is about creating experience.

26:46 Embrace failure, learn, nobody died, keep going.

29:15 Failure is necessary for learning and growth.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

https://www.linkedin.com/in/brandsthatspeak/

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Personal branding, Authenticity, Marketing strategies, Customer engagement, Business development, Digital space, Authentic insights, Customer needs, Education-based marketing, Targeted approach, Sustainable marketing, Meaningful relationships, Sales, Customer experience, DNA and actions, Authentic marketing, TLB coaching, Sales strategies, Meaningful activities, Personal brand campfire, Authentic expression, The One Thing, The Art of Gathering, Human connection, Community building, Productive day, Mentor advice, Asking the right questions, Business growth, Mistakes in marketing

SPEAKERS

Tracy Borreson, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:20]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science, 5 questions over coffee. I'm here at the moment. I've actually just finished my drink, but I should be getting another one very soon. I'm here with Tracy, who is obviously well caffeined up. Hi, Tracy. Really good to see you. Tracy is a, is is is really into the authenticity, particularly in the digital space, and, runs, TLB coaching, which I'm sure we'll get to, in the in the future. And she's really, all about trying to make your, your, brand, your your personal brand to become the leading way in which you engage with others.

Stuart Webb [00:01:01]:

So, Tracy, welcome to It's Not Rocket Science 5 questions, have a coffee. Looking forward to this conversation enormously.

Tracy Borreson [00:01:08]:

Me too, Stewart. I've for since the 1st time we chatted, one, I love the whole concept of it's not rocket science. So, hopefully, we don't make it too complicated for people to say.

Stuart Webb [00:01:17]:

Well, look. It's it's it's I always say to people, business is is so easy. Why do we overcomplicate things? And and for me, marketing is is simple as well. People people worry so much about, you know, the the terms and things like that. So talk to me a little bit about what it is you try and do to help people. What is it that you're trying to do with TLB coaching?

Tracy Borreson [00:01:37]:

So my background is marketing, and I was in the corporate marketing arena for a long time. And one of the things that I didn't experience very much of there was authenticity, which as defined by me is people doing and saying what they would do or say, when they would would want to do and say it. And so I kinda meandered around the marketing industry for a long time trying to find my place of where I could have this conversation, and I didn't find it. So I left corporate, started TLB coaching, and it's all about being in the conversation about what would you do. So I believe that every business has a unique DNA, and while the current environment that we live in is very much about one of ease and simplicity and let me just tell you what to do and you can do it and you'll be fine, The problem is is that doesn't work. It doesn't work the majority of the time. Sometimes you get lucky, but the majority of the time, it doesn't work. And so in everything we do at TLP Coaching, whether that is an in person networking event to actually, like, be a marketing advisory services we provide, It's all about helping people figure out what would you do.

Tracy Borreson [00:02:57]:

What would your business do? I did this post on LinkedIn yesterday that I was super annoyed about, because people have started using the, like, service request form on LinkedIn to pitch. And I was like, for real? I got 2 in the same day. So, like, clearly, someone is telling people this is what they should do. Right? This is a way to hack the new LinkedIn so you don't have to have a paid membership or whatever. But just like, would you do that? Would you? Or would you not? Because if you wouldn't do that, then you don't have to do it. And just helping people get back to honestly, I think it's a personal confidence thing or a business confidence thing. Personal confidence creates business confidence. Would you do that? And if you wouldn't do that, honestly, it doesn't even matter if everybody else in your industry is doing it because if you wouldn't do it, you're either going to, a, do it in a completely undedicated way that's not gonna work for you, or 2, you're gonna do something else which makes you stand out from the industry, and that's really what we're trying to do in marketing anyway.

Tracy Borreson [00:04:04]:

So Yeah.

Stuart Webb [00:04:06]:

Yeah. I was, I was on a, a meeting with a a bunch of other company directors recently, and we were talking about the disconnect of marketing in organizations and talking about the fact that so often, you know, marketing is doing something which, you know, then can't be delivered by by by sales and can't be delivered by operations. And as a result, what you end up with is marketing fighting and saying to people, but we should be doing this. And the answer is, yeah, that might be what you want. But, unfortunately, the rest of the organization can't do it. You're just making yourselves look unauthentic as you say or end up in a situation where there's there's infighting, and it's not collaborative. And as a result, what do you end up with? You just you've somebody looks at the marketing and goes, great. I'd like that experience.

Stuart Webb [00:04:50]:

But when they get delivered that product or service, it doesn't match what they believed, and they will they will then just turn off. And that would that'll be that'll be the end of their their interaction with that that particular company. So being authentic is so important to the whole experience that you have, not only the marketing, but how it gets delivered, whether the salespeople can sort of live up to the promises. It has to be one thing that everybody can can can live to.

Tracy Borreson [00:05:13]:

Yeah. It's a it's a we exercise. And the we is marketing and sales and customer experience and operations and the delivery truck drivers and whoever else is involved in this company going to market. And it's also the we in the ideal customers and partners and vendors and, like, all of these things. This is a we exercise, and it's something that it's it's just very interesting. It it I'm not gonna say it's not complex because the more people you a thing, the more complex the interrelationships between humans become. But at the end of the day, this is about, okay, we are all here for one reason. There's a famous quote by a, janitor at NASA who was at like, what do you do here? And he is like, putting a man on the moon.

Tracy Borreson [00:06:10]:

Like, that's what we're doing here. And we all have our different roles in that, but when you have that kind of commitment from a we, then, like, it makes a huge difference and not that makes it huge difference internally, which then makes a huge difference externally.

Stuart Webb [00:06:27]:

And and we sort of strayed into it, Tracy, but, you know, at this stage, it's sort of you know, what is it you see people doing, which which, you know, we've sort of talked about it a little bit where where it is unauthentic, where people are not doing something which which is authentic to their to their marketing efforts and somehow makes it look as if they're liars?

Tracy Borreson [00:06:49]:

I mean, quite honestly, I think a lot of the times, it comes back to doing the easy thing. And if you're just listening, I used air quotes in there because it's sold to you as if it's the easy thing, as if you just do this. I have this ex like, personal example that I always reference, which is, like, I hand chop nuts almost every day to go in yogurt or granola or whatever. I I and I like to do it. It makes me feel like a top chef, and I am very far from a top chef. Let's put it that way. And my dad was at my house once, and he was observing me chopping these nuts, and he was like, you need a slap chop. And I was like, I mean, a slap chop would make this easier, and it would make it faster, but it would also take away all of the joy that I have in doing the activity.

Tracy Borreson [00:07:45]:

And so I have not got one. I told him not to buy me one because he's also the type of guy who would be helpful and just get you one. And it's like, no. I like to do I like to do this, and this is the thing where we're, like, so caught up in this ease of use conversation because we just everything want everything to be faster. We want everything to be more simple, and we miss that we're trading away what is meaningful for us to do those things, and then we have businesses who are in business using their marketing departments to just convince people that what you need is my easy thing. Right? You you don't have my easy thing. It fixes all your problems, except most people don't know enough why they have a problem to answer that question, to say, like, yeah. That actually fixes my problem because in my scenario, I don't have a problem.

Tracy Borreson [00:08:38]:

I don't have a problem with chopping nuts. Right? So now your slap chop is irrelevant to me because I don't have a problem with that activity and but the people in this scenario, the company, put yourself in my nut shopping shoes as a business, you don't know enough about what your problem is to say, I don't need your slap show. Right? Like, I don't need your website design services. I don't need your podcast production services. I don't need wherever. I I don't know what I need. So the answer is really in that, like, going back to basics and saying, like, what's the problem here? Because the problem is our problem isn't we'd need to chop nuts faster. That's not our problem.

Tracy Borreson [00:09:26]:

What's our problem? Okay. Let's go to market and see what's out there to fix that problem and let or from the flip side, if you're not looking at it from, like, marketing perspective, now you have really good clarity on the problem. You fix for people, and you tell the market it. Right? Yeah. No. I don't know how many slabchops have been sold. A lot of them. Right? There are lots of people out there who have problems chopping nuts.

Tracy Borreson [00:09:52]:

Sure. Get a Slack job. I don't have 1 though, so that's not the prob that's not a problem for me. There are problems I have, but it's not that problem.

Stuart Webb [00:10:02]:

Yeah. There are so many people that sort of you know, and I I come across this with people who are teaching lead generation. I'm I'm using air quotes as well now. So we're we're all into the lead generation, lead generation services on LinkedIn, which is, you know, the first thing you have to do is sort of, say hello. And then immediately, the message goes back where where you know, hello. And then do you want such and such? You know, I get I must get I don't know how many a day. I've sort of, you know we've seen your podcast. You must need podcast production services.

Stuart Webb [00:10:30]:

My answer is, hang on a minute. You haven't even asked me whether or not that's a problem. You don't know yet whether or not that's my problem. I have problems, but you haven't actually even bothered to reach out and find out whether or not. And I was talking to, you know, a client actually today who was who was actually sort of saying, you know, about their the the the they've they're trying to gen they're trying to write a course for a for a particular standard. And and I said said, well, you know, are are customers coming to you and asking for this course? And his answer was, well, they have they do once we've told them they need it. And I said, and why don't they need it? And he said, well, we're dealing with industrial places, and they're all using the domestic standard, and they don't know that there's an industrial standard. And so the first thing they come to us to say is, can you can you, can you implement this regulation? And they go, yeah.

Stuart Webb [00:11:23]:

We can, but, actually, you need this one. And they go, oh, why do we need that one? And then they start the education, and he said we it's only after they've we've engaged with them and started talking to them that they recognize that what they initially thought they wanted isn't what they want. And that some somehow and I sort of said, like, I love the way you're doing it, but the major problem you've got at the moment is that you haven't yet engaged with the number of people that actually have a problem and don't know they've got a problem. It's exactly what you were saying. Too many people are reaching out and sort of basically trying to thrust down the throat. You that'll solve your problem. You don't even know you got a problem yet, so they're trying to reeducate their educate their their market, which is proving to be the the the thing which is gonna cost them the most, but it's gonna be the most profitable in the end.

Tracy Borreson [00:12:08]:

Well and I think that's that is exactly the point. Right? And is that the thing that's gonna be all most profitable for everybody in the end? No. A lot of people go to market with this education component assuming that if I educate you, then you will buy what I need, but this is not then really education, right? This is persuasion, so let's call it what it is, and it's not that it, it's not that it can't work. Right? It can work. It has worked. It has worked on me, right, but is that what you can find yourself committed to doing for the long term? And these are the things about, like, like, the lead gen on LinkedIn is that, like, this strategy is based on I call spray and pray. And I spray my message everywhere, and I pray that it lands with somebody because there are people out there that have a problem, but I am not doing anything intentionally to find a person who has a problem. I'm just spraying the market with stuff.

Tracy Borreson [00:13:16]:

When you have a very small percentage of the market that has your problem, you're gonna spend a lot of money on that strategy before you find somebody, and if you're a business that doesn't have a lot of money, including the time you're paying somebody to do those activities to do that, then that's probably not the right strategy for you. Can it work? Sure. I'm more of a fan of the shoot the fish in the barrel analogy. You got all these fish in a barrel and, well, I'm not trying to shoot people, but, like, everything is sounds like I'm very into guns, and I'm Canadian, and I'm not, but it's like but these are the points. Right? Like, that's more of a me. I wanna, like, kinda wrap people in a community, and then I wanna see if there's something in there that is is is worth mining instead of, like, I wanna go out and, like, just and so the the secret there is in being able to say, I don't wanna do that. Somebody who tells you I had this guy once on LinkedIn, and I've, like, referenced him pretty much every conversation trying to convince me that if I don't do prerecorded video, I will never have a successful business. And I was like, I hate prerecorded video.

Tracy Borreson [00:14:32]:

I just don't believe what you're saying, and you should spend your energy somewhere else convincing someone else who is opening to listen to you because it's not gonna be me. You can try and peer pressure me all you want. I will never believe what you're saying and just move on, and, again, it's not that, like, video is bad. Right? It's just not something I'm ever gonna do because I'm totally uncomfortable with it. I waste a huge amount of time doing it. It's not for me. So being able to stand up for what's not for you, what is for you when someone else is telling you that that is bunk, and you're like, well, I've built an entire funnel based off them that works for me, and you have the confidence to say, this is my way of doing it, then we're into the realm where you can have a sustainable growth focused marketing program.

Stuart Webb [00:15:20]:

Brilliant. Tracy, there must be some stuff that you've got on, your websites and things like that. Is there a is there a one particular thing that you find that most people would be most interested in that that talk to them about, you know, some valuable advice that you could give. And I I put your LinkedIn profile on the screen, which is linkedin.com/in/brands that speak. Is it is it is it stuff that you you you we should know about that you give away and help people to understand how to do this sort of thing?

Tracy Borreson [00:15:52]:

So the first thing that I personally love is my LinkedIn live show, which is called the Crazy Stupid Marketing Show, which Stewart is gonna be on in the future. The show is based on helping people understand what they're doing from a marketing perspective that is crazy and stupid and not going to lead you in the direction you wanna go and opening the door to perhaps more empowering perspectives that can allow you to do things that are more meaningful and more sustainable for your business. So that is one of the things I love to do. It's on Tuesday afternoons, depending on where you are in the world. It's on. Actually, I have a guest from, Australia later today, and it's technically Wednesday morning for him. But, anyway, it's it's it's a show, and it's on LinkedIn. You can find it.

Tracy Borreson [00:16:41]:

You can also find it on YouTube. Crazy stupid marketing. The other thing that I really love to do, and I do this with, a lot of the workshops that I host, is something called I mean, I call it the personal brand campfire. You can do it equally from a business perspective too. It is an audio experience. It's available on my website, and what it does is it's it's kinda like a meditation that helps get you re centered on who you are and how you show up, and then using that as a foundation allows you to choose marketing strategies, sales strategies, narratives. What I mean, honestly, you could use it to start your day and have a productive conversation with your kids. It helps you get realigned to what would you do and what does it feel like to be in your most authentic expression of yourself and how can you start with that visualization and let it roll out into your day, into whatever you're going to do that day.

Tracy Borreson [00:17:46]:

It could be goal setting. It could be KPIs. It could be pretty much anything. It's about starting from you. So that is something that's available on my website. People can feel free to go and download that. I think it's like a 4 and a half minute thing, audio experience, and, yeah, give it a try. I have some clients who, like, do it every morning.

Stuart Webb [00:18:07]:

Brilliant. What was it that re initially got you, or or or or is there a valuable book or something that you recommend your clients read or that you read yourself that that sort of helps to to center people around authentic marketing?

Tracy Borreson [00:18:23]:

I have 2, and neither of them are actually marketing related books. So the first one is a book I recommend to pretty much everybody that I meet. Again, regardless of whether you are running your own business or you're just a human doing life, it's called The One Thing, and it's a book about focusing on what's important. So again, whether you're trying to do that from a business perspective or a life perspective, it's very empowering. The central question of the book is what is the one thing I can do right now that will make all other things easier or unnecessary? And as soon as I heard that, I was like, this is genius. This is going to be my life. Yeah. It's a great idea.

Tracy Borreson [00:19:06]:

And you will be surprised. Right? I'm like, you can look at what can you do in your, like, list of chores at home? What are the things that you can do with your kids? What are the things you can do in your business? What are the things you can do in your marketing? It is really, like, a very global question that is very, very empowering, allows you to get back to the simplicity of that. Secondly, a book called The Art of Gathering, and so

Stuart Webb [00:19:33]:

to me

Tracy Borreson [00:19:34]:

yeah. Okay. So I love it. I have it on repeat on my Audible. It is a book about people being together. And so for me, I believe that marketing is about creating a community of people, and so that is tied into the art of gathering. And whether you're hosting events or you're looking at this from a marketing perspective or you're having a birthday party or what have you, this book brings about so many interesting ideas of what it looks like for humans to connect with humans, and that is one of the things that I like the most about it.

Stuart Webb [00:20:12]:

I have made a note of the book of The Art of Gathering, and I love the idea behind that. That is one that we'll be getting, that will be getting into my, my bookshelves very soon. And on that one thing, you know, the what a mentor of mine said to me many years ago, they they they they sat me down, and they I'm you know? This was back in the days when I was, a a young young young, you know, research student.

Tracy Borreson [00:20:36]:

So yesterday?

Stuart Webb [00:20:37]:

Back yesterday. Yeah. And they turned around to me and they said, look. If you can get one thing done tomorrow morning before 11 o'clock, that means you've moved forward 1 step. The rest of the day, you can take off. And if you get 2 things done by doing it by 11 and then 1 after 11, you've almost brought yourself back a new day. And I sat there and I thought one thing by 11 o'clock, I can do that. I can do 1 thing by 11 o'clock, and it's become a habit.

Stuart Webb [00:21:08]:

You know, I sit down at the end of every evening. I sit down and I write the one thing that I'm gonna do tomorrow morning before I get onto my emails, before I do anything else, before I receive a telephone call or anything, I'm gonna do that one thing that moves the business forward. And then if I achieve it by 11 o'clock, the rest of the day is mine. I can take the rest of the day off if I like, or I can try and do a second thing. And it's such a simple idea, isn't it, to do one thing? Just one. But it's possible. Your brain can compute one thing.

Tracy Borreson [00:21:40]:

It's true. Although I will also say having be being a check a checklist person, there's a lot of things that we put on a list that we do that aren't meaningful.

Stuart Webb [00:21:54]:

Yeah.

Tracy Borreson [00:21:54]:

That aren't meaningful to the relationship we're building, that aren't meaningful to the businesses we're building. And I think that is probably the toughest arena to explore is that you could go from doing a 100 things that are not meaningful in one day to doing one meaningful thing.

Stuart Webb [00:22:14]:

Yeah. You're right. You're absolutely right. The seek one of the secrets I learned when I was doing 1 training course is I did a statistical thing, and I turned around and said, you mean the important thing is to ask the right question? And he went, yes. That's it. It's asked the right question. You can ask a 1000000 questions and get an answer. But unless you've asked the right question, every answer you've got is wrong.

Tracy Borreson [00:22:37]:

It's so true. I remember having this conversation with 1 of the ladies who is on my show, and she got this opportunity to, have a booth at a trade show, and so she had asked me. She's like, okay, I know you know about, like, what are what are the things someone would normally have at a trade show booth? And I was like, well, some of the things people would normally have at a trade show booth are a table and some chairs and some swag and a banner and a video with rotating video of your cup like, this is what people would typically have, but is that what you would have? And she was like, ugh. No. Okay. That's the point. Right? The the point is the question isn't what should I have. Right? Like, it's what what what would I create? Right? What experience do you want people to take away of you from this trade show? Do you want to just do what everybody else is doing, or do you want to look different? And, like, this is my people.

Tracy Borreson [00:23:37]:

We're talking about, so, obviously, she wants to look different, but, like, these are these are the things, and also this is why I believe it's so powerful to be surrounded by a community of people who are curious in that nature. What would you do? This is the thing I always think about. Even when it like I was young, I had nobody ask me that question. Right? I I went into the program. People told me what I should do. This is a good idea. I I did that for a very long time. Got to the point where I was like, well, that's not what I could do.

Tracy Borreson [00:24:07]:

Then had to figure out, what would I do? I'm still in the process of figuring out what I would do. I feel like this is a lifelong journey. But when you surround yourself with people asking you what you would do instead of surrounding yourself with people telling you what you should do, your experience from a personal and a business perspective changes, dress.

Stuart Webb [00:24:26]:

Yeah. Yeah. Brilliant. Look, Tracy, up until now, I've been doing all the work asking you all these questions, and there must be a question that you're thinking to yourself. Hey. He hasn't asked me about such and such. So what is that 1 question that I should be asking you? And, of course, once I've, you once you've asked that question, you're you're gonna need to answer it for

Tracy Borreson [00:24:46]:

us. You know, it's funny because I knew this question was coming, and then I feel like I kinda, like, answered my own questions the way along because that's how I do. But I think one of the most powerful things in this process is, like, how do you move? Like, how do you go from where you are today to having confidence in the way you would do things? So that's the question I will ask myself. My answer is practice. You have to practice. It's yeah. So I grew up playing competitive basketball. We're city champions when I was in high school, and so, I mean, it's cities.

Tracy Borreson [00:25:28]:

It's not like, woo, the biggest thing, but it was a championship basketball team And a lot of the times I look at what are the difference between a championship team and a not championship team? And almost always, it's because of practice. Mhmm. Yeah. And it's not also because of just, like, individual practice. A whole bunch of players can go out and practice alone and it doesn't mean that your team is going to jail. It was a we activity and we practiced. We practiced and we ran and we did stairs. We did sprints and we shot free throws and, like, I don't even know.

Tracy Borreson [00:26:02]:

I kinda wish I had counted how many free throws I have shot in my life so that I could get to the point where I can shoot 80% from a free throw line. Like, it doesn't happen the 1st time you shoot the ball. Right? It doesn't, and so many times in business and from a marketing perspective and from a personal development perspective, we think we get this idea. Right? Okay. I'm gonna be authentic. I'm gonna go and and and do it my way, and then we don't because we don't know how to do that.

Stuart Webb [00:26:32]:

Yeah.

Tracy Borreson [00:26:33]:

So you have to go idiot. To the basketball court and shoot. You have to shoot, and you have to miss. You have to get it wrong. There's no 100 percents here. So practice. You gotta practice.

Stuart Webb [00:26:46]:

And and fail. You know? Sometimes sometimes you have to allow yourself to fail because I I said this sorry. Once again, I said this to another client recently who turned around and said something along the lines of what happens if it doesn't work? And I said, do you know how a baby learns to walk? A baby learns to walk by getting up, falling on their backside, and thinking, well, I'm not gonna do that again. I'll do it different. And you don't learn and get it right by by just waiting and waiting and waiting until eventually it becomes right. You have to get out, do something, practice it, and if it goes wrong, well, okay. That's one way that you don't do it the next time. And even if it does go wrong, nobody died.

Tracy Borreson [00:27:28]:

Well and especially okay. I had a boss once working in marketing. He used to always say, we're not saving babies, which I 1, just resounded with me, 1, because my mom was a neonatal nurse, so it was actually her job to save babies. It has never been my job to save babies. Also, I can't handle the sight of blood, and my mom is a nurse. I don't know. Person. There's no problem, but, like, we're from a marketing perspective, folks, like, this is not if you are doing flyers and they don't go out till Tuesday when they were supposed to go out on Monday, doesn't matter.

Tracy Borreson [00:28:09]:

Right? Like, it just doesn't matter. And maybe maybe you learn like, okay. Yeah. They do need to go out on Monday to give people enough time to know because there's people like me who don't check their mailboxes for, like, 2 weeks, which is yeah. That's a thing I do. I have the worst checking my mail. Don't mail me something important, folks, unless you're gonna tell me it's coming. But, like, you learn from getting it wrong, and if you aren't, if you aren't, then you're just a baby who lies there.

Tracy Borreson [00:28:38]:

You're not even a baby who learned how to crawl. Right? Babies learned how to crawl. They learned how to walk. They learned how to ride a bike. They learned how to run. Right? Like, that's a that's a staged methodology, and if you don't experiment at the very first step, you are never going to get to running. So if you are hoping that there's some kind of magic that exists to take you from stage 0, lying there flat on your back like a baby in your marketing, all the way up to running and beating your competitors ahead of all your competitors in the market, it has to come from experimentation. You have to experiment and you have to get it wrong.

Tracy Borreson [00:29:15]:

You have to fall down. So if you also are looking for someone who's, like, going to promise you that this is going to work a 100% of the time and it's not a thing, guys, because you haven't done it before. That same that same methodology hasn't been tried on by your body type, so you don't know that it gets until you try it on, and then you're like, oh, no. This doesn't fit. Let's not do that. But I did kinda like that. Like, I like the color of that shirt, but I don't like the cut of that shirt. So I'm gonna look for more shirts that are that color, but not that same kind of This is how humans get learn how to walk.

Tracy Borreson [00:29:51]:

It's how we choose clothes. It's this is the same methodology for your marketing as well.

Stuart Webb [00:29:57]:

Tracy, yep. I I I love the ideas. I love that. We think we could go on for hours, but we better let you get back to doing something important, and meeting with your customers. Folks, I'm just gonna I'm just gonna wrap up. And and now if you wanna go to, this link, h t t p s, colon forward slash forward slash link .thecompleteapproach.co.ukforward/newsletter. That's link .thecompleteapproach.co.uk forward slash newsletter. Fill out the form there.

Stuart Webb [00:30:25]:

Get onto the newsletter list so that you can get an email from me with some of the brilliant people that we're gonna have on in the future, like Tracy. I'm gonna give you words of wisdom like this. You can't believe. Tracy, thank you so much for spending some time with us. You have such an infectious attitude and such an infectious spirit. I love what you're saying. I really believe if you can't get authentic with you, you can't get authentic with anybody. So thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us.

Stuart Webb [00:30:51]:

I look forward to hearing what people think about what you've said and, being authentic with it.

Tracy Borreson [00:30:58]:

Awesome. Thank you for the opportunity,

Jill Maidment is the Founder and Director of  Natural Talent Bristol and South Wales. She is a highly respected,  sought-after and effective International Executive Business Coach and  Mentor, Career Transition and Outplacement Coach, Resilience Coach, and  British Psychological Society qualified Assessor. Jill also speaks at  virtual events and delivers virtual Leadership and Management Training  Modules.

What you will learn in this podcast :

1. how organisations are adapting to change since early 2020


2. how strategic management prepares your organisation for major change like a pandemic


3. understanding the Kubler-Ross curve will help you understand how change affects people.

Read more about Jill at natural-talent.com

When Jacquie left teaching to start a Tipi Hire business in 2010,  tipi weddings were very new. Jacquie has used her marketing skills to  grow that business to be a market leader. Now she's offering her  expertise to other Business owners who want to grow their business by  implementing her Marketing and Sales System to create a constant stream  of new leads and customers. Jacquie works one to one with motivated and  aspiring business owners and without exception, her clients increase  their profits and improve their lifestyle!

What you will learn in this podcast :

1. Proactive marketing will bring new clients


2. Price for value not compete


3. Spend some time on your business every day

Invest your time, don't spend your time,  invest it.

Who is Margaret?

Margaret is a result-driven Business Coach for female entrepreneurs just like you. She uses business strategies, as well as NLP techniques and NLP coaching that work on your mindset and assist you with your personal development, to help you build and grow a business and a lifestyle that you can truly enjoy.

Key Takeaways

What you will learn in this podcast: 

• How having clarity with your target market allows your message to be heard


• Why too many business owners try to solve their own problems


• How to ensure you have a magnetic message to avoid selling

Margaret offers a free 30 minute call. Get more details at https://mgcoach.co.uk/

Sian is based a Business Mentor, member of the Forbes Coaches Council and I help service-service-based business owners and agencies gain an unfair advantage and crack the growth code to getting and keeping more clients in order to build a business that loves you back.

In this recording you will learn that Sian has spent many thousands developing herself and her own knowledge and how that has helped her to focus her skills to develop her clients business and that the key to growing your business is to grow your email list.

You can learn more Sian at workwithsian.co.uk

In our latest episode of It's Not Rocket Science! Five Questions Over Coffee recorded on International Women's day, we talk to eco-business mentor Jannine Barron.  Jannine is a business mentor with a special interest in brand activism and climate change who uses strategic marketing and communication skills to help sole traders and small companies simplify complex marketing ideas that allows her clients to create and scale their businesses with ease. She is on a mission to support ecopreneurs create brands and services that can change the world with zero harm products and solutions.

Links

https://linktr.ee/janninebarron

Take away messages from this discussion:

Find the right mentor or tribe to support your dream and move the business forward without 'playing small'

Make everything simple. Choose a couple of inspirational mentors, choose only a couple of marketing newsletters. Too much information stops you from working on your business because of information overload

Know the difference between doing and why you are doing it so you get to your objective.

Jannine was influenced by the writings of Florence Scovel Shinn

Jannine offers a free 1-2-1 - contact her at https://linktr.ee/janninebarron

Creative commercially astute Copywriter helping businesses get seen, known & booked! 

Her copywriting track record is for value rich, income generating content creation that boosts awareness, engagement, sales, sign-ups, and visibility. 

During the past ten years, She has significantly evolved my copywriting services, for one-off jobs and regular retainers, as a freelancer, or an agency sub-contractor. 

Her key competencies are 

- A proven ability to write persuasive copy designed to sell, grounded in years of frontline sales experience. 

- Excellent writing skills. 

- Accuracy and an eye for detail. 

- Ability to write concise and engaging copy to tight deadlines. 

- Experience in optimising copy to deliver maximum conversions.

Learn More about Judith at https://www.linkedin.com/in/judith-rafferty/  

What you'll learn in this video 

1. two tools to help you be a better copywriter : answer the public and co-schedule 

2. A great book on content DNA 

3. A tool to help your content be more readable.  

Judith has a special offer - blogoff - buy one blog, get one free.  Contact Judith for more details.

Robin is the Fearless Business Coach.

Fearless Business helps amazing business owners to FINALLY grow their business and shift away from a value-driven exchange of "time-for money" to charging based on "RESULTS" and RESULTS ALONE. As a direct result of being in the Fearless Business Accelerator many of our clients get a direct return on their investment within the first 4 weeks of the programme and go on to double or treble their turnover within 3-6 months of starting the programme. We've helped over 120 business owners to break out of selling their time-for-money over the last 12 months alone.

Find out more at Fearless.biz

Jenny is a life coach with a great money mindset workshops which are having fantastic results. Read more about Jenny at http://jennyjarvislifecoaching.co.uk/about-me/

Simon runs that coaching and facilitation business, Wheresmylunch, http://yourl.ch/1b1zd73. Their ideal clients are business owners and/or leaders that want to explore new possibilities that can further enhance their business opportunities. Working in a frame of wider wealth (social, intellectual, community and financial), he helps people to unlock dreams and passions that have before just been that. This short chat over coffee will invite you to dig into what type of innovator you are and therefore, what type of support you may need around you to help release these dreams.  

In this podcast you will earn how to manage your remote team and how engage, engage, engage are the most important three things you can do today!

Jenny Bracelin is a qualified, skilled and experienced money coach and business mentor.  Passionate about transforming people’s relationship to money and motivating them to make more.

Originally trained as a ballet dancer, Jenny brings creativity and passion to every conversation. Starting her first business in linen hire aged 23, going on to win a National Customer Service Award with The Prince’s Trust and retiring aged 30.

Jenny motivates and explains how to make more money in a  simple, positive and confidence-building way.  Learn more about Jenny at https://www.linkedin.com/in/jennybracelin/

Who is Ben?

Ben Dickie is the co-founder of Hivemind, a platform designed to provide flexible and dynamic access to expertise for executives and business leaders within enterprise organizations. With a focus on transformation and innovation, Hivemind connects these leaders with specialists in a meaningful way. Ben's vision for the platform is to enable executives to access the right consulting support at the right time, ultimately moving their businesses forward. Hivemind also serves as a networking environment for independent experts who have left industry to set up their own consulting businesses or work as independent contractors. Ben's goal is to create a space where these individuals can share and learn from one another, ultimately driving success for all involved.

Key Takeaways

00:00 Hivemind provides flexible consulting support for execs.

04:23 Clients are unique, need change management investment.

10:55 Hivemind offers diverse expertise and adaptable methods.

14:13 Helping organizations create their vision for success.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

https://assess.hivemindconsulting.com/transform1

A video version of this podcast is also at

https://youtube.com/live/H0p3Ex3SDaw?feature=share

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

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Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

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It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

business technology consultants, positive sustainable change, Hivemind Consulting Network, enterprise organizations, transformation specialist, innovation specialist, medium and large sized enterprises, independent expert, shared values, independent contractor, change management, investment in change management, transformation readiness, transformation programs, fractional role, communities of excellence, transformation and change, small independent consultants, traditional consultancies, shared learning, networks, expertise, transformation and change community, transformation and change framework, transformation and change literature, small groups working together, Be More Pirate book, pirate culture, future vision, FTSE 100 businesses

SPEAKERS

Ben Dickie, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:22]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science 5 questions over coffee. My coffee is here. It's nearly gone actually because it's, it's been it's been a lot to do this morning. I'm really grateful that we've got time from Ben Dickey This morning to talk to us. Ben is the chief revenue officer and cofounder of the Hind Hivemind Consulting Network, A global network of really business, technology consultants driven by a lot of shared values and a desire to make a Positive sustainable change in in business today. So, Ben, really grateful for you making a few minutes, for us today. Thank you for your contribution to It's Not Rocket Science. Five questions over coffee.

Ben Dickie [00:01:04]:

Delighted to be here, although my, my coffee sadly empty as well.

Stuart Webb [00:01:10]:

What can I say? Sometimes sometimes you have to actually stop drinking the coffee and do work, but, you know, we'll try to avoid that for the next few minutes. Listen. Just just tell us a little bit about sort of, you know, what you're trying to achieve with with Hivemind. Who are the who are the sort of people that you're attempting to to help overcome some of the problems they've got in a different way.

Ben Dickie [00:01:33]:

Sure. Yeah. So Webb founded Hivemind. It's our 10 10 year, anniversary or our 10th birthday this year. Yeah. Yeah. We've got 2 distinctly different, customers as as we see it. So our our focus, I think to answer your question is is primarily with medium and large sized enterprises.

Ben Dickie [00:01:57]:

So execs, Yeah. Executives and and business leaders within enterprise organizations who are Transforming and changing their their their business or or they're looking to innovate. And so With with that customer group in mind, we founded Hivemind really to provide a more flexible, and dynamic way For for execs in in those organizations to access expertise, so external consulting support At the right time and and for just the right amount of time. So enabling them to to interact with Transformation specialist or innovation specialist like yourself, Stuart, to To five, yeah, to to move their business forward in a in a in a really meaningful way. And, yeah, the the our over customer group It's, so it is is the independent, expert. So individuals who Yeah. For for for over variety of reasons, it's becoming more and more, more and more popular over more and more commonplace, decided to leave the, leave industry and set up their own, their own consulting business or strike out as an independent contractor. The network provides, an environment for them to share and learn with, with others.

Ben Dickie [00:03:24]:

It's a network of like minded, individuals with, as as you said, a shared a shared set of, of of principles or or values, but ultimately driven To do the work that they enjoy and and five, and, and to and to make an impact and a difference for, yeah, for for for for clients and and the the wider community.

Stuart Webb [00:03:49]:

And and and we could talk for hours about sort of, you know, the the value of of shared learning and shared networks. But but for for the purposes of this, because I'm I'm hoping that what we got are people who are who are watching us, who are, you know, that That target, customer that you're trying to help, you know, they they will have been working with traditional consultancies, Small independent, consultants themselves. What what is what is the problem that they really face that that you are addressing in a slightly different way of working.

Ben Dickie [00:04:23]:

Yeah. I think I mean, every client That we work with is is is unique. I think they have their own, you know, their their own culture and their own their own ways of working. The common threads that we see, are are specifically around change and and transformation Our, you know, change changing big organizations is really, really hard, and, It Stuart with with the exact leadership and and the vision for, for for for change and transformation. And, and and and I would say then, yeah, having having worked on more than a dozen, large transformation programs, I think most organizations underestimate the, the the impact an investment needed in in change management. So once they've set a vision and a course of direction, It's really all about the people in in the organization and and probably some of the more, yeah, some of the more challenging environments that we've, that we've worked in, are those where change management and the effort required there in investment required there has been, been been underestimated, And and what were successful, where we've where we've been working with them from the beginning is really rightsizing that, After understanding the impact of the the change that they want to make on the on the people in in the business, and, and then proactively managing that on an ongoing, on an ongoing basis.

Stuart Webb [00:06:06]:

So so so it so so the five mind is obviously better at Estimating some of those things. Where where does that where does that expertise come from?

Ben Dickie [00:06:14]:

It comes from the the the 2nd group of customers that I mentioned. So we we've we've now got over 2,000, leading independent Consultant and expert, really practitioners. So, you know, these are these are people who've been, successful and I had successful careers over, over the years that have have now decided to, yeah, decided to To set up their own business or or to become independent, and some of that's, I think being a, Having a fractional role or being able to support 1 or 2 or or more clients is is becoming more attractive to, to to people with expertise in, and Hivemind provides a, Hivemind provides an environment where All of our members are able to retain their own independence, so still free to go and win work outside of five mind and and continue supporting customers that they've worked with previously, but also have the opportunity then to work on, Projects and engagements as a as a collective where, where their their unique experience is, is valuable to One of our end clients, challenges and, and and issues. So we organize, yeah, we organize those experts In, yeah, in in communities of excellence, and, and then look to surface the, you know, the The the leading approaches and and also learn from, from from unsuccessful, unsuccessful interactions as well.

Stuart Webb [00:07:53]:

Yeah. It's those, it as, as as as I've often had to explain it to people when they turn around and ask, you know, so what What what is it that's different about somebody like you? And the answer is, you know, I've got the the the, the the story the war stories to tell, the scars that I can prove But that's not the way you do it. I've I've found a better way now.

Ben Dickie [00:08:13]:

Yeah. It's it's it's exactly that, Stuart. I think all of our, All of the practitioners in in in our communities have probably as many, as as many lessons learned from things that didn't quite go go to planning in their corporate career as as they have got, you know, awards and and stars for, For for for real successful, outcomes that they've achieved and and what we enable when we're taking our clients, The the end clients, the enterprise clients on a on a journey through, through change and transformation or over innovation Is, is is bringing to bear really all of that experience so that we can we can help them avoid, mistakes that that folks in our organization have have made in the past.

Stuart Webb [00:09:04]:

Yeah. Brilliant. Ben, I think you've got a, I'm just gonna pop it up now. I think there's a there's a there's a, a a valuable, piece of free advice or or Guidance, however you'd like to describe it, that I've just put on screen now, which is assess. Hivemindconsulting.com Forward slash transform. What do do you wanna just describe what that, that valuable offer is?

Ben Dickie [00:09:27]:

Sure. Yeah. It's I mean, it's it's Taking on the, yeah, taking the learnings and the insight from, our transformation and and change community. We we built a, sort of a short, maybe five 5 to 10 minute, online assessment that that looks at really looks at transformation readiness. So if you're either A bank to embark on a change in transformation program, or you're in the middle of 1, and it's not going as well as, as as well as it could. It's really just a, yeah, an an online diagnostic to get to, in in six Six core areas. What what might be the root cause of, the transformation program not going as smoothly as it could or or really just to make sure that you've got, You're considering the the core, yeah, the the core elements of transformation ahead of, ahead of getting started and making a big investment and and a big change in the business.

Stuart Webb [00:10:32]:

So so leading into that, is there a particular course or Book or or program or something which which which has led you to to understand how those elements are important to transformation and how to to Better do things as as you're advocating than than than more traditional consultancies might might make it.

Ben Dickie [00:10:55]:

It's a really it's a it's a really good question. The there's, there's huge amounts of, of literature On, on on transformation and change, and there's there's, yeah, lots of of frameworks and methods and and tools. And, I think probably one of the advantages that that Hivemind brings is that we, We we've got such a broad church of of, practitioners and specialists and experts, and so Webb we try not to make the clients fit the methodology and rather understand the client's environment and, and and look to leverage The right the right tools or, or or or methods. I I think the, you you you mentioned is there a is there a book or or a resource, and and One that we, one that we went through last year, actually, in there's there's a there's a book club for the practitioners in in in in your network. And one of the books that that was, that was in in the book club last year was Be More Pirate, Which, I don't know if you've if you've come across.

Stuart Webb [00:12:03]:

Come across that one. That's one to go on my list.

Ben Dickie [00:12:06]:

Really, really odd title, But, actually, a fascinating, a fascinating read and and kind of draws parallels between the, the the pirates of the, Well, the the famous pirates of the Caribbean and the Blackbeards and and how, they were really driving, and and there were there were, Yeah. Lasting impacts of, of of kind of pirate culture in, in in our society today. So, The the real strong message that comes out in in that in that book is how, yeah, smaller focused Groups of, of people working together can can five, you know, a a much can have a really significant impact, and and that's our, Yeah. On unwittingly or knowingly kind of call to how we work at Hivemind having having small groups of, of really dedicated and committed people Working together to achieve really big things.

Stuart Webb [00:13:06]:

And is it absolutely critical that every single one of those persons has a, pirate, a a a patch, And a a peg leg to go with it, Ben, or is now are those now optionals in the pirate world?

Ben Dickie [00:13:18]:

Yeah. It's a so totally optional. And No. No. Good to know.

Stuart Webb [00:13:22]:

Good to know.

Ben Dickie [00:13:23]:

No pirate nicknames are given out. It's a yeah. But yeah. So I Personally recommend having a, having a read of that if, if if you five, like

Stuart Webb [00:13:35]:

It's it's it's on the list. I will go and look at my, My hat and, and my hat and immediately see what I can do about it.

Ben Dickie [00:13:43]:

I mean,

Stuart Webb [00:13:43]:

we you we're kinda coming towards the end, Ben, so there must be 1 question that you're currently thinking, I wish he'd asked me about, such and such. And so this is the bit where I sit back and go, well, you can do the work for once in your life. So, What is the question that I should five asked you by now? And, obviously, once you have, given me what the question is, you will obviously need to answer it. So What's the question you want to, you want me to ask you? And then please give us the answer to it anyway.

Ben Dickie [00:14:13]:

Okay. I think for, yeah, for, I think for for me, The question on where we where we would be how you know, how how how can we how can people get started working with Highfines, and and what's the most what's part of the most valuable work that we do? And I'd say, really, it's it's helping organizations create their, their their future vision. So considering where they are and, and and really working working with an external organization on, On on, yeah, tapping into the knowledge and experience that they've got across their senior executives, Setting a, setting a really strong vision up for changing or transforming the organization is is is probably the most important, Activity to undertake to ensure ensure success, and and it's something that we've, you know, we've we've we've got Really, really strong practitioners. Lots of really great experience in in doing and achieving, and, from from midsize organizations right way through to, to FTSE 100, businesses. And I and I think very, very much along the the the theme of, of of the pirate book with a, you know, with a with a really small initial team and small initial investment, that's the that's the starting starting point to to to kicking off successful change and and transformation.

Stuart Webb [00:15:45]:

Ben, that's absolutely brilliant. Thank you so much for your time today. Just point people back to that, free assessment, which is, assess.hypemindconsulting.comforward/transformone. And and if you'd like to get on to the mailing list to hear over, brilliant speakers, I I send an email letting people know Who's coming up and and and and so that you can prepare and and get ready to ask questions on the on the live chat? Get on to that list by going to link dotthecompleteapproach.co.ukforward/newsletter. That's a link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk forward slash newsletter, and, and we'll see you at another one of these in a few days' time. Ben, I really appreciate, you spending a few minutes with us now. Thank you so much for spending some of your I know it's valuable time because you're a busy guy. I really appreciate you coming on and telling us a bit more about the hive mind.

Ben Dickie [00:16:42]:

No problem

An interview with Joanne Wurpillot of Integra HR.  

We talk about her journey from marine biologist to HR consultant.   Integra HR provides 360° problem-busting support, from recruitment to employee exit but also offer the benefits of a complete value-adding service: protecting your business, helping to create the best HR structures that will make consistent, positive people management easier for you and your team, as well as the tools to maximise your people power.  

Integra HR can support you by dipping in an out of your business as needed, working by the hour, half-day, day or project-based. Integra HR can be your on tap HR department or we can give an extra helping hand to your existing HR team.   

Contact Integra HR at https://www.integrahr.co.uk/

Jessica is  an experienced Digital Manager with a demonstrated history of working in the entertainment industry and with SMEs. We're going to spend a few minutes de-mystifying the world of SEO and PPc and Social Media.

You can read more about Jessica at https://logicdigital.co.uk/

Who is Sneha?

Sneha Mandala started her career with high hopes and determination to succeed. She joined her first job with a mindset to give her all and perform at her best, aiming to see where it would take her in her career. However, as time passed, her enthusiasm and engagement dwindled, reflecting a common struggle many employees face. Sneha's story serves as a reminder of the importance of maintaining passion and drive in the workplace to avoid the negative impact on businesses.

Key Takeaways

00:00 Businesses struggle with workforce productivity and engagement.

06:19 Seek joy and flow at work, succeed.

10:28 We spend 100000 hours at work lifetime.

11:44 Praise for Sneha and invitation to join mailing list.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

https://www.linkedin.com/in/snehamandala/

A video version of this podcast is also at

https://youtube.com/live/xVziTz9lpB0

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Sneha Mandala, TEDx keynote speaker, coach, adviser, employee engagement, work culture, flow state, suboptimally, CEOs, workforce productivity, engagement levels, HR department, Band Aid fixes, happiness, satisfaction, engagement surveys, flow state, Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi, Steven Kotler, peak performance, corporate setting, 5th question, work culture, work enjoyment, effortless work, mailing list, podcast, work culture transformation.

SPEAKERS

Sneha Mandala, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:22]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science five questions over coffee. I haven't actually got in front of me. This is a lemon tea. Sneha, I believe you've got something in front of you at the moment. So, Sneha, welcome to It's Not Rocket Science. Five questions over coffee.

Sneha Mandala [00:00:38]:

Thank you so much for the opportunity.

Stuart Webb [00:00:40]:

Sneha is a TEDx keynote speaker. She is A, coach and adviser on, employee engagement, work culture, and she, works with people to get them into a great flow state as part of their work. So, Sneha, welcome to the podcast. We're looking forward to hearing what you've got to say.

Sneha Mandala [00:01:01]:

Thank you so much, Stuart. I'm sure this is gonna be a fun conversation.

Stuart Webb [00:01:06]:

So so I I mentioned then the sort of The the sort of problems that people have getting into a sort of their state at work. What are the issues that you see with people when they are working, Suboptimally, and CEOs find that they don't have, optimal engagement from their from their people.

Sneha Mandala [00:01:25]:

Thank you. So think about this particular employee. Okay? Imagine an employee who who has just gotten started in their career. Now they're not signing up for that 1st job of the career thinking that they are doomed to fail. Right? They are thinking, I would love to give it my everything. I would like to give it my best. I would like to perform at my We can see where this is going to take me in my career. But, flash forward to a year or 2 in, You don't see the same amount of enthusiasm and engagement in that employee, and this is where businesses suffer.

Sneha Mandala [00:02:01]:

They think they're hiring great people for these jobs, and then a few months in or a year in, they see the productivity lacking. They see engagement levels dropping, and that's what a lot of business owners and CEOs are worried about. We thought we are we were hiring all stars, And now they are on the verge of leaving. And worse, if they're not leaving, they're just coasting here at work. Studies show that, The American workforce on average spends less than 4 hours productive being productive, during a workday, which is just astonishing. Yes. So those are the challenges that businesses are currently facing. You have on one side a leader that wants extraordinary results but is not getting them through the workforce.

Sneha Mandala [00:02:54]:

On the other hand, you have an employee who is feeling dull, exhausted, not very engaged at work. And everything I talk about is how do we make sure that these 2 things are occurring harmoniously at at work. Mhmm.

Stuart Webb [00:03:11]:

So so what are the things that CEOs are trying to do to get that back which are which are not working?

Sneha Mandala [00:03:19]:

Yes. So one of the things that CEOs typically tend to do is they go to their HR department and they say, hey. We would like to increase our engagement levels. We wanna keep our Employees happier, and more satisfied. And what the HR department, comes up with is, sure. Let's Have over Tuesdays and free pizza Fridays or five, ping pong tables in in, lunchrooms. And somehow they would think that, the dissatisfied and disengaged employees would magically become a 100% engaged at work. And the problem is They don't.

Sneha Mandala [00:03:54]:

These are simply Band Aid fixes that help in the short term, but not in the long term. So if I'm an employee and I'm dissatisfied, I see, you know, free pizza Friday, and that's gonna momentarily make me feel, oh, Okay. This place has its own perks, but the moment, a shiny new object passes by so in a another words, A recruiter with a better package, tries to post them, they are ready to jump ship like that. So I like to compare this, with relationships. So trying to keep your employees happy and satisfied using these Band Aid fixes is like dating. But what we are really looking for is not dating. We're looking to put a ring on the finger. We're looking to get them feel committed and engaged to the larger organizational No goals here.

Sneha Mandala [00:04:46]:

So when I work with CEOs, I clearly distinguish that, hey. We're not looking to make them happy and satisfied Because that's not going to, contribute to productivity. That's not going to contribute to create them being creative and innovative and, More, raising the bar at work. We are looking to get them feel more engaged and committed to, to understand what their personal goals are and how they connect to the larger organization picture. And that's when leaders are just five they stop Dead in their tracks, and they're like, what? Were we thinking about the wrong thing all this while? Were we measuring the wrong things all this time. So, for example, when they implement engagement surveys, they're really measuring happiness and satisfaction and not really engagement. So, that self awareness, I feel, is the 1st step to going down in the right direction towards building that higher performance and engagement and employees, And that's the moment for leaders.

Stuart Webb [00:05:48]:

And is there a one piece of advice or valuable offer you can give people to really sort of help them get message?

Sneha Mandala [00:05:56]:

Absolutely. And I have this message both for employees as well as leaders. So Think about this. If you are spending all of these hours, we spend more time at work than we spend with ourselves or with our loved ones. And those are all the hours that you could be smiling. You could be engaged. You could be passionate. You could be committed at work.

Sneha Mandala [00:06:19]:

And, Unfortunately, that's not the case for many employees and in many businesses. So the one piece of advice that I would love to give to leaders as well as employees is that, when you can feel alive at work, why not chase that feeling? When you can make your work Feel not like work. Make your work feel more effortless. Why not chase that? And that is where the whole concept of flow state comes into picture. A flow Stuart, as described by a positive psychologist, is A point in time where you are your mind and your body are performing at their optimal levels because you're so engrossed In what you're doing, your attention as it's is at its peak. Your performance and your creativity levels are at their peak. So this Stuart is the only time when an individual can perform in the highest possible manner While their stress levels are the lowest, isn't that what we all want, that work to be producing amazing results while not burning out. That's what employees want.

Sneha Mandala [00:07:31]:

That's what leaders want. So how do you create the conditions of flow at work? Work. Employees do things. Look for things that you five to do at work And try as much as possible, try to do them in the way you love to do them. Add more drive to your work. Do more of the things that you love to do and add more authenticity at work. Try to do them as much as you can in the way you love to do it in your most natural state. And that is the exact same advice that I would love to give leaders too.

Sneha Mandala [00:08:11]:

How well do you know your employees? How driven do they currently feel at work? How comfortable are they feeling in order to bring their whole selves, their authentic selves at work. And I'm not asking you to change jobs overnight. That's not what I'm asking you to do. But adding a little bit more and, more drive and authenticity to what people are already doing, that's gonna make a ton of difference. That's gonna help them get into that flow state more often, spend more time in it, and, hence, you get extraordinary business results and happy engaged employees.

Stuart Webb [00:08:46]:

Good advice. Is there a a book or a course that really sort of led you to understand, particularly, the this flow state that you're talking about?

Sneha Mandala [00:08:55]:

Absolutely. My, there are 2 gurus really that I follow in this space, Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi, who's considered the grandfather of flow. So he has a book called Flow. Definitely, it has all the foundations and the, neuroscience behind the flow state. I would Love to recommend this to your audience. And Mhmm. The other prominent figure in this field that I highly follow the work of is Steven Kotler. He has done amazing research and really addresses individuals who want to peak their performance while decreasing that those stress and burnout levels.

Sneha Mandala [00:09:33]:

All that I'm doing is taking, all of their research and their work and bringing it into a more corporate setting to help leaders and employees' experiences in everyday, work, really.

Stuart Webb [00:09:47]:

Brilliant. Stuart, that Webb we're we're coming towards the end of my, my 5 questions to you. And and the 5th question is the one that I often use to sort of, as as I say, Get out of jail five, and it's my opportunity to say there must be a question that you wish I had asked you by now already, and I haven't asked it. So I'm gonna ask you, What is the question that I should five asked? And then, obviously, you have to answer it because you're the only one here who can answer that question.

Sneha Mandala [00:10:12]:

Absolutely. The question I would love to be asked any day in any conversation is, what do People care about at work.

Stuart Webb [00:10:24]:

And what do people care about at work?

Sneha Mandala [00:10:28]:

You might think maybe it's their paycheck. Maybe it's connection, community. There's all sorts of different answers that, you know, you could get from different guests on your podcast for this question, but I would argue that in the basic terms, we spend Close to a 100000 hours at work in our lifetime. If you do the math of 40 hours per week on average, Close to a 100000 hours at work in a lifetime. That's equivalent to 11 years of your five. And no person It's thinking that, oh, I wish I spent these 11 years making as much money as possible or have as many connections as possible. No. What they're looking for is, I would love to enjoy and have fun In these 11 years of my life, that's what it really comes down to.

Sneha Mandala [00:11:29]:

What they really care about at their core level is For work to not feel like work, to work to be feeling like play, to work to feel like effortless.

Stuart Webb [00:11:40]:

Yeah. Yeah.

Sneha Mandala [00:11:42]:

That's what people care about.

Stuart Webb [00:11:44]:

That's brilliant, and I love the way that you put it. That's brilliant. Sneha, thank you so much spending a few minutes with us and for talking us through this stuff. I love what you're saying. Listen, everyone, if you would like to get on to the mailing list And hear about the upcoming talks that we've got with people such as Neha, please go to this link. That's h t p https colonforward/forward/link.thecompleteapproach.co.ukforward/newsletter. That's just a simple form. You just put this email address in.

Stuart Webb [00:12:17]:

You'll get onto the newsletter list, subscribe you to the podcast. You will get to see brilliant talks like this coming up. And if you've liked this, please like and subscribe and recommend it to Your friends and family. Sneha, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. Really appreciated the insights that you brought about how to get our work culture to be something more like that flow state that you so, advocate. Thank you so much.

Who is Edmund?

Edmund Bradford is a successful entrepreneur known for his expertise in online gaming and business consulting. With a degree from Warwick Business School, he has built a global client base, including prestigious universities and large corporations like Airbus. His work extends far beyond traditional business schools, as he conducts Middle East chat sessions and collaborates with diverse clients all over the world. Edmund's innovative approach and ability to work with complex international organizations have earned him a reputation as a highly sought-after consultant in the gaming and business industry.

Key Takeaways

00:00 Business schools and corporations face similar challenges.

05:28 Company teaches engineers profit through transformative game.

07:29 Deliberate practice crucial for learning; failure essential.

10:36 Misuse of strategy in business can mislead.

16:11 Debate on organization's values and stakeholder returns.

18:56 Ask about sustainability cup, involvement, and organizations.

21:30 Encouraging message about sustainability and business growth.

23:44 Announcing guest and expressing gratitude for event.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

www.market2Win.academy

A video version of this podcast is also at

https://youtube.com

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

sustainability, marketing, strategies, business schools, corporations, simulation games, university, competition, change management, leadership, consulting, SWOT analysis, deliberate practice, strategic planning, sustainable business, sustainability World Cup, education, training, workshops, postmortem analysis, leading change, force for good, innovation, adaptation, strategy execution, marketing plan, academic, corporate clients, economic strategy, profit generation, business sustainability

SPEAKERS

Edmund Bradford, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:21]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science 5 questions over coffee, which is what I have In front of me here, I hope my Edmund has got something similar. It's Edmund, well done. I'm delighted today to be joined by Edmund Bradford. Edmund is, a hugely experienced founder, owner, and managing director of Market two Win, which produces sales and marketing and sustainability games for university business schools and corporations. It's gonna be a fascinating conversation. Not only that, he's the author of Marketing Navigation, How to Keep Your Marketing Plan on Course To implementation success, which I think is gonna be brilliant. I'll put links to that in the show notes. He's a guest speaker at many universities, Teaching associate at Warwick University, great university in England, and a judge at the International Business Awards.

Stuart Webb [00:01:13]:

And I know he's gonna make mention of some other Judging and things that he's gonna be doing. So, Ed Edmund, welcome to It's Not Rocket Science five questions over coffee.

Edmund Bradford [00:01:24]:

Thank you, Stuart. It's a pleasure to be here with you.

Stuart Webb [00:01:27]:

I'm I'm really looking forward to this conversation. Edward, do you want to just start off by trying to Describe, you know, who it is that you're trying to reach with with not only the stuff you don't market to win, but also all of the the the the university and And business school stuff that you that you help students with.

Edmund Bradford [00:01:42]:

Yeah. Sure. It's, I'll I'll try and keep it quick because it's not easy, question to answer, actually. I just I should I should tell I should tell him an introduction. But I think we have 2 we have 2 broad, kind of ideal clients if you like. So, One is on the academic side, the education side. So those are those business schools that that you mentioned at the Stuart. University business schools, wherever they are around the world.

Edmund Bradford [00:02:05]:

So our games are online, so they don't have to be, you know, a brilliant business school Like Warwick, they could be anywhere in the world, and our clients are are all over the place. I'm doing a a Middle East chat, after you after you finish here. So, yeah, University Business School is one type of client. And then on the corporate side, yeah, I think sort of, you know, the the the big Corporations are also really good good client for us. Airbus is one of our clients as well. So that type of big, you know, complicated International organization is also a great a great client for us to to work with.

Stuart Webb [00:02:39]:

And and and the work you do with these, Challenges, these these these cups, they're they're they're ways of of helping people as well, aren't they? They're things that you you bring to To to to really sort of help challenge people to think more about what they're trying to do.

Edmund Bradford [00:02:55]:

Yeah. I think, the sort of challenges that they have, I think I think that it's interesting because the the the challenge is very similar. Whether you're a business school or a big corporation, you're both competing in a very, intense, marketplace. Business schools, even in the UK, business schools have lots of competition, especially, sort of master's level, especially MBA level. It it goes right down to to under undergraduate level as well, often competing on a on a global stage. And the same, of course, with with big corporations. We know we know they they live in highly competitive and and fast changing market. So The the kind of challenge they both share in a way is is, you know, how to get control of that and how to develop a kind of proactive strategy to to get through all that.

Edmund Bradford [00:03:44]:

So, and and my my work, if you like, whether it's, As, you know, doing the game stuff or or just standing up there and and doing a bit of training. It's often around helping them to get a a a growth strategy together That will help them. Well, they do it now if it's a corporation or help them do it in the future, if they're if they're a student at the at the university. So finding a way through that. Yeah.

Stuart Webb [00:04:08]:

Yeah. And so so what is it that that others are doing which which, you know, you find these approaches particularly with with things like market When I just put your website on the, on the screen for people to see, which is which is going across market to win coffee. Well, what is it You're finding that others are doing Webb where market to win, it does differently. What what what is it they try other people have tried before with which you're trying to sort of help them to get through?

Edmund Bradford [00:04:34]:

Yeah. I think, I mean, it's a it's a very good question. The I mean, the market, even my market, you know, if if I'm talking about developing, you know, strategies, it's a very crowded market. You know, they've got the big consultancies in there as well as, you know, individuals. And actually I mean, I I started Market Twin, 18 years ago, because, one of my big corporate clients at the time, we were doing some some strategy work with them, And we're doing the usual stuff of of coming in there, running a 2 day workshop with lots of, you know, lots of engineers and and over functions in the room. We'd produce, in this case, a marketing plan on a flip chart, you know, and then the we'd walk off, and I I know damn well that they're not gonna look at it for another 12 Until we have the next workshop. So I was I was thinking this, you know, this isn't right. And we actually went into a, a 2 day session with that with that Client Webb they actually it wasn't my session.

Edmund Bradford [00:05:28]:

It was another session run by another company, and they were teaching the engineers, how to understand profit. And what really made a difference was the fact they had a game, a little a little over simple table game that was used to help them learn profit, it was really transformative. The whole experience was transformative. And so I thought about that, and it's 18 years ago, that that what we need what I needed to do if I was going to help, You know, my clients understand, you know, the importance of of getting a business strategy, particularly an external market strategy right, is that, we needed to experience it a bit. And so we Webb developed a game, about 18 years ago, and we we started to to to to play with that. And and now the idea it's obviously evolved over over many many years, and so now the idea is is that we have teams of people playing this online game Against each other in a sort of a a fictionalized world, always based on a real industry, but we kind of gained it. And they they learn, you know, all the issues that you have to deal with as a, you know, as a chief marketing officer or as a CEO in in developing a successful and competitive strategy. So I think, And I think in a nutshell, you know, what what Webb do that others don't, it's the it's the game, and it and it gives them the the the skill, Not just the knowledge from reading books or attending lectures or going to training, but because we're practicing it, it gives you the practice Of of actually applying some of those those really good ideas.

Stuart Webb [00:06:54]:

Yeah. Deliberate practice.

Edmund Bradford [00:06:55]:

Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. And it's all in little cycles. You know? It's not it's not let's Let's read a book for 3 months and then execute for 3 months. It's about let's do that, you know, over you know, ideally, it could be a 2 day workshop, it could be if it's a university running it over over, you know, several weeks, during a during a semester. So, yeah, that that you know, learn it, practice it, learn it, practice it continuously over different decision rounds. Hopefully, at the end of it, everybody comes out with a bit more, bit more, you know, a bit better competence in the area and and, You know, with a bit of, enjoyment of the actual process as well.

Stuart Webb [00:07:29]:

Yeah. No. I absolutely agree. I think the the the act of practice, deliberate practice, I mean, it's it's a huge element of of learning, isn't it? Too many people learn by doing, and we don't give them enough opportunity to learn in Safeway in a safe an environment where failure is actually part of the learning process. I mean, I I often say to people I work with, clients of mine, You know, babies don't learn to walk by standing there and going, right now, I need to Stuart running. They fall on their bottoms several times. And as you get up from that, you think, well, that's not the way to do it. You know, the great quote of Edison, you know, on one of his experiments, it's failed when, you know, he started scribbling notes.

Stuart Webb [00:08:08]:

His assistant said to him, well, why are you talking about that? It was a failure. He said, yes. But if I wanna do that again, I now know how to do it. And that's a great example Sort of learning by doing something and and not necessarily getting it right, but saying, well, now I know what not to do Webb I know what to do different next time. Learning by doing is a huge Yeah. And

Edmund Bradford [00:08:26]:

I I I totally agree, Stuart. And and and I I sometimes learn it. You know, even in my own experience, when from looking at others, you learn more from failures When you do few successes. And and I know I know the world is full of, you know, examples of successful companies. You know, Apple is is is always mentioned, you You know, in marketing courses. But but I find that the companies that have failed, you know, the of this world, you know, the the Something that's sort of gone from success to failure very quick. I find that very fascinating. And how did that how did that happen, and what went wrong? And we can we can learn more from that, like a postmortem.

Edmund Bradford [00:09:02]:

There's a there's a great article on the Harvard Business Review about doing a a postmortem on a on a project. And we learn more from that postmortem Than we do on actually just just, you know, exploring successful companies. Because often, you know, I come five Apple. It's got the budget. It's got the experience. It's got the skills already there that we don't five, so maybe we can learn learn from looking at looking at failures.

Stuart Webb [00:09:23]:

Yeah. I I I I love your your your your idea of the the postmortem, I often I often think that we don't spend nearly enough time looking at those postmortems and learning from them, though. Too too many times people find that sort of, you know, Do the postmortem. Stick it on the shelf in a report. Never look at it again in the same way they don't look at their strategy ever again. It's a document written. I I like sometimes sort of encouraging people to do the what I call the premortem

Edmund Bradford [00:09:47]:

Yes. Which is,

Stuart Webb [00:09:47]:

you know, think about what could possibly go wrong Yes. Right now to avoid doing that. Know? Yes. Let's let's do the postmortem upfront. This has all gone horribly wrong. Right? Now let's find a way of not doing any of that. Yes.

Edmund Bradford [00:09:57]:

That's right. And I think that was that was the the the point behind the article I mentioned, I think, as well. They did. I think they looked at I think they looked at NASA and what went wrong with the with the Challenger, shuttle. And, yeah, and and And as as you know from reading the article, the issue is often about the culture in the organization, and the fact that the culture does not allow Webb know this in the UK. We see it in the post office. We see it in the NHS. The The culture doesn't allow, you know, criticism, whistle blowing.

Edmund Bradford [00:10:23]:

Yeah? It's five, no. So that's not that's not right. You know? It doesn't fit doesn't fit our thinking. So, yeah, so often the pre mortem is that is that idea of saying, well, you know, let's assume assume things go Webb, alright, what that look five, and what would what would bad look five? Yeah?

Stuart Webb [00:10:36]:

Yeah.

Edmund Bradford [00:10:36]:

And and then and then putting that back into back into back into your thinking. So, yeah, I mean, you know, there there's lots of different corners and angles and Those are aspects of of strategy, and and and I find the thing I found and it it probably I it probably intrigued a few years ago for me, Stuart. Haven't been in the business about 30 years. It only took me a few years a few years ago that that the job with strategy is it is is it's the most misused word in business. You you can add the word strategy to anything and think you've done it. So so I can have a pricing by putting the word strategy on the end of it. I can have a promotion strategy. I can have a Facebook strategy.

Edmund Bradford [00:11:15]:

I can have a digital a social media strategy. You know? Can have anything, any Stuart, by putting the word at the end of it, and and, therefore, I think, therefore, that I'm strategic. But the, the research has shown, actually, that that, Particularly, you know, marketers are are actually not very good at this at being strategic. And and worse than that, they don't know they're not very good. That's that's the problem.

Stuart Webb [00:11:37]:

I'm not gonna comment on those of us that haven't yet managed to work out that we are not quite as good as we think we are or indeed we're actually so stupid that we can't work out How good we are or not good at something, we'll leave that to, to politicians. So so so, Edmund, is there a there is there a valuable free gift you can leave people? I mean, obviously, we can go to market to win and learn a little bit more about what you're up to. But is there anything there that you can sort Point us to, which would be a a a great way of getting value from this idea of of approaching things with with a learning head on and the practice to go with it.

Edmund Bradford [00:12:12]:

Yep. Sure. There's 2 there's 2 2 places you can go to. So first of all, yeah, the market to win .com website's really good, if I don't say so myself. Webb are we are starting well, we are starting. What's interesting there is that we are starting a new Competition, in sustainability, which we haven't really talked about yet, but in sustainability. And I think sustainability has got a fascinating impact on strategy. And and, if you wanna participate in that competition, it's called the Sustainability World Cup.

Edmund Bradford [00:12:45]:

Just go to the Market2win Webb, go to our simulations menu, and you'll see the Sustainability World Cup under the simulations menu there. So, so go there. Have a look at that. Get in contact with us if you're interested in participating because that's gonna be running, from April, over few weeks. It's a really good opportunity for for you to Learn some of these these ideas. So that's that's option number 1. And option number 2, we actually have an academy site, Webb we we we put, you know, lots of videos and tutorials, etcetera, on there. And there's a couple of good free ones on there.

Edmund Bradford [00:13:20]:

So if you if you go also to www.market to win.academy, okay, which is a different website, then you'll see some interesting, you know, videos that we've done, on on different aspects of of strategy as well. Okay? So if you sign you just sign in for five, and and some of those tools are really good. Five, for example, we've got a really good Video on on how to do a good SWOT analysis, you know, which is always done badly Webb I when I look at them. So here there's a good video there, You know, your next swatch should be a better swatch than your your last swatch after watching that that that particular video.

Stuart Webb [00:13:56]:

I've I've Stuart my link on On there, which is www.market to win.academy.

Edmund Bradford [00:14:02]:

That's it. Thank you.

Stuart Webb [00:14:03]:

And, thoroughly suggest you go and check some of that because I know I've gone and looked at that, See, looked at the Sustainability Cup, which I hope we might get an opportunity to talk about if I if I if I come to a question in a minute where I ask You sort of, ask a question I shouldn't have asked. There's an opportunity for you, Edmund. Anyway, let's not let's not leap ahead. Obviously, you've you you're an author yourself. You've written a book. Are there any other Books or courses or anything else you think, people should be using as their inspiration for practicing in a safe way their strategies before they put them

Edmund Bradford [00:14:37]:

Yeah. I think, I mean, I'll I'll recommend a few. I think on the, on the sort of marketing side, should we say, There's there's this one, alright, which is which is this sort of bible. Yeah. That's Mark The Marketing Plans book. Okay. So that's by Professor Malcolm McDonald And Hugh Wilson. Alright.

Edmund Bradford [00:14:56]:

So that's that's a really good book in terms of how to write a marketing plan, a strategic marketing plan. That's the one that we mentioned at the Stuart, my one, if I if I can plug it on the execution side. Yeah. So that's how to execute your plan. So those 2 books together, Yeah. It's all about, you know, how to how to think about strategy, write it in a good plan, and and execute it.

Stuart Webb [00:15:17]:

And then do it.

Edmund Bradford [00:15:18]:

And do it. Yeah. And then the final one I'm gonna I'm gonna mention in terms of sort of the strategy stuff, which is which is more on the sustainability side. And, this is one that that that you can tell because I've got lots of, Post it notes in there. So Webb well read. That one's brilliant. I mean, that's about, you know, it's called Reimagine Capitalism, How Business Can Save the World, And it's it's trying to get to that sweet spot, which which we do in the the new Sustain to Win Simulation, which is about, you know, how do we Have a company that that, yeah, generates profits for shareholders, but is also a force for good in the world. Yeah.

Edmund Bradford [00:15:57]:

Very good. Rebecca Rebecca Henderson, professor Henderson, She's done a really good job of of of of talking about how that that can can be done. So those you know, if you if you wanna you know, 3 recommendations there, That that's that's those are really good books.

Stuart Webb [00:16:11]:

Obviously, we could spend the the the next 20 years debating how to make your your your You your organization, both a force for good and yet still return value to stakeholders. But let's, let's gloss over that, Before we get too deep in it, because I think that is a fascinating subject. I know it's a subject of many MBA theses in the past, some of which I'm sure you've been subjected to unless you've, unless you've managed to find your way out of that. So let's let's get on to our 4th question before we we get too deep, and I'd five to Spend more time talking about that one. But but is there a is there a a a a a question I haven't yet asked you? Is there something I haven't yet Sort of come to you and sort of said this is this is the killer question. If I was to give you the opportunity to what ask what that killer question was it, what would it be? And then, obviously, once you've asked it, you will be the only person that we could possibly turn to to answer it for.

Edmund Bradford [00:17:04]:

Yeah. I think I think the the question is what's the what's the hidden skill that you need to be a great leader, I would say. Yeah? For anyone that wants to be a great leader or whatever age you are. And I and I would say and I've been through all this myself, And and I and I was just very, very lucky in my early career, but it's catch with me all all through my life is is change. Yeah? Mhmm. If you whatever function you're in, whether it's finance, Law, you know, whatever you're doing, basically. Alright? Marketing, sustainability, whatever it is. If you wanna be successful in life, you have to Drive through change.

Edmund Bradford [00:17:37]:

And that doesn't mean to say that you need to be, you know, somebody upfront, an Elon Musk or Steve Jobs, anything like that. You know, Richard Branson, a famous A famous face. You you can lead change, as we used to call it in in my old days. You can lead from behind. Yeah? So the quiet you'd be do it quietly. So that is a that's a whole science, Stuart, of of of change. And, whatever you're doing, I think, you know, There's you're never too late to start reading up on that on that particular subject. My final book, nothing to do with me.

Edmund Bradford [00:18:08]:

Final book, I would say, you know, a good place to start is that That man there, John P. Kotter. That I probably don't have his latest book. That's probably an older version. But Leading Change by there we go. Try to get it on the slide. Leading Change by, on the screen, by John P. Coffee.

Edmund Bradford [00:18:21]:

Just go to his website. Go look up Leading Change, John P. Cotter. I think it's, kotter.com or something? But, he's got some really good principles of how to how to lead change. And, You know, everything you do, whether it's in your business life, personal life, whether it's social life, whether you're working in a sports club, you know, Whatever you're doing, it's about it's about, you know, changing things, processes, people, behaviors, organizations. Yeah. And that That is, the that's something everybody needs to understand.

Stuart Webb [00:18:56]:

Edmund, we've we've reached the end of the 5 questions have a copy, but But one thing I'm burning to ask you about is so I'm gonna deviate from my from my normal 5 questions gonna ask you a 6th question. Can you please give us a little more detail on what the sustainability cup is? Just just once again, tell us Webb do we find details, what it is you're looking for in terms of, of people sort of getting involved in that, and then I'll I'll promise I'll let you go, before I start then down the the the the path of how do we make organizations, in this capitalist world be both a force for good and force for change.

Edmund Bradford [00:19:28]:

Yeah. And that's that that that subject, by the way, Stuart, is is is is one that is has a lot of research. More research is needed, and and, you know, there's a lot of discussion about it. Not that's not definitely a closed subject. Yeah. So the the Sustainability World Cup is a is a is a new competition that we're putting together. It uses our new Sustain two Win simulation. So it's game game based game based learning.

Edmund Bradford [00:19:53]:

And, what we're looking for is for teams just like the World Cup. We're looking for teams from around the world To participate in in the World Cup, we're gonna have some nice awards handed out at the end. We've got a five bunch of judges, Stuart lined up, I believe.

Stuart Webb [00:20:11]:

Good. I figured that's right. I figured some of them are excellent.

Edmund Bradford [00:20:14]:

Yeah. Some of them might some Some of their excellent judges. We've got a fantastic set of judges to to to to judge it, and it's it's really it's 2 thing. It's a course and a competition. So, it's it's about playing the game. And just like, you know, just like anyone that plays our games, they they they learn from playing the game, but also so that's a serious side. Alright. I was in that's that's the serious five.

Edmund Bradford [00:20:36]:

But the fun the fun bit is is that because it's a game, There's there's some nice nice awards at the end. And, you know, there's some some great you know, how good it would be, wouldn't it, if if if someone on this call Signed up to play the game and ended up being our sort of sustainability leader, sustainability champion of 2024. I mean, what what a great title to have on their their CV. So, yeah, so a chance to practice some of the ideas, you know, that that that we've been talking about today in a safe environment. Yeah. And to and to to get there, Yeah. Just go to the market2win.com Webb, www.marketwin.com. Not the academy one, so that's on the coffee one.

Edmund Bradford [00:21:13]:

And, look for the simulations menu along the top, and you you see on the drop down, it will say the Sustainability World Cup. Okay. And go there and, sign up or or just drop me a message, and we'll be delighted to send you more information.

Stuart Webb [00:21:30]:

Edwin, I'm looking forward enormously to seeing what comes out of that. I know there's gonna be a sort of a a bit of a social media push, over the next few, few weeks to really sort of launch this. I think it's great initiative. I mean, it's brilliant not only for people in universities, schoolchildren, but also, you know, those who are Currently starting out in business to start to get a team around them to think about these challenges and to really push forward with How do you make your business sustainable? Not only sustainable for an environmental and, a a positive impact upon the world, But how do you make it sustainable so that in years to come, it's not some, unchanged, unwill unwanted commercial organization, But it's something that learns to adapt, change, generate ideas, innovate, and and continue. I mean, the the The the the fact that we don't have enough organizations that have been surviving 3, 4, or 500 years because they have learned to adapt and change and be adaptable, sometimes sometimes surprises me because we we do tend to coffee too short term. So I really hope that people grasp hold of the Sustainability World Cup, Look at it as an opportunity to start rethinking how to make the organization both a force for good in their community, in with their stakeholders, as well as continue to be profitable for years to come. Edwin, I think it's been a brilliant conversation. Thank you so much for spending a few minutes.

Stuart Webb [00:22:58]:

I know you are so busy. You are gonna rush off now And be all over the rest of the world trying to do the same thing.

Edmund Bradford [00:23:04]:

Yeah. I'm putting into actually, yeah, putting into action, Stuart. Yeah. Putting into action with the classic I love that.

Stuart Webb [00:23:08]:

I love that.

Edmund Bradford [00:23:08]:

The classic dudes. Yeah.

Stuart Webb [00:23:10]:

Thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. I I really appreciate it. And, listen, just 1 last comment. If you would like to join the newsletter Get information about some of the brilliant people we have. We had a comment about, about the book that Edmund represent suggested. So if you wanna get on, make comments, ask questions of the guest, go to this address, which is, link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk Forward slash newsletter. That's link .completes.co.ukforward/newsletter. You will get, an email from me.

Stuart Webb [00:23:44]:

Very simple. Just sort of announcing what's going on, who the guest is gonna be. So you get the opportunity to join, live on LinkedIn and show that, show that you get regrets like this. I'm just gonna show, Annie Dunning It's just coffee to you. It's always such an education to work with you, Ed, at the University of Portsmouth. So you're you're making your way all the way Warwick University to Portsmouth University in the blink of an eye. Brilliantly done, Ed. Thank you, Annie.

Edmund Bradford [00:24:10]:

That's very nice. Nice to meet you, Annie.

Stuart Webb [00:24:12]:

Coming coming on and letting us know that Ed is a a decent chap, to work with as he appears. And with that, Ed, I'm gonna let you go. Thank you so much spending a few minutes with us. I'm just gonna play the outro, and, I look forward to speaking to you again very soon.

Edmund Bradford [00:24:26]:

My pleasure.

Who is Alfred?

Alfred Poor is a leading expert on the future of work and the impact of technology on business meetings. He is known for his research and insights on the increasing prevalence of online meetings, citing a report by the Gartner Group that predicted 75% of all business meetings would be held online. He emphasizes the convenience and accessibility of video meetings, particularly in the context of the pandemic. Alfred is dedicated to helping businesses adapt to these changes and thrive in the new work landscape.

Key Takeaways

00:00 Alfred Poor, health tech expert, discusses presentation capabilities.

04:16 Optimize camera angle and eye contact.

10:09 Project evolved to 75% solution for presentations.

12:00 Supporting new tech founders in pitching online.

14:35 Excited to be part of wonderful interviews.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

alfredpoor.com/video-meeting-blueprint

A video version of this podcast is also at

https://youtube.com/live/Np8ys9oIiRg?feature=share

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Alfred Poor, Health tech expert, Keynote speaker, 75% solution, Video meeting world, Technology, Presentation capabilities, Gartner Group, Online business meetings, Pandemic, Video meetings, Impressions, CEO, Executives, Zoom calls, Communication, Body language, Camera angle, Engaging, Intentional, Virtual events, Speaker skills, Presentations, Virtual presentations, Incremental improvements, Chief Technology Officers, Founders, Funding sources, Technology sectors, Startups, Passion.

SPEAKERS

Alfred Poor, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:22]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science, Five questions over coffee. I'm delighted to have a returning guest this afternoon, Alfred Port. Alfred is a health tech expert, a keynote speaker. He has So many talents. It's gonna be impossible to list them all today. So what we're gonna do is we're just going to allow him to explain His, his his his HealthBeat and his some his 75% solution, which is the solution he has got for those people who are currently Having to adapt to the video meeting world and how you can make best use of your technology to prove your presentation capabilities. So, Alfred, welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science five Questions Over Coffee.

Alfred Poor [00:01:07]:

Cheers to you. I'm so glad to be back.

Stuart Webb [00:01:11]:

I've got a I've got water in front of me at the moment because I probably have There's water

Alfred Poor [00:01:16]:

in here, but you can't tell.

Stuart Webb [00:01:19]:

Excellent. Alfred, I mean, you you I I introduced you there with the the 75 solution. Who who is the the solution aimed at? Who are you trying to help with this solution?

Alfred Poor [00:01:29]:

So the the the the key to that quest answer to that question is in the in the name. The 75% solution actually comes from a report by the Gartner Group. They came out with a report that predicted that for this year, 75% of all business meetings are going to be held online. That's internal and external. That's talking to investors, potential partners, customers, you know, staff, teams, management, whatever. And my whole point is that the pandemic gave us video meetings as a as a target of opportunity. It was easy to do. They're convenient, and and they don't take a lot of technical skill.

Alfred Poor [00:02:11]:

You just open up your laptop and have at it. My problem is that people aren't being intentional about how they present themselves in those settings. And if you're gonna be spending 75% of your meetings online, why wouldn't you want to make the most of that time? You're that's a huge investment of your time and money for your company. Why wouldn't you wanna maximize the benefit?

Stuart Webb [00:02:37]:

Brilliant question. And, you know, I look at so many people who are currently taking those. I I spoke to 1 executive who, Being being female had gone out and equipped herself with an entirely new wardrobe in order to make sure that she was presenting her best self on video, something which I have never considered myself. So, you know, what do you find in the people that are making those mistakes who who who don't try to maximize their their their best time and their best, best view when it comes to video meetings.

Alfred Poor [00:03:08]:

I I for me, the keyword is intention. Yeah. I don't think they're doing it intentionally, and that's the whole point. They're not intentional about the impression they make.

Stuart Webb [00:03:18]:

No. It's it's they're not talking

Alfred Poor [00:03:20]:

to people. Is We've all met CEOs and and executives and founders who you bring them into a boardroom for a presentation and they're just amazing. You put them up on stage and they just kill it. You know? Just audiences in their hand. You put them on a Zoom call, and it looks like they've joined witness protection. You know? They're just I don't think that they stop and think about whether or not what's coming through actually represents their brand, their company, Their their professional and personal image, and it's so easy to do it better. And Yeah. I would argue that when you do do it better, people notice.

Stuart Webb [00:04:02]:

Yeah. So it's that, It's that laptop on the desk with the view sort of strangely up the up the face, isn't it? It's the it's the poor, like yeah. That one. The that's the poor view.

Alfred Poor [00:04:16]:

I mean, you know, I I've yet to find anybody where the up and nose looking at the ceiling camera angle is is flattering. You know, when you look like this, it's more engaging. It's you know, people will be able to pay more attention to you and be making contact with him, you know, eye contact. There's a whole lot of pieces that go into it. But, you know, basically, You need to get your camera up so it's about eye level. You need to look at the camera, and you need to show more. You don't wanna just be this disembodied head because then you don't get the hand motions. You don't get the the body language.

Alfred Poor [00:04:54]:

You know, there's a whole lot missing in your communication, which which we count on.

Stuart Webb [00:04:59]:

Yeah. Absolutely. I'll find I and and and that's another great tip that you just sort of gave us there with the With old camera, isn't it? Because, you know, I'm now currently looking at you. The camera is actually above my screen. I have to consciously shift my gaze to a camera and not stare at the screen because otherwise, it looks as if I'm looking down. And it's a ridiculous it it just doesn't look right, does it? But If

Alfred Poor [00:05:24]:

somebody if you were in a conversation with somebody at an event or a meeting or whatever, and they were looking down like that and not at you, what would you think?

Stuart Webb [00:05:32]:

Yeah.

Alfred Poor [00:05:33]:

Yeah. Are they are they, you know, withdrawn or, you know, total paralyzed by by Introversion. I mean, you know, what what's going on with them? Why why aren't they looking at me? Now here's a if you want a quick, Almost no cost tip. To solve that, go to the your local store, gift shop, or whatever and get a pair of those little googly eyes that you can, you can stick onto anything, Stuart stick them up next to your camera. It'll give you eyes to look at and it'll make it much easier for you to to focus on the camera.

Stuart Webb [00:06:11]:

Great tip. I love it. Now I know you've got a you've got a valuable free offer it, I'm gonna just display this on the screen now. Tell us, what's on your valuable free offer? What is this thing that you can want Webb to do do with the with our video meetings?

Alfred Poor [00:06:24]:

So I tried to go through and create as comprehensive a list of the different factors that go into how to be more engaging, more influential, in your online meetings and presentations, and I laid them all out in what I call my video blueprint. So if you can go through and check all the boxes in that video blueprint, you're gonna end up having a much better presentation. You're gonna make a much better impression in in the course of it. This is this is my gift to your listeners.

Stuart Webb [00:06:56]:

So do you wanna just, read out what it says, on on the on the ticket going across the bottom of the screen so that you've got it for those people who are listening back and that haven't at the moment

Alfred Poor [00:07:07]:

See Alright. Just take us through

Stuart Webb [00:07:08]:

what we've got here. It's alphreypore.com

Alfred Poor [00:07:10]:

Yep.

Stuart Webb [00:07:11]:

Forward slash.

Alfred Poor [00:07:12]:

Alfred pore alphreypore.com/ video meeting blueprint. So it's video meeting.blueprint not dash blueprint. And alphore.com, nice and easy to remember that part.

Stuart Webb [00:07:27]:

Yeah. I I encourage you to go see that, and I will put this in the notes. It's alphore.com / video meeting blueprint. Dashes in between the the gaps where I pause there. So so go down go download. What what is this is just a series of tips and tricks that you can use that that ensures that you you get the very best out the 75% of the meetings you're currently gonna be having online

Alfred Poor [00:07:51]:

Right. I actually, I would say it's more A checklist for you to be intentional about.

Stuart Webb [00:07:59]:

Yeah. Okay.

Alfred Poor [00:07:59]:

You don't know what you don't know? So This gives you a list of things, oh, I never thought about. You know, should I be wearing stripes when I'm, you know, you know, finely striped clothes when I'm on camera? Probably not. But, you know, have you thought about what you're wearing? A lot of people just go on with what whatever they wear. When you well, first of all, this is my brand. So, but whenever you see me on on online on, you know, in a video setting, it's gonna be solid colors. It's gonna be In the blues and the grays for me, that's all by design. It's not it's not by accident. That's it's intentional.

Stuart Webb [00:08:38]:

I think that's a brilliant that's a great word you keep coming back to. That's the word intentional. You have to be intentional with these things, don't you? Barbara, was there a was it was was it this Gartner course, Gartner report, I mean, or anything else which really highlighted to you the importance of sort of Taking this step because I know that you're a you're a you're a really experienced speaker. Is is the world of speaking currently really being changed I I for this world.

Alfred Poor [00:09:04]:

Absolutely. I mean, this had its genesis years years ago. I've been doing virtual for probably 9 years now. I've done, you know, been a speaker at online conferences. I've produced my own online webinars and other events. I've produced, you know, online series of Presentations by other speakers. I actually produced a series of online trade shows about, for consumer electronics companies. So, and this was all pre pandemic, so, you know, I didn't jump to this because of the pandemic.

Alfred Poor [00:09:42]:

I already had these skills in my in in my kit bag, as you would. But so when the pandemic hit, I saw these other speakers saying, you know, all my on-site Gigs have been canceled. So I started doing workshops for them, showing them some of the key points about what you need to do to trans Trans transition between online, you know, on-site to online presentations.

Stuart Webb [00:10:08]:

Yep.

Alfred Poor [00:10:09]:

Yep. In doing that, it was very very well received, but in doing that, I realized I had a ton more than would fit in a 45 minute presentation. And So the project went through a number of different iterations and now exists as this 75% solution in which is intended to give found give executives and and teams the skills they need Starting wherever they they happen to be with whatever budget and skills and knowledge they have, what they can do to to make a better impression. I I follow what I call my, principle of the three i's for making improvements. Webb can make improvements, and this is beyond just presentations, but it Stuart that's how I came up with it, you want to make, improvements that are incremental. Don't try to do everything at once. Webb wanna make them intentional. There's the intentional again.

Alfred Poor [00:11:04]:

Don't just accept the default settings. And you wanna make them impactful. You wanna choose the ones that are gonna have the biggest impact. And so when I work with a client, I've helped them. It's not a course. It's not some series of things that they have to work through. I work with them custom and find the one thing that's gonna make the biggest difference for them, and we get that working. And then I find the next thing and the next thing and so forth.

Alfred Poor [00:11:29]:

And so it's continuous improvement and just gets better and better.

Stuart Webb [00:11:33]:

I love it. Alfred, I've I've asked you questions, and, you've answered them, but there must be 1 question that you're currently thinking. I wish you'd get around to asking because that's one that really sort of knows it. So what's the question that you're wishing I could ask? And, and then, obviously, asked the question you need to answer.

Alfred Poor [00:11:50]:

Well, I think it is, where's the passion come from for this project.

Stuart Webb [00:11:57]:

I like the question. I love the question.

Alfred Poor [00:12:00]:

And and for me, I've been working doing a lot of work with Stuart ups Because having worked with technology for as long as I have, I've been very excited to see the New companies coming along, the founders with their great ideas and how they wanna solve big problems with them. And the problem is that most of these founders are now having to make their pitches online, And this is life or death for their for their project. If they don't get the funding, and right now, funding is very tough for a lot of technology sectors. If they don't get the funding, that's you know, that could be the end of the dream. And so One of one of the motives behind the the 75% solution is to include founders in this, the ones who are just getting started. Help them think about the things that they hadn't thought about and so that they can be more effective when they're talking to funding sources because, you know, again, for them, it matters the most.

Stuart Webb [00:13:07]:

I love that. I love that. Alfred, as ever, it is brilliant to, to hear your views on things. You have some absolute gems of thoughts, And I love the fact that you bring passion to this, and you bring the the passion to help founders, people who who really have got to nail this and get it right in order to be able to get their company off the ground. I love I love the fact that you do that. I'm just gonna make an appeal at this point. If you are listening to this on replay or if you want Stuart, to To join the LinkedIn lines that we do on a regular basis, please, would you go to this, this link, which is a link .thecompleteapproach.co.uk forward slash newsletter. If you go to that URL, you will find a form that you can fill out.

Stuart Webb [00:13:55]:

Get you onto the newsletter list, and then we can keep you informed of who's coming up on these, weekly, Meetings and join and see the brilliant ideas that come through. There are so many brilliant ideas. Please come on. Please join that newsletter list and see brilliant people like Alfred Poor. And I encourage you, go to Alfred Poor's, website, afripoor.com forward slash video meeting blueprint. Download that blueprint, and make sure that you get a hold of his intentional things that you need to think about for your video meetings in the future. Alfred, I hope that was good, as good a summary as you're gonna get from anybody.

Alfred Poor [00:14:35]:

The best. The best. And I I just wanna underscore to to the audience that, you know, this is your Interviews are just great. You somehow managed to bring wonderful people and I'm actually honored to be part of that, and actually having to having get the opportunity to do it more than once. So, you know

Stuart Webb [00:14:56]:

You're very kind. You're very kind. I look forward to the next time we meet on a video call and, and and chat. But for now, everyone, thank you very much for joining us. I look forward to seeing you again next Time on, It's Not Rocket Science, 5 questions of a coffee. you.

Who is Jacqueline?

Jacqeline Conway is a successful marketing strategist who understands the struggle of feeling stuck in a professional rut. After her own experience of hitting a plateau in her career, she decided to use her knowledge and expertise to help others in similar situations with Conway Consulting. Through seminars and events, they empower individuals to set new goals and find their direction again. Jacqeline's passion for guiding others through professional challenges has made her a trusted mentor in the business community.

Key Takeaways

00:00 University, career, plateau, need direction, success, stuck.

03:54 Many seek mentorship, achieve impressive business success.

09:37 Transitioned from marketer to coaching business while pregnant.

11:33 Key to success is exceptional service for clients.

14:55 Business success is about serving your customers.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

https://conway.consulting/manifestwithconway

A video version of this podcast is also at

https://youtube.com/live/dhacjffgiG4

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software (and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Conway Consulting, Jacqueline Conway, brand strategist, marketing, music marketing, fashion marketing, search signature marketing, mentorship company, coaching, consulting, entrepreneurs, coaches, consultants, real estate, finance, insurance, professional services, plateau, goallessness, seminars, events, inspiration, personal development, manifest, masterpiece, sprint goal, workbook, challenge, service, entrepreneurship, inverted energy, mentorships.

SPEAKERS

Jacqueline Conway, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:20]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science five questions Over coffee. I'm delighted today, not only to have my coffee in front of me with, my bears on them, which are my my favorite bears in the world, But also to have Jacqueline Conway with me who is a marketer and brand strategist with Conway Consulting. She has a root a background in music and fashion marketing and has been working with comp clients through Coffee with their one day one sale a day club, bringing clients through their search signature marketing framework called The Brand Project. So, Jacqueline, Absolutely delighted to be here with you, and, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us this morning.

Jacqeline Conway [00:01:06]:

Well, thank you. Thank you for having me. I'm excited to chat about, business and helping people and all the things. So it's Really? Great day to start chatting.

Stuart Webb [00:01:15]:

So, let's start with, let's start with what you do with with Conway. What what is what is who is it you're trying to help, and and and what's the problem they've got that you're trying to help them to overcome?

Jacqeline Conway [00:01:25]:

Sure. Sure. Well, do you mind if I set the table first and just explain what Conway is? Because I'm sure it's a little vague at this point for everyone. So Call Me Consulting is a elite mentorship company. It's, coaching, consulting, events. We do lots of different things, but Webb, support clients through helping them achieve their goals. And my husband, Dave, is the kind of I don't know. We call him the what do we call him? There's a really good slang that my team member calls him.

Jacqeline Conway [00:01:52]:

He's the show that makes the dough, so to speak. So he's the speaker. He's the coach. And then I, you know, help lead all the operations and marketing and product endeavors behind the scenes. So it's kinda like this, like, unification of us together. Like, both of us kinda bring our expertise, to the table to, you know, to create a really amazing experience for our clients.

Stuart Webb [00:02:13]:

And and who are those clients? What what what's the problem you're helping solve?

Jacqeline Conway [00:02:16]:

Sure. Sure. So our clients that we work with are typically already in business. So they're either entrepreneurs. They're potentially sometimes coaches or consultants. Lots of times, there's people working in the real estate real estate industry or finance or insurance, different kind of professional services like that. And the issue is that they're stuck. So typically, what will happen in life is, you know, you You go to high school.

Jacqeline Conway [00:02:40]:

You maybe go to university. You get a pro you get a job. You start working in your career, and it's almost like you start to plateau sometimes. It's like You need that goal or that, like, north star to direct you. And where people sometimes fall down is that they kinda knock down all these big goals and then they Start going and earning money income, have Stuart a family maybe, and then they suddenly Stuart of hit this roadblock where they're, like, not growing in the same way that they were before. And so I find when we run our seminars and our events, that's a common thread. It's something we hear a lot. It's like I've I've got some success under my belt, But I'm just stuck.

Jacqeline Conway [00:03:14]:

I'm not feeling inspired anymore. I've lost a bit of motivation. I need I need something to sort of, like, fuel my My mind and get me get me thinking differently, open up different ideas for myself. That's really common. So, the biggest challenge is really, Like, as we say, Coffee, goallessness. Because if we don't have this, like, really exciting, direction that we're moving toward, we don't We don't have that motivation and inspiration to keep going.

Stuart Webb [00:03:43]:

And and and what are the the the the the the clients you work with? What five they tried Before the hasn't quite worked Yeah. The decision about what you're doing with them in Conway.

Jacqeline Conway [00:03:54]:

Yep. Good question. I would say, Like, lots of them have done over programs or mentorships, like maybe they've done some mindsets, you know, work before. Maybe they've read a lot of books or they've gone to seminars. And so it's not that they're not trying to kind of solve this problem, to, like, really fall in love with a goal or to really get clear on their purpose and Some of the deeper understandings about life for themselves, they are doing these things, but sometimes it just the penny hasn't dropped yet. And suddenly they come into our ecosystem, into our sphere, and they hear information in a whole new way, and suddenly it starts to land. And Truly, you know, not to brag, we do get some really amazing results coming out of our client base. Five, we've seen people come in that are making, you know, maybe 8,000, $10,000 a month in their business.

Jacqeline Conway [00:04:35]:

And Today, they're over half $1,000,000 a month. That's one client that's been with us for about 3 years. We've got somebody that had our a successful finance, Webb management firm and started working with Dave and did a one day seminar and made over 350,000 in a single seminar. You know, we're seeing these, like, this explosive growth, and those results are are common. Like, there's many stories I could share about this transformation. And I think it's just The delivery mechanism of how we present the material. So if you are trying to, like, improve improve your life, improve your business, Coffee that sense of, like, ownership and growth in yourself and you're typically going after that. Coming into Conway seems to just sort of speed that up.

Stuart Webb [00:05:18]:

That's brilliant. That's absolutely brilliant. And I know, you have got a, an offer which would help people to understand a little bit about So which I'm gonna put on screen now. Webb, Stuart talk to us about what this is, in terms of, a quiz, I understand.

Jacqeline Conway [00:05:35]:

Well, it's a 21 day challenge, and it's called well, we have manifest with Conway. It's a 21 day manifestation challenge. And the whole thing is predicated around going after what I what we like to call like a sprint goal. So for the next 21 days, you set, you know, like a challenge for yourself, and it's over personal experience. You don't have to share it with anybody and you choose it yourself. It could be I wanna land, you know, 10 clients in the next 21 days. It could be I wanna, like, Reboot my personal brand in the next 21 days. I want to revolutionize my health.

Jacqeline Conway [00:06:04]:

I mean, you could you could do whatever you want with it. And, so you select that. There's a beautiful workbook that'll help you do that. It has prompts. It helps you work through what that goal is gonna be for yourself. And again, it's not daunting. It's just 21 days. That's it.

Jacqeline Conway [00:06:16]:

And then we'll email you every single day for those 21 days to keep you accountable, remind you to to do the, you know, the challenge work that's included in the workbook. And it's just our gift to help people start to to get that goal and start to feel maybe some of that inspiration that they might be missing right now.

Stuart Webb [00:06:32]:

Sounds, yeah, sounds like something we should avoid doing, actually, to be honest. And, maybe maybe we'll we'll try and encourage a few more people to get on to the to the to the website and, and pick up, that challenge to try and push push through through that. And it sounds like you get some really great results.

Jacqeline Conway [00:06:49]:

That's right. Great results with this challenge. Even, you know, people that send us, you know, their their wins. Someone said that they had, like, Dropped, like, weight. Some like, some people use it for weight loss. Someone was saying that they landed x number of clients, even internally in our team, we used it for a particular launch as a team. We were five, let's use the 21 day sprint model to, like, help us, like, do this launch and then we had, like, the best results we ever had. Because what it does is it just starts to focus your mind to and then To the exclusion of noise.

Jacqeline Conway [00:07:23]:

You know? It's just like, okay, I'm really gonna go all in on this 21 day sprint for myself. And I'm gonna ignore any other Ideas that Five that are trying to pull at me right now. Because as you know, like, we can get distracted. Our focus can get pulled around. Right? And so what this does is it really helps you what we like to say, it's like five extra focus. It's like it helps you just 0 in on this, like, one thing that you really wanna accomplish and achieve, And it just takes all this powerful energy in your mind and focuses it. So that's what it'll help people do.

Stuart Webb [00:07:52]:

Love it. I love it. I encourage people to get on to conway.consulting, forward slash manifest with Coffee, and have a look at that challenge. Is there is there a a a book or program that sort of began to spark your interest in how to help people do this? Was there something which the original, original thing that that got you to this, I think you'd like to share with the audience.

Jacqeline Conway [00:08:15]:

Yeah. Sure. Well, you know, Dave and I have an interesting story. So, like, I used to work in music marketing. Dave used to actually be a carpenter. So we had very different five, about 6 years ago. And Dave was has always been interested in personal development and Read a lot of, like, Napoleon Hill's work and Earl Nightingale's, and Bob Proctor was his, like, all time favorite. And he Said to me in 2017, he's like, you need to come to we need to go to the seminar Webb in LA with Bob.

Jacqeline Conway [00:08:43]:

And me being sort of five the burnt out, tired mom, I was just five, like, you can go to the seminar. I'll come with you, but I'm just gonna go to the beach. You enjoy it, and then, like, we'll hang out at night. He's like, no. No. No. No. That's not how this works.

Jacqeline Conway [00:08:55]:

Like, We go to this together. And I was like, okay. Because I've always, you know, I've always been supportive. So we went to the seminar together with Bob, and we kinda mark that Seminar is, like, really the the date when our life really transformed. So that was the date when Dave decided to become coach, And I remember leaving that event and being just sort of, like, observant of my life at that point. It was almost like I was like, yeah. Why am I doing the things I'm doing? Why am I why am I, thinking I've got everything figured out when I Clearly don't. You know? It it was a very humbling experience, and it was also just, this opportunity to zoom out and really look at my life.

Jacqeline Conway [00:09:37]:

So one day we had the decision to become a coach, I'm a bit an event marketer, and so I said, well, I'll help you. I'll help you with your business. And here I am, you know, years later kind of running the company, but, I was like, I'll help you run, you know, seminars and workshops and, you know, I know that world. You know, I've been in events marketing world for over. So I I'll help you with that. And, you know, he was still working as a carpenter, and then we ran the seminar together. It was actually This the last day of my my very last day of my previous job was the 1st day of was the day of our 1st seminar, which is kind of poetic in a way. And, it was because I was pregnant.

Jacqeline Conway [00:10:12]:

I was going on maternity leave. So that was, like, my last day of work and that was our 1st seminar. And remember Dave tells the story really funny, but he's like, I installed a kitchen that day as a carpenter and I made $400. And then that night, I went and did a personal development talk, And I made $20,000. And, like, we sold 4 clients for $5,000, and that was, like, our first event. And so it was kinda like, wow. You know, there's A real opportunity here not only to help and serve people, but to earn the income that we want and to, you know, put all these amazing skills we have to work as well. So that was our very first event, Webb.

Jacqeline Conway [00:10:47]:

And now flash forward to today and, you know, we work with hundreds of clients. We've served thousands of people. We produce mastermind events all over North America called freedom mastermind and vision maker, and we do these amazing events for people. And, it all started because somebody asked us to just dream, which is really, really cool. So that's why we tell people to do the same thing. Just Start to think, start to dream again because you can let yourself go free for a little while and suddenly, like, a lot of magic can start to pour in.

Stuart Webb [00:11:18]:

I love the story. There must be a question at the moment that you're wondering why I haven't asked you. So so my 5th question to you is is what's the question I should by now have asked you? And, obviously, once you worked out what that question is, you really I'd really love you to answer it for.

Jacqeline Conway [00:11:33]:

Sure. Sure. I would say the question, An important question that any person can ask themselves in business is, well, what's the key to my success? Ask them to themselves, like, who I coffee is the key to my success. And if I was to ask myself that question, what has been the key to our success thus far and what I think will continue to be the key to our success is service. Always focusing on the service of others, helping them gain the knowledge and understanding of, What's what's holding them back? Five, that when I mentioned goallessness being one of the main things that holds people back a lot of the time. And I know that when we lean into this idea of providing exceptional service, excellence in service, just everything falls into place because It's really not about me or the founder. It's always about the clients. It's all about the people.

Jacqeline Conway [00:12:23]:

So we just always keep top of mind What is the best thing for our clients? What's the best experience we can possibly create? How can we surprise and delight people all the time? How can we make them feel seen and heard and appreciated and just put as much energy and effort into into them as we can. So that's what I feel are key to success is, but I think everyone should ask themselves that question.

Stuart Webb [00:12:46]:

Hi. It's a brilliant question to ask. Actually, I really love the idea of asking that question. What is this? And and so many businesses, I think, fail To do that, I I I, I've I've worked with a with a couple of business owners recently, and the first question I asked is, so So what is it that you do which is which is different to others? Why are you in the business? And when they don't give you an answer, you know that Somehow, there's not gonna be the sort of legs to really drive through to some scale, is it? Because people, if they don't have that passion, if they're not keen, if they don't really recognize What they're gonna do to sort of change the five of other people and how they're there to serve them. They can never ever make a success of what they're trying to do.

Jacqeline Conway [00:13:27]:

That's right. Well, a lot of problem a big problem in entrepreneurship is what we like to describe as, like, inverted energy, where people worry too much about themselves And they don't just release their passion and their and their service into the market because if you're struggling with something, if you're having if you're if you're, Five doubting or if you're, like, feeling fearful about I'm not making enough money this month, I'm not serving or I'm not the money's not coming in or something like that. That just means that you're just thinking about yourself. And if you were to go out and just start to serve others and release energy out into the market, the money will come in. It's just just how it works. You deliver service. The money comes in. Is it always to the direct five that you serve in? Not always.

Jacqeline Conway [00:14:08]:

That's always been our experience. Sometimes, honestly, this is kinda nuts, but We'll do workshops for thousands of people, and not very many people will sign up for mentorships. And then suddenly, 5 clients will just come out of the woodwork, Hi, elite clients, and we're like, well, this is very interesting. I mean, that's kind of funny, isn't it? And so We always look at those situations and we always analyze them and we're like, well, how come this didn't necessarily attract the people, but they still came anyway? So you always have to just look at Are you releasing energy? Are you just in service of people? Are you are you, inverting your energy? Or, you know, anytime we have fear, doubt, worry, That just means we've just entered into a state of almost five selfishness. And it's like, well, no. Just get out there and help somebody, and suddenly the problem will likely just go away.

Stuart Webb [00:14:55]:

Well, you hear it heard it here. You know, if you're not in business, to help others, if you're not thinking of your clients first, If you're not thinking what it is you're there to do to serve your customer, you are burning out, and, you need To rethink why you're in business, and I love that message. Jacqueline, I really I really love the energy you've given off today and the way that you put that. I think it's it's fantastic. Thank you so much for just spending a few minutes with us today talking about that. I am just gonna invite people. If, if there is, If you wanna get an email from me on a Monday, it goes out on Monday telling you who's coming up on the podcast on Tuesday so that you can prepare to To watch these brilliant show and catch up with past issues, please go on to our newsletter. That's at link dotthecompleteapproach.co.ukforward/newsletter.

Stuart Webb [00:15:49]:

That's link.thecompleteapproach.co.ukforward/newsletter, And and get yourself on that list so you too can hear brilliant people like Jacqueline come here and tell us about the wonderful things they're doing Jacqueline, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us.

Jacqeline Conway [00:16:05]:

Webb We

Stuart Webb [00:16:06]:

really appreciate the time you spent.

Jacqeline Conway [00:16:07]:

Thank you very much.

Stuart Webb [00:16:09]:

And, look, we'll we'll we'll we we'll keep in touch. We'll see what other things you're up to at Conway Consulting.

Jacqeline Conway [00:16:16]:

Sounds good. I love it.

Stuart Webb [00:16:17]:

Speak to you very soon.

Jacqeline Conway [00:16:19]:

Take care.

Who is Tiago?

Tiago Faria is a digital marketing expert who specializes in helping professionals in the help industry, such as coaches, mentors, and consultants, to achieve profound transformations and charge a premium for their services. His ideal clients are those who rely on passive word-of-mouth referrals and are seeking to expand their reach through digital marketing strategies. Tiago's mission is to alleviate the anxiety of starting fresh every month and help his clients establish a consistent online presence through daily content creation."

Key Takeaways

00:00 Ideal customers: help industry, focused on transformation, digital marketing.

05:38 Investing in ads without proven results problematic.

07:25 Focus on serving individuals to maximize satisfaction.

10:05 Marketing strategy focuses on leveraging existing assets.

15:30 Resolving issues and persevering with a mentor.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

https://tiagofaria.pt/calls

A video version of this podcast is also at

https://youtube.com/live/dhacjffgiG4

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

consultant, business mentor, coach, help industry, coaches, mentors, consultants, service providers, digital marketing, passive word-of-mouth referrals, consistency, marketing strategies, daily content, ad hoc freelancers, digital marketing courses, qualified leads, internet gurus, shiny objects, ideal customer, specific niche, proven offer, lifetime value, vision, outcome independent, accountability, focus, 80/20, distractions, networking, referral programs, proactive incentivizing, emotional words.

SPEAKERS

Tiago Faria, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:18]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science, 5 questions over coffee. I'm delighted today To be joined by Tiago Faria. I hope I pronounced that correctly, Tiago. I'm

Tiago Faria [00:00:29]:

sure you're correct here if

Stuart Webb [00:00:30]:

I'm wrong. We have in front of us our our drinks. Tiago, as you can see, is drinking a nice mug. Is it coffee, Tiago?

Tiago Faria [00:00:37]:

It's coffee. Yeah. It's coffee, In a in a nice Belarusian, mug.

Stuart Webb [00:00:41]:

Oh, oh, oh, wow. I am having, I'm having a very healthy, A cup of water with some lime in it. We're we're starting well. I've gotta keep my voice going out. I've, cold up a couple of days, but Delighted to be welcoming you, Tiago. You're a you're a business mentor, coach, helping people in the in the in the the results outcome Help community. So I'm delighted to to welcome you today to this and to talk about the work and the way in which you help people to achieve what they're trying to achieve. So welcome to It's Not Rocket Science, 5 questions over coffee.

Tiago Faria [00:01:14]:

Thank you, Stuart. It's a true pleasure to be here, and I'm looking forward to these 5 questions. They they look very fun.

Stuart Webb [00:01:20]:

Well, let's start with a nice easy one. So who is the customer that you are trying to help? What's the what's the problem that they've got that you're trying to help them to solve?

Tiago Faria [00:01:29]:

Yeah. So my ideal customer is so as you said, someone that works in the help industry as, some people call it, which is simply people that help others, Get some results, some specific results, or solve some specific problem like coaches, mentors, consultants, even service providers. But those are focused on, profound transformation so that they charge a premium for it. So high ticket, these people who are working that area. And, usually, the the people that I work with are, most of their business usually comes from passive word-of-mouth referrals, and they're kind of worried that Those might dry out at some point, and Mhmm. They're a bit tired of the anxiety of starting every month from 0. And then so they've been trying to resort into some kind of a Digital marketing, strategies. And, so they've been trying to publish daily content.

Tiago Faria [00:02:20]:

They hired some ad hoc freelancers, Bought some digital marketing courses, but somehow, nothing really seems to be bringing qualified leads in a consistent basis. And and, also, they've been been bombarded by the Internet gurus sending them very coffee, confusing strategies. And so they feel that that losing their time, they're getting exhausted and because lack of of consistent results. Just here and there, but nothing consistent. Mhmm. And the that's their biggest change.

Stuart Webb [00:02:48]:

Consistency is a problem because most of us in in these sort of fields find that we sort of go through these feats of famine, don't we? We have we have a period when we have a lot of work. We're very busy, but we then don't get around to doing the thinking about what we need to do for the next period, and then Suddenly, the work five up and you look around and think, well, where is where's all the work gonna come from now? So that consistency is a really important message, isn't it?

Tiago Faria [00:03:12]:

Yeah. Absolutely. It's, it's the the what keeps us going. Right? And and if we don't reach that specific level, it's, it's hard for for us to keep motivated, and then some people just, you know, just quit quit because, okay, she's not bringing exactly what I wanted. I tried so many things. Nothing works. And it's a very easy trap to go into this kind of Chasing the shiny objects. Like, this strategy seems more complex and a faster button.

Tiago Faria [00:03:34]:

Right? I'm gonna try this. Well, I didn't work immediately. I'm gonna try the complete different thing. And it's a trap that you get involved in, and, it's very hard to to get out of. And I was wondering if this is

Stuart Webb [00:03:45]:

So what is it that you, that you think that most these people that your help have done before you you you they they they they turn to to what you try to do to help them together. What what what are the mistakes they've made? What are the things they tried to do which which haven't necessarily worked for me.

Tiago Faria [00:04:01]:

Yeah. So the main thing that, I I was also guilty myself, and the most people I talk to still have this tendency is to to try to help everyone. They they questions themselves as, like, a coach or a, Consultants, and they are not very specific into in terms of who they actually help. And they just keep accepting anyone that just pays them money. Right? So that's they're my niche is whoever pays me. And this is is problematic because, number 1, if you're too generic, No one actually resonates with your message, so it's hard for you to to communicate and then to over to sell it. You're basically trying to I have a view here of of a over, Tagus River in Lisbon. It's like, you you like using a huge five net with huge holes to try to capture all the fish in in this river, But then all of them go through the nets.

Tiago Faria [00:04:50]:

Right? So you end up just catching 1 or 2, you know, by by chance, versus if you try to cap capture a, I forgot how to say, like, a a group of specific fish that, you know, that that share the same same species of five, and then you just use a shorter fishnet, and you capture all of them, Mike. And that's the difference of the approach because you actually know exactly who you're serving, and your message will resonate. They will feel attracted to you because you know them more than better than anyone else. And that that's the that's the the way to go. But, that's the main one of the main issues is trying to help everyone. And then because you try to help everyone, it creates a problem for yourself because you'll just accept anyone. And then most of the times, That persons might not be your ideal client. You might not be able to help them as much as you can, the best you can, or you attract people that you cannot actually helping them.

Tiago Faria [00:05:38]:

It's, it's a problem because, they pay you money. You you cannot generate results. You won't get testimonials. They'll be unhappy. And in in this industry, the results industry or Webb we are, it's it's a problematic, and it's not a place that you would like to to be on. And then so the the second mistake that I I feel that is a a trap we fall into Is is to invest in ads without having a proven offer, something that you already proven that works consistently, that you can generate results consistently, that people Resonate with the the the it's easy to sell, easy to over, and, and you also don't have a proven lifetime value of your clients, like, you don't have you you solve 1 problem, but then you have another solution for the new problem that you create. So you don't have the lifetime value of the client calculated, which is a problem for you too when investing ads Because you don't you don't know exactly how much you can spend on ads, you don't have a proven funnel that will make it all work. So when you when you're at the beginning stages, using ads is like pouring gas on a on a pile of sticks, like Miles Bekker says.

Tiago Faria [00:06:43]:

And you just get you get you just get a Wet five of 6. Right? Nothing will happen because there was no flame. There was no nothing to combust, and that flame is usually the The the proven coffee, an offer that works Yeah. That consistently works. So it's another trap that, many people make.

Stuart Webb [00:06:59]:

You You you're so right, Tioga, and I and I and I I love the way that you're putting it because, I've often said this with customers Webb I when I speak to to to major businesses. I work with some some some very, very big custom and and even the big businesses, when you turn around and say, who's your ideal customer, they'll often turn around and you what, we can serve anyone, and it's not true. You can't serve anyone. It's just not possible. And You can

Tiago Faria [00:07:23]:

serve anyone. I mean

Stuart Webb [00:07:25]:

It it's it's it's it's a way to And you're right that by trying to serve too many people, you don't end up with those hyper hyper happy, very satisfied customers who will then be prepared to go out, Become your your ambassadors who will preach to the rest of the world about just what a wonderful service you do. And if you can target individuals Over down to sort of the right person within, within an organization who will then become the most satisfied customer you can, They will end up being the best advert that you can and with that proven coffee, with a with a with a solution and Five often said this people. I was talking to somebody not so long ago, and I said they told me they hated selling, and I said, well, stop selling. Listen. Well, what do you mean? How will I get customers? And I said Stuart helping. If you have a proven offer, which is a solution to a problem, find the person with the problem, And don't say, can I help you sell it? Reach across to them and say, would you like help solving your problem? And if you've got the solution to their problem, they will ask to buy it from you.

Tiago Faria [00:08:26]:

And

Stuart Webb [00:08:26]:

so it becomes much easier to work with your customers if you've got something you know will solve their problem. You know they've got a problem, and then you just reach out and say, can I help? And they will buy from you if you have got the right solution. And so often people look at you as if to say, I don't even know how to find those people, but it starts with knowing what the problem is that you're solving and knowing that your solution is the solution for that problem.

Tiago Faria [00:08:53]:

Yeah. Absolutely. You really are only as good as as your clients will allow you to be. Right? Absolutely. If you don't generate results, You're in trouble.

Stuart Webb [00:09:02]:

It's Absolutely.

Tiago Faria [00:09:03]:

It's not a long term way to have a business. You really have to focus on bringing only the right people, the ones that you feel I can easily transform this person. She has all the motivation and the skills, the resources. That makes everyone's lives easier, and we rarely focus on that. Right? We are constantly focusing on new clients, cold audiences, selling, sell, sell, sell, sell Webb and disregard this part of okay. But what about the results? What about the Yeah. Congratulations and the testimonials and case studies and etcetera. It's a problem.

Tiago Faria [00:09:32]:

Yeah.

Stuart Webb [00:09:32]:

What a what a great message. Thiago, I know you have, you have an offer, and that is a A free call, should anybody want to have a, Stuart to understand a little bit more about what you can to help with and and just tell me, I believe this is the, the Yes. URL they can reach in order to have that free call with you. Tiago, that's t I a g o f a r I a dot p t Slash call. Tell me what happens during that, that call? How long does it take, and what is it you're trying to help your your clients do when you speak to them?

Tiago Faria [00:10:05]:

Yeah. So it usually takes half an hour. I I five to first of all, I love to meet new people in this in this industry. It's just super interesting for me. And, of course, I'd like to have make a couple of questions just to understand the goals, the objectives, what what I've been trying to do before that didn't work. And I try to understand what what are the current assets because my my anti marketing method is based on, you don't need anything else other than what you already have in your current world, like your current contacts, audience, and network, to to have a over fun sustainable to grow a very fun and sustainable business. So we try to look at, okay, what are your current contacts, how many clients you've had before, what is the size of your audience, and then I can calculate, okay, I think we have here something to work on, because if we have past clients, if you have past leads that you've worked with, though, that's usually the starting point for my strategy. And it's actually something that I can share now that is, a valuable five act free, action that Yes.

Tiago Faria [00:11:01]:

The the audience could implement, which is So like we talked to you initially, choose a very specific niche. Right? The person, the problem you try to solve. And then you simply reach out to your current network of past clients, past leads, even your audience, network you have around you. And you simply interview people, 5 to 10 people that you feel are Very well suited for your niche. And you ask them questions, like, about their about their symptoms. What what are the main obstacles? What did he feel? What five you been trying to do that doesn't work? What what do they actually wish to achieve? Because simply by the fact that you're interviewing people in your niche, You will collect the emotional words, the, the actual feelings that people have that later you can use to create your offer. If you reflect exactly what the market wants and needs, it will be so much easier to sell, you know, to create something that they will actually want to buy now. Right? That's That's so key for us to to create offers, because we're so ingrained, and we usually stay in our head.

Tiago Faria [00:11:58]:

And Webb we think we create something, now people have to buy it, which and we should invert that process. And you'll find out very easy that everyone loves to give their opinion, their feedback. And if it's a short call, it's easy yes for them to for you to interview. And you you you get lots of wins out of this simple exercise. You you you craft an offer around that. You go back to them and you can say, hey. Just create this offer that solves the problem you told me you had. What do you think about it? You can actually start selling immediately there.

Tiago Faria [00:12:26]:

And then For people that say yes, you sell it to them. For people that don't want it or don't need it, you can also ask them, but you know anyone else would be interested in this? And so you create here a network of refers and, which is perfect. It's

Stuart Webb [00:12:40]:

Absolutely fantastic. Spot on advice, Tiago. Five I love the value you five there. It is so simple to to implement and and just, you you as you say, reaching out to somebody and just saying, can we spend 15 minutes just just so that I can understand your problem, so that I can I can work out ways you can even do a a networking event that you're attending Today, just, you know, the the when you're handing over your business card, just say to them, what's the major problem that you're facing at the moment in in growing your practice? And if somebody turns around five you just 2 or 3 sentences, use those sentences, use those words to sort of craft your coffee, and then you can put them into those ads that you were talking about, can't you, Tiago? If you're currently facing this problem, people will resonate with that because those are the words that they are themselves using. Once again, you've solved 222 problems with 1 with 1 conversation.

Tiago Faria [00:13:32]:

You became a popular writer. Yeah. It's amazing.

Stuart Webb [00:13:34]:

I think Tiago, what is it that, is it is it a book or a program, a course, something like that, which which brought you to the understanding of of your, and I love the words, the anti marketing method. What was it that that helped you form that?

Tiago Faria [00:13:50]:

Absolutely. I, I got it right here with me. It's a book by mister Jay Abraham, getting everything you can out of all you've got. And that's that's last sentence that inspired me. All you've got. So what do we have around us? Right? It talks a lot about this reaching out to past clients, so to your network, creating referral programs, proactive, and incentivizing people to refer you and become your sales team. It talks about lots of things that are super interesting, like, the basis of marketing and sales, five, the timeless strategies, five, the 3 ways to grow a business, the The lifetime value, creating an irresistible offer that is so crucial, with the help of of people around you, networking referrals. So This this book is really gold.

Tiago Faria [00:14:32]:

It's like, in the all his brain most of his brain is here. And it's a very, underrated book. Think I I haven't seen it that much. But, yeah, I definitely advise,

Stuart Webb [00:14:43]:

JJ. Such a good such a good author, such a such a of knowledge in this in this area, isn't it?

Tiago Faria [00:14:50]:

Absolutely. I really love them when they consume everything he he sends up.

Stuart Webb [00:14:54]:

Yeah. Absolutely. So, we've kind of reached the the 5th question of my five, and, this is my, this is my simple one because, up until now, I've had to be thinking of the questions and now what I want to do is is suggest that perhaps there's a question that I haven't thought of that you would like me to ask you and obviously Once you've given me the question that you want me to ask, you'll have to answer it. So this is where I sit back and sort of relax a bit whilst you're doing all the work. So What's that question that I should've asked that you, that you've that you've not been given so far? And and and what is that answer, Tiago?

Tiago Faria [00:15:30]:

Yes, Stuart. It's a amazing question. I was thinking about it. We we sent it before, and, it's something I I would love to that someone Told me before when I was starting out, it would save me a ton of headaches is which is a questions that almost nobody ask who's which is, how to how to go how to go on when Nothing is working. Like, when when things go wrong, when when clients are upset, when, you do some some tail some some tests and it doesn't work, a campaign doesn't work, Five, how do you do how do you how do you go by and, how do you not quit suddenly and then start doing crazy things and reactive and go to? That's not, like, a super important question. And I and I thought here about a simple process that we could think about. But at least I add I did it for myself and probably it will work with someone else, Which is, first of all, with my mentor I worked with my mentor, and he told me, okay. Let's create a vision.

Tiago Faria [00:16:20]:

A vision is so important to have something something clear in your mind Webb you're going, why you're doing what you're doing, How would your life be like after the storm? Right? So know exactly where you're going. It it's it keeps you immune to distractions, to, to accidents, to I don't know. It just keeps you going. It's it's super important. And then getting the skills of, Actually, I I've learned I've learned with, Jim Braun to you should work harder on yourself than on your business. So that's that's something to keep in mind all the time. So I I I I I practiced to myself to to start becoming outcome independent. So no matter what happens, I'm gonna keep doing what I five planned.

Tiago Faria [00:16:59]:

If it doesn't work immediately, it's fine. Just keep going. Just keep going. And also how to how to remain calm. This is also super important too Because things will hap crap will happen for sure in the business, in entrepreneurship. It always does. So if you if you train yourself to become calm and not Reactive all the five. If something bad happens, things become much easier.

Tiago Faria [00:17:22]:

And how do you do that to be to remain calm is to so we have a vision. We should also have a plan of a simple plan, a very simple plan five the strategy I I use here and something that you do daily no matter what. Very simple steps. Like, 3 things you do in a day. 1 for marketing, 1 for sales, 1 for, you know, delivery of your services or whatever. And if you if you stick to it, a simple plan that you know that you can do, that you don't stretch yourself too too thin and you're consistent no matter what happens, Usually, things things things Stuart working and the the, the compound effect effect takes takes takes place, and, You will reach your goals faster than you expected.

Stuart Webb [00:18:02]:

I've just put on screen, Thiago, a question that's come in from from LinkedIn, which is Paul Burton who Said, isn't a consultant just someone who borrows your watch to tell you the time? And I think I think you were addressing some of what, Paul is talking about with, That, that last coffee. And it's true that very often, we as coaches, consultants, mentors, End up telling somebody, what they already know. They know they should have a simple structured plan to their day, that they should spend x amount of time working on their marketing. They should be spending time doing those things. The problem is that very often, despite the fact they've got the watch, they're not looking at it because there's so much going on around them. So The advantage of the outside help that somebody comes in from outside to sit beside that that business owner, that coach, And just remind them of what they're supposed to be doing. It takes away the it takes away their busyness, it takes away their focus from The the the the day to day struggle that they have and reminds them that they've got the watch on their wrist, they need to look at their watch. I object to the to the consultants who take the watch away.

Stuart Webb [00:19:17]:

I prefer to leave the watch very definitely with the business owner, But just remind them to look at it and spend time thinking. I think too many consultants have in the past removed the the the agency from the business owner and said, I'll do that for you. But in actual fact, our job is to help them to do it themselves. I don't know what you think.

Tiago Faria [00:19:39]:

Yeah. I think the key word here for coaches, consultants, etcetera, is your You're, remain your clients accountable. I think that's all we need. Because all information is already available. You can just YouTube, Google everything. There's nothing new that you can create nowadays. It's mostly the the fact that you keep the person accountable. You You unlock when she has some issue.

Tiago Faria [00:20:01]:

You keep her focused, like you said. Like, focused on the 3 things you should do today or whatever is the 80/20, that actually brings results and keep them from all the distractions that that come about the the day. And it's actually that. We're just, accountability coaches, basically.

Stuart Webb [00:20:17]:

Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. Tiago, this I think it's been a fascinating discussion. I thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. I would just just now direct people excuse me. A bit of a frog. I send out a newsletter each week telling you about the The person that's gonna come on and talk to us on, on this call each week.

Stuart Webb [00:20:38]:

And if you'd like to get from me, an email, which Just points out who's gonna be on so that you could join the the call five Paul, and just ask questions that you would like to. The link to do that is on screen now, it's httpscolonforward/forward/link.thecompleteapproach.co.ukforward/ Newsletter. That's link.thecompleteapproach.co.ukforward/newsletter. Get on there. Join the newsletter list, and then it's available, you'll get notification each week about who's coming on to the call and how to join. Tiago, thank you so much for spending a few minutes With us today, I will just remind you if you've got questions, don't hesitate to post it in the chat at the end of this. Thiago and I can then, come on and answer those questions. And if you need to speak to Thiago, obviously, he's available.

Stuart Webb [00:21:32]:

Thiago, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. Really appreciate it. I wish you the very best in what you're doing. I think you've said some really interesting things, And I look forward to catching up with you again soon.

Tiago Faria [00:21:42]:

Thank you so much, Stuart. It was a true pleasure, and I hope someone takes something out of this conversation today.

Stuart Webb [00:21:46]:

I surely will. Thank you.

Who is Larry?

Larry Goddard is a man of confidence and determination. He believes in facing fears head-on and taking on any challenge with a can-do attitude. His multifaceted nature comes from a decision to pursue his passions wholeheartedly and not be held back by self-doubt. He is motivated by a desire to work with people who share his confidence and belief that they can achieve anything they set their minds to.

Key Takeaways

00:00 Interview with Larry, a talented, visionary leader.

05:35 Active on LinkedIn and YouTube, sharing progress.

10:08 Believe in self, pursue passions, mentor others.

13:48 Paul promotes his book on test automation.

16:17 Excitement for book, follow on LinkedIn, subscribe.

17:49 Thank you, Larry. Talk soon.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

https://www.packtpub.com/product/enhanced-test-automation-with-webdriverio/9781837630189

A video version of this podcast is also at

https://youtube.com/live/ra2bB6d6Plc?feature=share

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Stuart Webb, Joshua Berry, It's Not Rocket Science, Five Questions over coffee, author, Dare to be NIEV, CEO, Econic, conversation, workplace, broken, humane, people positive, leaders, strategy, innovation, growth, human resources, new practices, agile, DevOps, lean start up, HR standpoint, remote work, return to work, curiosity, trust, experimental, collaboration, leadership mindset, creativity, purpose of work.

SPEAKERS

Larry Goddard, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:23]:

Welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science, Five questions over coffee. I'm gonna admit that right at the moment in my mug isn't actually coffee. It's, raspberry tea. I don't know what Larry's got in front of him, but Yeah.

Larry Goddard [00:00:35]:

I have hot chocolate.

Stuart Webb [00:00:36]:

I have hot chocolate. So that's brilliant. So, Larry, welcome to in rocket science over over Five questions I've got. Delighted to invite you to spend a few minutes with us today. Our guest today is Larry Goddard. Larry is an incredible, Polymath. I mean, the man that has so many talents, it's almost impossible to understand exactly where we're gonna go with this, but he's a he's a visionary leader, An award winning test architect, an interim CTO, and a a mentor to, the Black Girls in Tech and, the Black Voices and the founder Founders Institute, he is, He's been an expert witness for for international law firm and a technical adviser to a fashion house. Now This is this is more than we could possibly get into at this stage, Larry.

Stuart Webb [00:01:26]:

So I'm just gonna start with saying, talk to us a little bit about the sort of people you're trying to help and the problems they've got.

Larry Goddard [00:01:35]:

Yeah. I I I think, from from my point of view, I think I don't wanna look at the people who, They wanna do things, but, have this fear that, oh, if I do this, this is going to happen or it's gonna fall apart. I'm I think I I think I would use the word confidence. I don't think I'll be I wanna deal with people, you know, that want that confidence in themselves that I could do anything. Because although my I have to say, I'm multifaceted. And and it all comes from, you know, just deciding, you know, I wanna do this. I'm going all day, and I'm I'm doing that. So

Stuart Webb [00:02:11]:

And and talk to us about some of the some of the people you've helped. Some of those, of the you know, you're obviously working with with people who are starting businesses, and you're doing a lot of public speaking. Tell us about some of the sort of advice you give to those people. Especially,

Larry Goddard [00:02:27]:

I could say especially with the mentoring side of things where, you know, I help them deal with all these people. And I do it a lot from the, Fungus Institute. And those are people who actually looking to open some business. They are funded. They're to get funding for the business only. And one thing I tell them, I tell them is, you know, don't be afraid to take that step. That's the first thing. And 2, the other thing is once you have an idea, you need to put your idea somewhere.

Larry Goddard [00:02:56]:

If you just keep it in your head, Things just things just doesn't match up over that period. You need to document it. You need to relook at it again. And in short, yes. This is what I wanna do, and these are the steps that I want to take. And then you We really do again, you come to people like myself and others. You know, we would tell you, guide you hold your hand and guide you along the way It took your part, not from our vision, but your part.

Stuart Webb [00:03:29]:

Yeah. Absolutely. I love that idea. Be did if, You know, I've I've often said, you know, that, a a bad message out in the world It's far better than a perfect message still inside your head. You know? The the keeping something inside yourself and just waiting for the perfect moment is is always wrong, and I'm just trying to remember who it was that once said it. You know? The best time to start was 20 years ago, but the 2nd best time is now.

Larry Goddard [00:03:56]:

Exactly. Because what's up in your head? It's just you are all annoyed. If you put it on paper, yes, it's still your idea, and you are all annoyed. But now you now have Something visual that you could look at, and you could say, oh, you know, I think I shouldn't go here. I should do this before I do that. But once it's just in your head and it goes around, You spend years waiting for and and and as I always tell people, there is nothing ever called the perfect moment. The perfect moment is right now.

Stuart Webb [00:04:24]:

Yeah.

Larry Goddard [00:04:24]:

Yeah. You know? That's the perfect moment. People tend to we are fine a lot too. People tend to try and Bill is perfect. And I'll just use the word product for the conversation. I want the bill is perfect product before They put it out to the market. No. You need to bill a product, put it out to the market, get some feedback, and improve on the product.

Stuart Webb [00:04:46]:

Yeah. Yeah. That that, that's so often the the the the fault that people have, isn't it? It's it's Trying to make sure something's absolutely perfect before the put it put it out, and it will never be perfect because, you know, first of all, you you have not I got had every single idea you're ever gonna have, but your customers, if they love it, will tell you what they like, what they don't, and what they want to see improved.

Larry Goddard [00:05:11]:

Exactly.

Stuart Webb [00:05:13]:

So, Larry, I mean sorry. Go ahead.

Larry Goddard [00:05:15]:

No. No. No. You you go ahead. Sorry. Now

Stuart Webb [00:05:19]:

so so tell me, what what are you you're also developing new software tools as well at the moment. What where are you where are you gonna be telling us all about this in the future? Where can we continue to watch what you're what you're up to and and your best ideas coming forward?

Larry Goddard [00:05:35]:

Well, like, I think I have my my LinkedIn profile, and then I have my YouTube channel. You You know? So that's where I put everything. So as time goes by and I improve on things or I build things, I put it out on the on the YouTube channel. I talk about it on on my LinkedIn profile. So if you're following me, you know, there you would see you're gonna see everything as it progress And go forward, and you'll get to see all the little bits and pieces that I get myself involved in. You know? So that that's where you'll find me. So I'm I'm on LinkedIn. I'm on YouTube.

Larry Goddard [00:06:08]:

And I'm on Twitter. Sorry. X.

Stuart Webb [00:06:11]:

X. Of course. Yeah. And I I've just put, Larry's, LinkedIn profile now at the bottom of the page, which is, linkedin.com.in. Larry g. So that's Larry G. Follow Larry on LinkedIn. He does do some really interesting stuff.

Stuart Webb [00:06:28]:

I'd say it's he's really got some very interesting things going on. And, yeah, he is an interesting character. So where did you get some of the inspiration? What book or course or, what was it that that really inspired you down your path, Larry?

Larry Goddard [00:06:46]:

Well, I have I have a thing. I mean, I'm one of the old school guys. It had nothing to do with A book or anything is just back in the day. You know, and computers, especially, have now come out because a a a novelty in the day. And just something that interested me, and I started to take my interest in it from since then. And so over the years, I have, you know, looked into it and always do something with it. Mind, I've not always I've never always been in tech. I'm a mechanical engineer by trade.

Larry Goddard [00:07:15]:

So It's it's after I moved from, I'm from Trinidad Tobago, by the way. So after I moved from Trinidad Tobago and came to the UK to live, Then I realized I I had a rude awakening that the call and mechanic don't mix. So So and and that is where my journey is to and that is when I changed my I took my my my hobby. I made it into my career. So a lot of it 90% of what I know is self taught. I thought literally taught myself, I got the software, Back in the day, and I got copies of a lot of things. It wasn't until now. I got a copy of the software.

Larry Goddard [00:07:54]:

I bought some computers. I, you know, I build them up. I start. And and and that's and that's going on and on. And as the technology change, I continue to follow it. And then, you know, the world opened up to open source. So then I started to delve into that, and Then I got to see what people are doing, and we got to use what people were using. And and and think and that's where Classy GS comes up comes about.

Larry Goddard [00:08:16]:

You know, I was tasked with, getting a a job done for Cambridge University at the time back then, And it was it was one of them surreal moments. I realized, oh, I know I I know what I should do. And I decided I started building this framework. Well, the rest is history, as you said. You're quite happy about it from that rough draft and being used to now it's a a node module. You could just, You know, just install as a known module in their place. That's one of the things I do. Yeah.

Stuart Webb [00:08:47]:

So so the the the the current The current set of things you're doing, they've just they've just been something you've never been trained for any of this stuff. This is just something that you just know, you just wanna do. What's the what's the 1 piece of advice that you that you that you sort of took from somebody? What was it that sort of made you think, well, I'm just gonna give it a go? You you you there's nothing that's held you back. So it must have been something that somebody did or said or or at some stage pointed out to you that made you think, I could give it a go. Is it something from your parents?

Larry Goddard [00:09:21]:

It it it's one of the things my mom actually used used to say to us, you know, growing up. She see all you say, you know, don't matter what you're doing. Always try to be the best there is. You might never make it, But you will get very, very good at it. You know? And I and I took that I took that through. And then I started and that is where I was, like, about 10 years old or or something and down to the end of the street that I was living on growing up in Lebanon, that guy used fixing cars down there. Now I was trying out, you know, oh, that's really good stuff. Imagine a 10 year old back then, you know, in the early seventies, turns out, oh, that looks good.

Larry Goddard [00:09:56]:

And I just briefly walk into the and say, can you teach me how to do that? And he look at me and say capitalist. Yeah. He actually look at me and say, Son, go home. Why are you down here?

Stuart Webb [00:10:07]:

And yeah.

Larry Goddard [00:10:08]:

But when I I kept going. And then one day, you're saying, okay. You know what? Watch that for me. At the beginning of it, I, yeah, at the beginning, I started washing parts and, you know, and and and following and then the thought that he taught me. And and I think one of the things from that is I think everybody should understand is if you want to do something, no matter what it is, You for yourself have to have a bad belief in you that you could do it. And following my online normal advice, either that's how I think. And I thought I think now, like you rightfully see, I I'm into a lot of stuff. And especially now with the whole AI and the whole framework and building things in it, You know, I'm mentoring people.

Larry Goddard [00:10:48]:

I'm thinking it's all about I could do this. I'm not going to do this. I want to be the best there is. You know, like, somebody said to me once, This is how I just think. I just think like this. If I am a mechanic, I want to open the dictionary. And when I type a new mechanic, I must see a picture of myself there. No.

Larry Goddard [00:11:06]:

I yeah. I got resonate with me. Not really resonate. That means it it simply means what you're going to do always put your best foot forward. And and there's nothing as a stupid question. The only stupid question I have is the one it did not ask. You know? And and it's and it's true that and I follow that all the way through. So as new technologies come out, I I pick up on it.

Larry Goddard [00:11:30]:

I I I do some research. I, you know, I look at the white papers. Yeah. I get involved in in it in a lot of different ways. Going to, expose and and things like that. So that as well keeps, You know, keeps my head in the game with with everything that I'm doing.

Stuart Webb [00:11:47]:

Brilliant.

Larry Goddard [00:11:47]:

And and as you see that and I and as you see that, I think I might just mention this one time, and it's true that, I've written a book, so I don't actually have a book on the market. And it's all you know, talking about, again, automation and and doing other bits and pieces. And from that as well, you know, somebody asked me, hey. Could you and I thought about it. And then, in my head, I say, Why why think about it? Here, you have an opportunity to to write a book. Just go for it. And then why did I just say, yes. I'll do it, and this is the end result.

Stuart Webb [00:12:19]:

And when are we seeing that?

Larry Goddard [00:12:21]:

It's it's out now. I mean, I could see if you look at my my LinkedIn profile. I mean, I can I I could I could even share the the cover, the book you? I'm not sure where I can do that. Great.

Stuart Webb [00:12:30]:

Yeah. Please do.

Larry Goddard [00:12:32]:

I mean, I will send it come up for you in a email or call. I don't think I could drop it in this chat yet. Hello, Blake. And, yeah, I'm. So it's the book is live. It's on, Amazon. It's, it's on Pat Pat Publishing for the publishers. And and yeah.

Larry Goddard [00:12:47]:

So it's there. It's called it's called, enhanced test automation with WebDriver IO. That's in that's in the name of the book. If you look at Amazon right now, you could just you could find it with that.

Stuart Webb [00:13:00]:

If I I if I could find it in the moment, I'd show it, but there we go. We're not gonna be able to do it. Had 1 comment in as we've been talking. Paul has commented and said, it's so true. Test in test automation, it is never too Soon to start. And, yeah, what can I say? The number of, of live software projects that I have been involved in where We started testing far too late, and we tested with the wrong people, and it all ended up in complete disaster. But that's another story for another day, And I won't bore you with it bore bore you with an hour range.

Larry Goddard [00:13:33]:

Guys have I don't think I that just you randomly choose that, but that is my co author, by the way.

Stuart Webb [00:13:40]:

That's a good one then.

Larry Goddard [00:13:42]:

Yeah. That's that's my call. You both know that.

Stuart Webb [00:13:46]:

I'm so glad

Larry Goddard [00:13:47]:

reach out there.

Stuart Webb [00:13:48]:

I'm so glad that Paul's listening in. Paul, he's also said to us at this very moment, enhance test automation. Okay. That's the name of the book. It's enhance Test automation with WebDriverIO unlock the superpowers of hybrid testing frameworks. Paul, Larry, I'll make sure that goes into The show notes so that people can get a copy of that if they want to. Look, I've, I've asked you a series of questions at the moment, Larry, and I'm sure there's probably one that you're thinking I haven't asked, and when's he gonna get around to asking it? So this is my way of saying, Here's your opportunity to to tell me the question you would have liked me to have asked, and then, obviously, you have to answer it for us. So what's that question?

Larry Goddard [00:14:32]:

I think I think that question should, you know, should be, what are you working on now, and where do you see yourself going with it?

Stuart Webb [00:14:39]:

Okay. So what what are you working on now? Where do you see yourself going with it, Larry?

Larry Goddard [00:14:44]:

Yeah. At at the moment At the moment, I'm working on a project called Classy GS. It's it's out there. What it does is our test automation framework. By the way, it's using WebDriverIO and and things like that. And where where, where I'm going with it is, Because, you know, AI is the whole new talk at the time, the new kid on the block. Yes. I'm heavily involved in in in in AI as well.

Larry Goddard [00:15:11]:

So right now, going forward, I'm going to remove some of the existing parts from it and replace it with AI powered technology and and make it, you know, up to scratch and activate the, you know, for the future going forward. And in in doing that, it will also It will also gives me the opportunity to improve on what is there and see, you know, what's new coming out. And as you can see, we're in the AI space. So A lot of new text. You know? You have. You have the you have the Microsofts. You have the the the the Chrome, the Googles. I know everybody bringing out their own copilots and and things like that.

Larry Goddard [00:15:47]:

So going forward and for the future, it's about locking into those products and seeing how best we could use it to, You know, to to help the testing community. So I would spend a lot of time, you know, going forward doing that for for the for the community. And it's and it's all open source. So not like I'm building something that people have to pay for it in a day. I'm building it, and I'm giving them that just as part of me. That is me saying thank you for all the knowledge I got from you guys over the years, and This is my contribution back to the community.

Stuart Webb [00:16:17]:

I love that. I love that. I look forward to seeing that in the in the world. Larry, it's been fascinating sort of having you on for a few minutes. I really do hope people check out that book, and follow you on LinkedIn because you've got some fascinating insights into the world. I'm just gonna mention at this point, if, if you would like to get onto our mailing list so that every A week, pretty much, I put out an email which just says who's coming up on the, on the podcast so that you can be prepared to follow them, To ask questions as Paul was here to sort of interact with the guest on Tuesdays, please go to this link, which is link.thecompleteapproachdot c0.ukforward/newsletter. That's link.thecompleteapproach.c0.ukforward/newsletter. Get on to the list.

Stuart Webb [00:17:04]:

Allow me to send to you our upcoming, live interviews with interesting characters just like Larry, and then you too can be here to, to interact with people like that. Larry, thank you so much for being with us today. Really appreciate you taking out a few minutes of your day. You're a busy guy, so I guess, I guess we better let you get back to changing the world, changing the lives of some of those mentors that you're working with. And thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us.

Larry Goddard [00:17:34]:

Yeah. The pleasure is all mine, Stuart. And, you know, like I said, it was a pleasure to to to do this, and, I and I will continue doing so, and I will follow I myself will follow your newsletter and, you know, jump in and see what some of the other guests come and have to say as well. Another thank

Stuart Webb [00:17:49]:

thank you very much, Larry. Speak to you again soon.

Who is Joshua?

Joshua Berry is a visionary leader who is determined to fix the broken state of the workplace. With a strong belief in creating a more humane and people-positive work environment, he is committed to revolutionizing the world of work. Joshua understands that true change starts from within organizations and often seeks out leaders in strategy, innovation, growth, and human resources who share his passion for transforming the how and why of business operations. Through his book and various initiatives, Joshua aims to support these individuals in their mission to bring about positive change within their organizations.

Key Takeaways

02:10 Exploring new practices, adapting without supporting people.

04:13 Innovation hub hindered by division manager.

07:22 Daring to be naive for progress and joy.

10:26 Allow employees freedom, reap the rewards.

14:01 Impact of intangibles on bottom line ignored.

17:54 Promote and grow by building trust.

20:43 Books, openness, curiosity, inner work, progress.

23:58 Work: a space to grow people, organizations.

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Stuart Webb, Joshua Berry, It's Not Rocket Science, Five Questions over coffee, author, Dare to be NIEV, CEO, Econic, conversation, workplace, broken, humane, people positive, leaders, strategy, innovation, growth, human resources, new practices, agile, DevOps, lean start up, HR standpoint, remote work, return to work, curiosity, trust, experimental, collaboration, leadership mindset, creativity, purpose of work.

SPEAKERS

Joshua Berry, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:20]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science. Five Questions over coffee. I'm delighted to be joined this afternoon by Joshua Berry. Joshua is the author of Dare to be NIEV, which is a really interesting book, and the CEO of Econic. I'm really looking forward to this conversation. Joshua, welcome to It's Not Rocket Science 5 questions over coffee.

Joshua Berry [00:00:39]:

Thank you, Stuart. Got my coffee, and we are ready

Stuart Webb [00:00:41]:

to rock. Yep. Yep. Yep. We are it's 2 o'clock in the afternoon for me. This is probably not what I should be drinking. I won't sleep, For the rest of the afternoon, which is normally what we like to propose. Anyway, Joshua, yeah, now welcome to, to to the podcast.

Stuart Webb [00:00:55]:

Good luck to have you here. Just, just for just for clarity, kind of, what is it that you're trying to do with Dare To Be Naive and and your work at Econic? Who who are the who are the customers you're trying to help them out? What problems do they have? What is, what is what is the sort of problem that you're helping them solve?

Joshua Berry [00:01:11]:

Sure. You know, I believe in a lot of ways, the workplace, is broken. Right? We can go long strides in making, the world of work Even more humane and more people positive. And a lot of the times, the people that we work with are leaders in strategy or innovation or growth Or human resources, I think some of those leaders who are most also passionate about shifting the how and why of their businesses. And, you know, that's that's routinely where we meet them. And a lot of what, as you mentioned with the book, that we're trying to do is to help more of those People as they are trying to shift those ways of being within their organizations.

Stuart Webb [00:01:53]:

And and, You know, come a lot of these these people would have tried things before they get around to reaching out to you. What what Things do you see them doing? What problems do you see them getting into before you're able to help them overcome those problems?

Joshua Berry [00:02:10]:

Good question, Stuart. I think there's there's a lot of people who are out there who know they need to do something different, And so you they rightly are looking at new practices for their organization. Maybe they are, Looking into using agile or or DevOps, or they're looking at lean start up or or new ways to do innovation in the organizations. Maybe from an HR standpoint, they're looking at remote work is a big example right now and return to work. They are experimenting with new ways of trying to shift how they do business. But I'd say one of the biggest Challenges, and sometimes the mistakes that they run into is not well, 2 of them, I guess, we can get into. The first one is That they realize that while they're trying to adapt to these new practices, they're not actually taking the opportunity to help those people adapt as they're trying to practice Those new things. Right? Like, the the whole idea of, you know, if if you dig into some of those practices, they're saying, We want our people to be more curious.

Joshua Berry [00:03:15]:

We want them to be more trusting. We want to be more experimental. We want a bit greater collaboration. And yet if you just pursue adopting one of those new says and just push it down to people and use a traditional approach to it, you're missing out on this amazing opportunity to also involve people in practicing those behaviors, Which you're actually hoping to get from some of those practices. So that's that's a big piece of it. I think the second one is, not also taking the opportunity to Do shifts in leadership mindset behavior. A great example is in the innovation space, trying to get people to be more creative or experimental or even spinning up innovation labs, But not investing equally in helping shift the mindset of leaders because they also need to work on those things that help create a safer space for people to innovate or, become more iterative in their decision making or or a number of those things. So they they try to get people to do new practices without starting to adapt and adopt new practices themselves.

Stuart Webb [00:04:13]:

I particularly love that last majority. I was involved some years ago in helping to set up, an innovation hub in the business and, You know, the people that I was working with incredibly enthusiastic, but there was a there was a division manager who would, Who would insist that everything that came through this innovation hub had to come through him for vetting before he was prepared to green light it to go forward for commercialisation And this attitude was basically, this is going to somehow destroy either part of my revenue stream or Something else that I that I hold is a pet project so I will just stop everything. So the Innovation Hub came up with, I think in the 3 months that we sort of started trialing this, a 106 Innovations of which one was given the green light, and it was one of those moments where I had to go to the chief executive and go, it's a brilliant idea, this innovation hub, but there is a problem. And he looked at me and said, do you know where the problem is? And I said, yes. I know where the problem is. He said, where is it? I said, it's in that office. He looked at me and went, I don't know how to solve that problem. And I went, and that's nothing I can do to help you.

Stuart Webb [00:05:20]:

You're absolutely right. The mindset is so critical, You know, the the number of chief executives would go, well, if we can just make it work, it will be fine, but I don't really wanna disturb anything that's going on around here because It will make other things problematic for me.

Joshua Berry [00:05:35]:

You you nailed it there, Stuart. We are in the middle of a fundamental Shift that is happening in the world of work and how work is done. And and what you're seeing is we've had things that worked for many decades that relied more on a command and control sort of approach. Right? Our ability to streamline and predict and forecast. And now we have tension, right, between, our ability to even predict the future or need things. And so Rightly so, the best leaders are saying, I need people to be more adaptable and agile and nimble, and, hence, they do all those practices that I was saying before. But it runs into this clash as you just said with people who are still trying to hold on to some of those vestiges of what got us to to where we are right now. And so we're in this interesting liminal space, and and I think you have to acknowledge that there are some of those beliefs about what maybe assessors for that person, maybe there's even internal things that that your former leader needs to work through to be able to get to a spot to make it okay for some of these new practices that that I think most employees and people want to bring into the world.

Stuart Webb [00:06:41]:

And and I guess this is the sort of the thrust of the book, dare to be naive, that that That you've you've recently got around to giving to the world and there's going to be a a link where people can go look at this and have a a look at, the book, which is here, at joshuaberry.com/ dare to b hyphen naive. I'll put that in the show notes for those people who didn't manage to catch you at this stage, but talk to us a little bit about, you know, the sort of advice and that you talk about in that book. And maybe give us some an insight of something we can go away and do, with that advice today to help move on some of these mindset shifts we need to do.

Joshua Berry [00:07:22]:

Yep. The idea of of daring to be naive is really about letting go of I already know everything. Right? And it's also about tapping into those things that represent not just what's reasonable, but also what feels intuitively Correct to look at, right? So back to the example that you used before of your leader, there's There's a lot of things that go into protecting ourselves and making us try to feel safe and smart and right and perfect and all of those things. And What we challenge in the book is a lot of times the beliefs that have led us to where we're at today, some of them have become limiting beliefs To what is possible for the future, and it's only until you have a shift into saying, you know what? I might be wrong, or you know what? There might be another way. And sometimes even things that might not have been thought before, that we're truly going to have progress. And so the book is about All those times where we probably self limit ourselves, we screen ourselves to present only those things that seem acceptable to the rest of the world, and how we might continue to move through that. Through some of the research and interviews that I've seen, a lot of people Fear being seen or labeled as naive, and yet that fear of being seen as naive actually prevents you from having a greater impact and greater joy in your life. Back to your question about maybe prompting for a free tool.

Joshua Berry [00:08:56]:

One of the things that we practice in the book, and you can find it on that dare to be naive.com or the or the link that you shared, is When we look at our practices, similar to the things that we talked about before, too often, we're not digging into what the beliefs are that power those practices. Right? And so there's a simple 2 by 2 matrix that we use to to help people, and and you can find it there, or you can email me afterwards if you can't find it. And, the tool is basically, what is the current practice? Let's take, for instance, work from home right now. It then challenges you to say, what are the beliefs, either known or maybe just observed or accepted, that are powering that practice. Right? And then it challenges people to talk about and reflect on what is shifting in those beliefs. Right? So so maybe it's maybe the practice is work from home, and the beliefs are a mixture. Oh, people can't be productive, or maybe they can be productive, or whatever it might be. You then create conversation either for the leader or for the team to be able to talk about how are those beliefs shifting or evolving, and then from those evolved beliefs, what are new that we can begin to experiment with.

Joshua Berry [00:10:10]:

And so being intentional about understanding how our beliefs inform our practices and having a simple process to To kind of dissect those and dig into those is, one of the things that we explore in the book through a myriad of different examples and ideas.

Stuart Webb [00:10:26]:

Brilliant. Joshua, I'm I'm I think you've you've you've really highlighted one of the things with you is pretty critical In the workplace today, which is the the the mindset should've shift. We talk about a lot about servant leadership and things like that, but, you know, leaders still have got to get their heads around Allowing people to to to to become themselves at work, can't they? One of my, one of the people I've Spent some time looking and and and talking to is a guy called John Timpson who runs A series of shops around the UK that are about shoe shops and he has only 2 rules for the people that work for him and that is Show up and look the part and put the money in the till. And that's it. You know, pretty much after that, his managers, the people that are on the front line, got Free reign to do a whole load of things, to really adapt their business practice and process in order to sort of truly serve the customer. As a result, He's grown enormously, and he has people working for him who worked for years and will never work anywhere else. Because they turn around and say, When it comes to spending money, he gives me free rein to do what I want. And, you know, so long as so long as they make a profit, and so long as he can sort of see they're making a profit, he gets out of their way as a As a a chairman of a large company, he just gets out of their way and leaves them to it.

Stuart Webb [00:11:47]:

That's a that's an attitude very few leaders have managed to grasp and put put put on in their organization. I think it's it's inspiring when I hear people like you sort of talk about some of this stuff and how to make that happen.

Joshua Berry [00:11:59]:

Yeah. You hit upon it there, Stuart. And one of the stories that I cover in the book, talks about a manufacturing facility, actually in France, that The CEO took it over, and it was a traditional manufacturing facility, right, where, time clock cards and you get penalized if you show up late. All of the materials and supplies are locked up in the closet, and you gotta go take your coupon to be able to get new supplies and materials. And, when Jean Francois showed up at that factory, he started to say, why did we design an organization that assumes Humans are wrong or bad or trying to be lazy or trying to get away with things. What would happen if we designed An organization from the opposite that assumes humankind was good, And they stripped away the controls. They stripped away a number of those things, and you know what? People started to show up earlier. They started to care about what they were doing.

Joshua Berry [00:13:02]:

Quality went up. Engagement went up. Their market share went up. There was amazing impact and a great return on that investment. And so we cover in the book that, like, it it isn't 1 or the other. We we we talked about it as 2 ROIs. You can get ripples of impact and a return on investment. And similar to what your leader, that you're just highlighting there, with the cashiers, It isn't, oh, I'm only going to do it as long as I'm gonna get these results.

Joshua Berry [00:13:33]:

We're not telling you to ignore those sorts of things, but it's amazing How many stories are out there of when you do choose to prioritize treating people as human, treating people as wanting to give something, and honoring people, that a lot of times a decent ROI also comes on the backside of that. And sometimes it's hard to have the faith or the optimism or the hope to be able push through some of that, that's the dare to be naive. Right?

Stuart Webb [00:14:01]:

It's a it's a great message, Shashank. I I I love the fact that I think One of the things that you're sort of highlighting there is that the return on investment is so often in things that are difficult to measure or or almost in those intangibles. You know, If you can reduce churn, if you can keep somebody working for your organization longer, you know, you reduce recruitment costs, you recruit Retention costs you recruit, you you reduce your your retraining costs. You get people who are better attuned to your customers, your ethos. Although it's something difficult things to measure it that people just therefore just don't measure and as a result they go, okay, well if we can't measure it, we'll ignore it And yet it has huge impact upon the bottom line. If you are constantly having to recruit team members and they're just they're there for a month or 2 and then go because they've been treated horribly, We don't measure that, but what we don't what we don't as a result, we miss out on is the is the impact that that has on the bottom line. People just turn around and go, I can't understand why it Costs us so much and yet, you know, going back to sort of a simple retail store, if if if those costs are built in, they raise the price And yet people will look around and go, I don't know what's don't know what happens, but down the road, that warehouse, everything's much cheaper. And everybody always seems to be the same.

Stuart Webb [00:15:17]:

I don't know what's going on. That's something that just is so often not measured even by HR departments who are trying to sort of find these things and work out what they are.

Joshua Berry [00:15:26]:

I think you're right, Stuart. There is definitely a concrete ROI that you can see from those good actions from retention and loyalty and Productivity, etcetera. I will throw out there, and this is probably maybe a little controversial for at least for me, 8 o'clock coffee. I wonder if sometimes even our thought of retention is maybe the wrong term. Right? Because it it sets up an organization and an employee as some as a person to be retained. Right? Stewart, I don't know your relationship status, and we don't need to get into this. But Imagine with my spouse if I went into thinking about what is my retention of my spouse. Right? Like that's From an unconditional love standpoint, like, that's probably not something that I'm going to go for.

Joshua Berry [00:16:13]:

And yet we I know it's not a perfect analogy here, but When we start to think about the act of care and concern for the people who are serving us in this organization, employees, And the consumers and people that we're serving, what would happen if we started from another standpoint instead of saying, I need to retain this person, and we said, what would I need to do to make this person want to be here? And I would be okay if they didn't. We work with a great leader of HR who said before, this this individual works in a community, has several Fortune 500 companies. She said, the future belongs to a place where I might have someone who works Down there at Union Pacific, down there at Mutual of Omaha, and some of their time over here with me. If I understand that that's how the community is going to be or even shortsighted, understand that I'm helping prepare people who go out into the community that I want to live in, why wouldn't I prioritize the growth and the deference, right, that we're able to do it? So, it's, it's it's it's a challenge that's out there. It's baked into a friend yesterday was telling me, you know, it's baked into the word the war on talent. Right? It it implies that there has to be this this tension or this otherness that happens to it. And and I think More and more successful leaders are testing the ideas that there can be a different relationship there.

Stuart Webb [00:17:39]:

Yeah. And I think we just had that comment come in that the retention is a word Jesus control. And you're right. It's it's a it's about it's about, that introduction of a lack of trust and falling back on our beliefs. And and I'll I'm Sorry, Greg. I'm sorry. I don't know who the user is. It's just doing that on mobile.

Stuart Webb [00:17:54]:

I'll find out as we get back out of this. But but, you know, I can remember In some of the companies that I've been working with, I have had words with managers when I say to them that one of the ways that I measure them as a success is if there are people that come through and get promoted and they go out into bigger roles because as far as I'm concerned, their job as a manager is to ensure that the people that They are working with their coach to go on and do better and and, you know, actually, the manager looks at you as if to say, but but I don't measure on people leaving and I go, Yeah. This this what I'm trying to do is turn around and say if that person leaves, they leave to a different part of the Company or they go and do something else. You've you've they they got a a a somebody who will be grateful to you forever for what you've done for them, And you will always be able to speak to them and go, do you have a young person that's ready for the next I'll take them. I'll move them on in exactly the way that you've been moved on, And they'll be throwing people your way and you'll get the best talent in your department because there will be people who trust you and it's back to trust. It is it is largely around getting them to trust that you really do have their best in at heart and their best interests and that Grows the entire operation, grows the organization as a whole.

Joshua Berry [00:19:09]:

That sounds like an amazing legacy, right, to be able to leave behind 100%.

Stuart Webb [00:19:14]:

So, Joshua, there must be some, book course or or program or or something which really started you down the path of of starting to think like Share that with us so that we can all go on the same journey that you've gone on.

Joshua Berry [00:19:30]:

And

Stuart Webb [00:19:30]:

with this, I'm gonna take a sip of coffee. This is gonna I'm gonna need you to call for You know,

Joshua Berry [00:19:35]:

if if any if any of my family is listening or friends who know me too much, they know I have a book problem. And So, there there is quite a bit, quite quite a number, so I I will try my best. More recent ones that have influenced some of this belief, One is, there's a couple authors. Diana Chapman is the main one that comes to mind of the book called 15 Commitments to Conscious Leadership, is is a great book that has helped me think through some of those shifts. I would say There's been a lot of inner work, that I've gone through because you do have to yourself. And so there's a number of programs whether it's been through the Purpose Guide Institute or, or other coaches, or or people that I've worked with who have really helped me start to understand What are the stories that are in my head that prevent me from entertaining so many other ideas that might be out there? So, For instance, you know, I needed to there's no such thing as a book problem. Thank you, Melissa. Melissa is ahead of me on reading books this Sure.

Joshua Berry [00:20:43]:

Anyway, so I can't claim I have a book problem, I guess. When I think about, specifically, though, the Ability to be able to, like, recommend books, I think there's so many. And I think just the act of people being open and curious And learning and wanting to try and dig into something different, I think that is what's helpful. And then as I mentioned, any programs that focus on inner work and what the stories are that you're telling yourself. You know, in our organization, we experimented with increased not only our financials, but even pay over the last couple of years. If I hadn't done some of my own inner work To understand what are my hesitations to share that as as as the owner and CEO of the company. Like, there's no way we're going to move beyond that. And so Yeah.

Joshua Berry [00:21:32]:

Any leaders who are starting to say, like, if this feels like a thing I wanna do, but all the rest of the world and everything is saying no, Spend a little bit of time doing some inner work just to truly understand what are the things you gain and what you lose by holding on to some of those beliefs that may actually be Time to sunset.

Stuart Webb [00:21:50]:

I think you're absolutely right, Jeff. In terms of in terms of that, one of the things that I did, with a guy that the company that we grew from, Well, initially, about 3 of us through to about 60 people. I basically took the entire company and I said, right. I'm gonna teach you how to read the company accounts. And, once a month on a Friday, I'm gonna stand up and talk about what's going on in the business, and you can ask me any questions you like. And I was astounded. First of all, that that I thought that the you know, I had a couple of people who turn around me go, What what what if they ask about so and so? And I go, well, I'm gonna be honest. I mean, you know, there's a problem.

Stuart Webb [00:22:28]:

They might as well know about it because they might know how to solve it. And that was exactly the attitude I got. There were people who were standing up and going, well, why are we doing that? Why are we spending money on that? We could do that. You go, okay. Fine. We can we can cut that or I've got an idea of how we could sell this and I'd go, terrific. Yeah. Let's get together and talk about exactly what we do do to turn that into a prop.

Stuart Webb [00:22:49]:

People who you would you'd imagine would never never be interested in doing such things, but, wow, the opportunity is is just, It's just it's just fantastic to take people on that journey.

Joshua Berry [00:23:02]:

I I I love that. You know, the the purpose of Econic, is truly to create the space for people to practice the behaviors that grow themselves and the organization. And you just nailed it right there. Like, I I believe that my community, for sure, my family, I know will be even greater if they get an opportunity to build their financial acumen, their business acumen, as you Jared. Right? And if we continually see that what we're doing you know, if if there was a question that I would hope you'd ask me, Stewart, it'd be, what is the purpose of work? And that was the question

Stuart Webb [00:23:36]:

I was about to get here, to get to you. We're gonna leave in now.

Joshua Berry [00:23:40]:

Swooping the tables. Swooping the tables on you, Stuart.

Stuart Webb [00:23:44]:

Leap in now because the last question I was gonna ask you, Joshua, is a is a question that I haven't yet asked you. What is it? And now you need to answer it. So No. I'm glad we got to that stage. We're not be needing to do anything more any more work.

Joshua Berry [00:23:58]:

Well, okay. What of the purpose of work? And I I truly believe in in today's world where where I think there's fewer and fewer institutions that bring people together for that growth. I think work can Begin and and continue to be a place for people to practice, right, those opportunities to grow themselves, right, and that work. Whether it's whether it's social experiences, whether it's collaboration, whether it's trust, whether it is creativity, curiosity, whether it's finding meaning. Right? There's there's really few places that we spend more time than work, and if we take the opportunity to say, You know what? All of our work, all of our projects, all the things that we're working on are not only a space to be able to grow the organization, but maybe first and foremost To help grow the people who are working through that, again, I think growth becomes an outcome of that and you have all the other great ripples of impact that happen that are beyond that. So, yeah, I I think that's that ties back to the mission, that that I'm definitely working on and, I'm excited to be able to share with everybody today, Stuart. So thank you.

Stuart Webb [00:25:13]:

Listen, Joshua. This has been a really fascinating discussion. I'm gonna I'm just gonna point out once again. You need to go check out Joshua's book, which is at joshuaberry.com/uh, dare to be naive. There with hyphens in between each of those words. Otherwise, it would just run into 1. Very You

Joshua Berry [00:25:32]:

you can also just go to dare to be naive .com. There is a

Stuart Webb [00:25:35]:

Or dare to be my e.com. So, please, go go check out Joshua's book. And, my thanks to you, Joshua, for coming and spending a few, minutes with us here. Listen. I'm just gonna just gonna wrap this up by saying if you would like to get a pre notification, we send we do one of these pretty much every Tuesday. If you'd like to get notification before the event so that you can join on the live and ask questions as you've seen, we've had comments and questions coming in during this discussion. Why don't you go to this link which is, httpscolon/linkthecompleteapproach.co.uk / news lecture. That gets you onto the mailing list.

Stuart Webb [00:26:13]:

You come out once every week with a little bit of a a blurb from me just telling you who's coming up And you can be on the LinkedIn live and watch out for that, each week and then obviously you can obviously also subscribe to the podcast and hear these when they get Issued as a podcast. Joshua, thank you so much, for your time. I'm just gonna leave the link back up. It's been a fascinating discussion. I love what you're doing with Econic, and the the book. Please, keep us informed. Let us know what's going on, and we look forward to watching the progress, in the future.

Joshua Berry [00:26:47]:

Thank you, Stuart. This has been fun. And if I had to leave you with one last thing, do you know the secret to taking good coffee on the go?

Stuart Webb [00:26:56]:

That's secret now.

Joshua Berry [00:26:57]:

It's it's not where you're going. It's where you've been.

Stuart Webb [00:27:03]:

Thank you, Joshua. Goodbye. Please take your jokes with you. I gotta I gotta get us out with a quick quick wrap up for you.

Who is Adrienne?

Adrienne Bellehumeur is a seasoned professional based in Calgary, Alberta, known as "Texas North" due to its association with the oil and gas industry. With expertise in working with clients in various industries, Adrienne primarily focuses on assisting oil and gas companies, including those in the process of going public in Canada or listed on the US exchange. Her main area of expertise lies in running compliance and internal control operations, as well as handling financial process work. Additionally, Adrienne excels in using her skills in documentation to solve a wide range of problems faced by her clients. While her clientele spans across different sectors, her current work heavily revolves around the oil and gas industry.

Key Takeaways

[00:02:18] Doing more with less: a universal problem.

[00:04:04] Knowledge lost; document lessons, automate, avoid stagnation.

[00:07:27] Wasted money on known problem; lack of communication.

[00:10:35] "Documentation is a problem-solving tool for career success."

[00:14:43] Book summarizes career best practices for all.

[00:18:13] Poor cash flow due to delayed sales.

[00:20:39] Subscribe to link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/newsletter for updates and free downloads.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

www.bellehumeurco.com/6steps

A video version of this podcast is also at

https://youtube.com/live/1ZKGoZUxiNA?feature=share

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

documentation, grow your business, 24 hour rule, mass market, advice, guidance, compliance, internal control, financial process, oil and gas, scalability, employee engagement, headcount, systems, knowledge, inflation, interest rates, business owners, high interest rates, high inflation, people's heads, do more with less, lessons learned, automate, minimal effort, sale price, knee-jerk reaction, fancy systems, knowledge management programs, consistent habits, routine.

SPEAKERS

Adrienne Bellehumeur, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:21]:

Hi. And welcome back to It's not rocket science. I've gotta get that in the middle of the frame. Five questions over coffee. I'm here today with Adrian Bellhuma. Adrian is an expert on documentation and how to best use that documentation to help grow your business. And she's the author of the 24 hour rule, which is the 1st real mass market, book, which gives advice and guidance on the best use and best of documentation to grow your business. So I'm really pleased to have Adrienne here with me on the podcast.

Stuart Webb [00:00:54]:

Adrienne, welcome to It's Not Rocket Science 5 questions over coffee.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:00:58]:

Thanks so much, Stuart, for having me. This is great.

Stuart Webb [00:01:01]:

Well, it's terrific to have you. Adrian, let's, let's start by sort of understanding a little bit about the The sort of audience that you you that you help the the the people that have got pros problems that you are trying to help them solve those problems.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:01:16]:

The clients I work with are well, I'm I'm in Calgary, Alberta, so we are considered Texas North, that's our nickname. So I work with a lot of oil and gas clients here, of but and Of companies of all sizes, to be honest, whether it's company that is just in the process of Going public in Canada or large, companies US to on the US exchange. The bulk of my business is actually running Compliance, internal control, financial process work, but I do a lot of other, types of using using the skill of documentation to solve to solve problems. So but it's it's a range of, it's a range of clients, but we we have a heavy focus on oil and gas right now.

Stuart Webb [00:02:03]:

So tell me, what are the sort of problems that those clients have had, and and what have they tried to do to solve the problem that that that they've not necessarily been that successful with before you get involved with them.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:02:18]:

Yeah. Well, it's I mean, it's very topical right now, and I hate give a buzzword, cop cop out response, but doing more with less is a huge theme right now. And I'd say it's a it's Almost a universal problem with inflation, interest rates, really changing the game and how, companies make decisions. So, Again, it's talked about a lot right now, but I don't think it's just just a buzzword. I would say it's the the biggest problem that Clients right now are are struggling with is how to do more with their their staff, first of all. I mean, we Employee engagement is at a all time low right now. People are not looking we are in an age where people are not looking to increase their headcount. In fact, we're looking to decrease headcount pretty much everywhere and just operate with a leaner, structure.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:03:11]:

I have other clients that are that are in a maybe in a different category than a more mature business. They are looking To scale or leverage what they're doing, but still not not really looking they don't we're not in a environment of spending a ton of money, so I this This do more with less theme, is massive whether it's, an existing business scaling kinda scaling back, Using their people better, using systems better, using knowledge in people's heads better. It just seems like a universal and even even Business owners that are looking to scale, right now with high high interest rates, high inflation, It's a more it's a people wanna do it right without just spending a ton of money throwing throwing, you know, Throwing money at at the problem, which is really not what I'd advise to do either.

Stuart Webb [00:04:04]:

And re and really one of the great problems that that, That we we've we've we've we've found ourselves locked into for a lot of years, isn't it? It's the fact that we don't often document All of the lessons learned and things that have happened in the past and how we do things well enough so that when you do get that Turnover of engagement or when you do need to downsize and you do need to automate things through systems, it's not possible to do that because the knowledge is lost. So the knowledge is is lost because it's locked in people's heads, and it's only by sensibly and by, Well, I'd like to say with minimal effort, but that's what it is. With minimal effort getting into a document which is easy to understand, keep refreshed, Keep people sort of, up to speed that a business owner is able to do that. And it and it it's critical to to not only growth, but When it comes to that stage of when you need to, as a business owner, start thinking about exit, if it's all locked away in people's heads, you cannot possibly move the business forward.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:05:03]:

Yeah. It certainly can hurt your sale price as well, in the event of a of a even even informal documentation can be used to increase your sale price as well. So that's that's a great point. I mean, any, tier audience that's often looking to leverage their business, I mean, Doc, just getting things on paper is that's a huge part big part of my business too is actually

Stuart Webb [00:05:27]:

business

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:05:28]:

point of leverage. Even even myself, if I'm looking to bring someone new in our team or, Using an administrator, all of a sudden, the stuff that I've done from my own head has to be transferred. I mean, it's it's very interesting how Important documentation becomes oh, even when you expand to just 2 people doing doing something. I mean, my my advice, I guess, Stuart, what I see in and and why I'm so motivated in this area is that most most businesses have really knee jerk reaction to these projects Where it's kind of, oh, let's just go doc run and spend a fortune either documenting or fancy systems or almost overkilling, the problem as opposed to just consistent habits, that is less costly. So that's Part of my soapbox I'm getting on and the motivation for my work, I know you wanna ask about why we're what companies Could do better. Yeah. The knee jerk reaction of rushing out and spending a fortune either documenting or systems or these Fancy knowledge management programs. And then what happens is, of course, they just get cut.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:06:40]:

This is cut when, when the Buzzword changes. So I've I've my whole math my entire methodology is about Consistent habits that are actually quite an Habits. Quite routine.

Stuart Webb [00:06:55]:

Habits are really important with this, aren't they? If it becomes what it as you say, it's it's one of those things where if somebody turns around and says, We need to make we need to get our documentation up to date, and everybody rushes around and starts doing it. Yep. And then it you know, the the fatigue flags and and everybody gets fed up Doing it, and then you get to the point where somebody leaves and it's okay. Well, we'll you know, let's not worry about that. We'll get on with what we got on with, and then we'll just 2, 3 years later, somebody says, All our documentation's out of date. Let's get all our documentation out of the day. It it it just is a cycle. I've seen it 3 or 4 times of businesses I've been involved with there.

Stuart Webb [00:07:27]:

We we we we we haven't got this. Yeah. Learning, learning and a a a habit with, you know, Making it just part of whatever is going on, you just keep a note of of the latest thing and record record it. A a great example of this, I was working with a business recently, and there was a huge amount of effort to get a particular problem solved. And then somebody sort of was looking through the Wiki, and they came across an entry which was essentially, I guess the best thing could be described as, oh, this is a bit of a known problem. We ought to solve it and think about solving it at some stage. And I asked the question, Well, when did that get written? Well, the date stamp is this date, and I went, so let's get this right. We've just spent Nearly a quarter of $1,000,000 trying to solve a problem that was known about.

Stuart Webb [00:08:22]:

Yeah. But we'd all forgotten about it. And I went, didn't anybody think of Checking the Wiki before we started down this path, and they went, no. We kind of don't really bother too much about it. We just look at it when we're really, really stuck. It was one of those moments when I thought the habit of constantly sort of doing documentation has been lost in this organization, And it would have saved a good quarter of a 1000000. Yeah. We would have we would have been 4 weeks ahead of schedule had we not spent 4 weeks Forgetting that there was some documentation and not even bothering to look at it.

Stuart Webb [00:08:55]:

A horrible experience.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:08:56]:

It's it's, it's very Basic, basic skill in some ways. I mean, we're we and we assume, our workforce knows how to do it correctly. My Experience as a business owner and consultant, is is actually it's the contrary. It's very few people that really understand mechanics are doing it well, and that's actually why I do so much have so much effort writing and training others and, promoting best practices and habits around because my experience is that it's it's not as well done or understood as a skill, and it and it does take work. It's not something like breathing. Not every you're not gonna just hire experienced people, and they necessarily are great at it.

Stuart Webb [00:09:43]:

I'm just making a note of, of things that I need to remember in the future, Adrianne, to Check. Come back to. Listen. You must have some valuable free advice that you, that you you could give to the audience listening at the moment. What what would that be? And I I think there is A an interesting, download that I can refer to now, which I'll show on screen.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:10:03]:

Sure. There's a download here. So my book, I'm gonna I'm gonna do,

Stuart Webb [00:10:09]:

this to James.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:10:10]:

Oh, I'm just going the wrong way.

Stuart Webb [00:10:11]:

I went right

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:10:15]:

for smarter organizations. So it's actually don't I I don't wanna freak out your audience that it's a book on documentation. It's actually a fun read. It's much more, aligned with solving business problems. That's actually how I view documentation. It's not just a exercise you put on the shelf. It's it's really about solving problem. That's what I That's what I do for a client.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:10:35]:

Whether a client is going public or it is or you're stuck in a vortex of meetings or you have, Peter is retiring, and he built your systems from scratch 15 years ago. I mean, there's so many different scenarios which you apply documentation to, and I Truly believe that it's just a tool for problem solving, also a set of skills that you carry your entire career, and and in your life as well. So my book is structured along these 6 steps, of of capture, structure, Present, which is about writing and and visualization, communicate, store and leverage, and lead and innovate, and, I give Tips, and skills along each of these things. So my download will give your audience a bit of a flavor for some of these techniques, and if you're interested more, certainly check them out in the book. I mean, I would say if if I could leave your audience with One very simple technique in documentation, that is no technology required, no fancy education, and they will get their money's worth from, joining your, this this podcast today, is the 24 hour rule, and that is a very simple it's actually I believe the golden rule of documentation is that you have To process, you have to do something with information within 24 hours of either hearing it or even have it it can be applied to ideas as well. The 20 the 24 hour rule, is is the again, golden rule documentation, also a great productivity tip. One of the worst losses of of good of knowledge, momentum on projects, opportunity comes within 24 hours. We don't we are really good at processing information in 24 hours.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:12:32]:

But if you really wait past that window, Your short term memory and your your energetic connection to that information starts dropping. So I'm sure, Stuart, you've been to meetings. Everyone Came out with brilliant ideas and, all this they solved the world, and then they they just head out for the weekend and really forget to action anything. Those are Very classic examples of how good information opportunity momentum gets lost because we don't We don't process it effectively. And in my experience is a lot of great information is lost within That that 24 hour window. Certainly, meetings is a great example, but you can apply it to business I mean, sales. It's usually when you don't When you don't follow-up on a sales opportunity or even process it or connect with someone you met at a conference, you are your likelihood of doing that diminishes actually quite rapidly in 24 hours. So it's a very different take on how documentation is usually so Formal and, so, corporate, but this is a this is a new take, of driving better habits will change Change your documentation across the board in so many different areas of your business.

Stuart Webb [00:13:48]:

I like it very much. I agree. I really do. I really do. Was there a particular, book or experience or course or something which really sort of got you into understanding the the the value of commendation in in a in an organization?

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:14:05]:

I I actually wrote the book because I thought there was A hole in the market. I've again, I I as a I'm a I'm a CPA. I started, your it's and it's a very documentation, patient, intensive career, actually. You do need to loan your auditor, or you you have to you have to know the document. And, usually, you're plunked. And I my experience is you're plunked into, into the work world. People expect to do how to do it. And I actually remember it really drowning, When I worked for I worked for a lot of banks and all the just sea of documentation.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:14:43]:

I I remember not actually having a good grasp on it, So I was very motivated to write a book that I think would be helpful, but it it it would be helpful for people new in their career, but also really all levels. I've I mean, certainly, it it's it's almost, a it it's levels the playing field, really. It's not everyone Almost it doesn't matter if you're a senior executive or, just starting your career. We could all benefit from some of these best practices. The the book actually draws from the worlds of information management, organizational design, which is effectively better process, and And productivity, personal productivity, is kind of a smooshing together of these 3 disciplines, and, actually, that's why That intersection is really where this world, I call it dynamic documentation, is defined. I I would say I mean, one big influence is David Allen's getting things done. It is, and he's influenced a lot of people. He he really that productivity component, he's the one who Really kicked it off.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:15:45]:

There's been a lot of great productivity books since then, personal productivity, but I would his is still This is still kind of the the kickoff about just over 20 years ago of that new discipline, which is so needed in today's work world. We do we do need Teach people how to be more productive.

Stuart Webb [00:16:04]:

Absolutely great. Look. We're reaching towards the end of the, for the interview. Adrian, I really thank you for spending some time with us, but But there must be 1 question that's currently, currently keeping you, keeping on the edge of your seat thinking, why hasn't he asked me about? And so, therefore, I'm gonna ask you now, What's the question I should have asked you, which I I haven't yet? And then, obviously, you have to answer it because otherwise, we'll all be going away wondering why it is we didn't get a good answer to that question. So What is that 1 question that I haven't yet asked that you'd like me to?

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:16:34]:

The oh, wow. That's a hard question, Stuart. You can ask me to

Stuart Webb [00:16:37]:

I like to I like to leave the hard questions for other people to, to ask as well as answer, Adrian. That's, that's that's my that's my secret of my success.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:16:45]:

You can ask me, What's the simp my favorite simple framework for document I know it's a very question, and I'll I'll I'll, I I have lots of

Stuart Webb [00:16:55]:

people

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:16:55]:

to ask me, but yes.

Stuart Webb [00:16:57]:

Please give us that description.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:16:59]:

Alright. I'll give another simple this is also very helpful for your audience, and I use it extensively in my training is that documentation has been traditionally viewed as big d documentation. That means, like, Policies, records, formal, big systems, transform big big initiatives like that. Documentation is equally about little d, everyday disciplines and habits that we talked about, including the 24 hour rule, How we take notes, how we store things regularly, how we can write, how we communicate. To have great documentation, you need to balance Big d and little d. You can you can implement the fanciest sales system in the world, but if your sales team doesn't have the habit of recording sales prospects, it's not gonna fly. I vote so I'm a huge believer. My very simple framework is that you keep you Basically have to keep the 2 in balance, big d and little d, to have very successful initiatives, projects, and organizations as well.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:18:07]:

So I'll just leave with that last little framework easy framework for your audience.

Stuart Webb [00:18:13]:

Adrian, I happen to love that, and it reminds me. Just gonna give a very real example. I led, I led 1 business that was currently in undergoing a huge amount of, trouble. The, the the problems were were myriad, but one of the major problems I had to solve was the fact that their cash flow was poor. And the the the one of the keys to solving their cash flow was to discover that these salespeople Captured most of their sales on bits of paper and then uploaded them to the computer system when they got back into the office. And they were traveling, So they would have what I call what I eventually came to call briefcase time. That was orders that were ready that customers wanted to pay for In a brief case for 1, 2, or possibly even 3 weeks, by which time the customer had even forgotten they'd made the order And then we cancel it when they saw it come through on an email because they thought it was no longer an order or it was a duplicate. And that was one of the major problems that that business had, and all we had to do was get them to upload it on a slightly more regular basis than leave it in their briefcase for 3 weeks.

Stuart Webb [00:19:23]:

And the 24 hour rule became an absolutely critical rule for us. All orders from paper into system Improper documentation so that we actually understood what the order was within 24 hours. You're absolutely right. Big d and little d, Absolutely critical to every organization. I love that. I'm gonna be starting to I'll steal that from you if that's okay with you. Okay. Yeah.

Stuart Webb [00:19:43]:

Absolutely. Big d and little d or

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:19:45]:

You can talk

Stuart Webb [00:19:46]:

day long.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:19:46]:

Big d, little c, you can use it you can use it in different capacities, but they do always have to be in balance. And we talk a lot about big d, so I'm Bringing a lot more attention to those little d habits, skills, and

Stuart Webb [00:19:58]:

different ones. Brilliant. Adrian, look. This has been a really fascinating discussion, And I think you've brought documentation to life, which I know is not something which I expected people to be hearing from me because documentation is not something that most businesses find themselves thinking It's a good use of their time. It's a critical use of their time if they wanna grow, critical use of their time if they wanna avoid some of the problems you've been saying. Look. We're we're reaching the end, but if you would like to get on to our newsletter list so that you get to hear about brilliant interviews With people like Adrian so that you can participate by asking questions when we're live or by being aware of the recordings when they come out on podcast form on Apple Spotify. Here's the link you go to.

Stuart Webb [00:20:39]:

You go to httpscolonforward/forward/link.thecompleteapproach. That's thecompleteapproach word.co.ukforward/newsletter. That's link.thecompleteapproach.co.ukforward/newsletter. Get on that newsletter list, get to hear about great people like Adrian who are coming up, and about the brilliant sort of things that you'll hear When you see Adrian's, notes coming out, because I'll link to that book and I'll link to her 6 steps, a free download. Adrian, this has been absolutely fantastic. Thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. Really appreciate you coming to us all the way from, from Calgary. I guess it's still nice and warm there at the moment.

Stuart Webb [00:21:19]:

I've been to Calgary, and I know it could get a little cold. But I guess for

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:21:23]:

a moment,

Stuart Webb [00:21:24]:

it's still up.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:21:26]:

Adrianne, thanks.

Stuart Webb [00:21:28]:

Thank you so much. You're gonna play us out, and then, we'll Speak to you again soon.

Adrienne Bellehumeur [00:21:33]:

Thank you.

Who is Darren?

Darren Saul is a seasoned podcaster who has found his passion in the world of podcasting. With multiple successful podcasts under his belt, Darren has established himself as a prominent figure in the industry. His belief in the power of podcasting as a marketing tool has led him to create valuable content that not only builds brand awareness but also serves as a passive means of sharing his expertise with the world. Darren's dedication to podcasting has allowed him to create a platform for himself and his work, connecting with audiences in a unique and engaging way.

Key Takeaways

00:00 Maximizing podcast content for effective marketing.

07:00 Podcast resources, courses, and free webinar available.

09:04 Traditional advertising no longer effective, turned to podcasts.

12:03 Podcasting creates diverse, reusable marketing content opportunities.

17:03 Start a podcast with a video call.

18:11 Leverage other podcasts for marketing content.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

Some free resources at https://tinyurl.com/3p8pnpnz

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

podcasting, podcasters, podcasting strategy, brand awareness, marketing content, podcast monetization, podcast guests, podcast preparation, podcast marketing, podcast production, podcast promotion, podcast value, podcasting courses, podcasting resources, podcasting webinar, podcasting content, podcasting journey, podcasting advice, podcasting strategy, podcasting coach, podcasting industry, podcasting impact, podcasting audience, podcasting success, podcasting commitment, podcasting imposter syndrome, podcasting start, podcasting consistency, podcasting confidence, podcasting opportunities

SPEAKERS

Darren Saul, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:24]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science 5 Questions Over Coffee. My name is Stuart Webb. I'm here with Darren Saul, who is, a podcaster, pretty pretty experienced at this podcast stuff. I'm fairly sure that he doesn't need any introduction from me on what we're doing. So, Darren, you're a you're a podcaster. You're a you're a strategist, trainer, coach, student of human, attention, you say. And you've started heavily utilizing the power of podcasting. So I'm really interested to hear how you're helping your clients to use podcasting and how it's making a difference in in their their business.

Stuart Webb [00:01:06]:

So welcome to It's Not Rocket Science, 5 questions and go for coffee. I hope you've got your coffee there in front of you. My coffee.

Darren Saul [00:01:13]:

I have to stay on brand with the show.

Stuart Webb [00:01:16]:

Good man. Good man. So, Darren, tell us, how is it that you help people, in their podcasting?

Darren Saul [00:01:23]:

You bet. So podcasting is something that's growing from strength to strength as we all know. I heard some ridiculous statistic the other day. I don't know if it's true or not. That there's more podcast than there are listeners. I don't know if that's true or not, but it's crazy. But it just goes to show you how many people are podcasting at the moment. But that's not to say that every podcast that people set up goes past episode 10.

Darren Saul [00:01:49]:

There's a lot of podcasters, but not many of them get past episode 20 or certainly not to 50 or a 100. So basically, I love podcasting, and I've just fallen in love with podcasting over the years. And so I podcast more and more. I've got 2 podcasts, but I think they're an incredible way to build brand awareness, to build, marketing material, to build content in all those different forms and to be a very indirect passive way to tell people what you do and where you work rather than a very aggressive push sales process, which is something that we all do more and more these days.

Stuart Webb [00:02:34]:

So so what is it that you see that people are doing wrong? And and and what is it that you think people are you're trying to help them to do with with the work you do, Darren?

Darren Saul [00:02:45]:

Yeah. Great. So really two things. I I tackle podcasting from both sides. So I work with podcasters to create a better podcast, deliver a better podcast, monetize their podcast, possibly if they're looking to do that, and just continue to get value and extract marketing content as well as brand awareness and business results from their podcast. But then I also work with guests to help them get podcast ready. Cause a lot of guests jump on a podcast. They're not prepared.

Darren Saul [00:03:20]:

They don't know what they're gonna be talking about. They haven't articulated their little 30 or 1 minute commercial. And then when they've done a podcast like this, they say, great, had a great show and they never do anything else. So for me, that's madness. If you do a show like this, you ask for the raw footage and then you actually start using that raw footage in your marketing material. So I'm really trying to work both sides of the podcasting equation so people can really start using podcasting as a medium, or I keep coming back to the same two things, brand awareness and marketing content. That is the power of podcasting. And then of course, all those things can continue from there.

Darren Saul [00:04:05]:

You can turn you can monetize them in so many different ways. You can, have fun. You can create new podcasts. You can get on other people's shows. You can build yourself up as a thought leader in your industry. You can get keynote speaking opportunities. I mean, you can get workshop opportunities, coaching opportunities. It goes on and on and on.

Darren Saul [00:04:26]:

But it's really those 2

Stuart Webb [00:04:28]:

things I love. And and I think it's I think you're absolutely right. Too many people do anything like this where they don't think about what their message is and and make it clear, and then they fail to I mean, most people know that you've got to repeat your message many times for people to hear it. I always worry about people who sort of sit back and wait for the results to sort of flow in rather than having a plan and following it through and actually you know, it's a it's a bit like any activity, isn't it? You've gotta know what your objective is and follow that plan rather than just sort of sitting back and going, well, why hasn't the world turned and faced towards me and sort of run at me?

Darren Saul [00:05:05]:

100%. 100%. And you brought a really good point. It's there's a lot of patience and consistency needed. If you really wanna run a good podcast, you have to just keep on pounding away with the episodes, marketing them well, and fill giving time for the audience to find you and building your your brand. You know? And people start to get used to you dropping an episode every Monday or every Tuesday or once a fortnight or once a month or whatever it is, and they'll start talking about your podcast, telling other people about it. All that stuff takes time. You can't expect to have podcast results in 2 months, and that's why a lot of people start and finish really quickly.

Stuart Webb [00:05:45]:

Brilliant. So, I'm now hopefully gonna ask you for the dead simple one, which is you must have a bunch of advice that you can give us and and and valuable, advice as well that you might wanna sort of pass on. And I know you've got a link on your website, which I'm gonna pull up here. It's it's at tinyurl.com3p8 pnpnzed, or for those of us in the US, that would be z. 3p8 p n p n zed. So, Darren, tell tell us some of the stuff that's at that link. What is it that you're trying to help people to do with that, man? Yeah.

Darren Saul [00:06:22]:

Sure. So there's a a great link there. There's lots of free resources on that link. So, for example, there's a great, PDF that you can download to help you build a podcast from a to zed. It's like my a to zed formula of podcasting. So if you're thinking about dipping your toe in the water, you're not quite sure, there's lots of information in there about the tech needed, the strategy, the little bit about the the preparation sorry, the, processing and the producing, because that's a little bit of a fine art in itself. Exactly. And then there's a lot of production and promotion, working there as well.

Darren Saul [00:07:00]:

I've got stuff for guests as well. If you a little PDF on how to be podcast ready, covering all sorts of different topics from your 32nd commercial or your your story to how to leverage your content, how to choose the right host, how to choose the right podcast, how to choose your target audience, how to choose your niche, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. And I've got a few other paid resources. If anybody is interested in jumping on and learning, there's a a recorded course and a few other opportunities. There's also another webinar, a free webinar that I'm doing next week on how to monetize your podcast. So there's a 1 hour free webinar you can jump on, and we're gonna talk about 15 different strategies to how you can start thinking about monetizing your podcast. And you don't have to have a lot of podcast episodes to monetize. You just have to think in a little bit of a creative way, and there's all sorts of stuff you could do, and you can have a lot of fun as well.

Darren Saul [00:07:56]:

So lots of great resources if anybody wants to dive into the podcasting world.

Stuart Webb [00:08:00]:

That's great stuff, Darren. Thank you very much. So I've I've got a I've got a a little link going up at the moment. If anybody has any questions, put them into the chat. But but, Darren, how did you get into Pasciani? What was it? What was there a book, a course, a program? What is it that sort of made you a podcast strategist? And and and if you don't mind me describing you, I think in the very best possible way, a podcast nerd, I actually think that's the highest compliment I can pay somebody, but all those disagree with me.

Darren Saul [00:08:28]:

I love it. I'll take it. I'll take it. I love being called a podcast nerd. I love to nerd out on podcasting stuff.

Stuart Webb [00:08:34]:

Yeah. Good for you.

Darren Saul [00:08:35]:

Love it. So, yeah, good story. So I do a number of different things. I've been working as a a corporate IT recruiter, for 25 years, nearly 25 years. I've been working as a photographer for about 10 years. And about 6 years ago, I realized that the tide had changed in terms of marketing and business development. The yellow pages or we have we have the yellow pages here. I don't know what you guys have

Stuart Webb [00:09:03]:

over here. Yeah. Yeah.

Darren Saul [00:09:04]:

Yellow pages where you can advertise locally and people can find you and all that stuff. That wasn't being looked at anymore. Letter drops were being thrown in the bin. Cold calling was getting harder and harder to get in past the gatekeepers. So I started thinking about there's gotta be a better way to start marketing my business. And I stumbled onto social media, digital media, podcasting, and I thought, wow, this is amazing. So I thought, you know what? What the hell? So I started 2 podcasts right off the bat, one for my recruitment business and one for my photography business. And the recruitment business is a little bit more esoteric where I interview people about job seeking and career development and building company culture and hiring and firing and all that kind of stuff.

Darren Saul [00:09:55]:

And then I have my other one, which is what I call my variety show. I've got about over 220 something episodes where I talk about all sorts of different things from real estate to health sciences to book launches to music to mindset, entrepreneurship, business, whatever. And that's my my passion project. And since that, the birth of that and the journey, I've started wanting to really just give as much information and coach and teach other people to get the same results out of podcasting because I think it's such a great tool. And there's a little bit of a backstory, but it's been a lot of fun, and I just who knows where it's gonna lead?

Stuart Webb [00:10:36]:

That's brilliant. I think it's absolutely fantastic. So so what is it about, about podcasting therefore then that you see as being the way of sort of driving that marketing? Because, you know, it's it is once again, it's one of those things where it is it is a bit passive. So so how do you how do you what what can you do to sort of make your podcast as successful as you can?

Darren Saul [00:10:56]:

Yeah. Good. Great question. Well, I mean, that's the beauty of it in itself because it's passive. Like, I always use this analogy. If you were to look through your social media, LinkedIn and Facebook in particular, turn off the sound, just scroll down the feed. All you see are people like, like this little if you imagine my little box is one little screen, all you see is people talking to the camera with this all this animation and energy trying to sell you something. Right? So it gets a little bit much after a while.

Darren Saul [00:11:30]:

And I love podcasting because it's the exact opposite. It's me, particularly when it's with a guest. So we've got 2 of us here. We're talking to each other. It really takes the pressure off. You know? We're not we're not trying to sell you anything. We're just we're more almost inviting you in for a conversation, you know, with our coffee, rather than pushing our agenda down your throat. So it's a very indirect, curious way of attracting people rather than really aggressively promoting whatever it is that we wanna promote.

Darren Saul [00:12:03]:

So that's really number 1. But the other thing that podcasting does, and people are really starting to realize this more and more these days, it is an incredible way to create content. So if you run a podcast system and you record in video and audio form, long form, you have so much video, audio, written, graphic content that you can utilize now for your marketing on social media, on your website, in your email newsletters, in your email signature. Maybe if you wanna do letter drops, whatever the hell do you wanna do, there is that many things you can do with that content. You'll never run out of it. And it's fresh and varied because you've got a different guest every week or every 2 weeks or whatever. Then you can start bringing mash up the greatest hits within a month or, I mean, send out newsletters with your, playlist of different topics. I mean, it goes on and on and on, But it's all about getting the content in the 1st place, and a podcast system just gives you that opportunity.

Stuart Webb [00:13:14]:

That's brilliant. Darren, you know, there must be one question you're currently thinking. He hasn't asked the critical question here, and he's he's he's missed the point of this stuff. So what's the critical question I should have asked you? What is it that you are burning to sort of tell me about something? And, you know, now I've given you the opportunity to ask that question. You'll obviously have to answer it because you're the only one that actually knows the answer.

Darren Saul [00:13:37]:

Yeah. That's a really good one. And the real the question would be, if I had to ask people, why are you not starting your podcast? Everybody always is fascinated by podcast. They do podcast courses. They come to podcast workshops. And then 6 months later have you started your podcast? Oh, we're about to start. We're just talking about this. We're just talking about that.

Darren Saul [00:14:00]:

We're just finalizing this. We're finalizing that a year later. They still haven't started their podcast or they've started and done 2 episodes. I'm like, what? What's going on? Why haven't you either started or continued? And the reason is it takes work. Yeah. It takes strategy.

Stuart Webb [00:14:18]:

Yeah.

Darren Saul [00:14:19]:

And it takes commitment. But if you do it and you do it well, it is in one of the best marketing tools available. And the other reason that people stop or they don't start is, you know, I hate that term imposter syndrome, but everybody's using it. So I'll just use it because everybody knows what it is. But a lot of people think, oh, I'm not worthy of sharing my voice with the world. I'm not worthy of sharing my message. What do I who am I to start a podcast? But you look around there every Tom, Dick, and Harry has started their own show. They're talking about what they love.

Darren Saul [00:14:55]:

They're talking about what they know about, and it's now the era of giving getting away with worrying about the gatekeepers. We don't have anybody to tell us what we can and can't do. We can all have our own show. We can all have our own production, and it's all about free to air. We wanna listen to what we wanna listen to. So why the hell not? You know, if you've got something that you're burning to share with the world, and even if you're not perfect from episode 1, you're gonna get better. When I go back to my episode 1 and rewatch my first show, it's terrible. Episode 10 is terrible.

Darren Saul [00:15:34]:

But as I've been doing more and more podcasts, I get more and more confident. And you just you start to enjoy it and you learn from other people, and it's we're all learning from each other. So all I can say is if you're on the fence about podcasting, jump in, have some fun, at least try it for a couple of episodes before you worry about not doing it. And if I can leave with one great title of a book that really sums this up beautifully, there's a book, I'm trying to think of the name of the the author, but it's called Ready, Fire, Aim.

Stuart Webb [00:16:09]:

Aim. Yeah.

Darren Saul [00:16:10]:

Is it Michael Masterson? I think it's Yeah.

Stuart Webb [00:16:12]:

I think it is. It is. Yeah.

Darren Saul [00:16:13]:

Instead of ready aim fire, and that sums this concept up beautifully. Start the journey, get some feedback from the audience, get some feedback from whoever it is your your viewers and, and, listeners are and tweak as you go. You don't have to have it all sorted out before you begin. It never is that way. Just not and tweak and change and have fun along the way. It's a journey.

Stuart Webb [00:16:38]:

Yeah. Brilliant. Do you know I I just wanna I just wanna add one thing to what you said, Dan, because because I think it is important. I've spoken to a number of people and invited. I hope I hope you've had a good time, which just as you said, it's been 2 2 professionals just just talking. There's, you know, it's nothing more complicated. It's nothing more serious. Well, it is serious, but it's nothing more intimidating than that.

Stuart Webb [00:17:03]:

And the number of people I've spoken to and said, why don't you just go and be a guest on a podcast? And they'll say, I couldn't do that. And you go, well, you can appear on a video call. We all do them nowadays since 2020. We've spent 8 we spent we've re reinvented ourselves as people are able to do a video call. Why don't you just do a video call with somebody and record it? And that is the beginning of your podcast. And I mean Yep. It's nothing more than a video call. And people will turn around and say, well, yeah, I do a lot of those and I record them and I go, okay.

Stuart Webb [00:17:35]:

Terrific. So so that's your podcast. And their immediate response is, yeah, that wouldn't be very good. And I well, what? Who defines if it's good?

Darren Saul [00:17:44]:

That's

Stuart Webb [00:17:44]:

right. It's it's not a it's it's not about good, it's about doing, and it's not only about doing as you said and starting, but it's also about thinking to yourself there may be somebody out there, even one other person that this could help. Great. Help that one other person. Stop worrying about the the 99.999 percent of people that that don't want that. They don't want it, they'll turn away. But there might be 0.0001% of people that go, that was useful for me.

Darren Saul [00:18:11]:

Yeah. If you could have one person if I could have one person with this, I'm very happy. If I've got one person to start podcasting and you made a really, really good point. And this is something that I usually say, if you're not ready to jump in and set up your own podcast, get on other people's shows, at least do that. Get on other people's shows, ask for the content, pop it up, use it in your marketing. You're often away. You don't even have to have your own show if you don't wanna do the extra work and, you know, the extra cost and the resources and whatever else. Just book yourself into lots of different shows and you're up and running.

Darren Saul [00:18:45]:

And then maybe one day you might start your own.

Stuart Webb [00:18:49]:

Darren, I don't know if you've helped anybody else. I hope you have. You've helped me a lot, and I'm really enthusiastic about sort of doing more now. So thank you so much for coming on and spending a few minutes with us. I'm just gonna ask you all, if you could go to, this link, which is link dot the complete approach dotco.ukforward/newsletter. That gets you on to our newsletter website, mailing list, then you get to hear about when we're publishing really interesting articles from the sort of people that we're talking to like Darren. So that's link dot the complete approach dotco.ukforward/newsletter. Please subscribe to that.

Stuart Webb [00:19:27]:

Darren, if you've done nothing else, you've helped me today. Thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us.

Darren Saul [00:19:32]:

My pleasure.

Stuart Webb [00:19:33]:

Looking forward to sharing the content with you because that's what this is all about. I'm quite happy to do that, and I think it's a really good point you've made. People should ask for that footage, that that content, and use it as much as they can. So, Darren, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. Looking forward to seeing what you do with this stuff.

Darren Saul [00:19:51]:

You bet. Thank you, Stuart, for having me, and thank you audience for listening and watching.

Stuart Webb [00:19:57]:

Bye bye.

Who is Sophie?

Sophie Dearden is a professional who specializes in helping businesses with their hiring and recruitment needs. From small solo printer setups to larger companies, Sophie understands the struggles they face when it comes to bringing in the right talent. She assists smaller businesses that lack experience or HR departments by providing alternative methods of hiring. Additionally, Sophie aids larger companies, particularly those in industries like engineering, construction, and recruitment, where there is a significant skills gap or shortage. In the UK, she has successfully placed gas engineers and electrical engineers in companies facing these challenges. Sophie has extensive knowledge of the employee market and understands the difficulties companies face in offering competitive salaries to attract skilled professionals. With her expertise, she not only helps businesses with recruiting skilled individuals but also assists in staff retention strategies.

Key Takeaways

[00:03:17] Companies struggle to fill gaps in their workforce, leading to burnout, low morale, and high turnover. Traditional hiring methods are expensive and time-consuming. Hence, many companies turn to recruitment companies after failed attempts to fill the gap themselves.

[00:05:17] Big rebrand, hiring remote professionals, task delegation.

[00:11:24] University in England, ski instructing in New Zealand, art degree, gym failure, successful sales company, sacrificing relationships, shutting down company, working with virtual assistants, learning from past experiences, Tim Ferris's book, starting Resource Worldwide.

[00:15:45] Flexibility and cost-effectiveness of hiring remote professionals

Valuable Free Resource or Action

www.resourceworldwide.com

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

https://www.youtube.com/live/Jj64xdzEeig?feature=share

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

struggling small businesses, right skills, talented individuals, technical or skill, hiring individuals, solo printers, home office, physical location, budget, alternative method of hiring, skills gaps, skill shortages, engineering companies, construction companies, recruitment companies, gas engineers, electrical engineers, employee's market, candidate driven market, salary requirements, HR department, retention of staff, organic growth, add more responsibilities, burnout, morale, team, infrastructure, competitors, gap, hiring, recruiting, recruitment company, expensive mistakes, rebrand, current website, tips for hiring, remote professionals, Philippines, cost-effective option, local area, upfront fees, sliding scale, A player, career progression opportunity, culture of the company, vision of the company, sense of purpose, poor retention, timely, expensive.

SPEAKERS

Sophie Dearden, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:22]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's not rocket science 5 questionnaire with Profiolo today. I'm having just some nice lemon water because I've got a bit of a sore throat of that. And I'm delighted to welcome Sophie Deird and Sophie is the co founder of resource worldwide there are businesses on a mission to really help, struggling small businesses find the right skills and talented individuals no matter her technical or skill they need to be. And so she's gonna talk to us a little bit about some of those problems. So welcome to it's not rocket science. Five questions over coffee.

Sophie Dearden [00:00:56]:

Thank you so much. It's great to be here. I'm super excited to talk to you and, hopefully share some new information and insights to anyone that's watching.

Stuart Webb [00:01:05]:

Brilliant. So, Sophie, tell me what is the sort of problem that you are currently trying to solve? What's the What's the problem that your customers have that you really help them to to to solve?

Sophie Dearden [00:01:17]:

So we work with a fairly sizable range different businesses. So anything from solo printers right through to kind of multiple 7 or 8 figure companies. And the one consistency across the companies that we work with is essentially they are struggling to hire individuals into their businesses. And it can be for a range of different reasons. Obviously, smaller businesses sometimes they don't necessarily have one any experience or a HR department to help them with recruiting. They may not necessarily have an office. A lot of solo printers in 2023 are able to start a amazing businesses, run amazing businesses even from their home office, for example. So they may not have a physical location. They may not have a budget to bring somebody in full time. So we'll come in and we'll help those business owners with hiring in our way, which is an alternative method of hiring. Or with the larger companies that we work with, we find that there's real skills gaps and skill shortages. So we work a lot with engineering companies, construction companies, recruitment companies, for example. Let's talk about engineering We have recently been placing gas engineers, electrical engineers into companies here in the UK because there's just a real skill shortage of that specific, niche. Alternatively, the skills are available in the UK, but the cost, but it's very much an employee's market or a candidate driven market, the cost of which the salary requirements are is so high, the companies just can't afford to pay them. that's the type of company that we start to work with, people who have got problems with recruiting skilled professionals, recruiting at all, and also retention of their staff as well.

Stuart Webb [00:03:03]:

So what's the sort of thing that you find business owners have tried to do or failed before you sort of help them? Where have they where they've been putting their efforts, which have not resulted in the right higher or getting the right sort of skill in their business?

Sophie Dearden [00:03:17]:

a lot of companies, and again, if we're talking about kind of our more established businesses here. A lot of companies grow organically. So they may have somebody in their business who's been there for a long time and they've kind of started to build up a team And what happens is they just add more and more responsibilities onto their existing team members. who might not actually be the right skill set for those responsibilities, their assistant team members come in and start to get burnout, for example, the morale of the team can drop. The retention then can drop. People might start moving looking for different positions. So when a company will step back and look at their infrastructure and go, okay. Actually, we've got a gap here that we need to fill, or it may be that their competitors are offering service there, not yet, sir, they're not offering. So for whatever reason, there'll be a gap that becomes available in the company where they need to hire. Traditionally, they'll look at either hiring themselves, but like we kind of touched on already, a lot of companies don't have HR departments. that ensure how to hire. they may look at using recruitment companies. Both of these different ways of hiring traditional recruitment companies I'm talking about, they can be really expensive and also timely. So if you try to hire yourself or you hire for recruitment company, the recruitment company gets it wrong, It can take a really long time to find the right person, and it can be really, really expensive mistakes to be making along the line. So the the biggest reason that we find that people come to us is because they've tried one of those 2 methods to fill this gap already. and they've failed in their attempts to do it themselves?

Stuart Webb [00:04:52]:

No. I know you're currently going through something a bit of a rebrand, so I'm sure I'm about to show your current current website down below where people can get more information about what resource worldwide do. But are there any tips that you can offer that that might help somebody who's currently in the process of trying to hire somebody with the right skills that you might give them to sort of really help them sort think through some of the issues they need to solve.

Sophie Dearden [00:05:17]:

Yeah. We are going through a big rebrand at the moment. So, hopefully, if you if you check this website out right now, not gonna be that relevant to what I'm talking about because that we've changed direction so much because of the demand for our service in the last 12 months. We've grown significantly. and we started the business working with solar printers and placing virtual assistants into solar panel businesses. And now we've really evolved and we're placing remote professionals into much bigger organizations. the the best tips that I can or the first tip can share is just to be really open minded about how you're hiring. So what we do is we hire remote professionals in four companies from the Philippines. so as long as the role can be done remotely, we can find someone with the skill set to do it. And the reason that we use the Philippines is because there's such huge supply of skill sets for the roles that we're looking to fill. And also it's a super cost effective option for clients because over in the Philippines cost of living significantly less than it is here in the UK. So the first thing I would say is if you've been trying to do the same thing and you've been trying to higher in either your local area and you're not getting the right applicants through or you're getting the right applicants through, but the amount there expecting to be paid is significantly more than your business can afford. There is another solution, and that's where we come in. Secondly, you can use the recruitment companies and they charge big upfront fees and they haven't necessarily delivered the best candidates. Again, that's something we hear a lot from our clients. Then again, the alternative method that we have, there are no upfront fees. and also if it's the wrong fit, we replace them for free for free. There's no kind of sliding scale on it. So be open minded to how you're recruiting Secondly, be really, really clear on what you're actually recruiting for. So have identify the skills that you need, but also identify the type person that you want to attract and what you can offer them. So very often in recruitment, people will just go, oh, I need this person to fill this gap. But actually, you've got to look, if you're trying to attract an a player into your business, what is it that you're gonna offer them? And I'm not talking about pay package and benefits. I'm talking about career progression opportunity. I'm talking about the culture of the company, the vision of the company. How can you help give them a sense of purpose? This is something that when we're recruiting for our clients, we talk about all the time because we wanna make sure when we present the opportunity to the candidates, we're a the very best quality and the very best talent that we can because we're providing them with a real career opportunity. Again, when you're looking to place someone into your business, whether a physical staff member, a remote staff member. If you can attract someone who's gonna be there long term, who's gonna grow into the role, who's gonna grow with the company, it's a much better situation to be in because like I keep saying, if you are recruiting someone, you have poor retention, it's very timely and it's very expensive. So just really thinking about that whole package that you can be offering when you're recruiting your team members. And involve, if you've got staff, involve all of your team or at least all of the department within this, really spend some time having a look at how your staff are spending their time. Because in our experience, if people are doing jobs that they're not either qualified to do or they don't really want to be doing, slightly their productivity is gonna drop. So an exercise that we often will get people to do is we will either get them if they're a solo owner or we'll get the the team that they're looking to fill the gap in to spend some time writing down all of the tasks that each one of them is doing. If they can spend, say, 3 to 5 days writing down all of the tasks that they're doing and then just eliminate first any task that they don't need to do, anything that's not helping reach the company goal or company vision. Sometimes it's tasks that they were doing 5 years ago that were relevant. They're not relevant now, but they're still doing them. So eliminate them first. Is there any tasks there that can be automated? So anything that AI can look after or anything technology. There's so many amazing programs, so many amazing ways to automate your business out. So is there any of those tasks that can be automated? And lastly, is there any of those tasks that can be outsourced in the way that we always make that last decision? or can be handed to someone else is we get people to highlight the things that only they can do and that only they want to do, and it's gonna give them energy and make them more productive again, a thing that we see in larger departments, and we see this as solopreneurs as well. If anyone listening is a solopreneur, you'll know what I'm talking about. I've been there myself, and you feel like you're head is in the weeds. And you're just there and the business is churning, but you're not really growing and the revenue is not really growing. It's probably because you're not doing revenue generating tasks because you haven't got enough time. That continues as the company grows in size. So anything that your team members are doing, that isn't revenue generating or isn't specialist to their skills, but they've just picked up along the way. Those are things that should start to get delegated to a never team member. And that's again, where remote professionals come in. They're very flexible. So it can be part time. It can be full time. it can work on your time zone or any time zone, essentially, So if there is that flexibility element of it, but it's definitely something that most companies haven't done for a long time is actually reviewed what tasks everyone is doing and how productive they're being in doing those tasks.

Stuart Webb [00:10:32]:

Do you know that I I did speak a lot of us lower language, you'll have to hear about automating and delegating those things because there's too many people spend too much of their time doing stuff that I either shouldn't do, or, you know, don't or cling on to something. I often say that too many business owners, even in very large businesses choose the path of least assistance because they're quite determined. Nobody else could do this as well as me. And in actual fact, many people can do it as well if not better than them, and they should be concentrating on, as you say, the revenue generation rather than admin or something else that they think is important, but in actual fact, it's just not really what that a business needs them to be focused on. And there must be something, a book, of course, some some some moan in your life that sort of brought you to the realization that you could help businesses like this. Is is there anything you could point us to that would would help us to understand?

Sophie Dearden [00:11:24]:

Well, for me, I'll give you my kind of short inversion of my longer story. but I went to university in England. So I moved to New Zealand when I was sixteen for 4 years and did ski instructing and had lots of fun. My parents wanted me to go to university. I said I'll go to university, but I want to do a course that I want to do. And that was art. And I did get a 1st class in an art specializing in painting in the renaissance period. but it's not really a career. I mean, I could have had a career as an artist, but opted looked at the financial possibility of success there and opted not to. so I finished my degree and I was kind of left wondering what I was supposed to do with my time. And I set up a gym anyone that's ever worked in the gym bit of personal training space or know that you work insanely hard for very little money. It's moved now. Online coaching, you can make a lot of money in that space, but online coaching wasn't a thing 15, 16 years ago when when I had my gym. so 6 months in, the gym went bump and I was kind of a graduate and in, I think, I was about £31,000 worth of debt from the gym. So I started to work in sales and very quickly, found that I had a real natural ability and ended up setting up my own sales company. So In my twenties, I spent 8 years working 80 to a 120 hours a week, skiing is my favorite thing to do. I didn't go skiing for that 8 years. I made money. I made good money. I had a great lifestyle. Lots of nice handbags, nice fancy cars. lots of VIP parties, but I've lost relationships with friends and family. I missed my parents' 25th wedding anniversary, for example, And my belief at the time was if I work really, really hard now, you know, work hard for 10 years and then the rest of your life, your have all these things that no one else is ever gonna have because they didn't work as hard as you worked. And it's a very old fashioned. It still gets thrown around a lot on social media. you notice the whole, like, you the harder you work, the more that you get, but actually the harder I work, the the more that I seem to lose. And meeting my husband through that company, made me realize. So a year after I met my husband, I actually shut that company down. And that whole experience made me commit that when I set up another company, and it took me a few years before I set up another company, but it made me commit to doing it in a way that, yes, there was going to be great financial a reward, but would never sacrifice my time again. So I had that mentality in place when I set up my next company. And that's what got me looking at working with virtual assistants very early on. I just had a newborn baby. I'd set up a new commerce company, on my maternity leave. and that pattern started to play out again, you know, I put the baby to bed and I'd be working till 1 o'clock in the morning and my husband would get back from his job and I'd say, Hey, I need you to help me pack these orders up. So the pattern was coming back and I thought, I'm I'm gonna learn from my previous company. I'm not gonna do that. So that's why I started working with commercial assistance very quickly outsource and make sure I was using my energy and my time only in the tasks that could generate the revenue. So It was that experience was really, really key. And then secondly, the book that I read around the time that I'd started to think about winding that company down, was Tim Ferris's 4 hour work week. I couldn't imagine it to be true. there's lots of bits in it, which I think are slightly outdated and slightly exaggerated now anyway. But just the concept that you could build company and still have that freedom and flexibility to spend your time traveling having experiences now for me with my family and my children, I thought, well, if if they can, if he can do it, then surely I can do it as well. So I did in my own business, and it was so impactful and so powerful. I got really passionate helping other business owners do the same thing, and that's when resource worldwide was born.

Stuart Webb [00:15:24]:

Brilliant story. I love it. I love it. I love the book. so if there is a question that I'm sure you are currently thinking he still hasn't asked me about. And so, therefore, I'm not gonna give you the opportunity to ask the question that I should have asked. And of course, once you've asked that question, you really do need to answer it for us. So what's the question I should have asked you, which I haven't yet?

Sophie Dearden [00:15:45]:

I think it's more a question, that people would think about themselves before deciding to hire remote professional from outside of the UK. and the question would be, well, why would I hire someone from outside of the UK? when there's, you know, lots of people in the UK that I could hire instead. and again, I'm not necessarily speaking to the solar printer here who's looking to make their 1st hire. I think most entrepreneurs looking to make that 1st hire, it makes sense on every single level to probably invest in a remote professional as opposed to hiring someone because it gives you the flexibility. It's so much more cost effective, all of the things that we talked about. But in answer to that question, we don't believe that you should hire a remote professional over someone in your home country. work a lot. We actually have probably about 70% of our clients in the States. We are just starting to develop our UK market further, at home territory, but just because we've built everything from word-of-mouth, to now, hence, why the marketing piece is coming into play. Most of our clients ended up being from the States. and it's the same it's the same there. It's not that we don't think you should hire in the UK or higher mistakes. And there's massive, massive value in hiring locally. But with the changing landscape, of recruitment and the way people work, there's a huge opportunity to tap into this massive network of talent and skill. that's just a bit further afield, literally, you know, the click of a button, the the cert, the the push of an email. And that's working with remote professionals. And where I really see this and how I see and I'm actually on a podcast next next week, which is where we're talking about the changing landscape of recruitment and retention. in the States, specifically in the construction and real estate industry. the way that I see this and we've seen, we've been running for 3 years, right, and the way that we're seeing this space change and develop sped up because of COVID, of course, everyone's understanding of how accessible actually it is to work remotely, is that if you balance having in house team members who also can work hybrid days or or local team members, but you also have remote professionals. you can build a much stronger company, and you can have a little edge on your competition. So let's say again, back to the skills, let's say that you are a digital marketing agency and we just did a place traditionalizing agency who specifically wanted an expert in Shopify Plus And WordPress. They're based down in Surrey. They've been trying to hire for this role themselves for the last 8 months. locally through recruitment agencies, and they just haven't been able to fill it because of, like I mentioned, the demands of the costs, Sorry, demands of the salaries. the candidates were being offered a position with them and then being coached by another company afterwards because it was so competitive. and then the candidates, 2 of candidates they did start just weren't actually up to scratch at all. So they came to us. We placed a team member in with them 3 months ago. It's they've took him from part time to full time within a month. So it's gone really, really well, but they also have all of their in house team So they've used him to fill a skills gap. They now come to us to fill another skills gap. But what it means is it means there's going to be more money in the company because it is more cost perspective to hire from the Philippines. So that's gonna go towards team bonuses. It's gonna go towards team days. It's gonna go towards more, marketing so that they can expand clients. The services that our guys are able to give them means they're able to expand their services. So again, they're able to build the business out. So it's more looking at how can I use this form of recruitment as a way to deliver better service to my clients, how can I use this form of recruitment as a way to enable the staff currently work with me to have a better experience of working with me, and how can I use this this remote recruitment to actually build my business and achieve my business goals in a more efficient way than I've been doing. So I think the 2 should work together, and we do the same thing. We've got CMO here in K. We're about to hire, operations manager again here in the UK. And by the end of next year, we'll have 4 or 5 key senior team members in the UK. but we also have a team of 12 out in the Philippines. So I think that working together is what's gonna give you the edge. as opposed to it's one or the other.

Stuart Webb [00:20:11]:

Brilliant. Brilliant. So if you thank you so much for bringing that to our attention, I really hope that we get see a lot more of what you're doing and really changing the way in which we're operating as teams. I think it's great. just very quickly before we end. if you would like to get notification of when we do these, chats and if you want to get on the mailing list and you get a copy of this when it comes out or local and Apple Podcasts and places like that. You can go to httpscolonforward/voltash link dot the complete approach. dotco.ukforward/newsletter. That is httpscolonforward/forward/ link dot the complete approach dotco.ukforward/ newsletter. Get on there, let me know about you would like some, some notification and I will send you the email and I'll send you notification of when we do these calls with really interesting people like Sophie, and you can get notification when it comes out on our podcast So if you thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us, I really appreciate you taking us through all of that. I hope when we get to see the website, it will be really spot on, and sort of speak to what you're trying to do, but we'll come back and we'll check-in with you later.

Sophie Dearden [00:21:21]:

Amazing. Thanks so much for having me to do it. Really enjoyed it.

Stuart Webb [00:21:24]:

Really appreciate it. Thank you, Sophie.

Who is Jo?

Jo Cowper is a business strategist who specializes in helping entrepreneurs and business owners achieve their goals. With a focus on those who have big ideas and dreams but feel stuck in their current situation, Jo provides structured guidance and a proven system to help them overcome obstacles and make significant progress. By helping her clients navigate the challenging journey from where they are to where they want to be, Jo empowers them to take the next steps and reach their true potential. With Jo's expertise, business owners no longer have to dwell on "if only" and can instead turn their aspirations into reality.

Key Takeaways

[00:02:39] Two common challenges when pursuing ideas.

[00:05:01] "Workbook for success: find encouragement and clarity."

[00:09:10] Three steps to turn big vision into reality: clarity, mindset, community support.

[00:13:09] Sign up for the email newsletter at thecompleteapproach.co.uk

[00:14:20] Joe discusses clarity and show link. Good luck!

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

big vision, turning vision into reality, clarity, writing it down, mindset, conviction, goals, trusted individuals, encouragement, support, supportive community, significant difference, big vision workbook, exercises, finding energy, messages, encouragement, clarity, printing out workbook, generating ideas, free workbook, own pace, backward planning, end goal, necessary steps, series of questions, smaller goals, creating a clear path, strategy, accountability

SPEAKERS

Stuart Webb, Jo Cowper

Stuart Webb [00:00:24]:

Hello again, and welcome to It's Not Rocket Science five Questions Over Coffee. I'm delighted to be here with both my coffee, which I probably should be stopping drinking.

This is about the 6th one so far today. Joe, I believe you've got something more like tea in front of you, by the looks of things, which is excellent news. So welcome to the podcast, Joe. Joe is a vision coach. She helps people to take the business they have and transform it to the business they really wanted to have, which I think is a wonderful subject for discussion. Joe, I'm really looking forward to this conversation. Welcome to the podcast. I hope you're going to enjoy it and please tell us what it is you do. Let's start with my first question. Who do you help and and how do you help them?

Jo Cowper [00:01:12]:

Thanks, Stuart. Well, thank you very much for having me. It's great to be here today. I help business owners, founders, people who have got small businesses and big ideas, people who have really got a big picture of what they'd like to achieve in their business. But perhaps they've had this vision for years, perhaps for a long time, they've been thinking, I could do more than I'm doing right now. I wish I could just take this next step, I wish I could be just serving these slightly different customers. I wish I could be doing these slightly different things. But these ideas haven't yet come to anything because it's hard. There's a long way to go from where they are to where they want to be. There are lots of what, unforeseen stumbling blocks along the way. There's lots of distraction. You're running a business, you're already working flat out and somehow this stuff never comes to fruition. And I help people make that jump in a way that is structured and to follow a system that means that you can actually get where you want to be from where you are to where you want to be, rather than staying stuck where you were in the first place for an endless amount of time thinking, if only. I wish.

Stuart Webb [00:02:16]:

I love it. I love it. Tell me, you often must come across people that have been trying to do this for years. You said that people are stuck because they can't quite make the lead. You've come across those people that are somehow not quite getting there. What is it that you find that they've done that tries to get them out of that position and move forward, which you can help them to overcome?

Jo Cowper [00:02:39]:

Sure. There are two things that can really often happen when you try and do this yourself. And I know I've experienced these two things myself. It's totally normal. One of them is that you just keep on having ideas after ideas after ideas, but you don't actually make the time and space that it's going to take to transform those ideas into anything more solid than that. And so you have all of the excitement. You've got all the vision, you've got this really clear sense, I could definitely do this. But you don't actually ever take that step. Or you start trying to take some step, but then real life comes in, work takes over, you don't get there. And then a couple of years down the line, nothing has happened. That's the first common thing that can happen. And then the second common thing that can happen is you think, yes, I've got this brilliant, great idea, I'm going to do it straight away. And you set off. But you haven't actually done the thinking that needs to be done along the way and so you're throwing yourself a million miles now into this thing and for whatever reason, perhaps you haven't thought it all through fully. Perhaps it doesn't really quite stack up. Perhaps once you get it out of your head and put it into reality it doesn't quite make sense. I mean, I think there's something that you'll find. One thing that I'll do with my clients all the time is get them to really write down stuff about their vision, about their customers, about where they are now, ask them to really tough questions and these are often things that you think you already knew. It's easy to tell yourself when you're doing all in the privacy of your own head, I know this, this is easy, I can answer this question. When you come to actually try to make sense of it, you say there's a gaps in here. Actually it doesn't make quite as much sense as I thought it did. And so what I'll do is pose these questions in the right order and insist on filling the gaps so that instead of wasting off 1000 miles an hour, you can actually tackle it in a way that's systematic and that you can see is turning your big vision into a real reality.

Stuart Webb [00:04:26]:

I love it. I absolutely love it. Joe, I hope I've got this right. You've got some great ideas, I think, on your website that can help people with this sort of visioning. What can you tell us about how you can help them? And I'm going to put up the link that you showed us or you told me about before we started. So I hope that I've got the right link and you're about to tell us about what you can get from your website which can help people with this first steppers as they start this journey.

Jo Cowper [00:04:55]:

Good, I hope it's the right link too.

Stuart Webb [00:04:56]:

I believe it is technology, Joe. We'll get there, we'll get there.

Jo Cowper [00:05:01]:

Well look, there's something there, right there. There's an incentive. Go there and see what you find. Now what I've created actually is what I've called a big vision workbook and this is about giving yourself a support kit for success because having the big idea isn't hard. Anybody can have a big idea, right? We've all had dozens of big ideas, I'm sure. But the tricky bit is going through the tough moments that come between having the great idea and feeling totally discouraged after guardian know, this is too hard, I can't do this. I don't know why do they ever think I could in the first place? I feel so alone, all of this stuff. So I've created this workbook so that you can, from where you are right now, prepare your own toolkit for success, the stuff that's going to support you when it gets hard. And so in this workbook, you're going to work through seven different exercises, all about finding the energy, the messages, the encouragement and clarity that's going to keep you going all the way towards that vision and starting to put in place an action plan that will help you to get from where you are to where you want to be. It's totally free. It's something you can do in your own time. Totally recommend that you print it out because that goes back to what I was speaking about before. That when you actually put pen to paper and you write stuff down. I'm looking around myself with all the paper where I've written stuff down, the ideas will flow more freely.

Stuart Webb [00:06:18]:

I tell you the other point about what you've just said about writing it down, and that is when you've got those ideas, I find it really helpful to stick them on the walls around me because they're very visual reminders. You cannot have things just put away in a drawer. They have to be out around you so that you can see it. So having something written down so that once you've written it, you sort of put it on a wall or put it on your desk or whatever, it's so much more useful to you than just leaving it in a drawer and going, well, that's great, I've done all that. I can get back on with the day job now. You've got to have these things in front of you, haven't you Joe?

Jo Cowper [00:06:51]:

I couldn't agree more. Yeah, I really couldn't agree more. And that's actually in my full program. That the paid for program as opposed to the freebie. That's one of the important things that you get to at the end. That you'll literally have a one pager of all the stuff that you know that you need to commit to and do. So that whenever the next opportunity, the next distraction comes along, you've got this one pager which printed out, you stick it on your wall. No, that's where I'm going. Okay, that's why I'm going there. So important.

Stuart Webb [00:07:18]:

I love it. Was there a particular book or course or time in your life which helped you to sort of make the realization that you have to have these visions and you have to sort of move towards these things on the journey that you've just spoken about?

Jo Cowper [00:07:36]:

Well, the system that for me has been transformational in this is a system called backward planning and I learned about this on Gosh, I think on a border way day several jobs ago and it really stuck with me. And it's this idea that you start with the end in sight. You don't start by thinking, right, kind of going roughly over there what should we do now? Now you get really clear on the destination and then you work back. I can't get another image sorted out to get my hand in the screen but you work back and so you ask yourself a series of questions to always frame this. In order to do this I will need first to have achieved blah. In order to achieve that I will need first to have achieved blah. And what you do that is you reliably come back to an action that you can take, you follow it down to its conclusion, you'll come to an action that you can take right now or a goal that's small enough for you to work towards today. Today like now. Now that you know is leading you all the way to where you want to go and then you just keep on following that. You've retrofitted your path and you follow it brilliant.

Stuart Webb [00:08:37]:

Love it. Love it. Joe, I've spent the last ten minutes sort of asking you a bunch of questions and there must be one, I suspect that you're thinking when's he ever going to get to the really important question? So here is my opening to you. There must be a question I haven't asked. There must be a way that you are wanting to express something but I haven't yet asked it. Please tell me what is the question that I should have asked you by now? And obviously once you've told me the question you have to answer it because I don't know the answer. What is the question I should have asked you? What is the answer to that question?

Jo Cowper [00:09:10]:

Okay, so I think that the kind of burning question is what does it take to go from being somebody who's got a big vision? We've all got a big vision. What do I have to do? What can I do right now? If I really want to turn that into something real and I want to do it this year. I want not to be sitting here in twelve months time still thinking I've got all these great ideas, I've got these great ideas. What can I do straight away without having to pay anything to anybody, without having to buy any service, without having to take a massive leap and change my website, change my direction? What can I do easily now? What could anybody do? And the answer to that yes. Well, there are three things that anybody, anybody could do right now. First one is get really clear on that vision. So write it down and the work I've spoken to about will help with that. The second thing is your mindset. It's also well, jumping into this is what I'll have to do, this is the strategy I'll have to enact and I have to say for years in my career and in my business, I honestly fell into this trap of thinking, strategy is enough, I know what to do, I'm going to do it. It's not without that mindset, things will get hard. You really need to work on this conviction. What's going to keep you going? What do you really believe in? What is it to you? So mindset. The third thing that you can put in place for yourself right now, that will be a game changer, is tell people who you trust, people who will encourage you about what you're trying to do, because they will encourage you. They will get your back. They will give you a kick when you need it and say, look, hey, didn't you say that you were going to do this thing? Didn't you convince me of that last week when didn't believe you? Didn't you just tell me it was going to be great? So come on. And so having the clarity, the mindset and the people, the community around you is what will make the difference between you still sitting in the same place in a year's time thinking, wouldn't it be great, wouldn't it be great if I was working differently, living differently, helping different people make it happen?

Stuart Webb [00:11:10]:

Brilliant. I do absolutely buy in. And you're absolutely right, strategy is great, but implementation is better and accountability is the key to making those things happen. Because if you keep it in your head, once again we go back to the sort of it's in your head, nobody is going to turn around and go, whatever happened. And then you feel that, oh yeah, I should go on with it, shouldn't I? Having somebody who's just going to hold you to account is so valuable. It doesn't need to be anything more than just a two minute sort of reminder that that's where you were supposed to be going to kick you back into action. It's the most valuable thing in the world, isn't it? Everybody needs to have some form of accountability to make sure that they're delivering on the promise that they set themselves.

Jo Cowper [00:11:56]:

I think so. And having people who get it, they understand that you want to do this crazy thing, so why don't you just go and get yourself a job like everybody else? They understand that you've got a drive, you've got a vision, you really want to make a difference, get people around you like that and you'll support each other. It doesn't have to be a lonely business.

Stuart Webb [00:12:17]:

Love it. Love it. Joe, it's been an absolute delight having you here listening to this because I think what you're talking about is the thing that just about every business owner needs to have in their life. They need that vision. They need the transformation from where they are into what they really actually set out and wanted. So thank you for coming on and describing it. Thank you for giving us this free tip and for telling us about how you can help them get there.

Jo Cowper [00:12:46]:

Thank you, Stuart, for having me. It's been an absolute pleasure. It's my first ever LinkedIn life experience as well, so I'm excited to go back and see what I've done to my LinkedIn feast.

Stuart Webb [00:12:56]:

And you got through without actually sort of collapsing and the whole world ending as you expected, didn't it?

Jo Cowper [00:13:03]:

Yeah, and I didn't even touch my tea, so I feel should have made a coffee, shouldn't I?

Stuart Webb [00:13:09]:

So, listen, everybody, thank you so much. If you would like to get onto our email list so that you receive an email pretty much every week which says who's going to be on the podcast. Sort of interesting people that are going to be coming on so that you too can get brilliant advice like Joe has been giving us today, go to this link, which is link thecompleetproach Co UK. That's link thecompleetproach Co UK newsletter. That's link the completeaproach Co UK newsletter. That will take you to the newsletter sign up page. You just get a simple email from me, basically saying who's on what they're going to be talking about. Please come and ask whatever questions you want. Joe, thank you so much for coming on and allowing us to listen to your wonderful vision stuff. I do encourage people to go back to Joe's website, six Degrees East Co UK home hashtag vision. That's home hashtag vision. That's where you'll find that free booklet, seven Steps, seven pages, something like that.

Jo Cowper [00:14:16]:

Joe seven Steps.

Stuart Webb [00:14:20]:

Getting your clarity. That link will be in the show notes as well. So thank you, Joe, so much for coming along and talking to us, really appreciate it and good luck with the rest of the afternoon.

Jo Cowper [00:14:32]:

Thank you, Stuart. Been a real pleasure. Thank you much for having me. Have a great afternoon. Please.

Who is Emma?

Emma Westley is a marketing expert who understands the challenges that startups face, especially during uncertain economic times. With her expertise, she helps companies do more with less by coming up with creative solutions that allow them to market their products efficiently within limited budgets. Emma firmly believes in the importance of providing value to customers and helps businesses develop marketing strategies that resonate with their target market, ultimately adding value to the company and its customers.

Key Takeaways

[00:03:01] Reducing budgets and unrealistic expectations thwart success.

[00:05:11] Part-time senior freelance work gaining traction.

[00:07:59] Flexible work schedule for multiple companies.

[00:14:50] Fractional work attracts people with many interests.

[00:17:12] Emma discusses fractional senior management, subscribe.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

www.missing-piece.uk

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

https://youtube.com/live/qfYZRdZxgVU?feature=share

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

fractional work, self-development, time management, flexibility, leadership, teamwork, communication, urgent matters, problem-solving, Talk Like Ted, marketing, startups, "rule of three", Apple, internal presentations, It's Not Rocket Science Five Questions over Coffee, technical difficulties, Emma Wesley, Emerge IO, chief marketing officer, part-time work, job market, budget constraints, productization, positioning, marketing unicorns, senior management, podcast, newsletter subscription, growing businesses.

SPEAKERS

Stuart Webb, Emma Westley

Speaker A [00:00:21]:

Hello and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science five Questions over coffee in front of me. I have a good strong cup of coffee because I need it right at the moment because there was a slight technical failure before this started which I had to fix. Always love it when a plan comes together. But I'm here today with Emma, emma Wesley, who runs Emerge, Emerge IO, a small business marketing company. She is a fractional chief marketing officer. She works for small businesses as their marketing officer and I hope we can have a really great session talking about that today. Emma, welcome to the podcast.

Speaker B [00:00:58]:

Thank you Stuart, nice to be on. And I unfortunately don't have coffee because I don't drink coffee, but I have tea. So I hope that's acceptable tea is.

Speaker A [00:01:06]:

Tea is as acceptable as anything else is. I would suggest that glasses of wine whilst you're doing this are probably a bit one stage too far, but that's how you so Emma, tell us about the sort of people you help with their business growth.

Speaker B [00:01:24]:

Sure. So I predominantly focus on b to B companies. I've done a 20 plus year stint working with B to B companies. So that is my lane, I will stick in it. But I mainly help startups, tech startups and early stage AI startups for example. And then additionally service based companies, professional services or other service based businesses, small businesses and maybe creeping up into the medium sized as well.

Speaker A [00:01:58]:

What's the problem they've got that you help them to solve?

Speaker B [00:02:03]:

So I think at the moment especially the biggest problem is doing more with less. That's something that probably a lot of startups will know anyway for years. But especially at the moment, with continued uncertain economic times, limited budgets, maybe not getting the funding that they need. All of those factors are sort of coming together at the moment. And what quite often happens in these sorts of situations is marketing is hit with budget cuts. And it is this whole, like, doing more with less money, less resource. But those companies still knowing that they've got a viable, a good solution with platform or a service that they know will add value to the customers that they're trying to sell into.

Speaker A [00:02:54]:

And what have they done to try and overcome those problems that you help them to sort of fix with your services?

Speaker B [00:03:01]:

So very often when I get into a company start working with them, what I see is they've tried sort of doing everything but just scaling budgets back. So if for example, they're doing paid, some sort of paid marketing, all they've done is just reduce the budget on that marketing and hope for the same results. Or the other big danger is on the resource side and this has been going on for years, but it's happening more and more at the moment is companies trying to find these marketing unicorns so they'll think, okay, we need someone in to help and what does that person look like. And so they start listing out all the sorts of responsibilities that that person will have. And when it comes to marketing, it'll be SEO, content marketing, paid marketing, lead gen, demand gen, and the list goes on. And what they end up getting is maybe a candidate. Although a lot of them struggle trying to find the right people. But they'll get someone in who's who's not right for the business and has not got the right skill set and they're just expecting too much of this. Person because one person can't always cover all of those different areas and yeah, they just end up either handholding them or not achieving the goals and especially the, the business goals, because with that process, they'll often find that their marketing stuff is not aligned with their business goals as well.

Speaker A [00:04:39]:

And that's where you come in with your service and what you do to help.

Speaker B [00:04:46]:

So mainly in terms of the amount of time I spend as a company, so I'm fractional, and this term fractional is gaining a lot of grind at the moment.

Speaker A [00:05:00]:

And I just wanted to make sure everybody understands fractional, because that is a bit of a new term. So I think we need to define it, tell us what fractional means. And it doesn't mean that you're only half a person, I presume, or maybe.

Speaker B [00:05:11]:

Even a quarter, I don't know, maybe soon, maybe that'll be part of the AI cloning revolution, will be cutting myself in half or something. So there's a few different definitions at the moment because it's such a new term and I think companies and people like myself are sort of trying to work out what that term actually means. I've been doing it for about five years now, and it certainly wasn't called fractional a couple of years ago. So it is sort of a term that people are getting used to, but essentially it's being part time at a company, usually at a more senior level. So at a leadership level, or at least director level, but not being a part time employee, so you're still a freelance resource, so the company isn't having to pay benefits or overhead associated with even a part time employee. So you're still a freelance, self employed or whatever. And yes, you're working on a part time basis, but at a more senior level. And what I find with the companies that I've worked with is I'm definitely embedded in those companies. I feel like I'm a part of the team. When I work for a company, I'm really focused on it. I'm committed to their goals. I wear the T shirts, as would often be described, but maybe that afternoon I'm doing the same thing for another company. Or on a Tuesday I do it for one company, on a Thursday I do it for another. Something like that. So it's a difficult concept to get your head around and it certainly only works for certain types of companies, very often remote companies that are used to asynchronous working, that sort of thing. And certainly something that's gaining traction at the moment, partly because of the market, the way the job market is changing currently as well.

Speaker A [00:07:24]:

This is a balancing app for you. You know that you have to switch mindsets, you have to switch focus and you're as present and you are as involved in company A as you are in company B and you don't allow any distractions from one. But how does the business owner manage their involvement with you? Because on a Wednesday a need might crop up and you're not technically working for them on a Wednesday. So how do they manage that aspect of their lives?

Speaker B [00:07:59]:

So I find the best way is actually being more flexible for companies. So rather than doing it on set days, I work set days for set companies is just saying you've got X amount of time or X amount of my sort of resource. But I will be flexible with that throughout the week. So I will still commit to going to their meetings on their schedules. If they've got specific leadership meetings or team meetings that need to happen, I will attend those. And it does take a little bit of as a fractional, it takes a little bit of juggling, a lot of sort of different calendars and different ways of working for different companies. But once you get used to it and you find the right balance for yourself as well, then it works. And from a company perspective, they can just call on me if they need support, if it's urgent or whatever, and as long as I can do something relatively soon, then that's fine. So just as a quick example, regardless of how many sort of companies I'm working for at any one time, I will have all of their email clients open at the same time. So if something urgent pops up, I can jump on it or I can assess it, at least I can look at it and go, okay, that doesn't need to be fixed immediately. And then obviously communication is key. So if somebody does try and get in touch with me, what I can do is at least ping them and say give me five minutes and I'll call you. Or at least that sort of regular communication so that people know where I am and if I am or I'm not available. And then finally I think there are for companies as well, it helps them focus, so it helps them sort of understand actually is that important, is it urgent? A bit like going back to the whole urgent priority matrix. It makes them think a little bit more about actually is it important, does it really need to be fixed at the moment or can it wait? And very often what happens is in that waiting, the issue is fixed or a solution will come up. Jumping on things straight away is not always the best approach.

Speaker A [00:10:30]:

I know that you've got a valuable free offer for people, and this is a sort of 30 minutes session free with you in order to sort of get people clear on some of the things they want to sort of sort out in their business. So do you want to tell us about the 30 minutes session?

Speaker B [00:10:50]:

Yeah, so I've called it a pick your brain session, which a lot of people will obviously recognize and sure, lots of other people get asked about, you know, can I pick your brain? And it's a 30 minutes session either for companies that want to explore what fractional is, you know, is it right for them, would it work for them, especially if it's in the marketing area? Maybe it's for startups that are feeling a bit constrained, a bit pinched at the moment with budgets and thinking, I know I need to do that, but I don't have enough money for it. So what are the other options resource wise that I can pull in or I can leverage? And then on the flip side, I also do these sessions for other fractionals. So people looking to get into fractional work, maybe if they've just been made redundant or they're thinking about actually a slightly different way of working, I can sort of share some of the things that I did certainly did wrong along the fractional journey. Any other sort of tips and advice for how to get started and things like productizing services or packages, positioning, all that sort of stuff.

Speaker A [00:12:08]:

Brilliant. So there must have been some book or course which started your journey into sort of learning this. So what was the spark? What was the thing which started you in this journey towards both marketing and fractional? Marketing Officer.

Speaker B [00:12:26]:

I don't think there was any one book that sort of got me into fractional, but there is one book that I always come back to in terms of how I work and how I do my marketing, especially with startups. And it's a book called Talk Like Ted by Carmine Gallio. It'll seem completely random, but basically this guy, Carmen Gallio, he's been through lots and lots of Ted talks and he's analyzed which are the good ones, which get engagement, how do people pitch their talks. It's fascinating insights into the world of Ted, I suppose, as well. But the thing that I really grasped onto and love is he talks about this rid of three and how the brain is primed to think in threes. There's some sort of mathematical side to it in terms of pattern recognition, but also it's a good number for people to grasp as it's not too few, but not too many, basically. And so I just use it for everything. When I'm actually doing my marketing work, positioning statements or trying to come up with marketing plans, I use the rill of three. If I'm doing my own sort of thinking through concepts, I always try and sort of bucket into three concepts. I think in the book he also mentions that it's something that Apple use quite a lot and especially their leadership follow this rule, especially when they're doing sort of internal presentations. And it's so simple, but it really works. It's brilliant. It's really good for remembering things as well.

Speaker A [00:14:21]:

Yeah, it is a good concept. Emma, we've been chatting for a little while and there must be a question that's burning in your head that I haven't yet asked you. So rather than me sort of trying to guess what that is, I'm just going to ask you to tell us what the question is you would like us to have discussed, and then obviously you've then got the job of answering it as well. So I haven't got any work to do in the next few minutes. So over to you. What is the question I should have asked and then would you please answer it?

Speaker B [00:14:50]:

Yeah. So going back to the whole fractional thing, I think one of the interesting questions at the moment is why so many people are attracted to fractional as a way of work. And I've been having quite a lot of conversations recently with people either getting into fractional for getting started or have been doing it maybe a few years or a longer time. And I think I'm coming up with this sort of common personality thread of people who are drawn to fractional are people who like to juggle many balls, but it's not that they want to go part time or they want to sort of necessarily reduce the amount that they're working. It's that they just want to do work differently. And they want to also have time for self development, learning, being able to just having that head space to go right. I saw this tool the other day that someone recommended. I'm going to go and actually dig into it and learn a little bit about it. And ironically, that sort of self development actually then helps the clients that fractionals are working on because you're getting it for free as a company because you're not having to pay for that development time. But I see that as a really common thread with people like myself, that I just want a little bit of space for myself, but I'm not going to go off and just go to the pub or something in that time. I'm actually going to do something that's useful for the clients and for the business.

Speaker A [00:16:32]:

They get a lot of value from that.

Speaker B [00:16:34]:

Yes, definitely. Without realizing.

Speaker A [00:16:39]:

And I guess they got access to a fairly senior, well experienced person for a fraction of the price they pay because otherwise they can only afford 20% of the budget for a senior person, they'd end up with a very junior person. And so they're getting a huge amount of experience for a lot less capital outlet.

Speaker B [00:17:00]:

Yes, definitely. That's the first and foremost thing of fractional, is getting that senior experience, but at a fraction of the cost. Yeah, absolutely brilliant.

Speaker A [00:17:12]:

Emma, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us and opening our eyes to the new world of this fractional senior manager. I'm just going to invite people, if you would like, to get onto our newsletter list so that you get to hear about what we're doing and who's going to be coming up in the next week or so, please go to the link on the screen. At the moment, it is https link thecompletroach co uknewsletter that is link. Thecompletroach Co UK newsletter. Join the newsletter. You'll get an email about once a week which just sort of explains who's coming up, what they've got to talk about and how you can get more detail about who they are. And obviously, at some stage you'll also hear about when this gets released, not only live like it is now, but when it comes out on the podcast. And I would really ask you, please subscribe to the podcast and tell all your friends about it because that helps us to get even better guests. More information out to you about how you can grow your business. Emma, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. Really appreciate you spending the time and I hope that the fractional work continues to go well.

Speaker B [00:18:27]:

Yes, fingers crossed. I think it's definitely a gaining movement, so hopefully more companies will pick up on it. And thank you, Stuart, for having me on.

Speaker A [00:18:37]:

No problem at all. Thank you very much.

Who is Sean?

Sean Courtney is a creative problem solver who believes in bespoke solutions for individuals and businesses. As a dyslexic, Sean struggled with call center scripts and created a guided call guide that helped him flow through calls smoothly. This innovation helped him pass his audits and grow his potential in the business, leading to many promotions. Sean's focus is on creating bespoke solutions to help unlock the superpowers within the neurodiverse community.

Key Takeaways

[00:02:34] Improved call guide reduces anxiety, improves performance.

[00:05:50] Diversity advocates, unmasked, ADHD book, Dyslexia fonts.

[00:09:32] Simple and cost-effective solutions for inclusivity.

[00:11:26] Subscribe to our newsletter and podcast.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

www.missing-piece.uk

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

https://youtube.com/live/qfYZRdZxgVU?feature=share

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Inclusion, diversity, neurodiverse employees, keynote speeches, team leaders, social anxiety, structured environment, call centers, newsletter, podcast, Sean, positive feedback, bespoke solutions, dyslexia, call guide, superpowers, self-esteem, outside the box, cost-effective solutions, simple solutions, coaching course, productivity, longevity, missing peace, coffee, inclusivity, diversity within websites, fonts, colors, tools, empowering, unlocking potential.

SPEAKERS

Sean Courtney, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:22]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science. My questions over coffee. I have my coffee muki in front of me which has got coffee in it. I need that coffee mind at the moment. And I'm here with Sean Courtney. Sean is neurodiverse. He is really trying to help drive the inclusivity and options for people who have got diversity. Sean, I'm really grateful to have you on the podcast. I love the fact that you're empowering diversity and unlocking potential. So welcome to it's not rocket science. Five questions over coffee.

Sean Courtney [00:00:56]:

Amazing. Thank you very much for having me. It's a pleasure to be here.

Stuart Webb [00:00:59]:

Brilliant stuff. Look, sure. Talk to us a little bit about how you do help those customers of yours and unlock that wonderful potential.

Sean Courtney [00:01:09]:

Yeah, perfectly. So, I mean, the first thing I started to realize is that one size doesn't fit all. So what I do is I create bespoke creative solutions for the individual or within a team based solution if it is working within a business. One of the things I've created was known as a guided call guide. The Dyslexic myself, I struggled when I was working in call centers to follow the standard script that they give you. So I created a guided call guide which allowed me to understand when I needed to pause, when I needed to allow the customer to speak. And after a while, that call guide allowed me to flow through the call really well and signed. But I start to pass my audits, which made my potential within the business grow, making it more possible for me to be promoted within the business. So, yeah, just bespoke solutions that really like to release the superpowers, I call it, within the neurodiverse community.

Stuart Webb [00:02:12]:

I absolutely love that. I love the fact that you were able to do that and I know there must be a bunch of people who struggle with that. So do you find you now find yourself in situations where you are able to get in front of those sort of customers and help them to do exactly that? What things have they done that you're able to sort of spot and help them with?

Sean Courtney [00:02:34]:

Yeah. So there's a couple of examples there. So one of the things that I've done is I've worked with a young lad that's working in the call center at the moment, struggling to sort of pass his audits. They got to go through the same sort of disciplinary action as anybody else would need to. Reached out, had a look at his call guide, and by making the call guide more of a structure, so it's a more of a flow guide, if you will, in order to follow it made it easier for him to understand what he was doing. There was a section that is just literally introduction and it takes all the way through to the end of the call in the sense of the call guide itself. It's also color coded. So rather than having to remember where he is in the particular call guide, if somebody was to say, I'm sorry, what was that? He said, you only have to remember the color, which makes it easier for him to pick up where they left off and it doesn't send them into sort of a panic situation and start to cause things like telephone anxiety and kicking off anxiety. That makes it very difficult for them to continue the call, so it makes it more controlled and puts the power back in their hands in order to be able to do their job more effectively.

Stuart Webb [00:03:46]:

Sean, I absolutely love that. I think that's brilliant. And if we can't find more call centers out there that needs advice from people like you, I don't know what we're all doing wrong. Sean, listen, tell me you've got a great website. What advice do you put on your website? And I'm going to put the website now for people to have a look, which is missingpeace. UK, what sort of advice do you have on that website which you think would be valuable for the audience to know about?

Sean Courtney [00:04:18]:

I think the thing to take from the website is the website is a bit of more of a journey, so it introduces what it is that I do, and the idea is to increase self esteem. The idea is to take that self doubt and stick it in a box and put it away. As a neurodiverse person myself, I'm literally sort of wired to think outside the box and that is exactly what my website is promoting. I've been in many corporate meetings with many managers who said, look, we need some solutions and we need you to think outside the box. The neurodiverse community do that without even thinking. That is exactly what they're wired to do. So some of the creative solutions that I come up with are based on the fact that I am neurodiverse and I think that's what my website promotes. There's some great information on how to get in contact with me so we can have a chat. And I think it's a nice, simple, to the point, straightforward, structured website for you to have a look at and see what it is that I do, how I promote my business and what is on offer should you need my help.

Stuart Webb [00:05:21]:

Brilliant stuff. Brilliant. Sean, you've given us a short history there of your own journey, but there must be other courses or books or other things that you would like us to be able to know about in order to help explain both diversity and your own journey. So what would you advise for people to sort of understand or read or get to know better?

Sean Courtney [00:05:50]:

There's many different people out there that are really sort of flying the flag for diversity. Some of the people that are on sort of LinkedIn and Facebook include Ellie Middleton. She has amazing little unmasked. It's called Unmasked and they send you a little leaflet out where you can read about what it is that she does. A little PDF, a book that I helped, that helped my colleague who's ADHD was a book from Leanne Mascara called ADHD A to Z. What an amazing book that was. I got that on Audible just purely because of how my Dyslexia works. Sometimes one of the things I would research are Dyslexic fonts. Some people don't realize that there is an open Dyslexia font which is easier for people like myself to read because the letters are weighted at the bottom and they're slightly moved apart. That's not the only font that will help you with Dyslexia, obviously. There's comic stands as well. All these fonts are available but never really used. And sometimes it can make the difference between having to take somebody to one side and explain what it is that you want them to do when you're giving out a form at work or literally giving them the update. Or the sheet that you want them to understand and allowing them to just pick it up and ask the same questions anybody else would.

Stuart Webb [00:07:15]:

I think that's really valuable advice, actually, Sean, I must admit, I've seen now there are some people who are beginning to think about diversity within their websites in terms of changing fonts, changing colors, allowing people to sort of use rulers and things like that in order to sort of allow them to focus on one line or one section at a time without being distracted by a lot of things around on the website. So people are becoming aware of this, but you're right, there's not nearly enough known, not enough thought, not enough consideration for how to make these things more widely available so that everybody's included. And I know that inclusion is one of the important things that you think about in the way that you're doing work within the Missing Piece.

Sean Courtney [00:08:00]:

Absolutely, yeah. Inclusion is key. I mean, that's the thing that Missing Piece is setting up to change. I want the inclusion to be the main message. We're going into businesses and starting to do keynote speeches is something I'm bringing Missing Piece into. So I'm hoping to go into as many businesses as I can and do some talks on diversity and inclusiveness because once it starts at the top and works your way down, it doesn't become such an awkward subject. It's nice and simple to kind of teach the team leaders and teach the team and understand that okay, you may have somebody in the industry that you're working with that may be neurodiverse. It just means that they do things. A little simpler example would be maybe start 15 minutes early to avoid any social anxiety. Finish 15 minutes early to avoid the same thing. Give them a set place to sit in order to allow them to have that structure in place. And that sort of works really well for them. But unfortunately, sometimes that's missed when you have call centers, that hot seat.

Stuart Webb [00:09:10]:

Brilliant stuff, Sean. Look, I spent the last few minutes asking you questions and you're probably wondering when I'm going to get to the important one that I haven't asked. So I'm now going to give you that opportunity to tell me the question that I should have asked you and then obviously you get the pleasure of answering the question that I should have asked you. So what's that important question that I should have asked that I haven't yet?

Sean Courtney [00:09:32]:

I guess the most important question that you haven't asked yet is what is a simple solution and what is cost effective? There's a lot of things that are cost effective within this simple changes. What missing piece is trying to promote is that businesses don't have to break the budget in order to make sure that they're being inclusive. The chances are they're already doing it. That just needs tweaking. It's just making sure that if we work together that we are creating changes that are going to be implemented. It's a little bit like anything, you go and do a coaching course and you take all that information. If you don't implement it, nothing's going to change. Phil M. Jones once said that knowledge isn't power. The implementation of that knowledge is power and that's what makes the difference. You can have all the knowledge in the world. So when we go out and we do keynote speeches and we talk about how things can change and what you need to do, it's important that people implement those changes because they're going to make the world of the difference. Not just for your business, because you're going to increase the productivity of these individuals within the industry, but also for the longevity of the staff within the business.

Stuart Webb [00:11:01]:

Brilliant stuff, Sean. Thank you so much for being here for just a few minutes and talking about that. I think it's such an important object and I think you're doing a great job to promote it. I'm hoping that we're going to get you a lot more people following you because of your appearance here on It's Not Rocket Science Five Questions Over Coffee. So thank you for spending a few.

Sean Courtney [00:11:19]:

Minutes with us and thanks for having me. It's been an absolute pleasure and no problem. Thank you again. Thank you so much.

Stuart Webb [00:11:26]:

Look, everybody, I'd just like you to subscribe to our newsletter because that's how we can get to tell you about some of the great guests that we've got coming up on this podcast. So go on to the link that you can see on the bottom of the stage that's link thecompletroach Co UK newsletter and of course, like and subscribe to the podcast and tell all your friends about how you get to hear about great people. I know, I know lots of comments from people about some of the great guests we've had, like Sean who are bringing you really interesting comments and discussion points that business owners need to know about today. So get onto the website, link thecomplete Approach Co UK newsletter. Subscribe to the newsletter, you'll get an email from me about once a week just telling you who's coming up, what they're going to be talking about, and you get on and help to promote their businesses and connect with them on LinkedIn. Sean, thank you so much for being with us. Really appreciate you spending a few minutes. I know you've got a great topic to talk about here, so let's hope that we hear more businesses who are listening to what you've got to say about it.

Sean Courtney [00:12:28]:

Amazing. Thank you so much.

Stuart Webb [00:12:29]:

No problem.

Who is Sonny?

Sonny Kurmi is a professional who helps clients bridge the gap between where they are and where they want to be. He is an expert in creating plans and strategies that help individuals move closer to achieving their goals. With his experience and knowledge, he helps clients to better understand their future and create a path towards achieving their aspirations. Sonny Kurmi is a true professional who takes pride in his ability to help others achieve their dreams.

Key Takeaways

[00:02:29] Helping clients bridge gap between goals & reality.

[00:03:28] Speak to financial professionals or read books.

[00:07:46] Teen job offer leads to career magic.

[00:10:20] Interview with "Sonny" from Sonny, appreciated.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

https://youtube.com/live/z7TrGSsBuVw

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Lloyd's TSB, accountancy, finance, financial advice, financial advisor, goals, budgeting, client conversations, family background, networker, business advice, LinkedIn, unqualified help, problem-solving, Google, Netflix, financial triangle, Money Explained.

SPEAKERS

Sonny Kurmi, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:21]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science five Questions Over Coffee. Are Am here with my coffee mug. I'm here with Sonny. Sonny Comey is sonny is a great networker and a financial charter planner and he has got some great advice for businesses. And so Sonny, we're going to spend 5 minutes now talking to you about your business and about how you help businesses. So welcome to it's not rocket science. Five questions over coffee. Sunny.

Sonny Kurmi [00:00:47]:

Well, thank you. Good morning. Thank you for opportunity, Stuart. Appreciate it. Of course. Nervous as well, which is always good, isn't it?

Stuart Webb [00:00:58]:

It's just the internet. Tell me, what are the things that you help your customers do?

Sonny Kurmi [00:01:06]:

Ultimately, I think literally in a sentence it would be be less scared and in more control of their financial future. In a nutshell, that's exactly what I do in one sentence.

Stuart Webb [00:01:22]:

Okay, and what are the problems that the businesses you help have made? What have they tried to do without getting the help that you provide them with?

Sonny Kurmi [00:01:35]:

I think the problem that they make probably would probably more so be speaking to unqualified family members, relatives, friends, or using the likes of Google to try and understand what their problem is. Two, how to resolve it with things like Google or whatever it may be. It will only answer the question that you've asked. But if you don't know what question that you need answering, how are you going to get the answer? Does that make sense?

Stuart Webb [00:02:17]:

Yeah, the problem is that the answer is very much dependent upon the right sort of question, isn't it? And you need somebody with experience like you to ask the right question, don't you?

Sonny Kurmi [00:02:29]:

That's exactly it, isn't it? It's about having that conversation, because sometimes for the clients themselves, you've got to sit down with them and actually get them to start thinking about what is it that they want to achieve and then understand where they are today and then kind of bridge that gap or at least create the plans to at least move them one step closer. But I'd say, yeah, most individuals probably don't know what they want to be doing in 10, 20, 30 years down the line. And that's kind of like where I come in and other furniture devices as well. It's by helping them understand the future where we are today. And then we're obviously in between the planning approach.

Stuart Webb [00:03:11]:

Okay, I get it sonny, there must be something, some valuable piece of advice, something you can give people now that will help them to understand that without sort of get them started on that journey of understanding how they do that and build their wealth portfolio.

Sonny Kurmi [00:03:28]:

Yeah, no, of course. Ultimately I would always be an advocate of speaking to professionals. Now one thing that I think is quite important to mention here is there are a number of different types of financial advisors. They all get paid in different ways but ultimately having a conversation with someone is free. There will be people that your friends know, your family know, pick up the call and just say, look, ultimately I wanted to get more control over my finances or start saving for the future, whatever it may be. But I don't know where to start a conversation with someone that's a qualified professional will always be able to assist in regards to getting the ball moving. But if someone wants to do it off their own back, there's a number of different books that one can read. There's a lot of information and resources. You see the word I used, there was information and resources that are out there and that might give you a great understanding of exactly what is planning, what is finance, what is debt, what is budgeting, what is savings, what's investments. You can get bombarded. But it all comes down to time. It all comes down to what you're trying to achieve. Why is it important for you today? And how much time have you got to allocate it to that time?

Stuart Webb [00:04:54]:

Brilliant. Look, there must be a book or a course or something that you took or read which really sort of started you to understand your journey. What is that thing that you can recommend to the audience that might help them to understand how they should be putting their financial future ahead of whatever else they're doing at the moment?

Sonny Kurmi [00:05:13]:

Yeah, no, one of the concepts is a quite good one, actually. It always stays with me and it is fairly textbook, but it's still quite relevant in today's world that we live in. It's the financial triangle. That's something that people can just quickly research and it will show you the hierarchy as the pyramid gets to the top. What you should be thinking about later down life, what you should have, ie. Your foundations. That's a great concept to potentially follow here. I say it ultimately to be the right thing for the right person. But something that I've watched, which was I find quite interesting, especially for people that want to just get a quick overview of certain areas or finance is a program called Money Explained Netflix. They've got three different series and that is quite fascinating, I have to admit. That was quite good because it's 20 minutes per clip and it gives you just a little bit of an understanding of that one topic and the world that we live in today. So those two things I would say go and see, go and view. I think it will definitely add value to who you are.

Stuart Webb [00:06:40]:

That's the first time anybody's mentioned Netflix on it's. Not rocket science. Five questions of coffee. So well done to you, Sonny, for bringing us something new on that one, Sonny. But in terms of other things, there must be one other question that you're thinking at the moment I should be asking you that I haven't. So what's the question and please answer it for us.

Sonny Kurmi [00:06:58]:

What's the question? And please answer it for us. I'd probably say, how did I get into what I did today? And why do I do what I do? It's probably the question that I think you haven't asked me, but I think it could be of value. So the first part of me answering my own question here is how did I get into the industry? Or how did I get into what I do today? The simple answer is family. My family background is finance. I actually started in the financial services industry at the age of 16.

Stuart Webb [00:07:39]:

Wow.

Sonny Kurmi [00:07:40]:

I actually do my work experience at the age of 15.

Stuart Webb [00:07:43]:

And you're only 21 now, of course.

Sonny Kurmi [00:07:46]:

You're so kind, but no. Yeah, no. I did my work experience at the age of 15 at Lloyd's TSB in halfship. And I got on quite well with the local regional director. And he offered me a job near enough, the day I turned 16. Day after, shall I say. And that's exactly what I did. I worked for Louis CSB, my first ever job, at the age of 16, the day after my 16th birth, should I say. And that's how I got into the industry. I studied. I did account and finance at university. Hated the accountancy side, but loved the finance side, which is great. I've ended up in Abu Dhabi, Dubai, my first job after university. And again, that was doing financial advice. And that's how I got into what I do today in terms of the job that I do today. So I was quite lucky. At the age of 20, I knew what I didn't want to do. I e accountancy and go down that route. And I did know what I did want to do for a lifetime and was to become a financial advisor. Why do I do it? I'm able to change people's lives. And that feeling so that feeling of being able to assist people either move one step closer to their goals or achieve their future goals, that feeling is just I don't think there's no words that can explain that. It's like magic. That's the way I can explain it. I can do magic in some senses. I can help people by achieving their goals or move one step closer, giving them information that's simple and easy to understand and changing their lives. But that's quite cool.

Stuart Webb [00:09:31]:

I like that. I like that a lot. Sonny, where can people find you to find out more information? And there must be a LinkedIn profile or something that people can follow your activities. And actually, I've got to admit, I love following your activities. You have a great daily three things I did doing today or did yesterday that you post every day, which I think is just a great thing to follow. So where can people find you?

Sonny Kurmi [00:09:55]:

Yeah, like you said, I am on social media. i.e. LinkedIn. I'm on LinkedIn. I have a website. I'm on Google. My business google? Yeah. I mean, there's a number of different ways that people could find me, but I'd say, yeah, LinkedIn website, google either my company name or my name and I should pop up.

Stuart Webb [00:10:20]:

So that's Sonny. Sonny Kurmi Sonny. Brilliant stuff. Thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. I'm just going to pop up now. Look, if you would like to hear about more of what we're sort of doing here on It's Not Rocket Science Five Questions. Have a copy, get onto the newsletter. It's as https link the complete approach Co UK newsletter. Follow everything we do. We'll have more great guests like Sonny in a week or so time. Sonny, thank you so much for spending some time with us. Really appreciate it. Lovely.

Who is Bri?

Bri Smith is a financial coach who helps parents manage their finances. She specializes in helping people understand their finances and set financial goals. Many parents come to her with the misconception that they have bad credit, but Bri teaches them that the real issue is not knowing how to manage their money. She helps her clients make a plan for their finances and teaches them how to achieve their financial goals. Bri believes that wishful thinking doesn't make anything happen, and with the right plan, anyone can achieve financial success.

Key Takeaways

[00:01:43] "Social Media's Get Rich Quick Scheme Pitfalls"

[00:06:01] "Unleashing Financial Success with Cash Flow Quadrants"

[00:09:11] "Subscribe to our newsletter for exclusive content!"

Valuable Free Resource or Action

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

https://youtube.com/live/d6G5lnviv2s

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Warren Buffett, budgeting, saving, credit management, financial planning, goal setting, get-rich-quick schemes, investing, education, personal finance, Robert Kayosaki, Cash Flow Quadrants, financial success, client consultation, one-on-one program, group setting, financial breakthrough calls, budget creation, money management, generational wealth, newsletter subscription, upcoming guests, podcast rating.

SPEAKERS

Bri Smith, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:18]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's not Rocket science. Five questions have got me. I've got a slight hoarse voice today, so I'm sucking on lemon and honey water. Brie, I know you've got a lipton tea in front of you, so we're both not quite coffeeed up, but we're both ready to talk to you today about this five questions of a coffee. Brie is a wealth strategist who works with parents to really build generational wealth in their families. That's a brilliant thing to talk about. BRI. Welcome to it's not rocket science. Five questions over coffee.

Bri Smith [00:00:51]:

Thank you for having me. I love being here.

Stuart Webb [00:00:54]:

Thank you. So let's start with the sort of people you help to work with. What are the problems they have? What is it that you're trying to help them to overcome?

Bri Smith [00:01:04]:

So, a lot of parents that come to me, their main problem is that they think that they have bad credit, so that's usually what they see as their main issue. But usually it's just that they don't know how to manage their money. They don't know where their money is going, they have no plan for the future. So they have a lot of goals and they feel like they're unachievable because they stay in the same place year after year because they're getting no closer there. Just because they don't have a plan to get there. And wishful thinking doesn't make anything happen.

Stuart Webb [00:01:33]:

Yeah, I know that feeling. So what are the things they've tried to do to overcome these issues on their own without sort of resorting to help that you can give them?

Bri Smith [00:01:43]:

I think a lot of them try and find stuff on Instagram or Facebook. They get into, like this forex trading or crypto trading or whatever it is, that they think is this get rich quick scheme that's going to give them $10,000 tomorrow. Right? And so they try these things out and then they find out that, yeah, maybe initially you get $500 so that then they can steal 5000 from you. But then they find out that they're really upset because they were getting into something that they don't even understand. And when it comes to investing, you're just gambling if you don't understand what you're getting into. Gambling are two different things.

Stuart Webb [00:02:26]:

The thing that worries me so much about these get rich quick schemes is about the gold rush down in San Francisco. Back in the day, the people that got rich were the people that sold the shovels and not the people that were digging for the gold. It is easy to see the people that you're working with getting rich, but somehow it never happens to you, does it?

Bri Smith [00:02:47]:

Exactly, and I love that analogy because that's exactly what is happening. The people that are selling the shovels, the people that are selling the methods, so to speak, are the ones that are getting rich from it. And it also just messes up the whole financial space because it's unregulated. So a lot of people are just really getting scammed and don't know who to trust anymore.

Stuart Webb [00:03:09]:

Love it. Brilliant. I'm glad you're there trying to help them through it. Tell me, is there a valuable piece of free advice or something valuable? And I think there is something because we talked about it before. Something valuable you can do to help people to sort of overcome this. And I think this might have something to do with it.

Bri Smith [00:03:27]:

So, yes, people can book a free financial breakthrough call with me, and basically what I go over there is like, what are your goals? What is it that you're really trying to achieve? And can we create a custom plan for you to reach that? So instead of me trying to sell different financial products and say, this is what's going to fix your problem, I really like to get into the root of it with my clients and fix their poor money habits and also teach them about money because they never learned about it at school or at home. And they just need a plan to get to where they want to go.

Stuart Webb [00:04:00]:

Now, it sounds like a lot to cover in one call. So is that a long call? Is that a short call? Do you try and cover everything or do you just try and work with people with what you can do to help them at that point?

Bri Smith [00:04:10]:

So during that call, we're really just getting very clear on what their goals are. So what are your goals and what is your current situation? So basically, where are you? Where do you want to go? And can I give you a plan that will help you get there? This is what I have to offer to help you get there. And do you think that's a good fit for working with me? Because working with me is going to be much longer. I have an eight week course, and then I have three month program where people work with me one on one if they don't like the group setting.

Stuart Webb [00:04:42]:

Wow, okay, good. All right, thank you for that explanation. So, Brie, there must be a book or a course or something which brought you to this position in your life where you started to understand finances. What was that book or course or whatever that you really sort of embraced in order to get to the stage where you took this on for yourself.

Bri Smith [00:05:02]:

So there was not a book or course. That was the problem. I'm a CPA, so I'm a certified public accountant. I went to school. I double majored in accounting and finance, concentrated on personal financial planning. That gave me a lot of my base. But then there was also so much more that school didn't teach me. So I listened to a ton, like hundreds of hours of different podcasts from the NPR station or just wherever I can get information. I've read a ton of different books. So it wasn't like one that was like, oh my God, this is the best one ever. It really answered all my questions. It was really a bunch of them that kind of helped me piece together the different parts that I needed for my financial plan to work.

Stuart Webb [00:05:45]:

Is there something you can recommend that people I mean, other than working with you, Tara? Is there something out there that you think would be useful for people to start to at least understand, so when they come to you and talk to you, they've got the basic questions out of the way so that they can actually sort of have a conversation.

Bri Smith [00:06:01]:

They don't have to start with anything. But I would recommend Rich dad, poor dad by Robert Kayosaki. Everyone reads that. It's a great book. But also the one that slept on is Cash Flow Quadrants by Robert Kayosaki. So when I read that one, it was recommended to me by a client. I was doing their taxes, and in 2020, they made one hundred K. And then in 2021, when I was doing their tax return, they had made over $500,000. And I said, how did you go from being a school teacher making like $50,000, combined with your husband making $100,000, to you both now bringing in over a half a million dollars a year? That's a big jump. And she said that the big difference. For her. What changed her life was cash flow. Quadrants by Robert Kayasaki. She also had a very wealthy dad and brother who she's investing with and things like that. So not to say that we can all go from just five X our money in one year like that. She did have help, but nonetheless, it's still possible. If one person can do it, we all can do it.

Stuart Webb [00:07:08]:

Brilliant. I love the story. I love the story. So, look, we've had a couple of couple of minutes now where we've just talked about these sort of things, but there must be one question you're thinking that I haven't yet asked you, which you would like me to have asked. So what's the question that I should have asked you that I haven't? And please, once you've asked the question, would you please give us the answer?

Bri Smith [00:07:32]:

So the main thing is, what is the biggest thing that's holding people back from reaching their financial goals? And I will say that is just like starting with a budget. That is one thing that anyone can start. That is the one thing that I want everyone to take away, whether you work with me or not. Please do a budget so that you understand your money, you know where it's going, and you can start telling it where to go. Because if you don't tell it where to, it will find places to go for you. And that is just not ideal.

Stuart Webb [00:08:00]:

Yeah, I think it was. I can't remember if it was Warren Buffett that said you should spend what you've got left after you've saved, not the other way around. So, simple budget that enables you to work out exactly, make sure that you put this amount about it, money about aside and saved it, and then once you put that aside, that's the rest you've got to live on and manage within that budget is the way to sort of get richer and richer every year. Warren Buffett seems to have done okay.

Bri Smith [00:08:29]:

I love Warren Buffett. I have read his autobiography or his biography and he has a lot of great wisdom to give to everyone.

Stuart Webb [00:08:38]:

Yeah, well, he still lives in the same house that he's lived in for a long time. So it's another great story. To make yourself better, more wealthy, is not spend your money on large, expensive houses, isn't it?

Bri Smith [00:08:54]:

Well, I don't know. I'm going to get a large, expensive house and he could get a lot of large, expensive houses if he wants to, but I think it's just his preference. But, yeah, I'm going to get a large, expensive house. I don't know about Warren, but I know about BRI.

Stuart Webb [00:09:11]:

Been great chatting to you for a few minutes. Thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us talking about this stuff. You have a good day. And I would really encourage anybody who's currently not listening and subscribing to this, would you join our newsletter. That way you get onto the mailing list which tells you about when we have great people like Brie coming up and giving you advice. And that is if you go to https link the completeapproach Co UK that's link thecompletroach Co UK newsletter that gets you onto the newsletter. You can get to know about people like Brie. And you'll hear Brie on the podcast in a couple of weeks time when it's published on Apple podcasts. Please go and like and subscribe there and give us a nice rating as well. Brie, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. I really appreciate you coming on and talking about this. Look forward to seeing more of the stuff you're doing online and more of the stuff you're doing to help people increase that generational wealth.

Bri Smith [00:10:10]:

Thank you. Thank you for having me.

Who is Ann?

Ann Hobbs is an experienced writer who has mastered the art of writing books that speak directly to her reader's needs. Before putting pen to paper, she takes the time to understand her audience's problems and comes up with solutions that will make their lives easier. This strategy ensures that her writing is structured to address specific issues and provides a clear path to resolution. Ann's books are easy to follow, engaging, and packed with practical advice that is delivered in an enjoyable and relatable way. If you're seeking a guide that will help you transform your life, Ann Hobbs is the author you should seek out.

Key Takeaways

[00:01:40] Writer has good language skills, but lacks book structuring abilities.

[00:02:22] Know your audience when writing a book.

[00:03:44] Identifying the reader is crucial in successful writing.

[00:04:27] Before starting to write a manuscript, identify the reader, their problems, and how to solve them to make writing easier and help you structure the book.

[00:06:46] Publishing a book has a powerful impact on selling business programs.

[00:07:44] Writing a book takes effort, money, and help; many people want to write a book but don't follow through, admiring those who do.

[00:08:31] Author shares three steps to master ghostwriting, emphasizes importance of understanding reader and their problems in writing process. Also mentions writing a book in five weeks while ill.

[00:09:37] Editor cuts 30,000 words from a manuscript with multiple target readers, causing reluctance due to the author's effort.

[00:10:41] Writing is not just about grammar, it's about having a voice.

[00:11:55] Motivation comes from helping others and changing lives through sharing information in a book.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

https://mailchi.mp/f31a5f07b6af/3-steps-to-master-your-writing-booklet

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

https://www.youtube.com/live/nIBMoc1LV44?feature=share

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

audience, problems, desire to help, effort, writing a book, power of publishing, credibility, authority, program, motivation, scare, life-changing, valuable information, save time, social media, growth programs, proposal, knowing the reader, problem-solving, manuscript, English language skills, voice, podcast, advice, simple steps, target audience, persona, manuscript editor, cutting words, mastering writing, ghost writer, understanding reader's needs.

SPEAKERS

Ann Hobbs, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:22]:

Hi, and welcome back to It Not Rocket Science five Questions Over Coffee. I have my coffee mug in front of me. I'm here with Anne from Forward Thinking Publishing. I think Ann is going to give us some great insights into how we as business owners can go about letting people know about our experiences, our expertise by publishing. So, Anne, welcome to it's not coffee. Five it's not rocket science. Five questions over coffee.

Ann Hobbs [00:00:52]:

Yeah, thank you for having me. I've got my coffee mug, too.

Stuart Webb [00:00:55]:

Excellent. Tell me about the sort of people that you help with your business. What is it you're helping them to do?

Ann Hobbs [00:01:04]:

So, mainly I work with business owners that really want to kind of promote their business by writing a book, and that has to be done in a specific way. So one of the problems that they know what they do and they're expert at what they do, they just don't know how to write a book. So that's where I come in.

Stuart Webb [00:01:26]:

And tell me, what sort of things do they find themselves doing to try and get out of getting things written down that don't help them? What is it you help them to sort of straighten out in their heads?

Ann Hobbs [00:01:40]:

Yeah, I think they know how to write. It's not a question of the writing. As an editor, I never correct the language or the writing. That's always quite perfect. It's how they kind of structure the book. They just don't know how to write a book. And that's a lot different to I don't know how to write, because they obviously do. They just don't know how to write it in a book and how to get it into kind of a book.

Stuart Webb [00:02:12]:

And what do you see as some of the main problems with people actually therefore writing a book? What are some of the things that you see that go wrong?

Ann Hobbs [00:02:22]:

Yeah, so one of the main issues that I see when I have a manuscript is that people don't think about who the reader is. Then they try to solve so much of their expertise in one book, they're not speaking to anybody. Like, kind of marketing. If you're not speaking to anybody, you can't market it. And this is the same kind of with the book I know within two sentences of a manuscript who the reader is that I know they don't know who they are.

Stuart Webb [00:02:59]:

Yes.

Ann Hobbs [00:03:00]:

Amazing.

Stuart Webb [00:03:02]:

I know. I was taught many years ago when it comes to starting any piece of writing, in order to really get it clear in my head exactly who it was that I was writing to, that I had to sort of get a picture of them, give them a name, and then start any writing with Dear Ann or Dear Fiona. So that whenever I was writing it, I was writing it very specifically to a person, even if that person was a fictitious person or an Avatar or a persona, whatever. But by having that clear picture and writing Dear so and so at the beginning of my writing, that enabled me to be absolutely clear about writing something very specific to a specific person.

Ann Hobbs [00:03:44]:

Yeah. And people don't want to do it because they don't want to unleash. They think by speaking to one person, they're only speaking to one person. But I can write a book in four weeks because I know the subject, I know who the reader is. And it's very simple, kind of with the writing. So, yeah, the number one problem that I see is that they don't know who the reader is.

Stuart Webb [00:04:07]:

Yeah. Brilliant. Well, I know you've got some valuable free advice to give to people who have got that sort of problem. And I've got the link on the screen at the moment. Do you want to talk us through what is on that particular booklet that you've got? The Three Steps to Master Your Writing Booklet.

Ann Hobbs [00:04:27]:

Yes. So it takes you through kind of and know your reader, what is their problem and how you're going to solve it. So these are the questions that before you stuart a manuscript, you should be looking at before you even start kind of the writing process, Ann. Think about who they are, what their problems are, how you're going to solve it, which will make the writing so much easier in a couple of weeks when your know these questions. So that will really help you to figure out how you're going to get the book all structured. So that will tell you how to do it all from the structure.

Stuart Webb [00:05:10]:

Do you know something, Ann? It is the same story for so many things, isn't it? I was only talking to somebody on one of my growth programs yesterday, and they're trying to pull the growth lever at the moment of getting their proposals accepted. We were talking about the key things to put into a proposal, Ann. The three key things that I said that they had to do was know exactly who the person was that was going to be going to be reading the proposal. What was their problem that they had and what was the solution that they were looking for, how you were going to provide that solution. It's really the key to business, isn't it? Know the problem you solve and demonstrate that you can actually understand that problem and demonstrate that you've got the solution to it. It is the key to everything.

Ann Hobbs [00:06:02]:

Yeah, it is the key to everything. But when you write a book, people seem to forget that. But if you get it all right at the beginning, then your marketing becomes very clear. Then you can sell that book. So that's what we do. We produce a great looking book, but we also help your with the marketing by getting it set up in the correct way.

Stuart Webb [00:06:31]:

Great. Brilliant. Was there a particular course or program that brought you into publish that really sort of helped you to understand exactly how you could do this?

Ann Hobbs [00:06:46]:

Not really. I understood the power of a book when I published one because kind of like all my clients, they want to kind of get their advice out there to help people, which I did. But then when I went to networking events, I didn't understand the power of it. Selling became very easy for me. I sold like a 2000 pound program in like ten minutes with my book. They didn't even want to read the book, which was I was really upset they didn't want to pay ten pounds for my book, but they paid two grand for a program. So it's the power that that book gives you as a business owner that you don't realize until you've published one.

Stuart Webb [00:07:32]:

It's the credibility builder, isn't it? It's the thing which actually really builds your credibility to have a book or something like that behind you, which allows you to sort of say, I really am an expert. I know. Because I've written a book about it.

Ann Hobbs [00:07:44]:

Yeah, because it takes effort, it takes kind of your money as well. So people really see that. But there's a lot of people that want to write a book, but they just don't. So they really admire those people that have taken the time, worked it out, got the help they've needed, and they've got kind of something to how for it, which not a lot of people will want to do well, they want to do, but they don't do.

Stuart Webb [00:08:14]:

You mentioned at the end it's possible you said you can write a book in 30 days, which I know is possible because I've done something similar. Do you have techniques, tips that you give people on how to sort of be able to crank out a book in such a short space of time?

Ann Hobbs [00:08:31]:

Yeah. It's all in my three steps to master. And I did it because I was a ghost writer for someone which I knew the subject, but I didn't know all of the subjects and so I had to put all of those like who is the reader? What is the problem? What am I going to solve? I had to do all of that and I wrote that in actually five weeks because I got ill after four weeks. But I mean, I did that in five weeks. But it's going back to those basics. Who is the reader? What's their problem? So I have to put all that into practice to get that book all written brilliant.

Stuart Webb [00:09:11]:

I love it.

Ann Hobbs [00:09:12]:

Quite eye opening because I stood there because when I first got the proposal, I like, how am I going to write this? So I have all the same questions all my clients have and I just thought, no, back to the reader.

Stuart Webb [00:09:28]:

Absolutely love it. I think you're absolutely right. It is so critical we get that focus on the person that you are speaking to isn't it?

Ann Hobbs [00:09:37]:

Yeah and especially when I see a manuscript I had one and it was 90,000 words. I asked him who the reader was and it was like five different people so I'm like that's not going to sell anyway. But then I had to cut out the words. I had to cut out like 30,000 words. And it pains me because it took him so much time to write these words, but they just didn't. Once you worked out who the reader is that reader was they didn't actually but I had to take out so many words, they didn't kind of belong there anymore. So that what pains me is that I'm having to cut a lot of words out once your realize who the reader is.

Stuart Webb [00:10:20]:

Yeah, I love it. We're coming towards the end of our interview and I've only got sort of the one question left for you really which is there must be one question that I haven't asked which you would quite like me to have asked at this stage. What would you have liked me to have asked you? Which I haven't so far.

Ann Hobbs [00:10:41]:

I think a lot of the time people say can I write it? Am I really good at English? Am I good at this? I wasn't really good at school. So these are the blocks people come to me with. And I say, it isn't about where the comma is or if you've kind of used the Capital Letter. It's about having a voice. And if your voice shines through that kind of your manuscript, then that's where the power is. And no one's going to be upset if the comma is in the wrong place. But if your voice doesn't shine through, I think that is really important. Other than the English language.

Stuart Webb [00:11:25]:

I think it comes back to that thing that you started with, isn't it? It's knowing who you're trying to reach. If your know who you're trying to reach, if you know what their problem is and you really want to help, then all you have to do then is put the effort behind that. And then a book comes from that because you are reaching out to help somebody, even if that is with money intention. But because you're looking at ways of helping them, it becomes easier to put that across, doesn't it?

Ann Hobbs [00:11:55]:

Yeah and it helps you with the motivation, it always does. If I'm thinking about that one person ann, I'm like I've got the information that they need, if I don't write it, then I'm not doing them any favors. So that always kind of motivates me into getting it out there because it is scary. It is scary putting your stuff out in a book and I understand that but I'm looking about that person if I can change someone's lives, even if you know how to do social media and you tell them it's going to save them so much time so why not get it in a book.

Stuart Webb [00:12:36]:

Yeah, brilliant. I love it. I love it and that's great. I love what you've been telling us. I love what you're speaking about. I think it's brilliant. Everybody, if you're watching this and thinking, I'd love to know about who's coming on so I can get on and ask questions of these people and really catch up with some of the great advice you're getting, go to this link, which is https link thecompleetaproach co UK that's link thecompleetaproachnewsletter that gets you onto our newsletter list. You will get an email every week which lets you know about who's coming onto the podcast, what great advice they're going to be giving you so that you can get your questions into the people that you need to speak to. Really would encourage you to do that. And I'd love to thank Ann this day for coming and spending just a few minutes with us about how we can go about very easily creating a book. And it's so simple, with just three simple steps. Anne, thank you for that advice.

Ann Hobbs [00:13:36]:

Thank you for having me, Ann. Stewart.

Stuart Webb [00:13:38]:

That's absolutely no problem at all. Speak to you again soon.

Ann Hobbs [00:13:41]:

Okay, bye.

Who is Suzanne?

Suzanne Jabour is a grief integration specialist who helps organizations create supportive cultures around emotions, particularly grief. She believes that grief is not something we can ignore or suppress, but something that needs to be integrated into our lives. Suzanne works with companies to address their culture around emotion and protocols for supporting grieving employees. She provides a menu of support options to choose from and encourages conversations about grief. By doing so, she helps create a culture of support and wholeness in the workplace, which not only benefits grieving employees but also improves customer service. Suzanne's ultimate goal is to help individuals integrate their grief, so it becomes a part of them and their lives moving forward.

Key Takeaways

Addressing Grief in the Workplace: "We want to integrate our grief. It becomes a part of us and a part of our life as we carry forward...None of that really works with grief...One to three days is nowhere near as long as it takes. It doesn't even take that year that sometimes we're given grace through. It takes much longer than that for many of us, especially if you've had a really catastrophic loss." - This quote emphasizes the importance of understanding that grief cannot be compartmentalized and ignored, and that it takes much longer than a few days or even a year to process. It also highlights the need for workplaces to have protocols in place to support employees going through grief, as well as a culture that embraces emotions and offers support without the burden falling solely on the grieving person to ask for help.

— Suzanne Jabour [00:02:07 → 00:08:46]

Grieving in the Workplace: "We need some scaffolding to be able to be successful at work."

— Suzanne Jabour [00:09:27 → 00:11:21]

Supporting Your Team Through Grief: "We're all experiencing grief and let's brainstorm. Let's talk about some of the ways we could support each other when we're having those difficult moments or those difficult days."

— Suzanne Jabour [00:11:21 → 00:12:23]

Supporting Grieving Employees: "I'm all about it, own it. Go to them and say, oh my gosh, I listened to this podcast and I realized I totally didn't support you the way you needed. What can we do now? What support do you need now? Right? There's always time to say, oh my gosh, I didn't know any better."

— Suzanne Jabour [00:13:46 → 00:15:25]

Grief at Work: "The biggest thing for business owners, I think, that impacts people at work, is the brain fog."

— Suzanne Jabour [00:17:02 → 00:18:29]

Grief Resources: "One of the people's work that helped me really get through those early, early days is Megan Devine, and her book is It's Okay That You're Not okay."

— Suzanne Jabour [00:19:00 → 00:21:07]

The Importance of Grief in the Workplace: "So it matters because grief gives us an in to talk about some really complicated things that are actually really important for all of us."

— Suzanne Jabour [00:21:55 → 00:24:19]

Valuable Free Resource or Action

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/6013019a02a2d7779026a55e/t/64092e6c2df4700a16d5dadd/1678323312188/e+book+final%3F.pdf

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page : https://scientificvaluebuildingmachine.online

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

grief, Grief at Work, ebook, brain fog, practical support, program, business owners, Suzanne Jabor, grief education, lack of support, long-term support, consult, newsletter, processing grief, vulnerability, emotions at work, team members, loyalty, bereavement leave policies, culture, menu of support options, disengaged employees, anticipatory grieving, team-building, business leaders, follow-up, cycles, returning to normality, nonfiction comprehension, Facebook, Instagram, Megan Devine, David Kessler, post traumatic growth, meaning in grief.

SPEAKERS

Suzanne Jabour, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:22]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science five Questions Over Coffee. I'm really delighted to be welcoming Suzanne Jabor today from a lived experience. Now, Suzanne is somebody who's passionate about helping people to understand and overcome grief, and she's a grief education. I think it's going to be a really fascinating discussion because it's something that we so rarely deal with, and as business owners, it is the thing that we need to deal with, because if it's not somebody within our organization, it could well be us that's having to go through something like this. And we just often want to put this away in a shed and hope that it just goes away. And that's not really the right way of dealing with some of these feelings. It really doesn't help the organization. It doesn't help you. So I think it's going to be a really fascinating discussion that Suzanne really want to welcome you to it's Not Rocket Science five Questions of Copy. And thank you for spending the time with us.

Suzanne Jabour [00:01:17]:

Thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate, especially people whose work is focused on business, taking the time to talk about this topic because it's so important, it has such a huge impact.

Stuart Webb [00:01:27]:

Yeah. Well, I will tell you that when my father died, it was a problem for my business for a short while until I eventually learned to overcome it. So I know how it can affect people who are trying to run businesses, who are also trying to, as I said, compartmentalize this thing and just ignore it and hope it just goes away, which is just if that's happening within your organization, it's happening with one of your employees. It's the wrong way of dealing with it. So, Suzanne, you've seen this. You've helped people talk to us about the sort of things that people are doing and how you're trying to help them, to educate them on their grief and the way to deal with it.

Suzanne Jabour [00:02:07]:

Yeah. So the thing that's the most important for me is exactly what you're talking about. This kind of whole idea we have that we can put grief in a box, we can just kind of ignore it, we can pretend it's not there and it will eventually go away, is unfortunately not how it works. Really the only way to get to I talk about integration being the goal. We want to integrate our grief. It becomes a part of us and a part of our life as we carry forward, which is, I'm sure, what you've done with your dad, right? You haven't left him behind. You haven't moved on or gotten through anything. You've learned how to live with the loss, to carry that grief with you and carry him with you. And what happens at work often is work many places is a place where we're not encouraged, really, to have emotions anyway. Employers want us to kind of show up and get the job done and figure out what the problem is, make a plan, solve the problem, move forward. None of that really works with grief. And so if that's your office culture, it can be really challenging for grievers. And if your office culture is more accepting of emotions than that, even then the really big emotions that happen in grief, which are mostly, to be honest, the ones on that negative or bad side of the list if you think about that weird paradigm we have of positive and good emotions and negative and bad emotions? The ones that we've been taught from our childhoods for most of us to ignore and not express and tamp down are the ones that are coming at you in a tsunami when you're in early, especially those early days and those acute days of grief. And for most places, certainly in North America, and I'd love to hear about what it's like for you in the UK. There's kind of a standard one to three days off, and then you're expected to just show up and be your normal self and get your job done. And one to three days is nowhere near as long as it takes. It doesn't even take that year that sometimes we're given grace through. It takes much longer than that for many of us, especially if you've had a really catastrophic loss. And so that sort of sense that you should be able to show up and do your job really does a disservice to everyone because you're then as the griever, feeling all these expectations that you can't meet, which is then more grief and loss, right? Because you're already mourning the person you lost. And then if it's someone who the loss of them changed your identity, which is what happened to me, you're mourning yourself, your loss of yourself, and now you're mourning that you don't have these capacities at work that you used to have, but you're supposed like, it just gets so complicated. So if instead we can have talked about it ahead of time, we can have protocols, we can have developed the skills and mindsets that allow us to at least witness all of those emotions that are coming up and at least have an open forum where people could talk about them, maybe a quiet place where they could go when they feel overwhelmed. Preferably not the bathroom, right? There's many of us that have cried massive tears in a bathroom stall. It's not all that dignified, right, somewhere quiet to go when you're an overwhelmed. That's not the bathroom. I love to think about it as like a menu of things you could choose from that you might need support with, and we can talk about details of that if that's interesting. But what I do with companies is just come in and look at what the culture is around emotion because that's where we need to start. And I know that's scary and I know we don't really want to, but it makes us better humans. It makes us better business leaders. It makes us better employers and customer service providers. And then once we've got to that point where we can maybe have a conversation about grief without feeling like we're terrified and we want to turn and run away, then we can look at what are the practical things we can do. A lot of companies come to me because they have someone who's important to their team who's had a significant loss and they realize they want to do something more than like the referral to the Employee assistance program, right, that referral to sort of the three free counseling sessions. They know that's not going to be enough, but they don't know what else to do. So that's where I can step in and really go, okay, great, let's look at your culture. Let's look at this. If it's based on an individual, let's start there and then from there we can make some really robust protocols that people know they can hook into. So the other thing that happens that's really hard for grievers is if there's no conversation that's ever been had in your workplace, there's no protocols in place. You're having to go in the hardest moments of your life to try and advocate for what you need. And that's really a big burden for people. So they tend to not do it because they're in full on survival mode. They can't also go and say they can't even necessarily identify what's happening to them. So they can't go and say, well, I'm really having significant brain fog and I'm struggling with keeping track of my calendar. Could we set up a shared calendar? Like they can't even articulate any of that because they're in survival mode. But if you as the boss, the supervisor, the business owner could say, hey, I know you're grieving. Here's our grief protocol. What of those things would really help you this week? Let's put those into place. And it's an offer that's made as opposed to someone coming to have to ask. That's really powerful. And the ripple of that is that it shows all your other employees who aren't grieving that you care about them, that their whole self is welcome at the office. And if they're struggling with a loss, big or small or just struggling with something else, they know there's an ability to come and get support. So it creates that whole culture of support and wholeness that I really think is a big part of that sort of quiet quitting epidemic and people showing up and just being barely engaged. If people feel seen and heard, then we also want to show up in a really robust way as best as our capacities are that day. And we know the vast majority of people are doing the best they can in any given day with the skills and capacities they have. So if we're working from that assumption, then we can really make real shifts around how we support both our staff and we have customers who are grieving too. So if you have customer facing folks, if that's your business, even if it's business to business, the way that you interact with people who have experienced a loss I just was talking with a friend the other day who'd experienced a significant loss. And honestly, we're all sharing notes. So I know which companies I will not go to because they didn't have capacity to help him when he needed it, and I know which ones I will. So if you think that grief is not impacting your business, I'm here to tell you you are wrong. Because especially right now, coming out of the last three years, we've all experienced we all have grief for something. Whether we've lost people or multiple people or all the other things we lost, we all have it. So we need to be talking about it.

Stuart Webb [00:08:46]:

Suzanne, it's really interesting, and it's exciting to hear you say, I guess the question that follows on from that we could turn this into 200 questions of a coffee. We're not going to. I could probably but we were so you mentioned it at the end there. What are the things that people are doing wrong? Because you've already sort of said there are things that people are trying to do to sort of overcome this. And it's often a business owner sort of doing something and you think that they have just missed the point, or they've just misunderstood, or they're trying valiantly to do something, but it's misguided. What are some of the things you've seen that have sort of made you stop and go, no, I really think you need to stop and turn around and go somewhere else?

Suzanne Jabour [00:09:27]:

Yeah, I mean, I think the biggest one that I hear from grievers is that there's just no support at all. So they get the sort of I'm sorry, they might get sent flowers, maybe not. They might get a card, maybe not. All of those things are great, and we need support. Beyond that, we need practical support. We need some scaffolding to be able to be successful at work. So that's the biggest one, right? Is that the same fear that we feel in our real lives when we're faced with someone who's grieving and we don't know what to do, we don't know what to say, we don't know how to respond? That happens in the workplace. So that's one end of the scale. One end of the scale is they get no support at all. That's a big problem. The other end of the scale is they get support, but it's not what they need. So it's not kind of griever centered. It's happened without a conversation. Perhaps someone has said, oh, you must be overwhelmed, so let's take this task from you. Well, if you're taking the task that they really like, then now they're left with, not the things that they really enjoy at work or the companies that are trying that want to help and want to give support that offer, and they take things away, or they provide scaffolding. There's no follow up plan put in place. So I actually was talking with one woman who ended up quitting her job and going somewhere else because she had lost a child, so she'd lost a son. And they provided all kinds of support, really robust support at the beginning, but no follow up plan to then take that scaffolding down so she could step back into the fullness of her role. So she ended up leaving because she became that woman who'd lost a child who everyone had to help, and she didn't want that to be her identity either. Right. So it's kind of like, from both ends of the spectrum, we kind of go wrong. And really the key, key thing, if you can hear anything, is do it all in consultation with the griever. Yeah.

Stuart Webb [00:11:21]:

Brilliant.

Suzanne Jabour [00:11:21]:

And understand that they may not have the capacity, especially in those really acute early days, to articulate or even comprehend what they need. So that's why if you've talked about it ahead of time, I mean, think about what a powerful team building exercise that would be if you had a team meeting where the conversation was, we're all experiencing grief and let's brainstorm. Let's talk about some of the ways we could support each other when we're having those difficult moments or those difficult days. And if you don't have the skills to do that, then you can bring in someone like me who can easily facilitate that conversation and just get the ball rolling. Right. Because then we're sending all kinds of messages. Like, it's also, as we know, as business leaders, right. It's not just about what you say. It's about the messages you're sending. It's about that idea that we value your whole person and your whole experience. Whatever's going on for you is, okay, you're a valued part of this business, and we need you, and we need you at the best of your capacity, whatever that is. Right. So there's kind of, you know, there's pitfalls both ends of the scale.

Stuart Webb [00:12:23]:

Yeah. You said something really valuable there that I think which is doing these things in advance, isn't it? Because doing it too late and having that conversation before I think it's absolutely brilliant that you stress that, because I think that is one of the things that I think, once again, I don't want to get into too. Much personal stuff. But there was a situation with me where somebody who was in the process of they had a terminal condition and they were starting the grieving process before the grieving before the person has left. And essentially, I sort of eventually realized this person was grieving the healthy situation. They were sort of anticipating and sitting, going, well, the healthy what I had before has gone and everything was rosy. Now I know it's not going to be rosy. And they were grieving that, and then there was going to be a second grief after the death. And so it was one of those, this is going to be a long term thing. And the follow up has to be very critical because they will go through several cycles of feeling good and feeling bad and things will change and then it becomes, well, how much longer do we do this and what do we do in order to sort of return to normality? Which is the critical step on that path, isn't it?

Suzanne Jabour [00:13:46]:

Yeah, absolutely. And that can take a really long time. Like for me, I came to this work after the death of my son, which now is two and a half years ago, which is not all that long in the grand scheme of things, but in our sense of how grief works. I should be back to normal, right? I should be totally fine. Well, of course that's not the case. I still have capacities that I go, wait, I used to be able to do that and I can't. So that's okay. I can do lots of other things, but that sort of sense of and in a situation you describe where it's complicated, right? You're having to support someone through anticipatory grief, and then they're going to have the grief when the person finally dies. That person is going to need support for a long time. And you don't want to lose them, right. They're a valued part of your team. So you want to do what you can. And I just want to riff off to something. You were saying that there's a point where it's kind of too late. I don't actually think that's true. I think you can do a lot of really good mitigating of what you might not have done brilliantly, because we all are doing the best we can as we learn new things. So if you're coming out of this conversation today of listening to us and thinking, oh my gosh, I totally blew it with my person who lost someone fairly recently, I'm all about it, own it. Go to them and say, oh my gosh, I listened to this podcast and I realized I totally didn't support you the way you needed. What can we do now? What support do you need now? Right? There's always time to say, oh my gosh, I didn't know any better. Now I have this inkling I might not have stepped up the way I would have wanted to. Where do we go from here? Right? And that's that vulnerability piece, that honesty piece about we don't know what we don't know, until someone says, hey, you don't know that. And then we need to recover. And that's okay.

Stuart Webb [00:15:25]:

I absolutely love that, Suzanne. Thank you. I've just put a message up on the screen for people to see if the questions and I'm just going to throw this open. I hope you don't mind, Suzanne, but even after this recording is finished, if they've got questions, they can easily post them to you by contacting you on LinkedIn, where you're obviously tagged on this particular episode. Or if they need me to contact me, I will then pass them on to Suzanne so that you can actually get those questions answered. So please don't suffer in silence, as it were. Ask the questions. And I love the advice you've just given Suzanne, which is, it's never too late to just turn around and own that situation.

Suzanne Jabour [00:16:04]:

Absolutely.

Stuart Webb [00:16:06]:

Now, I'm just going to hide that question for a minute. I'm hoping that you've got some valuable free resources that you can talk to us about. It's on your website, which is on screen now, which is a lived experience. So that's a lived experience. And I hope I've spelled that right. It's difficult for me to be absolutely sure.

Suzanne Jabour [00:16:26]:

I've got I know I realized I picked a really complicated to spell thing. It's all those letters that you don't usually type. I'm sorry.

Stuart Webb [00:16:36]:

It's easy to say, but difficult to get right when you're typing. What have you got on there that could help us sort of understand a little bit better some of the things that we could be doing as business owners, business small business owners and people who are working together with clients and customers and also within organizations so that we can be better grief supporters.

Suzanne Jabour [00:17:02]:

Yeah. So the most important thing that your listeners will find there is a very short, I promise. It's about six pages, a little quick ebook, and it's called Grief at Work. So you just look for the Grief at Work ebook. It's in the top banner. Click there. It's about six pages of really distilled a starting place. Right. So I talk a lot there about some of the symptoms people might be experiencing, really practical ways that you can support them. The biggest thing for business owners, I think, that impacts people at work, is the brain fog. And if you haven't ever experienced and no one's ever told you about it, it's a thing. And it's a really big thing for a lot of grievers that sense that just your brain is foggy and you can't remember things. And it's of course, linked to sleep deprivation and all our issues with sleeping and eating and all the things that keep us healthy and whole that we don't do very well in early grief. So that would be the thing to really click on there. And then there's another page that's called Grief at Work that just gives a little brief outline of what I offer as my program. So what I would come into your company and offer you. So that would be the two things. And then if you want to keep digging, my blog posts are all there so you can learn more about how grief worked for me. And now when I'm doing a blog post, I try and include a section on the bottom with some suggestions and ideas for someone who's grieving, for someone who's supporting them, and then for a business owner. So there's some really rich information there, but I would start with the Grief at Work ebook. That's the place to start. Brilliant.

Stuart Webb [00:18:29]:

Thank you, Suzanne, so much. You talked a little bit about how you sort of go into this, and I don't want you to expose too much of that because I think that's a thing which probably is personal to you. But is there a particular book or course which you think helped you when you were starting your grief journey that you would recommend other people to start using to get through the grief process and help them to understand what they should be doing?

Suzanne Jabour [00:19:00]:

Yeah, that's such an interesting question for me in those early days of grief. And one of the things I still struggle with is nonfiction comprehension. Like remembering what I've read, is still really hard with nonfiction. So I relied really on Facebook and Instagram posts because they're short and chunky and you don't have to read very long. So one of the people's work that helped me really get through those early, early days is Megan Devine, and her book is It's Okay That You're Not okay. And she's on Facebook and Instagram. She has a website, email, podcast, all the things she's really great for those early days. And the other person that has helped me really the most on my grief journey is David Kessler. And that's actually who I did my grief educator course with. I knew that from my own experience, which is how my company ended up with the name it had. I knew my lived experience was going to be enough for me to be able to help people. And I also wanted to have a foundation in understanding grief in a broader sense and what other people's experiences might be. So I sought out a grief educator course, and I did that with David Kessler, who's written I think he's written six books now about grief. His latest book, which is really fabulous once you're out of that kind of survival mode, is called Finding Meaning. And it's all about sort of that sense of post traumatic growth that we know is possible if we choose it and if we have the capacity for that. So his most recent book is about sort of how do you integrate that person, how do you find meaning from this experience, from this loss? And that's really helped me a lot, sort of after that first year and a half, two years, when I started to really well. I mean, I looked for meaning right from the beginning because that was going to be my path, my way with grief. But for a lot of people, they don't make that choice then, because they're so in survival mode and they just need to get through every day. But once you're ready to kind of look at the broader impacts of that loss in your life, that's a really helpful resource. And he also is present on Facebook and Instagram has a great website, courses, an amazing online support community. So both of those people really helped me a lot.

Stuart Webb [00:21:07]:

And Susanna, I hope we'll find your website and your pages to do exactly the same thing, because I think you're bringing us some real valuable insights here and I don't want to diminish those in any way. But look, we've covered some interesting ground, but I always finish these interviews with my fifth and I often admit, a get out of jail free question, which means I don't have to do any work here. This is about you, and I want this to be about you. So there is a question that you must be thinking, he hasn't yet asked me, and so now is the opportunity for you to say, the question you really should have been asking me is this. But then, of course, you obviously have to answer it because otherwise we won't know the answer. So what is that question you would have liked me to have asked, which I've so far failed to do?

Suzanne Jabour [00:21:55]:

I think the question that is the most important to me that we've touched on a little bit is why does it matter? Because I think with this topic that we so are sort of conditioned and enculturated to kind of Turntail and run away. We're all so scared, we feel so much fear around it. It's really easy for us to think, well, but that doesn't really matter. Why does that matter? Why do I need to do this? It's uncomfortable. I don't like it. She's talking about emotions at work. I'm out. Like, I don't want to do this. Why it matters is that these people who are grieving are valuable parts of your team and they're valued customers and they are important to your business's success. So everything that I'm talking about, we all want to do because we're most of us on a path of trying to become a better human. The other reason it matters is because this impacts your bottom line. When you look at the cost of having to do recruitment and interviewing and training and all that stuff and getting someone up to speed as opposed to retention. It is much cheaper if we're only going to look at it from the bottom line, right? From a business financial perspective, it is much cheaper to offer short term, medium term, long term scaffolding and support to existing valuable team members than it is to find somebody new. And especially in this climate where it feels easier for people to leave and find something else that feels like it's shifting a little bit now here anyway. But it's been an employees market for a long time these last few years, so people seem to feel more able to go. You know what? I've had a shift in my perspective and a shift in what I'm prepared to do at work and what I'm prepared to put up with. And I'm not prepared to put up with this anymore. So it matters because grief gives us an in to talk about some really complicated things that are actually really important for all of us. And the ripple effect that you create, this system of having scaffolding, this system of supports for people who are struggling, a culture where it's expected that sometimes we will struggle and we have all these things in place for when you are. That's a huge shift in culture. And when we shift that culture to having a business where people feel seen and heard and valued, then we're increasing loyalty for our staff and our customers. And ultimately that's what we all want. So that's why it matters.

Stuart Webb [00:24:19]:

Love it. Suzanne, that's been what a way to finish this particular episode. Suzanne, you have educated me. Thank you so much for spending a few minutes on this call with me today. I really appreciate the effort that you've gone to to talk to us about this. I will just now be very quick and just say, look, if you would like to join the newsletter list and get notification each week of just some of the most brilliant guests that we get on this, so that you can ask them questions during their interview or connect with them afterwards, get onto the website, which is link thecompletroach Co Uknewsletter simple form. Fill it out. You get onto the newsletter list, I send you an email once a week which says, who's coming on this week? You get access to be able to talk to some of the most brilliant people I've found on the planet. Suzanne, thank you so much for coming on and spending a few minutes with us. We really do appreciate all the time you spent with us and for some of that really educational advice.

Suzanne Jabour [00:25:24]:

Thank you so much for having me. You're so welcome.

On this episode of Five Questions Over Coffee, our guest speaker, an ESG consultant focused on social impact, emphasizes the importance of managing social risks and creating long-term value. They discuss how companies need to align social impact with business objectives, examine the key areas of people, purpose, community, and supply chain, and navigate practical challenges in implementing ESG priorities. They also explore the lack of effective communication and the importance of seeking guidance from experienced ESG consultants. Our guest shares their expertise on ESG consulting, specialization, materiality assessments, and data analytics while providing a comprehensive, globally recognized framework for responsible business conduct. The speaker offers advice and insights into understanding sustainability, ensuring social impact aligns with business objectives, and the biggest challenge of effectively integrating ESG considerations into employee engagement. Join our host and guest to hear more about managing social risks and achieving long-term value through ESG consulting.

Who is Therese?

Therese Baptiste is an ESG consultant who specializes in managing social risks and opportunities for her clients' products, processes, and services. She believes that a company's brand value heavily relies on its customer relationships and workforce, making it vital to manage social risks effectively. However, with no globally accepted benchmarks for social topics, it is hard to ensure consistency and comparability across ESG as a whole. Hence, companies face increasing pressure from stakeholders to display social responsibility by addressing issues related to human rights, labor practices, diversity and inclusion, community development, and customer privacy. As a consultant, Therese works with her clients to identify, prioritize, and manage social risk and opportunities aligned with their business objectives. She guides them by understanding their perspectives and developing strategies and programs to provide long-term value for multiple stakeholders, not just shareholders.

Key Takeaways

Topics covered in the episode:

- Overview of ESG consulting and social impact

- Lack of globally accepted standards and consensus across ESG

- Pressure on companies to demonstrate social responsibility

- Role of ESG consultants in identifying, prioritizing, and managing social risks and opportunities aligned with business objectives

- Challenges in ensuring social impact aligns with business objectives and provides long-term value for all stakeholders

- Specializing in a specific area of ESG consulting and the need for materiality assessments, targets and metrics, and data analytics

- Different skillsets required for analyzing the E and G aspects vs. social impact

- Importance of seeking guidance or checking progress

- The impact of UN Guiding Principles on Business and Human Rights

- Key areas for a company to examine, considering people, purpose, community, and supply chain

- Challenges in implementing ESG priorities, including lack of clarity, difficulty in measuring and reporting ESG performance, and limited resources

- Need for employee engagement and effective communication

- Importance of managing social risk and creating long-term value

- Failure to align social impact with business objectives and narrow, short-sighted views

- Insufficient data collection and analysis tools

Bullets under each topic have been provided in the main text.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

Connect with Therese - https://www.linkedin.com/in/therese-baptiste-cornelis/

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

https://youtube.com/live/6gP28ro_axA

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

Keywords

ESG consulting, social impact, brand value, customer relationships, workforce, global standards, social responsibility, social risks, reputational damage, legal issues, financial losses, stakeholders, business objectives, sustainability, UN courses, environment, governance, materiality assessments, data analytics, internal biases, graduate advice, GRI standards, labor practices, human rights, diversity and inclusion, community engagement, customer privacy, GDPR, pandemic, employee engagement, resistant to change, effective communication, social responsibility efforts, ESG consultants, social risk management, stakeholder engagement, data collection, analysis tools.

Therese Baptiste [00:00:21]:

Hello.

Stuart Webb [00:00:23]:

It's not rocket science questions over coffee. I cannot tell you how much I'm looking forward to today's conversation. Tariff is an ESG consultant. She has got a really interesting history. Really love her history of what she's been doing. But we're not going to sort of get her to give all of her history today, her career history. But she has had some really interesting roles in Path. But she's got a really great understanding of the sustainability aspects of ESG consulting. And I really am looking forward to her describing in more detail some of that sustainability. Therese, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us and taking your time today. I'm really looking forward to this conversation.

Therese Baptiste [00:01:13]:

Okay, thank you for having me.

Stuart Webb [00:01:16]:

And I hope you've got your coffee ready. I've got my favorite bear mug in front of me at the moment.

Therese Baptiste [00:01:22]:

Fresh brewed coffee served here, but it's cooked zero inside of it.

Stuart Webb [00:01:27]:

I love it. Listen, Deris, you help people with their ESG journey, particularly as we sort of talked about that sustainability. So who are the sort of businesses you're currently trying to help? And I know you've got some really interesting stories to tell you.

Therese Baptiste [00:01:42]:

Well, the thing is, for me, I really look at clients because, like I said, I do ESG consulting, but it's more of the S, the social impact. So I'm looking my clients are those who want to manage the social risk and opportunities of their product or their processes or services. And the value of most, if not all brands, I say, sits heavily in the S focused area, and that is customer relationships and your workforce. So it's easy to see how this can be getting the wrong side and can destroy a corporation's value. And what has happened is that there is yet no globally accepted. I know everyone knows about the Task Force for Climate Financial Disclosures, but there's none for social topics. And to add to this lack of comparability and consistency, the lack of the global consensus across ESG as a whole is causing a lot of problems. So what I find, companies are facing increasing pressure from stakeholders to demonstrate their social responsibility and to address issues related to what we say human rights to labor, to practices diversity and inclusion. Everyone is like, oh, we practice diversity. It's on everyone's front page of their website. To community development, truly recognizing your role in the community and customer privacy, because failure to manage these social risks effectively can lead to a reputational damage, legal and regulatory issues, and even financial losses. Okay, so again, my role would be to help my client identify, prioritize, and manage their social risk and opportunities. And there's a way I do it. And as a consultant, I will provide the guidance and the support necessary for them to achieve these goals by understanding their perspectives. So I go in, I speak to them, develop strategies and programs that align them with the company's overall business strategies. And therefore, the biggest challenge is to ensure that their social impact actually aligns with their business objectives and that they're able to manage their social risk and opportunities effectively to give long term value for all stakeholders, not just shareholders. Stakeholders?

Stuart Webb [00:03:52]:

Yes, stakeholders is important in that respect, isn't it? Because so often we focus on the shareholder aspect of things and forget that stakeholders involve the community, the employees, a group of people that are often neglected in many of these things.

Therese Baptiste [00:04:08]:

Yeah.

Stuart Webb [00:04:10]:

Tell me some of the mistakes that I know you have come across that people try to do in this journey that fail to really encounter and work through some of that impact that you've been talking about.

Therese Baptiste [00:04:28]:

Yeah. The thing is some people believe oh, I don't need an ESG consultant, I can do it myself. The mistakes are like one, focusing only on compliance so they only do what they have to do. Two, ignoring stakeholder perspectives. They don't care what the community says. Lack of integration with business strategy, insufficient data collection and analysis and failure to communicate effectively. If you wish, I can go more in detail or I can just stop there.

Stuart Webb [00:04:57]:

No, please give us a bit more detail because I think you've given us some really great ones there. I'm particularly concerned myself about the lack of integration with business strategy because I find so many of these there is a great deal to be said for integrating with your business strategy. And people will often just turn around and go, we've got to tick a box or let's just do something. And it's not integrated, it doesn't help to build the business. And then it does lead into a failure to communicate effectively. What can you give us in terms of pieces of advice around those subjects?

Therese Baptiste [00:05:34]:

Well, I'll start with the one you went with. So it's lack of integration with business strategy. What we see is that companies may view social responsibility as a separate and distinct aspect of their operations rather than an integral part of their business strategy and this can result in a failure to align social impact with business objectives and a missed opportunity to create that long term value. And I started off with focusing only on compliance. That was my first one, focusing only on compliance. Many companies, they make a mistake of focusing solely on compliance with regulations and laws related to social issues without considering the broader social impact of their operations. I mean, there are some laws that said no child labor involved and they said okay fine, no child labor. But then they go and they want to make their products in countries where child labor is the norm. So rather than saying okay fine, if we don't hire those children, someone else would and saying let's see how we can work with this law. No child labor. Really? What is the intent of that? The intent of it is really that we want children to be educated. And there are some companies who have managed to say, fine, I will hire your child. Your child can work for a maximum of 2 hours, but they must go through four or 5 hours of education per day and the company pays for it. So it's more like in the curriculum as such. Again, if you just go poopy on compliance, it can be a narrow, short sighted view, and it doesn't serve the purpose of helping the community. If we look at ignoring stakeholder perspectives, companies may fail to engage with key stakeholders such as their employees, their suppliers, their customers, and their communities to understand their perspectives and their concerns related to social issues. So they just go with what the law says they have to do. The law says, okay, fine, we must like, I saw like there were some people wanted to say, let's say 10% of your company must be diverse. If you just look at that, 10% must be diverse. Some people interpret it to be of a different race, but that is fantastic if that reflects your environment where you operate of having that percentage. Because I teased one person, I was talking to a company and they were like, yeah, that's a good thing to do. But then one person in that group was actually from a company based in Africa. So I said to him, so are you getting 10% of people there of North African descent? And he looked at me like, of course not. I said, but if you want to make this a global thing, it has to be that way. So again, we see. This can lead to a lack of understanding of the social risk and the, I say, opportunities that a company faces and the potential impact on its reputation and financial performance. Like, I tell people, yes, I understand we want to get gender inclusivity, but will I hire someone just because they're female? No, if they have the qualifications and stuff. So, I mean, don't just tick the box, really implement it. Then we talk about insufficient data collection and analysis and oh my God, we don't have the data, and we make all these assumptions. Companies may lack the necessary data collection and analysis tools which exist out there, but you have to look through to see which ones apply to you, which one are built. I always remember when I first started doing business process reengineering straight out of university back in 1994, and that was the big buzzword. And at that point they said that you need to have 99.9% no errors. And I went to a client and the client was, okay, we want to make sure that we have 99.9% no errors. And I was like, you do 100 transactions a day. In other words, you can't have any go wrong. That is what it means. You can't use that as your measuring tool. So this can lead to incomplete understanding of social risk and opportunities, making it difficult to develop strategies they must be logical and able to implement. If you come up with metrics and try to implement them without data that matches what your company does, you literally excuse the word screwing yourself out of the systems. Right?

Stuart Webb [00:09:52]:

I have to ask about data thing because I had a client once who told me that they were bringing some machine learning and they were going to use some data in order to improve their process. And I said, okay, so from where are you gathering this data? And they said, well, we're not gathering it yet, we're going to start gathering it. And I went, okay, when are you going to implement the machine learning having gathered the data? And they told me they were implementing machine learning at the same time. And I went, but that doesn't work because you won't have the data to train the model. And they went, oh, don't worry, we're going to make data up. And I looked and I thought, I worry about the fact that companies actually.

Therese Baptiste [00:10:27]:

Do think these are the thing is my problem. I come from a background of It. My first degree was mathematics and computer science. I only went on to do business studies because I couldn't speak business speak and the business people couldn't speak tech speak. So now I call myself a perfect bridge. So I can understand when the techs are trying to throw wool over your eyes and also to when the business people are asking for things that are impossible given the circumstances. And the last thing and that comes, it failure to communicate effectively. Companies fail to effectively communicate their social responsibility, efforts and impact to stakeholders. And if you don't tell people what you're doing, don't expect them to know, okay? They lead to a lack of trust and confidence in the company's commitment. It's not blowing your own horn, but recognize that I'm doing good, let them know what you're doing. Bad news travels faster. You got to keep ahead by telling them what you're doing good. So those are the kind of things I teach to companies. Keep it out there because again, when I was doing my Masters, I did technology. Yeah, why not, right? Because it was easy to continue onwards. But I took marketing and strategy as the three subjects I were looking at, simply because marketing, getting that brand, that communication out there is all strategy with technology. So I consider myself, oh yeah, I got the blend and that is what needs to go there. So you have to manage the social risk. If you want to manage it without the help of an experienced ESG consultant, you're going to end up with a piecemeal approach that fails to effectively address your company's social impact. It's crucial you seek guidance and support from experienced ESG consultant, not those who have done an ESG course. There's too many courses out there and I see people, I look in this and they say they've done a course and they're ESG consultant. They haven't even lived life yet, right? Stewart they barely have. Like you said, you can still see the baby eyes and everything, but no, they're the consultants. I've gone to meetings with other ESG consultants and then when I'm speaking, they look at me like I was like, We've lived it. Stuart like I said, as I go further, you will realize this is not something new. It's just keep new terminologies that come out, new buzzwords that come out. It's crucial companies seek the guidance of an experienced person to ensure they're managing their risk and opportunities effectively to create that long term value.

Stuart Webb [00:13:00]:

Because for me, one of the signs of a good consultant is not that they've done 15 implementations, but they've done twelve, and three have gone badly wrong. And they won't make those mistakes again because they don't want to live through that pain ever again. And I often say to people, when they sort of say, well, why should I hire you? And I said, I've made all the mistakes so you won't have to. And that's the secret of being a good consultant, is to turn around and be honest and say, I've made enough mistakes that I now know what not to do. And I'll make sure you don't actually make those mistakes because I don't want to have to live through that experience ever again. You were talking then about some great ways of helping people to understand sort of some of these things. And I know you've got a really valuable free piece of advice, which I'm just going to show at the bottom of the screen. So can you talk to us about this valuable piece of free advice that.

Therese Baptiste [00:13:54]:

You'Ve sort of yeah, because you were asking me in our little talk before about what valuable resource people can go to because not everyone, I agree, can afford to hire an ESG consultant. Do I have to admit to Raspberries.com I'm not that expensive compared to the others from the so called firms who really inflate their cost? Okay. One valuable free resource I can recommend to people looking to manage is the Global Reporting Initiative Standards. The link is there for you that Stuart has given you. It provides for you a framework for companies to report on their sustainability performance. It provides guidance on how to report on a range of social issues because you have to report on your labor practices, on your human rights. Yeah, your human rights. What are you doing to the people in your company, people around people around the world? Diversity and inclusion, community engagement, customer privacy, GDPR and data security. Okay. Because those are things you look at. Even as far as passwords. I mean, just today I got a message from someone showing me according to how many words and characters in my password, how long it will take a hacker to hack. Okay? So now I have realized I need to develop a 14 word password. 14 words. I used to have eight or 914 words password with numbers lowercase and so on, and then it will take them some years. Other than that, it was five minutes, so I thought I was good. But apparently now the hackers are getting better. So by following the Gir standards, companies can ensure they're collecting and reporting on relevant data and information related to their social impact. Okay? Because remember, we have a lot of stuff about the climate and I could go on Stewart about green washing, but that's not my area. Just like this green washing, there's a lot of social washing pretending to care for people. Okay? The GI standards are a valuable free resource because they're publicly available and can be used by any company regardless of size or industry. Okay? It's widely recognized if you use it, companies can improve their understanding on their social impact and skills, develop strategies and programs. It can help them create long term value. But like I said, it's always best still to get. You don't have to get an ESG consultant like myself to manage the entire project, but it's normally helps when you start in guidelines or to check in on what your people are doing. Is it on your right path because you don't want to wait till 2025 when everyone's supposed to be ready to realize, I did it on my own and I did it wrong. Like when you baked that cake that you never followed in directions for, but you saw it in a book and you figured everything was there, which never is, and your cake doesn't come out the way it's supposed to and you only find out when you serve it to the guest. You don't want to do that.

Stuart Webb [00:16:48]:

Yeah, they'll help you make sure you never make those mistakes again because nobody wants to live through those sort of mistakes, do they, Teresa? No. There must have been a concept that you came across which really fired you up towards sort of this passion you've got for the social impact that your enterprise can have. What is it? What do you recommend that we read or get into in order to be able to understand and get into the passion that you've got for the subject?

Therese Baptiste [00:17:21]:

Well, then we are going back to one of my positions. I held, not tooting my own horn. I was my country's UN ambassador based in Geneva, and I was on the UNHCR committee. And that was when I was first exposed to the UN guiding principles on business and human rights. And I was like, literally, I was a business lecturer at university and I had not been exposed to how in depth this was. People have sat down and developed this. There are set of international standards that provide guidance to companies on how to respect human rights in their operations and supply chains. Okay. The Guiding Principles establish responsibility of companies to respect human rights, the need for companies to conduct due diligence to identify and address human rights. This sounds familiar, right? This is all what ESG and all these things are saying. This existed before the importance of providing access to effective remedies for human rights violations. I mean, I was so much into it when I was recently lecturing at a local university based in Belgium. We had students in final year, and one of the topics I had my students research was human rights. And at the beginning, they were like, human rights business. And then they saw the major impact and they saw the linkages. They had never seen that document. And it was so great to see these students dwell into it and develop research looking at technology and human rights. And for a senior ESG consultant focused on the S in ESG, I would say the UN Guiding Principles provides a comprehensive, globally recognized framework. It incorporates if you look at the ESG consultants, we help clients develop and impact human rights policies. Right. We see right now there's a lot of confusion with is EU policies for human rights for ESG really focused on the correct thing, or is it what looks good for the finances and people don't realize? The UN Guiding Principles has been implemented and is the key thing for responsible business conduct. It has been used by OECD in guidelines for their multinational enterprises. It has been used by IOL for their triparty. Declaration of Principles Concerning Multinational Enterprises and Social Policy It has also been used ISO 26,000 for guidance and social responsibility. It has been a transformative concept in ESG. And that's why I go back to her to say in ESG, it's coming from there. Okay, so, yeah, I was a UN ambassador back in 2011, 2012. So it sounds over 1112 years ago, I've been in this sustainability thing. I even served as the vice president on the UN Forum of Sustainability Standards. I was like the only diplomat at that time because I was a diplomat. I had been a minister of health. Yeah. Another thing, a politician. I've been an academic, had been in business. So they wanted that kind of background to see because to give that Holistic approach. And it provides what we consider to be a framework for managing social risk and opportunities related helping establish global standards. Because as I said in the beginning, there's nothing out there ready. There's no agreed on global principles. We don't have someone like Bloomberg, who is the head of the Task Force for Climate Financial Disclosures pushing on the social impact. We need someone to take that mantle and push on it, someone high profile who people respect the social impact. Okay? And we see that what we call the UNGPs. The UN guiding principles has helped develop the S component.

Stuart Webb [00:21:01]:

Ask you the first question before I do, I'm just going to suggest I know there are a couple of people watching at the moment. I'm just going to ask, if people do have questions, please post them in the chat. And I can ask them. Theresa now, because she's got some really valuable experience and as you've heard, she has a sort of background of taking a lot of input from politics to social impact and working with the UN. And some of that might give you what might give you problems. I know that I wouldn't want to do half of those things, but it might provide a lot of opportunities for people to say so if there are questions. But whilst we're just doing that, I'm just going to pose the final question that I've got for you, Teresa.

Therese Baptiste [00:21:50]:

It's an easy one. It's going to be an easy one.

Stuart Webb [00:21:55]:

I always use this question in order to sort of not have to do too much work. So it's quite honest. I have been asking you some questions, you've been having to answer them, but there must be a question which I haven't answered, which you would like me to answer. So what would you like me to have said? What question would you like me to have asked you, which I haven't yet? And obviously you have to answer it.

Therese Baptiste [00:22:19]:

Thank you. I would say you should have asked, what are the key areas for a company to examine who's looking to consistently meet the requirements and expectations of their stakeholders? Now, I'm going to answer that. I have two questions, actually, but that's my first one. I would think they would have to look at people. Yeah, why not? We must. People can't do math, people purpose, community and supply chain. Those are the four key areas, I would say people, because the pandemic something like don't Ranch on the pandemic again, Ms Matisse, the pandemic has changed the way we work. And with more working from home, it has shone the light on people's. Wellbeing, it really has. Therefore, companies will need to communicate clearly what staff support is going to be available. And there's also a job to close the gap between those at the top of the workforce and the millennials. The millennials are willing to grasp, want to work in at home. We still have some of the older people that believe, if I don't see you, you're not working. And again, I was never that way. I mean, even when I worked at a bank, I always told people I worked at the bank and I had younger I shouldn't say younger, older people underneath me. Right. But they consider themselves younger. But my logic was I didn't check what time they came in or what time they left. I gave them an assignment. They could come in one day every week, but if that assignment was finished, good, because I don't believe in watching every hour, because some people work very good quickly and then need a time off, right? And the FRC Reporting Lab has released what they call useful guidelines on workforce reporting including the importance of workforce engagement. Okay? And engagement doesn't mean because they're working from home, having nonstop meetings online. That's not it. If we look again at purpose, I think it's businesses need to create value, okay? Don't assume you're creating value and address these issues. Investors, because ESG came about primarily to make people invest in your companies. Okay? Everybody knows it's money. Everything is not going to be done unless there's money to be seen in it. And investors want to see companies believe in something and more than ever link the purpose and trust is dominant. It's a key requirement and I think it's also in your UK corporate governance code, key to building trust. It is essential for companies to think about demonstrating how their purpose drives what they do and the impact they have. The third thing I said was community businesses should be able to demonstrate how they tend to support or add value. So you need to look at that and supply chain, consider your ecosystem. And again, I remind, I mean, most people here wouldn't know, but there are some people who think that ecosystem talks only about trees and the forest. Ecosystem is the area of the businesses operating. And we say of your business, who you are to be an employee versus a contractor. Who do you want as your employee? Which ones can you say? Okay, I don't need this person as an employee, I need them as freelance. I give them opportunities to have other projects because that is sometimes why in your supply chain you have to look at do I need someone nonstop or do I need someone for projects? Because there are people willing to a lot of people are realizing the value of being a freelancer, okay? It's given them that control over their lives. They all have an impact on your brand and reputation because again, if you take someone just as a contractor as opposed to an employee, you don't again have full control and again what they do can impact on you and we talk about all those issues. And your business only operates well if all parts are healthy. Okay? So that comes back to my Minister of Health part. Everything needs to be healthy working together. Nothing can be a silo on its own. Okay? And a question that would have opened up more. My 6th thing is what do I see as the biggest challenge for companies to effectively integrate ESG considerations and how can they overcome this?

Stuart Webb [00:26:33]:

Well, I've asked you that but I didn't want you to feel under any pressure, honestly.

Therese Baptiste [00:26:38]:

I know because again, when I thought about it, I said if I answer this, that might reduce the need for them to hire terrestrial.com, right? Should I put that question? Because then it will have all the ESG consultants about how we support companies in this process. But I'm going to be honest and I'll just give you the four things. The several practical challenges that companies face is lack of clarity and consensus on their ESG priorities. There's a lack of clarity and consensus. There is difficulty in measuring and reporting on ESG performance and again that is where I do advise you to bring in someone who can make that so much simpler for you. I always tell people stick to what you're good at okay? Too many people are just taking ESG reporting and saying hey that's your job and throwing people into the wind and then wondering why it's taking so long, why it's not getting done. Okay? Limited resources and capacity if you have limited resources and capacity in your company recognize that. Put those limited resources and capacity where it makes money for your company and hire another resource to deal with it. And I go back to for instance when I lived in Trinidad and my husband and I had our company called Cornells and Associates. I used to really find it. It was strategic but it was funny. At the same time we were being hired by a leading accounting company to run their website. We were being hired by them to develop a strategic plan for them. Meanwhile they were hiring their consultants out to people to develop website. And I said to the managing partner I said you know something you not hire me because I'm that better than your employees but you can get more money from sending them out than I would charge you. And he says you know and I said yeah because I work for you I know what rate you charge thing but I don't charge that to you. So they can get me for 50% of what they would charge. So they make a lot more money off of it. But then they know that is it limited resources. They need something done. They want an outside perspective someone with a clean with no bias in it. And that is a problem if you take too many internal people to do that reporting they may have an internal bias, they may have it and they don't see anything wrong with the way it is operating now. So it can easily fix the report to say all is okay but then when the audit comes you're going to be in problems when the audit comes because what is reported is not true. And again be careful of the internal silos and your resistance to change. As people we don't like change.

Stuart Webb [00:29:29]:

Owners directors who spend a lot of their time doing things actually they ought to get other people to do partly because it's more effective and they pull a bigger growth lever by getting on and doing something which produces better results. But also because their internal bias means that they make decisions based upon what their gut tells them and their gut is often. Very wrong. It doesn't involve the right data. They haven't collected the data. So they go on what they think is the right thing. And I see a lot of decisions being taken by people who don't have the data but have decided to. As I sort of said before, they guessed what they think it will be, and they end up making a lot of mistakes, largely because they haven't brought somebody in from the outside who's able to take a fresh view. And just look at it and go. But it's obvious because I can see things here that you can't see because you're inside looking out. And I've come in from the outside so often. We do need to have that perspective of somebody who can just take a fresh view. Theresa, I just want to ask one question. We've had one question from Mark Thomas. I think it's a really interesting one that I would love you to just give. And perhaps you need to link with Mark Thomas outside of this, but can you just give him two minutes? And I don't want to take up too much more of your valuable time, because I know you have actually got a lot of things you want to try and do today, but what advice do you have for a graduate who wants to get into this field? And I think encouraging young people into this field is absolutely critical to the future.

Therese Baptiste [00:30:56]:

Yeah. And the thing is, one of these main things is if you're going into the field of ESG consulting, then you really have an interest in sustainability. Okay? It's not just finance, it's sustainability. The UN has a lot of sustainability courses to give you that background, the connections of it, not just the financial part, depending on your angle, which one is more for you? Are you one for environment? Are you one for social impact? Or you want for governance? Because the problem is when people try to say, I'm an ESG consultant of all, okay, because that is where it's problematic. So I would say Mark Thomas, because if you go out and you have to help them conduct materiality assessments, okay, you have to help them set clear targets and metrics. You have to help them do data analytics. So if you will, I see you see background in financial computing will understand I wouldn't see you doing more the social impact, but you can analyze it and do the comparison, but I definitely see you more in looking at the E and the G would be for somebody in finance. So, again, understanding sustainability and what it means, it doesn't just mean, okay, I don't use disposable, I don't do this. It's really understanding how these things interact, realizing that there is no perfect utopia that we want to create. If we create this perfect utopia, we are creating it for a few people because you can't get rid of everybody goes electric cars and stuff like that. So you're going in there with an understanding that you can't fix their problems, but you can help them understand their problems. And that is what a graduate needs to do. Okay, brilliant.

Stuart Webb [00:32:48]:

Theresa, you broke up a little bit on that question, but I think we absolutely got the spirit of it. And if people want to sort of get a message to you afterwards, I'd encourage you to please post them into this post on LinkedIn YouTube. We will get them to Theresa. She's just fond of knowledge and so much enthusiasm. Theresa, I want to thank you so much for this time you've spent with us. It's been brilliant. I really, really have enjoyed it. I hope everybody watching has enjoyed it. I'm just going to leave you with the one final link on this, which is if you want to get onto the newsletter list so that you get notification of this thing coming up. Coming up in the next few weeks. I would encourage you to just go onto this link, which is link thecompletroach Co UK newsletter that's link thecompleetproach Co UK newsletter that will get you onto our newsletter list. We send out a newsletter which basically says who's coming onto the podcast so you can join our questions, get them answered by people like theres Mark Thomas. I hope that's been useful to you. When you get advice from somebody as knowledgeable and ingrained in this and is so much of an expert, you can't get better advice. Theresa, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. Really appreciate it. My pleasure, everybody. I just really appreciate the amount of time that we've had Therese on today. I hope you have, too. Thank you.

Therese Baptiste [00:34:17]:

Thank you.

Stuart Webb [00:34:19]:

And we'll just make sure everything works on the podcast before it all goes horribly wrong on me.

Who is Sorin?

Sorin is CEO of SantinelaSantinela is an integrated Management Environment for production facilities, unlocking their full potential. It covers diverse functionalities specific to the management of production facilities, as a transversal platform designed by the workforce for the workforce.

Key Takeaways

How to help manufacturers improve their digitalization. 1:45

The right process isn’t it. 4:41

Advice on how to improve your processes. 8:06

Understanding the interconnectivity of processes and implementation. 11:53

The importance of diversity in process improvement. 14:52

Bringing people from the shop floor into the planning process. 19:30

Valuable Free Resource or Action

Find out more about Santinela at www.Santinela.com

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

digitalization, processes, process improvement, factory, understand, people, organisation, important, problems, therese, roadmap, question, point, big, shop floor, continuous improvement, company, spending, talk, website

SPEAKERS

Sorin Petcu, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb

Hi and welcome back to it's not rocket science five questions over coffee. I'm here today with Simon Pesci. Sarin is the CEO of Centinela. They're a agency which is dedicated to making the manufacturing of efficiency greater and improving it through process improvement and using digitalization to do that. So I'm really excited about this, because this is something I've done in my past. So I'm really excited to welcome Soren today to the to the podcast, and sorry, welcome to It's not rocket science five questions over the coffee, which I have in front of me, I know you've got one as well. Excellent, excellent news. Well, I'm sorry,

Sorin Petcu

you're enjoying a lot of stuff from my cup of tea, coffee, whatever.

Stuart Webb

Yeah, whatever it takes to get through. Sorry, tell us a little bit about the sort of the customers you're trying to help with these with this great way of trying to digitalize some of the some of the work that's going on today and in process improvement.

Sorin Petcu

So first of all, Stuart, thank you very much for having me. On today. So since 2003, I've been passionate about helping manufacturers to improve their manufacturing waste, let's put it like this. And after maybe 2005 2006, I started to see that there are lots of possibilities for digitalization in companies, and especially in the manufacturing businesses. And I've been working for different companies in food and beverage, so we are more specialised in food and beverage. And in 2016, I started to do consulting work. And I found out that food and beverage companies they were far behind, and they're still far behind in comparison to other to other industries, in terms of digitalization, digitalization is a very, very big word I would say. And what is happening is that manufacturers have some challenges, and they try to understand them. But to put in a very simple way, if you have a factory, a factory is like a black box, right. And if you look in, in the box, if you if you look at the box, you have inputs and your outputs. And in the box, if you don't understand it, as I was saying is a black box, you need to do something to be as efficient as possible to get those outputs the best way possible at the right time, the right quality, the right quality, you know the right quantity and stuff based on the inputs you get. So the challenges that they have, especially in this difficult and changing times is, I believe, to understand what they need to do to have the right digitalization. So how do you get from a process that is pen and paper in many, many factories and what we really want to do at something nela we really want to help manufacturers no matter the size, so there are small, medium or big. So the point is, how do you help them understand or generally they have a big problem to you know, to not look at the holes in front of the bike, but to look in the long term because they don't have time there are firefighting many times. And to think about how to optimise the processes, they have and digitalize them. This I believe are big challenges that they face in digitalization. Besides all the other challenges they have to face you know, with the inflation with Labour with whatever. So if we talk about digitalization, is about how you get the right processes, the right processes, not the wrong processes, digitalized and reliable Yeah,

Stuart Webb

and that's the key isn't it? Sorry. And because I remember back in when I was one of the first companies I started was was was working with workflow technologies and we've talked about getting the right work to the right person at the right time. So so the problem that that many factories face. Is that right process, isn't it, which is the right process because you can pull a lever to digitalize a process which does not affect the if the efficiency of the factory does it you can, you can you can spend a lot of time and effort processing and working on a process which actually doesn't have as big an impact as you expect it to. So it is that right process, isn't it? And some, I would guess, of your customers have spent a lot of time trying to digitalize a process and then discovered it didn't have the effectiveness that they expected it to have.

Sorin Petcu

Yeah, so the most interesting case I've I've seen many times in factories is that they tried to digitalize to digitise processes that are not, as you're saying that are not necessarily that important to the business. But most of all, they don't have the right processes in place, like the daily management system in a factory is critical. I call it the backbone of the factory. If if you don't have the right process in the in the shift, you know, the shifts, eight hour shifts, if you don't have the right meetings in the morning, if you don't talk about the right things in the morning, you know, the KPIs the actions from the day before the day the priorities of the day if you don't have the right processes and continuous improvement, right. What do you digitise you digitise some firefighting system, that will never give you the right results? So this is, I believe, the best example I have, and I've seen it in multiple multiple factories. So we go there to some basics of of management processes, let's put it like this.

Stuart Webb

Yeah, yeah. And it is that problem of, of knowing, which is the right lever to pull, isn't it the growth lever, the big lever that you pull, which is the greatest growth lever for any, for any factory to improve its efficiency.

Sorin Petcu

From from our experience is that, you know, factories have systems like ERP warehouse management, quality system that they need for the for the whole, for their survival, and from a legal standpoint, and then they have the assets, right, they have the lines, and those lines have to produce in a reliable way. They also have the teams of course, that need to be trained, they need to know what they're doing, they need to have reliable processes, standardised work and stuff like this. So, in our experience, the biggest lever to improve efficiency and effectiveness, let's put it like this and productivity in a factory is by making sure that the lines and the assets run properly, and they produce the right quality product at the right time. And there you start with the holes with a whole package of methodologies for continuous improvement that you can of course apply and afterward digitise, right. But the biggest one I would say is the is the way the lines run the OEE, as general people call it, you know, but generally people call it

Stuart Webb

so and I'm just gonna show on the screen now the your the link to your your company, LinkedIn profile. Now, there's some interesting stuff going on there. And then your website, or other any free piece of advice you have on the website that you can help people to understand exactly how they can make use of this obvious thinking, in order to get them to sort of understand that the way they should start to, to attack and to to approach these problems.

Sorin Petcu

Yeah, well, we don't necessarily have these things on the website. But together with Leila, that was your that you invited last week, we were trying to make these messages come across to as many people as possible in the near future. But I would say if you want to improve your processes and digitise your processes, that's something along the way we think is the following. So first of all, don't think short term. So short term is you can cherry pick, but you won't see the whole stuff, you won't have the time to do a holistic approach. What is really important is to understand your problems, map your processes, understand your problems, create a roadmap, this is really important. There are some companies that you know, there are a pen and paper and they have some processes that sometimes are not the best one so they can be improved. And they're already thinking about deep learning AI but without necessarily understanding the full extent of all this. So Yeah, the way we think is, you know, you depending on the maturity, you must learn how to walk, then you must learn how to run, right. So understand your processes, understand and build your roadmap, talk to the people in their own your company, and the especially the ones that are impacted by the change, because fear of change and not not understanding the change can be a very big roadblock. And sometimes, you know, without any sustainable proof, so he's just about the feeling of people, right how they see the change. So afterwards, make sure that the roadmap is made in a pragmatic way, because your resources are limited, right? And take a look at what you were saying before about the things that mostly impact your business. But without you can cherry pick, but you can cherry pick from the roadmap, you don't cherry pick just to cherry pick, right? So and make sure that you plan the improvements, and that you have some way to track the success. And once you understand your needs, and you create your roadmap, only then you look for the suppliers that might help you. And one more thing, the suppliers, I would say that there's really two things very important about the suppliers, the hidden costs, sometimes are there. And the second one is get the supplier that can also help you not only from if we talk about digitalization, don't take a supplier that can only help you from an IP perspective. But also from a methodological aspect. It's good

Stuart Webb

point, I'm just going to show one point that somebody has pointed out on LinkedIn, which is a great point about changing the roadmap taking from your roadmap, which is thing. But there's a great comment that's coming in from Therese Batista, which is unless you understand the interconnectivity of the various processes, and proper implementation of change management, any change can lead to chaos. And as a really good point, because I do remember in one particular project in which I was involved in one company that I was involved with, for a while, the management decided to apply some some really interesting technology to one process. And all they did was made rubbish, effectively move, not rubbish knowledge move through the organisation much faster. I mean, I did say to them, I said, Look, I hate to tell you this, guys, I'm going to use a bad word, you just made the ship flow faster, rather than actually, rather than it clearing out what you should have done and actually get the right that these people had just just picked the wrong interconnectivity on various processes. And what they'd ended up with was a bigger mess that was now just flowing much quicker through the organisation. So it's really important. And Theresa makes a FIPS is picking suppliers to look at their understanding of compliance with ESG. That's really, really key, isn't it?

Sorin Petcu

Absolutely. Absolutely. And I, again, talking about talking about things that that you have witnessed, I've also witnessed to SAP implementation some time ago, a long time ago. And I heard there was a consultant that was saying crap in crap out sorry for my word, right? So whatever you make sure you put the right data in there and without affecting the people that input the data, and also thinking about what's in it, about what they think you know, what's in it for me, because if you just asked me to put some numbers in, then it doesn't have my work. It doesn't help the digitalization process in any way.

Stuart Webb

Sorry, news, there have been a particular book or something which has affected your thinking that you you'd like to share with with the people that are we're talking to at the moment, that would help them to understand some of some of what you're saying.

Sorin Petcu

Yeah. So first of all, I would say that in order to have good digitalization processes, you must understand the continuous improvement process. If the organisations that, listen to us today, have the possibility to take to take a step back from the daily business, you know, and think a little bit about the continuous improvement roadmap that they'd like to implement. I think that some very good books would be TPM for process industries, which is, which is like, that was one of the first books I've ever read about, you know about TPM. It's really great. Then you have the Toyota way, which is also really good and it gives you but At one point here, it for both books. We are Europeans or from the US or certain things do not necessarily apply, as well as they would apply in Japan, for example, because we're not that. How do you say? Yeah, let's say that we have another way of thinking, right?

Stuart Webb

The culture is different, isn't it? There's no point in pretending that you're right the process improvement is culturally dependent. You cannot employ process improvement in a culture, which is determined not to necessarily think in a particular way, Ken Yeah,

Sorin Petcu

exactly. But these two books they can give you hints about the steps to take. And you have to adapt them to the culture and to the into the company you're in. Right. So but these are two books that are really great. And the third one I've just started was white digital transformation fails. by Tony Sultana, I just have it in a document here. They this guy, I've just started it. So he's from Procter and Gamble, and Procter and Gamble, they are really well known in the industry for having some very good processes. So and I think that they've made it and they are making it the right way. Yeah. So I think that we can learn some things from their

Stuart Webb

Sinem. I'm gonna throw in a question which is coming from the audience. So we can have a debate around this. But it's a question about how would you engage colleagues on equality, diversity, inclusion and belonging? What what do you think are important considerations for organisations to take into account to enable things like equality and diversity to get embedded during the sort of process improvement activities that you're, you're talking to your customers about? Wow, that's a long question. It's a it is a long, and we could talk for many hours about it. So let's,

everybody by having a long debate, but I mean, the importance of diversity and equality are quite important in process improvement, because a lot of what you're doing at the moment can seem to disadvantaged people unless it's brought in so that people understand the change and understand how their part within it isn't. And bringing people along is a really important part of process improvement activities.

Sorin Petcu

So all my life I've so one of my first one of my first credos, let's say in life is that I want to help people money comes, money comes if people are happy at the workplace, if they come to work, you know, liking the fact that they come to work that day. So, and in manufacturing, the manufacturing industry, the operator the technicians, the people on the shop floor, they are the ones that are really making the production happen, management is a supporting function. So, we do believe well, me and my colleagues, we do believe that equality and listening to people on the shop floor and making their lives easier and having good teams you know, that are motivated and happy to come to work. These are key to any digitalization and to any process improvement. Digitalization if it comes top down without explaining anything to the to the organisation will fail in probably more than 80 to 90% of the cases. So, diversity, inclusion belonging are really really important in all of this, but how do you engage? I would say I don't know if we can engage at the global level ourselves, but each organisation or small medium or big company, they should engage their colleagues you know, so, they should think that and operate operator is equal to a manager, you know, and their needs are equal. And moreover, a production line cannot run for the moment cannot run without an operator but it can run without the manager.

Stuart Webb

Yeah, I have been involved in a number of change initiatives within organisations and the one thing that I nearly always advocate for where I where I where I can, I can help management to understand is to have people from the shop floor be involved in the planning process, because it's those people on the shop floor who have most understanding of where the changes will in fact impact on people. And, and I think that without bringing those people into the planning process and actually making the part of the team, you are going to be pushing against the forces, which actually, you can't understand from the boardroom, you don't understand. And actually having that person sort of tell you about where the real problems are, will enable you to make the the digital change so much easier, because you will actually be helping those people to make their lives easier and happier. And, and and, you know, sometimes that is about inclusion, sometimes it's about, it's about belonging. And I know that Theresa just made a great point that they have not given consideration to employ people with more skills. And and that's something that is part of this process as well, isn't it? It's bringing those people back into those skilled those skill areas.

Sorin Petcu

Great points you both made, either in writing or verbally, I would like to add something here. So first of all, what is happening is that, you know, that you have I've seen over over time, two types of management in factories, yeah, top down. So basically, most of the decisions are taken at the top level of the factory, and the operators on the first line managers don't necessarily have any influence over the decision. But this is the not this is not the right or let's say the most successful, the most successful and the most inviting way of working. So in what we do at Santa nella, we try to invert this pyramid where operators team leaders, first line managers take most of the decisions. And we have, I have a great example from our of our customers that has implemented a ticketing module that we have with like, with a chat inside and people can work together. And just imagine that in over three is operators, with technicians, with team leaders with technical team leaders, they have worked on more than 100,000 tickets in a 150 person plant. Okay. So this is an extraordinary involvement of people in solving problems and the data, the the solutions, the problems, operators, know them, technicians know them. And most of the time, they also have the right solutions for the problems. Instead of getting an engineer like myself going there and creating, like the friends, they lose the night guys. So a guest station, right to solve a small problem. So these guys have a lot of experience, we should listen to them, and make sure that their lives and their opinions are respected.

Stuart Webb

Great point. Listen, sorry, we could talk all afternoon about this. And I'm very conscious of keeping you away from doing something which I'm sure is really important in your business at the moment. So I'll bring it to an end. By asking you if there is a question that I hadn't yet asked you. Well, what would you have liked me to have asked you? And then obviously, you need to give us the answer to the question that you would have liked me to have asked you?

Sorin Petcu

Well, I would I would say that something really important to ask, but not necessarily myself, but maybe the manufacturers, I would have a question for the manufacturers, you know, in these in these really challenging times I was talking about the inputs, the inputs are getting more expensive, you don't find them at cetera, et cetera, right. So these are things that you can control up to a point. But every manufacturer is taken into account, the way that continuous improvement implemented a good continuous improvement programme, you know, what Lean Manufacturing, TPM, whatever, plus the digitalization, what implementing these things would bring to them in terms of resilience and come competitivity let's put like this. And this, I think that this is a question. Not that you haven't asked me, but I think that it's a pretty important question too, for manufacturers to think about maybe at the end of our session. So how have they thought about continuous improvement and digitalization? Have they taken these into account to help them get more competitivity and productivity

Stuart Webb

Brilliant Sauron. Thank you so much. You know, I gotta I gotta finish by by thanking you for your time. Just to show one more comment from Therese, we what we're trying to do with this, in case you haven't guessed, guys, we're trying to remove the silos to give more exchange of information. Because for me, you know, removing silos in businesses is gonna lead to greater and I'm somebody who spends a lot of my time thinking about innovation. And one of the things that I find that too many companies think is that innovation is somehow just happens. Innovation doesn't just happen. Innovation happens to come from having conversations like this, potentially with sort of, you know, different viewpoints. And that brings together new ways of doing things. So I just love having people like sarin, come on and talk and give us their insights into things. Sorry. And thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us for talking about what you do at Santa nella, I would encourage you all to get onto the Santa nella website, which is here at Santa nella.com. And if you can't get on Santa nola.com, because your LinkedIn person, then get back to the LinkedIn website, which is Santa Ana, oh II on LinkedIn. And I really appreciate you, you coming on and spending a bit of time with us today. Sorry, if you're one of the people who comes on and listens to these things, please join our newsletter, where I send out an email which basically says who is going to be coming on, you can get details of that at HTTPS forward slash forward slash link the complete approach.co.uk newsletters, so that's link dot the complete approach.co.uk forward slash newsletter, go onto that website. And just subscribe to the newsletter. And you will get the notification coming and spending some time like people like Therese has done today. And being able to ask questions of our guests like sarin and future guests. Sorry, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us really appreciate your insight. Love the

Sorin Petcu

pleasure, real pleasure to be with you. Thank you very much for the invitation. No

Stuart Webb

problem. We could talk all afternoon and my coffee would go cold and I don't you need to get back to your job. Thank you so much for joining. Appreciate it.

Sorin Petcu

Have a great Day. Bye bye bye bye

Who is Daniel?

Daniel Gbujie is a passionate advocate for sustainability and global cooperation. His experiences have inspired him to work towards creating a more sustainable and inclusive world. Through his work, he hopes to inspire young people to follow in the footsteps of those who have come before and make a positive impact.

Key Takeaways

00:00 Born in West Africa, evolved, overcame challenges.

05:18 Young Africans advocate for sustainable development globally.

06:51 Highlighting sustainability, leadership, and forward-thinking mindset.

11:52 Forming team Hakuna Matata to drive change.

16:36 Biosphere's balance, sustainability, and diversity importance.

18:07 Sustainability principles for inclusive and lasting systems.

21:39 Networking, expertise, and sustainability showcased through app.

26:37 Promoting sustainability through app and solar box.

29:29 Development requires inspiration, willpower and community.

32:26 Sustainability and resilience are crucial for culture.

36:13 Commitment to sustainability; grateful for support. Future involvement.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

Follow Daniel on https://www.linkedin.com/in/chidubem-gbujie-961aa6130/

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

ESG consulting, social impact, brand value, customer relationships, workforce, global standards, social responsibility, social risks, reputational damage, legal issues, financial losses, stakeholders, business objectives, sustainability, UN courses, environment, governance, materiality assessments, data analytics, internal biases, graduate advice, GRI standards, labor practices, human rights, diversity and inclusion, community engagement, customer privacy, GDPR, pandemic, employee engagement, resistant to change, effective communication, social responsibility efforts, ESG consultants, social risk management, stakeholder engagement, data collection, analysis tools.

SPEAKERS

Daniel Gbujie, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:18]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science, 5 questions over coffee. I'm Stuart the Webb, the host of this thing, and I'm joined today by, a guest I'm truly honored to be, to be on the podcast with me. This is doctor Daniel Bougie. Doctor Daniel Bougie is a, is is a public health, expert, but has recently taken part in the 200 the Webb Sustainability World Cup. And I'm proud to be able to say, as a judge of that particular competition, he was voted and his team won, but he was voted the most impressive and valuable team leader of that competition. So, doctor Buge, thank you so much for spending a few minutes here with us today. I'm really honored that you've taken some time out of what I know is a very busy day for you to come and spend a few minutes with us. But please, just spend a few minutes.

Stuart Webb [00:01:22]:

Please introduce what it is you do because you have got a really very impressive CV.

Daniel Gbujie [00:01:30]:

Yes. Thank you very much, sir. And first of all, since after the completion, I've not had time to thank you. On behalf of the team, I wanna thank you for, you know, your imputes and your ability to crystallize why we should be sustainable on a global level, on a local level, on a subnational level. The game indeed has inspired us, and the game has been able to identify the uniqueness in all the regions as you know. And of of course, the game has also been able to inspire us young people knowing that the ones that have gone before us are really smart people. Yeah. So I am Daniel Buje Chidoben.

Daniel Gbujie [00:02:13]:

I was born in, in West Africa, Nigeria to be precise, in the southern part of of the country. And I am, a human being that has evolved over time. I say that with all honesty because if you don't evolve in light of the realities of the changing time, you will just become extinct just like the dinosaurs who felt who felt that they were the tallest, the most massive, amount of, species in the world, when others were running for for shelter and hiding on caves and evolving in the kinds of meals they can do and inventing, they felt they could muscle weight. And then where are they now? They are fossils. So the lesson is, I'm a child or an African child who has seen it all in the continent, who understand what it means to be poor, who understand what it feels like to see people being poor, who also knows that there's a better world for everyone if people tap into the better versions of themselves. I do have a health background, and that also helped me be able to articulate, you know, what I really want in life and how I could move forward. But, things got better for me when I got the opportunity to come to the United States on scholarship. I actually did come with the climate change background, the fellowship in climate change, and that really helped me.

Daniel Gbujie [00:03:50]:

The former vice president, his excellency, Al Gore, runs an environmental based program. Al Gore was once the vice president here in the United States. He he runs, an environmental based stuff. He was looking to expand, you know, and then he brought a lot of Africans, Asians to come to the US, you know, to come and learn more about the changing times. That also influenced me because at that time also, I was with the World Medical Association as a resident doctor then. There's a there's a junior doctor network within the World Medical Association, and they were looking into the environmental impact of health, you know, and I felt, wow, that will be nice. So about that same time, I got the opportunity to come to Colorado for some training, and boy was I introduced to sustainable development goals, climate questions, sustainable energy, renewable energy, clean energy, you know, all those beautiful terms, you know. And that really inspired me to know that, woah, there's a lot Africans need to do rather than just keep numb or keep paralyzed in the past while others evolve, you know, digitally, others use technology, others look for new ways to reinvent humanity.

Daniel Gbujie [00:05:18]:

We cannot keep being where we are, doing the same kind of things that have not changed anything. So I and many of the young Africans felt it would be wise to, you know, evolve and begin, you know, to to bring in this best sciences, evidence based sciences on how our environment, the policy we have, the way we do business, the way we articulate our views, the way we tell other members of the world, you know, the western world that we are an asset to be harnessed. But how do you know you're an asset to be harnessed if you don't know what it means to be harnessed? So, so over the years, I've evolved, like I said, but I'm proudly an African who understand where we should be and working with over Africans to bring about a better world for everyone Webb we all can see ourselves as, as brothers and sisters and as instruments of change for a better world. And that's the principle of sustainability. It's not about you. It's all also about those that are yet to come. However, the current people need to exist in time and space. Right? Why we do that? We do it in such a way that we do not disadvantage or we do not prevent those ones coming not to feel empowered, not to feel blessed with the natural resources that we have.

Daniel Gbujie [00:06:46]:

So so that's a little about, about about me. And,

Stuart Webb [00:06:51]:

That is that is if there is nothing else that you say today, Daniel, that shows well, 2 things. 1 of which is, you have a very, very impressive CV. You have got those honors that you've been brought in order to be able to bring that sustainability. From what you're learning back to where you went so that you can actually implement some of what you've learned, and we'll get on to how you're doing that. But also, Webb we I think we did at 1 stage on the sustainability world cup to talk about If there was 1 thing that we could teach everybody about sustainability, it would be to think not in quarters, not in years, but in decades because sustainability needs to needs to be thinking about not not not our children, but our children's children and the world we lead for the future because it is only by thinking in decades that we can actually start to see the sort of, the sort of effects Stuart we want. And I must admit, we we can get quite we can get quite distraught by some of what we see around us, but we have to realize that only a decade ago, this wasn't even a movement, and now it is embedded and people are Webb, and it is going to be different in another 10 years. So we need leaders like you in order to take people into that that new, that new thinking. So so that was a little bit about you and how you, you you you have become the person you are.

Stuart Webb [00:08:23]:

But how did you get involved in the Sustainability World Cup? What was it about it that you, that you that you that interested you, and how did you get involved? And and tell us a little bit more about the team that you're involved with.

Daniel Gbujie [00:08:35]:

Yes. Thank you. So I I feel it's just coincidence, and and I totally agree with your viewpoint that you must always be thinking futuristic, you must also be thinking of the actions you take now and how it has rippling effect in the future. And that's what really happened to me. So I did set up a nonprofit based organization here in the United States. Shortly after my training in Colorado at the Climate Reality Project, I, got to meet, a wonderful American lady. Her name is Renon Garriga, you know, and, we both got involved in the training, and we became mutual friends. And, over the years, we we we lost contact at some point.

Daniel Gbujie [00:09:23]:

But when she came back online, she saw that I had built a network of people across over a 100 questions, and I was really going into environmental climate actions, creating content, creating ideas, domesticating the knowledge of sustainability that involves vulnerable people, involves a better natural way we handle our natural resources to the benefit of people without creating poison, emissions, without, creating, distorting ecosystems. She liked the way that I was explaining, you know, the science behind climate change, the need for us to evolve, the need for us to be more smarter in our agricultural practice, cutting down trees indiscriminately to build shopping mall only for you to have flooding that kills thousands of people in less than 5 year. Doesn't make sense. So so so she loved all those concept. But somehow Webb lost contact. And then around March ending, you know, she reached out to me. Oh my goodness. You're doing a wonderful job.

Daniel Gbujie [00:10:27]:

I said, woah. Long time. What's going on? She says, there's this sustainability World Cup, and I know you are into sustainability development goals. They're all the same. It's just a process. It will be nice for you, you know, to gather your teams in team 54 project, you know, maybe 2 teams of 5 people, and let's see whether you can be in the final. I said, wow. That that would be nice.

Daniel Gbujie [00:10:51]:

I did not have any intention of joining. Mine was to push my team, push the movement, and bring them on board. And then somehow it now became a fact that we needed an African team, you know, and, I knew fully well that if the game is gonna be a simulation or an Internet based platform, it's gonna be hard because about the week, a week before the competition started, an undersea cable that runs through, West Africa got damaged. It had affected, you know, much of West Africa and some parts of the Central Africa. You could imagine. So already before now, the Internet penetrance was very poor. Now you now have a cable damage, so it's it only means it's gonna get worse. So I had to intervene, and and what what we did was we needed to now find, like, a team of people, you know, that has administrative background, marketing background.

Daniel Gbujie [00:11:52]:

I have a health background and a bit of sustainable development goal background. Having worked with the UN for some time, you know, and, I just decided that it would be nice to keep it within our team, you know, and, with her help and help of the organizers, we're able to form team Hakuna Matata. That's our AKA, you know, but we're team ambassador team. So it's, it's, it's providence, it's, hard work over the years, it's maintaining a steady relationship, it's also reaching out to my brothers within the continent and telling them that we cannot continue to remain where we are. If there's any opportunity to show the world how we think and articulate processes, It only adds value, you know, to the system. The world needs value, not not just the product, but a value based product. And the only way we can add value is to be part of the process, create, over own niche for ourselves, and get all these best sciences and domesticate it in the peculiarity of our region, in our social economic realities, so that our people know that we cannot remain where we are, and we cannot keep doing the same thing over and over again that has not given us a positive outcome, believing it will do the same thing. That's insanity.

Daniel Gbujie [00:13:25]:

So so the the the the opportunity that the sustainability woke up, you know, the little that I knew then created was something that I always five. I love a new challenge. I love innovation because I know innovation brings improvement. Improvement brings knowledge. Knowledge adds to culture change, the mentality, the mindset. So being a driven person, being a tech person, being someone who wants to showcase the continent as people that truly articulates knowledge, you know, I felt it was just, right to to, you know, represent the continent, and the game indeed created that platform well. You alongside the 8 judges and the organizers, professor Lila and Edmund, you know, created a wonderful game that is life changing. In short, I think it's the best content that we can ever have, you know, different from the kinds of game we always know, you know, the violent, the shooting, the slaying, and all this.

Daniel Gbujie [00:14:28]:

This is the content that can get you thinking. This is a content that does not create a monopolistic Stuart. No disrespect to monopoly, but the idea is that the sustainability principles are all immersed in this game. It's a tool that helps you think out of the box and helps you relay the concept of sustainability in a way that you have fun, build teamwork, you know, brainstorm with others, see the way people articulate thoughts, and then you know how to create the messaging. So so our our fusion in the game was just years of experience, years of building healthy relationship with environmental based people, and they're reaching out to us and say you're doing a good job. You can take this to another level, create content for the platform, inspire a new generation of people to better see what sustainability is from a gaming kind of point. So it was a match made in heaven, so to say.

Stuart Webb [00:15:29]:

So tell me, Daniel, what what advice would you give people? I'm going to just put the the the link now on the screen to show people where they can go and get some more information about what the Sustainability World Cup is. I mean, but what what advice would you have for people who might want to enter, next year and compete in the way that you have to and and achieve the sort of results, the sort of knowledge, the experience that you've got from, from entering for this year?

Daniel Gbujie [00:15:53]:

Yeah. So for for those wanting to enter for next year, I would just say have an open mind. You know? 1st, ask yourself, the world in which we're living in, are you very comfortable with the way things are going? Whether it's governance, whether it's your future, whether it's the future of the kids, is there a tool or an alternative way to press the reset button and start to have the mindset that respects the environment, respects people, and can still help you make your livelihood. You understand? In such a way that you are not a threat to not just yourself humans because humans think they're the only ones on the planet. No. No. No. No.

Daniel Gbujie [00:16:36]:

There are other non living things and living things that do not speak like us or go to school. But they are very important in creating the balance that we need. So there are lower animals, there are birds, there are animals, there are insects, There are bacterias. All of all these are part of the balancing act within a biosphere. So if you feel very passionate about being an agent of change and creating stability, sustainable development World Cup platform is a wonderful way to do that with a team, to do that, you know, enjoying yourself, you know, building that leadership trait, seeing how people articulate thoughts, listening to the judges, how they crystallize their opinions, you know, how they tell you that sustainability has many terms. Sustainability is a kind of improvement. Sustainability is a kind of social vehicle that creates change that we badly need in light of, you know, the growing, emission, in light of the the pollution, in light of the flooding, in light of climate crisis, if there's any way that we need to change our ways, we need to change the ways from where our pockets are. You know? Once we're able to control where we spend our money, we'll be able to be able to create a better definition of what wealth should be, a better definition that includes everyone, inclusivity, diversity.

Daniel Gbujie [00:18:07]:

These are terms that look so big, but these are the principles that sustainability, you know, drives on, that you cannot leave anyone behind. Anytime you develop or do anything, whether you you create a new financial market system, a new health system, a new educational system, a new fashion system that does not include the people, that does not include respect for the environment. Any system you build with no respect for the environment, for the people, for inclusion. It's not gonna be sustainable. It will not stand the taste of time. And when chaos begins to come, you will just fall like a pack of cat. However, if you absorb the sustainability principle that says that you can exist in time and space and create hope for the people coming and empower them as quick as possible, If you factor in environmental factors, you factor in social factors, you ensure that there are policies that protect our natural resources. You ensure that the decisions you make are all in the interest of the common good, not just America, UK, Europe, but also Africans.

Daniel Gbujie [00:19:20]:

Yes. These are some of the things that the game brings to you. And the game has its own calculations. The game teaches you how to really apply, you know, this is a financial game. So the corporate sustainability definition, how it connects with your everyday life, how you see the indices and the components that helps you grow and develop, you know, business and even your individual life. So I will encourage you five an open mind, be willing to learn, and then listen to the instructors, listen to what they say, follow those terms, ESG, environment, social, governance, framework, or indices. What it means is the corporate way that investors use to assess companies now to know whether they are viable for investment. You know, if you want to develop anything, your Stuart up ideas, if it doesn't have the elements of respecting natural resources, including people, targeting vulnerable community, meeting the needs of people, protecting environment.

Daniel Gbujie [00:20:27]:

It's not gonna stand the taste of time. It will just come and go.

Stuart Webb [00:20:31]:

Daniel, I mean, I think if anybody has any questions about why you were the, the the the the leader and voted the most, the the the best leader in this Sustainability World Cup. They've got a very good idea from what you've just said, how well you and you embrace Stuart, what you what you've what what you've learned from it. But what are you doing with your knowledge now? What are you doing in order to take this to the next level? How are you using those experiences? You've spoken a little bit about the nonprofit, but what are you now doing with those with those experiences in order to take you into the next, into the next phase of your, your journey?

Daniel Gbujie [00:21:08]:

Yes. Thank you. What we're now doing, what I am doing along with the team is creating awareness for the people back in the African continent. We are beginning to see a lot of people, you know, want to be in the next game. I know our friends in Ghana, I know friends in Ghana that want to set up 4, 5 teams, you know. I know people in South Sudan, they say they want to get involved in the team. And because, you know, the the the competition has a bit of benefits. Webb, it has a certificate that's given to you.

Daniel Gbujie [00:21:39]:

Secondly, it gives you visibility and exposure. Thirdly, you come into a community of people who are seasoned experts in corporate sustainability, and, and that's if you do your homework well, you can network well. Of course, while in the game, I develop an idea around an app called test. The app is to create a bit of awareness and see how sustainability can be done on an individual level. You know? So if you are a housewife and you have the app on your system and you want to see, okay, how can I be sustainable this week? You type in all the things you wanna do, and the app is able to give you, like, an idea. It's like a chat gpt of sustainability. You know, if you are a tomato seller, you want to sell tomatoes, you don't know how to be sustainable, it starts from the farm, right? Farm to the market. You know? So it tells you the farm to the market principles, areas where you can leverage on local sourcing, area where you can even have your own greenhouse stuff.

Daniel Gbujie [00:22:42]:

So those are kinds of the things that I've learned from the game. But most importantly is to raise awareness amongst my kind, The people in the continent, you know, explain sustainability in the language they understand. Swahili is the most spoken language in the central and the southern part of Africa. Hausa is 1 major language spoken in the entire Western African region and some parts of North Africa. In somewhere within the Southern Africa, we have Portuguese too. Angola, Mozambique, they speak Portuguese too. And of course, in most of West African, we have the Commonwealth of Nations that the English speaking part of it. So how to domesticate this knowledge of sustainability that every single person had to contribute towards that sustainability pool.

Daniel Gbujie [00:23:32]:

It is that critical mass of people that move the needle of progress. Just me and you doing things when 7 0.8000000000 people are not doing it will not work. Just United States and China believing that they are doing sustainability. It ain't gonna work. What truly works is when we have critical mass of people at the same time doing in their only 2 corner the sustainability. Got it. The sustainability principles. Now, doing that creates a culture.

Daniel Gbujie [00:24:04]:

Remember, a culture is formed when bulk sum of people over time. Aggregating their thoughts and are believing in a system that will drive them towards the promised land. It's not few people. We have to do this together, and we have to uplift those that are not in the current position to help themselves. And that's why I always want to use platform like yours that you are creating for us. Reach out to our leaders. You know? See young people in the continent, especially Gen Z's, especially people in the nineties and the eighties. We're tired of being, being told about the colonial time.

Daniel Gbujie [00:24:42]:

When we know the world has evolved, we just want to eat our fries. We just want to eat our fufu and Gary. We want to watch our Netflix. We want our kids to go to good schools. You know, trying to create an environment of toxicity won't work, especially now that young people know what's going on, is what's going on in in in Kenya. It's happening in Nigeria. It's happening everywhere. Young people, especially Africans, are tired, and they are showing their skills in music.

Daniel Gbujie [00:25:13]:

Almost every musician now sings African music. And go and check the age of all the African musicians that are topping the chart now all over the world. Bonaboye is in his thirties. Right? Davido is in his thirties. These are young people who are tired of how their, ecospace is not allowing them to evolve. When they see global best practices, they bring it on board and then they become celebrity. It's the same thing with the sustainability workers. So we're encouraging, Africans, young Africans, you know, partner with the sustainability world cup team, create a miniature version of your own, use that to identify young people that think critically out of the box, incentivize people, tell these young people whatever comes out of this will be to the development of your people.

Daniel Gbujie [00:26:02]:

You know? And all this will bring progress, development, and then investors will see that there's a critical mass of people who understand sustainability. Why not we go to invest? Because investors are also looking. Do we have resources? Human resources. It's not just about capital. Do we have human resources? Do we have the right environment? You know, to ensure development goes forward. Sustainable development or sustainability cannot work when there is conflict. It's simple. And the principle of sustainability defines itself that you have to be more inclusive, more transparent, more honest.

Daniel Gbujie [00:26:37]:

You have to respect the entire ecosystem. So domesticating this knowledge will be very central and that's what I intend to do with my app. Of course, working with you and many of, you know, many of the judges and many of our new partners that are relating to us. I truly believe we can have an app that can, you know, translate sustainability in all the major languages in Africa and remind people that sustainability can be on a personal level, on a subnational level, on a national level, and, of course, on a global level. But when all these connect together, that's only when we drive the sustainable development. You know? So these are some of the things we're doing. And then before I end, 1 of my teammates, sorry, 1 of my teammates is trying to build a cubicle, a cubicle that is called a solar box. He wants to build it at the center of a major market.

Daniel Gbujie [00:27:32]:

Now that solar box will have sockets all around about the 1, 000 sockets within the center so people can plug in their stuff, you know, you can barbecue, you can cook, you can trim hair, you know, you can refrigerate, you know, something like that. So these are some of the things we're trying to do, you know, eco smart practices, pilot projects in some of this stuff, you know, bringing in these principles we've learned within the and the things you've taught us within the game. So those are the few things.

Stuart Webb [00:28:03]:

Daniel, if there is anything I can do I mean, it it what you you you are you are you are an impressive an impressive leader. I think we can all agree that. And, I will once again I would just put up. This is, this is Daniel's, LinkedIn profile, which you'll find on LinkedIn, obviously. If you're not following somebody as impressive as doctor Daniel Bougie, then go follow him now because this man is gonna go a long way, really a long way. Daniel, IIII just wanna ask you 1 final questions, and the question obviously is, I haven't asked you 1 question that you must be burning for me to ask. What is the 1 question that you think I should five asked that I haven't yet?

Daniel Gbujie [00:28:47]:

Oh my goodness. Woah. That is so good. Okay. So 1 question I truly feel that you should have asked me is, what drives Africans to to to be much resilient, you know, in light of the things they see, in light of the things some of their leaders do. And why is it that when they move to clients or environments that are very, merit based, they always excel.

Stuart Webb [00:29:23]:

Mhmm.

Daniel Gbujie [00:29:24]:

So I I feel that that question will also go a long way.

Stuart Webb [00:29:27]:

What is the answer to the question?

Daniel Gbujie [00:29:29]:

And the answer is that the truth of the matter is that progress and development are a mixture of 2 walls. The those that do not have and those that have. Now the problem often is for those that don't have, if they're not inspired to want to have, it becomes difficult for them because they become paralyzed and they will not five, and the circle of poverty continues. But when you have experienced not having and you have the willpower, the I believe kind of mentality, the growth mindset, you know, when you observe best Webb you see evidence based science, when you seek knowledge and understanding, when you domesticate this knowledge and understand it with your African belief system. My African belief system tells me that we are community driven. There's a community based approach that brings about development. And that's the definition of sustainability. It's not a 1 person thing.

Daniel Gbujie [00:30:33]:

Now my African belief system tells me that, my brothers, my uncles, my mom, my dad, my nephews, my are all part of that eco space. And I must work hard to defend, you know, that community, that unionism, that common goal, that common agenda. Now all of those things build resilience. Remember, I'm a reflection of many things I have seen. Knowledges I've gotten in the US, experiences I've gotten in Africa, experience I've gotten in my marriage, experiences I five seen on TV. All of us are a reflection of that. However, we can turn that around. We can absorb those positive attributes and bring to light and inspire new generation of people that, yes, you see my skin like this, but I think differently.

Daniel Gbujie [00:31:21]:

I know that 4.03 parts per million is not good for the climate. I know the emphasis is to bring down carbon emission to pre industrial level. I know fully well that you may be concerned about your polar beer, but my brothers in Ethiopia are more concerned about their goods, their millet, their means. They are all needs that are different. However, it is the human needs that brings us together. And that if we work together in such a way that those that do not have and those that have can come together, we can build a better world where people that don't have now have hope and aspiration to learn because they know that their brothers that have are willing to help them pull them up the ladder of progress. So our resilience as an African, young man, young woman, or Africans you see are a reflection of our environment. But what has changed over the last 30 years is that young people do not want to get sucked up.

Daniel Gbujie [00:32:26]:

You know, we want to ensure that this resilient mindset which is also part of the definition of sustainability. Ability in the long run to sustain, you know, a culture that respects everything within the environment, respects the system established, respect regulatory laws that protects the natural resources in such a way that is beneficial for us that are currently alive and all. That's the textbook of resilient. And that's what I've known all my five. You know? So when I walk to school and don't have school bus, I know fully well I need to read harder than everybody in my class, you know, because I know that the knowledge I will get will articulate the way I think will help me be able to communicate to you who do not know my world very Webb, but you will now say, I can resonate with what Daniel is saying. He's he's dressed differently. He's definitely an African, but he's speaking a language that I can relate with. So it's what resilient does, it's what knowledge base does.

Daniel Gbujie [00:33:27]:

You're able to bring your experience as an African, relate it with those in the questions world, and create that bridge that is badly needed. Yes. It's the bridge that we're important. To develop ourselves.

Stuart Webb [00:33:39]:

Bridge is very important. Daniel, this has been a fascinating fascinating insight into the way you think, and it is an absolute demonstration of the reasons why you won that award as the leader of, of of note. You are you are obviously going a long way, and thank you so much for spending a few minutes talking to us. I really appreciate your insights On the message that we all need to learn to think about, as Daniel's just said, we might be worried about, whether or not we're we're emitting too much carbon. But today, in Africa, in Ethiopia, somebody's worried about whether or not their goats have got enough millet and remembering that we need to bring everybody together, I wanna thank you very much for spending some time with us. If you would like to get on to the newsletter, which will announce who we have coming up on future of these LinkedIn five and podcasts, please go to this link. That's link. Thecompleteapproach.co.ukforward/newsletter.

Stuart Webb [00:34:44]:

That's httpscolonforward/link.thecompleteapproach.co.ukforward/newsletter. Daniel, I can't thank you enough for spending a few minutes with us. I can't thank you enough for your contribution, and I can't do anything but wish you, that you take this learning these experiences and continue to drive them forward into what I know you're gonna make a huge success of how you take forward your sustainability goals. Thank you.

Daniel Gbujie [00:35:15]:

Thank you so much, Saf, for giving Africans like me the opportunity. This is what it means to be sustainable. This is what it means to be, your brother's keeper. This is how we build community. We use our platform to uplift others because in the long run, we are uplifting millions of more people. So I really am very appreciative. Again, I wanna thank you for all the comments for teaching the 50 of us who are participant, the 10 teams, you know, your contribution about improvement, advancement, you know, being realistic in real time, you know, all those things have taken them to heart, you know, and I'm looking forward to working with you, you know, learning more. It's a learning thing.

Daniel Gbujie [00:35:55]:

Nobody knows it all. You must continually evolve. Many people don't know that Facebook started as a campus, go to place. Now it's a marketplace. It's almost like a bank. You get paid on Facebook now. So what it means is that ideas evolve over time. It's never static.

Daniel Gbujie [00:36:13]:

And that's the same thing with sustainability. In the long run, you have to evolve but in such a way that you are very protective of the environment, the people, you bring everybody along in a transparent way. So I'm eternally grateful to Edmund and professor Lisa, and I'm commit completely committed to 2025. I hope to see more team participation, you know, in any way possible, you know, whether as a mentor, whether to advise people, whether as an emcee, you know, or whether even as a TV show because I see the sustainability World Cup 1 day becoming a TV show where you'll be a judge and then everybody will say, ah, that's the first judge in the show. So but the idea is that it's a wonderful opportunity. It's a good game that brings like minds together. When you leave the game, your life is never the same.

Stuart Webb [00:37:03]:

What more can I say? Daniel, thank you so much for spending some time with us. Thank you.

Who is Leila?

Leila is a strategist and educator in the field of digital transformation and marketing strategy with PhDs in Business Economics and in Communication and PR.

Key Takeaways

Introduction to Leila. 0:00

What is the main challenge of being an entrepreneur? 4:57

The importance of having an open mindset. 7:53

What’s the launch date for the podcast? 13:10

Inspiration for the strategy of kindness. 14:43

Leila’s research and how it influenced her. 18:57

The definition of homeostasis. 22:39

There’s nothing as stable as change. 25:33

Valuable Free Resource or Action

Find out more about Leila at https://www.linkedin.com/in/leila-phd/

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

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Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

leila, work, digital transformation, business, strategy, people, challenges, question, build, pitstop, instance, university, linkedin profile, innovation, coffee, collaboration, continue, kindness, homeostasis, digitalization

SPEAKERS

Stuart Webb, Dr. Leila Lunguleac-Bardasuc

Dr. Leila Lunguleac-Bardasuc

Thank

Stuart Webb

you Hello and welcome back to it's not rocket science five questions over coffee. I am just going to reach and get my coffee which is here at the moment it's in my it's in this mug at the moment I won't put any brand names up because we're not sponsored at the moment. But I'm here with Leila. Leila is, well, Leila has a really impressive career track record. And when I tell you that she has, she's a strategist and educator in digital transformation and marketing. She has got two PhDs. Now I know people that have got PhDs, but I've not come across somebody that has got so much brain power, they've managed to get two of them. But she's been recognised for her work in leading digital transformation initiatives, developing successful marketing strategies and driving innovation and growth in really competitive markets across Europe. And over the past eight years, she has created and sent a new business strategy called strategy kindness. And I think we're gonna get to the strategy of kindness in a little while. And that's about creating a culture of positivity and trust, where businesses and people can come together with a shared purpose. And so she's working with people like Future Processing, and Santi Anala. And she's also a professor of new business models in the master's degree in industry 4.0 in the university Europe of Europea, Europa, Madrid. So Leila, welcome to It's not rocket science, five questions over coffee. I hope that introduction, at least gave a small amount of credence to your incredible career. Thank you for joining us.

Dr. Leila Lunguleac-Bardasuc

Thank you. Thank you, Stuart, for having me. And hello, everyone. You know, I've been a follower and the fan of your sessions since a while now. And I'm really happy to join you today.

Stuart Webb

Well, I'm really pleased to get you on at long last Leila Leila. Let's start with with with my first question. So we talked a little bit about some of your work, who are the people you're trying to help at the moment, and what is one of the problems they've had, which you try and help them to solve?

Dr. Leila Lunguleac-Bardasuc

me working with people who can share feedback, especially with people that are open to communicate and explore and shift the fit their thinking, in order to build some some value both ways, and also to build networks of collaboration. It's very important for me, because I see collaboration as a process of sharing assets, and what they have as an asset, and what I can share with them, what is the value to the customer and what they can offer me in return. So I also think that one of the great qualities to have is to always be teachable, and it's needed for all parties. So for me finding the key people in businesses to join forces with and construct this mutual point in objectives. I think it's my main role. And one of the main challenges that I detected is how to get your message out there. When we both know there is a lot of noise making. It's a challenge and also to help how you can differentiate and show the purpose of your work. I think that's the companies and the people that I work with. They are all looking to offer something of value like technology with purpose acknowledged, that can improve our lives. And I think this is what really unites all the people that I work with, they are all set to help in the digitalization journey, sustainable digital transformation as well or themselves. They have embarked on this journey of digital transforming their business and they are in need of this type of partners and advisor to support and participate at each step of the way. So this is how I see my role bringing this businesses together and sharing this time type of note know how we know from the data that around 80% of digital transformation processes are failing. So in my work so far, I have noticed that the ones that do succeed, know how to communicate and they know how to build strong business relationships and trust inside and out meaning communicating trust building within your organisation and outside with the tone of the actors.

Stuart Webb

So you're really facilitating that communication and you're trying to bring that communication from both within the business and outside of the business to bring together those strong partnerships that you need for transformation to you, you need for innovation to really start to be to take hold within within the business.

Dr. Leila Lunguleac-Bardasuc

Exactly. And to add to that, if I were to put my academic hat on now, as a as a university teacher, this is something that we're fanatical about, we also see as a main as a main challenge. And so we detected this as a challenge. So what we did is developed a curriculum that combines the soft skills and technology skills. So our focus is to best form the future leaders who are capable to detect the main challenges that their customers are, are facing. And well, to put it in a nutshell, and then respond to your question, I think the main challenge is to understand the challenges that your clients are facing, and an entire process.

Stuart Webb

I think it's interesting, isn't it before the before we started talking, we were sort of sharing some of the some of the differences if you like, between the businesses we work with and the students we work with, because, as I was saying, we do a little bit of helping some students. And, you know, I often see that when you get into the student population, they have absolutely no fear, they have nothing that they believe can hold them back. And yet, when you get into a business, there's an awful lot of barriers that need to be broken down before you can really see communication, and you can see trust be built because those barriers have somehow built up in businesses and trying to sort of bring that collaboration together is so much more difficult it would appear when you get into into a business.

Dr. Leila Lunguleac-Bardasuc

Yeah, I think that it's, it's true, and how you build that. So that is also a challenge how you start building on it. To define something of value. What we do at the university is to train our students with real life situations, for instance, and innovative methodology. And we see also in my work with other companies that you might work with students, to see technology and innovation as something that can help you achieve your goal, not the ultimate goal. So you have your ultimate goal, your objectives, and use technology to help you support that.

Stuart Webb

So So and I know we've got a number of people listening to you talk at the moment. And if people want to sort of bring a question to you, I'm more than happy to feed them onto the stage and let you answer them later. But but perhaps you could talk a little bit about the sort of mistakes you see businesses making, that you are trying to help them to overcome.

Dr. Leila Lunguleac-Bardasuc

Sure, maybe that's a mistake. But when you're trying to build this type of collaborations, you really need to have this open mindset. And to be open to share know how in order to receive something like we are doing now something that we've been doing in in our talks for a long time. And this generates value. Also, you need to know that it takes time. And it's not something that can be built right away and overnight. And it depends on the type of type of the problem. But because in this case, what I mentioned, it's a very complex problem that needs constant effort and involvement. Without help, I think that it's almost impossible to construct. And the same if we think of digitalization or sustainable digital transformation, especially when we think about SMEs, how can we help them find solutions to their problems? It simply cannot be done from what I've seen so far, if we are not aware of their challenges, and why would SMEs for instance, ask us for help. So this is why I started working together because he mentioned in when you presented my work to work together with Future Processing in the innovative tech space, and with something aligned industry 4.0 And smart manufacturing space, because we want to gain a fundamental understanding of the business challenges. So what is preventing them to take the business to the next level?

Stuart Webb

You've mentioned you've mentioned those two to two companies that you're working on at the moment. And I know you've got some some, some great, some great offers and things coming up. And I'm just going to sort of put your LinkedIn profile at the bottom here because I know there are some events that you're going to be running which I think it would be great for people to hear about what it is you're hoping to do in those events and and hopefully, that they're open to people to join in and hear you talking about this sort of thing in the future.

Dr. Leila Lunguleac-Bardasuc

Thank you You're thinking I would really love to share that. So please feel free to reach out on LinkedIn if you want to learn more about any of these actions or events that I'm taking, so please feel free to drop me a message. And I would be really, really happy to hear from everyone joining joining us today. I think that the main reason why all this initiatives are taking off is that they're based on the same belief of collaboration and idea sharing. And because I built them, not on my own, but alongside other collaborators, mentors and business partners. And as some resources are where where can we take it from here, I would like to invite everyone to join future series of events and get togethers that are coming up, the first ones are coming up in May. We are designing this in order to start building this kind of networks and collaborations that we talked about and apply the strategy of kindness. So if for instance, you are into finance, FinTech digitalization sustainability, the first event in the series will bring together on the 25th of May. In the afternoon, I think it's going to be five CT will bring together some top experts in FinTech, cybersecurity digitalization and leaders in finance, and they will discuss opportunities and challenges for sustainable digital transformation. So this one is organised together with Future Processing, you can find it on LinkedIn or again, just drop me a message and I can send you the invite. And if you are in manufacturing, together with Centinela, we are building a series of podcasts and get togethers that will start also in May, we do not have the date yet. So please keep in touch, and I'll share the details if you are interested, we want to discuss and see how we can overcome challenges in the industry. And also how we can increase the productivity and sustainability and manufacturing operations. And another event is the Friday coffee, which you're very familiar with. So we focus on collaboration, creativity. One when people come together at a Friday coffee, they have the opportunity to connect with others from different sectors and share this ideas with we do not have a specific topic and in mind, you can find a coffee and inside the digital transformation community on connects platform for instance, you can also drop me a message and the Friday coffee actually turns two years old. And we have the celebration on Friday. And I know Stuart you're going to join us this this Friday. So if you if you want you to join me and Stuart and progressive the group that we usually get together on Friday, this is also something I would very much like to invite everyone here to

Stuart Webb

I'm just gonna I'm just going to repeat those dates just in case anybody wasn't actually able to catch them. So that's the 25th of May, you're going to be talking to finance professionals, people like that you're in conjunction with Future Processing, that's going to be available to people on your LinkedIn profile. So they'll see details of that then you're also starting the podcast in make podcasts a brilliant strategy, Leila, congratulations on taking that one. I can't I can't think of anybody that enjoys one of those more than me. And that's a really a really great strategy. So look out for the podcasts that I'm sure Leila will be posting on her LinkedIn profile. Once again, go to the LinkedIn profile, say on Friday coffee. Well, what can I say about Friday coffee, a an interesting and eclectic group of people that normally seem to somehow end up discussing AI and the impact of AI upon their world. So really great things. Um, thank you, Manuel, for Manuel's just committed that. What a great, what a great series of topics and upcoming events. Yeah, you'll be busy later. But I think that's a good thing. If I'm honest, I think that's a really great thing. And congratulations on all of those. Can I just turn to my fourth question now we've now we've we've we've talked about that because I think there's there's there will be a really great, it would be really great to understand what was it in terms of either a book or a course or strategy which really drove you to understand some of this. There's this need for collaboration, this strategy of kindness within within business that sort of drove your your thinking about it.

Dr. Leila Lunguleac-Bardasuc

Well, actually a lot of things so I do get my inspiration from from many different sectors like from music to sports, to science fiction and fantasy books, for instance. So we know the quote that today's science fiction is tomorrow's science Pack. Wrong Isaac Asimov. And also Ray Bradbury says that science fiction is the most important literature in the history of the world. Why is that? Because it's the history of ideas, and history of our civilization birthing itself. So I get a lot of inspiration from there, I think that it has built since I was little it has built its has built the path that I'm currently on. And in strategy, for instance, I'm also influenced by several sports like Formula One like football and snooker in terms of the reaction to change the use of data, for instance, in decision making, from creating the competitive advantage and how you manage a team, and learning from your opponents just to name a few. I actually just wrote an article on strategy similarities and what we can learn from Formula One race strategy, and you can find it on the Future Processing blog. And I will continue on this with ESG. And sustainability in Formula One, race teams and data analytics. So this just to put it in a nutshell, but I think that if I am to look at the major influence, for the strategy of kindness and how I started developing it, it has been my mother and her study of living organisms, because she's a biologist. And she's, yes, sure that you can relate and you can have a lot of things to talk about and to expand on this. So now, you know that the strategy of kindness is, is inspired by by similarities between open biological systems, and what we can learn from them to apply in companies or organisations. And I've learned that organisations are open biological systems. So they also transform all the environmental factors. And they do this exchange with the environment because and it becomes one of the essential conditions right for the existence of the system to be able to do this exchange. So according to her, it creates this dynamic balance of balance and a permanent movement. And the organization's have distinct properties and characteristics of open biological systems. And I'm sure that I'm keen to hear from you on this, like attributes like self regulation, historical character, information, integrity, rights, and the dynamic balance.

Stuart Webb

Yeah, no, I could, I could, I could spend several hours lecturing on it. But I am interested in noting that you're doing some things at the moment of Formula One. And it reminds me that about 10 or 11 years ago, I actually gave a talk. And the subject of my talk was how to increase team productivity. And the entire talk was based around a pitstop change in the Monaco Grand Prix that had taken place just the two or three days prior to that. And the whole thing was how do you this unit worked together to make that pitstop change? And I think it was eight seconds at the time, if I recall, so some years ago, no, do it in less than two but but they made a pitstop change in something like eight seconds. And I sort of worked through exactly how each of the members of the team cooperated, what they did, how they did it, how they communicated prior to the pitstop how they communicated after the pitstop how everything worked together to make that as efficient as it possibly could. And, and I think even at that I did actually bring in homeostasis, which is a cellular process, which brings equal balance of, of water essentially, between the inside and the outside of the cell and, and how you how you do that. So I absolutely understand how you're where you're coming from when it comes to sort of cellular systems and things like that. And I absolutely agree with you. There's an awful lot about biology, which we could learn, because a biological system exists within what is a very toxic environment. And yet, most of the day we get through and we you know, there are millions of things trying to essentially kill you every day. And you actually not only fight those off, but thrive. And it's that ability to sort of ignore the ignore the the environment, which could could well could well take you apart as a business and move in and thrive because you actually get everything to work together. So there's an awful lot of lessons that we could take into that as a biologist, I'd like to sit there and talk about sort of cells being taken over and the DNA and such like but we won't, we'll move into something much less, much less contentious and and I'll just ask you the final question of the of the, of the of the session, which is, you know, I've asked you three or four questions now and you must be itching to talk about the thing, the question that I should have asked you. So I'll ask you to ask the question. I should have asked and then answer it. So that we've got a real understanding of where you're coming from?

Dr. Leila Lunguleac-Bardasuc

Well, first, just to just to say that seeing the your passion and this and maybe we can join forces and publish an article together. I would really like that. Exactly, exactly. And on the question, well, if we have the audience here, I would really like to see if they have a question that they would like to ask. And we've seen some messages that,

Stuart Webb

yeah, well, as I say, Manuel, Manuel was, was asking a question, I don't know if anybody has got a question. I mean, I'll post one. Now, the your PhDs are in quite different subjects, do you find that there is an interaction between them, which is where you have been able to sort of draw inspiration from both?

Dr. Leila Lunguleac-Bardasuc

Yes, because the research that I did, and the first, the first PhD was on creating competitive advantage. So even if it's on the business economic side, too, I was trying to look at ways how you can gain competitive advantage to creativity and innovation. And the main research that I did was on universities, on private universities and see how they interact and gain this type of advantages. And the second one, even if it wasn't in communication, I focused on new strategies, new communication strategies, and new digital marketing strategies. Because and I had the chance to interview directors of communication and marketing from different universities, because I also based it on the university's pace of public universities this time, and it was very interesting, to say the least, because I was interviewing them before the pandemic, and during the pandemic. And I could notice this shift in strategy and how universities and needed to to adapt and how students needed to adapt. So I think this, this really brought them together, and be able to have a broader analysis on the education, the superior education system.

Stuart Webb

And well, I'm gonna, I'm gonna leap in and try and see if Leila wants to sort of answer your question. So those of you are not familiar with the with the subject of homeostasis. Homeostasis is about the inside of a biological cell and the outside of a biologic cell or a biological organism reaching balance, essentially, it's it's the, it's a key feature of the way in which if we take in water, we don't end up sort of swelling, becoming a balloon, we actually wish we would if we if we didn't, if we didn't get rid of the wastewater that we don't need. But the thing which is really critical about homeostasis is it's an active process, it doesn't happen by doesn't happen. It there's a small amount of it, which happens just by sort of by normal diffusion, but actually, the body has to put in energy in order for that homeostasis to continue. And I actually think that, yes, certainly, a lot of organisations stop putting energy into their, for instance, their innovation strategy, which is one of the things that I focus a lot of my time on, a lot of companies get comfortable, and just sit there and say, Everything's great. We don't need to continue on, I guess, I guess later, you'd, you'd agree an awful lot of companies with their digital marketing strategy will say, it's great. We don't need to do so much anymore. We've got it right. And the problem is the world moves on. Things change in the outside environment. And your immediate response is one of hey, I don't need to fight this anymore. I can just carry on being what I will. And you know, if the world is if you know, if the economy is growing, even if it's growing slowly at one or 2% per year, if your business isn't growing at one or 2% per year, you're going backwards, because the world is advancing with you staying still. So you have to continue to put in energy to move your business forward to change things to look for the new things. And I am an advocate because a lot of I've done some work with companies, they go in and I do their innovation strategy, and they'll go great, we've done that now. My answer is no. This is a continuous energy. You need to continue to do innovation. It's not something you do and forget. It's something you continue to do on a daily, weekly, monthly basis. Lately, you must have something you can say in terms of How they must continue with their digital marketing.

Dr. Leila Lunguleac-Bardasuc

Yeah, it's an ongoing process. So this is why I also mentioned at the start of our session today, that you always need to be teachable to learn, and it's input and output. So what you've put in in terms of effort to build this type of relationship to build your marketing strategy, is what you're taking out of. So when you stop this, you also stop the continuous growth and build. Well, Bob Dylan said that there's nothing as stable as change. You're looking for one stable thing. That's that it's changed.

Stuart Webb

Brilliant. We've managed to bring science, we've brought communication and we brought Bob Dylan into the podcast. What else can you possibly want? From a podcast with Leila? Leila, thank you so much for spending just a few minutes with us. I am so Britt, I'm so brilliant. You managed to end it on Bob Dylan, I don't know how you did it. But that's just a skill that you have, which I think is great. I'm just going to bring us to an end by saying because I don't want to take up too much of less time, she's busy. As you can tell, she's got a lot of things to get on with. But if you would like to hear more about the sort of things we're doing on this podcast, go to this link, which is https colon, forward slash forward slash link dot the complete approach.co.uk forward slash newsletter, that's link dot the complete approach.co.uk forward slash newsletter, that will get you on to the newsletter list. And I send out a newsletter, which highlights and tells you about brilliant people like LELO, who are going to come on and give us this fantastic stuff on a weekly basis, Leila, I cannot. I cannot thank you enough. We have one question, which I'm just going to throw in now. How will the new tools of artificial intelligence are available affect the digital transformation process? And once you've answered that, I will let people go and you get on with your job.

Dr. Leila Lunguleac-Bardasuc

Well, not only the digital transformation processes, but I think that all our work, healthcare, and we just need to see an education, how we are going to implement that. So we need to learn how to use this tools, but in the same manner, so you have an objective, use these tools to help you reach that objective and do not make just like aI implementation or implementation of the surgeon to your overall objective. Because I think that this is where this is where digital transformation processes fail. So we need to see how to how to implement them how they can help us and just just use them for the purpose that we have to generate value. And to create this this type of value, I think that we are focusing on that we are able to do so. And thank you so much for your questions. Thank you for having me. And I'll see everyone next time I will be in the audience because I will. I'm looking forward to your future sessions and Stuart

Stuart Webb

Lila, I will only say if you want to spend more time talking about AI join Leila to Friday coffee, we spend a lot of time thinking about how AI will affect the working environment, how it will affect the way in which we work. We've had some brilliant discussions, which really do highlight the fact that too many people are using the use of AI as the destination rather than as the support to achieve their bit their business objective. And so, you know, les that's absolutely right. AI has to be the supporting tool in the way that workflow is a supporting tool in the way that things like Video Pro video calling is a supporting tool, use it as a tool, not as a destination. Leyla, thank you so much for your time. I really do appreciate the use of taking a very valuable 2830 minutes out of out of your day. And I really appreciate the fact that you've given us these pearls of wisdom. So thank you so much for that. Look forward to seeing you in the audience next time. Thank you so much.

Dr. Leila Lunguleac-Bardasuc

Thank you. Thank you for having me. Thank you everyone for joining

Who is Tai?

Tai is CEO of That Marketing Team

Key Takeaways

How do you help your customers to generate leads? 0:20

Automated lead generation and sales. 2:18

Tools for using to attract more leads. 3:27

How to attract agents to become your local office? 5:30

The importance of understanding your customer’s needs. 6:34

Do you know something your customers know better than you? 7:56

The better decision you make, the better business you build. 8:58

The one thing you need to be able to do. 11:23

Stuart’s advice on how to make leads more automated. 12:51

Valuable Free Resource or Action

theleadsworkshop.com

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

https://youtube.com/live/cgIK-sCYl4g?feature=share

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page : https://scientificvaluebuildingmachine.com/svbm_1_page

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

customers, gpt, talk, ty, automated, quiz, leads, word, business, people, work, hoping, write, prompts, marketing, data, automated system, questions, great, stuart

SPEAKERS

Stuart Webb, Tai Goodwin

Stuart Webb 00:20

Good afternoon and welcome to excuse me, another episode of frog in my throat of five questions over coffee. I'm here today with Thai Thai Goodwin, she's CEO of that marketing team. And she's really going to talk to us about how she's gonna help us to generate more leads, and make more sales. Welcome to the podcast. Ty.

Tai Goodwin 00:43

Hey, Stuart, I'm so glad to be here. Now, I hope it's okay that I don't actually drink coffee.

Stuart Webb 00:49

That's fine. I've been drinking enough for both of us, Ty. I think I've finished six so far. So that's more than enough. So Ty, let's just understand a little bit now how exactly do you help your customers to to generate those models? What what is that? What is the ideal customer that you're looking to help you said small businesses to find small business for me?

Tai Goodwin 01:12

Yeah, we work with a lot of small businesses who are doing, you know, $2.5 million and above in their business. And they don't have the real budget to bring on a full blown marketing manager or CMO chief marketing officer. But they also really don't have time to do it themselves. So one of our tagline, Stewart is no time, no tech, no team, no problem. They struggle with getting the people in place, they don't have the tools in place, and we can help them with that.

Stuart Webb 01:41

So what is it that they've been doing until you get involved? You know that it's been a mistake that you're helping them? So

Tai Goodwin 01:49

a lot of my clients have been focused only on referral marketing or word of mouth? Right? And so because you know that that's great, until it's not great, right, when the referrals dry up, and then you don't have any leads coming in? What do you do? How do you find your next client and that makes it really hard for them to scale beyond where they are. And so we are able to come in and show them how to put an automated marketing system in place that generates leads for them on autopilot, it actually kind of creates demand for their business without them having to have a referral or word of mouth.

Stuart Webb 02:18

I love automated systems, I spend half of my life talking to people. In fact, I was in a conversation this morning about the fact that he didn't have an automated system in order to sort of take the leads he had through a sort of sales process. And make it automated, I always say, you know, once you've got somebody in the funnel, you need to make it impossible for them to crawl back up the funnel, you got to gently educate them until they eventually become a customer whether they really want to or not, because that's the that's the that's what we put these funnels in place for so so I know you've got a you've got some some great offers on your website and things like that. There's one in particular I'm hoping you're going to sort of talk to us about and that's the the leads workshop.

Tai Goodwin 03:01

The leads workshop is we do it every week. And in that leads workshop, I'm sharing the five things that we use to automate marketing for our customers, because it's not just about getting the leads in. There's ways to automate qualifying people. There's ways to automate your sales and delivery. So all of those things can be automated, and it saves our customers time, it helps them make more money, because now nobody's slipping through the cracks.

Stuart Webb 03:27

That's a really great. So how do you how do you talk to us about some of those tools that you use it that in, without giving away too many of what I'm sure you're going to talk about, but just tell us a little bit about that?

Tai Goodwin 03:38

Well, one of the things that we've used for a lot of local businesses is a quiz. We just built a quiz for an insurance person who, you know, wanted a way to bring in more leads. And it was simple quiz that can attract people because it's not intrusive. It's kind of fun, right? But people will give you more information and data. And when you have something like a quiz, as opposed to just a traditional PDF download, or you know, a webinar, you're going to get more data that you can use to do a better job with your marketing and people like a quiz. But how does that work? Are you talking about the Harry Potter? You know what kind of Harry Potter character are you quiz? We're talking about things that are a little bit more technical than that, and a little bit more specific than that. But it's still a quiz that asks people questions that helps them pinpoint what their real pain is and how you can specifically solve it.

Stuart Webb 04:28

I love the idea. I love the idea Ty tell me Is there a particular book or, or programme that really sort of helps you to hone the way in which you work with your customers?

Tai Goodwin 04:37

Oh, wow, there's so many Stuart, one of the ones that really helped me most recently is the 100 million dollar offer. And you probably heard folks talking about that. And, you know, it's one of those things where it's got some really great points in it. We don't take everything in it very literally, but it's got some really great points, specifically around it. And this is just what I picked up from, because there's a lot of people talking about the book right now. But it really helped me focus on what my customer wants, instead of what I think I should offer them. And that was the mission that was the linchpin for me, because so many of us, like, when we come into businesses, we've got these skills, we want to use our skills, you want to do this, and you want to do that. And we don't really take the time to actually figure out what is it that's going to solve the customer's problem? Fastest. And that was your,

Stuart Webb 05:30

I love it. I love it. It's so interesting, because I was having a customer meeting this morning with somebody. And they were talking about how they were wanting to set up a new business and set up agency in different countries. They've got a very international business. And I said, so. So what is it, they don't talk a lot about how this would help them to sort of, you know, accelerate this house. And I said, so what is it that that that will attract those agents to become your agent in that locality? And they looked at me as if to say why you've now have you started speaking a completely different language. And I sort of said, well, you know, you want to attract these people to become your local office, effectively, a sort of, you know, an attitude of your business, you're gonna give them your branding, and all that good stuff, but what's in it for them. And they kept looking at me and saying, but I don't understand this is going to help me accelerate my sales, and they will make money and I went, Yeah, but that's not what will attract them to become your office, what is it that you are doing to solve their pain or their problems when they went? Oh, these people want to do such and such? Okay. That's what I've been asking for the last five minutes, and they weren't see. And it was one of those moments where you sort of you, you've got to get somebody out of there sort of what is it that I'm trying to do to? What is it that my customer wants from me in order to get them to understand how to sort of make that sort of LEAP, don't you?

Tai Goodwin 06:48

Oh, absolutely. And it's amazing, because people forget that all the time. And, you know, I'll ask people, I said, Well, have you talked to the people that you want to serve? What? I can do that or what I need to talk to them? Well, yeah, you know, it's their money that they're going to invest is their energy, it's their trust is their time. So it amazes me when I run into people that have never asked the AUG, they intend to sell to, what is it that they really need? And why do they really need it?

Stuart Webb 07:17

Yeah, it's interesting, I spend a lot of my time with companies that are trying to innovate. And they, they they very, very rarely do, I sort of you know that there are two types of innovation, one of which is very much incremental. And the other one is what I call sort of recombinant, which is where ideas come back together. And it's often the customer that produces that recombinant idea. It's something which is completely out there. It's sort of something they've not considered, but the customer is thinking about it because they've got a different view on it. And I often say that the greatest source of innovation is your customers. And the one thing that I've had said to me more often than not, is, why would our customers want to be the source of innovation? They don't know what they're doing. And I'm saying, Well, do you know something your customers actually know better than you what it is you're trying to do for them. And if you ask them occasionally, if you just reached out and told them, I'd like your input, they might actually tell you more things that you could help them to solve in terms of pain points in their problem in their business.

Tai Goodwin 08:14

Absolutely. And it's not that they don't know is that they might not put it in the same phrase, you know, so it takes a really smart entrepreneur, really savvy entrepreneur, to learn what questions to ask so that you get the right data, it's like, and this is gonna sound like really, this is gonna connect for those of you that have parents, if you're a parent of like a five or six year old, there's some things you can't come out and directly asked a five or six year old, but if you ask them questions around it, you'll get to the answer. And that's kind of what you have to do as an entrepreneur. You know, and when you learn how to ask those questions, which is how we tie back into the quiz marketing that we do, it's learning how to ask the right questions, so you get the right data, so that you're making better decisions with your marketing and a better investment of your time and money.

Stuart Webb 08:58

I love that I love that phrase I actually read even this morning, because I was it's one thing I try and remind myself is, the better the decision you make, the better business you build. And you've really got to ask the right questions to make a really smart decision to build a really great business. Yeah. Good, good. Tie. Listen, I've been asking you some questions for last 1010 minutes or so. And there must be one question that you're currently thinking. Why doesn't he asked me this? It's so obvious. I don't understand why he hasn't bothered to ask me. So I'm not going to get you to ask that question. And of course, as soon as you've asked that question, you need to answer it because I'm not going to be able to know the answer to that one. So what's the question? I should have asked you that I haven't.

Tai Goodwin 09:41

Oh, goodness. Well, you know, one of the questions that's really coming up right now has to do with like chat GPT Nai. And a lot of people are flocking to it because they're like, I'm gonna fire my copywriter and I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna be able to do all this myself and I wrote this the other day, but let me give The question first, the question is, you know, what's the best way to use AI technology for my business? Right? Especially when it comes to marketing? And that's a such an important question right now, like I said, because a lot of people are flocking to it. And if they go, I'm just gonna get it to do this. You can write as many chat GPT prompts. And for those of you who are new to that, it's an AI Artificial Intelligence, which is not always artificial intelligence, artificially intelligent technology that people are using, and you can put questions in. And it'll give you a great amount of data, it'll give you great responses. Sometimes you have to, you know, go through and filter them and make sure they're correct. But a lot of people are using it to try to write, copy and to get prompts for social media and a good website, copy. And that's great. But here's the thing, no matter how many prompts you write, if you don't have a clear audience, offer, or messaging, none of your prompts are going to matter. It all comes back to this strategy. And that's with anything, that's the biggest mistake that I see people make is that they're running after tools are what we call throwing spaghetti at the wall, hoping something sticks this week, I'm going to try tic tac next week, as somebody said, I should use YouTube. So I'm going to try and YouTube as the next week. And you're just throwing things at the wall. And so you're never getting enough data to really know what's working or why it's working. And if you don't understand why it's working, you cannot replicate it.

Stuart Webb 11:23

Yeah, great, great stuff, great stuff. I have a scientific background. And I know that the one thing you need to be able to do is have enough information behind you to be able to replicate something that's been successful, because it's those one offs that were really successful. And then you go kind of want to know what it is I did. So I can do it again. And I just don't know. That's the problems that you have where people go, I think I did such and such, and it doesn't work and you're scrambling around. And that blows you off course, doesn't it? It leaves you know, it's all very, you know, people say I don't need a plan because plans never work. And I often say you know, what you forget is a plan helps you to know whether or not you want to be able to do that, again, it doesn't matter if a plan ends up being you being blown off upon you know how far off plan you are. So without that guiding strategy, without that thing that sort of says I know what it is I'm trying to do. You're absolutely right, people find themselves adrift. And that's, that's a really great message, I worry a lot about people who are now leaping into chat GPT chat GPT is just a great big load of words or put together and it just predicts the next best word, it doesn't mean it has any form of intelligence, it's not intelligent. It just predicts the next possible word with a high likelihood of success. I put some words into chat GPT the other day in order to sort of demonstrate to somebody how it would write them up until it wrote an entire paragraph of about 250 words without a sentence stop without any sort of without any sort of formatting. And I looked at it and went, would you like that to become that automated post that you put out on a regular basis? And they looked at it and they went? No, that's horrible. And I said, but that's what you were proposing. And too many people are just going, it's easy, but it will blow away any hopes that your customers have got of looking at you as an intelligent human being that doesn't know.

Tai Goodwin 13:11

Yeah, you know, it's like, I think it's like when people and I've never experienced this, but I've watched TV, I think it's like when people get hooked on drugs, you know, you get that high from Oh, this worked on Chet GPT one time or this worked on tic tac, and it went viral. And then you're always trying to chase that same result. But you're never getting it. And it's interesting, man, I can't wait like written his first like, you know, wave of people kind of just getting into this whole chat GPT. And it's gonna be really interesting to see what has actually worked, that's been implemented, like, it's one thing to, for people to be able to create stuff from it. And that's fun, and it's exciting. But I want to see what the results are. When people actually implement the content and the data and the responses that they're getting. That's what we need to be taking a look at.

Stuart Webb 13:57

Brilliant Ty, it's been a real pleasure having you come on and talk to us about some of this stuff today. Thank you so much for doing it. I'm just gonna, just gonna remind everybody that if you would like to get onto the newsletter, mailing list, I send out an email pretty much every Monday morning talking about who's going to be coming on to the podcast on Tuesday so that you can see the sort of wisdom that we're hoping to bring to you and the free advice stuff like typing giving us today. So go to this link, which is https colon, forward slash forward slash link dot the complete approach.co dot c a.uk forward slash newsletter. So that's linked the complete approach or one word Kodo co.uk forward slash newsletter, come on to that. Get that newsletter every week. So you can see some of the brilliant people we've got coming up in the future. Ty, it's been an absolute pleasure having you on today. Thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. Really appreciate you giving us some of that wisdom about how to go about making your leads more automated. It's brilliant stuff. Thanks. Q

Tai Goodwin 15:00

Fantastic. Thanks, Stuart. It's been a pleasure

Who is Joe?

Joe is the human Kaizen expert and author of the Amazon Kindle #1 New Release "Every Day Excellence".

Key Takeaways

From every mistake to every interaction. 3:34

Taking a step back and looking at your mistakes. 5:22

Understanding failure as an opportunity. 8:35

Books that would add value. 9:44

Why aren’t you like this? 12:19

Using time with intention and starve your distractions. 15:06

Valuable Free Resource or Action

https://everyday-excellence.com/excellence-shop/

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page : https://scientificvaluebuildingmachine.online

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

people, joe, book, kaizen, understand, programme, mistakes, brilliant, brain, life, mark manson, friends, learn, talking, everyday, forward slash newsletter, power, screw, day, big

SPEAKERS

Stuart Webb, Joe Templin

Stuart Webb 00:17

Hi, and welcome back to it's not rocket science five questions over coffee. I have my coffee here. Joe has got his coffee in front of him. That's brilliant Joe well done. I'm just really, really glad to have Joe Templin with me today. Joe is an author and he's a human Kaizen expert. I'm really looking forward to the conversation. Joe has a website called everyday excellence.com Really well worth going on and having a look at some of the stuff that Joe talks about that I'm really confronted with conversation. So welcome to It's not rocket science, five questions over coffee, Joe

Joe Templin 00:50

Stewart, happy Pi Day, it's a nerd Hi holiday, I could actually be wearing my Pi Day shirt, but we're in the middle of a blizzard. And so we're making do with what we have.

Stuart Webb 01:00

Yeah, I'm just looking at my window, right. And it has started that the heavens have opened and hail is now falling. I don't know what I've done to deserve this. But you can't hear it on the roof. Thankfully, Joe, listen, let's just talk a little bit about the sort of the problems that the customers are trying to help and the problems that they've got when you when you reach out to them.

Joe Templin 01:21

So let's just start with the premise that everybody has problems. The reason why is because everybody is alive and is a component of life that you're going to have difficulties and struggle. If we can start from that premise, then it's easy to see that everybody can benefit from who I am and what I do. And I'm not everybody's cup of tea or a glass of whiskey as it might be. But there are aspects of what we talk about that are really across the board and for everybody. And I am a human Kaizen expert, a lot of people are familiar with Kaizen from the manufacturing world where it's the concept of continuous improvement. And it's been applied to manufacturing, finance, software, but we are not applying it to the most basic and important component of any business or organisation, which is the people. And when you're a little kid, you are engaged in human Kaizen, you're learning to walk and you fail multiple times, you're learning to talk and you fail multiple times, you're learning to tie your shoes or draw or ride a bike. And so you're in this continuous improvement mindset. Really, until the time that people reach teenage years, maybe even when they go off to university. And then two thirds of the people stop growing. And so as you move further in your life and your career, it further Narrows and people start to be resigned to their current situation, or they just follow orders from their boss or from somebody in a uniform or what have you. And so we need to almost regress somewhat, to that childhood, to be able to re stimulate and grow and be the best that we can be and sort of appropriate that we're doing this on March 14, because this is Albert Einstein's birthday. And Albert Einstein himself said that the essence of genius is to maintain the enthusiasm of childhood into adulthood

Stuart Webb 03:34

and loved I love I love that quote Joe and I think you're absolutely right there are so many of us that have forgotten that in order to learn how to walk you have to fall on your backside several times and get up and say well that's not the way to do it, then is it let's have another crack and too many of us think that you should get it right. Well, yeah, we should aim to get it right first time but in actual fact you beat yourself up and I had a conversation yesterday with somebody who's starting out in their business and the one thing that he said is I made a lot of mistakes in February but I decided that I got to learn from those mistakes and I thought well he you're likely to make a success that aren't you know, that was that was that was just just warms my heart that this is this is somebody who just decided he'd made mistakes but he wasn't gonna beat himself up he was gonna learn from those mistakes and I guess that's that's the essence of what we're talking about. If you can extract

Joe Templin 04:25

one bit of information one pearl is my father calls it from every mistake from every interaction you can string together enough those pearls now a very rich life.

Stuart Webb 04:37

Yeah, brilliant. So one of the sort of things you find that your, your the people you're reaching out to help have tried to do in the past and essentially failed to do Joe before you can you can step in and try and do what you can't help them.

Joe Templin 04:50

One of the big overarching component actually looking at you know, the meta awareness from this is that people are failing To learn from their failures, because we all fail. And as we were talking about with learning to walk or your guy in business, there are a lot of salespeople then trading currently, you know, we make mistakes, we screw up. And because we're interacting with other individuals, there's lot of delaying false self false self interactions going on there, that we have to deal with. But it's people make the same mistakes again, and again, because they're not pausing, taking a step back and looking at what went right and what went wrong. In the military. They do after action, debriefs, and professional sports they watch the tape afterwards. And having the ability to set your ego aside and look at any interaction whether it was with your significant other or extravagant. Other unfortunately, whether it's in business, whether it's in an athletic endeavour, whether it's music, or trying to develop any other skill, taking the time to step back, look at disengage your ego, and emotion, and looking at the situation to try and extract the wisdom from it. So that the next iteration that your better is really the biggest mistake I see people make because they're either too emotional, or they don't take the time because they're too busy, which seems to be the way of the world at this point. Or they are unwilling to take ownership of part of the screw up, essentially, and make it so that next time they're better.

Stuart Webb 06:39

I really, really can't thank you enough for bringing us back to thinking about that sort of thing. Tell me Is there a particular valuable free offer a valuable piece of free advice that you can leave with the audience at the moment and this point, I'm going to put up what I think is a really interesting website, web links that you can you can refer us to which is everyday hyphen excellence.com. Forward slash, excellence hyphen shop.

Joe Templin 07:04

So if you go to the everyday excellence.com website every single day, there's a new blog there. And so every single day, there's free information, free insight for individuals that can help them grow and develop and improve in some capacity. If they go into the shop, they can find the three day three brain free training programme, which is a three day programme. Being honest there, and it's completely free, no hidden costs or anything, just sign up and every single day, for the three days of the programme, you'll receive an email. And what I do is I go through the evolutionary history of the brain from a biology point of view, the lizard brain, the monkey brain, or limbic system, and then the neocortex, and explain how it works, and how its evolved, and how they interact. And some of the power and weaknesses thereof, because we live in an information society. So everybody's trying to focus on their neocortex, but they don't realise that that is, although it's incredibly powerful. It is limited its capacity when compared with the older, stronger parts of the brain. And this is why even though you're on a diet and trying to finish your work, you're gonna go out and have tacos and margaritas with your buddies, because you've got 80 plus percent of your brain saying we want tacos, we want friends, as opposed to the neocortex. And so understanding these different components will allow people to harness the full power of their capability and utilise it.

Stuart Webb 08:35

It's really interesting, isn't it, because it's by understanding and despite the fact that you've explained it so well there, it's by understanding those things that you can actually start to address the, the failings you sometimes have where you don't understand where a feeling or where a behaviour has come from. And it's only by starting to break that down and understand it, you can actually start to sort of refocus your attention as it were, isn't it so that it's learning to do that that's the key thing to sort of being able to adapt to those new habits. And indeed, in your business life learning that in actual fact, we just said, a failure doesn't actually mean that everything's coming to an end, you just use it as an as a learning experience, if you can change your mindset. And you can understand where some of that's come from, you've got the power to do that.

Joe Templin 09:20

As Sun Tzu said, you know, 2000 plus years ago, he knows his enemy, and himself will ever be victorious. And essentially, you have three different selves and three different enemies going on simultaneously within your triune brain. And so you need to understand and utilise all of them. And if you can get them working in harmony, that's when you unlock your power. And you can do pretty awesome stuff.

Stuart Webb 09:43

Joe, love it. Joe, is there a particular book or a concept or programme that you think would add some value and I know there's a book currently over your left hand shoulder so I don't sure if you want to refer to that one in particular? Yeah.

Joe Templin 09:56

This is my book. So obviously I want people to buy this book because You know, that lets me buy beer and be able to, you know, go do more research and stuff like that. So everyday excellence.com they can get the book every day excellence. And obviously, I'm going to encourage people to do that. But when we were talking earlier about great books, it made me think about all the books that I've consumed because reading or audiobooks or what have you are all consuming information over the past few years. And the two that really rise to mind. One is the E Myth Revisited by Michael Gerber. I saw him speak decades ago, and it was like Sam Kinison, you know, on steroids, he was absolutely insane, but awesome. So anybody who is working in any sort of business or sales capacity, that is about how to systematise. And when you systematise, you free up time, so that you can go do other things. So that allows you to go run the ultra marathons, or learn guitar or spend more time with your sweetie or whatever, because you're able to do your business much more efficiently. And the other big one is Mark Manson's book, The Subtle Art of not giving up. And that one is, at this point, I think one of the leading self help sales books in terms of sales. And it's all about resource allocation. About you only have so many apps so much that you can care about. And so if you can allocate it towards the things that are most important to you, you're going to not be bothered by Little things like, Oh, we got snow start. Okay, roll with the punches deal with, oh, you know what this happened? Not a big deal. Because I'm concerned about this, well, this is building your business, or again, your special needs kid, you know, to develop properly, or getting through that issue with your relationship, as Nietzsche said, for man has a strong enough why he will overcome any how. And the subtle art of not giving up is about understanding yourself understanding that world screwed up, because once you understand that you can move forward. And from that point, being able to allocate your bandwidth to the most important areas of your life.

Stuart Webb 12:19

Absolutely love it. Brilliant, brilliant recommendations. Absolutely. really buy into those. A Joe, you know, I've asked you a bunch of questions. And I guess there's one question that you're currently thinking, why isn't he talked about this? Or what is it he hasn't yet mentioned? So I'm not going to throw open to you? What is the question that you would have liked me to have asked despite I failed to do, obviously. And then once you've asked the question, what would the answer be? Otherwise, we'll all be sitting here for the next several weeks, wondering what that answer will be. So what is that question? So the

Joe Templin 12:47

question that I get really often is, you know, how are you like this? Why are you like this? Because I've got a lot of friends who hated me when they first met because they're like, No, there's no way this is an act. Nobody's like this. And you know what my friends from grad school, who's now like Dean of a school, literally said that you she's like, there's no way a human being is like this. And I am like this is Liang talks about in his true self false self model, which is a very interesting read. I don't waste time with illusions. Yes, I write poetry and stuff like that. And I can really use words to spin stuff up. But I am who I am. And is straight on through by not telling lies, especially to yourself, you don't have to waste any energy. And in going back to that Mark Manson allocation of apps, it then allows you to have more resources. And you got to remember life is a gift. This is a wonderful world that we Armstrong and I burned the candle at both ends and in the middle of flame throne. And the reason why is when I was 10 years old, I died. No flatline, floating up bright lights, the whole nine yards big, deep James Earl Jones voice and all that. And I came back home. And so that's the reason why I've been able to work world championships in martial arts, and run ultra marathons and write over a dozen books and get more degrees than a thermometer and play Legos with kids. And you know, take time to watch butterflies and all these things. Because I don't screw around. And I am true to who I am what I am and dedicated to being the best version that I can be of Me, so that I can then bring that out of other individuals. And so there's an old Irish saying, a good friend is the best mirror that you can have. And the best friend that we can actually have is ourselves because we can be true to ourselves. So if you can do that you can really unlock your potential. And you can add what I don't find.

Stuart Webb 15:06

Joe, I wish I could get that spirit of wanting to, to not waste time into more people because I work occasionally with students. And I worry so much about the fact that students spend half their life worrying about wasting money, but never think about time, they never ever considered time. And the one thing that I say to them on so many occasions, and they look at me as if I'm insane, is you can always get more money, you will never, ever have more time. So use time with intention and feed, your, your, your, your, your excellent and, and, and starve your distractions and they look at me as if I'm insane, because, you know, they never ever focus on those things. It is a brilliant message you've got in order to sort of tell people, you will not get this period of time back ever. So use it with intention and make it your absolute focus.

Joe Templin 16:02

I wish I was a college student again, there's so much cool stuff to learn, experience and do yo turn off the TV and go actually experience it. Have people read stories about you and your adventures, instead of watching somebody else with them.

Stuart Webb 16:18

Brilliant, brilliant. Joe, this has been such a really fascinating conversation. And thank you so much for spending just a few minutes with us talking about it. I really would like to encourage all of the listeners at the moment go to everyday hyphen excellence.com forward slash excellence, hyphen shop or just go to everyday hyphen excellence from just read some of the stuff that Joe's got on there. Fascinating stuff, fascinating thinking, really encourage you to go and probe around and have a look. And I just also like to bring to your attention our newsletter because that's how you get to hear about interesting people like Joe and get to see the results of these conversations come back to you through the podcast. And that's link dot the complete approach.co.uk forward slash newsletter that link dot complete approach.co.uk forward slash newsletter. Joe, it has been an absolute pleasure to be here talking with you for just a few minutes today. Thank you so much for your time. I appreciate you're in the middle of a blizzard at the moment. I've got the halo briefly stopped, but I suspect it's coming back. So we'll we'll muddle through. We'll have a brilliant day because of it. Thank you very much for your time.

Joe Templin 17:28

Stuart, thank you for the opportunity to be excellent and grow today.

Stuart Webb 17:31

And thank you very much for that Joe

Who is Richard?

Richard is an award-winning voice actor working with Your Script, Telling your Brand Story to Deliver Clear, Articulate, Warm and Engaging Results. My Story Telling Process will Assess Your Script to deliver :🎤 What is important, what needs to be emphasized? 🎤 What is the script trying to portray? 🎤 Is it informational, instructional or a warning, 🎤 A call to action, an invitation to participate or purchase? 🎤 To whom am I speaking, where are they, why is this information important to them? 🎤 What might be their reactions and how do I incorporate those into the telling of the story? 🎤 Who am I and why am I imparting this information?

Key Takeaways

Where do you get your voice from? 0:00

What are the problems that you help companies solve? 1:48

Working with people who have no idea what they’re doing. 3:38

What drew you into the voice acting life? 8:30

The importance of thinking about the customer’s problem. 11:50

Ai speech or text-to-speech. 15:11

We can bring the emotion and passion. 16:48

Stuart’s thoughts on the robotic voice. 18:35

Valuable Free Resource or Action

listen to Richard’s demo at https://voiceactingmagic.com

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page : https://scientificvaluebuildingmachine.online

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

voice, richard, narration, medical, message, voice actor, ai, people, listen, question, training, record, cartoons, demos, fantastic, scottish, elearning, voiceover, various parts, script

SPEAKERS

Richard Crossman, Stuart Webb

Richard Crossman 00:00

Hi

Stuart Webb 00:20

Hi, and welcome back to it's not rocket science five questions over coffee. I'm here with my coffee. Probably had too much of that already. Actually Richard is here with me Richard is a voice acting magic maker. I'm gonna say that I love the I Love the Doctor Who thing we've got going on so far. Richard. That's brilliant. Richard got an amazing career and range of voices as well to go with it. So I'm delighted to have you on the podcast. Richard, welcome to It's not rocket science. Five questions over coffee. Thank you so much. I'm so happy to be here. We have to get into the voices before we even started, didn't we?

Richard Crossman 00:58

Sorry, Stuart. I couldn't resist. Richard,

Stuart Webb 01:01

you've got a such a fantastic range of voices. I'd like to start by asking you where they come from before we get into the into the five questions because you've demonstrated to me so many voices in the past when we've talked what where do they all come from? Where's the inspiration?

Richard Crossman 01:17

That's a really good question. Some of them come from family. I have Scottish and English Heritage. So I have those accents that come sort of naturally to me. I'm also a trained opera singer. And so I have French and Italian as well. I was spent a number of years in a French classical kitchen as a cook and a chef and a pastry chef. So I have that French coming with me as well. And other stuff I've just sort of created as time has gone along. Having listened to cartoons and all kinds of radio dramas and all that sort of stuff, I can come up with a voice. I wanted to be the villain today.

Stuart Webb 02:05

Richie fantastic. Listen, tell me about the sort of people you work for, what are the what are the problems they have that you're trying to help them solve?

Richard Crossman 02:14

Well, the main problem is trying to get their message out. They want to get their brand out there, they want to get an idea of what they do and who they are or what sort of services and products they offer, or they want people to learn more about them. And then there's also the the client who wants to do internal training with staff. So I do a lot of that much of my work is corporate facing. So not a lot of it is out there in the public, because it's proprietary. I do a lot of elearning stuff, training of staff, and so on and so forth. So that's that's kind of where they are. They're trying to get their message, whether it's an internal message or an external message, and that's when I do my best to help them with.

Stuart Webb 03:05

And you've got a fairly nifty sideline there as sort of working with medical practitioners, because you're one of the few people I know that actually understand all of those deeply scientific Latin names in order to sort of get that message across, which is a pretty unique skill.

Richard Crossman 03:20

Yeah, I did one couple of weeks ago. It's a new drug called Zobo. rituximab relating to gastro esophageal junction adenocarcinoma. So I think I can throw that around in my mouth fairly easily.

Stuart Webb 03:38

Don't we all have to have to worry about that one. So that's a it is really fantastic that you you bring that? Do you find that you're constantly having to work with people who have tried sort of, well, let's take an example of a medical drug company that have done their best to sort of produce their own sort of promotional video, and even half the people working for them, I've got no idea how to pronounce that particular word. And they've eventually sort of given in and sort of found somebody like yourself to sort of help them out. And then you've got to sort of educate them on the fact that it would have been cheaper if they started that way in the first place. Well, I'm

Richard Crossman 04:12

not so sure how many people have tried it on their own first because I generally get them at the point where it's like, we need to hire a voice actor. Right? So what they've done before that I have no idea but I get everything from medical studies done in universities or research labs down to the medical disclaimer at the bottom of a television commercial you know, if you're pregnant if you do this and if you have that if you have that you shouldn't take this please consult your doctor and also, I work with companies who create medical equipment new new tools for dentists and doctors and and so on and I do the explainer videos on how to use those or how they came about and you know, what was the reason for their for their creation?

Stuart Webb 04:58

Do you know it It's, it's it's it's amazing that we even have to have the discussion about why you why you get involved in the first place. But I guess I guess I'll ask it, you know, there are there are people out there who and I know because you know, I've come across the, the the narrate your own video is not always particularly successful because you get the pacing, right, don't you that is the one thing that I think most of us really struggle with, without the sort of training in terms of acting and singing that you've got, we all really struggle to get the pacing, right, when it comes to sort of explain what we do. And we can we don't get the the excitement necessarily, you bring all of that to the video, don't you?

Richard Crossman 05:42

Well, that's what I try and bring. And sometimes I'm allowed to do what they call a self directed session where they send me the script, I prepare it, record it, send it in, and they like it, or they don't, and we have to redo or whatever. And that doesn't happen very often. The redo part, I may have to fix a word or something, but it's rare that I have to redo the whole thing. And then the other side of the coin is a directed session where I'm recording with somebody on Zoom or in some other form, you know, stream yard or whatever. So that they're right, they're directing me as I go. Letting me know that, you know, this is the the attitude we want, this is the vibe we want. And you know, can you take this a little faster? Can you slow it down? Oops, you made a mistake, in the words, you inverted words. Which is which is great, because it means they have exactly what they want when we're finished.

Stuart Webb 06:35

Brilliant. Tell me I mean, I think I'm going to do it now where can we find out more about your sort of work? And I hope that I've got the right thing here. I'm going to put up a a website there. What What can we do when we get onto that website? What can we find? What help can you give us to understand how you help people

Richard Crossman 06:50

with voice acting magic.com is the is the website, I have several domains, but that's the main one. And everything else comes into there. Basically, on that website, there is a sampler of sample player of a number of my demos in political spots in elearning. In medical narration, in commercial work in I missed one narration, that's the one I was looking for, for documentary or whatever it is. And you can listen to various parts, various samples and demos or parts of those demos, and decide whether or not I'm the voice you want. There's there's character samples up there. And if you go to write on that, that's on the homepage. And then if you go to other pages, you will learn more about who I am, what I do what I've done, who my agents are representing me in various parts of the world. And you'll also hear some other demos that I haven't put on the player. For instance, one of my demos is a reading of a section of the first chapter of Harry Potter in full scale Scottish dialect.

Stuart Webb 08:01

Oh wonderful. wonder are you going to do this? Are you going to do the Scottish voice first now I don't know whether or not I can even cope with Harry Potter being Scottish but it must be worth a listen.

Richard Crossman 08:14

Well, you know I do provide voiceover for business explainers social media promotional videos, telephone answering systems and stuff, training videos if you want something like that. And also costs us a bottle of McAllen, 50 year old

Stuart Webb 08:29

Richie. There must have been a book or a course which really started you to understand and get you into the into the voicing voiceover. way of thinking what was it that really drew you into this life?

Richard Crossman 08:43

I have been enamoured with VoiceOver in cartoons since I was a child. But I didn't understand what it was at the time. I just knew I loved all the voices, you know, Mel Blanc and his 300 characters, the Looney Tunes, you know, and the Hanna Barbera and all of those from way back in the 1600s or whenever it was I was born. And as I got older, I understood what was going on. And as an actor. You in film and television, I started to look at ways to get in. And before COVID Everything was done in Studio, you had to travel to the studio to record. There was no such thing as a home studio. For the vast majority. There were a few artists who had their own studios but not not the vast majority. And getting in was extremely expensive. demos were expensive training was expensive. And it just wasn't something I put my focus on at that point, although I still had the the pathway open. And then in 2019 I met a fellow who was a voice actor for an animated television series. And he and I got chatting and I discovered he had at a studio in the hometown that I lived in, and he was doing courses. So I went in and did some studying with him, did my first demo, and then started looking for other voice coaches and other training that I could get and found some fabulous stuff. And I've trained with some of the top voiceover artists in North America and in the UK. Over the past five years, I started doing it professionally three years ago. And I've done reasonably well, for the first three years, it's a long game, it's not something where you go and pick up a microphone and say, Tomorrow, I'm going to make a million dollars, it doesn't work that way. unless somehow or you get really, really, really lucky.

Stuart Webb 10:41

Well, that would be the story of actors as well wouldn't know.

Richard Crossman 10:44

Exactly, exactly. And one of the main things I do eight, almost 80% of my time is spent marketing. Yeah. Marketing myself to various production companies and video videographers and, you know, elearning companies and medical companies and everything else. And I had to create a brand, which the first one we created didn't work for me, as well as I thought it might. So about a year in, we changed it to the voice acting magic, which it is now. We changed the colours, we changed the logo, we changed everything. And that has proven to be very, very beneficial to me. And I also have a secondary website, that is only my medic, medical narration stuff. And that's your medical narration.com. And that's a very different branding, from what my voice acting magic is. Because for commercials and animation and all of that stuff, it tends to be a lighter brand. But for the voice actor for the medical narration, it's a more professional, professional brand and professional looking website.

Stuart Webb 11:50

So you know, I think that's a really important lesson there, Richard, and I'm gonna sort of hijack it a little bit and just sort of talk about that. But that's a really important lesson I think a lot of business owners tend to miss which is, you know, they don't think about the problem that their customer has. And for you, you are thinking about the medical narration, which is, you know, to serious problem. It's somebody who doesn't want to think about cartoons, because that they're not, they're not, that's not their problem. They're trying to get across a very serious, heavy subject. And so reaching out to them with the wrong message or reaching out to them with the wrong solution, which is what you were doing is not it's not helpful. It's counterproductive, isn't it, and you had to adapt your message to help them understand how you can help them solve their problem.

Richard Crossman 12:37

One of the first things that I discussed with my medical narration coaches, was a change in branding for medical narration. It was almost even before we started doing any work on pronunciation and delivery and telling the story and finding the story. It was you need a different brand.

Stuart Webb 12:57

Yeah, interesting.

Richard Crossman 12:58

It's already it's worked. Well.

Stuart Webb 13:00

Just before we come to my final question, I just want to give you a chance to highlight one other particular skill that you've got, which, for those people that are currently watching. Rather than just listening to this, you have a certain look, shall we say that you have a certain look, which, combined with a slightly red or a suit, would perhaps go down? Well, a particular time of the year. That's something that I think you must, you must enjoy doing.

Richard Crossman 13:28

And Stuart, I can tell you, you're on the nice list with just a little bit of naughty.

Stuart Webb 13:34

That's where I like to be Richard. That's exactly where I like to be.

Richard Crossman 13:37

Yes, I do. I've done well. I played Santa professionally for 35 years, but it's actually in my blood. The very first acting gig I had was a recitation of the poems was the night before Christmas. Oh, fantastic. At the age of three years old. Oh, fantastic. And we have we, we this year discovered a photograph of me in one of my mother's albums, at 10 years old dressed in a Santa suit handing out Christmas gifts on Christmas morning. So it's, it's been in my blood my entire life.

Stuart Webb 14:09

You know, you know, I would never have guessed a 10 year old could develop such a such an impressive beard, but well no, so that's pretty impressive.

Richard Crossman 14:21

Well, I'm actually 16 112 Christmas Day, but I've really enjoyed that aspect of of my career as I have enjoyed all my, all the aspects of my careers. I think I'm a number 13 Now or 14. And since COVID, has started it's been really wonderful because I've been able to do virtual visits all over the world, New Zealand, Australia, South America, North America, the UK and Europe. And I've two years ago, I started doing video Christmas cards, where I would talk to the client find out what it is they wanted Santa Claus to say as a greeting. Then we record it and they can do it. they want with it posted on the Internet, put it on YouTube, send it out as a link or send it out as a video or whatever, to whoever, whoever and how many people, they want to do it. And it's gone over very, very well with the clients. So

Stuart Webb 15:10

that's fantastic. That's absolutely brilliant. I love it. I love it. Richard, you know, we're coming to the end of this because I don't want to take up any of your really valuable time when you've got marketing to go and do. But tell me, there must be one question that you currently are thinking I wish you'd asked me about such and such. And so I'm going to give you the opportunity to tell me the question I should have asked you. And then whenever you've asked the question, you better answer it otherwise none of us we won't sleep tonight as we wonder what it is you would have said? Well, one

Richard Crossman 15:39

of the big things that's in the mind of pretty much every voice actor right now is AI speech or text to speech. It's it's a really difficult situation that's that's starting to poke its head up. And one of our voice actors actually had her voice stolen by tick tock, wow. A couple of years ago, and there was a huge outcry from the voiceover community. And she actually filed a lawsuit against tick tock and, and one. So there's, there's a lot of stuff happening right now with AI. A lot of companies are trying to put text to speech together, because it's cheaper, quote, unquote, than hiring a voice actor. But what we try and educate the clients to is that by having a real voice, you are investing in your project, not just making an expense, because it does improve. If I hear and even before I became a voice actor, if I hear artificial voices, I just tone out almost immediately. But we can bring the emotion we can bring passion, we can bring all kinds of nuances to a script that AI can't.

Stuart Webb 16:57

Richard, that is fascinating. I joined a group of academics and senior business level advisors, most most Fridays for what we call our Friday coffee. And you know, for the last four weeks now, despite everything that's going on, I mean, we've got we've got one UN ambassador, as part of the group and several professors of universities, every single one of them was bringing up how AI is affecting their, their, their their industry at the moment and the impact of AI. And do you know, the one thing that seems to be coming through on all of it is the fact that we have to remember that as humans, we still have got unique capabilities and unique characteristics, computers still don't have, and maybe they will start to develop some of it. But the thing is, we still have our humanity and we should learn to work with our humanity rather than sort of kicking back against the computer. So emphasise the positive of being a human, I guess is the message behind that, isn't it?

Richard Crossman 17:58

I actually did a script two days ago, no Friday it was. And part of that one statement in the script, which is stuck in my head is that AI will replace 800 million jobs by 2030. And I have a sneaking suspicion, that's a conservative estimate the way things are going. But it's going to be a very interesting few years as we go through that and realise what AI can do, and what we still need humans to do. And it's just going to be an interesting time, a difficult time for a lot of people. But an interesting one.

Stuart Webb 18:35

I will only say having heard a video posted recently that I was very interested in watching. The voice that was behind it was very obviously robotic quite quickly. The emotion was missing from the narration of what was a really interesting topic. And I was very quickly turned off from the listening to the video, because I was distracted by the rather robotic and cold voice and had it had a human being narrated with the warmth that you can bring with the interest with rise and fall of the voice and all the intonation. I might have actually stayed with that video to the end. But unfortunately, I clicked off in about 28 seconds. And that I'm afraid probably defeated the object to the person that put that video together in order to try and save a few pennies. And yeah, I didn't get to the end of the message and didn't take in what they were trying to teach me. So you know, there are still very large numbers of people out there who I hope are taking that on board and thinking about that before they start to turn away from human beings and what they can bring to their video production.

Richard Crossman 19:44

I am a robot from the satellites surrounding the Earth at the moment and I am asking you to please listen to human voices rather than me.

Stuart Webb 19:54

Interestingly, even trying to sound like a robot Richard, you failed miserably and still sounded like a human be just the message, we want it brilliant. Richard, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us, I really do think you could not do better than go to voice acting magic.com That's voice acting magic.com and listen to some of the great accents that Richard puts across on there, they really are quite fantastic. And if you need, if you need somebody to come and visit you in your home, come come around November, December. And you would like somebody to give you a special message, or here's the man to come and contact you because he does a really wonderful sideline in helping you to still believe, you know, I'm I have now passed the threshold when I shouldn't believe. And it's quite difficult to believe that he's not the real man. So, Richard, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. I really appreciate it.

Richard Crossman 20:49

It's been my pleasure, my friend. I'm so happy you invited me to join you today.

Stuart Webb 20:55

And if you would like to get onto our mailing list so that you see an email that comes out both Mondays and Tuesdays that lets you know who's going to be with us on it's not rocket science five questions of coffee this week. This is the link to go to which is https colon slash slash TCA dot FYI TCA your FYI forward slash subscribe, get onto the list. Come and find out who you are going to be listening to this week. And join us live on the recording. Richard, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. Much appreciated. I'll let you get back to your day job now of making people happy with the voices you produce.

Richard Crossman 21:33

It has truly been a pleasure, Stuart, thank you so much for the invitation.

Stuart Webb 21:38

It's wonderful to hear those voices. It really is

Who is Elaine?

Elaine uses DISC Profiling alongside laboratory and online health assessments to find the root cause of your health challenge Multi award winning Best Health and Wellbeing Mentor 2022 – Business Excellence Awards Brainz Magazine Top 500 Global Award Winner 2022 in recognition of my "entrepreneurial success, achievements, and dedication to helping others".

Best Speech & Health Mentor of the Year 2022 (Nottinghamshire): Elaine Godley- European Business Awards (EU Business News)

Best Disc Profiling Therapy Company – Europe - European Business Awards (EU business news) See more at https://discplus.health

Key Takeaways

Who is Elaine Godley and what does she do? 0:21

The pressures of working in the legal field. 2:11

How did you become interested in nutrition? 3:47

How to be proactive about your health and wellness. 4:54

Looking at your behaviour and health. 6:28

Where to start with a cancer diagnosis? 8:23

Elaine’s journey from leading law firm to helping others. 9:37

How to get in touch with Elaine. 11:19

Valuable Free Resource or Action

see elainegodley.com

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

https://youtube.com/live/ZS6SBqCfF68

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

behaviour, understand, behavioural, elaine, health, 12th, programme, burnout, disk, people, cancer, day, work, books, march, home, team members, show notes, lawyers, cancer diagnosis

SPEAKERS

Elaine Godley, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb 00:21

Hi and welcome back to five questions over coffee. My apologies we're a little bit late starting this one that's due to my inability to understand my own computer. But that's behind us. I have today with me a really lovely guest. I'm really looking forward to this conversation. So Elaine Godley Elaine is a multi award winning health and wellbeing, mentor who uses disk as part of her part of a work if you know disk, you will understand how that how that works. She's really been transforming team effectiveness, health and wellbeing for professional service firms. And she is a multi award winner, including a brains magazine top global 500. Mentor, I'm really looking forward to this conversation. Welcome to the podcast, Elaine.

Elaine Godley 01:05

Thank you lucky to be here. Thank you for the invitation.

Stuart Webb 01:09

No problem. So let's start by trying to understand who it is your help what what are the what are the what are the people that you are looking to try and help with their health and well being problems?

Elaine Godley 01:21

Well, that's not doable in marketing terms. So I've narrowed it down to lawyers and accountants, in particular, because I know from firsthand how difficult it is, in the current environment, how stressful their environment is, any time of year, lawyers and accountants always have problems. So they are my total market these days, although I do help private individuals.

Stuart Webb 01:48

And of course, I think you were at one stage, somebody who understood the law by taking a law degree, didn't you? I didn't take a law degree. And Stuart, I took her I have a master's in I have an MBA in legal practice from Nottingham law school. And I have been chief executive of a few firms and organisations

Elaine Godley 02:08

both in in legal and accounting.

Stuart Webb 02:11

So you certainly understand the understand the pressures that the search people are under because of your background.

Elaine Godley 02:17

I do indeed. And it's 70 or so from the inside out. So I know how to speak legal and accounting speak, we say,

Stuart Webb 02:25

somebody needs to be able to speak legally. So tell me what are the sorts of problems you find that people that you help so top lawyers, top accountants have got and how they try to help themselves before they seek the sort of advice you give.

Elaine Godley 02:40

And a lot of them suffer with burnout and overwhelm. They're constantly told, Oh, we know, by their employers, we think the world of our team members, and we look after your view, this hack and that, but very often, they're not proactive, not proactively looking after their, their team members. And they'll provide methodologies that they don't score, you know, a foot rub or a gym membership or something like that. But that's kind of after the event, a lot of these people who are so dedicated to their work, they've got their head down the time their desk, they've just pressure upon pressure upon pressure, and they get the bond and their health coke goes. So my aspect these days is merging disc behavioural profiling. So the behaviour aspect with the psychology and the health results. So that's how I've ended up kind of blending the two together.

Stuart Webb 03:35

Can you describe that to us? What what is it you? What is it you do with disc that help people to understand that and now, have you applied that within your own within your life as well?

Elaine Godley 03:47

Well, I was, I was running. I was managing partner of a local London Authority, and suddenly years ago, and so I finished the project. And then the next day, I got the next month, rather, I got the breast cancer diagnosis. I've subsequently had more different versions of cancer, including stage four. So I learned in nutrition, diet, lifestyle, all that kind of stuff, in addition to using disk in and merging it in disk. Previously, I've used the disk model. So disclose. I'm aware it's a lot of behavioural profiling, if you're Personality Typing, it's not about people in boxes. It's about looking at what ageing characteristics are. So for example, people who run law firms and accounting firms are typically different behavioural types to those who are actually doing the work. And there's often a mismatch in communication. So I've used just in terms of helping the teams understand one another, helping the bosses understand the team members in every which way. And I've identified patterns. So when somebody is out of alignment, when they're just behavioural profile patterns for themselves at home, is out of alignment with how they're behaving in the workplace. That's a guarantee for health problems, though I can look at somebody's spiritual profile now, and I can tell you what the likelihood is of them being ill, or they're likely to deal with if reach burnout if they've exceeded burnout. And of course, I had the health strategies now to, I'm not just saying, oh, you know, this person doesn't look very well, or whatever. It's, it's an open for conversation. So it's not a medical diagnosis or anything fancy like that. But I've got the health strategies with my other aspects of training, where I can help people unravel if they have got difficulties. So it's about being proactive.

Stuart Webb 05:39

It's great, great line, is there any advice you can give the audience that, that that will help them to think about how they are proactive about their health and their well being, including understanding their own behaviour?

Elaine Godley 05:55

Well, first of all, looking at how different potentially their behaviour is at home from in the workplace, did they put on a suit or when some cases people put on a uniform, and they'd behave differently? They put on like a public mask. And a lot of people do this without even realising they're doing it. So think about what your behaviour is like at home, what your behaviour is, like, is it work? Are you building up stresses and strains at work, and then going home to the family or the kicking the dog or whatever you do? So look at how your behaviour potentially is changing? And are you asking yourself, are you an element? Ideally, to your view, are what you see is what you get? Very often, that's not what we say. So look at your own behaviour. Look at your health situation. Are you drinking too much? That's a typical one with lawyers in particular, particularly litigator so are you thinking too much? Are you eating rubbish food? Are you taking exercise? Are you moving at all? I use it as your school day. And are you suffering with migraines? Do you join steak? If you've just taken inventory of your of your body really? And the because the answers are all there in the body, the body knows the body will tell you when something's wrong, but very often we don't listen.

Stuart Webb 07:12

Absolutely, right. Absolutely right. I'm going to put a link down at the bottom of this page. So that you can see some information about where you can go and read more about Elaine and her fascinating history. So if you have a look at here, which is Elaine godley.com. That's Elaine godly e l a i n e godly g o d l ey.com. And if you go to this page about underscore us, you'll see some great information about Elaine and what she does and how she helps people. So Elaine, I hope you don't mind I shall put that into the show notes so that people can go and have a look into your website and learn a bit more about the sort of thing you do to help people. So Elaine, is there a particular you mentioned your your cancer diagnosis? Was there a particular book or course or programme that set you understanding how your health and well being could be affected by your the food and the things that you do and eat to help you overcome some of those troubles that you mentioned?

Elaine Godley 08:23

There are so many books is difficult to know where to start. When you're given a cancer diagnosis, it's It's scary. It's very scary, particularly when they say stage four, and you've got less than a year to live, which is what happened to me in 2015. I previously had to two versions, I had different types of breast cancer previously. So I'd already had any kind of what to do. I've, I support a number of different small charities, I don't support big charities, and then marketing budgets and fancy travel and whatnot. I believe in small charities, and there's one called cancer active.com. And that is an amazing resource. So rather than recommend a book, I'd recommend this resource because the creator of that site Chris woollens has written a number of books, or any number of his books will tell you what to do and how to get started in the cancer field. Obviously, contact me

Stuart Webb 09:23

contact that cancer active.

Elaine Godley 09:27

Yes, cancer active.com. And as I say, there's various there's research articles, there's books, there's all kinds of information on there, which is really really useful.

Stuart Webb 09:37

Terrific. I shall also make sure that goes into the show notes look like it's been really interesting hearing about your your journey from from leading law firms, accounting practices through to somebody who's now trying to help those people are doing exactly the same job. And there must be a question that's currently on your mind that I haven't yet actually asked you which you're itching for me to do. So I'm I'm gonna just now throw open to you. What is the question that I should have asked, which I haven't? And then obviously, once you've, you've made know what that question is, you'll need to answer it. Otherwise, we'll all be left hanging for forever.

Elaine Godley 10:12

Yeah, so I suppose the question might be, as you know, what do I do currently have I've merged with the disk and their behaviour together? How do I actually help people, and she's on Long live in golf, as you know, Stuart. So I've got a very nice lifestyle here. So I do everything I do online, which mate means that my support is cost effective. And you see, nobody needs to leave home. And I've got a number of training programmes that I'm in the process of creating, which aren't on any of the websites at the moment. But do contact me I've got a course coming up on the 12th of March, which is a 10 week programme, looking at all the areas is 10 areas that people get themselves into trouble with, and those 10 areas, and we will be going into deep dive discussions on a Sunday evening, starting from March the 12th. From six till 830. And that's fascinating, okay, and you can reverse Iran's illness or how you can avoid it.

Stuart Webb 11:19

I think we're gonna have to try and promote that one for your land, because it sounds like that sort of thing we know a number of people should be getting involved with. So that's the 12th of March. This point, if you're listening to this, after the 12th of March, obviously, you can have to catch up but the 12th of March 2023.

Elaine Godley 11:37

Yes, absolutely. So obviously, email me or LinkedIn lingo view on LinkedIn. And I can send

Stuart Webb 11:47

it once again. Oh, make sure that that that is in the show notes. So that's Elaine, Elaine godly.com. I think if I remember right, and your email address later, to Elaine, Elaine godly.com. So I should make sure that's in there. Elaine, thank you so much. Thank you for spending a few minutes with us. I appreciate you breaking away from the lovely life you've got there in Portugal and the dreadful the dreadful difficulty it must be to sort of tear yourself away from doing something fun. And come inside and speak to us on a call like this. Thank you ever so much. I'm really looking forward to seeing how you develop those those courses because I think that'd be a really great resource for us to all understand exactly how to do better with our mental and physical health to enjoy pushing forward. If you've managed to avoid I managed to survive Morula stage four cancer for more than a year. You've done remarkably well, haven't you? And I'm sure there are many doctors around the world who are still looking at you and wondering quite how they can copy everything you've been doing. So it'd been really great spending some time listening to you and talking to you about this. Thank you.

Elaine Godley 12:49

I did it in three months and that was eight years ago. Example.

Stuart Webb 12:55

It can be done. It can be done. encourage everybody to find out how by following what Elena is doing at Lane. godley.com. Lane, thank you so much for spending some time with us. I really appreciate it

Who is Tom?

Tom Spyt was a CardioThoracic Surgeon and University Professor but since his retirement has turned his experience to becoming an experienced Life Coach and Hypnotherapist. He helps people facing career change or retirement and those concerned with mental health issues.

Key Takeaways

Trauma is something that happens in our lives. 2:50

Lack of confidence comes from childhood trauma. 5:06

How do you help people with mental illness? 7:08

Thoughts create feelings and feelings lead to actions. 10:17

Engaging with thoughts about the past. 11:39

The metaphor of a railway station. 13:38

We are all experiencing changes in our mood. 17:16

What book or course would you recommend to the audience? 19:14

How to change your identity and purpose. 21:24

Valuable Free Resource or Action

http://thekindnessproject.co.uk/book/

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

people, thoughts, trauma, tom, important, coaching, life, spending, veterans, talking, experience, consciousness, metaphor, brilliant, retirement, psychologist, depression, understand, engage, mailing list

SPEAKERS

Stuart Webb, Tom Spyt

Stuart Webb  00:18

Hi and welcome to It's not rocket science, five questions over coffee, I have my coffee in front of me at the moment I hope that Tom has as well. Today we're going to be meeting Tom spy Tom is a fascinating character, Tom will obviously give us some of his own history. But he was a cardiothoracic surgeon and professor, and spent a lot of his time helping medical students and his patients. But at retirement, he switched his focus and started to think about those people who are facing career change, retirement and mental health issues. And he's retrained as somebody who really thinks deeply about how those mental health issues affect those people. So, Tom, I'm really grateful for you to spend a few minutes with us, thank you so much for this, I'm thoroughly looking forward to this conversation.

Tom Spyt  01:06

Thank you, Stuart, I appreciate this opportunity. So because you, you said, I am recently retired cardiac surgeon, it did not happen immediately that I started to do what I do now. Retirement for professionals is, can be a challenge, because it is associated with the loss of identity and purpose. It doesn't only happen at the retirement, it happens also, when somebody is made redundant. If somebody comes to the end of the service in armed forces, these people whose identity and purpose and that's very often leads to a degree of depression. For me, and it took me about a year to to find myself again, I will tell you more later how I done it. So now

Stuart Webb  02:17

so what is it so what Tom, before you launch into that what what is it that you find that the people you help now have tried to do to address these issues on their on their own without any form of help and and how has that potentially not helped them?

Tom Spyt  02:34

Well, this takes her takes me to a little bit more to what they do. And as I said, as you introduced me, I deal with mental well being. Now trauma is something which is common. I work with veterans, British and Americans. And it's not about Battlefield trauma, you just trauma which happens in our lives. And it affects one in three of us, in one form or the other. And yet, this is the most the good note denied and belittled cause of human suffering. The difficulty here is that people we have a very different trauma. So one person may be look trivial for the other one. However, it's still very important. It doesn't matter how it feels for observers. What's important how it feels for an individual. Difficulty with for people with trauma is that there is a general reluctance to talk about it because it is ignored. It's denied. And furthermore, people who experience trauma quite often feel that they are responsible for it. The deal really caused it examples childhood trauma, or childhood abuse and for the abuser which happens so often. For instance in like rape, women who experience that feel responsible or they are made responsible for what happens to them. So the difficulty to reach out. Consequently, long term consequences of trauma are devastating and life long lasting example, a, quite a few of my veterans I work with, we just have Have them to transition from life in forces into civilian life. And they don't really often didn't know how to do it. Because they enlisted when they were still teenagers. Quite often in during conversations will turn, I discovered there were always who tell me eventually, oh, you know, I feel like impostor I, I can't do things I don't think I'm capable of. And what it is this lack of confidence comes from childhood. And this is a lack of closer relationship close bond between the primary caregiver, usually this biological mother doesn't have to be and a child. And the reason because the small person is doing our utmost to be loved to be closed, as if it's denied at this closeness. It starts doubting and doing my best. I can't do any anymore. And they grew up and it is it's not surprising. And I'm not put off by fact, when somebody who is in his 50s tells me, you know, do you think I really can get this job, we just say my dream job. So this is something important and you'll think about the extent of trauma, there's somebody in our family, amongst our friends or neighbours who suffered from this from from trauma. And also it will, you know, if your data comes from the United States, mainly, if one in five kids observed domestic violence in the one in the six, lift up, lived with the caregiver abusing alcohol. These are patterns, which will lead to inability to create to have loving relationships to continue domestic violence, Oh Is my father was doing it, it is okay for me to do it. Or it's okay to abuse children, girls in school or at latest later age. So these are issues which go far beyond Oh, just mental well being. That allows me to uncover a lot of areas, which that sort of intervention is not easily available. There's not enough psychologist or psychotherapist who can help me the circumstances. And of course, I'm not. I'm not securities, I'm very interested in psychiatry of trauma. And as a result of me studying it. And I'm certainly not a psychologist. So I hope that answers your question.

Stuart Webb  08:19

Tom, it's interesting that people suffer with this because of, of trauma in their childhood, how do you go about helping them to recognise and overcome this? What are the techniques

Tom Spyt  08:35

use not as technique is something which very few people know about. And what I'm going to tell you about is now there are rules how we all experience life, regardless of age, gender, race, language, culture, or religion. All eight billions of us experience life in exactly the same way. And the rules are constant, they always work like a gravity does. The others work even if we are not aware of them. So this simple explanation of how we experience life turns life's round, because it allows people to deal with depression and also with anxiety. How? What I'm talking about is three three principles. That's how we this cold in there in psychology are rare. I would say in the field of even psychotherapy. There are three principles principles of mind, consciousness and thought would be don't understand how important is how central is the thought, to our experience in life, we get an awful lot of thoughts during the day, about 10 to 30,000 of them, and they are all neutral. So there is no such a thing, oh, I keep on getting negative thoughts or I need to think positive. All thoughts to start neutral. And there's a metaphor out. You probably remember first time when you went to the cinema with your parents or siblings, very little person, and they were curious where the speakers are coming from, and eventually you turn back and you you notice this white flickering light? Well, to see the picture, there's got to be screen. And screen is a metaphoric description of consciousness or conscious awareness. And the picture is a thought, oh, pictures are just pictures to start. However, thoughts create feelings. There's no such a thing like, Oh, I feel one way or the other, if you look sad or depressed. Now there's got to be thought first. And the feelings lead to actions. And no actions, also some form of action. And all actions have caused the consequences we are responsible for. So when it comes to a depression, what is it? Well, actually, it's engaging with the thoughts about the past is 98. I was thinking about, Oh, that's such a fantastic job. And it's gone. How terrible it is. Yes, in this days, it felt terrible. I ended up being diagnosed with severe depression. Once I understood, there's actually this thoughts about the past, and the past is gone. I cannot undo it, I cannot make it any better. And that's how it is the same as with the future. I'm talking about anxiety, what is anxiety? It is engaging in thoughts about our imagination. Once we believe that the thought which came to our mind is true, wow, it becomes a reality. So what to do? Now some people say and when when I work with veterans who are very depressed, nearly suicidal, we talked about it. And I teach them how to get rid of those thoughts. Or let them go. Because those are like clouds, the paths? So how to do it from the in practical terms? Well, when you drive a car, you often listen to the music, some music, you like some music, you know? Like your thoughts? Well, you do belong to the musical station, you change it. There's no such thing that you become thoughtless. Immediately. next thought comes the other. If that doesn't appeal to you that sort of metaphor. Imagine yourself standing on the platform of busy railway station, like a new street in Birmingham. You're standing in trains stop in front of you, or things or thoughts, doors open. It doesn't mean that you go to a certain example which is third metaphor, which is appealing probably for the younger population is we all have got smartphones, and quite often we look at posts on the Facebook, Instagram or LinkedIn. And we spend about two or three seconds looking at the post and then we scroll so it comes into our mind. I noticed that I've seen it. I noticed thought about how fantastic was the past is gone. How fantastic moves, the relationship is gone. How close I was to my mother who passed away. Is this old true? But I don't have to engage in that sort of world. Who does how you Just a real practical advice. And that's how it works.

Stuart Webb  15:04

Tom, I love I love those analogies. And I love that you've given us such valuable free advice there in how not to engage in those self destructive thoughts. That's fantastic.

Tom Spyt  15:16

Well, it does. It does work, as I said to you. There's a lot is written on the rules of how we experience life. It is a term, which was coined by American philosopher called Sidney banks. And really, it is not a concept. It's not psychology or, or philosophy. That's the rules. And there's no way we can ignore them. Quite often, if Furthermore, it's possible to teach a little people about them, and they they understand it and understand it very well. Example. What's the consciousness? Well, consciousness is not binary. It's not that we are conscious or unconscious, of course, we've got to be conscious to, to be aware of the thoughts which come to our mind. However, consciousness has got the infinite number of levels. Like imagine a lift made out of glass, outside a skyscraper. And it goes up and down all day long, because that's what lifts to do. But it's the ground floor, it looks so the glass, it may not be necessarily quite nice picture of traffic, crowds, fumes. It may be some people you don't like the look of, but then it goes up. When it comes on, to the theatre, such as floor, you look through the same glass. Oh, it's so nice. I can see far away, it's peaceful and quiet. Well, as anything changed, it's exactly the same world. What it is what is important, the recognition of this is that we are all experiencing changes of our mood. Sometimes, we are in a not very good mood. And what is important to know that the moods are like, left, it will go up with a with us without us doing anything about it. There are certain conditions when it is impossible to make things better. If for instance, somebody is in a chronic, severe pain, that is impossible, without dealing with the pain first. What is what's the important when I was teaching this to my grandsons who were at the time, six and eight, and the next morning after our conversation, I was telling them, so what are you going to do if you are in a bad mood? Oh, and I think granddad is going to pass. So even the little people can understand that. And they can understand now, the importance of it is oh, they said there was a number of suicides among two teenage girls. Wow. How could they protect themselves? Understanding how we experience life that is the best protection and the only probably protection which comes from within not just regulating more and more different media. Yes, it is important is contributing. But for a teenager to understand that they what they experience may be just illusion.

Stuart Webb  19:12

Yes, yes. brilliant advice. I love it, Tom, that there must be a book or a course that you would recommend that the audience do some reading or thinking about that would help them to sort of understand some of what you've been talking about today. What What would you recommend?

Tom Spyt  19:31

I would recommend there is a American psychologist who spent a lot of time teaching people about it through a different programmes of crime prevention mainly. By the way I work with inmates. I correspond with them. And they are very responsive to what I have been talking about. They can rehabilitate not all of them, because some of them have got real psychopathic tendencies. And you cannot do anything to say government. But so what I would recommend, the author name is Jack pranskey. And the book to start with this, somebody should have told us, and it's a brilliant title. And when I read it, I thought somebody should have told me lie would have been so much easier. This book is also available in audio format. For those who, who prefer listening, because that's also very important to recognise that some of us are mostly visual, and some of us are predominantly auditory. That's helpful. I like audiobooks, because that makes going for a lot more interesting.

Stuart Webb  21:02

Brilliant stuff. Uh, Tom, I've asked you for questions. There must be a question that you think I should have asked, which I haven't. And so I'm now going to ask you to tell me the question that I should ask you, and then obviously, you're going to answer it for us and give us even more value?

Tom Spyt  21:24

Well, one of the things is, you could have asked me, How do you change? Like the question of someone who lost identity and purpose in life?

Stuart Webb  21:40

I do love the question.

Tom Spyt  21:44

Because that is there's a way and it's quite quick, easy way. And it's, it's the best is to do it in person, not always possible. So with the people who know. NLP, it's a, it's a more advanced than it would be, is possible to do it online. It's there is a different way of doing it. And that helps, helps people who are stuck as many of us are at some point in our lives. We don't need coaching all the time. However, any experience experienced there, any successful business person would have a coach from time to time. And then companies like Amazon provide free coaching for employees who wanted or encouraged it. And this, as I said, what I do with veterans, it's called mentoring, but in sent, in fact, it is it is coaching, too. So the mechanism already available. It's not a problem, the challenge of coaching is lack of awareness of how it works, and how it can benefit an individual.

Stuart Webb  23:13

Tom, Tom, I think you hit the nail on the head, so many people are not aware of what help they could get, and how they could overcome some of these and struggle too often on their own, don't they? And with that, I'm just going to put up this. scrolling across the bottom of the screen at the moment is where you can find more information about the sort of help that Tom gives. I'll just read it out for those people who are going to be listening to the audio. But it will be in the show notes. But it's www coaching and hypnosis. sanctuary.co.uk That's coaching and hypnosis. sanctuary.co.uk. Tom, you are a fascinating character with a fascinating history with some really brilliant things to say. I really do want to thank you so much for just spending a few minutes with us talking about some of this stuff. I know your time is valuable because you have so many people you're trying to help at the moment. So thank you so much for just spending a few minutes with us.

Tom Spyt  24:13

Oh, yeah, appreciate your station. Thank you, Stuart.

Stuart Webb  24:16

No problem Tom. Now, I'm just going to tell if you'd like to get onto our mailing list so that you can come and be sure that you get to catch up with really fascinating characters like Tom would you go to this link which is TCA dot FYI. So it's very simple TCA dot FYI, forward slash subscribe that gets you onto our mailing list. And we will email you once a week with who's gonna be on the link who's gonna be on the podcast this week. And also when it comes out as a further podcast, really interesting characters like Thomas spied, who will be he will be I'm sure. A valuable a valuable addition to your to your list if you can get on and look at his website. I'll just give you that one again, which is coaching and hypnosis. sanctuary.co.uk. Tom, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. I really do appreciate it. I know how valuable your time is. And I appreciate that you've been so willing to give so much value to people about how we can better address some of our some of our issues. So thank you so much.

Tom Spyt  25:24

Thank you, Stuart.

Stuart Webb  25:25

I'm just gonna play the intro. I look forward to seeing you all next week.

Who is Mark?

Mark is a leadership professional who has developed a unique tool. TeamLytica is a web-based team analytics tool that:

* Analyses and identifies a team’s strength indicators allowing focus to raise their performance through immediate actionable insights

* Is web-based, intuitive, simple and quick to complete with zero tech integration and instantly deployable – results in just twenty minutes

* Has recently launched but whose benefits are already being realised by companies such as Boeing, Lockheed Martin, and NatWest

* Has impactful and unique insights to improve team cohesion and actions to reduce stress and increase overall employee wellbeing

* Is purposely different and complementary to other solutions like staff surveys and psychometric profiling tools

* Allows for benchmarking and Team360 retests to help prove ROI on training spend

Key Takeaways

How do you offer value to your team? 2:28

Mark’s approach to measuring team cohesion. 4:12

Launching a self-serve platform. 5:30

How to get free stuff from the website? 6:50

Inspiration: Scouting. 9:07

Toxic masculinity and the core of gold. 10:47

Leaders need to be committed to their teams. 11:56

The importance of building trust in your team. 14:35

Valuable Free Resource or Action

https://www.teamlytica.com/solution/free/

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

https://youtube.com/live/tkshPCTe-Uo

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

team, people, mark, coach, litical, trainers, longer term, business, problem, psychometric, building, high performing teams, tool, spending, customers, report, leila, question, coffee, stress

SPEAKERS

Mark Hide, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb 00:08

Hi again and welcome back to it's not rocket science five questions over coffee I have, I've just admitted to mark actually, my coffee is going cold, I've got a fresh one in front of me. But that's another story that we will refresh later on. Mark, I know you got a nice fresh cup of coffee in front of you. So, welcome to the podcast. Let's enjoy 1520 minutes talking about team dynamics, team cohesion, over a cup of coffee mark from Team litical. Welcome to the podcast.

Mark Hide 00:37

Thank you, oh, my coffee is warm and gorgeous.

Stuart Webb 00:41

As it should be, as it should be. So Mark, sort of talk us through the problem that you are looking to help businesses with and and the sort of the problems that you've seen that they get the get wrong, which you're trying to help them to correct.

Mark Hide 00:59

Short when I came into corporate life and said, set up a leadership and team development company 20 odd years ago seems like yesterday. And over the years I've struggled, I struggled to differentiate myself from the competitors in a crowded marketplace, all doing very similar things. And I decided to do something about it. And I created a web based app that analyses a team and how it works and functions together, my marketplace, our business coaches, trainers and HR professionals that I understand because that was me that 20 odd years. And I think the biggest challenge they have is to for new business development getting in that funnel getting inconsistent business. And the challenge is to be different. And there's an awful lot of business coaches out there all doing very similar things. So my platform helps them differentiate that helps them stand out from the crowd and creates a new way of talking to their customers and adding value to those teams and those leaders that they deal with.

Stuart Webb 01:56

That's an interesting problem anyway, what sort of things have you seen business leaders doing, which gets them into the problem of not having a cohesive team before you help to try and solve that problem.

Mark Hide 02:10

So the business coach or trainer, they, they tend to have come out of corporate life, they've gone on a course they bought in to an accreditation process, and they love being qualified in something, the majority of them, there's those like me that wanted to become a coach, but I can't because I ended up just telling rather than listening, because I think I know the answer is probably don't. So without that consistent approach, and how they're going to help their customers, they rely on referrals. And so therefore, they get challenged how they continue a long term business with a with a customer. Whereas what my platform loves team, the ticket enables a team to measure sorry, coach will try to measure a team here, then we've their professional magic, whatever that magic is, and then come back and really importantly, retest three 612 months later. And that gives them this brilliant thing of return on investment, which is like the Holy Grail for for coaches and trainers, it's very hard to quantify and to measure how much a team has improved. I believe I've achieved that. And I can do that with my platform.

Stuart Webb 03:13

Brilliant. So tell us, how do you offer value to your team litterer customers, both the coaches and our guests the end customer of that coach or, or your client question. So

Mark Hide 03:27

I do have a number of ways. First is I'm really passionate about this is this is a 20 year journey for me. And I want to help every team realise its potential every manager, give them an easier life and be more productive. So first thing I'm doing is building a community. These are good people, they're nice people, they're good. The people you want to do business with coaches and trainers are very passionate about what they do. So that community is important to me, and then giving them the resources to help them stand out in that credit marketplace. And they will probably use one of a plethora of psychometric profiling tools that range from free to hundreds of pounds. And they will do a very similar thing, which is allow the individual to assess themselves in their career. This report goes, Hey, yeah, that's me, Wow, this psychometric profile is so accurate. Well, of course it is because you've done it on yourself, then show it to their boss, show it to their partner home and put it in a drawer and it gathers dust, vast majority 10s hundreds of millions of pounds wasted. Whereas what I've built is something that I will analyse a team measures cohesion, stress morale, and 54 other colour coded matrix, I spent a lot of money making it very accessible. And it allows the coach to go in and work with that team and that manager, do some immediate quick wins, which makes them stand out and gain trust with that team. And then over a period of time implement longer term, either structural or behavioural changes to that team to get them from either stressed or apathy into what I call optimal performance, the top of that performance curve, and building that relationship investing in that team. Might be small things might be coaching might be training might be skills, and then coming back, as I say, and retesting, and enables that coach or trainer to have a longer term relationship with their customers, and hopefully see them good and improve their productivity and measure it along the way. So that's what I do.

Stuart Webb 05:15

So Mark, have you got any, any metrics, you could point to some success stories, you could just briefly tell that sort of give us an indication of that sort of longer term success of the cohesion of the team changing because of the interventions?

Mark Hide 05:29

That's a great question. So I originally launched this as a self serve platform directly into teams, and but my passion is with business coaches, and trainers and a consulting firm pick this up last summer. And they compared my report with another report, they were judging to see which one might be more appropriate, as part of their three initial tools they use with very senior leadership teams to consult with. And the the gentleman phoned me up, Matt phoned me up, and he said, we tested your platform. And we tested this other one on our same zoom call. He said, yours we introduced, and I sent the team off with the questionnaire and a packet of biscuits on a virtual call. He said, within 20 minutes, we were making positive changes to how our team operated, which is not quite as you can see, I'm very proud of that. And he said, and then with the other team, the guy took two and a half hours to explain how the software worked and how to utilise the results. And of course, we never picked it up. Because I think managers are time poor and they want quick wins. So we go straight in there, urgent actions, get it done, start moving the dial forward. He then implemented it with two of his clients at very senior leadership levels, with airline manufacturers, which are household names. And sadly, I can't tell you, but they are very big companies. And so yes, I'm really proud of the I got quite emotional, actually, because he asked me to actually analyse a team with having never met them. And we sort of nailed this team and that their main challenges and the opportunities for for them to go in and help that team progress. So it was good.

Stuart Webb 07:00

Love the story. Mark, there must be a great way that we can sort of get some free, free stuff from you to help us I'm gonna just put the website now scrolling across the bottom of the of the screen here, which is Team Politiker. Which is you know, it's not Analytica, it's team politica. So don't get don't get confused. Team litical.com. Tell us what can we get when we get onto that website? What what what great offers and, and stuff? Can we learn about team litical from that website,

Mark Hide 07:31

or I do like you, Stuart, great approach. So there's a number of things. Firstly, it's packed full of case studies. And so we try and give away lots of information about how that can be used in different industries and other culture training can use it was starting to build up a whole series of blog articles around the 54 different metrics, which is a problem, each of those metrics is a problem in a team somewhere. And we're going to be building up that bank. If you want to access the report, and you don't have a budget, or you just want to try it out, we do a free version, which will give you just cohesion, stress and morale and the nine categories scores. And that's free, you can just come in and access that and have a look through. And then you can just pick up the phone and talk to me because I'm quite generous, and I tend to give away too much. And I'm really happy to help a team and get stuck in and help them with their problems.

Stuart Webb 08:20

Mark, I love it. Because as you know, as I said, you know, the one thing that we believe in here on this particular podcast, if if we give massive pre sales value, it'll come back. So I love the approach. Yeah, good free stuff, love the love the the offer of picking up the phone and just talking to people. Because that if if anything for somebody who's cash strapped and then wants to move a bit forward, that'll might just give them enough momentum that they come back later and go now I really need to engage. So, Mark, thank you so much for that. Listen, we're getting to the real meat of this now, which is there must be a book or a course or a programme or something which has sort of inspired you which you want to sort of pass on to the to the audience listening, what is that book or course that you think would really add some value to the way that they would bring about some sort of cohesion in their team.

Mark Hide 09:07

My first inspiration and my first guide for people I spent my entire life in scouting, and it's been a an amazing family resource, motivator, whatever it might be. And I was taught Scout leadership and team working from seven or eight years old. And in fact, next week and a half term week. I'm up to Scotland with 22 young people will teach you ice climbing skills and slow holding and doing stuff teaching leadership to young adults. So that's that's really important to me. I'd love to stress that a couple of things. I'm I'm following a guy in America called Jocko Willink. And he's an ex US Navy SEAL he's he's a bear of a man he's but you know what if you take away the WHO raw American stuff underneath is a core of really good solid, valuable leadership and team working knowledge Insights and skills. And I really like what he does. There's a badge he had, which was, nobody's coming. It's down to you. And I just I have this little badge and I stick it up on the wall, because it's, it's not us, isn't it, we've got to work hard and get out there and knock on doors and make it happen. And the other person I really admire her approach is lady called Helen Pritchard. Now, Helen Tudor. She's a LinkedIn specialist. And she has his very down to earth, very simple, replicable, scalable way of using LinkedIn to develop your business. And if you're a coach or trainer out there wondering how to get further contacts, then I would check out her details. And it's very accessible. And she's good at what she does No, no rubbish, either. Just straightforward advice.

Stuart Webb 10:47

Mark, thanks. Yeah, no, I must admit the, there's an awful lot of we could talk for many hours, I suspect about people who are now beginning to form opinions of the way they should form team through some of this toxic masculinity. And, you know, there's, there's there are people that are in the news, we won't talk too much about them that are out in the sort of the eastern part of Europe that have recently been arrested, because they sort of spout a particular type of toxic masculinity. And so one thing I've learned over my years is that most of those people that have that sort of, they may be gruff on the outside, but the core Heart of Gold are the people that you look at and go, they'll make a great team, no matter what's going on around them, because they are focused on not only what they've got to do to move something forward, but how they bring everybody else with them, not forced them, not drag them, not push them ahead, but turn around, you know, you're coming with me. And I'm a great fan of the fact that, you know, most of the people that I've been working with in the past have those that will turn around and say my foot will be the first out of the helicopter when we attack the hill and the last foot off off the hill when we when we finish taking it. And that is what truly inspires me that you as a leader, you have to be committed as much as you'd expect anybody else to be committed, don't you?

Mark Hide 12:05

100%. And we're all people. And there's a really bit of old theory called Hertzberg as motivation theories, why we go to work, and we go to work, because we're tribal, we want to be with other people, we want to interact with other people and enjoy what we do. And if we get to work, and we will like a bit of pressure pressures, okay? Stress is okay, but not too much. And if you've got the wrong manager, or the wrong people in that role, then you come to work, and it's not enjoyable. So you're not likely to put your all into it. And when that team is cohesive and working well, and it's fired up, and it's aligned, it's got shared goals, and it's got energy and passion, and then it's going to drive forward and deliver whatever the role is, whatever the job is, they will do that, and they will deliver it at a high standard. So that's what I'm trying to aim for really

Stuart Webb 12:51

had a great comment from Leila. I do know Leila, pretty well. And, you know, she sort of talked about, it's a great tool. So, Leila, I hope you check it out. Because it is really quite an interesting tool. I've seen it it is simple to use. So thank you, Mark, where we're, I've been sort of asking you questions for the last 1015 minutes. And you must be fed up with me asking you all the questions that you didn't want to be asked. So what's the question you would like me to ask you? And then once obviously, you ask the question, you need to answer it. Otherwise, I should just be forced to make you answer it. So what is the question you would have liked me to have asked you.

Mark Hide 13:26

So the Holy Grail that people buy? Have you ever been in a high performing team? And because we all strive for it, but very few of us ever get there. And it's a joy when you're in a high performing team. It is pleasurable, it's exciting. You solve problems you didn't know you could. There's a high and you're waiting for that bubble to burst, but it's Pairing your Phone. It's an amazing feeling. And I've only been privileged to be in two high performing teams in my life, one in my work life, and one in my scouting life, and I was climbing a big mountain. So how about you, Stuart? Have you ever been in a high performing team I

Stuart Webb 14:05

have been lately, yes, you really should connect with Mark. He's an interesting character. And lately, you're an interesting character, say the very least, as well. So Mark, I will find a way of connecting the two of you together. Yes, I've been in a high performing team, one that I joined, and was an inspirational leader who, you know, was very single minded, but at the same time, you know, was prepared to get there by committing themselves more than anybody else, and one that I was fortunate enough to actually end up leading. And that was largely because I was able to pick the people that I needed around me who the trust between us was so was it already somewhat established, but through the circumstances it built and that some of those people, you know, this is now some 20 years later, we're still in contact because we still value each other's advice and that's the sort of the thing that comes out of He's high performing teams, isn't it? It's not just do you solve that problem? But do you want to solve other problems into the future and continue to support each other long after the project or the company or whatever has moved on.

Mark Hide 15:12

It's so true. And in fact, that high performing I mentioned in my corporate life was 20 years ago, and I'm still in touch with the guy that was my boss. And we're still trying to do work together because I enjoy His company. And I know what we can do when we work well together and achieve this amazing thing.

Stuart Webb 15:29

Mark, this has been an inspirational and thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. I do really do. I'd like people to go and check out Team liquid.com. That's T am litical l y t i c a.com. It's well worth having a look at even the free stuff that Marc's got up there. It's quite an interesting tool. As I said, I've seen it in depth, and sort of the the report that he produces is really well worth having a look at. So please check out what Mark is doing with Tim Nitika. Mark, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. I'm just going to tell everyone, if you would like to get onto our mailing list and get an email each week telling you who will be on this week's podcast to be able to join us Layla did to either put questions or comments during the recording, or please join the mailing list, which is TCA dot FYI, that's TCA dot F. Well, why I forward slash subscribe. I will put that into the show notes. I'll also put into the show notes, the email, sorry, the web address of Team let's get in case you weren't able to capture it, so that you can connect with Mark and further discussions. Mark, thanks so much for spending a few minutes with us really appreciate you spending the time. It's been a fascinating discussion. I just love the love the energy that you bring to your and the passion you bring to your business. And I know that team litical will will will be a tool most people won't be to get into.

Mark Hide 16:51

Great Alison Stewart. Thank you for your time. I love your question set. It's different and it's it sparks conversation and thought and debate which is what it's all about. So appreciate it.

Stuart Webb 17:01

That's exactly what we're trying to solve and debate is absolutely it. Thank you, Mark. I really appreciate it. Speak to you again in a very short time.

Who is Debbie?

Julie runs an accounting company helping businesses grow through acquisition with confidence, credibility and calculated risk

Key Takeaways

The importance of clarity in business. 3:35

The power of asking for help. 6:10

The value of learning from bad experiences. 9:34

Leadership and body embodiment. 13:15

We all stand on the shoulders of giants. 16:04

Connect with yourself when you’re at your best. 19:16

What’s the question I should have asked you. 22:27

Valuable Free Resource or Action

www.wilkinsonaccountingsolutions.co.uk

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

https://youtube.com/live/QAI98x2ONMo

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

people, debbie, working, leadership, coaching, invite, question, problems, telephone call, podcast, life, feel, deep breath, bit, connect, email, humour, conversation, absolutely, book

SPEAKERS

Stuart Webb, Debbie Moore

Stuart Webb 00:21

Hi, and welcome back to five questions over coffee. I'm delighted to have with me now Debbie Moore. Debbie runs the high achievers coaching company. And she is she's got some great coaching advice, I think for real, really high performing teams, high performing companies. So I'm really looking forward to this conversation. Debbie, welcome to questions over coffee.

Debbie Moore 00:51

Thank you so much.

Stuart Webb 00:55

Just put my water down here. Because if I drink any more tea or coffee today, I'll probably not sleep for the rest of the month. And there's not much left in this month. So Debbie, tell me, what is it you do with your clients? Who are your clients? What are they? One of the problems? They've got the you're trying to help them to solve?

Debbie Moore 01:15

Okay, great question, Stuart. Thank you. So I think first of all, I've kind of gone through what I would call my a bit of an r&d phase last year, and I'm just getting clearer and clearer and clearer, who I'm here to serve. Now the problems that I'm here to solve. And the people that I am predominantly working with now are who are classes, young professionals, so young professionals, leaders, entrepreneurs, and when I say young, they're typically in their 30s, although that might vary a little bit anyway, they're younger than me. And the problems, the challenges that I hear, that they are particularly faced with the stories that I keep hearing are, that they feel they're living a life that somebody else envisaged for them. Meaning the times that we grew up in, and I'll kind of put you in the same kind of age group, as me, if you don't mind, is different to what that younger generation is experiencing, socially, politically, economically across the board technologically. And they find that they're working in some structures and with some principles that are not working for them. So they're feeling out of alignment, and they're feeling stuck. And it's resulting sometimes in exhaustion in sometimes a lack of motivation. And it's feeling quite UK. That's they're the stories that I often hear sometimes, if they're working in teams, despite their best efforts, they might not be able to communicate effectively with their teams. And then there's this frustration that sets in. And then they're wondering, why isn't this working? Now? Is it me? Is it my leadership, so it's then inward self blaming, which doesn't help either. And sometimes wisdom, other people that I'm working with, they do have a high aspiration to work in an aligned authentic and a healthy way where their life feels that it has more meaning. They just often don't know how to get there.

Stuart Webb 03:35

Debbie, I love the fact that you've got that clarity is so critical. Well to any business owner to have the absolute clarity of what is the problem that they have the solution for and having that absolute clarity, I think is really helped you to articulate that fantastically well. And if I can say, you have got, you know, a wonderful target audience there because you're so right, there are so many younger people who just are striving to do their best but but but you know, the pressure of social media and the pressure that people feel they have to show performance, etc. You're right. There are so many things at the moment which are which are besetting them. And I think it's great that you have got that focus and you are you are targeting that particular audience. I love that. Absolutely. Love it.

Debbie Moore 04:29

Thank you. I appreciate that. And there's one more thing actually that I didn't mention some smoothies people that they are incredibly successful in their own right things look like they're great on the outside, but on the inside, it's not and it can be a crisis of confidence, a lack of self confidence and that authentic confidence as well. Just wanted to name and presents that.

Stuart Webb 04:51

Yeah, and I think there's this there's a tremendous there's a tremendous, I do some work with with some with ship students and The thing which worries me so much about some of those students as they're coming out of it, and they feel the need to somehow demonstrate self esteem by putting on a sort of cloak, and they don't have what I would describe as their own self worth, they don't know. You know, they, they, I often describe it as a self esteem is where they, they walk down the street, and they want to know that they're allowed to walk down the street. So they put a mask on. But if they had true self worth, they wouldn't care whether or not they had to walk down the street, they just know the right street, to be honest, so few of them, I've got the clarity to say, I should be here. And I know that I'm doing the right thing. And, you know, they do need the help of people, aren't you? And I guess that brings me to question two, which is, what is it that you found that they've been doing which may or may not have helped them to get to where they need to be? And how do you help them to break through some of those, those barriers?

Debbie Moore 05:54

So what, before I respond to that studio, so just want to acknowledge that what you named and the insights you're having, and it just, it just makes me feel so sad that because that's what people are doing, you know, that they're putting on a mask putting on a face? And you don't have to do that. So thank you for naming that. So what I'm what I'm discovering is, I think, first and foremost, that, that people often think it's a weakness to ask for help and support, because that means being powerfully vulnerable. And people have not always yet discovered the power of being vulnerable and saying, you know, what, I don't know, can you help me? And sometimes, that's about who they ask, and feel. They're not always confident, or Sure, for example, in some workplaces, in some instance, situations, it might even be, you know, going to a networking event that they can actually speak up and say, you know, this is me, I'm not quite sure. But I'm, I'm trying to learn and I wonder who can you know, who can help me. And they often think it's the old Henry Ford quote, you know, if you, if you keep doing what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always got. And I know it's a well used your well use quote, but it's so true, because often what we're trying to do, is sought out those problems that we're experiencing from our beautiful logical thinking brain, but we're going round and round and round the same circle. And the other thing that I noticed is, by their very nature, we don't necessarily see our own patterns, we don't see our own limiting beliefs necessarily. And we certainly by their very nature, don't see our own blind spots. So that then leads to all sorts of challenges. And what often happens then is somebody might think, well, it's my job, my job is not working for me or my business is not working for me, like similar, or even my relationships not working for me. And they might suddenly summon up the courage to leave and think the right thing to do with start again. And then heaven forbid, what happens is the same patterns the same the same circumstances, but it's just in a different setting. And that that just breaks my heart. So what I find is that without the right help, and whether that's me or whether that's somebody else, but without the right help, people often don't have a clear, aligned authentic intention. That's then expanded not just through our thinking brain, but through our through our senses. So what it feels like to be moving towards that place, what it might look like, what it ignites smell like or sound like or tastes like, and having somebody along their side to sponsor them to support them to help them move into a growth mindset when challenges arise, because Surprise, surprise, they do. And it's also there's a couple of other things here. It's also about taking, really having somebody with you so that you can take aligned action and be held accountable. And I don't mean having a big sticker or anything like that. What I mean is that sense of okay, you took that loot, you took that action, you did something differently. So what worked about that, what didn't might you do differently next time. So it's one of my teachers, Dr. Clay Samet says, you know, let's composted and learn from it and then move forward.

Stuart Webb 09:34

I love that expression. I love that expression. I might borrow that sounds okay. I think he's lovely.

Debbie Moore 09:40

You're welcome.

Stuart Webb 09:42

I think that's a lovely expression, because you're right. And I love the reason that you put behind that because so often, these experiences that people have, they think they they're, they're bad and they need to be forgotten, but actually, it's the learning from it and taking the you know, changing them mindset and looking at it and going well, you know, that might not have worked the way I wanted. But if I did something else, or if I took from that this learning that I know, I won't do that, again, that's a positive and we don't do that enough, do we, we don't take the, and try and change the bad and the negative into something that we can use to become a positive spring forward.

Debbie Moore 10:20

Yeah, absolutely. And, and I think, I think the other thing is with that, when something happens, we often try and push it away. And when we try and push it away, it just gives it more energy. So that in itself needs and again, I'm gonna, I'm gonna quote, the dots close, dammit here. It needs sponsoring, it needs witnessing in in a in an appropriate way, so that we can composite that and help that be part of his moving forward. And that's really important.

Stuart Webb 10:51

Absolutely love it. Debbie, we've we've come to the part of the show where I now ask you to give us some valuable free resource valuable free advice that we can start to move forward from and I know you have a link that it would be worth making a note of which is HTTPS, colon forward slash slash, Debbie more and that's D, B, B, i e, more ammo or e coaching.com. Forward slash organisation? Debbie, tell us about that link. And what what the valuable offer is that you have going behind that link?

Debbie Moore 11:25

So thanks, thank you for that, Stuart, I appreciate it. So behind that link, there is an opportunity to connect with me for one on one if what I'm saying resonates with you for a one on one kind of 20 minute exploratory discussion so that we can just do a bit of laser coaching on where you are in your life right now. And there's also just to be totally transparent, an invitation to potentially be considered to join us in May where I'm going to show you running a new group coaching programme, it will be a small group of people learning together from one another's experiences called revolutionise your life. And we can have an exploratory chat about that, if you'd like to do so if you don't, and it's not sometimes it's not resonant working with me, I have a cohort of people who are referred people to and that might be a suitable, you know, possibility, or just the conversation might be enough. Whatever works for you,

Stuart Webb 12:26

Toby, I love that. I love the fact that, you know, you you acknowledge and we all need to acknowledge that sometimes the synergy isn't there. And that's, that's not a problem. There is no, there is no expectation that sort of, you know, taking up an offer like that is going to be calm. Right now there's the hard sell. This is an exploratory conversation, this is an offer. And and I love the fact that you will termina go Do you know, there's somebody else who perhaps you would get on better with, let's have a conversation about how I can introduce you to them. And I think that's really valuable.

Debbie Moore 12:58

Thank you. That's really important. Yeah, absolutely.

Stuart Webb 13:01

Is there a particular book or, or course or something, which, which enabled you to sort of unlock some of this coaching advice and, and would be a valuable resource for people to, to take on themselves?

Debbie Moore 13:15

That there is to us and within that, as well, if I may, and if you'll humour me today, I'd just like to offer a little experiment while we're while we're on the call. So I'll just talk to to your question directly, first of all, and then maybe offer something that might help people here today. So there are there are, there are 333 women actually, and and within that, some publications that might help people. So three women have inspired have inspired me and moms very many, many, and I do stand on the shoulders of giants. On is my leadership and body, embodiment somatic coach, teacher when department who God rest her soul, she actually passed in December. She actually taught me I really want to present her today because she actually taught me I have got a body as well as a head because growing up as I did, I kind of was disconnected and that's the other experience that I see with my clients today. We get disconnected from our our heads and our bodies. And I'll come back to that with a little exercise in a moment. And you can find when this work online and there is a book called Leadership embodiment, it's a valuable resource. My my teacher who I've been with now since 2013, Dr. Claire Samet is the founder of the Institute for Women centred coaching, leadership and training. And her work is all around her PhD research into the power blocks for women, which she's researched. into shame, like an isolation and how our limiting beliefs keep us stuck. And her work is absolutely game changing. And Claire is, is absolutely a high recommendation. And then the other one is, and it's a book series that I'm part of just to be transparent about this, and the inspirational leader behind that, because they are looking at and it's called the Payette, forward series notes for my younger self. And it's this there are four volumes now. And there are stories in there that are real life stories from women and men, about seminal moments in their life when they write back to their younger selves with the wisdom and the experience that they've gained where they are in their adult life right now. And that kind of brings me almost full circle to why I'm here today and doing what I'm doing. And it is about bringing that wisdom that I've learned from the shoulders of giants to try and help people today.

Stuart Webb 16:04

We we all stand on the shoulders of giants, don't we don't think we really do.

Debbie Moore 16:08

Yeah, so absolutely. So if you'll indulge me, if anybody wants to play along with this so. So we often what I want to speak to here is how we get triggered in a typically unconsciously. Now, some people listening to this may have done work in martial arts. So this may, this may just humour me and go along with this. So what I want to invite people to do, and you have to play along with this Stuart as well is if it's safe and comfortable to do so. So please make sure you're not driving or looking after young children are operating heavy machinery if it's safe and comfortable to do. So I just want to invite you to think about something that kind of happened today, low level, not a big unprocessed emotion, low level that's happened today or yesterday, that kind of triggered a reaction in your body might be an email coming in and you think ah, I should have answered that. Or it might be the telephone ringing and it's somebody who you don't want to talk to or you might be doing a talk. Or you might be at a meeting. And you notice that somebody suddenly falling asleep or yawning or looking away or rolling their eyes just something like that low level.

Stuart Webb 17:27

Okay. Mind a telephone call I didn't want to make.

Debbie Moore 17:31

Okay. Okay, so I want to invite you now to think about where is your attention, as you think about that. And you don't have to share it with me, but often are retail you can if you want often our attention then is on the stressor. It's on the telephone, it's on the call, it's on the screen where the emails come in. It's if you if you're in a meeting, it's it's on that person who might have your own doors, rolling their eyes. And all of a sudden, we start to run stories in our mind, I should have done that. I don't want to do this. So everybody must be bored because that person's rolling their eyes. And our our concentration then gets narrower and narrower and narrower. Yeah. So and then

Stuart Webb 18:16

I'm gonna have to agree with you every minute. Thank you knew I had to make that call. All I could think of was the reaction I was gonna get and what he was going to say and how I didn't want to have that discussion. And and suddenly, all I could think about was, Do I have to pick the phone up at all?

Debbie Moore 18:33

Yeah, so all of a sudden, whatever your intentions were for that day, it's gone out of the window, all your attention to that. And I just and thank you for for sharing that story because it just normalises this happens to us. And then I also want to invite you just to notice anything that you might feel in your body. So for example, any muscle groups that might tense Yeah. Yeah, so just noticing that just very gently from place of curiosity and wonder. Okay, so now I just want to just notice in all of that, so now I want to invite just to shake all that off, and I'm doing it with you just shake it all off that sort of right. So okay. Just Yeah, that's better. Okay. So now once we invite you to just make a shift, and you see, or if you're standing or if you're walking, and just think about you when you're at your best. And it might be for example, when you're cheering these these causes podcasts call Stuart, or it might be somebody who is out just having a walk and connecting with nature. Or it might be when you listen to music, it might be in your work. It might be when you're playing with your children, whatever. Just Just connect with you when you're at your best. And as you do that just seemed like to take a deep breath and as if you were breathing all the way down into your hips, down through your legs or the soles of your feet. Okay? Connecting with the earth. And just see if you need to make any minor adjustments, even 10% more. What would it be like even if I connect with myself even 10% More, and just taking a deep breath. And for some of us, we might actually want to do either Wonderwoman or Superman pose currently what Superman does, but no wonder woman goes like that and just lifts her head up a little bit and just have your chin just tilted up a little bit. And now take a deep breath. Once you do that, as you connect to you at your best, just feel the space as if the space and you've been supported from behind. And now, just in lighting to put up retention kind of out there a little bit on the horizon. Not too far, not too close. Now, I invite you to think about that telephone call? Or that email coming in? Or that person who's rolled their eyes in the meeting? And I wouldn't

Stuart Webb 21:06

think about it, you feel so much less worried about it.

Debbie Moore 21:10

And when you feel in less worried about it, what options does that give you? Oh,

Stuart Webb 21:16

what a good question. I can I can choose not to be angry when they make the comment I know they're gonna make because why do I need to be angry?

Debbie Moore 21:28

And what I'm hearing you say there, it gives you choice. It actually gives you choice about how to respond. And actually yeah, that person might be angry. And that might be legitimate. But that then might inform your response that might then take the conversation in a totally different direction to the direction it would have gone. So I just invite sorry, gone.

Stuart Webb 21:53

No, no, I'm just taking a lovely deep breath, Debbie.

Debbie Moore 21:57

You're welcome to do so. Is your podcast after all. So I just didn't like people. If that resonates for you just play with that and practice. It's just ah, and just getting to this place of I wonder what might that be how I respond to that telephone, call that email or event just expand a little and look beyond that person who's rolling their eyes. I wonder what my next step might be from there. So what

Stuart Webb 22:27

a lovely exercise. Thank you. Brilliant, brilliant exercise, I almost hate to ask you the question that I've got in my mind now, because it'll break the spell, but I'm gonna do it because that's the format of the coffee of the five questions over coffee. And my fifth question is, there is a question that I should have asked you by now. And I haven't. So what's the question? Please don't let it be. What is the email that what is the telephone call that I should have responded I had to make? Because that would be very cool. What is the question I should have asked you at this stage, which you are wanting me to ask. And then once you've, you've asked the question, then obviously you need to answer it for us.

Debbie Moore 23:07

Okay, so I'm not cruel. So I won't ask you that question. What I would do I'd get, I'd get really curious. And I'd challenge me and I would say, Okay, do you want your talk? And if you do what you talk, then what's the help and support? Or what's what's inspiring you to get to the next level in your life right now? Because like everybody else, I'm on my, I'm on my own growth edge. And my answer to that would be two things. One is this I'm in, in part of a leadership mastermind group with a global with some incredible global leaders, Athena leadership mastermind to try and raise my own level and my own contribution, my own thinking. And the other thing. Someone last week, introduced me to a woman, a woman's work, who I'd never ever heard of before. Until that time, Dr. Edith Eger, and Dr. Edith is 93 years old. She'd been in outfits, and she is incredible. Listening to her on the podcast, she has two books, the first one she wrote in 2017. And she put a publish another one three years ago at the age of 90, the choice and the gift. And both of those I've ordered, because I'm constantly up levelling, I'm a lifelong learner, and actually kind of share one more, please do the book that I'm reading right now is called the people part by Annie Hyman, what? And the hymens and the Hammonds what talks to as moving into this place of self leadership, rather than self protection and the benefit of that for people and organisations

Stuart Webb 25:01

I love I love that. And I will be I will be looking into certainly two of those books because they sound absolutely incredible. One of the reasons I should be looking into one of them is that I spent a day. And I expect in November of 2022, and it is a trip, I believe everybody should take. Because you learn a lot about yourself by looking at the that picture and whether or not you could choose to take away from that a positive or negative experience. If you can choose to take a positive from that, then you have achieved more or less things, Debbie, I'm going to thank you so much for spending those few minutes with us, and for taking us through that lovely exercise. And I do hope people, when they hear the replay of this, spend a few minutes thinking about making those choices, when you get that phone call, or when you have to make that phone call when you get that email or indeed, when you get bad news or whatever. Take the moment to just centre yourself and do the exercise to choose how to respond because that choice is so important to us. And thank you so much for sharing it.

Debbie Moore 26:12

See that. And thank you very much for your time today and having me on the podcast. I've really enjoyed it. Thank you so much.

Stuart Webb 26:18

It's no problem. Listen, I'm just going to say one thing, if you would like to get onto our mailing list so that you can get on and hear when the these are being done live and join us and watching participate in those discussions that we've just had. Go to the link at the bottom of the page, TCA dot FYI, that's TTA dot F where forward slash subscribe that just comes through to me, I put you on the mailing list, and I send you an email most Tuesday mornings with the who's on the podcast interview live this week. Debbie, thank you so much. I'm looking forward to seeing how your mastermind group that you're putting together in May goes. I sincerely hope that people will take advantage of coming back to you about that because I think it'd be a brilliant opportunity.

Debbie Moore 27:06

Thank you so much to do it. And thank you for having me on for my very very first podcast on live.

Stuart Webb 27:12

It's been a pleasure to be thank you so much. Thank you Stu out see you again soon. Bye bye

Who is Julie?

Julie runs an accounting company helping businesses grow through acquisition with confidence, credibility and calculated risk

Key Takeaways

What do you find that businesses do without professional help? 1:50

The value of having a CFO 3:27

The types of clients they work with. 4:45

How to turn a business into a saleable asset. 6:13

The different areas of finance they help. 7:18

What books and courses do you recommend? 8:30

How do you know when you need more financial support? 10:04

Understanding the information you’ve been given. 11:32

Valuable Free Resource or Action

www.wilkinsonaccountingsolutions.co.uk

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

https://youtube.com/live/1NjGvqu53Xs?feature=share

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page : https://scientificvaluebuildingmachine.com/svbm_1_page

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

business, julie, acquisition, cfo, own internal processes, question, grow, people, forecast, control, finance, exit, build, strategy, business owners, financial support, book, tca, buyer, growth

SPEAKERS

Stuart Webb, Julie Wilkinson

Stuart Webb 00:18

Hi, and welcome back to it's not rocket science, five questions over coffee. I'm delighted to be here today with Julie, Julie Wilkinson. Julie runs an accounting firm, we'll get into that in a little bit. And she helps businesses to grow through growth through acquisition with confidence, credibility, and calculated risk or shoving. It's fantastic. I'm really looking forward to hearing about that, particularly the calculated risks, Julie, so Well, welcome to It's not rocket science, five questions over coffee.

Julie Wilkinson 00:48

Thank you. Thanks for having me.

Stuart Webb 00:50

No problem. So let's start with the sort of, you know, those customers who you are trying to help, particularly those who are looking to grow by acquisition.

Julie Wilkinson 01:00

Yes, so we have a accounting and consultancy firm. There are three types of clients that we helped mainly. So we have, a lot of people we work with are in the end, potentially looking to exit. So they're looking at what they want the business to be worth, when they exit the business. The acquisitions come into play often, because they have a growth span, that's not really viable just to go in organically. So the acquisitions is a route to help people expand quicker so that they can meet their exit strategies on the timeframe that they want. So we help people plan their financial strategy, longer term, and then help them look at acquisitions and also then work with them to do the due diligence when they buy those businesses.

Stuart Webb 01:43

difficult job actually, sometimes the that that's that span of trying to sort of grow quickly, isn't it? What do you find that businesses have done without professional help like you to try and do that? And, you know, sometimes I know, because I get involved in some of it, is the difficulties they end up getting themselves into?

Julie Wilkinson 02:04

Yeah, so I think not bringing on in a finance support or in a form in the business. And I think that's often because people don't know is out there, I suppose. So what what I tend to find, when businesses are getting into a sort about half a million stage, you know, they are starting to get to the place where they could potentially, you know, have an FD or a CFO. Now that might be part time. But I still think people often get to that age and a bit worried about spending money. So they creep, and then people creep quickly, and then it gets a bit out of control. Because what so sometimes owners are quite some people are good at financial analysis, and some people aren't. And people, some people are more savvy with business and others. But even if you have got the time, we find that when and you're quite good at it, you get to a size when you don't have the time to actually do it anymore. So you end up just not doing it, but you haven't bought anyone in to do it for you. And that's where people I think, fall short of the financial analysis, because they either don't do it at all they've tried to do but they just don't have time.

Stuart Webb 03:04

Yeah, yeah. And interesting. I was having a conversation with, with somebody this morning, who was in a position where they were wanting to rapidly accelerate, but they you know, you start asking questions about cash flow forecasts, and where are they at the run rate, and they there is a blank look, and you go, Okay, I think one of the problems might be that you haven't yet really grasped what your financials are. And they really need the sort of help of somebody to sort of, you know, sit them down and explain how they do that sort of thing. And then to get well, perhaps you need somebody one day a week to just come in and hold your hand through this. Because otherwise, you're right, you know, 18 months down the road, it's become extremely complicated. And they fail to grasp some of those cashflow forecasts or run rates and things like that, which actually make it very difficult for them to grow any further.

Julie Wilkinson 03:53

Yeah, yeah, definitely. And I think, you know, I think comms bit overwhelming for people sometimes because they've got so much to think about. But at the end of the day, if you want to grow, you've got to put some more like a CFO or someone out will help something will take a lot of the work off of them. But they are going to have to be open that they need some time to actually grasp and possibly strategy thoughts. If people can't do this type of growth without putting days aside to actually deal with the growth and there's no point in trying to do the process. Even we can build the best reports in the world if you never have any time to take it in. And it's not. It's a bit of a pointless exercise. Anyway.

Stuart Webb 04:26

Brilliant. Brilliant. Julie, what help do you help with doing this initially, with some some of the funds you come across? I guess you don't immediately just launch in and say, right, it's 2000 pounds a day for me to even start engaging with you. What's the sort of route into getting help?

Julie Wilkinson 04:45

So it does kind of depend where they are and who they are. So the two main types of clients is either we just get buyers coming to us who are just looking to grow by acquisition. Now they could have businesses or it could be like a sideline business. So if it's, if you're at an acquisition stage, we come in In sort of when they found the businesses because we're not brokers, so we don't help people find businesses. So they're either a buyer, obviously a buyer can be a business. But if it's like an independent buyers would come in. But then on the generic business, if they're looking to grow, yeah, like you said, they're probably probably have like what we call a discovery session, which is basically a deep dive where we go in and sort of assessment businesses. Because we find people that want to grow by acquisition, if they haven't got their own internal processes sorted, it can make it worse, basically, because they're bringing in more complex scenarios into their business, and they don't even measure their own business, let alone another one. So we would sort of assess it to say, Well, what do we think they're ready into, like how we would get them on that journey to be ready to do the acquisition, the exit strategy is a whole nother conversation, because obviously, that's more about them building their own internal processes, so that the business is more of an asset than, than just sort of like lifestyle. But it all encompasses really into the same sort of journey, because the acquisition is just an option within that growth journey. You can still wet sit and grow without an acquisition. But you still need to set set things in place to actually be able to exit to maximise value at the end

Stuart Webb 06:13

of it, absolutely love it, the fact that you're talking about that? Yeah, once again, that's really the sort of thing that that we deal with here, which is actually helping people to understand that, you know, you can't exit a business if you're still at the centre of it. And if it's still you, and everything you do, that's no longer an asset. That's, that's that's you. And to turn that business into something which is potentially saleable, only say, potentially, because too many times, I find business owners who will turn around and go, Well, I don't I want to, I don't want to leave that much control in other people's hands. The answer is, well, you don't want to leave your business then do so you might as well accept it. But you know, in order to be able to sort of get to the point where you can leave the business, you have to have processes, systems, checklists, database, all the rest of things, which are in other people's control that you can say, Well, so long as they're doing everything that I need them to do, then I can actually walk away and leave the business in good hands. And that's when it becomes a saleable asset. Until then, it's just as you said, it may be a very large lifestyle business, but it's still at the heart. It's still a lifestyle business.

Julie Wilkinson 07:18

Yeah. And if you broke down the different areas of finance that we helped with, we would help in different areas. So we have different levels of staff. So we have bookkeepers. So they would sort of help businesses deal with day to day, bookkeeping, keeping on top of their reconciliations and making sure the integrity is in order. Then we saw got our CFOs, which we have, which would help with the strategy. So someone said to us, well, I want to exit in five years, we would say, Well, before we do anything, let's build the forecast initially, just to see like, if you carried on as you were, where would you be, like the value and then looking at like, what are the opportunities or the milestones they have to get to get there. And then you would have sort of the governance and controls piece around the organisation. So that would be more likely who's doing what and where to control. So the example I generally use to people, if they wanted to pay a supplier, they own the still paying suppliers and they want someone else to pay the supplier, would they have an end to end order to payment control process, so they could feel comfortable that someone would do that and it wouldn't go wrong. And so so as safe as we can do like governance and control. So we can help look at the organisational structure and how those controls will help minimise, like risk of error and fraud.

Stuart Webb 08:28

Brilliant. Julie, what is there? Is there a particular book or programme or course that that you sort of you learned your craft through and you'd recommend other people to sort of get hold off and start thinking?

Julie Wilkinson 08:42

Well, I so I'm a chartered management accountant by trade. I mean, I've been taught for over 10 years, I've worked in sort of finance in different areas, clients for over 20 years. So I don't, there isn't? Yeah, obviously there's courses and books that can give you knowledge. But I just think this type of thing comes with experience. And so I don't the I don't believe there's any court or book that can help them magically do all this themselves overnight. I think obviously there's courses that can give people knowledge, some guidance, I I just think the best thing to do is get the right help from the right people, because obviously we would be expected. So when we when we come to look organisational structure of a business, you know, the first thing would be saying to people they want to exercise Have you got a management team? Now that management team would probably include one of our CFO, they wouldn't only be the CFO and be de our sales director, do you have a managing director or UPS director maybe you know, and if they don't have those people, this person would be sort of thinking as well you need to stop and go and get them on the team. So but obviously you know there are I don't particularly read that much Ralph. I do listen to some podcasts and stuff, but I don't think there's anything I don't feel that one course or book that could give the overall knowledge of finance because it's too detailed. And that's why people study for years to learn. Ah, I get the experience from it.

Stuart Webb 10:02

course there are some excellent podcasts out there. And I'm not going to mention any one in particular. But if you're not listening to this one, you've clearly done something seriously wrong in your life anyway, moving on, Julie, there must be one question that I'm currently sort of poised to ask you, and it must be sort of on the tip of your tongue. I wish he'd asked me the following question. So I'm going to ask you to specify what is the fifth question I should ask you? And then once you've answered the question, what is that question? You should answer it for us?

Julie Wilkinson 10:32

Yeah, so the question, well, I'm sort of taught, I'm doing this question to help business owners really, I just think business owners need to sit? The question I'd be asking is, as a business owner, how do I know I need more financial support? That's what's what I think the business owners should be asking themselves, because it's difficult to know what their account is. And I think, you know, my answer to that would be if you don't have a forecast, and I don't mean what in your head or written down on the whiteboard, I mean, sort of like a five year plan with a bit of a cash flow. If you don't have the actual KPIs and master documented and some form of management report that will literally report on those. And so that means everything, not just, you know, writing a few marketing things down on the whiteboard, again, you know, to help people track things, if you don't have those things in or don't regularly get information that you understand, then that's when you need more financial support, because you need those things to start making decisions.

Stuart Webb 11:31

And love your question. And it would be one thing that I would spend a lot of my time talking to customers about, actually, which is Yeah, have you actually understood the information you've been given by people? Or indeed, have you got any information? Because there are so many that when you ask about information, just have no nothing at all, which they can actually sort of point at. So I love the question. I think it's brilliant. Thank you so much. Okay, look, we've come to the end of the five questions with Julie. If you would like to get notifications about when we have an upcoming discussion, such as this one want to join in, join us live, even ask questions and make comments. go to this link, which is TCA dot FYI, forward slash subscribe, that's TCA dot FYI, forward slash, subscribe, get on the mailing list. We've had quite a number of people join in the last few days. And you'll get a notification that we've got an interview coming up, such as people like Julie, you get some interesting information. It's not it's not all sales. It's about helping you build a better business. So Julie, thank you so much for coming on. I really encourage people to get onto your website and find out about the sort of thing that you do in terms of getting people to sort of acquire and think about how to acquire sensibly and with sensible strategies. Thank you.

Julie Wilkinson 12:54

Thank You.

Who is Janet?

Free yourself from Imposter Syndrome?

Feeling like an imposter and feeling not good enough, can cause overwhelm, exhaustion, stress and leave you full of self-doubt.

I can show you how to free yourself from this, in order for you to be the amazing businesswoman you know you are, free from overwhelm, self-doubt, and the all too often need to people, please.

I will help you get to the root cause of why you feel and act the way you do, so that you can exchange your negative self-talk and negative self-beliefs for positive ones. You will learn to put in boundaries in place and be able to say ‘no’ to things that you don’t want to do. That way, you can then be in control, excited about your future and free to live a phenomenal life.

Key Takeaways

Imposter Syndrome and the impacts on job performance. 1:30

Where did they not feel good enough? 3:03

How do you overcome the feeling of guilt and shame? 4:15

The value of a free offer. 6:39

Recognise the negative voice in your head. 7:47

The belief that you’re not good enough. 9:12

Book or programme that set you on the track. 10:24

How do you overcome feeling like an impostor? 11:41

Valuable Free Resource or Action

janetgabrieltherapy.com/https-bit-ly-3uzjqh3/

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

janet, feeling, beliefs, clients, changing, brilliant, podcast, running, stressed, imposter syndrome, work, people, stay, tca, told, talking, absolutely, recognise, coming, impostor

SPEAKERS

Janet Gabriel, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb 00:24

Hi, and welcome back to it's not rocket science five questions over coffee. I've got my coffee mug in front of me I know Janet's also got something to drink. So Oh, you're drinking water, Janet, that's very good, probably much more healthy than what I'm taking them out, which is probably appropriate. Janet is a transformational coach. I I've met Janet on a couple of occasions. And frankly, some of the stories she's told me. Absolutely fascinating. So I hope we're going to get into a little bit of that now. So welcome to the podcast. Janet.

Janet Gabriel 00:56

Thank you for inviting me. I'm looking forward to it.

Stuart Webb 00:58

Terrific. So, Janet, tell us a little bit about the sort of people you're trying to help.

Janet Gabriel 01:05

So I mostly work with women in business and entrepreneurs who are suffering with imposter syndrome. Some people say what is impostor syndrome? It's feeling like a fraud, feeling that you're not good enough to be in the position in your job or running your business, or even in a relationship

Stuart Webb 01:24

where we don't we all occasionally feel that way. And there's no there's no harm in admitting it as well. That's the thing that I think stops people and maybe that goes into the second question is, what is it that some of the people you're trying to help have already tried to do that have maybe sort of not succeeded in trying to help them break these imposter syndromes? And what are the what are the impacts of imposter syndrome on their ability to do their job, that relationship, etc.

Janet Gabriel 01:53

Okay, so they tend to work harder and longer than anyone else, they may be a bit of a perfectionist, this shows up quite a lot. They believe that if they get everything perfect, that they'll stay under the radar, this is what they're trying to do. So they might find themselves in a job that they don't particularly like, and but they will stay there. Because they're comfortable. If they went for promotion, for example, they're not likely to ask for the promotion, they're waiting for the boss or somebody else to recommend them first. Because they're not confident enough. And they have low self esteem. So they're staying in their job so that they can stay quiet. So they're not progressing. Or maybe they want to start their own business. But again, they believe that other people know what they're doing. They're far more experienced than them. So they don't put themselves out.

Stuart Webb 02:45

Yeah, yeah. And we've all met people that have done that, haven't we that somehow the long hours are going to solve the problem? So that's obviously not worked? What what do you do? What do you help them? And how have you helped some of these people?

Janet Gabriel 02:59

So I helped by getting to the root cause of the issues. So where did it come from? Why did they not feel good enough. So around about the age of seven or eight, most of your beliefs about yourself are fixed. So not feeling worthy, not feeling good enough, not feeling lovable, likeable, capable, etc. And we take all those negative beliefs into adulthood, where they will run the show. Because 97% of all our daily thinking, our emotions, our reactions are all coming from our subconscious mind. So it's as if we're still running on that seven or eight year old. So using hypnotherapy, which is perfectly safe, we all go into a hypnotic state every day. So if you're making a cup of coffee, for instance, or driving the same route every day, you're not thinking about it, you're also dries. So I help by putting my clients in a very relaxed state. It's nothing like state hypnosis. It's just a two way conversation. And I find out where their beliefs came from. And it is always fascinating because sometimes we don't know why we act the way we do. So when my clients find out, Oh, gosh, you know, when I was six, I was in a class at school, and something happened. And I'll give you a quick example. One lady said, and she remembers that she's, gosh, how old is she? Now she's in her 30s. As she remembers this very clearly that they have paintings around the school classroom. And at the end of the turn, the teacher was giving them out. She said, this girl, which one's yours, and she pointed to one of the teachers that can't possibly be yours. It's too good. Those teachers and another lady told me, she wasn't very academic and And she did particularly well in a project. And when the teacher handed them out, he said to her in front of her, can you imagine this? You must have cheated. She sat next to one of the very clever boys in the class. And he said, I believe you cheated off of him. Oh, sorry, that belief of even when I try really hard, it's not good enough that stuck. And obviously, there were a lot of other things going on.

Stuart Webb 05:29

That's, yeah, I mean, I don't want you to divulge any secrets. But how do you get people to overcome that feeling during this, this discussion you have when they're very nicely relaxed, and they suddenly realise that's what happened,

Janet Gabriel 05:43

is getting them to recognise where their beliefs came from in the first place, and that they are still running on that very old outdated programming. And then we can change it. So they're looking at that particular, you know, scene that they've gone to, in that very relaxed state, and they are, they're looking at it as an adult now. So changing it that isn't true. I do have personalised recording for all of my clients, which they absolutely love. And it depends on the person on each individual. Some listen to it for 21 consecutive days. And that helps you change your neural pathways, changing the way you're thinking and updating your thinking and beliefs. Some people take longer, it could take up to 60 days. I've used the word like the clients over a three month period. So they get three recordings. We spoke to them.

Stuart Webb 06:39

Brilliant, brilliant. Now I know you've got a really interesting offer, which is which is going under the screen now. So I just I just say it for those people who are listening and can't see but but it will be in the show notes. It's Jared Gabriel therapy.com HTTPS hyphen be it hyphen l EY hyphen, three user ID J GQ. I think that is h three? I think that's probably got that right. I don't know, Janet, I don't know. I may be wrong. But it will be in the show notes. I have a look in the show notes. We get Jenny, tell us what what are what is there on that valuable, valuable free offer that that that page

Janet Gabriel 07:17

10 Things you can stop doing right now that's causing you the problem?

Stuart Webb 07:22

That is such a valuable free offer? Isn't it? 10? I mean, that's 10 things, not just one or two, that's 10 whole things you can do, which is great, great way. I must say I just had a quick look. So I think I think that's a really great offer, Janet, I mean, do you want to give us a hint of one or two of those things? Not all 10 Because we don't want to get everybody sort of not going to that length. But But what I want to tell you the things that we could stop doing now.

Janet Gabriel 07:47

Just recognise what you're saying to yourself everyday. Get that negative voice, that chatter that you can't shut down recognising what you're saying to yourself. And if you believe that you're in a career that you're not good enough, would it actually stand up in court? Just ask yourself, or if it was a good friend of yours with the same experience and qualifications as you? What would you be saying to them, having this positive self talk, and the way we speak to ourselves affects us emotionally, there's a mind body connection. So the more you have chest and having that negative negative self talk, and you will then start to experience other symptoms. If you suppress your emotions, they will come out somewhere else. So clients come to me they have migraines, constant headaches, stomach issues. If they're stressed, they've got IBS flaring up just what the lady got her IBS, so under control, because she's sorted out her, her anxieties been absolutely amazing. You know, things like eczema flaring up, and then it's the vicious circle, isn't it, you're stressed, your Xmas flared up, which is so irritating, and then you're more stressed. So again, you're in that vicious cycle. And again, those beliefs that you have, I need to work harder and longer than anyone else. Everything has to be perfect. Oh, I'm having to do this. Because I'm not good enough. I'm not good enough. So I have to work hard and they you go round in those circles. And it does affect not only your health, your relationships as well.

Stuart Webb 09:36

Brilliant, love it. Absolutely love it. And, you know, from my own personal experience, I know. You know, it's a bit like that one that you're often told, particularly when I used to do a lot of public speaking and I kept thinking to myself, What happens if an eye mentors took me aside and went look, for goodness sake, you know, fake it till you make it because nobody else knows whether or not you're You know, they're all sitting there wondering what's going on as well. And if you tell them by, you know, by basically telling yourself, you're not good enough or telling yourself, you're gonna make a mistake, they'll look at you and go, Well, I can see he's made a mistake. But if you tell yourself, it's fine, they'll think it's fine. And it is that self talk, isn't it? It's just beginning to sort of bring yourself under control and just saying, you know, this is it, there's so much so much in there. So, I mean, there's Brilliant, thank you, Janet, thank you so much. Now, there must be a book or a programme or a course that really set you on the track towards this what was what was that that book or programme, of course, that you think other people might enjoy reading about other than your own your own therapy in imposter syndrome.

Janet Gabriel 10:41

What really resonated with me was, I am good enough. And I needed help years ago, and I was sent for CBT online, which didn't work for me, beginning of the third session, the therapist said, this isn't working, and I couldn't agree more. It's no good just talking about your issues, you need to resolve them. And that's what I do for my clients. So that book really resonated with me. And that's what got me on the course for rapid transformational therapy. So I've not only been able to sort my own issues out, I've been able to help friends and family, which has been absolutely amazing. I've got hundreds, I could recommend so many books and podcasts. This is what I do every evening, I'm either listening to a podcast or reading a self help book. I absolutely love what I do. And I never stop learning.

Stuart Webb 11:34

Not that brilliant. Now, this is where I get away from having to spend all my time thinking about questions, and I put them straight back to you. So there must be a question, which you're currently thinking he hasn't asked me about or something like that. So what's the question that I should have asked you, Janet. And when I've asked you the question, I should have asked you answer the question for me, please.

Janet Gabriel 11:56

The question would be everyone's out there asking how do I overcome feeling like an impostor or fraud or not good enough? And the answer is, I have already touched on this, you need to update your programming. So we update our laptops, we update our phone or hope we do. We need to update our thinking because as I said, you're you're operating on that old, very outdated programming. So you see very successful people, or maybe you've worked with somebody who suddenly will go off with long term stress. This happened a lot when I worked for the NHS, and people would just disappear. And you'd have no idea that they was really struggling at the time. You know, people don't speak about this women come to me. Their friends and family have absolutely no idea what they're going through. Or their partner. They they very much they're ashamed to say how they're feeling. And they want everyone to know they're still coping. So for me, hypnotherapy has just been life changing. Because you can update those those thoughts and beliefs that you had.

Stuart Webb 13:05

Fabulous. Brilliant. Janet, I loved our conversation. Thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us and just talking to us about this. It's been a real pleasure sort of talking about this. Let me just introduce everybody here to the link which you can use to get on the mailing list and that means that you get an email from me on normally on Monday or a Tuesday morning telling you who it is that's coming on this week's podcast so you can join us live on LinkedIn and YouTube and watch and and and understand people like Janet and the help she brings people and that's TCA dot FYI, forward slash subscribe, TCA dot FYI, folks, I subscribe. Jared, thank you so much for coming on. And just spending a few minutes with us. I really appreciate you being here. I really look forward to to hearing more of those wonderful stories and I really appreciate how much effort you're putting in to help us all and impostor syndrome.

Janet Gabriel 13:58

My absolute pleasure. Thank you so much for inviting me. Thank you. Have a great day. Bye bye. Thank you. Bye

Who is Lubna?

Lubna Samara is a seasoned healer and leadership coach who specializes in well-being coaching for people in the workplace. With a focus on supporting individuals at all levels of the organization, she helps senior leaders and lower-ranking employees navigate the challenges they face. She understands the toll that burnout and feelings of being marginalized can take on individuals in the professional world, and is dedicated to providing the support and guidance needed to thrive in the workplace. Through her work, Lubna seeks to create a more inclusive and supportive environment for all.

Key Takeaways

00:00 Healing, coaching, and support for workplace struggles.

06:10 Book focuses on holistic healing and psychology.

07:44 Unlocking superconscious mind for personal and workplace success.

12:32 Focus on the positive, nature heals tech burnout.

14:26 Book integrates psychology, coaching, meditation, and energy.

18:35 Thank you, check out newsletter and subscribe.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

Download a workbook from www.higherwill.com with a copy of Lubna’s book “Beyond Potential”

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

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It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

healing, well-being, leadership, coaching, burnout, confidence, imposter syndrome, procrastination, work environment, imposter syndrome, meditation, energy healing, mindfulness, emotional intelligence, resilience, empathy, personal development, business, book Beyond Potential, values, purpose, intuition, energy fields, body-mind-spirit, team building, stress management, leadership coaching, energy exercises, empowerment, mindfulness exercises

SPEAKERS

Lubna Samara, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb [00:00:22]:

Hi, and welcome back to It's Not Rocket Science five questions over coffee. I actually don't have a coffee in front of me right at the moment. This is a fruit tea, because I've had quite a lot of coffee already today, and therefore, I'm trying to reduce the amount of caffeine in my system. But I'm delighted to be joined by, Lubna Samara. Lubna is a an award winning leadership and well-being coach. She works with healing and she's a best selling author of a book called Beyond Potential. I'm sure we're gonna get into that in just a moment which is a number 1 in 7 categories, including business. So we're gonna talk a little bit how this applies to business.

Stuart Webb [00:01:05]:

So welcome to It's Not Rocket Science five Questions Over Coffee, Lubna.

Lubna Samara [00:01:10]:

Hello, Stuart. Hi. Good to be here.

Stuart Webb [00:01:12]:

Thank you. So so, Lubna, who who is who is it you're trying to help, particularly in in the work you do? And and I know it's not just about healing, but it's about leadership as well.

Lubna Samara [00:01:24]:

Yes. It is. I am a long standing healer, but I also do leadership coaching and well-being coaching. So I I specifically work for with people at work. And, my work basically, I try and help out anybody in the workplace who needs help, you know, whether you're senior leadership or whether you're kind of lower down the ranks and, you're really struggling. And a lot of people struggle with so many different, issues at work. Burnout tends to be a little bit higher up, you know, with with leadership because they tend to be just so overworked and professional and and perfectionist often Stuart, that kind of five, that character five. But a lot of people feel overlooked in the workplace And 1 of the very common things that we don't often hear about is somebody thinking their boss doesn't like them and they end up feeling marginalized at work because people know what's going on.

Lubna Samara [00:02:23]:

And when they turn to their colleagues, their colleagues kind of back off. They don't really want to get involved because that might put them in a bad place with their boss. So that is a very common problem, and, strangely enough, it actually works the other way. You know, leaders can be as phased by somebody in their team not being very nice to them as the other way around. And this, you know, these are problems that can be very easily worked with. Then you've got people who have lack of confidence. And without that lack without confidence, often people are scared to speak up. They won't put themselves up for projects.

Lubna Samara [00:03:01]:

They won't put their hands up. They won't put their input in. And they may have really valuable input, but they don't feel comfortable opening up and sharing because maybe they're scared of ridicule or for whatever reason. So these are, and of course the usual suspects like imposter syndrome is really a big 1 as well, especially with people who are working in a corporate environment and they may not have formal education. These people can have amazing personal resources and knowledge base and skill sets, but they kind of think that over people or their colleagues will not accept them or to the same level. And, they often suffer, you know, sometimes people can suffer from that, and and of course, you know, procrastination, all the usual things that people really suffer with in the workplace, I've dealt with, you know, that's

Stuart Webb [00:03:58]:

And what do you find people that you are dealing with have have tried in the past, Lubna, to sort of overcome these issues before before they sort of seek help from somebody like yourself?

Lubna Samara [00:04:07]:

Five mean, the reason why I was smiling is because just, a couple of my clients were very senior. And, 1 of the symptoms of burnout actually that, again, is very little spoken about, is anger management. Now this is 1 of the less appealing manifestations of stress. And, like, these guys have kind of smashed laptops down in meetings, coffee pots, and, and they end up getting blacklisted across the board, right, because of that kind of behavior. And typically, they come to me saying, you know, don't talk to me about my mother. And obviously, obviously, they've been sent to therapy before. You know? So III don't start off with that. We start with the behavioral aspects.

Lubna Samara [00:05:00]:

And as soon as they feel more in control, they kind of start thinking, well, I I need to look deeper. And then we do go back into that. So that is, 1 aspect, say, of burnout that can really that is more unusual. That is more unusual. But typically most people have tried working on themselves, they've tried personal development, they've tried, they're actually curious. A lot of people already have analyzed and worked out the whole situation and that's 1 of the problems in fact, Because jumping to conclusions can create even more problems and can keep you stuck in a loop.

Stuart Webb [00:05:45]:

That's amazing. We're gonna get to your to your book and I guess, I'll I'll I'll I'll put a a scroll up now about, your book which is which is Beyond Potential. Stuart to me a little bit about, thank you.

Lubna Samara [00:06:00]:

Talk to

Stuart Webb [00:06:01]:

me a little bit about about Beyond Potential and and and the sort of advice that you five, in the book.

Lubna Samara [00:06:10]:

The book deals with all these issues basically. And, more than that though, I mean, apart from it's the way we're working. I, again, as a healer, I'm very keen on raising awareness and so that people can become independent and catch their problems themselves, So we work holistically, body, heart, mind and spirit, and Webb work literally section by section. So in chapter 2, we're really looking at the more physiological kind of problems like triggering and anxiety triggering and jumping to conclusions. It's our expectations. I mean, these are all psychology theories that are very well established that show us how these can get us into into trouble and how to fix them. The the workarounds generally can be quite easy to manage. So the book tells you how to do that.

Lubna Samara [00:07:05]:

In chapter 3, we look at emotional intelligence and how to raise that. We look at emotional sovereignty and how to bring your awareness back and calm your heart down. It's when our hearts get engaged, our our we lose clarity. When we lose clarity, we we end up stuck. You know, this is really I'm very, very big on clarity and gaining clarity. Through calming the heart and the mind, we start gaining clarity. And, in chapter 3, we look at resilience and empathy. And then we move into chapter 4, which is more about the mind and how to get the mind to to get rid of all the fog in the mind.

Lubna Samara [00:07:44]:

But also as a healer, I work a lot with the superconscious mind, the higher mind, and coaches these days call this your genius. And accessing that part of our minds and each 1 of us has it, you know, you're born it's a facility you're born with. It's not a question of, you know, you've already got it and chances are almost everybody would have used it, would be using it at some level without really being aware of it. So bringing more awareness to that, developing that brings very tangible benefits to the workplace, five better communications, better focus and concentration, and and inspiring creativity. So and then in chapter 5 Webb then look for me what is the heart of the book is really the spirit aspect Webb we're going deeper into the self, we're looking at values, we're looking at purpose, we're looking at a deeper alignment, we're looking at connecting better to our work environment, to our family, to our community, and to be more authentic, and how to do all of that. So that's the book kind of takes you through all of these chapter by chapter pretty much and in the final chapter, in the beginning of the book, we start by looking at what your dreams were, what did you want to do when you were a child and how has Stuart, what aspects have you taken through into adulthood? And in the final chapter, we end up doing your journey of transformation. So we look at where you are today, what are the challenges that have held you back and taking you to the dreams that you've and your ambitions to and charting that path clearly. So that's basically the book.

Stuart Webb [00:09:25]:

Brilliant. Brilliant. You have a you have AAA Webb as well, higherwill.com. Are there are there any, pieces of advice, workbooks, and things like that on the on the website which can help people to understand better themselves what they're trying to do?

Lubna Samara [00:09:45]:

There are a lot of blogs actually on the website. So for instance, there is, 1 blog, to do with values and and and that gives, I give an exercise on team building in that. But the work there is a workbook that comes with the book Beyond Potential, which I've kept at a low price. I mean, it's 2 past 40 for the Kindle version. And, with that, at the end of chapter 1, you can download the workbook for free, which is a substantial document in its own right. It's it's a it's a 50 page document. At the moment, it's free with the book, and, that takes you chapter by chapter through all the exercises. Actually, I was talking to somebody a few days ago, and, he was telling me how he loved 1 of the meditations.

Lubna Samara [00:10:31]:

And actually it's an energy exercise, a very simple I give you very simple energy exercises in the book, in the workbook, because developing that is a really important aspect, but we'll come to that in a minute I think. But it's, yeah, so he was telling me how much he loved it and how it actually healed his neck, which he was struggling with for some days. And, yeah. So it's and and there are also meditations.

Stuart Webb [00:11:00]:

There there

Lubna Samara [00:11:01]:

are a lot of exercises, so that is free with the workbook. I'm sorry. That is free with the book. The workbook is free with the book. And, and also there are a lot of diagrams in the book. And, you also get with the book AAA PDF of all the diagrams in color because they make a lot more sense in color.

Stuart Webb [00:11:22]:

Tell me, you you you were you're sort of talking that a little bit about, about, these meditations. I mean, how did you how did you discover this? How did you get into it? What was the what was the the the the source of this, for you and and how is how is this helped the leaders that you that you're working with now?

Lubna Samara [00:11:41]:

Well, that's a good question. I got into it it's a long it's a long story. I was actually, a mathematician who worked in the petroleum industry, then I moved into banking, I did an MBA in finance, and I started seeing energy fields. And, I never really expected to be a healer. I I Webb along, and the first course I went to was in January 93. So it's a long time. And I really just did it to get an experience of what it was about. You know, I was doing a lot of Tai Chi and a lot of meditation which I developed myself and I went to a lot of classes and I kind of put together what I liked, which was about feeling the love cause I see it all around us and focusing on that.

Lubna Samara [00:12:32]:

It's really, you know, you can focus on all the negativity, which is gonna keep your thoughts over, you know. But if you focus on all the five, you can rise above pretty much anything. And it really is about, you know, the old Oscar Wilde adage, you know, we're all in the gutter but some of us are looking at the Stuart, right? So it's about that. And the meditations really developed out of that. And the guided meditations are part meditations and part energy work. So we start with grounding and grounding and connecting to earth is extremely important and that helps anybody. I mean, people with tech burnout five, in Japan, they send them, they they use forest bathing to to heal people with tech burnout because nature is such an important part and harmonizing our energy fields with nature is extremely important. We can do it through energy healing but you can do it just by going out for long walks in nature.

Lubna Samara [00:13:31]:

Your energy fields will harmonize and and and nature is a massive healer for us, you know, so everybody benefits from that. You know, this is 1 of the reasons why people go in teams to to to go hiking together and to it resets It sets us all on the same level. We're all equal where nature is concerned and it builds connectedness and it's over healing thing to do.

Stuart Webb [00:14:02]:

Lubna, we've been talking for a while now and and you've answered some questions very fully. There must be 1 that you're currently thinking. I I do wish you'd ask me about this because that's the real critical question. So tell me what's that question that you really want me to ask and obviously, as you've asked, you will have asked a brilliant questions. You better give us an answer to it. So what's that question you really do think I should have asked you?

Lubna Samara [00:14:26]:

I'm not sure it's a critical question, but it's a question I've been asked quite a lot since actually I gave the book to my beta readers from the beginning. In the book Webb work with 4 modalities: we work with psychology and coaching as 1 pillar. We work with meditation as a second pillar. Webb work with energy works, energy, the principles of energy healing, and we work with the quest, your questions in what it is in life. Right? Now I've been asked from the beginning, do you need to put the energy works in? What does it contribute? Because it's a bit weird and it might put people off who are who don't believe in it. And I would just say, first of all, there is a lot of research to show that energy healing does work. I mean, clinically, 1 of the largest, I'm with an organization called The Healing Trust and 1 of the largest clinical trials was actually done by 1 of the fellows of the Healing Trusts, Sandy Edwards with Birmingham City University. And the results of that trial were so, Webb so strong that the, doctor Michael Dixon, who's head of the Royal Medical Household and past head of the past chair of the NHS Alliance wrote a forward for the book recommending and I think, I hope I'm getting this right, but I think he recommends that the NHS should take it very seriously and start looking at bringing in healers into the NHS to cut costs.

Lubna Samara [00:16:01]:

So there's a lot of research, a lot of it is in the book, throughout the book is kind of peppered in. But for me, I really wanted to put it in because as somebody who myself was skeptical about it and I was kind of, when I was still working in banking and I started seeing energy fields and I started doing a lot of Tai Chi and meditation, somebody stopped me and said, you know, you've got very strong energy, you should do energy healing. And I was like, I don't do that. I'm a mathematician. And then I caught myself and I thought, oh God, I hate that kind of thinking, I'm gonna go. And so I did really, I went really as to find out a little bit more about it and how it works. And by the 3rd session I came out, you know, I was like, wow. You know, I was really I felt struck and I was thinking Webb use 5 to 7% of our cognitive processes.

Lubna Samara [00:16:58]:

This is some of the rest. And I realized I'm not using my usual kind of mind. So in a nutshell, energy healing, just developing the faculty. I don't teach in the book how to heal other people, but just to develop the faculty and to understand the basics, give you very basic exercises to heal yourself, but it you can't heal without empathy. Okay? It's really it's it's it's it so it really develops your empathy. It really develops your intuition because you're using your intuitive faculties. And I teach you how to do that in the book in order to connect more fully to your over senses. And you see people from Oprah Winfrey Stuart to to Jeff, gosh I've forgotten his name, the guy who started Amazon.

Stuart Webb [00:17:50]:

Bezos.

Lubna Samara [00:17:51]:

Thank you. All of them attribute their success to their intuition. And research even shows that of leaders over successful, very successful people over a 10 year period, all of them, most of them attribute their success to their intuition. So this is extremely important, faculty. And healing helps you to develop that awareness, but also it helps you to connect your higher mind. So we heal with that and, the practice of it, the discipline of it. If I had my way, I would get children to do that at school and get them to develop it very early on because the benefits are so powerful. And so that's really the 1 question that I would have asked you.

Stuart Webb [00:18:35]:

Lopne, thank you very much for for spending a few minutes with us and and talking about that. I'm I know you're a a busy person and so I'm gonna I'm gonna leave you to get on and and help others. I'm just gonna just gonna point out, as we come to the end, if you would like to, get on to the newsletter and find out when people like over, I'm a great guest. Coming on to this podcast to talk so that you can engage ask questions get on to the to the to this link, which is HTTPS colon forward slash forward slash link.thecompleteapproach.co.ukforward/newsletter. That's link dot the complete approach.co.uk forward slash newsletter and obviously like and subscribe to this podcast as well and tell all your friends about it because that way we get more people knowing about the great work that people like over are doing at the moment to help us all so love with all of that, said. Thank you so much for coming in and spending a few minutes with us really appreciate the time that you've spent and well get out there and help a few more people to overcome some of those stresses and, burnout that I know it is a major problem in businesses today.

Lubna Samara [00:19:50]:

And, Stuart, thank you very much for having this platform and hosting people like me and, I look forward to seeing more of your podcasts.

Stuart Webb [00:19:58]:

Thank you, Lorna.

Lubna Samara [00:20:00]:

Thank you.

Who is Chris?

For 4 (and a bit!) years Dad and Daughter team Chris and Charlotte have been on a mission to share stories. Specifically stories of amazing people doing brilliant things to make the world a kinder place.

Along the way they've spoken to hundreds of people, and learned hundreds of lessons of why we should all try to be a little bit kinder, and how we might practically apply kindness in our lives.

Now you can get access to all of these amazing lessons in The Kindness project book due to be released later in the year.

Key Takeaways

How do you help people be kind? 0:22

The importance of financial planning and giving back. 2:50

Time is the commodity that’s most limited as opposed to money. 5:37

The one thing you can control is your reaction to the circumstances -.7:52

Focus on the right thing, not the wrong thing. 11:29

Why it’s all about relationships -. 13:50

How to reach out to clients in a way that’s not intimidating. 15:57

The fear of letting go and the fear of saying no. 19:46

Valuable Free Resource or Action

http://thekindnessproject.co.uk/book/

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Subscribe to our newsletter and get details of when we are doing these interviews live at https://TCA.fyi/newsletter

Find out more about being a guest at : link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/beaguest

Subscribe to the podcast at https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/podcast

Help us get this podcast in front of as many people as possible. Leave a nice five-star review at apple podcasts : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/apple-podcasts and on YouTube : https://link.thecompleteapproach.co.uk/Itsnotrocketscienceatyt!

Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

If you are a business owner currently turning over £/$10K - £/$50K per month and want to grow to £/$100K - £/$500k per month download my free resource on everything you need to grow your business on a single page :

It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

————————————————————————————————————————————-

Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

people, book, kindness, clients, business owners, business, life, money, fretting, chris, project, stories, spend, talking, stoic, interesting, read, financial planning, question, financial

SPEAKERS

Chris Daems, Stuart Webb

Stuart Webb 00:22

Hi, and welcome once again to five questions over coffee with me Stuart Webb and today I've got Christine's with me who is a really got I'm really looking forward to this is a really inspirational talk, I think we're going to have a chat about a really interesting project that Chris has been doing with his daughter. But Chris in his day job does financial planning. So you know, this is a real break from tradition to Chris, somebody who actually works in kindness and financial services.

Chris Daems 00:52

Combinations. Don't think I've ever had a conversation with somebody that is said to me. Yeah, kindness and financial planning, they come together really well.

Stuart Webb 01:03

Chris, welcome to the podcast, I'm really, really pleased to see you. Listen, you know, we normally start off with how do you help your clients? But you know, how do you help people be kind, I guess is the question I'm going to sort of put back to you.

Chris Daems 01:17

It's a really good question. I hope that we inspire people through the work we do on the podcasts, because, and we've been doing it for five years now, I know sort of podcasting is an interesting thing. It's something I've fell into with an inch with a desire to share stories of people doing good stuff in the world. And when we first started it, it was that case of going, we looked at the numbers, because I am a financial planner. And that's just sort of part of my personality is looking at now than others. And I think

Stuart Webb 01:52

the person but you can't take the person out of the planning.

Chris Daems 01:56

I think I think I'm a business owner as well. Right. So tracking the numbers and understanding what's going on is, is part of it's part of who I am. And it's interesting, because when we first started looking at so the amount of listeners we were getting on the podcast, I think week one was 17. And week two was 12. So we lost listeners in the first week for some bizarre reason. But now we've been doing it for five years, and we've consist you shared stories of people doing amazing stuff in the world. We get 10s of 1000s of listeners who tune in to the kindness project every month, and it's an absolute honour to share the stories of people doing amazing stuff in the world. I absolutely love it.

Stuart Webb 02:44

Yeah, it's a really, really great thing to do. You know, to be honest with your question, there's not enough kindness going around. Is there? That's one of the that's one of the messages that come through to me.

Chris Daems 02:54

Yeah, I mean, I mean, part of its interest in Islam, you know, what you said at the start about that combination between being in financial planning unkindness, even though even though we're in a position where that link might not be obvious, what I do in the day job is help people achieve financial independence so they can live the lives they want. And actually, there's nothing kinder than having that financial clarity, so that you can come and do stuff you want. And often, for a lot of our clients who are typically between 50 and 60, when they start to work with us, part of their life plan moving forward is giving back, because they've been lucky in their life to build a level of wealth. And it's often it's about that next stage of their life being in a situation where they go, Well, how can I help others?

Stuart Webb 03:49

Yeah, yeah, I, you know, you're probably aware a little bit that some of the work that I do, and I'm working with business owners to try and grow their business, but nearly nearly all, I mean, it's not true that every one of them, but pretty much every one of them wants to be or grow their business, because what they want to end up doing is saying, Well, I've got this charity, or I've got these people that I want to help actually what I want to do is liberate enough money from the business at the end of the day to go into, you know, there's only so much time you could spend on the golf course. So you know, they want to do something else. They want to spend some time with some people, they want to be there. I mean, now I've just helped one guy, he's grown his business. And what has he done, he's done two things. One, he's now spending a lot more time in a hospital because as he said, the one thing that you hear about people when they get to this stage in their life is they've spent too much time in the office and he wants to get people out of doing that. And the second thing is that he actually sort of developed devoting some of that money back to helping other people grow their business so he can see them get back out and do good things after they finished with their business. Like financial financial planning is important part of being able to give back.

Chris Daems 04:56

I mean, one of the things I'm really proud of is and again, we talked about that Okay, one of the lucky things I've managed to do is take all of the stories from the podcasts and put them in a book. And that was published late last year, it's doing really well. About 100% of the profits we get from that book, go into our local hospitals, funny enough, some proxies who do amazing work. But for people at the end in the lives and certainly go in, and we've got really good close relationship with our speakers, they've been on the climate project a number of times, and I did the marathon for them in 2021. So we've we've done a lot of work together supporting what they do. And I've been lucky enough to see the work they do firsthand, by going into spirits and meeting the team and stuff like that. And you look at that, and you go, it does give you a different perspective on life, when you realise that sometimes it comes to an end quicker than we think. And sometimes we need to think about the decisions we make with our time, which is the commodity that's most limited, as opposed to the money.

Stuart Webb 06:11

Yeah, Chris, you're absolutely right. I'll put the link to the book down at the bottom of the screen. So the kindness Project book.co.uk, forward slash book, that's the kindness project, book.co.uk, forward slash book can't recommend that everybody just goes and gets a copy of that themselves. Because there's, there are some great, great stories. Chris, you just mentioned something there in terms of time, and I'm sort of constantly aware that time is the one thing that you can't get, you can make more money. You just can't make more time time passes, you know, whether you like it or not. And I'm, I'm constantly aware that, that, you know, I talked to people who own businesses, and they talk about time management ago, time manages itself, whether you like it or not, it passes at 60 seconds per minute, whether you do what only thing you can do is manage your attention during that time. And I think that's one of the things that you're sort of talking about there is it it's about attention isn't it's about people being attuned to what they're trying to do and being and thinking about more what they're trying to achieve with some of the stuff that they're talking about. Yeah,

Chris Daems 07:13

I mean, I mean, for me, and again, this is the planner coming in, coming out. And it's about having a clear strategy, step one, because the amount of people we speak to, like in our professional lives, talk about, I've done the setup this investment, or I've done before we start talking about any of that what the plan, you know, and it goes back to be intentional with your time and look at sort of how we have we do that. And just having been financially clear about where you are, so that you can move on to to where you want to be. And it's interesting, because when I get through it, I'm not perfect. You know, if you've read the book, I tend, I tend to stories about the fact that I am liable to make mistakes like goal averse. And so one story in the book about I travelled with my dad every year, my dad's in his 70s Now, and we do like a little weekend, boys weekend, every year where we go away together. And a couple of years ago, we went to you brought up and I booked a hotel, the hotel Gibraltar and not booked flights and stuff like that flew into Gibraltar airport, got in the cab at Gibraltar airport and said, Look, we'd like to go to the hotel with Gibraltar. It went I can't take you there. Okay, interesting. Why not? Cuz, because sir, the hotel Gibraltar is an interpreter. It's in Spain. And I bear in mind that we manage millions and millions of clients were really good at what we do. Hopefully, we do all that sort of stuff. I don't know anybody else do it, who's booked a holiday in the wrong country, you know, who's put in the wrong place. Now, I thought I'd done my research on Google Maps, it was 10 minutes from the airport, it was just over the border. But one thing I do write about in the book, and the reason I share that story, particularly as business owners, is I think the starting point to be kind to others is also to try and be kinder to ourselves. And understand that life isn't perfect, but also sort of navigate that in a way which allows you to do the best for you and your clients.

Stuart Webb 09:39

Yeah, absolutely. Right. You know, Chris, that's a really interesting. Yeah, a really interesting story to illustrate that because, you know, too often I find business owners who are beating themselves up and, you know, I think you and I both fans as well of the daily stoic, I sort of sit and read, I sit and read that that's the first thing I sort of read pretty much every day is To just centre myself on the fact that there are a lot of things in this world that you cannot control. But the one thing you can control is your reaction to the circumstances. Often we're trying to fight against data, we're trying to control things which are just out of control. We can't control the world, we can't control the weather. But what we can do is decide what we're going to do to react to it and deciding to react to a setback like that. I go, Okay, fine. So we're gonna go on, go in a hotel, that's 10 minutes down the road, but in a different country, we'll make the mess that will make better that will find a good

Chris Daems 10:30

thing. It's about perspective, isn't it? I mean, my dad wasn't happy for money. So I mean, drag it and 74 year old men through them. And the thing is, we tried to get a cat the other end, but we didn't have any euros because I didn't expect to, like need any, because to still use sterling. But we woke up in the morning, it took a while for him to get over it. But they'd say we are now getting international travel every day of our trip. So so it did it did potentially help. But I mean, you've allocated I'm glad you brought out that. If there's one book that I recommend anybody read. It's the daily stoic. It's the book that I read every day. And it's a really interesting discipline that book has around, only read a page or die. I've never done that before. But throughout 2022, I did it. And it really helped my morning routine, and having a perspective in the day. What's your, what's your favourite stoic teaching?

Stuart Webb 11:29

Oh, gosh, I think I was probably getting towards it towards the end. And we started doing it when we were talking about just now which is, which is that that concentration on the fact that you know, I remember very clearly it was towards the end of December, the the momentum, alright, you know, everyone is going to die and you sit there and you think I don't want to think about it, but at the same time, it focuses your mind on and it's so difficult to get across to people who are younger, and I work a lot with students. And you I watched them spend hours debating if they could spend 20 Pence less on this or 20 quid less of that. And you think the time that you're spending debating that you could actually put into something which you're gonna make 20 quid later on the new life. But yeah, just focusing on that, we'll come back to that thing. It is that focus, it's the focus on the right thing, not the wrong thing. People spend too much of their time and I was just dealing with business owner, just before we got into this call, and you know what, he was fretting about something and I was going, let it go. It's just not that important. You know, in the grand scheme of things, when you get to the end of the business life, you're gonna look back and go, What the heck that was about, you know, that was a day of fret wasted because I could have got on with doing what we're doing. It is that focus on, remember, you've got a legacy. Remember, you've got something you're going to leave and make sure what you leave in worthwhile rather than fretting about the money or fretting about the it is it is, you know, you look back and you go, did I have the right relationships? Are people going to look back on me and think I was, you know, a reasonable nice kind person? Or are they going to I can go why was he always constantly worrying about the money? You know, that's, that's, I think, the teacher,

Chris Daems 13:16

and I agree, I mean, the money, what we what we sort of start with is all money is a tool to allow you to live the life you want. Now without money, life can be fairly difficult karmic because it brings worry where you don't need it. But thankfully, the clients who try to start off with their, you know, accumulate wealth and savings, and that's a responsibility insurance we take really seriously are in a position where they've either financially independent or getting there. And ultimately, it's all about relationships. You know, the reason we started the kindness project, and it was really selfish, if I'm honest, the reason the reason I decided to climb this project is she's 19 Now, but she was 13. And I was really worried about maintaining a really relationship with a teenage girl, because what do I talk to the teenage girl about? And having that project, we work on it together, particularly as we, you know, we published every week and record content pretty consistently. It's been a really good anchor to that relationship, you know? And it's inspired, hopefully, you know, she's at uni at the minute and Strathclyde studying journalism, hopefully, that curiosity of helping understand and tell other people's stories has inspired her to do that. But

Stuart Webb 14:43

yeah, and I think it's a great Oh, it's a really great way of maintaining that relationship by I don't know, with my son the relationship revolves around something so much more shallow and sport but I mean, you know, yeah, I mean, it's,

Chris Daems 14:58

it's whatever you Hold on to isn't it when my youngest, it's out because she loves she loves. So it's just a thing, you've got to go where they are.

Stuart Webb 15:11

Now, that's interesting, Chris, I'm sorry, we've sort of gone off on off the kindness project a bit, but actually go where they are, it's really, it's really an important lesson for business, isn't it? Because so often, you know, as business owners, we are not reaching out to where the customer our client is. And, you know, I say this, so often, he sort of alluded to it a little bit, then, you know, we don't add, reach to our customer and try and put ourselves in their shoes nearly enough do and that's kind of where I was sort of thinking, it's sort of some of the kindness project sort of comes into this, we don't actually try and put ourselves in their shoes, we try and sort of hope that they will come to us. But actually, The Secret to Building a business, the secret of kindness is going out and saying, What do I do to put myself in your shoes, and then look at it from your point of view. And actually, that's a good lesson for business.

Chris Daems 15:57

It's a really interesting one, particularly in the business that we're in is a financial planning practice. Because I think we underestimate how scary it is comes to somebody like me, I think in the UK, money's still quite taboo. It we're in a position where having open and honest conversations about money is something we're not, we're not that great at in the UK. But come into somebody like me and saying, I'm not clear about where my financial future lies, and I need your help, is scary. So when we were thinking about how we could help clients in a way that the mic is intimidating, part of the reason we, we put videos on our website, client testimonials and, and things like that is to show that smart, sensible people get the help, they need to get the outcome they want. And it is scary initially, but we're quite friendly. So and if we can show that if we can show that the spirits and speak to a financial planner, getting the help you need is a I was gonna say painless, less pain than you expect. Then hopefully, more people will then get get out they need to achieve their goals. But we, as I said, We Never underestimate truckers, people putting us you know, somebody's worked 2030 years building their business, building their careers, building their wealth to achieve what they want to do in the next chapter of their lives. Trust me and my practice and my team with it is it is a big jump. So think illustrate in the fact that we're decent people who want to do the right thing is important. Now, the kindness project has nothing to do with that. I didn't expect the two to overlap. The kindness project was about a desire to share stories of people doing good good with well, when a time I was looking at the world and going where are all the good stories. But I think it does help for clients to be too to recognise that we believe in doing well and doing good.

Stuart Webb 18:23

Yeah, I agree with you, Chris, there must be something you're doing at the moment to reach out to those clients, giving them that help without sort of going to charging them the earth before you sort of do it. What what do you what's the what's the way that people should should engage with you both as a business owner with you as a person sort of now promoting the kindness that you're talking about in the book?

Chris Daems 18:44

Yeah, so typically, it's interesting. So we're 12 years into the practice now. And we're typically referral one. So all of our clients come through introductions, either through our professional network people who know unlike us, and trust us, or through our existing clients, and that's a really nice position to be in. But I'm always looking to connect with fun, interesting people. One of our roles as a practice is we only work with people we like, that's really important to us, because we want to have a great time while we work in as you say, if we were intentional about who we work with its interest and want to get your perspective on this. How many business owners you do you work with? Are we take on clients they know they're not?

Stuart Webb 19:36

Yeah, boy, you know, that's interesting, because I had a discussion with a with a with, with somebody about that the other day. When I say the other day, it was back 10 days ago. So it's a bit more than a week. It was just sort of the turn of the between the Christmas and New Year period. And they were basically saying, you know, I have problems, and I just sort of went through and then it's a quiet period. Let's just spend, I spent, I spent a couple of hours and when let's go through all the current customers you've got and just sort of ask the question, are they making your profit or not? Absolutely every single one he basically Terminator are they're difficult. I don't make much with them. They're difficult. And I looked at him and I said, Why do you have these customers? Yeah. Anyway, I couldn't do without him and I went, are you having fun with them? No. Well, what's the point? Well, you know, they might be profit. And we've just proved that to have those losing money, working with people that are losing your money, and the fear of letting go the fear of saying no, I don't want to, because there was this, but they might produce better results in the future when the evidence from history is that they won't. And if the only business just to hope you're in business, just to sort of expect some miracle, you're in the wrong business. So my advice to him was start start basically quitting clients just turn around, say, sorry, your behaviour is not what we want. We're not interested in working with people like you, you can change your behaviour or, or we're firing him. And he looked at me and said, couldn't possibly do that. And I went, I don't think we're gonna be able to work together, because that's my attitude. My attitude is not to turn around and work with people who, frankly, you're gonna cost me more effort than I'm gonna get

Chris Daems 21:14

out of it. Yeah, yeah. And I get positive. I get why it's difficult, right? Because I've been there in terms of the the sort of my journey as a business owner in the first couple of years not being able to do that. And then getting to a point where I go, Well, why am I why am I doing that? Brian? Brian's obviously pro just commented side hope he's not the strategy. I agree with that. I mean, it's, it's having that having that clear plan, and having the difficult conversations when clients aren't working with you. That's the bit that I think a lot of business owners avoid.

Stuart Webb 21:52

Yeah, absolutely. Right. Chris, I mean, I've taken up far too much of your valuable time. So I'm just going to very quickly get to the sort of the final question I've got for you, which is, you know, I've asked you some questions. You've asked me some questions. But there must be one question that we haven't yet sort of asked. And I know we sort of veered into this a bit. So you know, what's the what's what some of our sort of strategies, but what's the what's the one question that I should have asked you, perhaps about the kindness project, perhaps about financial planning, perhaps about life itself? But which one? Would you like me to have asked, which I haven't asked yet?

Chris Daems 22:21

Well, firstly, let me say you say, I've really enjoyed it's been a short chat, but I've really enjoyed our conversation today. And thank you for helping me promote the book.

Stuart Webb 22:31

We're gonna push this out, Chris, you know what I will get out of that with but yeah, I think it's great book. I think it's worth everybody getting a copy.

Chris Daems 22:39

Yeah. I mean, I mean, thankfully, the sales have been, uh, been pretty decent so far. The more we can raise space, the more I'll be happy. And one thing I do want to mention on the book for us to talk about the question is we've got a event at NSX in the middle of Feb. So it's a bit of a light book launch slash celebration event. We'll share that with everybody. If you're if you're in the area or you want to travel down, we should have a really good turnout help us celebrate the impact of the book. One thing one thing that I think we could have explored more is reading material, because I think the starting point was when people were building their financial plan is self education, right? You know, what can I learn to learn to empower myself with before actually come to speak to a professional, and there's a few books number one is happy money by Elizabeth Dunn, talks about the fact that spending money can make us happy, but spending money on certain stuff makes us happier than others. So that's a really interesting book to read. Wellbeing by Tom Rath is another good one. That's all about looking at all aspects of well, being not only financial, the ultimate Millionaire is one of my favourite books by David Bach. And interestingly, the daily stoic I definitely recommend that in all aspects of your life reading the daily stoic is worthwhile.

Stuart Webb 24:13

Can I Can I just because I we've just talked a little bit about sort of daily routines progress on I don't know, as I said, one of the first things I do is get up and I read the Daily stoic, but I also have a routine that means that the one of the first things that I do in the morning is actually read myself in the way that you've just discovered. I'm just going to show you the book that I'm currently reading that's, that's on my desk. So that's, that's a really that's a good book that I recommend. I take the other one that I've got, which might surprise you. But that is absolutely brilliant. Anybody who hasn't read that book will know you're not expected that to be a really good business but but it's a brilliant business, but because it's about people. It's about how you manage to get inside the head of somebody and you You know, we just talked about it too often business is not about try, I'm going to try and put these down without locking everything down and show off to business owners are not thinking about the people are they? They're not thinking about the, the, you know, how do you make somebody's you know, happy in their life. And I said this to a business owner recently I turn around said, he said to me, I'm afraid of selling and when everybody's afraid of selling, we're all afraid of rejection. But I'll tell you what. Yeah, I like that from Howard Bullock is another financial advisor, which I'm going to do. So we'll put that up in a minute. But you know, the one thing that I keep saying to people about selling is, if you've got a solution to their problem, and you've understood their problem properly, if you just reach across the desk and say, Do you want help, they will buy it from you, you don't sell a solution to anybody, you, they will buy it from you. So to be honest with you work with the people you like and just offer them help, you'll be surprised.

Chris Daems 26:01

And interestingly, I mean that our approach is, it's got to be when you're ready, you know, and sometimes that element of speed somebody initially and then not being ready yet, doesn't mean they don't need your help sometime down the future. The amount of times clients have come back when they've gone. The pains got too much. Now I need to get financially cleared to go to the next stage in my life. It's it's an interesting model.

Stuart Webb 26:26

Chris, this has been a really fabulous discussion. Thank you so much. I am very aware of how valuable your time is. Look, everybody go get this book, go get the kindness project. Book. It is it is it is it is an interesting, but it is not your standard business book. Except it is. So if you see what I mean. Chris, I wish you all the success with that. I'm just gonna just gonna, just gonna put one. One final thing up if you would like to get onto our mailing list so that you get an email on a weekly basis about who I'm talking to on the podcast this week. Really interesting conversations like this. So you can join us we've had people today, putting comments up and talking about the sort of comments that people like interesting people like Chris, we only have interesting people on this podcast, we don't have any wasted time. That's the link to get on, which is TCA dot FYI, forward slash subscribe, that's TCA dot FYI, forward slash subscribe, Chris. Thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us. I'm just gonna play the outro so that we finish this off, and then I'll make sure that we get out we really helped you to promote the kindness project, but because Thank you, no problem at all. Chris, thank you very much.

Who is Elena?

Elena is a professional accountants and tax advisors who help automate and optimise your business processes, to be able to make informed decisions and experience the financial freedom you deserve.

Key Takeaways

What are the mistakes business owners are making and how do they play out in their business? 2:24

Looking for the problem in concentric circles starting at your desk. 4:28

The importance of taking a simple approach to business. 6:08

Not all business coaches are very good with the financial data. 8:03

What is the most stressful period in accountants’ lives? 12:54

The importance of paying yourself first -. 15:47

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

business, elena, clients, business owners, accountant, problem, accountability partner, people, find, money, book, life, question, report, speak, coach, burnout, share, talking, tips

Stuart Webb 00:24

Hi there, and welcome to It's not rocket science five questions over coffee. I'm here with my coffee in front of me. And I'm ready to have a really interesting discussion with Elena Meskhi. I hope I'm saying that correctly. And that, you know, you'll tell me, thank you. Elena is an accountant, she helps her business clients to optimise and automate their processes so that they can make better financial decisions and therefore achieve the financial freedom that they're really interested in. I love this sort of subject this is definitely write up my tweet, I love talking to business owners about how they optimise and and make their business, less about them and more about the business process. Because that's the only way you can exit your business. If you're still at the middle of your business, being the controller everything, you cannot exit your business, you can never sell it. So Elena, I think it's gonna give some great, great, great tips in there. So she's also the author of a book, we'll come to that I'm sure during the discussion, Elena, welcome to It's not rocket science, five questions over coffee.

Elena Meskhi 01:26

Today, thank you so much for inviting me, I'm very excited to be here to share with you the tips with their audience about how to extract yourself from the business and move yourself to the next step. And how to face different fears and challenges. So we work with that business owners who run their own businesses day to day. So it's usually starting when they think that they had enough working for one lunatic and surprise and maybe they they started working for another one being themselves who is much harsher, who is more demanding and more challenging and constantly sitting inside you and say Go Go Go doo doo doo bigger, but more more not enough. How to how to overcome all that.

Stuart Webb 02:21

I know that lunatic very well. And I'm not going to say any more than that. So I mean, that's the answer to the first question. But tell me about the second one, which is you're obviously working with people that have tried things in the past, they've tried ways of doing it, what are the mistakes they're making? And how are you seeing those mistakes sort of play out everyday in their business?

Elena Meskhi 02:39

The first thing, the most predominant one, they the business owner would think that there is no problem. So they don't acknowledge the problem, that there is a problem. They think it's the team, they I can't find the right people. It's the system which don't work. It's the banks who don't get the loans. It's a cash flow. It's always the problem. And you know, the social media and the media overall, it's kind of support that thought. So everything else is wrong around you, you're the right one. So you're in the, in the quest to put things right. And to what I understand about business and business owners being so foreign in this industry for the last 15 years, you better start from yourself. And when when you face yourself and you realise that you have the burnout, you keep doing doing doing and you're afraid of stepping back and think about the business and analyse the situation. And actually when you remove yourself and this is the first fear because what if they're willing to go job What if the product is not going to be so good what if someone else will drop the ball I have to control everything and everywhere. And by being in the operational side so much involved, the business owners struggle to actually present the better product the better idea and to do to remove themselves from the business and enjoy it and deliver even bigger scale the life changing opportunities they can do. And when they finally identify the problem, they would try to solve it in isolation. So, they would think people is the problem. So, I will fix the people they will hire different consultants, they will aim they will improve the recruitment process the training process and then something else does work then they will figure out that there is another problem there was a system don't work because we do things in a without using technology for example, and then they will work with another specialist who will help them to improve technology. So the problem I see is that total disintegration of there are aspects of the business, because they, they either have to put all the consultants together, which first of all challenging to find the right people. Secondly, it comes at a cost, because, um, the business owner feels the demand that they have to know, all those areas, they go in deeper research, they invest more of themselves in that subject. And that's more harder for them to delegate it. So it's like a catch 22 They never can win in that situation. And this is, this is how they get more stress, burnout, this money, never ended circle. Sounds familiar?

Stuart Webb 05:41

Does sound familiar? And and I remember a very wise mentor of mine in my early in my career told me that whenever you see a problem in your business, you start looking for the problem in concentric circles starting at your desk, because so often the problems that you see are the ones that you are beginning to create. So having been somebody that spent a lot of time in businesses trying to help them fix process problems. You're absolutely right. There are too many times when people look and go, Well, it can't possibly be there, it's got to be over there. And you start putting together too many different disparate things that just make it even worse, you really need to take a simple approach only you take it back to basics. Business is actually fairly simple business is really not very difficult. But we make it difficult by looking and trying to complicate things, because it can't be as easy as it looks kind of.

Elena Meskhi 06:34

Absolutely, yes, we will look everything at our perspective. And one of the very good technique is to have the accountability partner. And this is also very tricky solution, because we tend to find the wrong people to be our accountability partners. I see different situations, sometimes that could be your life partner, and your common goal and you consult with them to discuss at their dinner or breakfast, how to do different different scenarios. It can be a business partner, and I find it there once you reach the limit very quickly, because all those people they subjective. And of course, they have your best interest at heart, but they can't, subconsciously they always will be their first advisor for themselves rather than you. So that's why it's very, it's very different, different. Another solution business owners comes up with, they will find the business coach. Yeah. But the business coach themselves, they will help them to take their mind to the next to look at the things differently, they will challenge them, they will be their accountability partners. However, not all business coaches, they are very good with the financial data. And the business owner also would be a little bit reluctant to share too much financial data with coach for the number of reasons. And the business coach, understandably, they would withdraw themselves from that sort of conversation and talking about money. God, this is what the business about is nothing if you are in business for money, yes, okay. You could have the illusion, I started the business, I want to help people, I want to make this live better. I want to work with best people. That's that's fine. That's your ethical. And that's your ethical understanding of the business. And this is the mission of the business. But the primary goal of the business is to make money. And who is the better person to speak about money than your account? Because we know so many, we know so many information, it is so valuable, that even life partners they don't know and with accountants is why do I call myself more than accountant because I'm not. I'm not scared to talk about money with my clients. I'm very open and open to share my insights and my advices about it. It's type of the industry accountants, typically they are introverts, and they don't that much like talking to people, they will like during reports or data and analysis of the digits and figures. And, and by presenting you with that. So one of the Gronk conversation we hear from our prospective clients who come to us the question we ask, How often do you speak with your accountant? And then most times, they will say well Once a year when the financial year is over this is when they see their accounts. And they're like, That's too late. That's already too late. How did you make all those decisions through the year? How did you know how to borrow money? How to whether you have capacity to recruit more stuff? How did you raise the prices? These are all the questions you speak through with your accountant, because Coincidently, not coincidentally, it all come to the matter of your business. This is all interlinked, and this is what evolved. So I find that accountant would be the best accountability partner, accountant would be the best business coach, when you find the right accountant, who is keen to speak, who came to share, and who will not be, you know, afraid of hiding behind the figures are the highs of the reports, and actually elaborate and be open and give you feedback to understand what's the reports about how to read the report. And what's the report, because there is the another fear that some accountants have, if I will share too much information with my clients, and they will teach them too much how to read the report, they will be doing it themselves. And it's, it's again, it's self fulfilling prophecies, it's when when you are not sharing the learning the understanding what business business owners are crazy. Business owners, they, they are best in what they do in their best in their product, their best in their services. They don't know that much information about the financial data, and how to read it and what strategy to use and how to approach. So that's why I think that we have done tremendous help and tremendous assistance to the business owners on growing the business on extracting them from the business. They have more clients less and less time in their business, they have bigger profits, and they finally living the life they want.

Stuart Webb 12:13

I have to admit a very unusual accountant because I find very few accountants who are who are quite so happy to act as a business coach to their clients as you Elena and in fact, some of the best, best work that I do is with accountants, because the accountant will often say, you know, you need to help them to sort of extract themselves from their business by making some changes. They won't listen to me because they think I'm just here to talk about their numbers. So if you've managed to crack that you've done very well, I know that a lot of a lot of the best joint ventures that I got going on are with accountants who are turning around and saying, you know, I need to crack into what is actually going on in that business. I can't find out the numbers are telling me something. I don't know what it is. And they're not prepared to tell me so. And I know you've you've written a book about all of this, I'm just going to share the link for where we can see that book on screen. There it is going on. It's on Amazon. And I think you said that you you have you not only have you documented this but you eat your own dog food, don't you you actually live what you have written in your book.

Elena Meskhi 13:14

Yes, exactly. It's all the self, self written. This book is about my experience, how I put my business to the next level. I've been in this business for the last 15 years, started from scratch from the kitchen table and grown it throughout town at some point in time I sold my business and I started again from scratch with more experience and with more knowledge and tips. And now finally, believe it or not the most stressful period in accountants live in December and January because it's such a joy. So look at me. I'm not in the office, I'm actually in Africa, having the time of my life with my family. And I know for sure that all the deadlines are done on submitted. And they wish the same for all my clients. Because they on top of like things they don't have to stress on the 30th of December or 23rd that they have to complete the tax returns. So we totally implemented all those strategies in the business to meet with the use of technology with use of different different aspects including psychology, including neuroscience. And it was very, very exciting journey and it is still is I'm still this is actually what we keep doing. I'm training and speaking with my clients on a daily basis, parts of the day. This is sacred and assisting them on taking that journey forward to find a way to find that happiness in life. I found the balance.

Stuart Webb 15:02

Pretty bad, pretty good. If you've ever if you've been able to train your clients that well, you've done well, we're coming to the end. And I've got the final question for you for you. Couple of questions wandering off his and we've talked about your book. But there must be a question that I haven't yet asked you that you would really like me to have asked you. So what is the question you would have liked me to ask you? And once you've asked the question, would you mind answering it as well for us?

Elena Meskhi 15:27

All right, that's a good strategy for the interview, I learned that you might wish to ask me about my innovative method called Pay yourself first. And what it is about this is at length spoken in my book, and this is the idea I came along. And I have been lucky tested on the on on the several on all of our clients, and have the tremendous results. So the concept and I think this is one of the tip on takeout, what your listeners and your audience can take and actually sleep on it and see how this concept will be lent into their business. So the business owner, they have so much pressure and they have so much responsibility. So they are responsible to the clients for the product to the team for the salaries to the suppliers, and they always prioritise and they act like firefighters, whichever demand think they're touching. First, they completely forgetting about themselves. And they completely forgetting to pay themselves first. So the concept talks, and introduces the change of this world and to put themselves first. So they think about themselves first they think how much money they do the personal budget how much money they need, in order to functional properly not like on bread and water, but to have all the variety in life what they used to, and come with a personal budget and setup that as the minimum amount of money their business must generate and generate, but probably after to leave as a bottom line on what they can take it minus taxes. So and to put it as a priority. And rather than every month, paying the salary, and then suppliers and then the software and then whatnot, they will pay themselves first that particular amount of money and see how the world will start changing around them. So on my website, and under mosquito calm, we have a scorecard which will help your audience if they take that test, they will be able to see they will get there pretty neat report about their business where the business right now and what next actions they can do to take the challenge and then out of that test, they will get a free copy of my book. So this is one of the perks and they can learn a little bit more about their pay yourself first, which I find is a life changing for all of my clients.

Stuart Webb 18:15

They know I think that's a brilliant offer. And I thank you so much for spending a few minutes away from your holiday to spend some time with us today. I wish you all the success going back to that holiday. I'm just going to finish by saying we've got a problem with the video. It's playing far too quickly. We will we won't read it because we don't edit on this programme. I'm just going to say thank you to Elena Elena. Thank you so much for spending a bit of time with us. If you would like to get onto the mailing list so that you get to hear about really interesting people like Elena coming up go to TCA dot FYI forward slash subscribe that's tcaa dot FYI, forward slash subscribe and get on to our mailing list so that you can hear about really interesting people. Elena, thank you so much for spending a few minutes with us today. I am now going to play the the out video which will enable the other metre stop this so you'll hear the music you're getting so my apologies for for glassing areas with that far too quickly. But we're gonna we're gonna say thank you very much wish you all success in your business and have a lovely holiday.

Elena Meskhi 19:25

Thank you so much. Thank you, Stuart. I am the subscriber to your podcast from now on and I'm looking forward to hear more interesting, insightful stories

Who is Marc?

Marc Singer - The Men's Coach

After being sentenced to life in prison for a crime he had not committed, Marc had to also endure the tragic deaths of his entire family, whilst in custody... Fast forward to now, he is a successful professional Men's mindset coach who works to help them discover their turning point and create a life that they choose.

Key Takeaways

Despite being in a very bad situation, Marc didn't want to see himself as a victim, and had to choose to take responsibility for thoughts, feelings and actions, in order to move himself forward.

it was only then that he discovered that he had the skills and attributes to become a great coach and this sent him on a path of self discovery

Our past may not take us into a life of crime, but mat prevent us from achieving our best, such as presenting us from being able to speak in public

Men specifically avoid moving forward with their lives a group that struggles the most in terms of everything that we do. Suicide rates are the highest with men. And that's a lot to do with a reluctance for men to sort of move forward. So the question I would ask is, why is that men struggle to move forward with their lives, and really take control of the things that matter most, which is your mindset. The way the mindset creates everything we do in life, it creates our thoughts, our feelings, and our actions. And if we're not in control of that, then our actions are not going to be conducive to the life that we're living.

Valuable Free Resource or Action

Links;

www.marcsingercoaching.co.uk/

http://www.facebook.com/leaderwithincoreenergy

(4) Marc Singer ~ The Men’s Coach | LinkedIn

https://youtube.com/@MarcSingerCoachingSeminars

A video version of this podcast is available on YouTube :

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Here's how you can bring your business to THE next level:

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It's a detailed breakdown of how you can grow your business to 7-figures in a smart and sustainable way

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Transcript

Note, this was transcribed using a transcription software and may not reflect the exact words used in the podcast)

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

life, people, beliefs, men, prison, book, coach, attitudes, struggling, create, deal, mark, discover, mindset, question, important, helped, jail free card, moment, work

Stuart Webb  00:25

Hi, everyone, welcome back to it's not rocket science, five questions over coffee I have here in front of me, my favourite mug filled with coffee. And I've really, really looking forward to the next 1015 minutes we spent with this man Mark singer is the men's coach, he was sentenced to life in prison for a crime he hadn't committed, but he had to endure deaths of his entire family whilst in custody. And now he is a really successful men's mindset coach who works with them to help discover their Turning Point and create a life that they would choose now I think this is gonna be a really fascinating few minutes. Mark, I really am looking forward to this welcome to It's not rocket science, five questions over coffee.

Marc Singer  01:14

Thank you very much for having me on.

Stuart Webb  01:16

Look, what do you do you want to just start by describing those men that you're trying to reach? And the sort of people they are? And?

Marc Singer  01:33

Yeah, yeah, no, that's fine. Yeah. I mean, like, as you said, I went through a traumatic set of variances, which then create the lives that they choose. And, yeah, it was a it was a bit of a journey. So as you just said, they're convicted of a crime that had been in God, the trauma or all of that, whilst actually raising the family funerals and selling the family, home and so on whilst in prison, whilst not knowing if I was ever going to be actually released from prison, so, but I sorted as an opportunity to turn my life around, eventually secured really no, I'm a professional coach, working with men to help them create the lives that they choose as well. So that's what I now do.

Stuart Webb  02:21

So tell me, how did you I mean, what are the what are they doing? And who are they trying to reach at the moment? And why? Why is your approach different? What was it about the your experience that helped you to see that as a positive, and turn your life around?

Marc Singer  02:40

Well, actually, well, when I was in prison, I hit rock bottom. And for a period of time, saw myself as a victim, and then it was that realisation that I never wanted, I didn't want to see myself as a victim, and I had to choose to take responsibility for my thoughts, feelings and actions, in order to move myself forward. I never wanted to be a victim. So it was at that moment, I decided enough was enough. And it was then that I decided to deal with that, then then instead of my actual situation where I was the prison and so on, which I couldn't change I could only change what I was doing how I was working. So I failed, because more were then and that led me to a situation when I did actually secure release I fell into code. King, no, no. And it was only then that I discovered that I had the skills and attributes to become a great coach myself and it was sent me on a path of self discovery and and oxide pectins chip professional excellence in coping, and I enrolled with them. And two years later, I qualified as a professional coach, and an S. Now what I do I work with men, particularly, to help them overcome whatever's in their wine. The reason I work with men, typically now, back in the day normal guys who are looking to have some sort of breakthrough in their lives and looking to move forward with their lives. There is a lot of stigma, and I work to break that down so that men can deal with what, whatever they're going through in a moment, and not to put forward to things like this because they have that belief or attitude that it's more feminine, it's more for women. It's not necessarily for working class got that then holds them back from moving forward. So I do tend to work with a lot of guys who are normal everyday guys who look not so much in terms of like dealing with the emotional side because that's what all All of us do, but we deal with it in a different way. But it's more given a more common sense. way of moving forward without all of fluffiness ism a common sense process work way of working forward, which helps them create whatever they want with their lives and, and it's effective and it helped them choose.

Stuart Webb  05:22

Mark, I love your message, I love what you're doing. And I'm just going to put a ticker across the bottom of the screen now, which is, which is your website, which is Mark, as Mark Mar, see, singer coaching.co.uk That's M AR C. Singer coaching.co.uk. Mark, there's lots of great stuff on your website. And I know you're in the process at the moment of writing a book which, which I hope is going to be a real, real bestseller to tell us tell us what is what's going to be in your book, what's, what's the stories in that book that you're going to sort of write and help men to discover this path from, from what you're telling them?

Marc Singer  06:09

Yeah. The book is my journey. It's a story about the only the tip of the iceberg. But when you look at the whole story, because there's a heck of a lot more to it, it was my journey and why I ended up in place one motion. So it really goes back to the beginning where I started. And I actually got involved in a gang I was involved in drugs and things like that when I left school, football violence and things like that. So I created a whole set of antisocial beliefs and attitudes which dogged me for many, many years after, and that led me into countless situations which were antisocial, and, you know, with the police, and so on. But it was many years from all of that in my 30s that I actually got convicted of the thing that I went to prison for. And even though I hadn't done, what they convicted me of, it was actually my own beliefs and attitudes that created that situation inadvertently, and only realised that later on because I I hadn't dealt with the underlying stuff that dogs been for many, many years on the surface or surface I hadn't. I hadn't had I dealt with the beliefs and attitudes at an earlier stage, I wouldn't have been involved in motion to begin with. And so I recognise that when I was in prison, and I started doing the work on the beliefs and attitudes whilst in there, that then helped me change my belief system so that it was more prosocial, more able to move moving forward. And a lot of us in life, we tend to develop beliefs and attitudes as we go through life, which affect us in different ways as we move forward. And it could be something. For instance, I'm working with a guy at the moment who, who's a businessman who struggles doing live speaking events. Now, the reason why he does that is because something that affected him many, many years ago when he was a kid. And he hadn't dealt with those beliefs and attitudes, which are now holding, holding him back from being is at his most comfort in front of people. So it's those sorts of things that I work with to help them identify and remove or change. And so understanding how our mind works is imperatively important for us to be at our best. And it's anything in life, if you want to be a footballer and you want to be the best, then guess what you're going to work on different aspects of become the best version yourself. And if you're a business minister, same thing, if you want to use your mindset, to the best of its ability, you're gonna have to learn how to do that. And many of us don't understand how our minds work fully. And don't understand how the beliefs and attitudes and things that we develop years before affect us in the current. And it's important that we do our best. So a lot of the stuff in the book is about that. It's about how my journey went from where I was to where I am now and everything in between there. But it's also more about individual reading the books is about me, it's about the people, whoever everybody's going through some sort of transition, transfer transformation in life. Doesn't matter who you are. And it's important that we understand how we can work our way through things like that in a more positive and productive way. And my book is about everybody, it's not just about me. It's about whoever you are away from create what you life. And that's the whole premise of the book. It's hast Half Life Story autobiography, half self help book.

Stuart Webb  09:41

I love it. I absolutely love it. I really think that's a brilliant way of putting it. Listen, normally my fourth question when we get to this point of the interview is about what book or what programme? Do you sort of, did you discover which actually sort of you know helps you get forward? You've sort of described a lot of that but is there a cific instance of something you'd like to leave the audience with to say, This is why you've got two graphs. Now this is what you've got to do. This is what I did to, to push me in the direction I'm taking now.

Marc Singer  10:14

Yeah, I mean, basically, what ask is that? What are the likes of? You know, Elon Musk, Steve Jobs Christianna Cristiano Ronaldo, Bill Gates when all of these people got in common? And the answer is, they all have a coach. And I think there was a general misconception, many people that if you ask for help in any way, in life, if you have a coach, if you have a mentor, it means you're weak in some way that you're struggling in life. And so many people avoid reaching out and asking for help, because I think it's a slot that's on this. And it means that they haven't got the ability to do it themselves, and that they're struggling. And I have a device. And it's a common misconception that a lot of people have, that you know, you have, you have to be, you know, mentally challenged or depressed or something like that, in order to reach out and get a coach. And it's really not the case, it's just it really is for the people who want to be the best versions of themselves. And that's essentially the difference between something like therapy and coaching. Coaching is for people, sorry, therapy is for people who want to delve into a certain life coaching is for people who want dispersions. Simple as that. And so my advice would be to people who are, you know, looking to progress in their lives and become the best version of yourself to consider hiring a coach. And so, in order to do that, there's no, it's no coincidence that six people in all have coaching? And that's one of the things I would learn. I'd say, you know, again, yeah, I mean, I learned a philosophy when I changed my life. And that, if you are asking me about a book called leadership by Bruce Knight, and he's the one he is the founder. And I would suggest anybody who's interested in find out more about that, check that book out.

Stuart Webb  12:09

Globally, Mark, listen, I've spent the last 1015 minutes asking you a bunch of questions. And there must be a question that you're currently thinking, Well, why isn't he asked me a bag, whatever. So my Get Out of Jail Free card at the moment is to turn around, get out of jail free card, what a wonderful thing to have for a few years in your life. Anyway, my purse, my question that I'm going to put to you now is, what's the question that you would have liked me to have asked that I haven't done yet. And obviously, I'm going to make you do the work again, I'm going to ask you to answer the question that you asked yourself. So what is the question you would particularly like me to?

Marc Singer  12:53

Well, again, I mean, it's really, what what is it that people, you know, why is it that people, men pacifically avoid moving forward with their lives? I mean, this is the thing that people look at the the general demographic of men, we're with a group that struggles the most in terms of everything that we do. You know, suicide rates are the highest with men. General issues, such as women is the highest in society. And that's a lot to do with a reluctance for men to sort of move forward. So the question I would say, you'd ask is, why is that men struggle to sort of move forward with their lives, and, you know, really take control of the things that matter most, which is your mindset, and your, the way we the mindset creates everything we do in life, it creates our thoughts, our feelings, and our actions. And if we're not in control of that, then our actions are not going to be conducive to the life that we're living. And it's very important that we do that. Because most of settling in life for things that we don't truly want. And if we really want to be at our best, we have to be in control. And the question I would ask is why why do you? Why why is it that men does some common misconception among general men that it's or it's for a feminine all these different labels that people put things on? And none of it is true? It's inaccurate, completely. And I think mainly, a lot of guys will avoid doing these sort of things or investing in a coach because they feel that, you know, there's, you know, the old fashioned belief is just get on with it mentality is just get on the, you know, stiff upper lip, and I had that for a long time when I was in prison. And, yes, it has a place in some ways in society to do that. But the reality is, like I said, it's a misconception because people assume that by getting on with things when you're tough in some way, but it's actually the opposite. A real strong guy in life is the man who asked for help to help and it doesn't mean mentally. Ill like I just explained it in a in a You know, mentally ill way or you're struggling with the president is a way in which we all get forward in life, the most successful people in life always do. So I would say the answer to that question is to not judge things before you, you know, move forward, always have an open mind when you go. In life, generally, very closed minds, even though we tell ourselves, we've got an open mind, we will actually judge pretty much everything from our past beliefs and perspectives. And that then stops us things with any sort of clarity and objectivity. And it's very important that most of us see things with that. Because if you don't, you won't learn, you won't grow. And like me, I would have been stuck in prison. Still, I wouldn't be here talking to you today, if I had that sort of mindset. Because had I believed what everybody was telling me at that time, which was, you're never getting out of prison. There's no point I had no release date, it was a lot harder believe that I wouldn't have got out, I chose not to believe that I created my reality by my actions day in day out by focusing on myself and being the best version I could possibly be learning, exercising and doing all the things I knew, that would help me move forward. So it doesn't matter what your circumstances in life doesn't matter. If we've got a cost of living Christ says it doesn't matter if there's a war in Ukraine, it doesn't matter if there's COVID going on, it doesn't matter if we're struggling, that we're struggling through, we can all be successful with the right mental approach. And that's very, very, very important for any of us, specially right now, with what was going on around us. And, you know, there's the most successful people are the ones who walk through any sort of recession and things like that, and grow from it, rather than allowing it to force them to, you know, crumble basically,

Stuart Webb  16:45

I absolutely love what you're talking about, I think it's so, so brilliant. I mean, really, really appreciate the message you're putting across. And I think you're right, men are taught from a very young, early age, you know, it's the big boys don't cry, suck it up, get on with it. And, you know, we suffer for years because of it. I, I know, find most of my ideas from turning to people around me and go, What do you think, and you know, as business people, as leaders of businesses, the one thing that we can't afford to do is to just close down outside help and close down coaching and close down mentoring. We need those people to help drive us on and drive our businesses on to be the best. So I think what you're doing is brilliant. I love the story. Absolutely. Looking forward to the book. I know it's not out yet. I know he's coming soon. I'm looking forward to getting my hands on a copy of that book and reading it and I should be I should be sort of promoting it through through things like this podcasts and things like that. So really appreciate you coming on and spending a few minutes with us today. I just think that the message is great. I really absolutely love it. Listen, I'm just going to I'm just going to finish now by by doing the usual if you have got got any value out of this and I hope you have one or subscribe to the the newsletter list and then you can get an email every Monday which tells you what speakers we've got coming up in this week's our podcast recording and and you can get on and make sure that you follow people like Mark through his website. He's got lots of links on there, lots of information. So come on to our website onto our newsletter, which is TCA dot FYI. STCA dot FYI. FYI forward slash subscribe that gets you onto the newsletter mailing list. You'll get care about some great speakers like people like Mark coming on. Mark, thank you so much for coming on and spending a few minutes with us. I really do appreciate you spending a few minutes and giving us such huge value in the way that you have approached. Huge what what would have crushed me absolutely would have crushed me but you have approached it so positively and given so much value back and I thank you very much for your time today. Thank you very much.