First of Kind - Details, episodes & analysis

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First of Kind

@soleio

Arts

Business

Frequency: 1 episode/34d. Total Eps: 16

The future belongs to designers who build. First of Kind is the story of design and tech told by its pioneers. Hosted by Soleio. Coproduced by Room 3. Sponsored by Framer, Noon, Grok Bot, Ramp, Vercel, Granola and Profound. firstofkind.com

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Data updated on 05/11/2026

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https://www.instagram.com/firstofkind
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https://youtube.com/@firstofkind
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Score global : 58%

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Karri Saarinen: How We Win

Season 3 · Episode 3

Wednesday, November 4, 2026 • Duration 45:40

Can a designer/founder win the VC game by ignoring all its rules?

Karri Saarinen is the co-founder and CEO of Linear, the product development system for teams and agents. A Finnish designer, he was previously the principal designer at Airbnb and the founding designer at Coinbase.

In this conversation with Soleio at his historic barn in Silicon Valley, Karri explains why Linear set out to win by being better instead of faster, why quality is directional and never static, why he still designs in Figma instead of code, and why the interface still matters as a shared source of truth in a world brimming with agents.

Karri lives the example that a design founder can choose the races worth running and win by their own rules.

00:00 Winning by Your Own Rules

03:12 Quality Is Directional

06:24 Do You Design in Code?

15:45 Owning the Problem

22:45 Beyond the Issue Tracker

26:36 The Bull Case for Design

28:45 Do We Still Need UI?

33:02 The Car Designer of Software

37:37 School Feels Fake

40:59 Never Build the MVP

43:56 Clarity of Scope

45:37 Linear Recalibrates the Palate

—

First of Kind @firstofkind

S3:E03 Karri Saarinen: How We Win

featuring Karri Saarinen https://x.com/karrisaarinen

hosted by Soleio https://x.com/soleio @soleio

coproduced with Room 3 https://room3nyc.com @room3nyc

—
First of Kind is powered by our sponsors:

Framer – https://framer.com

Noon – https://noon.design

Grok Bot – https://x.ai/bot

Ramp – https://ramp.com

Vercel – https://vercel.com

Granola – https://granola.ai

Profound – https://tryprofound.com

—
First of Kind is available wherever you enjoy premium content:

YouTube: https://youtube.com/@firstofkind

Instagram: https://instagram.com/firstofkind

𝕏: https://x.com/firstofkind

Threads: https://threads.com/firstofkind

Website: https://firstofkind.com

Hashtag: #FirstofKind

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Jason Yuan: For the Plot

Season 3 · Episode 2

Thursday, October 29, 2026 • Duration 45:44

How can being a playwright prepare one for designing social intelligence?

Jason Yuan is the CEO and founder of Hivemind. A former Apple designer, he pioneered MercuryOS, an early vision of intent-based computing, then cofounded Dot, a personal AI companion with long-term narrative memory. He now sets off to build a second AI startup inspired by the Madonna song “Future Lovers.”

In this conversation with Soleio, Jason explains why Hivemind runs on principles instead of rules, why every relationship is a story with shared authorship, and why his product motto is “for the plot.”

Jason makes the case that the best products, like the best stories, are based on truth. A truth that is fundamentally plural.

00:00 Own Your Story, Do It True

00:49 Costumes, Stages, then World-Building

03:03 Hivemind in the Wild

08:42 From MercuryOS to Dot

13:20 Did You Make a Startup to Fix Yourself?

16:47 Every Relationship is a Story

19:35 The Graveyard Before Hivemind

22:25 Can Jason See Gotham?

28:13 Do It for The Plot!

29:13 Designing the Hivemind launch

32:48 The Information Market

34:45 Making Work That Feels True

41:02 Being Known Is the Most Wonderful Thing

S3:E02 Jason Yuan: For the Plot

Hosted by Soleio https://x.com/soleio @soleio

Coproduced with Room 3: https://room3nyc.com @room3nyc

Guillermo Rauch: One Stroke Dragon

Season 3 · Episode 1

Thursday, October 22, 2026 • Duration 46:49

What can a dragon painted in a single stroke teach us about software?

Guillermo Rauch is the founder and CEO of Vercel. Growing up in Argentina, he taught himself English in order to teach himself programming, then went on to create Socket.io and other foundational technology for the real-time web. Along the way, he developed a cunning designer’s eye that became the competitive advantage for what is now a multi-billion dollar venture.

In this conversation with Soleio, Guillermo explains why he designed Vercel’s first command line in Sketch before writing any code, why layout shift erodes trust, and why his company won’t commit any “random acts of AI.”

Guillermo makes the case for why he’s not just chief executive. He is also chief designer.

00:00 Human Effort Is Still Underrated

00:44 Chief Executive, Chief Designer

02:33 Two Bets: Software and English

05:15 Gmail Was My Siren Call

11:06 Exposure Hours

14:49 Layout Shift and the One Stroke Dragon

17:10 No Random Acts of Al

25:17 Can Agents Have Taste?

30:15 Software Factories and Agent Customers

34:59 Everything Is Communication

38:04 A New American Story

41:52 Lifemaxxing

S3:E01 Guillermo Rauch: One Stroke Dragon

Hosted by Soleio and produced by Room 3: https://room3nyc.com @room3nyc

Guillermo Rauch: https://x.com/rauchg · https://rauchg.com

Everett Katigbak: Indie Streak

Season 2 · Episode 6

Wednesday, March 18, 2026 • Duration 32:49

What do Anthropic, Facebook, Pinterest and Stripe all have in common?

Everett Katigbak has played a foundational creative role at some of the most iconic brands in technology. His film work documents the stories of seminal figures who have shaped culture, such as his documentary projects on Stewart Brand and Luis Valdez.

In this in-depth conversation at his beautiful San Francisco home, Everett describes the “golden thread” that weaves through his non-linear career path, the importance of humanizing infrastructure, and why he believes your side hustle is actually your “true form.”

As of this recording, Everett has set out on his own to develop an independent creative practice. After years behind the camera, tech’s “brand guru” steps out in front of it.

00:00 Intro: “Your side hustle is your true form”

03:01 Making Facebook Feel Human

05:04 Getting Hired Because You Don’t Fit

08:10 Why San Francisco? Place Before Job

11:33 Analog Research Lab origins & mantras

13:35 Propaganda, Self-Talk, and Shaping Company Culture

16:32 Designing for Engagement vs. Meaning

17:18 Living in Contradictions: Anachronist Meets Futurist

19:27 How to Pick the Right Company (A Nose for What’s Next)

21:03 Expansion vs. Mastery: A Different Kind of Career Path

24:00 Going Independent

26:24 Inside Cursor as a “Cultural Sleuth”

28:49 Stories of Unseen Figures: Luis Valdez, Stewart Brand

Joseph Cohen: Infinite Ride

Season 2 · Episode 5

Wednesday, March 11, 2026 • Duration 36:07

What if you designed a new class of vehicle from the ground up?

Joseph Cohen first cofounded Universe, the mobile-first website builder, before turning his attention to the physical world. He and his brother Eddie Cohen now run Infinite Machine, an automotive company reimagining how people move through cities — not with cars, but with something entirely new, starting with the electric motorcycle.

We met at Infinite Machine's headquarters in New York City, where Joe walked us through the design philosophy behind “non-car” vehicles, why electrification unlocks radical new form factors, and what it means to bet on autonomous people over autonomous cars.

00:00 – Intro: Color Outside the Lines

01:50 – A New Symbol for Freedom

05:52 – The Stolen Vespa

09:49 – The P1 vs. The Vision Pro

12:52 – Hard Modernism

17:26 – Painters Who Paint Factories

19:42 – Ten Times the Trips

23:33 – The Vespa Has No Engine

27:51 – Ask New Questions

32:00 – The Company as Medium

34:11 – Outro: What Memories Will You Make

S2:E5 Joseph Cohen: Infinite Ride

Hosted by Soleio and produced by Room 3: room3nyc.com @room3nyc

First of Kind is powered by our sponsors:

Framer — framer.com

Cursor — cursor.com

Koen & Jorn: Framer Reloaded

Season 2 · Episode 4

Wednesday, March 4, 2026 • Duration 35:36

When do you know to pivot or surrender?

Koen Bok and Jorn van Dijk co-founded Framer, the web design platform that helps designers ship beautiful sites fast. 55% of YC companies run on it. Designers love it. But Framer almost didn't make it.

What began as a high-fidelity prototyping tool born inside Facebook's design culture became—after a near-death pivot five years in—the premier site builder for designers who ship.

Over drinks at the Lone Palm in San Francisco, Koen and Jorn recall what it took to step back from the brink of oblivion and chart a new course — for themselves and the field of digital design.

00:00 Intro: Lone Palm, Last Call

01:34 What is Framer Today?

02:39 Pick a Problem You Love

06:14 Three Interactions to Fifty

08:20 Rough Riding / Why VC is Good

11:38 Three Options Left

14:31 The Pivotal Lunch

20:46 Act III: Solving the Walkie-Talkie

29:08 Artistry meets Wall Street

32:20 Stay Weird, Keep Building

Special thanks to Jane Seabrook and the Lone Palm team for permitting us to film the first ever video podcast at their storied bar.

–

Koen Bok & Jorn van Dijk: Framer Reloaded

First of Kind, S2:E4

Katie Dill: Quality Control

Season 2 · Episode 3

Wednesday, February 25, 2026 • Duration 41:34

What can flying teach us about software design?

Katie Dill has built world-class teams at three iconic companies—Stripe, Lyft and Airbnb—proving that thoughtful design can shape quality at industrial scale.

In this conversation with Soleio, Katie describes her winding path into technology and how fields as disparate as architecture and aviation shape her approach to leading design at Stripe.

00:00 – Intro: It's All About Mileage

02:18 – What Flying Teaches You About Design

07:01 – From History to Design School

10:30 – The IDEO Moment

18:01 – Saying Yes to the Scary Thing

19:46 – The Chair Pullback

21:16 – The Gray Room at Airbnb

25:47 – Breaking Down the Ivory Tower

30:05 – Put In the Mileage

33:35 – Beauty Builds Trust

36:53 – Steam Gauges and Simple Systems

38:53 – The Best Checkout in the World

Katie Dill: Quality Control

First of Kind, S2:E3

Hosted by Soleio and produced by Room 3: room3nyc.com

First of Kind is powered by our sponsors:

Framer — framer.com

Cursor — cursor.com

Vercel — vercel.com

Ryo Lu: The Way

Season 2 · Episode 2

Wednesday, February 18, 2026 • Duration 33:44

What is the future of design in a post-AI world?

Ryo Lu pioneered new patterns for collaboration as founding designer at Notion. He now leads design at Cursor, shaping how software gets built through a fusion of design and engineering.

In this conversation with Soleio, he explains Cursor's approach to design and how the product will evolve to empower designers who build.

00:00 – Intro: The future of design
01:49 – What is design at Cursor?
02:50 – How the team actually works
04:46 – Generalists, Self-Starters, Ex-Founders
07:34 – Building Cursor inside Cursor
10:45 – The next level: Agents & Abstraction
13:48 – Pattern language
18:24 – A lingua franca for builders
20:34 – Baby Cursor
23:45 – The new shape of designer
26:10 – Does AI distribute or concentrate power?
29:43 – Why Cursor is the tool you should learn
30:54 – A new design philosophy
32:36 – Where the path leads

S2:E2 Ryo Lu: The Way
Hosted by Soleio and produced by Room 3 (www.room3nyc.com)

First of Kind is powered by our sponsors:
Framer: framer.com
Cursor: cursor.com
Vercel: vercel.com
Profound: tryprofound.com

Website: www.firstofkind.com
Threads: threads.com/firstofkind_
Instagram: instagram.com/firstofkind_
X: x.com/firstofkind_
Hashtag: #FirstofKind

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Joe Gebbia: Designer-in-Chief

Season 2 · Episode 1

Thursday, February 12, 2026 • Duration 37:46

Why did Joe Gebbia go to Washington? I spoke with America’s first-ever Chief Design Officer last fall to find out. We met on the White House grounds to discuss his newly created role, the formation of @ndstudio, and how Joe plans to weave design into the frabic of U.S. federal government.

00:00 - Intro / Eisenhower Exec Office Bldg
01:34 - From Airbnb to Washington
04:39 - The Federal Retirement Problem
06:31 - The Mine in the Mountain
08:29 - Do Things That Don’t Scale
11:35 - The Julie Prototype
14:20 - Down to 60 Seconds
16:33 - Consumer-Grade Government
18:31 - Nixon’s Federal Beautification
20:22 - The National Design Studio
24:24 - Trust Through Design
27:43 - Building the Dream Team
31:22 - The Silicon Valley Coalition
35:33 - A Golden Age of Design

Special thanks to Joe Gebbia and his team for making this conversation possible.

S2:E1 Joe Gebbia, Designer-in-Chief
Hosted by Soleio: x.com/soleio
Produced by Room 3: room3nyc.com

First of Kind is powered by our sponsors:
Framer: framer.com
Cursor: cursor.com
Vercel: vercel.com
Profound: tryprofound.com

Website: www.firstofkind.com
Threads: threads.com/firstofkind_
Instagram: instagram.com/firstofkind_
X: x.com/firstofkind_
Hashtag: #FirstofKind

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Twiddling Bits with Susan Kare

Season 1 · Episode 7

Thursday, June 5, 2025 • Duration 01:12:34

Explore our Conversational Show Notes, brought to you by Granola.ai — https://notes.granola.ai/f/ee3b12a6-82bb-4662-940a-d4270871994a

Thank you to our partners!

Cursor — https://cursor.com
Framer — https://framer.com
Granola — https://granola.ai
Linear — https://linear.app
Perplexity — https://perplexity.com

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First of Kind - Details, episodes & analysis

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First of Kind - Details, episodes & analysis

Podcast details

Recent rankings

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