We've been trying to book this walk with director Chelsea Hernandez for weeks, but she's just too-busy city-hopping for the PBS music doc-series to hit the trail with us—until now. Chelsea is an Emmy-nominated director, a part of the Brown Girls Doc Mafia, and a great friend!  

On a return from a recent shoot in Puerto Rico for CITY OF SONGS, Chelsea found that her living room ceiling had collapsed, turning her life upside down… rather than get down about it, she took it as a sign from the universe. Time to move!

And time, finally, to get moving with us—thru the Boggy Creek Greenbelt in East Austin—on a winding walk & talk through her career. Starting with her early days (at age 9) hosting her own Martha Stewart-style kids show (99 episodes!)—then assistant editing for Ellen Siro and editing for Mario Troncoso—all the way to making her own feature doc. We get the scoop, with a focus on casting BUILDING THE AMERICAN DREAM, her feature debut about undocumented construction workers that's still painfully relevant today. And she breaks down the approach to co-directing (with Heather Courtney and Princess A. Hairston) for 2023's BREAKING THE NEWS—a doc that Keith EP'd and Episode 3 guest Diane Quon produced. She makes a compelling case for why three directors may be better than one.

Like many, Chelsea is caught-up in today's anti-PBS culture war, outlining how the Trump administration just killed her ITVS-funded film ("the movie Trump doesn't want you to see"). But she's happy to make the case for why PBS matters. It's not just art—it's jobs, community, and the lifeblood of democracy. Plus: why spending time in people's kitchens beats journalism, that time she worked for the Beto campaign, and how many baseballs are in Ben's minivan.

Discussion Links: BUILDING THE AMERICAN DREAM (2019) | BREAKING THE NEWS (2023) | AN UNCERTAIN FUTURE (2017) | ARTS IN CONTEXT (2013-2016) | THAT ANIMAL RESCUE SHOW (2020) | THE EYES OF ME (2009) | ( CITY OF SONGS (2025) | TO BE AND TO HAVE (2002) | TOWER (2016) | BEFORE MIDNIGHT (2013)

Timestamps: 00:00 Introduction and Guest Announcement 01:00 Chelsea's Roof Collapse Story 02:00 Walking the St. David's Community Garden 03:30 Child Star Origins - Kids Ideas TV Show 06:00 Transition from Broadcasting to Documentary 08:00 City of Songs and Traveling for PBS 10:00 CPB Funding Cuts and Trump's Impact 13:00 Building the American Dream Origins 16:00 Casting Real People - Finding Your Protagonists 20:00 Workers Defense Project and Building Trust 24:00 The Fat Mouse Encounter 26:00 Journalism vs. Documentary - Learning to Take Sides 30:00 Breaking the News - Three Directors, Three Perspectives 36:00 Co-Directing Challenges and Triumphs 40:00 Gateway Drug Film - To Be and To Have 42:00 Dream Collaborator Ethan Hawke 43:00 Immigration Raids and Current Work 45:00 Future Projects - Asylum Seekers School and Ruben Ramos 47:00 Baseball Count and Episode Title

Keith wanders LA's Atwater Village with acclaimed producer Megan Gilbride—a co-conspirator on TOWER, A SONG FOR YOU, and DEAR MR. BRODY. We stroll the neighborhood, two old friends and frequent collaborators, outlining just how Megan's the "producer kind of crazy" and not the "director kind of crazy."

Megan's got theories and she has opinions—and she's got the experience to back them all up. This wide-ranging talk covers a whole lot, like… the ethics of authenticity, how the budget tells a story, community building in the doc-making space, and the difference between journalism and cinema. 

Plus: creeping on a stranger's house to smell juniper trees, the Princess Bride theory of medium-specific storytelling, and why Megan won't shoot 70mm "if there's no wide shots in the fucking movie." The producer of WHERE SOLDIERS COME FROM, LOVERS OF HATE, and FATHOM makes a case for JAWS, THE LIFE AND TIMES OF HARVEY MILK, ALL THAT JAZZ and the NY EXPORT: OPUS JAZZ—or as she puts it: going to church… watching movies… making fucking cinema.

Discussion Links: TOWER (2016) | DEAR MR. BRODY (2021) | FATHOM (2021) | LOVERS OF HATE (2010) | WHERE SOLDIERS COME FROM (2011) | THE REASON I JUMP (2020) | THE PLEA (2024) | JAWS (1975) | ALL THAT JAZZ (1979) | THE LIFE AND TIMES OF HARVEY MILK (1984) | THE PRINCESS BRIDE (1987) | NY EXPORT: OPUS JAZZ (2010) | 32 SOUNDS (2022)

Timestamps: 00:00 Intro and Atwater Village Setup | 01:00 Origin Story: The 2012 Picnic Table Pitch | 03:00 What Does a Producer Actually Do? | 06:00 Excellence, Financing, and Distribution as Creative Acts | 09:00 Cinema vs Journalism: The Grammar of Documentary | 13:00 The Psychology of Storytelling and Gut Instinct | 16:00 Ethics, Authenticity, and Not Being Provocative | 18:00 The State of Documentary in 2025 | 20:00 PBS as the Invisible Backstop | 23:00 Mid-Career Reality Check and Volume Problems | 26:00 Cauleen Smith's Life-Changing Question | 29:00 The Space Inside the Frame | 32:00 Do You Wanna Make Fucking Cinema? | 36:00 Princess Bride and Medium-Specific Storytelling | 39:00 Community as the Through-Line in All Her Work | 42:00 Battery Dies, We're on Zoom Now | 43:00 Gateway Drug: Jaws, Harvey Milk, All That Jazz | 46:00 What Makes Her Say Yes to a Project | 48:00 Go to Church: Watch Movies | 52:00 Where to Find Megan's Work

It's a sobering summer day in Austin as we invite the Austin Chronicle's  Richard Whittaker out for a walk. Fresh off the presses, Richard has researched and written a story that details the ramifications of the recent defunding of the Corporation for Public Broadcasting and the impact that this move has on independent documentaries. We get into it, talking up the history and significance of PBS and ITVS, the Independent Television Service — the leading funder of indie docs in the public sphere. Richard provides context and detail far beyond the headlines for this hot-button issue affecting everyone who tells or takes-in non-fiction media. It's a frustrating, shared reality that we inhabit, and this episode is a must-listen for anyone passionate about documentary filmmaking and the future of public broadcasting. Subscribe and stay tuned for our conversation!

Richard's article in The Austin Chronicle: https://www.austinchronicle.com/news/2025-08-01/texas-public-media-grapples-with-funding-loss-from-gop-bill/

00:00 Introduction and Setting the Scene

00:28 Interview with Richard Whittaker

03:56 Impact of Funding Cuts on Public Broadcasting

09:20 The Role of ITVS in Independent Documentaries

10:48 Historical Context and Future Implications

16:48 Challenges and Responses from ITVS

22:00 Independent Production Budgets

22:29 Funding Strategies for Documentaries

23:20 The Role of Major Filmmakers

26:07 Challenges in Nonprofit Funding

28:17 Public Media and Political Perception

32:30 The Value of Public Media

36:29 Future of Documentary Filmmaking

38:37 Conclusion and Next Episode Preview

We talk a lot about mentorship on this podcast—so it makes sense that we'd bring a pivotal mentor to both of us into the mix. Join us as we find a shady spot on the campus of the University of Texas as DocWalks becomes DocTalks with Dr. Paul Stekler. We'll get into Paul's POV from many angles—from his days as a Harvard PhD, to his filmmaking roots in New Orleans, through his role as the chair of the Radio-Television-Film department at UT, Paul has made teaching and community building a priority. But that hasn't held him back from building an impressive catalog of films… with SETTING THE WOODS ON FIRE, VOTE FOR ME, LAST MAN STANDING, and GETTING BACK TO ABNORMAL (& more) he's pushed political perspectives beyond wonky intellectualism into a place full of heart and humor. Paul has played a significant role in each of our careers—as he has with dozens of other filmmakers… and this episode celebrates lessons learned (or missed) in grad school, the many mea culpas of George Wallace, Henry Hampton and his EYES ON THE PRIZE, and the importance of community (not to mention: memories of drunken revelry with Richard Leacock). Take a seat as we replace DocWalks with DocTalks with Austin's doctor of documentaries.

00:00 Exploring the University of Texas Campus

00:56 Meeting Dr. Paul Stekler

01:26 Paul Stekler's Impact on Filmmakers

03:57 The Art of Taking and Giving Feedback

13:01 Paul Stekler's Journey into Filmmaking

14:43 Early Filmmaking Experiences and Challenges

18:41 The Role of a Director in Documentary Filmmaking

24:14 The Art of a Good Shot

24:28 Interview Techniques and Influences

25:27 Advice for Aspiring Filmmakers

26:06 The Importance of Passion and Story

27:33 Building a Filmmaking Community

28:44 Transition to Austin and Early Projects

29:42 George Wallace and Political Documentaries

34:27 Collaborative Filmmaking

38:22 Supporting Emerging Filmmakers

42:46 The Power of Documentary Films

46:11 Final Thoughts and Reflections

49:14 Next Episode Preview

This week we're breaking out of the non-fiction world to talk fictionalization with Oscar-nominated writer/director Greg Kwedar. Fresh off the awards trail with last year's SING SING, Greg shares insights and ideas about turning documentary style research into based-on-a-true-story truth. It's a light-hearted walk through Hyde Park, with another stop at a shady creek, as we dig into Greg's approach to creative partnership (he's 4-films deep with collaborator Clint Bentley) — and catering his directing approach for different acting styles. Step with us into a free-roaming conversation about creative resilience and the role of friendship and adventure that drives Greg's process.

00:00 A Stroll Through Hyde Park

00:49 Introducing Greg Quedar

03:00 Greg's Journey from Accounting to Filmmaking

10:37 The Inspiration Behind 'Sing Sing'

15:01 Exploring the Creative Process

27:36 The Importance of Colleagueship and Collaboration

28:31 Challenges in the Writing Process

29:35 The Lightning Bolt Moments

30:00 The Role of Friendship in Storytelling

31:31 The Joy and Struggles of Filmmaking

33:15 Preparing for New Projects

35:07 Working with Different Actor Processes

37:57 Documentary Filmmaking Insights

40:15 Reflections on the Creative Journey

47:26 Gateway Films and Inspirations

50:31 Closing Thoughts and Future Plans

Take a stroll with Reed Harkness, Portland-based creator behind SAM NOW, a creative portrait that follows the journey of the Harkness brothers, Reed and Sam, as they search for Sam's mother who mysteriously disappeared in the year 2000. This walk mirrors Reed's film, becoming a moving and unexpectedly epic conversation about family, loss, and long-haul filmmaking. This one takes us off the trail, through a literal portal with a detour into a stone-skipping dip in Boggy Creek. This one's got heart, humor, and a few unexpected turns—just like any good walk (or film) should.

00:00 Introduction to Reed Harkness

00:06 The Artist's Way Group

01:04 Walking Through East Austin

01:26 Meet Reed Harkness

02:23 Reed's Filmmaking Journey

04:37 The Mystery of Joyce's Disappearance

06:43 The Emotional Impact on the Family

09:29 The Filmmaking Process

15:50 Reed's Early Filmmaking Influences

23:09 From Play to Documentary

24:04 Sam's Journey and Filmmaking Challenges

25:12 The Emotional Impact of the Film

27:49 Balancing Filmmaking and Family

34:12 Exploring Meaning and Audience Reactions

42:32 Future Projects and Reflections

47:10 Conclusion and Next Episode Teaser

After 15 DocWalks Keith & Ben take a look back. Where did we start, where are we going? Walk with us as we discuss the evolution of the podcast, highlighting some highs and glossing-over some lows along the way. In addition to all that, we talk (as always) about changes in the film industry, notably Texas' new film incentives, and share some enthusiasm for upcoming episodes, including deep dives into classic docs, and long walks with impactful filmmakers, like next week's conversation with Portland-based filmmaker Reed Harkness. This one's just us — a look back, a look ahead, a chance to stand lakeside, beneath a spreading live oak tree and express gratitude for the doc life and each other — and you, if you're out there (& even if you're not). Onward!

00:00 Reflecting on 15 Episodes of Doc Walks

00:56 The Origins of Doc Walks

03:11 Recapping Memorable Episodes and Guests

04:20 The Joy of Connecting with Fellow Filmmakers

08:50 Upcoming Episodes and Future Plans

12:03 Filming Locations and Personal Stories

16:10 Austin's Creative Spirit and Challenges

20:58 Texas Film Production Incentives

21:44 Texas Film Incentives Explained

22:39 Squirrel Distraction and Life Lessons

23:14 Go Valley's Post-Production Expansion

24:33 Texas' Role in Film Incentives History

26:42 Gateway Drug Films and Personal Influences

32:44 Bird Watching and Documentary Insights

35:19 Reflections on Aging and Podcasting

37:09 Concluding Thoughts and Future Plans

We're off to Kansas! Or… Ben is. He's flying back to to Lawrence, Kansas, to interview one of his professors from his days at the University of Kansas — Academy Award-winning filmmaker and KU professor Kevin Willmott. Known for co-writing BLACKKKLANSMAN with Spike Lee, Wilmott shares personal stories of his journey from a young creative in Kansas to an Oscar award-winning filmmaker. This one is jam-packed with a wide-ranging discussion covering the power of cinema, activism, the impact of Black history, and the challenges of making films outside Hollywood — and the role of the teacher. Ben is filled-up with admiration and respect for Kevin Willmott and before the end of this one, you will be too!

00:00 Introduction and Overview

01:01 Meeting Kevin Willmott

03:08 Kevin's Early Life and Influences

05:23 The Journey to Filmmaking

12:28 Activism and Filmmaking

20:27 CSA: Confederate States of America

29:46 Collaboration with Spike Lee

34:05 The Importance of Having a Follow-Up Project

35:11 Pitching 'Gotta Give It Up' to Hollywood

36:35 Collaborations and Career Milestones

40:22 The Impact of Black History on Filmmaking

44:08 Teaching and Building a Film Community

46:45 Challenges and Rewards of Independent Filmmaking

53:57 Facing Racism and Its Influence on Storytelling

59:43 Reflections on Activism and Filmmaking

01:05:39 Upcoming Projects and Final Thoughts

This one's a little different… Keith gets off the trail for an old-fashioned sit-down conversation with Amanda McBaine and Jesse Moss, the acclaimed husband-wife filmmaker duo behind the BOYS STATE and this year's MIDDLETOWN. Jesse and Amanda share insights and highlights from their films, their career, and the challenges and opportunities that come from working together as a married couple and film team. From THE OVERNIGHTERS through MIDDLETOWN, this sit-down episode offers an intimate look at the creative dynamics and career evolution of two impactful documentarians at the top of the form. Special thanks to the Austin Film Society for the collab on this one!

00:00 Introduction and Overview

01:10 Discussing 'Middletown' and Audience Reactions

02:40 The Impact of Streaming and Theatrical Releases

04:45 Early Inspirations and Career Beginnings

08:49 Meeting and Forming a Partnership

13:16 Challenges and Breakthroughs in Filmmaking

17:04 Navigating the Documentary Film Industry

23:59 The Uncertainty of Verité Filmmaking

24:57 Ethical Dilemmas in Documentary Filmmaking

26:11 The Role of Objectivity and Journalism in Documentaries

26:39 The Collaborative Process in Documentary Filmmaking

29:19 The Genesis of Boys State

34:21 The Impact of Boys State on Careers and Industry

38:37 Reflections on Middletown and Documentary Filmmaking

41:11 Final Thoughts and Future Projects

Acclaimed filmmaker Sandi DuBowski has come to our hometown to present SABBATH QUEEN at Austin Film Society's Doc Days. Twenty-one years in the making, Sandi has grown up with this film… and they're taking the show on the road with dozens of fests, scores of community screenings, and an art house tour to rival any indie film this year. Sandi takes us on a heartfelt exploration of their work, from the groundbreaking TREMBLING BEFORE GOD to their work with the late 'Good Pitch' we delve into Sandi's passion for creating documentary films that foster community and dialogue. And they've got plenty to share about their unique fundraising strategies, and their philosophy of building deep, lasting audience and distributor relationships. This one starts off with ducks and ends up with a lightning round of advice that we can all benefit from, though nothing hits home more than Sandi's key takeaway: Go To The Love!

00:00 Introduction and High Fives

00:28 Meeting the Duck and Ducklings

03:00 Introduction to Sandi DuBowski

05:38 Trembling Before G-d: The Journey

11:56 Impact and Distribution of Trembling Before G-d

17:59 Personal Stories and Community Screenings

19:05 Spirituality and Filmmaking

25:56 Creating Spaces for Dialogue and Resistance

29:43 The Journey of Sabbath Queen

31:23 Balancing Filmmaking and Other Projects

35:17 Fundraising Strategies for Filmmakers

40:41 Advice for Emerging Filmmakers

43:29 Reflecting on Influences and Future Projects

48:10 The Importance of Community and Art Houses

49:10 Final Thoughts and Where to Watch

Known for her versatility as a director, producer, showrunner, and distribution advocate, Avril Speaks joins us this week to walk and doc. From her theological start to her producing days on the SXSW award-winning feature JINN, Avril delves into the importance of storytelling, her transition into nonfiction during the pandemic, and her advocacy for better distribution practices. And, she's our first guest to act out a scene from the movie, ANNIE! 

00:00 Introduction and Setting the Scene

00:28 Meet Avril Speaks

02:27 Avril's Seminary Journey and Its Impact

04:48 The Intersection of Film and Theology

10:21 From Seminary to Filmmaking: The Journey Back

11:51 Producing 'Jinn': A Relatable Faith Journey

18:08 Transitioning to Nonfiction During the Pandemic

19:12 Exploring Diverse Topics: From Family Histories to UFOs

20:04 Directing and Producing: Balancing Roles

21:03 Distribution Advocates: Origins and Mission

21:17 Challenges in Film Distribution

22:27 Creating a Filmmaker's Cheat Sheet

23:30 Funding and Support for Filmmakers

24:12 Collaborations and Outreach

25:48 Marketing Innovation Fund

28:08 Navigating the Film Industry

29:37 The Role of Producers

37:33 Advice for Young Filmmakers

40:00 Conclusion and Final Though

It's a picture perfect spring morning in East Austin, a beautiful walk made better by the presence of our guest, acclaimed filmmaker Kahane Corn Cooperman, in Austin to premier CREEDE, USA, her newest doc. Keith & Ben explore Kahane's illustrious career, from her 1991 Sundance debut with COOL WATER, to her days behind-the-scenes of DAZED AND CONFUSED, through nearly two decades as a producer and EP on The Daily Show, and her Oscar nominated run with the heartwarming short, JOE'S VIOLIN. An easy-going ramble through the Boog Creek greenbelt yields candid insights into Kahane's storytelling approach, as she provides invaluable advice for emerging filmmakers. "No wasted steps!" she says. And none were, in the making of this episode. 

00:00 Introduction and Mic Check

01:11 Introducing Kahane Corn Cooperman

02:22 Kahane's Early Career and Sundance 1991

04:11 Her Dazed and Confused Doc

10:19 The Daily Show Journey

14:53 Transition to Joe's Violin and Beyond

17:24 The Struggle of a Showrunner

20:22 It's All Connections

20:45 Introducing Creede, USA

26:24 Challenges and Realities

34:52 Advice for Emerging Filmmakers

36:31 Conclusion and Upcoming Episodes

Welcome to Austin Studios, the airport-turned-soundstages located at the intersection of Austin Film Society and Richard Linklater's Detour Filmproductions… and who better to catch on the backlot than Mike Blizzard?

A producer known for APOLLO 10½, HIT MAN, and this month's BLUE MOON, all made with longtime collaborator Richard Linklater, Mike takes us through the old airport hangars where MISS CONGENIALITY stumbled and where WALKER spurred onto screens. Breaking down how true stories become narrative films. We dig into the real Gary Johnson (fake hitman, real person), Lorenz Hart's final night at Sardi's (BLUE MOON), and why Linklater keeps returning to stories that actually happened. 

Mike produced the Sundance doc NO NO: A DOCKUMENTARY, and as director of the non-fiction ode to local film, ALSO STARRING AUSTIN, he's the perfect tour guide through Austin film history. And, we're catching Mike just as CLEMENTE, his baseball-doc about Roberto Clemente, is rounding third on it's theatrical run and sliding into THE HISTORY CHANNEL — and BLUE MOON releases nationwide. It's a busy time for Blizzard, and we're glad he gave some of it to us….

Discussed Works: HIT MAN (2023) - Netflix | BLUE MOON (2025) - Sony Pictures Classics | APOLLO 10½: A SPACE AGE CHILDHOOD (2022) - Netflix
| ALSO STARRING AUSTIN (2018) - Available online | NO NO: A DOCKUMENTARY (2014) - Netflix | MISS CONGENIALITY (2000) - Various platforms | BERNIE (2011) - Various platforms | BOYHOOD (2014) - Various platforms | CLEMENTE (2024) - History Channel

The flowers are blooming, Ben's chasing squirrels while Keith eyes the skies over Hyde Park for hawks… oh, and we're talkin' docs. Spring brings up new thoughts about New Media and the docmakers role vs the "influencer's paradise" of Youtube and social media.  This episode steps into Ben & Keith's perspectives on storytelling approaches and the future of media consumption — and we even stop to smell the flowers. Plenty to consider here, and next week look forward to a conversation with Academy Award nominee Kahane Corn Cooperman, feeling good after the SXSW premiere of her new doc, CREEDE, USA.

***Note that Ben got the numbers wrong for YouTube's net worth. They are projected to make $22 billion in 2025. The $8 billion he quoted was for the 1st quarter of 2025.

Drink up the scene like a local as Keith & Ben chat up their fellow Austinites (and a few out of town visitors) at the annual Austin Film Society Parking Lot Party at SXSW. This episode is a veritable smorgasbord of festival conversation including appearances by local filmmakers Cassie Hay, Tracy Frazier & Karen Skloss; festival programmers like Bart Weiss and James Faust; SXSW-premiering CREEDE, USA editor Andrew Saunderson;  producer Mike Blizzard; and an AFS-appreciation conversation with CEO Rebecca Campbell. All that and a literal Rolls Royce car crash makes this bonus episode a unique peek into Austin's film community. 

00:00 Introduction and Setting the Scene

00:59 Meeting Cassie Hay: A Filmmaking Journey

03:38 Tracy Frazier: From Documentaries to Gaming

06:39 Bart Weiss: The Evolution of Video Fest

11:56 Andrew Saunderson: Editing Creed USA

15:54 James Faust: Festival Highlights

16:16 Introduction to South by Southwest

16:53 Interview with James Faust

17:12 The State of Documentary Films

19:54 Challenges in the Film Industry

24:16 Rebecca Campbell on Austin Film Society

29:45 Mike Blizzard on Austin's Film Community

31:37 Karen Skloss on the Austin Film Society Party

34:22 Conclusion and Future Episodes

Taking it back to the indie film boom of the 90s with super-sales-agent John Sloss of Cinetic Media. Walking through the tree-filled Zilker neighborhood in an escape from SXSW, John shares his career journey from a life-changing pickup basketball game with John Sayles to  longtime associations with film legends like Richard Linklater, John Pierson and Errol Morris. Ben & Keith eat up the stories of John's early days, but it's his unique perspective on the current state of the doc marketplace that makes John Sloss a real 'get' for Doc Walks. 

00:00 Introduction and Setting the Scene

00:32 Meeting John Sloss

01:12 A Walk Through Zilker 

02:15 Career Highlights and Insights

13:54 The State of the Documentary Market

17:25 Wrapping Up and Future Episodes

Walk and talk with ZODIAC KILLER PROJECT director Charlie Shackleton as he recounts the challenges (& opportunities) of bringing a film to new life after losing access to the subject. Ben & Keith explore Charlie's love-hate relationship with true crime and the way his film twists up familiar tropes. Never one to accept creative defeat, Charlie extolls the virtues of having a close collaboration with your entertainment lawyer and takes us back to the inspiration of Nick Broomfield as a basis for overcoming rejection on screen.  The three filmmakers have a lot of laughs and together decide to start a cult! Join them… for this episode of Doc Walks.

00:00 Welcome to Doc Walks: South by Southwest Day

00:49 Meeting Charlie Shackleton: A Unique Filmmaker

02:42 The Zodiac Killer Project: A Film About Failure

04:13 Overcoming Obstacles: The Making of Zodiac Killer Project

07:41 Archival Films and Legal Battles

11:17 Influences and Inspirations: The Filmmakers Who Shaped Charlie

15:28 Pitching and Funding: The Journey to Create Zodiac Killer Project

17:48 A Twist on True Crime: Charlie's Unique Approach

19:56 Starting a New Cult: A Filmmaker's Perspective

20:23 Intentional Critique in Documentary Filmmaking

22:08 Navigating Personal Involvement in Documentaries

25:32 The Reality of Developing Multiple Projects

29:13 Advice for Aspiring Filmmakers

34:24 Concluding Thoughts and Future Episodes

New York City — Ben takes on the Big Apple and a long walk with filmmaker Matt Wolf, all by himself. This episode features a deep dive into Matt Wolf's career and approach — from his days as a gay teen activist to his new two part series, Pee-wee As Himself, premiering on HBO Max. Matt leads Ben through the streets of the Lower East Side while sharing insights into his unique approach to doc filmmaking, the power of archival footage, and the importance of finishing what you start.

00:00 Introduction and First Impressions

00:44 Technical Difficulties and First Steps

01:18 Exploring the Neighborhood

03:11 Meeting Matt Wolf

05:14 Matt Wolf's Early Career

08:16 The Journey to Filmmaking

14:35 Reflecting on Success and Challenges

16:19 Finding New Stories

17:51 Navigating Construction Noise

18:26 The Art of Documentary Filmmaking

18:59 The Importance of Archival Material

20:56 Pitching and Funding Projects

23:20 Current Inspirations and New Projects

28:15 Challenges in the Documentary Industry

33:06 Passion for Filmmaking

35:29 Advice for Aspiring Filmmakers

36:50 Conclusion and Upcoming Episodes

With SXSW in full swing, Ben & Keith walk downtown Austin with director Adam Bhala Lough (Telemarketers) the day before the premiere of Deep Faking Sam Altman. A prolific filmmaker, Adam shares stories behind the scenes of his new doc, gives tips on pitching, and after spending a year chasing AI pioneer Sam Altman, offers a surprisingly rosy view of the AI landscape.

00:00 Welcome to South by Southwest 2025

00:30 Meet Adam Bhala Lough: Prolific Director

01:23 Deep Faking Sam Altman: The New Film

01:49 The Journey of Making the Film

04:33 Challenges and Triumphs in Filmmaking

08:12 Pitching and Networking Secrets

12:59 The Train Keeps Moving

13:41 The Pivot: Embracing New Opportunities

14:29 Creating the Sambot

16:02 Journey to India

17:30 The Future of Documentaries

21:05 AI: A New Tool in Filmmaking

22:53 Closing Thoughts and Reflections

Back from Sundance and inspired by Diane Quon's email to Morgan Neville, Ben & Keith discuss the impact of seeking career guidance in their early days as doc-makers. Join us for a walk around Austin's Ladybird Lake and a lively conversation about outreach and insights for aspiring and established documentary filmmakers alike. 

00:00 Starting the Journey: Back to Where It All Began

00:14 Post-Sundance Reflections and Illness

01:18 Networking at Sundance: Strategies and Insights

02:36 The Power of Reaching Out: Diane Quon's Story

04:46 Personal Experiences: Seeking Advice from Filmmakers

07:26 Wise Words from Albert Maysles: Love Your Subject

10:38 Exploring Austin: The Bat Bridge and New Projects

17:44 Advice for Aspiring Filmmakers: Practical Tips

19:41 The Power of Encouragement

21:07 Seeking Advice and Building Relationships

23:36 The Importance of Community

30:35 Practical Tips for Aspiring Filmmakers

33:44 Conclusion and Upcoming Episodes

In this episode of Doc Walks, Ben & Keith duck out of the freezing temperatures of Park City for a warm and cozy indoor sit-down with Academy Award-nominated producer Diane Quon. A personal story of determination, Diane shares her inspiring journey from marketing executive to Academy Award-nominated documentary producer. From acclaimed films like 'Minding the Gap,' and 'Breaking the News,' to her Sundance premiering 'Third Act,' Diane shares insights and experiences as a late-entrant into the documentary world, relying on real-world experience and some well-timed words of encouragement too. 00:00 Braving the Cold: A Frosty Start 00:45 Seeking Warmth: A Change of Plans 01:48 Introducing Diane Quan: A Special Guest 05:55 Diane's Journey: From Marketing to Filmmaking 08:37 The Impact of Documentaries: Personal Stories and Social Issues 13:12 Advice for Aspiring Filmmakers 16:39 Wrapping Up: Reflections and Gratitude

It's Ben's first time in Park City, and despite the freezing temps, he and Keith take to Main Street to kickoff the indie film calendar-year, exploring the 2025 Sundance Film Festival. Man-on-the-street interviews capture the vibrant atmosphere as Ben & Keith seek intel and advice from filmmakers, volunteers, and festival-goers alike. Listen for candid encounters with Frank Mosley, Russell Wayne Groves, Su Kim and more — including a sneeze and you might miss it cameo from Conan O'Brien, who warns us all — "Look out for the ice!"

00:00 Starting the Day: Leaving the Condo

00:08 Walking Directions and Weather Update

00:59 Discussing the Film Festival Experience

02:45 Exploring Main Street and Festival Atmosphere

04:28 Bird Watching and Film Festival Analogies

05:48 The Role of Sales Agents in Film Distribution

08:54 Navigating the Festival: Tips and Insights

09:23 Tunnel Walk and Festival Reflections

11:05 Interviews with Filmmakers and Attendees

20:01 Worlds Colliding at Sundance

20:25 The Impact of Social Media on Documentary Filmmaking

21:40 Excitement for the Future of Social Media

22:24 Meeting Industry Professionals at Sundance

23:00 Challenges in Indie Film Distribution and Financing

23:41 First Impressions of Sundance

24:27 The Importance of Optimism in Filmmaking

30:44 A Conversation with Su Kim

36:28 Wrapping Up Day One at Sundance

Step into 'Doc Walks' with indie filmmakers Keith Maitland and Ben Steinbauer as they kick off this walk & talk podcast with a pilot episode focused on their documentary origins, storytelling motivations, personal frailties, and a few bird sightings. Tune in for candid conversations, industry insights, and the ambient sounds of Austin's hike and bike trail.

From The Bear and Go Valley comes the show you didn't know you wanted (or needed, probably). Hosted, produced, and edited by Ben Steinbauer and Keith Maitland, with help from Tanner Bass. Theme song by Sam Billen and Primary Color Music.

00:00 Introduction and Sound Check

00:40 Launching the Podcast: Doc Walks

02:03 The Concept Behind Doc Walks

02:56 Insights on Documentary Filmmaking

06:22 Personal Journeys into Filmmaking

12:06 Challenges and Realities of Filmmaking

13:53 The Collaborative Nature of Filmmaking

17:19 Synchronicity and Creative Inspiration

25:34 Conclusion and Future Plans

We're wandering through a mystery neighborhood (we don't know the name) with Alex Ross Perry, who has TWO movies screening in Austin on the same day.

Here to promote his 10-year passion project VIDEO HEAVEN—an essay film about video stores screening at Austin Film Society, and his part of the omnibus VHS series at Fantastic Fest, Alex has built up a fair amount of cred since 2014's LISTEN UP, PHILIP. Of course, "you can't pay for Montessori preschool with cred." Ain't that the truth.

We catch Alex on the heels of last year's PAVEMENTS, a fictional(?) documentary about the indie rock band Pavement that aims to be both fabricated—and factual. We've got questions and he's got answers, pulling at the seams of a complicated film for which he created a fake Hollywood biopic (Joe Keery as Stephen Malkmus), staged a full off-Broadway musical with audiences who had no idea they were in a movie, and curated a hagiographic four-day Pavement museum all while cutting an archival dive into the 1990s phenoms against a  2022 reunion tour. It's a lot. 

We walk where the streets all have names… and end up with Alex's contrarian take on AI, which is both slanted and enchanting: the long and short of it, he's not worried.  This industry is built on execs' calendars filled with endless notes calls with the sole job of justifying everyone's existence. Just like politicians, "studio execs won't let themselves be put out to pasture….and nobody who's rich shows themselves the door."

Discussion links: IMPOLEX (2009) | LISTEN UP PHILIP (2014) | COLOR WHEEL (2011) | QUEEN OF EARTH (2015) | HER SMELL (2018) | RIGHT HERE, RIGHT NOW (2023) | VHS HALLOWEEN (2025) | VIDEO HEAVEN (2024) | SLOW CENTURY (2002) | PAVEMENTS (2024) | DUNKIRK (2017) | BARBIE (2023) | BOHEMIAN RHAPSODY (2018) | ROCKET MAN (2019) | SISTERHOOD OF THE TRAVELING PANTS 2 (2008)

Tags

Alex Ross Perry, Pavement documentary, Video Heaven, indie filmmaking, music documentary, documentary filmmaking, Stephen Malkmus, experimental documentary, mockumentary, Robert Greene editor, Austin Film Society, Fantastic Fest, video store documentary, indie rock documentary, fair use filmmaking, VHS horror, Listen Up Philip, screenwriting, AI and filmmaking, narrative documentary

This week we're roaming from Go-Valley (the production compound) thru Govalle (the neighborhood) with Marfa, TX-based filmmaker Hillary Pierce, a producing force behind Ben Masters' THE RIVER AND THE WALL, and Maisie Crow's AT THE READY..

Hillary's path involves assisting the legendary Albert Maysles in New York (yes, he ate her leftovers), looping back to Austin, and then simultaneously working on two wildly different features with Keith, TOWER and A SONG FOR YOU. A meandering stroll through Govalle's sculpture garden and lizard-lurking trails, Hillary shares why "love your subjects" is ardent filmmaking advice, how producing a wedding preceded additional documentary productions, and why she eventually fled to Marfa during COVID.

We dig into the Documentary Producers Alliance - why it matters, what those crediting guidelines actually do, and how unsexy spreadsheets save productions. Hillary breaks down fundraising across political aisles, the death of traditional distribution, and why your next project might not need to be a feature.

The industry's burning down? Rumor has it. But Hillary's got ideas for what we build next.

Discussion links: TOWER (2016) | A SONG FOR YOU (2016) | THE RIVER AND THE WALL (2019) | AT THE READY (2021) | DOCUMENTARY PRODUCERS ALLIANCE

Timestamps: 00:00 Govalle Adventures Begin 02:00 From Maysles to Austin 07:00 The Costa Rica Doc That Never Was 09:00 Producing Two Features at Once 14:00 What the DPA Actually Does 21:00 Escaping to Marfa 24:00 Conservative Conservationists & Border Politics 28:00 Plans Are Made to Be Changed 33:00 Direct Distribution Isn't Plan B Anymore 40:00 Redefining Documentary Success 44:00 What Do We Build Next?

Tags: documentary filmmaking, film producer, documentary producer, Tower documentary, The River and the Wall, Albert Maysles, documentary distribution, direct distribution, indie filmmaking, Documentary Producers Alliance, DPA, Austin filmmakers, Marfa Texas, film production, documentary careers, filmmaking advice, Keith Maitland, Ben Steinbauer, documentary industry, independent film

Ben crashes the Matt and Bob show to talk WINNEBAGO MAN, viral videos before viral was a thing, and tracking down an angry RV salesman living as a hermit in Northern California. The conversation rips through documentary evolution—from Ken Burns photo zooms to Tiger King (quick: who directed it? exactly)—and lands on why docs are the offensive linemen of film: you don't know their names, but you need them. Ben breaks down Doc Walks, his new weekly walk-and-talk series with Austin filmmaker Keith Maitland, where tiny cameras, AI editing, and real conversation collide. They dig into HIGH HOPES (his Hulu dispensary doc with Jimmy Kimmel), the terrifying gamble of documentary filmmaking (what if nothing happens?), and why authenticity matters when everything else is fake. Plus: why Ben's wife is rooting for Chuy's love life.

Discussion links: WINNEBAGO MAN (2009) | HIGH HOPES (2023) | TOWER (2016) | SHERMAN'S MARCH (1985) | DEAR ZACHARY (2008) | ICARUS (2017)

Timestamps: 00:00 Intro | 01:00 HIGH HOPES | 02:00 WINNEBAGO MAN Origin Story | 06:00 Docs as Offensive Linemen | 07:00 Doc Walks Launch | 10:00 Authenticity vs AI | 11:00 Documentary Risks | 13:00 When Stories Swerve | 14:00 Where to Find Doc Walks

YouTube Tags:

documentary filmmaking, Ben Steinbauer, Winnebago Man, documentary filmmaker interview, Matt and Bob show, Doc Walks podcast, Keith Maitland, High Hopes Hulu, Jimmy Kimmel, documentary series, Austin filmmakers, Tower documentary, filmmaking podcast, indie filmmaking, documentary production, viral videos, Jack Rebney, reality vs documentary, authentic storytelling, film industry, documentary editing, Sherman's March, Ken Burns, Tiger King, documentary evolution, cinema verite, nonfiction filmmaking, Sundance documentaries, film school, documentary techniques, filmmaker interview, behind the scenes, documentary process, creative process, film production, independent film, documentary storytelling, Texas filmmakers, Austin film scene, entertainment industry, media production, film discussion, movie podcast, documentary history, filmmaking tips, creative collaboration, film theory, documentary craft

This one is pure gold! Join Ben on a solo walk with the legendary Maureen Gosling—a prolific documentary editor and director, and a longtime collaborator of Les Blank. Dig into the makings-of iconic films like SPROUT WINGS AND FLY, GAP-TOOTHED WOMEN and BURDEN OF DREAMS, and explore Maureen's latest work, THE NINE LIVES OF BARBARA DANE. We dive deep into the fascinating twists and turns of Maureen's career and her seamless transition from editor to director. Maureen inspires as she lays out the unique nature of her collaborative process—and there are ideas in here that we can all learn from. Don't miss this golden stroll through documentary history with someone who's lived it. 

Discussion links:

THE BLUES ACCORDIN' TO LIGHTNIN' HOPKINS (1968) 

SPEND IT ALL (1971) 

DRY WOOD (1973) 

HOT PEPPER (1973) 

A POEM IS A NAKED PERSON (1974) 

CHULAS FRONTERAS (1976) 

DEL MERO CORAZÓN (1979) 

BURDEN OF DREAMS (1982) 

SPROUT WINGS AND FLY (1983) 

IN HEAVEN THERE IS NO BEER? (1984) 

GAP-TOOTHED WOMEN (1987) 

BLOSSOMS OF FIRE (2000) 

WAITING TO INHALE (2005) 

THE NINE LIVES OF BARBARA DANE (2023)

00:00 Introduction and Guest Announcement

01:05 Maureen Gosling's New Film

02:26 Les Blank: A Legendary Collaborator

05:25 Early Career and First Projects

11:15 Filmmaking Philosophy and Techniques

16:26 Transition to Directing

24:19 Challenges and Collaborations

26:31 The Nine Lives of Barbara Dane

27:08 Chris's Annual Parties and Barbara Dane's Musical Influence

27:50 Discovering Barbara Dane's Legacy

28:59 Filming Barbara Dane's Last Concert

30:24 Barbara Dane's Son and His Life in Cuba

32:25 Raising Funds and Continuing the Documentary

36:38 Barbara Dane's Impact and Final Years

39:31 Maureen's Reflections on Her Career

44:14 The Importance of Documentaries

47:40 Upcoming Screenings and Live Music Events

49:13 Maureen's Time in Austin and Final Thoughts

A walk down docu-memory lane as we welcome Ben's early filmmaking collaborator, roommate, and mentor Bradley Beesley…. A prolific and adventure-prone docmaker, Bradley's created acclaimed docs OKIE NOODLING 1 & 2, FEARLESS FREAKS, and SWEETHEARTS OF THE PRISON RODEO—among others. This walk takes us through Brad & Ben's old neighborhood, with a stop in front of the house they shared in French Place, here in Austin. In a flowing conversation filled with stories and insights from Bradley's early days at OU art school where he made the infamous PIZZA MAN, through his collaborations with Wayne Coyne of The Flaming Lips, and his intense love of Oklahoma hand-fishing, it's no surprise that Ben calls Bradley, "The Pride of Oklahoma." And Austin takes plenty of pride in this former-pirate too!

Links:

The Making of Biffy Clyro, My Recovery Injection directed by Ben Steinbauer 

Okie Noodling (2000)

Fearless Freaks (2005)

Summercamp! (2006)

The Creek Runs Red (2006)

Okie Noodling 2 (2008)

Sweethearts of the Prison Rodeo (2009)

Calls To Okies: The Park Grubbs Story (2014)

00:00 The Pride of Barbados

00:22 The Pride of Oklahoma

02:10 Walking and Talking with Bradley Beesley

04:29 Journey to Austin

05:35 The Flaming Lips Connection

20:49 The Making of Okie Noodling

27:33 Sweethearts of the Prison Rodeo

28:38 The Best Summer of Bradley's Life

29:39 The Pirate Life of Filmmaking

33:16 The Okie Noodling Phenomenon

36:11 Creating the Noodling Tournament

38:56 Funding and Production Challenges

40:51 The Passion for Noodling

44:54 Advice for Young Filmmakers

47:49 Current Projects and Reflections

51:30 Conclusion and Future Guests

Summer's done and Fall is Falling as we (Keith & Ben) check in with each other about the state of our respective projects and how we go from development to production (fingers crossed). We don't have the answers, but we each have our approaches to deck-creation, sizzle reel sizzling, pitching & fundraising, all to get into the 'making' part of filmmaking. Ben shares details about his doc project DR. DANTE, a collab with filmmaker/producer Bradley Beesley and Jimmy Kimmel's company Kimmelot (plus Julie Goldman's Motto Films), as an adaptation of a short into a podcast into a feature doc. And Keith shares where he is with two upcoming projects: a twist on  true crime that he's making in partnership with Frank Mosley and Concordia Studio and an all-archival film about an international auteur. Fall is here and so are important deadlines—we're looking at expanding our industry connections and providing insights into the seasonal dynamics of this confusing industry… walk with us and let's figure it out together!

00:00 Introduction Under the Tree

00:28 Reflecting on Seasons and Time

01:03 The Big Reset: End of Summer

02:59 Pitching New Projects

03:41 Dr. Dante: A Comedic True Crime Doc

09:32 Challenges and Changes in Filmmaking

17:05 Building a Team and New Projects

21:22 The Excitement of Filmmaking and Education

22:06 Creating a Documentary Package

22:43 The Grant Route and Its Importance

24:27 Sundance Catalyst Invitation

26:38 Editing the Sizzle Reel

29:47 Balancing Multiple Projects

30:05 The Importance of General Meetings

33:51 Pitching and Developing New Projects

37:14 Fall Festivals and Film Releases

40:15 Wrapping Up and Future Guests

Two-time Sundance winner Reid Davenport is in town with his new film LIFE AFTER. We were excited to book time with Reid and his producer Colleen Cassingham for a  sit-down with Keith at the Austin Film Society Cinema. Reid shares the story behind what drew him to telling this complex story about the issues attached to state sanctioned assisted suicide and talks about his early filmmaking days where questions of identity and politics shaped him as a filmmaker with a unique perspective. Both Reid and Colleen appear on-camera in LIFE AFTER and we dig into that process, their respective roles, and how their story (& they) changed along the way. This is a film supported by ITVS and airing this Fall on Independent Lens and so of course, the recent cuts to CPB are in the air—but it's not all politics on this episode. We also dig into the filmmakers and films that inspired these two filmmakers and find plenty to laugh about together. Join us for a look at LIFE AFTER and life on the road with Reid Davenport and Colleen Cassingham.

00:00 Introduction to the Podcast and Guests

00:44 Setting the Scene: Austin Film Society Cinema

01:21 Introducing the Film 'Life After'

03:23 Challenges and Strategies in Film Distribution

06:27 Impact of Public Media Cuts

08:56 Exploring the Film's Themes and Personal Reflections

13:33 Production Process and Personal Insights

24:24 The Tension of Filmmaking

25:07 Exploring Disability in Film

25:45 Inspiration and Filmmaking Journey

31:15 The Role of Mentors

40:07 Practical Advice for Emerging Filmmakers

44:33 Concluding Thoughts and Gratitude

Keith's out this week, so Ben is strutting Travis Heights solo with his good pal Scott(y) Ballew. Scott's a lesson in cutting-against the grain and getting more for it. You might know him from his work as the former Head of Content at Yeti, making 100+ branded docs with one rule: no product placement. Scott's path is pure chaos theory - starting with a UT football national championship ring, spending time as an insurance salesman, working the ol' LA PA grind to end up changing how brands tell stories (all while writing and recording his own songs), Scott's tried it all. We dig into the decade-long golden era at Yeti where he worked with 20 filmmakers at once (including Ben on the TOOTSIE film), and how he learned directing on the job from his inspirations. Scott breaks down Terry Allen's "follow the muse" philosophy (including how it sent him on his own musical journey), the surreal Telluride premiere of ALL THAT IS SACRED (his Jimmy Buffett/Tom McGuane film that premiered the day Buffett died), and why he'd rather make films with friends than chase a Townes Van Zandt-type of obsession (learning in part by documenting Townes' son, J.T.). 

Plus: exploring classic Texas cinema with Jeff Nichols, why loving your subjects beats gotcha filmmaking, and the eternal truth that podcasts are the new mayonnaise. 

This episode is sponsored by our friends at The Long Time—a 5-acre event-space and playground for your imagination. It's also the home field of The Texas Playboys (the sandlot baseball team that both Ben and Scott play for). 

For more information go to thelongtime.com and follow along on IG @thelongtimetexas 

Discussion Links:
WINNEBAGO MAN (2009) | GREENBERG (2010) | DIG! (2004) | BE HERE TO LOVE ME (2004) | THE DEVIL AND DANIEL JOHNSTON (2005) | NO DIRECTION HOME (2005) | MUD (2012) | ALL THAT IS SACRED (2023) | THE LONG TIME (2018) | TOOTSIE (2016) | ANCHOR POINT (2016) | EVERYTHING FOR ALL REASONS (2019)

Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction and Travis Heights Walk
02:00 Defining Yourself as a Creative
05:00 UT Football and National Championship
09:00 LA Dreams: Music Manager to PA
13:00 Podcasts Are the New Mayonnaise
15:00 Starting at Yeti
18:00 Why Branded Docs Work
24:00 Learning to Direct in the Edit Room
31:00 The Golden Era and Going Public
35:00 Writing Songs Out of Necessity
40:00 Tom McGuane, Jimmy Buffett, and Key West
47:00 Loving Your Subjects
53:00 Telluride and Jimmy Buffett's Death
57:00 Moving to Tecovas
01:00:00 Working with Jeff Nichols
01:02:00 Lightning Round: NO DIRECTION HOME (at home)
01:06:00 Dynamic Life vs One-Track Obsession
01:12:00 Closing Thoughts

Consider this your second helping of the holiday—Charlie Shackleton's THE ZODIAC KILLER PROJECT is now playing in theaters, which means audiences can now experience one of the most twisted, brightest docs of the year. This thanksgiving we're grateful for filmmakers who take big swings and for audiences who show up to support adventurous storytelling. So grab another slice of pie, settle in, and revisit our SXSW conversation with Charlie—a filmmaker who turned rejection into art and morphed failure into near-genius…

Walk and talk with ZODIAC KILLER PROJECT director Charlie Shackleton as he recounts the challenges (& opportunities) of bringing a film to new life after losing access to the subject. We'll explore Charlie's love-hate relationship with true crime and the way his film twists up familiar tropes. Never one to accept creative defeat, Charlie extolls the virtues of having a close collaboration with your entertainment lawyer and takes us back to the inspiration of Nick Broomfield as a basis for overcoming rejection on screen.  We share a lot of laughs and together decide to start a cult! Join us… for this episode of Doc Walks.

00:00 Welcome to Doc Walks: South by Southwest Day

00:49 Meeting Charlie Shackleton: A Unique Filmmaker

02:42 The Zodiac Killer Project: A Film About Failure

04:13 Overcoming Obstacles: The Making of Zodiac Killer Project

07:41 Archival Films and Legal Battles

11:17 Influences and Inspirations: The Filmmakers Who Shaped Charlie

15:28 Pitching and Funding: The Journey to Create Zodiac Killer Project

17:48 A Twist on True Crime: Charlie's Unique Approach

19:56 Starting a New Cult: A Filmmaker's Perspective

20:23 Intentional Critique in Documentary Filmmaking

22:08 Navigating Personal Involvement in Documentaries

25:32 The Reality of Developing Multiple Projects

29:13 Advice for Aspiring Filmmakers

34:24 Concluding Thoughts and Future Episodes

Thanksgiving is here and we're thankful for the filmmakers who make our home town of Austin, TX weird and wonderful. So this week, we're serving up a heaping helping of gratitude and indulging in a re-release of one of our favorite community episodes, EP09 - THE WATERING HOLE, LIVE FROM THE AUSTIN FILM SOCIETY. We recorded this one during SXSW at the annual Austin Film Society party. We're grateful to documentary filmmakers, the festivals that bring us all together, AFS for holding down the fort and for you—yes, you—who keep showing up to listen to a coupla turkeys. Most of all, we're grateful we get to do this together. So pull up a chair, loosen your belt, and feast on this Austin film family reunion.

ORIGINAL SYNOPSIS:

Drink up the scene like a local as Keith & Ben chat up their fellow Austinites (and a few out of town visitors) at the annual Austin Film Society Parking Lot Party at SXSW. This episode is a veritable smorgasbord of festival conversation including appearances by local filmmakers Cassie Hay, Tracy Frazier & Karen Skloss; festival programmers like Bart Weiss and James Faust; SXSW-premiering CREEDE, USA editor Andrew Saunderson;  producer Mike Blizzard; and an AFS-appreciation conversation with CEO Rebecca Campbell. All that and a literal Rolls Royce car crash makes this bonus episode a unique peek into Austin's film community. 

00:00 Introduction and Setting the Scene

00:59 Meeting Cassie Hay: A Filmmaking Journey

03:38 Tracy Frazier: From Documentaries to Gaming

06:39 Bart Weiss: The Evolution of Video Fest

11:56 Andrew Saunderson: Editing Creed USA

15:54 James Faust: Festival Highlights

16:16 Introduction to South by Southwest

16:53 Interview with James Faust

17:12 The State of Documentary Films

19:54 Challenges in the Film Industry

24:16 Rebecca Campbell on Austin Film Society

29:45 Mike Blizzard on Austin's Film Community

31:37 Karen Skloss on the Austin Film Society Party

34:22 Conclusion and Future Episodes

Join Ben as he walks solo with Patrick Heaphy—a New York producer/director and music doc extraordinaire. Together they saunter across South Congress, past the Continental Club to Arlyn Studios. Pat's the filmmaker behind CHARLEY CROCKETT: $10 COWBOY documentary—now screening at Austin Film Festival—but his career path runs through a Nancy Kerrigan vampire clip (the lav accessory, of course), the 1994 Olympics, and a 9/11 doc compiled from his day-of footage. We dig into the music documentary hustle: multi-cam concert films at the Ryman, working the Springsteen archives, and why answer-the-phone opportunity beats mere aspiration. Pat breaks down his company LCM247 (figure out what it means yourself), eating ramen for 26 odd years before festival recognition, and why the AI his mom uses is top of mind. Plus: Pat spots Will Ferrell's eyeballs and uncovers Willie's old haunt.

WITNESS TO 9/11: IN THE SHADOWS OF GROUND ZERO (2020) | NEBRASKA CELEBRATION: WORDS AND MUSIC (2024) | CHARLEY CROCKETT: $10 COWBOY (2025)

00:00 Introduction and Camera Work 01:00 Patrick's Background and Nancy Kerrigan Story 05:00 From Firefighter Family to Filmmaking 08:00 Post-Traumatic Stress Documentary 10:00 Selling Cars and Making Cable Commercials 12:00 Becoming the Music Guy 16:00 Musicians and Documentary Filmmakers 18:00 Charley Crockett's $10 Cowboy Origin 20:00 Arlyn Studios and Willie's Legacy 22:00 Americana Fest and Noah Kahan 24:00 Irish Connection and Multiple Hustles 26:00 9/11 Documentary 27:00 Lightning Round Begins 29:00 Charley Crockett Recording Process 33:00 Advice for Young Filmmakers 35:00 Gateway Drug Question 36:00 Dream Collaborators and AI

Meet Rena Effendi—National Geographic photographer, and first-time filmmaker whose SEARCHING FOR SATYRUS just won the top doc prize at the Austin Film Festival. This walk is pure magic—seemingly in honor of her butterfly-hunting film, monarch butterflies flit all around us like they know something the rest of us don't. Rena's film traces her hunt for one of the world's rarest butterflies, named after her father—a Soviet-era lepidopterist who collected 90,000 specimens before his untimely death. This unique species flies only once a year, on a mountaintop, above 10,000 feet, and along the militarized border between Azerbaijan and Armenia—two countries at war for decades. Just five people had ever seen the Satyrus Effendi—and that's when Rena enters the story.

She's got a lot to say about complicated family stories, layers of secrets, and life in the collapsing Soviet Union. Rena unpacks her jump from medium-format still photos to motion picture storytelling, building teams vs. working solo, and why neutrality matters when you're documenting war—even when it's your own country. 

Plus: a cowboy guitarist on a bicycle, honky-tonk dancing at the White Horse, and why documentary photographers make fearless filmmakers. A woman of the people, and of the butterflies, Rena Effendi is the real deal.

DISCUSSION LINKS:
SEARCHING FOR SATYRUS (2025) | PAST LIVES (2023) | HONEYLAND (2019)

TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Introduction—Budapest or Istanbul?
01:00 Searching for Satyrus and the Austin Film Festival Win
02:00 Monarch Butterflies and the Rare Satyrus Effendi
04:00 First Time in Austin, First Film
05:00 From Office Job to Photographer—The Magnum Moment
08:00 Collapsing Soviet Union and Standing in Food Queues
10:00 Father's Death and Choosing Butterflies Over Geology
13:00 The Craft of Pinning Butterflies Like a Jeweler
14:00 Early Photography—Documenting Mahala's Transformation
16:00 City Symphonies and Capturing Disappearing Identity
18:00 Story Arcs in Still Photography
19:00 The Dying Mother—Last Picture in the Series
21:00 Austin's Transformation and Tech Bro Architecture
24:00 Birth of the Film—Googling Her Father's Name
26:00 The Butterfly Named After Her Father
27:00 Discovering a Half-Sister at Age 14
30:00 Healing Through Art—Looking at Father Through New Lens
32:00 2020 War and Gaining Access to Habitat
33:00 Building the Team—Producers and National Geographic Grant
36:00 Leadership Challenges of Filmmaking vs. Photography
37:00 Mom's Resistance and Opening Up
40:00 Kevin Andrew—Picking and Pedaling Through Austin
43:00 First Impressions of Austin and White Horse
45:00 Growing Up in War-Torn Culture
47:00 Neutrality and Non-Judgment
49:00 Artists vs. Journalists—The Blurry Line
51:00 Speed Round—Past Lives, Stay True to Story, Kill Your Darlings
54:00 Where to Find the Film

What is it with all the doc-filmmakers turning to podcasting?!? No, not us… we're talkin' about David Modigliani—a playwright turned poet turned documentary filmmaker turned podcaster (and Stanley Tucci voice director). This is a fun walk with an old friend at a park rumored to be populated by peacocks!

The director of 2008's CRAWFORD (about a small town invaded by George W. Bush) and 2019's RUNNING WITH BETO (a quixotic look at Beto O'Rouke's life on the campaign trail), David is back in Austin for 36-hours to emcee the Home Slice Pizza Carnival and crash his old improv troupe, so naturally we dragged him through rocky trails and past $10 million homes to talk about his winding path from the Michener Center Grad program to doc-making, to his latest creation: PACK ONE BAG, an investigative podcast about his grandparents' escape from fascist Italy that premiered at Tribeca in 2024.

David speaks from personal experience (and with his hands) about why improv is basically documentary directing, how hybridized narrative podcasting allowed him to write dialogue for Stanley Tucci as his great-grandfather—and what it means to metabolize democracy's fragility in this troubled time. Plus: bubbling ponds of coy fish, finding a peacock carved in stone, and David voices his Italian grandparents' (as he does in his podcast) with glee.

This episode is sponsored by our friends at The Long Time—a 5-acre event-space and playground for your imagination. It's also the home field of The Texas Playboys (the sandlot baseball team that both Ben and David play for) and an ideal location for film productions!

For more information go to thelongtime.com and follow along on IG @thelongtimetexas.

DISCUSSION LINKS:

CRAWFORD (2008) | DONT LOOK BACK (1967) | RUNNING WITH BETO (2019) | PACK ONE BAG (2024) | BOYHOOD (2014) | MERRILY WE ROLL ALONG (2024) | BLUE MOON (2025) | HIT MAN (2023)

TIMESTAMPS:

00:00 Introduction and Setup at Mayfield Park 02:00 Shoutouts: Chris Floyd, Pizza Champion & Austin Sayers' Steve Fromholz Doc 04:00 Finding Our Footing on Rocky Trails 07:00 The Santa Fe Grandparent Babysitting Setup 10:00 From Playwriting to Documentary: The Michener Center Years 13:00 Crawford Origins: Mini DV and Cindy Sheehan 17:00 Improv as Documentary Directing 21:00 The Yes-And of Verite Filmmaking 24:00 Houses Documentary Filmmakers Will Never Live In 26:00 The Grip's Advice: Get Feedback While You Can 30:00 Branded Content as Film School 34:00 Wounded Warrior Project and MSNBC 37:00 Pack One Bag: Fleeing Fascist Italy 42:00 Why Audio? Creative Nonfiction and Invented Archival 46:00 Writing Dialogue for Stanley Tucci 50:00 Playwriting Meets Podcasting 54:00 The HBO Bus Billboard Moment 58:00 Audio's Frictionless Distribution 01:03:00 What's Next: Italian Version and Screen Adaptation 01:05:00 Lightning Round: Don't Look Back, Linklater Dreams, Fatherhood 01:10:00 Metabolizing the Political Moment 01:12:00 David Does His Grandparents' Voices

As we close-out of our first year of doc'in & walkin' it's time to take stock in what this podcast is all about. We're excited to welcome self-proclaimed number one fan and Australian-born doc-maker, Sally O'Grady for a year-end, Year in Review episode. This nature-walk snakes through the wilderness behind Sally's North Austin home as Ben intros us to a game of "High, Low, Buffalo, Mitzvah" (a Steinbauer family dinner game) and a chance to reflect on the ups, downs, weird little moments and the true mitzvahs of our first 33 episodes. We'll catch up with some favorite Doc Walks bits, dig into what's working, get schooled on our Bechdel Test failures (eight women out of 33 guests—Sally came with receipts), and navigate the eternal tension between preparation and off-the-cuff authenticity. And Sally shares her 10-year journey making THE TROUBLE I SEE, a film about incarcerated fathers and their daughters, premiering at AFS Cinema on January 14th (tix on sale now!)

Along the way: a surprise encounter with an 86-year-old Vietnamese general-turned-crossing guard, a sit-down at Sally's Pond™, and a chance to commune with a magnificent blue heron who refuses to fly. Through the highs, the lows, the birds and the buffaloes, every step we've taken together in 2025 has been a mitzvah… happy holidays to you, and thanks for walking this road with us!

THE TROUBLE I SEE (2025) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2010) | TOWER (2016) | HIGH HOPES (2024) | PEEWEE PLAYS HIMSELF (2025)

00:00 Introduction and Sally O'Grady arrives
01:05 Sally as "number one fan" and Doc Walks origin story
02:00 Discovering Copperfield Nature Trail in northeast Austin
03:00 Sally's journey from Sydney to New York to Austin
05:00 Year one reflections and holiday episode setup
06:30 Do Ben-and-Keith-only episodes work? Sally weighs in
08:30 "Gardener Not a Carpenter" and useful documentary wisdom
10:00 Ben's vulnerability about prep vs. free-jazz conversations
11:00 Keith on wanting episodes to feel more like real conversations
13:00 The magnificent blue-painted live oak
14:30 High-Low-Buffalo-Mitzvah game explained
16:00 Sally's HIGH: Diane Quon's sensitive interview and Megan Gilbride's "make fucking cinema"
18:00 The title debate: why "Make Fucking Cinema" got vetoed
20:30 Keith's HIGH: Matt Wolf episode and overcoming fears about solo Ben episodes
23:30 Ben's HIGH: Celebrating Maureen Gosling and Les Blank's legacy
26:00 Sally's LOW: The Bechdel Test reality check (8 women out of 33 guests)
28:30 Ben and Keith respond to diversity critique
31:00 Ben's LOW: The off-camera conflict moment with Keith
34:30 Keith's LOW: Wanting guests to recognize them as fellow filmmakers
38:30 Buffalo: Matt Wolf's vanity and Ben's "tugboat" gaffe
40:00 Keith's Buffalo: Birds and describing the world
42:00 Ben's Buffalo: Embracing new formats amid industry change
43:30 Meeting Sally's neighbor Bowie, the 86-year-old Vietnamese general
46:30 Keith's mitzvah and development deal announcement
47:00 The blue heron finally appears
50:00 Sally's film THE TROUBLE I SEE and 10-year journey
54:00 Working with editor Sandra Guardado
57:30 Sally's next project: MA'AM and scammers targeting women therapists
1:01:00 Closing reflections and 2026 preview

Consider this a favorite re-wrapped Christmas gift just for you—Matt Wolf's PEE-WEE AS HIMSELF documentary is streaming now on HBO, reminding us all that the best presents are the ones that make us feel like kids again. This holiday season we're celebrating filmmakers who find magic in obsession and who build their own creative communities one passion project at a time. So pour yourself some eggnog, settle in by the fireplace, and unwrap our conversation with Matt—a filmmaker who turned his love of underground artists into a career that spans from cello-playing disco composers to the most beloved man-child in American comedy…

It's a walk and talk through Matt Wolf's Lower East Side neighborhood as Ben unspools the making of WILD COMBINATION and Matt's path as a gay teen activist to documentary filmmaker. Matt opens up about why he never puts his own money into projects (and how he's managed to pull that off), the importance of finishing what you start, and finding archives you didn't know existed. We dig into his new soap opera doc filming behind the scenes at THE BOLD AND THE BEAUTIFUL, and Matt shares his philosophy on building a body of work that surprises even himself. Plus: the secret to finding your creative community in a Melrose Place-style Manhattan courtyard.

Timestamps:

00:00 Walking to Meet Matt Wolf in New York

01:26 Matt's Melrose Place: Building Community in Manhattan

02:33 First Connections: Wild Combination and Arthur Russell

05:11 From Gay Teen Activist to Documentary Filmmaker

08:21 The Documentary That Was Made About Matt (And Why He Hated It)

09:45 Paper Tiger Television and the Experimental Film World

11:46 How Wild Combination Became a Feature (Accidentally)

13:11 Finding Your Niche and Telling Stories That Connect

16:29 The Search for Stories: Archives and Access

20:56 Never Put Your Own Money In: Matt's Golden Rule

23:41 Taking a Break (And Why It Never Really Works)

25:32 The New Project: Behind the Scenes of Soap Operas

28:16 The State of Documentary: Shrinking Budgets and Staying True

31:27 Building a Body of Work That Surprises You

33:19 What Keeps Matt Going: The Love of the Work

35:37 Advice for Filmmakers: Finish What You Start

37:01 Wrapping Up the Walk

Discussion Links:

WILD COMBINATION: A PORTRAIT OF ARTHUR RUSSELL (2008) | PEE-WEE HERMAN AS HIMSELF (2025) | WELCOME TO THE DOLLHOUSE (1995) | SPACESHIP EARTH (2020) | THE YOUNG AND THE RESTLESS (1973-present) | THE BOLD AND THE BEAUTIFUL (1987-present)

Consider this your midnight toast to new beginnings—we're popping the cork on our Sundance episode just in time for the calendar reset. As 2024 turns to 2025, we're grateful for the documentary community that keeps showing up, keeps creating, and keeps walking these festival streets in search of collaborators, inspiration, and maybe a free hot cocoa. So grab a glass of whatever you're having, bundle up (it's 31 degrees in spirit), and ring in the New Year with Ben and Keith's man-on-the-street adventure through Park City…

We're walkin' and talkin' through the heart of Sundance, crashing the festival without a film and somehow finding exactly what we came for. From chance encounters with Iranian filmmakers debuting their first feature to freestyle raps from parking lot attendants, this episode captures the serendipity of showing up. We debate whether you need to be a "hopeless optimist" or a "pragmatic realist" to survive indie filmmaking (spoiler: legendary producer Sue Kim has strong opinions). Along the way we spot tuxedo pigeons, dodge UPS trucks, and nearly intercept Conan O'Brien. Plus: the house analogy for selling your film that actually makes sense.

Timestamps:
00:00 Welcome to Doc Walks: Sundance Day
00:49 First Impressions: 31 Degrees and Feeling Like Imposters
02:42 Why Sundance Matters (Even Without a Film)
04:13 The House Analogy: Films, Sales Agents, and Finding Your Plot of Land
07:41 Man on the Street: Volunteers, Skiers, and the Latino Flu Panel
11:17 Meeting Frank Mosley: In-Person Connection in a Virtual World
15:28 Iranian Filmmakers Debut: Cutting Through Rocks
17:48 The Adobe House and Free Hot Cocoa
19:56 Chosen Glory: Parking Lot Freestyle and Good Vibes
22:08 Speed and First: Hope for the Future Generation
25:32 Producer Sue Kim: The Case Against Hopeless Optimism
29:13 Hopeful vs. Hopeless: Finding Your Festival Philosophy
34:24 Wrapping Up Day One and Looking Ahead

Discussion Links:
CUTTING THROUGH ROCKS (2025) | OVEX (2025) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2009) | TOWER (2016)

Come along as Ben flies solo—no Keith, just the UT campus and two documentary titans who've been making films together longer than most marriages last: the indomitable Louis Alvarez and Andrew Kolker have a working partnership runnin' north of fifty years. They made AMERICAN TONGUES (1988) back when folks across the US said they just spoke like everyone else. They made PEOPLE LIKE US (1999) while Americans were spurring their nose at class conversations. And they're still at it—currently chasing down an obscure architect and sharing a film about a storied Texas State Senator. We get into the unglamorous truth of comedic docs (funders hate them), the secret to not killing your creative partner (separate wives, separate boroughs), and why the best stories are in places nobody's looking. They started as VISTA volunteers in New Orleans with no one to tell them where to point the camera. Now they're late-career and busy doing whatever the hell they want. Plus: we decipher a bunch of boats strung together, we bask in neo-classical architecture, all while Louis just wants a dirty chai.

DISCUSSION LINKS:

AMERICAN TONGUES (1988) | YEAH YOU RITE! (1985) | PEOPLE LIKE US (1999) | CONFLUENCE (2024) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2010)

TIMESTAMPS:

00:00 Keith sits this one out 00:49 Meeting Louis and Andy on the UT campus 02:42 The Rodney Ellis short and pulling political levers 04:13 Fifty years of partnership—step one: separate wives 07:41 Cass Gilbert: The everywhere architect you've never heard of 11:17 VISTA volunteers in 1970s New Orleans 15:28 Filming the intangible—accents, class, motherhood 17:48 Why funders hate funny 19:56 The three Cs killing documentary: celebrity, crime, cults 22:08 Steel canoes and the sculpture guessing game 25:32 Making CONFLUENCE during COVID 29:13 AI horror movies and the death of 90-minute docs 34:24 Advice: Go where nobody else is 37:00 Co-directing—the case for and against 43:00 Turtle pond, dirty chai, wrap it up

This week, Ben is on a solo mission to a freezing New York City, where legendary filmmaker Alan Berliner guides him through his studio that's equal parts fine art gallery and documentary laboratory. We're talking about a 108 drawer sound sculpture that Alan plays like an instrument, flood-destroyed film reels turned gorgeous works of art, and the kind of collections that make you wonder where archiving ends and genius begins. Alan waxes poetic on the fine art vs. filmmaker debate, breaks down why every film portrait is really about the person behind the camera, and encourages thinking like a filmmaker even when you're not on set. We get into his philosophy on acting at the speed of thought, editing without treatments, trusting your gut and letting the material tell you what it wants. Then there's his new film, BENITA, a deeply personal work born from decades of friendship and unimaginable loss — Alan's tribute to a woman whose story yearned to be told, even after she was gone. He opens up about what it means to honor someone through film, and why he believes the documentary world is about to shrink fast. This one's about honoring both your mentors —  in the case of Ben learning from Alan — and your mentee's — in the case of Alan coming to know Benita. Buckle up for a beautiful, wild walk through Alan Berliner's studio and his filmmaking career.

DISCUSSION LINKS:

INTIMATE STRANGER (1991) | NOBODY'S BUSINESS (1996) | THE SWEETEST SOUND (2001) | WIDE AWAKE (2006) | FIRST COUSIN ONCE REMOVED (2012) | BENITA (2024) | THE FAMILY ALBUM (1986)

TIMESTAMPS:

00:00 Welcome to Doc Walks: Ben Solo in NYC 00:49 Meeting Alan Berliner at His Studio 02:42 Audio File: The 108 Drawer Sound Sculpture 07:00 The Object Cabinets: Bells, Keys, and Lock Drawers 11:17 Composing with Drawers: Live Demonstration 14:00 "Slow Dissolve" and Think Like a Filmmaker 19:56 Fine Art vs. Documentary: Does the Distinction Matter? 23:00 Parts and Labor: The 534-Frame Machine Sculpture 30:00 Translucent: Film Reels as Light Sculptures 34:24 The Title Card Lens Installation 40:00 The Martin Luther King Jr. Citizenship Award 45:00 Oklahoma, Graduate School, and Unlikely Origins 50:00 From Grandfather to Father to Self: The Portrait Films 56:00 Never Writing a Treatment: The Intuitive Process 1:03:00 Acting at the Speed of Thought 1:07:00 BENITA: A Collaboration with the Departed 1:16:00 The Documentary Landscape in Crisis 1:22:00 Windows and Mirrors: The Purpose of Portraiture 1:26:00 Advice for Filmmakers: Fascination and Need 1:31:00 Closing and Next Episode Preview

What does impact look like? That's what we're asking this week's guest, Courtney Cook—a veteran impact producer who's helped hundreds of doc-makers answer that question in her 7-years at POV. A high school teacher-turned-PhD-turned-doc-producer and soon-to-be professor of documentary film at Texas State, Courtney has strong opinions about perspective, ethics, and how having a "bad attitude" is the only way to make it in this field. 

Courtney happily draws inspiration from Black Feminist Thought, HANDS ON A HARDBODY, and the stop-motion masters, the Brothers Quay—explaining just what it means to be "theoretically promiscuous."  Transitioning out of her role at POV and preparing to re-enter academia, we catch Courtney shortly before the Augmented Reality project LAYERS OF PLACE: AUSTIN that she produced with the MIT Open Documentary Lab makes its debut at SXSW this Spring. Courtney breaks down the difference between making art and making a career, why you should know how you want to "haunt" your audience, and what it actually takes to build a life as a documentary storyteller when you're not "kind-of rich." This wide-ranging walk cuts through the noise and confusion of the current doc landscape and lands at a simple conclusion, that the real silver lining in this industry is us. "We're the silver lining." 

Plus: the gospel of asking better questions, how EYES ON THE PRIZE changed her entire life, why librarians rule, and a peek inside a little free art gallery in the Mueller neighborhood of East Austin. This one's about community, hustle, and learning to "hold on gently."

Discussion Links:
EYES ON THE PRIZE (1987-1990) | HANDS ON A HARD BODY (1997) | LAYERS OF PLACE: AUSTIN (2026)

Timestamps:
00:00 Welcome and Guest Introduction
02:00 Outlook on Texas Filmmaking and Doc Distribution
05:00 Mueller Lake Park and POV Impact Work
07:00 Education, Ethics, and Power in Documentary
10:00 From PhD to POV: Courtney's Path
15:00 Building Careers vs. Building Projects
19:00 Producer Pay and Labor Practices
23:00 The Three-Month Trial Period
26:00 Feisty Conversations and Better Questions
29:00 Grant Applications and Process
33:00 Theoretically Promiscuous
34:00 Silver Linings: We Have Each Other
37:00 MIT Augmented Reality Project
39:00 It's All Who You Know (Two Steps Away)
43:00 Believing in People Until You Learn Otherwise
45:00 Gateway Drug: Eyes on the Prize
48:00 Advice for Emerging Filmmakers
52:00 Little Free Art Gallery Discovery
53:00 DIY Impact and Educational Distribution
55:00 What's Next for Courtney

We are excited to catch Sam Green—despite freezing our asses off on Main Street—hours after the world premiere of THE OLDEST PERSON IN THE WORLD. What starts as a conversation about chasing Guinness World Records quickly becomes something bigger: how curiosity transforms into meaning. 

Sam walks us through ten years of filming, cancer scares, fatherhood, and the realization that 116-year-olds don't give a fuck about pearls of wisdom—like Keith, they just want snacks and naps. Sam is an inspiration, driven by endless curiosity and the urge to overcome his own inner shy-kid, he shares the impetus to innovate docmaking with 'live cinema' and we witness his obsession with manhole covers (yes, really). Sam pulls back the curtains on his years-long cutting process with OLDEST PERSON editor Aaron Wickenden—they cut for 1-month a year for ten years! This walk is full of positivity, creativity, and a lot of laughs.

Plus: a stop & chat with Oscar-winning producer, Dan Cogan, why SALESMAN changed everything, and insight into Sam's new alter ego as a Venice futbol fanatic: Samuel Verde. 

It's the end of an era at Sundance, but Sam reminds us why we fell in love with this art form in the first place.

Discussion links:
THE OLDEST PERSON IN THE WORLD (2026) | THE RAINBOW MAN/JOHN 3:16 (1997) | THE WEATHER UNDERGROUND (2002) | 32 SOUNDS (2022) | SALESMAN (1969) | SANS SOLEIL (1983)

Timestamps:
00:00 Main Street at Sundance—14 Degrees
01:05 Meeting Sam During Covid Austin
02:42 The Oldest Person in the World—The Film That Changed
04:13 When Centenarians Just Want Snacks
07:41 The Manhole Cover Obsession
11:17 From Rainbow Man to Sundance 1997
15:28 The Weather Underground & Paul Thomas Anderson
19:56 Editing Over Ten Years with Aaron
25:32 The Live Documentary Revolution
29:13 Performing Arts Saved My Career
34:24 Advice: Keep It Small, Keep It Fun
41:39 Barbara Kopple on Watching Your Own Films
45:01 Gateway Drug: Salesman & Sans Soleil
48:25 Samuel the Venice Soccer Fan
49:26 The End of an Era at Sundance

Ben squeezes into the VHS vault that is the Found Footage Festival (FFF) headquarters in NY with Joe Pickett—half of the FFF comedy duo who quit his job to follow a dirty country singer for four years, turned stolen instructional videos into a 20-year comedy empire, and once declared a half-naked woman painting ceramic clowns "the greatest moment in VHS history." Joe walks us through his filmmaking suicide pact with Nick Prueher, explains why Larry Pierce's "I Like to (BEEP)" changed everything, and reveals the dark truth about JINGLE BABIES. From sleeping on floors for a full year to getting sued in federal court for morning show pranks, Joe's path from documentary filmmaker to comedy archeologist proves you need to be willing to sleep on couches in order to finish what you start. We're surrounded by 14,638 tapes (no doubles), a giant Bart Simpson mask, and a signed GROWING PAINS poster that survived the New York subway. Plus: his new doc is so illegal you have to sign an NDA just to watch it.

Discussion links:
VHS PARTY LIVE! (2026) | DIRTY COUNTRY (2007) | CHOP & STEELE (2022) | AMERICAN MOVIE (1999

) | SHERMAN'S MARCH (1985) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2009)

Timestamps:
00:00 Welcome to Found Footage Festival HQ
02:42 The origin story: Larry Pierce and dirty country music
07:41 Quitting jobs and the suicide pact
11:17 Following weirdos for four and a half years
15:28 How Found Footage Festival started as fundraising
19:56 South by Southwest premiere and audience award
24:19 Greatest hits from the VHS vault
29:13 What makes bad things good
34:24 Lightning round: American Movie as gateway drug
40:00 Advice for aspiring filmmakers: sleep on couches
45:00 Video Filmed for Life—the illegal documentary

When we find Julie Goldman and Chris Clements of Motto Pictures in a Sundance hotel lobby, they're doing what they do—sharing hugs and encouragement with the Oscar-nominated team from THE PERFECT NEIGHBOR. They're the kind of producers who root hard for everybody in the field while juggling 8-10 projects of their own. 

Julie and Chris know everyone—and they champion longtime friends and newcomers to docmaking alike. When we asked Julie to walk with us last year at SXSW, she was a quick and easy "YES," but it took til Sundance for us all to be in the same place at the same time. And here we are. Keith knows the Motto Pictures folks from the 2016-2017 awards campaign when they were shepherding both LIFE, ANIMATED and WEINER. Ben's lucky enough to be in business with Motto on his upcoming DR. DANTE project. So we've all spent time together, and this time we're bringing you along for a winding view into Chris & Julie's work philosophies and partnership—they're married business partners who each offer different aspects to the films they produce.

We're away from the hubbub of Main Street and onto the nature trail spotting birds, murals, tunnels, and trees, all while digging into the Motto approach: how they financed their first feature on maxed-out credit cards at Brooklyn College, why they Zoom into shoots they can't attend, and how they handle story development and adaptation, including seeing a doc become a scripted comedy in partnership with Mike Schur and Ted Danson. Hear how Julie went from memorizing international phone prefixes at First Run Features to spotting potential in filmmakers before they see it themselves; and Chris drops a theory on why AI will never replace human storytelling—"it doesn't understand doubt." Join us as we stumble into a public art garden where we can't resist trying our hand at live-scoring the walk with some sculptural instruments. And we land on a question that these walks keep coming back to: where does documentary go from here? 

Plus: love for Errol Morris and Barbara Kopple, Owen Suskind's flawless post-screening routine, the beauty of sad bells echoing through a Park City tunnel, and the tuxedo pigeon is back (still a magpie). 

Discussion Links: BUCK (2011) | LIFE, ANIMATED (2016) | WEINER (2016) | CHICKEN PEOPLE (2016) | THE MOLE AGENT (2020) | MAN ON THE INSIDE (2024) | THE PERFECT NEIGHBOR (2025) | GATES OF HEAVEN (1978) | HARLAN COUNTY, USA (1976) | ABACUS: SMALL ENOUGH TO JAIL (2016) | WALTZ WITH BASHIR (2008) | CAPTURING THE FRIEDMANS (2003) | AN AMERICAN FAMILY (1973)

Timestamps: 00:00 Sundance lobby: hugging THE PERFECT NEIGHBOR crew goodbye 02:42 Meet Julie Goldman & Chris Clements of Motto Pictures 04:13 Motto origin story and the greatest hits 07:07 The tuxedo pigeon returns (still a magpie, Keith) 08:04 Married and making movies: how they navigate both 09:12 Eight to ten projects at once—parallel action as philosophy 11:17 Creative producing: Zoom-ing into shoots, feeding notes live 15:28 Julie's sales brain meets Chris's creative obsession 17:35 The credit card feature: Brooklyn College's worst financial advice 19:01 Why producing called louder than directing 21:02 Owen Suskind wants a cheeseburger and three movies 22:08 Motto's unofficial motto: dragging filmmakers kicking and screaming 25:02 The light at the end of the tunnel for doc filmmaking 29:15 Documentary is defense—and championships are won reacting 31:19 The pivot moment every good doc goes through 36:08 "AI doesn't understand doubt" 39:03 The sculpture garden jam session 40:27 What Motto looks for: a new way to see the world 46:03 YouTube, platforms, and where distribution is headed 50:12 The Motto farm system: interns to A24 51:14 Advice for first-time feature filmmakers 55:04 Gateway docs: GATES OF HEAVEN and HARLAN COUNTY, USA 57:08 What they can't stop thinking about 59:32 The short: FOR SOME KIND OF REFUGE 01:01:12 Sponsors: Austin Film Society & The Long Time

It's time for some JOYBUBBLES! That's what first-time doc director Rachael J. Morrison believes—and she's brought her feature doc to Sundance to share the power of JOYBUBBLES with the world. Rachael's film introduces the world to Joe Engressia, a blind kid who discovered he could whistle a magic tone and hack the analog telephone system—becoming a pioneer in the world of "phone phreaking." Joe's story twists and turns as freaking leads to joy… and he inspires generations of outsiders to find their own unique paths through this life. 

Rachael comes from years of experience as an archival producer, so it's no surprise that her first directing effort relies heavily on the use of "emotional archival," playing at the intersection of audio and visual communication techniques. We'll learn how she stumbled onto Joe's story and how four cassette tapes of him narrating his own life completely transformed the film. Those tapes are right up Ben's alley, and he shares his experience making a cassette-inspired short doc about telephone pranksters, and Keith confesses to benefitting from a college friend who knew how to hack payphones for free long distance back in the 1990s. Anyone who spent time on twentieth-century party lines, or making 3-way calls with friends will be transported into those landline days when the telephone was a great connector. Rachael spent ten years meeting phone phreaks and making this film, and she shares her affinity for jamband bootleg trading, mixtape culture, and the beauty of sitting by the radio with your finger on the record button. Plus: kids sledding in Park City, shout-out to an Errol Morris deep cut, finding inspiration via the obituary page, and appreciation for Joybubbles' words of ultimate wisdom: if you love something enough, it loves you back.

Discussion Links:

JOYBUBBLES (2026) | GATES OF HEAVEN (1978) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2009) | READING RAINBOW (2024)

Timestamps:

00:00 Arrival in Park City — crisp is the word of the day 00:49 Meet Rachael J. Morrison (and immediately regret going uphill) 02:00 The JOYBUBBLES pitch — on a steep incline 04:00 Born blind, born to hack: Joe Engressia's story 05:00 Keith's college payphone hack and red boxes vs. blue boxes 07:00 Finding the story through a New York Times obituary 09:00 Emotional archival vs. see-and-say archival 13:00 Four cassette tapes in a closet change everything 15:00 Joe as proto-podcaster: answering machine radio in the '80s 17:00 What is a phone phreak? 19:00 Keith's son gets a landline for Christmas 22:00 Sundance premiere jitters and what audiences might grab onto 23:00 Phone phreaks meet Phish bootleg tape traders 25:00 Mixtape culture and the lost art of analog intention 28:00 Angry Kickstarter backers who turned out to be the biggest fans 30:00 "If you love it enough, it'll love you back" 32:00 The director-editor relationship: finding your band 37:00 From Bard art school to MoMA library to archival producing 40:00 Fair use and why indie docs depend on it 42:00 Lightning Round: GATES OF HEAVEN, Matt Wolf, and what's next 46:00 Where to find JOYBUBBLES

Park City, 2026 —  we showed up without films, without press credentials, but still… ready to make our DocWalk dreams a reality. Welcome to the last of 4 episodes at Sundance: a walk down Main Street, where we hobnob with the best of the fest, greet the people, and do everything we can to stay warm in sub-freezing temps without a single movie ticket in sight.

This year at Sundance everyone was looking back (at the legacy of Robert Redford and what the fest has been) while still looking forward (to where we'll be in a year… Boulder, Colorado). We catch-up on the festival BizBuzz™: it's all M&A! Mergers and acquisitions (netflix/paramount/warners, oh my) and whether the indie spirit is actually back (Ben says it is). As men of the people, we focus on the men (& women) on the street. And they have a lot to say. Entertainment lawyer Ben Moskowitz breaks down what not to do when you're pitching, first-time producer Will Butler shares the innovations of JOYBUBBLES—the first film at Sundance to screen with open audio description for blind audiences, and Tribeca programmer Jarod Neece offers insight into the numbers game that you've gotta overcome when applying to a premier fest. We meet David Fortune, who turned a million-dollar grant into his debut feature COLOR BOOK, Jamaican producer/lawyer Rob Maylor who's about to make Delroy Lindo a first-time director, and filmmaker Dana Reilly fresh off her OUR BODY ELECTRIC premiere. Austin-based producers Russell Groves and Jessica Wolfson make brief cameos and former-Austinite Heather Courtney joins us to talk about the film she's producing with Christina Ibarra, and the one she's directing (thx to a Chicken & Egg research grant). 

Plus: surprise run-ins with editor Josh Ethier, publicist David Magdael and doc-superstar Ondi Timoner; Aaaand an owl that's been in 150 movies; a meteorologist and horses; and insight into a Park City real estate deal that proves that karma is real, but the best deals are behind us. Thanks to the Austin Film Society and The Long Time for sponsoring our trip! This one is a super-sized DocWalks with 50% more runtime, and a whole lot of fun! 

DISCUSSION LINKS:

JOYBUBBLES (2026) | COLOR BOOK (2024) | OUR BODY ELECTRIC (2026) | BUDDY (2026) | AMERICAN DOCTOR (2026) | THE OLDEST PERSON IN THE WORLD (2026) | THE HISTORY OF CONCRETE (2026) | ALL THE WALLS CAME DOWN (2025) | BREAKING THROUGH ROCKS (2025) | COME SEE ME IN THE GOOD LIGHT (2025) | HOT WATER (2026) | LITTLE MISS SUNSHINE (2006) | SEX, LIES, AND VIDEOTAPE (1989) | SLACKER (1990) | CLERKS (1994) | SEIZED (2026) | NUTS (2016) | TOO MANY COOKS (2014) | CARTS OF DARKNESS (2008) | MARCH OF THE PENGUINS (2005) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2009) | TOWER (2016) | CHOP & STEELE (2022) | DEAR MR. BRODY (2021) 

TIMESTAMPS:

00:00 Ben is cold — arrival in Park City 03:58 Main Street dispatch — the last Sundance in Park City 07:00 First-timers and the indie spirit question 08:00 Jordan Tracy — ABC4 live weather with horses 11:50 Russell Groves and Jessica Wolfson 17:50 Ben Moskowitz on how new filmmakers find a lawyer 21:00 Good ideas, bad ideas — don't promise access you don't have 25:15 Will Butler and JOYBUBBLES — open audio description at Sundance 29:00 Jarod Neece — Tribeca at 25 and the 14,000-film funnel 37:10 Kino Lorber re-releasing Tower — breaking news 41:00 Bill and Robin — Park City locals since the sixties 44:30 Night falls — BizBuzz™ on Main Street 48:00 Dana Reilly — OUR BODY ELECTRIC premieres at Dances With Films 52:30 TOWER superfan and the sorority screening 55:00 David Fortune — COLOR BOOK and the AT&T Untold Stories million 58:30 Dapper dressed rule of thumb 1:01:30 Rob Maylor — producing Delroy Lindo's directorial debut 1:05:00 Josh Ethier — editing BUDDY from TOO MANY COOKS director Casper Kelly 1:09:30 Eagle and Spencer — skiing, Fugazi, and CARTS OF DARKNESS 1:14:00 Day three — Heather Courtney and Chicken & Egg research grant 1:19:00 David Magdael — publicist, Oscar campaigns, and changing the world through cinema and Ondi(!) Timoner 1:22:30 Heather's final thoughts — call your representatives 1:29:30 Driving away from Sundance — reflections on community and the grind 1:36:00 Sponsor messages and next episode preview — Anna Rau and the Nonfiction Hot List

We're takin' it to the streets, sure—but this week we're also takin' it to the list: the Nonfiction Hotlist, with producer Anna Rau. Anna's got the scoop on this new endeavor to connect nonfic producers with money and distribution, and she's here to share just what the Nonfiction Hotlist is and where it's going. It started when former ESPN producer Adam Neuhaus made a viral LinkedIn post that inspired a community initiative championing unreleased nonfiction storytelling. And it's growing quickly. Anna explains their brand new Yahoo partnership that's creating a real home for short films that deserve more than a life relegated to the purgatory of the filmmaker's hard drive.

Anna has a lot going on right now! She's been producing commercials and doc-series for years, with her husband Corbett and their company The Range, but she realized there was a language on the finance side of this industry that she still needed to learn. So she enrolled in an MBA program to decode the business, and to find some creative ways to grow… and that growth has yielded big ideas in the form of westward expansion. Anna reveals that she is turning a grad-school assignment into an active business plan by putting an offer in on the legendary Palace Theater in Marfa, TX—the single-screen showroom where GIANT premiered, in the town where Anna and Corbett got married, and where they've got big plans to build a cinema-slash-production-hub from the ground up. Producer, MBA grad, entrepreneur, and Media Mogul—now that's a hot list. 

Plus: a ufo-shaped gazebo on the shores of Lady Bird Lake; we eye a colorful ceramic cow; talk abundance over scarcity; and walk away feeling like the future of nonfiction is in very good hands.

***Also deadline for the Yahoo initiative is this Friday if folks want to get something in under the wire, there's an info Q+A happening tomorrow on instagram live over @nonfictionhotlist 

Discussion Links: GIANT (1956) | JAWS (1975) | CALIFORNIA'S GOLD (1991–2012) | ARTBOUND (2012–Present) | ALL WE NEED IS ANOTHER CHANCE (2017) | TENDING NATURE (2018–2021) | EVERYTHING EVERYWHERE ALL AT ONCE (2022) | THE YOGURT SHOP MURDERS (2025) | GOOD MOMENT (in post-production)

00:00 Welcome to Doc Walks: Banter About Banter 02:42 Introducing Anna Rau: Old Friends, New Walks 03:00 The Marfa Wedding Suit Disaster 05:00 Anna's Career: The Range, PBS, and Beyond 06:30 Enter the Nonfiction Hotlist 08:30 What Is the Hotlist? Origin Story and Mission 10:00 The Blacklist Comparison: Nonfiction's Turn 12:00 Human-Centered Curation and Painting the Back of the Fence 15:00 Anna's MBA Journey: Understanding the Money Side 17:48 The Business of Docs: Tangibles, Intangibles, and Impact 20:30 The Yahoo Shorts Partnership: Finding a Home for Short Films 22:00 Why Shorts Are Harder Than Features 25:00 Ben's Short Film Life and the Distribution Dead End 27:00 Submission Details: Who Should Apply 29:00 The Gazebo Detour: Women Voters and Homeless Photographers 31:00 How the Curation Actually Works 33:30 Anna and Corbett's Body of Work 36:00 The Huel Howser Tangent We Needed 40:00 Crisis as Opportunity: Abundance Over Scarcity 41:00 The Palace Theater in Marfa: A Big Announcement 44:00 Pivots, Blind Leaps, and Never Having a Real Job 48:00 Community Over Competition 50:30 MBA Takeaways and the Finance of Filmmaking 54:30 Gateway Drug Film: GIANT 56:00 Advice for Young Filmmakers: Curiosity and Joy 58:30 Closing Thoughts and South by Southwest Preview

Holly Herrick is all about the film-life—as the Head of Film for Austin Film Society and Doc Days festival founder / programmer, she's at the center of Austin's film community, but this SXSW finds Holly wearing a new hat: first-time documentary producer. 

FIRST THEY CAME FOR MY COLLEGE, directed by Patrick Bresnan, chronicles the 2023 "hostile takeover"—their words—of New College of Florida by Ron DeSantis and his Christo-fascist cronies. Holly's a New College alum. She saw the press getting the story wrong and did what any reasonable person in her position would do: panicked. But a call to Margaret Brown gave her some confidence, and together with fellow alum Harry Hanbury, decided to make a movie.

No big deal… hahaha… just squeeze-in a first feature with a full-time job running a non-profit and two-screen cinema, overseeing awards shows and grants, & two invite-only artists' labs (scripted & doc), all while raising two small kids. Holly Herrick is living proof: with enough caffeine, anything's possible….

We love this walk, because we never get enough time with Holly (busy busy lady), but today she's all ours as we stroll through the flowering native plants of Mueller Lake Park taking inspiration from this powerhouse of gettin' shit done—psychosis, be damned. 

Plus: Dave Hickey on art and laziness, Jean Luc Godard on women, and Holly on: knowing your why.

FIRST THEY CAME FOR MY COLLEGE (2026) | A WOMAN IS A WOMAN (1961) | BREATHLESS (1960) | WINNEBAGO MAN (2009) | TOWER (2016) | JOIN OR DIE (2023)

00:00 Caffeine-induced psychosis as a lifestyle philosophy 00:49 Introducing Holly Herrick and Austin Film Society 03:30 AFS origin story—Linklater, the old airport, and Mueller 08:30 AFS Cinema as Austin's repertory art house 11:30 Doc Lab and Doc Days—what they are and how they work 17:30 "Community"—the most used word on Doc Walks 21:30 Austin Public—public access TV as democratic infrastructure 26:00 Programming as art, not science—Holly's philosophy for Doc Days 33:00 How Holly got into film: New College, Sarasota, and the accidental programmer 38:30 Dave Hickey, Air Guitar, and why art can't afford to be lazy 41:00 JOIN OR DIE, Bowling Alone, and democracy through community 45:00 FIRST THEY CAME FROM MY COLLEGE—origin of the project 49:00 The hostile takeover of New College of Florida 55:00 Patrick Preston as director and the Food Forest gardening club 1:01:00 Hopes for the film—what Holly wants audiences to understand 1:04:00 Festival run: True/False, SXSW, and beyond 1:08:00 Lightning round—Godard, knowing your why, and Wendell Berry

If you ever wanted to get into the head of a premier festival programmer, this is your chance! Meet SXSW VP of Film & TV, Claudette Godfrey, a self-described Chaos Coordinator and all-around boss. Keith's flyin' solo while Ben's off shooting commercials (allegedly) and you won't want to miss the chance to walk & doc with Claudette today, on the 40th anniversary SXSW kickoff. An ADHD/OCD whirlwind of ideas and observations, Claudette is a trip—and she's ready to talk all things SXSW and highlight this year's best of the fest…

But first we'll check-in on Claudette's origin story: native Austinite, UT film student, SX intern in the Matt Dentler days, shorts programmer-extraordinaire under Janet Pierson, and now ascendant head of all things film & television at Austin's far-reaching culture fest. She's got intel to share—everything that's different now that the fest is 7 days instead of 10. She breaks down what actually gets a short film into a festival (pro tip: make an animated or a doc short—there's just a 0.4% acceptance rate for narrative), why docs are getting "more samey by the day," and why the overnight success myth is a comfortable lie filmmakers have been telling themselves since the early days of Quentin Tarantino. All that in preparation for the main event as Claudette rapid-fires through the 2026 doc slate with obvious glee: Sea Monkeys, classified Bigfoot footage, penis injections, NDA whistleblowers, the world's first extinct glacier, and a film about Kentucky weed farmers. Keith confesses he's in development on seven projects and none of them are close to done, so it'll be a few years before he's submitting to the fest. But Claudette supports his idea of making a short…

Plus: thoughts on Ben's role as Claudette's film prof; shout out to Trey Edward Schults' KRISHA and Jeremy Workman's SECRET MALL APARTMENT; Johnny Cash & Beck & Janis Joplin all at Keith's first SX (class of '94); and cameos from future DocWalks guest Sarah Kuck and Pickles the dog!

This episode was sponsored by our good friends at Rambler Sparkling Water.  A tasty limestone mineral blend with the perfect level of tight, crispy bubbles.  Made in America and proudly supporting American Rivers.  Ramble on.

PULP FICTION (1994) | TOMMY BOY (1995) | E.T. THE EXTRA-TERRESTRIAL (1982) | KRISHA (2015) | JANIS JOPLIN SLEPT HERE (1994) | EVERYTHING EVERYWHERE ALL AT ONCE (2022) | NAVALNY (2022) | DEAR MR. BRODY (2022) | SECRET MALL APARTMENT (2024) | MY BROTHER'S KILLER (2026) | AMAZING LIVE SEA MONKEYS (2026) | CAPTURING BIGFOOT (2026) | DRIFT (2026) | MANHOOD (2026) | MY NDA (2026) | SUMMER OF '94 (2026) | TIME AND WATER (2026) | SUMMER 2000 (2026) | THE LIFE WE LEAVE (2026) | THE DADS (2026) | THE LAST CRITIC (2026) | CORNBREAD MAFIA (2026)

00:00 Introduction and circle of confusion 00:49 Meet Claudette Godfrey, VP of Film and TV at SXSW 02:42 Ben was Claudette's TA in college 04:13 Why Claudette went producing track instead of directing 06:00 Pulp Fiction, Tarantino, and the dream of being discovered 08:00 Festival producer vs. film producer 09:30 SXSW 40th anniversary and what's different this year 12:00 Seven days instead of ten, new badge structure 13:30 Claudette's first SXSW memory: Janice Joplin and Emo's, 1994 16:30 How SXSW has grown since the shed-in-a-backyard days 19:30 Keith's mushroom Easter egg and the intern connection 22:00 Shorts programming: what actually gets in 28:00 Animated shorts, acceptance rates, and premiere strategy 30:00 What makes a great short film 33:00 Watch the films at the festivals you want to attend 35:00 Trey Edward Shults and the moment Claudette was bowled over 37:00 Features: docs are getting more samey 40:00 The myth of the overnight success (the Daniels) 43:00 The 2026 SXSW doc slate begins 44:00 SECRET MALL APARTMENT and patience in documentary filmmaking 45:00 MY BROTHER'S KILLER, AMAZING LIVE SEA MONKEYS, CAPTURING BIGFOOT 47:00 CORNBREAD MAFIA, DRIFT, MANHOOD, MY NDA 48:00 SUMMER OF '94 and the AI DOC 50:00 TIME AND WATER, Sarah Dosa, and the survival of humanity 53:00 SUMMER 2000, THE LIFE WE LEAVE, THE DADS, THE LAST CRITIC 55:00 50% first-time filmmakers, the submission process myths 57:00 Film festival fit: not every great film belongs at every fest 58:00 Lightning round: gateway drug films 59:00 Francis, Pickles, and Keith's seven projects in development 01:02:00 Outro and teaser for Holly Herrick episode