Mary Murphy is Professor of Psychological and Brain Sciences at Indiana University. She is also Founding Director of the Summer Institute on Diversity at the Center for Advanced Study in the Behavioral Sciences at Stanford University and founder and CEO of the Equity Accelerator, a research and consulting organization that works with schools and companies to create more equitable learning and working environments. She is the author of Cultures of Growth: How the New Science of Mindset Can Transform Individuals, Teams, and Organizations*.

Many of us have heard the distinction between a fixed and a growth mindset. Turns out it’s more of a both/and, especially with our teams. In this conversation, Mary and I discuss how team collaboration can support a growth mindset.

• Nobody has only a fixed or a growth mindset. While we may favor one, all of us shift between them.
• Team culture is so powerful that it can either block or encourage a growth mindset.
• Mindset doesn’t just affect perceptions and behaviors, it shapes the bottom line.
• To support collaboration, begin with a cues audit. Consider starting with affinity groups.
• It’s misperception that cultures of growth are less data-centric than cultures of genius. The opposite is actually true.
• Don’t eliminate competition, recast it. Consider how incentives align with supporting others and the organization as a whole.
• Yes, share outcomes — and also include the distance traveled to achieve them. This supports a culture of growth.
• Traditional rating systems, especially forced-rankings, often reinforce cultures of genius.

• Cultures of Growth: How the New Science of Mindset Can Transform Individuals, Teams, and Organizations* by Mary Murphy
• Culture Cues Assessment

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• Growth Mindset Helps You Rise From the Ashes, with Jeff Hittenberger (episode 326)
• How to Build Psychological Safety, with Amy Edmondson (episode 404)
• Help Your Team Embrace Growth Mindset, with Eduardo Briceño (episode 644)

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Maureen Dunne is a cognitive scientist, neurodiversity expert, global keynote speaker, board director, and business leader with over two decades of experience helping organizations build thriving cultures. She has served as a Senior Advisor to some of the world’s top organization, including the LEGO Foundation, Cornell University, and Members of Congress. She is the author of The Neurodiversity Edge: The Essential Guide to Embracing Autism, ADHD, Dyslexia, and Other Neurological Differences for Any Organization*.

We often don’t notice our deeply held biases — and there’s certainly bias against neurodiversity. In this conversation, Maureen and I discuss the research, mindsets, and contributions relevant to neurodiversity. Plus, how neurodiversity can provide an edge for almost every organization.

• We often don’t see our deeply held biases. As one example, we assume that north is “up” on maps and globes, even though that’s only a construct.
• Research and estimates vary, but at least 20% of the population is neurodivergent.
• Divergent bees in hives find new sources of honey. Instead of viewing neurodivergence from a deficit-based perspective, use a strengths-based approach.
• Intellectual capability is entirely independent of having a neurodivergent profile.
• Rather than maintaining accommodations for “quirky people,” move towards a norm of universal accommodations that benefit the entire employee population.

• The Neurodiversity Edge: The Essential Guide to Embracing Autism, ADHD, Dyslexia, and Other Neurological Differences for Any Organization* by Maureen Dunne

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• How to Begin Difficult Conversations About Race, with Kwame Christian (episode 594)
• Supporting Return to Work After Maternity Leave, with Danna Greenberg (episode 639)
• How to Be a Better Ally, with Lauren Wesley Wilson (episode 675)

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Ty Wiggins is a leadership expert who is passionate about setting up new CEOs for success. As the global lead of Russell Reynolds Associates’ CEO & Executive Transition Practice, he helps world-leading CEOs successfully transition into their roles, guiding them through their first 12-18 months as their trusted advisor. He is the author of The New CEO: Lessons from CEOs on How to Start Well and Perform Quickly (Minus the Common Mistakes)*.

Taking on a top job is unique in many ways. In this conversation, Ty and I explore what new, top leaders can do to get out of the bubble and hear more truth. Plus, we discuss why the first 90 or 100 days might not be the best metric for top leaders, and how to better start with easy wins and early moves.

• You’ll see more in the top job, but hear less. This is even more pronounced for those promoted internally.
• Getting out of the bubble means spending more time with middle managers and front-line employees. Second and third time CEOs do this more from the start.
• Key questions that can help you hear more: (1) Tell me some of the workarounds you have in place and (2) What’s the question I haven’t asked you but I should?
• The first 90 or 100 days as a success metric is often overstated in top jobs. You’re often still learning context at an exponential rate.
• If it’s on fire, fix it. If it is smold­ering, leave it alone until you have more context.
• It’s helpful to address common pain points for easy wins. They don’t have to be enormous, but they should be deliberate.

• The New CEO: Lessons from CEOs on How to Start Well and Perform Quickly (Minus the Common Mistakes)* by Ty Wiggins

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• How to Genuinely Show Up for Others, with Marshall Goldsmith (episode 590)
• How to Start a Big Leadership Role, with Carol Kauffman (episode 617)
• How an Executive Aligns with a Board, with Joan Garry (episode 662)

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Amy Gallo is an expert in conflict, communication, and workplace dynamics. She combines the latest management research with practical advice to deliver evidence-based ideas on how to improve relationships and excel at work. In her role as a contributing editor at Harvard Business Review, Amy writes about interpersonal dynamics, communicating ideas, leading and influencing people, and building your career.

Amy is co-host of HBR’s Women at Work podcast and author of both the HBR Guide to Dealing with Conflict and Getting Along: How to Work with Anyone (Even Difficult People)*.

In this conversation, Amy and I discuss one of the most common questions she receives from leaders: how do I handle a colleague who’s passive aggressive? We examine what causes this behavior, how to respond to it, and what to avoid that could worsen the relationship. Plus, we discuss the intention that leaders can bring in responding to passive-aggressive behavior that will help everybody move forward.

• Don’t use the “passive-aggressive behavior” to label someone. It rarely helps and often results in more defensiveness.
• Focus on the other person’s underlying concern or question rather than how they are expressing it. Not everyone is able to discuss thoughts and feelings openly.
• Consider doing hypothesis testing to determine what’s next. Language like, “Here’s the story I’m telling myself…” can help everyone move forward without assigning blame.
• When making a direct request, stick to the facts. Review past behavior like you’re a referee vs. a fan.
• Artificial harmony is a danger spot for teams and leaders. Setting norms can help to reduce passive-aggressive behavior.

• Getting Along: How to Work with Anyone (Even Difficult People)* by Amy Gallo

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• The Way to Have Conversations That Matter, with Celeste Headlee (episode 344)
• Four Habits That Derail Listening, with Oscar Trimboli (episode 500)
• How to Prepare for Conflict, with Amy Gallo (episode 530)
• The Way to Get People Talking, with Andrew Warner (episode 560)

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Kwame Christian is a best-selling author, lawyer, professor, and the Managing Director of the American Negotiation Institute. He has conducted countless specialized trainings worldwide and is a highly sought after keynote speaker. His best-selling book, Finding Confidence in Conflict has helped countless individuals overcome the fear, anxiety, and emotion associated with difficult conversations. The book was inspired by Kwame’s TED Talk with the same name that has over 250,000 views. He’s also host of the Negotiate Anything Podcast, the most popular negotiation podcast in the world.

Kwame was the recipient of the John Glenn College of Public Affairs Young Alumni Achievement Award in 2020 and the Moritz College of Law Outstanding Recent Alumnus Award 2021. Additionally, Kwame is a business lawyer at Carlile, Patchen & Murphy LLP and serves a professor for The Ohio State University’s Moritz College of Law in its top-ranked dispute resolution program and Otterbein University’s MBA program. He is also a Contributor for Forbes and his LinkedIn Learning course, How to Be Both Likable And Assertive, was the most popular course on the platform in July of 2021. He is the author of How to Have Difficult Conversations About Race: Practical Tools for Necessary Change in the Workplace and Beyond*.

In this conversation, Kwame and I discuss how to begin a difficult conversation about race. We explore the key questions that each of us should ask ourselves so that we can determine in advance what we want to gain from a tough conversation. Finally, we look at the three critical things to say in the first 30 seconds that will help you start an important conversation that helps everybody move forward.

• It’s hard for someone else to appreciate how much of a person’s identity affects every other area of their lives until you’ve lived it.
• People explain away racism because they don’t like it and don’t want it to be true.
• Whether you think a conversation is about race or not, if it’s about race for the other person then you’re having a conversation about race.

There questions to ask yourself before a conversation:

1. What do I hope to accomplish in this conversation?
2. Given what I know about them and the situation, what is likely to be their goal?
3. What are three questions I can ask them that will help me to understand their position?

• Use situation, impact, and invitation as the starting point for a difficult conversation. Usually this is less than 30 seconds.
• “Naked facts” reduce the likelihood that someone will dispute the premise of what you are addressing.

• How to Have Difficult Conversations About Race: Practical Tools for Necessary Change in the Workplace and Beyond* by Kwame Christian
• Negotiate Anything podcast

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• The Way Into Difficult Conversations, with Kwame Christian (episode 497)
• How to Reduce Bias in Feedback, with Therese Huston (episode 510)
• The Way Managers Can be Champions for Justice, with Minda Harts (episode 552)

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David Hutchens helps leaders find and tell their stories. He works with leaders around the world to find, craft, and tell their most urgent stories for the purpose of creating shared meaning, preserving culture, disseminating learning, and speeding change in organizations.

He has taught the Storytelling Leader program at some of the most influential organizations — and he’s written many books, including the Circle of the 9 Muses and The Leadership Story Deck. He is the co-creator with longtime friend of the show Susan Gerke of the GO Team program. He’s also the author of the new book, Story Dash: Find, Develop, and Activate Your Most Valuable Business Stories…In Just a Few Hours.

In this conversation, David and I discuss how to find stories that you can use in your organization. We reflect on the reality that we both hear many leaders say to us: “How do I find the right stories?” David then shares the key principles and steps that every leader can take to surface and curate the best stories.

• The “Us At Our Best” taxonomy is what it looks like when are are delivering with energy and excellence. A recent Southwest Airlines story is an example of this.
• Find the area the area of your work where you need to influence the emotional system.
• Trust stories about small moments. Don’t attempt to create an epic drama of huge importance. The best stories are individual incidents that send a bigger message.
• Formal story mining can be done alone or as team building. Institutionalizing practices like story sharing can help this happen regularly and naturally.
• When informally collecting stories, listen for time, place, and person as signals that a story is beginning.

• Download a free set of Story Deck cards or…
• Reach out to David directly at david@davidhutchens.com for more free resources
• Purchase the full set of Leadership Story Deck by David Hutchens

• How to Create an Unstoppable Culture, with Ginger Hardage (episode 350)
• Three Stories to Tell During Uncertainty, with David Hutchens (episode 486)
• The Way to Earn Attention, with Raja Rajamannar (episode 521)

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In 1982, Ari, along with his partner Paul Saginaw, founded Zingerman’s Delicatessen with a $20,000 bank loan, a Russian History degree from the University of Michigan, 4 years of experience washing dishes, cooking, and managing in restaurant kitchens and chutzpah from his hometown of Chicago. Today, Zingerman’s Delicatessen is a nationally renowned food icon and the Zingerman’s Community of Businesses has grown to 10 businesses with over 750 employees and over $55 million in annual revenue.

Besides being the Co-Founding Partner and being actively engaged in some aspect of the day-to-day operations and governance of nearly every business in the Zingerman’s Community, Ari is also a prolific writer. His most recent publications are the first 4 of his 6 book series Zingerman’s Guide to Good Leading, including A Lapsed Anarchist’s Approach to The Power of Beliefs in Business.

In this conversation, Ari and I explore how the power of our beliefs show up in virtually every one of our daily actions. We examine how to begin looking at what isn’t working and how to start examining our beliefs. When those beliefs aren’t working, Ari shares several, critical steps we can take to begin to change our thinking.

• Our beliefs, many of which we may not be consciously aware of, are often calling the shots in our daily actions and behaviors.
• Start examining a belief by picking a current problem to address.
• Listen carefully to your internal voices to identify the language showing up. Notice places especially where you frame things as facts, certitudes, thoughts, theories, norms, shoulds, and should nots.
• Examine how you came to the beliefs that you uncover. Then, confront your cannons.
• Change now, find facts later. Most people do that the opposite way.

• A Lapsed Anarchist’s Approach to the Power of Beliefs in Business by Ari Weinzweig
• Humility: A Humble, Anarchistic Inquiry by Ari Weinzweig
• Schein On, You Crazy Diamond by Ari Weinzweig

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• The Path of Humble Leadership, with Edgar Schein and Peter Schein (episode 363)
• How to Help People Engage in Growth, with Whitney Johnson (episode 576)
• Help People Show Up as Themselves, with Frederic Laloux (episode 580)

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Ruth Gotian has been hailed by the journal Nature and Columbia University as an expert in mentorship and leadership development. Recently, she was named as the #1 emerging management thinker in the world by Thinkers50. She was a semi-finalist for the Forbes 50 Over 50 list and has coached and mentored hundreds of people throughout her career.

In addition to being published in academic journals, she is a contributor to Forbes and Psychology Today, where she writes about optimizing success. She is the Chief Learning Officer in Anesthesiology and former Assistant Dean of Mentoring and Executive Director of the Mentoring Academy at Weill Cornell Medicine, where she is a faculty member. She is the author of The Success Factor: Developing the Mindset and Skillset for Peak Business Performance*.

In this conversation, Ruth and I explore her research on how high achievers build their networks — and also what works for us both in our personal practices. We discuss several tactics that most leaders can use to strengthen existing networks. Plus, we examine the mindsets that tend to lead to success in professional relationships, in spite of busy schedules.

• High achievers are always seeking perspective, insight, and inspiration from people in many different career stages and disciplines.
• Use the 24/7/30 rule when making new connections. Reach out within 24 hours, again in 7 days, and also at 30 days.
• Almost always there is a way you can add value to another person, even if they are at the top of professional game. Find that way to help.
• When you create content on social media, you emerge as one of the 1% of professionals who choose to do this.
• Give without expectation of anything in return.

• The Success Factor: Developing the Mindset and Skillset for Peak Business Performance* by Ruth Gotian
• How Do You Find a Decent Mentor When You’re Stuck at Home? by Ruth Gotian
• Networking for Introverted Scientists by Ruth Gotian
• Conversation Starters by Ruth Gotian

• The Power of Weak Connections, with David Burkus (episode 347)
• How to Strengthen Your Network, with Marissa King (episode 425)
• How to Get Noticed on LinkedIn, with Stephen Hart (episode 495)
• How to Lead and Retain High Performers, with Ruth Gotian (episode 567)

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Marshall Goldsmith is one of the world’s leading executive coaches and the New York Times bestselling author of many books, including What Got You Here Won’t Get You There, Mojo, and Triggers. In his coaching practice, he has advised more than 150 major CEOs and their management teams, including clients like Alan Mulally, Frances Hesselbein, and Hubert Joly. His newest book is The Earned Life: Lose Regret, Choose Fulfillment*.

We’ve all heard about the benefits of empathy and most of us assume that more empathy for the people we lead is always better. In this conversation, Marshall and I look at the different types of empathy and explore the downsides of leaning into empathy too much. Plus, we discuss how singular empathy can help busy leaders stay present in the midst of their busy schedules.

• There are multiple types of empathy — and each of them bring challenges along with their positive attributes.
• We often hit the reset button successfully at work, but then neglect it in our personal relationships.
• Singular empathy helps us to stay present with people and to move between the multiple spaces and situations that most leaders find themselves in daily.
• A key question for us all to ask ourselves: am I being the person I want to be right now?

• The Earned Life: Lose Regret, Choose Fulfillment* by Marshall Goldsmith

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• The Way to Stop Rescuing People From Their Problems, with Michael Bungay Stanier (episode 284)
• Getting Better at Empathy, with Daniel Goleman (episode 391)
• The Way to Be More Self-Aware, with Tasha Eurich (episode 442)

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Ruchika Tulshyan is the founder of Candour, a global inclusion strategy firm. She is a regular contributor to The New York Times and Harvard Business Review. As a keynote speaker, Ruchika has addressed organizations like NASA, Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation, and the United States Congress.

Ruchika is the author of The Diversity Advantage: Fixing Gender Inequality in the Workplace, and most recently, Inclusion on Purpose: An Intersectional Approach to Creating a Culture of Belonging at Work*. She is on the Thinkers50 Radar list and named as one of Hive Learning’s Most Influential D&I Professionals for the past two years.

In this conversation, Ruchika and I discuss how leaders can adapt their hiring practices to attract more diverse candidates — and ultimately support inclusion inside their organizations. We discuss the importance of what to both include and avoid in job postings. Plus, we examine how well-intended interview practices can sometimes have unintended results on supporting diversity and inclusion.

• Make the hiring process transparent from start to finish.
• Include an authentic equal opportunity statement.
• Refrain from using certain words in job listings. Examples include: rockstar, ninja, hacker, guru, manage, build, aggressive, fearless, independent, analytic, and assertive.
• Emphasize skills and experience over professional degrees.
• Avoid panel interviews and refrain from asking questions or having conversations about culture fit.

• Inclusion on Purpose: An Intersectional Approach to Creating a Culture of Belonging at Work* by Ruchika Tulshyan

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• How to Get the Ideal Team Player, with Patrick Lencioni (episode 301)
• How to Be More Inclusive, with Stefanie Johnson (episode 508)
• Start Finding Overlooked Talent, with Johnny Taylor, Jr. (episode 544)

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David Gergen has served as a White House adviser to four US presidents of both political parties: Richard Nixon, Gerald Ford, Ronald Reagan, and Bill Clinton. He then served as the editor of US News & World Report. For the past two decades, he has served as a professor of public service and founding director of the Center for Public Leadership at the Harvard Kennedy School.

David is also a senior political analyst for CNN, where he is a respected voice in national and international affairs. He is the author of Hearts Touched with Fire: How Great Leaders Are Made*.

In this conversation, David and I discuss his years working in the White House for four different presidents. We explore what worked for David to be able to support a powerful person in being the best version of themselves. Plus, we discuss how to speak truth to power, the strategy of playing to strengths, and the critical importance of staying aligned with the big picture.

• Speaking up means you ensure that your manager has considered alternate perspectives.
• Be aware of your own shortcomings so you do not bias your own advice.
• You made need to help a manager overcome their own challenges. Help them play to their strengths.
• Beware of managing up with arrogance. Instead, create zones and pathways that can help a manager make tough calls.
• Making a suggestion in a short note can be one way to open up a tough conversation.
• Keep the bigger, nobler motive in mind at all times. Advocate for that larger vision.

• Hearts Touched with Fire: How Great Leaders Are Made* by David Gergen
• The Bin Laden Raid: Inside the Situation Room Photo

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• How to Start Managing Up, with Tom Henschel (episode 433)
• Leadership in the Midst of Chaos, with Jim Mattis (episode 440)
• How to be Diplomatic, with Susan Rice (episode 456)
• Your Leadership Motive, with Patrick Lencioni (episode 505)

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Bonni is the host of the Teaching in Higher Ed podcast, Dean of Teaching and Learning and Professor of Business and Management at Vanguard University, and my life partner. Prior to her academic career, she was a human resources consultant and executive officer for a publicly traded company. Bonni is the author of The Productive Online and Offline Professor: A Practical Guide*.

• Margaret is wondering what resources we’d recommend for her team to identify different communication styles.
• Jeff asked us what steps we might take to help someone increase their confidence.
• Christopher mentioned a prior episode and is seeking our advice on what to do when challenging authority is ignored.

• GO Team Resources by Susan Gerke and David Hutchens
• Creative Acts for Curious People* by Sarah Stein Greenberg
• Emergent Strategy* by adrienne maree brown
• StrengthsFinder
• Dignity: Its Essential Role in Resolving Conflict* by Donna Hicks

• How Teams Use StrengthsFinder Results, with Lisa Cummings (episode 293)
• How to Lead an Offsite, with Tom Henschel (episode 377)
• End Imposter Syndrome in Your Organization, with Jodi-Ann Burey (episode 556)
• The Way to Make Struggles More Productive, with Sarah Stein Greenberg (episode 569)

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Eric Pliner is chief executive officer of YSC Consulting. He has designed and implemented leadership strategy in partnership with some of the world’s best-known CEOs and organizations. Eric’s writing has been featured in Harvard Business Review, Fortune, Forbes, and Fast Company.

A member of the Dramatists’ Guild of America, Eric is co-author of the U.S. National Standards for Health Education and Spooky Dog & the Teen-Age Gang Mysteries (with Amy Rhodes), an Off-Broadway theatrical parody of television cartoons for adults. He is a board director with Hip Hop Public Health. He is also the author of Difficult Decisions: How Leaders Make the Right Call with Insight, Integrity, and Empathy*.

In this conversation, Eric and I discuss the difficult and sometimes awkward moments when we engage other stakeholders in our decisions. We explore the language to use when discussing a stakeholder’s role in a decision. Plus, Eric details how to establish clear expectations about involvement in decisions to avoid sending messages that we otherwise don’t intend.

• Clarify who you will engage and how you intend to do so.
• Before discussing a decision with a stakeholder, explain how the decision is going to be made. Make it clear if you’re offering them a view, a voice, a vote, or a veto.
• Standardize your individual and team processes for decision-making.
• Ask the stakeholder for input — and go deeper with a second or third question to appreciate what’s behind what they’ve said.
• Remind stakeholders how the decision will be made when you conclude. Don’t underestimated the importance of this step.

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• How to Influence Many Stakeholders, with Andy Kaufman (episode 240)
• How to Deal with Opponents and Adversaries, with Peter Block (episode 328)
• The Way to Make Better Decisions, with Annie Duke (episode 499)
• Handling a Difficult Stakeholder, with Nick Timiraos (episode 581)

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Ruth Gotian is the Chief Learning Officer and Associate Professor of Education in Anaesthesiology at Weill Cornell Medicine. She has been hailed by Nature and The Wall Street Journal as an expert in mentorship and leader­ship development. Thinkers50 has ranked her the #1 emerging management thinker in the world and she’s a top LinkedIn voice in mentoring. Ruth is the author of The Success Factor and now along with Andy Lopata, The Financial Times Guide to Mentoring*.

We’ve all heard about the benefits of mentoring. In addition to receiving mentoring, great leaders give back by providing it to others. In this episode, Ruth and I discuss what the research shows that the best mentors do well.

• Effective mentors use a combination of skills in coaching, sponsorship, role-modeling, and mentoring to support the situation.
• Informal mentoring tends to be more effective than formal pairings. 61% of mentoring relationships develop organically.
• Open up your network to your mentee. It’s an essential way to support their growth — and yours.
• Park your ego at the door. Instead, allow your mentee to shine. With their permission, amplify their achievements.
• Take the role of “sophisticated barbarian.” Approach mentee situations with knowledge and experience, but with distance and objectivity of their other, daily interactions.
• Document the challenges, accomplishments, and next steps during mentoring. This helps your mentee recognize accomplishments and grow their confidence.

• The Financial Times Guide to Mentoring by Ruth Gotian and Andy Lopata

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• How to Build a Network While Still Doing Everything Else, with Ruth Gotian (episode 591)
• The Art of Mentoring Well, with Robert Lefkowitz (episode 599)
• The Way to Get Noticed by Key Stakeholders, with Daphne E. Jones (episode 614)

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Scott is a senior partner in McKinsey’s Southern California office. He co-leads the firm’s global CEO Excellence service line and is the author of six books, including the bestseller Beyond Performance. Scott spent his early consulting years working on business strategy and operational topics until his life was turned upside down when his second child was born with profound special needs.

After taking time off to attend to his family, Scott returned to McKinsey with the desire to bring the best of psychology, social science, and the study of human potential into the workplace. He is a cofounder of Digital Divide Data and one of a few hundred people in history known to have traveled to every country in the world. His most recent book written with Carolyn Dewar and Vikram Malhotra is titled CEO Excellence: The Six Mindsets That Distinguish the Best Leaders from the Rest*.

In this conversation, Scott and I examine McKinsey’s research on what the top CEOs do (and avoid) when building great teams. We look at a few of the key mindsets that the best CEOs bring to their organizations — and how teamwork plays into this. Plus, we explore some of the key questions top leaders should ask when determining if it’s time to exit someone from the team.

• Top leaders staff for both aptitude and attitude. The have an eye to both the short and long term.
• The most successful CEOs have a mindset of “first team” and expect leaders in the organization to prioritize serving the whole team/organization over any functional area.
• New CEOs are often known for acting quickly on staffing, but the most successful leaders also temper this with fairness. They use the four questions below to act with both fairness and speed.
• Top leaders stay connected with people throughout the organization, but also keep some distance. There’s a key distinction between being friendly and making friends.

The best CEO’s ensure that they have positively addressed all four questions below before removing somebody:

• Does the team member know exactly what’s expected of them: i.e., what the agenda is and what jobs need to be done to drive that agenda?
• Have they been given the needed tools and resources, and a chance to build the necessary skills and confidence to use them effectively?
• Are they surrounded by others (including the CEO) who are aligned on a common direction and who display the desired mindsets and behaviors?
• Is it clear what the consequences are if they don’t get on board and deliver?

• CEO Excellence: The Six Mindsets That Distinguish the Best Leaders from the Rest* by Carolyn Dewar, Scott Keller, and Vikram Malhotra
• The Hidden Life of Trees: What They Feel, How They Communicate – Discoveries from a Secret World* by Peter Wohlleben

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• How to Create Team Guidelines, with Susan Gerke (episode 192)
• How to Sell Your Vision, with Michael Hyatt (episode 482)
• Your Leadership Motive, with Patrick Lencioni (episode 505)

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Susan MacKenty Brady is the Deloitte Ellen Gabriel Chair for Women and Leadership at Simmons University and the first Chief Executive Officer of The Simmons University Institute for Inclusive Leadership. As a relationship expert, leadership wellbeing coach, author, and speaker, Susan educates leaders and executives globally on fostering self-awareness for optimal leadership.

Susan advises executive teams on how to work together effectively and create inclusion and gender parity in organizations. She is the coauthor, along with Janet Foutty and Lynn Perry Wooten, of The Wall Street Journal bestselling book, Arrive and Thrive: 7 Impactful Practices for Women Navigating Leadership*.

In this conversation, Susan and I discuss the reality that while we may intend well on inclusion, real change starts with us first. We explore how implicit bias assessments can be useful in discovering where they bias is that we don’t see in ourselves. Plus, we examine some of the key actions we can take on relationship building and repair in order to get better.

• Most of us intend well, but we often miss the opportunity to move from being an ally (alignment) to being an upstander (taking action in the moment).
• Utilizing an assessment can help us understand where our implicit biases diverge from our conscious thoughts.
• Curiosity and relationship-building isn’t just for the moment — it’s the before, during, and after of conversations to discover how we get better.
• When we make a misstep, move quickly and purposefully to repair the relationship.

• Arrive and Thrive: 7 Impactful Practices for Women Navigating Leadership* by Susan MacKenty Brady, Janet Foutty, and Lynn Perry Wooten
• The Inclusive Leader’s Playbook by Susan MacKenty Brady, Elisa van Dam, and Loe Lee
• Project Implicit: Implicit Association Tests

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• What You Gain By Sponsoring People, with Julia Taylor Kennedy (episode 398)
• How to Build Psychological Safety, with Amy Edmondson (episode 404)
• How to Be More Inclusive, with Stefanie Johnson (episode 508)
• How to Reduce Bias in Feedback, with Therese Huston (episode 510)

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Russ has had a diverse 28 year operational management career. He was a Company Commander in the Marine Corps before starting his first company, Pathfinders. From there, Russ went to the Wharton School, and then onto management roles at Google and Twitter. He then co-founded Candor, Inc., along with best selling author and past guest Kim Scott.

Over the last several years, Russ served as the Chief People Officer at Qualtrics, and is now the Chief People Officer for the fast-growing venture capital firm, Goodwater Capital, where he is helping Goodwater and its portfolio companies to empower their people to do great work and be totally psyched while doing it. He’s the author of the book When They Win, You Win: Being a Great Manager Is Simpler Than You Think*.

It’s the job of every leader to give feedback. In this episode, Russ and I discuss what to say and what to avoid when giving feedback. Plus, we explore how to think about truth and the most effective ways to start and close feedback conversations in order to help everybody move forward.

• Avoid spending too much time talking about the impending conversation and just have the conversation.
• Use language like this: “I think I’m seeing some behavior that I believe is getting in your way. Are you in a spot where you can hear that right now?”
• Use the framework of situation, behavior/work, and impact in order to organize your feedback.
• Invite dialogue by asking: “What are your thoughts about that?”
• Avoid framing feedback discussions around “the truth” — there are always multiple truths in every discussion like this. You are offering them what you see.

• When They Win, You Win: Being a Great Manager Is Simpler Than You Think* by Russ Laraway
• When They Win, You Win website

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• Three Steps to Soliciting Feedback, with Tom Henschel (episode 107)
• Three Steps to Great Career Conversations, with Russ Laraway (episode 370)
• How to Balance Care and Accountability When Leading Remotely, with Jonathan Raymond (episode 464)
• How to Reduce Bias in Feedback, with Therese Huston (episode 510)

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Mollie West Duffy is an expert in organizational design, development, and leadership coaching. She previously was an organizational design lead at global innovation firm IDEO. She’s helped advise and coach leaders and founders at companies including Casper, Google, LinkedIn, Bungalow, and Slack. She’s experienced in designing talent processes and systems, as well as organizational structures and behaviors, cultural values, and learning and development programs.

She’s written for Harvard Business Review, Fast Company, Entrepreneur, Quartz, and other digital outlets. She co-founded the Capital Good Fund, Rhode Island’s first microfinance fund. She is the co-author with Liz Fosslien of the Wall Street Journal bestseller No Hard Feelings: The Secret Power of Embracing Emotions at Work and now their second book Big Feelings: How To Be Okay When Things Are Not Okay*.

We’ve all heard the well-intended advice that we should not compare ourselves to others. In this conversation, Mollie and I explore why that’s almost impossible to do and how we can cooperate a bit more with the inevitable and make our comparisons more useful. We highlight some of the key ways that comparison can help us and where leaning in may actually be useful in your own happiness and development.

• It’s a myth that the less you compare yourself to others, the better. Often, the opposite is true: we don’t compare ourselves enough.
• We tend to compare our weaknesses to other people’s strengths. Finding ways to curate our inputs is often much more useful.
• Shifting from malicious envy to benign envy is helpful. Thoughts such as “I’m inspired by what they’ve done…” or “I haven’t done what they’ve done…yet,” can move us to a healthier place.
• We see the best of people on social media. It’s helpful to piece together the missing footage by comparing some of the nitty gritty.
• Compare present you against past you.

• Big Feelings: How To Be Okay When Things Are Not Okay* by Liz Fosslien and Mollie West Duffy
• How to Manage Your Anger at Work by Liz Fosslien and Mollie West Duffy

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• Four Steps to Get Unstuck and Embrace Change, with Susan David (episode 297)
• What to Do With Your Feelings, with Lori Gottlieb (episode 438)
• How to Reduce Burnout, with Jennifer Moss (episode 561)

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Nick Timiraos has been the chief economics correspondent at The Wall Street Journal since 2017, where he is responsible for covering the Federal Reserve and other major developments in U.S. economic policy. He joined the Journal in 2006 and previously covered the 2008 presidential election.

He wrote about U.S. housing markets and the mortgage industry as a reporter based in New York. His coverage included the government’s response to the foreclosure crisis and the takeover of finance companies Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Nick is the author of Trillion Dollar Triage: How Jay Powell and the Fed Battled a President and a Pandemic — and Prevented Economic Disaster*.

Some of Federal Reserve Chair Jerome “Jay” Powell’s core skills have helped him navigate difficult stakeholders:

• He’s highly regarded as a good listener with excellent emotional intelligence.
• He’s intentional about creating strong teams and espoused the value of teamwork regularly.
• He is mindful of daily events, but is always playing the long game.
• He speaks in plain language that makes sense to many people, regardless of their education level.

Specifically, four unwritten rules of dealing with a difficult stakeholder like Donald Trump emerged in Nick’s analysis of Jay Powell’s public appearances:

1. Don’t talk about Trump.
2. When provoked, don’t return fire.
3. Stick to the economy, not politics.
4. Develop allies outside the Oval Office.

• Trillion Dollar Triage: How Jay Powell and the Fed Battled a President and a Pandemic — and Prevented Economic Disaster* by Nick Timiraos
• Nick Timiraos website

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• How to Listen When Someone Is Venting, with Mark Goulston (episode 91)
• How to Handle a Boss Who’s a Jerk, with Tom Henschel (episode 164)
• The Way Out of Major Conflict, with Amanda Ripley (episode 529)

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Frederic is the author of Reinventing Organizations: A Guide to Creating Organizations Inspired by the Next Stage of Human Consciousness*. The book is a global word-of-mouth bestseller with over 850,000 copies sold in 20 languages. Frederic’s work has inspired the founders of Extinction Rebellion, the Sunrise Movement, and Project Drawdown, as well as countless corporate leaders and faith movements. In a past life, he was an associate principal with McKinsey & Company. He’s also the creator of the Insights for the Journey video series.

In this conversation, Frederic and I explore a place where almost every leader can have a meaningful impact: helping people show up as their whole selves. We discuss how critical it is for leaders to lead the way in doing this — and how storytelling can be an important entry point. We look at some of the practical actions leaders can take to enter into a place of wholeness, including elevating beyond content, using everyday language, and integrating with the work at hand.

• As a leader, wholeness begins with you. Exploring wholeness yourself sets the stage for everyone else to be able to engage more fully.
• Rather than talking lots about wholeness, it’s often helpful just to begin modeling it. When you do, everyday language us useful to help others engage.
• Your personal history, the history of the organization, and the organization’s purpose are often helpful stories to share that open up a space for wholeness.
• You can turn any conversation into a moment of wholeness. One invitation for leaders is to stop talking about content and elevate the dialogue to “what’s happening” overall.
• Resist any temptation to disconnect wholeness from the work at hand. Bringing these together helps people to show up at work more authentically.

• Reinventing Organizations: A Guide to Creating Organizations Inspired by the Next Stage of Human Consciousness* by Frederic Laloux
• Reinventing Organizations: An Illustrated Invitation to Join the Conversation on Next-Stage Organizations* by Frederic Laloux
• Insights for the Journey video series by Frederic Laloux

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• The Way to Stay Grounded, with Parker Palmer (episode 378)
• How to Be More Inclusive, with Stefanie Johnson (episode 508)
• The Path Towards Trusting Relationships, with Edgar Schein and Peter Schein (episode 539)
• End Imposter Syndrome in Your Organization, with Jodi-Ann Burey (episode 556)

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Tom Henschel of Essential Communications grooms senior leaders and executive teams. As an internationally recognized expert in the field of workplace communications and self-presentation, he has helped thousands of leaders achieve excellence through his work as an executive coach and his top-rated podcast, The Look & Sound of Leadership.

In this conversation, Tom and I explore the sometimes awkward moment of needing to get buy-in from your manager on a next step, proposal, or funding. We detail three considerations and how attention to them can help you frame this conversation better. Plus, we share tactics such as making the business case, telling a story, and past interactions — in order to help you get forward movement.

• Three lenses of consideration are helpful when considering how to pitch you manager: purpose, preference, and protocol.
• When framing your purpose in making a pitch, it’s helpful to be able to change altitude. Consider “clicking out” on a map to frame the bigger picture.
• To be purposeful, make sure you are making the business case for whatever you are pitching. Anger and emotion can be sentinels that you might not have moved past thinking about it personally or framed the business context fully.
• Consider past interactions with your manager on how they prefer to receive information. The way you pitch them should begin with their preferences, not yours.
• Get intel in advance from other stakeholders, if practical. They can help you see the variables that might be clouding your judgement if you’re too close to the situation.
• Clearly frame the problem and examples of it. Consider strutting your pitch in the framework of The Want, The Obstacle, and The Resolution (see PDF below).

• Storytelling: A Three-Part Model by Tom Henschel (PDF download)

• How to Start Managing Up, with Tom Henschel (episode 433)
• The Way to Influence Executives, with Nancy Duarte (episode 450)
• The Way to Make Sense to Others, with Tom Henschel (episode 518)

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Bonni is the host of the Teaching in Higher Ed podcast, Dean of Teaching and Learning and Professor of Business and Management at Vanguard University, and my life partner. Prior to her academic career, she was a human resources consultant and executive officer for a publicly traded company. Bonni is the author of The Productive Online and Offline Professor: A Practical Guide*.

• Allison asked for resources on how to lead others who are more knowledgeable than you in the field of work.
• Everett wondered how he can navigate a situation where accents make it difficult to understand interview candidates.
• Stephen asked about motivating people independent of incentives.

• The Empowered Manager: Positive Political Skills at Work* by Peter Block
• Drive* by Daniel Pink
• Effective Delegation of Authority: A (Really) Short Book for New Managers About How to Delegate Work Using a Simple Delegation Process* by Hassan Osman
• The Coaching Habit* by Michael Bungay Stanier
• Humble Leadership* by Edgar Schein and Peter Schein
• HBO Max Presents Brené Brown: Atlas of the Heart
• Leading with Dignity: How to Create a Culture That Brings Out the Best in People* by Donna Hicks
• On the folly of rewarding A while hoping for B by Steven Kerr

• How to Improve Your Coaching Skills, with Tom Henschel (episode 190)
• How to Motivate People, with Dan Ariely (episode 282)
• The Path of Humble Leadership, with Edgar Schein and Peter Schein (episode 363)
• Effective Delegation of Authority, with Hassan Osman (episode 413)
• Start Finding Overlooked Talent, with Johnny Taylor, Jr. (episode 544)

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David Novak is Co-Founder, retired Chairman and CEO of Yum! Brands, the world’s largest restaurant company with over 45,000 restaurants in more than 135 countries and territories. During his tenure as CEO, Yum! Brands became a global powerhouse, growing from $4 billion in revenue to over $32 billion. After retiring in 2016, he became Founder and CEO of David Novak Leadership, dedicated to developing leaders at every stage of life. David is also the host of the top-ranked podcast, How Leaders Lead and founder of the leadership development platform of the same name.

An expert on leadership and recognition culture, David is also a New York Times bestselling author. His books include Taking People With You: The Only Way to Make Big Things Happen, O GREAT ONE! A Little Story About the Awesome Power of Recognition, and his latest book with Jason Goldsmith, Take Charge of You: How Self Coaching Can Transform Your Life and Career*.

In this conversation, David and I discuss the importance of finding joy in our careers. David highlights several of the key questions that he utilizes when helping others to uncover how joy can show up their work. He encourages us to surface the single biggest thing that’s important right now in order to get immediate traction.

• Sometimes your best (and only) coach is yourself.
• Use joy as your destination finder.
• Find your joy blockers by asking yourself: what’s getting in the way of my joy? Your worst days often provide insight on this.
• Discover your joy builders by asking yourself: what would grow your joy personal and professionally? Your most memorable days are starting points for answers here.
• Your goal is to surface your single biggest thing. This changes over time, but ideally is only one thing, one at a time. That’s how you gain traction.

• Take Charge of You: How Self Coaching Can Transform Your Life and Career* by David Novak and Jason Goldsmith

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• How to Find Your Calling, with Ken Coleman (episode 352)
• Align Your Work With Your Why, with Kwame Marfo (episode 542)
• How to Nail a Job Transition, with Sukhinder Singh Cassidy (episode 555)

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Whitney Johnson is CEO of the tech-enabled talent development company Disruption Advisors, an Inc. 5000 fastest-growing private company in America. As one of the top ten business thinkers in the world as named by Thinkers50, Whitney is an expert at smart growth leadership. She has worked at FORTUNE 100 companies, and as an award-winning equity analyst on Wall Street.

Whitney co-founded the Disruptive Innovation Fund with the late Clayton Christensen. She has coached alongside Marshall Goldsmith, selected by him in 2017 as a Top 15 Coach out of a pool of more than 17,000 candidates. She is the author of Disrupt Yourself and the host of the podcast of the same name. She is also the author of Smart Growth: How to Grow Your People to Grow Your Company*.

In this conversation, Whitney and I explore a big reality of growth; it’s often slow at the start. We discuss three practical steps that leaders can take for both themselves and others to stay engaged during the early stages of growth.

• Auditing some of your roles, secrets, beliefs, values, and boundaries will help you move forward along the growth path.
• Listen to the stories that others tell and help them link past experiences with what’s important today.
• Images are a critical entry point to growth. Utilize them in addition to the new behavior itself to begin to frame your thinking and identity.
• Circle back after receiving feedback and show others what you’ve learned from it and how it’s changed your behavior. That motivates them to stay invested.
• Use “I am” statements that have a noun rather than a verb. Instead of “I run,” consider saying, “I am a runner.”

• Smart Growth: How to Grow Your People to Grow Your Company* by Whitney Johnson

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

• How to Become the Person You Want to Be, with James Clear (episode 376)
• How to Motivate Leaders, with John Maxwell (episode 452)
• How to Win the Long Game When the Short-Term Seems Bleak, with Dorie Clark (episode 550)

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David Novak is Co-Founder and the retired Chairman and CEO of Yum! Brands, the world’s largest restaurant company. During his tenure as CEO, Yum! Brands became a global powerhouse, growing from $4 billion in market cap to over $32 billion. After retiring in 2016, he became Founder and CEO of David Novak Leadership, dedicated to developing leaders at every stage of life. He is the author of How Leaders Learn: Master the Habits of the World’s Most Successful People.

One element of powerful leadership is bringing different people and ideas together to create something entirely new. In this conversation, David and I discuss how leaders can use pattern thinking to create new value. Plus, we explore why active learning is so critical for successful leadership.

• Pattern thinking is 1+1 = 3. Create something bigger than its parts by pairing things not related to make something new.
• Be curious about the world by being an active learner. Use books, travel, listening, and hobbies to come across insights you wouldn’t normally see.
• Active learners seek out patterns proactively in order to create something new.

Questions to ask yourself:

The last time you came up with an especially creative idea or solution, what was your inspiration? What pattern were you applying and where had you discovered it?

How much time do you spend exploring outside your usual work and life experiences? Where are you getting exposure to different disciplines or industries?

Think of a challenge you’re facing or a problem you’ve been struggling to solve? Have you looked for patterns or ideas from unusual sources yet? If not, where could you turn next?

• How Leaders Learn: Master the Habits of the World’s Most Successful People by David Novak

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• How to Solve the Toughest Problems, with Wendy Smith (episode 612)
• Better Ways to Lead Brainstorming, with Jeremy Utley (episode 630)
• Doing Better Than Zero Sum-Thinking, with Renée Mauborgne (episode 641)

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Richard Rierson has over 30 years of real-world, practical leadership experience as a United States Marine Corps officer, professional aviator, and corporate executive. His philosophy is that our leadership challenges should be met with the lifelong dedication and pursuit of becoming composed, confident, consistent, courageous, and compassionate.

In addition to being a sought after speaker, coach, and consultant, he is the host of the Dose of Leadership podcast. He’s also a commercial airline pilot, currently flying as a first officer on the Boeing 787 Dreamliner.

In this conversation, Richard and I explore how professional aviation emerged from the accidents of the 1970’s to improve challenging authority inside the cockpit. We discuss the principles of crew resource management (CRM) and how more structure and intention between crew members vastly reduced the number of aviation accidents. We examine what leaders can do to use similar principles to support appropriately challenging authority inside their organizations.

• Almost every accident is a chain of events. The key is to have self awareness in the chain and to interrupt it.
• Making the invitation to challenge before the work begins makes it far more likely that another party will speak up when they see something.
• Pilots use green, yellow, and red as simple and immediate indicator to others in the cockpit how much stress they are holding.
• Three steps are use to pilots to escalate challenging a more senior pilot: ask a question, make a suggestion, take control i.e. “my aircraft.”

• Sully with Tom Hanks
• The Crash of Flight 401, and the Lessons for Your Company by Dave Yarin
• The Evolution of Airline Crew Resource Management by Jean Dennis Marcellin

• The Way to Turn Followers Into Leaders, with David Marquet (episode 241)
• How to Deal with Opponents and Adversaries, with Peter Block (episode 328)
• How to Talk to People Who Have Power, with Jordan Harbinger (episode 343)
• How to Use Power Responsibly, with Vanessa Bohns (episode 551)

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Deepa is the co-founder of nFormation, a company which provides a brave, safe, and new space for professionals who are women of color. She spent more than twenty years at Deloitte and was a first herself: an Indian American woman and one of the youngest people to make partner in the company’s history.

In her time there, she helped grow Deloitte’s Social Impact Practice, served as a National Managing Partner of Inclusion, and served as the Managing Partner of WIN—the firm’s renowned program to recruit, retain, and advance women.

Deepa speaks extensively on women and leadership. She has been featured at national conferences and in publications including Bloomberg BusinessWeek, The Huffington Post, and Harvard Business Review. She is the author of The First, The Few, The Only: How Women of Color can Redefine Power in Corporate America*.

• The corporate space has not fostered true equity. Often, many of us don’t see the systemic examples each day of friction.
• “We can’t find you,” is an often believed delusion when companies intend to attract more women of color.
• “I don’t see color,” is often a well-intended belief, but in practice often marginalizes the lives experiences of women of color.
• “DEI will fix it all,” is an illusion. We all should be supporting peers in formal DEI roes to volunteer, show up, and be key partners in the work that benefits all of you.
• “You got white-manned,” reflects the belief that the world has to be a zero-sum competition.

• The First, The Few, The Only: How Women of Color can Redefine Power in Corporate America* by Deepa Purushothaman

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

• Start Finding Overlooked Talent, with Johnny Taylor, Jr. (episode 544)
• The Way Managers Can be Champions for Justice, with Minda Harts (episode 552)
• Overcome Resistance to New Ideas, with David Schonthal (episode 557)

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Nate Zinsser is an expert in the psychology of human performance. He has been at the forefront of applied sport psychology for over thirty years. He has been a regular consultant to the Philadelphia Flyers and New York Giants as well as a consultant for the FBI Academy, the U.S. Army World Class Athlete Program, the U.S. Army Recruiting Command, and the U.S. Army Marksmanship Unit.

Since 1992 he has directed a cutting edge applied sport psychology program at the United States Military Academy’s Center for Enhanced Performance, personally conducting over seventeen thousand individual training sessions and seven hundred team training sessions for cadets seeking the mental edge for athletic, academic, and military performance. His most recent book is titled The Confident Mind: A Battle-Tested Guide for Unshakable Performance*.

In this conversation, Nate and I explore the reality that almost every leader faces: continual challenges to our own confidence. We examine some of the misconceptions around confidence and how those misperceptions tend to limit us. Then, we discuss the most effective practices you can use to maintain — and improve — the confidence that you’ve already built.

• It’s a misconception that once you become confident, you’ll stay that way forever.
• Confidence has little to do with what happens to you and tons to do with how you think about what happens to you.
• For a more constructive attitude when bad things happen, use these three elements: decide that it’s temporary, limited, and non-representative.
• To win the battle with your own negative thinking, acknowledge the negativity, silence it, and then replace it with something better to get the last word.
• Protecting your confidence is an ongoing practice. You’ll never stop doing it — but the good news is that it will give you an edge if you can develop this practice.

• The Confident Mind: A Battle-Tested Guide for Unshakable Performance* by Nate Zinsser

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

• The Way to Make Sense to Others, with Tom Henschel (episode 518)
• How to Build Confidence, with Katy Milkman (episode 533)
• How to Speak Up, with Connson Locke (episode 546)

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Keith Ferrazzi is the founder and chairman of Ferrazzi Greenlight, a management consulting and coaching company that works to transform many of the largest organizations and governments in the world. A graduate of Harvard Business School, Keith rose to become the youngest chief marketing officer of a Fortune 500 company during his career at Deloitte and later became CMO and head of sales at Starwood Hotels.

He has contributed to Harvard Business Review, Forbes, Fortune, and The Wall Street Journal and is The New York Times number one bestselling author of Who’s Got Your Back, Never Eat Alone, and Leading Without Authority. He is the co-author with Kian Gohar and Noel Weyrich of Competing in the New World of Work: How Radical Adaptability Separates the Best from the Rest*.

In this conversation, Keith and I discuss what his team and him have learned from the most resilient teams they’ve supported. We explore some of the most useful strategies to build a more resilient team and highlight key actions that will help leaders and teams through challenging times.

• Resilient teams have compassion and empathy for each other. They show care through both success and failure.
• Humility is the ability to ask for help. Resilient teams have a culture that supports and encourages this.
• Many leaders espouse candor for their teams, but far less actually have teams with candor. Resilient teams speak truth — and it’s up to leaders to show them the way.
• Resourceful teams develop solutions at a higher velocity. They use systems and structures to move past challenges and doubts more quickly.

• Competing in the New World of Work* by Keith Ferrazzi, Kian Gohar, and Noel Weyrich
• 7 Strategies to Build a More Resilient Team*

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

• How Great Teams Find Purpose, with David Burkus (episode 481)
• Leadership Means You Go First, with Keith Ferrazzi (episode 488)
• How to Engage Remote Teams, with Tsedal Neeley (episode 537)

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Cassandra Worthy enables organizations and individuals to grow through major change and significant shift by harnessing the power of emotion. Whether undergoing a merger, acquisition, start-up, explosive growth, or significant contraction, the strategies and tools of Change Enthusiasm are motivating and energizing workforces worldwide. Her consulting firm was birthed from the pain and challenges she overcame as a corporate executive.

Cassandra’s client base spans the Fortune 500, including Procter & Gamble, Allstate, Jones Lang LaSalle, Centene Corporation, ConferenceDirect, and WeWork. She’s a chemical engineer by training and also brings over a decade of M&A experience distilled down into the critical leadership traits required to lead with exception during times of change and trans-formation. She’s the author of Change Enthusiasm: How to Harness the Power of Emotion for Leadership and Success*.

In this conversation Cassandra and I explore the critical importance of emotion in the change process. We detail some of the key places where leaders often miss opportunities to prioritize employee well-being. Then, Cassandra shares some practical steps leaders can take that will help employees better recognize signal emotions so they can eventually find opportunity and choice during the change process.

• Many leaders tend to diminish or ignore negative emotions during change. Actively doing that may prevent employees in getting to a place where they see opportunity — and eventually choice.
• Beware focusing too much attention on vision, roles, and responsibilities — and not enough on employee well-being and fulfillment.
• The change process is like driving in a car. The structure of the process is the vehicle itself and the people are their fuel.
• Have discussion about handling change a regular item in 1:1 agendas and team meetings.
• Leaders can enter into the opportunity that change provides by sharing their own emotions. One way to do this is to be explicit in conversation about what is genuinely inspiring you about the change.

• Change Enthusiasm: How to Harness the Power of Emotion for Leadership and Success* by Cassandra Worthy

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

• How to Build Psychological Safety, with Amy Edmondson (episode 404)
• The Way Innovators Get Traction, with Tendayi Viki (episode 512)
• Overcome Resistance to New Ideas, with David Schonthal (episode 557)

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Hassan Osman is a director at Cisco Systems (his views are his own) where he leads a team of project and program managers on delivering complex projects across the world. He’s also served as a management consultant at EY, where he led projects and programs for the largest enterprises.

Hassan the author of several Amazon bestselling books about team management, including his most recent book, Hybrid Work Management: How to Manage a Hybrid Team in the New Workplace*.

In this conversation, Hassan and I examine the new reality and popularity of the hybrid workforce. Many leaders are now managing teams that are both co-located and remote, with individual team members regularly migrating between the two. We explore useful practices that will help you support effective teamwork and progress, regardless of physical location.

• Recent statistics from many sources are indicating that a majority of employees desire (and are beginning to expect) some kind of hybrid work arrangement.
• Lead with a remote first culture so that there isn’t a two-tier class of employees in your organization.
• Conduct all meetings online, regardless of the location of attendees. Use technology to provide a seamless experience whether somebody is co-located or remote.
• Batch meetings together and, if possible, align work days to allow from in person interactions, when ideal.
• Be cognizant of offline decisions. Involve remote employees in conversation that start offline and inform them about updates and decisions that might have occurred outside virtual interactions.

• Hybrid Work Management: How to Manage a Hybrid Team in the New Workplace* by Hassan Osman
• Hybrid Work Management: How to Manage a Hybrid Team (Udemy course)
• The Couch Manager (Hassan’s site)

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

• Effective Delegation of Authority, with Hassan Osman (episode 413)
• Transitioning to Remote Leadership, with Tammy Bjelland (episode 509)
• How to Engage Remote Teams, with Tsedal Neeley (episode 537)
• Hyflex Learning (Teaching in Higher Ed podcast)

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Sarah Stein Greenberg is the Executive Director of the Stanford d.school. She leads a community of designers, faculty, and other innovative thinkers who help people unlock their creative abilities and apply them to the world. She speaks regularly at universities and global conferences on design, business, and education.

Sarah holds an MBA from Stanford’s Graduate School of Business and also serves as a trustee for global conservation organization Rare. She is the author of the book Creative Acts for Curious People: How to Think, Create, and Lead in Unconventional Ways*.

In this conversation, Sarah and I discuss the reality that all of us face with real learning: uncomfortable struggle. We detail some of the typical pattens that occur with struggle and how we can almost predict it at certain points. Plus, we discussed what Sarah and her colleagues have discovered about we can do to make the most of the struggles we regularly face.

• Part of the process of creativity almost always feels terrible. The “trough of despair” is hard, but also essential.
• Struggle helps us learn better. There’s a sweet spot between what you already know well and what seems impossible. That middle zone is productive struggle.
• It’s helpful to set expectations in advance when innovating or creating that discomfort is an indicator that you’re moving forward.
• When people are in the midst of struggle, shifting the focus from thinking and talking to actually doing can often illuminate the best, next step.
• Productive struggle often comes at predictable moments. When it does, scaffolding and models can help move us along to get to where we need to go.

• Creative Acts for Curious People: How to Think, Create, and Lead in Unconventional Ways* by Sarah Stein Greenberg

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• Growth Mindset Helps You Rise From the Ashes, with Jeff Hittenberger (episode 326)
• Help People Learn Through Powerful Teaching, with Pooja Agarwal (episode 421)
• The Value of Being Uncomfortable, with Neil Pasricha (episode 448)

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Michael F. Schein is the founder and president of MicroFame Media, a marketing agency that specializes in making ideabased companies famous in their industries. His writing has appeared in Fortune, Forbes, Inc., Psychology Today, and Huffington Post, and he is a speaker for international audiences spanning from the US to China. He is also the creator of the popular Hype Book Club, which provides regular recommendations of books about hype artists and hype strategies.

Michael is the author of The Hype Handbook: 12 Indispensable Success Secrets From the World’s Greatest Propagandists, Self-Promoters, Cult Leaders, Mischief Makers, and Boundary Breakers*.

In this conversation, Michael and I explore his research on hype and how we can benefit from lessons throughout the history of human influence. We examine what we can learn from both positive and negative examples to discover how to brand ourselves better. Michael then invites us to frame the messaging about our own work to align with these human tendencies though a lens of genuine care and authenticity.

• We’ve evolved through history to seek guidance from those who appear miraculous.
• Surprise and worthiness are two indicators of what people perceive as miraculous vs. simply chance.
• The elements of your narrative are faders on a mixing board. Raise and lower different elements of the story to get the right mix.
• Make a list of strengths and weaknesses and don’t mention your weaknesses for a week.
• Reframe how some of your weakness might be strengths.
• Develop your story using the elements of theatre.

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• The Four Critical Stories Leaders Need For Influence, with David Hutchens (episode 148)
• Get Noticed Without Selling Out, with Laura Huang (episode 480)
• How to Actually Get Traction From Leadership Books, with Nicol Verheem (episode 549)

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Ruth Gotian has been hailed by the journal Nature and Columbia University as an expert in mentorship and leadership development. In 2021, she was selected as one of 30 people worldwide to be named to the Thinkers50 Radar List, where she was described as a “Prolific mentor and educator, leading important research into the secrets of success.” She is a semi-finalist for the Forbes 50 Over 50 list and has coached and mentored hundreds of people throughout her career.

In addition to being published in academic journals, Ruth is a contributor to Forbes and Psychology Today, where she writes about optimizing success. She is the Chief Learning Officer in Anesthesiology and former Assistant Dean of Mentoring and Executive Director of the Mentoring Academy at Weill Cornell Medicine, where she is a faculty member. Ruth is the author of The Success Factor: Developing the Mindset and Skillset for Peak Business Performance*.

In this conversation, Ruth and I discuss how leaders can genuinely connect with (and retain) their top performers. We explore the difference these employees make in organizations and what’s unique about how they approach work and their careers. Ruth then suggests a number of practical steps to engage high performers genuinely to develop them well and benefit the entire organization.

• High achievers can produce up to 400 percent more than the average employee.
• Promotions, diplomas, and awards may be starting points for high performers, but they are not ending points. Leading high performers well requires you to align with their intrinsic motivation.
• Offer high performers opportunities for exposure with visibility to senior leadership, strengths assignments, and decision-making.
• Provide autonomy to high performers. For them, the chase is as exciting as the win. They fear not trying more than failing.
• Recognize that internal professional development programs may not be sufficient for the demands of high performers. Support external opportunities they identify and connect with them during and after those experiences to further their learning (and yours).

• How to maximize the benefit of sending high achievers to conferences

• The Success Factor: Developing the Mindset and Skillset for Peak Business Performance* by Ruth Gotian

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• Six Ways Teaching Adults is Different than Teaching Kids (episode 3)
• What High Performers Aren’t Telling You, with Scott Anthony Barlow (episode 466)
• How to Multiply Your Impact, with Liz Wiseman (episode 554)

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Amishi Jha is Director of Contemplative Neuroscience and Professor of Psychology at the University of Miami. With grants from the Department of Defense and several private foundations, she leads research on the neural bases of attention and the effects of mindfulness-based training programs on cognition, emotion, resilience, and performance in education, corporate, elite sports, first-responder, and military contexts.

She launched the first-ever study to offer mindfulness training to active duty military service members as they prepared for deployment. Her work has been featured in many outlets including TED, NPR, and Mindful Magazine. In addition, she has been invited to present her work to NATO, the UK Parliament, the Pentagon, and at the World Economic Forum. She is the author of Peak Mind: Find Your Focus, Own Your Attention, Invest 12 Minutes a Day*.

In this conversation, Amishi and I explore the importance of our attention and why harnessing it is essential for leaders. We dive into the neuroscience and how our brain is similar to a computer in how much we can hold at one time. Plus, Amishi provides us several practical starting points if we wish to do a better job of placing our attention in the most useful places.

• Attention is powerful, fragile, and trainable.
• Our working memory is like the RAM inside a computer — there’s only so much we can hold at a time.
• You experience what’s in your working memory, even if that doesn’t correlate to what’s right in front of you.
• If your working memory is full, it blocks the ability to encode or whatever you are trying to learn.
• A key tactic is to be aware of what’s in your working memory — and what you choose not to rewrite.
• Mindfulness practice can provide the white space for the space in our working memory that we need.

• Peak Mind: Find Your Focus, Own Your Attention, Invest 12 Minutes a Day* by Amishi Jha

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• How to Know What You Don’t Know, with Art Markman (episode 437)
• How to Be Present, with Dave Crenshaw (episode 511)
• Help Your Brain Learn, with Lisa Feldman Barrett (episode 513)

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Bonni is the host of the Teaching in Higher Ed podcast, Dean of Teaching and Learning and Professor of Business and Management at Vanguard University, and my life partner. Prior to her academic career, she was a human resources consultant and executive officer for a publicly traded company. Bonni is the author of The Productive Online and Offline Professor: A Practical Guide.

• Qasim asked our thoughts on how to break the busy cycle and actually get started with something important.
• Aruj wondered how to handle a tricky situation where colleagues are gossiping lots in the office.
• Alice has three great opportunities in front of her was curious our advice on how to decide between them.

• How to Decide by Annie Duke

• How to Start a Conversation With Anyone, with Mark Sieverkropp (episode 177)
• How to Deal with Opponents and Adversaries, with Peter Block (episode 328)
• The Way to Make Better Decisions, with Annie Duke (episode 499)
• The Power of Unlearning Silence, with Elaine Lin Hering (episode 678)

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Tiziana Casciaro is a professor of organizational behavior at the Rotman School of Management of the University of Toronto. Her research on interpersonal and organizational networks and power dynamics has received distinguished scientific achievement awards from the Academy of Management and has been covered in the New York Times, Washington Post, Financial Times, and many other outlets.

Tiziana advises organizations and professionals across industries and has been recognized by Thinkers50 as a management thinker most likely to shape the future of how organizations are managed and led. She is the author with Julie Battilana of Power, for All: How It Really Works and Why It’s Everyone’s Business*.

In this conversation, Tiziana and I explore the reality that many leaders face: the desire to discover what people want — but the challenge of actually determining this. Even when intentions are good, employees may not have the self-awareness to articulate what they what. We detail what the research shows us about what most people care about — and the practical steps we can all take in our organizations to surface this through familiarity and similarity.

• To be powerful in a relationship, it means having control over resources the other person values.
• Even if asked, people don’t always tell you what they need — either because they don’t trust you or because they aren’t self-aware.
• Much of the research literature concludes that almost all people have two basic needs: safety and self-esteem.
• To discover what people want, you need to earn trust. Competence and warmth two ways this happens. When forced to choose between the two, most people prefer warmth.
• To build warmth (and trust) use two key sources of interpersonal liking: familiarity and similarity.

The six resources that address our basic needs of safety and self-esteem:

• Material resources
• Morality
• Achievement
• Status
• Autonomy
• Affiliation

• Power, for All: How It Really Works and Why It’s Everyone’s Business* by Julie Battilana and Tiziana Casciaro
• Power, for All website

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• Three Steps to Great Career Conversations, with Russ Laraway (episode 370)
• How to Use Power Responsibly, with Vanessa Bohns (episode 551)
• How to Reduce Burnout, with Jennifer Moss (episode 561)

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Sönke Ahrens is the creator of Take Smart Notes, a project dedicated to helping students, academics and nonfiction writers get more done – ideally with more fun and less effort. He has spent years researching and experimenting with different note-taking systems and his settled on a methodology called Zettlekasten.

Sönke is a writer, coach, and academic — and also the author of the bestselling book, How to Take Smart Notes: One Simple Technique to Boost Writing, Learning and Thinking – for Students, Academics and Nonfiction Book Writers*.

In this conversation, Sönke and I discuss how to move past the practice of simply reading and highlighting by beginning to seek meaning. We explore how you might create a system for doing this and how external scaffolding can help. Plus, we explain what notes might look like and how you can use them for an ongoing conversation with yourself — and perhaps others.

• Move past details and look for meaning.
• As we become familiar with something, we may start believing we understand it.
• Real thinking requires external scaffolding.
• It’s not so much about saving information, but in making connections between the information.
• Your notes need not be long or numerous, but should spark (and continue) future conversations with yourself.

• How to Take Smart Notes: One Simple Technique to Boost Writing, Learning and Thinking – for Students, Academics and Nonfiction Book Writers* by Sönke Ahrens
• Take Smart Notes

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• How To Create a Personal Knowledge Management System, with Bonni Stachowiak (episode 129)
• Help People Learn Through Powerful Teaching, with Pooja Agarwal (episode 421)
• How to Use Cognitive Psychology to Enhance Learning (Teaching in Higher Ed)
• How to Enhance Your Credibility (audio course)

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Alisa Cohn has been named the Top Startup Coach in the World by the Thinkers50 Marshall Goldsmith Global Coaches Awards and has been coaching startup founders to grow into world-class CEOs for nearly 20 years. She was named the number one “Global Guru” of startups in 2021, and has worked with startup companies such as Venmo, Etsy, DraftKings, The Wirecutter, Mack Weldon, and Tory Burch. She has also coached CEOs and C-Suite executives at enterprise clients such as Dell, Hitachi, Sony, IBM, Google, and many more.

Marshall Goldsmith selected Alisa as one of his Marshall Goldsmith 100 Coaches – a gathering of the top coaches in the world – and Inc. named Alisa one of the top 100 leadership speakers. Her articles have appeared in Harvard Business Review, Forbes, and Inc. and she has been featured as an expert on Bloomberg TV, the BBC World News and in The New York Times. She is the author of From Start-Up to Grown-Up: Grow Your Leadership to Grow Your Business*.

In this conversation, Alisa and I discuss the difficult reality that most leaders need to face: saying goodbye to an employee. We detail the mindset you need in preparation for letting someone go. Alisa also helps us with specific language that will help you follow-though on a conversation and help everybody move on — and move forward.

• Our human tendency is often to side-step problems that we need to address.
• By the time you take action to fire somebody, you are likely months late.
• Just because someone was effective in the role previously (or in the last role) doesn’t mean their role is right for them today.
• It’s helpful to be prescriptive in conversations leading up to firing on exactly your expectations — and the actions the other party has agreed to.
• There’s no way to fire someone without it being awkward and painful. You’ll need to make peace with that before you take action.

• From Start-Up to Grown-Up: Grow Your Leadership to Grow Your Business* by Alisa Cohn

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• How to Challenge Directly and Care Personally, with Kim Scott (episode 302)
• How to Build Psychological Safety, with Amy Edmondson (episode 404)
• How to Balance Care and Accountability When Leading Remotely, with Jonathan Raymond (episode 464)

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Michael Bungay Stanier distills big, complex ideas into practical, accessible knowledge for everyday people so they can be a force for change. His books have sold over a million copies, and The Coaching Habit was a Wall Street Journal bestseller. His TEDx Talk on Taming Your Advice Monster has been viewed more than a million times.

Michael is the founder of Box of Crayons, a learning and development company that helps organizations transform from advice-driven to curiosity-led action. His new book is titled How to Begin: Start Doing Something That Matters*.

In this conversation, Michael and I discuss how to make progress when starting something new. We explore the value in looking back at what you’ve already done to support you on what’s next. Plus, Michael highlights the key principles in running effective experiments that transition into new practices.

• Fire bullets at the start. Then, fire cannonballs.
• Discover what your history reveals about your future self. It will open up a window to who you are that will help you when moving on something new.
• When experimenting, don’t make the experiment bigger or more complex than it needs to be.
• Avoid putting too much risk in the experiment or investing too much in its success.
• We have the most learning when we’re struggling with something.

• How to Begin by Michael Bungay Stanier
• How to Begin overview

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• The Way to Stop Rescuing People From Their Problems, with Michael Bungay Stanier (episode 284)
• How to Become the Person You Want to Be, with James Clear (episode 376)
• How to Nail a Job Transition, with Sukhinder Singh Cassidy (episode 555)

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Jennifer Moss is an award-winning journalist, author, and international public speaker. She is a nationally syndicated radio columnist, reporting on topics related to happiness and workplace well-being. She is also a freelance writer whose articles have appeared in HuffPost, Forbes, the Society for Human Resource Management, Fortune, and Harvard Business Review.

Jennifer’s prior book, Unlocking Happiness at Work, received the distinguished UK Business Book of the Year Award. She also sits on the Global Happiness Council. She is the author of The Burnout Epidemic: The Rise of Chronic Stress and How We Can Fix It*.

In this conversation, Jennifer and I explore a few misconceptions about burnout — and also how curiosity and empathy can help to reduce it. We discuss a few key questions leaders can ask to gain insight on how to help. Plus, we detail how to avoid confirmation bias through generic interactions.

• Self-care doesn’t cure burnout.
• Curiosity increases empathy — and empathy from leaders is a fabulous antidote to burnout.
• There are two kinds of curiosity, epistemic and perceptual. True empathy comes from a focus on epistemic interactions.
• Go beyond the generic, “How are you?” and instead get more specific with a request like, “Name a high — and a low.” Doing these with a team can help surface how to help.
• Assume the best. It’s ok to say, “Thank you for sharing this with me. I don’t have any advice. I just want to listen and learn.”

• The Burnout Epidemic: The Rise of Chronic Stress and How We Can Fix It* by Jennifer Moss

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• How to Build Psychological Safety, with Amy Edmondson (episode 404)
• What to Do With Your Feelings, with Lori Gottlieb (episode 438)
• Leadership Means You Go First, with Keith Ferrazzi (episode 488)

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Andrew Warner is an entrepreneur and host of the Startup Stories podcast, where he uncovers the secrets of the world’s best founders. Over the course of 2,000+ episodes, Andrew has interviewed everyone from Barbara Corcoran, to Gary Vaynerchuk, to the founders of Airbnb.

After building two startups of his own—one successful and one that failed—Andrew started Mixergy as a way to learn from other entrepreneurs. Today, Mixergy is a place where successful people teach ambitious upstarts through interviews, courses, masterclasses, and events. He is the author of Stop Asking Questions: How to Lead High-Impact Interviews and Learn Anything from Anyone*.

In this conversation, Andrew and I discuss what he’s learned about getting people to talk from thousands of hours of interviews and research. We explore some of the key tactics that he uses to help people open up in a genuine way. Plus, we discuss some common questions to avoid that may work against your goal to connect well with the other party.

• Help others get comfortable talking about themselves by revealing something about yourself first. They may not reciprocate immediately, but it often opens the door for future depth.
• Just a word or two can open up an entire new level of a conversation. Try using “Because?” or “How so?” as ways to hear more.
• People expect leaders to show up and have a direction for the conversation. Not everything needs to be phrased as a question — you may consider making requests like, “Tell me more,” to direct to conversation.
• Avoid asking questions that try to get people to articulate “most” or “best” answers. People spend too much mental bandwidth trying to rank-order instead of just engaging with the dialogue.
• When potentially uncomfortable situations come up, allow people an easy way out by giving them two paths they can go down.

• Stop Asking Questions: How to Lead High-Impact Interviews and Learn Anything from Anyone* by Andrew Warner

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• The Way to Have Conversations That Matter, with Celeste Headlee (episode 344)
• How to Ask Better Questions, with David Marquet (episode 454)
• Four Habits That Derail Listening, with Oscar Trimboli (episode 500)

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Muriel Wilkins is Managing Partner and Co-founder of Paravis Partners. She is a C-suite advisor and executive coach with a strong track record of helping already high performing senior leaders take their effectiveness to the next level. She is also the host of the Harvard Business Review podcast, Coaching Real Leaders and is the co-author, with Amy Su of Own the Room: Discover Your Signature Voice to Master Your Leadership Presence*.

Prior to entrepreneurship, she served on the senior team of U.S. News & World Report and also did marketing and strategy work at Accenture and The Prudential. Muriel has been recognized by the Washington Business Journal as one of Metro-DC area’s Top Minority Business Leaders.

In this conversation, Muriel and I reflect on our recent client work in order to surface some of the current struggles leaders are facing. We discuss a few trends we’re seeing in relation to diversity, the great resignation, binary thinking, and human relations. Plus, we make a few practical invitations to leaders in order to avoid some common missteps.

• Leaders are making the shift from explanation to inquiry in relations to diversity, equity, and inclusion. The next step for many leaders is to consider how they use their power to affect change to the system in the organization.
• Many leaders are considering the, “Should I stay or should I go?” question without the full context of impact and feeling. Begin by considering the impact you wish to have before making a major change.
• Beware the trap of binary thinking. Often leaders get fixated on “OR thinking” without considering the opportunity for “AND thinking.” If you catch yourself thinking in “ors” consider how you might bring in some “ands.”
• Leaders who inherently see value in people development can tend to write off other leaders who they see as only focused on the numbers. It’s helpful to realize that the larger objective is often shared, but style is different. Meet people on their terms with their language.

• Own the Room: Discover Your Signature Voice to Master Your Leadership Presence* by Muriel Wilkins
• Coaching Real Leaders podcast

• Enhance Your Executive Presence, with Muriel Wilkins (episode 272)
• The Way Out of Major Conflict, with Amanda Ripley (episode 529)
• How to Win the Long Game When the Short-Term Seems Bleak, with Dorie Clark (episode 550)
• How to Use Power Responsibly, with Vanessa Bohns (episode 551)

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Bonni is the host of the Teaching in Higher Ed podcast, Dean of Teaching and Learning and Professor of Business and Management at Vanguard University, and my life partner. Prior to her academic career, she was a human resources consultant and executive officer for a publicly traded company. Bonni is the author of The Productive Online and Offline Professor: A Practical Guide*.

• Lucus asked us for advice on his reading habits as he makes the transition to CEO.
• Elizabeth wondered the best way to address issues where experienced employees appear resentful about her giving them direction.
• Beth sent us a question about drawing the line between being a friend and a manager.

• 13 Crucial Books That Every Leader Should Know
• Drive* by Daniel Pink
• Readwise
• Day One
• Seven Principles for Leading People Older Than You, with Bonni Stachowiak (episode 59)
• How to Manage Former Peers, with Tom Henschel (episode 257)
• Three Steps to Great Career Conversations, with Russ Laraway (episode 370)

• Three Steps to Soliciting Feedback, with Tom Henschel (episode 107)
• How to Make Deep Work Happen, with Cal Newport (episode 233)
• Tie Leadership Development to Business Results, with Mark Allen (episode 435)
• How to Help People Thrive, with Jim Harter (episode 532)

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David Schonthal is an award-winning Professor of Strategy, Innovation & Entrepreneurship at the Kellogg School of Management where he teaches courses on new venture creation, design thinking, healthcare innovation and creativity. In addition to his teaching, he also serves as the Director of Entrepreneurship Programs and the Faculty Director of the Zell Fellows Program.

Along with his colleague Loran Nordgren, David is one of the originators of Friction Theory – a ground-breaking methodology that explains why even the most promising innovations and change initiatives often struggle to gain traction with their intended audiences – and what to do about it. He is the author with Loran of The Human Element: Overcoming the Resistance That Awaits New Ideas*.

In this conversation, David and I discuss how leaders can do a better job at helping others overcome resistance to a new idea. We explore the distinction between friction and fuel — and why leaders tend to miss opportunities to reduce friction. David also shares several, practical strategies that almost all of us can use to reduce the weight of friction with those we are trying to influence.

• When introducing something new, we tend to think more about fuel than we do about friction. Both are essential for traction.
• Repetition is missed opportunity in most organizations. Leaders tend to want to perfect the details too much.
• Start small with a beacon project to prototype the value change may bring to the organization.
• Leaning in on making a new idea prototypical will help it be more familiar to those you are trying to influence. Emphasize what is similar — not just what is new.
• Analogies can help bridge the gap between the new and the familiar. Use an analogy the audience can relate to.
• Adding an extreme option and/or an undesirable can help transform inertia from a friction into a fuel.

• The Human Element: Overcoming the Resistance That Awaits New Ideas* by Loren Nordgren and David Schonthal

• How to Succeed with Leadership and Management, with John Kotter (episode 249)
• How to Pivot Quickly, with Steve Blank (episode 476)
• The Way Innovators Get Traction, with Tendayi Viki (episode 512)

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Jodi-Ann Burey is a sought-after speaker and writer who works at the intersections of race, culture, and health equity. Her TED talk, “The Myth of Bringing Your Full Authentic Self to Work,” embodies her disruption of traditional narratives about racism at work. Jodi-Ann is also the creator and host of Black Cancer, a podcast about the lives of people of color through their cancer journeys.

She is the author, with Ruchika Tulshyan, of two recent Harvard Business Review articles: Stop Telling Women They Have Imposter Syndrome and End Imposter Syndrome in Your Workplace.

In this conversation, Jodi-Ann and I challenge that notion that imposter syndrome is something that an individual should address alone. Instead, we invite managers and organizations to begin to consider their own contributions to “imposter syndrome” and how we can work together with employees to help everybody move forward. We highlight several key actions that managers can take to begin to end imposter syndrome inside of their organizations.

• Managers and organizations tend to address the symptoms of imposter syndrome, but not the source.
• Those who experience imposter syndrome often feel like it is “death by a thousand paper cuts.”
• Managers can help by reinforcing an employee’s belief in their abilities and chances of success. Listen for what employees are asking for — and explore when they are silent.
• Managers should be transparent about an organization’s locked doors — and demonstrate that they are also willing to be vulnerable.
• In private conversations, managers should redirect perceptions and language that do not accurately reflect the value of their employees.

• Stop Telling Women They Have Imposter Syndrome by Jodi-Ann Burey and Ruchika Tulshyan
• End Imposter Syndrome in Your Workplace by Jodi-Ann Burey and Ruchika Tulshyan

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• Three Steps to Great Career Conversations, with Russ Laraway (episode 370)
• What You Gain By Sponsoring People, with Julia Taylor Kennedy (episode 398)
• The Way Managers Can be Champions for Justice, with Minda Harts (episode 552)

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Matt Abrahams is an educator, author, podcast host, and coach. He is a lecturer in Organizational Behavior at Stanford University’s Graduate School of Business and a keynote speaker and communication consultant for Fortune 100 companies. He is the host of the popular podcast Think Fast, Talk Smart and the author of Think Faster, Talk Smarter: How to Speak Successfully When You’re Put on the Spot*.

One of the most common places leaders get put on the spot is when facilitating a question and answer session. In this episode, Matt and I discuss the mindset, preparation, and steps that will help you answer questions with confidence and increase credibility with your audience.

• Many presenters think about a Q&A session like playing dodgeball. It’s more helpful to frame it as dialogue.
• Answering questions well allows you to project authenticity, expand on key points, and resolve objections.
• Use the ADD framework to respond to a question. A: answer the question, D: detail an example, and D: describe the value. If helpful, adjust the order.
• Set boundaries for the kinds of questions you’ll answer and the timeframe for them. The audience expects you to lead the conversation.
• Ask yourself a question if nobody else asks one first. This might start with, “A question I’m commonly asked…”
• End with an exclamation point. Sticking the landing provides you confidence and shows credibility to your audience.

• Think Faster, Talk Smarter: How to Speak Successfully When You’re Put on the Spot* by Matt Abrahams

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

• The Way to Influence Executives, with Nancy Duarte (episode 450)
• How to Rehearse Before a Presentation, with Jacqueline Farrington (episode 645)
• That’s a Great Question (Dave’s Journal)

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Sukhinder Singh Cassidy is a leading technology executive and entrepreneur, board member, and investor with twenty-five years of experience founding and helping to scale companies, including Google, Amazon, and Yodlee. Most recently, she served as president of StubHub, which thrived under her leadership and sold in 2020 right before the pandemic for $4+ billion.

She is the founder and chairman of the Boardlist and has been profiled in Fortune, Forbes, The Wall Street Journal, Business Week, and The New York Times, among others. She has been named one of Elle’s Power Women, one of the Most Creative People in Business by Fast Company, and one of the Top 100 People in the Valley by Business Insider. She is the author of Choose Possibility: Take Risks and Thrive (Even When You Fail)*.

In this conversation, Sukhinder and I discuss how to handle a transition in a way that works for both you and the organization you’re leaving. We discuss the value of proactive communication and clear timelines — plus some of the hidden costs of transitioning poorly. Finally, we made the invitation to consider transitions in the context of your long-term career goals.

• Don’t leave before you leave. Putting in maximum effort until you’re gone protects your reputation and the impact you’ve worked to achieve.
• Beware the cost of lingering. You likely know the right timeframe for your departure — use that to frame your transition.
• Leave opportunity in your wake. Use remaining time to set the team up for success, provide coaching and mentoring, and make it an easier transition for others.
• Tie up loose ends before you depart. Leave the team an organization in a place you would want to inherit if you were the new leader coming in.
• Take small steps, middle steps, and big steps. Avoid fixating on the myth of the single choice. Careers come together with many choices, over time.

• Choose Possibility: Take Risks and Thrive (Even When You Fail)* by Sukhinder Singh Cassidy

• How to Challenge Directly and Care Personally, with Kim Scott (episode 302)
• The Way to Make Better Decisions, with Annie Duke (episode 499)
• Making the Case for Your Promotion, with May Busch (episode 526)

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Liz Wiseman is a researcher and executive advisor. She is the author of the New York Times bestseller Multipliers: How the Best Leaders Make Everyone Smarter*, The Multiplier Effect: Tapping the Genius Inside Our Schools*, and Wall Street Journal bestseller Rookie Smarts*. She is the CEO of The Wiseman Group, a leadership research and development firm headquartered in Silicon Valley.

Her clients include: Apple, Disney, Facebook, Google, Microsoft, Tesla, Twitter, and many others. Liz has been listed on the Thinkers50 ranking and named one of the top 10 leadership thinkers in the world. She is a former Oracle executive, who worked over the course of 17 years as the Vice President of Oracle University and as the global leader for Human Resource Development.

Liz is the author of Impact Players: How to Take the Lead, Play Bigger, and Multiply Your Impact*. In this conversation, Liz and I discuss the mindset that’s most useful in making real traction in an organization. Plus, we explore practical steps that you can take to think bigger and get noticed for your work.

• The #1 thing managers appreciate: when employees do things that need doing without being asked.
• Upward empathy is the ability to consider what the bosses situation feels like — and what they need from you.
• Pursuing your passion sounds nice in a commencement speech, but can get in the way of what the organization actually needs.
• A job description might be a starting point, but it’s almost never the ending point.
• Beware of becoming the foosball player that does hard work in one spot, but misses the bigger picture. Become a nimble midfielder who plays where they are most needed.

• Impact Players: How to Take the Lead, Play Bigger, and Multiply Your Impact* by Liz Wiseman
• The Wiseman Group

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• The Benefit of Being a Rookie, with Liz Wiseman (episode 340)
• Influence Through Overlapping Networks, with Sandie Morgan (episode 422)
• How to Motivate Leaders, with John Maxwell (episode 452)
• Keep Your Ideas From Being Stolen (Dave’s Journal)

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David Hutchens helps leaders find and tell their stories. He works with leaders around the world to find, craft, and tell their most urgent stories for the purpose of creating shared meaning, preserving culture, disseminating learning, and speeding change in organizations.

He has taught the Storytelling Leader program at some of the most influential organizations — and he’s written many books, including the Circle of the 9 Muses* and The Leadership Story Deck*. He is the co-creator with longtime friend of the show Susan Gerke of the GO Team program. He’s also the author of the new book, Story Dash: Find, Develop, and Activate Your Most Valuable Business Stories…In Just a Few Hours*.

In this conversation, David and I revisit the power of storytelling and highlight where many leaders go wrong. We explore the common mistakes that David sees in his work all over the world. Plus, we invite listeners into a few practical actions that will help stories land with better impact.

Four mistakes that leaders make:

1. They are not storytelling, sometimes because they don’t see themselves as storytellers or feel like they are performing.
2. They don’t connect the story to the strategic intent but never clearly answering the “why am I telling this story?” question.
3. They avoid emotional content of stories because they either don’t want to be emotional or are presenting to a “numbers person.”
4. They expect it to just happen, instead of making intentional effort to make it happen.

• To receive David Hutchen’s Story Canvas, reach out to him at david@davidhutchens.com and tell him one valuable tip you gained from this episode.

Download my interview notes in PDF format (free membership required).

• The Four Critical Stories Leaders Need For Influence, with David Hutchens (episode 148)
• The Way to Influence Executives, with Nancy Duarte (episode 450)
• The Way to Earn Attention, with Raja Rajamannar (episode 521)

Activate your free membership for full access to the entire library of interviews since 2011, searchable by topic.