Explore every episode of the podcast Chain of Learning: Leadership Strategies for Transforming Culture, Developing People, and Getting Results
| Title | Pub. Date | Duration | |
|---|---|---|---|
| 88| When Urgency Isn't an Emergency: How to Choose When to Step In | 04 Nov 2026 | 00:23:52 | |
Stepping back is stepping up. But it's not stepping away. Every time I say that, I get the same question: aren't there times I should step in? And yes, there are. But far fewer times than you think. Or than you actually react to. When everything feels like a five-alarm fire, you step in. The immediate problem is fixed, but the root cause still remains. The next fire is ready to burn, and your people never build the confidence and problem-solving skills to solve the next problem without you. And every day becomes a crisis that needs you. How many of these fires are real emergencies? And what can you do to develop more fire preventers than firefighters in your organization? You’ll Learn:
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| 87| When Help Becomes Unhelpful: How Providing Support Develops People | 28 Oct 2026 | 00:21:45 | |
Help and support. Two words we use almost interchangeably. But do they mean the same thing? And does the distinction even matter? It does. Because your help can be the very thing that keeps someone from developing their own competence and confidence. You want people who are capable and confident to solve problems at every level, without needing you to do it for them. But the project gets done, or the problem gets solved, and the person still can't do it without you. And you find yourself unintentionally owning the responsibility of doing it all. Providing support is an essential part of people-centered leadership. You meet them where they're at, and keep the ownership where it belongs. You’ll Learn:
IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 03:35 How being the expert can take ownership away from others 04:45 The difference between providing help and support 05:55 Why ownership matters more than time or effort 07:20 When doing it yourself keeps your team dependent 08:05 Three responsibilities of leaders who develop people 09:15 When caring becomes carrying: The Doer Trap 11:45 Why productive struggle is essential for learning 12:55 When to let people struggle and when to step in 13:20 How AI can shortcut learning—or support deeper thinking 14:35 Why stepping in limits your leadership capacity 15:15 How to assess whether someone needs help or support 16:35 The power of asking instead of answering 17:15 The “Jedi mind trick” that helps people find their own answers 18:15 What providing support looks like in practice 20:05 One question to try in your next conversation | |||
| 86| Ask, Don't Tell: How Humble Inquiry Builds Deeper Connection [with Peter Schein] | 14 Oct 2026 | 01:01:49 | |
How do you build deeper human connection in your relationships so that you can more effectively lead change and help others? That question sits at the heart of some of the most influential books in my work, including Helping and Humble Inquiry by Edgar Schein: how we help, not as the expert with all the answers, but by asking better questions as a leader and creating the conditions for other people to develop their own ideas.
Peter spent 30 years in Silicon Valley in corporate strategy and development before partnering with his father to co-write seven books. He recently released the third edition of Humble Inquiry, continuing to bring these foundational ideas forward for how we lead, learn, and create change today. In this conversation, Peter and I explore how to move beyond transactional relationships to build genuine personal ones. We get underneath the meaning of many of the words we use today—curiosity, vulnerability, and psychological safety—and why seeking clarity gets you further than seeking certainty. You’ll Learn:
ABOUT MY GUEST:
IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 03:06 Transactional vs. relational leadership and why connection matters | |||
| 85| It's Not the Workload, It's the Thoughtload: Move from Overwhelm to Focus [with Liane Davey] | 30 Sep 2026 | 00:41:32 | |
Enter for your chance to win a copy of "Thoughtload" by Liane Davey: http://chainoflearning.com/85 Your team isn't resisting change. They don't have room for it. It's not just workload that's overwhelming us, it's what Liane Davey calls our "thoughtload": the invisible tax on our performance and presence.
Liane shares how to lighten the noise inside your head to focus your attention, work through what you're carrying emotionally, and get your energy back. Urgency, constant change, and the pressure to deliver aren't going away. But thoughtload is something you can manage, before it turns into leadership burnout for you or your team. You’ll Learn:
ABOUT MY GUEST: IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 03:00 Why it’s not the workload—it’s the thoughtload 06:00 How thoughtload undermines team performance 08:00 Why overwhelm shifts leaders from reflection to reaction 11:00 Three ways to manage your thoughtload 12:00 Why being productive doesn’t mean you’re effective 16:45 The problem with having too many priorities 19:00 How leaders can lighten their team’s thoughtload 20:45 Why your brain needs space to process, not more input 23:00 What change leaders miss about resistance 24:30 Why labeling people “change resistors” gets it wrong 29:30 How avoiding conflict makes your thoughtload heavier 32:30 Why managing thoughtload means saying no to good things 36:15 When changing direction is learning—not flip-flopping 37:25 What deserves to be in your thoughtload? | |||
| 84| You Want a People-Centered Learning Culture. What's Getting in the Way? | 16 Sep 2026 | 00:25:14 | |
People-centered. Learning organization. Culture of continuous improvement. We use a lot of different words to describe what we are trying to create. But do we actually mean the same thing? And if we all want it, what's stopping us from getting there? And what is the one thing that could have the biggest impact? So I asked. And you answered. Leaders and change practitioners around the world responded. There wasn't one shared definition or set of words for a people-centered learning culture. But the same essence was in almost every answer. The pressures we're all working in are real, and they're not going away. Yet the biggest impact comes from something we can influence: our own leadership behavior. And that starts with us.
IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 02:03 What leaders actually want from their teams 04:31 Why urgency gets in the way of developing people 06:17 How ego and leader behavior limit ownership 08:22 When fear makes it harder to speak up and learn 10:37 The biggest lever for creating a people-centered culture 12:35 Why we can’t wait for the system to change 14:08 How caring pulls us into the Doer Trap 15:47 What “respect for people” really means 17:28 What people-centered leadership looks like in practice 18:07 How learning happens through the work 20:49 What people need to solve their own problems 22:35 Start with what you can influence | |||
| 83| Keep Ownership at the Right Level: How to Sustain Organizational Transformation [with Anna Pessah] | 02 Sep 2026 | 00:41:17 | |
Overstepping ownership rarely looks like overstepping. It looks like moving things along. You know how something could be improved, so you give your suggestion. Work gets done, progress is visible, but the person you were there to develop doesn't build the capability they need, and the improvement doesn't sustain.
As a transformational change leader at Kaiser Permanente, Anna Pessah watches this play out every day with the internal consulting team she leads, and with the physician and operational leaders she supports. We break down this challenge and share the practices to use instead. Leaders don't need to stop helping or teaching. It's about getting clear about what each person owns, and adjusting how you help based on what that leader needs in the moment.
ABOUT MY GUEST: Anna Pessah leads the internal consulting team that oversees the operating system at the North Valley Service Area of Kaiser Permanente, where she coaches physician and operational leaders on strategy, management systems, and the behaviors that support a culture of improvement. She is an industrial engineer from the University of Michigan and an ICF-certified coach. Anna brings a blend of systems thinking, operational improvement, and leadership development to help leaders generate insight, turn goals into action, and build habits that stick. IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 03:16 Why change leaders struggle to keep ownership with leaders 05:22 When helping starts creating dependence 06:15 Building capability instead of becoming the bottleneck 07:12 Why doing more can make your job harder 09:23 Getting explicit about roles and ownership 11:25 Why new practices require reflection and adjustment 13:17 Making your leadership practices visible 16:03 How to give direction without taking over 22:16 What happens when leaders operate at the wrong level 24:05 The personal cost of staying in the weeds 25:30 Why helping can turn into overstepping 27:43 When coaching questions aren’t helpful 31:25 The power of listening—and leaving space 36:46 Why humility is essential to learning 38:18 Recognizing your own pull to control 39:06 Simple practices for keeping ownership where it belongs | |||
| 82| Connect the Parts, Focus on People: Inside the Toyota Economic System [with Olivier Larue] | 19 Aug 2026 | 00:57:22 | |
Profit or cash. Efficiency or flexibility. Speed, or doing it right.
You’ll Learn:
IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 05:14 Why call it the Toyota Economic System? 09:42 Profit vs. cash: the trade-off companies get wrong 12:32 Why Just-in-Time doesn’t mean zero inventory 16:30 What happens when company values and work conflict 20:20 Why leaders have to “earn” how they manage 21:42 Why Toyota’s seven wastes are in a specific order 23:38 The hidden cost of human waiting 27:20 Why leadership skills alone aren’t enough 30:05 Why organizations keep repeating the same problems 31:26 What Andon actually means for empowerment 35:17 The leadership response that makes problems safe to surface 39:16 Why Toyota can avoid layoffs during downturns 44:30 The unanswered question about AI and economic growth 48:30 How enthusiasm turns pull into push 50:44 Why isolated improvements don’t transform systems 54:35 Refusing the either/or trade-off | |||
| 81| Adapt How You Lead: Situational Leadership in Practice [with Suzie Bishop] | 05 Aug 2026 | 00:38:55 | |
Your leadership style isn't the problem. Your default is. The gap between how you're leading and what the person in front of you actually needs is one of the most common and most invisible places leaders get stuck. Most of us default to one mode and don't notice the mismatch until something breaks down. Suzie Bishop has spent over a decade at the Center for Leadership Studies helping leaders close that gap and strengthen their leadership effectiveness. Her new book, Situational Leadership, puts nearly sixty years of research into a practical framework for reading the situation, building leadership flexibility, and adapting your approach. Suzie walks through the four leadership styles, how to read what someone needs in a given situation, and how to adapt your approach to coach, develop leaders, and lead through influence. The best leaders don't pick one style and commit. They pause, assess the situation, and flex to have the impact you intend.
ABOUT MY GUEST: Suzie Bishop is VP of Product Development at The Center for Leadership Studies. She's a Certified Professional in Training Management, a Stakeholder Centered Coach, and a Marshall Goldsmith 100 Coach. Suzie is co-author of Situational Leadership: The Model for Leading Others, Navigating Change and Unlocking Performance and is currently writing her next book, Match: How to Meet Leaders Where They Are, with Marshall Goldsmith.
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 02:52 Why leadership is influence, not control 04:43 Creating the conditions without controlling 06:51 What Situational Leadership looks like in practice 07:35 Flexibility vs. adaptability: the critical difference 07:48 The four Situational Leadership styles 11:41 How to recognize your natural leadership tendency 13:08 When asking questions isn’t effective coaching 16:46 How to be directive without taking away ownership 17:37 The cost of not adapting how you lead 21:37 Why organizations need a common leadership language 24:05 Creating the conditions for people to ask for help 25:24 The leadership challenge even top executives struggle with 29:06 How to give direction without taking over 30:33 Influence versus control when you have authority 31:06 Three types of power that shape your influence 32:51 Why trust is your most important source of power 36:02 The difference between flexibility and adaptability 37:08 Practice an intention pause before you respond | |||
| 80| Bad News First: How a Leader's Response Builds a Culture of Learning [with Isao Yoshino] | 22 Jul 2026 | 00:44:29 | |
How many problems are actually visible in your organization? Research shows senior leaders see just 4%. The other 96% stay hidden — invisible, yet still there. And some aren't even recognized by employees as problems anymore, because they have become the norm. We all say we want psychological safety. But you don't get it by saying you want it. People-centered leadership is about creating conditions for people to speak up and highlight issues by how you, and leaders across your system, respond. Recorded live with a group of global leaders participating in my Japan Leadership Experience in May 2026, this special episode celebrates the sixth anniversary of Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn. You'll hear Isao Yoshino, a 40-year Toyota leader and the subject of my book, reflect on three of the book's most talked-about stories. These examples bring two of Toyota's mottos to life, "bad news first" and "no problem is a problem," and show why a leader's response is what turns problems into a culture of improvement:
Whether on the front line or in the boardroom, creating the conditions where bad news comes first, and support follows, is what builds a culture of excellence.
ABOUT MY GUEST: Isao Yoshino spent forty years at Toyota, from the late 1960s to the early 2000s, where he helped shape the people-centered learning culture the company is known for today. He was a key leader in the Kan-Pro senior-management development program and led the training of the American managers at NUMMI, the Toyota-GM joint venture, where he hired John Shook. He is the subject of Katie Anderson's Shingo Publication Award-winning book, Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn.
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 03:16 The paint mistake that shaped Mr. Yoshino's leadership 05:28 Why Mr. Yoshino was thanked for his mistake 09:34 The leadership lesson that lasted 40 years 11:22 Why Toyota starts every leader on the front line 12:18 Inside the early days of NUMMI 17:13 Why workers were afraid to stop the line 23:34 What changed the culture at NUMMI 24:40 Why leaders only see 4% of problems 25:16 Responding down instead of blaming 25:50 Asking for help at the leadership level 28:43 Why President Cho flew to a failing business 34:17 The power of bad news first 35:54 Mr. Yoshino's biggest leadership regret 38:19 When doing it yourself becomes the problem 39:05 The response that creates culture 40:28 The two behaviors every leader needs 42:02 Two questions to reflect on this week | |||
| 79| Build Powerful People: Why Transformation Starts with Your Own [with Gary Peterson] | 08 Jul 2026 | 00:56:46 | |
Efficiency and cost savings aren't what makes operational excellence last. People are.
Gary Peterson spent more than 30 years building that kind of culture of continuous improvement at OC Tanner. But the hardest part wasn't creating the systems or processes to get better outcomes. It was his own transformation — coming to see how, without meaning to, he'd become the leader getting in his people's way. Put people first, and the results follow. And the deepest transformation you'll ever lead is your own. You’ll Learn:
ABOUT MY GUEST: Gary Peterson spent more than 30 years at OC Tanner, where he held leadership roles across manufacturing, marketing, and operations, most recently as Executive Vice President of Supply Chain and Manufacturing. He led the people-first transformation that earned OC Tanner the Shingo Prize and made it one of the few companies Toyota holds up as a global showcase for its system outside automotive. Gary is an Association for Manufacturing Excellence Hall of Fame inductee. IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 05:02 The real purpose of operational excellence 07:19 How Gary knew the culture was changing 09:00 Creating people who change the world 12:13 The outcome every leader should want 13:07 Two pillars that shaped the journey 14:26 Breaking a culture of fear and control 15:35 The five-minute habit that changed everything 17:15 Redefining what it means to be a manager 19:12 Why transformation takes longer than you think 20:05 What to do when leaders don't support the change 22:26 The experiment that almost got shut down 24:19 Helping managers make the coaching shift 25:23 When people outgrow their leaders 28:28 Why improvement should never threaten jobs 30:23 The manager who couldn't stop yelling 32:23 The leadership habit that destroys ownership 35:35 Becoming the leader you never wanted to be 37:00 The habit that was holding people back 38:01 The executive behavior that shuts people down 40:07 Proving your worth vs. creating conditions 45:37 Showing results isn't the same as showing people 49:53 Where transformation really begins 51:16 The question every leader should ask about their people 53:34 When helping starts limiting growth 55:14 The shift that made everything else possible | |||
| 78| Strategy Isn't Enough: 9 Practices to Help Your Team Meet the Moment [with Karina Mangu-Ward] | 24 Jun 2026 | 00:40:34 | |
Have you poured months into a strategy your team couldn't bring to life? Or watched capable people work harder than ever, and still struggle to pull together as a team?
Karina Mangu-Ward, author of Teams That Meet the Moment, has spent more than a decade helping complex organizations redesign the messy day-to-day of how people actually get things done together. Her belief: good everyday teaming habits are both good for people and good for results. You don't have to choose between them. Making this real doesn't require a reinvention. You just need the right structure and the intention to show up differently. In this episode, Karina shares simple, tangible practices you can use in your very next meeting or strategic project.
ABOUT MY GUEST: IMPORTANT LINKS:
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| 77| Lead with Joy: A Business Strategy for Success [with Rich Sheridan] | 10 Jun 2026 | 00:53:16 | |
Joy isn't a perk. It's a business strategy. Have you ever wondered whether work has to feel this hard? Whether the team you've built can actually function without you? Whether there's a way to lead that doesn't burn you — or your people — out?
You don't have to change the world. You just have to change your world. You’ll Learn:
ABOUT MY GUEST: IMPORTANT LINKS:
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| 76 | What Is the Purpose of Kaizen? John Shook Answers Your Questions (Part 3 of 3) | 27 May 2026 | 00:28:45 | |
What does it really take to sustain a culture of continuous improvement – through pressure for results, across generations, and into an era of AI?
You'll Learn:
ABOUT MY GUEST:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 02:28 [Listener Question] How do you balance patience with action? 04:06 Avoiding solution jumping and analysis paralysis 05:20 [Listener Question] What will matter most for the next generation of organizations? 07:21 Why underlying assumptions matter more than artifacts 08:28 The deeper level of hansei and reflection 08:53 [Listener Question] How do you bridge generations without slowing improvement? 10:43 Quick PDCA vs. long-cycle learning 11:23 Aligning people around shared purpose 13:56 [Listener Question] In our age of AI, how do we stay true to jidoka's original intent, separating machine work from human work? 14:12 AI, jidoka, and protecting human work 15:23 Four questions to navigate uncertainty 16:17 Why respect for people still matters in AI 17:15 Jidoka beyond “automation with a human touch” 18:54 Curiosity, experiments, and learning with AI 19:30 The promise and risk of AI thinking for us 22:08 PDCA beyond engineering and problem solving 25:39 The purpose of kaizen is to do more kaizen 26:18 Creating conditions for people to think and grow 27:00 Shifting from leading change to creating conditions | |||
| 75 | The Human Side of Lean: John Shook on Building Systems That Last (Part 2 of 3) | 20 May 2026 | 00:47:10 | |
Lean has always been about people. We just kept reaching for the tools, without understanding the human purpose behind them.
John shares behind-the-scenes reflections from his time inside Toyota that you might not have heard before. Drawing on his direct experience in the company and our shared experiences living and working in Japan and globally, we explore a critical feature that is often missed: lean has always been a socio-technical system. The tools only work when we understand the deeper human purpose behind them. In this episode, we talk about the people who actually built Toyota's culture, what John learned from his two very different bosses — including Isao Yoshino, the subject of my book “Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn” — and what happens when we lose sight of the human purpose inside the tools we practice every day.
ABOUT MY GUEST:
IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 04:05 John’s question that still drives him: Why Toyota? 05:10 How John found his way into Toyota and NUMMI 06:15 Why Toyota endured while other Japanese companies faded 07:10 Short-term leaders vs. long-term system builders 08:15 The crisis that shaped Toyota’s future direction 10:05 John’s experience learning from very different Toyota leaders 11:15 Why conflicting feedback accelerated John’s learning 12:10 Bringing your own thinking into the A3 process 13:15 Different cultures inside Toyota and how they shaped leadership 14:10 Mr. Cho’s powerful way of teaching through stories 16:10 Katie’s lion story and breaking the telling habit 17:15 Adapting your leadership approach to the situation 19:15 Reading both the technical and social sides of change 20:20 TPS as a way to expose weaknesses and accelerate growth 21:45 Are you a lean mechanic or a lean social worker? 22:50 Identifying your leadership bias and growth edge 24:05 Why process improvement and OD teams should work together 27:10 Scientific thinking, humanism, and ethics in Toyota leadership 28:55 Eliminating waste as more than a technical exercise 30:05 Mottainai and the deeper meaning of waste 32:25 Why lean tools were always socio-technical 33:40 Kanban, standardized work, and the human side of lean 35:10 The A3 as more than a problem-solving tool 37:35 The most common failure mode in lean transformations 38:30 When lean becomes the goal instead of the means 39:30 Why lean isn’t just for executives 40:35 Improving work at every level of the organization 41:40 Why empowerment without support falls apart 42:20 The Andon system as a model for real support 43:45 Where do you need to grow: technical or human? | |||
| 74 | What Problem Are We Solving? John Shook Reflects: Has Lean Failed? (Part 1 of 3) | 13 May 2026 | 00:37:42 | |
Has lean really failed?
John's perspective isn't a rebuttal. It's a reframe. A counterpoint to the question itself. John asks: what problem are we really trying to solve? His answer unfolds across three episodes — the first ever three-part series on Chain of Learning. And I think it will change how you think about your own impact as a change leader.
ABOUT MY GUEST:
IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 05:25 Why change leadership always starts with changing yourself 06:40 The tension between influencing others and trying to control them 08:15 What a people-centered learning culture actually looks like in practice 09:05 Why John avoids lean jargon and starts with the problem instead 10:00 The Toyota question that shaped John’s thinking: “What problem are you trying to solve?” 11:15 Why learning only matters when it’s grounded in the work 12:30 Toyota’s “attitude toward learning” and why it changes everything 15:05 Why leaders must create the environment for learning and problem-solving 16:00 How organizations drift into “big company disease” 17:05 Why purpose → work → capability is the sequence most leaders miss 18:15 The risk of starting culture change with leadership behaviors alone 19:20 Why focusing on the work reveals what’s really blocking change 21:00 Why John sees more “command and abandon” than command and control 23:20 Focusing on your span of influence instead of waiting for senior leaders 27:15 How every person at work already has “problem consciousness” 29:00 The surprising truth about who is most frustrated in organizations 32:15 Building systems at your level that create ownership and capability 33:20 Why modeling the behavior matters more than pushing harder 36:15 Why sustainable change starts with how you show up each day | |||
| 73 | Small Steps, Leading with Heart: How Transformation Sustains [with Richard Koch] | 29 Apr 2026 | 00:46:35 | |
The way you’re leading transformation might be getting in the way of the culture you’re trying to build.
Our passion can unintentionally pull us away from creating the conditions for learning, alignment, and growth, and taking ownership back by stepping in to do, to solve, and to own the work. To explore this, I’m joined by Richard Koch, who has spent 25+ years leading change inside large, complex global organizations—from frontline improvement to system-level transformation. We’re connected by a shared belief: sustainable transformation doesn’t come from pushing harder. It comes from creating the conditions for people to be successful. In this conversation, Richard shares what he’s learned from being inside that tension including why the way many organizations deploy improvement teams can unintentionally prevent the problem-solving ownership they’re trying to build. You’ll Learn:
ABOUT MY GUEST: Richard H. Koch is Managing Director of Serofia and works with leaders who want to create meaningful progress for people, performance, and the future they are helping to shape. Drawing on more than 25 years of international experience across strategy, leadership, operational excellence, innovation, and transformation, he brings together coaching, training, and consulting in a way that is both human and practical. His approach is grounded in systems thinking, deep listening, and helping leaders turn strategic ambition into real progress through small steps and real work.
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 03:44 Importance of seeing potential in every person 06:10 How seemingly insignificant actions ripple through teams 15:14 Why forcing change undermines ownership 17:32 The mindset shift for change leaders and internal consultants 33:52 Value of having the right outside partner to achieve goals 35:50 Seeing a leader move from sponsor to truly owning and enabling change 39:36 Importance of staying curious and creating space for ideas and growth 43:00 The essence of small steps, belief in people, and leading with heart to create the conditions for change | |||
| 72 | Finding Clarity Through the Messy Middle: Reflections from My Book Retreat [with Betsy Jordyn] (BONUS) | 22 Apr 2026 | 00:45:48 | |
The messy middle is part of the learning process.
And while it can feel uncertain, this is often where the deepest continuous learning happens.
We pull back the curtains and invite you into our unscripted reflections from working through the messy middle of shaping my next book—and the leadership (and life) lessons that continue to emerge through the process. Tune in to hear the real-time learning, reflection, and refinement happening as I shape the ideas behind my next book.
ABOUT MY GUEST: Betsy Jordyn is the founder and CEO of Betsy Jordyn International, a strategic branding firm that helps transformational consultants and coaches refine their messaging, positioning, and offers to accelerate their success and amplify their impact. She is also the host of the Consulting Matters podcast and a sought-after speaker and trainer on brand strategy, executive influence, and the business of transformation. IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 01:16 The hidden reality of creativity and why books are written multiple times | |||
| 71 | Own the Thinking Process, Not the Thinking: How Leaders Build Problem-Solving Capability | 15 Apr 2026 | 00:22:55 | |
Caring becomes carrying.
That shift is subtle. And costly. Because the moment you take ownership of the thinking, you take away the very capability you're trying to build.
Your value as a leader isn't in having the answer. It's in creating the conditions where others can think, test, and learn. When you want to create empowered problem-solving in your organization, stepping back is stepping up. You'll Learn:
IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 00:40 The subtle shift from caring to carrying problem solving 05:27 Why problem solving and problem solving coaching are two different skills 10:56 The identity shift from having all the answers to holding the process 19:15 Positive result from leading by asking questions that helped team gain confidence | |||
| 70| Talk to the People: How Leaders Make Better Decisions [with Nigel Thurlow] | 01 Apr 2026 | 00:49:42 | |
What happens when leaders make decisions further and further away from the work itself? In a world of AI, automated dashboards, and remote work, it’s easy to manage representations of work instead of understanding what’s actually happening for the people who do it. Yet, when leaders rely on data rather than facts, they often end up solving the wrong problems, even with the best intentions. In this episode of Chain of Learning, I'm joined by Nigel Thurlow, consultant, systems thinker, and Toyota's first-ever Chief of Agile, to explore how better decisions come from understanding how the system actually operates. And that understanding is built by engaging with the people doing the work. When you stay connected, you don't just get better information. You see how work actually flows, where problems emerge, and what's getting in the way. You build trust, surface issues earlier, and make it easier for people to think and solve problems together. In this episode, you’ll learn:
ABOUT MY GUEST: Nigel Thurlow is CEO of The Flow Consortium and the creator of Scrum the Toyota Way. He spent over 20 years at Toyota, including serving as the first Chief of Agile at Toyota Connected. He is co-author of The Flow System and The Flow System Playbook, and his work focuses on improving decision-making in complex environments.
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 03:19 Effects of being detached from the work when working remotely 09:21 How to go to gemba and go where the work is done 29:10 How to help workers make changes that need to be made visible to senior leaders 40:31 The possible future of AI and how it can affect our decision making 47:24 Reflect on where your decisions may be happening too far from the work | |||
| 69| Better Judgment, Not Better AI Tools: What Leaders Need to Learn and Unlearn [with Barry O'Reilly] | 18 Mar 2026 | 00:45:13 | |
You're being told to use AI. But which tool you actually need to do your best work? Leaders and change practitioners everywhere feel the same pressures right now — more meetings, more information, more mandates to adopt AI — with less time to think and less clarity about where to start. And most of the advice begins in the wrong place: with the tool.
It's about letting go of the belief that your expertise is your competitive advantage, and starting to see AI not as a replacement, but as a thinking partner that can sharpen your clarity, your presence, and your preparation. In this episode, you'll learn:
Where does judgment matter most in your role right now — and what might you need to unlearn to create space for a better way of working? ABOUT MY GUEST: Barry O'Reilly is the bestselling author of Unlearn and co-author of Lean Enterprise. He hosts the Unlearn Podcast and is co-founder of Nobody Studios, an AI-driven venture studio. His newest book, Artificial Organizations, is a practical guide for leaders ready to combine human and machine intelligence to make better decisions faster.
RELATED LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 02:28 Where to start on adopting AI | |||
| 68| The Power of Learning Together: How Shared Experience Enables People-Centered Leadership | 11 Mar 2026 | 00:23:21 | |
RELATED EPISODES:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 1:30 The gap between inspiration and the system you return to 2:46 Three conditions that most leadership development is missing. 4:13 The fundamental difference when others are learning beside you vs. learning alone | |||
| 67| Why Learning Is the Foundation of Influence (and How it Can Limit Your Impact) | 04 Mar 2026 | 00:22:24 | |
What if your approach to learning is actually limiting your influence as a change leader? Many of us pride ourselves on being lifelong learners. We read, earn certifications, study new tools, and go deep into our methodology. That depth is a strength. But as your responsibility grows—from running projects to shaping transformation—what’s required of you changes. At some point, going deeper into your method or functional expertise is no longer enough. Your role shifts from applying tools to enabling leaders to see the whole system, define the real problem before choosing an approach. In this episode of Chain of Learning, I help you learn how to move from learning as accumulation to learning as adaptable influence. As your scope expands, you’re no longer just responsible for executing well. You’re responsible for how others think, decide, and take ownership. That requires more than expertise. It requires the ability to step back, question the form, and respond to what the situation truly calls for. We often define learning as going deeper into an area of expertise, but what can be missing is a shift toward adaptability and broader perspective. A learning and growth mindset is the foundation for enabling a learning organization—yet if you get attached to one form or method, it can constrain your influence. In this episode, you’ll explore how to:
If you want to build a learning organization, your own learning approach must evolve first. It’s not just what you know, but how you show up.
RELATED EPISODES:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 00:40 The Katalyst model revision and why lifelong learning was removed as a standalone competency 03:24 Why learning isn't what distinguishes your influence. It's what makes influence possible 06:52 Three questions every change leader should be able to answer without jargon 09:22 What 75 leaders revealed in a survey and the lesson underneath it 11:25 [HA] where you begin to adapt 11:35 [RI] Transcending the form entirely 12:20 Five Toyota Kata Coaching questions developed by Mike Roth that requires learning and unlearning to develop, grow, and improve 16:04 Katie's personal confession about her own telling habit and what modeling the way actually looks like in practice 21:01 Three practices to try this week to create more impact | |||
| 66| Leadership Is Practice: What It Takes to Lead Transformation as Responsibility Grows [with Carlos Scholz] | 18 Feb 2026 | 01:03:08 | |
What does it really take to lead transformation as responsibility grows? At some point, leadership stops being about doing the improvement work or having the right answers. For operational leaders and change practitioners alike, the work moves to holding the system—people, priorities, and consequences—and helping others learn how to do the same. In this episode of Chain of Learning, I’m joined by Carlos Scholz, CEO of Catalysis, to explore the critical shift leaders must make to enable systemic, lasting organizational change. Carlos shares his journey from technically trained engineer in manufacturing, to transformational change leader in healthcare leading a team of continuous improvement practitioners, to operations leader, and now CEO. Across these roles, he’s learned that transformation doesn’t fail because leaders don’t care or aren’t trying, but because we often rush to outcomes and skip the systems-level and behavioral maturity required to sustain them. This conversation highlights a critical truth: leadership is practice. It’s not a role or a title, it’s how you intentionally show up and get better, day after day. Together, we explore what really changes as leadership responsibility and organizational complexity increase, how leaders have to change their own behavior, and how influence shifts when the work is no longer about doing improvement, but about developing leaders who can own the system. In this episode, we explore:
If you’re navigating your own growth as a change leader—or supporting leaders in truly owning their system—this conversation offers language and perspective to help you lead with greater impact. ABOUT MY GUEST: Carlos Scholz is the CEO of Catalysis, a mission-driven organization advancing people-centered, value-based healthcare. A former manufacturing engineer and healthcare operations and change leader at Kaiser Permanente and NYC Health + Hospitals, he brings deep experience driving system-wide Lean and continuous improvement transformation and developing leaders at scale. Carlos was named a Shingo Rising Star and serves on the Shingo Institute Board. IMPORTANT LINKS:
RELATED EPISODES:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 03:02 Leadership shifts Carlos made stepping into senior executive responsibility 43:28 How skills developed as an influence leader strengthened operational leadership | |||
| 65| From Learning to Impact: Turn Insight into Leadership Action | 04 Feb 2026 | 00:23:54 | |
What if the reason your learning feels productive—but your impact feels stuck—has nothing to do with effort?
IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 00:59 Why doing more is not mean progress 07:48 [ONE] Make the learning itself concrete and specific 09:00 [TWO] Focus on specific observable behaviors, not traits that we want to develop 18:06 Questions to ask to help break the telling habit 22:40 Reflection questions to reflect on to make an impact through your behavior P.S. This episode happens to be released on my birthday 🎉 If Chain of Learning has made a difference for you, a quick rating and review would mean a lot—and helps others discover the show. Leave a rating and review on Apple Podcasts or rating and comments on an episode on Spotify or YouTube. | |||
| 64| Stop Doing Transformation—and Start Enabling It: Redefine Your Role as a Change Leader [with Jill Forrester] | 21 Jan 2026 | 00:45:02 | |
What if the reason leading your organization’s transformation feels heavy isn’t the work itself—but the role you’ve been playing as a change leader?
In this episode of Chain of Learning, I’m joined by Jill Forrester, Director of Continuous Improvement at 3sHealth, to explore the leadership shift that changed how she and her team show up—and the impact they’re having—by moving from helping to intentionally creating the conditions for learning and ownership.
You’ll Learn
ABOUT MY GUEST: Jill Forrester has been a leader in health system transformation since 2012. She has collaboratively guided the development of a comprehensive management system at 3sHealth, encompassing patient and customer engagement, problem-solving and process redesign, strategic visioning and deployment, performance measurement, leadership coaching and development, and employee engagement. Jill is an active member of a strong provincial network of continuous quality improvement leaders dedicated to strengthening Saskatchewan’s health system through learning-centered, people-focused practices.
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 03:27 Jill’s new role director of continuous improvement and when she realized she needed to make a shift 27:16 An example of 5S in the Japanese culture 38:29 Top recommendation for change leaders and continuous improvement practitioners who want to show up in that different space from doing to enabling | |||
| 63| Close the Execution Gap: How Leaders Turn Sustainability Intent into Action [with Rose Heathcote] | 07 Jan 2026 | 00:39:41 | |
Many major transformations, including lean and sustainability—don’t stall because leaders don’t care. They stall because of an execution gap: the gap between what organizations say matters and what actually shows up in daily work, decisions, and priorities. When you hear the word sustainability, what comes to mind first? If it’s recycling, you’re not alone. But sustainability is far bigger—and more complex—than end-point solutions that address the symptoms of deeper problems. As this episode reveals, sustainability efforts—are stuck in the execution gap between intent and action. In this episode of Chain of Learning, I’m joined by Rose Heathcote, sustainability expert, lean adviser, and author, to explore sustainability as a leadership and transformation challenge, not just an environmental one. Together, we discuss why sustainability often lives in strategy decks and slogans, but struggles to take root in everyday work, and how leaders can shift their focus upstream to close that gap: to how work is designed, how problems are framed, and how people learn to see new kinds of waste and impact. This conversation goes beyond sustainability to address a pattern that shows up in any transformation—lean, AI-enabled change, or building a people-first learning organization. If you’re working to close the gap between intention and execution, this episode offers perspective and practical starting points for leading meaningful change that lasts. You’ll Learn:
ABOUT MY GUEST: Rose Heathcote is a speaker, adviser, and Chartered Environmentalist who works at the intersection of Lean thinking and sustainability. She is the founder of Thinking People and the author of "Green Is the New Gold." With decades of experience supporting organizations across industries and regions, Rose focuses on helping leaders move sustainability from aspiration to everyday practice through systems thinking, problem-solving, and people-centered change.
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 01:04 Why the real challenge with sustainability starts with where the conversation begins 04:16 Why people mistake sustainability for “recycling” 11:26 Seeing waste, energy loss, and impact through a green lens 14:06 Using AI as a thinking partner, not a replacement 15:16 The skills leaders must develop in an AI-driven world 19:19 Why sustainability requires systems thinking across the value chain 20:23 How to make progress towards big challenges 24:33 How the book “Green is the New Gold,” came to be 29:19 What we are doing well as a global community to make improvements towards sustainability | |||
| 62| Remove the Muda to Reveal the Buddha: Turning Life’s Weight from Waste Into Wisdom | 23 Dec 2025 | 00:18:43 | |
What if the very thing weighing on you right now is the key to your next level of growth? Many of us carry more than we realize: unfinished goals, unmet expectations, family pressures, and the constant mental load of what still needs to be done. In this episode of Chain of Learning, I share a grounding teaching from a Zen priest in Japan after a Zazen guided meditation session that has deeply resonated with me—and with leaders on my Japan Leadership Experience: “Remove the muda to reveal the Buddha.” In Japanese, muda means waste. And in Lean, muda refers to anything that doesn’t add value. I’ve been reflecting on this phrase and its deeper meaning as I process my own life experiences, both personally and professionally. This Zen teaching invites us to look inward: to notice what weighs us down, reflect on what it’s trying to teach us, and transform that weight into wisdom. As you move forward—whether at the end of a year or in the middle of a busy work period—this episode offers an invitation to slow down, study your experiences, and release what no longer serves you, so that you can lead your life and work with greater intention, clarity, and a continuous learning mindset. YOU’LL LEARN:
IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 01:55 Daruma dolls and what they represent 12:00 How the burning of daruma dolls each year show reflection in practice 13:05 Your intentional practice to help you remove the muda 15:07 Example 3: A relationship has shifted | |||
| 61| Reflections from the Japan Leadership Experience: Live from Tokyo [with Nick Kemp] (BONUS) | 17 Dec 2025 | 00:45:57 | |
Have you ever stepped outside your routine and suddenly seen your work—or yourself—with fresh clarity? Sometimes the most meaningful leadership breakthroughs happen when we pause and immerse ourselves in a space designed for reflection, curiosity, and connection.
You'll hear us revisit the moments that stood out, the leaders who inspired us, and the Japanese concepts that came alive throughout the week—ikigai, kaizen, ichigo ichie, omotenashi, sanpo yoshi, and more. This unscripted conversation offers a glimpse into what my Japan Leadership Experience is all about: a week of learning, community, and connection that helps global executives, lean practitioners, and change leaders discover the essence of respect for people—and “hold precious what it means to be human”—and how to create a culture of excellence. YOU’LL LEARN:
If there’s one thing to take away from this episode, it’s this: ABOUT MY GUEST: Nicholas Kemp, is the founder of Ikigai Tribe and is the author of IKIGAI-KAN: Feel a Life Worth Living and co-author with Professor Daiki Kato of Rolefulness:A Guide to Purposeful Living.
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 01:54 The story behind how Nick and Katie first met 17:41 The planning behind the scenes to make the experience a success 26:37 The key to being more roleful and the book “Rolefulness” | |||
| 60| Bounce Back From a Faceplant: How to Flip the Script on Failure [with Melisa Buie and Keeley Hurley] | 10 Dec 2025 | 00:40:51 | |
We all know that moment where something falls apart. A project slips. A conversation goes sideways. The promotion doesn’t happen. We call it “failure,” but it’s often not the mistake itself that stops us. It’s the fear, the funk, and the uncertainty that follow. And those emotions can hold us back far more than the faceplant ever did. In this episode, I’m joined by Dr. Melisa Buie and Keeley Hurley—seasoned leaders in engineering, quality, and continuous improvement and the co-authors of Faceplant: FREE Yourself from Failure’s Funk. Together, we explore what really happens beneath the surface when we stumble—and what it takes to get back up with clarity, confidence, and intention. Just like Daruma dolls represent the Japanese proverb “Fall down seven times, get up eight,” always righting themselves when knocked over, our path to success comes from acknowledging the stumbles, setbacks, and faceplants that are inherent along the way. What matters is that we don’t get stuck—we get up and learn our way forward. YOU’LL LEARN:
If a setback has ever left you uncertain about your next step in building a people-centered culture, this conversation offers a compassionate, practical path to learn your way forward when you fall down. ABOUT MY GUESTS: Dr. Melisa Buie is a laser physicist–turned–problem solver with a PhD in Nuclear Engineering/Plasma Physics and decades of leadership in manufacturing at Coherent, Lam Research, Applied Materials, and Advanced Energy. She’s published 40+ papers, holds 6 patents, and is a Six Sigma Black Belt. Melisa is the co-author of Faceplant: FREE Yourself from Failure’s Funk, where she turns hard-won lessons into practical wisdom for navigating setbacks. Keeley Hurley is a continuous improvement leader with 20+ years in engineering, manufacturing, and quality, and a Certified Manager of Quality/Organizational Excellence. Known for her humility and humor, she brings real-world experience from the many “faceplants” that shaped her problem-solving approach. She is the co-author of Faceplant: FREE Yourself from Failure’s Funk, blending lessons from her own missteps into tools for resilience and growth.
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 01:46 What inspired the book, “Faceplant” 14:25 Breaking down the acronym FREE: Focus, Reflect, Explore, Engage | |||
| 59| Get Better at Getting Better: Leveraging AI to Elevate Human Learning [with Nathen Harvey] | 26 Nov 2025 | 00:48:22 | |
AI is everywhere. And its use and capabilities are accelerating every day. But is AI actually helping us get better at getting better? Or is it just amplifying the friction, bottlenecks, and complexity that already exists in our workflows and processes?
Drawing on new findings from the DORA 2025 report on AI-assisted software development, we dig into what truly drives high performance – regardless of your industry or work – and how AI can either accelerate learning or amplify bottlenecks. If you lead or work on any kind of team you’ll discover how to use AI thoughtfully, so it supports learning and strengthens the people-centered learning culture you’re trying to build. YOU’LL LEARN:
ABOUT MY GUEST:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 03:04 What DORA is and how it’s used as a research program for continuous improvement 04:31 AI’s primary role in software development as an amplifier where organizations are functioning well and where there’s friction 07:44 Importance of a value stream to understand the customer journey 10:41 How value mapping creates visibility across silos so others see different parts of the whole process 12:20 Finding seven team characteristics based on a survey of 5,000 respondents and learning how to leverage the results to improve performance 17:00 Focusing at different types of waste to prevent undue pressure on people 17:51 What DORA has found in having a tradeoff in having fast and stable production pushes vs. working slow and rolling back changes 22:37 How the report findings are being used to help improve organizations 23:42 Seven capabilities of the DORA AI Capabilities Model in amplifying the impact of AI adoption to improve team and product performance 28:52 How to leverage AI to elevate human work vs machine work 30:58 The benefits of AI in making new skills accessible, but does not make anyone experts in a specific skill 31:44 Leveraging AI to help you complete tasks that would’ve taken longer 32:43 Using AI to elevate creative thinking, but doesn’t replace your thoughts 33:56 Ability to ask AI “dumb” questions to improve collaboration across teams 34:49 Creating an experiential learning experience where there's not a step-by-step path on how to reach outcomes 37:08 Importance of collaboration when moving from point A to point B 37:35 The difference between trainers and facilitators 39:03 Using the DORA report to form a hypothesis for your next experiment in whether a process is working 39:55 Two ways to start leveraging AI to accelerate learning 40:23 Importance of using AI and learning through use 40:58 Benefits of having a conversation with someone who introduces friction to your work 44:21 The concept of jidoka in designing systems that empower humans to do their best thinking and work 45:22 Questions to ask yourself as your reflect on the role of AI in your organization | |||
| 58| People First: Why Leaders Get It Backwards with Lean and Operational Excellence | 12 Nov 2025 | 00:19:18 | |
Where is your primary focus as a leader, change practitioner, or organization? Getting business results? Improving processes? Or developing people? What if the real key to lasting business success isn’t found in metrics or milestones—but in how you create a culture that nurtures people and their problem-solving capabilities? In this episode I explore what it really takes to deliver sustainable organizational success, and why building a people-centered learning culture—one where developing others isn’t an afterthought, but the foundation that enables operational excellence and, ultimately, better business outcomes. Effective leadership begins when you shift from managing results to developing people—creating the conditions for continuous improvement, engagement, and growth. When you put people first, results follow. Whether you are a senior executive, lean practitioner, or team leader, that’s how you build organizations that learn, adapt, and thrive—today and for generations to come. YOU’LL LEARN:
IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 01:51 What leadership with purpose truly means 06:50 The meaning of the quote, “profit is excrement,” that captures the backwardness of the usual business approach to success 08:41 Leaders who put people first as the foundation for success 10:12 The challenge in putting people first 14:08 What leadership in action looks like 14:35 What it really means to create a chain of learning across your organization 15:00 The two pillars of the Toyota Way 16:26 Questions to ask your people to create a cycle of reflection and continuous improvement | |||
| 57| How GE CEO Larry Culp Leads with Lean to Build a Culture of Continuous Improvement (BONUS) | 04 Nov 2025 | 00:39:37 | |
What does it really take to become lean—not just do lean? This is the secret to transformational lean leadership that Larry Culp, CEO of GE and GE Aerospace shared with me on stage three years ago. In this special bonus episode, I want to share his insights and wisdom about leadership and lean culture with you. This bonus episode marks two milestones in my own Chain of Learning® journey: 🎙 The two-year anniversary of the launch of this podcast! These two moments are deeply connected and they tell a powerful story about learning, leadership, and continuous improvement in action. To celebrate, I’m bringing you my “fireside chat” with Larry Culp—recorded live on stage at the AME Conference in Dallas in 2022. It’s a rare, candid look at how one of today’s most respected global executives leads with a lean mindset to practice intentional leadership, humility, and continuous learning to reshape culture, improve decision-making, and lead sustainable organizational transformation at scale, You’ll also hear how this conversation became a defining moment for me—ultimately inspiring the launch of the Chain of Learning® podcast—and why Larry Culp’s insights on lean leadership are just as relevant today. YOU’LL LEARN:
ABOUT MY GUEST: Larry Culp joined the GE Board of Directors in April 2018, and was appointed CEO of GE in October 2018. In June 2022, he assumed additional duty as CEO of GE Aerospace and became Chairman & CEO of GE Aerospace when it launched as a public company in April 2024. He also serves as the non-executive Chairman of GE HealthCare. Larry spent 25 years at Danaher Corporation, serving as President and CEO, where he helped increase both revenue and market capitalization fivefold. Recognized as one of the world’s top CEOs by Harvard Business Review and Barron’s, Larry has served as a Senior Lecturer at Harvard Business School, teaching leadership and strategy.
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 02:51 Larry Culp’s view on lean as a lever to embrace cultural disruption at GE 12:25 The importance of doing the work even though you have a coach | |||
| 56| Slow Down to Speed Up: The Power of the Pause to Accelerate Continuous Learning | 29 Oct 2025 | 00:23:25 | |
How often do you find yourself racing from meeting to meeting, rushing through tasks, or filling every silence with your own voice? In our doing-oriented culture, pausing feels uncomfortable—even counterproductive. Yet left unchecked, our instinct for action and answers can limit learning, development, and innovation. In this episode, I explore the power of the pause and why mastering it may be one of the most transformative leadership habits you can develop. Pausing with purpose—slowing down to create space for silence, reflection, and intentional action—actually accelerates your impact. It’s in the pause—the space between our “doing”—that learning deepens, decisions improve, and people grow. Whether you’re leading a team, coaching others, or developing your own learning mindset, this episode will help you discover the power of the pause to drive performance, engagement, and lasting change. YOU’LL LEARN:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 01:50 The benefits of mastering the pause 02:12 Why silence is uncomfortable making us want to keep things moving 10:16 How the pause is used in Japanese culture 17:47 Why the power of the pause is three-fold | |||
| 55| Adopt the Mentor Mindset: How to Motivate, Guide, and Develop the Next Generation [with David Yeager] | 15 Oct 2025 | 00:52:23 | |
Enter to Win a Copy of David Yeager's book "10 to 25: The Science of Motivating Young People" - Register to win before October 24th at 11:45pm Pacific: http://chainoflearning.com/55 How do you motivate, coach, or lead someone younger—without sounding critical, nagging, or controlling? We’ve all heard the stereotypes: But what if those assumptions are what’s really getting in the way of growth, engagement, and connection? In this episode, I talk with Dr. David Yeager, professor of psychology at the University of Texas at Austin and author of the bestselling book, 10 to 25: The Science of Motivating Young People.
Together, we explore the “mentor mindset”—a practical approach to coaching and intentional leadership to help young people move from compliance to engagement and step into their full potential — and how you can provide feedback that creates connection and motivation, not conflict.
YOU’LL LEARN:
ABOUT MY GUEST: David Yeager, PhD, is a professor of psychology at the University of Texas at Austin and the cofounder of the Texas Behavioral Science and Policy Institute. He is the author of, 10 to 25: The Science of Motivating Young People, and best known for his research conducted with Carol Dweck, Angela Duckworth, and Greg Walton on short but powerful interventions that influence adolescent behaviors such as motivation, engagement, healthy eating, bullying, stress, mental health, and more.
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 02:23 The misconceptions about young one that led to David’s research | |||
| 54| Build Influence and Get Buy-in: Elevating the Positioning, ROI, and Value of Lean and Continuous Improvement [with Betsy Jordyn] (BONUS) | 02 Oct 2025 | 00:59:40 | |
What do people in other functions at your organization think lean is all about? For many—in HR, OD, Finance, or operations—the answer is simple: process improvement, efficiency, waste elimination. And while those are pieces of the puzzle, they miss the bigger picture. Too often, continuous improvement and operational excellence teams get pigeonholed as “process people,” making it hard to gain traction or build the partnerships needed for real transformation. But lean isn’t just about processes—it’s about people. It’s a strategy for developing leaders, engaging employees, and creating lasting change. If you’re struggling to get leadership buy-in for lean or continuous improvement, the problem likely isn't the results you deliver. It’s how you’re positioning the value of lean and your role as a change leader.
Together, we explore one of the biggest challenges you face as a lean and CI professional: how to position and frame your work so others see its true impact. YOU’LL LEARN:
Whether you’re an internal or external consultant, this conversation will help you reframe your work in ways that create greater traction and impact.
Betsy Jordyn is a Brand Positioning Strategist that helps consulting and coaching business owners clarify their brand positioning and messaging, create a website presence that positions them as sought-after experts, land clients with ease and integrity, and take their place as thought leaders and influencers in their niche. Her mission is to help consultants and coaches monetize their best-at strengths and authentic passions to make a bigger difference in the world.
TIMESTAMPS:
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| 53| Rediscover Ikigai: What it Really Means for Your Leadership and Life Purpose [with Nicolas Kemp] | 01 Oct 2025 | 00:44:48 | |
Ikigai is one of the hottest buzzwords in leadership and personal development. But what does ikigai really mean? When you think of ikigai, what do you envision? Is it the popular Venn diagram that claims to help you find your purpose by identifying “the sweet spot” where what you love, what you’re good at, what the world needs, and what you can be paid for overlap? The problem? That’s not ikigai at all. And in fact, the very process of putting ikigai into a framework contradicts the authentic meaning of the word. To dispel what he calls the “ikigai hoax” and uncover its deeper meaning I’m joined by Nicholas Kemp—Japanologist, researcher and author of IKIGAI-KAN: Feel a Life Worth Living and the new book Rolefulness, co-authored with Professor Daiki Kato. We explore how ikigai is fundamentally about creating meaning, connection, and a life —and workplace—where people feel life is worth living It’s about being before doing and cultivating simple joys, authentic relationships, and spaces where people feel safe, valued, and inspired, whatever roles you are playing in your life or at work.
YOU’LL LEARN:
ABOUT MY GUEST: Nicholas Kemp, known as The Ikigai Coach, is a coach trainer, public speaker, consultant, and author of IKIGAI-KAN: Feel a Life Worth Living and Rolefulness. He is the founder and head coach of Ikigai Tribe, a community of educators, psychologists, coaches, and trainers dedicated to serving their communities through the authentic practice of Ikigai. With decades of experience living in Japan and training leaders worldwide, Nick is the trusted voice on how Ikigai can be embodied—not just studied. IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 02:20 What ikigai really means 38:12 The greatest gift of ikigai and allowing a person to pursue their work role 43:24 Three simple ways to create ibasho to build a welcome place where people thrive | |||
| 52| What You Love About Lean and Operational Excellence - And Your #1 Frustration: Executive Buy-In | 17 Sep 2025 | 00:25:26 | |
What’s the #1 frustration most lean and continuous improvement practitioners face? It's something that I bet you've felt too, no matter how passionate you are about the work, no matter what you call it: lean, agile, continuous improvement, operational excellence, or DevOps... Too often, we struggle to clearly explain what we actually do as CI change leaders and why it matters. And when you can’t articulate the deeper value of lean or OpEx, it’s hard to get the buy-in needed to lead the organizational transformation you envision. In this episode, I take you inside a qualitative survey of 100+ change leaders—from internal continuous improvement practitioners and leaders, to external consultants and coaches, executives and operations leaders—on what draws us to this field of organizational improvement, what fuels our passion, and what holds us back from the impact we know is possible. Before listening to this episode, take a moment to reflect on:
If you love lean and continuous improvement and are ready to overcome the frustrations holding you and your organization back from real transformation, then this episode is for you. YOU’LL LEARN:
IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 03:01 Reflection questions on your own experience as a lean and continuous improvement practitioner 03:58 [FIRST] Problem solving that directly impact people’s ability to work meaningfully 04:51 Survey examples of what leaders love about solving problems 06:16 [SECOND] People development and empowerment 07:07 Survey examples of what leaders love about empowering people to solve problems 08:50 [THIRD] Tangible and meaningful impact 09:52 Survey examples of what leaders love about creating meaningful impact for people, organizations, and systems 10:46 Change leader’s frustration: leadership buy-in 12:57 The deeper truth in what’s stopping us from leading real organizational transformation 13:18 Challenges in changing mindsets and shifting behaviors in an organization 13:42 The meaning of Douglas McGregor’s Theory X and Theory Y and the relationship to lean 16:00 The paradox in changing mindset management and leadership for change leaders 17:12 Three practical tips to shift shift the story and the system 17:18 [FIRST] Acknowledge the size of the challenge 18:07 [SECOND] Speak the language of business 19:07 One of the best examples of how a leader effectively led change through influence 20:54 [THIRD] Pair technical process improvement skills with influence and human-focused skills 22:54 The consistent themes from the survey of loving this work and wanting to make meaningful impact 23:54 Take the next step in expanding your influence skills | |||
| 51| Elevate Your Impact Beyond Tools: The Problem-Solver’s Toolkit [with Elisabeth Swan and Tracy O'Rouke] | 03 Sep 2025 | 00:45:32 | |
Organizations invest thousands of dollars and countless hours into lean, Six Sigma, and other continuous improvement training programs. Certifications get awarded. Belts get earned. But nothing actually changes. Technical problem-solving training alone isn’t enough to drive meaningful impact. Without guidance and support on how to apply problem-solving tools—and the people-side of leading change—improvements stall. In this episode of Chain of Learning, I'm joined by Tracy O’Rourke and Elisabeth Swan, co-founders of the Just-in-Time Café and co-authors of "The Problem-Solver’s Toolkit." With more than 50 years of combined Lean Six Sigma experience, they’ve trained and coached thousands of problem-solvers across industries—from healthcare and government to manufacturing and service—helping teams turn knowledge into real results. Whatever problem-solving method you use—DMAIC, PDCA, or an A3—you’ll walk away with practical insights to help you bridge the gap between knowledge and action. YOU’LL LEARN:
ABOUT MY GUESTS: Tracy O’Rourke is a Lean Six Sigma Master Black Belt, and co-founder of the Just-in-Time Café. As a sought-after consultant, instructor, and speaker with over 25 years of experience, Tracy specializes in cultural change, leadership development, strategic alignment, and process improvement. Elisabeth Swan is a leadership coach, keynote speaker, award-winning author of “Picture Yourself a Leader”, and co-founder of the Just-in-Time Café. Elisabeth brings decades of experience helping Fortune 100 companies and nonprofits embrace conscious leadership and continuous improvement. IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 01:37 The inspiration behind the “Problem Solvers Toolkit” 02:54 The disconnect between what is education and what leads to retention 04:22 The aha moments in creating the revised second edition in leading process improvement 05:55 Potholes and detours as a metaphor in process improvements not going the perfect way 06:36 The journey of continuous improvement in taking your team on the journey with you 07:26 Incorporating road games in getting the team involved in problem solving 11:03 What led Tracy and Elisabeth to want to help people in leading process improvement 13:31 The real meaning of being a leader — more than just being a senior executive 16:04 The difference between lean and Six Sigma 18:24 Why the process steps matter more than the name 19:22 Why people feel lean has failed 20:38 Additional learnings in making the second edition of “The Problem-Solver’s Toolkit” 21:53 Changes made in the second edition including graphics, examples and templates 22:19 What the Just-in-Time Café digital toolkit includes 25:23 How to solve problems based on solving similar problems 27:19 The 5S Baby spoof music video inspired by process solving tools 29:12 The next spoof song based on root cause analysis 33:16 Elisabeth’s takeaways from the Japan Leadership Experience in seeing worker happiness 34:53 The importance of focusing on human happiness and engagement for growth 36:53 Tracy’s takeaways from the Japan Leadership Experience 40:00 Top recommendation for being the most effective in getting traction in solving problems 41:41 The importance of building curiosity to get to know people and their experiences 43:34 What is involved in successful problem-solving 44:14 How to close the gap between learning and doing | |||
| 50| Change the Culture: NUMMI and the Power of Leading Through Influence, Not Authority [with Isao Yoshino] | 20 Aug 2025 | 00:26:25 | |
“Change the culture!” That’s exactly what longtime Toyota leader Isao Yoshino was tasked with during one of the most famous business transformations in history—NUMMI—Toyota’s joint venture with General Motors in the 1980s. The challenge? Take GM’s worst-performing plant—plagued by absenteeism, low morale, and poor quality—and turn it around. Within just one year, with the same American workforce but under Toyota’s leadership, NUMMI became GM’s best-performing site. Behind the scenes was Mr. Yoshino, leading the design and delivery of a three-week training program in Japan for hundreds of NUMMI’s frontline and middle managers.
You’ll Learn:
ABOUT MY GUEST: Isao Yoshino, worked at Toyota Motor Corporation for over 40 years—from the late 1960s to the early 2000s—and played an important role in the development of Toyota’s people-centered learning culture it’s now famous for. He was a key part of Kan-Pro senior leadership development program, which embedded A3 thinking as the process for problem-solving, communication, and leadership development across the organization—and has deep expertise in the practice of hoshin-kanri—Toyota’s strategy deployment process. He’s the subject of the Shingo award-winning book “Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn: Lessons from Toyota Leader Isao Yoshino on a Lifetime of Continuous Learning”
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 03:02 How Isao Yoshino felt to be tasked with changing the culture and attitude of NUMMI leaders 04:27 Creating the space for leaders to experience working in Japan and Toyota’s style 09:21 Positive results from employees changing their attitude mindset themselves without being forced 12:06 The importance of “check” in the PDCA process 14:38 Making the “check” process a positive experience in learning how to improve systems without blame 20:19 The positive results from lettings others learn and grow without force | |||
| 49| Shift Your Mindset, Shift Your Impact: 3 Reframes for Positive Leadership and Impact | 06 Aug 2025 | 00:27:32 | |
When you encounter challenges or setbacks, and it feels like things just aren’t going your way, it’s easy to get caught into a downward negative spiral. But could simple mindset shifts change not just how you feel, but how you move forward and influence those around you with positive momentum? In this episode, I’m sharing three powerful reframes that have helped me reset, regain perspective, and move through challenges with intention and empowerment. These reframes aren’t just personal practices—they’re leadership strategies that can help you model resilience, learning, and agency, and inspire the people around you to do the same. This episode isn’t about blind optimism or sugarcoating hard things. It’s about real, actionable ways to reframe challenges and move forward with greater clarity, strength, and purpose. Learn the three reframes that have helped me (and the leaders I work with) get back up and lead with heart and intention. YOU’LL LEARN:
IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 01:56 [1st REFRAME] Find the good—even when it’s hard 15:51 Understanding, “The ball is in your court” to help how you respond to negative conditions | |||
| 48| Make Leadership Meaningful: From Tools to Purposeful Impact as a Lean Consultant [with Josef Procházka] | 23 Jul 2025 | 00:49:23 | |
Apply for the Nov 2025 or May 2026 Japan Leadership Experience Making the improvements. Delivering the project results.
In this episode, Josef Procházka, a lean consultant from the Czech Republic, shares his personal journey of transformation—from frustrated practitioner to heart-led coach—and the impact his shift in approach to consulting has had for his clients and for himself. Josef began his career focused on tools, metrics, and deliverables. But something didn’t feel right. After reading Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn and joining two of my Japan Leadership Experience programs, Josef experienced a transformation of both mind and heart. He found a more meaningful path: one centered on people, purpose, and intentional leadership. Whether you're an external consultant, internal improvement or operational leader, or simply looking to grow your impact—Josef’s story is a reminder that real change doesn’t come from better systems alone. This episode will challenge you to rethink how you show up to lead change, what transformation really requires, and what it means to lead with intention. YOU’LL LEARN:
ABOUT MY GUEST: Josef Procházka is a Lean Six Sigma consultant from the Czech Republic with 20+ years of experience helping manufacturing companies improve productivity, streamline processes, and enhance quality through structured problem-solving and project leadership. He specializes in making Lean practices meaningful by translating tools like 5S and A3 into values-driven change that engages people at every level.
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| 47| Develop Leaders the Toyota Way: Lessons from Kan-Pro Senior Leadership Development [with Isao Yoshino] | 09 Jul 2025 | 00:50:32 | |
A global economic crisis is dragging down sales. Departments are working in silos and leaders at all levels are arguing about priorities. Managers are too busy to coach their teams. You might think this describes your organization today—and it was the exact situation Toyota faced nearly 50 years ago. This challenge sparked one of the most ambitious and influential—and least known outside Japan—leadership development programs in Toyota’s history: the Kanri Nouryoku Program, or Kan-Pro for short. “Kanri” meaning management, and “Nouryoku” meaning capability. Kan-Pro helped establish the people-centered learning culture Toyota is famous for today and embedded A3 thinking as a foundational process for problem-solving, communication, and leadership development. I invited Isao Yoshino—a 40-year Toyota leader who was one of the key team members who helped create and lead the program—to share his experience in two pivotal moments in Toyota’s evolution and how he learned to lead cultural leadership transformation from a place of influence, not authority. Join me and Mr. Yoshino—also the subject of my Shingo-award winning book Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn — as we celebrate its 5-year anniversary this month! YOU’LL LEARN:
Stay tuned for Episode 50 where Mr. Yoshino shares his major assignment to “change the culture”—how he and his team, including Lean Global Network Chairman John Shook, led the training and transformation of frontline American leaders at NUMMI, the GM–Toyota joint venture in the 1980s. ABOUT MY GUEST: Isao Yoshino, worked at Toyota Motor Corporation for over 40 years—from the late 1960s to the early 2000s—and played an important role in the development of Toyota’s people-centered learning culture it’s now famous for. He was a key part of Kan-Pro senior leadership development program, which embedded A3 thinking as the process for problem-solving, communication, and leadership development across the organization—and has deep expertise in the practice of hoshin-kanri—Toyota’s strategy deployment process.
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 03:51 The leadership shift behind the Toyota Way towards a people centered approach 18:55 The leader’s role in setting direction and providing support to their people 20:40 The mindset shift in top management to not to fake it 37:48 Importance of handwritten A3s to senior executives | |||
| 46| Lead Change at Scale: Inside GE Aerospace’s Lean Cultural Transformation [with Phil Wickler] | 25 Jun 2025 | 00:44:19 | |
Is it possible to lead a real, long-term cultural transformation in a publicly traded company—where shareholders often demand short-term financial results? It’s challenging, yet possible. And GE Aerospace, with CEO Larry Culp at the helm, is leading the way. I invited Phil Wickler, Chief Transformation Officer, back to discuss the enterprise-wide shift toward lean at GE Aerospace. We explore what it takes to build a lean management system across a global company of 50,000+ people and how GE Aerospace is embedding problem-solving thinking, leadership behavior, and capability building into every layer of the organization as the strategic approach to getting business results.
If you’re an operational leader, internal lean practitioner, external consultant, or if you want to lead change at scale, don’t miss this episode! YOU’LL LEARN:
ABOUT MY GUEST: Phil Wickler is a Chief Transformation Officer at GE Aerospace where he has enterprise responsibility for EHS, Quality, Lean Operations, Sustainability and Transformation. Phil joined GE in 1995. He progressed through several operations roles, including Six Sigma Black Belt in assembly and component manufacturing, and as a facility manager. Then most recently, the Vice President of Supply Chain at GE, leading global manufacturing and supply chain operations.
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 01:54 Phil’s career journey to Chief Transformation Officer 04:28 Steps to lead culture change and build a thriving lean enterprise 07:23 Common leadership misconceptions 09:13 Helping leaders go to gemba with humility 14:25 Importance of reflection for continuous improvement 16:41 Narrowing down objectives vs. working on everything at once 20:18 Moving from an operational leader to a transformational change leader 22:04 How centralized and decentralized lean teams support enterprise culture change 25:15 Integrating communications and HR functions in transformation & talent development 26:18 GE Aerospace’s proprietary lean management system – FLIGHT DECK 28:12 Mindset shifts that shaped Phil’s leadership 31:00 Measuring cultural change through lean and FLIGHT DECK 34:57 Starting with the basics is critical in leading change 37:55 Real-world example of progress at site level 39:21 How to strengthen the positioning of lean/Operational Excellence in your organization 41:55 One element that accelerated GE Aerospace’s transformation 42:31 How to get started/ bring senior leaders on board | |||
| 45| Manage on Purpose: Align Teams, Develop Strategy, Grow People Through Hoshin Kanri [with Mark Reich] | 11 Jun 2025 | 00:48:50 | |
How effective is your organization's strategy in achieving results? If your team doesn't understand how their daily work connects to bigger organizational goals, you don't have a strategy—you have a gap. A gap in engagement. A gap in alignment. This gap leads to confusion, misaligned priorities, and wasted effort. I’m joined by Mark Reich, author of “Managing on Purpose”, to explore how hoshin kanri – often translated as strategy or policy deployment – can bridge this gap and transform your strategy development and deployment process. With 23+ years at Toyota and extensive experience guiding organizations through lean transformations, Mark reveals how hoshin kanri offers a different approach to strategy execution and management. It connects people to purpose, builds capability, and aligns cross-functional areas, turning vision into results. Turn your strategy into action by aligning and building a purpose-driven organization. YOU’LL LEARN:
ABOUT MY GUEST: Mark Reich is the author of “Managing on Purpose.” He spent 23 years at Toyota, including six years in Japan, seven years at the Toyota Supplier Support Center (TSSC), and over a decade leading Toyota’s North American hoshin kanri process. Today, he’s the Senior Coach and Chief Engineer of Strategy at the Lean Enterprise Institute (LEI), where he guides organizations and their executives on lean transformation. IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 2:05 Hoshin Kanri vs. traditional management approaches to strategy 2:52 Mark defines hoshin kanri 3:49 What people get around around strategy deployment 4:26 Two key differences that sets hoshin kanri apart from traditional strategy 5:16 The problem Mark aimed to solve in “Managing On Purpose” 10:07 Why knowing your true north vision matters 11:34 The complexity of the x-matrix in implementing strategy 15:31 Why catchball is essential to hoshin kanri 20:32 Leading effective catchball conversations 23:07 Vertical vs. horizontal catchball 24:31 Collaborative input in the A3 process 26:17 How leaders can retain perspective for effective catchball conversations 28:30 The PDCA cycle’s critical role in hoshin kanri framework 31:06 Importance of flexibility in leadership 32:19 Distinguishing daily tasks vs. long term tasks for success 34:31 Embedding reflection time in the hoshin process to make PDCA work 37:31 Long-term learning in implementing effective systems 39:48 Using hansei for reflection and prioritization | |||
| 44| Master the Coaching Continuum and Become a Transformational Improvement Coach | 28 May 2025 | 00:18:34 | |
How many questions is too many? You know that asking effective questions is key to helping others solve problems and unlocking improvement, but can you ask too many questions? Yes! And when you do so, you actually hinder progress, not enable it. In this episode, I share one of the most common mistakes leaders and coaches alike make when learning to Break the Telling Habit® and moving from “telling” to “asking”. It's a crucial shift to stop being the expert with all the answers, but when you overpivot to only asking, you can leave the person you’re intending to support feeling frustrated and stuck. Coaching for improvement isn’t just about inquiry—it’s about navigating what I call the “Coaching Continuum”—knowing when to provide open support for problem-solving and when to step in with direction. And importantly, always keeping the problem-solving responsibility with the person you are coaching. YOU’LL LEARN:
Tune in to learn how to navigate this continuum and become a more effective Transformational Improvement Coach!
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 02:59 Navigating the coaching continuum 03:59 A brief explanation of the coaching continuum to be a more helpful coach 05:32 The 3 key steps to effectively navigate the coaching continuum 05:43 Step 1: Understand their thinking to know whether open coaching or directive guidance is needed 07:12 Step 2: Get comfortable with struggle 08:26 When to pivot from open coaching to directive coaching 8:37 How to label your actions to clarify your intention 11:01 Step 3: Today’s not the only day, follow up with a coaching process question to encourage learning 11:27 Benefit of asking a process question to understand next steps 13:32 A leader’s role in developing an A3 report and owning the thinking process not the thinking 15:13 Why coaching and leadership is situational 15:35 Steps to make a plan for effective coaching 15:42 Step 1: Ask a question before immediately jumping in 15:54 Step 2: Give an example how you might approach the problem 16:15 Step 3: The next step to take and what to expect | |||
| 43| Human-Centered Leadership and Kata, Obeya, and Omotenashi: Japanese Management Masterclass Part 2 [with Tim Wolput] | 14 May 2025 | 00:32:09 | |
What’s the real purpose behind the Japanese practices integral to lean management —like kata, obeya, and A3 reports? These methods are often misunderstood as mere templates or formats, without recognizing the deeper meaning and intention that drive their impact. In this episode, we’re picking up on my conversation with Tim Wolput, Japanologist, Toyota Way management expert, and former World Aikido Champion, in Part 2 of this masterclass on Japanese culture and management. Tim brings a unique perspective on the connection between martial arts and leadership—exploring how practices like kata, obeya, and omotenashi (the spirit of hospitality) can be applied to transformational leadership in your organization. YOU’LL LEARN:
In episode 42, we explored how Samurai and rice farming shaped Japanese leadership and how it differs from Western management. If you missed it, hit pause and listen now before continuing this episode! ABOUT MY GUEST: Tim Wolput is a Japanologist and Toyota Way Management expert passionate about helping people transform themselves, their organizations, and the world for the better. Since 2023 Tim has been my in-country partner for my immersive Japan Leadership Experiences. Originally from Belgium, Tim has lived in Japan since 1999 where he attended Tokyo University Graduate School where he studied the history of traditional Japanese mathematics. He is also the 2005 World Champion in Aikido. Tim is a certified Toyota Way Management System instructor and consultant to global organizations on Lean, Agile, and Toyota Production System (TPS).
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:
06:20 What it means to flip the organizational pyramid and how it relates to supportive and servant leadership 09:37 Importance of kata in Japanese culture 17:24 The ritual of the tea ceremony and how it relates to business and customer service 21:05 Disadvantages of replacing humans with machines to get things done 22:40 The concept of obeya, visual management, and people development 25:30 The importance of being people focused rather than tools and processes to reach goals | |||
| 42| Do the Right Thing: Japanese Management Masterclass Part 1 [with Tim Wolput] | 30 Apr 2025 | 00:43:26 | |
How much of the Toyota Way is dependent on Japanese culture? And how much of it all comes down to… being human?
To help you answer this question, I’ve invited Tim Wolput – Japanologist and Toyota Way Management expert, to Chain of Learning.
In this episode, we travel through Japanese history—from Confucius’ teachings to samurai and rice farming traditions, and Deming’s influence on Japanese management.
YOU’LL LEARN:
Subscribe so you don’t miss Part 2, where we continue along this path of learning to explore the nuances of Japanese concepts like kata and obeya and their relationship to lean management practices today. ABOUT MY GUEST:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:
17:28 The working culture in Japan and how work together in the community 30:56 How to focus on processes as the way to get results 34:13 Powerful words of wisdom about the way of the samurai | |||
| 41| Transactions to Transformations: Positioning the Value of Change Leadership for Greater Influence [with Betsy Jordyn] | 16 Apr 2025 | 01:00:17 | |
You’re doing great work….yet you know you and the change you envision could have greater influence. You have a vision for more. More strategic work. More influence. More change that really makes an impact and actually sticks -- for your clients or organization. Only question—how do you get there? The issue isn’t your talent or skills. It’s how you and your work are positioned—how your clients or organization see (and value) your role or the organizational transformation you propose. In this episode, I’m joined by Betsy Jordyn—former Disney OD consultant turned brand positioning strategist—to help you reshape how others perceive your value and become the one leaders turn to when it comes to making significant changes to their leadership and culture. Besty shares actionable ways to communicate your value -- and that of organizational transformation -- so you can land the roles you deserve and lead the work you know will make a difference. We both share insights we've learned from evolving the framing of our own positioning as internal and external consultants and change leaders. Whether you’re an internal change leader tired of being stuck in execution mode or a consultant struggling to land strategic engagements, this conversation is your road map greater impact. YOU’LL LEARN:
ABOUT MY GUEST: Betsy Jordyn is a Brand Positioning Strategist who helps consultants and coaches clarify their message, amplify their influence, and monetize their strengths. Drawing on her experience as a former Disney organizational development (OD) consultant and leader of an external practice serving brands like Wyndham and AAA, she empowers clients to make a bigger impact through authentic thought leadership.
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 03:26 What positioning is and why it matters 06:48 Why your brand is your reputation 10:38 Betsy’s personal story in understanding the importance of positioning 18:28 How Betsy helped Katie improve her positioning 25:37 Changing the name from Japan Study Trip to Japan Leadership Experience 28:42 Clarity - the highest level of positioning 42:15 Third level of positioning in positioning yourself as a strategic partner 46:12 How to position yourself when working with a new client 54:07 The strategic framework to pivot your messaging | |||
| 40| Escape the Doer Trap: 3 Simple Shifts to Instantly Get Unstuck | 02 Apr 2025 | 00:37:20 | |
Do you ever feel overwhelmed that you are responsible for doing too much?
YOU’LL LEARN:
IMPORTANT LINKS:
04:55 Mode 1: The Hero – Not everything needs your rescue 05:48 Mode 2: The Rescuer – Why you need to let others struggle 06:52 Mode 3: The Magician – Doing it all behind the scenes 09:53 3 simple shifts to break free from the trap 23:03 How to frame a clear contracting conversation | |||
| 39| Doing More Isn’t the Answer: Why Simple Wins [with Lisa Bodell] | 19 Mar 2025 | 00:37:49 | |
Ever feel like your to-do list never ends? Running from meeting to meeting with no time to think—let alone lead or create? You’re not alone. The problem isn’t you – that you’re not working hard enough. You’re probably stuck in the complexity trap—buried in endless demands, inefficiencies, and busywork that keep you (and your team) from doing what truly matters. To help you simplify and focus on meaningful work, I sat down with Lisa Bodell, CEO of FutureThink and bestselling author of Why Simple Wins and Kill the Company.
💡 The problem isn’t the people—it’s the process of the work. In this episode, we dive into the biggest barriers to your effectiveness—what you can do to cut through the noise and create space for work that actually matters. If you’re ready to escape the complexity trap and start simplifying to make a real impact, this episode is a must-listen. YOU’LL LEARN:
ABOUT MY GUEST:
IMPORTANT LINKS:
TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:
03:51 The illusion of control and why organizing isn’t the same as simplifying 04:28 Why doing less can make you more valuable 11:36 Why meetings with no agenda can be a time waster | |||