ABM is evolving fast in APAC, and xGrowth has the data to prove it. In this episode, Shahin Hoda and Alexander Hipwell unpack the findings from xGrowth's latest ABM Pulse benchmark, based on responses from 93 B2B marketers actively running ABM programs across the region.
From a dramatic shift away from one-to-few programs to AI quietly expanding the scale of what a single budget can cover, this episode cuts through the noise and tells you exactly what is actually happening with ABM in 2025. If you are making investment decisions or defending the ABM line item to your CFO, this one is for you.
Key Topics
Why one-to-few ABM dropped from 72% adoption in 2024 to around 38% in 2025, and what that signals about market maturity in APAC
How strategic (one-to-one) ABM has held steady at around 50% as organisations focus on protecting and expanding existing customer relationships
The AI effect on program scale: why nearly a third of respondents are now running programs targeting 100 or more accounts on the same budgets they used for far fewer
ABM investment sentiment in 2025: 57% of respondents are holding or growing their ABM budgets, with only 5.2% cutting
Why inbound is under pressure from zero-click search and LLM-driven traffic drops, and how this is pushing more organisations toward ABM as a primary pipeline channel
Budget planning paralysis: why a significant portion of APAC marketing leaders still had not confirmed their 2026 budgets well into Q1, and what that says about market uncertainty
How to use benchmark data like this as social proof when making the case for ABM investment to a CFO or board
Rebroadcast: Building Global Marketing from APAC: Lessons from Airwallex with Jon Stona
Episode 259
Thursday, April 9, 2026 • Duration 31:49
Running a global marketing function from APAC sounds like a logistical headache. For Jon Stona, VP of Global Marketing at Airwallex, it's a deliberate competitive advantage. In this episode, Jon unpacks how one of the world's fastest-growing fintechs has architected a marketing org that's globally consistent yet locally authentic - spanning Singapore, San Francisco, London, and regional hubs across Asia, Europe, and Australia.
From making the case for product marketing before performance spend, to using an F1 sponsorship to systematically close a trust gap against legacy financial institutions, Jon brings rare clarity to the strategic decisions that most B2B marketing leaders only talk about in theory. If you want to think bigger about brand, team design, and what marketing can actually own in a scaling business, this episode is worth your time.
Guest Introduction
Jon Stona is VP of Global Marketing at Airwallex, the Australian-founded global payments and financial platform supporting over 150,000 businesses worldwide. Before joining Airwallex, Jon held senior marketing roles at Stripe, Google, and Nike - giving him deep experience scaling marketing across global technology platforms and challenger brands at every stage of growth.
Key Topics
Why Airwallex built its global marketing org out of APAC, and why the APAC talent pool - wired for fragmentation and global trade from day one - is a genuine strategic asset
How the team is structured across Singapore, San Francisco, London, and regional markets, and why a flat, matrix model is essential when you're this geographically dispersed
The case for investing in product marketing before growth marketing - and why getting your positioning, segmentation, and value prop right is the "root" everything else depends on
The four truths Jon applies to any market expansion: brand truth, product truth, market truth, and user truth - and how product marketing is the function that calibrates where the variation sits
How Airwallex uses its McLaren F1 partnership to build trust at scale, structured around the reliability-credibility-intimacy-low self-orientation framework - and how they actually measure the pipeline and employee sentiment impact
How to Turn B2B Events into a Genuine Revenue Lever with Jannat Dawra
Episode 258
Thursday, March 26, 2026 • Duration 26:38
Events are one of the highest-effort, highest-impact levers in B2B marketing, but most teams run them on autopilot. In this episode, Shahin sits down with Jannat Dawra, Head of Marketing APAC at Dotdigital, to break down her commercial, revenue-first approach to field marketing and events.
Jannat runs 80 to 100 events a year and brings a rare blend of creative instinct and commercial rigour to the craft. From deciding which event type to run, to managing a thin attendance list two weeks out, this episode is packed with practical frameworks for senior B2B marketers.
Guest Introduction
Jannat Dawra is Head of Marketing APAC at Dotdigital, a leading customer experience and data platform. Based in Sydney, Jannat leads brand and demand generation across the region and has previously held senior marketing roles at Insider and LinkedIn.
Key Topics
The three event buckets: sponsored industry conferences (brand and first-touch), strategic partner events (deepening executive relationships), and owned events (roundtables, community events, summits).
A commercial approach to event prioritisation: reverse-engineering every event from revenue and pipeline goals. Does it add value to the ICP, accelerate existing pipeline, or strengthen retention and expansion?
The opportunity cost framework: why a $10K event is never just $10K, and how to factor in team time and effort before committing.
Planning across the funnel: quarterly check-ins with sales, CS, and partnerships to flex the event mix based on where pressure sits in the business.
The individual event checklist: clear objective and KPI, stakeholder buy-in, a one-sentence audience definition, speakers matched to the audience profile, and a project plan with contingencies.
Post-COVID attendee expectations: smaller rooms, curated guest lists, clearer themes, no buzzwords, and ROI scrutiny over vanity metrics.
The 70/30 prospect-to-client split: why each audience needs different event design, and what happens when you blur the two objectives.
The New B2B Playbook, What AI Startups Are Doing That Incumbents Aren't with Scott Albro
Episode 257
Thursday, March 12, 2026 • Duration 47:28
Getting your buyer's attention has never been harder. In this episode, Shahin sits down with Scott Albro, serial entrepreneur and GTM advisor to early-stage AI founders, to unpack what modern go-to-market actually looks like. Scott reframes the most common answer to "what's changed?" by showing how AI isn't just a trend; it's an accelerant for the three forces already making buyer attention scarce.
From founder brand to manufactured moments, tight customer feedback loops to strategic narrative, Scott shares the GTM pillars he works through with his founder clients. He breaks down why the new breed of AI startups is out-marketing incumbents, what Lovable's live-streamed design competition can teach any B2B team, and why ServiceTitan's origin story is the best strategic narrative he's ever heard.
Guest Introduction
Scott Albro is a serial entrepreneur and go-to-market strategist who co-founded TOPO, a sales and marketing research and advisory firm acquired by Gartner, and advises early-stage AI founders on building their first go-to-market functions, drawing on 30 years of experience studying the GTM practices of the world’s fastest-growing companies.
Key Topics
Why attention scarcity is the defining GTM challenge today, and how AI makes it worse across three fronts: information overload, professional busyness, and competitive noise
What incumbent vendors like Salesforce and Workday need to do to defend their position as AI-native startups grow more innovative in both product and go-to-market
Founder brand as a strategic GTM asset: why it goes far beyond LinkedIn posts, and how Nick Mehta made Gainsight synonymous with the customer success movement
Growth experiments and the "Mr. Beast for SaaS" mindset: how Lovable drove 40,000 live viewers and 3 million replays with a zero-budget design competition
Building tight customer feedback loops: why the company that iterates fastest wins, and how AI is finally making weekly feedback cycles achievable
Building Xero’s Brand from Scratch in Australia with Penny Elmslie
Episode 256
Thursday, February 26, 2026 • Duration 39:33
What does it take to build a brand from nothing in nine weeks, with no assets, no brand book, and a board breathing down your neck? Penny Elmslie did exactly that as the first Marketing Director Xero hired outside of New Zealand, turning a company most Australians confused with a certain photocopier brand into one of the world's most recognised accounting software businesses.
Penny shares the story behind Xero's early Australian growth: the scrappy "Hello, Xero with an X" campaign, guerrilla activations like Cloudstreet, the partner strategy that turned accountants into an army, and the event machine that scaled from 30 people in a winery to thousands globally. She also opens up about joining Affinda as CMO and why AI document processing today mirrors where the cloud was a decade ago.
Guest Introduction
Penny Elmslie is a CMO, Board Director, and marketing coach who spent over a decade at Xero, rising from Australia's first Marketing Director to Global Director of Brand and Community. She is currently CMO at Affinda, a Melbourne-based AI document processing company named one of Australia's fastest-growing tech companies by Deloitte.
Key Topics
Building Xero's brand in nine weeks: Launching a full campaign with no brand book, no assets, and a tiny budget, and why the insight was simply making people spell the name correctly.
The accountant-as-channel strategy: How Xero built its go-to-market around accountants and bookkeepers, turning that partner network into the most efficient channel to market.
From "Hello" to XeroCon: How brand experience evolved from small intro sessions to national roadshows and a flagship conference now running worldwide.
Cloudstreet and guerrilla marketing: The pop-up activation that scaled from a city storefront into a shipping container touring Sydney, Melbourne, and Brisbane.
B2C thinking in a B2B world: Why Penny approaches every B2B campaign as human-to-human, and how that philosophy shaped her work at Xero.
Joining Affinda: What drew her to an AI-first scale-up and the brand-building opportunity still ahead.
AI Myths Debunked and The Real Data Behind ChatGPT, Jobs, and Search Traffic With Rand Fishkin
Episode 255
Thursday, February 12, 2026 • Duration 46:26
While everyone panics about ChatGPT stealing traffic and AI replacing jobs, the data tells a different story. For every search on ChatGPT, there are 373 searches on Google. AI's disruption is far less dramatic than media hype suggests. Rand Fishkin challenges this prevailing wisdom about AI's impact on B2B marketing.
In this conversation, Rand and Shahin explore why consensus views are usually wrong, how to build marketing strategies around actual audience behaviour, and what Rand learnt from building Moz versus SparkToro. From audience intelligence research to radical transparency about the venture capital trap, Rand delivers insights that help B2B marketers make smarter decisions.
Guest Introduction
Rand Fishkin is the co-founder and CEO of SparkToro, an audience research software company, and Snackbar Studio, an indie game development studio. Previously, he founded Moz, where he grew the company from debt to $50M+ in revenue over 17 years. He's the author of Lost and Founder: A Painfully Honest Field Guide to the Startup World and is known for his radical transparency about startup life and his contrarian takes on marketing trends.
Key Topics
AI's real impact on search: Data shows ChatGPT handles one search for every 373 on Google, and AI hasn't caused predicted job displacement (US unemployment remains historically low).
Audience-specific research: Rather than following industry trends, marketers should investigate where their audience spends time using tools like SparkToro to discover relevant channels and influencers.
Channel strategy and execution: Effective B2B marketing requires both overarching positioning strategy plus channel-specific tactical approaches for LinkedIn, email, and content platforms.
Learning from hype cycles: From mobile apps to crypto, media creates fear-based narratives around technology that rarely match reality, and marketers who chase every trend waste resources.
Building companies differently: Rand compares growing Moz with VC funding to building SparkToro through alternative funding, highlighting how serving investors rather than customers creates misaligned incentives.
Standing Out in B2B Marketing Without a Big Budget with Udi Ledergor
Episode 254
Thursday, January 29, 2026 • Duration 47:21
In this episode, Udi Ledergor, Chief Evangelist at Gong and author of Courageous Marketing, explains why bold creativity is essential for startups competing in crowded B2B markets.
Udi shares the principle behind Gong’s rise from zero to hundreds of millions in revenue: “different is better than better.” From fuchsia branding and a bulldog mascot to running Super Bowl ads as a startup, he shows how courageous marketing helps companies punch above their weight.
The episode also explores practical ways to create standout content, foster experimentation, and turn customers into passionate fans, even on a limited budget.
Guest Introduction
Udi Ledergor is Chief Evangelist at Gong and author of the bestselling book Courageous Marketing. He served as Gong's first CMO, helping grow the company from zero to hundreds of millions in revenue whilst achieving a multi-billion-dollar valuation. Over his 20-year career, Udi has led marketing teams at successful companies, advised startups, served as a board member and angel investor, and mentored hundreds of marketers.
Key Topics
Different is better than better: Why startups should stop trying to incrementally beat competitors at their own game and instead do something completely different to get noticed
Punching above your weight: How small startups can use guerrilla marketing tactics like out-of-home advertising to appear much bigger than they are when selling to enterprises
Creating raving fans as a company-wide operating principle: Why marketing can't own brand alone, and how every employee at Gong works to create raving fan experiences for customers, candidates, and partners
Building a culture of experimentation: The importance of fostering an environment where teams can take calculated risks, fail safely, and learn from both successes and flops
Gong Labs content marketing: How Gong created original, data-driven content by analysing millions of sales calls to position themselves as the most informed voice in sales effectiveness
Category creation strategy: When it makes sense to create a new category (and when it doesn't), illustrated through the De Beers diamond engagement ring marketing campaign
How to Book a Meeting with Anyone with Stu Heinecke
Episode 253
Thursday, January 15, 2026 • Duration 41:19
What if a $28 Facebook ad could generate $20 million? Stu Heinecke, the father of contact marketing, reveals how micro-focused campaigns connect you with virtually anyone.
Stu shares stories of a sales rep who used a live pigeon to reach a famous CEO, a startup that landed Walmart with one targeted ad, and how Kris Kristofferson landed a helicopter on Johnny Cash's lawn to deliver a demo tape.
Guest Introduction
Stu Heinecke is a bestselling author, Hall of Fame-nominated marketer, and Wall Street Journal cartoonist who helps B2B sellers acquire million-dollar accounts. His campaigns have produced response rates as high as 300% and ROI in the millions of percent.
Key Topics
Contact marketing defined: Targeted campaigns (as few as one person) marked by creativity, audacity, and relevance
Pigeon campaign that closed a $250,000 deal with a famous tech CEO
Orabrush's $28 Facebook ad that landed a 735,000-unit Walmart order
Deep personalisation through profile research and relevant gifts
Why compelling campaigns exceed 100% response rates through viral sharing
Getting started by reading foundational books and researching prospects
Resources & Links
People Mentioned
Dan Waldschmidt - Turnaround specialist who sends swords, achieving 100% response rates
Kris Kristofferson - Singer-songwriter who landed helicopter on Cash's lawn for demo delivery
Johnny Cash - Country legend who received Kristofferson's helicopter delivery
June Carter - Cash's wife who received Kristofferson's demo tapes
Rebroadcast: How to Build a Personal Brand Without Losing Your Mind with Caleb Ralston
Episode 252
Thursday, January 1, 2026 • Duration 47:05
Caleb Ralston challenges one of the most sacred rules in personal branding: niching down. While it's technically the fastest path to growth, it's also a fast track to burnout and quitting altogether. In this conversation with Shahin Hoda, Caleb shares hard-won insights from working with some of the biggest names in business (Gary Vaynerchuk, Alex and Leila Hormozi) and reveals the sustainable approach to building a personal brand that doesn't make you hate what you've created.
From why you should inject your personality into everything you make, to how organisations can build loyalty by empowering team members to develop their own brands, this episode is packed with contrarian wisdom for anyone building content for the long term.
Guest Introduction
Caleb Ralston is a brand strategist, content producer, and creator mentor who has worked with Gary Vaynerchuk, Leila and Alex Hormozi, and other leading voices in entrepreneurship. He now helps founders and creators scale content in a way that's sustainable, strategic, and honest through his company Ralston.
Key Topics
Why niching down is overrated: The conventional wisdom on niching down works in theory but leads to creator burnout and audience fatigue in practice. Caleb explains why sustainability matters more than short-term growth hacks.
The sustainability framework for content creation: Building a personal brand is like fitness: you get returns by doing it forever, not by sprinting for a year and quitting. Learn how to create systems that allow you to keep showing up.
Lessons from working with Gary V and the Hormozis: What most people assume about these mega-brands is completely wrong. Caleb shares the behind-the-scenes reality of how these creators actually build their influence.
Injecting personality without losing focus: How to integrate your interests and quirks into your content without confusing your audience or diluting your message.
Building personal brands within organisations: The Barstool Sports approach to content: why Dave Portnoy isn't in all the content, and how this creates a more scalable, sustainable media company. How this strategy applies to B2B companies.
2x Your Revenue Growth Without Increasing Your Marketing Budget with Robert Chatwani
Episode 251
Thursday, December 18, 2025 • Duration 33:46
What if your CEO asked you to double revenue without adding budget or headcount? Robert Chatwani, President and General Manager of Growth at DocuSign, believes not only is it possible - there's never been a better time to make it happen.
In this conversation, Robert unpacks the frameworks and organisational changes required to achieve exponential growth with existing resources. From building agile growth squads that operate like engineering teams to leveraging AI agents for hyper-personalised prospecting, he reveals how DocuSign is transforming from an e-signature company into an AI-powered platform. If you're facing budget cuts but still expected to deliver results, this episode offers a roadmap.
Guest Introduction
Robert Chatwani is President and General Manager, Growth at DocuSign, where he leads the Marketing & Growth organisation to scale its digital strategy across marketing, product, technology and sales. Before joining DocuSign, Robert was CMO of Atlassian, where he helped scale the business to nearly $3 billion in revenue. He also spent more than a decade at eBay, ending his tenure as Chief Marketing Officer for North America where his teams supported $35 billion in trading volume. Robert is the 2023 American Heart Association Bay Area Heart Walk Chair and serves as a West Coast Board Member at the American India Foundation.
Key Topics
The 2x-10x challenge: Why companies expect exponential output increases without adding resources, and why Robert believes marketing teams can deliver.
Thomas Barta's V-Zone framework: Maximising the overlap between customer needs and company needs to drive business impact and secure executive support.
The harsh realities facing B2B teams: CAC is up 60% since the pandemic, traditional channels show diminishing returns, and most GTM models are obsolete - creating opportunities for teams willing to rethink their approach.
Operating principles over company values: DocuSign's five core principles - "we before me," "dreaming big," "take action," "ignite the way," and "delivering customer delight" - that guide team behaviours and decisions.
Where AI is genuinely delivering efficiency gains in marketing (Writer, Jasper, Profound) and the paradox this creates: as AI levels the playing field on distribution, the non-technical facets of marketing - storytelling, positioning, insight - matter more than ever
Jon's advice for B2B marketers who want to take bolder moves: return to first principles, and remember you're marketing to humans who happen to make business decisions
Reko Rennie - Internationally acclaimed Kamilaroi artist who collaborated with Airwallex and McLaren on the 'Shifted Perspectives' campaign at the 2025 Australian Grand Prix
Manufacturing moments: how Mark Benioff staged a fake protest at Siebel's user conference to launch the no-software movement and put Salesforce on the map
Strategic narrative done right: why ServiceTitan's "the trades stand frozen in time" story is the best B2B narrative Scott has ever encountered
The danger of performative nihilism: why shock-value launches like Cluely's generate page views but destroy brand equity
Bold visual identity choices: The decision to use fuchsia pink and purple with a bulldog mascot in 2018 when all B2B competitors were using corporate blue
Startup advertising on a shoestring budget: Creative approaches to billboard advertising, Super Bowl commercials, and other typically expensive channels that small companies can leverage
Resources & Links
People Mentioned:
Chris Orlob - First content hire at Gong who created most early Gong content independently.
Devin Reed - Former Gong sales rep who transitioned into leading Gong’s content marketing.
Kyle Lacy - CMO referenced for using AI to eliminate obvious ideas and push creative thinking.
Michael Lewis - Author and podcast host whose show drove inbound interest for Gong.
Francis Gerety- Copywriter behind the “A Diamond Is Forever” campaign, cited as a category creation example.
Strategic hiring for content bottlenecks: Why your first hire shouldn't be another you, and how to identify the specific constraint that's actually holding back your content production.
Being 100% yourself in the age of AI: As everyone starts sounding the same on LinkedIn with ChatGPT-generated posts, authenticity becomes your competitive advantage. Caleb's advice: lean into your insecurities and the things you're terrified to share.
Growth squads and agile methodologies: Why effective GTM teams operate like engineering teams with two-week sprints, daily standups, and experiment backlogs instead of traditional campaign structures.
Building a culture of experimentation: Robert's framework for systematic testing - generating ideas, prioritising experiments, executing with discipline, and scaling what works.
AI-powered prospecting in action: How DocuSign used AI agents to turn tens of thousands of exhausted leads into millions in the pipeline, generating 60 replies and 15 meetings within 72 hours.
Designing for the future you want: Why leaders must ask whether their current team structure and capabilities match what they would design from scratch to achieve ambitious growth goals.
Resources & Links
People Mentioned:
Thomas Barta-Marketing leadership expert and author of "The 12 Powers of a Marketing Leader"
Jeff Bezos-Founder of Amazon, referenced for the "two pizza team" principle
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