A Rational Fear – Détails, épisodes et analyse

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What a great episode to end the year on. It's magic when the guests are good old friends with time under their belts, joy in their hearts and stupidity in their mouths.

Kirsten Drysdale's new YouTube show is crushing it, she reviews creators on the internet — The Internet Reviewed

Sami Shah you can find weekly on Patreon making podcasts and thoughtful posts — News Weakly

This week we cover a deeply important threat to democracy as we know it; The US State Department calling the Calibri font woke, we cash in on politician entitlements, and we try to decipher who 36 Months are and what they really want. Cam Wilson at Crikey.com.au has done some great work over the last year on the teenage social media ban — and this 36 Months story is developing fast. It's worth a sub to Cam and Crikey to follow it as it unfolds.

There's also and end of year quiz, and for some reason we talk about Jimmy Fallon and tech bros.

There's a lot going on — but it's a fun 45minutes hanging with funny friends.

Couldn't think of a better way to spend a road trip.

Happy Christmas to you all — we'll be back after Australia Day with some more A Rational Fear episodes, and perhaps the odd secret gig. To find out more sign up to our Patreon!

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G'day Fearmongers —

We have two of Australia's great brains join us, the brilliant Grace Tame and the editor of The Chaser John Delmenico. This week we sling satirical barbs about Spotify, satanic worshipers with a even less desirable side hobby, the bad essay that tried to start a culture war, and do a quick drive by of the photos release from Epstein's Island.

And for new Patreon supporters who sign up this week — you can win yourself a bottle of Evil Ray sunscreen. https://evilray.com/

All you have to do is sign up to our Patreon https://www.patreon.com/ARationalFear

Cheers

Dan

🤑 CHIP IN TO OUR PATREON https://www.patreon.com/ARationalFear

Here's all the fun stuff you get when you sign up to Patreon.

🎧 Get an ad-free and sponsor free version of the show.

🎟 Get early access and discounts to live shows.

🎥 Get early access to final videos, and draft edits of upcoming videos.

👨🏼‍⚖️ Make show suggestions.

💬 Get a link to the A Rational Fear discord.

If you enjoyed this please drop us a review on Apple podcasts:

https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/a-rational-fear/id522303261

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

G’day Fearmongers,

This week we have one of my favourite comedians and tv producers walk us through the CBS decision to axe the Stephen Colbert Late Show.

Was it financial or something more sinister?

W.Kamau Bell is one of the smartest TV creators and stand ups and he’s got the silverware to prove it. Kamau has even hosted his own tonight show. He’s one of the most prolific brains in media, comedy and justice.

 📝 You can read his very thoughtful analysis of the Colbert moment on his Substack Who’s With Me.

🎟️ And you can book to see him live on tour around the US later this year. 

If you enjoy A Rational Fear, chip in to the Patreon.

ALSO In two weeks we have a Federal Minister on the show and on Patreon, you will be able to pitch your questions directly to them - but I’ll only take them for Patreon.

Cheers,

Dan

🤑 CHIP IN TO OUR PATREON https://www.patreon.com/ARationalFear

Here's all the fun stuff you get when you sign up to Patreon.

🎧 Get an ad-free and sponsor free version of the show.

🎟 Get early access and discounts to live shows.

🎥 Get early access to final videos, and draft edits of upcoming videos.

👨🏼‍⚖️ Make show suggestions.

💬 Get a link to the A Rational Fear discord.

If you enjoyed this please drop us a review on Apple podcasts:

https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/a-rational-fear/id522303261

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👕 BUY OUR MERCH HERE

We're joined this week by fearmongers:

Dave Warneke
Jess Perkins
Lewis Hobba
and Dan Ilic

And we cover:

• National Press Club 
• Elon Musk's private jet
• Facial recognition

PLUGS:
Listen to Jess and Dave on 'Do Go On': Website

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Heading into the election your support is going to be more crucial than ever!

Thank you FEARMONGERS!

If you enjoyed this please drop us a review on Apple podcasts:

https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/a-rational-fear/id522303261

----------------

Bertha Announcement  0:00  
This podcast is supported in part by the Bertha Foundation.

Dan Ilic  0:04  
G'day Lewis. How are you?

Lewis Hobba  0:06  
Good evening Daniel. I'm well I'm well how are you?

Dan Ilic  0:09  
I'm really good. I feel I feel it's good having a week off, isn't it like it's good when NBN besets your podcast with Whoa, that you can actually record and you have to take a week off from doing it. God. Yeah. Every week.

Lewis Hobba  0:20  
You think you were taken down by the powers that be? You think you're getting too powerful?

Dan Ilic  0:24  
Yeah, I have been in getting into quite quite a Twitter stash every time Tim Wilson tweets. I don't know if you've seen this. Tim Wilson is all of a sudden turned into it like an environmentalist. I've seen it. Yeah. It's quite the transformation for some guy who has been at the EPA for years trying to rip down every bit of climate policy. He's the guy that's like, Hey, come on over and we can do it.

Lewis Hobba  0:49  
It actually makes you really wonder what it's like when he catches up with his old but like, do they? Like when he goes back to the IPA for the secret meetings when he puts the hood on and he goes underground? And they when they're finished with the chanting? Like, Are they friendly to him? Or like they go we know what you're doing him and it's okay. Or they like you trader used to be one of us.

Dan Ilic  1:09  
Oh, we know what you're doing just you know, getting one more time we need to keep the power keep the power to him, placate them keep those votes away from I mean, we will talk to Georgia steel a little bit about this later on. But I feel like there's this incredible moment. We're in right now where liberals are trying to pretend to be environmentalists because all the quote unquote conservative environmentalist votes are now heading towards these climate independence, which is pretty interesting. So

Lewis Hobba  1:34  
it is there on edge. I'm on edge as well. Actually, I have to admit, I haven't been to this part of my bedroom in a few days. In the middle of the night, like Three nights ago. I thought I saw a cockroach over here. And so I came over like 3am with a shoe. And I whacked the cockroach and it felt like a dead cockroach would. And then it was too late in the night for me to deal with the body of a cockroach. I was like I can't kill but I can't clean up. I went

Dan Ilic  1:58  
somewhere there's a mass grave of cockroaches from where you're sitting right now.

Lewis Hobba  2:02  
Sydney is a mass grave of cockroaches. I am I haven't been back here for three days. And this is what's coming over to my computer. I thought I'm gonna have to deal with the dead body. That cockroach got here. And there is no dead body of a cockroach twist dude still alive somewhere in this room. And now I can start thinking about it.

Dan Ilic  2:20  
Well, you are a Victorian by nature. So I assume you're not adjusting to Sydney cockroaches yet? I mean, 15 years, but you still haven't adjusted to the big Sydney cockroach.

Lewis Hobba  2:32  
I don't know how people live here. Like I don't. I don't know how, like, they live here and were just renting from the cockroaches in this city. It's wild.

Dan Ilic  2:42  
Well, I gotta tell you, that is an apt metaphor for all of Australia right now. We are all just renting from the cockroaches. Big shout out to everyone who turned up to our opera house show that was cancelled and show you that opera house show is going to be rescheduled for June. So hang on to your tickets. And we'll see you in June. And hello to anyone who may have been thinking go to bed thinking about going to a Judas Nielsen show at the Judith Nielsen institute that's now going to be rescheduled for May because of the whole Omicron stuff. So just a bit of housekeeping out of the way. I say we start tonight's show. What do you reckon, Louis?

Lewis Hobba  3:18  
Let's do it. Let's do it.

Dan Ilic  3:19  
I'm recording my irrational fear on Gadigal land in the Eora. Nation sovereignty was never said we need a treaty. Let's start the show.

Unknown Speaker  3:25  
A rational fear contains naughty words like bricks, Canberra, and gum and section 40 of our rational view recommended listening by immature audience.

Dan Ilic  3:39  
Tonight, Morrison scraps empathy training and instead spends $200,000 on basic grocery costs consultancy, and Bitcoin has halved in value sparking concerns of a crypto winter where crypto bros will be forced to live with their parents and only communicate to each other via podcasts, also known as a crypto Summit, and In a surprise move, Scott Morrison agrees with Matt McGowan's decision to keep wa borders sharp saying that anything to prevent Perth based comedians from infecting the eastern states with improv is a good thing. It's the fourth of February and this is a podcast with more side either Grace time, this is a rational fear.

Hi, welcome to irrational fear. I'm your host, former Supreme Court Judge Dan Ilic. And rational fear if you this is your first time listening. It's kind of like the rat tests of podcast it's it's painful as negative but ultimately, more than once a week it gets a little annoying. Let's meet our fear mongers for tonight. First time fear mongers Indeed, He is the Multiple Award nominated podcaster and comedian from the do go on podcast. He's got a tiny head, but it's filled with facts. It's Dave Warner. Hey,

Dave Warnake  4:55  
hello. Great to be here. Good evening.

Dan Ilic  4:59  
Yeah, I can't believe you guys. They're up to 103 127 episodes friend and 27. That is an incredible incredibly prolific well done,

Dave Warnake  5:06  
thank you. Some would say too much, but I say never enough, we will never stop

Lewis Hobba  5:11  
you. Your podcast is notable for being one of the only comedy podcasts that requires preparation. Yes, probably. Like you've actually really shot yourself in the foot.

Dave Warnake  5:22  
It's a choice we regret every single week.

Dan Ilic  5:26  
And she also is the co host of that podcast she's just returned from the frontlines of battling COVID-19 Her tests may be negative, but her laughter is contagious. Also from do go on is Jess Perkins.

Jess Perkins  5:39  
Oh my god what a delight thank you so much for having me. Perfect timing to be on a podcast that's you know really focused on news and politics when you still have brain fog and when to say roll because that's where

Dan Ilic  5:54  
she doesn't think she knows she's got brain frog. And he's the only Boomer left at Triple J.

Lewis Hobba  6:01  
Richard king so have you heard that? Richard Kings I can't leave until it like I can stay there as long as he's there because I'm the second oldest man in the back of my head like a whole I write most of Elvis

Dan Ilic  6:21  
Hey, I wanted to give everyone a bit of a joke keeper update now folks who are Patreon members have already seen this. They're already aware of what's going on. But I thought I'd update everyone who listens normally. So

Lewis Hobba  6:34  
here's a bit of a just gonna be sorry, Dan, if I can interrupt is this for the podcast, this is gonna be a largely visual presentation.

Dan Ilic  6:40  
For me allegedly. This is why you need to be a streamer like the seven people who are 21 people who are streaming right now. So you know this is

Lewis Hobba  6:48  
you are listening on the podcast. Maybe just skip ahead two minutes.

Dan Ilic  6:52  
Well, we do video content turn. And if you've been seeing our videos, John, John boy, our video assistant takes our stream and cuts it up and puts it out onto the internet every Friday and Saturday and Sunday. So I don't have to. It's amazing. We've got a guy who, who makes videos and puts them on the internet.

Lewis Hobba  7:07  
Yeah, I'm just saying this is not what I say in front of me is that you've got a slideshow. And I just wonder if how long you like podcasts before you realise you can't do a fucking slideshow.

Dan Ilic  7:22  
Here's the thing. If you want to see these pictures, go to the Patreon a rational fear.com forward slash Patreon and you can get a taste

Unknown Speaker  7:33  
for it. There's a guy does it.

Dan Ilic  7:37  
But if you want to see it, if you want to see it, you got to pay for it. This is what we're trying to do. I'm trying to funnel people Louis from the free thing to the thing that gets paid. So making money on the podcast, I understand and I know you work at the ABC taxpayer dollars fund your cushy dope smoking lifestyle going on watching your Kanye West in your Vera blues all around the country. And you're hot tracks and the bankers and the flippers and the flumes. But come on, mate. We're gonna try and make money on these things somehow.

Lewis Hobba  8:07  
I don't care. I don't get paid for this podcast.

Dan Ilic  8:11  
So anyway, I wanted to kind of give you a breath. So you may remember we did we had a billboard in Josh Frydenberg electric in in Hawthorne, and it was a billboard you weren't allowed to put any political messaging up. So we put up this billboard that says hey, it's time to buy a standing desk because you're about to lose your seat. And that got lovely billboard was kind of handled plenty of space for someone to vandalise it and they did they fertilise it with a good Frydenberg right along the bottom of it not next to Hey, empty blank space, but Frydenberg at the bottom, so,

Dave Warnake  8:43  
you know they worried that he wasn't gonna get it.

Dan Ilic  8:46  
Perhaps Yeah. So as a result, this got an ATC warning and it got taken down. So I tried to get another one up. So I tried to get a billboard up saying hey, go to Hawaii is a wonderful Hawaiian holiday hilarious Hawaii joke. And they said that was too political. And then I'll hit is Yeah, Hawaiian hideaway for when things get too hot at home bushfires. And they said, No, that's too political. You can't play that up. You know, I can't advertise her way that's too political. I said yep. Okay, all right. So but by the time we got around to negotiating the billboards, Bates had been gone. And so I decided to put one up in Bundaberg to attract the ire of our friend of the show who we like to make fun of on the show rather, Keith Pitt, Keith Pitt who is who's the MP for Hinkler up there. He is famous for not talking about battery power. He hates batteries. He can't even say the word battery. He goes on Sky News in this great Sky News interview from a few months back you may remember where he couldn't even say the word battery. It's fantastic. So I decided to do a billboard with a vibrator that says Hey Keith, batteries give you power in the dark. And unfortunately, the out of home company said that was too political and also to 62 Sexy so I decided to give this one a go. I said hey, outdoor company how about this one? It's a billboard. And it says Do you know batteries can give you power in the dark with a flashlight and

Dave Warnake  10:11  
a flashlight. Come on.

Dan Ilic  10:13  
Well hang on a second. They said well, that was too political and they wouldn't run it. And then I said, How about this is the one batteries Wow. And they said actually, you know, we'll compromise we'll put batteries Wow up in the main street of Bundaberg that's not political. But as Dave keen eyes have discovered that the flashlight was actually a flashlight

Dave Warnake  10:42  
where I didn't realise I don't know

Dan Ilic  10:48  
guys, we did get them over by putting a sex toy on the main street of Bundaberg critical thing about this is that this is actually above a battery shop some one of our listeners went and took a photo of it so batteries WoW is actually above the shop

Lewis Hobba  11:07  
everyone's gonna think it's an ad for the battery shop

Dan Ilic  11:10  
for the battery shop and like so if you are in bonded Bundaberg and you're going down Mira road, I think it's merubah Rhodia merubah Street, head on down there, check out our batteries. Wow, take a photo with a selfie and we'll we'll put it on our social so

Lewis Hobba  11:26  
if you are a standing desk company and you know there's a billboard anywhere near your shop, let us know because Dan can put the Josh standing billboard above there. Do another joke that no one will understand.

Dan Ilic  11:40  
We've got more billboards lighter and more visual jokes for the podcast later on. When we have Georgia steel. She's the independent candidate for Hughes will run our billboards that are ending up in her electorate will also ask her how will she deal? or rather how will Craig Kelly deal with running against a competent person. But first of all, let's have a message for this week's sponsor. In these uncertain times, it's important to be fiscally responsible our nation's on the edge of an economic cliff with very little interest in interest rates

Unknown Speaker  12:11  
at a record low 0.1%.

Dan Ilic  12:15  
And with the stock market sliding faster than a test cricketer into your DMS $50 billion wiped off the value of Australian shares today, there's only one place to put your money that will see guaranteed returns political donations. starting as low as $25,000 you can be guaranteed enormous returns such as $21 million of subsidies and grants for your fossil fuel projects. That's the return of 840% Imagine how many politicians you could buy off with that kind of fuck you can ask your financial advisor if political donations are right for you. Political Donations, it's as safe as houses owned by parliamentarians in Canberra. Jason says apply check the PTS for details Oh, actually there is no PDS just a handshake. So you know, whatever. No rules. This week's first fear when the group chat goes public, it seems that the only gigs that are not cancelled other ones that should be the National Press Club this week. Prime Minister Scott Morrison put on his first ever solo show in over a year the critics gave it zero stars after being pummelling from journalists on questions around accountability and transparency and the price of bread. It was a bombshell text message sent years ago that made the headlines. And now it was brought to light by the Union made of Christian Porter and channel 10s. Most senior litigant, Peter van Onselen he read out the text from a put allegedly from premier Gladys Berejiklian and a senior woman minister who said that Scott Morrison was a psycho and a horrible, horrible man. Now, if Peter van Onselen was going to be rude to the Prime Minister's face Why even go in the first place?

Unknown Speaker  13:59  
Well, you know, I've maybe there's some bravery to it for you know, speaking to someone face to face. I don't know I I love this so much. Because more and more. I'm starting to Yeah, be a bit more mindful about what I'm texting to people. Because of screenshots. I'm just terrified of screenshots. I can't even say that I'd be you know, saying anything particularly bad but you just never know.

Lewis Hobba  14:25  
If I ever let if I leaked the our text message thread between you and a Perko. It would just be you asking me every week are you my best friend?

Jess Perkins  14:37  
I'll get you Monday. And when I do you better believe I'm screenshotting that

Dan Ilic  14:43  
it really goes against the first rule of politics, which is never ever put anything into writing ever. Like why why would you even why would you

Lewis Hobba  14:50  
do that? Why didn't they like put it on the like telegram you know, the one that disappears?

Dan Ilic  14:57  
Oh, yeah, tell it that one way Snapchat a jello. Yeah. Yeah,

Lewis Hobba  15:00  
that's right, then you can put it with a little dick pic. It's gone? Well,

Dan Ilic  15:04  
I mean, the benefit of a telegram of an actual physical tell around is that you have to say stop every few words. So it'll be like, Scott Morrison is horrible, horrible Stop, man stop horrible. So you would kind of have that mix that mix up, you wouldn't actually

Lewis Hobba  15:18  
knock yourself out. Like, he's a complete psycho stop. Maybe I should.

Dan Ilic  15:27  
Now, these texts were actually sent years ago, like, you know, up to two years ago, some people suggesting this is because PVOH, who is now like a litigant in a court case, due to a bully bullying case taken against him at Channel 10 is throwing a bit of a dead cat on himself to deflect attention from himself and put it back on the Prime Minister. Do you think this was a good strategy to deflect attention from himself?

Unknown Speaker  15:48  
I think is well, he was saying on radio that it's like, there was a question of why now. And he was sort of like, oh, you know, these things take time to verify. And, you know, it's not that it's convenient. But it is it's it took took some time for to get to me and then for me to verify. So you know, nothing's us.

Dan Ilic  16:07  
Yeah, no, it's it's really pretty weird timing that he's done this at this time. It does

Lewis Hobba  16:12  
also feel though, like I do sometimes think that journalists have a sense of the prevailing winds. You know, and I do think that, you know, two years ago, if you just said stood in front of Scott Morrison and gone, everyone saying your complete psycho, that story might not have like, hit the way it does right now. It was just like the same way the opinion polls came out that showed his unprepared Prime Minister writing was way up. That he was if the election was tomorrow, he would lose. I feel like there is a bit of a sense of like the people who maybe a year ago, were I'm not saying giving him an easy run, but maybe not necessarily looking for the cracks. And now looking for those cracks and trying to stick a little crowbar in

Dave Warnake  16:56  
as in like the people on his team from the coalition or from No, I

Lewis Hobba  16:59  
just I mean, I'm not saying Peter van onsens on his team. But I may just I do think that you do get a sense I think sometimes with a variety of politicians over the years, that when a politician starts to wane in popularity when they start to feel a little less like Teflon. People do start to get kicked the bird in these sort of National Press Club chats.

Dan Ilic  17:22  
Louis, can I just say that was a very non political answer. That was very good if you considered running for politics. That was that was very good not naming any names. Nothing very specific at all, could generalise hand wavy That was excellent.

Lewis Hobba  17:35  
Thank you so much. I should have done my hand like that I should have done.

Dan Ilic  17:40  
Obama thumbs.

Lewis Hobba  17:41  
I'm not saying anyone's on anyone's team. Just saying it seems like there are fewer people on his team now than they used to be. If you got a theory about who might be the texting minister

Unknown Speaker  17:53  
was Colonel Mustard in the library with a smartphone, a rational fear. Thank you for that.

Dan Ilic  18:00  
This week second fear Elon Musk, a rich guy and space coward has been jumping into the DMS of teenagers making demands Jack Sweeney and 19 year old college student build a twitter bot that tracks and publishes the location of Elon Musk's private jet Nim mask isn't too happy about this. He jumped in the kids dams and asked and offered him $5,000 To shut it down. Jack demanded 50,000 and a Tesla and then Elon back down and then blocked him. Now Dave should a lot of paid out this kid. Well, I

Dave Warnake  18:31  
mean, five grand from Elon Musk, the world's richest or second richest person is like that's like five cents from an average person is that's like a normal person offering to not spit on you. You're not going to take that. You want more? You're gonna go 50 grand. That honestly. That's still a drop in the ocean from ask if he wants it. If he doesn't want us to know that he's travelled 240,000 kilometres on his private plane. He should pay up.

Dan Ilic  18:57  
Yeah, that that whole trip probably cost him $50,000 It is my Jack was really kind he's like, you know, I'm I'm a college student just kind of, you know, I just need 50,000 pair of my college debt and a Tesla. Come on, do you can give that to me. I think it's a great idea. It's it's such a lowball offer as well.

Lewis Hobba  19:14  
I'm sort of on the other side of this. I kind of feel like people What he's basically done is gone. I'm stalking a person and I'm making sure everyone else can stalk him too. But and then before the trials even gone is that he's got the character defence out he's like, I'm just a uni student. I'm just looking for this. Like this is still extortion. Like you are epic thing you're doing. This is like I don't know if anyone has ever been stalked, but it's not a lot of fun. And you'll notice

Dan Ilic  19:42  
are you saying this because you just put a down payment on a Gulfstream Is this done you

Lewis Hobba  19:49  
don't follow up I've upgraded from scooter to Gulfstream. All of the normal cars but I genuinely do believe and I say this so rarely Am I Elon Musk's I don't.

Dave Warnake  20:02  
I'm all for this. It's like a prison style electronic GPS monitor for billionaires, which I think personally they should all have for their crimes committed against society. Should all happen, we should know where they are at all time. And I will say that it is I think it's publicly available data that this kid's just smart enough to use bots, which sort of put it all together and make a neat Twitter account about it's not like he's hacking anything. It's all out. Yeah.

Dan Ilic  20:28  
It's just putting it this is making the public publicly available data more public. Yeah, putting it into a

Jess Perkins  20:37  
nice dinner for other people as well as any like, not just Elon Musk, like He's really He's covering his bases because if they all fork up, you know, between 550 grand, he's gonna be fine.

Dan Ilic  20:48  
There Bill Gates, a Drake. Apparently, Drake has got a really awesome jet like it's a 767 which can hold

Lewis Hobba  20:55  
you saying that we the tone of surprise, right? Like, you guys know that? Right? Because a private jet is a crazy person in the world. I would have had a private jet.

Dan Ilic  21:06  
Nobody's like it's so expensive.

Dave Warnake  21:10  
Seats over 200 people it's

Dan Ilic  21:13  
Yeah, but like I can understand, I can understand like Elon Musk having a private jet. But Drake is like a performing artist, like you know that

Lewis Hobba  21:21  
Drake has has like had more time in the numbers like as a number one artist than the Beatles, and they had to split it four ways. He's one guy.

Dan Ilic  21:30  
I know what things are worth you know, we're the number one comedy podcast in Australia and I'm begging people join the Patreon

Lewis Hobba  21:38  
where the Drake of Australian podcasting he has some shit going on that we did not want to be associated with.

Dan Ilic  21:48  
Right Good. Excellent. Oh, great. Drake is cancelled but he's got a private jet swings and roundabouts. If you saw Elon Musk flying into Australia, what would you do?

Dave Warnake  21:58  
Obviously, run to the airport with a guy, you know how

Unknown Speaker  22:07  
I love you a lot.

Dave Warnake  22:08  
Let's say give me five grand and I won't take a selfie with you and see what

Lewis Hobba  22:13  
when you're in the grace a couple of years ago, and Elon Musk was there? No. And yeah, it was while he was building the battery at a in South Australia. So he was there with his at the time, girlfriend Amber Heard. And I was there with Australian of the deal. And Olcott has the name dropping on this. I was having a I was having a beer with Dylan. And we looked over and he's like, over my over my shoulder is Elon Musk. I look over I'm like, fuck, man. It's Elon musk and amber hurt. And I'm like, don't move. I'm gonna get a photo. And before I can even get my phone out deal and all God has done on one ad and gone straight to Elon Musk and he's having a chat with a coffee. Is that still an Orca? Yeah. And so I I'm like, Oh, do it. Oh, God, Concetta Elon Musk. I guess I'll just take quick snap of deal and chatting to Elon, and then I can send it to deal on LIDAR. And I left my phone out. And as soon as I left my phone up his security pointed like a laser at my phone, so that my phone flashed like my phone wouldn't take the photo because it would just say it was just a white flash. And then the bouncer he's like, security guy looked at me and gave me this like smile and a shake of the head. And I put the phone down and I like gave him a little imaginary tip of the cap. And I think well.

Dave Warnake  23:32  
It sounds like you're, I was like some men in black style technology. Let's come up and just watch your memory of everything.

Lewis Hobba  23:39  
Totally. I'd forgotten about it until right then.

Unknown Speaker  23:43  
Today, Australians will come together in every corner of our nation across the globe to reflect, respect, and celebrate. I'd like to thank the National Australia Council's partners. Chevron.

Voice Over  23:57  
Your fear isn't rational.

Dan Ilic  23:59  
This week's third fear Peter Dutton, once your face, attender has appeared on a government website to build a giant facial recognition database, it's got a catchy name, everyone can remember the national Driver Licence facial rescue recognition solution or endler. For for short. First, I think it needs a catchy name I've got I've got one needs a name that I think people can trust. I think people would really love Robo face. I think you know, it'd be great the database could. She's meant to provide secure National Real Time and online services through facial recognition matches. So you know, like if settling send you a robo debt, you just show your face to a robo face and Robo face talks to Robo debt. And it says you're the wrong person. And then Robo debt apologises for the robo snafu and you don't go to Robo. Here's the thing though the laws that allow such a service haven't actually been passed yet. So technically, the thing if it gets built is illegal. fear mongers, the Human Rights Commissioner Ed centre is pretty worried about This does Robo face worry you Louis.

Lewis Hobba  25:03  
Well, I mean how could it What could possibly go wrong Dan? I mean I love how often is the Human Rights Commissioner worried in this country you know? I know what it's like to wake up every day anxious and my life is not his life you know what I mean? Like you just

Dan Ilic  25:22  
know the Lewis you must be You must be so scared of Tony Martin robbing a bank and you're getting

Lewis Hobba  25:30  
i I'm content, I'm worried about it every day, every day it takes Tony Martin I'm just like, how's the finances? Do you have so much to live for? I just think that the amount of times we completely ignore human rights in this country at the moment like it's got to a point like human rights. It's something we're interested in, but we're not so much caring about it.

Dan Ilic  25:54  
Dave and Jesse worried about this? Yeah,

Dave Warnake  25:56  
I'm not surprised to hear that Peter Dutton is after literally anyone else's face in this country I'll take it I'll take anyone any of them

Lewis Hobba  26:07  
next it's gonna be Robo here he's just like just looking for photos I'm just trying out a few new looks on

Dan Ilic  26:18  
God well there's a bit as Mr. Potato Head he can you know interchange his facts I think that's kind of his the next transition of the spot right.

Jess Perkins  26:27  
All right, then take it even further. And like you know, CCTV, facial recognition. I love the idea of me being tracked at all.

Lewis Hobba  26:38  
And just because you like attention

Jess Perkins  26:41  
it's because I fear being kidnapped. Why would I be a target of that? Not sure. I don't have wealthy parents. I've got no money of my own. Nobody would miss me.

Dan Ilic  26:54  
It's interesting. A few states have already bought into this and they're already kind of adding the driver's licence photos to the database the Queensland has mania and I think Victoria have done that already. Does this mean like people are going to be turning up to like Vic Roads in finding disguises now like to make sure the government has a wacky picture of them they won't be disguised as if they're

Lewis Hobba  27:13  
only using driver's licence photos they'll only be able to track you in the street if you're not smiling

Dan Ilic  27:20  
Yeah, it's bad news for Grace time.

Yeah, oh, I mean, I look pretty different to the photo I took in like 2005 So I like the idea that there's

Unknown Speaker  27:35  
no

Dan Ilic  27:42  
idea there's a skinny Jon Lovitz getting arrested for my bad crime.

Unknown Speaker  27:49  
The Prime Minister's Office is accused of plotting to keep documents from its controversial carpark scheme as secret.

Unknown Speaker  27:56  
The Auditor General found the government pushed projects into seats the coalition needed to win at the last election, they seize

Unknown Speaker  28:03  
a rational view.

Dan Ilic  28:06  
Joining us now is a woman who is determined to take the seat of us from well known intellect Craig Kelly, but the question is, how will she proved that she has the chops to do so? Please welcome Georgia Steele. Welcome, Georgia. Thanks, Dan.

Georgia Steele  28:19  
Thanks for having me.

Dan Ilic  28:20  
It's really great to have you quite a privilege now first of all, Georgia, many people would know you from your 2018 appearance and ITV is love Ireland. How has your audience in reality TV prepared you Oh, sorry. I'm reading the wrong bio here. That's a different George's deal. Is yours. Okay, here it is. Oh, yes, he go. Sutherland local corporate litigator? What makes you think you have the diligence and competence to be the member of us over a failed furniture salesman and a conspiracy theorist?

Georgia Steele  28:47  
Well, the introduction says it all doesn't it Dan. Local and a corporate litigator go any further than

Lewis Hobba  28:56  
someone who doesn't live in us and isn't in Sydney from Sydney originally. How did Craig like how did how, you know what I mean? Like, this

Dan Ilic  29:06  
is huge. To me. Sound is a pretty feels like a pretty middle class. Yeah. Wealthy southern people are educated. They're like, first of all, how? How did he even get in like, and how is he perceived now?

Georgia Steele  29:18  
Well, Craig Kelly was a captain's pick, at least for the last two elections. He has actually been voted in by the people of us four times, and is currently serving his 12th year in Parliament. But for the last couple of times, and particularly the last election, Scott Morrison intubate and saved Craig Kelly as the liberal party's pre selected candidate. So that's the reason that he got elected again last time, unfortunately, with a swing towards so that was when I started thinking, all right, well, I did not expect that to happen. And something different has to happen next time.

Dan Ilic  29:56  
So what was the catalyst for you? Was there a moment you went? I can't have No, this guy representing me on the federal stage, like what was the thing that was one if you can, yeah, very genuine, we ran out of time,

Georgia Steele  30:08  
I couldn't possibly break it down to one. I was just appalled, obviously, that he was my representative, appalled and embarrassed. And so I started volunteering for some of the local political community groups. And then at the same time, became increasingly desperate about what was not happening happening on the climate action front, in our country, and so forth. You know what? I could give this a red hot Rahzel. Watching those politicians up there and thinking, I think that me and a few of my friends can probably have a crack at this. So decided to.

Dave Warnake  30:40  
So did you. Do you want to be a politician? Or are you just happy to get rid of Craig once he's gone? Job done? Yeah,

Georgia Steele  30:47  
that's a good question. Dave. No one's actually asked me that. I don't particularly want to be a politician. It just got to a point where it was so dire.

Dan Ilic  30:57  
I'm so glad you said that. Because you know, this, that clip is going to be circulating all around the way. People will go. Oh, that she said it on some podcast and people come on the podcast, the rest of the story.

Georgia Steele  31:11  
Yeah. When I've been in the House of Representatives for 25 years. See, she's a liar.

Lewis Hobba  31:17  
I want to be a politician normally, that's where the Nationals end up. Do you ever consider becoming a national?

Unknown Speaker  31:22  
Yeah, I'll just go straight. No for that. Louis.

Dan Ilic  31:27  
I noticed you launched your your crowdfunding kind of campaign this week? It sounds very well polished. Have you had any, like major donors like from Chevron, or shell or chip in, you know, to kind of swing your vote?

Georgia Steele  31:41  
No, no, can't say that. I have. We're running a community campaign community donations. And, you know, Craig, Kelly's an asset in that regard. So we're not doing too badly on the fundraising front?

Dan Ilic  31:54  
How are you going in the street with folks and like face to face? Like, what are folks telling you about the feeling of the electorate? And do you come across any liberal fans who are like, you know, I'm not really into Craig. But I am a diehard liberal.

Georgia Steele  32:11  
Yeah, loads, loads, I speak to, you know, obviously, he uses a safe liberal seat. It's been a safe liberal seat for a long time. They have won on first preferences for the last, you know, several elections. And so there are a lot of diehard rusted on liberal voters here. A lot of them tell me that they can't put up with Craig Kelly any longer, but actually, more of them tell me that they're just overall fed up with the way Government's going at the moment with the robots and the scandals and you know, the lack of integrity. That's the number one issue with the people that I talk to on the street. I think everyone except that, you know, Craig Kelly, is who he is. And we need to move on from that. But there's broader issues at play now. And people are just upset generally with the government and the Liberal Party in particular.

Lewis Hobba  32:58  
I mean, if it is a sort of safe liberal seat, I imagine there must be some policies you have that are crossing over in that area. What do you think are like the main issues in your area, apart from getting rid of Craig Kelly, you're hoping to bring forward here?

Georgia Steele  33:14  
Well, as I said, Before, I decided to run because I wanted to get action on climate change that that is my number one aim in doing what I'm doing. We live in a beautiful electrode actually used takes in the Royal National Park and a number of river systems and beaches. And so I think the people here actually want to maintain their beautiful surroundings and their lifestyle. But also, back to integrity. I can't believe what the federal government has been getting away with over the last few years. I don't think many of us can. I mean, even to the point where Craig Kelly got up to his worst shenanigans last year, and you know, really got a tiny little slap on the wrist and go over there and sit back down. You'll be right.

Dan Ilic  33:56  
That's right. When you got seven guests in for a dressing down in this in the Prime Minister's only,

Unknown Speaker  34:02  
exactly a dressing down and then it was only a few months later that he just decided to leave himself. So, you know, every day we use some scandal that's coming out of the federal government, and they're supposed to be representing all of us and they're supposed to be serving us. And I think that's the concept that we really lost in federal politics, that we're serving the public that there's no you know, personal gain to be had here.

Dan Ilic  34:27  
We're seeing quite the shift or the pivot, if you like, in the attitude to climate particularly in seats that are under threat from climate independence. Like Tim Wilson, Tim Wilson, and Goldstein is all of a sudden this crazy environmentalist who is going around to all the renewable businesses in his electorate telling everybody what a great job solar panels are doing and and he's really big on batteries and he's eating kombucha that is that is like carbon neutral. And it's so fascinating because for years he's been putting of the IPA where he is systematically tried to destroy every bit of carbon abatement or, or emissions policy and burn it all to the ground. And you see something very similar happening in Wentworth with Dave Sharma, Dave Sharma handing out flyers that unfortunately had a epic typo. But he wouldn't understand what the typo meant, had a typo that said, Net Zero climate action. That was the title of the fly, which is amazing. So you have all these, like, all of a sudden, you've got these liberals who aren't well versed in climate trying to be climate heroes. That's not happening in your electorate for a pretty good reason, isn't it? Because there is no one in the liberal party who's standing up to you yet? What's happening in the Liberal Party? What Why are they taking their time to get someone to go against you?

Georgia Steele  35:51  
I think the answer to that is because they're a complete shambles. They're trying to find a candidate that Scott Morrison can conveniently parachute into Hughes, like they've done over the last couple of elections with Craig Kelly. I'm currently running against a Liberal Party empty chair. And, you know, that's, that's fine by me. I like

Dan Ilic  36:25  
the Liberal Party by that chair from Craig Kelly's old shop.

Georgia Steele  36:31  
Yeah, so it's Craig Kelly in an empty chair in the Liberal Party. Right. That's, that's what I'm up against in queues. So it's good. It's gonna be an interesting time. But yeah, the Liberal Party is taking us for granted and ignored us for a very long time. It's no surprise that they haven't bothered pre selecting anyone yet.

Dan Ilic  36:46  
I mean, I kind of you're the wrong person answers. But do you think UAP has any kind of traction at all in here? It's like, do you think the United Australia party? You know, the Clive Palmer party? The Craig Kelly, Polly, is there an audience for that message in use at all?

Unknown Speaker  37:03  
No, I think I'm the perfect person to ask about that actually. started probably about 2.4% of the vote in queues in the 2019 election. And Craig Kelly,

Lewis Hobba  37:13  
the chair get,

Unknown Speaker  37:16  
you know, closer, closer to 50. And he was roundly disliked before he left the Liberal Party. And now he's terrorising people all over the country with his text messages and billboards and, and advertising in every traditional media he can find. So

Dave Warnake  37:35  
can I ask how many contacts you have in your phone? And have you messaged them all yet?

Unknown Speaker  37:42  
A lot? And yes. Oh, my free contacts, you know, phone numbers that I didn't have to buy.

Lewis Hobba  37:56  
I mean, they are spending a lot of money, though. Is that something that worries you? We'll be talking about the amount of political advertising that, you know, Australia party had done. Just just on the podcast the other week, and it's, you know, what's the 60 million? 60 million? Yeah, yeah, compared to, you know, other major party Labour Party had spent whatever, 500,000 or something comparatively, it was nothing.

Dan Ilic  38:17  
Oh, yeah. Then that was on YouTube, they spent $5 million on YouTube and the Labour Party have spent like $37,000 or something? Yeah.

Unknown Speaker  38:23  
Well, I mean, we all know that Clive Palmer spent $84 million to hand the 2019 election back to the Liberal Party, and in spending that amount of money did not win a single seat. So we can fully expect that to happen again. Where his strategy will ultimately land is unclear. But in answer to your question, no, I'm not worried about it. I mean, I can't possibly compete with that kind of money. But what I don't have in terms of money on the ground I have in people on the ground, and I'm in my electorate, I'm working with my community, and they're the ones who are going to vote. Come.

Lewis Hobba  39:02  
Check. We've actually got a million dollar donation. Very good. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker  39:11  
fine. Let's get it in there. Full disclosure, and then I'll get into parliament, I'll make sure that no one can donate $60 million to anyone.

Dan Ilic  39:20  
Well, that rolls me out. Well, I was 60 million lying around.

Lewis Hobba  39:26  
Being independent, is has historically been quite tough, not impossible, but tough. Do you think that there's been more of a conversation around it certainly in the media, people zali Steggall have sort of changed the narrative around that as well as others. But if you found that people are like, potentially, I guess you don't necessarily have a yardstick to measure it against but more receptive to the idea of an independent now and potentially they might have been previously.

Unknown Speaker  39:50  
Yeah, I do. I'm finding people to be very receptive to the idea of an independent. The seat of Hughes has never been held by an independent and so it's a big change. To ask the people around you to vote for an independent, I think they voted 92% of the vote at the last election for one of the two or three major parties. But I think that people like zali Steggall and Helen Haynes MP have really opened people's eyes to the power that independence can have in Parliament, and open people's eyes to the ways in which the two party system is failing us. And people are starting to really get to the point where they're going to be willing to try something different. Because if we keep doing what we've always done, we'll get the same result.

Dan Ilic  40:34  
This is an interesting question from Kieran Castellina. On YouTube, what about preferences, how you be, how you kind of dish out preferences and your how to votes and things like that?

Unknown Speaker  40:43  
That is the number one question that I get asked from everywhere from people that I meet on the street on social media, even to the point that today I put up an FAQ list on my website so that people can check it out. I will not be suggesting preferences on my how to vote card preferences do not belong to candidates, they belong to voters. And this is a misconception that I'm really really keen to clear up. Preferences are the voters superpower. And all they need to do is spend a very small amount of time once every three years, check out the candidates in their seat, check out their platforms, check out their qualifications and vote. I will of course be asking people to vote one Georgia steel, but then I will say Please rank the remaining candidates in order of your preference. That is what preferences are.

Dan Ilic  41:35  
I will just chime in here. If you want to know more about preferences, go to the irrational fear email list irrational fear.substack.com. Drop us your email and check out the first column from Kara Schlegel. From this week. She's written a great explainer on preferences and how they work. And preferences are pretty important. So make sure you check out that article from Kara Schlegel Georgia thank you so much. I'll have you know that you know while we were not you know going to donate to your campaign. We have done some joke keeper billboards in your electorate, and your neighbouring electric car could Can we just run them by you and see what you think I'd love to I'd love to know how you you know how you rank these. First of all, is this one. Let's put this one up here. This is it. Hawaiian hideaway. So when things get too hot at home, bushfire sound now on how would you feel about that one?

Unknown Speaker  42:24  
Yes, I like it. I like it and subtle. Shade. Just very delicately down. I like what you've done.

Dan Ilic  42:30  
What about this one? This is good to visit the old growth stumps of Tasmania. It's got a little upturned wombat there and mom and daughter on a hike through the hog crest dumps in Tasmania.

Unknown Speaker  42:43  
That's one of the ones that you really don't want to laugh at but can't help yourself. Yeah,

Dan Ilic  42:48  
maybe I should point out it was done by a Tasmanian artist. So you know, we're, we're okay there. Here we go. What about this one here? This is another one like kind of a jobs one, you know, a jobs for the future. It's got a picture of a woman a little girl and a graduation outfit. It says in 2035 Cassie will be qualified to put former politicians in jail for historical climate crimes. Climate prosecutor is one of 1 million new jobs in one main Australian jobs in a fossil free future. What do you think of this one?

Unknown Speaker  43:15  
Bring it on. That's the short 13 years away totally fake Happy Taking it to them. I'm in favour

Dan Ilic  43:24  
and finally in anger Dean in Hughes we've got this one going up.

Unknown Speaker  43:30  
And immediately

Dan Ilic  43:33  
Welcome Welcome to anger in the place where Scott Morrison last did anything well look you're

Unknown Speaker  43:43  
just opened this week a campaign office in anger doing across the road from McDonald's. You know, we're gonna we're gonna we're gonna be making anger doing great again.

Dan Ilic  43:55  
Oh, could you at least me and getting clean again? That would be great.

Unknown Speaker  43:59  
I'll give it a give it a shot. Georgia steel.

Dan Ilic  44:02  
Thank you so much for joining us on irrational fear.

Unknown Speaker  44:04  
Thanks, Dan. Thanks for having me.

Dan Ilic  44:06  
Let's see if the show big thank you to all of our guests. Georgia steel. Just Perkins Dave Warner key Jason. Dave, what would you like to plug?

Dave Warnake  44:13  
I think we should plug our podcast yes do go on, which is a history based comedy programme where for the last six years, we've taken it in turns to research a topic, bring it back to the others and try and make jokes about it.

Unknown Speaker  44:26  
Sometimes it's really well researched, sometimes pretty poorly. But I'm always I always have a good laugh.

Dan Ilic  44:33  
It's very good. It's very enjoyable. Louis, would you like to plug anything?

Lewis Hobba  44:36  
Well, I mean, since I've got Jess Perkins here not to start a turf war and not to create a staking eating its own tail kind of inception situation where we're at a dream within a dream. But Jess Perkins and I also do a podcast as well as Dan and I doing this podcast.

Dan Ilic  44:52  
What it simply I just

Lewis Hobba  44:55  
I didn't want you to feel I didn't want you to hear about it like

Dan Ilic  44:59  
you He did that podcast.

Unknown Speaker  45:02  
Who do you think the jest is?

Dan Ilic  45:04  
She's just she really listened to podcast.

Unknown Speaker  45:11  
You should. It's great.

Lewis Hobba  45:13  
Where Michael Hague, myself and Jess Perkins here the best stories around the country on a topic. The topic this week was boats. It's coming out on Monday and I don't feel I feel like I can't tell you the stories in front of a person who's campaigning for Parliament because I don't want to. I don't want you to think you'd be like this Ga

Unknown Speaker  45:32  
Ga CEO. What would you like to plug just vote one GA steel? come election day,

Dan Ilic  45:36  
naturally. Hey, a big thank you to all of our Patreon members who signed up we've had a huge sign up over the last two weeks. I'm going to read them all out. So just hang in there. Jesse lapide Renee Ridgeway Chris Harris Pascoe, Sash de Souza, si 316801 For Emily are James Russell. Joe Wade, Brooke, Santa Matt best Zuzia Abdul Youssef. Alex Hi dakak Diane rial Dominic night from the chaser has signed up Michael Solomon Clyde, Joe still it still in LA pulis and Verona Miller X. Dana Van Dyck, Megan, Chela Collins Sky Bar, Yan yay, see Peter, and Trudeau Wow, that is so many people. Thank you for signing up to irrational fear. And you can do that too. If you want to see us continue on with this podcast. Please go to rational fear.com Or go to Patreon Ford slash irrational fear big thank you to everyone who has tuned in for the stream tonight. And that's about it. Also big thanks to roadmaps versus Foundation, and everyone who listens. So thanks, everyone. We'll see you next week. There's always something to be scared of by

Lewis Hobba  46:42  
now, let's all do it in harmony. Bye.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

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----------------

Bertha Announcement  0:00  
This podcast is supported in part by the birther foundation.

Dan Ilic  0:04  
Hello Lewis. How are you?

Lewis Hobba  0:06  
Daniel on well how the hell are you?

Dan Ilic  0:09  
I'm really I'm really good. I'm feeling good feeling. I'm feeling tired but I'm good otherwise I'm tired because bit a personal News. Today I mailed the last ever joke keeper billboards sticker pack out a 480 sticker packs have been mailed out to people who paid 100 bucks to get them. But as a result, Louis I've actually got quite a few stickers left over I thought I under ordered so I did an extra order and then I ended up with about about 100 More stickers per sticker that I actually ordered. So if you want a pack of these $150 valued sticker packs hang around to the end of the podcast and I'll tell you how to get them at a massive discount. Wow Lewis Do you have good olive? I haven't even sent you these?

Lewis Hobba  0:58  
No, I've got one of I got I've got these irrational fear QR code that's not in functioning anymore, obviously. But um, all QR codes. Now if you

Dan Ilic  1:10  
if you if you scan that actually exports your entire browser data to Twitter. Everyone could say everything you've ever downloaded. It's great. Oh, great. The billboard stuff is continuing. I've spent the last bit of money on some billboards around Cooke which is Scott Morrison seat. So I've got a few bit of artwork going I'm going to show you some of the artwork now this is a classic. Let's have a look here is Hawaiian hideaway for when things get too hot at home bushfire sale now one that's going up, and then we've got this one, visit the Old Grove stumps of Tasmania just a beautiful bit of artwork in a classic 1960s US national parks kind of studied that. That's beautiful. Her name is Tanya she's from Tasmania, Tasmania artist, she actually did a cracking job on this like so good. Like it's beautiful. Someone gave a huge donation to joke keeper and they wanted one particularly around the jobs of the future. So I've designed this one to go up which is in 2035, Cassie will be qualified to put former politicians in jail for historical climate crimes. And it's got this picture of this cute little girl in a graduation outfit. And it says climate prosecutor is one of the 1 million new Australian jobs for the fossil fuel free future.

Lewis Hobba  2:27  
Yeah, well she looks about six which is probably is Scott Morrison's kind of child slavery plans stay on track. You could just hop straight into the court right now.

Dan Ilic  2:38  
And we're gonna be talking a little bit about that a little later on right now. I'm recording my end of irrational feet on Gadigal land in the urination sovereignty is never seated, we need a treaty. Let's stop the show.

Unknown Speaker  2:48  
A rational fear contains naughty words like bricks, Canberra, fed gum and section 40 of our rational view recommended listening by immature audience.

Dan Ilic  3:01  
Tonight Victoria Health Corps a code brown on Scott Morrison's press conferences, and the Prime Minister asked the states to let kids drive forklifts in order to give George Christiansen something to do and just wait and turns out to be an even bigger shift and Justice League. It's the 21st of January 2022. And there's a high pressure system of breakfast television asking should we change the date of Australia Day that could last all week? This is a rational. Welcome to rational fear. I'm your host former chairman of Credit Suisse, Dan Ilic. And this is a podcast that vaccinates your brain once a week to make you impervious to scary news stories for at least seven days. Let's meet our fear mongers for tonight. First, did you know that Australian TV comedy shows have a diversity problem? 90% of the head writers are straight white men and 90% of those are James Colley from 81% of comedy shows that are on TV. It's James Colley.

James Colley  4:08  
Oh, hello, Dan. I'll always be from a rational fear. This is why I have made a push to be the official prodigal son of a Russian

Dan Ilic  4:16  
mafia, as you've got it in the name tonight. Thank you, James. Appreciate that. And when she's not being an aria Award winning musical comedian, she's busy being an aria award winning data point on Facebook. It's the ARIA award winning Brian econyl.

Bridie Connell  4:32  
Thank you for using my full title.

Dan Ilic  4:36  
Now you're there's a little bit of a delay, but I assume that's because you're beaming to us from New Zealand the place where there is no COVID where you can go to the shops and you know see your friends and put on comedy shows

Bridie Connell  4:47  
and fortunately no COVID but also no friends. Real real tough spot that I've been just kidding. I'm actually very popular. So I've done but

Lewis Hobba  4:58  
how long have you been there? I feel like you Your accents gotten stronger since I saw you last.

Bridie Connell  5:02  
As soon as I have like one conversation with my dad, it comes back fairly quickly today. And I have

Dan Ilic  5:08  
to say, I've been listening to your podcast with James Colley and there was the listening back to her like, hang on a second, right econyl All of a sudden sounds like she's throwing music.

Bridie Connell  5:21  
Not sure identity is finally been revealed.

James Colley  5:24  
We're pushing for a lot of international funding.

Lewis Hobba  5:29  
And code switching. It's very impressive, very much.

Dan Ilic  5:33  
And it's a man so tall that HR is required to hire a forklift to have a face to face conversation with him. It's Louis harbor.

Lewis Hobba  5:40  
Yes, then I can finally get those six year olds on the end of a fork and raise them up to my level.

Dan Ilic  5:46  
Here's a message from this week's sponsor.

Unknown Speaker  5:50  
Hey, Veronica milsim here to remind you that you've only got two days left to submit your favorite years for the hottest 100 Now with over 2000 years to choose from, we want to know which year you think will come out on top as the hottest year ever.

Unknown Speaker  6:06  
I thought 1989 was pretty high. No, no,

Unknown Speaker  6:09  
it's not when you will asked hot the temperature of Earth. Oh, god, it's got to be 2007. That's the year I was born and my mom was in labor for like four hours. And that was hot. Yeah. Okay. I can understand from a friction perspective. But once again, we're talking about the earth's temperature.

Unknown Speaker  6:26  
And you know, the hottest year was actually 1890 and the Earth's been getting colder every year.

Unknown Speaker  6:32  
I'm sorry. Is this Senator Malcolm Roberts.

Dan Ilic  6:35  
No, it's an attempt round come. They finally

Unknown Speaker  6:41  
get ready for the most predictable countdown. Most of the world is ignoring the hottest 100 years ever. Spoiler alert. It was last year. It's always the last year.

Dan Ilic  6:57  
Always good to have friends of the show on Veronica Milson that are you excited, Louis? So how does 100 week for you? I mean, it's like Christmas for Triple J presenters.

Lewis Hobba  7:06  
It is it's really easy. Obviously. It's always nice for Christmas not to be riddled with disease. Usually the most fun part of the hardest 100 people having parties and really the only parties people having our people who have triple Vax trying to deliberately get COVID that they have the extra immunity. So it is a bit of a somber affair. But you know, I'm sure they'll still be plenty of people who listen to those 100 who will be any absolutely shit faced with 1000 people and it will make me very nervous.

Dan Ilic  7:36  
Yeah, get shit faced on Twitch. That's the That's the name of the game. This week's first year on Thursday, Scott Morrison which should be pointed out despite everything he's still Prime Minister of Australia floated the idea that 16 year old children should be able to operate forklifts as a way to solve some of the supply chain problems that Australia is facing due to adults being sick from COVID-19 But no sooner had Scott Morrison raised the idea by the afternoon it was lowered again by some adults in the national cabinet fear mongers Is this a good idea letting 16 year olds drive something that according to the union's causes one in six workplace deaths Bridey well

Bridie Connell  8:15  
look it was not the news I was expecting today like I knew that the Liberal Party is big on like old fashioned conservative values I just didn't know that like child labor was one of them. I kind of feel excited for them because if this is a value like with the current climate the way it is there's not a lot of chimneys and therefore not a lot of chimney sweep. So I'm like this is cute. Maybe this will lead to our first like little Mary Poppins moment. We can have an adorable chorus line of like, kids on forklifts. I think the choreographic opportunities with this news a huge so I'm for it the premiere

Dan Ilic  8:52  
that would be most up for surely be dominant paradigm and he's got seven forklift drivers ready to go.

Bridie Connell  8:58  
A whole fleet

James Colley  9:01  
is exactly how Tiny Tim got his crutch to so we've wet

Lewis Hobba  9:08  
Yeah, this does feel like a bunch of schools are gonna be really excitedly doing modern adaptations of Oliver.

James Colley  9:18  
I actually really like this plate. I know this is controversial, but I really like this for two reasons. One of which is I have an eight week old and babies are expensive. So get a job honestly $100 A big W two days. You know how hard it is to spend you know how many, like 100 shirts made by other children I would have to buy to make up $100 A big W on my own.

Dan Ilic  9:41  
I was gonna say if you're buying $100 worth of merch you need a forklift to get that $100 worth of stuff to the car.

James Colley  9:48  
We are disgusting, get a job Stop, stop living off my dime. And also more importantly, because I have an eight year old I've been stuck inside for about eight weeks and I need more tick tock content. So you Give every 16 year old a forklift. Let's get this thing

Lewis Hobba  10:03  
humming. Like I have a three year old nephew and he loves trucks. Like he would be so keen for this. If I told him that he could drive a forklift, he would do it for free. He can't technically hold a fork yet, but I reckon he's about ready.

Bridie Connell  10:18  
This is what I'm worried about, Louis, because three year olds love trucks, but it makes this whole policy makes me think that they came up with it. The government while playing with Tonka Trucks, like Fine, let's do this, which would explain why they like coal mining so much, but I'm like, Sure, no, no, let's not be playing with Tonka Trucks, let's be consulting with experts and really official documents, planes.

Lewis Hobba  10:43  
The next plan is gonna be like, we're gonna build a bunch of comedic cowpox, and we've found this some really good infrastructure material, it's called Lego. And we're gonna really go

James Colley  10:54  
It's remarkable to me that what we've learned over the last couple of years is that the global supply chain can be stopped by a boat that gets very stuck when it's absolutely should not be stuck, or just not enough teenagers to operate heavy machinery. How fragile is this thing?

Bridie Connell  11:10  
You know, one of the most concerning parts of this news story to me apart from the child labor laws and the death and although you know, all the year, is that I just had a flashback to when I was 16 and I told the boy at school that I could drive a forklift because I thought it would impress him, which doesn't lie.

Lewis Hobba  11:32  
How's he gonna prove it? He's like, Oh my God, that's crazy. I've got a forklift at home we get over here Brian.

James Colley  11:39  
Yeah, she gave me a PJ a pallet jack

Dan Ilic  11:44  
I did love the best pan on Twitter I saw with this was a university professor saying the whole idea was unpalatable. I was like yes, well done. I'll pay that. I enjoyed that. How do

James Colley  11:55  
we make that person do physical labor?

Lewis Hobba  11:59  
I do think it would stimulate the economy in a lot of ways like I think not only is it just good to get kids into highly, highly dangerous trades as soon as possible. But I think there are a lot of offshoots that we haven't considered yet like you got to think that dare iced coffee you will be bringing stuff out and hit size kid size pack a weenie blues, they're gonna start flying off the shelves like this is gonna stimulate the economy from the ground up crowd would have to change

Dan Ilic  12:26  
their their their jingle there is nothing like crown from picking them up and putting them down after snack. You know to have a

James Colley  12:36  
little man Yeah, I actually worked at like 15 and 16 I worked in the back docks of Toys R Us. And can I say it was already it was already horribly horribly mismanaged. It was our system at the time was you climb up on the racks and someone will throw the screw is up to you and you try and catch them. I will take the last thing we need

Lewis Hobba  13:02  
some of those handled grabbers

Dan Ilic  13:06  
I love the reaction on Twitter to some of this. A lot of a lot of folks are saying this is a bit of a distraction from everything that's going on in terms of Dr. V on Sharma said this he said some days you drop the dead cat other days you are the dead cat. That's a really beautiful summation of that.

James Colley  13:23  
I don't know if like I'm worried that I don't know if you can still be calling this distraction because like it's like if Sideshow Bob gets up to the 14th rake and you're saying well that's just distracting from the first 30 rakes like at some point you're just tremendously shit at what it is you're supposed to be doing. Lucky GOP and the fact that time is linear makes every you have it seems like a distraction from the past.

Lewis Hobba  13:45  
There is also an element to this because it's like oh, we've run out of rat tests whatever out of rats. Oh, we run a rat because we don't have enough forklift drivers. Okay, the forklift drivers will be 16 Oh no wait, that's gonna call it's to me this feels like bringing in the cane toads. Like I've come up with a solution and that solution ends up being far worse than the original problem.

James Colley  14:05  
We are running out of 16 year old shop right the forklifts, but we are also canceling sex ed to create more teen pregnancy so we can get more 16 year olds as soon as possible.

Dan Ilic  14:15  
We love and I love this from my country's on Twitter when he wrote down at this point we're going to learn that the government has hasn't ordered enough forklifts.

Lewis Hobba  14:27  
And all you need

James Colley  14:31  
how great it would be though to rock up to year 10. For more in a forklift, two boys on each fork. Be a king of the school?

Bridie Connell  14:40  
Of course I can imagine it that's why I told that stupid lie in 2007.

Unknown Speaker  14:45  
Arsenal fair, we have been working to reduce the regulatory requirements. There are changes that we need to make around the age of forklift drivers to get quite specific

Unknown Speaker  14:54  
your fear is irrational

Dan Ilic  14:56  
this week. Second fear Boris Johnson is on the ropes again ever since Boris Johnson took over the office of Prime Minister from Theresa May. We've read for about three years that his time as prime minister will be over. But because of this whole debacle around the Christmas party in Downing Street, it could possibly be over I mean, Labour leader key Astana had very strong words about Boris Johnson. He said he broke the law, and he lied. But if that happened in Australia, you'd be gifted a portfolio with more responsibility, James, his whole career over what do you think? Well,

James Colley  15:29  
I don't think he's career's over because this is a man who has made a career out of failing upwards so they'll take him out of this and he'll end up King somehow. This is does seem like a worry because they had leaked. The story of this was a quote, Operation Save big dog, which is the best day I've ever heard for any political communication Operation Save big dog was the play to find a series of people that he could throw under the bus before him to slow the bus down just enough that he would survive.

Lewis Hobba  16:03  
It sounds like a GoFundMe for a pet.

Bridie Connell  16:06  
No, it sounds like that person in high school who really desperately wants a nickname so I was like, Yeah, everyone's calling me big dog now. Promise they are

James Colley  16:16  
Operation Safe big dog was when SEAL Team Six and birded

Dan Ilic  16:22  
operation Big Dog sounds like the sequel to Operation Dumbo drop.

Lewis Hobba  16:30  
A timely reference

Dan Ilic  16:33  
1995 it was a it was a well,

James Colley  16:35  
I one of my favorite parts of the outrage for this because it's very funny. So this all started with they had a party as the farewell for the now deputy editor of the sun before the sun broke the story without revealing that it was the deputy editor which took a little while to come out because you think he could have mentioned that the old day. I know a weird amount about this party because frankly, it was my party. I loved in the traditional way that any British outrage goes and eventually comes back to Will they suffered the queen in this that angle is it was just days before Prince Philip's funeral, which is weird, like it was just days before Prince Philip's funeral and she was harried with grief and busy asking her her son Seriously, are you a pedophile? Seriously? Are you are you though?

Dan Ilic  17:24  
Man? Isn't Christmas at the Royals this year? It would have been extremely awkward all year round.

James Colley  17:29  
Oh, yeah. You know, like you've got Philips gone. Andrews in trouble. The queen is already dead. But they've got big sunglasses on her and no one is allowed to ask any questions.

Dan Ilic  17:39  
Weekend at Lizzie's, that's what's going on there?

Lewis Hobba  17:43  
Yeah, but she starts drinking at like 9am. And you've always sort of been like, why does she do that? But the more you find out about the family, you're like, oh, fuck yeah. Founding and unit nine if my if I was a pedophile in my family that I'd been hiding for decades.

Bridie Connell  17:57  
100%

Dan Ilic  17:59  
just so do you think Bo Joe is gonna go James is Bo Joe? Is this the last offer by Joe?

James Colley  18:05  
I think it kind of has to be but then who's it? The Vinci who was like, part of the joy of this was denying the party and they'd Leakey give the press conference you had at the party addressing how we'd appropriate the party was going to be the footage of someone bringing drinks into the play, like short of photos of Boris Johnson in a party hat. Boy, we got one of those little I don't know what else they need.

Bridie Connell  18:31  
It's interesting, too, because I reckon, I think if the party was just objectively awesome, in Australia would be like, yeah, man, three more years. That was a fucking sick buddy. But just the description of like, just platters of sandwiches. It sounds like a terrible time like people are just some of them are in the garden. Like if you're gonna lose your job over a party, at least make it a really epic one. That's the real tragedy here.

Dan Ilic  19:01  
Yeah. You want to be doing coke off the treasurer's chest. That's what you want to be doing?

Lewis Hobba  19:06  
Yeah, you want a Christmas party?

James Colley  19:10  
I am shocked and disgusted that there was cocaine at a media party sickened by this and I wouldn't ever trust him. This

Dan Ilic  19:17  
might be a bit inside school for folks who listen to the podcast but Mumbrella betrayed rag that talks about the media all the time put out a put out a blog post this week saying yes, I'm letting people know that there was cocaine at the Christmas party last year. And we want to get ahead of the story as

Lewis Hobba  19:34  
it did last year, like four years ago.

Dan Ilic  19:36  
I was in for easy. I thought it was like it was December. No, no,

Lewis Hobba  19:39  
it was ages ago.

Dan Ilic  19:41  
Oh my god. This

Lewis Hobba  19:45  
honestly, like, it's so direct. It's like saying there were chips at the McDonald's birthday. It was such an insanely unnecessary post you like what were you afraid of that like other people medalists would go and go like bit Did you hear that? There was like drug versus party?

James Colley  20:04  
Are they busy snorting up at the walkway?

Dan Ilic  20:06  
Yeah, I've I got off the drugs the 2006 Lucky's maybe I should talk to somebody chattel tan.

James Colley  20:13  
Yeah. The real problem with this is there's still a media organization that can afford cocaine.

Unknown Speaker  20:21  
More than 800 police officers are in isolation tonight because of critical shortages of rapid antigen tests.

Bertha Announcement  20:29  
stampli stations have actually been forced to close in some local areas have been left without a local response.

Unknown Speaker  20:35  
Your fear is rational.

Dan Ilic  20:37  
This week's third fear Craig Kelly is up in Google and Facebook's face this week for removing United Australia party ads from their platforms. Now some of the ads that you put up were quite sensational. They make outrageous claims that aren't based in truth, you know, stuff like Craig Kelly and Clive Palmer would be good politicians, you know, stuff like that. And please vote for them, you know, stuff that everybody knows isn't true. There's also a bunch of stuff that got taken down that were or COVID conspiracies. Now out of the 57 ads that have been running on YouTube, only four got taken down, after they had been running for a week. And they'd been seen by millions and billions of people. It seems to be kind of almost pointless to even like like why even complained that four ads got removed out of 57. And millions of people already seen your ads. But what's interesting is the media is kind of focusing on this moment are the ads being pulled. But right down the bottom of all these articles has like the number has has money kind of spent by UAP on these ads. And I just want to share these these numbers for with you. Apparently 90% of all political advertising on YouTube, is done by the United Australia party. The next is done by by labor. Now the United Australia party spends $4.9 million on YouTube ads. And guess how much labour has spent? Louis Do you know how much labour would have spent? 50 grand? It's close 90 grand like $90,000 Compared to 4.9 million. Wow, isn't that just crazy. And here's, here's the thing, here's the strange thing. Like, there has been several bits of legislation to stop lying in political advertising go in front of this government for the last 10 years. But everyone in the coalition has been against it. So it's actually not illegal to lie in political advertising.

Lewis Hobba  22:29  
That sounds healthy. You're not even allowed to lie about like the shake weight, but you're fucking policy.

James Colley  22:36  
If you save it, your spray and wipe kills 100% of germs, they're gonna kick down your fucking door. Like, you know what, drink it and it will cure COVID That's cool. That's right.

Dan Ilic  22:46  
James, I forget your other head writer of grow and transfer. So you would know all of this kind of minutia, right? Well,

James Colley  22:53  
these ads are fascinating for us because they they pre roll ads and pre roll ads. Traditionally, you have five seconds to win your audience's attention. And it famously takes Craig Kelly seven seconds for his mouth to register that his brain is we're dealing as we described, the weekly we are dealing with the MP most likely to run into it wall with a tunnel painted on top of it. The stupidest person in Parliament, and that is grading on a curve. Like it is remarkable that this man is able to upload anything onto YouTube. But these ads go for so long and say so little. They're amazing. And but I've got to say if you're on YouTube, and you want to find a Craig Kelly video, the gold standard is when he is in his private apart like private the home quarantining for two weeks to enter Canberra. So instead, he sets up the red Ensign on the fence behind him, which means he is a boat, and he sits there and he bounces a ball against the wall. Like he's in the Shawshank bucket.

Dan Ilic  23:59  
I think I remember say that. Yeah. But they just so many other crazy things that he says in his YouTube ads, like there is like a Chinese Air Force Base in Western Australia. And there's a whole bunch of other kind of conspiracies like this, but they don't get taken down. But the COVID stuff gets taken down because it's it's kind of against Facebook and Google's policy to not spread misinformation about COVID.

James Colley  24:20  
Well, there's a very interesting part of this, which is that like, they have a three strike policy, they have a three strike policy, which is you should be banned for 90 days after your third strike. But gray Kelly's had, say six of his videos brought down at once. But that counts is one strike, because they were all brought down together. So it's like if you were like, well, technically I was on a crime spree so that your account was one scratch against my record.

Bridie Connell  24:45  
And that ties into something that I found funny about this reporting of the story. It's just a little semantic detail, but in a lot of the articles about this, it's like Google says it's doing all it can to take these ads down and I'm like, you though, like, I'm just weighed down by this whole point. $9 million, get all this money off me and then I can take them off the internet.

Dan Ilic  25:05  
I think it's so interesting though, that you can actually put out political advertising and you can you can line it like anyone could publish an ad saying that Scott Morrison is a good bloke who never lies, and you would never go to jail for that. Like you could even say, Barnaby Joyce is a family man who has the interests of farmers at heart and he couldn't even touch you for defamation. But you could you could spread so many lies with illegal advertising.

Bridie Connell  25:26  
Perhaps some of those products that we've mentioned before that want to spread some lies about how effective this sprays are at killing germs should just become a political party and keep their ads the same. And then they'll have no ramification.

Lewis Hobba  25:40  
Absolutely, I brought he's really onto something I would love to say companies turning into political parties to sort of both maybe get elected but also just sell products. Like if you just I just say political activists like vote Windex, yeah, don't smash the glass ceiling clean it.

Dan Ilic  25:56  
Yeah, I would. I would vote for crazy John's I mean, he looks like Craig Kelly, like crazy. John mobile phones could easily run for parliament and be great, blisteringly topical.

Bridie Connell  26:08  
It's a worry to me, though, that like even some of the cartoon spokespeople for many products that I can think of I would prefer to be leading the country. That that's a sad time. Yeah,

Lewis Hobba  26:20  
yeah. I worry that the only people who would do it would be James mowing and Dick Smith.

Unknown Speaker  26:27  
Open Society back up, restore our freedoms in this man.

Unknown Speaker  26:33  
I'm George Christensen, host of conservative one pandemic amassed the podcast, lifting the veil on the Chinese Communist Party created COVID-19 This is a rational fear.

Lewis Hobba  26:46  
A little while back, I was going I was deleting a bunch of shit from something. I found this old irrational fear joke from from before Scott Morrison was Prime Minister years and years before Scott Morrison was prime minister. It was a website that was I was actually we created Dan created, which was the Scott Morrison excuse generator. Oh,

James Colley  27:08  
I remember writing that exact face. Yeah.

Lewis Hobba  27:13  
I remember like thinking at the time, I was like, no one knows this Scott Morrison guy is I'm not sure this is gonna fly. But it would if we kept that up. It would be crashing right now.

Dan Ilic  27:22  
Is it still up? Did you? Did you find it bring it back?

Lewis Hobba  27:25  
I don't think it is. I seem to remember. I think the link was broken when I saw it.

James Colley  27:30  
Oh, yeah, it was like 2014. All the jokes are incredibly racist.

Dan Ilic  27:36  
Out of all the irrational fear kind of physical stance we've done I you know, like in the real world stuff I do. I do enjoy a good website or a good or a good billboard, as you know. But the thing that I love the most was the was the phone number was the WHO THE FUCK IS Prime Minister phone number which had the talking clock, which can tell you who was prime minister at that exact point in time because it had a great bit of code that you that would connect to the Wikipedia that would automatically change as soon as the Wikipedia entry for Australian Prime Minister was changed. So I remember on election night, just calling it hoping to hear change over and then of course, Scott Morrison won, so it's kind of pointless.

James Colley  28:16  
I missed the days where we've managed to convince Clive Palmer that we had just found a garbage bag full of the exact number of votes that he was missing. Right?

Dan Ilic  28:28  
Oh my god, you should

James Colley  28:29  
definitely go son.

Lewis Hobba  28:32  
He's back baby.

Dan Ilic  28:33  
We unfortunately have to postpone our opera house show. So for our 10 year anniversary, but I tell you what, we should probably do like a definite full retrospective kind of show. In the next few months before the election just to kind of reminisce about all if not just to be lazy and not write any new jokes. Just replay the old ones

James Colley  28:53  
to play the last 1000 years of liberal darkness.

Dan Ilic  28:56  
I was gonna play an old all the rational fi video with James Colley. But I thought I just hold off. Oh, now I'm curious. So hang on a second. Oh.

Lewis Hobba  29:08  
This is fans. Yeah, I'm really curious about this. Oh, boy. Oh, I mean, comedy is known for aging. Well, so Kali

Dan Ilic  29:17  
came to me ages ago and said I can can I be an irrational fear? This is when I was like writing irrational fear out of my out of my kitchen. And I said, Yo,

Lewis Hobba  29:26  
you just done a bullshit degree in astrophysics.

James Colley  29:31  
Yeah. And I thought, let's focus on something challenging.

Dan Ilic  29:37  
And so I kind of, I kind of wanted to go to Kings Cross and interview people in Kings Cross about, you know, this is when Kings Cross was like raging, and there were so many drunk people in Kings Cross and this is before the lockout laws happened. The whole premise of it was to ask the people of Kings trust to solve the problems and looking back at it. It's So it feels so ancient like it feels like 1000 years ago.

James Colley  30:05  
So what you need to understand is these people have just come from a Mumbrella after party.

Dan Ilic  30:11  
So this is the first one of the first ever videos we ever made for rational fear. I'm on the microphone interviewing drunk people in James You are filming as we go. Why don't we play hang on a sec, if anyone wants to stop this as we go just say hang on a sec. Here we go. rational

Unknown Speaker  30:27  
thinking cross crosses for

Unknown Speaker  30:29  
decades. How do you fix that? Well, you can't really see Australian culture you guy you get drunk and you become a dickhead. I'll tell you the problem.

Lewis Hobba  30:40  
The way to fix it

Dan Ilic  30:45  
Yeah, in retrospect, that was the solution. And housing prices went up

Unknown Speaker  30:50  
everyone's just drugs. I'm not gonna lie. Everyone's on drugs. You just got to get paid. Suggestions. Just honestly kick every violent person out of King

Unknown Speaker  31:00  
scops and dog because he's a wombat.

Unknown Speaker  31:04  
With alcohol alcohol problem I don't believe in it because guess why I'm alcoholic myself.

Unknown Speaker  31:09  
So let me ask you a question. How do we fix global warming? Turn off you hate is is a carbon tax got to do with that. That bad saving carbon or something?

Unknown Speaker  31:19  
Less mobile phones, cars all that shit. Go back to old school just walking in that

Unknown Speaker  31:25  
will get pyramids. And buses made no more buses nothing. Continue shuffling.

Unknown Speaker  31:29  
Where's the problem of China and India are the problems. Level actually.

Unknown Speaker  31:37  
I think we just go I mean by solving the whaling the whaling is a problem?

Unknown Speaker  31:43  
I don't believe in it. But actually I'll do because fucking Julian

Unknown Speaker  31:47  
I believe in global warming. You can't prove it right now. Are we warm me up? No. Cuz we're not. I'm pretty fucking cold. It's called

Unknown Speaker  31:58  
global warming tonight. Global warming will be fucking I'll take my shirt off right now. Take it off. I'll take it off.

Unknown Speaker  32:03  
Come on. It's global warming. Everyone's like it comes on stage. Hang

Bridie Connell  32:07  
on a sec. Just cuz I just need just two seconds. Here these men. All of these men now I promise you have high profile corporate jobs in Sydney

Dan Ilic  32:23  
with a short without a doubt. And they still believe the same thing.

Lewis Hobba  32:28  
They're selling the properties in Potts points that have gone up 200% Because they shut down fun in the cross.

Dan Ilic  32:33  
I'm pretty sure I'm pretty sure we interviewed the cost of Sydney Lux listing so I'm pretty sure that

Lewis Hobba  32:40  
those two bled out guys who were like, not just China and India like those were the people at COP 26 representing Australia to fuck me

Unknown Speaker  32:50  
what make the ice caps melt? What was it frozen ice melts, it cools down the rest of the earth.

Unknown Speaker  32:59  
What do you not let

Unknown Speaker  33:01  
me just get a lot out of government. Maybe

Unknown Speaker  33:03  
that might help. That's a big one. Yeah, get a lot out of grab a woman.

Unknown Speaker  33:07  
I don't give a fuck about global warming right getting pizzas Yana pizza. What about gay marriage? Personally? It's Adam and Eve. Not Adam and Steve.

Unknown Speaker  33:19  
I'm not against guys. But gay marriage is fucking a bit too fun. Guys, yeah, you guys.

James Colley  33:27  
Very disappointed in Stuart Lee on the left.

Unknown Speaker  33:32  
Guys have civil unions already. So it's exactly the same writers game like men and women marriages. Why do they have to have the same as us? Kind of like black people? Well, no, not kind of like black people. Because marriage is traditional. You can't go against tradition. That's what I'm saying. Like slavery. Not against slavery. No, slavery is pretty traditional. Its traditional. But it's wrong.

Unknown Speaker  33:57  
Like gay marriage is cool, man. Because everyone says God is like, our main merchant ship. God didn't make marriage. It's a man made thing, man. of fact, but 50 years ago that no we're voting I'm pretty sure it's a lie. I made that up in the spot. But yeah, look at it. Look at him. we're innovating. Women are marrying men and married. There's nothing wrong with it. It's

Unknown Speaker  34:24  
two males that want to get down to business buddy can ask this that. It's up to them. I'm against

Unknown Speaker  34:33  
against my religion. What about if it wasn't your religion? If it wasn't my religion, if he had a different religion?

Unknown Speaker  34:41  
What would have been sensitive about it?

Dan Ilic  34:49  
Those are the days so dies on the rest of 2012.

Bridie Connell  34:53  
The only thing that I like that that was a brief reprieve from that Frank A horrifying couple of minutes of the day was the guy who was like, for climate change. Let's get pizzas which I reckon as a policy slogan. I would vote for that party every time. Sadly, they weren't

James Colley  35:13  
called Five pizzas.

Dan Ilic  35:17  
That is it for a rational fee. Big thank you to James Koehler, he Bridey. Connell and Lewis, how about now James and Bridey? You guys have got a brand new podcast that you you want to plug on the show.

Bridie Connell  35:31  
We know two best friends who decided to start a podcast we thought it's never been done.

James Colley  35:38  
If you enjoy political satire, you're going to love us pouring through the horrible vanity albums of B list celebrities in vanity project.

Bridie Connell  35:48  
Yes, it's a very fun time. And there are a surprising amount of vanity albums out there. So we are having a great old time going through them and it's been really fun so far.

Lewis Hobba  35:58  
Who have you done a bar?

Dan Ilic  36:00  
I? Well, I've been listening to the Paris Hilton episode that you guys did with Beck shore. And I have to say, every time you play a song, I simultaneously get annoyed when you cut it off. Didn't start talking and kissing doesn't like hang on a second though. It's actually pretty good. What's going on there? Paris Hilton. She's a She's a superstar waiting to have a

Bridie Connell  36:20  
truly it's been my favorite album that we've covered so far.

James Colley  36:23  
I can tell you our next album up is Steven Seagal songs from the crystal cave and you will not have that feeling. Wow,

Bridie Connell  36:32  
you're like life will flash before your eyes if you listen to this.

Dan Ilic  36:37  
And the name of the podcast is vanity project. Is it? vanity project? Yeah, you can listen to it wherever you get podcasts big thank you also to rode mics, the birth of foundation and our Patreon supporters as well as Jacob round on the Tepanyaki timeline. Now we had a whole stack of people sign up to Patreon from last week so big thank you to people signing up Sarah Brennan Chris Brooks Elaine van Bergen, Lucy M Peter Clayton pebbles Alinsky. Roz quirk, Sean McQueen, Abdul Youssef and Matt best you're the best so please, if you like this podcast, please subscribe to patreon.com forward slash irrational fear. And if you want some joke keeper stickers for the first people to sign up to the $14 a month level I will send you out a sticker pack with all of the joke keeper stickers I can muster so please do sign up and I'll shoot you out a joke keeper sticker pack I noticed. Peter Lola on the on the text has already said free jokey billboards count me in. Well, Peter, I've already sent him an envelope. It's on the way Peter, it's going out to you. It's going out already. It's

James Colley  37:40  
going to break the back of your poster.

Bridie Connell  37:44  
Not it's a tiny child and a full clip.

Dan Ilic  37:48  
Anything else you want to plug before we go Louis?

Lewis Hobba  37:50  
No nothing for me dan.

James Colley  37:52  
I've got some vintage irrational fear sticker packs here. So

Dan Ilic  37:58  
I got that poster that says Tony Abbott bad Rastro

Well, that is it. That is it for the show. b Thank you everyone. We'll see you next time until next week. There's always something to be scared of. And you know what, you know, maybe we'll just rather than do like a long retrospective. We should just play a little bit of something from old days once once an episode or something like that. That's fun. Oh,

James Colley  38:25  
I'd love to be edited out of that.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

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--------------

Bertha Announcement  0:00  
This podcast is supported in part by the birth of foundation. This episode of irrational fears

Dan Ilic  0:05  
recorded on the land of the direwolf people sovereignty was never said When did a treaty let's stop the show. A rational

Unknown Speaker  0:11  
fear contains naughty words like bricks, Canberra fan COMM And section 40 of our rational view recommended listening by immature audience.

Alan Jones  0:24  
Good morning, everyone. I'm Alan Jones debt, Ilitch has invited me to host the interview show for a rational fear as my own show. Keulen was too popular and crashed the internet after three minutes of streaming. Oh god, you know who else crashed after three minutes of my streaming July on Gilad? Now this show is dedicated to the most important people in the country, the sponsors of a rational theme, we will celebrate them all in this very special episode, the highs, the lows and be in between. This is genuinely cash for comments. Let's kick it off with a message from my very dear friend and close personal tuber Peter Dutton.

Peter Dutton  1:06  
Oh, Peter Dutton here wishing you and your family Christmas and reminding you that just like Santa Claus, I'm keeping a list of who is naughty and nice. Previously, if you were an Australian citizen, and you made a joke about a minister, for instance, a minor dog looking like a potato, there was no way he could legally tap your phone or jingle your bell. But as of today, ASIO can be my own personal health on a shelf, and I can spy on anyone I want foreign, more Australian, more Australian it looks a bit foreign or worse, the leader of the greens. So if you're gonna buy certain jokes about certain ministers, remember, potatoes have eyes and they could see when you are sleeping, and they know when you're awake. Just consider yourself lucky that Santa Claus isn't coming by boat. Whoa, whoa, whoa, authorized unopposed by Peter Dutton, Canberra.

Alan Jones  2:06  
Thank you, Peter. What a warm kind of Dare I say jolly man. Next up is another jolly fellow, the President of the United States of America's alternative reality. Donald Trump. Here he is writing a letter to fake incoming President Joe Biden way back in January 26.

Donald Trump  2:26  
Dear Joe, as you are senile, I will write this letter slowly. As I leave the White House with my wife and her lookalikes. I reflect on my time here as a career highlight of their with when I play the successful hotel owner in home alone to last in New York, even though you had the highest amount of votes in US history. I had the second highest and second is better than first. Justice two is higher than one. That's just a fact looking. So with that in mind, congratulations on pulling off a hoax election and undermining the country. I das by red cap your way and have chosen to write this letter in my finest crayons. You have ruined democracy in ways I could only dream and I usually only dream of the hamburger. But as a chick with big Tata. It has been an honor being the president of a country that would allow me to be president. Sincerely, Donald J. Trump. PS follow me on parler PPS, actually don't follow me on.

Alan Jones  3:32  
Good on your Donald from the President of the USA to the president of Australia. Rhythm Murdoch was awarded a lifetime achievement award back in January for how many lives he's managed to suck the blood out of to stay alive himself. Ah, well, Dad Rupert,

Rupert Murdoch  3:48  
good evening paying subscriber Rupert Murdoch here saying thanks for my lifetime achievement Award. It fills me with enthusiasm for my final days of planetary destruction until I die. Well, let me tell you I'm far from done. I've ruined democracies in the UK, USA and Australia. But they're still pansy little democratic countries around the world that have yet to be torn apart by my lieutenants. Defense us little New Zealand, I'm looking at you. There's a real movement to silence conservatism, which is why my 1000s of publications, TV networks and radio stations are home to them. And let's not forget MySpace, the future of the Internet. Once Facebook and Google are taxed into submission, you'll need an account. You can even put me on your top five friends if you'd like to young people, I say do what I do. Try to destroy everything before you die leaving behind a hash of a planet that looks just like my heart. Oh, and by The Daily Telegraph all the Herald Sun confidential this week is particularly sexy believe

Alan Jones  5:01  
Rupert Murdoch will be back in just a moment to explain why the federal government is forcing big tech players like Google and Facebook to pay media proprietors for their content. And why wouldn't be listening to me talk about how many immigrants shouldn't be allowed into the country, his premium stuff. But before that, here is a message from Bill Gates on why you should take a dump on

Bill Gates  5:20  
Google. Hello, I'm Bill Gates, former Microsoft founder and CEO now full time Boomer with too many resources at hand. And when I'm not planning to vaccinate the world with the latest antivirus, I'm using Bing Bing almost works as great as Google. That's why over 6% of the world trust Bing to find what they're looking for. Say you want to find the best coffee shop near you. All you have to do is go to www.bing.com and type in Spanish Civil War, and the best coffee shops will appear on your screen. And say you want to read all the latest news on your phone. Just download the Bing app and hit the latest news tab. And you can binge all the latest news on the cost of Concordia Shipra departure of Google from Australia my old friends at Microsoft are ready to make being relevant to Australia as Australia is relevant to the world. I wonder this has nothing to do with the rumors of me trying to inject you with 5g nanobots just try to search for it I'm hoping it doesn't exist. bearing

Alan Jones  6:40  
good on your bill is February rolls around so does all things budgets and to celebrate here is something very very special and strange.

Unknown Speaker  6:50  
Frydenberg industries and audible presents economic measures as you've never heard them before mother mind my money my mother from his hermetically sealed home studio in the southern highlands. Robbie McGregor Australia's most well known sexiest voice. Okay, already says the woods stimulus package for three sexy hours.

Robbie McGreggor  7:18  
stimulus package, stimulus package, stimulus package, stimulus package, stimulus package, stimulus package

Unknown Speaker  7:30  
ride the wave of fiscal foreplay,

Robbie McGreggor  7:34  
stimulus package, stimulus package or stimulus package, stimulus package

Unknown Speaker  7:42  
anomic era eroticism package ride the down Jones bull all the way until his bubble bursts stimulus package stupid.

Unknown Speaker  8:12  
Frydenberg stimulus package is guaranteed to get everyone excited except for freelancers, migrants and casual workers. If you use the offer code hashtag fuck freelancers, get a 20 minute bonus of Robin McGregor saying the words quantitative easing,

Robbie McGreggor  8:26  
quantitative easing, quantitative quantitative

Unknown Speaker  8:30  
Frydenberg stimulus package is available to download from the audible store. Now. If you're registered for GST,

Robbie McGreggor  8:38  
oh.

Alan Jones  8:43  
I've got no idea what that was. It was like living through a Labour government. We're doing a recap of the 2021 sponsors of irrational fear. And thank God the coalition is here to govern the only effective way we know how press conferences

Rupert Degas  8:58  
standby for an announcement about announcements from the Commonwealth of Australia. The federal government to secure the COVID-19 vaccine for all Australians is what we hope you picked up from the news this week. We haven't yet but we announced it. How good would that be? Just like the $2 billion national bushfire recovery fund that only existed in your brain the moment we announced it now that science and not to mention getting the arts industry back on their feet with a Coronavirus stimulus package that we haven't delivered. That was a really good announcement. We did it ages ago. Guys. Sebastian was there. And he looked sad. The federal government announcing things because doing things is the state's responsibility. Spoken by Rupert Degas, my son was being crushed because I have to read these ads to stay alive regardless of my own political opinion.

Alan Jones  9:43  
The pandemic remember that? Gosh, more like plan Demmick I feel stronger than ever. And you know who else is my good friend Jerry Harvey. Oh,

Scott Morrison  9:53  
it's the Harvey Norman swimming in money sale.

There's so much money we're drowning in it profits up 116% sales up by $462 million. As a bonus we're keeping job keeper That's right $22 million from the government to help struggling businesses during a pandemic The only thing we're struggling to do is find space to bottle this excess $22 million tax free interest free no cash back

Unknown Speaker  10:18  
the savings are huge and Harvey Norman if you're me, Jerry

Scott Morrison  10:23  
it's the Harvey Norman swimming in money sale. Oh cash that's gotta say. Say

Alan Jones  10:29  
good on your Jerry. He's a go at that one. Remember the first time the plan Demick finished and the government was literally begging people to fly the broom. The only reason to fly the broom is to sweep your life under the carpet.

Robbie McGreggor  10:44  
Federal government is giving away 800,000 Half Price plane tickets to anywhere in Australia. That is a marginal electorate. There's never been a better time to seek the seven swinging wonders of Australia. Walk through the colossal Women's Rugby Union change rooms of Red Cliff Queensland it or hike through the poisoned wasteland where they're hanging native grasslands of jam land one screw or fly to secluded Kangaroo Island just stay in your own rather check to experience how the Emperors of the Great Pyramid Scheme of Paladin once left swinging by swing seats has never been this cheap. All you have to do is just sell a little tiny part of yourself if you book through hello world use the offer code one word all lowercase. I know my tears Coleman and you'll get a surprise discount you'll have no idea about obviously free travel. There's nothing marginal about the seven swinging wonders service Australia do pack a jacket because anywhere you go, it's gonna be Bellwether

Alan Jones  12:06  
now here's one of the best ideas I've ever heard of when it comes to accountability. No, it's not a federal ipecac it's a hotline to kick the pause pour.

Bronwyn Morgan  12:15  
This episode of irrational fear is brought to you by Makayla cashes. Dobin adult ledger hotline. If you know someone who is earning hard earned money from taxpayers and is refusing to do their job, just call one 800 dole bludger Oh, are

Scott Morrison  12:29  
you said to hold on to job in the bludger? Yes. Hello to Davina Blodger.

Unknown Speaker  12:34  
Yes come on barrel. Darrow who I think we need some more information

Scott Morrison  12:39  
there all the guard SEC last week after the job keeper thing ended off with him his job back at high five for three hours a fortnight in the bug or refused aerelon

Unknown Speaker  12:46  
job seeker? Did I? Was he applying for the job? Well, I

Scott Morrison  12:50  
reckon he would if I advertised that you haven't advertised the job then now then the tax department would not right. So what are you going to do about it? You're going to ring him and tell him that he should take it away

Unknown Speaker  13:00  
that maybe I could I have your full name and contact number should click to hang up you actually need to press the red button not say click off. Thanks.

Bronwyn Morgan  13:11  
One 800 dole bludger because there's nothing more Australian than dubbing in your mates.

Alan Jones  13:18  
For a brief moment in March 2021, Australia was one of the few countries in the world that didn't have real news on Facebook. What a relief. Thankfully, Sky News was available still at the time to explain why here's Rupert.

Rupert Murdoch  13:31  
So why isn't there any news on your Facebook newsfeed? Here's a quick explainer by me Rupert Murdoch left 10 on general of the News Corp and assorted expeditionary forces. Now, Mark Zuckerberg owns a website, Facebook, and Google owns a website called Google's and their websites own the data of all Australians who use it, which means they know what you want before you do. They're really good at selling advertising. I own newspapers that are really bad at selling advertising. And those newspapers own the Australian Government and the Australian government makes laws so one day on a whim I thought Geez Louise wave bad at selling edge. Not everyone wants 60 month interest free deals for electrical computers, furniture, bedding and flooring from Harvey Norman. Some people want magnetic lashes leggings that make you bump up and other bullshit. We have no idea. But then I said to myself, Rupert, you own a perfectly good government. It's just sitting there doing nothing. Maybe you can get them to force the blokes with the websites that are good at selling ads to give us money. Then I call the government to my house by private jet made them pay for And I said, Hello government, man, I forget their names. I've had a lot of staff turnover lately. If you still enjoy being the government, can you do this? And they said, We do still enjoy being the government boss. Yes. And yes, we can do that. Now the websites that are good at selling ads have to by law, give me money. And the best part about it Googles and Facebooks give the money straight to me tax free. And we wouldn't have it any other way. Why start paying tax now? Of some journalists would say, oh, but there's no way to guarantee that money will be invested in New Journalism. Well, none of those journalists work for me. I don't hire journalists out and you may have noticed Facebook news is back. For now. Zuckerberg told the government is only going to pay us if he feels like it. Well, I respect that. At the end of the day, Facebook, Google and I all agree that we're not going to pay any money to the Australian Government. Because why would you? There are a bunch of

Alan Jones  16:14  
cowards you technology has become quite the constant in our lives. I remember when I got a TV remote control for the first time and that the click of a button you could flick between watching me on the Ernie sigley Show to watching me on the online shown to watching me on the bird show to watching me on the Graham Kennedy show to watching me on the Simon Gallagher show to watching me on the John Singleton show you're watching me on the Mike Walsh show to watching me on the Barry Crocker show to watching me on the TED Hamilton show to watching me on the Darryl summer show and to watching me on the Alan Jones Show. Now that was media diversity when it comes to new technology to keep track of consent. Dawood knows who is allowed in which holes better than a New South Wales Police Commissioner.

Scott Morrison  16:57  
Hi, I'm Nick fuller. As New South Wales Police Commissioner, I love stripping down with others but gaining consent can be a confusing process. That's why we've developed a new app to help men with important careers feel safe at night. If individuals have developed relations to a point where undergarments could be heading in a southerly direction, it's important to document the consent of each party before the engagement of horizontal proceedings. Simply take out your service New South Wales app and scroll to the sexual consent form. You and your sexual participants simply tick the boxes for the style and duration of sexual intercourse. Also note if applicable, which private high school participants attended. So we assign the most appropriate legal response should we even need to then simply sign on the screen or use a finger on the fingerprint reader. If one of your participants is too drunk to sign definitely don't coerce them or just place their finger on the fingerprint reader. They'll never be able to prove otherwise, then and only then can sexual intercourse proceed at a location of your choice. There is currently a 15 person limit per sexual event per household. But this will relax as COVID rules change. Now, this is important. If any participant changes their mind it won't be automatically updated by the app. But were assured by the Boston Consulting Group that this will be addressed in a future upgrade. So when emotions are running high, remember now at no wet. This has been a message from the New South Wales Police. Thank you.

Alan Jones  18:31  
Usually right now I'd love to have Anthony clear on the show. But unfortunately, Dan Ilic turned irrational fear don't have enough patreon supporters are caught is so cheap. Instead, here is Andrew bolts daughter, Gabby bolt blurting out a tune about how the Prime Minister of Australia can relate to women who he is related to

Gabbi Bolt  18:52  
welcome to the fifth annual Parliament House karaoke competition. I know I know Garrett comes back and wins every year. But I might not be one to pick up a hose. But I certainly have picked up a microphone before

Unknown Speaker  19:06  
Hey, kids

Unknown Speaker  19:07  
learn from my empathy consultant turns out all that I have to say is I find those guys repulsive once I a thing about how I will

Gabbi Bolt  19:16  
propose real change. But if I try to cry, maybe no one will notice anything strange.

Unknown Speaker  19:27  
cuz I'll stand up for women when they need me. But only the ones

Gabbi Bolt  19:32  
I like. Jenny and the girls only relate to my relatives. Good. I really even I haven't named names. I mean, I'm not to blame. I could have shot protesters right at the scene.

But I didn't want to know

why Jenny and the girls Yeah, Jenny

I'm personally nailing Miss Dutton. What do you think? Scott better than

Unknown Speaker  20:10  
Danny and the girls?

Alan Jones  20:13  
Oh, what a voice. Up next, some pandemic recovery packages that aren't about building out a gas pipeline. Oh, God.

Bronwyn Morgan  20:21  
The rules of federal parliament are changing from April 1 2021. Some behavior will now be quietly condemned. Whether that's accidentally quote, assaulting a silly drunk girl, or just whacking on a desk. The consequences of your actions could now be enforced with serious thinly veiled threats. Like you could lose your portfolio, lower the chances of pre selection maybe or possibly even getting a telling off by a state Premier. That's why the Prime Minister's Prime Minister for female complaints is introducing knob keeper. knob keeper provides relief for your upstanding member. Non keeper supports knobs with fully paid leave, so you can spend more time with your family if you still have one before coming back and fulfilling your promise to the Australian people while collecting $200,000 A year or your fully paid leave can be used to brief a team of lawyers so you can sue a trusted journalist who never mentioned your name for defamation. But remember, if you're not sure whether that upskirting photo or dick pic is appropriate, check with Jenny first Julie has a way of clarifying no keeper, a helping hand for our big swinging decks authorized by irrational fear on behalf of the Australian Brotherman Canberra.

Alan Jones  21:41  
Well, that explains a lot but not as much as who is eligible for those irrelevant vaccines which the government has done with absolute clarity.

Virginia Gay  21:50  
We understand there's been some confusion about who is eligible for the COVID-19 vaccine and who votes labor.

Rupert Degas  21:57  
That's why the federal government is clearing up the confusion with job seeker.

Virginia Gay  22:02  
Job Seeker tells you when the Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine will be made available to groups most in need of protection first, and Liberal Party donors.

Rupert Degas  22:12  
These vulnerable communities have been identified by medical experts and focus groups.

Virginia Gay  22:18  
Group one includes people who are at increased risk of being silenced by Kancil culture,

Rupert Degas  22:24  
like journalists who haven't asked any questions, cab drivers and divorced dads with an axe to grind on facebook

Virginia Gay  22:31  
group to priority access will also be given to people working in critical services such as

Rupert Degas  22:37  
residents of marginal electorates, sharks fans, coal industry professionals,

Virginia Gay  22:42  
and men with law degrees who went to university with current or former Liberal Party Cabinet members.

Rupert Degas  22:48  
If you're not listed in groups one or two, keep checking job seeker to see when other groups of people will be eligible for the AstraZeneca vaccine like women's scientists, union members, and Tom Ballard, who will definitely be last on the list job seeker, helping those who are more on to Australia than others get a COVID-19 vaccine first whenever they fucking arrive, authorized by someone anonymously to give us plausible deniability. Should it all go to hell camera.

Alan Jones  23:16  
Back in April Scott Morrison visited a Pentecostal church and tell them that God gave to him in a dream and told him to run for the top job as Prime Minister now, I've never called Nick grana God, and I don't think I'm about to start now.

God  23:32  
Hi, I'm God, also known as Yahweh, the Lord Jehovah, and in some circles, Jenin you may remember me for being the father of Jesus, the guy who was murdered by the mob when the local authorities claimed his safety was the responsibility of the states. Now I just want to clear a few things up. Your Prime Minister Scott Morrison claimed that I came to him in a vision. And I said, quote, Scott, you've got to run for Prime Minister. Well, that's not how I remember it. I remember appearing to him and saying, Scott, you've got the runs. And if you don't make it home, you'll have to stop at anger Dean McDonald's. I'm glad we could clear that up on the record. And remember, folks love one another. Although I understand that's more of an inner city a dinner party cafe, green's thing to do. Oh, and by my book is big, and it's a best seller.

Alan Jones  24:38  
May 2021. So corporate Australia ran out of patience with Coronavirus while hospitals had an oversupply of patients. Back in May the CEO of Virgin had a message for anyone wanting to travel overseas again.

Virginia Gay  24:54  
A message from Virgin Australia. You may have heard our CEO say that Cost of opening up international borders is that some people will die. Sorry for the gas. It's our first time. We want to let all Australians know that there's always a small risk of dying on one of our flights, be it from the food, overcrowding, or watching too many Adam Sandler movies on long haul connections. at Virgin Australia, we're committed to helping our customers reach their dream destination, but an unlucky few will also reach their ultimate destination. At least Virgin Australia customers can take comfort in the fact that, unlike Qantas, your death will most likely be delayed. Virgin Australia, some people will die, but probably not on time.

Alan Jones  25:47  
The NDIS is a crucial service for Australians with a disability but according to the government this year, there's only two problems with it. One, it costs money into the public servants who run it have bleeding hearts. Now to me that sounds like a preexisting condition garden.

NDIS Empathy Hotline  26:04  
Thanks for calling NDIS. Unfortunately, all of our empathetic Public Service employees are attending other customers, or they're in a meeting with human resources because of something they tweeted or are at home suffering burnout, and Your call has been diverted to our artificially intelligent empathy hotline. If you require a computer generated voice to occasionally say listening sounds like oh, yeah, and Aha, and oh, no, you poor thing. Press one. If you would like to be misdiagnosed by an artificial doctor, press two, to experience having this call being passed to an endless loop of computer generated NDIS employees for several hours. Press three to speak to the human breast for that's a little computer joke. There are no more humans, they're all fired. If you would like to meditate to the pace for sound of a dot matrix printer, stay on the line.

Alan Jones  27:09  
If we've learned anything this year about the management of the pandemic, it's not a race, because we're all gonna die sooner or later. We're not me, I'll live forever.

Rupert Degas  27:19  
This episode of irrational fear is brought to you by the National Vaccine rollout. Remember, it's not a race. It's a marathon, which is the name of a race. But in this case, no one is racing. It's more of a fun run.

Unknown Speaker  27:33  
But not funny.

Rupert Degas  27:35  
And there's no running. Because the National Vaccine rollout is the gold standard. A monetary policy that was abandoned by Australia in 1932. Steel, it sounds nice, like a gold medal. But you'd get if you won a race, which the National Vaccine rollout definitely isn't authorized by the Department of mixed metaphors and grasping at straws camera.

Alan Jones  27:55  
Well, let's clear that up. In July 2021, the federal government upped its vaccine messaging, that is to say they started vaccine messaging, only a year and a half into the pandemic. They put out an ad to encourage everyone to get the vaccine. But back in July, no one could get the vaccine. It was harder to get a vaccine that tickets to any other musical. God. That was a good show. I was in it. Oh dear.

Dan Ilic  28:19  
She was a 39 year old non essential graphic designer who was merely eight months away from being eligible for a FISA vaccine. And yet, she refused to enroll herself into St. Joseph's College. Let's be COVID-19 together, turn 40 Sooner or be the son of Liberal Party donors. Spoken by someone who never be held to account for the audit hold a syringe to Bob and Gambro

Alan Jones  28:41  
2021 was a census year, which is an old fashioned way for the government to know everything about you before we had social media and QR codes.

Rupert Degas  28:50  
Tuesday the 10th of August is senseless Nice. Each household is required by law to fill out the online form. So the Australian Bureau of Statistics can collect data on the makeup of Australia and to see if the NBN is working in your area. It then gives that data to the federal government so they can build critical services like carpark sporting facilities and hospitals in coalition seats, regardless of what the data says. The senseless providing scientific data to the Australian government so they can willfully ignore it authorized by a bunch of glittering idiots in Canberra

Alan Jones  29:22  
in August 2021 With cop 26 Only a few months away. Everyone was talking about climate change that doesn't exist. Lots of people think we've already solved it. Well, let me tell you something. David Attenborough didn't think so. God

Robbie McGreggor  29:35  
OMA series finale of who Lammott Earth things are really heating up. Mr. Morrison,

David Attenborough  29:42  
it's with regret to inform you that the snow is on fire. You need to do something. Now.

Scott Morrison  29:49  
I've always said I've got a plan and the plans the plan. It's a plan a plan that's been planned. I've always said that

Robbie McGreggor  29:56  
will David Attenborough and the Earthlings be able to stop the Your time.

David Attenborough  30:02  
Now you listen hear Scott, we've only got a couple of years left until the point of no return. The numbers are just not

Scott Morrison  30:09  
looking good. Oh, that's great, then we can blame the collapse of the earth on labor.

Robbie McGreggor  30:13  
Oh, well, they suffocate themselves and every other living creature in a toxic soup of stinky greenhouse gases.

David Attenborough  30:23  
Everything is dying, Mr. Morrison, and you're doing nothing.

Scott Morrison  30:29  
I'm not going to do anything that will cost jobs. And the most at risk jobs are those on the boards of fossil fuel companies that all need after I lose the election in a month's time. I've always said that.

Robbie McGreggor  30:39  
I find out in this book potentially lost emissaries of the show, but jumped the shark of the Renaissance.

Planet Earth is recommended for mature audiences. It contains strong sex scenes, as the whole globe gets royally

Bill Gates  31:11  
fucked

Alan Jones  31:13  
when it comes to climate change. Thank God for the big Australian and I'm not talking about Ben Robert Smith. So big strong heads do now I'm talking about bhp who are pretending to do something about their huge carbon footprint. God

Rupert Degas  31:27  
in 2021 bhp is getting rid of fossil fuels and focusing on sustainability of our province. Our profits are fragile and we must do what we can to save them. And Experts warn that our reputation will soon face a tipping point from activist shareholders from which it could never recover. That's why we're selling our coal, oil and gas assets. Some other company can bravely ignore the problem of greenhouse emissions production that will continue unabated regardless, that bhp we believe the only way to clean up the planet is to wash your own hands first. We're doing it for our children and our children's children.

Scott Morrison  32:14  
Your children ours will be inheriting the province. Yeah, BHP open cut and running.

Alan Jones  32:21  
This government is cooked a lot of flack when it comes to action on climate change doesn't exist. But no one is talking about the Minister for emissions reduction plan to keep cows alive, which will make more co2 so that plants can survive.

Dan Ilic  32:34  
At the Australian government, we know that coal powered electricity plants are running out of time. On one hand, they're old, expensive, and make climate change worse every minute they run. But on the other hand, the coal industry also provides critical baseload donations to the LMP. So that's why we're launching coal keeper. We're spending $7 billion a year to keep coal powered polluting clunkers running way past their use by date. That way the LNP can get more donations from the coal industry to stay way past our use. By Date, the government could invest in new wind, solar and storage that renewable energy is to claim to give us donations, coal keeper, a reliable source of donations at the cost of only $400 per household per year. And everyone's existence

Alan Jones  33:29  
you know, something my good friend Jerry Harvey never ceases to amaze me when it comes to generosity. Harvey Norman acknowledged that they made a matzah on job keeper and they decided to give it back. Well, not all of it there'll be stupid Harvey Norman

Scott Morrison  33:41  
is giving $6 million of job keep her cash back I caved into a huge huge, huge public pressure as all my credibility went out the door. During the pandemic our profits increased by half a billion dollars selling furniture electrical embeddings $13 billion worth not to mention $22 million in free job keep no strings attached. But we're giving back all 27% of it. Wow, that sheets million dollars $6 million that the government can spend on car parks or sporting sheds and swinging electrodes in the hope that the Australian public will lose interest in Harvey Norman. Speaking of interest, we've kept $16 million interest free. Australia has been telling me to go Harvey go Harvey go fuck myself. And that's what I've done just a little bit.

Alan Jones  34:38  
As September rolled around more voices, we're adding to the pressure on the government to adopt a net zero target. Personally, I'd like to see Net Zero benefit Simon's is by 2030 on what an ogre Oh, God. G'day.

Dan Ilic  34:51  
I'm Dan Ilic, the executive director of the Australian lapsed Catholic lobby. And I just want to say that as the group that represents the largest sector of Christian In Australia laughs Catholics, we think the only way to give hope to children for their future is to take meaningful action on climate change, as statistically the only thing that will harm children more than climate change is an exponential increase of chaplains in schools. So please, when it comes to emissions net zero by 2030 and when it comes to chaplains and schools, gross zero by 2021.

Alan Jones  35:28  
Spoken and authorized by Dan Ilic for the Australian likes Catholic lobby, Canberra come in September. The Prime Minister copped a lot of flack for using Australia's Air Force One for personal trips, like flying to have high level multilateral talks with his family on Father's Day. Disgusting. Who'd have a family

Rupert Degas  35:43  
there is only one airline that can fly you to vacation in Hawaii while your home is ablaze. There's only one airline that can fly you to discover your family's history on the other side of the world, while families at home are being made history. And there's only one airline to help you secretly see your loved ones in another city when everyone else is only allowed to travel three miles from home. Fly the entitled skies where tone deaf headphones are complimentary.

Scott Morrison  36:16  
Oh, good to you. Very good. You're the best Prime Minister ever.

Rupert Degas  36:20  
The only airline where you don't have to put your seat up if you don't want to entitled airlines direct flights now available from Canberra to a place where they filmed the White Lotus.

Alan Jones  36:32  
Back in September with Sydney clocking up its 100th Day in lockdown, so called investigative humorist Dan Ilic stone it would be funny to take the mickey out of the premieres daily press conferences, I can assure you it wasn't smart or funny and needed more Anthony Kalia.

Dan Ilic  36:50  
Okay, thank you. Thanks, everyone. Okay, great. First of all, can I say how pleasing it is to hear so many people in this apartment block, yell at apartment number two, for playing Arctic Monkeys do I want to know on loop at 3am last night, it is so pleasing to hear everybody join in with a collective Shut up. That's really important. And please, we want to see more of that behavior in this apartment block. So thank you for that. As of 8pm Last night, we have seen three new episodes of Ted lasso, and two new episodes of what we do in the shadows. Those episodes had already existed in the community, and we are just catching up to them now. So what we want to do is be able to see more of those episodes sooner, but we realize there is a limit to how many streaming services people can sign up for. But as a little treat, there will be more episodes of succession for those who persist longer than the two week trial that binge is offering currently. So that's something to look forward to. For everyone that's on binge. As is a health advice, we have been going to the toilet a lot more often. But please can I just want to remind people if you are doing a number two, please please close the door after you to avoid airborne contaminants affecting the living space. This is a real issue. So please, please keep that door shut. Okay. For lunch today. It will be a spinach and tuna salad, as is the health advice. I just want to stress here. I just want to stress that it can be tempting to order a Portuguese chicken chili chips and solo combo from the local shop and have it delivered. But it is it that's fine in normal times, but it's not conducive to the long term sustainability of someone that's been in lockdown for over 10 weeks. Okay, you just can't keep that up. So tuna and spinach it is today. Now, can I say? On the weekend? We did witness about 12,000 people down at Bondi Beach just a few blocks from here. But the numbers haven't that 9000 Those people were from the Daily Mail and Channel Nine taking photos of everyone else. So please, if you do have to go to Bondi Beach, please wear a mask. So you aren't identified by Sydney confidential. Okay. All right now we'll take your questions. I've got some here from Twitter, climate patriot. Why have I never seen you in the same room as Jon Lovitz, and David Mitchell Well, climate patriots, this is an offensive question. Okay. And I'm not going to answer it. Okay. Mary wiper. What time does Dan Murphy's open? Look across most LGs it's some it's 9am to 8pm. But there are some LG A's that do it differently. So Guilford Randwick, North Ryde, you're looking at 10am opening in Mosman. It's a different closing time. 7pm. And they do that because you can't trust rich white people. You give them an inch, they take a mile and they build a hedge around that mob and no one's allowed to walk there. Okay, Gary Moore, why do we put an extra x in anti vaxis look, Gary that was a decision taken at national cabinet. The federal health minister and wanted to put three x's in there Triple X as his he's wanting the Premier's. We just thought one was enough. So we met halfway. That's why those, there's two in anti vaxxers. Okay. Hopefully that answers your question. Guido Tsali. What is the philosophical significance of girdles theorems? Look, we I think we all know, girdle was a brilliant thinker, but a wasn't a mainstream thinker. He had a lot of gaps in his theorem. It's safe to say his his theories have more gaps than a block of Swiss cheese. So that's that. Wilco last What's for lunch? Like we said in the briefing, spinach and tuna Wilker. That is the current plan. Taking the best advice from health there. Okay. Kim Fitzgerald, why is there air? Look him? The air is here Chem. Okay. We're committed to air. And can I just stress there are some in the press who say we should get rid of it, you know, get rid of the air get rid of the virus, but that's not going to happen. Okay. Areas necessary for life. And the current advice from health is that we must make a mandatory. Okay. Thanks, Kim. Peter credal asks, Do you scrunch or fold? Look, it is a tough question. And the advice currently is to do whatever you can do in front of you. There is research still being done. Currently, we're doing both we so crunching and folding. But if all you have is the ability to scratch them scratch if you're waiting for someone to teach you how to fold. We don't suggest that at all. Strange now. You can learn to fold later. Okay? Now's the time to scratch. Okay, you can't be fussy about scrunching or folding. Alright, Miss Wolfie wolf asks, Are we there yet?

No. No. All right. Thanks very much, everyone. Thanks very much.

Alan Jones  41:58  
Thank you. At the height of lockdown tensions in September Milburn's right wing fascist tended at high vis vest and pretended to be tradies and proceeded to ride in Melbourne, fake tradies are nothing new, but usually they're reserved for the Liberal Party, not the Nazi Party. Though it's hard to tell the difference these days, that's for sure. God.

Unknown Speaker  42:18  
White brothers, white bread through one of our own here today has portrayed us due to sick. So I say unto you, here in the group chat. On the first day, we shall rise, and we shall walk and together we will fight for our tiebreak. And on the second day, toward our enemies, we shall throw ceremonial peace.

Unknown Speaker  42:45  
I've just been struck in the back of her head by a camp, then we shall

Unknown Speaker  42:49  
go to the water and walk over the bridge the West Gate Bridge to the holy promised land of Werribee. And on the third day, I will descend upon the shrine of remembrance, and they will remember who we are. We are the chosen trainees returned to us what was taken our smoko. Until then, may their rivers turn into bourbon in their backyard swept by mosquitoes, their boards. Digit with be nice, they won't be easy. We will be persecuted, crucified in the media, but they're passionate but we will rise from the ashes of our building sites. We will beat Corona with protein, vitamin C and vitamin D. Blessed are those who hunger for righteousness, or I will feed them or the victim and they will remember us lest we forget in my own name. Amen.

Alan Jones  43:53  
Thanks ladies freedom loving white power traders word alone, we heard them and so did corporate Australia who was quite happy to help. At soft yakka we believe eating our meat pies and Chucky milk on the inside. So we believe the Anzacs didn't die fighting fascism during the global pandemic so we could choose to die during another global pandemic. And soft yakka we don't believe lockdowns should stop trival EMS Rocktober when it's already ruined lead September and Faith No More August soft yakka the official supplier of nappies to Melbourne tradies. So if you ask anyone inside the camera bubble, they'll tell you that the Liberal Party has a woman problem. Well, let me tell you that they're doing just fine and their latest program to address it should be put in the chat bag and be thrown out to see

Unknown Speaker  44:50  
in March of 2021. The women of Australia made it clear that they wanted things to change that up with the lack of government action when it comes to gendered violence. Many marched to Parliament has to demand the Morison government listen to what they had to say. Well, the good news is we did hear some of the many changes the Morison government made that will benefit all Australian women. When former Liberal staffer Brittany Higgins went public about an alleged rape in a ministerial office in 2019. The Prime Minister listens to Brittany after his

Dan Ilic  45:21  
wife clarified at him using his daughter's as a theoretical example,

Unknown Speaker  45:24  
and immediately ordered an inquiry into which members of his office knew about the alleged incident so the right people can be held accountable.

Dan Ilic  45:32  
This report was due in June 2021. It has now been suspended before it could be completed due to legal advice. When a historical rape allegation against Christian Porter was made public. He was immediately stood down after 27 days and he's a position of Attorney General only to avoid a conflict of interest while launching a defamation case against a woman journalist he later a border which means he definitely didn't lose or win. And Leader of the House, Christian Porter was later temporarily reappointed the leader of the House, and in 2018

Unknown Speaker  45:58  
the Morison government commissioned the respected work report, which made 55 recommendations towards how to improve women's safety at work

Dan Ilic  46:07  
of the 12 recommendations that needed parliamentary approval, the government passed half ignoring workplace laws to ban sexual harassment and for employees to have a duty of care to take meaningful action to prevent sexual harassment from happening. With Porter gone, not gone,

Unknown Speaker  46:20  
the Prime Minister created a new women's Task Force to tackle these problems. Head on the Morison government looks forward to making the behavior of blokes like Barnaby Joyce, who resigned from his position as Deputy Prime Minister due to sexual harassment allegations. A thing of the past.

Dan Ilic  46:36  
Barnaby Joyce is once again the deputy prime minister. He's also been appointed to the women's task force

Unknown Speaker  46:41  
because the Morison government looks forward to the future. That's why we're holding the Women's Summit in September of 2021. With a prime minister will definitely be listening to what the many speakers will have to say.

Dan Ilic  46:53  
Scott Morrison appointed himself as main speaker at the Women's Summit. Brittany Higgins was invited last minute by a third party.

Unknown Speaker  46:59  
Ladies you asked for change. And you got it

Dan Ilic  47:03  
not technically true. The liberal party put your blind trust in us supported by Diana royal am for rational fear Canberra,

Alan Jones  47:10  
come October 15. Only two weeks out from cop 26 The biggest climate change conference the world has ever seen which still doesn't exist. Barnaby Joyce decided now was a good time to start to think about doing nothing about climate change, which still doesn't exist.

Dan Ilic  47:26  
Do Sunday. It's the biggest decision in Australian climate politics history bigger than starting the emissions trading scheme bigger than axing the emissions trading scheme bigger than implementing their renewable energy targets bigger than canceling the renewable energy targets bigger than creating the Department of climate change bigger than dismantling the Department of climate change bigger than starting a mining super profits tax they get an ending of mining super profits tax begins hitting a sunset date for old coal plants bigger than trying to use Texas to keep those old coal plants alive bigger than the High Court ruling the Environment Minister has a duty of care to Australia's children bigger than the environment. Mr. Sage, you High Court Oh kill those children if I want to use three new coal mines much much much bigger, much much bigger than the size of the barrels the nets get their pork in this Sunday, the National Party will gather to vote on whether or not to agree on net zero by 2050. Like the rest of the world. Will the National Party dare to do the bare minimum for one or will they do whatever their mining donors want to help them stay in power for another 36 months and ruin the entire thing planet for every one for ever? This Sunday, a decision bigger than Barnaby some count the national party room showdown a donation will buy your whole seat but you'll only need the edge. There ain't no party like a National Party because the national parties don't adopt new policies.

Alan Jones  48:50  
I think it's safe to say we are a premium program here and a rational fear, which is why we're very very choosy when it comes to fresh tomato sandwiches and financial sponsors.

Rupert Degas  49:00  
You live in a fast changing world. Today's Attorney General is tomorrow's backbencher. Accountability is something that can only exist if you can see something to count. When you need a sense of mystery for your big pot of money. Put your blind faith in orders blind trust because whoever is paying off a public person's legal bills should remain private, at least until after the next election. Borders blind trust is sort of program should keep going in Australia essentially forever. terms or conditions don't apply. If you're a member of the Liberal government. Check the PDS for details. No really, please check because I couldn't find any details. When I look.

Alan Jones  49:40  
Well. Would you believe it 48 hours before cop 26 The biggest climate change conference in the entire world which doesn't exist. The government rushed out a plan on a napkin to reach net zero greenhouse emissions by 2050. Except the plan didn't reach that at all. Just like my ratings on Sky News. It fell short by about 50%

Dan Ilic  50:01  
It's time for another episode of Angus bull.

Scott Morrison  50:04  
Angus Taylor, welcome to the program.

Angus Taylor  50:06  
Thanks for having me species Great to be with you.

Dan Ilic  50:08  
The netzero 2050 plan from the Minister for emissions plateauing. First,

Angus Taylor  50:14  
the how. Now we are investing $20 billion in targeted r&d expenditure prioritizing key technologies like high clean hydrogen,

Dan Ilic  50:24  
clean hydrogen is the spin name for blue hydrogen, which is made from fossil fuels, which creates greenhouse gases, which adds to global warming. Anything else that may keep the fossil fuel dream alive, Minister for emissions plateauing to carbon capture and storage, carbon capture storage and mystery technology that doesn't work at scale anywhere in the world, the only thing it's managed to capture is time to delay the phasing out of fossil fuels. So what is this plan? That's not going to work going to cost? I mean, other than all life on Earth,

Scott Morrison  50:56  
the $20 billion, you mentioned there is just for the next for this decade. So what's the full cost to get to net zero?

Angus Taylor  51:04  
Well, that run rate of the money we're spending over the next decade is what we would expect into the future,

Dan Ilic  51:10  
expect to pay 20 billion each decade until we reach 2050. And if you include the 250 billion national slush fund, that may have been agreed to so that the prime minister could utter the syllables 2050 in Glasgow, that could be $310 billion. That's right $310 billion for a bunch of miracle technologies that don't work and don't cut emissions. Hope I'm not paying for it, just to

Scott Morrison  51:37  
be clear what a taxpayer is going to have to pay under your plan to get to net zero.

Angus Taylor  51:43  
Well, taxpayers are not paying anything. We're not raising taxes. I mean, that that's the important point.

Dan Ilic  51:49  
The 310 billion isn't going to be paid by taxpayers, it's going to be paid by the government who is paid by the taxpayers. Fantastic, great move. Well done. Angus. If the Minister for emissions reduction was interested in reducing emissions, he'd phase out fossil fuels and turn Australia into a renewable energy superpower, but he's not. He's interested in one thing, ensuring baseload donations from his fossil fuel friends.

Alan Jones  52:18  
One of the rational fears greatest guests in 2021 was mcnevin the self proclaimed World's Greatest high jumper. He's a national hero, just like me, Alan Jones.

Dan Ilic  52:27  
So McNabb and thanks for joining us and Australian high jumper who claims to be the greatest high jumper in the world. Welcome.

Mick Neven  52:33  
Yeah. Thanks for having me. Yeah, that is correct. I am.

Dan Ilic  52:37  
I am. Do it's an amazing claim to be the world's greatest high jumper. What's the basis for the claim? Well,

Mick Neven  52:44  
I have never missed the jump. No one's not that. That's right. I have never noticed the bar onto the mat. So what's your highest jump 50 centimeters 50 centimeters, that's not very high. Well, that is the target that I've set for myself. And I meet and beat that target. Every time I jump.

Dan Ilic  53:05  
Now, the mentor jam record is 2.45 meters and the women's record is 2.09 meters. You're nowhere near that.

Mick Neven  53:12  
I hear but I don't worry about what other high jumpers are doing. You've never once competed at the Olympic Games. Why would I see a limbic at the heart of all those so called high jumpers making bold claims about clearly 2.4 meters and what happens? They all not the bar onto the mat, and they look pretty stupid doing it. I made them beat my target every time I can do high jumper. Yeah, it's only 50 centimeters. That's right. I don't need to jump higher. I'm less than 2% of the world type jump. If I raised the bar to even 1.5 minutes sure I could jump it so that's a clear goal. To achieve that I need to coach I'd have to start training I did objective. Why bother? I can meet the beat that 50 centimeters and it doesn't tax me

Dan Ilic  53:54  
or anyone else. Yeah, 50 centimeters. You know a primary school kid could jump that jump. So

Mick Neven  53:59  
I am the world's greatest I'd never you're not the world's greatest. The World's Greatest high jumper. Never missed the jump. Don't forget that. Never missed the jump. Make. Thanks for joining us on irrational fear. See you on the mat buddy.

Alan Jones  54:16  
Now one of the reasons I don't go on social media is to constant bullying and criticism from voices who have megaphones but no real authority. If I wanted to experience that, I've just listened to my own show. Thankfully, the government has a plan to silence the wrong kinds of speech.

Peter Dutton  54:32  
Hi, I'm Peter Dutton. And I'm calling on the tech giants to keep Australians safe on the internet by implementing trolls seeker. Trolls seeker is about protecting the most vulnerable people to criticism in society, government ministers. So if you're an anonymous internet user who can't afford a defamation lawsuit, or worse, a journalist from the ABC with an incorrect opinion. You better watch out I already see when you're sleeping. I already know when you're awake. I don't know if you've been bad or good, but I don't know who you are. And that is a problem because we can't Trump a subpoena down your chimney. So, tech giants Facebook, Twitter, MySpace and Solitaire. I'm talking to you unmask your anonymous trolls now, especially the ones that look like eggs. I'm jealous, otherwise will unfriend you like they do in China, North Korea and Myanmar. Now that's how you handle a bully troll seeker. Protecting Australians who work at Parliament House trolls second does not apply to anonymous accounts run by MPs like Andrew laming Mark Latham, or Amanda Stoker, because that's just awkward fun.

Alan Jones  55:36  
Now, let me tell you something. When I got sacked from Sky News, I did it for a reason to serve Australia. I once coached the Wallabies I could cut the government easy peasy. For one. There's no point of it. Simon's in the Liberal Party. God, what an ogre. Good morning everyone and fellow Australians, many people are asking me when am I going to run for politics? Well, there's no better time to step up than after being stood down. So after being the king of broadcasting on TV, and who GB I'm joining the LNP. After all, they share my values, we both deny the existence of climate change. We both deny the existence of women. We both know how to do cash flow comment. Speaking of there's never been a better time for gas led recovery. Nine out of 10 epidemiologists agree the best way to cure a respiratory virus like COVID-19 is with a gas pipeline, pumping delicious, natural methane to everyone's home where they sleep. Turn on your gas pipe today. And when it comes to accountability, I'm not scared of a federal icoc After all, I've had to face achma a number of times. Remember when I started a race, right? I was held accountable and forced to say sorry, God, that was hard. It was only a race, right? So they've won me, Alan Jones on Alan Jones to join the Liberal Party which got us to sign me up just like Sky News were to get us to get my brave opinions on the air. So I did the next best thing I got one of my interns to start a company that I held a press conference to announce to the world that my interns company would be signing me up for a brand new all digital network cure LAN. The Morning everybody. Over the last few months I've been undergoing emergency medical treatment on my leg. It turns out I had been leaning too far to the left. God thank God they fix that up. Now while I've been away those vermin at scar news have canceled me. Yes, I'm a victim of canceled culture. So that's why I'm starting my own social network. Cancel your Foxtel subscriptions and sign up for que LAN the social network by me Alan Jones from sign up you can enjoy all the benefits of being a kulen member, Robert Menzies is still Prime Minister,

Robert Menzies  57:44  
you call a man a racist. The Wallabies win every

Alan Jones  57:47  
now and then. And for the first time in four years, the Wallabies have won mark Latham cooks up a delicious Southeast Asian inspired meal. These are the best scones. And each week a new album is released by Anthony Kelly as a I want a voice sounds like a bit like a computer but we're working that out. And the best thing is you'll be surrounded by like minded retirees over the age of 65. So you'll never have to worry about grandchildren correcting you with fake news about climate change from NASA. God global warming, what next? There's a plague or something. Give me a break. Anything you can do on Facebook you can do on Cuba LAN plus more. You can poke people. Yes, you can berate people, you can put people in a chat bag and throw them out to see you can even inside a race right at the click of a button. And the best thing is a camera can't touch you. So join que LAN the social network where free speech is for easy payments of 4999 a month and you can be friends with me Alan Jones for an extra 699 a month. That's real cash in the comments. So join cure Len today. I was gonna call up Jonestown but it was taken on Alan Jones. Well, that is it for another year. A big big thank you to Jake Brown, Dan Ilic Rupert Degas, Robin McGregor, mcnevin Virginia gay brother and Morgan, Anthony callea and all of the Patreon subscribers that Australian digital holdings including John the deep as kid to read McCoy Tenjin sing, Fred Stokes, Ned Bilham Ziqi and Alistair Bondo Mazagon. Thank you very much. honored to have you on our little podcast program. Good dad, Australia.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

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This is the 3rd Episode of the monthly spin-off podcast from A Rational Fear — Julia Zemiro Asks 'Who Cares?' 

Each month for the next 4 months on the A Rational Fear podcast feed, Julia will be interviewing change makers, civic leaders, and people who organise their communities and claim their power to discover the secrets to making good things happen.

This month Julia chats with two Australian very different Australian media leaders who at the opposing ends of their career timelines

Kerry O'Brien— One Australia's most distinguished journalists. Kerry O'Brien may be off our TV screens, but he is far from retired. Kerry is busy, writing and thinking about journalism and democracy. In this chat with JZ, Kerry talks about how the atomisation of media puts our democracy at risk.

also we hear from:

Zara Seidler — The co-founder of one of the largest publishers of youth media in Australia. The Daily Aus is Australia's leading social-first news service. Offering young Australians a digestible and engaging way to access the news, all through social media. The Daily Aus reaches nearly 300,000 young people through its Instagram, Tiktok, email and podcast channels.

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Julia Zemiro  0:00  
This podcast is supported in part by the birther foundation. I'm recording my part of Julia's Amuro asks, Who cares on the lands of the gunman? Gara and Darwell people, sovereignty was never ceded. We need a treaty. Let's start the podcast.

Dan Ilic  0:18  
A podcast about politics for people who hate politics. This is Julia Mira asks Who cares?

Julia Zemiro  0:27  
Hello Julia here and thank you again for joining me on the irrational fi podcast feed to listen to who cares this month, Kerry O'Brien and Zara sideline to people who have been and are working in the media in Australia. Zara Seidler in her 20s with Sam Koz Lasky set up the daily oz news for millennials will be speaking to her after we speak with Kerry O'Brien, of course, carries a prominent Australian journalist and author whose long career includes 28 years as a national current affairs, television presenter and interviewer. From this day to night, four corners Lateline, the 730 report where he was editor and presenter for 15 years, he's written two books, one on former Australian Prime Minister for Keating, but more recently, a memoir on the social and political upheavals he's witnessed in half a century of journalism. And that's what I wanted to talk to him about today, because one of the biggest upheavals I think, is this independent grassroots movement. And I wanted to ask him what he thought about that and where he thought it might go.

Kerry O'Brien  1:41  
Just in terms of the phenomenon, and it is one I think it's been in the pipeline for quite a while, it's been coming to a slowly, and I think it's probably been hastening, the more people have become disillusioned and lost respect, and grown angrier and more frustrated with the political process, I don't think the state of politics in this country has been at a lower ebb in my working life as a journalist than it is now. And there are all kinds of reasons for that. But in terms of how the media deals with it, I would say, the media in its coverage of politics really reflects the state of our society to in the sense that we are digitally disrupted, generally, in all of our individual lives, and the media is disrupted, as it hasn't been, for a very, very long time. And disrupted not necessarily in a good way. I mean, what ultimately emerges, in a sense is in the lap of the gods, it's not all that easy to predict. I hope I never lose faith in the belief that the public will always be hungry for information. And that the same reasons that saw journalism gradually proliferate through the developed world as the printing presses arrived, and, and as communications improved, and so on. So I just don't see how we will ever lose that hunger. But what I also hope is that the quality of end and accuracy and responsibility of coverage doesn't continue to dissipate as it has, because of the disruption, because of the extent to which the Internet has crowded, and got in the way of the capacity of the mainstream, credible media to function as it is supposed to.

Julia Zemiro  3:34  
But I don't think we're ever going to be able to wind back to 24 hours news cycle.

Kerry O'Brien  3:39  
Well, I just think that there will be an evolution of some kind, Julia, I mean, I don't think what we've seen in the last, say 15 years, slowly, and then gathering pace. And now Now it's kind of on us is the meeting in the middle of the various news operations, and media operations. So print and television have met in the middle, we have converged, we've been talking about convergence for a long time, we now have convergence, it's still evolving. And the final form of that convergence is still there to be kind of played with speculated upon. But print, and television and radio have all met in the middle, you can see the ways that print is adapting to that. And I think it still has quite a ways to go. Whereas in one way, it's been a bit easier for for television, and radio to adapt to its online presence, particularly the ABC, because we're just changing the written word somewhat. We're changing if we're writing for online as opposed to for television. We're writing just for the oral word and the written word. Whereas for newspaper journalists who've known only print writing for print, in their past, they've got to learn the process of writing for pictures and and writing in a different way. So they'll catch up, they are catching up. You can see it They'll they're developing the interviewing skills. I mean, I can remember when I was a print journalist, you'd go with your little tape recorder and you'd sit down, you'd have a chat. And you'd cover all the ground and you'd walk away with about an hour of stuff, about 10 minutes of which was worth using. For television, you're very conscious of the clock ticking and you are you are forced to apply a real discipline and a serious thought process to the questions you really want to explore. And you've got to have a sense in your head of how long you've got to do it in. So that's an adaptation to print. But you see, outside of those things, those things on their own, would not present a difficulty. The real difficulty lies in the fact that the traditional model of journalism has gone out the window. Newsrooms have been seriously disrupted. The commercial operation has been seriously disrupted. Newsrooms and our either the same size, but the journalists are asked to do a lot more. So the the size of the newsrooms and the resources of the newsrooms haven't grown to match the demands that are now on the journalist. And secondly, where there have been attempts to cut back on the cost of operating newsrooms, the first to go, it always pretty much starts with with the human resource, which is the costly resource. And the most costly resource in a newsroom tends to be the more experienced older journalist who spent a lifetime accumulating knowledge and history, they've got the scars, they know where the bodies are buried, but they're more expensive. So if you're an accountant sitting down, to work out where you're going to make your cuts, newsrooms have blade, age and experience. And so you've now got a situation where newsrooms around Australia are, on average, probably 10 years, at least younger than they might have been 10 or 15 years ago. So an awful lot of very smart young journalists. And they are smart, or growing up without mentors, that they are developing as journalists without mentors. And if they don't have a sense of the history that's passed, then that comes at a great cost to the quality of their journalism, because because when I watch politics being reported, now I do get frustrated. I'm not the old white guy throwing a slipper at the screen, because it's not like it was in my day. I don't want to ever make that mistake. But I do see not just opportunities going begging, I see important questions, important checks and balances in the journos process, which is supposed to be fundamental to good journalism, I see those things going begging, I see them not being done. And that really worries me,

Julia Zemiro  7:34  
I've only been to parliament house a few times, couple of times to you know, beg for money for the ABC and SBS. Well, you're preaching to the converted anyway, in the group that you're speaking to, I'm always amazed at how much access journalists actually have in the house. And I sometimes think of the analogy of private schools and selective schools go with me, I went to the selective school. And while we weren't, didn't have the poshness or the money necessarily surrounding us, if you went to a pub, where there were private school kids, you'd be accepted, you'd be welcomed. You could share all the information, you knew what was happening behind the veil, you could see what was happening in those private schools, how they all behaved, and then you left with that information. And it was your little secret to keep because we're not one of them. But we're allowed in there. But we'll keep the secrets. And I sometimes feel like with journalists, they cannot really be in that house, they must know that stuff goes on that they don't report. And I'm not talking just now I'm talking 2030 years ago, and I wonder what the responsibilities there. And it can't just be about protecting a source or whatever. There's a kind of like an in joke or an inworld. That just annoys me when I hear it. And I think it's not a joke. It's not something to kind of go you're all pals and you know each other. And that's how he acts. And that's how she acts. That two I think has has come into journalism. And that's not the young ones necessarily,

Kerry O'Brien  9:02  
ideas, but I don't think it's quite the club that you painted to be. And I don't think it ever has been quite that club. But the aspects of it are true. Absolutely. But I mean, I can remember the wonderful mango McCallum, the late mango, in the days of nation review and mango was doing it on the Australian of all papers before he went to nation review. Rupert, by all accounts wasn't all that thrilled with the way he wrote but nonetheless, he went to Canberra and reflected this is like back in the 60s and reflect when he reflected on it, he could have sounded somewhat like you because because he was saying, even though he had gone through university, he had been a journalist. He was very well read that getting any was writing politics from Sydney to some degree, but when he actually got there, he was shocked at how little he knew. And so he made it his business to take his readers behind the scenes and give them a sense of how life really how the political process function, how the processes of government function, including the public service, how the parliament functioned. He made his business impact to educate. And he saw that as a part of his responsibility. You also got a laugh, a lot of laughs, reading it, and were sometimes scandalized as you read it. And other journalists, from time to time have reflected some aspects of that. But it's less I suspect, because it's a club, but that journalists can sometimes make the mistake of assuming that, that the kind of nuts and bolts of something is too mundane, it's not interesting enough to make it interesting for the public, which to me means that they're not doing their jobs, and they don't really understand why they're there. Or they take for granted that everyone knows. The other aspect that you touch on really is is the kind of behind the scenes chitchat, you know, you lift the phone to a politician, and you have an off the record check. But that is that has always been a part of journalism everywhere. And without that part of the process, journalism would be only ever bringing you a fifth of the story. It allows you to be more nuanced in your reporting, without necessarily reporting what the person has told you specifically, one private conversation might lead to another which leads to a story, which is an important story to get out. I look, I'm sure that some journalists have had favorite sources over the years that they have, that they've nurtured, and they don't want to burn their sources. So maybe they treat them a little gently. And I know that a journalist here or there who's who has who I've thought has done that, and I don't like it when I see it. But it is a more complex operation than then than it might appear sometimes from the outside looking in. I don't think it's quite the club you talk about. I'm sure journalists would like to be more in the know than they are,

Julia Zemiro  11:48  
when you watch the Westminster system that that we use that that sort of yelling across, do you ever do you ever get frustrated, there's just got to be a better way. You know, when you look at cultures around the world, you look in schools, you know, the whole idea of when you're trying to want to get to the bottom of something, you kind of you try and find ways to agree on it, rather than disagrees is constant arguing, I feel like part of the independence movement is that there might be five or six people on that crossbench being able to go well, you know what, clearly, you guys don't know how to have a conversation. So let's cut to it. And it's just not that hard. You know, I get as a trained actor, I get employed by companies to go in and help them figure out how to talk to each other, and how to communicate better. So you know, we're all happy to offer our services, our service, because we've all lost our jobs. So please, by all means, bring us in. But um, but yeah, I wonder about, I wonder about that system, will that changes? Well, one day? Well, we I mean, whether we become a republic or not that idea, it can't be the best way to spend time, because it's not it's not working. It's just not working.

Kerry O'Brien  12:52  
Yeah, look, I'm speaking as a journalist, but also as an individual. I do love some good theater.

Julia Zemiro  12:58  
Like to see some in there.

Kerry O'Brien  13:00  
Well, they used to be yes, the I agree with you, I go again, starting to walk down the track of, you know, the good old days. But the truth is that the standard of political debate today is about 50%, or less than what it was even say 15 years ago. There's always been a gladiatorial element. Paul Keating has maintained that, that he thinks the mood changed after the dismissal in 75. It was that the extent of the friendships across the party lines, behind the speaker's chair and in the privacy of various offices and so on, there was quite a bit of that went on. There were friendships across the aisle, and there was certainly a capacity to speak across the aisle. I think a lot of that has gone. And that is very unfortunate. I also think that the polarization of our politics is symptomatic of a wider polarization in the whole of our society. And that really, really, really worries me. Because I think, I think we're losing the capacity and we certainly risk losing the capacity to be able to talk to each other across our differences. Whether it's over the back fence, in the shop, in the pub, or in the parliament. And, and in the media. I think the media itself is polarized, like I can't remember it being polarized at any other time in my life. I think people are choosing now to to absorb the media that fits their views of the world. People who once upon a time might have read across the media that you might identify as right and left and in the middle, or various, you know, various places in between. People are choosing you know, they're calling it the echo chamber people are now choosing to learn their news get their news from sources that reflect their worldview. And you know, the the social platform for social platforms like Facebook. They exacerbate that they actually Aleut Lee exacerbate them. You know, some some bloody robot or some logarithmic algorithmic process is determining what I'm interested in and sending me stuff. And that's getting seriously creepy. But that polarization really does worry me really worries me because you look at what's happening, and if particularly if you couple it with with what's happened on the internet and social media, and America is the kind of leading edge of this, and the sort of bombardment of fake news and and attempts to manipulate us is crowding out, and D legitimizing the traditional news gathering and news gathering process that we might have once been able to rely on with greater confidence than we can now. So I just you put all of that. So so that kind of process I think, is just going to drive us into more polarization. And I think, I think it is driving us further and further away from the democracy we have known and come to take for granted.

Julia Zemiro  15:58  
Oh, I think it's definitely taken for granted. And you could argue that it starts in schools, and I know everyone says every, it's like, honestly, if you had to teach a kid, everything they need to know in the whole universe, it's all gonna go back to schools, and what more do they have to do in their,

Kerry O'Brien  16:11  
in home in the home don't fit in

Julia Zemiro  16:13  
the home, but gee, that's not happening, either. I mean, you know, you know, I'll sound like an old woman from the past now. But you know, my mom would by the National times the nation review the Australian, the Sydney Morning Herald, we had interesting magazines, you know, it was having a bit of everything there and having someone talk about, you know, and it's exactly what I'm talking about. Yeah, a bit of everything. And Mum would her thing was that she really wanted to compare. And she was looking at writing styles. I mean, she was a language teacher at secondary, and then tertiary. But there's a girl who, who went to school, who loved French, who had a teacher that actually said to her parents, this one should go to university. And they were like, Nah, that's not going to happen. She somehow got there, and was interested in how the place is run. But really, a lot of a lot of kids would not have that. And certainly not papers, papers, were there on the floor, and you can read them every day. We're all on our own different devices. Little may be looking at stuff, but I'm always astounded how people who I think have switched on, and also on the Women's March, you know, did you go to that? What Women's March? So people are still even though that information is there, they're not engaging with it, because they don't think it concerns them. And my way to fight against that polarization is to really be that one, that when she gets her coffee, or is at a barbecue after the niceties of five minutes, and you know, you and I get approached by random civilians all the time. I'm in, I'm like, what do you what do you get? And I don't care. Now I go straight into the conversation go, literally, what are you thinking of voting for or what, and I try and take the heat out of it, I'm not trying to have a go, I'm trying to genuinely go. And half the time. When you just explain a couple of things, or maybe offer something else, they genuinely seem enlightened by something they didn't know. And that's because you're having that one on one one to one conversation with them. And it might just sit in there for a little minute and imagine, but it's that one to one conversation with people sometimes. And we don't even have conversations without heat, let alone what we see in Parliament. So it's modeled.

Kerry O'Brien  18:29  
That's what I mean about about losing the skill and the capacity to be able to talk to each other civilly across the divide, becoming engaged on behalf of the ABC alumni in a process of trying to promote the ABC as a serious and important issue in this next election campaign, because the ABC as a as a public institution, which to me, is so fundamental, has played such a fundamental and important role in helping developments and sustain a cohesive fabric across our society. And this kind of seriously trusted institutions still in an age where there is no trust for anything. And and so I'm interested when I get some small insights into this sort of this independence movement that's taking place. And the idea of people having community discussions that aren't that they're roundtables. They're not even necessarily for big groups of people. I mean, the idea of community of our sights, small talk, relatively speaking, given that politicians and their apparatchiks turned their backs on the town hall meeting in the 70s. And I saw it happen. I can tell you the last election when any political leader in an election campaign bothered to go to big public town hall meetings was golf slash campaign in 77. Against Fraser, so that's how long it's been since but now you know the kind of the so called Town Hall. Meeting is coming back. Yes, yes. And that's not a bad development provided. It's not just part of some bullshit stitch up marketing process to create an illusion of something that's not real. And it seems to me that this independence movement is genuinely looking to the grass roots as a way of allowing its message and and the things that worry it that worry though those people are involved in it, about the kinds of things we're talking about, you know, they want to actually engage voters. And if there's one thing I hope, I'm going to be able to say again, and again, wherever I go between now and the election is make your vote count, not telling people how they should vote, but just saying, make your vote count, think about the issues that are important to you. And I hope that they see the ABC as one of them. Think about the issues that are genuinely important to you, not who's gonna not who's promising to give you an extra five bucks in your pocket or something. Those things are passing. Proper funding of various policy areas is important, of course, but isolate the key issues that are important to you, whether it's climate change, whether it is the ABC, whether it is growing corruption in the political process, whether it is lies, whatever, the idea that people, I believe, for this election, people should be challenged and feel challenged, and actually take, become interested in the challenge to really think, in some instances for the first time in their lives. What is really important to me, in this campaign, and how can I make my vote count,

Julia Zemiro  21:41  
I've always seen the election as an exam, you know, you when you go into an exam, and you've studied you feel good, because you kind of know what you're going to be saying, you can feel good about the result, the amount of times I've stood in a line at a school waiting to vote, and people are still deciding in that line. Yeah, they're still deciding in the line. And so there's something in them that goes, I won't do the homework I need to do about it. And I'm and you can that you might see someone with a friend and go with who you voting for. And it's astounding to me. So just think you can't be thinking about this right now. And I think certainly this grassroots level of independence is is more about that I, I hosted the independent candidate for Hume Penny Acuras launch. And we were in a basketball court because it was raining, we had an outdoor and indoor idea. But we went indoors in the end and 300 We didn't have a tin roof. No, we were lucky. We're very lucky that I was really worried about the acoustics as well. 350 people turned up. As you know, as the emcee, I warmed up the crowd and chatter to people beforehand. And it was really, it was quite stunning carry to see people wanting more information. Eyes wide open, for clarity for something to be able to believe in something to be a bit hopeful about, especially after the last couple of years. Others who were nervous to be there a little bit nervous, not sure why they were nervous, sort of tryna

Kerry O'Brien  23:13  
possibly feeling a little bit exposed,

Julia Zemiro  23:15  
absolutely exposed.

Kerry O'Brien  23:16  
One of the things that I think has happened, I mean, I've thought a lot about this, the impact of, of technological change the the impact of the digital age as it is now. And it's been a long road hasn't been that long a time coming really post war, post war, and it really only started to take off in the 70s. And the thing about the thing about the digital revolution is that it's a little bit like measuring a title, like measuring an earthquake, it there is a seismic shift going on, there is an exponential kind of pace, as you get further and further into that revolution. And we can I don't care how much thought we put into what's going to happen next. And then what happens after that. And then what happens after that. Try by all means, but don't get too bloody coordinate, because because you'll just end up being blindsided every time I think that the pace of change when you look at not just the pace of change, but the breadth and the range of change is unprecedented in human history, including I think, the the original industrial revolution and, and our capacity to try and stay pace with just left behind at every step of the way. When we first when we first saw the internet coming the very first rosebuds of the internet, and people started to speculate about where it would hit nobody anticipated. Facebook, nobody anticipated Google nobody anticipated any of these things. And, you know, let alone quantum physics and all the rest of it. So

Julia Zemiro  24:55  
I know I contemplated doing putting some rules around it some regulations. is around, they don't need doing it now. And at the time, you're just thinking, like even even on a level, for example, my agent for years was just worried about what do I get them to pay my actors for doing a film or television? All of a sudden, she was having to go into meetings to dis to figure out, what will I now pay my actors? What am I asking for? If the stuff goes online? If it's on the internet, what's that worth? What's happening there, the stuff just keeps moving around. If you're not gonna put a rule around it or regulation around it. It's like we let we let it all go to shit first, and then go, Oh, why people are really getting hurt by this. How do we bring it all back?

Kerry O'Brien  25:37  
I mean, look, there are so many things that feed into this. I've just been reading a terrific article, a guest essay in the New York Times, and it's headed for those who want to Google it. You are the object of a secret extraction operation. And it's by Professor Emeritus at Harvard Business School. Shoshana Zubov and the author of a book called The Age of surveillance capitalism, and that's what it's about. And it says that Facebook is not just any corporation, it reached a trillion dollar status in a single decade by applying the logic of what I call surveillance capitalism, an economic system built on the secret extraction or manipulation of human data. And it says the world's liberal democracies now confront a tragedy of the quote unquote uncommons information spaces that people assumed to be public are strictly ruled by private commercial interests for maximum profit. The internet as a self regulating market, has been revealed as a failed experiment, surveillance regulating market has been revealed. As I said, failed experiment, surveillance, capitalism leaves a trail of social wreckage in its wake, and it goes on, you know, this stuff is profound, the impact of it and where it's going to go. Profound. And, and most of us are sitting in our lounge rooms with the bloody blinds drawn, or the curtains drawn, and we cringing. We don't we don't just, you know, we don't just worry about the future for our kids. We're worried about our own futures, you know, a 30 Something person who has been trained for one thing, having to contemplate how they retrain, and then retrain again, and then retrain again. And then they think, how on earth do I prepare my children for this? What's going to be the story for my grandchildren, these things. And, you know, it is no mistake that we are in an age, riddled with anxiety, riddled with anxiety. It's the it's the unseen or barely seen pandemic, alongside the highly visible pandemic that we've been through in the last two years, and in many ways, reaping a far greater, more tragic outcome. Because we are talking about, we are talking about the future of many of our of our kids, many of the youngest people in our society, their future is being ruined for them, as they grow towards even their teenage years. On there's so many potential threats. And I don't want to be alarmist I hate being alarmist. I, no point in being alarmist. But be and so people say, Well, how am I supposed to react to that? I don't know. That. You see, it's too big for government. And at the same time, the quality of government is in decline in Liberal Western democracies, we're seeing the growth of illiberal democracy through Europe, we're looking at, we're looking at the great miss that American societies become. And we have over the last 20 or 30 years increasingly seen America as what we want to be. Well, good luck with that. We're part we're already paying a price for

Julia Zemiro  28:36  
it. Yeah, I've never understood that at all. There is also another possibility. And the other possibility is to be not hopeful, because I think that's a useless word often. But there's another possibility, which is to have a kind of a vision for things that we could achieve the things that we could change. So whether it is in the renewables are kind of argument climate argument, that a renewables could make a strong economy that, you know, Australia could lead in all these ways. You know, if we could find a way I don't know, to make universities free again, and offer the opportunity for everybody to go and be in a situation where they meet different people, and do classes where you have to apply some kind of constructive criticism called critical thinking, and everyone hates the word critical thinking now. But this idea that we could also start getting excited about that kind of place to live where we have to accept change, and things will have to move. And we start to become a country that is moving forward in an exciting way. Rather than always, even though we have to be worried about the things that aren't working, and that's where our leadership can come from in terms of be it state or federal, or, you know, performers or whoever it might be that sort of has those visions in knows a bit more than us, you know, don't be afraid of being with someone that knows more than you because that's how you learn. Right?

Kerry O'Brien  30:05  
Yeah. Look, I think I think there is. I mean, there's the single biggest source of hope for me in the future, is the extraordinary range of great young people coming through, in through various public forums, wonderfully articulate, passionate, clear sighted, demanding a better way, demanding, demanding better actions, demanding action on climate change, because they're saying, You're robbing us of our future, how dare you. But at the moment, it's still fractured. You know, there's no sort of form to it that I can see. And which is why I find that that independence movement, so interesting, because it does seem to have developed as a grassroots thing. There's no hand from the top that has arranged all this. And if and the longer, I think that the mainstream parties choose to ignore the challenge that's being laid out to them, they're, the more they're going to be affected by it. Because ultimately, if this continues the way it is, if mainstream parties do not improve their act, do not reform from the middle and think seriously about getting back on the track that they once were on as responsive parties to their constituencies. Then you're going to see hung Parliament's and in multi party governments, as as much more commonplace than they have ever been in this country. And we already saw Julia Guillen, the low you had you had and more power to her for her capacity to actually bring those people together. She had independence from both sides of the political divide, broadly speaking, functioning very efficiently with her minority government, to keep pushing legislation through the parliament. at record levels, really, including some quite substantial significant legislation

Julia Zemiro  32:05  
is not the job of a prime minister to be someone who can. And I'm not saying this disparagingly about anyone, but I'm just saying surely the job, or you would want someone in that position that goes, Okay, I see your point of view, I see your point of view, we're going to bring it together, why do you think that's what's going on? Now, I'm not going to, that's the skill, right? I've got skills in what I can do, I'm certainly gonna overshoot what I can do. But those kinds of skills, that's what you need, you need someone who can do that. And they're out there, they're out there. But somehow, we're not inviting them into the fold. And it's so interesting to me, that this grassroots level of people all over the country somehow seem to be choosing in the Maine women as they candidates

Kerry O'Brien  32:48  
that that is a fascinating part of the equation, I have to say an impressive women, often,

Julia Zemiro  32:54  
grassroots movements seem to be choosing women as their candidates even though there's been men in the mix. And yet apparently, there's no place for women federally on the hill when it's done in the in the other systems. So, again, it's showing that people it's not that people don't trust women, they absolutely do the choosing them.

Kerry O'Brien  33:15  
This is you this is the same struggle that you've seen in the corporate world, as well. And funnily enough in trade unions, I think, I think trade unions were ahead of the game in that regard, because there have been some very strong female trade union leaders going back over a couple of decades. Yeah, that's just that's that's still catching up. And and even though there has been a significant increase in the numbers of women in the parliament, that very revealing series of Anabel, crabs, just shows how long it's taking any number of men to actually catch up with what the wider public has already appreciated. And that is that women have a huge and at least equal contribution to make, and in the whole process will only improve as a result of it. You

Julia Zemiro  34:01  
always hear people saying, I wish we had a just Cinder and you guys, I say she has a job already with that there were plenty of descenders around, you just have to make them get in there. And it seems like the independent way is allowing women to step up, you know, women who've already had careers and are now in the third act of something that they want to do in their life. And and it just, I mean, so eloquent, you know, zali Steggall and Helen Haynes so eloquent and how they speak and get their ideas across that I feel saying when I listened to them, I got I understand what you're saying, You're being very clear, you're being very direct, you're not mucking around, hiding anything.

Kerry O'Brien  34:39  
I mean, look, just so that we don't get too carried away with with what we're hoping as against the realities. I mean, the truth is, if you're an independent and you're settling on three or four or five key issues, that you're going to say these are my you know, stand against the tide, or no matter what, and I'm going to represent you on these issues more than any other but I also be very sensible and what else comes along, unlike the major parties, they don't have to have a whole platform. And that does make their job somewhat easier. But nonetheless, the role that they potentially can play is of really serious import, given the standards of politics generally today and the need for the mainstream parties to be forced to rethink, reassess, and reform in a way that is much more responsive to the broader public and going back to politics more as a vocation than as just another career. And that is a part of what's gone wrong.

Julia Zemiro  35:36  
But don't think that but don't you think the way they express themselves too, if you think of Rob Oakshott and Tony Windsor as well, I mean, it's just a different way of expressing yourself as well. It's, it's, they always take the heat out of the discussion and the bias. And I just saying, Well, this is how it is. And I just don't see why we can't do that more for and I hope voters start to see, that's a way of doing things that's different, that seems to be yielding more. It's an approach if you know that old you can't be what you can't see. And I know it's an old cliche term, but it's true. If you can't see that someone can actually cut through with just, you know, calm discussion. It's sort of saying, Well, I know, I know, you might not have as much power and I might still be a laborer or a liberal voter. But why can't we have more of those in our group, and there are some I'm not saying they're not.

Kerry O'Brien  36:22  
But don't forget the tourney, Windsor was in a mainstream party, he was National Party, he was in the state parliament as a National Party representative. So he had come out of the mainstream, he had come out of conventional politics. And I think, any smart individual who's got any understanding of politics, if you're going to be an independent, you got to be really clear about what it is that your potential constituency is going to find attractive, because if you can't work it out, goodbye, goodbye to your chances of ever being elected. Some of them are populist. In fact, I think, I'm just guessing here talking off the top of my head, but I think over the course of time, if you went back and counted them all, and looked at them, you'd probably find that most of them were populist, most of the successful ones like a, like a bob Katter. In this day and age, if you're going to be a successful, independent, other than like a, like a rogue, self interested, Clive Palmer, then you've got to be offering alternative around issues of trust and honesty, and responsiveness to the public. Those are the things that I imagine the key resonators, and so you've got to be prepared to practice what you preach or you'll be very quickly exposed. Because before you walk through the front door of parliament house for the first time, you've made a whole shitload of enemies.

Julia Zemiro  37:39  
And that's a technical term, everybody Shitload, there'll be in the McCrory dictionary, Shitload final question to you is, I've always been sort of, I don't quite understand why. So I'm half French, half Australian. And when I go to France, people talk about politics quite naturally, easily, openly. It can be part of any conversation. And yes, sometimes it'll get a fiery and other times, it just will not. People will protest for things much for being shut down for things go on strike for things, and it all moves along. And in Australia, I honestly feel that Australians almost need permission to speak, they like that. Firstly, they'll shut it down. And I'm talking about, you know, yes, there's a group of you know, who might have been to uni, like us, and all the rest of it, who of course, have the tools to be able to, but I'm talking about, you know, any people you meet to sort of say, you are allowed to talk about this, and you are allowed to express yourself around it and find out more about it. And I guess that's the sort of feeling I got from that basketball court of people going, I can turn up, I can be here. And it doesn't have to be under the bright lights of a q&a in an audience, which is terrifying. It can be here. And I cannot say anything, but I can sort of, I'm allowed to listen to it and maybe dare to dream or dare to believe or dare to question why Australians like that.

Kerry O'Brien  39:05  
Well, look, I think truly you need to unpack this. If you've got another hour, we're gonna have a crack at it not have to give it some really serious thought beforehand. Australians have always had a capacity to there's been no shortage of anger in politics 1970s, maybe even 16, the the conscription debates, no holds barred. They're in the middle of the First World War. Australia has thrown up some significant surprises in its politics. I do think that one thing that is so fundamentally precious to our system, which really works and is a shining example to the rest of the world, is the fact that our voting is compulsory, even if people aren't prepared to to pursue an interest in politics, that the Constitution is saying that, that the Founding Fathers I hope, I hope I'm reflecting the genuine view of the founding fathers that they understood how fundamentally important the right to vote It was that they were actually they took the view that it should be, you know, shut your ears antivaxxers that. And you know, please don't mandate my life, despite the fact that has constantly mandated in all kinds of ways many of them legitimate, that it was such a crucial key to, to a healthy democracy. As that they were that they've decreed that the voting that voting should be compulsory. Now, I'm not walking article on the constitution. So I'm assuming that that was there from the outset, it might have been presented some years later. One of the great things that's happened to differentiate Australian democracy from many others. And it's, and it's why partly, it partly explains America's problem and partly explains Britain's problem. People might grumble as they go to the polls, but for one brief moment, at least, they're forced to think about it. And some more so it does create conversations. If you're right, that people are kind of timid about expressing their own views. And you're probably more right now than you might have been in the past simply because of this sense of almost isolationism and and polarization. People are scared that because they might pick a fight, because there are so many angry people out there on this stuff, which is why I think it is a kind of a nice example of how things can be done, that people can decide to sit down in a civil environment and speak to each other and open their minds up to the views of others and feel confident enough to express their own views and start to develop their own views with others.

Julia Zemiro  41:39  
Well, on that note, Kerry O'Brien What a beautiful way to finish but a beautiful way to finish what's what's the rest of the day hold for you carry you're gonna do something raining what you ox it's pouring

Kerry O'Brien  41:51  
rain writing constantly but I came to a view very early in our time up here we came up to the north coast of New South Wales when I left 730 And my wife walked away from her job the Herald I learned very early on not to complain about the rain because you you appreciate it when it's the and and often it's the it's here in abundance and the bar and Bayview have a dry season is where you have four months without rain. But now it's wonderful, wonderful part of the world and the only what it reminds you of though is is that there are now so many manifestations of the impact of climate change already on us that again, nothing is predictable anymore. The only thing I think that is predictable as is being demonstrated season after season after season. Is that is that whatever weather patterns we've had in the past we're going to have in spades and we're going to have with greater intensity and at greater cost. Sorry

Julia Zemiro  43:02  
Jesus Christ

Kerry O'Brien  43:04  
was I say never asked a question you don't know the answer to

Dan Ilic  43:07  
what out what up Jay Z asked who cares? Sure, boy, Jay Z make some noise. No, by Jay Z joins me right. This is Julius Amira asks, Who cares?

Julia Zemiro  43:19  
Thank you, Kerry O'Brien isn't it great to hear Kerry laugh on to Zara Seidler What an impressive human being she is in her 20s She set up with Sam cars Lasky the daily oz news for millennials. And it's Australia's leading social first news organization. They're on a mission to arm Millennials with the tools they need to begin their own deep dive into the news. Their news recaps and explainers are read by over 100,000 Australians daily 85% of whom are under 34. They've also got a daily podcast you can check out. And it was just wonderful to hear her talk about how they got into this and why they thought it was necessary. And I started by asking her about how she got into it in the first place. And it went via possibly wanting to become a teacher going to Washington to work in politics, and finally getting a gig with Karen Phelps.

Zara Seidler  44:15  
Straight out of school, I thought I wanted to do teaching, I was dissuaded by those around me, perhaps because of my temperament more than anything due to that. I think that people rightly identified that I'm very opinionated, I am quite impatient at times and perhaps needed to go out there and figure out a bit more about the world and then go back to teaching a little later. So I thought I was gonna do my undergrad and then go back and do a Masters of Education. And I mean, still could happen but doesn't look very likely. So I did an international level studies degree straight out of uni, and it's a fairly open degree where you can kind of Have make your own way and figure out what you want to do. Ended up at Georgetown for an exchange and got there the weekend that Donald Trump was inaugurated.

Julia Zemiro  45:10  
Now that's in Washington for people. I mean, that's the heartbeat, isn't it? That's a hard day's politics.

Zara Seidler  45:15  
It is. Yeah, you nailed that. It was quite an awakening, I think that I had thought I was political. And then I went over there and got a whole new sense of what being political really is. My understanding of being political was caring about things. And when I went there, it was a full embodiment, it was a head to toe, you know, you have thrown your life into this, it is affecting your day to day in a way that I mean, Trump really brought a new sense to, to engage during one's everyday life. But I will acknowledge that I had had a privileged upbringing where I chose issues that mattered to me and I cared deeply about those, but day to day wasn't really affected by decision making. And so I got to see that up close when I went to DC. And I also did a fellowship with Hillary Clinton's campaign director, who was obviously quite jaded post election. And so it was this just really, yeah, it was really quite life changing. I mean, I was extremely young. So

Julia Zemiro  46:29  
how can we didn't turn you off, though?

Zara Seidler  46:32  
I just honestly, and it sounds so contrived, the passion that people had the fact that this guy was still going into Georgetown, and teaching a bunch of teenagers about politics after he'd lost the biggest election in history, I just something, it just appealed to me even more. And it made me angry, I think more than anything, because the day after Trump's election, I had the Women's March. And that was just on the complete other side of the spectrum. So both deeply political experiences, but but my, you know, interaction with those was very different. So I came back, just really excitable and I wrote myself a note, I actually found it recently that said that I didn't want to become complacent when I got back, that I didn't want to just be one of those people that said, that had an amazing experience, but then never channeled it into anything. Hilariously, I ended up coming back and working for Sky News. But what a

Julia Zemiro  47:27  
great experience to be in the kind of the Belly of the Beast there and sort of go, how stuffs done here and what sort of tactics is in this world,

Zara Seidler  47:37  
I often find in in my role, now, I get a fair bit, not a fair bit, that's an exaggeration, I get some comments about my time at Sky News and people thinking that I am aligned with the Murdoch way of thinking. And to that I just respond that I was a young kid who needed a job, and that it was an amazing foot in the door. And when the media market is owned, you know, two thirds owned by the same person, you don't really have a whole lot of choice as a young person who's interested. So it was a really great experience. And my role there was to set up guests for their interviews, Karen was one of those guests. Kind of just tutor ear off a bit, and then sent an email out into the world hoping that it would land and somehow got put in touch with someone who puts me in touch with someone and ended up working for Karen, for a very short period, which was wonderful and, you know, reinvigorated my my love and passion for public policy and all the likes of that.

Julia Zemiro  48:46  
So when great when you came back from America, do you come back to Australia and often feel this Australians are just so afraid to speak up? We're so afraid to have an opinion. We will not talk about politics, we won't our cup will go settle down. I need to get excited about it. And you're like, if not, when now? If not now When? And I'm getting excited by and affected by as you said, the the daily decisions that are made on our behalf, whether we like it or not. Did you come back to Australia and have your shoulders kind of drop and go? Come on everyone?

Zara Seidler  49:20  
I did. I definitely did. I think that I was in a unique position because like you I grew up in a family where it was kind of always the conversation. Like there was never a time that I remember we were talking about politics. When I noticed it most acutely was with my friends. It was that I would kind of speak at them. And would it be getting a whole lot back in terms of excitement around certain things. I would say though, that if there was any time where people seem to care, it was that time it was because and I think it has something to do with the way that Americans Politics is based on this real value system that I don't think we've identified exists in Australia despite the fact that it does. And so there, it's this, like sweeping ideology that's, you know, connected to these big systems of how you see the world. And you either agree with Trump or you don't. And that's, you know, it's very two dimensional, I found that to be quite a stark difference to how we see Australia and that people consider things to be on a lesser scale for some reason. And I know, we're obviously a lot smaller, but no decision affects us any more or less than it would being in a different country with a different light on

Julia Zemiro  50:37  
one an amazing experience to you know, wasn't necessarily going to be interested in politics. And you have this time in Washington, you come and work with Karen and to work within and pendant at such close quarters. And she achieved so much, and was one of one of those first lots of examples of how much an independent can actually achieve. And now look what's going on. I mean, I mean, Zoe, Daniel has just stepped up as gold. It is very exciting. And I mean, you know, there is some very experienced people out there, stepping up, as they say, because it's not easy to this assumption that doing something like that. I'm sure you experienced that with Karen, and her life, but it's, you know, you're also stepping into a world of extreme dizziness, and you'll never see, again, all of that. But when that finished, did you think I'm onto my next independent, I'm going to get into this, how can I get into into the with this world,

Zara Seidler  51:38  
I went a different route. What attracted me so much to Karen was that I agreed with everything she was about there was there was no part of it, that I feel this with the party two party system is that you love some of it, and then you hate some of it. And you just have to take it, I never really liked that and never saw myself reflected in in that sort of style of politicking. So, with no other independent, that really appealed to me or had a job. I moved into government relations.

Julia Zemiro  52:14  
But sometimes when I'm on rock quiz, and I get my contestants up, and I ask them what they do, they'll say something like government relations, and I'll go

Zara Seidler  52:21  
and what is it? What is their lovely euphemism?

Julia Zemiro  52:25  
It's like, you know, I mean, communication to you, but what do you communicate? So tell me, in your own words, what is government?

Zara Seidler  52:34  
Government Relations is, I don't know if this is a flattering picture of it. To me, it was using the connections that you had in the political system, to affect change on behalf of a client. So ultimately, it is lobbying. And my role during that time, was to specifically have those relationships with the independent politicians, so members of the crossbench. And that was fascinating. Because the thing with that is that you get across every policy in you could ever think of because you're not married or tied to one client with one policy area, you learn about health, about science, about tech, and it's sort of just this amazing, deep dive into a whole lot of things. And I really, I really enjoyed it, I think, I think it taught me a lot, I learned so much about communication, and how to communicate a point effectively, and concisely and in a way, funnily enough, it's kind of the opposite way, but in a way that makes sense to a politician who needs to get across things really quickly.

Julia Zemiro  53:43  
Yeah. And he is still catching up with friends and having great discussions about this great job you've gotten. They're still blinking and going yet, when you start talking Zara about

Zara Seidler  53:51  
the night as a drink. Yeah, no.

Julia Zemiro  53:55  
And why are they interested? I mean, you've you've probably had similar schooling, you're in a similar area, are they? That this is what always fascinates me? I'm not saying you're gonna be a hardcore not about politics. But you know, you're either in it or you're not. And I still can't quite, you know, if you stopped paying someone in the street and say, Who do you think controls your life? No, I do. And you go, Well, you know, there is this umbilical cord to what's happening in Canberra, and people choose to ignore that or at their peril, or go, Look, I'll just vote for the light whoever I voted for last time. What what is it for them? Are they just busy off with uni? Do they genuinely don't see that it affects them?

Zara Seidler  54:36  
I think that both the media and the political class have not. I don't want to take agency away from the individual. But I think and this is the problem that I've been trying to solve, that there has not been enough communication in the style and the way that is accessible to this generation that makes them realize They care and why they need to care and what is at stake here. I think that there's a lot of assumed knowledge.

Julia Zemiro  55:07  
This is what the daily odds does, it makes it clear, it kind of separates, you know, the complicated set, not even the complicated stuff. It just sort of isolates those moments. And those are stories and ideas that can actually make sense to someone.

Zara Seidler  55:24  
To exactly it. And that assumed knowledge part. And that component was the driving force. It was, how do we provide context to the headlines that people are reading every day because people turn off when they feel dumb. And I know that, that it people in my life have said that to me before it's, well, I don't contribute to conversations because I don't know enough. And I don't want to come across as dumb or uninformed. And I completely understand that I would feel the same way. And so what we're trying to do is really provide that backstory that context to a headline, or a concept or a political mechanism, so that people feel empowered to then get into the discussion or vote a certain way, because they know that there is a level of information that sets the foundation of their knowledge.

Julia Zemiro  56:15  
So you're working in government relations. Lobbying, and, and what how do you meet Sam? Or how do you go on to this other?

Zara Seidler  56:27  
Uh, my timeframes are really murky. But

Julia Zemiro  56:30  
I mean, they can be general for a day. Yeah,

Zara Seidler  56:34  
I was sick that night. So Sam started the daily orders a number of years ago. And he, he taken the name on Instagram, he had the idea, didn't do anything about it, and then put it on either Instagram or LinkedIn, we kind of gray and saying, I want to do this with someone. Is anyone interested? And I had like, eight friends send it to me. And I say no, you know what? I know. It's as if my friends listened to me. And just kind of have to complain. No, they know, my friends are absolutely wonderful. But I yeah, I just remember being sent it. And we are part of the same community, but had never met each other. And we went for coffee. And we were like, oh my god, we're the same person in two different bodies. Like this is insane. We had exactly the same ideas we had, I mean, different upbringings, but the same values and belief system. And we have been best friends since that day. There's not been a day since then, that we haven't spoken. And I think that was four years ago, I love from there grew the daily hours. And for a number of years, it was just a side hustle. There was nothing else to it, it was it we'll do this everyday because we want our friends to have something to talk about on a date, or we want to not have friends, which very much happens and family members texts made the morning of an election saying Who am I voting for? So it was an attempt to address all of those issues with the one answer, which was, let's give you accessible, digestible Quick News bites and not actually disrupt the way that you consume information, we're going to just put it in your way so that when you're going about you're scrolling, you get a chunk of information, and you're smarter than when you started.

Julia Zemiro  58:29  
And how do you know it's working? You know, you're starting it off. And like anything, it starts slowly, and I knew it sort of jumped and grew. But how do you know that this side hustle is making a difference of people getting in touch with you? And they're saying, I get this now? And I'm getting interested? Like, have you seen people go down new kind of, you know, wormholes of inflammation or

Zara Seidler  58:51  
school question. I think for the first little while, it wasn't like, I don't think there was any indication that it was working, or that it was successful. But we just kept doing it every day, because we loved it. And we didn't really have an audience. As it grew, it became very clear to us through just anecdotal evidence that people were starting to rely on it as their sole news source. That's a massive responsibility for people that are doing this before and after their very long day jobs. That was terrifying. But also, we have always positioned ourselves we say we're the entree to the news diet. So take us, you know, it come with us and then off, you go into the world and you can consume whatever else, and at least you again, have that foundation. So we grew more. Yeah, our audience grew and then COVID happen and then here we added COVID affect you. Everyone suddenly had a reason to care about politicians, because in a way that I think, like we discussed earlier Politics had touched people personally in their day to day life before, especially the more privileged among us. This affected every single person. So no matter who you are, no matter where you lived, no matter what you did. And so suddenly, we had people who previously wouldn't have known the name of their premier or chief minister, texting saying, What time is it on? Like, I need, I need an update. I need everything. And so we went from whatever we were doing before to doing just, we will translate these press conferences for you. And that was just clearly what people wanted. Yeah, yes. And we just continued to grow and grow. And we started hearing more about what our audience wanted. And that was a really gratifying thing to have that audience important to have young people saying, I've heard this around. Can you just explain it for me? And so it continued to grow. There were a number of other events. And I've spoken about this before, but Black Lives Matter movement, the US presidential election, and COVID taken together or really just, yeah, put a rocket ship under our I don't even know what the word for that is.

Julia Zemiro  1:01:11  
They put a run. Wherever it did it blue thing. He got it going? What a rocket.

Zara Seidler  1:01:18  
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. That. And yeah, yeah.

Julia Zemiro  1:01:22  
It's, it's hard to find good things that came out of COVID. But one of them is that yeah, there's definitely. And the thing is to it doesn't even have to be the word politicization. It's actually just being involved in a civic engagement and engagement. Yeah, with what's going on around you. The work is so great. On daily ours, it's so accessible, it's so clear, it does, it's not dumbed down at all it is the clarity of it is what I love so much. And I know that people who, as I said before, it's not just 20, that 20 year old group that that listens and reads, what shocks you, as you're putting work together is anything that you see in the way it's all put together, or what's out there, that shocks you about media,

Zara Seidler  1:02:05  
just how much assumed knowledge there is. And it's not even about the concept. It's about the historical happenings that kind of predate that event, I just

Julia Zemiro  1:02:21  
so what happened you just so how can we change that? Like, you know, I still think that, like, I think, I think, say in terms of the arts, for instance, you know, we still have such a problem in this country, just legitimizing it full stop, people have gone to see shows, sure, but in terms of training in terms of what needs to be done in terms of the discipline involved in in terms of it being a full time job, if you're lucky. And not being a side hustle, and don't keep asking people to do stuff for free. I sometimes think Well, the best way to make good audiences is at school, you give them the jargon and the vocabulary to read a play on stage to understand what that there's a stage manager to understand what film is to understand that there's layers of meaning and understanding to go to dance and go, I'm not quite sure how to get into this, but I'm feeling something I'm not sure what it is. Like, for me, it's art. I don't know enough about it. And I there's no point me going to a gallery unless I'm with a friend who just gets it right. And it's so different. It's so good. Because you they go oh my god, you've got this whole knowledge and you can share it with me. I'll hopefully I can share some rock music with you later. But um, but it's it's a sense of going you make better audiences for something and not by necessarily marking them on it. Maybe we could just do it because it's interesting and fun, and makes you feel good to sing a song every day. That's cool with a whole group of people and go and we're not getting marked on that. We just generally did that because it was enjoyable. Great. Yeah. Maybe we could do that with media unless you unless you take Media Studies at school.

Zara Seidler  1:03:55  
That is something I have thought about for so long, is actually texted some of my old school teachers to just say whether there would be an appetite, because having media literacy at a school age. I mean, our school leavers are at voting age, and it's too late, then it is too late when we are trying to mean it's not too late. It's never too late. But I think it is later than it should be when we're at the daily hours are intercepting these people. I think it should be as early as possible. And it's a completely a political non partisan. Yeah, I think in my head, I've always thought of a civics and a media course. And I've always thought of someone coming in. I mean, at school, we had all of these like study skills, things that they just brought in external people to run. And they were like, cool, hip, young kids, and you're like, Oh, I like you like maybe I'll listen to what you say. And in my head, I think that way of doing it would be really useful and working with the teachers alongside them. but actually having experts in the room to talk to the need for media literacy, so that when these people go and finish school, they have at least that foundation of knowledge to then go out and seek out their own information. You cannot expect a school age student to know what they can't know. And I really see it as something that needs to happen.

Julia Zemiro  1:05:22  
But yeah, the media literacy thing would is ridiculous that we're not sort of harnessing it there. And then people are lost and absolutely feel stupid. And no one knows.

Zara Seidler  1:05:32  
Exactly. And I think the big thing to point out is that, no wonder no wonder you feel that way. And that's not wrong. And you're, you haven't done anything wrong to feel that way. You've just been underserviced in this department, for lack of a better term. And I think, often times there can be this condescending tone that is implied when talking to people who might not be involved in our, you know, civil society, when it's how can we actually engage them? Let's not isolate them further. Let's try bring them in. And how do we do that?

Julia Zemiro  1:06:09  
There was a time when I remember when Natasha stopped Despoiler joined Parliament, and we're a similar age. And I remember thinking, wow, I mean, and a lot of fuss was made about how young she was. And because she did it with the Democrats. Maybe that was the only way that could happen. It could only happen through a slightly off center party. But um, but she was about the only one really, I mean, or maybe I paid attention because she was a woman. But you know, it's not. And what's interesting to me is that now all these independents that are stepping up, they're mostly women. Yeah, I mean, bar a couple. And it's interesting to me that all of a sudden, you know, apparently, we're a country that doesn't like being run by a woman. And yet grass roots are going, we absolutely choose you to be the person to run,

Zara Seidler  1:07:00  
you know that it's electorally advantageous to have someone that will appeal to the electorate, and it's just turning out to be women every day.

Julia Zemiro  1:07:09  
Good grace. Now, when you when you got into the daily Oz, surely part of the enjoyment too, is that you have creative control.

Zara Seidler  1:07:18  
I mean, I actually, we had a job interview today with someone who we are looking at hiring. And they asked about the bureaucracy of our organization, and what bureaucracy? What red tape there is done? Yeah, I mean, it is, we, I think this was something that was really important during COVID. We don't have to wait on anyone, we don't have to get approval for anything, we don't have to fight upwards for anything it is, we do what we want. And I think that lends itself to listening a lot more to what our audience wants to. And so we're really guided by what is happening in their lives, what they are interested in what they want, you know, as a talking point, before a date, and to have that freedom. I mean, it's just, I'm in my dream job. And I'm 24 I can't quite imagine a world that is better than this. It's amazing. There's a lot

Julia Zemiro  1:08:18  
of fast made about how the young uns Sam, but I kind of think God, I mean, in your 20s, if you switched on, that's where you have a lot of energy,

Zara Seidler  1:08:25  
you've got a lot of couldn't do this at any other point, I'm exhausted, you know what I mean? It's like, you've

Julia Zemiro  1:08:31  
got this amazing energy, and it's like, I'm going to use it while I'm here. Well, I can. Yeah, it's a good, good idea. You also incorporate serious news story. I mean, you know, Sam puts it as the necessity of news. It's sort of having that in there. You do hard news, you're not going to be doing, you know, fun stuff for fun. But you're doing intent, you do tend to include a good news story. And what was the idea behind that?

Zara Seidler  1:08:57  
That a lot of people said that they didn't read the news, because it made them feel really shitty. And I understand that it can be really shitty, just not a good enough reason to turn off. And I also think that you can turn off if it doesn't affect you, which again, goes to one's privilege. So I just wanted to eliminate that excuse altogether. Yeah. And like, Yep, the news can be shitty. Here's a great story to end the day with. And I'll tell you finding the good news is the longest thing. It is the longest task in a day by an absolute mile. It is so difficult to find a good news story every single day of the week. And that is horrible. I don't blame the people that say it's dark. It is dark, but we always find them.

Julia Zemiro  1:09:47  
But the funny thing is, though, you is it isn't a good news story, what we want to try and turn our bad news stories into because you know, if you see that something's been dressed, addressed if you see that climate change is being addressed, or we're going to start Looking at renewables in a fundamental way you go, that is the good news story. You know, today having a liberal across the floor for for something is the good news part of saying, you see, you can work together, we can have those conversations. But again, there's a lot of assume knowledge into why that could be seen as a good news.

Zara Seidler  1:10:18  
Exactly, exactly. There's a lot of assumed knowledge. And also, I mean, this goes against what I've said this whole time at, I've been speaking in a personal capacity and in a professional capacity. We we really value impartiality. And so we've taken a position on a couple of issues, things like climate change, not political, not a political game. It is our future. We care deeply about that. We will always put good news that is about action on climate change. Yeah, that can be seen as political for a couple of people. Yeah. As they make it known to us every single time it happens. But that's just the editorial position that we decided to take. But yeah, what's good news to set, one person might not be good news to another person. And that's when you have a quarter of a million people who are following your every move that can get quite sticky very quickly.

Julia Zemiro  1:11:11  
And do you feel a pressure though, that one day, you'll find yourself trying to please your audience more than saying, Well, hang on, we started this because we're into the hard news, and we're into the necessity of news. So no, we've got to, we've got to stick to what we initially said.

Zara Seidler  1:11:29  
I don't see it becoming an insurmountable problem. It's, it's like they're always going to be there. We respect the opinions and the views of our audience. And as I said, we will take, you know, guidance from them. But we this is our thing, they can go elsewhere, if they don't like honestly, yeah, like someone said something about the way that we were reporting COVID numbers, and I was like, mate, just look for them yourself, then like, it's just, you can seek out the information without coming here. It's a freemium news service that no one is making, you follow. But I mean, we have to do stuff that some popular all the time in the subject matter itself, like no one wants to write about taxation. And that doesn't mean we're not going to do it, because you need to know about it. And so it's funny, because an indication of success for us at a very superficial level is no likes and comments, which is bizarre. And so there's a very quick rate, and we can gauge very, very quickly what the audience cares and doesn't care about. But to us, that doesn't ever affect the editorial process, it really informs it.

Julia Zemiro  1:12:41  
I think it's something like tax to you know, people are horrified that say, in a country like Denmark, you know, half of their salary goes into tax, but they have paid parental leave for men and for women, you know, they want for nothing, their university is free, because they believe that, you know, every kid no matter where they come from, shall be able to have the choice to go to uni, if they want to go to uni, I mean, free university, I had free university in, you know, the age I'm at, but um, I mean, that's a pipe dream. Now, you know, and it would be so that mean, that would be a monumental thing to be able to say you can go to uni for a certain amount of time, at least for free.

Zara Seidler  1:13:19  
It's really, I haven't thought about this before, but I'm thinking about it now. And you say that what I feel is missing right now, at least among the cohort that I speak to and hang out with, is there is no sense of aspiration in our politics, no one is aspiring to reach, you know, the levels of Yeah, of what you just described of having free, you know, it's just like, how do we, how do we change what we're in now? I could better within the limitations of what we know, I don't get a sense that there's any like big thinking happening.

Julia Zemiro  1:14:04  
But there's no big thinking happening from the people in charge of

Zara Seidler  1:14:07  
who it is probably that trickle down effect. It's that there's no big thinking at the top. So how can there be big thinking at the bottom? Yeah, I'm

Julia Zemiro  1:14:16  
behind. Yeah, yeah, we really are. Oh. Now, as we, as we finish off, what do you do you and Sam see yourself doing the daily AWS for another five years, 10 years, you hand it over, and then you do something else?

Zara Seidler  1:14:35  
I mean, I don't want to be the person that I refer to earlier, which is a person that thinks that they are among peers, and speaking to peers when they're not. So when we are no longer the age of our audience, I think that that's a good indication that we're in the wrong place. For now, it's really great that we feel like we're growing with them that as they learn, we learn and it's just this beautiful to full relationship unless someone forces me and I'd like to stay. We're just starting to grow our newsroom. were recruiting lots of young journalists and to have you know, that just passion and excitement and people wanting to rock up to work every day. I'm not quite sure I'll find it anywhere else.

Julia Zemiro  1:15:19  
I know you've kind of quit, you know, when you create your own job

Zara Seidler  1:15:22  
peak too early. I know. I know every disappointment.

Julia Zemiro  1:15:26  
But at least you've seen disappointment too. You've seen a lot of hard work going to a campaign like Karen's, and you see that there's incredible highs and incredible lows. And absolutely, until you've you kind of do need to experience that I guess to kind of go Oh, yeah, well, you know, and q&a. What was that? Like? How did you find that show?

Zara Seidler  1:15:45  
I felt like it was studying for the HSC. Yes, I like tried to get across so much. And then they ask you one specific thing on something you're like, Oh, wow. Not quite where my mind was gonna go with that one. Um, I think I mean, it. It was my dream as a kid to be on q&a. I just like, in I am. I'm Jewish. No, I said that so strangely, but for my Bar Mitzvah. When I was 12, my friends did a speech for me. And in it, they like embodied different parts of my personality. And one of them was them pretending to be on q&a. And they've nose just kills me and ham raising it. Yeah. Lots to lots to learn lots to improve on but it was just I'm so lucky. That that's all really I was very fortunate. And I will. Really, yeah, remember that one?

Julia Zemiro  1:16:42  
Zara. What a delight to talk to you. Onwards and upwards. Young lady.

Zara Seidler  1:16:47  
Thanks so much lovely to chat Woman of the Year.

Dan Ilic  1:16:51  
Julia Zemiro asks, Who cares? A big

Julia Zemiro  1:16:53  
thank you to Kerry O'Brien and Zara Seidler for talking with me today. And a big thanks to irrational fear our Patreon supporters, the birther Foundation, and to our post producer Jacob Brown, who makes us sound great on equipment from the wonderful people at road. Join me next month, which will be 2022 to find out who else cares. I promise I'll find people. We do care and I do hope you'll get to have a break and arrest. Alright, see you soon. Bye

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We're Talking Fears with the Talking Pictures crew.

Yianni Agisilaou
Mike Bowers
Fiona Katauskas
Dan Ilic
+ Zoe Daniel

We talk about the diplomatic boycot of the winter olympics, world leaders hitting the pingers at 4am, Andrew Laming's staffers poor choices, and we talk with Zoe Daniel about running as an independant.

PATREON 💸:

If you enjoy our podcast, emails and important climate change conversations, you can also chip in here like a good sovereign citizen  www.patreon.com/arationalfear

THANKS:

Big thanks to The Bertha Foundation, our Patreon Supporters, RODE Mics, and Jacob Round

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G'day Fearmongers,

If you can't tell in this recording, I'm super stoked to have Alice Fraser and Andy Zaltzman on for the first ever Bugle X A Rational Fear crossover special. 

We talk.

On-line Trolls.
Xenobots.
NFTs.
UK Anti Vax Protests.
and I attempt a Pun Run for Andy's sake.

Cheers

Dan

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THANKS:

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A Rational Fear on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/ARationalFear

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.