Hauling 32,000 lbs of dead rats, strategically planning every turn and pit stop, and soaking up the highway sunrises and sunsets with Kathy and Gene Lednicky, team truck drivers. What's the chatter like on the CB radio? And what's a "lumper”?

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Conjuring a world where kids can reinvent themselves, running a small town in the woods, and witnessing camp counselors falling in love with Eric Sasson, a summer camp director. What happens on the last night of camp? And why does the question "Do you have a minute?" spark anxiety?

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Building cases against MS-13 gang members, flipping a suspect in an interrogation, and writing countless subpoenas for phone records with Dan Brunner, a retired FBI Special Agent. What's the significance of the "1,000-piece jigsaw puzzle"? And what does it take to get a fugitive on the FBI's Ten Most Wanted list?

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Raising cattle in the high desert, hauling calves to auction, and protecting the herd from mountain lions with Chachi Hawkins, a cattle rancher in southwest Texas. How did she go from selling clothes to selling cattle? And does she ever get attached to particular calves?

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We've got a special bonus episode for you this week! Our friends over at Choiceology, the podcast hosted by Katy Milkman, explores the lessons that can be gleaned from behavioral economics. They tell true stories with high-stakes, sharing what the latest research tells us about making better decisions. In this episode, called “The Superforecasters”, they examine President Barack Obama’s decision to move forward with the raid on what was thought to be Osama bin Laden’s compound in Pakistan back in 2011. But, as you’ll hear, there were doubts, and the costs of getting the mission wrong would have been massive. How was that decision made? And what can it tell us about how to make better predictions?

Katy Milkman is a professor at the Wharton School at the University of Pennsylvania and the author of the national bestseller How to Change. You can learn more about Choiceology at the show’s website.

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Diagnosing what ails struggling companies, choosing the "least crappy option", and managing constant stress with Jeff Vogelsang, a turnaround consultant. What kind of personality do you need to lead turnarounds? And what does it mean to make someone "available to industry”?

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Caring for patients with serious burns, making sure the correct leg gets operated on, and working 24 hours straight with Teresa Shuster, a nurse in Florida. How did a patient change the trajectory of her career? And what's a "Code Brown"?

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Crafting jokes that kill, hustling to find gigs, and improvising based on the audience's reaction with Chris Grace, a stand-up comedian. What's the worst he's ever bombed? And what is a "bringer" show?

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Cutting to accentuate the client's eyes and ears, plotting to tame Einstein's hair, and riding the ups and downs of entrepreneurship with Ona Diaz-Santin, a hair stylist and owner of 5 Salon & Spa in New Jersey. What's the most irritating way a client can respond to a haircut? And why was she christened "The Hair Saint"?

Our show takes a lot of inspiration from Studs Terkel's classic book Working. It features interviews Terkel did with more than 100 different people from different jobs: police officers, waitresses, gravediggers, private investigators. His guiding question? "What do they do all day?" Radio Diaries actually got their hands on the audio that Terkel recorded of his interviews and collected them into an episode that you can listen to here.

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Pushing perfectionism to its limits, suffering third degree burns from slag, and having your welds “shot” by X-rays with Matt "Lucky" Reed, a welder in Florida. What happens to welders' eyes if they don't wear protective hoods? And what's a time-tested way of trolling a fellow welder?

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Delivering the perfect first lesson, working with 89-year-old students, and learning how to charge for your work with Christina Whitlock, a piano teacher in Indiana.  How does she help students hear the heartbeat of music? And what is it like to teach a student from first grade through college?

IF YOU LIKE THIS EPISODE: Check out what it's like to be a creative director, a tennis coach, or a mystery novelist.

Learn more about StoryCorps and the Story Preservation Initiative at their websites.

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Refurbishing old sleighs, reviewing advance dossiers on kids, and going to “Santa School" with Larry Jefferson, a professional Santa Claus based in Dallas. How does he handle situations when kids ask for something Santa could never grant? And what would a kid have to do to get coal?

Music credit:
"Dance of the Sugar Plum Fairies" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License

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Transforming school buses into ice cream trucks, watching kids grow up (one popsicle at a time), and struggling to keep the freezers running with Erin Bailey, an ice cream truck driver in New Jersey. What’s her best selling treat? And does she ever get sick of the ice cream truck song?

Music credit:
"The Entertainer" by Scott Joplin
Courtesy of Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License

WANT MORE EPISODE SUGGESTIONS? Grab our What It's Like To Be... "starter pack". It's a curated Spotify playlist with some essential episodes from our back catalogue.

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Managing complaints from parents, handling the horrors of teenage social media, and serving as an emergency substitute teacher with Marcus Belin, a high school principal in Illinois. How does it feel for everyone in town to know him as The Principal? And what exactly is a “sandwich email”?

WANT MORE EPISODE SUGGESTIONS? Grab our What It's Like To Be... "starter pack". It's a curated Spotify playlist with some essential episodes from our back catalogue.

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Scouting body disposal sites, investigating obscure poisons, and computing royalty payments with Donna Andrews, the mystery novelist behind the Meg Langslow series. How do you make a living as a mystery novelist? And could Tylenol be a murder weapon?

Know someone who is a great storyteller that we should talk to about their job? Email us at jobs@whatitslike.com

WANT MORE EPISODE SUGGESTIONS? Grab our What It's Like To Be... "starter pack". It's a curated Spotify playlist with some essential episodes from our back catalogue.

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Catching embezzling CFOs, sniffing out a corrupt private school headmaster, and sifting through fake invoices with Chris Ekimoff, a forensic accountant. What are his go-to moves to detect fraud? And who is the most famous forensic accountant (besides Ben Affleck)?

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Tracking a 2.5-mile-wide tornado, fretting over forecasts, and waking up at 2:30am with Lacey Swope, a TV meteorologist for News 9 in Oklahoma City. How does she deal with fans and stalkers? And what is the “deformation zone”?

You can see Lacey's daily forecasts on the News 9 website. She's also on Instagram.

Got thoughts on the show? Reach out to dan@whatitslike.com

WANT MORE EPISODE SUGGESTIONS? Grab our What It's Like To Be... "starter pack". It's a curated Spotify playlist with some essential episodes from our back catalogue.

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We can’t respond to every message, but we do listen to all of them! We’ll follow up if it's a good fit.

Defending a man prosecuted for breaking into his own house, carrying clients’ burdens, and dispelling a myth about Miranda rights with Mike Panella, a criminal defense attorney from Orlando.

IF YOU LIKE THIS EPISODE: Check out what it's like to be a homicide detective, an FBI special agent, or a secret service agent.

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Mystery dates, adult playrooms, habit stacking, and the misuse of “narcissism” with Laura Heck, a virtual couples therapist. Laura is also a co-host of the podcast Marriage Therapy Radio.

IF YOU LIKE THIS EPISODE: Check out what it's like to be a hospice nurse.

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Meeting Muhammad Ali, handling fans who are alcoholics, pouring with no foam, and dreaming about one last game with Howard Hart, who spent three decades as a stadium beer vendor.

If you want to see Howard in action, The Washington Post put together a great video feature on him in 2014.

IF YOU LIKE THIS EPISODE: Check out what it's like to be a barman or an ice cream truck driver.

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Curious what it would be like to walk in someone else’s (work) shoes? Join New York Times bestselling author Dan Heath as he explores the world of work, one profession at a time, and interviews people who love what they do. What does a couples therapist think when a friend asks for relationship advice? What happens if a welder fails to wear safety glasses? What can get a stadium beer vendor fired? If you’ve ever met someone whose work you were curious about, and you had 100 nosy questions but were too polite to ask … well, this is the show for you. 

WANT MORE EPISODE SUGGESTIONS? Grab our What It's Like To Be... "starter pack". It's a curated Spotify playlist with some essential episodes from our back catalogue.

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Learning to read the ocean, performing CPR on a dolphin, and leading daring (and sometimes foolish) rescues with Ed Vodrazka, an ocean lifeguard in California. What are the signs that someone is in trouble in the water? And how do you stay vigilant after many hours in the tower?

Ed is the author of a couple of books about ocean lifeguards, including Stories from Sea Level: The Heroic and Humorous Adventures of California’s Ocean Lifeguards.

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Scanning crowds for suspicious behavior, learning how to leap from moving vehicles, and investigating every threat to the president with Cindy Marble, a retired Secret Service agent. What's it like to witness history up close? And what is "left of boom"?

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Scouting for signs of greatness, bolstering players after heartbreaking losses, and fighting the "yips" with Vesa Pönkkä, a veteran tennis coach. Why are tennis matches played in silence? And what's a "lucky loser”?

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Taking late-night phone calls from panicked clients, dueling with company lawyers over what to disclose, and rushing to preempt unfavorable stories with Chris Thomas, a PR crisis manager. What was it like to manage the media frenzy surrounding the Elizabeth Smart case? And what's the worst possible answer to a journalist's question?

WANT MORE EPISODE SUGGESTIONS? Grab our What It's Like To Be... "starter pack". It's a curated Spotify playlist with some essential episodes from our back catalogue.

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Churning out creative possibilities on tight timelines, crafting bespoke stock images with help from AI, and pitching unique ideas to risk-averse clients with Jo Skillman, a creative director in Texas. Why do a lot of creative directors grind their teeth at night? And what is a "swoop and poop"?

WANT MORE EPISODE SUGGESTIONS? Grab our What It's Like To Be... "starter pack". It's a curated Spotify playlist with some essential episodes from our back catalogue.

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Reading canine body language, boarding dogs to teach them manners, and training the dogs' owners with Keely Korbel, a dog trainer. Is it a good idea to clone your dog? And what is a "marker word"?

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Unearthing ancient wine cellars, finding the right places to dig, and tracing the arc of lost civilizations with Eric Cline, an archaeologist. What's the difference between a shard and a sherd? And what will archaeologists of the future make of us?

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Framing a scene to draw in the audience, dealing with screaming directors, and getting lost in an actor's performance with Pauline Edwards, a camera operator. What's it like filming a reality TV show? And what's a "swingle"?

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Overcoming "soft objections," hustling to line up meetings, and navigating the line between business and friendship with David Johnson, a third-generation life insurance salesman. What is the mistake that "ruins careers" for salespeople? And what is a "feed list"?

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Outsmarting drunks, competing with ride-share apps, and discovering that some of your passengers were Spice Girls with Jamie Owens, a London cabbie. How much does it cost to buy a cab? And what's "The Knowledge"?

You can find Jamie on YouTube at his channel "Jamie The Cabby".

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Ignoring 10,000 booing fans, collaborating with the replay center, and striving for perfection with Billy Kennedy, an NBA referee. What happens when you get a call wrong? And what's the difference between the trail, slot, and lead officials?

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Perfecting the soft finishes, dealing with divorcing couples, and cultivating the perfect network of artisans with Julie Anne Burch, an interior designer. Why did she need a crane to move a piano? And how can interior designers create a "moment"?

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Swimming with 20-foot manta rays, suffering through grant applications, and rushing to the whale freezer with Jessica Pate, a marine biologist based in Florida. How have drones changed her work? And what's wrong with being a "parachute scientist"?

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Shearing Christmas trees into their classic shape, fighting back weeds and blackbirds, and planting 5,000 trees a year with Sheldon Corsi, a Christmas tree farmer near Cincinnati, Ohio. What does a tree baler sound like? And what makes Christmas tree farming distinctive within the world of agriculture?

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Hurtling down an ice track at nearly 100mph, perfecting the practice of visualization, and shaving off hundredths of a second with Kaillie Humphries, an Olympic bobsledder. What's the most feared track in the world? And how do athletes practice when there's no ice in the summer?

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Forecasting demand for 40,000 different products, arranging for model kits to traverse the globe from Chinese factories to mom-and-pop hobby shops, and enduring random customs inspections with Alan Bass, a hobby kit and toy distributor. Why can't shops place orders directly with factories and cut out distributors? And what is it like to discover your childhood toys were actually samples given out for market research purposes?

The hobby kit and toy distributor business he runs is Stevens International. You can find his family’s brick-and-mortar hobby shop, AAA Hobbies and Crafts, in Magnolia, NJ, and an online store at MegaHobby.com. 

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Cracking decades-old murder cases, delivering unthinkable news to victims' families, and tracking suspects across borders with John Lamberti, a homicide detective with the Los Angeles Police Department. Why are cold cases harder to solve these days? And what's a "415"?

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We've got something a little different and special for you this week! The day this is dropping, January 21st, is the launch day for my new book, called RESET: How to Change What’s Not Working. We’re running an excerpt (a whole chapter!) from the audiobook on this podcast.

You can buy the full audiobook, hardcover, or Kindle version here!

We’ll be back next week with a new episode of the show, talking with a professional audiobook narrator!

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Fine-tuning the perfect accent for a character, recording for hours in a sound-insulated booth, and tracking down obscure pronunciations with Sean Pratt, an audiobook narrator. What is "punch and roll"? And what kind of voice do you need to be a great narrator?

EXTRA
We spoke with Sean about his work narrating the David Foster Wallace literary behemoth Infinite Jest. That part of the interview didn’t fit into this episode, but you can listen to it here!

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Singing cleanup songs, tiring out kids before naptime, and battling the "babysitter" stereotype with Brenda Hawkins, a daycare owner in Maryland. How has childcare changed over the years? And what is a "dope and drop"?

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Commanding a floating city of 5,000 sailors, intercepting Houthi missiles in the Red Sea, and stripping rank from sailors who cross the line with Captain Chris "Chowdah" Hill, commanding officer of the USS Dwight D. Eisenhower aircraft carrier. How do you stop a fighter jet in 2-seconds? And what are “midrats”?

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Zapping parts of the brain to know where to cut, operating a mouth-controlled microscope that's worth more than a house, and carrying the weight of life-or-death decisions with Dr. Alfredo Quiñones-Hinojosa, a brain surgeon at the Mayo Clinic. How do you preserve a mathematician's expertise when removing tumors? And how did he go from picking tomatoes to performing brain surgery?

Dr. Q wrote about his remarkable journey to the operating room in the book, Becoming Dr. Q: My Journey from Migrant Farm Worker to Brain Surgeon.

He was also featured in the Netflix documentary series The Surgeon’s Cut.

IF YOU LIKE THIS EPISODE: Check out what it's like to be a hospice nurse, a nurse, a veterinarian.

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Pouring pints for thirsty tourists, defusing situations with drunk patrons, and finding flow in the Friday night rush with Brian Wynne, a barman in Dublin. What caused one customer to throw a dog at Brian? And what is "craic"?

If you'd like to reach out to Brian, email Dan at dan@whatitslike.com

IF YOU LIKE THIS EPISODE: Check out what it's like to be an ice cream truck driver, a stand-up comedian, or a London cabbie.

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Mediating pickleball noise disputes, shepherding communities through thorny decisions, and practicing radical pragmatism with Martha Bennett, city manager of Lake Oswego, Oregon. What is it that makes public hearings so noxious? And what's the difference between "Big P" and "Little P" politics?

IF YOU LIKE THIS EPISODE: Check out what it's like to be a high school principal, a PR crisis manager, or a turnaround consultant.

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Tracing mysterious errors to their source, jousting with product managers, and rolling out new features (without breaking the old ones) with Taylor Hughes, a software engineer. How did one failed software fix ruin Christmas for kids around the country? And what is "spaghetti code"?

Taylor is currently a co-founder and the CTO at Hypernatural.ai.

IF YOU LIKE THIS EPISODE: Check out what it's like to be a forensic accountant, a creative director, or a brain surgeon.

Learn more about StoryCorps and the Story Preservation Initiative at their websites.

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Comforting patients as they prepare to transition, navigating end-of-life regrets and frayed relationships, and providing support and advice for fearful families with Heather Meyerend, a retired hospice nurse. How does she know when the end is imminent? And what has the work taught her about the different ways we deal with death?

Heather is a contributing author to the book Resilient Faith: Dare To Believe. She was also profiled in The New Yorker in 2016: "A Tender Hand in the Presence of Death".

IF YOU LIKE THIS EPISODE: Check out what it's like to be a nurse, a brain surgeon, or a veterinarian.

Learn more about StoryCorps and the Story Preservation Initiative at their websites.

WANT MORE EPISODE SUGGESTIONS? Grab our What It's Like To Be... "starter pack". It's a curated Spotify playlist with some essential episodes from our back catalogue.

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Calming scared cats with pheromone sprays, advising families how to balance their pet's well-being with budget realities, and diagnosing mysterious animal maladies with Dr. Hindatu Mohammed, a veterinarian in Austin, TX. What breed of dog, when having its nails clipped, responds as though it's being murdered? And how did an injured ant shape her career choice?

IF YOU LIKE THIS EPISODE: Check out what it's like to be a dog trainer, a nurse, or a brain surgeon.

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Scaling three-story rope ladders up the sides of ships, memorizing every rock and current in a harbor, and narrowly avoiding catastrophic collisions with Captain Grant Livingstone, a retired harbor pilot. What do you do when your engine and anchors fail in heavy fog? And how do you dock a ship the size of the Empire State Building?

Grant and his twin brother Captain George Livingstone co-authored the recent book Shiphandling, The Beautiful Game.

IF YOU LIKE THIS EPISODE: Check out what it's like to be a long-haul trucker, an ocean lifeguard, or a London cabbie.

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Choreographing massages to Mozart, enforcing cancellation policies with beloved clients, and shutting down callers seeking "undraped sessions" with Allissa Haines, a massage therapist. What made her cry in her car after one particular house call? And what is "effleurage”?

In this episode, Dan recommended The Work of Art by Adam Moss, a book about how artists make their work. Check it out here.

IF YOU LIKE THIS EPISODE: Check out what it's like to be a couples therapist, a hair stylist, or a piano teacher.

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