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AI & IP Panel Discussion: A Global Perspective Part IV27 Sep 202600:56:57

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Show notes:

0:00 Inha Cha’s comments on the takeaway she hopes listeners have to the panel discussion

0:30 introduction by Stephanie Drawdy

2:10 introduction by Haneen Alkenany

2:42 introduction by Inha Cha

3:30 introduction by Patrick McGranaghan 

4:30 HA–research with visual artists on use of AI in light of creative cognition theories on divergent thinking and convergent thinking 

8:00 IC–research around selective choices of AI use in the workplace in light of questions around agency and identity

10:00 HA–mixed opinions by creatives on AI use

10:35 IC’s co-authored article entitled “The Values of Value in AI Adoption: Rethinking Efficiency in UX Designers' Workplaces” – workers as artisans seeking greater agency per Economist Joan M Greenbaum (1979. In the name of efficiency: Management theory and shopfloor practice in data processing work. Temple University)

13:50 HA–AI use as part of the creative process based on artists’ personal choices of when and how to use AI 

15:10 PM–paradox created by AI: need to understand AI outputs to actively avoid AI patterns and to avoid having their works seen as less valuable if suspected to be generated by AI

18:15 PM-ChatGPT's use of Studio Ghibli 

19:10 Emily Gould–increase in value of human-created work

19:50 use of GI indicator model to mark / certify human-authored work

20:30 PM–Christopher Nolan’s choice not to use AI in upcoming film, The Odyssey 

22:00 HA–decision when to use AI depends on the context

23:00 IC–design life cycle for introduction of AI features and value of AI for users

26:00 HA–creators’ use of AI as a controlled collaborator but not decision-maker

27:00 Gould–view of AI as just another tool

27:50 HA–democratization through AI

28:50 IC-AI-generated actor as an ex. to question who is benefiting from AI democratization and the need for balance

31:15 IC–her article’s use in AI training based on platform's general consent language – ex. of how ‘consent’ is being stretched without creators having a voice in how their content is used

34:10 PM–public outrage response to use of creators’ work without consent, e.g., IG’s withdrawal of terms and conditions that allowed use of anyone’s photos after Twitter backlash erupted to those terms and conditions

36:20 EG–Adobe’s use of data without consent

37:35 PM–violations by platforms like IG and Adobe

38:35 EG’s question to HA about creatives’ view of their work used in training data

41:25 PM–UK collective management organisation Design and Artists Copyright Society  (DACS)’s efforts to ensure dark patterns not used 

42:45 HA–exaggerated fear of AI in her perspective 

43:40 PM and HA on AI stages like the ideation cycle versus the story/experience and artist's intent behind their work

46:15 PM–posthumous rights in light of AI, e.g., Osamu Tezuka x AI Project 

49:00 PM–AI-generated work based on Ansel Adams’ work without permission of AA Foundation 

50:00 EG and PM-distinction between posthumous creation without AI versus with AI 

53:00 IC–closing comments

53:30 HA–closing comments on creators’ thoughtful use of AI and HA’s personal use of AI

55:10 PM-closing thoughts 

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

ikonoTV Founder Elizabeth Markevitch on the Slow Art Movement, Democratizing Art & Her View of Justice30 Aug 202600:59:22

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Show Notes:

1:40 Markevitch’s background as an Impressionist and Modernist expert 

3:30 democratization of art like the music industry

4:30 accessibility of art and how art makes us feel

5:20 unfairness of the art industry’s elitist approach 

8:00 Emily Gould-inquiry on how to bring more people into the art world

10:00 art world representative’s narrow perspective on criteria to be an artist

12:45 Markevitch’s creative prompts on YouTube and Instagram

14:00 Markevitch’s perspective on AI and art

17:25 Picasso’s mantra that “bad artists copy” and “good artists steal” and his style appropriation from African art

19:05 Astrologist Neil deGrasse Tyson’s perspective on art and AI 

21:45 ikonoTV and its purpose to share a feeling 

23:00 the Slow Art Movement

28:25 Gould’s inquiry about the experience of art online versus with community

29:00 Philosopher Walter Benjamin’s 1935 essay, “The Work of Art in the Age of Mechanical Reproduction”

30:00 feedback about ikono.tv that includes giving individuals courage to go to museums

34:15 placing art in hospitals  

37:55 launch of ikono’s meditation app: slow, feel the calm 

38:55 ikono.tv’s “projects we love” page, including an art survey app to develop your “emotional garden” about an event, Sentiko.app 

50:00 future of ikonoTV to include all films that feature art

51:45 legacy that Markevitch hopes to be making with her work: to bring art to the people

52:30 Markevitch’s view on the power of art: “Art is what makes us human.”

53:30 Markevitch’s inspiration

54:00 how Markevitch defines justice  

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Dr. Caterina Moruzzi on the Philosophy of Human Creativity and AI: Authenticity, Accountability and What the Material Aspects of Creativity Mean26 Jul 202601:28:03

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Show notes:
0:00 – Caterina Moruzzi on knowing the needs that standards should respond to

1:30 results of the “Authenticity Unmasked” exhibition, part of the CREATEC project sponsored by UK’s BRAID (Bridging Responsible AI Divides) and UK Research and Innovation Programme
4:00 “Authenticity Unmasked” exhibition with 3 artists responding to how AI is changing authenticity: Georgia Gardner, Kinnari Saraiya, dmstfctn
8:00 interdisciplinary aim of BRAID 

9:20 “Embracing the Complexities of Authenticity” project
13:45 standards should consider the level of diversity and detail creators want included with their work-ex: creator’s intent for why they used certain tools
16:30 distributing credit and authorship
17:35 types of authenticity discussed in the Content Authenticities article
19:20 ex: Beethoven
22:40 questions raised by the use of AI to build on works by deceased artists like the Beethoven X: AI project
25:30 Matt Dryhurst and Molly Herdon’s project of training AI model on choirs recorded across the UK
27:25 change to “originality” definition
32:00 US copyright approach and A Single Piece of American Cheese
34:40 blockchain use as seen through ORAgen
39:00 pillars of provenance standard – metadata, watermarking and fingerprint
41:00 concerns of creatives from economic harm to loss of identity
44:00 jurisdictional approaches to generative AI
46:50 EU AI Act’s mandatory transparency requirements to establish content provenance under code of practice on marking and labeling AI outputs
48:45 input of creators on policy like through C2PA community
52:45 defining justice for the creative sector: equity of agency and accountability/responsibility 
55:40 mark CM hopes to make in her work-to find a proactive approach 
59:00 collaborative book project of CM to rethink what the material aspects of creativity mean
1:01:00 Stefania Salles Bruins’ questions to CM
1:03:25 CM: AI versus artistic workshops of artists from Rembrandt to Koons
1:07:00 CM: opt out v opt out issues as seen with AI functionality on phones 
1:10:00 Emily Gould's comments 
1:13:00 AI agents-possible danger of anthropomorphizing AI agents
1:16:00 authenticity
1:17:00 case study related to responsibility-reporter in war zone who doesn’t want certain metadata disclosed as seen with Georgia Gardner’s exploration of an author’s process when they don’t want all info disclosed
1:19:20 face value of ‘responsibility’ in regard to liability and the ability to receive feedback on your work from the environment such as critics even if you don’t disclose your identity
1:21:30 what creativity is, what a work of art is
1:25:20 SSB: Tolstoy’s definition of great art as requiring universality, sincerity and specificity

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Hon. Simon Frankel & Prof. Stephen Urice on the 6th Edition of LEVA: Law, Ethics, and the Visual Arts 28 Jun 202600:53:27

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Please visit LEVA, 6th Edition's site to learn more. 

Show Notes:

0:00 Prof. Stephen Urice describes Law, Ethics, and the Visual Arts 

1:30 Urice's background 

3:25 Hon. Simon Frankel's background

6:00 SU: evolution of Law, Ethics, and the Visual Arts (LEVA)

9:00 SF: changes in LEVA, 6th Ed.

11:40 SF: 6th Ed.’s accessibility and increased framing

12:25 SU: 6th Ed.’s shift in perspective to a more centrist presentation

14:00 SF: 6th Ed.’s usefulness for a broad audience

15:20 SU: examples of stories in 6th Ed, e.g., Naruto v. Slater, (9th Cir. 2018) 

16:00 SU: Brancusi v. US, 54 Treas. Dec. 428 (U.S. Customs Court 1928) 

 17:25 SF: variety of materials in LEVA, e.g., articles, statutes, transcripts, novels

18:20 SF: Examples of cases about the authenticity of works and the disconnect between legal judgments and art world valuations: Greenberg Gallery v. Bauman, 817 F. Supp. 167 (D.D.C. 1993), aff’d without opinion, 36 F.3d 127 (D.C. Cir. 1994) (Calder sculpture held to be authentic by the trial judge versus expert Klaus Perls’ rejection of the work) 

20:30 SF: Herstand & Co. v. Gallery Gertrude Stein Inc., 211 A.D.2d 77 (N.Y. App. Div. 1995) (remand on authenticity of Balthus drawing despite Balthus' repudiation of the work) 

22:40 SU: colorful settings and range of legal issues arising in art-related cases

24:45 ethical issues arising in art-related disputes, e.g., restitution claims

26:35 SF: Museum Studies Scholar Marie Malaro, the law makes us only bearable, not honorable.

27:00 Holocaust Expropriated Art Recovery Act of 2016; HEAR Act of 2025 

31:50 LEVA website and its future resources

34:10 SU: AI-generated discussions about issues in LEVA, 6th Ed.

36:00 SU: 6th Ed. updates 

37:05 SF: generative AI issues in pending suits

40:00 LEVA, 7th Ed.

41:30 Feedback from readers of 6th Ed.

42:15 Tax issues covered in 6th Ed.

45:50 SF: definition of justice

47:50 SU: ethical concerns in defining justice to aim for honor 

50:00 SF: mark he hopes to be making 

50:55 SU: mark he hopes to be making with LEVA

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Art Lawyer Patrick McGranaghan on AI, Copyright and the Collision of Culture and Infrastructure14 Jun 202601:01:15

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Show Notes:

1:35 Patrick McGranaghan’s background 

2:45 McGranaghan’s work with Pierre Valentin

3:05 focus on collision of culture and infrastructure

4:45 “evidential fog” around AI in the arts

6:00 abstract nature of these AI issues 

7:00 his writing on these issues to navigate these issues

8:30 EU’s AI framework “recognizes the structural nature of the problem” – can’t be minor updates to old copyright debates, “AI creates problems of scale, opacity and jurisdictional arbitrage that traditional legal categories do not solve very elegantly.” 

10:00 incentive for jurisdiction shopping

11:40 Getty v. Stability AI in the UK 

14:05 EU AI Act’s extraterritorial obligations 

15:00 EU AI Act, Article 53: general purpose models brought into EU must comply with EU copyright law, including opt out reservations; and detailed summary of training data

17:55 UK’s approach is more exposed to loopholes

19:25 opt in versus opt out systems

21:35 Kadrey v. Meta 

22:55 the burden placed on creators by the opt out system 

25:45 sporadic licensing deals and unclear remuneration standard

27:30 interoperability 

28:40 impact of robots.txt

31:15 Alan Robertshaw re: impact of AI on the practice of law

34:50 AI defamation cases

36:20 McGranaghan - need for lawyers regardless of AI

37:25 Robertshaw - legal professions’ varied approaches to AI

38:55 AI and astronomy

40:30 moral conflict with not compensating artists

43:00 justices/injustices related to AI

46:45 market harm created by AI

49:25 definition of justice 

53:05 protections that artists can use, e.g., robots.txt, metadata, units based protection, Glaze and Nightshade 

58:00 mark Patrick hopes to make around AI and art

 

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Artists' Rights at Risk: From State Sovereign Immunity to Generative AI25 May 202600:49:37

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Cover photo of Rick Allen - copyright Cindy Burnham, Lucky Shot Productions 

Show Note: 

0:00 Nautilus Productions' Co-Founder Rick Allen gives the history of Allen v. McCrory - suit against NC over Allen's footage of the Queen Anne's Revenge Shipwreck 

1:20 SCOTUS’ 9-0 decision in Allen v. Cooper that the Copyright Remedy Clarification Act of 1990 (CRCA) was unconstitutional 

2:00 NC’s technical arguments against Allen’s claims 

2:55 court's use of pendant jurisdiction to wipe out 5 years of Allen’s case

3:45 petition for rehearing en banc denied 

6:45 states’ use of sovereign immunity against creators

8:50 Jeff Sedlik’s suit over use of his photo of Miles Davis as a tattoo  

9:30 Michael J. Bynum’s suit over Texas A&M University’s unauthorized use of Bynum’s 12th Man book (complaint here; dismissal of copyright infringement claims against A&M employee discussed here)

11:00 Allen’s recommendations to artists to protect their work online

13:35 Emily Gould’s discussion of LAION case 

17:00 Bartz v. Anthropic - 23 June 2025 Order on Fair Use in N.D. Cal.

19:50 Allen on opt out policy

20:20 Visual Artists Copyright Reform Act (VACRA)

21:00 Gould on survey by DACS (the Design and Artist’s Copyright Society) 

23:00 response to UK government’s consultations 

24:00 UK House of Lord’s hearings

24:30 Allen on artists not understanding impact of generative AI

26:00 Gould on UK judgment from trial in Getty v. Stability 

28:50 Gould on judgment in GEMA v. Open AI

31:55 Lauren Stein on ChatGPT and law school's encouragement to use AI 

33:00 Getty v. Stability in UK – Getty’s drop of direct infringement claim and appeal of ruling on secondary infringement claim

35:50 UK’s Section 9(3) - copyright protection for original work created by a machine

39:20 Stein on copyrightability and Japan’s approach to sufficient human authorship

41:40 Gould on Beijing Internet Court's judgment in Li v. Liu

42:05 Allen’s position on AI

44:00 Gould on authenticity and human contribution

47:35 Ed Newton-Rex 

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Multidisciplinary Artist Zoë Buckman on Agency, Jewish Personhood & Multiple Truths03 May 202601:00:13

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Photo of Zoë Buckman by Abbey Drucker

show notes:

1:10 background as a multi-media visual artist

7:00 Buckman’s dialogue with agency

9:25 her use of embroidery

10:40 filmmaking

11:00 Show Me Your Bruises, Then

14:25 exhibition at the Perez Museum 

18:50 power of art

22:00 Artist Tracey Ehmann  

23:45 exploration of personal issues in her work 

26:15 her work on Jewish personhood 

34:30 erasure and gaslighting of Jewish artists

37:00 show at Mindy Solomon Gallery 

41:00 Jewish people’s complicated relationship with the home

42:45 her definition of justice / injustice 

45:40 how her work addresses her view of justice / injustice

49:30 use of vintage textiles

51:45 coffee table book

52:45 2027 NY show

53:30 collaboration with Actress Cush Jumbo

54:50 the legacy Buckman hopes to make with her work

56:15 multiple truths she addresses in her work

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

TEDx Speaker Ronnie Stephens on His Legacy Journey as a Member of the Quapaw and Cherokee Tribes, the Impact of NAGPRA, How Best to Preserve and Celebrate Native American Culture & the Importance of Storytelling19 Apr 202601:04:06

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To learn more, please visit Ronnie Stephens' site and view his TEDx Talk

1:50 background of Ronnie’s “legacy journey” as a member of the Quapaw and Cherokee Tribes

3:30 1897 allotment of 240 acres to Stephens' great-grandfather

4:30 Quapaw Tribe’s relocation from Arkansas to Oklahoma 

6:30 McGirt v. Oklahoma, 140 S. Ct. 2452 (2020)

9:00 issues identified by Tribal Leaders

10:50 Dawes Commission and Burke Act

17:00 management of allotted land

19:25 Emily Gould – question about allotted land 

24:45 Keeping Traditions Alive exhibition

26:20 Killers of the Flower Moon rewritten with input from Osage Nation

27:55 Echo film involved input from Choctaw Nation

30:00 Alan Robertshaw–Prey-film with Native American heroine

31:55 Dark Winds series

33:30 policy shifts needed 

38:30 NAGPRA and its amendments

43:45 education needed for cultural sensitivity 

46:00 BBC Documentary: Rich Hall’s Inventing the Indian

49:20 Lauren Gowler–question about historic US federal laws

55:00 definition of justice 

 

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Aurelian Lawyers & Advisers' Director & Founder Alana Kushnir on Antisemitism in the Arts, Education on the Depth of Jewish Culture and History, and the Moral Component of Justice 28 Mar 202600:53:32

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Photographer credit: Simon Strong

Here is more information about Alana Kushnir and Aurelian Lawyers & Advisers.

Show Notes:

1:45 update since Alana’s 2021 interview at Ep. 43

3:45 rebranding to Aurelian Lawyers & Advisers

5:00 LinkedIn posts by Alana and Guest Work Agency

8:00 antisemitism in the arts  

13:00 resignation from Australian Centre for Contemporary Art’s Board

13:35 Australian news article led to her public cancellation 

15:55 Serpentine Gallery's removal of her after 5 years as the lead on its research programme, The Legal Lab

20:00 steps forward to address hypocrisy in the arts sector

20:55 service on Jewish Museum of Australia’s board

21:40 her curation of Chutzpah: Spirit. Recollection. Self.

23:20 Georgian Artist Nina Sanadze's “Call to Peace” Series

27:40 Sanadze’s use of flowers from Bondi Massacre in future sculpture

30:30 Israeli-German Artist Elinor Sahm’s "Ha'layla"

31:30 Simm’s family archive used to show a Jerusalemite-Sepheradic “Hafla” (traditional celebration and gathering)

33:35 Alana's aim to bring back the depth of Jewish culture and history

37:25 Alana’s dream project to highlight the Jewish community's contribution to Australia's culture, especially Jewish women

39:30 education to bring together Jewish and non-Jewish communities

42:50 current relevance of the Holocaust

45:00 Jewish community from former USSR at the Bondi massacre

46:50 moral courage as a form of justice

48:00 legacy to create culture not fear, to emphasize integrity and loyalty 

49:15 her work with Arts Patron and Hospitality Icon Rinaldo Di Stasio 

50:05  Di Stasio’s commission of Artist Sean Gladwell for a moving image work in flagship restaurant, Di Stasio Città 


Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Iranian-Italian Actor Isabella Nefar on Resilience, Censorship and the Power of Storytelling22 Feb 202600:31:53

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Show notes:

1:30 background

3:30 My English Persian Kitchen

5:15 Sheherazade, narrator of One Thousand and One Nights

5:45 My English Persian Kitchen author Atoosa Sepehr’s efforts to address misconceptions about Iranians 

7:30 Reading Lolita in Tehran

9:45 choice of roles that challenge the stereotype about Iranians

10:10 Apple TV series Tehran

12:00 defenders of human rights

14:25 response to Iran’s formal and psychological censorship of creative community

16:45 Artist Soheila Sokhanvari

18:30 Women Life Freedom movement

21:00 global response to human rights’ violations in Iran

23:00 the meaning of justice in terms of accountability 

24:20 future projects

27:25 legacy / mark of her work 

28:55 creative process and connection with other creatives

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Multidisciplinary Artist Bayeté Ross Smith on Art, Technology and Restorative Justice01 Feb 202601:00:50

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multidisciplinary artist/visual journalist/filmmaker/education worker Bayeté Ross Smith

Show Notes:

2:00 Bayeté Ross Smith’s background, work and collaboration

7:00 relevance of colonialism in transnational issues 

9:50 collective brain trust/collective culture

14:30 employing technology with storytelling

20:30 creatives’ protection of their metadata

24:40 “art” and “data” as information 

27:50 “human authorship” and copyright 

34:25 bias proliferation with AI

39:40 power of art and media to raise awareness 

44:50 “restorative justice” to mitigate and deter harm so individuals can flourish

54:00 current and future projects, including Got the Power Boomboxes: Sugar Cane and Cotton, Hip Hop 50 Boombox, video game project and collaboration with legal community

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Steven Gambardella on Stoicism: Its Benefits and Paradoxes18 Jan 202601:03:41

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Please visit Steven Gambardella's site here to learn more. 

Show Notes:

1:15 background in the arts

4:00 Dutch philosopher Spinoza’s parallels with Hellenistic philosophies

5:20 Gambardella’s Become As You Are

7:30 “Stoic Kitsch” blog post 

9:00 individual agency and collective action

11:00 crisis of agency

11:20 emergence of stoicism

14:00 four-fold root of virtue

20:10 four facets of autonomy, perspective, objectivity and control and their relation to the four virtues of wisdom, moderation, justice and courage/fearlessness

21:25 Steven's blog 

21:45 Stoic view of justice relates to ignorance

26:00 moralism

27:00 Seneca, tutor and advisor to Roman emperor Nero

32:00 applying ancient Stoic ideas in current day

35:35 Stoicism and Philosophy Reading Group 

38:30 summary of Stoicism: Virtue is the only good; and you have full control over the domain of your soul/your “inner citadel”

40:20 Stoicism at a crossroads 

43:45 his hope to contribute to a revolution of the soul that encourages a view of the world that is more holistic and spiritual

45:40 Question from Susanne van der Meer about the paradox in Stoicism about the responsibility of agency versus a Stoic view of incarceration 

55:00 Stoic view of fear and desire

1:00:00 Comments from Emily Gould

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Italian IP, New Tech and Art Law Lawyer Massimo Sterpi on Issues Raised by Generative AI and the Future of Agentic AI04 Jan 202600:55:27

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IP attorney Massimo Sterpi

Massimo Sterpi photo by Eolo Perfido 

Show Notes:

1:30 Sterpi’s work with emerging tech

2:30 shift in use of emerging tech/arts issues

3:55 Brazilian artist Eduardo Kac's transgenic work

4:30 blockchain / NFT as a testing area

5:10 generative AI and copyright

6:20 copyrighted works as training data 

12:25 11 Nov 2025 judgment by Munich Regional Court in GEMA v. OpenAI (Case No. 42 O 14139/24)

14:20 fair use in the US

17:05 copyright of outputs

23:55 "A Single Piece of American Cheese"

26:00 Gema decision’s impact on OpenAI’s business model

29:00 UK decision in Getty v. Stability AI

32:30 harmonisation 

34:20 collective licensing as a solution for AI training

36:20 view of justice/injustice with emerging tech in the arts

38:40 cultural impact of emerging tech

42:00 Christie’s auction of "Portrait of Edmond de Belamy"

43:40 2024 Venice Biennale - The Conference on Art and AI’s “The Neo-Synthetic: A Dialogue on Art, A.I., and Emergent Aesthetics”

44:30 expanding area regarding the roles involved in outputs

46:40 authenticity becoming enigmatic

47:00 attempts to create digital scarcity

47:55 different standards of creativity 

48:30 neighboring rights for AI

50:00 Italy’s protection of “simple photographs” versus “photographic works”

50:40 UK’s Section 9(3) copyright of outputs fictionally attributed to human involved

52:40 Agentic AI  

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Artist Marina Heintze on Art, Activism and the Holocaust21 Dec 202500:53:15

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Link here to learn more about Marina Heintze.

Show Notes:

1:00 Heintze’s background in the arts

2:30 sculptures of Heintze's father

3:30 Heintze’s use of materials

5:30 current events addressed in Heintze’s work

6:20 Politics series – gerrymandering

7:25 Bullet proof vests – assassinations and deviseness 

7:45 Holocaust addressed in her work like “Gentian Violet Violence”

8:30 "Yitler” and “Dog Whistle” pieces

9:50 Heintze’s family research that led her to work with bone planters

11:20 archival research used in her work

13:35 "The eyes are the windows to the neshama/soul"  

15:20 Lure series regarding nefarious organizations 

19:50 how/whether her works address justice/injustice

21:50 work related to B2 bombers

22:50 Tunnel Talk / Vision series

27:25 feedback on Tunnel Talk / Vision series

31:40 Banksy image removed from Royal Courts of Justice 

34:15 Holocaust denial and free speech

36:40 Alan Robertshaw – importance of work on the Holocaust

38:45 David Irving v Penguin Books and Deborah Lipstadt – 1996 UK Judgment 

42:20 facts of genocide/terrorist acts 

48:10 camouflage IP

50:30 design of Arab nation flags

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

AI & IP Panel Discussion: A Global Perspective Part III07 Dec 202500:59:43

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Photographer credit for Anja Neubauer: self-portrait created with an AI tool.

Show Notes:

2:30 Prof. Tim McFarlin’s focus on copyright and authorship

3:30 Dr. Caterina Moruzzi’s philosophical/design perspective / focus on authenticity

5:00 Dr. Anja Neubauer's focus on global AI/copyright framework

5:50 Artist Lisa Lebofsky’s perspective on AI as a nomadic painter

8:45 “Authenticity Unmasked”–looking at the artistic process not the product

9:55 “Authenticity Unmasked” insight-centrality of human perspective

12:00 Neubauer–redefinition of terms like originality in light of emerging tech

13:30 Getty v. Stability finding  outputs are not copies so not infringements

14:55 McFarland–genAI’s scale and redefining understanding of terms

17:05 US state and federal laws 

19:00 need for unified global protection

19:50 Alan Robershaw – UK Getty decision’s technical focus on the process 

21:40 Defining originality 

22:10 Getty opinion at 601 v. AI models are memorizing/making copies 

24:00 Robertshaw - one step away from judicial definition of consciousness

24:40 McFarlin – scale is the concern

25:35 Lebofsky – how prior claims of infringement fit into AI/appropriation of artists’ works

26:20 McFarlin – ‘substantially similar’ takings are prima facie infringement subject to fair use defense

27:10 consideration of outputs flooding the market harm 

29:25 Lebofsky – use of AI through tools like AI Charm Lab app 

31:00 Lebofsky’s view of threats to her style and her language 

32:45 human requirement for ‘authorship’ and consumer trends

35:55 Moruzzi – human effort to value the process

37:15 Process visible in generative AI circa 2015 v. current genAI’s less visibility and thus less authenticity

38:30 Anthroprocentric – human need for authorship

40:20 Robershaw - Monkey-selfie case; animal versus machine personhood 

43:15 McFarlin – Arkansas statute on AI

44:40 Gould – UK Section 9(3) - limited copyright for output in person who organized the output

45:00 Neubauer – issue of term “equipment” for tools 

46:50 Gould – current copyright legislation is not fit for purpose

48:35 Distinction between camera use and AI model training

49:05 Copyright Criminals documentary regarding music sampling 

50:00 Sampling case involving Kraftwerk 

51:35 Moruzzi – response to consultations

53:00 McFarlin – extent of law v. parallel tracks to copyright or other alternatives to preserve and protect human creativity

54:00 Stefania Salles Bruins–solutions outside the law

54:40 Copyright not fit for purpose 

55:20 Neubauer - Shift in definition of artwork

55:45 Lebofsky – how to establish boundaries

57:25 Lebofsky’s work


Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

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To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

"Through Their Eyes" Exhibition - The Story of Kfar Azza Before, During and After 7 October 202323 Nov 202500:19:52

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Show Notes:

1:45 Lawrence Badzin - introduction of The Surviving Project

5:45 three parts of Through Their Eyes Exhibition

7:00 Wings of Hope messages

9:00 stories from the delegation

10:15 exhibition mission

11:30 future cities for the exhibition: Chicago, Atlanta, LA, NYC, Toronto

12:40 how the exhibition addresses theme of drawing strength from what’s lost

15:00 defining justice – the way of getting back is continuing on

16:30 legacy of the exhibition 

18:00 Through Their Eyes Exhibition




Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

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This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

AI & IP Panel Discussion: A Global Perspective Part II02 Nov 202501:14:17

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Oluwatobi Aluko photo by Praise Samuel

Show Notes:

2:50 Tobi Aluko–Nigerian copyright 

5:30 Nigeria’s national AI strategy and creative sector 

7:25 Emily Gould – query on tech sector’s strength in Nigeria

9:40 debate over UK’s copyright provision for machine-generated work

11:40 Johan Brandstedt - Sweden’s approach to copyright 

13:40 Czech Republic case on AI and copyrightability 

16:40 Aluko – prompting versus creating art that involves effort/process

19:00 US copyright for A Single Piece of American Cheese 

20:30 Prof. Ahmed Elgammal - background of AI use in the arts

23:45 19th C. French case on copyright of photographs that show originality 

24:45 US refusal to copyright AI outputs 

26:35 Bartz v. Anthropic and Kadrey v. Meta 

30:45 AICAN project

32:55 GAN-based art movement celebrated prior to prompting

33:55 “Text-to-Image Generators Have Altered the Digital Art Landscape—But Killed Creativity. Here’s Why an Era of A.I. Art Is Over”

34:25 artists survey on value from AI

37:15 backlash of Christies’ auction of Generative AI works 

41:50 Elgammal – effort versus intentionality e.g., DuChamp/ready-made art

42:30 intentionality and agency missing with prompting and random output 

51:40 AI's cultural impact 

1:04:30 Beethoven X project 

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Israeli Artist Ronit Levin Delgado on Activist Art after 7 October and Art's Power to Heal & Bring Cultural Repair19 Oct 202500:40:45

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Show Notes:
1:30 background
2:45 shift to add activist element to her art
4:00 response to 7 October 2023 during residency at LMCC
5:30 ‘artivism’
5:45 workshop at Israeli American Council event
6:45 Rosh Hashanah gift for families of hostages
9:00 how her work facilitates justice
12:30 defining justice through recognition and healing
13:20 work as a curator to connect voices
13:50 “Artists on Antisemitism” exhibition
15:00 co-curated with director of Jewish Art Salon
15:40 LA-based artist Marina Heinze included in exhibition 

15:45 Joan Roth
17:30 Ronit’s “David” kisses painting included in exhibition
19:40 Chai meaning alive
19:50 use of technology in her work as a bridge for global participation
21:40 heat-activated work that shows happiness levels like mood rings
23:25 Stefania Salles Bruins: connection between art and justice making whole
26:00 work by Marina Heinze in Artists on Antisemitism exhibition
27:10 other exhibitions she has curated
27:50 work in the antisemitism exhibition
28:40 fellowship in Germany in collaboration with German Academic Exchange Service (DAAD) - art's importance in memory and justice
29:00 urgency of keeping the Holocaust alive in the conversation today
29:45 murder of Ukrainian refugee Iryna Zarutska
30:00 to hold and carry memory forward to inspire vigilance and resilence
30:40 artists as witnesses of our time and responsibility to be an activist
32:00 “Wandering Jew” project for 2026 Jerusalem Biennale
34:00 Drawdy’s definition of justice
34:50 Drawdy’s focus on stories to highlight
35:20 Alan Robertshaw’s comments
36:00 art speaking for itself
36:50 “Written in Water” and “Project Forgiveness” - 2018 NY Spring/Break

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Artist & Attorney Stefania Salles Bruins on "How to Work Your Lawyer-Trained Brain to Strengthen Your Cranial Nerve 2" Part II - A 2ND Saturday Conversation 04 Oct 202501:05:44

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Cover photograph credit: Jessica Minor

Link to PowerPoint presentation referenced in episode is available here.

Show Notes:

1:20 intro and background

2:40 Slide 4 - Overview of Part I: 6 & ½ tips & tricks: 1 – perspective & point of view; 2 – Light; 2-1/2 – shadow; 3 – value / contrast; 4 – temperature; 5 – depth and illusion of 3-D; 6 – line

5:00 Slide 5: Point 7 - Brushstrokes

6:35 thickness of paint

7:00 blending with dry brush

8:00 Slide 6: Point 8 - Layering

9:40 ‘fat over lean’ rule

11:15 scumble – layer of opaque white 

11:30 glaze – transparent layer over an underpainting

12:40 Slide 7: Point 9 - Paint as a Language

15:50 Slide 8: Point 10 - The Figure

19:45 Slide 9: Point 11 – The Palette

32:40 glazing 

33:50 Slide 10: Point 12 – Studio Practice

42:50 figurative group show with artist from Hip Bone Art Studio

43:45 process of applying to shows

45:00 narrative/figurative and surrealist approach to still life work

46:05 artist statements

48:45 sharing WIP and final works

51:20 connection to the cranial optic nerve – thinking with our eyes when painting

1:00:00 painting from imagination with focus on ‘technique in service of art’

1:02:10 how to deal with writers’ block and painters’ block

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Curator Michael Jacobs on the Museum of the Southern Jewish Experience 07 Sep 202500:59:58

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Cover photo by Rhonda Dumas, Pieface Photography 

Show notes:

2:00 Museum of Southern Jewish Experience beginning

2012 MSJE moved to Jackson MS and became part of Institute of Southern Jewish Life 

3:30 4th year in New Orleans

4:50 MSJE’s mission

5:45 Chapman Family Research Center

6:00 archival vault – over 375 collections and over 4,000 artifacts

7:20 genealogy workshops

10:00 artifacts from southern Jewish general stores, e.g., 1890s saloon’s whiskey jug

12:30 collection digitization 

13:35 Jewish orphans’ home exhibition

14:30 MSJE’s film

15:20 A Better Life for Their Children exhibition

18:00 Greetings From Main Street exhibition

22:00 French Jews from Alsace-Lorraine

23:00 Central European Jews 

23:55 Galveston Plan – Rabbi Henry Cohen

26:00 New Americans exhibition at St. Charles Parish Library

26:30 love story of Joseph Sperling and Anni Frind 

36:00 New American Clubs

38:00 relevance of Holocaust survivors’ stories

39:45 rapid response collecting 

41:00 view of justice 

42:00 lynching of Leo Frank and southern Jewish mayors

44:00 social justice

44:50 Howard Turner – rapid response collecting

45:00 Emily Gould – slave trader memorials, e.g., Colston Statue in Bristol

48:00 Confederate statues built often by the Daughters of the Confederacy

50:45 future exhibition by MSJE on current war

52:00 Turner: school visits at MSJE

53:45 MSJE hours

54:35 Shalom Y’all video, etc. on MSJE site

56:00 visit to MSJE 

56:55 interactive map on St. Charles streetcar line

57:30 New Americans - upcoming MSJE exhibition 

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Dr. Hannes Hartung on Germany's Nazi-Looted Art Claims Reform, Bavaria's Nazi-Looted Art Scandal, Restitution and Remembrance 03 Aug 202501:09:18

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To learn more, please visit Dr. Hartung's site.
2:30 Jonathan Petropoulos' Faustian Bargain: The Art World in Nazi Germany
2:50 Hartung’s 2005 book, Art Theft in War and Persecution
3:25 representation in 2014 of Cornelius Gurlitt regarding the Gurlitt Trove
5:20 Gurlitt exemplifies issues with Germany’s soft law towards art restitution
6:50 twelve works from Gurlitt Trove confirmed as looted
7:15 works from Gurlitt Trove with historical gaps in provenance
8:50 Germany’s task force – 5 million Euros
10:20 degenerate art in Gurlitt Trove
11:10 works on loan from private collections seized as degenerate
11:40 Paul Klee’s “Swamp Legend” from Sophie Küppers
13:30 Kandinsky’s “The Colorful Life”–Irma Klein / Lewenstein Family
17:10 Germany’s shift from advisory commission to an arbitration tribunal
22:30 restitution of “The Colorful Life"
23:40 "Blick in Ebene" by Paul Adolf Seehaus to Koppel heirs
24:10 Gibb's "Aeneas and his Family Fleeing Burning Troy" to Hartveld heirs
24:35 Sir Justice Moses, chair of UK’s Spoliation Advisory Panel
26:00 restitution-Waldmüller’s “Young Girl with Her Family” looted from Teresa Belthower; acquired by Nazi photographer Heinrich Hoffmann
28:00 looted art scandal at Bavarian State Painting Collections
30:50 suit over Friedrich von Amerling’s “Girl with a Straw Hat”
37:05 Emily Gould–restitution by Bavaria versus other German states
39:55 no formal restitution schemes in Spain and Belgium
41:25 whistleblower from Bavarian State Painting Collections
42:50 Markus Stötzel, attorney for Flechtheim heirs
44:00 Picasso’s “Madame Soler” taken from Paul von Mendelssohn-Bartholdy; Bavaria refused to accept its body’s restitution recommendation
47:20 Hartung’s view of justice
48:00 Germany’s arbitration system-public versus private holders of work
50:40 new framework’s guidelines-presumptions and burden
53:55 new framework’s guidelines-dealers and work on commission
55:50 Hartung’s hope to contribute to higher justice and remembrance
57:20 Stolpersteine 
1:01:55 Aluko, Stein & Gould 


Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Art Historian Silvia Wistuba on the ‘Malweiber’ - Female Artists of German Modernism20 Jul 202501:04:42

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To learn more about Silvia Wistuba and her work, please visit here and here.

Cover Image: Wistuba's adaptation of work by artist Julie Wolfthorn for the cover of Jugend magazine (1898).

Show Notes

0:00 Silvia Wistuba on equality of artists

1:15 Wistuba’s background

2:30 Gabriele Münter

4:30 ‘Malweiber’ meaning 

6:00 timeframe of ‘Malweiber’ labeling – 1871-1918

8:30 research process

12:00 regional approach to research

15:00 twelve female artists focused on in research

16:30 finding that art is not gendered

18:15 Charlotte Corinth

21:30 Dora Hitz

22:40 Maria Slavona

24:25 Augusta von Zitzewitz

25:20 Erma Bossi

26:25 Elisabeth Epstein

27:23 Maria Franck-Marc

30:30 Gabriele Münter

32:25 Elisabeth Erdmann-Macke

34:25 Ida Gerhardi 

36:30 Fifi Kreutzer

37:55 Olga Openheimer

40:30 range of resources 

43:30 Blue Rider Group

45:30 Gabriele Münter’s donation to Lenbachhaus (Munich) 

49:00 Museum Art of the Lost Generation 

51:30 current relevance

53:30 need for discourse on art’s social context

55:08 social justice for artists of the past

55:20 defining justice as respect shown to all

56:25 feedback

58:10 challenging the sexist paradigm that art is gendered

59:40 plans to convert thesis into book

1:00:15 derogatory nature of term ‘Malweiber’

1:01:45 cover image inspired by Julie Wolfthorn’s image 

 

 

 

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

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To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Dr. Michelle Fabiani & Dr. Fiona Greenland on CURIA Lab's Work to Measure the Impacts of Cultural Loss15 Jun 202501:12:54

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Show notes:

0:00 Dr. Fiona Greenland discussing collabarative work with Curia co-founder Dr. Michelle Fabiana 

2:00 Dr. Michelle Fabiani's background

3:40 Dr. Greenland’s background

5:40 collaboration between Greenland and Fabiani

7:10 overview of Curia Lab

9:40 Informatics, the science of information

11:30 Syrian project - how robust and reliable data on scope of Syrian looting was with a review of remote sensing imagery 

15:10 participants in Syrian project  

17:20 Syrian project – evidence on whether there is a connection between Syrian civilian fatalities/casualties and cultural heritage looting

22:45 prelude hypothesis 

27:50 war in Ukraine and its effects on Ukrainian culture

32:00 how the data is used to inform accountability 

34:30 Greenland’s work with Conflict Observatory Ukraine

36:00 Ukrainians’ current restitution, reparations and accountability efforts

37:50 user guides for each area 

42:30 Fabiani’s PhD project on Egyptian archeological looting 

44:00 current project that builds on PhD project 

46:00 impact of technology on their approach, including disinformation 

50:00 complications created by AI, including generative AI

54:00 perspective of skepticism required 

56:30 online risks and need for mitigation

58:15 how their work speaks to justice

58:30 Miranda Fricker’s book Epistemic Injustice: Power and the Ethics of Knowing

1:02:30 questions of justice for whom 

1:05:30 Lauren Stein: question on the role of universities in Curia Lab

1:07:50 hope for their work to establish frameworks of cooperation and collaboration that cherish equal access to knowledge/information that would then lead to equal access to accountability 

1:09:10 hope for their work to facilitate a shift to a multi-disciplinary approach 

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

The Healing Power of Art - A Conversation with Artist/Retired Judge Jerry Alonzo & Artist/Attorney Gina McKlveen04 May 202500:54:28

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SHOW NOTES:

0:00 artist & attorney Gina McKlveen

1:05 artist & retired judge Jerry Alonzo - the impact of depression

3:00 documentary American Symphony 

3:50 Suleika Jaouad - release she experienced by painting about cancer 

6:00 Alonzo’s “Out of Balance” 

6:40 “Civic Sacrement"

8:20 woodwork during Alonzo’s time as a judge 

9:00 “The Jury Box” 

10:45 “The Judgment” 

11:45 “Justice is God’s Plumb Line” 

12:30 Environmental works like “Monstronse”  

13:15 “Justice?” 

14:15 “Passage”

14:40 “Faltering”

16:00 “Arc”

16:25 asylum work inspired “Matthew 25” 

20:30 importance of leaning into the pain

21:35 Emily Gould’s comments

23:30 American Symphony - leaning into anxiety through art

26:25 McKlveen’s response to Alonzo’s work

26:45 “Upturned House” by Phyllida Barlow 

27:20 “Inflated Balloons” 

27:50 Carnegie International 

28:40 McKlveen’s work leaning into grief and loss

29:35 “Fisherman on the Roof” 

37:45 “Mermaid Mama”

39:25 “Stay Wild”

40:15 “Heather’s Mama”

42:00 McKlveen’s grandparents

44:50 portraiture versus still life works

47:00 other artists who created still life paintings as portraits, e.g., Van Gogh

48:30 Alonzo’s response to McKlveen

49:05 Gould’s response to McKlveen

49:45 Oluwatobi Aluko’s response

51:00 McKlveen’s planned portrait of grandmother with post box like Mona Lisa



Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Jesuit Priest & Artist Father Jonathan Harmon on Art as a 'Work of Service', Defining Sacred Art and Seeking Justice Through Art13 Apr 202500:57:29

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To learn more, please visit Father Harmon's site.

Show notes:

1:15 Harmon’s background and work as priest since 2008

2:10 teaching fine arts and being a pastoral resource at Loyola University

3:00 his work in the arts

8:20 history of art in Jesuit community 

12:00 Daniel Segers, Jesuit Priest and artist 

12:30  Harmon’s process as a painter in light of being a ‘work of service’

16:00 Harmon’s painting from pilgrimage through Spain

17:30 students’ responses

19:15 his attendance at New York Academy of Art  

23:30 Jerry Alonzo: how to communicate through your art

26:45 Pope Benedict XVI’s Encyclical Letter Caritas in Veritate 

28:20 definition of ‘sacred art’

30:30 seeking social justice through art

32:00 his work in Brownsville, TX connected to his art

33:00 his series of Catholic objects

35:30 his balance of time

37:25 Alan Robertshaw’s comments about all art being sacred

42:10 Tolkien and Flannery O’Connor on religious imagination

44:00 incorporating Catholic objects into his work

46:50 Emily Gould - spiritual impact of artwork/architecture/nature

49:15 Jarnick Vitters - importance of the physical objects to Harmon’s faith

51:00 Alan Robertshaw - subjective importance of objects

53:30 Yelena Khajekian - art as a sacred endeavor

54:40 Nnebundo Obi - interest in hearing about priest’s pursuit of other vocations 

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

AI & IP Panel Discussion: A Global Perspective Part I02 Mar 202501:30:23

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Show notes:

3:00 David Newhoff - question of authorship

7:15 Peter Wasilko

9:00 Andres Guadamuz - blog post on AI copyright authorship

10:30 China’s focus on “intellectual achievement” 

12:20 Section 9(3) of its Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988 

13:00 Emily Gould - whether copyright is fit for purpose 

13:30 UK joint evidence session on the future of AI and copyright law 

17:15 Newhoff - use of an artist’s style 

18:40 Wasilko - an artist’s training of a model with its own work

20:15 artist's post-stroke gen-AI recording from model training on his work

21:00 Salles Bruins' question on definition of intellect 

25:40 - Ankit Sahni -  China’s protection

28:30 Sahni - India’s position on creativity falls in the middle 

29:00 Ankit Sahni - RAGHAV output “Suryast” 

33:45 Sahni - protection of AI-assisted works by China’s courts 

35:00 Wasilko - hypothetical-photo of sunsets on VR headsets

36:50 Sahni - USCO’s case by case basis

37:50 Newhoff - what is protectable against infringement

39:30 Sarony: looking at human choices used to create photos

41:00 Newhoff - ‘authorship by adoption’ is a “bridge too far”

42:15 Bruins - question about training in Wasilko’s hypothetical

43:10 Wasilko - “bridge too far”- license to “learn” from works

48:00 Stanford’s CodeX Group - talk on product JudgeAI 

50:30 Andres - human creativity exists irrespective of copyright 

52:00 Salles Bruins - copyright is a tool to enable artists to profit 

53:30 Kritika Sahni - defining intellect dependent on AI context 

54:50 Ankit Sahni - sui generis system of registration 

58:45 Gould-a right like copyright for outputs "tough" to get right

1:02:00 Guadamuz - Ukraine’s sui generis right for AI works 

1:03:45 Jason Jean - defining intellect 

1:08:50 Newhoff - unconvinced that it’s a “sui generis question”

1:09:30 Wasilko - whether inputting human work makes model “assistive”

1:13:00 question of global copyright approach

1:17:15 what is the end game?

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

AI, Copyright and Justice - A Conversation with Copyright Lawyer Anja Neubauer02 Feb 202500:42:23

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To learn more, please visit Anja Neubauer's site.

Show Notes:

1:30 background in the law and tech 

4:45 overview of global framework “AI and Authorship Redefined: Towards a Global Copyright Framework for Commerce and Human Originality - Exploring Ownership, Infringement, Moral Rights, and Human Originality”

12:35 question of authorship

19:35 moral rights

26:30 viability of global copyright 

28:20 issues of injustice raised by AI

34:30 German study about developers’ infringement

38:00 public’s choice to lock up data 

39:00 The Congress 



Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Art/Cultural Heritage/IP Law Attorney & Musician Leila Amineddoleh - a 2ND Saturday Conversation05 Jan 202501:08:35

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To learn more, please visit Amineddoleh & Associates LLC and view Leila Amineddoleh performing Chopin Polonaise, Op. 26, No. 1 and Liszt Liebestraum No. 3.

Show Notes:

1:00 Amineddoleh’s background and work in music and law

4:00 Patty Gerstenblith 

7:00 building Amineddoleh & Assoc.

8:45 Amineddoleh's work with Greece 

10:00 perspective as musician aids in work as attorney to other artists 

11:00 Amineddoleh's experience with plagiarism 

14:20 Amineddoleh’s practice

15:45 Foreign Sovereign Immunities Act

19:50 artists’ perspectives in hiring an attorney 

22:50 Jerry Alonzo: what brings artists to seek out Amineddoleh

26:00 return of golden coffin of Nedjemankh 

31:45 use of AI 

36:30 AI-assisted Beatles song 

37:45 analogy of photography to AI outputs

38:20 Japanese photographer Hiroshi Sugimoto 

39:45 suit over copyright of monkey selfie 

41:45 Thaler v. USCO 

44:30 Rupali Gujral: negotiating on a client’s behalf

48:30 Stefania Salles Bruins: history of art collecting

52:30 Bruins: Amineddoleh's balancing of legal and musical practices

54:00 Amineddoleh’s perspective on sharing her music and performing

56:30 Liszt’s Hungarian Rhapsody No. 2  played by Bugs Bunny 

57:20 Amineddoleh’s performance of Chopin Polonaise, Op. 26, No. 1 and Liszt Liebestraum No. 3 

59:00 under-appreciated composer Brahms 

1:01:20 injustices in art law

1:04:30 Amineddoleh’s definition of justice - access

1:06:00 John Cage’s 4’33” 



Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Researcher, Writer & Advisor Frances Liddell on the Intersection of Emerging Tech, the Arts & Culture01 Dec 202400:53:45

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To learn more, please visit Frances Liddell's site.

Show Notes:
0:00 Frances Liddell on justice and technology
1:30 Liddell’s background
2:50 CryptoKitties
3:50 NFTs
5:20 ORAgen
& DECaDE research centre
7:20 C2PA
8:15 tokenized rights
9:45 ORA use cases
10:30 themes from ORA interviews
12:15 YouTube as a supportive platform v. TikTok
13:00 smart contracts and licensing
15:00 perspectives on attribution
16:30 Emily Gould question on attribution
24:50 animation sector with stronger preference for attribution not open source
26:45 interviews revealed uncertainty on data scraping
29:50 lack of awareness about the environmental impact of blockchain
31:50 repatriation and blockchain and her work as associate research fellow with
Art & Antiquities Blockchain Consortium
34:50 Balot NFT - Balot sculpture in Virginia Museum of Fine Arts 
37:30 ORA project status
38:15 ORAgen Fables
39:00 recommendations for creatives: to review C2PA & Content Credentials
41:00 Gould: responses during interviews about copyright concerns 
45:30 location of individuals interviewed
47:20 impact of tech on issues of injustice - benefits/concerns surrounding decentralization 
50:40 current work with ORA
51:30 Oluwatobi Aluko

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

IP and Tech Attorney Ankit Sahni on the RAGHAV AI Painting Tool and "Suryast" Copyright Registration Efforts in India, Canada & the US10 Nov 202401:08:16

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Show Notes:
1:00 Anki Sanhi
1:45 Sahni’s background and work
5:00 Eric Raymond’s The Cathedral and the Bazaar - essay on open source development
6:40 association with the arts
7:45 trademark enforcement work
10:00 infringement case between client working in fashion space sued by global brand
12:30 origin of the Raghav project
16:45 process to use Raghav
18:30 Van Gogh’s Starry Night
21:00 Raghav = Robust Artificially Intelligent Graphics and Arts Visualizer
21:45 Indian copyright application for “Suryast”
25:40 Section 2(d) of Indian Copyright Act, definition of author
34:30 Canadian copyright application for “Suryast”
35:35 Notice of Application filed in Canadian Federal Court by Samuelson-Glushko Canadian Internet Policy and Public Interest Clinic (CIPPIC)  against Sahni over “Suryast”
37:10 US copyright application for “Suryast”
37:35 Sahni’s US Counsel, Alex Garens, Esq. with Day Pitney
38:00 USCO decision on “Suryast”
43:30 India’s definition of ‘author’ - no qualifications
46:50 Parliamentary Standing Committee recommended creation of new right for AI works per Sahni’s recommendation
47:05 February 2024 -  Union Minister of State Commerce in India’s Parliament submitted that there is no need for creation of a new right and current legislation offers sufficient protection
48:45 ambiguity in Canada law on AI
49:40 USCO’s Request for Comments
52:00 Sahni’s position of need for amendment of US law to address AI
53:50 Optimus
54:50 Definition of justice
56:30 global harmonized principles on AI
57:30 injustice of humans unknowingly competing against AI due to historic suppression of AI use
59:00 Sahni’s intent to contribute to the change in law to address AI
1:00:00 consultation with Ryan Abbott, Esq.
1:00:50 Future projects 
1:02:20 shaping issues where art and law intersect
1:03:30 cultural impact of the debate over human authorship, AI and art
1:04:30 comparison of photography to AI

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Artist & Attorney Stefania Salles Bruins on "How to Work Your Lawyer-Trained Brain to Strengthen Your Cranial Nerve 2" Part I - A 2ND Saturday Conversation06 Oct 202400:37:28

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Cover Image: Artist's MFA Studio - Tribeca Ball.
To learn more, please visit Stefania Salles Bruins' site.

Show Notes:
1:15 art school’s training to visually think
2:00 Bruins’ work as attorney
2:30 overview of grad program at New York Academy of Art
5:00 medium: use of linseed oil and paint without medium
5:30 tools: importance of brushes
6:15 support: Bruins’ preference for aluminum
7:15 Vincent Desiderio’s Cockaigne
8:00 Lesson 1 Perspective
8:45 Point of View
9:30 Lesson 2 Light
10:50 Lesson 2.5 Shadow
11:30 Rembrandt’s The Nightwatch
12:00 Lesson 3 Value
12:55 Lesson 4 Temperature
13:05 Courbet’s The Madman or The Desperate Man
13:50 Steven Assael - king of temperature shifts
14:20 Lesson 5 Depth
15:00 Value is King, Temperature is Queen and Color is a Fool
15:30 Lesson 6 Lines
15:40 shapes within da Vinci’s Mona Lisa
17:00 Adam Miller - narrative large oil paintings
17:20 Carl Dobsky
17:30 NYAA Big Stories exhibit artist talk
18:00 transitions within grad school and post-grad
19:40 learning to be your own voice of reason - parallel with work as general counsel
20:55 Old Masters Rembrandt and Vermeer
21:55 Alan Robertshaw: Vermeer’s use of optics
23:00 SSB: application of illusions in cinema and inspiration from movies more than paintings
24:00 Kubrick's Barry Lyndon
24:50 use of grids and projectors
27:15 use of technical and human assistants
28:45 critiques
30:00 art historical references to read the work
31:20 Nnebundo Obi: time commitments within art grad school
32:50 Escoda brushes
33:00 use of aluminum
34:45 advice for individuals who want to begin painting
35:30 always clean your brushes!

see also:

JP Roy's IG post re light

checkerboard illusion

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

D. Paul Schafer on Shifting to the Cultural Age and his book, The Great Cultural Awakening01 Sep 202401:10:16

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To learn more, please visit the World Culture Project and read about D. Paul Schafer's most recent book, The Great Cultural Awakening

Show Notes:

0:00 Schafer quotes Gurte: “live in the whole , the good and the beautiful”

2:15 background 

7:50 Ontario Arts Council

8:15 Arts Administration and Cultural Policy graduate program at York University

8:45 freelancer-UNESCO, Canadian Dep’t of External Affairs

9:25 publications predicated on argument that it’s time to shift from Economic Age to Cultural Age

9:50 creation of the World Culture Project

16:40 Culture: Beacon of the Future (1998)

18:10 AI impact

18:45 Geoffrey Hinton’s concerns over AI

20:50 Revolution or Renaissance: Making the Transition from an Economic Age to a Cultural Age (2008) 

24:25 The World as Culture: Cultivation of the Soul to the Cosmic Whole (2022)

30:05 The Great Cultural Awakening: Key to an Equitable, Sustainable and Harmonious Age (2024)

42:30 future leaders should have backgrounds in the arts and culture sector

46:50 Feedback received about The Great Cultural Awakening

48:00 excerpt from The Great Cultural Awakening’s chapter titled Tale of Two Ages that references Charles Dickens’ Tale of Two Cities

53:00 the power of art to address social injustice

1:00:00 definition of justice

1:02:20 Cultural Historian Johan Huizinga, author of The Waning of the Middle Ages

1:04:20 legacy 

1:06:40 future projects

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Dr. Andres Guadamuz on IP in the AI Age: Exploring Copyright, Authorship, and Future Regulations 04 Aug 202401:00:42

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Show notes:

1:20 background and work in IP law and technology

2:20 blog article, “What can internet history teach us?”

3:25 IP issues emerging in the age of AI

5:10 inevitability of AI

6:40 global regulation of AI

8:25 Emily Gould - which body would handle global regulation of AI

11:00 Council of Europe’s adoption of first AI international treaty 

11:50 Gould - UK proposal to expand text and data mining exception to cover commercial uses 

14:55 transparency issues 

18:40 Gould - response - need for legislation

20:20 authorship question 

21:40 THJ Systems v. Sheridan (THJ Systems Ltd. v. Sheridan [2023] EWCA Civ 1354, [2024] E.C.D.R. 4, CA, 20 November 2023) is of great interest because it confirms the test for originality in copyright law in the UK after Brexit.

22:55 Li v. Liu, Case Number: (2023) Jing 0491 Min Chu No. 11279, Beijing Internet Court, 27 November 2023

25:00 NFTs

25:30 Thaler v. Perlmutter and USCO, USCA Case #23-5233 

 29:30 continued utility of copyright 

32:40 AI copyright suits in the US

36:30 cultural impact of AI models’ accelerated training capabilities 

38:20 view of whether there is a future for careers in art

42:50 tools like spawning.ai for artists’ protections 

43:00 opt ins versus opt outs

43:50 technological protections like Glaze and Nightshade 

45:15 difficulty of implementing opt ins 

47:45 injustices in the AI age and definition of justice

50:33 mark that Andres hopes to make with his work

53:40 Stefania Salles-Bruins - IP protection for AI software and outputs



Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Artist in Exile: Tetiana Cheprasova Shares About Her Work as a Witness of her Time07 Jul 202400:59:22

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To learn more about Tetiana Cheprasova, please visit her page at Agency of Artists in Exile.

Special thanks to Valentina Kostornichenko for acting as interpreter in this episode.

Show Notes:

0:00 Tetiana Cheprasova's view of the war in Ukraine & interpreter Valentina Kostornichenko

1:30 Cheprasova's background and work in painting, photography, sculptures and graphic design 

4:50 Giovanni Ercolani’s book The Maidan Museum Preserving the Spirit of Maidan. Art, Identity and the Revolution of Dignity that features Cheprasova’s paintings inspired by Caravaggio

8:00 from Cheprasova's Depassement portfolio - paintings of hands, including wounded hands signifying stigmata 

10:30 Mariupol woman who inspired Cheprasova

20:40 ‘Stop Emotions’ series of 9 paintings

25:00 Cityscapes of Mariupol

29:30 sculpture that’s part of new work to depict destruction in Ukraine

34:00 Parisian architecture

35:00 consequences of war 

38:00 power of art to address social injustices and the impact of war

41:00 Cheprasova's view of justice 

45:40 Cheprasova’s work as art therapist

49:20 Cheprasova’s hope for viewers of her work

53:00 Giovanni Ercolani’s questions to Cheprasova 

56:00 if only one person is impacted by your work, it’s worth doing 

56:50 Artists as witnesses of their time

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Author & Historian Angie Elita Newell Discusses her book, All I See Is Violence, involving the 1876 Battle of Little Bighorn and the 1970s American Indian Movement09 Jun 202400:49:47

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To learn more, please visit Angie Elita Newell's site for All I See Is Violence.

Show Notes:

1:20 Newel’s background 

4:00 impetus to address historic inaccuracies

4:50 women warriors

5:30 research process

7:20 perspectives decided on for All I See Is Violence

8:45 interconnectedness of all 

10:15 timelines within All I See Is Violence

11:50 reading from All I See Is Violence

16:50 archival research

18:45 surreal stories from elders

20:40 feedback

21:40 Custer

22:40 power of art to address social issues

23:00 Picasso’s Guernica

25:00 reparations

25:50 the Very Little Truth and No Reconciliation Committee 

27:00 reservations / prison camps

28:30 publishing process and manipulation of the truth by the big 5 publishers

32:30 Indigenous Poet Joy Harjo

33:30 American Indian movement in the 1970s

35:50 concept of justice related to awareness

38:40 next book tells story of Apache leader Geronimo and female warrior Lozen

43:50 research on Lozen

45:00 Mexican slave trade of indigenous people 

45:45 questions from Anjali Rao

47:00 to build dual timelines, Newell asks questions about what’s the point and building on that overarching point


Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Deadria Farmer-Paellmann Provides an Update on Restitution Study Group's Work for Slavery Justice, including the Status of the Benin Bronze Suit Against the Smithsonian Institution26 May 202400:36:37

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Cover Photo by Nils Paellmann

0:00 Restitution Study Group (RSG) Executive Director Deadria Farmer-Paellmann 

1:30 overview of suit and issues raised 

4:30 Prof. Tobias Skowronek’s findings on the metals contained in the manillas

7:00 Dismissal of suit against Smithsonian based on mootness

7:55 court order that Plaintiffs conceded points and waived arguments 

8:45 ruling in OK reparations case for the 1921 Tulsa Race Massacre

10:30 Nigerian declaration by outgoing President Buhari 

12:00 critical argument that transfer was ultra vires  

13:00 Administrative Procedure Act - failure to hold public hearing on ‘ethical transfers’ creates First Amendment issue 

15:00 opinion on Nigeria’s position 

17:00 DNA research as to descendants from Esan People from Benin Kingdom

19:00 Benin Kingdom’s enslavement of their females

20:15 Manchester Museum’s 2023 repatriation to Australia’s Aboriginal Anindilyakwa community of Groote Eylandt

21:00 change in narratives offered by Frankfurt’s Museum of World Cultures and Berlin’s Humboldt Museum 
22:45 ancestral dedications at institutions holding Benin Bronzes

23:30 Benin Kingdom Museum in Harlem, NY 

25:15 underreporting on lawsuit 

26:00 shock about value of Benin Bronzes - a classic Wakanda story at end of first Black Panther film

28:20 potential for justice in US lower federal courts and in SCOTUS

31:00 narrative attached to the Benin Bronzes

33:30 Illinois State Rep. Carol Ammons - Joint chairwoman of Illinois Legislative Black Caucus meeting with Chicago's Field Museum

34:30 NY Legislator involved in work of RSG

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Fast Familiar Co-Founder Rachel Briscoe on Creating Audience-Centric Theatre to Facilitate Dialogue and Address Social Issues and How Tech Can Serve Humanity in that Process 05 May 202400:40:16

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To learn more, please visit Fast Familiar's site.

Show Notes:

0:00 Briscoe discussing justice

1:20 Briscoe’s background in theatre and co-founding Fast Familiar

3:15 2015 project ‘Invisible Treasure’ about systems of power

4:40 2018 began work with computational artist Joe McAlister

5:20 technological solutions for use in projects 

6:30 The Justice Syndicate 

8:40 The Acquisitions Panel

9:40 collaborations 

10:25 The Evidence Chamber - forensic science work with University of Dundee 

13:00 use of comic strip with forensic information in The Evidence Chamber

15:40 Curse of the Burial Daggers 

18:00 Smoking Gun - collaboration with Data Stories 

23:00 outcomes in jury shows and influence of current events

25:25 machine learning with data gathered through projects

26:45 process 

28:40 Future for Fast Familiar

30:30 justice defined

32:20 feedback

35:35 arts to address social issues

38:20 2024 projects


Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Author & Art Historian Dr Laura Morelli Discusses her Historical Fiction Novel The Last Masterpiece and WWII Looting of Florentine Collections21 Apr 202400:46:00

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To learn more, please visit Laura Morelli's site.

Show Notes:

0:00 Laura Morelli  discussing the WWII era art looting

1:15 genesis of writing about the looting of Florentine art collections in The Last Masterpiece 

2:45 German Jewish artist Rudolph Levy as guest of German Art History Institute 

4:30 Stolperstein for Levy

5:00 perspectives in WWII Italy: museum officials, German expatriates and Allies

8:30 German Eva Brunner and American Josephine Evans - characters in The Last Masterpiece 

9:30 decisions on where to begin and end The Last Masterpiece

13:30 decision to use fictional characters versus historical figures in book

14:40 German Art History Institute Director Prof. Friedrich Kriegbaum

16:00 Kriegbaum’s participation in Hitler’s 1938 tour of Florence

18:25 Brunner’s back story

20:10 German photographer Hilde Lotz-Bauer who worked for Prof. Kriegbaum photographing Allied damage to historical monuments in Florence 

24:15 Evans based on Women’s Army Corp (WACs)

28:25 women who worked with and supported the Monuments Men

29:00 justice in terms of the individual actions and decisions that enabled the survival of art looted during WWII

31:30 books by Robert Edsel and Ilaria Dagnini Brey

32:15 survival bias 

33:30 van Dyck painting

33:40 Uffizi Director Eike Schmidt’s work for Germany to return looted Dutch painting

35:00 impact of propaganda during WWII

38:10 Michelangelo’s Secret Room with 16th C drawings 

42:20 2024 release of book related to hiding places in Tuscan countryside in 1943-44


Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Novelist & Attorney Barbara Hinske Discusses her Rosemont Series, Guiding Emily Series & Hallmark Movie, Discrimination Against the Blind, Art's Ability to Address Social Issues and Much More07 Apr 202401:00:11

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To learn more, please visit Barbara Hinske's website.

Cover photo of Barbara Hinske, 2020 Jean Laninga Creative.

Show Notes:

0:00 Guiding Emily Series to effect change for good in the sighted community

1:15 background in engineering and the law

2:00 whodunit books by Barbara’s father

2:25 double vision by auto accident led to Rosemont series

3:55 her approach to writing while still working as an attorney

7:00 work with a writing coach

8:15 writing coach Linden Gross

8:45 Author Conference on Clubhouse

10:30 Rosemont Series 

13:50 Guiding Emily Series

14:45 Guiding Emily movie on Hallmark in April 2024

15:00 genesis of Guiding Emily at Foundation for Blind Children

22:50 discrimination against the visually impaired community

24:45 unemployment rate of the visually impaired community

26:00 panel to address employability of individuals from visually impaired community

30:05 viewers@hallmarkmedia.com

35:20 exclusion of unsighted parents

37:30 guide dog graduation ceremony

40:20 Guiding Emily presentation

41:40 power of art to shift and address social issues

42:00 The Christmas Club

44:00 pregnant unsighted individual’s experience

45:30 Canadian child at Foundation for Blind Children

46:55 definition of justice

49:15 The Write Approach podcast

51:20 Hinske’s strong older female protagonists 

53:50 Final Circuit 

57:30 self-published in e-book and print; traditionally published in audio

58:00 Hinske’s legacy to uplift, encourage and empower

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

*Bonus* "Manifestation of Freedom" from Elicit Justice: Conversations Off Grid31 Mar 202400:03:18

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Featuring excerpts from Episode 108, an interview with Dr. Ashfaq Ishaq, and Episode 105, an interview with Milena Chorna, with musical composition by Toulme, Copyright 2024.

Many thanks to M.C. Sungaila who sparked the idea for "Manifestation of Freedom". 


Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Appellate Attorney M.C. Sungaila on Space Cultural Heritage Preservation and Lessons to be drawn from Holocaust-Era Restitution Cases like Cassirer 03 Mar 202400:47:07

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Show Notes:
0:00 M.C. Sungaila discussing history / preservation of space exploration
1:50 Sungaila’s Portia Project Podcast interview with Space Law Expert Michelle Hanlon
2:45 Sungaila’s experience with University of Mississippi School of Law’s Air and Space Program
5:30 unclear language related to space law
8:00 mining on the moon
9:40 lessons from Holocaust-era restitution cases like Cassirer v. Thyssen-Bornemisza Collection Foundation
12:30 For All Moonkind
13:30 International Symposium on Cultural Heritage in War and Peace: Tangible and Intangible Cultural Heritage through Past, Present and Future
16:45 Sungaila’s proposed framework to create space cultural heritage commission
22:45 The Artemis Accords
24:50 Italian Opera added to UNESCO intangible cultural heritage list
25:15 treaty requiring registration of space objects
25:35 For All Moonkind’s moon registry
26:10 One Small Step To Protect Human Heritage in Space Act
27:40 Sungaila’s projection
29:30 Dubai space court
31:25 urgency of space cultural heritage preservation
32:40 definition of justice
35:40 9th Cir's 9 Jan 2024 opinion in Cassirer and the question of ethics and law
39:45 Mismatch between domestic law and international obligations
42:10 Institute on Space Law and Ethics
44:00 issues related to satellites, drones, air taxis

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Attorney Sanjay Sethi Discusses Artistic Freedom Initiative's Work, Oppression of the Arts and Cultural Sectors Globally & the Need for Pluralistic Discourse18 Feb 202400:55:07

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Cover image by Nosrat Tarighi of Sanjay Sethi at an AFI event entitled Revolutions and Movements

To learn more, please visit the sites for Artistic Freedom Initiative and Sethi & Mazaheri, LLC.

Show Notes:

2:00 overview of Sethi’s background and work as Founding Partner of Sethi & Mazaheri, LLC and Co-Executive Director of Artistic Freedom Initiative (AFI)
3:45 genesis and mission of AFI
5:00 AFI’s services
8:00 AFI’s residency program
9:00 AFI’s Artists for Social Change
9:45 challenges to helping artists
13:00 AFI’s creation of a sponsorship model
13:30 AFI’s program in Germany
15:00 determination of artists in imminent danger
16:20 assistance for female artists
18:20 university placements for female artists
18:40 the New School’s fellowships for Afghan artists at risk
19:00 Germany’s program for artists at risk
21:00 Journals of Exile at the Berliner Ensemble
22:10 programs through AFI’s Artists For Social Change
23:45 Brazilian Singer Songwriter Bia Ferreira
25:20 AFI’s Afghan Artists Protection Project & Iranian Artists Support Project
27:00 challenges of single intent visas like student visas and O-1 visas
28:30 denial of entry based on immigration intent for Afghan versus Iranian artists 
30:00 applications from Myanmar, Egypt, Nicaragua, India and particular Kashmir
31:00 impact of prior and upcoming elections 
31:30 Poland shifted back to center left with loss of Law and Justice (PiS) party
31:50 Slovakia’s election of Fico w/ agenda similar to Hungary’s Orbán
32:00 Slovenia’s election of liberal Robert Golob
32:10 Brazil’s election of leftist former president, defeating Pres. Jair Bolsonaro
32:15 Indian PM Narendra Modi’s Hindu Nationalist Party projected to win 
32:30 elections in Italy and the Netherlands
32:45 new and different threats to cultural sectors globally
33:00 AfI’s Artistic Freedom Monitor - initial reports on Poland and Hungary
36:00 regimes replaced museum/cultural institute heads w/ right wing politicians
36:00 Curation of shows under those regimes would conform to nationalist ideals
37:25  defunding anti-regime institutions or anti-Catholic in Poland 
37:50 intimidation of non-conforming artists
38:10 Poland’s use of blasphemy law to criminally charge non-conforming artists
38:00 chilling effect of such subversive mechanisms 
39:15 AFI’s position that arts decisions should be merits-based and non-ideological   
39:30 response to Artistic Freedom Monitor’s reports
40:00 erroneous belief that arts are inconsequential in public & political dialogue 
41:35 elevation of AFI’s advocacy efforts to an international forum 
44:00 collaboration to lobby for artistic and creative freedom
45:00 impact of artificial intelligence 
47:50 legacy of his work
49:50 his notion of justice 


Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Dr. Elizabeth White and Dr. Joanna Sliwa discuss their book, The Counterfeit Countess: the Jewish Woman Who Rescued Thousands of Poles During the Holocaust04 Feb 202400:57:14

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Show Notes:
2:00 Dr. Joanna Sliwa’s background
4:20 Dr. Elizabeth White’s background 
5:20 Majdanek concentration camp
8:00 1989 - White received the manuscript of Dr. Janina Mehlberg’s unpublished memoir from Dr. Arthur Funk
10:30 Dr. Janina Mehlberg’s humanitarian work in Polish concentration camp during WWII
12:20 Mehlberg’s alias as Countess Suchodolska
13:30 2018 - Dr. Joanna Sliwa began work with Dr. White to research Mehlberg's memoir
15:00 reading from The Counterfeit Countess
20:00 balance of co-authoring The Counterfeit Countess
22:20 research process
24:00 surprises from the research 
27:45 Countess Karolina Lanckorońska
30:30 Saturnina Malm
33:30 Dr. Stefania Perzanowska 
35:00 view of women’s roles during war and instances of persecution 
38:00 empathic approach of Mehlberg as a model for today
42:00 propoganda
46:00 individual ways to address hate
49:00 justice
51:45 legacy
54:30 Sliwa’s focus on marginalized groups, including future volume on experiences of older jews before, during and after the Holocaust  

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Researcher Chiara Gallo on Influencer Advertising & Art - A 2ND Saturday Conversation 21 Jan 202400:51:10

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Show Notes:

1:00 overview of thesis topic
3:00 2018 music video at the Louvre by Beyoncé and Jay Z 
3:55 Advertising campaign by Louis Vuitton that featured Joan Mitchell paintings
6:00 2020 Uffizi promotional campaign to promote Botticelli exhibition
7:25 Uffizi’s TikTok account posting with Dua Lipa 
8:10 criticism of Uffizi campaigns
9:20 Approaches by EU and UK
11:20 Influencer marketing
14:35 EU Directive
30:10 Italian approach 
33:00 liability under Italian case law and consumer code
35:30 historical events that caused Gallo’s choice on research and thesis
37:00 Emily Gould
38:20 Alan Robertshaw 
43:15 risks and contractual issue with fees
46:20 Gould
47:45 Gallo on InstaGram disclosure 

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Anthropologist and Author Dr. Giovanni Ercolani on Artists in Ukraine Who Are Preserving the Spirit of Maidan 07 Jan 202401:06:54

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To learn more, please have a look at Dr. Ercolani's book, The Maidan Museum: Preserving the Spirit of Maidan.
Show Notes:
1:00 Ercolani’s background
3:50 Ercolani’s focus of Ukraine
6:40 research and writing The Maidan Museum: Preserving the Spirit of Maidan
11:40 new Maidan language created that includes symbols
14:45 portraits by Marina Sochenko
16:50 Yulia Ovcharenko
17:45 Tatyana Cheprasova
18:20 Cheprasova’s use of Caravaggio 
19:00 Oleksandr Ivanovych Melnyk’s “I Can See Your Deeds”
19:45 Melnyk’s “I Can See Your Deeds”
20:25 French anthropologist Marc Augé - ‘anthropology of encounter’
21:15 Marina Sochenko’s art as documentation
21:55 Artistic Hundreds group
22:15 Artist Ivan Semesyuk with Artistic Hundreds
26:15 Kandinsky quote that artists are receivers and beneficiaries
28:15 Maidan art and a new world order
33:45 NATO
36:45 Maidan revolution and the current war
41:00 memory of identify and identity war
42:05 author Andrey Kurkov’s move to Ukraine to have the identity of Ukrainians
43:25 significant of preserving art and cultural heritage in times of conflict
47:00 his legacy 
49:50 his definition of justice
51:15 the constitution of Melfi by Emperor Frederick II
53:15 link between Russian-Ukraine War and Maidan Revolution
58:45 next projects focused on conflict in society
1:00:30 anthropological identity work tied to art and cultural heritage
1:02:30 artist seen as enemy

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

*Bonus* “Signs” from Elicit Justice: Conversations Off Grid22 Dec 202300:03:54

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Featuring excerpts from Episode 121, an interview with Dr. Samson Munn and musical composition by Toulme, Copyright 2023.


Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Copyright Advocate & Author David Newhoff on State Sovereign Immunity, IP, AI and Artists' Rights - A 2ND Saturday Conversation17 Dec 202301:07:52

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Cover Photo of David Newhoff by Sean Mekas

To learn more, please visit Mr. Newhoff's site as well as his blog, The Illusion of More.

Show Notes:

1:45 Newhoff’s background 

4:15 impetus to write Who Invented Oscar Wilde?: The Photograph at the Center of Modern American Copyright? 

6:15 SCOTUS’s Warhol decision

10:00 Sarony’s input compared with and AI users’ input

14:00 Newhoff’s comments to USCO’s NOI and Request for Comments

17:20 compulsory licensing scheme

18:50 RightsClick

25:45 USCO’s focus on how a work was created (by AI or human) versus leaving that to courts

25:55 feedback on his comments to USCO

32:00 AI copyright lawsuits in the US

36:25 liability for AI training data

40:45 Emily Gould: whether training involves making copies, EU exception for copies

43:00 whether US copyright is still fit for purpose in light of issues raised by AI

44:20 work “in the style of” 

48:40 Deborah Roberts vs Lynthia Edwards - suit over collage works

52:30 Alan Robertshaw: threshold of infringing work versus transformative work

54:50 why use AI to create artwork

56:45 NFT hype

57:35 the legacy Newhoff hopes to be creating 

58:50 Newhoff’s view of justice 

1:01:00 status of Allen v. Cooper and Allen’s pending constitutional takings claim

1:04:00 camouflage patents

1:05:20 change from allowing IP claims against states to decision that Congress does not have that authority and 11th Amendment’s restriction of individuals bringing suit against states controlled 

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Dr. Samson Munn on Recovering Art by Jacob Mącznik and other School of Paris Artists, Escaping the Burden of Silence Through Dialogue, Citizenship, Israeli PM Netanyahu, the Fraught Concept of Legacy & Defining Justice03 Dec 202301:25:55

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Cover Image:  Self-Portrait, oil on canvas by Jacob Mącznik.

To learn more, please visit the website for Jacob Mącznik, the Lost Art Database page for Mącznik's Still Life with Fish,  The Austrian Encounter and the trailer to The Ghosts of the Third Reich.

Show Notes:

0:00 Dr. Samson Munn discussing Van Ham art auctionhouse

1:45 Munn’s background

2:50 history of Holocaust-related dialogue with Dan Bar-On

4:00 Children of the Third Reich

4:20 Austrian dialogue group 

4:35 Ghosts of the Third Reich

6:00 second group, The Encounter 

7:45 Dan Bar-On’s book Fear and Hope

12:00 examples from dialogue groups

17:15 Munn’s initial motivation to start dialogue group - emotional responsibility 

24:40 Munn’s dialogue work in Northern Ireland

27:25 dialogue work with descendants of displaced indigenous peoples

28:50 preparation for dialogue group facilitators 

32:20 screening individuals for dialogue groups

33:45 Israeli, Polish and German citizenship

44:30 Jacob Mącznik’s work 

1:00:00 Van Ham auctionhouse

1:06:00 Parisian archive research

1:11:00 Munn’s research of other artists from the Paris School

1:12:30 female artists from the Paris School

1:14:30 Mącznik catalogue raisonne

1:17:00 legacy that Munn is working to create

1:19:30 justice

1:22:30 Israeli PM Netanyahu


Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Fair Use and AI - A 2ND Saturday Exploration19 Nov 202300:45:09

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Show Notes:

0:00 Yelena Khajekian

1:30 Warhol v Goldsmith decision by SCOTUS 

3:00 USCO NOI’s Question 8

4:00 Google LLC v. Oracle America, Inc., 593 U.S. ___ (2021)

4:20 liability question

4:45 Emily Gould - fair use

6:30 Alan Robertshaw - Warhol court’s focus on use of the work

7:50 Khajekian - artists’ perspective on Warhol decision

9:00 Campbell v. Acuff-Rose Music, Inc., 510 U.S. 569 (1994)

10:20 confusion of fair use analysis and court’s aesthetic analysis

12:00 USCO NOI’s Question about fair use 

13:00 Robertshaw - UK’s fair dealing analysis

15:50 Gould - big players like Getty 

17:45 text and data mining exception

20:10 Drawdy - private contracting as a solution

21:00 Robertshaw - Getty

22:15 Khajekian - conceptual art

25:55 Warhol’s 2 Cir decision 

26:50 Gould & Khajekian - Richard Prince decision held not fair use

27:20 Khajekian - equity issue

28:40 Gould - UK courts’ emphasis on purpose, e.g., Stormtrooper helmet case 

30:30 Drawdy - amount and substantiality of use

31:10 Gould - Australian case about Men at Work’s use of folk song Kookaburra in its pop song Down Under

32:20 Robershaw - dispute over Vanilla Ice’s Ice Ice Baby

33:00 Ed Sheeran  

34:15 Getty case pending in UK

35:00 Khajekian - international versus US issues 

37:30 Robershaw - test that contemplates level of effort or end result regarding AI output

40:30 Gould - risks involved with AI

40:50 EU’s application-based approach 

41:10 AI for medical applications

41:55 detecting forgeries will still require humans, e.g., conflicting AI results regarding Raphael

42:50  implicit bias in AI

43:15 dogs detecting forgeries 

43:40 chickens detecting shapes

Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

Glance at Culture - Martha Szabo's NYC Solo Exhibition & MSeum's Celebration of Unknown Female Artists05 Nov 202300:54:31

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Cover art: Martha Szabo, Rooftops in Snow 11, oil on linen, 24 x 35 in., circa 1964

To learn more, please visit the sites for Martha Szabo and MSeum.

Show Notes:

0:00 Art historian Kathleen Hulser

1:30 Journalist Julia Szabo’s motivation to work on Martha Szabo’s body of work

4:30 MSeum to be built in the Catskills

5:00 National Association of Women in Construction

7:50 Justice for unknown female artists

11:15 Museum’s mission related to blind and low-vision visitors

13:45 Sculpture Robin Antar’s limestone sculpture of Szabo’s “Red Sunset”

15:20 Legacy to be created with MSeum includes redefining storage

16:45 Visible storage space

18:30 Julia Szabo’s parents

19:45 ‘Mother Artist’ field of scholarship

20:00 Author Hettie Judah

21:20 Reception for Martha Szabo’s exhibition Up On the Roof

22:10 Artist Christina Massey

23:20 Museum’s director Kathleen Hulser

24:30 “Up On the Roof” exhibition curated by Hulser

26:00 “Incorrigibles” trans media project

27:45 MSeum’s creation and mission

34:15 Hulser’s scope a MuSeum

36:45 Martha Szabo’s background and how it impacted her work 

43:15 Feedback about Martha Szabo’s solo exhibition Up On The Roof: Liberation, Transformation, Celebration

49:35 MSeum and exhibitions like “Up On The Roof” role in bringing some historical justice for female creatives

52:10 David Richard Gallery


Please share your comments and/or questions at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com

Music by Toulme.

To hear more episodes, please visit Warfare of Art and Law podcast's website.

To leave questions or comments about this or other episodes of the podcast and/or for information about joining the 2ND Saturday discussion on art, culture and justice, please message me at stephanie@warfareofartandlaw.com. 

Thanks so much for listening!

This podcast and its content may not be used for training or developing AI systems without permission.


© Stephanie Drawdy [2026]

© My Podcast Data · Projet indépendant · Données issues d'Apple & Spotify