Just when you thought you had a handle on all of the Christian Nationalist efforts to reshape America into their biblical paradise (think New Apostolic Reformation, Seven Mountains Dominionism, Jericho Marches, The Federalist Society, The Heritage Foundation, TurningPointUSA, Project 2025), along comes Ziklag, a secret society of mega millionaires created to help sway our elections toward a Christian Nationalist agenda that's also, (get this!) a tax-exempt 501(c)3!

With a name right out of the Marvel Universe, you'd think it comical if it weren't for real. ProPublica reporter Andy Kroll (along with his collaborator Nick Surgey of Documented) engaged in good old fashioned investigative journalism to draw back the curtain on this nefarious group and the ultra-wealthy families (whose fortunes you likely contribute to) behind it. 

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After a long long week of activity in Chicago, our friends Sarah Levin (Secular Strategies) and Hemant Mehta (Friendly Atheist), graciously agreed to connect for an exclusive conversation for Unreasonable listeners, recapping what they saw and heard at the Democratic National Convention, especially from a secular perspective, since over 30 percent of the Democratic party is non-religious.

There was a lot of god talk coming from the podium. And we get it: Democrats have the opportunity to draw in people of faith who’ve finally had it with their anti-Christ candidate. How many of those people actually exist? Who knows, but in this game of inches it behooves us to invite them to the party and feel welcome. As they should: honest people of faith do, for the most part, share the social and moral values of secular voters.

And though there’s still work to be done, tremendous strides have been taken by the party to acknowledge their reliable None voters. 

Sarah and Hemant walk us through them on this special DNC episode of Unreasonable.

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Erica Coray and Zach Pekelis are attorneys working to limit the deleterious impacts from religious accommodations. Their SRF panel “Past, Present and Upcoming Battles Over Health Mandates and Religious Accommodations” examined the law governing religious exemptions from public health requirements and the impact these cases have on the future of religious exceptionalism in law and society.

They talked to Unreasonable about the real-life threats posed by religious accommodations, the cynical use of the term “deeply held religious beliefs” and how courts are meant to assess a plaintiff’s standing, as well as the sincerity, of their religious-based objections. (Think gay wedding cakes, hypothetical websites, postal workers demanding Sunday off and football coaches making 50-yard line public spectacles of their personally held religious beliefs.)

Most timely, we get into the current Supreme Court battle argued by Erin Hawley (a former clerk for Justice Roberts who now works for the Alliance Defending Freedom, a powerful conservative Christian legal group, and the wife of insurrectionist Sen. Josh Hawley ) regarding access of the abortion pill Mifepristone.

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Erin Reed is a transgender woman, public speaker, journalist and activist who tracks anti-LGBTQ+ legislation around the world, tirelessly reporting on issues concerning the trans community. Her immensely influential TikTok account has over 445,000 followers and her daily Substack, Erin In The Morning, has more than 54,000 subscribers. 

On twitter alone, her works has been viewed over 250 million times. That’s reach.

All told, her content has been viewed hundreds of millions of times with one goal: “to achieve gender justice for queer and marginalized people through education and understanding.”

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On June 12, 2016, life changed for Brandon Wolf. He crouched in a bathroom while a gunman opened fire at Orlando’s Pulse Nightclub, killing his best friends, Drew Leinonen & Juan Guerrero, and 47 others.

Rather than be swallowed by the anger and fear of tragedy, Brandon set out to honor the victims’ legacies with action.

In the immediate aftermath of the shooting, Brandon co-founded The Dru Project, a nonprofit organization that works to empower youth and provide future leaders in the LGBTQ community funding for higher education. To date, the organization has given over $150,000 in college scholarships to rising leaders.

He also became an outspoken activist in the gun violence prevention movement, partnering with March For Our Lives, Everytown, Giffords, and others to demand legislative solutions to the epidemic. In 2019, he became the first survivor of the tragedy at Pulse Nightclub to testify before Congress.

Today, Brandon is a nationally-recognized gun safety and LGBTQ civil rights advocate and dynamic public speaker. He currently serves as National Press Secretary for the Human Rights Campaign, the nation’s largest LGBTQ+ civil rights organization.

He is the author of the memoir, "A Place for Us."

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By his own definition, Todd Stiefel is weathly. He just is. That’s not a judgment, just a fact. When his family business was sold and the non-compete clause kicked in, he was left financially secure and without a career. His years of preparation to lead the company were rendered unnecessary. One day he was Chief Strategy Officer of Stiefel Laboratories. Next, he’s searching for ways to protect, and make the best use of, his windfall.

He created the Stiefel Freethought Foundation, whose mission is to “secure humanity’s future by ensuring public policy decisions are based on love and reason rather than bias and dogma.” He has gifted over $8.7 million to charitable causes, including $7.7 million dollars to nonprofit organizations in the secular movement. 

We met Stiefel at the Summit for Religous Freedom in April. This interview follows up on a screening of the new documentary, "Bad Faith," (Stiefel is an executive producer) that closed out the event.

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Tim Whitaker is a true believer. The creator and facilitator of The New Evangelicals podcast, Tim advocates for the marginalized within the church, exploring the full depth and breadth of Christian faith traditions, and seeks to hold toxic churches and their leaders accountable.

So if you’re appalled by watching the America you thought you knew violently shapeshift into an authoritarian theocracy, imagine what it’s like for those who have a completely different understanding of religion — a progressive one — witness the debasing of their country at the hands of those cravenly reinterpreting the sacred tenets of their  faith.

In an age of Christian cosplay, The New Evangelicals seek to reclaim the evangelical tradition by embracing Christ-like values like inclusivity, diversity, and respectfulness.

The New Evangelicals “advocate for a restored church that recognizes the imago dei in others, and does not dehumanize anyone in their journey.”

Imagine that. 

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Dr. Anthea Butler is Geraldine R. Segal Professor in American Social Thought, and chair of the department of Religious Studies at the University of Pennsylvania.

A historian of African American and American religion, her research and writing spans African American religion and history, Nationalism, race, politics, Evangelicalism, gender and sexuality, media, and popular culture.

She is an opinion writer for MSNBC, and her articles have been featured in the New York Times, The Washington Post, CNN, NBC, and The Guardian.

Dr. Butler is also the author of “White Evangelical Racism: The Politics of Morality in America.”

So with that portfolio, you might find be suprised to learn that she has some thoughts on our current religio-political moment.

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We're going to assume that if you're listening to this, Jamie Raskin needs no introduction.

He's an icon among progressives and the secular movement. He co-chairs the Congressional Freethought Caucus with Rep. Jared Huffman from California.

Even if you're not especially politically engaged, you couldn't have missed him as a forceful and learned voice for justice during the criminal investigation into J6.

Prior to his political career, he was a professor of constitutional law at American University. He's the author of several books, including the must-read "Unthinkable: Trauma, Truth, and the Trials of American Democracy," which tracks the simultaneity of his own personal tragedy with the political convulsions surrounding the 2020 presidential election.

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Ani Zonneveld is a writer, singer/songwriter, and founder and president of Muslims for Progressive Values (MPV), an international human rights organization that advocates for social justice and equality for all, and supports freedom of expression and of conscience, women’s rights and, as an ally, LGBTQ rights. 

She spoke with Unreasonable about the false narratives around Islam, the religion's view on abortion, America's equivalent to the Taliban, and her message of social justice and peace from a progressive Muslim woman’s perspective.

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Like just about everyone we know, Jason Berlin woke up one morning in November 2016 and realized he had to change his life. 

Being a writer for a reality comedy TV show was all fun and games. But real life had taken a dark turn with the election of a new president who, let’s just say, was not Hillary Clinton.

He became an activist. And now, his grassroots organization, Field Team 6, is a political powerhouse, registering new voters around the country. 

Their slogan is "Register Democrats. Save The World." Jason and FT6 are doing their part. Listen and learn how you can join them.

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LIVE FROM SRF is a new limited series from Unreasonable, recorded at the 2024 Summit for Religious Freedom in Washington, D.C., April 13-16.

We kick off the series with the event's host, Rachel Laser, Americans United for Separation of Church and State’s formidable president and CEO. In this conversation she sets the tone for the amazing and illuminating conversations coming your way by describing the political landscape, the measures AU is taking against religious intrusions on our secular democracy, and the organization’s ambitious plans for the future. 

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The Black Church is as American as anything you can name. For so many, the promise of a glorious afterlife gave, and gives, succor to a lifetime of hardship here on Earth.

The influence of its sacred music is directly linked to the secular music we all listen to and enjoy today, from Jazz to Soul to R&B to Rock nd Roll. And for that we can be grateful.

But despite the prevalance of church culture in the African-American community, and American society as a whole, many Black people reject the idea of an afterllife and a god that oversees it. For them, Jesus was a salve foisted on their ancestors by slaveholders who needed their property to behave.

Mandisa Thomas is the founder and president of Black Nonbelievers, an organization that promotes atheism among the Black community, and provides  communal shelter from a world that often ostracizes nonbelievers.

She is a happy warrior in the battle of certainty vs. skepticism.

Listen now, and then check out these resources to learn more.

Black Nonbelievers

Pew Research:
History of Faith Among Black Americans

gOD-Talk Film and Web Series

”Black Nonreligious Americans” Survey by
Black Nonbelievers and American Atheists
Black Nonreligious Survey

Black Christians vs. Black Nonbelievers Debate

Cringe Alert: Kent Hovind Debate

Black Freethinkers by Chris Cameron

Dr. Tony Pinn

Candace Gorham

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With this episode, we begin a four-part series focused on those individuals and groups around the country who are leading the secular ground game.  Some are facing tsunamis of resistance. Others are making headway. But the brighter the light on their efforts the easier to find and join them. 

You can contribute to their work, get your hands dirty, hit the streets. work alongside them toward the world we all wish to see. 

But first you have to know who they are.

In upcoming episodes we'll focus on Michigan and Wisconsin, Arizona and Nevada, and Georgia and North Carolina.

Let's start at Ground Zero: Florida and Texas.

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What if young people took their collective future into their own hands, cultivated and supported their own candidates, rather than relying on the elders who appear increasingly out-of-touch with their concerns and will inevitably disappoint them?

That sounds promising, until you discover the incredibly low voter registration rates among high schoolers arriving at the age that was once considered a major milestone: voting in your first election.

Culture warriors have made it so that the simplest civics lesson is contested, reducing that awareness, and many teachers watch their words out of fear of being accused of “indoctrination.” Who really knows what these kids are being taught?

Jahnavi Rao knows. At 16, the now 23-year-old Harvard grad founded New Voters, and held her first voter registration drive amongst her fellow high schoolers in Berwyn, PA. Since then, over 300 volunteers have registered more than 80,000 young voters across 39 states, thanks to New Voters. 

In this conversation, Jahnavi provides insight to a demographic we think we know, but probably don’t. It turns out that Gen Zs are more than their characterization as smartphone ostriches, buried in their curated virtual worlds as the real world conspires against them. 

The kids are alright. And it’s their turn to lead. 

Please share this conversation with the young people in your life. It’s an important message. But it's better if they hear it from her.

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David and Christina talk to one of the country’s leading lights in the area of American constitutional law and dean of Berkeley Law, about the various interpretations of the First Amendment’s two religion clauses; freedom of speech in the age of artificial intelligence and political deep-fakes; staying positive and vigilant even as an overreaching Supreme Court undermines the constitution it is sworn to uphold; judicial term limits and expansion of the Court; the electoral college, even where Chemerinsky and Antonin Scalia find common ground.

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To help us better understand our Christian brethren, and how to build alliances between people of faith and those who are perfectly good without a god, we invited into the studio someone whose name is mentioned frequently on the podcast, usually preceded by the phrase “devout Christian”: David’s wife Kaitlyn Waterson.

Where do this couple, an atheist and “devout Christian” find common ground? Religiously polar opposites, where do their politics intersect? What do those kitchen table conversations sound like and are there lessons to be learned there?

In the final Unreasonable Coffee before the launch of Season Two on March 15, Christina pivots from election guru to marriage counselor, in this fascinating conversation with David and Kaitlyn.

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This week's Unreasonable Coffee is served steaming hot! Christina is so pissed off she needs a dose of David's hopium to cool her off. 

Her ire is focused on the Supreme Court’s brazen disingenuousness over their backtracking on whether to hear the case for and against presidential immunity. At first, they punted to the Circuit Court. When that ruling didn’t go their way, they elected to receive. How will that decision impact the election?

Plus, is the right's "firehose of bullshit" wearing us down?

That, and more...

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On this week's Unreasonable Coffee, David and Christina bring their hot takes to the extra-uterine children of Alabama, Tom Suozzi's winning strategy, eau de Trump, and why we brewed this Coffee just too damn early in the day.

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This time, David and Christina review the week’s special elections in New York and Pennsylvania; coming of age in the age of internet disinformation; Chris Ullery’s reporting on the Central Bucks school board member; David’s UUism and progressive allies in faith; religious and political Super Bowl ads.

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Over this week’s cuppa, David and Christina discuss the Independent State Legislature Theory in light of the just-concluded SCOTUS arguments regarding Colorado’s assertion that the 14th Amendment empowers the state to remove certain individuals from its primary ballot; Breaching the Mainstream project by the Institute for Research and Education on Human Rights; a case for open primaries; the latest NAR-cissistic doublespeak coming from C. Peter Wagner-anointed “apostle” Lance Wallnau; a win against Project Veritas; the disbanding of Moms for Liberty in Lehigh County; and an introduction to Conservapedia, the alt-fact reference site.

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This week on Unreasonable Coffee, David and Christina wonk out on political fatigue, the endorsement process, the problem of judicial retention, as well as Turning Point USA crazy talk, a win for The Satanic Temple, and whether Taylor and Travis are psyops.

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During our hiatus, David and Christina engage in a series of mid-season one-on-one conversations analyzing the latest news, offering tools for engagement and serving up reasons for optimism. This week, they discuss a bill allowing the National Prayer Breakfast to be held in the Capital Rotunda, making faith-nonfaith marriages work, candidate vetting, the less-obvious value of lobbying, the work Wil Jeudy and Secular Houston are doing on the ground in Texas, tools for growing a secular electorate, and the positivity of pluralism.

Season Two of Unreasonable starts March 15!

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Ten weeks ago Joe Biden was still the Democratic candidate for president and Donald Trump was…well…still Donald Trump (and he’s only become a more extreme version of himself since).

Yet somehow, these two — one, a decent career civil servant, the other a loathsome career self-servant — were neck-and-neck in polling. And Democrats were losing their shit.

It was then, in mid-May, that The New Republic magazine convened a group of academics, lawyers, journalists, activists, politicians and pundits in Philadelphia for their Stop Trump Summit. It was at once illuminating and comforting for an audience desperate to be talked off the ledge if only for that one afternoon. 

The event’s theme song might well have been “How Do You Solve a Problem Like The Donald?”

Now that Kamala Harris is the presumptive nominee, it is still worth revisiting that event, because it wasn’t so much about Biden as about the other guy. And though Biden’s handoff and Harris’s launch have gone off fairly smoothly and met with tremendous early enthusiasm, the problem of Trump, like a bad case of impetigo, persists. 

Panels ranged from the threats to democracy posed by a second Trump administration (who only this week promised "my beautiful Christians" that if they voted him in it would be the last time they'd ever have to vote), to the impact of the Dobbs decision, to voter registration strategies. 

Among the speakers: PA State Senator Vincent Hughes, and podcaster and pundit Molly Jong-Fast.

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During our hiatus, Unreasonable is gearing up for what will be an extremely active year. But between now and March 15, David and Christina will engage in a series of mid-season one-on-one conversations analyzing the latest news, issue calls to action and, as is their wont, share reasons for optimism. This week, they consider the results of the Iowa caucuses, conservative campaigns courting the Jewish vote in light of the Israel/Hamas war, and whether Democrats have been complicit in normalizing the extremism of Republican candidates.

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As a constitutional lawyer, Andrew Seidel has fought on the front lines in the battle to protect and preserve the separation of church and state. 

He’s written two books on the scourge of Christian Nationalism: “The Founding Myth” provides a detailed history of the false notion that America was founded as a Christian nation, how the myth began and who’s perpetuating it today. 

“American Crusade” focuses on how Christian Nationalists have won incremental battles in the courts for over 50 years leading to foundational changes in our country, from deciding elections to the reversal of Roe, book bans, the legal  erasure of Black history, public funding for religious institutions, an insurrection, and the theocratical activism of our Supreme Court. 

He is a ubiquitous presence on social media, and his TikToks go viral. This may sound superficial, but his warnings are resonating with younger audiences. He’s found a way to communicate arcane constitutional issues in ways everyone can understand. 

All of this makes Andrew Seidel the perfect guest to help us close out Season One of “Unreasonable: Church, State and the American Divide.”

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Pennsylvania State Representative Chris Rabb represents the 200th district of Philadelphia County, which includes, as he calls it, The People's Republic of Mount Airy.  He is also non-religious and is proudly open about it. We talked to RepRabb about politics, religion, and why the twain should never meet. This one is fast and furious and 100% on point!

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Since Eisenhower, every American president has attended something called the National Prayer Breakfast, hosted by a mysterious and amorphous group called the Fellowship Foundation, or more familiarly, The Family.

The Family’s focus, according to our guest, journalist Jonathan Larsen, is to “pursue relationships with people in power and use those relationships to pursue relationships with people in power. Jesus plus nothing. In contrast to the sort of traditional, stereotypical Jesus image of helping the poor, washing the feet of lepers, [The Family] is very much is focused on people in power.”

And through those people in power they can influence policy according to their biblical interpretations. Fast forward to Mike Johnson.

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In the lead-up to the 2022 midterms, pollsters uniformly predicted a red wave. This seemed a harmless prediction as our fickle American electorate often engages in buyer’s remorse a mere two years after a presidential election. But what actually happened was the exact opposite of that polling. While not exactly a blue wave, Democrats performed well enough for the election to be considered not just an upset but a full-throated rejection of MAGA.

How did the pollsters get it so wrong?

And how did Simon Rosenberg get it so right?

In this episode, we talk to the long-time Democratic strategist and creator of Hopium Chronicles about his lonely prediction of a blue surge, the difference between quantifiable data and opinion polls, why progressives have been so successful over the last three elections, and what we all need to do to keep our democracy out of the hands of right-wing wackos moving forward. Hopium = Hope with a Plan. Let's do this!

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Since Unreasonable began, we’ve heard of horrifying tales, from the dark money fueling our far-right SCOTUS to the religious impositions on our personal healthcare choices, to the history, mobilization and impact of White Christian Nationalists literally praying for Armageddon.

In observance of Halloween — Unreasonable’s highest and holiest of days — we’re revisiting some of our scariest moments and reflecting on what they mean for our future.

Enter. If you dare… 

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“How do you expect this country to ever be anything but in turmoil?”

This is the rhetorical question posed by our guest, Gwen Leaffe Carr, executive director of the Carlisle Indian School Project.

A relatively unknown chapter in the ongoing tragedy of America’s Native people is the one about the boarding schools designed to erase them. Or, in the words of their architect, Lt. Col. Richard Henry Pratt, to “kill the Indian in him, and save the man." 

This episode of Unreasonable is dedicated to all those who suffered the indignity of these schools, to those who died there, and to those who survived.

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When we give up on our students, especially those in public schools, we relinquish our collective responsibility as stewards of a thriving democracy. After all, knowledge is power. And in a democracy, knowledge is also a birthright. Defunding our public schools, demonizing public school teachers, diverting public funding to private and religious institutions, deprives our kids — soon to be adults — of that power, and assigns to them less than first-class citizenship.

To some highly-motivated (and well-funded) members of American society, that’s precisely what would make America great again. Thus, from local school boards to the highest court in the land, public education is under attack.

What’s happening on the ground and in the courts, and what can we all do moving forward, to prevent a theocratic takeover of our secular schools?

In our special Back To School episode we talk with Liz Cavell (Staff/Board member of the Freedom from Religion Foundation and co-host of the “We Dissent” podcast); Dan Mach (Director, ACLU Program on Freedom of Religion and Belief); and, for a local perspective, Chris Ullery, Extremism and Social Justice Reporter for the USA Today Network in PA). 

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On the eve of Rosh Hashanah we talk with Paul Golin, executive director of the Society for Humanistic Judaism, an organization which promotes the concept of being Jewish  absent a belief in God.

But as with so much of Judaism, it's not that simple. Jews and their history are laden with baggage. 

For starters, is it a religion, a race, an ethnicity or a culture? 

Are Jews obligated to adhere strictly to biblical scripture or read the Talmud for interpretive guidance?

Is marrying outside the faith a betrayal of those who died in the Holocaust?

Is it even possible to be a Jew without God?

Does being sympathetic to the Palestinian cause make you anti-Jewish? Does anti-Zionism equate with anti-semitism? If so, what are we to make of Jewish anti-Zionists?

That's a lot to unpack. But we dive in. On this episode of Unreasonable.

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Sometimes you don't know whether to laugh or cry.

On the one hand, a typical Donald Trump speech is comedy gold. No sentient human actually speaks like that, and the words, not to mention the syntax, are often a spew of laughable preposterousness. (Alec Baldwin was good, but nowhere near as hilarious as the original!) Still, he has an audience that takes him straight, no irony. 

And then they act out on those words. And then, as a democracy, we want to cry.

But as each of our guests have demonstrated, we can cry, or we can do something.  For nearly 20 years, comedian and activist Pete Dominick has brought his political activism to the airwaves, first on Sirius Satellite Radio (later Sirius XM) and now on his immensely popular daily podcast "Stand Up with Pete Dominick." 

We invited Pete to join us on Unreasonable because, frankly, we needed a good laugh. And he delivered. And, like any good social commentator, he left us with plenty to think about, too, from politics to parenting.

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Last month, David and Christina attended the annual Secular Student Alliance conference, held this year in sweltering Little Rock, Arkansas. 

It's a gathering of college students from campuses around the country seeking community and inspiration. That opportunity is especially important at a time when, being reason-based, one feels increasingly outnumbered. 

They presented our “So You Want to Be An Organizer” workshop and conducted a series of run-and-gun interviews, collaring speakers like author Anne Nelson and "The Thinking Atheist" Seth Andrews, as well as student attendees.

What you'll hear from the students may disturb you. The students they spoke with are struggling, trying to calibrate their own moral compasses in a world where morality seems to shift with the tide. 

What to make of a world where pious churchgoers worship the anti-Christ, where the "good guy" signs off on arms in support of genocide, and where so many of the lessons they learned in American history class turned out to be deeply biased at best, or just wrong?

You may agree or disagree with what you'll hear, but attention must be paid. Because their vote – or non-vote – may be the difference between keeping our democracy and the end of the American experiment.

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While some politicians — who had never given a thought to God or Christianity or had ever committed an act of forgiveness or charity toward others that anyone could recall — were disingenuously embracing Jesus for their own craven ends, others were working across multiple, nonviolent, nontheistic, and legal approaches to protect children, fight on behalf of women’s bodily autonomy, and litigate to restore true religious freedom and equality for all Americans, regardless of their belief system. 

By their iconography, you might not recognize that these people, under the banner of Satanism, are actually the ones doing God’s work.

Lucien Greaves is the co-founder of The Satanic Temple, whose mission is “to encourage benevolence and empathy, reject tyrannical authority, advocate practical common sense, oppose injustice, and undertake noble pursuits.” 

Sounds good to us.

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The New Apostolic Reformation is a loose network of independent congregations untethered by the dogmas of traditional denominations and many of their leaders, or self-anointed “apostles,” make claims so outlandish you wonder how anyone in their right mind would believe them. NAR was also a primary driver of J6.

Never heard of NAR? You need to, because its membership and belief system – as crazy as it will sound to you – is alive and viral in the halls of Congress and local governments. And the acceptance of this religious movement, invented only a couple of decades ago, is metastasizing not just here but around the world, into the hundreds of millions.

There’s a fine line between harmless, deeply held religious belief, and certifiable madness. At the top of this episode, you will hear an audio clip by a Florida NAR pastor who uses the violent language of the Gospel to call for Joe Biden’s beheading. As Dr. Taylor points out, “they walk right up to that line. But they definitely know where the line is in order to be protected by the First Amendment.”

Become aware of the horrifying world of the New Apostolic Reformation. Because it just might be the world we all inhabit after November 5th, 2024.

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How did the faux “grassroots” organization Moms For Liberty metastasize in just a few years to attract hundred of followers, as well as extremist presidential candidates, to their summit in Philadelphia last month? Money. Crazy money.

We know about Barre Said, we know about Leonard Leo and the Federalist Society. There are plenty of deep-pocketed dark-money sources we don't know about. So where’s our money? Who’s funding our movement in support of the secular nation our founders intended? We’re living under the tyranny of the minority because the minority are willing to spend whatever they have to reduce our country to a superstitious backwater nation.

As it turns out, there are lots of secular folks who are putting their money where their values are, but you have to know where to look. We looked no farther than the American Humanist Association. Never heard of them? Well, you should. Their PAC, the Center for Freethought Equality, identifies and supports secular candidates. And that's key to preserving our democracy. They don’t have a lot of money, but what they have often seeds successful campaigns. 

Ron Millar runs the PAC. His professional life has been dedicated to supporting progressive movements, and we’re delighted to share our conversation with him about how progressives can counter the billions conservatives pour into political races, on this  episode of Unreasonable.

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What if there was a war on but you didn't know it? And what if you were the enemy?

The White Christian Nationalist movement in America is weaponizing. And they're using scripture to justify violence in the service of Jesus. After all, when you believe that America was founded as a Christian nation and all who identify as anything but are criminal trespassers, rapists and pedophiles -- coming for your children!) -- taking up arms seems like the only rational thing to do.

Sounds crazy, though, right? 

Bradley Onishi lived in that world. A one-time evangelical preacher,  he's a religion scholar, author, and co-host of the Straight White American Jesus podcast. We talked with Brad about the origins of Christian Nationalism in America, its evolution over the past 50 years, its embodiment in today's GOP, and how to battle back...if that's even possible.

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David talks to Christina about her Catholic upbringing, her mother's premature death, and her atheism.

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What would you do if you knew your days were numbered? 

In 2019 Dave Warnock, one-time charismatic evangelical preacher now-atheist, was diagnosed with Amyotrophic Lateral Sclerosis. ALS is a fatal condition, and with his diagnosis Dave had a choice to make: live out the rest of his life quietly waiting to die, or “live out loud.” That meant speaking publicly about his spiritual deconstruction, his disease, and dying without a belief in a god or an afterlife.

Trigger warning: this conversation speaks frankly about death. We are grateful for the opportunity to share Dave’s story with you, and for the time he gave us for this interview that we promise will move and challenge you. 

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Happy Thomas Paine Day! June 8, also known as Freethinkers Day, celebrates one of leading lights of the American Revolution that hardly anyone knows anything about.

His writings ignited our independence; laid out the structure for a new democracy; articulated the rights of all men and women, young and old; envisioned the safety net we now call Social Security; decried slavery and, above all, called for a separation of church and state. A deist himself, he understood that although religious devotion is a right, it should have no influence on the body politic.

It’s time America gave Thomas Paine his due. David and Christina learn all about who Thomas Paine was, and why his work is more relevant today than ever before, as they speak with Margaret Downey, founder of the Thomas Paine Memorial Association.

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In Part Two of this frank, fearless and provocative conversation, Rev. Naomi addresses topics ranging from blind faith, literal readings of the gospel, and the falacy of religious unity, to the demise of Christian progressivism, advice for secular candidates seeking to appeal to traditional Black congregations, and what inspires her, despite everything, to "keep showing up."

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The Christian bible is filled with contradictions, its text contested even among adherents. With so much of “the gospel” in question, where does one’s faith come from? David and Christina explore the meaning of faith, the state of American Christianity, and the separation of church and state with Rev. Naomi Washington-Leapheart. This is the first of two parts. 

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Calling All Secular High School and College Activists! For over two decades, the Secular Student Alliance has empowered secular students to proudly express their identity, build welcoming communities, promote secular values, and set a course for lifelong activism. The SSA provides scholarships and their national conference is coming up in June. Executive Director Kevin Bolling tells us all about it.

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This was an especially nutty week in America. And none of it had to do with a particular televised debate or even the Supreme Court’s ruling on presidential immunity. 

This week the state of Louisiana mandated that The Ten Commandments be displayed in every one of its public school classrooms.

In Oklahoma, in the wake of the state’s Supreme Court decision to disallow the establishment of the country’s first publicly-funded religious charter school, Ryan Waters, the state’s education superintendent, issued a requirement that the bible be placed in all public school classrooms. 

We parse the immediate and long-term implications of both of these issues with Alison Gill, Vice President for Legal and Policy at American Atheists.

Alison also helps us understand "the Chevron deference” in light of the U.S. Supreme Court’s decision last week in Loper Bright Enterprises v. Raimondo to ignore the expertise of federal agencies in favor of politically-appointed and inexpert judges with their own ideological leanings. 

So much to unpack. 

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So what do we do when the party that generally embraces secular values like bodily autonomy, democracy, and science, demonstrates an abject disinterest in its secular voters, despite representing a huge voting bloc? Could this be the biggest miscalculation in  the Democratic party's strategy? Do we even have a strategy? Okay, that's a lot of questions. We talk with Sarah Levin, founder of Secular Strategies, seeking answers. 

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When you consider how many laws and exemptions accommodate Christian Nationalists, and the militancy with which they fight to impose their extremist vision of America – from White supremacy to homophobia to vicious attacks on women’s healthcare – it’s not a stretch to see the battle lost. Thankfully, we have organizations like Americans United for Separation of Church and State litigating and lobbying on behalf of all American citizens of all beliefs.

At their Summit for Religious Freedom last weekend in Washington, DC, hundreds gathered (including the entire Unreasonable team!), from faith leaders to atheists, from college-aged to seasoned activists, all working on the front lines to save our country from going the way of full-on theocracy. AU's senior advisor Rob Boston recaps the event with us. 

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For nearly 20 years, the Military Religious Freedom Foundation has been on the front lines of calling out and litigating Christian Nationalism and religious indoctrination in the U.S. military. David and Christina talk to its founder, Mikey Weinstein, and his report from the field clearly illustrates America’s strong-armed bend towards theocracy. “It’s not a problem or an issue or a challenge,” he says. “It’s a national security threat.”

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David and Christina go deep diving into the dark money world of Christian Nationalism and right-wing extremism, with journalist and best-selling author, Nina Burleigh. 

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