Explorez tous les épisodes du podcast Thresholds

Jordan sits down with Renee Gladman to talk about prose architecture, Henry James, walking in cities, and mushrooms.

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Nicholson Baker sits down with Jordan to discuss writing about the unsung pleasures and details of the world-- things like the way your mother cuts up a banana, or the advertisements in your favorite magazine. Things that "live in this between area of noticing, they're part of the background of life."

Mentioned in the episode:

• Nicholson's book about WWII, Human Smoke
• "Sock (Object Lessons)" by Kim Adrian
• "The Lab Leak Hypothesis," New York Magazine

Nicholson Baker has written seventeen books, including The Mezzanine, Vox, Human Smoke, The Anthologist, and Baseless—also an art book, The World on Sunday, in collaboration with his wife Margaret Brentano. Several of his books have been New York Times bestsellers, and he has won a National Book Critics Circle Award, a James Madison Freedom of Information Award, a Guggenheim fellowship, and the Herman Hesse Prize.

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Sarah Aziza sits down with Jordan to talk about the eating disorder that almost took her life in 2019, and the search into her family's history in Palestine that she undertook in a bid for her own survival.

Mentioned in the episode:

• the Nakba
• transgenerational trauma
• José Muñoz, Cruising Utopia
• ghurba

Sarah Aziza is a Palestinian American writer, translator, and artist with roots in ‘Ibdis and Deir al-Balah, Gaza. She is the author of The Hollow Half, a genre-bending work of memoir, lyricism, and oral history exploring the intertwined legacies of diaspora, colonialism, and the American dream. Her award-winning journalism, poetry, essays, and experimental nonfiction have appeared in The New Yorker, The Paris Review, Best American Essays, The Baffler, Harper’s Magazine, Mizna, The Washington Post, The Guardian, and The Nation, among other publications. Previously a Fulbright fellow in Jordan, she is the recipient of numerous Pulitzer Center grants for Crisis Reporting, a 2022 resident at Tin House Writer’s Workshop, a Pushcart Prize nominee, and a 2023 Margins Fellow at the Asian American Writers Workshop.

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Lisa Ko sits down with Jordan to talk about the daily journaling practice that she started at age five, and the period of creative crisis between her first and second novels when she began methodically destroying every journal she'd ever kept.

Mentioned in the episode:

• Tehching Hsieh
• soft gaze
• Moleskin daily journals

Lisa Ko is the author of the new novel Memory Piece and the nationally bestselling novel The Leavers, which was a finalist for the National Book Award for Fiction and the PEN/Hemingway Award, and winner of the PEN/Bellwether Prize for Socially Engaged Fiction. Ko’s writing has appeared in Best American Short Stories, McSweeney’s, and The Believer.

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Jordan sits down to talk with Sabrina Imbler, author of How Far the Light Reaches, about writing the non-human world, leaving the world of legacy media, and how they've learned from the deep sea --and from their colleagues-- about the power of collectivity.

Mentioned in the episode:

• how to write a book on top of a full-time job
• uncharismatic microfauna
• Sabrina's essay on salps and queer collectivity, from How Far the Light Reaches
• Who Is Steven Hotdog?

Sabrina Imbler is a staff writer at Defector, a worker-owned site, where they cover creatures and the natural world. Their first full-length book, How Far the Light Reaches, won a Los Angeles Times book prize in science and technology. Their chapbook Dyke (geology), was published by Black Lawrence Press, and was selected for the National Book Foundation Science + Literature Program.

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This week, Jordan sits down to talk with Maya Binyam, author of the novel Hangman,about a near-drowning that changed her life.

Maya Binyam is the author of Hangman, which was named a 2024 National Book Foundation “5 under 35” honoree, received the Rosenthal Family Foundation Award from the American Academy of Arts and Letters, and was longlisted for the Women’s Prize, the Mark Twain American Voice in Literature Award, and the Dublin Literary Award. She is the recipient of the 2025 Bard Fiction Prize. Her work has appeared in the Paris Review, theNew Yorker,Best American Short Stories, and elsewhere. She is an advisory editor of theParis Review.

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This week, we're sharing a live conversation between Jordan and Carvell Wallace, recorded last year at P&T Knitwear in New York. They talk about his new memoir, Another Word for Love, a moment of real peril from his childhood, and the long process that followed for him of learning to embrace vulnerability, connection, and his own writing voice.

Carvell Wallace is a writer and podcaster who has contributed to The New Yorker, GQ, New York Times Magazine, Pitchfork, MTV News, and Al Jazeera. His debut memoir, Another Word For Love (MCD, 2024), explores his life, identity, and love through stories of family, friendship, and culture and is a 2024 Kirkus Finalist in Nonfiction. He was a 2019 Peabody Award nominee, a 2022 National Magazine Award Finalist, a 2023 winner of the Mosaic Prize in Journalism, and a 2025 UCross Fellow. He lives in Oakland.

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This week, Jordan sits down to talk with Lidia Yuknavitch about menopause, where stories lodge in our bodies, having a creative process that takes the shape of an ocean wave, and more.

Lidia Yuknavitch is the National Bestselling author of four novels: Thrust, The Book of Joan, Dora: A Headcase, and The Small Backs of Children, winner of the 2016 Oregon Book Awards Ken Kesey Award for Fiction as well as the OBA Reader's Choice Award. She has also published a critical book on war and narrative, Allegories Of Violence (Routledge). The Misfit's Manifesto, a book based on her recent TED Talk, was published by TED Books in 2017. Verge, a collection of short fiction, was released in 2020. Her widely acclaimed memoir The Chronology of Water was a finalist for a PEN Center USA award for creative nonfiction and winner of a PNBA Award and the Oregon Book Award Reader's Choice. Her newest memoir, Reading the Waves, was published by Riverhead books in 2025. She is a very good swimmer.

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This week, we bring you a live interview with Garth Greenwell, conducted in October 2024 at Pioneer Works in Brooklyn. Garth talks about growing up in Kentucky assuming that he would die young, the teacher who gave him a path toward being an artist, and the doggedness with which he has pursued his aesthetic practices (in both music and literature) ever since.

Mentioned:

Garth's new novel, Small Rain (FSG 2024)

Frank Bidart

Benjamin Britten

Così Fan Tutte

The HIV/AIDS crisis

Garth Greenwell is the author of What Belongs to You, which won the British Book Award for Debut of the Year, was longlisted for the National Book Award, and was a finalist for six other awards, including the PEN/Faulkner Award, the James Tait Black Memorial Prize, and the Los Angeles Times Book Prize. His second book of fiction, Cleanness, was a finalist for the Lambda Literary Award and Cleanness was named a New York Times Notable Book of 2020, a New York Times Critics Top 10 book of the year, and a Best Book of the year by the New Yorker, TIME, NPR, the BBC, and over thirty other publications.  A new novel, Small Rain, is now out from FSG. He is the recipient of many honors for his work, including a 2020 Guggenheim Fellowship and the 2021 Vursell Award for prose style from the American Academy of Arts and Letters. He has taught at the Iowa Writers Workshop, Grinnell College, the University of Mississippi, Princeton, and NYU. He writes regularly about literature, film, art and music for his Substack, To a Green Thought. 

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We're revisiting our 2021 interview with the poet Jericho Brown, who this week was named a MacArthur Fellow-- one of the highest honors in the arts and humanities. He and Jordan talk about the great mystery of why we desire the things we desire; about oration and the poets he read and memorized as part of his own becoming; mitigating our impulses toward violence with tenderness, and more.

Jericho Brown is author of the The Tradition (Copper Canyon 2019), for which he won the Pulitzer Prize. He is the recipient of fellowships from the Guggenheim Foundation, the Radcliffe Institute for Advanced Study at Harvard, and the National Endowment for the Arts, and he is the winner of the Whiting Award. Brown’s first book, Please (New Issues 2008), won the American Book Award. His second book, The New Testament (Copper Canyon 2014), won the Anisfield-Wolf Book Award. His third collection, The Tradition won the Paterson Poetry Prize and was a finalist for the National Book Award and the National Book Critics Circle Award. His poems have appeared in The Bennington Review, Buzzfeed, Fence, jubilat, The New Republic, The New York Times, The New Yorker, The Paris Review, TIME magazine, and several volumes of The Best American Poetry. He is the director of the Creative Writing Program and a professor at Emory University.

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This week, Jordan talks to the novelist Sigrid Nunez about her youthful preoccupation with mimicking the prose of Virginia Woolf, the step-by-step intuitive way she writes prose now, and the best way to make overnight oats.

Sigrid Nunez has published nine novels, including A Feather on the Breath of God, The Last of Her Kind, The Friend, What Are You Going Through, and, most recently, The Vulnerables. Nunez is also the author of Sempre Susan: A Memoir of Susan Sontag. The Friend, a New York Times bestseller, won the 2018 National Book Award and was a finalist for the 2019 Simpson/Joyce Carol Oates Prize. In 2024, The New York Times listed The Friend among the 100 Best Books of the 21st Century. The Friend has been adapted for film by directors David Siegel and Scott McGehee (2024). What Are You Going Through has been adapted for a film directed by Pedro Almodóvar, The Room Next Door (2024). Nunez’s other honors and awards include a Whiting Award, a Berlin Prize Fellowship, the Rosenthal Family Foundation Award, the Rome Prize in Literature, and a Guggenheim Fellowship. She is a member of the American Academy of Arts and Letters.

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Jordan chats with Sofia Samatar (The Practice, The Horizon, and the Chain and Opacities) about having two books out this year, doing everything twice (once in non-fiction, once in fiction), and her growing sense of an ongoing overarching project to her work.

MENTIONED:

• A Stranger in Olondria by Sofia Samatar
• Monster Portraits by Sofia Samatar and Del Samatar
• The White Mosque by Sofia Samatar
• Tender: Stories by Sofia Samatar
• Tone by Sofia Samatar and Kate Zambreno
• Quicksand by Nella Larsen
• Seasonal Associate by Heike Geissler, tr. by Katy Derbyshire

Sofia Samatar is a writer of fiction and nonfiction, including the memoir The White Mosque, a PEN/Jean Stein Award finalist. Her works range from the award-winning epic fantasy A Stranger in Olondria to Opacities, a nonfiction book about writing, publishing, and friendship.

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Jordan chats with Emma Copley Eisenberg (Housemates) about a ghostly encounter that led to her new novel, the opposing worldviews of Grace Paley and Ottessa Moshfegh, and the choice to make art in difficult times.

MENTIONED:

• Jazz by Toni Morrison
• Fleishman is in Trouble by Taffy Brodesser-Akner
• American Pastoral by Philip Roth
• Terrace Story by Hilary Leichter
• "Why I Write" by George Orwell

Emma Copley Eisenberg is the author of the nationally bestselling novel Housemates and the narrative nonfiction book The Third Rainbow Girl: The Long Life of a Double Murder in Appalachia, which was named a New York Times Notable Book and was nominated for an Edgar Award, a Lambda Literary Award, and an Anthony Award, among other honors. Her fiction has appeared in Granta, McSweeney’s, VQR, American Short Fiction, and other publications. Raised in New York City, she lives in Philadelphia, where she co-founded Blue Stoop, a community hub for the literary arts.

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Shades on, sleeves up—it's summertime and we're back! This week, Jordan talks with Amy Lin, author of Here After, about grief, the sudden loss of her husband, miracles, and her family's history with thin places.

Amy Lin lives in Calgary, Canada where there are two seasons: winter and road construction. She completed her MFA at Warren Wilson College and holds BAs in English Literature and Education. Her work has been published in places such as Ploughshares and she has been awarded residencies from Yaddo and Casa Comala. She writes the Substack At The Bottom Of Everything where she wonders: how do we live with anything? Here After is her first book.

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This is a re-airing of our 2021 episode with the poet and bestselling essayist Aimee Nezhukumatathil. We're celebrating the release of her new collection, BITE BY BITE: NOURISHMENTS AND JAMBOREES. Come for the new intro about pizza on the beach, stay for Aimee's reflections on everything from champion trees to 80s-era Madonna to what society tells us about who "gets to" be comfortable in nature.

Aimee Nezhukumatathil is the author of the New York Times best-selling illustrated collection of nature essays and Kirkus Prize finalist, WORLD OF WONDERS: IN PRAISE OF FIREFLIES, WHALE SHARKS, & OTHER ASTONISHMENTS (2020, Milkweed Editions), which was chosen as Barnes and Noble’s Book of the Year. She has four previous poetry collections: OCEANIC (Copper Canyon Press, 2018), LUCKY FISH (2011), AT THE DRIVE-IN VOLCANO (2007), and MIRACLE FRUIT (2003), the last three from Tupelo Press. Her most recent chapbook is LACE & PYRITE, a collaboration of epistolary garden poems with the poet Ross Gay. Honors include a poetry fellowship from the National Endowment for the Arts, the Pushcart Prize, a Mississippi Arts Council grant, and being named a Guggenheim Fellow in poetry. She is professor of English and Creative Writing in the University of Mississippi’s MFA program.

For more Thresholds, visit us at www.thisisthresholds.com

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Jordan chats with Dorothea Lasky (The Shining) about interpreting a horror classic in her latest poetry collection, her love for horror, and why playfulness and horror aren't incompatible—and might in fact be inextricably connected.

MENTIONED:

• The Shining by Stephen King
• The Shining (1980)
• Bernadette Mayer's "Memory" project

Dorothea Lasky is the author, most recently, of The Shining  (October 2023), and Animal, published in 2019 in the Bagley Wright Lecture Series. She is also the author of Milk (Wave Books, 2018), Rome (Liveright/W.W. Norton, 2014), Thunderbird (Wave Books, 2012), Black Life (Wave Books, 2010), and AWE (Wave Books, 2007). She is also the author of six chapbooks. Born in St. Louis in 1978, she has poems that have appeared in American Poetry Review, Boston Review, Columbia Poetry Review, Gulf Coast, The Laurel Review, MAKE magazine, Phoebe, Poets & Writers Magazine, The New Yorker, Tin House, The Paris Review, and 6x6, among other places. She is the co-editor of Open the Door: How to Excite Young People About Poetry (McSweeney's, 2013), co-author of Astro Poets: Your Guides to the Zodiac (with Alex Dimitrov, Flatiron Books, 2019) and is a 2013 Bagley Wright Lecturer on Poetry. She holds a doctorate in creativity and education from the University of Pennsylvania, is a graduate of the MFA program for Poets and Writers at the University of Massachusetts-Amherst, and has been educated at Harvard University and Washington University. She has taught poetry at New York University, Wesleyan University, and Bennington College. Currently, she is an Associate Professor of Poetry at Columbia University's School of the Arts and lives in New York City.

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Jordan talks with Vinson Cunningham (Great Expectations) about finding himself in the midst of history, discovering ways to hang onto moments, and why he turned to his real life for his debut novel.

MENTIONED:

• The Vanity Fair Diaries by Tina Brown
• Answered Prayers by Truman Capote
• "How Auto is Auto-fiction" by Christian Lorentzen
• "American Boy" by Estelle
• The Idiot by Elif Batuman
• Shadow and Act by Ralph Ellison

Vinson Cunningham is a staff writer and a theatre critic at The New Yorker. His essays, reviews, and profiles have appeared in The New York Times Magazine, The New York Times Book Review, The Fader, Vulture, The Awl, and McSweeney’s. A former staffer on Barack Obama’s first presidential campaign and in his White House, Cunningham has taught at Sarah Lawrence College, the Yale School of Art, and Columbia University’s School of the Arts. He lives in New York City.

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Jordan chats with Meghan O'Rourke (The Invisible Kingdom) about hiding from herself, the death of her father, and the challenges of writing a book without knowing where it will go.

MENTIONED:

• The Riddles of the Sphinx by Anna Shechtman
• Walking and Talking (1996, written & directed by Nicole Holofcener)
• "The Teens Have Made Nirvana Preppy" by Sarah Stankorb

Meghan O’Rourke is the author of the New York Times bestseller The Invisible Kingdom: Reimagining Chronic Illness and The Long Goodbye, as well as the poetry collections Sun In Days, Once, and Halflife. Her writing has appeared in The Atlantic Monthly, The New Yorker, and The New York Times, and more. The recipient of a Guggenheim Fellowship, a Radcliffe Fellowship, and a Whiting Nonfiction Award, she resides in New Haven, where she teaches at Yale University and is the editor of The Yale Review.

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Jordan talks with Rumaan Alam (Leave the World Behind) about money, freedom, his recent period of creative fecundity, and the enduring power of art.

MENTIONED:

• The Golden Bowl by Henry James
• Appropriate by Branden Jacobs-Jenkins
• Family Meal by Bryan Washington
• Zero K by Don DeLillo
• Agnes Martin

Rumaan Alam is the author of three novels: Rich and Pretty, That Kind of Mother, and Leave the World Behind. Other writing has appeared in The New Yorker, The New York Review of Books, Bookforum, The New York Times, New York Magazine, and the New Republic. He studied writing at Oberlin College and now lives in New York with his family.

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Jordan talks with artist and writer Maira Kalman about the death of her husband Tibor Kalman, the process of grief, and her irrepressible creative spirit.

MENTIONED:

• Pippi Longstocking by Astrid Lindgren
• Sarah Berman's Closet
• The Diaries of Franz Kakfa by Franz Kafka, tr. by Ross Benjamin
• "Cheek to Cheek" by Irving Berlin, sung by Fred Astaire

Maira Kalman was born in Tel Aviv and moved to New York City with her family at the age of four. She has written/illustrated over 30 books for adults and children, been a frequent contributor to The New York Times and The New Yorker, and created textiles for Isaac Mizrahi and Kate Spade and sets for Mark Morris. Other collaborations have been with Nico Muhly, Alex Kalman, Michael Pollan, David Byrne, John Heginbotham, and Gertrude Stein. Her watch and clock designs appear under the M&Co label, the design studio created by her late husband Tibor Kalman. She has won many awards and given numerous talks, including several TED talks. Her art has been exhibited in galleries and museums around the world. Her latest book is Women Holding Things.

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Thresholds is back! To open a new season, Jordan sits down with McKenzie Wark live at PioneerWorks in Red Hook, Brooklyn, for a conversation about raving, gender transition, and the radical work of "playing" with form.

MENTIONED:

• Leonora Carrington
• Kenneth Goldsmith
• Audre Lorde’s Zami
• Zoo, Or Letters Not About Love

McKenzie Wark is the author of Love & Money, Sex & Death; Raving; Capital Is Dead; Reverse Cowgirl, and The Beach Beneath the Street, among other books. She is a Professor of Culture and Media and Program Director of Gender Studies at the New School.

For more Thresholds, visit us at www.thisisthresholds.com

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For her last guest as guest-host, Mira chats with former mentee Gina Chung about her debut novel Sea Change, writing about the honest messy stuff, and about learning to take better care of yourself (mind, body, and spirit) for the long-haul creative practice.

MENTIONED:

• The bats under Congress Bridge in Austin, TX
• “The Love Song of the Mexican Free-Tailed Bat” by Gina Chung (at F(r)iction)
• The Daniels accepting the Oscar for Best Picture for Everything Everywhere All At Once

Gina Chung is a Korean American writer. Born in Queens and raised in New Jersey, she is now based in Brooklyn, New York. She is the author of SEA CHANGE (2023 B&N Discover Pick for April; Vintage, March 28, 2023; out in the Commonwealth on April 13, 2023 and in the UK on August 10, 2023 from Picador) a novel about climate change, giant Pacific octopuses, and family, and GREEN FROG (Vintage, 2024; out in the UK/Commonwealth from Picador in 2024) a collection of short stories that explore themes of Korean American womanhood, bodies and animals. A recipient of the Pushcart Prize, she is a 2021-2022 Center for Fiction/Susan Kamil Emerging Writer Fellow and holds an MFA in fiction from The New School's Creative Writing Program and a BA in literary studies from Williams College. She is an alumnus of several workshops and/or craft intensives, including the Asian American Writers' Workshop, Sevilla Writers House, The Center for Fiction, Kweli, and Tin House. 

For more Thresholds, visit us at www.thisisthresholds.com

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J Wortham joins Mira to talk about the power of changes -- changing location, changing names, changing pronouns -- and the space that can open up as a result of them. Plus, some love for benevolent conspiracies!

MENTIONED:

• Alejandro's Run in LA
• Still Processing
• Kristy from The Babysitter's Club

J Wortham (they/them) is a sound healer,, reiki practitioner, herbalist, and community care worker oriented towards healing justice and liberation. J is also a staff writer for The New York Times Magazine, and co-host of the podcast ‘Still Processing,’ They occasionally publish thoughts on culture, technology and wellness in a newsletter. J is the proud editor of the visual anthology “Black Futures,” a 2020 Editor's choice by The New York Times Book Review, along with Kimberly Drew, from One World. J is also currently working on a book about the body and dissociation for Penguin Press. J mostly lives and works on stolen Munsee Lenape land, now known as Brooklyn, New York, and is committed to decolonization as a way of life.

For more Thresholds, visit us at www.thisisthresholds.com

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Legendary cartoonist Barbara Brandon-Croft (Where I’m Coming From) joins Mira to talk about building a life out of odd jobs, the double-edged sword of being ‘the first,’ and how being a cartoonist was never on her mind until it happened.

MENTIONED:

• Brumsic Brandon, Jr. (Barbara’s father, creator of the comic Luther) 
• Marie Brown
• Jules Feiffer’s Village Voice strip
• Women’s Wear Daily

Barbara Brandon-Croft was born in Brooklyn and grew up on Long Island. After debuting her comic strip Where I’m Coming From in the Detroit Free Press in 1989, Brandon-Croft became the first Black woman cartoonist to be published nationally by a major syndicate. During its 15 year run, Where I’m Coming From appeared in over 65 newspapers across the USA and Canada, as well as Jamaica, South Africa, and Barbados. Her comics are in the permanent collection of the Library of Congress. Brandon-Croft lives in Queens.

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Writer and organizer Sarah Thankam Mathews (All This Could Be Different) joins Mira to discuss a brush with mortality in a rip-tide off the California coast, discovering “the sourdough starter of ego death,” and the problems of being an artist under capitalism.

MENTIONED:

• Big Sur, California
• "How to Escape a Rip Current"
• What It Is by Lynda Barry
• I May Destroy You
• Michaela Coel's Emmy acceptance speech (video, transcript)

Sarah Thankam Mathews grew up between Oman and India, immigrating to the United States in her late teens. Her work has been published in Best American Short Stories and she is a recipient of fellowships from the Asian American Writers’ Workshop and the Iowa Writers’ Workshop. In 2020, she founded the mutual aid group Bed-Stuy Strong. All This Could Be Different, Mathews’ debut novel, was named an NYT Editor’s Choice, chosen for multiple high-profile Best of 2022 lists, and shortlisted for the National Book Award.

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Poet Layli Long Soldier joins Mira to talk about her transformation during pregnancy, learning to open up to the possibilities of the world, and how she makes a space for ease in order to make a space for creativity.

MENTIONED:

• The Indigenous Language Institute
• The Real Housewives
• S.J. Res 14 (111th Congress)

Layli Long Soldier earned a BFA from the Institute of American Indian Arts and an MFA with honors from Bard College. She is the author of the chapbook Chromosomory (2010) and the full-length collection Whereas (2017), which won the National Books Critics Circle award and was a finalist for the National Book Award. She has been a contributing editor to Drunken Boat and poetry editor at Kore Press; in 2012, her participatory installation, Whereas We Respond, was featured on the Pine Ridge Reservation. In 2015, Long Soldier was awarded a National Artist Fellowship from the Native Arts and Cultures Foundation and a Lannan Literary Fellowship for Poetry. She was awarded a Whiting Writer’s Award in 2016. Long Soldier is a citizen of the Oglala Lakota Nation and lives in Santa Fe, New Mexico.

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Comedian Hari Kondabolu joins Mira to talk about seeing space for himself on the screen, discovering an answer to the question of how to be in the world, the first joke he was really proud of, and the power that comes from alienating an audience on purpose. There's a lot of laughter in this one, y'all -- as you might expect.

MENTIONED:

• People Magazine's Sexiest Man Alive in 1992: Nick Nolte
• Apu
• Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal
• Hari's 'diamond' joke
• Race by Paul Mooney
• Stewart Lee

Also, a big announcement: Hari has a new comedy special coming to YouTube on April 18th -- "Vacation Baby"! Get excited; we sure are!!

Hari Kondabolu is a comedian, writer and podcaster based in Brooklyn, NY. He currently co-hosts the Netflix food competition show “Snack vs. Chef” with Megan Stalter. His 2018 Netflix special “Warn Your Relatives” was named one of the best of the year by Time, Paste Magazine, Cosmopolitan, E! Online, and Mashable. In 2017, his truTV documentary “The Problem with Apu” was released and created a global conversation about race and representation, and is now used in high school, college and grad school curriculums around the country. Hari has also released two comedy albums, “Waiting for 2042” & “Mainstream American Comic.” Additionally, he has performed on Conan, Jimmy Kimmel Live, The Late Show with David Letterman and among many others. He is also a former writer & correspondent on the much loved, Chris Rock produced FX show “Totally Biased with W. Kamau Bell.” He’s a regular panelist on “Wait Wait… Don’t Tell Me” and a regular guest-host on “Midday” on WNYC. As a podcaster, he co-hosted the popular “Politically Reactive” with W. Kamau Bell. Additionally, he also co-hosts what he politely describes as a “pop up podcast,” The Untitled Kondabolu Brothers Podcast with his younger brother Ashok (“Dap” from HBO’s Chillin’ Island and rap group Das Racist.) Hari attended both Bowdoin College and Wesleyan University and earned a Masters in Human Rights from the London School of Economics in 2008.

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Mira chats with novelist Angie Cruz (How Not to Drown in a Glass of Water) about figuring out who you want to be, Angie's semi-secret history in fashion design and painting, the arrival of her character Cara Romero in her life, and questioning the truths of America in these most trying of times.

MENTIONED:

• FIT (Fashion Institute of Technology)
• Go Tell It On the Mountain by James Baldwin
• Just Above My Head by James Baldwin
• Jazz by Toni Morrison
• Trick Mirror by Jia Tolentino

Angie Cruz is a novelist and editor. Her most recent novel is How Not To Drown in A Glass of Water (2022). Her novel, Dominicana was the inaugural book pick for GMA book club and shortlisted for The Women’s Prize, longlisted for the Andrew Carnegie Medals for Excellence in Fiction, The Aspen Words Literary Prize, a RUSA Notable book and the winner of the ALA/YALSA Alex Award in fiction. It was named most anticipated/ best book in 2019 by Time, Newsweek, People, Oprah Magazine, The Washington Post, The New York Times, and Esquire. Cruz is the author of two other novels, Soledad and Let It Rain Coffee and the recipient of numerous fellowships and residencies including the Lighthouse Fellowship, Siena Art Institute, and the CUNY Dominican Studies Institute Fellowship. She’s published shorter works in The Paris Review, VQR, Callaloo, Gulf Coast and other journals. She's the founder and Editor-in-chief of the award winning literary journal, Aster(ix) and is currently an Associate Professor at University of Pittsburgh. She divides her time between Pittsburgh, New York and Turin.

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Guest-host Mira Jacob talks with astrologer and author Chani Nicholas about being the child at the party, how Chani found her voice, and the question of who heals the healers?

MENTIONED:

• Morning Pages (from Julia Cameron's The Artist's Way)
• FreeFrom
• therapy

CHANI NICHOLAS is a Los Angeles–based New York Times bestselling author of You Were Born For This and astrologer with a community of over one million monthly readers. She has been a counseling astrologer for more than twenty years, guiding people to discover and live out their life’s purpose through understanding their birth chart. Her app, CHANI, offers users a personalized, daily understanding of their birth chart. She has been featured in the New York Times, Los Angeles Times, Rolling Stone, The New Yorker, The Atlantic, and on Netflix.

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Big News: novelist/memoirist/wonderful human Mira Jacob will be stepping into the host chair this spring! This week, she and Jordan sit down for a pass-the-baton chat -- kicking off with a flashback to the very first Thresholds episode (and interview) from February 2020.

MENTIONED:

• Mira's Thresholds interview
• "What You Might Not Know About 'Getting Roofied'" by Jordan Kisner
• Mira in conversation with Saeed Jones and Kiese Laymon for Bookable

Mira Jacob is a novelist, memoirist, illustrator, and cultural critic. Her graphic memoir Good Talk: A Memoir in Conversations was shortlisted for the National Book Critics Circle Award, longlisted for the PEN Open Book Award, named a New York Times Notable Book, as well as a best book of the year by Time, Esquire, Publisher’s Weekly, and Library Journal. It is currently in development as a television series with Film 44. Her novel The Sleepwalker’s Guide to Dancing was a Barnes & Noble Discover New Writers pick, shortlisted for India’s Tata First Literature Award, longlisted for the Brooklyn Literary Eagles Prize and named one of the best books of 2014 by Kirkus Reviews, the Boston Globe, Goodreads, Bustle, and The Millions. Her work has appeared in The New York Times Book Review, Electric Literature, Tin House, Literary Hub, Guernica, Vogue, and the Telegraph. She is currently the visiting professor at MFA Creative Writing program at The New School, and a founding faculty member of the MFA Program at Randolph College. She is the co-founder of Pete’s Reading Series in Brooklyn, where she spent 13 years bringing literary fiction, non-fiction, and poetry to Williamsburg. She lives in Brooklyn with her husband, documentary filmmaker Jed Rothstein, and their son.

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Hafizah Geter (The Black Period) joins Jordan to discuss her family's influence on her work, the power of memory, being in conversation with the writers you love, and how all of us live in a mix of genres.

MENTIONED:

• Goya's Black Paintings
• "Fighting Erasure" by Parul Sehgal
• Toni Morrison's concept of rememory
• Fela Kuti, Yussef Lateef, Otis Redding

Hafizah Augustus Geter is a Nigerian American writer, poet, and literary agent born in Zaria, Nigeria, and raised in Akron, Ohio, and Columbia, South Carolina. She is the author of the poetry collection Un-American, an NAACP Image Award and PEN Open Book Award finalist. Her writing has appeared in The New Yorker, Bomb, The Believer, The Paris Review, among many others. The poetry committee co-chair of the Brooklyn Literary Council, she is a Bread Loaf Katharine Bakeless nonfiction fellow, a Cave Canem poetry fellow, and a 92Y Women inPower Fellow and holds an MFA in nonfiction from New York University, where she was an Axinn Fellow. Hafizah lives in Brooklyn, New York.

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Sam Lipsyte (No One Left to Come Looking For You) joins Jordan to talk about giving up on punk rock, rediscovering a passion for writing, and the revelation that if you realize nobody cares, then you can do the thing that makes you happy.

MENTIONED:

• Dungbeetle
• Riverbank State Park
• John Cheever
• Galaxie 500

Sam Lipsyte's latest novel is No One Left to Come Looking For You. He is the author of the story collections Venus Drive and The Fun Parts and four novels: Hark, The Ask (a New York Times Notable Book), The Subject Steve, and Home Land, which was a New York Times Notable Book and received the Believer Book Award. His fiction has appeared in The New Yorker, The Paris Review, and Best American Short Stories, among other places. The recipient of a Guggenheim fellowship, he lives in New York City and teaches at Columbia University.

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Heather Radke joins Jordan to talk about Butts: A Backstory, the playful invitation of the book's title, the general unruliness of bodies, and the joys of a JSTOR deep-dive.

MENTIONED:

• Jodie Foster's Coppertone ad
• "Baby Got Back," Sir Mix-a-lot
• Elizabeth Alexander's "The Venus Hottentot"
• The Normman & Norma Statues

Heather Radke is an essayist, journalist, and contributing editor and reporter at Radiolab, the Peabody Award­–winning program from WNYC. She has written for publications including The Believer, Longreads, and The Paris Review, and she teaches at Columbia University’s creative writing MFA Program. Before becoming a writer, Heather worked as a curator at the Jane Addams Hull-House Museum in Chicago.

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Thresholds reaches its centenary episode with equal parts celebration and consideration. We reached out to old friends to leave us some voicemails, Jordan wrote a musing on this particular milestone, and we're doing a little giveaway to celebrate all of you who've helped bring us this far along the path.

Mentioned:

• "Notebook, 1981," by Eileen Myles
• The Isolation Journals by Suleika Jaouad

Thanks to all of our guests, to our team, and to you listeners! Here's to many more, in 2023 and beyond!

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It's the end of our last full capsule for 2022 -- and what a joyful, life-affirming batch of conversations it was! First up, we've got Saeed Jones offering some writing advice (and an exercise, of sorts) -- then some alumni news and a call to pre-order several 2023 releases -- and finally, Chloé Cooper Jones and Jordan get into talking about revision and the life-affirming process of writing.

MENTIONED:

• The Best American Essays 2022, edited by Alexander Chee
• Biography of X by Catherine Lacey
• Terrace Story by Hilary Leichter
• The Last Catastrophe by Allegra Hyde

Stay tuned for some end-of-year surprises and celebrations, coming very shortly!

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Alyssa Songsiridej (Little Rabbit) chats with Jordan about moving to a new city, the scary-freeing experience of being away from one's community, and how letting a book out into the world is a process of letting go.

MENTIONED:

• Days of Distraction by Alexandra Chang
• How Should a Person Be? by Sheila Heti
• Mating in Captivity by Esther Perel
• how cold winters get in Boston

Alyssa Songsiridej is an editor at Electric Literature. Her fiction has appeared in StoryQuarterly, The Indiana Review, The Offing, and Columbia: A Journal of Literature and Art, and has been supported by Yaddo, the Ucross Foundation, the Ragdale Foundation, the Vermont Studio Center, the VCCA and the Massachusetts Cultural Council. Little Rabbit is her first novel. A National Book Foundation 5 Under 35 Honoree, she lives in Philadelphia.

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Jordan talks with Asali Solomon about The Days of Afrekete, the unexpected discovery that she’s a funny writer, and trying to impart wisdom to students while she’s still learning too. 

MENTIONED:

Get a Life (1990-1992)

The Simple Stories by Langston Hughes

The Book of Night Women by Marlon James

An Exact Replica of a Figment of My Imagination by Elizabeth McCracken

Asali Solomon’s first novel, Disgruntled, was named a best book of the year by the San Francisco Chronicle and The Denver Post. Her debut story collection, Get Down, earned her a Rona Jaffe Foundation Writers’ Award and the National Book Foundation’s “5 Under 35” honor, and was a finalist for the Hurston/Wright Legacy Award. Her work has appeared in O, The Oprah Magazine, Vibe, Essence, The Paris Review Daily, McSweeney’s, and several anthologies, and on NPR. Solomon teaches fiction writing and literature of the African diaspora at Haverford College. She was born and raised in Philadelphia, where she lives with her husband and two sons.

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Poet Saeed Jones joins Jordan to talk about the long-term experience of grief, the intensity of writing from the point of view of another person, and the unexpected trilogy of his first three books.

MENTIONED:

• Paul Mooney
• Diahann Carroll
• Whitney Houston
• Toni Morrison

Saeed Jones is the author of the memoir HOW WE FIGHT FOR OUR LIVES, winner of the 2019 Kirkus Prize for Nonfiction and the poetry collection PRELUDE TO BRUISE, winner for the 2015 PEN/Joyce Osterweil Award for Poetry. His poetry and essays have appeared in the New Yorker, New York Times, Oxford American and GQ among other publications. His new poetry collection ALIVE AT THE END OF THE WORLD is out now.

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Alex Marzano-Lesnevich (The Fact of a Body) joins Jordan to talk about a particularly life-altering haircut, the power of a sequined tuxedo, and what it means for a culture to put a narrative onto a person.

MENTIONED:

• South Pacific
• Ghostly Matters by Avery Gordon
• My Autobiography of Carson McCullers by Jenn Shapland
• Joseph Lobdell

Alex Marzano-Lesnevich is the author of THE FACT OF A BODY: A Murder and a Memoir, which received a Lambda Literary Award, the Chautauqua Prize, the Grand Prix des Lectrices ELLE, the Prix des libraires du Quebec, and the Prix France Inter-JDD, an award for one book of any genre in the world. They have been the recipient of fellowships from The National Endowment for the Arts, MacDowell, Yaddo, the Bread Loaf Writers Conference, the Maine Arts Commission, the Eccles Centre at the British Library, and the Black Mountain Institute, as well as a Rona Jaffe Award. Marzano-Lesnevich has written for The New York Times, The New York Times Sunday Magazine, The Boston Globe, Oxford American, Harper’s, and The Best American Essays editions for both 2020 and 2022. They earned their BA at Columbia University, their JD at Harvard Law School, and their MFA at Emerson College.

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Chloé Cooper Jones (Easy Beauty) joins Jordan to talk about avoiding mandates, about writing through pain and trauma, and about finding the neutral room in one's own mind.

MENTIONED:

• "Everything is copy" -- Nora Ephron
• sacral agenesis
• Richard Serra

Chloé Cooper Jones is a writer based in New York City. In 2020, Chloé was a Pulitzer Prize finalist in Feature Writing for “Fearing for His Life,” a profile of Ramsey Orta, the man who filmed the killing of Eric Garner. She was the recipient of the 2020 Whiting Creative Nonfiction Grant and the 2021 Howard Foundation Grant from Brown University. Both grants were in support of her debut memoir, Easy Beauty. She lives in Brooklyn, New York.

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Jordan talks with poet/performer/advocate Kay Ulanday Barrett about their decision to get top surgery, the intersection of family and food, and writing through health crises.

MENTIONED:

• Grey’s Anatomy
• Swype
• The Asian American Writers Workshop
• Frankenstein by Mary Shelley

Kay Ulanday Barrett aka @Brownroundboi is a poet, performer, and cultural strategist. Their second book, More Than Organs (Sibling Rivalry Press, 2020) received a 2021 Stonewall Honor Book Award by the American Library Association and is a 2021 Lambda Literary Award Finalist. They have received residencies from Tin House as a 2022 Next Book Winner as well as MacDowell as a 2020 James Baldwin Fellow. Other residencies include: Drunken Boat, VONA Voices, Monson Arts, and The Lambda Literary Review. Barrett is a three-time Pushcart Prize Nominee and two-time Best of the Net Nominee. They have featured at The United Nations, The Lincoln Center, Symphony Space, Brooklyn Museum, Princeton, Harvard, Columbia University, Northwestern, The School of the Art Institute, & more. Their contributions are found in The New York Times, The Huffington Post, Poetry Magazine, them., Colorlines, Al Jazeera, NYLON, Vogue, The Rumpus, to name a few. Currently, they remix their mama’s recipes and live in Jersey City with their jowly dog. kaybarrett.net

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It's the end of our 'ghosts' capsule and not a moment too soon! Those days sure are getting shorter...

FEATURED:

• Patrick Cottrell on his change-of-seasons vibe this year
• A thematically-appropriate clip from our long-ago episode with Lynn Steger Strong (whose new book Flight is out soon! pre-order it!)
• Threshold alum highlights!!
• Scary-season book recommendations from the October Country, courtesy of Drew

See you in a couple weeks!

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Samantha Hunt joins Jordan to talk about The Unwritten Book, what it means to believe in ghosts, grieving the death of her father, and confronting the darkness out there in the woods.

MENTIONED:

• geodesic domes
• slasher movies
• Flash Count Diary by Darcy Steinke
• If Not, Winter by Sappho, translated by Anne Carson
• One Direction

Samantha Hunt is the author of the non-fiction book The Unwritten Book, the story collection The Dark Dark and the novels Mr. Splitfoot, The Invention of Everything Else, and The Seas. Hunt is the recipient of a Guggenheim Fellowship, the Bard Fiction Prize, the National Book Foundation’s 5 Under 35 prize, and the St. Francis College Literary Prize, and she was a finalist for the Orange Prize and the PEN/Faulkner Award. She lives in upstate New York.

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Jordan talks with Ingrid Rojas Contreras (The Man Who Could Move Clouds) about the accident that left her with amnesia, grappling with the decision to write about her family, and the importance of offering healing.

MENTIONED:

• A black Vera Wang gown
• Curanderos
• Topographical disorientation

INGRID ROJAS CONTRERAS was born and raised in Bogotá, Colombia. Her latest book, The Man Who Could Move Clouds, was longlisted for the National Book Award in Non-Fiction. Her first novel Fruit of the Drunken Tree was the silver medal winner in First Fiction from the California Book Awards, and a New York Times editor’s choice. Her essays and short stories have appeared in the New York Times Magazine, The Believer, and Zyzzyva, among others. She lives in California.

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Jordan talks to Amy Fusselman about writers who perform, getting out of your own head, and the agonies and ecstasies of comedy. It's a laugh-out-loud kind of episode.

MENTIONED:

• McSweeney's Internet Concern
• "Hawk" by Joy Williams
• Second Position

Amy Fusselman is the author of five books. Her latest, The Mean$, is her first novel.

Fusselman’s previous four books, all nonfiction, have been translated into several languages. Her work has been nominated for The Believer Book Award and the University of Iowa's Krause Essay Prize. Her articles and essays have appeared in The New York Times, The Atlantic, The Washington Post, McSweeney's Internet Tendency, Ms., ARTnews, Artnet, and many other places. She lives in New York City with her family and teaches creative writing at New York University.

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Celeste Ng joins Jordan to talk about her new book Our Missing Hearts, motherhood and parenting while writing, and the big questions of what kind of place art can have in the fight against fascism.

MENTIONED:

• The School for Good Mothers by Jessamine Chan
• #DontLookAway / #NoKidsInCages
• Hamlet by William Shakespeare

Celeste Ng is the number one New York Times bestselling author of Everything I Never Told You and Little Fires Everywhere. Her third novel, Our Missing Hearts, will be published in October 2022. Ng is the recipient of fellowships from the National Endowment for the Arts and the Guggenheim Foundation, and her work has been published in over thirty languages.

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It's the end of a 'Family' capsule of episodes and the last before our summer break, so we really pulled out all the stops this time.

FEATURED:

• an outtake of Crystal Hana Kim talking about her next novel
• a voicemail from Mattilda Bernstein Sycamore about how she does August
• Threshold alum highlights (like a bunch of them)
• summer reading recommendations from Jordan & Drew

See you in September, with fresh pencils and notebooks and interviews!

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Jordan talks with Michelle Tea about her new memoir (Knocking Myself Up), making the decision to get pregnant, her tarot practice, and creating a queer family.

MENTIONED:

• The Rider-Waite Tarot
• Valencia by Michelle Tea
• XOJane.com
• Buddhism

Michelle Tea is the author of over a dozen books, including the cult-classic Valencia, the essay collection Against Memoir, and the speculative memoir Black Wave. She is the recipient of awards from the Guggenheim, Lambda Literary, and Rona Jaffe Foundations, PEN/America, and other institutions. Knocking Myself Up is her latest memoir.

Tea's cultural interventions include brainstorming the international phenomenon Drag Queen Story Hour, co-creating the Sister Spit queer literary performance tours, and occupying the role of Founding Director at RADAR Productions, a Bay Area literary organization, for over a decade. She also helmed the imprints Sister Spit Books at City Lights Publishers, and Amethyst Editions at The Feminist Press. She produces and hosts the Your Magic podcast, wherein which she reads tarot cards for Roxane Gay, Alexander Chee, Phoebe Bridgers and other artists, as well as the live tarot show Ask the Tarot on Spotify Greenroom.

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Jordan talks with Keith Gessen about his new memoir of fatherhood, Raising Raffi: The First Five Years, and the challenges -- and wonders -- of being a parent and a writer, and what he thinks Raffi will think of the book when he's older.

MENTIONED: 

• Raising America by Ann Hulbert
• "Choosing a School for My Daughter in a Segregated City" by Nikole Hannah-Jones
• Emily Oster, economics professor and parenting advisor
• The Kazdin Method

Keith Gessen is a founding editor of n+1 and a contributor to The New Yorker, the New York Times Magazine, and the London Review of Books. He is the editor of three nonfiction books and the translator or co-translator, from Russian, of a collection of short stories, a book of poems, and a work of oral history. He is also the author of two novels, “All the Sad Young Literary Men” and "A Terrible Country," as well as a book of essays, "Raising Raffi."  Gessen was born in Moscow and grew up outside of Boston. He graduated from Harvard with a B.A. in History and Literature in 1998, and subsequently received an M.F.A. in Creative Writing (Fiction) from Syracuse University. In 2014-2015 he was a Fellow at the Cullman Center for Writers and Scholars at the New York Public Library.

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Jordan talks with Crystal Hana Kim (If You Leave Me) about the ultimate unknowability of another person's story, about motherhood as a writer, and about how a friend's validation and encouragement helped her get serious about her craft.

MENTIONED:

• The Korean War
• Post-partum depression
• Reproductive justice
• Ceramics class

Crystal Hana Kim is the author of If You Leave Me, which was a Booklist Editor’s Choice title and named a best book of 2018 by over a dozen publications. Kim is the recipient of the 2022 National Book Foundation’s 5 Under 35 Award and is a 2017 PEN/Robert J. Dau Short Story Prize winner. Currently, she is the Visiting Assistant Professor at Queens College and a contributing editor at Apogee Journal. Her second novel, The Stone Home, is forthcoming from William Morrow / HarperCollins. She lives in Brooklyn, New York with her family.

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