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Barry is joined by Bella, founder of Salad, a Dorset-based creative agency built around brand strategy, visual identity, and websites, for a candid conversation about why she chose employee ownership and what it has actually required on the other side. 

This episode is especially relevant for founders who are thinking about succession and want a route that protects culture, rewards the team, and still keeps the business commercially grounded. 

What’s covered

• How Salad grew over 24 years, why they stay consciously small, and what “mindful ambition” looks like in practice. 
• The succession trigger that made Bella and her co-director question the default “grow to sell” path, and what shifted once EO entered the conversation. 
• Why EO felt like a genuine win-win, without pretending it’s a magic wand. 
• What Bella would do differently: choosing advisers, using the EOA as a starting point, and the one thing she wishes she’d done far earlier. 

The communication reality

Bella shares a very honest view of what “good comms” actually means in EO:

• Why she was advised not to rush and tell the team immediately, and how they handled early questions and anxiety. 
• The importance of repeating information, and adapting to different communication styles (from presentations to one-to-ones). 
• A reminder that EO is not a one-off event, it’s an ongoing cultural investment. 

Making owner mindset tangible

Practical examples of what changed post-transition, including:

• Sharing financial information with the team (with clear boundaries). 
• Involving the team in key planning and long-term goals, rather than keeping strategy “upstairs”. 
• Quarterly Vision Days designed to help the whole team “look up and look forward” together. 
• The role of beneficiary payments as a meaningful signal, while keeping the culture about more than money. 

Leadership and succession, unfiltered

Bella speaks openly about the tension many founders feel after an EO transition: loving the business, but also wanting the freedom to build a different kind of future. She also shares what Salad is working towards next, including succession planning and a longer-term shift in her own role. 

Quickfire highlights

• Employee ownership in one sentence: Bella frames it as an antidote to widening wealth inequality. 
• Biggest surprise: how much she’s valued the EO community. 
• Book recommendation: Radical Candor (for anyone leading through change and feedback). 
• CEO confessional: “I want to leave, but I don’t want to leave.” 

If you’re exploring employee ownership, this episode will help you think more clearly about the human side of the transition: communication, identity, leadership, and what it takes to keep EO meaningful after the paperwork is done.

Disclaimer:

The following podcast is intended to be of a general nature, will not be suitable for everyone, and should not be treated as a specific recommendation. We recommend taking professional advice before entering into any obligation or transaction.

Paradigm Norton Financial Planning Limited is authorised and regulated by the Financial Conduct Authority. Our FCA Register number is 455083.

Registered in England. Reg No 4220937, VAT Reg. No 918550904.

Barry is joined by Rob Haward (Riverford) for a practical conversation that links employee ownership with the realities of running a large, values-led organisation, including what has to change in leadership, communication, and culture for EO to actually “work” day-to-day.

Riverford’s transition is discussed in the context of protecting purpose long-term (and avoiding the business ending up “in the wrong hands”), while still staying commercially sharp and operationally disciplined.

What’s covered in this episode

• Rob’s route into food and farming, and how those early experiences shaped his values and leadership. 
• The why behind the move to employee ownership, including legacy, purpose protection, and long-term stewardship.
• How Riverford approached the transition, including exploring other ownership models before landing on an Employee Ownership Trust (EOT).
• The importance of over-communication, engaging people early, and tackling misconceptions head-on. 
• Governance in practice: Riverford’s democratically elected co-owner council, how it gathers input, and how agendas are shaped. 
• Making EO real beyond the legal structure: listening culture, closing the loop, and building systems that encourage an “owner mindset”.
• The tension points: decision speed, risk aversion, information flow, and why middle management can be either the blocker or the unlock.

Moments to listen out for

• The long-running internal conversations about ownership (including a memorable board meeting setting).
• “The Founder’s Wishes” and why documenting purpose and values matters more than most founders realise.
• Riverford’s continuous improvement approach: “Improve Tomorrow Together (ITT)”, built on lean thinking and designed to turn motivation into action.

Quickfire highlights

• Rob’s take: employee ownership as a “much needed” model that can balance society, planet, and commercial success. 
• Biggest EO surprise: how well the founder handled selling the business while staying positively engaged. 
• Book mention: Turn the Ship Around (as an accessible leadership read relevant to empowerment and engagement). 

If you’re a business owner exploring employee ownership, this episode gives you a clear view of the operational and leadership work that sits behind the headline benefits, without pretending it’s effortless.

Disclaimer:

The following podcast is intended to be of a general nature, will not be suitable for everyone, and should not be treated as a specific recommendation. We recommend taking professional advice before entering into any obligation or transaction.

Paradigm Norton Financial Planning Limited is authorised and regulated by the Financial Conduct Authority. Our FCA Register number is 455083.

Registered in England. Reg No 4220937, VAT Reg. No 918550904.

In this episode of Stake & Soul, Barry sits down with Chris McDermott, former Chair & CEO of Cambridge Nutritional Foods (CNF) and Chair of the UK Employee Ownership Association (EOA), for a candid conversation about what employee ownership looks like in the real world. 

Chris shares the behind-the-scenes reality of moving from a traditional ownership structure into employee ownership, what surprised him most once they were “properly” on the other side of the transition, and why the work does not stop when the paperwork is done. 

What’s covered

• Chris’s unusual career path (including a few pivots) and how it shaped his leadership approach. 
• How employee ownership arrived on his doorstep, plus the early scepticism that changed after seeing EO up close. 
• The shift from “we’ve become employee-owned” to “it finally feels real”, including the role of debt payoff and accountability. 
• A hard-earned lesson on governance: what happens when roles, decision rights, and power centres are not properly codified early enough. 
• Practical insights on building owner mindset, making the intangible tangible, and communicating financial performance without turning every update into a lecture. 

The people side of employee ownership

Chris and Barry also explore the parts EO advocates do not always lead with:

• Why communication in EO can feel like a bottomless pit (and how they try to handle it). 
• How “voice” works in practice: employee voice groups, a council structure, and how ideas become actions (not just complaints). 
• The tension between being an “owner” and facing the realities of tough commercial decisions when the business needs to change. 

A big transition is coming

Chris reflects on preparing to step down after a decade as CEO, the internal logic behind that decision, and why a clean handover matters, especially in an employee-owned business. 

Quickfire moments and a leadership read

Towards the end, you’ll hear a quickfire section that lands on a simple but meaningful truth. 

Chris also shares a book that had a genuine impact on how he handled imposter syndrome and high-pressure leadership. 

If you’re a business owner exploring employee ownership, this one is full of grounded lessons, honest trade-offs, and ideas you can actually take back to your own leadership table.

Disclaimer:

The following podcast is intended to be of a general nature, will not be suitable for everyone, and should not be treated as a specific recommendation. We recommend taking professional advice before entering into any obligation or transaction.

Paradigm Norton Financial Planning Limited is authorised and regulated by the Financial Conduct Authority. Our FCA Register number is 455083.

Registered in England. Reg No 4220937, VAT Reg. No 918550904.