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In this final part of the discussion of Simin Behbahani's dobāré meesāzamat vatan, we go over the end of the poem in detail.

In this fifth part of the discussion of Simin Behbahani's dobāré meesāzamat vatan, we go over the second-to-last part of the poem in detail.

In this episode, Leyla sits down with Sasha von Oldershausen — an Iranian American journalist on the news and politics team at Texas Monthly, and soon to be the New York Times' first-ever Texas culture reporter.

This conversation is a little different from most episodes of Growing Up Irooni: it centers on a single, remarkable story. In her Texas Monthly article "The West Texas Days of the Exiled Prince Who Wants to Lead Iran," Sasha uncovered a nearly forgotten chapter of history — the year that Reza Pahlavi, then seventeen and heir to the Iranian throne, lived in Lubbock, Texas, training as a jet pilot at Reese Air Force Base. It was 1978. Within months, the revolution would sweep away the monarchy, and he would never return to Iran.

Sasha shares how she found the story (it started with typing "Texas Iran" into Google and landing on a Lubbock Facebook post), and the extraordinary details she uncovered from there: the 28-year-old flight instructor flown to Niavaran Palace to meet the teenage prince, the weekend house fitted with bulletproof glass, the flower shop where he bought bouquets for four different women at once, and the four hundred Iranian students at Texas Tech who gathered outside his home to protest — many afraid to show their faces for fear of what could happen to their families back home.

Then Leyla and Sasha bring the story to the present: Pahlavi's return to Texas nearly fifty years later as the unlikely headliner of CPAC in Grapevine, where roughly a quarter of the audience was Iranian; the aftermath of the January crackdown in Iran, which left thousands dead by most estimates; and the harder questions the diaspora is wrestling with right now — about revisionist history, magical thinking, and how the events of 1978 rhyme with the events of today.

Woven throughout is Sasha's own Growing Up Irooni story: raised in Queens by a German father and an Iranian mother from Tehran, no Farsi spoken at home, finding her way to the language through Persian classes in college and summer visits to family in Iran — a life she describes as "one foot in, one foot out," which turns out to be exactly the vantage point this story needed.

Read Sasha's article: https://www.texasmonthly.com/news-politics/iranian-prince-reza-pahlavi-west-texas/
Follow Sasha on X: https://x.com/sashavono
More of Sasha's work: https://www.texasmonthly.com/contributors/sasha-von-oldershausen/

In this fourth part of the discussion of Simin Behbahani's dobāré meesāzamat vatan, we go over the next six lines of the poem in detail.

In this episode, Leyla sits down with Yasmin Khan — the acclaimed British-Iranian-Pakistani food writer, activist, and author of *The Saffron Tales*, *Zaitoun*, *Ripe Figs*, and her newest cookbook, *Sabzi: The Beautiful World of Persian Vegetarian Cooking*.

Yasmin takes us back to her childhood in Birmingham, where her mother — a Gilaki nutritionist from a small town near the Caspian Sea — organized an Iranian community association so her kids would grow up with Nowruz, Shab-e Yalda, and Farsi language school. She shares the story of her grandfather driving hours to find the perfect oranges, bringing a five-kilo bag of Gilani rice on the plane to England because he didn't trust the rice abroad, and how a family farm still tended by her uncles ended up shaping the way she writes about food today.

She and Leyla trace her unlikely path from a decade of human rights campaigning in conflict zones — Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine — to the burnout that pushed her toward her grandmother's kitchen in Gilan, where she recorded her first food-and-story interviews on an iPhone. That project became *The Saffron Tales*, launched on Kickstarter, and set the template for everything she's written since.

The conversation turns honest and difficult as Yasmin speaks about the toll of being a public Iranian voice — the pile-on she received during Woman, Life, Freedom while she was quietly recovering from her fourth miscarriage in Thailand, the trademark lawsuit that nearly derailed the launch of *Sabzi* (yes, someone tried to trademark the word for "greens"), and the anti-Arab racism she says the Iranian community needs to be honest about. She and Leyla discuss the difference between the UK and US Iranian diasporas on Palestine, why she believes bombing your way to democracy has never worked, and what she's learning from an Iranian art therapy group in London that's teaching her to hold space for people she deeply disagrees with.

Throughout, Yasmin returns to her core conviction: culture — food, language, literature, art — is not a luxury in polarized times. It's the way through.

A warm, honest, and quietly radical conversation about heritage, empathy, and what it means to keep a culture alive.

RELATED LINKS:

• Yasmin Khan's website
• Yasmin Khan's instagram

• Sabzi: The Beautiful World of Persian Vegetarian Cooking — Yasmin's newest cookbook

• The Saffron Tales — Yasmin's debut, a Kickstarter-funded travelogue and cookbook of Iran

• Zaitoun — her book of Palestinian recipes and stories

• Ripe Figs — recipes from the Eastern Mediterranean

• Yasmin's Guardian article on the Sabzi trademark dispute — search "Yasmin Khan Sabzi Guardian"

• Yasmin's essay on miscarriage and pregnancy loss — worth reading alongside this episode

• Gilan province — the Caspian region Yasmin's family is from, known for rice, tea, and its progressive politics

• Chai and Conversation Cookbook Club — where we'll be cooking from Sabzi this season

In this third part of the discussion of Simin Behbahani's dobāré meesāzamat vatan, we go over the next six lines of the poem in detail.

In this second part of the discussion of Simin Behbahani's dobāré meesāzamat vatan, we go over the first six lines of the poem in detail.

In this introductory lesson to Simin Behbahani's beautiful, important, and timely poem, dobāré meesāzamet vatan, we're joined by Dr. Sahba Shayani to talk about the general theme and meaning behind this poem.

In this episode, Leyla sits down with Hamid Rahmanian — the Iranian-American artist, filmmaker, and visionary behind some of the most ambitious Shahnameh projects of our time, including the illustrated Shahnameh: The Epic of the Persian Kings, the touring live productions Feathers of Fire and Song of the North, and most recently Rostam: Tales from the Shahnameh, a beautifully illustrated edition for younger readers.

Hamid takes us back to his childhood in Tehran, where he grew up in a traditional family with no exposure to the arts — not knowing that art school even existed until he was nineteen. He shares the moment Pink Floyd changed his life, the exam that nearly sent him to the front lines of the Iran-Iraq war, and the Saadi poem that pushed him to leave his successful Tehran design firm at the height of his career to start over in New York.

The conversation traces his unlikely path through Pratt Institute, Disney Animation (which he begged to be laid off from), early documentary films exploring Iranian identity, and his eventual partnership with his wife Melissa — whose simple challenge, "Why don't you just do it?", sparked what would become nearly two decades of work bringing the Shahnameh to global audiences.

Hamid speaks honestly about the economics of cultural work that doesn't fit easily into grants or markets, why he refuses to make art for elites or museums, and what he's learned about the Iranian diaspora's complicated relationship with its own culture. He shares why he believes culture, not politics, is what endures — and why building it requires us to show up, spend money, and participate, rather than scroll past.

It's a generous, funny, and often pointed conversation with someone who has spent his life proving that Persian stories belong on every table, in every classroom, in every home — and that the people best positioned to make that happen are us.

Related Links

• Hamid Rahmanian's official site — kingorama.com (note: I wasn't able to verify the exact URL spelling — Hamid mentions it in the interview as "Kingarama" but this should be confirmed before publishing)
• Hamid's instagram- https://www.instagram.com/hamidinperson/
• Rostam: Tales from the Shahnameh — the new illustrated edition, available at his site (this is the book Leyla is giving away in the episode)
• Shahnameh: The Epic of the Persian Kings — the complete illustrated edition referenced throughout
• Feathers of Fire — the touring live production (full video viewable on his site)
• Song of the North — the second major live production, which toured over 100 times
• Tragedy of Siyāvash — his newest live production, just finished
• The Glass House — his 2008 documentary about a charity center for troubled teenage girls in Tehran
• Sir Alfred of Charles de Gaulle Airport — his documentary about Mehran Karimi Nasseri, the Iranian who lived in the Paris airport
• Saadi's Golestan — the source of the poem (tang-cheshmān nazar be meeve konand, mā tamāshā-konāne bostāni) that changed Hamid's life
• Ja'far Mahjoob — the Shahnameh scholar whose recordings ignited Hamid's love for the epic
• Zeffirelli's Don Giovanni at the Met — the production that convinced Hamid to stay in New York

In this episode, Leyla sits down with Danesh Nosirvan — the Iranian-American creator known online for identifying perpetrators of public harm and holding them accountable through the court of public opinion. What began as a comedy career took an unexpected turn in 2021, when a single video calling out a child abuser went viral and reshaped the trajectory of his work entirely.

Danesh shares the story of his family's arrival in the U.S. after the revolution, growing up as one of the only Iranian kids in his Southern California school, and the quiet weight of watching his immigrant parents accept mistreatment in order to stay safe. That early sense of injustice, he reflects, is what now fuels his willingness to speak up on behalf of others.

The conversation moves through some of the most difficult chapters of recent Iranian diaspora life: the unifying surge of the Mahsa Amini protests, the painful fracturing that followed October 7th, and the ongoing struggle to maintain moral clarity when communities are pulled in opposite directions. Danesh speaks candidly about the cost of using a large platform to advocate — the stalking, the loss of income, the loneliness of being misread by people on every side — and why he still believes in doing it anyway.

Leyla and Danesh also discuss the cultural reluctance to hold powerful men accountable, the case of Jian Ghomeshi and his quiet rehabilitation in parts of the Iranian community, and what genuine accountability looks like in a media landscape that rewards outrage over reflection. Danesh closes with a meditation drawn from his anthropology studies — the contrast between chimpanzee and bonobo societies — as a lens for thinking about the kind of community we're choosing to build, both as Iranians and as humans.

A warm, honest, and at times uncomfortable conversation about identity, responsibility, and what it means to use your voice with care.

In the fourth part of our discussion about the Tale of Zahhak, Leyla and Dr. Sahba Shayani introduce the story of Fereydoon, who, as we already know by now, eventually kills Zahhak and rules Iran in his place. Zahhak tries in vain to prevent fate, and Fereydoon, even as a child, survives all of Zahhak's attempts to kill him.

In this lesson, we learn from Leyla and Dr. Sahba Shayani about the nature of the evil king Zahhak's reign and the beginning of his downfall.

In this lesson, we continue our discussion of the famous Tale of Zahhak from Ferdowsi's Shahnameh with Dr. Sahba Shayani. Here, having covered the background that led to Zahhak's rise to power, we begin to delve into Zahhak's own story in earnest.

In this lesson, we begin our discussion of the famous Tale of Zahhak from Ferdowsi's Shahnameh with Dr. Sahba Shayani. We use the end of the story of Jamshid as a prelude and begin to learn of how Zahhak becomes an evil king.

In this thrilling conclusion to Hafez's poem yoosofé gom gashté, we cover the words and phrases in the last four lines of the poem. Hafez concludes by acknowledging the difficulties the reader may face and reiterating his encouragement and confidence that God will help the reader overcome them.

In this lesson, we cover the words and phrases in the next four lines of the poem yoosofé gom gashté by Hafez. In this part of the poem, Hafez provides the reader encouragement and inspiration for overcoming any difficulties they may face.

In this lesson, we go over more words and phrases in the next four lines of the poem yoosofé gom gashté by Hafez. Here, Hafez reassures the reader regarding forces that are beyond their control.

In this lesson, we go over the individual words and phrases in the next four lines of the poem yoosofé gom gashté by Hafez, which refer broadly to the nature of the heavens and earth.

In this lesson, we go over the individual words and phrases in the first four lines of the poem yoosofé gom gashté by Hafez.

In this lesson, we conclude our discussion of the section “On the Creation of the World” from Ferdowsi's Shahnameh and reflect on its implications with Dr. Omid Arabian. In this last part, Ferdowsi explains the origins and significance of human beings in more detail.

In this introductory lesson to Hafez's poem yoosofé gom gashté, we're joined by Prof. Sahba Shayani to talk about the general theme and meaning behind this poem.

In this lesson, we proceed to the fifth part of our discussion of the section “On the Creation of the World” from Ferdowsi's Shahnameh with Dr. Omid Arabian. In this part of the epic poem, Ferdowsi briefly concludes his discussion of the origins of plants and animals and begins explaining the origins of human beings.

In this lesson, we proceed to the fourth part of our discussion of the section “On the Creation of the World” from Ferdowsi's Shahnameh with Dr. Omid Arabian. This part of the epic poem explains Ferdowsi's account of the origins of plants and animals.

In this lesson, we proceed to the third part of our discussion of the section “On the Creation of the World” from Ferdowsi's Shahnameh with Dr. Omid Arabian. This part of the epic poem discusses the formation of the Earth.

In this lesson, we continue our discussion of the section “On the Creation of the World” from Ferdowsi's Shahnameh with Dr. Omid Arabian. This part of the epic poem discusses the very beginnings of the universe.

In this lesson, we begin our discussion of the section of Ferdowsi's Shahnameh called “On the Creation of the World” with Dr. Omid Arabian. We begin with a discussion of just the first two lines (the first two rhyming couplets).

In this lesson, we learn some more expressions for expressing thanks, particularly in the context of visiting a jewelry store or other shop and making arrangements in advance.

In this episode of Growing Up Irooni, journalist Nilo Tabrizy joins Leyla Shams to talk about her groundbreaking book For the Sun After Long Nights — The Story of Iran’s Women-Led Uprising, recently long-listed for the National Book Award.
Nilo reflects on what it means to love a country she can no longer return to, the emotional toll of reporting on Iran from afar, and her friendship and collaboration with Iranian journalist Fatemeh Jamalpour, who reported from inside Iran during the Women Life Freedom movement.

Together they discuss:

• The personal cost of choosing to tell Iran’s story

• The rise of forensic journalism and verifying truth in the digital age

• The trauma and beauty of living between worlds

• The responsibility and tensions within the Iranian diaspora

• Why every act of defiance by Iranian women still matters

This conversation offers a rare glimpse into the human side of reporting on revolution, identity, and belonging.

🔗 Related Links

• 📖 For the Sun After Long Nights by Nilo Tabrizy & Fatemeh Jamalpour → Book Link 

• 🎧 Listen to Nilo Tabrizy on Pod Save America → [Episode Link]

• 📰 Follow Nilo Tabrizy’s work → Instagram @badboystomeninblackhawkdown | X @NiloTabrizi
  
  
• 📺 Watch the video interview on YouTube → YouTube Link to Full Conversation

• 🌸 Learn Persian with Leyla Shams → chaiandconversation.com

In this lesson, we learn some other tārof-related expressions for expressing thanks, especially when talking to people at a party or other social gathering.

In this lesson, we learn a few more tārof-related expressions useful when talking with neighbors and also learn some useful phrases about gardening.

In this lesson, we learn how to talk a little bit about school.

In this lesson, we continue to explore examples of tārof relevant in situations where we have guests at our houses.

In this lesson, we cover the thrilling conclusion to the Story of Zal in the Shahnameh with Leyla and Dr. Sahba Shayani, where Zal returns with Sam to their palace in Zabulistan, where he enjoys a hero's welcome.

In this lesson, we continue our discussion of Ferdowsi's Shahnameh with Dr. Sahba Shayani to the fourth part of the Story of Zal, where Simorgh reunites Zal with his father, Sam.

In this lesson, we continue our discussion of Ferdowsi's Shahnameh with Dr. Sahba Shayani to the third part of the Story of Zal, where Sam begins to have dreams that inspire him to search for the son he had previously abandoned.

In this lesson, we continue our discussion of Ferdowsi's Shahnameh with Dr. Sahba Shayani to the second part of the Story of Zal, where Simorgh spots the abandoned baby.

In this lesson, we begin our discussion of Ferdowsi's Shahnameh with Dr. Sahba Shayani. We specifically begin covering the first part of the Story of Zal in the Shahnameh.

In this deeply personal and wide-ranging conversation, Daniel Nayeri, author of the acclaimed autobiographical novel Everything Sad is Untrue, talks about growing up as an Iranian refugee in Oklahoma, the mythic structure of memory, and the stories we inherit—true or not. He reflects on what it means to carry generational trauma, how he began writing the book in a Brooklyn bathroom, and the long journey of learning to tell his family’s story with emotional honesty.

We discuss the magic of Persian storytelling traditions, from Shahnameh to Khosrow and Shirin, why he originally wrote the book for adults, and how his father reacted to seeing himself as a character on the page. Daniel also shares a preview of his newest novel, The Teacher of Nomadland, a literary adventure set in WWII-era Iran, and why he wanted to sneak a Farsi lesson into the heart of it.

This episode is for anyone who’s ever tried to make sense of a fractured past—and found something beautiful in the pieces.

📚 Related Links

• Everything Sad is Untrue by Daniel Nayeri (Amazon):
  https://www.amazon.com/Everything-Sad-Untrue-True-Story/dp/1646140001
  

• The Teacher of Nomadland (Preorder):
  https://www.chroniclebooks.com/products/the-teacher-of-nomadland

  
  

• Daniel Nayeri on Instagram:
  https://www.instagram.com/danielnayeri
  

• Learn Persian with Chai and Conversation:
  https://chaiandconversation.com

  
  

• Daniel's publisher:
  https://www.levinequerido.com/daniel-nayeri

In this final part of our discussion of Nizami Ganjavi's sokhanee chand dar eshgh, we cover the remaining lines, explaining how love transcends even existence on Earth and applies to the entire universe.

In this fifth part of the discussion of Nizami Ganjavi's sokhanee chand dar eshgh, we cover the two more lines that describe the life-giving nature of love.

In this lesson, we learn some examples of tārof appropriate for talking to older people and see some examples in a conversation at an art gallery.

In this laugh-out-loud and deeply personal conversation, Iranian Canadian actor, writer, and creator Tara Grammy joins Leyla to talk about growing up as an Iranian weirdo, navigating diaspora identity, creating her hit comedy series Soosi Lee, and embracing curiosity (aka being fusooli) as a cultural superpower. From getting discovered by Woody Harrelson in a tiny Toronto theatre to producing a DIY Iranian Borat-meets-Cribs series in LA, Tara's story is as inspiring as it is hilarious.

She shares her journey through acting, motherhood, cultural expectations, language guilt, and the power of telling your own story—even when no one gives you permission.

🔗 Related Links:

• 📺 Watch Foozooli: https://www.instagram.com/taragrammy
  
  
• 🎥 Simple Wedding (film): IMDb

• 📝 Tara’s Harper’s Bazaar essay: Joyful Rebellion – Harper’s Bazaar

• 📚 Learn Persian with Chai and Conversation: https://www.chaiandconversation.com

• 🎧 Follow Tara on Instagram: @taragrammy
  

📣 Connect with Us:

• Follow Growing Up Irooni on Instagram: @chaiandconversation
• Subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts | Spotify | YouTube

In this fourth part of the discussion of Nizami Ganjavi's sokhanee chand dar eshgh, we cover the next two lines in detail, regarding the indispensability of love.

In this lesson, we learn some more expressions we can use when meeting new people and a new expression related to tārof.

In this third part of the discussion of Nizami Ganjavi's sokhanee chand dar eshgh, we cover the next two lines in detail, beginning to contemplate the importance of love to all human beings.

In this lesson, we learn some useful expressions for talking with friends or people we know, especially people who we haven't seen in a long time.

In this second part of the discussion of Nizami Ganjavi's sokhanee chand dar eshgh, we go over the first two lines of the poem in detail.

In this lesson, we learn a new way to call attention to someone and how to return a lost item.

In this lesson, we introduce Nizami Ganjavi, an important 12th-century poet in the cultures of Iran, Azerbaijan, Kurdistan, Afghanistan, and Tajikistan who is also considered the national poet of Azerbaijan. We are joined by Dr. Sahba Shayani to discuss sokhanee chand dar eshgh, or “A Few Words on Love,” an excerpt from Nizami Ganjavi's Romance of Khosrow and Shirin.

In this lesson, we learn some phrases that could be useful when talking to people on the street and how to talk briefly about some routine daily activities.

We also introduce Vijay, his mixtape, and his YouTube playlist, which you can find here!