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What if the greatest threat to freedom isn’t immigration—but the effort to control it?

In this wide-ranging conversation, political theorist and author of Immigration and Freedom Chandran Kukathas joins host Jason Canon to discuss his lifelong engagement with immigration, national identity, and the liberal tradition.

From the practical mechanics of deportation to the philosophical dangers of nationalism, they explore why attempts to tightly regulate borders often end up restricting the freedom and equality of citizens themselves.

How does work make us more or less free? In this episode, host Jason Canon speaks with philosopher Elizabeth Anderson about her book Hijacked, tracing how a classical liberalism rooted in the Protestant work ethic — one that once promised both freedom and equality — became an ideology of worker discipline and precarity. They discuss what historical liberals actually believed about markets, why "just quit" isn't a real answer for most workers, and what co-determination, cooperatives, and a revived labor movement could mean for the future of work. Anderson also shares her concerns about democratic backsliding and toxic discourse, and why she still finds inspiration in Adam Smith.

Elizabeth Anderson is is John Dewey Distinguished University Professor of Philosophy and Women’s Studies, Arthur F. Thurnau Professor, and Max Shaye Professor of Public Philosophy at the University of Michigan. She received her PhD in philosophy from Harvard University. A MacArthur Fellow, her research spans moral and political philosophy, democratic theory, the ethical limits of markets, and questions of equality. Her books include The Imperative of Integration, Private Government, and Hijacked: How Neoliberalism Turned the Work Ethic against Workers and How Workers Can Take It Back.

• Adam Smith, The Theory of Moral Sentiments (1759)
• Adam Smith, The Wealth of Nations (1776)
• Elizabeth Anderson, Hijacked: How Neoliberalism Turned the Work Ethic against Workers and How Workers Can Take It Back (Cambridge University Press, 2023)
• Elizabeth Anderson, Private Government: How Employers Rule Our Lives (and Why We Don't Talk about It) (Princeton University Press, 2017)
• Hilary Cottam, Radical Help: How We Can Remake the Relationships between Us and Revolutionise the Welfare State (Virago Press, 2018)