Ramzi Marjaba is a solution specialist who transitioned from engineering to sales. With a background in communications engineering and over a decade of sales experience, he now coaches sales engineers on improving their soft skills and becoming invaluable assets in the sales process. He founded his business, We the Sales Engineers, in 2018.

In this episode, we get into the role of Sales Engineers (SEs) in bridging the gap between complex business problems and advanced technical solutions. We explore how SEs, equipped with both technical skills and business savvy, build trust with clients, diagnose issues, and drive successful client engagements.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How SEs solve intricate issues that traditional salespeople often cannot address.
• The importance of combining technical acumen with strong communication skills for SEs.
• Why SEs should not be seen as mere technical support, but as integral sales contributors.
• How SEs demonstrate cost-saving and risk-reducing benefits to clients.
• How customer confidence is built by SEs, guiding clients towards superior solutions.
• The role of SEs in the discovery and qualification phases of the sales cycle.
• How SEs diagnose problems before prescribing solutions, acting as trusted advisors.
• Why SEs must possess thick skin, autonomy, and excellent problem-solving skills.
• How effective SEs excel in time management and communication between technology and humans.
• The process of sales engineering in solving business problems with technology.
• The impact of effective demos and proof of concepts in the sales cycle.
• How SEs adapt their messaging to different stakeholders within a client's organization.
• The application of SE traits in other sectors like marketing agencies and professional services.
• How SEs use diagnostic frameworks to uncover and address client problems.

Ramzi Marjaba on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ramzimarjaba/

Stefan Debois is a former SAP consultant who transitioned into entrepreneurship by founding his own software company, Pointerpro. He leverages his extensive experience with multinational giants to develop innovative automated assessment tools that help consultancies grow without increasing headcount. Clients of his include Deloitte and AstraZeneca.

In this episode, we welcome Stefan to explore how his automated assessment tools are revolutionizing the consultancy industry, enabling businesses to scale efficiently. He provides insights into the power of benchmarks and thought leadership in consultancy, and demonstrates how paid diagnostic assessments can uncover opportunities for high-value projects. We also discuss how professional services providers can approach their content marketing strategy.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How Stefan's software company evolved from a survey platform to an automated assessment niche.
• Why automated assessments provide personalized advice to help businesses grow efficiently.
• Stefan’s joy of using sports analogies when talking business.
• How paid diagnostic assessments can bring in high-value project opportunities.
• Why an optimized online presence is vital for driving inbound traffic and customer acquisition.
• How Stefan’s digital marketing strategies have attracted major clients.
• Why having a junior sales team can reduce overall sales costs.
• How content marketing and thought leadership can expand a client base globally.
• Why moving from time-and-materials billing to fixed price projects enhances efficiency and profitability.
• How integrating collective knowledge into user-friendly digital solutions reinforces thought leadership.
• How a transition from professional services to SaaS can change sales cycles and strategies.
• Advice from Stefan to SaaS tech leaders who are launching their product and want to scale.

Stefan Debois on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stefandebois/

Emma Thwaite, a seasoned expert in new business development and marketing, runs the consultancy Beckon and joins us this week. With 25 years of experience across large network agencies and independent creative firms, she specializes in drawing the right clients to agencies and supporting their growth. In this episode, we dig into the secrets of building long-term client relationships in B2B sales. We check out how to transform thin pipelines into rich opportunities and ways to craft value-driven communication. Emma shares her expertise on becoming a trusted partner, building impactful pitch teams, and creating meaningful, profitable relationships.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why understanding ideal clients and effective communication are necessary before entering the pitch process.
• How Beckon focuses on drawing the right clients to agencies.
• Why nurturing relationships and maintaining engagement keeps agencies top of mind.
• Leveraging existing networks to transform thin pipelines into lucrative opportunities.
• Why cold calling and mass LinkedIn outreach are less effective than value-driven communication.
• Why pre-qualifying leads ensure meaningful and profitable relationships.
• Treating credential meetings as two-way streets to help gather insights into clients' needs.
• Why agencies should avoid bidding on projects without access to human decision makers.
• How offering valuable insights, even when declining to bid, fosters long-term relationships.
• Why trust within the pitch team and understanding the brief are critical for successful pitches.
• How a pitch lead should ensure every team member contributes effectively.
• Why clients seek hope and a better way forward during the pitch process.
• How creating compelling presentations involves focusing on how the team makes the client feel.

Emma Thwaite on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/emma-thwaite-3b26864/ 

Kevin Hopp is an outbound sales trainer and consultant that specializes at helping B2B companies build phone-focused outbound motions. He joins us for this episode to talk all about the world of modern cold calling. We debunk the myth that cold calling is obsolete and explore how generational differences shape sales strategies. Through live experiments and practical advice, Kevin and I demonstrate how even the most hesitant sales reps can transform cold calls into meaningful conversations. Also, we’ll emphasize the importance of building trust and using technology, such as dialers, to enhance productivity.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How generational differences impact cold calling strategies in B2B sales.
• Why younger sales reps face psychological barriers with direct phone interactions.
• A cold call experiment to demonstrate the effectiveness of modern techniques.
• How building genuine trust is crucial in cold calling and sales.
• Why moving beyond scripts and sales jargon fosters better communication with prospects.
• How pre-established contacts can give an edge in competitive bidding scenarios.
• Why maintaining a monosystematic list of callable numbers enhances cold calling efficiency.
• Why key metrics like connect rates and conversion rates are essential for success.
• How having a script helps maintain a linear progression during calls.
• Why asking specific questions about a prospect's business can reduce cold call anxiety.
• How engaging in purpose-driven, business-centric conversations can improve call effectiveness.
• Why following up and maintaining communication builds long-term trust.
• How modern technology can aid in making cold calling less daunting and more productive.
• Why shifting from an impersonal advertising approach to a business conversation is effective.
• How reducing pressure and focusing on booking follow-up conversations can lead to better outcomes.
• Why organizing contacts and using technology are critical steps in a structured cold calling process.

Kevin Hopp on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/khopp/

Stephen Steers is a renowned sales consultant who has collaborated with industry giants like Google and Nike. He specializes in ContextSelling, emphasizing the importance of making sales interactions natural and relationship-focused.

In this episode, Stephen reveals his secrets about ContextSelling. We explore how to engage clients effectively from the first call, emphasizing the importance of discovery calls and a compelling value proposition. Stephen also shares his proven strategies and frameworks for elevating conversion rates and building stronger client relationships.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• An introduction to ContextSelling, the method that Stephen created.
• How addressing customer needs early maximizes value and engagement in sales calls.
• Stephen's experience with major companies like Google and Nike.
• How Stephen made an unexpected cameo in a Beyoncé music video.
• The importance of discovery calls for founders, CEOs, and sales professionals.
• Effective strategies for securing discovery calls, including compelling value propositions.
• Leveraging platforms like podcasts and webinars for business opportunities.
• Practical tips for improving conversion rates through rigorous qualification and team training.
• The concept of the "kryptonite question" to reveal a prospect's core needs.
• Tailoring responses to client needs based on similar cases and solutions.
• The significance of setting a clear agenda to reduce client anxiety and resistance.
• Using permission-based statements and maintaining a relaxed yet professional tone.
• Stephen’s OCGC framework for effective sales calls.
• Understanding the client's ideal state, current situation, and obstacles preventing their goals.
• How to ask questions to understand a prospect's needs before offering a solution.
• Adding value through relevant case studies without turning sales calls into free consulting sessions.
• Creating and presenting an offer that aligns with the prospect's identified needs.
• The importance of recording and reviewing calls to identify areas for improvement.

Stephen Steers on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stephen-steers/ 

Remeny Armitage Royle, founder of Brilliant and Human, is an expert in building authentic B2B relationships. With over 20 years of experience in marketing and business development, she helps agencies understand and address their clients' true needs.

In this episode, we’ll explore the art of building genuine connections in B2B sales. Remeny shares her expertise on moving beyond transactional interactions to truly understand client needs. We discuss the impact of AI, the importance of in-person mentorship, and point out some strategies for maintaining strong client relationships in remote settings.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• The importance of moving away from transactional interactions to understand clients' true needs.
• How Remeny’s experience of “time travel” adds a unique twist to her professional insights.
• The challenges facing independent agencies amidst economic and political uncertainty in the UK.
• How AI is enabling larger agencies to compete more effectively with smaller ones.
• Why in-person mentorship in a hybrid work environment is needed for the next generation of agency professionals.
• How it is beneficial to source independent client feedback to uncover opportunities and validate new services.
• Strategies for maintaining robust client relationships, particularly in remote settings.
• How proactivity, effective internal communication, and building emotional credit with clients are crucial.
• Why innovative pitching techniques, such as interactive discussions, build trust and loyalty.
• Having the right team members during presentations to foster client trust.
• How to refine onboarding processes and challenge clients effectively for long-term success.
• The significance of understanding the audience and context during business pitches.
• Insights for agency leaders to assess client relationships and improve processes and communication.

Remeny Armitage Royle on LinkedIn: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/remeny 

Kate Ross is the co-founder and MD of the social content agency eight&four Group. She started the business at the young age of 24 and has since developed a unique company culture that even embraces her love for wine. Kate's integration of personal passions with branding demonstrates her forward-thinking approach to marketing and agency leadership.

We’re diving into the ever-evolving world of marketing in the AI era with Kate in this episode. We're discussing exactly how marketing agencies can differentiate themselves amidst the rapid technological advancements. We explore the shift from creative to technical prowess in agency credentials, the role of consultancy in modern marketing, and the impact of advertising automation on the industry.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How marketing agencies must evolve with AI advancements to maintain a competitive edge.
• Why agency differentiation means even more in a market where technical skills increasingly overshadow creativity.
• How legal and practical challenges within client organizations affect the adoption of new technologies.
• Why integrating personal interests can enhance a company's culture and branding.
• How consultancies act as navigators through rapid technological advances.
• Why there's a blend of excitement and anxiety regarding automation in the advertising industry.
• How the authentic human touch remains essential in storytelling.
• How smaller agencies can integrate AI without compromising their human-driven approach to sales.
• Why agencies face the challenge of maintaining quality in the face of automation.
• How AI is affecting advertising quality, potentially leading to consumer backlash against inauthentic ads.
• Why human creativity and emotional resonance are irreplaceable in effective advertising campaigns.
• The harms of believing the narrative of full industry automation.
• How embracing AI tools and strategic consultancy can solve specific client problems effectively.
• Why agencies should support internal debate and transparency about AI's role and potential impacts.

Kate Ross on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/katemhross/ 

Marcus Hemsley is the co-founder of Fountain Partnership - a Strategic Digital Marketing Agency and Google's Global Award Winner for Growing Businesses online. Fountain has a team of 41 who help a range of clients from well-funded start-ups to large corporate exceed their growth targets. They forecast upfront to minimise risk and optimise the full funnel to maximise ROI. They specialise in PPC, SEO, and conversion rate optimisation.

Marcus also founded the Million Tree Pledge, a non for profit that help SMEs take big action on the climate crisis. He is also a director of Reconnect, a company that helps Agency founders and their teams have less stress, avoid burnout, and make better business decisions.

Marcus is with us this week to examine how building long-term, empathetic relationships with clients can dramatically increase lifetime customer value. We also look at why shifting the focus from chasing new leads to nurturing existing ones can lead to more effective sales growth. From recognizing when to step back for the client's benefit, to the power of active listening, Marcus provides everything you need to know about fostering a trust-centric and profitable B2B sales process. This isn't just about closing sales—it's about opening doors to a future filled with referrals and partnerships that stand the test of time.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How trust-based selling forms the core of B2B relationships.
• Why prioritizing lifetime customer value and ROI over immediate sales reduces cost per acquisition.
• How empathy and active listening serve as foundational elements for strong connections.
• Why stepping back when another provider is a better fit can lead to future referrals and trust.
• How effective opportunity qualification minimizes wasted effort on unlikely prospects.
• Why understanding the client's needs and challenges leads to better alignment and sales outcomes.
• The benefits of nurturing existing clients rather than pursuing new leads.
• Why every client interaction should be viewed as a step towards a sustainable business future.
• How recognizing cognitive biases towards new opportunities can refocus efforts on current client expansion.
• Why strategic decision-making is needed when allocating resources.
• How the principles of trust-based selling can be integrated into team practices.
• Why you need to exceed client expectations, show genuine interest, and do follow-ups.
• Why focusing on the bottom of the sales funnel can yield quicker results in pressing revenue needs.
• How reconnecting with past or dormant clients can unexpectedly revive business opportunities.

Marcus Hemsley on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marcushemsley/ 

Debbie Kaplan is the Managing Director and Chief Delivery Officer at Mosaic, an integrated marketing agency known for its focus on experiential commerce, retail, media, and brand design.

In this episode, we’ll talk about critical aspects of lead qualification in B2B sales with Debbie. We're discussing how to differentiate promising leads from less viable ones, along with the emotional intelligence required to make strategic decisions. We'll also look at the complicated process of procurement and agency selection, analyzing the impact on the success of pitches.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How lead qualification is a large factor in the success of B2B sales efforts.
• Why understanding the quality of a brief is essential for pursuing sales opportunities.
• How internal relationships influence the decision to chase potential deals.
• Why differentiating genuine opportunities from price benchmarking exercises is crucial.
• How saying no to ill-fitting prospects is a strategic and brave sales move.
• Why emotional intelligence plays a key role in sales decisions.
• How procurement processes impact agency selection in marketing and advertising.
• Why challenging RFP briefs can indicate a genuine interest in an agency's proposal.
• How communication among agencies, procurement professionals, and brand directors is vital.
• Why knowing whose budget is on the line affects the procurement decision-making process.
• Why agencies may need to opt out of bidding to avoid unsustainable pricing.
• Why identifying pricing patterns in lost bids is difficult for agencies.
• Reverse auctions in agency pitches and why they create challenges.
• How reverse auctioning rate cards overlooks the actual deliverables and value provided by agencies.
• The evolving nature of agency differentiation and why it’s difficult to define.

Debbie Kaplan on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/debbie-kaplan/ 

Claudia Stephenson is Managing Director, Europe at INVNT, a global brand storytelling agency. She has over 20 years of experience in brand activation and live events, and her team has developed several award-winning brand storytelling campaigns.

We’re talking with Claudia today about how to build relationships and develop business in the digital landscape, even when you can’t meet your potential clients face-to-face. We share our combined expertise on creating dynamic, diverse teams and cultivating meaningful connections remotely. We tackle the challenge of sales "ghosting" and discuss the power of emotional intelligence and respectful persistence in winning over clients. We also examine stakeholder psychology, asking pivotal questions to unlock client budgets, and fostering long-term trust.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How virtual connections can revolutionize relationship building.

• Why nurturing talent and supporting underrepresented groups is vital for marketing agencies.

• How Claudia's figure skating background influences her leadership and personal growth strategies.

• Why understanding stakeholder psychology is crucial for overcoming sales "ghosting."

• How respectful persistence can transform silent prospects into active partnerships.

• Why asking the right questions can allow access to client budgets.

• How maintaining strategic vigilance ensures a team's alignment with innovation and attitude.

• Why trust, storytelling, and strategic insights are key to making pitches stand out.

• How team diversity contributes to a successful business environment.

• Why hiring for attitude often trumps skill in building effective teams.

• How remote communication tools like Zoom facilitate building rapport with clients.

• Why long-term relationship building and trust are essential for securing deals.

• How virtual meetings during COVID-19 often proved as fruitful as in-person interactions.

• Why demonstrating deep knowledge and insights when asked tough questions impresses buyers.

• How the approach to business development adapts to virtual environments.

Claudia Stephenson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/claudiastephenson/

David Miller is the CEO of Red Brick Road, an innovative strategic and creative agency based in London. With a background that includes taking a leap from stage actor to agency leader, David possesses a tonne of experience in advertising and marketing.

We’re welcoming David this week to discuss the retendering process as well as nurturing client-agency relationships. We’ll touch upon pitching and explore how emotional intelligence plays a vital role in re-securing trust. David explains how agencies can wield the power of optimism, innovation, and AI to keep partnerships strong in the competitive landscape of marketing and advertising.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How David transitioned from stage actor to CEO and uses his acting experience in pitching.

• Why understanding the reasons behind a client's retender is crucial for incumbents.

• How agencies can use the pitching process to demonstrate resilience and knowledge.

• Why emotional intelligence is necessary to navigate team dynamics during client retention efforts.

• How optimism and realism balance the emotional challenges faced by teams during re-pitches.

• Why innovation and fresh ideas are essential to impress clients and maintain relevance.

• How AI is currently influencing proposals and shaping the future of pitches.

• How frequent feedback and proactive communication contribute to strong agency-client dynamics.

• Why thought leadership extends an agency's reach beyond traditional marketing boundaries.

• How incumbents can leverage their industry knowledge as intellectual capital during pitches.

• Why the incumbency offers both opportunities and liabilities when re-pitching to clients.

• Why agencies should seek to influence the tender brief before it is finalized.

• How relationship building has changed in a virtual environment, plus the strategies to adapt.

• Why in-person meetings are critical for deepening client relationships.

• How challenger agencies can outperform incumbents by offering fresh insights and understanding client needs.

David Miller on LinkedIn: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/davidmiller9

Robert Leigh is the innovative founder of DeVono, a leading firm that advises on office space in London. He's an industry leader with deep insights into the post-pandemic evolution of work environments and office dynamics. His expertise extends to sales strategies, with a particular focus on the real estate sector.

In this episode, we’re talking all about office dynamics and sales strategy. Robert explains the challenges of the post-pandemic office landscape and the irreplaceable vibrancy of physical workspaces. Later, we hear about how strategic timing and providing value can build lasting client relationships.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How London's office spaces have evolved post-pandemic to enhance collaboration and mentorship.

• Why physical office presence boosts sales and business growth.

• How DeVono tracks lease expiries to strategically time sales engagements with clients.

• How understanding client decision making and timing can transform cold calls into opportunities.

• Why offering value on every call builds trust and reduces salesperson anxiety.

• How maintaining a database helps to customize interactions to client needs.

• Why hiring for passion, resilience, and active listening is crucial for sales success.

• How structured onboarding and group hires can increase sales team motivation and drive.

• Why long-term relationships and networks from sales interactions are vital for business growth.

• How DeVono navigates changes in office use and real estate strategies.

• Why commercial mindset development benefits from in-person interactions with leaders.

• How various outreach methods, beyond cold calling, enhance client engagement.

• What to look for when hiring for a sales position.

• Why not every interaction leads to an immediate sale, and why that’s okay.

• Why building a business development function requires a mix of sales and marketing strategies.

Robert Leigh on LinkedIn: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/robert-leigh-a544005

The guest for this episode is Haris Halkic, a tech sales professional and LinkedIn content creator from Germany. With five years of experience as an account executive across various companies, he now runs the SalesDaily newsletter, providing sales resources and insights to its subscribers

He explains revolutionary B2B sales strategies today, focusing on a multi-channel approach that combines LinkedIn, cold calling, and emails. We discuss the integration of AI tools to streamline sales processes, the resurgence of cold calling, and the importance of personalized outreach methods.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How AI tools for note taking and call analysis enhance sales productivity.
• Why cold calling is resurging post-pandemic within multi-channel strategies.
• How training, dedication, and flexible scripts are vital for successful cold calling.
• Why large enterprise sales organizations benefit more from cold calling than mid-market suppliers.
• How engaging prospects on LinkedIn through meaningful comments can build relationships.
• Why modern sales trends emphasize genuine human connections amidst AI proliferation.
• How creativity in outreach, like using LinkedIn voice notes and short introduction videos, can be impactful.
• Why many sales reps are reluctant to adopt basic yet effective sales tactics.
• How digital sales rooms and AI tools aid in streamlining the sales process.
• Why some enterprises restrict AI note takers due to data protection concerns.
• How top sales performers prioritize revenue-generating activities and say no to non-essential tasks.
• How personalized outreach methods, such as leaving voicemails, improve email open rates.
• How the transition from corporate roles to the creator economy helps salespeople discover innovative tactics.
• How remote settings challenge traditional sales training and support.
• Why young sellers need increased training and support to adapt to the current sales environment.

Haris Halkic on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/haris-halkic/

Dr. Anastasia Kārkliņa Gabriel is a cultural theorist, writer, social critic, and strategist specializing in inclusivity within marketing, media, and tech. Currently a senior insights lead at Reddit, she earned her doctorate in cultural studies from Duke University and has consulted for the world's top brands, including Nike, Samsung, Disney, Ulta Beauty, and AMEX, at agencies like Wieden+Kennedy, Dentsu Creative, and McCann, among others. A lifelong activist, Dr. Gabriel helps brands ignite cultural innovation and leverage the power of media for good. Her insights have been featured in the American Marketing Association (AMA), the Association of National Advertisers (ANA), WARC, Advertising Week, Wall Street Journal, New York Times, Washington Post, and Teen Vogue. She is the author of Cultural Intelligence for Marketers published by Kogan Page in March 2024.

We’re talking with Dr. Gabriel about the power of cultural intelligence in marketing on this week’s episode. We discuss the importance of understanding cultural trends to engage consumers authentically and navigate the complex landscape of consumer culture. Dr. Gabriel shares her journey from activism to brand strategy, showing how her unique perspective enhances brand relevance. We examine frameworks for cultural intelligence, the role of inclusivity in advertising, and the measurable impacts on both business and societal connectivity. We’ll also touch upon the role of AI in advertising and the importance of fostering diversity within marketing teams.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why understanding cultural trends is critical for influencing consumer behavior and brand authenticity.

• How Dr. Gabriel’s academic and activism background offers a unique perspective in applying cultural studies to marketing.

• How marketing agencies can navigate cultural landscapes by developing frameworks of cultural intelligence.

• Why distinguishing between fast and slow cultural trends is necessary for brand alignment.

• How brands can engage with “moments, movements, and mindsets” to resonate with consumers.

• Why brands must balance cultural relevance with their core values, avoiding silence on significant movements.

• How inclusive advertising impacts both commercial success and societal connectivity.

• Why empirical evidence is vital in guiding inclusive marketing practices for brand trust.

• How to measure cultural intelligence using traditional metrics and perception over time.

• Why it's important to understand advertising impact on underrepresented groups using the three Rs: representative, responsible, resonant.

• How AI in advertising poses challenges with potential biases in training data.

• Why marketing teams should enhance diversity and inclusivity within their strategies.

• How agencies can advise brands on meaningful movements without fear of cultural missteps.

Dr. Anastasia Kārkliņa Gabriel on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/anastasiakgabriel/

Claire Lambell is the Managing Director at Southpaw, a strategic creative agency that works with challenger brands (that is, brands that have a mindset of doing things differently). Her background is in sociology and social psychology, which she leverages to understand client motivations.

This week, we’re chatting with Claire all about client relationships and agency growth. We're discussing how to align agency values with client needs, the strategy behind successful pitches, and the importance of early engagement with procurement teams to secure a strong relationship. We’ll hear personal experiences and insights on maintaining a challenger mindset, along with clear budget communication to cultivate long-lasting client partnerships.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How shared values and understanding client motivations are essential in winning pitches.

• Why strategy and creativity must work together for insightful, effective campaigns.

• How diverse backgrounds such as Claire’s contribute to the marketing industry.

• Why early engagement with procurement teams leads to better negotiation outcomes.

• How clear budget communication is crucial for realistic marketing strategy planning.

• Why maintaining a challenger mindset helps agencies stay ahead and deliver on objectives.

• Why passion and proactive management are vital in managing day-to-day agency operations.

• Why overcomplicating pitches with too much information can lead to losing a client.

• How demonstrating value sometimes faces off with competitive pricing in the industry.

• Why simplicity and storytelling are effective in creating engaging sales presentations.

• How managing risk with procurement can set an agency apart during the pitch process.

• Why agencies should qualify opportunities based on fit, fame, firepower, and fortune.

• Why discussing targets and budgets with clients leads to more successful campaign outcomes.

Claire Lambell on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/claire-lambell-a934382a/

Nikki Gatenby is an agency specialist non-exec director and cognitive behavioural coach - with a laser focus on helping founders to build their agencies into highly valuable assets, by creating both agency and client value over time.

Having led, owned, managed and grown pioneering agencies in London, Paris and Brighton, Nikki understands what it takes to create business success.

Her last agency went from Brighton to global, from marketing services to two SaaS technology products (answerthepublic and coveragebook), both now independently bigger than the agency itself.

This was hand in hand with being named one of the Best Places to Work in the UK for 8 years running - whilst trebling margin, generating 4 times more revenue and 10x more profit.

Having captured the insights in two best sellers - 'Superenegaged' - focusing on high engagement at work and 'Better Business on Purpose' - centered around positive impact, Nikki took her exit in 2019 and is now focused on making other good agencies, great.

Nikki is with us today to talk all about sales qualification along with exploring strategic approaches to maximize agency growth. We’re discussing how embracing a “less is more” mantra is not just wise, but crucial for thriving in a competitive market. We hear about examining feedback loops, the importance of recognizing a deal's alignment with an agency's strengths, and the power of defining the ideal customer. Nikki even shares strategies for gracefully declining RFPs and reinforcing the significance of articulating unique agency value in high-stakes negotiations and QBRs.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How to increase pitch success rates by qualifying sales opportunities for agencies.

• Why turning down pitches is essential for agency growth and avoiding wasted resources.

• The necessity of feedback loops to identify early warning signs in potential deals.

• Defining an ideal customer profile to deliver value and elevate agency-client relationships.

• Understanding procurement language and the Kraljic matrix to enhance negotiation skills.

• Nikki’s insights on gracefully declining RFPs while maintaining future collaboration prospects.

• The pivotal role of conveying unique agency value during contract renegotiations and QBRs.

• The transition from agency growth to SaaS products in Nikki’s career.

• Why agencies should avoid the race to the bottom with pricing to maintain a quality team.

• Emphasizing the mantra "volume is vanity, conversion is sanity" for agency leaders.

• Recognizing the best opportunities to pitch by aligning with the agency's strengths.

• Why focusing efforts on the most promising pitches improves win rates and average order values.

Nikki Gatenby on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nikkigatenby/

Cain Ullah is a career consultant and digital transformation expert, as well as the founder of Red Badger. He has a fantastic ability to foster long-term client relationships, as well as a knack for guiding large organizations through strategic and executional challenges in digital product transformation.

In this episode, Cain shares his point of view on the essential practice of building trust in professional relationships. He’ll provide tips on how to craft genuine connections that go beyond transactional interactions, which helps in fostering credibility and nurturing sustainable business growth. We're discussing the importance of providing value plus prioritizing non-self-oriented interactions to cultivate a network that supports and enhances both personal and professional success.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why prioritizing trust and genuine connections is essential in professional engagements.

• How discovering shared personal interests can enrich professional relationships.

• Why starting with credibility in sales conversations lays the groundwork for deeper, trust-based connections.

• How "gold coins" of knowledge entice client interest and foster organic opportunities over time.

• Why delivering on promises is key to maintaining credibility and sustainable business growth.

• How a commitment to quality leads to financial stability and a reduced need for constant client acquisition.

• How shared risk-reward models and robust reporting can strengthen client engagement and trust.

• Why aggressive sales tactics that neglect delivery quality can harm your business.

• How strong delivery teams make it easier to build trusted advisor relationships.

• Why excellence in service is a foundation for business stability, client retention, and organic growth.

• Red Badger’s simple yet powerful mantra.

• Why defining clear success metrics early in client relationships is necessary for accountability and alignment.

Cain Ullah on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cainullah/

Catherine Allison is the founder of Master the Art, an organization dedicated to enhancing communication skills. With a diverse background in creative agencies and acting, she excels in teaching individuals how to display gravitas and confidence while maintaining authenticity.

In this episode, we’ll chat with Catherine about the world of professional communication. She’ll let us in on the keys to projecting gravitas and authenticity in the workplace. We’ll hear about practical strategies and insights to help you command respect and influence with ease, all while keeping your unique voice front and center.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How to project confidence and warmth in professional settings with the help of gravitas.

• Why gravitas isn't just for seasoned executives; it's an accessible trait that anyone can develop.

• Why preparation and the “gravitas equation” (knowledge + purpose + passion – anxiety = gravitas) enhance communication skills in various settings.

• How balancing gravitas with lightness and authenticity is crucial for commanding presence.

• Why authenticity in leadership and gravitas is about true presence, not performance.

• How clarity of thought without scripting can lead to engaging and meaningful conversations.

• Why gravitas is critical in sales and leadership for commanding respect and trust.

• How statistics show that soft skills often determine the success of pitches over content.

• How daily recognition of successes can contribute to a positive mindset and confidence.

• Why managing anxieties with specific strategies can improve focus.

• Why understanding and improving components of the gravitas equation is key for professional growth.

Catherine Allison on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/catherinea

A former FTSE100 Marketing Director, since selling his human insight and coaching business Chemistry in 2015, Simon Cooper has been leading, facilitating, and coaching change across a range of organisations.

A Partner at Positive Momentum, Simon has many years of business change and growth experience having been a Marketing Director at Cable & Wireless following a career in commercial leadership roles in technology, consulting, and telecommunications businesses.

After Cable & Wireless Simon grew the human insight consultancy Chemistry from a start-up in a village in England to standing toe to toe across the world with established leaders in human data analytics, behavioural change and business consulting working with clients such as Vodafone, Experian, and Diageo. He sold that business in 2015.

Prior to Cable & Wireless, as Marketing Director, Simon shaped the cultural and sales turnaround at Energis, a bankrupt business, when he and the team arrived. Simon drove fast, dramatic change across the marketing team, sales capability, customer experience, culture, brand, go-to-market strategy and external marketing, and was intimately involved with the successful exit for the shareholders netting them $750m.

Before Energis he lived in the USA whilst working with AT&T as Global Chief Marketing Officer for their Concert business, before heading back to Europe to join Accenture where he led the sale of +$100m outsourcing deals, working across Europe with clients such as Microsoft, Iberdrola and Nokia.

His early years in management were spent at BT where he introduced market shifting new services (including their first ever BT shop on the internet, yes really!) and formed a market defining partnership with Sky.

Simon has a Post Graduate Diploma in Behavioural Change from Henley Management College and an MBA awarded jointly by INSEAD in Paris and McGill University in Montreal under the direct tutorage of business guru Henry Mintzberg. Henry quoted Simon in his book at the time. The MBA study included periods at Kobe University in Japan, Bangalore Institute of Management in India and Lancaster University in the UK.

He’s never more energized than when playing football on a Friday night and describes his greatest burden in life as his love for Derby County (apparently they won the leagues in 1972 and 1975 – who knew). His humour will most definitely make you laugh, but he saves his widest smiles for his wife Carol, daughter Laura and son Jonathan.

In this week’s episode, Simon unravels the qualities that exceptional leaders possess to inspire their sales teams and surpass revenue goals. We delve into the crucial role of setting a vision, fostering growth, and constructing a high-caliber team. We debate the player-manager conundrum in sales leadership, considering if directors should directly close deals or focus on coaching their teams. We emphasize hiring for attitude over experience, plus the power of networking for genuine connections. We also explore the harmonious relationship between sales and marketing, especially in professional services, and the significance of articulating value propositions.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How exceptional commercial leaders drive team performance, even in challenging economies like today’s.

• Why a clear vision and roadmap for teams is critical for success.

• How fostering an environment of growth can empower teams to achieve and exceed targets.

• Why building a world-class sales team often involves frequent assessment and development.

• How sales leadership roles balance deal making with team mentorship and strategy development.

• Why hiring for attitude and cultural fit can be more important than industry experience.

• How attitudes and behaviours are critical factors in successful sales team composition.

• Why networking for genuine connections surpasses networking for mere contacts.

• How marketing leaders can craft compelling value propositions for financial decision makers.

• Why understanding the economic impact of marketing efforts is essential for business growth.

• How predictive modeling of marketing campaigns can improve accuracy over time.

• Why collaborative negotiation techniques can transform competitive situations into success.

• How empathy and curiosity are potent tools in high-stakes negotiations.

• Why leaders should understand core values as they deeply influence professional behaviours.

• How recognizing the influence of values can aid in hiring the right team members.

Simon Cooper on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/simoncooper11/

Kristin Gower is the Global President at EssenceMediacom, specializing in B2B marketing. With a background as a competitive horse rider and a rich international career, Kristin brings a wealth of experience in crafting effective B2B strategies. Her insights span across research, strategy, demand management, marketing technology, customer experience, content, and analytics.

With Kristin, we're exploring the essential pillars of B2B marketing success and discussing how to create impactful client relationships and win competitive tenders. We’ll learn about the art of negotiation and how to elevate our marketing game to not just compete, but to dominate.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How to streamline service offerings for cost effectiveness while delivering value.

• The five core pillars of B2B marketing.

• Aligning marketing automation with tech departments to leverage data and ABM technology.

• How to reduce marketing duplication while managing complex product lines within B2B organizations

• Establishing measurement as a baseline expectation for agencies in B2B marketing.

• How agencies can partner with clients to refine sophisticated measurement practices.

• Why you must understand nuances behind RFPs to create pitches that address underlying client needs.

• What must be done to balance strategic thinking with tactical offerings in agency tenders.

• The importance of chemistry and personal connections in winning competitive tenders.

• How to align the procurement teams' objectives to address the needs of all stakeholders in B2B pitches.

• Why embedding a commercial negotiation mindset within agency teams for profitability and quality delivery.

• Challenges in competitive tenders, including understanding RFPs and balancing strategy.

• Emphasizing the importance of data aggregation and creating a unified goal for effective measurement.

• How agencies demonstrate value and impact through efficient, integrated analytics.

• Navigating the procurement and marketing teams' differing objectives in B2B partnerships.

• How AI is being used for content creation and insights generation in B2B marketing.

Kristin Gower on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kristin-gower/

Derek Rey is the CEO of Demand Inc and Lasso AI, boasting a history of generating over 100,000 meetings and driving a $7 billion client pipeline. Derek has mastered the integration of AI in sales, providing innovative strategies that transform the traditional approaches to sales development and cold emailing.

In this episode, we’ll check out how artificial intelligence is revolutionizing the sales industry. Derek explains the critical role AI can play in enhancing productivity and crafting personalized cold email strategies, and we’ll examine the balance between technology and human connection in sales. He also debunks myths surrounding the effectiveness of cold emailing, and gives advice on how you can improve your own cold emailing strategy.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why personalization and storytelling are crucial in cold emailing and sales communication.

• How to balance human connections and AI in selling professional services.

• Why direct, business-centric messaging can sometimes be more effective than over-personalization.

• Why cold emails remain a powerful tool despite skepticism and legal constraints.

• How to build successful cold email strategies that lead to significant sales.

• Why understanding legal aspects like GDPR is essential for cold emailing.

• How AI tools are redefining sales prospecting and relationship maintenance.

• How AI language models like Microsoft's Copilot will transform email management.

• Why sales teams will face a drop in productivity if they continue using legacy processes.

• How AI can address the challenges of reaching the inbox amid spam filters.

• How human-like communication in emails can improve sales outreach.

• Why sales teams should leverage AI to find new prospects and maintain relationships.

• How Lasso AI identifies untapped opportunities by analyzing existing contact data.

• Why AI personalization at scale is becoming increasingly important for sales success.

• How AI is expected to change the sales landscape within the next few years.

Derek Rey on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/derekrey/

This week we’re joined by Geoff Griffiths, the CEO of Builtvisible. His company is a specialist organic marketing agency. A former professional rugby player, he gives his thoughts on the realm of digital marketing, focusing on team dynamics, resilience, and strategic partnerships. His approach to leadership is heavily influenced by the teamwork and loyalty cultivated on the sports field.

We’ll be discussing the world of high-performance teams and strategic marketing partnerships. We’ll unpack the parallels between sports dynamics and business success, exploring how to navigate the complexities of SEO, and crafting resilient teams that thrive on loyalty and empowerment.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why understanding procurement KPIs is crucial for effective negotiations and partnerships.

• How collective effort is more important than the "star player" in team success.

• Why resilience, empowerment, and loyalty culture are key to high-performance teams.

• How education in client relationships shapes the buying and selling of SEO services.

• Why the trusted advisor model is essential for lasting marketing partnerships.

• How to navigate the SEO and organic marketing landscape for business growth.

• Why clear communication with procurement aligns objectives for ROI and risk reduction.

• How articulating value overcomes price fixation in marketing service negotiations.

• Why preparation and vulnerability are strategic in long-term partnership negotiations.

• How Geoff's transition from sports to boardroom influences his leadership style.

• Why avoiding commoditization in SEO services is critical for agency success.

• How fostering a “we before me” mentality can improve agency and client relationships.

• Why a strategic, consultative sales approach matters in the organic marketing industry.

• How aligning agency-client interests can prevent the commoditization of services.

Geoff Griffiths on LinkedIn: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/geoffmgriffiths

Gavin Stone is a body language expert with over two decades of experience in the intelligence community, which he now applies to sales strategies. As a best-selling author and a top-ranked expert in his field, Gavin has mastered the art of psychological profiling and non-verbal communication to influence and negotiate effectively.

With Gavin’s guidance, we’ll learn all about the world of non-verbal cues and psychological sales tactics. We'll be unpacking the strategies used to recruit assets and extract information, revealing how these techniques can unlock success in sales. Gavin also gives tips on how to read people, from their motivations to their subtlest gestures, to build rapport and influence decisions.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why do individuals become assets in Gavin’s line of work.

• Why recognizing personality types is crucial in building relationships.

• How personal insecurities influence people's choices and behavior.

• Why empathy is important in understanding others and not projecting our feelings onto them.

• How rewarding personality traits can establish trust and rapport.

• What the “smile campaign” is in intelligence and how it builds relationships.

• Why selling in real estate is focused on selling dreams, not specifics.

• Why neuro linguistic programming (NLP) techniques are vital in influencing and understanding clients.

• How do visual, auditory, and kinesthetic communication styles affect sales techniques?

• How pronouns reveal personality types and communication styles.

• How understanding body language impacts sales effectiveness.

• Why mirroring body language can be a nuanced sales technique.

• Interpreting body language to detect deception.

• How salespeople can ethically profile prospects to understand motivations and influence them.

• Using the “pace, pace, lead” technique to build comfort and take the lead.

Gavin Stone on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gavin-stone-146ab1240/

Today we’re talking all about transformative power of strategic partnerships in scaling tech companies. We’re joined by Barrett King, who is Senior Director, Revenue & Partnerships at New Breed as well as a former HubSpot leader. We explore his unconventional journey from the restaurant industry to becoming a B2B tech sales expert. Barrett shares key insights from HubSpot’s early days, highlighting the importance of market listening, exceptional customer support, and innovative partnership models. We also discuss the critical role of tech ecosystems, personal branding, and customer-centric sales approaches in driving growth.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why Barrett’s transition from the culinary arts to B2B tech sales provides unique perspectives.
• How HubSpot’s early market listening, customer support, and partnerships led to SaaS success.
• Why tech ecosystems are crucial for company expansion and long-term growth.
• How distributors, resellers, and VARs enhance go-to-market strategies.
• Why customer retention and robust ecosystems drive business success.
• How personal branding for sales teams contributes to overall company success.
• Why salespeople need to be knowledgeable consultants, not just product sellers.
• How improving conversion rates requires a blend of data analysis and incremental changes.
• Why a strong company culture and mission belief inspire personal and organizational success.
• Emphasizing quality over quantity in sales efforts involving tech.
• Why customer service should be integrated into sales functions for better results.
• How successful tech companies retain and expand existing customers for sustainable growth.
• Why understanding customer problems deeply is essential for improving conversion rates.
• How owning one’s social and email presence can elevate personal and company brand.
• Why the conventional sales approach needs to evolve towards customer-centric methods.

Barrett King on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/barrettjking/

Today we’re welcoming Jenny Plant, an expert in training agency account managers, and a former agency account manager herself. With a rich history in the field since the early 90s, she can provide deep insights into client engagement and business growth. She's also had a stint client-side as a marketing manager and nearly started her own agency after a successful freelance project.

In this episode, we’ll discuss account management and how it can be a game changer for agency growth. Jenny sheds light on how agencies can capitalize on their account management teams to unlock opportunities, enhance client relationships, and drive profitability, all while managing the intricacies of time constraints and pricing models.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How account management can be leveraged for agency growth and profitability.

• Why nurturing client relationships is crucial for agency success.

• What challenges account managers face, such as time constraints and rigid pricing models.

• Strategies for transforming account managers into champions for growth.

• Why defining roles using the RACI model benefits account management.

• How agencies can experience immediate growth by optimizing account management.

• What common misconceptions exist about account growth and how to overcome them.

• Why ongoing support and a commercial mindset are vital post-training for account managers.

• How ChatGPT and other tools can be used for data analysis and identifying solutions.

• Ways to prioritize high-potential clients for deeper engagement and growth.

• Why understanding the full range of agency services is key for account managers.

• How agencies can foster an entrepreneurial spirit within account management teams.

• The importance of tailored approaches for account directors managing multiple clients.

• Why intrinsic motivation is necessary for account managers aiming for growth.

• How a commercial mindset involves understanding pricing strategies and client value creation.

Jenny Plant on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jennyplant/

Ted McKenna is a co-founder of DCM Insights and a co-author of the book The JOLT Effect. With a background in research and sales effectiveness, he specializes in B2B sales strategies and customer indecision. His expertise at DCM is built on the analysis of 2.5 million sales conversations, providing insights into the psychology of buying and the dynamics of trust in sales.

In this episode, we're discussing how sales teams can overcome buyer indecision and fears to close more deals. As AI reshapes the sales landscape, we're examining strategies to build authentic relationships and become the trusted allies that buyers need in the modern marketplace.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why understanding buyer psychology is crucial in overcoming sales indecision.

• How 2.5 million sales conversations have revealed key strategies for guiding buyers.

• Why AI and machine learning are reshaping sales strategy, despite skepticism.

• How to maintain authenticity in sales relationships amid technological advancements.

• Why the activator archetype is becoming the new beacon of sales success and what exactly it is.

• How professional service providers can adapt to evolving buyer behaviors.

• Why addressing fears of failure is essential in unlocking stalled sales deals.

• How omission bias affects buyer decisions and the role of the JOLT method.

• Why building a network is crucial for modern B2B sales professionals.

• How the landscape of professional services is changing due to buyer empowerment.

• Why trust dynamics between buyers and sellers have evolved and how to adapt.

• How to use LinkedIn and other resources to enhance B2B sales techniques.

• Why indecision in buyers has become more prevalent and how to tackle it.

Ted McKenna on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ted-mckenna

Richard Boon is CEO at Webmart, an award-winning B Corp. Richard is a sustainable marketing leader with over 18 years of experience in working with globally recognised brands. Richard has led contract pitches and built bid teams to achieve recurring success in Marketing procurement. Leaning on transparency, challenger sale and implementation of continual improvement cycles, Richard has evolved Webmart from a radical outsider to an established and compelling choice.

Alongside Richard, we're discussing everything from the evolution of sales pitches to integrating sustainability and technology for better business outcomes. We also dissect the Challenger Sale methodology and share strategies for crafting a winning sales team and improving commercial results. Also, we’ll explore innovative techniques to revolutionise client relationships and transform sales approaches.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How Richard's early experience in a Dragon's Den competition shaped his sales expertise.

• Why a structured approach to pitches, including a bid library and test-and-learn cycles, is crucial.

• What challenges businesses face when engaging with procurement for the first time.

• How the evolution of the pitch process impacts sales and marketing strategies.

• Why sustainability and technology are key differentiators in today's competitive market.

• How a marketing director's bold repositioning move can improve win rates and brand identity.

• What the Challenger Sale methodology entails for transforming sales teams into consultants.

• How credibility and risk management build trust and foster long-lasting client partnerships.

• Why reflecting on lost bids is a valuable strategy for continuous sales improvement.

• How to prepare for negotiations, understand KPIs, and recognise when to step back.

• Why adopting a sports psychology mindset can benefit sales performance analysis.

• How a consultative approach meets the contemporary needs of clients.

• What practical steps Richard suggests for enhancing commercial sales outcomes.

• Why walking away from a deal with confidence can lead to better negotiation power.

• How education, rather than threats, can be a more powerful negotiation technique.

• Why workshopping, role-play, and feedback are essential for adopting the Challenger Sale style.

Richard Boon on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/richardboon/

Miles Welch is a Partner with Milestone Advisory, a leading advisory firm specialising in growth, fundraising, and M&A for the marketing and related tech sectors. Miles is recognized for his innovative thinking and expertise in digital advertising. As an advisor, he aids agencies in differentiation, growth, and negotiation, ensuring their success in a competitive market.

Alongside Miles, we’ll dissect the intricacies of agency differentiation and share powerful strategies for winning business contracts. Miles also talks about transitioning from cancer research to advertising, crafting unique value propositions, and negotiating effectively to secure and retain clients. We also explore the optimal timing for agencies to enhance a company's value for potential sales.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why diverse experiences contribute to professional expertise, especially in agency differentiation.

• How to craft a unique value proposition that resonates with clients.

• Why winning RFP responses and skilled negotiation are critical in agency sales.

• How early relationship building can prevent common traps in the RFP process.

• Why understanding a client's objectives leads to successful negotiation and flexible deal structuring.

• How agencies align client retention strategies with growth objectives.

• Ways agencies can enrich the value of a business before market entry.

• How work-life balance translates into professional success.

• How to showcase distinctiveness through a clear growth plan and solid sales/marketing engine.

• Why agencies must avoid the common pitfall of failing to qualify out unfavorable leads.

• Why it is important to extend client relationships beyond service delivery.

• How to prepare for and execute effective negotiation strategies in business deals.

• The advantages of setting desirable and least acceptable outcomes in contract variables.

• How agencies can help businesses enhance their value ahead of a potential sale.

Miles Welch on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mileswelch/

Allen Adamson is a noted industry expert in all disciplines of branding. He has worked with a broad spectrum of consumer and corporate businesses in industries ranging from packaged goods and technology, to health care and financial services, to hospitality and entertainment. Given his broad perspective and depth of experience, Allen is able to help clients see and seize opportunities before the competition, activating solutions that enable them to shift ahead of the market, generating long-term value and increased brand equity. He and his teams help clients identify what truly matters to the audiences they serve – what is relevant to them – and deliver on it brilliantly.

Allen's newest book, Seeing the How: Achieving Market Advantage by Transforming the Stuff We Do, Not the Stuff We Buy, published in May 2023, focuses on the consumer experience as a competitive advantage, and how this change in perspective has allowed companies to achieve dramatic growth and categorical leadership. The book’s driving idea was sparked by Allen's recognition that experience transformation has been fast outpacing product transformation as a winning and sustainable marketing strategy.

His previous books, BrandSimple, BrandDigital, The Edge: 50 Tips from Brands that Lead and, Shift Ahead, are used as textbooks in higher education business programs across the country.

Allen’s multifaceted knowledge of all things brand and branding is the result of having worked on both the agency side of the business, and the client side. He spent the earliest part of his career as a marketing executive in packaged goods, at Unilever, one of the world’s largest consumer goods companies, where he oversaw a broad range of consumer products. He is proud to acknowledge that he spent a lot of his early business life in supermarket aisles, perusing one aisle or another in order to gain an understanding of the consumers’ outlook– and that of his brands’ competitors.

On the agency side, Allen held senior management positions at iconic advertising firms, including Ogilvy & Mather and DMB&B, before arriving at Landor Associates, a full-spectrum brand consultancy dealing with brand development and the myriad factors that makes one brand more successful than another. He eventually rose to the position of Chairman. Under his leadership, the company partnered with a variety of global brands, including Accenture, GE, Johnson & Johnson, FedEx, HBO, Marriott, MetLife, P&G, Sony, and Verizon. Additionally, he guided non-profit organizations, including the 9/11 Memorial and Museum, the Central Park Conservancy, and the Council on Foreign Relations, among others.

For the past several years, Allen has been an Adjunct Professor and frequent guest lecturer at New York University's Stern School of Business, and the Samuel Curtis Johnson Graduate School of Management at Cornell University, where he lectures on the significant and numerous challenges brands are confronting - and overcoming - in a fast-changing marketplace. He also serves as the brand expert-in-residence at the Berkley Center for Entrepreneurship at NYU Stern, working with student entrepreneurs from across NYU to help them develop and execute their brand “story,” providing guidance on the many aspects required to launch successful brands.

Given the depth and breadth of his expertise - his perspective of brands from both an academic and a long-standing practitioner’s point of view – Allen has been called on as an expert witness for companies across a number of industries involved in litigation over the protection of their brand assets, the distinguishing characteristics that differentiate one brand from another. His multidimensional experience makes him unparalleled in his ability to offer valuable insight to those defending brands that have come under competitive threat and encroachment of these assets.

 A sought-after industry commentator, Allen has appeared on ABC News, NBC's Today Show, CNBC's Squawk Box and Closing Bell, and Fox Business Network. He is often quoted in publications including The New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, Advertising Age, the Washington Post, and Forbes. He also regularly writes a column on current branding topics. He speaks on branding for a range of professional organizations, corporate events, and industry conferences.

Allen is Co-Founder and Managing Partner of Metaforce (www.metaforce.com), a disruptive marketing and brand consultancy which, unlike traditional firms, takes a multi-disciplinary channel-agnostic approach to marketing challenges. It was created to help leaders understand all the forces at work inside and outside their businesses to identify strategies yielding the highest returns. Once determining the best strategy, Metaforce's consortium of partners, each industry expert in their field, pivots to help clients brilliantly act on and execute customer experiences in the market. Metaforce combines the best aspects of brand management, strategy, and experience consultancies to deliver solutions that ensure its clients shift ahead of the dramatic marketplace changes to meet fast-evolving customer needs.

Allen received his B.S. from the S.I. Newhouse School of Public Communications at Syracuse University, and an MBA from New York University's Stern School of Business.

We’re speaking with Allen today about the art of pitching and how storytelling, preparation, and agency-client synergy can secure deals. We are treated to his valuable insights from his diverse experiences in filmmaking, advertising, and working with Unilever. He explains the importance of a polished pitch and how a cinematic approach to presenting can captivate clients. We’ll also discuss strategies for differentiation in pitches, the magic of engaging presentations, and the evolving landscape of marketing agencies and client relationships. Looking towards the future, we examine how to navigate the changes with a focus on team chemistry and tailored client strategies.

Topics covered during this episode include:

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  Why preparation and rehearsal are critical for a compelling presentation.

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  The role that having a creative idea plays in differentiating agency pitches.

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  How emotional engagement and surprise factor into crafting an unforgettable pitch.

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  Why team chemistry is essential for a successful pitch.

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  How to navigate the dynamic relationship between agencies and clients.

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  What strategies secure long-term client-agency partnerships.

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  Some personal stores that illustrate the importance of synergy in pitches.

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  What future disruptions in marketing might impact agency-client relations.

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  How thought leadership and authoring a book can enhance your professional status.

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  Why meticulous focus and editing are necessary for pitch presentations.

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  More tips about how agencies can differentiate themselves to stand out to prospects.

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  What interactive strategies can make pitch meetings memorable for clients.

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  How to effectively personalize team introductions during pitches.

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  Why team dynamics during pitches should be likened to casting for a Broadway show.

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  What upcoming challenges traditional marketing agencies may face.

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  How freelancers are increasingly filling expertise gaps in agency pitches.

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  Why it's crucial to tailor strategies to the client’s specific needs during pitches.

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  How to create a winning pitch by balancing standout ideas with thorough RFP responses.

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  Why it's beneficial to engage clients in workshops before pitching to them.

Allen Adamson on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/allenadamson

Stephen Cribbett, co-founder of Versiti, is a seasoned expert in business development and crafting winning business proposals. His background includes work with design and brand agencies, utilizing a consultative and listening-oriented approach to sales.

This week we’re diving into the strategies that set apart successful business proposals, along with how to secure wins in a competitive market. We also hear about how Stephen’s love for motorsport translates into the precision and strategic thinking needed in sales. We’ll even unpack the challenges small agencies face and the tactics they can utilize to outpace industry giants in the race to secure big projects.

Topics covered during this episode include:

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  Why a consultative, listening-oriented approach can dramatically improve sales outcomes.

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  How understanding client needs aligns with crafting successful business proposals.

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  Why comparing racing precision to sales strategy offers valuable business insights.

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  How smaller agencies can compete with larger firms using academic insights.

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  Why specialized knowledge can transform an agency's pitch from forgettable to front-runner.

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  How a “shall we bid” matrix helps agencies make rational decisions on project pursuits.

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  Why answering every question thoughtfully on tender documents is crucial for success.

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  How specialized expertise leads to winning high-profile projects without pitching.

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  How proactively addressing client issues positions an agency ahead of the competition.

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  Why using workflow management tools like Monday.com is important for organizing proposal efforts.

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  How agencies can demonstrate value even when previous client work is confidential.

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  Why recruiting team members with relevant experience can maximize success in winning new business.

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  How mindset shifts and rigorous proposal processes improve an agency's win ratios.

Stephen Cribbett on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/scribbett/

Jonathan McCallum joined George P. Johnson UK, over seven years ago as Vice President, Chief Strategy Officer and was promoted in 2021 to Managing Director UK & Nordics. With his experience rooted in strategy, Jonathan McCallum leads the agency’s approach to strategy fueled experience design and underpins the importance of being client-centric. Building on the momentum the agency had seen, in 2022 Jonathan led the UK team to achieve significant growth despite the turbulent industry landscape; opening new offices across the globe, doubling in size and welcoming new global partners. His work spans across GPJ’s client portfolio, overseeing teams like Cisco, IBM, DP World, Booking.com, Workday, Envestnet, and Equinor. Jonathan continues to help GPJ evolve and push new approaches to creating environments and experiences in physical, as well as digital, spaces; informing and inspiring the solutions to positively influence the success of clients.

In this episode, Jonathan helps us explore the intricacies of B2B sales success, particularly how procurement strategies and relationship building influence winning business pitches. Jonathan shares his insights on the significance of procurement teams and the power of pre-existing connections in closing deals. We’ll also discuss the evolution of procurement technologies and their impact on client-agency dynamics.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why understanding client motivations and procurement objectives is vital in the pitch process.
• How a competitive spirit in sports parallels strategic business moves for commercial success.
• Why over 70% of business pitch victories are linked to pre-existing client relationships.
• More advantages of having prior engagement with clients in business pitches.
• Why nurturing procurement relationships is essential, even outside the standard RFP process.
• How quality quarterly business reviews and service level agreements impact client satisfaction.
• Why automated RFP processes can limit the development of client-agency relationships.
• How artificial intelligence might influence future procurement strategies and agency dynamics.
• Why focusing on pitch wins rather than losses can improve commercial success rates.
• How agency dynamics and client selection criteria contribute to successful business pitches.
• Why agencies should be selective in bid qualification to increase win percentages.
• How relationship-building with procurement teams can lead to contract extensions.
• Why understanding pricing and client perspectives is crucial for agencies in pitches.
• How AI may assist in providing insights, but cannot replace creativity or relationship-building.

Jonathan McCallum on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonathan-mccallum-8a76bb2/

Emma, the Chief Creative Officer at Edelman UK, joins us this week. With a diverse background that spans brand advertising, direct, and digital, Emma began her career as a PA before transitioning into a leading creative role. At Edelman, she is responsible for all of the creative output of the business.

In this episode, Emma explains all about creativity in business. We learn about the unique path her career has evolved on, and tackle the challenge of preserving creativity in corporate negotiations. We also explore how to value creative outcomes over time, involving creatives in financial decisions, and crafting success through creative financial innovation.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why flexibility is crucial in procurement processes to foster creativity.
• What differences Emma sees between buying an undefined creative process and a known creative product.
• Why Emma argues against the traditional model of billing by the hour for creative services.
• “Thin slicing” and its importance in rapid decision-making in creativity.
• More on why outcome-based engagement is more beneficial than time-based billing.
• How the “bed, bath, or bus” concept relates to creativity and billing.
• How involving creatives in financial discussions benefits the creative agency-client relationship.
• The consequences of separating creative teams from media and strategy teams.
• How Emma's role at Edelman demonstrates an integrated team approach to creativity in business.
• Why experience is crucial for quick and effective problem solving in creative industries.
• How Emma's background contributes to her understanding of the creative and commercial balance.
• The challenges of aligning the best creative solutions with agency profitability.
• How Emma's insights reflect on the adaptability of the creative process to financial constraints.

Emma de la Fosse on LinkedIn: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/emmadelafosse

Experience the future of sales and marketing with our latest guest, Trenton Moss, founder of Team Sterka. With his finger on the pulse of technology's impact on business, Trenton provides a unique perspective on how emotional intelligence and people skills can streamline decision-making and lead to business growth.

Drawing on his 15 years of experience running his own agency, Trenton and I examine the current state of the pitch process, the obstacles of procurement, and how his agency experienced a 35% growth through a client leadership program.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why involving everyone in the process of growing accounts in an agency setting is crucial.
• The inherent limitations of the traditional pitch process in the advertising industry.
• Why the skills required to win a pitch are different from those needed to deliver work.
• The challenges faced in procurement within the marketing and advertising world.
• How artificial intelligence can revolutionize the traditional RFP process.
• The predicted impact of technology, especially AI, on the sales and marketing process.
• How agencies can secure big brand clients without pitching by creating exclusive communities.
• Why authenticity and emotional intelligence are essential in client development within the B2B sales industry.
• The concept of "winning without pitching."
• How a unique selling point can help agencies win pitches.
• The importance of differentiating your agency at its core to stand out in a saturated market.
• Why client development programs are great for developing necessary skills.
• How technology is predicted to disrupt and change the agency world at a rapid pace.
• The role of bravery and authenticity in standing out in the B2B sales industry.
• How creating a unique proposition can lead to significant success for agencies.
• Developing client leadership skills to achieve agency success.
• The potential for a socialist structure in the agency world.

Trenton Moss on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/trentonmoss/

Avivah Wittenberg-Cox is CEO, writer, speaker, coach, consultant, change agent – depending on the call and the context. She is a global expert on 21st century leadership, gender and generational balance, longevity and the future of work and careers. She is a Harvard 2022 Advanced Leadership Fellow and is helping individuals and organisations manage the transitions and extensions of the 2nd and 3rd Quarters of 100-year lives. Themes summarised in her latest graphic book Thriving to 100 – Through Life’s 4 Quarters. She is an Ambassador for the Stanford Center on Longevity, and the Global Peter Drucker Forum, and sits on the Boards of the National Innovation Centre on Ageing (NICA) and the Chartered Management Institute’s ‘Everyone Economy’ Board. She is also an Adjunct Professor at DePaul University in Chicago. In 2023, Avivah was inducted into the Thinkers50 Hall of Fame.

As the CEO of 20-first, Avivah works with organisations focused on capturing the competitive advantages of the future of work and the impacts of changing demographic trends on talent and markets. Author of WHY Women Mean Business (Wiley), and 7 Steps to Leading a Gender-Balanced Business (HBR), she is also a regular contributor to Harvard Business Review and Forbes, as well as a sought-after speaker with three TEDx talks. Avivah was given a Lifetime Achievement Award for Gender Balanced Leadership by PWN Global, was named one of the world’s 40 Most Inspiring Women Over 40 and was recently featured in a Financial Times article on how women are changing the future of management.

In her own 1st and 2nd Quarters of life, Avivah grew up in Canada, attended the University of Toronto as a joint Computer Science/ Comparative Literature major, went to Paris for a year and stayed for 30, completing an MBA at INSEAD along the way. Avivah holds 3 passports (CDN, F, CH), lives in London with her sculptor/ magistrate husband and visits her two grown, gender-balanced children, a son and daughter based in Dakar and New York. She is tracking her own path through her 60s and all things longevity in a weekly newsletter called elderberries.

In this episode, Avivah takes us into the world of generational balancing. She explains the complex dynamics of demographic change, the unique attributes of people throughout different quarters of their lives, and the profound impact of longevity on businesses and economies. Avivah emphasizes the importance of breaking down stereotypes between employers and older workers along with confronting ageism. This episode highlights the significance of adapting to the Q3 generation's needs for businesses to thrive in today's dynamic landscape.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why it's important to understand demographic change.
• The Q3 generation and the impact of living longer lives on businesses and economies.
• The difference in negotiating strategies that differentiate Q2 from Q3 individuals.
• Why the demographic shift of the number of older individuals being on par with younger ones is significant.
• How the future of aging and the role of intergenerational engagement is evolving.
• Why preventive care is crucial in an aging world.
• How stereotypes and misconceptions between employers and older workers can be broken down.
• The potential role of AI in performance evaluation.
• How the world is designed for Q2 individuals and the need for this to change.
• The importance of gender and generational balance in businesses.
• The impact of an aging population on consumer buying decisions.
• Why the benefits of gender and generational balance can give businesses a competitive advantage.
• How life expectancy varies across different populations and countries.
• Why it's necessary for organizations to engage with the older workforce.
• The issue of ageism and how it can be addressed effectively.
• How AI can help potentially save us from ageism.
• The importance of individuals being adaptable and lifelong learners in an aging population.
• How Q3 individuals can prove their value to employers through demonstrating learnability, curiosity, growth mindset, and tech skills.

Avivah Wittenberg-Cox on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/avivahwittenbergcox/

We are joined today by Gerry Hill who is RVP EMEA, Strategy and Alliance at ConnectAndSell. His company’s cloud-based dialing technology enables B2B businesses to have more conversations with their intended targets than serial dialing. With extensive experience in risk assessment, cost analysis, and market entry strategies, Gerry brings a wealth of knowledge to sales professionals navigating challenging markets.

Gerry will take us on an exploration of innovative sales strategies, diving into mastering sales lead generation in tough markets, understanding private equity's role in business efficiency, and engaging senior prospects. He shares actionable insights on boosting sales productivity using agile teams and scientific approaches.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why mastering sales lead generation in challenging markets is required for boosting sales team effectiveness.
• The role of private equity in value creation and operational efficiency through operating partners.
• Proactive strategies for slower markets, focusing on aggressive closing techniques and system improvements.
• How to confidently engage with senior prospects and uncover opportunities to add substantial value.
• The evolving landscape of sales strategies, emphasizing outbound sales and agile methodologies.
• Benefits of small, specialized sales teams for productivity and morale.
• Transforming lead generation by moving clients from fear to curiosity within seconds during cold calls.
• Effective sales strategies emphasizing permission-based openers and confidence in outbound sales.
• Why the emergence of operating partners in private equity is essential for enhancing company performance.
• The necessity of balancing labor and valuing experienced talent in today's market.
• How trusted advisors and value articulation become vital in down markets.
• Importance of selling underlying technology rather than just products in the SaaS industry.
• The role of executive buy-in and structured sprints in applying agile frameworks to sales.
• How nurturing relationships over time is critical for long-term demand creation in outbound sales.

Gerry Hill on LinkedIn: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/beaccurate

Today we’re welcoming Kevin Gibbons, the founder of Re:signal, a strategy-driven SEO and content marketing agency in London. His company works with clients such as Asics and Under Armour, and has just recently launched its US operations.

Kevin shares his journey from being a reluctant salesperson to an overwhelmingly successful entrepreneur and offers insights on his agency's growth. We’ll explore the nuances of maximizing sales win rates, the art of negotiation, and the significance of empathy in the sales process. Kevin gives an inside look at selling SEO services, revealing the importance of understanding the objectives of the client.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How to maximize sales win rates in the B2B industry.
• Why the power of empathy is critical in securing larger clients.
• Pre-qualifying opportunities to increase win rates.
• Why understanding the brief and objectives is crucial in pricing and selling SEO services.
• How to offer flexible pricing options based on the value delivered.
• Why understanding procurement and effective negotiation is essential.
• How to revive large deals using effective negotiation tactics.
• Why preparing in advance for negotiations is so important.
• How to avoid quickly discounting prices without any exchange.
• The usefulness of having procurement experience in negotiations.
• How to reach a mutually beneficial agreement by looking at things from the clients’ side of the table.
• Why pre-qualification is an essential tool in maximizing sales win rates.
• How to use a discovery template to build out a sales capability.
• How to trade, rather than discount, during negotiations.
• Why procurement should view investments with a return rather than focusing on cost reduction.

Kevin Gibbons on LinkedIn: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/kevingibbons

Kris Tait is the Managing Director, US at Croud. He's spent the last 12 years building his career in sales with the company, and has seen it grow from 5 to 500 employees in that time. His journey from a shy child to a sales expert even includes a unique stint with Butlers in the Buff. He credits an open mindset and strategic storytelling as keys to his success.

We’ll hear from Kris about how he became the sales professional he is today, discussing the power that his open mindset brings to procurement and negotiations. Kris also shares insights on the importance of having a collective mindset in business growth, why strategic storytelling is useful, and the art of building relationships before a negotiation even begins. We wrap up with a discussion on the evolution of procurement outcomes.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• What Kris’ childhood looked like due to his shyness at the time.
• Why Kris believes an open mindset is crucial in procurement and negotiations.
• How to predict and qualify opportunities from both casual client briefs and official RFPs.
• Why pricing strategy is the secret sauce to Croud's discovery process.
• How calculated risks and strategic storytelling can set an agency apart from the competition.
• Understanding the evolution of outcomes being a key aspect of procurement.
• The importance of building relationships before a negotiation begins to increase receptiveness.
• What it was like being a Butler in the Buff.
• Why diagnosis matters when tackling briefs in sales and negotiation.
• The role of collective mindset in scaling Croud from 5 to 500 people.
• How Kris's sales journey has been influenced by the mindset of Croud's founders.
• The benefits of strategic pricing, and who Kris learned about this method from.
• How to approach procurement with an open mindset to ensure successful negotiations.
• The importance of providing evidence in negotiations and being open to challenges.
• Dealing with price increases by leading with data and logic.

Kris Tait on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kristophertait

Gareth Turner is the former Head of Marketing at Weetabix, where he oversaw the long-term brand strategy for the nation’s favourite cereal. He has over 23 years’ experience working within food and drink and has also had the pleasure of leading the marketing for household name brands like John Smith’s, Bulmers, Lurpak, and Arla in local and global roles.

Career highlights (so far) include buying a racehorse for John Smith’s, new product launches like Bulmers fruit ciders and the partnership between the FA senior men’s and women’s teams and Weetabix. In 2021 Gareth’s team unleashed the multi award winning “Beanz on Bix” on the world and broke the internet in the process.

Since leaving Weetabix, Gareth has worked with household name brand teams like Coop, Birdseye (Nomad Foods) and Kingsmill (Allied Bakeries) to mentor their marketing leaders. He has also worked with scale-up, challenger brands like Mighty Drinks and Spoon Cereals to bring structure to and improve their marketing, and is a Non-Executive Director for Route, a media agency based in Newcastle.

Gareth is a regular guest on podcasts both video and audio, and has spoken at numerous events including MAD//Fest, Prolific North and the Marketing Meetup as both a keynote speaker and panel guest. He is also a regular contributor to marketing titles including Marketing Week.

Today, Gareth will explain the intricacies of the Fast-Moving Consumer Goods (FMCG) industry, including agency pitches, their emotional impact, and the importance of chemistry. We also explore the critical role procurement plays in securing new agencies. Later, we venture into maintaining agency relationships while highlighting the importance of broader business challenges and two-way conversations.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How Gareth navigated his career in the FMCG industry.
• Experience with brands like Heineken, Arla Foods, and Weetabix.
• Why a realistic brief is important in agency pitches, and the emotional impact it has on agencies and clients.
• How LinkedIn can be used to gather valuable information about clients.
• The significance of understanding various business pressures.
• Securing new agencies while making the process robust and defensible.
• Why reaching a mutual understanding and having two-way conversations maintain agency relationships.
• How to utilize different resources to aid clients.
• Considering the broader challenges that may be affecting the business.
• The story behind the controversial Beanz on Bix tweet and the public reaction to it.
• Why agency pitches can be draining for both agencies and clients, and how to avoid this.
• How Gareth managed to save money without having to run a pitch, and the strategies he used.
• Getting the best deal from a supplier, within reason.
• Researching clients on LinkedIn and understanding their backgrounds for better agency pitches.
• How Gareth made a strategic investment in hiring the right people to influence the success of his project.
• Why chemistry is an essential ingredient in building successful client relationships in the FMCG industry.

Gareth Turner on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/garethaturner/

Email: gareth@bigblackdoor.com

Big Black Door: https://www.bigblackdoor.com

Tim Ringel is a seasoned entrepreneur who has a history of building successful marketing agencies. His path from a performance marketing agency to running a stock market-listed company has transformed his approach to scaling. Tim is also currently leading his new venture, Meet The People, which is based in New York City.

We’ll discuss Tim’s unique career trajectory, the power of creativity in marketing, and his strategies for business success amidst the pandemic. We also explore the potential of a customer-centric approach in agency business models and the impact of AI on marketing agencies.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How Tim started his entrepreneurial journey in a performance marketing agency.
• Why Tim moved to a creative agency and his experiences with larger holding companies.
• How Tim tripled the size of his business in three years.
• Incentivizing teams and creating a virtual P&L to ensure the success of clients.
• The ways that Tim's journey shaped his views on media and creativity.
• Why Tim appreciates the power of creative storytelling and how it can be used to captivate audiences.
• Strategies that Tim used to keep his business alive during the pandemic.
• Why Tim believes collaboration can be incentivized for business success.
• How to build trust in order to win pitches.
• The importance of authenticity and creativity in the industry.
• Why Tim believes a customer-centric approach is beneficial in agency business models.
• How AI's impact on marketing agencies can help entrepreneurs.
• Keeping client success at the heart of all operations.
• How Tim transitioned from a performance marketing agency to a creative agency, and the resulting shift in his perception of media and creativity.

Tim Ringel on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tim-ringel

Anant Sharma is the CEO and founder of design consultancy Matter of Form. Most of Matter of Form’s work starts with brand, so the company usually works with large organizations in retail, hospitality, and luxury. They help these organizations to revisit their founding spirit and bring it to the current world that they operate in.

Anant discusses the art of understanding the motivations that fuel negotiations, the value of trust, and the challenges of selling big ideas to top executives. Additionally, we’ll hear about the importance of consultancy in business problem solving, along with the balance between branding and user experience.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why understanding the motivation of the other party is crucial in negotiations.
• How Matter of Form has evolved into a brand-led consultancy.
• Why it's important to think beyond the project scope in business growth.
• How trust plays an indispensable role in negotiations.
• The challenges of selling big ideas to CEOs and CMOs.
• How to differentiate yourself from competitors and deliver a compelling message.
• Why consultancy plays a crucial role in solving business problems.
• How an outside-in perspective can provide incredibly valuable insights.
• Why you don't always need to be the smartest person in the room.
• How the Benjamin Franklin effect can shape a memorable brand experience.
• The delicate balance between branding and user experience design.
• How creating the right tension can give customers a sense of ownership and victory.
• Why understanding motivation is more effective than responding to demands.
• More on the importance of tension and friction in customer experience.
• How to unveil the true value of offerings in negotiations.
• Why crafting joyful experiences through brand-led consultancy is essential.
• Using transformational negotiation techniques to scale a business.

Anant Sharma on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/anantisms/

Lucas was most recently Group Marketing Director at Cazoo, a used car start-up founded in early 2019 with a mission to transform the way people buy used cars. From national launch in early 2020, Cazoo has now sold over 120,000 cars, has over £1.2bn in annual revenues and over 80% awareness in the UK. He spent the first 15 years of his Marketing career on major FMCG brands such as Old El Paso, Haagen-Dazs, Heineken and Pepsi. The last eight years have been spent in marketing leadership roles at MoneySuperMarket, Aviva and Cazoo.

We’ll hear about the secrets behind assembling a competent team, the importance of empathy and transparency in business negotiations, and the practical aspects of building a digital business. Lucas also shares the negotiation tactics that he has acquired throughout his career.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How Lucas was able to massively grow Cazoo in such a short time span.
• Why assembling a team of internal and agency experts with empathy and a customer-centric mindset is particularly crucial in a digital business.
• How Lucas maintained transparency while negotiating commercial structures.
• The reason why and when sector expertise isn't necessary and can be a hindrence.
• How crafting contracts based on transparency laid a strong foundation for agency relationships.
• How to balance working and non-working expenditure while scaling a business.
• Maintaining an open and transparent relationship with agencies.
• How Lucas extracted maximum commercial value from media deals with negotiation tactics.
• How he used an alternative approach to agency selection, saving time and energy.
• How he ensured transparency in media costs and aligned agency incentives.
• Why having an entrepreneurial spirit helped Cazoo obtain maximum value from its spending.
• How he used open and transparent relationships to negotiate creative media deals.
• Why keeping agencies as close to the business as possible is necessary for growth.

Lucas Bergmans on LinkedIn: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/lucasbergmans-cmo

On this episode we’re joined by corporate finance advisor Andrew Jeffs. He helps founders effectively approach the process of negotiations and deals when they’re ready to sell their business. Andrew finds his work lively because every client is different, every negotiation is different, and every deal is different.

Today, Andrew shares the secrets to successful negotiations, how to stay cool and calm when the tone of the deal goes sideways, and how to identify your strengths no matter which side of the deal you’re on.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Andrew’s professional background and the clients he works with.
• What it takes to be a great negotiator.
• Why stepping back is sometimes necessary to achieve the best outcome.
• The importance of building rapport during the negotiation process.
• The secret to forming a successful negotiation mindset and what it looks like.
• Andrew’s tips for maintaining a calm state—even when the other side has not.
• What to do when the tone of a negotiation goes sideways.
• A unique experience Andrew had during a deal a few years ago.
• The importance of recognizing negotiations involving multiple decision makers.
• Why you should never bluff during negotiations.
• The benefits of being the smaller, more agile party in deal making.
• How to approach creating alternatives while structuring a deal.
• A strategy for changing the mindset around a deal and why it works.
• Why Andrew says we have two ears and one mouth for a reason.
• The intersections between deal structure and relationship structure.
• The specific situations in which it’s okay as an advisor to be the “bad guy.”

Andrew Jeffs on LinkedIn: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/andrew-jeffs-50610619

On this episode we’re joined by John Cornwell, who is the Chief Commercial Officer at Ogilvy Worldwide. John has been with Ogilvy for a number of years in various roles, but his current one focuses on their commercial strategy, including their pricing strategies, positioning, and training and development.

John talks about his experience with, and tips for, negotiating successfully. In negotiations, John emphasizes the importance of authenticity and credibility. This, along with understanding the interests (versus demands) of both parties, supports coming to an outcome both parties can be happy with.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• A primary passion of John’s and how he became interested in it.
• The two ways emotions show up during negotiations and why it matters.
• How identifying emotion as a tactic can help you negotiate better.
• The difference between demands and interests and which is more important.
• A strange experience of escalating emotion John had and what he learned from it.
• The importance of staying emotionally detached from the outcome during negotiations.
• Why preparation is the most important stage of negotiation.
• Signs you’ve likely won or lost a negotiation before it’s even begun.
• How agencies typically approach negotiations versus a more effective way.
• Why simply offering a discount is not the same as a negotiation.
• The power of language during negotiations and words you should avoid.
• Why investing in training and mentoring for commercial leaders is vital.
• The training program they developed during and since the pandemic.
• How agency leaders can approach shared challenges more effectively.
• Why some people will naturally be better negotiators than others.

John Cornwell on LinkedIn: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/john-cornwell-17684822

Today we’re joined by David Meikle, an author, consultant, intermediary, and trainer. He operates within what he calls the “triangle of doom” in marketing where he acts as an intermediary.

David emphasizes that cost plays too great a role in the marketing space. What the client actually gets is not a return on cost, but rather a return on their investment. David shares with us a better way of approaching this conversation with clients and why it leads to a more effective partnership on both sides.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• The various hats David wears and the space in which he operates.
• The thesis that evolved into a book in 2017, as well as his latest book Tuning Up.
• Why he describes himself as a “white glove intermediary” and what it means.
• Why focusing on cost in marketing does a great disservice to the industry.
• Why you can’t get a higher return without accepting a higher degree of risk.
• How to confidently determine the correct investment when working with a client.
• The difference between working versus non-working expenditures.
• The word that should be banned across marketing agencies.
• How to avoid negotiating against yourself and why it matters.
• What the Kraljic matrix is and how it relates to selling your services.
• The role intermediaries typically play in the pitch process and how it could be better.
• The secrets to choosing the right marketing agency for your business with confidence.
• How David has solved for the problem of selling time as a consultant or agency.
• The importance of going above the benchmark if your services are above average.

David Meikle on LinkedIn: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/david-meikle-6194405

Today we’re joined by Chris Jones, the CEO of Space & Time, which is an independent agency focused on solution-agnostic and client-led growth marketing. Their unique operating model allows them to combine efforts from different areas and provide the most effective solutions for their clients.

Chris believes in focusing on output versus input, because what matters in their industry the most is the end result. An increasing number of clients are adopting a value-based pricing model which aligns interests of all parties.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• What makes Space & Time stand out as unconventional in the media space.
• What Chris says they are laser-focused on and why they avoid certain labels.
• Why he describes himself as a “serial learner.”
• The shift towards a value-based pricing model and the challenges it brings.
• How the right value-based pricing ratio is achieved.
• The inputs that they maximize and minimize when creating solutions for clients.
• Why putting an hourly rate on an outcome doesn’t make sense.
• The importance of empathy.
• High-level examples of what value-based relationships can look like.
• The multi-faceted ways they qualify clients at Space & Time.
• How burning the candle at both ends can impact results.
• How the idea of a successful pipeline has shifted over time.
• Their people-first approach to business and the importance of relationship building.
• What the most powerful partnerships hinge upon and why it matters.
• The sectors Space & Time thrives in and where you can find more information.

Space & Time: https://spaceandtime.co.uk/

J Francisco Escobar, who is President & Founder of JFE International Consultants, as well as COO of Lake House Partners, joins us today. He is a seasoned marketing professional who transitioned from finance to marketing during his time at Texas Instruments. His unique journey and extensive experience in managing budgets and procurement have made him an expert in balancing creativity with fiscal responsibility.

In this episode, we’ll explore the balance between creativity and budget constraints in marketing. We hear about his change from finance to marketing and the difficult decisions that need to be made when selecting agency partners. Francisco also brings valuable insights into the impact of AI on marketing and agency models.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• How J Francisco Escobar's finance background influenced his approach to marketing and procurement at Texas Instruments.
• How maintaining advertising and travel budgets during tough times can capitalize on market opportunities.
• Strategies for managing budgets and procurement within marketing communications.
• How J Francisco's diplomatic upbringing and teaching influences shaped his career.
• Why procurement plays a critical role in marketing and travel.
• Insights on choosing agency partners and the role of search consultancies.
• The pitfalls of search consultancies shifting focus to cost consulting.
• Practical tips for ensuring a fair and efficient agency selection process.
• The importance of genuine enthusiasm and thoroughness in agency presentations.
• How AI is disrupting traditional agency compensation models.
• Explanation of the four basic pricing models in procurement.
• How AI introduces tech fees as a new dimension in monetization strategies.
• The impact of AI on agency models and the potential for value-based pricing.
• Benefits of agencies adopting AI to stay relevant and attractive to talent.
• How agencies can leverage AI to blur lines between different marketing services.
• Why client-side experience is valuable for agency professionals.

J Francisco Escobar on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jfeintl

Today we’re joined by Katy Howell, the founder of Immediate Future, which is a successful social media agency. She also has an intriguing background in science, having studied genetics and plant sciences. Katy transitioned from science to marketing, bringing an analytical perspective to her work.

We’ll discuss her journey from science to social media success, the critical role of empathy in understanding buyers, and practical strategies for effective networking. Katy also shares tips on how you can stand out in the crowded B2B market through passion, expertise, and authentic connections.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Katy Howell's transition from science to founding a social media agency.
• Why adopting an empathetic approach is crucial in today's climate of personal challenges and burnout.
• How a more empathetic approach aids in understanding the psychographics of buyers.
• The importance of having an ideal customer profile (ICP) for effective communication.
• How genuine curiosity and meaningful conversations build lasting professional relationships.
• Katy's personal experience of being sober for 19 months and its impact on networking.
• Why engaging others with interest and embracing uniqueness enhances networking efforts.
• Practical advice for early-career professionals on participating in industry events.
• The value of attending events, joining communities, and prioritizing face-to-face interactions.
• Why maintaining and nurturing connections through follow-ups and personalized communication is essential.
• How leveraging expertise and demonstrating a unique personality differentiate agencies in a crowded market.
• Why it’s a good idea to involve the entire team in social media efforts.
• The importance of understanding the professional and personal drivers for buyer decisions.
• Katy's strategy of using knowledge sharing as a means to build trust.
• The role of thought leadership in building trust and influencing purchase decisions.
• The importance of personality and expertise in agency differentiation.

Katy Howell on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/katyhowell/

Craig Letton is the CEO of Hyble, a world-class marketing technology company that serves the alcohol industry. With over 11 years of experience in this role, Craig has a proven track record of scaling the business, expanding into new markets, and delivering innovative solutions for global clients. Craig's core competencies include new business development, strategy, marketing management, and negotiation.

He has transformed Hyble from a family business into a software provider that is used by leading drinks brands and distributors in over 50 countries, such as Bacardi, Carlsberg, Campari, and Diageo. Under his leadership, Hyble has grown revenue 10X since 2017 and secured backing from the UK's most-active growth funding investor, BGF. Craig has recently re-located with his family from Scotland to Boston to build his business in the USA.

Hyble is a marketing technology company focused on disrupting the global alcohol marketing industry. Their marketing technology platform delivers high-quality, customizable, compliant printed and digital marketing materials ordered on-demand for clients.

In this episode, Craig guides us through the art of building trust and mastering enterprise sales. He shares his incredible journey from transforming his family’s digital print business into a global technology powerhouse. We discuss the critical elements of winning major B2B deals, the importance of emotional intelligence, and effective sales strategies like the Challenger sales approach. Craig also demonstrates how experience, innovation, and a relentless drive can help you win major RFPs and convince large corporations to embrace new technologies.

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Why building trust in B2B relationships is always needed for long-term success.
• How personal vulnerabilities can foster mutual trust in business relationships.
• The importance of strategic pivots and innovation for business growth.
• The role of experience, innovation, and perseverance in winning major RFPs.
• Why emotional intelligence and empathy are key to successful sales negotiations.
• The effectiveness of the Challenger sales approach in engaging clients.
• How nurturing a few key relationships can lead to long-term, reliable partnerships.
• The significance of understanding a client’s core drivers and aligning solutions accordingly.
• Why a collaborative approach to problem solving strengthens business relationships.
• How preparation and rehearsing to perfection are essential for successful enterprise selling.
• The value of listening and high emotional intelligence in B2B sales conversations.
• How making emotional connections first and backing them with logic can close deals.
• The versatility of sales skills across various business aspects, including investor negotiations.
• The role of thorough research in aligning solutions with a client's culture and values.
• How focusing on unique solutions and unwavering commitment drives business vision.

Craig Letton on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/craigletton

Jeremy Smith, the Managing Director at 4C Associates, joins us in this episode. 4C Associates is a 120+ person European focused Commercial, Procurement and Supply Chain consultancy delivering sustainable impact in Retail & Consumer, Life Sciences, Public Sector and Financial Services. He has been with 4C for about 13 years, and has amassed another 10 years of procurement consultancy before this tenure.

Backed by Jeremy’s decades of expertise, we explore effective methods for standing out in competitive markets, the importance of low-maintenance introductions, and the value of referrals. He explains exactly what procurement professionals look for when evaluating suppliers in RFP processes. Jeremy also provides insights into navigating procurement-led processes, the challenges of reverse auctions, and how to maintain engagement during periods of silence. 

Topics covered during this episode include:

• Jeremy’s personal journey from a quantity surveyor to procurement expert.
• How procurement professionals evaluate suppliers in RFP processes.
• Balancing organizational knowledge with the risk of becoming complacent.
• Why communication is vital during procurement processes, especially when experiencing delays.
• How to maintain engagement and pressure after a two-week period of silence from potential clients.
• The importance of being selective and realistic with the three-question framework for qualifying opportunities.
• How suppliers should engage with procurement departments when selling marketing services.
• Why early, low-maintenance introductions and referrals are better than spammy outreach.
• Challenges of reverse auctions and how to avoid commoditization in procurement processes.
• How suppliers can differentiate their services early to avoid being commoditized.
• Usefulness of the Kraljic matrix in strategically positioning your company.
• Practical advice for smaller companies bidding for larger contracts.
• The significance of building relationships with procurement professionals while maintaining humility.

Jeremy Smith on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeremysmith27