Explorez tous les épisodes du podcast FRIED. The Burnout Podcast

There's a story from the 1840s that is going to make you furious. And then it's going to make you look at burnout solutions very differently.

Stress spreads like a nasty bug. We have the data. We know what interventions work. We have the results. And we are still not doing what needs to be done.

Let's talk about why.

Want to bring this work into your organization?

Book Cait for a keynote, workshop, or training at caitdonovan.com

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Burnout does not start with overwork. It starts with miscommunication. Robyn Hatcher, keynote speaker and former soap opera writer for All My Children and One Life to Live, joins Cait to break down why every company has a show bible and what happens when the cast stops reading from the same one. This is an episode about the drama no one is writing on purpose and the silence that is writing it for them.

• The show bible as an organizational framework for understanding culture, values, and expectations
• How workplace drama is written by silence, assumptions, and miscommunication rather than malice
• The difference between breakdown writers (leadership) and script writers (employees) and why they need to work in tandem
• Why psychological safety alone cannot fix communication breakdowns rooted in personal history
• Robyn's LUVE framework for navigating hard conversations without sounding aggressive
• The evil twin phenomenon: how burnout and overwhelm change how we show up and communicate
• What it means to be your own editor at work and when to ask for direction
• Why hinting is not the same as speaking up, and how gossip becomes the substitute for direct communication

Former soap opera writer and keynote speaker Robyn Hatcher joins Cait on FRIED to talk about something most companies do not realize they have: a show bible. Every organization runs on a script, complete with characters, scenes, and unspoken rules about how the show is supposed to go. When leadership rewrites the show bible without telling anyone, chaos follows. When employees play background characters instead of owning their roles, drama fills the silence.

Robyn and Cait dig into the mechanics of workplace communication, why silence creates drama faster than conflict does, and how most people mistake hinting for speaking up. Robyn shares her LUVE framework for having hard conversations without coming across as aggressive, and they get into the evil twin phenomenon: what happens to our communication when we are burned out, overwhelmed, or operating from unexamined triggers.

Whether you lead a team or work within one, this episode gives you a new lens for understanding the drama around you and your own part in writing it. No tips list. No five signs. Just a real conversation about what is actually going on.

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED. The Burnout Podcast. She helps organizations uncover the mismatches that drive burnout, before they cost them their people.

Through keynotes, workshops, and leadership programs, Cait teaches leaders and teams how to use burnout as data instead of treating it as a personal weakness. Blending research, biology, and practical tools, she helps organizations build cultures where people can perform at a high level without burning out in the process.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Burnout searches just hit 24.8 million per month, and searches for burnout recovery grew 1,000 percent year over year (for those not great at math, that's 10x more searches for burnout recovery this year as compared to last year). Cait digs into a recent Inc. magazine article by Lucia Auerbach to unpack what those numbers really mean and why the conversation is far from over. Spoiler: Gen Z is not the problem, and the fix is not a wellness app.

•      The Inc. magazine data: 24.8 million monthly burnout searches and what 1,000% growth in burnout recovery searches tells us

•      Gen Z's 'It's PR, not the ER' mentality and the economic logic behind it

•      Why the real crisis isn't work-life balance, it's the loss of meaningful work

•      Simon Sinek's 'why' and what happens when companies forget theirs

•      Career breaks, sabbaticals, and why Boeing's return-to-work program matters

•      What leaders actually need to do now as this generation fills the workforce

•      Why FRIED is the largest burnout recovery resource in the world and why you should share this episode

Burnout isn't going away. Online mentions jumped 65% and burnout recovery searches grew 1,000% year over year, hitting nearly 25 million monthly searches. In this solo episode, Cait Donovan breaks down a viral Inc. magazine article on Gen Z's evolving relationship with work and what it means for leaders trying to build cultures people actually want to stay in. From the 'it's PR not the ER' mentality spreading through workplaces to the normalization of career breaks and sabbaticals, this episode covers what's really driving disengagement and what organizations need to prioritize to get ahead of it. If you're a leader wondering why your people seem checked out, this one is required listening. FRIED: The Burnout Podcast is the largest burnout recovery resource in the world. Subscribe, review, and share with someone who needs it.

EPISODE SUMMARY

Cait Donovan has spent the last seven years building one of the most rigorous, nuanced frameworks for understanding burnout in the world. In episode 350, she finally tells the full story of how she got there -- and it turns out it started long before she knew burnout was a thing. From a failed organic chemistry test at Boston University to an acupuncture practice in Poland with a six-month waitlist, from a 2016 article that named everything to years of peer-reviewed research and a second graduate degree, this episode is the origin story FRIED has been building toward.

KEY TOPICS COVERED

•      How Cait went from pre-med dropout to Chinese medicine practitioner

•      Running a top-earning solo practice in Poland while burning out without knowing it

•      The moment in 2016 when she read her first burnout article and felt shame instead of relief

•      Why the WHO definition of burnout puts too much responsibility on the workplace

•      What people who don't burn out do differently when things go sideways

•      How childhood patterns drive hyperindependence, perfectionism, and people-pleasing

•      Why burnout repeats across jobs when the real drivers go unaddressed

•      The role of match and mismatch in chronic stress

•      What Cait's current work with companies and leadership teams actually looks like

SEO DESCRIPTION

Episode 350 of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast is Cait Donovan's origin story -- and it's not the one most people expect. She traces the winding path from pre-med student at Boston University to licensed acupuncturist in Poland, where she built a thriving practice and slowly burned out without recognizing it. It wasn't until 2016, reading an article on burnout for the first time and ticking off every single symptom, that she had a name for what had been happening for years. The first emotion she felt was shame. That shame became the fuel for everything that followed: years of peer-reviewed research, a second graduate degree in biobehavioral health, thousands of conversations with people who had burned out, and a framework that refuses to assign blame to any single source. Burnout, Cait argues, comes from a web of mismatches -- between who you are and where you are, between what you need and what your environment provides. This episode is essential listening for anyone who has ever burned out and wondered why, and for the leaders building cultures where that question comes up less.

Watch this episode on Youtube: https://youtu.be/UffD0Ec0SX4

Cait Donovan, host of FRIED. The Burnout Podcast breaks down a 2018 peer-reviewed study on toxic workplaces and what it actually proves about the relationship between organizational dysfunction and burnout — and she has opinions. If you've been told to breathe through it, journal harder, or just be more resilient, this episode is here to tell you that the research says otherwise. This one's short, sharp, and direct.

Key Topics Covered

The study: An Empirical Study Analyzing Job Productivity in Toxic Workplace Environments* (Journal of Environmental and Public Health, 2018) what it found and why it matters

The four markers of a toxic workplace: ostracism, incivility, harassment, and bullying and how any one of them (not just the extreme cases) qualifies

Burnout as the mediator: Toxicity doesn't kill productivity directly it creates burnout first, and burnout kills productivity. This changes everything about how to fix it.

For leaders: Your highest performer might not be your highest performer if their behavior is corroding the culture around them, the net impact is negative. You have to act.

For employees: Stress reduction, mindfulness, and inner work are valuable but they are not enough to protect you from a genuinely toxic environment. You are not the problem. The system is.

When to leave: Cait's firm position: the only circumstance under which she recommends leaving a job quickly is when the workplace itself is the source of the toxicity

The data on staying: 80% of Cait's clients over 6-7 years stay in their jobs and recover from burnout. But not when the environment is the cause.

Lateral moves: Sometimes the fix isn't quitting it's moving to a different team, department, or manager within the same company

1 in 10 stat: An estimated 1 in 10 employees feel their workplace is toxic and that number likely underestimates small pockets of toxicity embedded in otherwise functional organizations

Not all burnout is the same — and the way you recover from it depends entirely on what's causing it. In this solo episode of FRIED, host Cait Donovan walks through a 2018 peer-reviewed study on toxic workplaces and makes the case that if your environment includes bullying, harassment, ostracism, or incivility, no amount of self-care is going to fix your burnout. The research is clear: toxicity causes burnout, burnout causes productivity loss — and the only real fix is removing the source of toxicity. For leaders, that means protecting the culture, even when it means letting go of a high performer who's corroding everything around them. For employees, it means recognizing when the problem isn't internal — and giving yourself permission to leave. Cait brings her own client data (80% of her clients stay in their jobs through burnout recovery — but that number drops sharply when the workplace is actually toxic) and unpacks the difference between burnout you can work through and a situation that is genuinely making you ill.

Keywords: toxic workplace, burnout recovery, burnout and productivity, toxic work environment, psychological safety, workplace culture, burnout signs, employee wellbeing, leadership accountability, when to quit your job, burnout research*

Your workplace might not be toxic. It might just be missing the biology lesson that explains why everyone keeps behaving badly.

Work burnout is rarely one person's failure, and this conversation makes that case clearly. Occupational psychologist and Truth, Lies, and Work co-host Leanne Elliott joins Cait to untangle what actually makes a toxic work environment, and what we keep getting wrong when we try to fix it. Before culture initiatives and values workshops, there are psychosocial risk factors: the concrete, measurable conditions that quietly drive stress and erode workplace culture and wellbeing. Cait pushes back from the body, pointing out that biology can make a bonded team reject a new hire without anyone realizing it, and that childhood trauma can permanently rewire how someone reads neutral feedback. Leanne doesn't argue. She acknowledges the limits of what organizational psychology can change and makes the case for cross-disciplinary collaboration as the only honest path forward.

One of the more useful reframes here is the difference between a toxic work environment and a bad fit. Real toxicity is behavioral. Workplace incivility rarely looks like explosive conflict. It looks like withheld information and subtle undermining that compounds quietly until mental health and psychological safety have eroded completely. Frequency is what turns friction into toxicity, and self awareness is what makes it possible to catch before it spreads.

The conversation gets pointed on manager training and workplace burnout. Managers have the single largest documented impact on employee health and performance, receive almost no formal training, and remain the first target when things go wrong. Work burnout and employee behavior are treated as individual failures rather than systemic ones, and that framing lets organizations off the hook. The future of work depends on whether organizations are willing to teach pro-social skills to everyone from day one, not just the people who end up with direct reports. That's not a small idea. It just hasn't been treated like one.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Introduction: Building a Top Global Business Podcast

06:02 The Role of Occupational Psychology in Workplace Wellbeing

11:52 Psychosocial Risk Factors and Organizational Culture

17:59 Toxic Work Environment or Bad Fit? How to Tell the Difference

24:07 What Workplace Incivility Actually Looks Like

36:48 Manager Training, Burnout, and Who Carries the Burden

45:00 Self-Awareness at Work and the Power of Feedback

Connect with Leanne Elliott: 

https://oblonghq.com/

https://truthliesandwork.com/

https://www.instagram.com/truthlieswork/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/meetleanne/

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mismatch, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

If you're a leader who's exhausted, this one's for you. Cait Donovan, host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast has spent over a decade coaching leaders through burnout — and the pattern is clear: expectations have skyrocketed, but support hasn't followed. In this episode, she draws on real stories, her upcoming book *The Match Move*, and 10+ years of field research to break down exactly what belongs on a leader's plate and what doesn't.

Key Topics Covered

- Why leaders are burning out at unprecedented rates and why it's not their fault

- The growing gap between what leaders are expected to be and what they're actually supported to do

- Why burnout and stress are biologically contagious and what it means when leaders hit their limit

- A real story about a manager who said "no" and changed an employee's entire understanding of leadership

- The four things leaders ARE genuinely responsible for: workload, clarity, resources, and culture

- The things leaders are NOT responsible for: being a therapist, life coach, nutritionist, or sleep consultant

- The "match/mismatch" framework from the upcoming book *The Match Move*

- Why working on your own alignment isn't selfish, it's true leadership

If you're in a leadership role and you're running on empty, this episode is your permission to stop carrying what was never yours to carry. Host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast has worked with over 60 companies — Fortune 500s, nonprofits, startups — and coached hundreds of leaders and teams through burnout. In almost 350 episodes, one pattern has emerged above all others: we are asking leaders to do the impossible, and then wondering why they're breaking.

In this episode, she maps out the dangerous gap between rising leadership expectations and stagnant organizational support — and explains why that gap is the single biggest driver of leader burnout today. You'll learn exactly which responsibilities belong to leaders and which don't, hear a powerful real-world story about a manager who modeled healthy boundaries, and be introduced to the "match/mismatch" framework from her upcoming book, *The Match Move*.

Whether you're a senior executive or a first-time manager, this episode will change how you think about leadership, capacity, and burnout culture.

If you could use this type of support for your leaders, book a call with Cait today:

https://caitdonovan.as.me/inquiry

Cait is available for keynotes, leadership retreats, offsites, nonprofit conferences, workshops, ongoing advisory work and more.

Workplace burnout makes a lot more sense when you stop blaming generations for the survival strategies they were trained to carry.

Kristin Scroggin, founder of genWHY Communications and a leading voice on generational communication in the workplace, joins Cait for a candid conversation about workplace burnout, generational conflict, and what happens when the career you worked so hard to build starts taking more than it gives back.

This conversation gets to the uncomfortable heart of burnout at work: success can look impressive from the outside and still feel impossible to sustain from the inside. Kristin’s story shows how resentment, exhaustion, decision fatigue, and disconnection can become burnout symptoms long before someone is willing to name what is happening. What changes when resentment becomes information instead of shame? What becomes possible when you stop treating capacity like a personal failure?

Cait and Kristin also look at workplace burnout through the larger forces shaping today’s teams. Generational conflict, employee burnout, leadership burnout, and workplace culture are all tied to the same bigger question: are we building work systems that people can actually survive?

With Kristin’s humor and research as the guide, this episode challenges leaders to think differently about Gen X burnout, millennial managers, Gen Z in the workplace, and the future of work. The real leadership reset starts when organizations stop asking why people are disengaged and start paying attention to what their behavior is trying to tell them.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Generational Conflict in the Workplace

03:05 Burned Out at Work: Kristin’s Breaking Point

06:04 The Burnout and Resentment Journal

11:51 When Success Turns Into Burnout

21:07 Why Different Generations Clash at Work

32:24 Leadership Burnout and People Manager Burnout

40:06 The Leadership Pipeline Crisis Ahead

Connect with Kristin Scroggin:

http://www.genwhy.com

http://www.instagram.com/genwhycommunications

http://www.linkedin.com/kristinscroggin

https://share.google/zdHigxST7Ltqwrc4Z

Connect with Cait:

https://caitdonovan.com/resentment-journal 

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mismatch, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Autonomy can be the silent mismatch that drains a team long before anyone names burnout.

Leadership and autonomy are often treated as simple: give people more freedom and they will do better work. Cait Donovan offers a more useful frame. Autonomy works when it matches the person, the role, and the responsibility in front of them. When there is an autonomy mismatch at work, the result can look like poor performance, low employee engagement, or workplace stress that has gone unnamed for too long.

This episode looks at autonomy and burnout through three practical lenses: time autonomy in the workplace, decision-making autonomy in leadership, and process autonomy at work. Does someone need more control over their schedule? Are they ready to make bigger decisions and carry the accountability that comes with them? Do they need clearer systems, or do rigid processes make their work harder?

Cait makes the case that employee autonomy needs are not the same from person to person. For leaders, the work is to notice the difference before autonomy and workplace stress start to affect trust, energy, and team performance. What would change if leaders treated autonomy as a matching conversation instead of a perk?

Episode Breakdown:

03:12 Types of Autonomy: Time, Decision-Making, and Process

05:55 The Importance of Matching Autonomy Needs

09:11 Reducing Friction and Chronic Stress in Workplaces

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mismatch, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Portfolio careers may be one of the smartest paths to financial stability in the future of work. In this episode, Cait Donovan talks with Ilana Golan about why the old career model feels less secure than it once did and why more people are questioning the idea that one company or one title can carry their whole professional identity. As the future of work keeps shifting, this conversation offers a grounded look at what it takes to build resilience, authority, and choice.

Cait and Ilana unpack the deeper tension underneath career change, especially for people facing workplace burnout. What happens when the role that once defined you starts to drain you? How do you rebuild when your energy is low and your sense of possibility has narrowed? They explore how portfolio careers can create more flexibility, more confidence, and a stronger foundation for long-term stability.

This episode also looks at identity, reinvention, and the value of small experiments that help you test what fits before you make a major leap. Cait and Ilana talk about community, adaptability, and why building your own economy may be one of the most practical responses to the future of work. If you have felt stuck, overextended, or unsure what comes next, this conversation offers a fresh and realistic way to think about career growth, burnout recovery, and what becomes possible when you stop treating your work life as a single-track path.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Portfolio Careers and the Future of Work

06:11 Barriers to Portfolio Careers and Burnout Recovery

20:13 Career Resilience, Adaptability, and Financial Stability

25:54 How to Create Your Own Economy

37:05 Career Experiments, Uncertainty, and Reinvention

49:04 How to Build a Portfolio Career That Fits Your Life

Links

http://www.leapacademy.com/cait 

Follow Ilana on Instagram 

Connect with Ilana on LinkedIn 

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mismatch, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Your body has been warning you about burnout, bad hires, and misalignment long before your brain caught up.

This episode looks at leadership burnout through the lens of interoception, or your ability to notice and respond to signals from your own body. Cait Donovan explains why leadership burnout often feels sudden even though stress has been building for a long time, and why many leaders miss the early signs until they hit a wall.

The conversation connects workplace burnout, self-trust, and emotional regulation in a way that feels both practical and deeply human. Cait explores how early life experiences can shape the way leaders relate to stress, interpret other people, and move through pressure without realizing how disconnected they have become from themselves. That insight opens up a more honest conversation about burnout, decision-making, and the hidden patterns that shape culture and performance.

What makes this episode especially useful is how actionable it is. Cait shows how small daily choices can help rebuild trust with your body, strengthen self-awareness, and improve the way you lead. In a future of work that asks more people to lead with clarity, steadiness, and empathy, this episode makes the case that leadership burnout is not only about workload. It is also about whether you can hear your own signals early enough to respond.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Why Interoception Matters for Leadership and Decision-Making

06:05 Childhood Trauma, Burnout, and Leadership Behavior

11:59 Practical Ways to Build Interoception and Emotional Regulation

14:51 Human-Centered Leadership in the Age of AI

Links

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mismatch, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Talent does not disappear on its own; it erodes when people feel unsafe, unseen and mismatched to the work meant to bring out their best.

Aoife O’Brien joins Cait Donovan for a thoughtful conversation about what helps people thrive at work and what quietly pulls them under. At the center is psychological safety and the way it shapes workplace culture from the inside out. When people do not trust the environment around them, how can they speak honestly, share ideas, or stay fully invested in the work?

They also dig into values alignment, autonomy, and the daily frustrations that often point to deeper unmet needs. Along the way, the conversation opens up a bigger question about workplace burnout and employee burnout. What happens when the values on the wall do not match the reality people live? How much stress is created when people are asked to perform in systems that do not fit how they work best?

This episode also brings real compassion to leadership. It speaks to leadership burnout and executive burnout with honesty, while asking what kind of support leaders need if they are expected to create healthy teams. For anyone thinking about talent, trust, and the future of work, this is a grounded conversation about the conditions people need in order to do their best work and stay well while doing it.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Introduction to Thriving Talent

03:01 Practical Leadership and Workplace Culture

09:13 Psychological Safety at Work

14:56 Workplace Values Alignment and Burnout

39:57 Self-Determination Theory, Autonomy at Work, and Employee Motivation

45:22 Strengths, Capabilities, and Team Dynamics

51:08 Leadership Development and Burnout Challenges

Connect with Aoife O'Brien:

https://happieratwork.ie

https://www.instagram.com/happieratwork.ie

https://www.linkedin.com/in/aoifemobrien

https://www.thrivingtalentbook.com

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mismatch, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

When leadership turns into a transaction, culture starts to starve. 

Workplace culture is at the center of this conversation as Cait Donovan sits down with organizational psychology expert Chris Pineda about leadership development, psychological safety at work, and the deeper forces that shape how people relate, respond, and grow inside organizations. Chris makes the case that organizational health is built through trust, purpose, and accountability, not just policies, titles, or polished values statements. He looks at how leaders influence employee experience every day and why organizational design has more impact on culture than many teams realize.

Together, Cait and Chris explore what happens when people stop waiting for someone else to fix the environment and start paying closer attention to the energy, ownership, and honesty they bring into the room. The conversation connects workplace culture to the human side of change and asks bigger questions about how teams create safety, how leaders earn trust, and what kind of leadership supports lasting growth. It is a thoughtful look at workplace culture, leadership development, psychological safety at work, organizational health, employee experience, and organizational design through a lens that feels practical, grounded, and deeply human.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Transformational Leadership and Workplace Culture

06:12 The Seven Conditions of Transformation

12:06 Purpose, Meaning, and Suffering

17:48 Trust, Safety, and Leadership

41:26 Resistance, Accountability, and Change

54:03 Personal Change and Organizational Transformation

Connect with Chris Pineda:

Groundwork Leadership's Website

Follow Chris on Instagram

Connect with Chris on LinkedIn

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mismatch, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout rarely begins with the job alone because the habits that once kept you safe may be the very ones quietly wearing you down at work.

Cait Donovan takes a clear-eyed look at burnout at work and the way workplace culture can either reinforce it or help interrupt it. This conversation explores how perfectionism, people pleasing, and unclear personal values can fuel employee burnout long before someone fully realizes what is happening. Cait connects personal coping strategies to the broader systems people work inside, offering a thoughtful perspective on culture and burnout without reducing the issue to simple blame. What happens when being helpful turns into overfunctioning? When do high standards stop serving you? And how often does organizational mismatch keep people stuck in roles or environments that quietly wear them down?

Throughout the episode, Cait shows how burnout at work is shaped by both internal habits and external expectations. She also touches on the importance of psychological safety at work, especially in environments where people feel pressure to perform, please, or prove themselves. The result is a grounded conversation about self-awareness, boundaries, and the small shifts that can support healthier teams. For anyone thinking more deeply about burnout at work, this episode offers a practical and human look at what needs to change.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Burnout at Work Starts With More Than the Job

03:18 How Perfectionism Fuels Burnout at Work

10:08 People Pleasing at Work and Team Health

14:01 Small Disappointments and Healthier Boundaries

16:47 Core Values, Organizational Mismatch, and Wellbeing

21:49 Small Shifts That Change Workplace Culture

Listen to the Top-down Burnout Factors episode: https://redcircle.com/shows/e4c0db0a-98a4-47e6-a2b0-6a291469e1d6/ep/8f9138c3-86b4-42ea-a62f-b55955456d19

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mismatch, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout recovery begins with one honest moment of self-awareness and the willingness to make a single small shift that your exhausted brain can actually sustain.

Burnout at work often builds quietly until one day you realize the pace, pressure, and expectations are no longer sustainable. In this conversation, Cait Donovan speaks with clinical psychologist Dr. Rachel Goldman about burnout at work and the subtle signals people ignore before they reach their breaking point. Many people assume recovery requires a massive life overhaul. Dr. Rachel explains why small shifts can interrupt workplace burnout patterns, support resilience at work, and help restore clarity, and energy.

Dr. Rachel shares one of her own burnout stories from early in her career and reflects on how organizational mismatch can slowly drain motivation and confidence. When roles, values, and systems stop aligning, workplace stress increases and employee burnout becomes almost inevitable. Their discussion examines how burnout culture often rewards overwork and perfectionism while discouraging people from using the tools and support that could actually help them recover. Over time, these patterns shape the overall employee experience and can even contribute to deeper organizational burnout when stress goes unaddressed.

The conversation also focuses on practical burnout prevention. Instead of chasing dramatic change, Cait and Dr. Rachel highlight small behavioral tweaks that build resilience and create momentum in burnout recovery. These shifts strengthen resilience at work, challenge rigid thinking patterns, and help people respond to workplace stress before it escalates into deeper workplace burnout.

If you have experienced burnout at work or want to better understand employee burnout and burnout culture, this episode offers grounded insight and realistic strategies for building resilience and moving forward without overwhelming yourself.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Burnout Recovery Begins With One Small Shift

01:25 Dr. Rachel Goldman’s Personal Burnout Story

05:54 Recognizing Misalignment at Work and Early Burnout Signs

10:44 Small Tweaks That Drive Real Behavior Change

20:15 Growth Mindset and Resilience in Burnout Recovery

27:33 Why Using Tools and Support Is Not Cheating

40:46 Building Your Personal Stress Management Toolbox

47:55 One Small Action That Starts Burnout Recovery

Connect with Dr. Rachel Goldman:

https://www.drrachelnyc.com

https://www.instagram.com/drrachelnyc/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/rachel-goldman-phd/

https://whenlifehappensbook.com/

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mismatch, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Why does workplace wellness still feel risky for leaders even when the data proves it works?

Burnout at work is widely acknowledged as a growing challenge, yet many organizations still hesitate to address it openly. Cait Donovan examines the tension beneath that hesitation and the complicated reality leaders face when they try to tackle employee burnout. Most leaders want healthier teams and stronger workplace culture, but conversations about workplace wellbeing can raise fears of blame, backlash, or initiatives that promise more than they deliver. In a crowded industry where trust is fragile, even well-intentioned workplace wellness efforts can feel like a gamble.

Cait offers a different perspective on burnout at work, one that moves away from blame and toward curiosity. Rather than framing burnout as a failure of leaders or employees, she explores it as a human pattern shaped by biology, history, and workplace dynamics. This shift opens the door for more honest conversations about employee burnout and the pressures people carry into their roles. What happens when organizations stop searching for someone to blame and start asking better questions about how work actually functions?

The conversation also challenges common approaches to workplace wellness that focus only on positivity. Employees experiencing burnout at work often carry fear, frustration, grief, or uncertainty into the workplace. Ignoring those emotions rarely builds trust. Acknowledging them can strengthen workplace culture and create space for real dialogue about workplace wellbeing.

Ultimately, the discussion points to a deeper issue facing many organizations today: trust. If leaders want to address burnout at work in meaningful ways, conversations about workplace wellness must feel safe, honest, and grounded in the realities of modern work.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Understanding Burnout and Its Stigma

02:49 The Business Case for Workplace Wellness Initiatives

06:14 The Risks of Hiring Wellness Speakers

11:55 Creating Psychological Safety in Wellness

14:57 A Blameless Approach to Burnout

18:10 How Burnout Conversations Shape Workplace Culture

Links

https://talkadot.com/s/caitdonovan

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mismatch, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout might be the cost of living someone else’s values instead of your own.

Cait sits down with Suzy Welch, creator of the Values Bridge and author of Becoming You, to explore why so much burnout at work stems from misalignment rather than effort. Cait shares the realization that shifted her path: she built thriving one-on-one practices and helped thousands, yet still felt drained because her core drive for broad impact did not match the intimate service model she was operating in. How often do we mistake competence for alignment? How often do we stay loyal to workplace values that quietly clash with our own?

Suzy breaks down why this disconnect is so common. We edit our values to look acceptable within our workplace culture or family system. We amplify what sounds admirable and silence what feels risky to admit. The Values Bridge reveals what actually motivates you and highlights the gap between your personal values at work and the life you are living. You can care deeply about people without centering your identity around caretaking. You can hold strong leadership values without organizing your life around constant achievement. Values are not moral badges. They are choices about how you want to direct your time and energy.

The conversation also moves beyond values into natural aptitudes and economically viable interests. What does your brain do with ease? What kinds of roles exist outside the narrow paths most of us were shown? When your workplace values, your wiring, and real-world opportunity line up, energy builds instead of drains. When they do not, burnout at work follows. The real question becomes this: are you living in alignment with your own values, or are you performing someone else’s version of success?

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Introduction To The Values Bridge And Burnout At Work

05:39 Why Values Misalignment Causes Exhaustion And Low Fulfillment

13:27 Values At Work, Workplace Culture, And Leadership Alignment

24:26 Family, Achievement, And The Truth About Workplace Values

30:02 Aptitudes, Career Fit, And Economically Viable Interests

Connect with Suzy Welch:

Visit Suzy Welch's Website

Follow Suzy on Instagram

Connect with Suzy on LinkedIn 

The Values Bridge 

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mismatch, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Only 2 percent of leaders believe their performance reviews actually work, yet most companies still rely on them to shape culture, compensation, and careers.

Cait Donovan sits down with leadership team coach and best-selling author Mike Goldman to question why so many organizations cling to management systems that quietly undermine organizational performance. If leaders say people are their greatest asset, why do they rely on a process that most of them admit adds little value? When expectations are unclear and culture standards are flexible for the wrong people, team health performance drops and talent retention becomes a guessing game.

Mike shares his concept of talent density as a more rigorous, systems-based approach to team performance. The focus shifts from annual ratings to talent fit and sustainable performance, where productivity and culture impact both matter. This is about rethinking performance management at work in a way that supports long-term performance. When talent density becomes the standard, leaders have a clearer path to building high-performing teams without burnout and without compromising the culture they claim to value.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Why Performance Reviews Are Broken

02:54 Rethinking Performance Management at Work

09:49 Setting Clear Expectations for Sustainable Performance

19:02 Productivity vs. Culture Fit: Redefining High Performance

24:07 The Cost of Tolerating Low Culture Fit

36:47 Coaching Up, Coaching Out, and Talent Fit

51:01 Building Leadership Accountability Through Talent Density

Connect with Mike Goldman:

Visit Mike Goldman's Website

Follow Mike on Instagram

Connect with Mike on LinkedIn

Order The Strength of Talent 

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mismatch, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Belonging might get you on the team, but if burnout is a systems problem, then mattering is a systems solution. Cait sits down with Zach Mercurio, PhD, author of The Power of Mattering, to examine why engagement continues to decline even in organizations investing heavily in culture initiatives. If burnout is a systems problem, then addressing workplace burnout requires more than resilience training. It requires redesigning how leaders show up in everyday interactions.

Zach breaks down the difference between belonging, inclusion, and mattering. Belonging is being welcomed. Inclusion is being invited to participate. Mattering is knowing you are significant and needed. That experience is built moment by moment when leaders notice, affirm, and show people how their contributions make a measurable difference. These small interactions directly influence organizational health and shape the employee experience.

Cait brings a biological lens to the conversation, exploring how chronic workplace stress and cortisol are connected to feeling unseen or replaceable. Research shows that when people feel they matter, stress markers decrease and exhaustion drops. That insight reframes the structural causes of burnout. This is not just about mindset alone but systems, expectations, and leadership behavior.

The conversation also addresses leadership burnout. Managers are overloaded with KPIs, administrative demands, and hybrid communication that erodes psychological safety at work. When leaders rush, care disappears and hurry replaces presence, burnout culture takes root. If burnout is a systems problem, then culture is built or broken in the accumulation of daily interactions.

You will get a useful framework based on three main actions which are noticing, affirming, and needing. You can use these leadership skills on a larger scale to improve the health of your organization, reduce burnout at work, and make the employee experience better without starting a new project.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Zach Mercurio, PhD, on The Power of Mattering at Work

02:37 Belonging vs Inclusion vs Mattering

06:39 What Makes Work Meaningful

09:43 Mattering and Burnout

11:48 The Biology of Feeling Valued

20:57 How to Build Trust With Check-ins That Feel Authentic

23:14 Notice, Affirm, Need: Leadership Behaviors That Reduce Burnout

28:47 Why Hurrying Kills Care

42:13 The Myth of Being Replaceable

48:12 One Simple Question That Helps People Feel They Matter

Links

Mind–Body Skills Groups for Posttraumatic Stress Disorder in Palestinian Adults in Gaza

Connect with Zach Mercurio:

Visit Zach's Website

Follow Zach on Instagram

Connect with Zach on LinkedIn

The Power of Mattering

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mismatch, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here.

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout does not get fixed by waiting for the workplace to change and it does not get solved by ignoring the biology of chronic stress either. Cait Donovan challenges the growing resistance to mindfulness in workplace and corporate wellness by asking a more honest question: what if the tools people dismiss as basic are misunderstood rather than ineffective? 

Drawing on research from war zones, medical training programs, and high-stress professional environments, the conversation reframes mindfulness as a form of burnout prevention grounded in trauma and PTSD science. When practices reduce symptoms in active conflict zones, it raises an uncomfortable but important question about what they might offer people living with constant workplace stress.

At the center of the discussion is the nervous system. Chronic stress creates a dysregulated nervous system that stays locked in fight or flight, reshaping the brain in the same way PTSD does. Through the lens of nervous system regulation, the vagus nerve, and polyvagal theory, burnout is positioned as a physiological pattern rather than a failure of willpower or mindset. The episode pushes back on the idea that burnout belongs only to systems and leadership, without minimizing real workplace harm. Research shows that choosing a small number of practices that truly fit can restore clarity and agency over time, giving people the internal stability needed to decide what actually needs to change next.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Workplace Wellness, Burnout, and Chronic Stress

02:46 Why Practical Stress Management Matters at Work

06:05 How Mind-Body Skills Support Burnout Recovery and PTSD

09:08 Reclaiming Personal Agency in Burnout Prevention

Links

James Gordon's episode on Transforming Trauma

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mismatch, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here.

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Part of burnout recovery is learning when to respond to what your body and life are telling you, even when that response brings some discomfort.

In this episode, Cait and Sarah talk openly about a shift in how they work together and what’s ahead for FRIED. As their roles and priorities have evolved, Sarah is stepping back and Cait is focusing her work more fully on leadership, organizational, and systems-level burnout.

Cait shares how she came to see that her work is strongest when she is creating change at a broader level, working with leaders, teams, and organizations. Sarah reflects on realizing that supporting others through burnout had taken the place of rebuilding her own life, and what became clear once she chose to redirect her energy back toward herself.

The conversation reflects the longer arc of burnout recovery. It speaks to how clarity often comes later than expected, how rebuilding tends to happen in stages, and how fit becomes clearer through experience rather than planning. What Cait and Sarah describe will feel familiar to anyone who has had to respond to a change they did not anticipate but ultimately knew they could not ignore.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Conscious Business Uncoupling and Burnout Recovery Alignment

03:29 Why Burn Bold Shifted From Individual Burnout Recovery to Workplace Burnout

04:28 The Values Bridge Assessment and How It Exposes Misalignment

08:29 Codependency in Helping Roles and Burnout From Borrowed Purpose

11:18 Ending a Business Partnership Without Blame or Failure

18:59 Why You Cannot Force Alignment Through Planning Alone

28:34 Why Transitions Feel So Hard According to Chinese Medicine

31:43 Workplace Burnout vs Misalignment and Why Not Everything Is Toxic

38:16 Using Your Voice and Finding the Work That Fits

42:34 Why Burnout Recovery Still Requires Support and Guidance

Links

Book Cait to Speak at your Event or Org

Schedule a Speaking Inquiry with Cait

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mis/match, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout recovery does not start with fixing yourself. It starts with understanding job fit, burnout at work, and whether there is a true values match between who you are and what your work and life demand.

Cait Donovan returns with a #straightfromcait episode that marks a turning point in how she thinks about burnout and in the writing of her next book. After years of explaining burnout as a complex web shaped by childhood, culture, health, personality, and work, she hits a wall. Information alone does not change behavior. What people need is a clearer way to see why burnout keeps showing up and what actually drives it beneath the surface.

That insight leads to a powerful reframe. Burnout at work is often the result of poor job fit and ongoing misalignment, not personal weakness or bad leadership. Cait unpacks how mismatches around autonomy, expectations, and success quietly drain energy over time. More freedom does not always help. Promotion does not always equal growth. What happens when your role conflicts with your values or asks for something you cannot sustain? And how often do we accept those mismatches without ever questioning them?

This episode also sets the direction for what comes next on the podcast. Cait shares how future conversations will focus on creating better alignment through values match, mattering, hope, and leadership at work. The invitation is simple and challenging. What would change if fit mattered as much as performance? And how much burnout could be prevented if mismatch was addressed before it turned into exhaustion?

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Burnout as a Mismatch Problem

02:29 Job Fit, Autonomy, and Burnout at Work

04:47 Values Match and Redefining Success

05:43 How Better Alignment Reduces Burnout

Links

Book Cait to Speak at your Event or Org

Schedule a Speaking Inquiry with Cait

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout is less a breaking point than a slow unravelling of identity and the seven messy phases high achievers cycle through on the way back to themselves.

We’re revisiting a conversation with Dr. Mandy Lehto that still holds relevance for anyone who has pushed past their limits and felt the ground shift beneath them. Mandy and Cait talk through burnout as a gradual process shaped by denial, urgency, over-efforting, and grief, rather than a single moment of collapse. Mandy’s “seven-ish” buckets offer language for patterns many high achievers recognize but rarely name. When the strategies that once drove success stop working, how do you begin to make sense of what comes next?

Burnout is framed here as an identity reckoning rather than a problem to fix or outwork. It often surfaces when performance quietly replaces self-trust and effort becomes the main source of worth. What happens when pushing harder no longer brings clarity or relief? What does it ask of you when the body stops cooperating with the plan?

The episode invites a different relationship with healing. One that allows uncertainty, grief, and slowness to exist without turning them into another project. Wholeness does not arrive as polish or resolution. It shows up through honesty, embodiment, and the growing ability to stop performing for approval. For anyone navigating the space between who they were trained to be and who they are becoming, this episode offers perspective, language, and permission to stay with the process.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 The Seven Phases of Burnout Recovery for High Achievers

01:35 Denial and the Push-Harder Pattern That Starts the Slide

06:38 Triage Mode and Why Your Worth Can Feel Tied to Productivity

15:19 Reluctant Surrender and the Grief of Losing Your Old Identity

19:10 The Humbling and What Acceptance Actually Looks Like

30:31 Achievement Addiction, Dopamine, and the Crash After Big Wins

39:02 Chutes and Ladders and Practicing Self-Acceptance in Real Life

42:28 Wholeness Equals Whole Mess and Reclaiming Your Energy

47:14 When Support Helps Most and Why Recovery Becomes an Inside Job

If today’s episode sparked ideas for your team, Cait is available for keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions. Learn more here: https://caitdonovan.as.me/inquire

Connect with Mandy Lehto:

Visit Mandy's Website

Follow Mandy on Instagram

Connect with Mandy on LinkedIn

Book Cait to Speak: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

What if you could step into a room filled with the people who hold the keys to the big stages, the book deals, and the most powerful platforms for your voice? The Gateway Gathering Pitch Fest is a visibility accelerator for thought-leaders. Whether you’re ready to pitch or just want to discover what’s possible, join us January 13 – 15. Visit: https://bit.ly/friedgateway

Why do millennials seem more exhausted than everyone else, and what does that say about the world they came of age in? Cait Donovan and Tess Brigham challenge the idea that burnout is caused by laziness, entitlement, or bad time management and instead look at the conditions that shaped an entire generation’s relationship to work, money, and ambition.

Millennials were taught to chase fulfillment through work while absorbing the expectation of constant availability, rising debt, and shrinking financial stability. That combination created a version of success that looked good on paper but often felt unsustainable in real life. Burnout, in this light, reads less like a personal breakdown and more like a rational response to a system that never powered down.

The conversation also reframes generational tension as misunderstanding rather than failure. Gen Z’s boundaries and openness around mental health are not rejections of effort. They are adaptations shaped by watching what relentless grind actually costs. What looks like resistance may be awareness.

This episode asks a quieter but harder question: what happens when the path you committed to no longer fits who you are or the life you want? Burnout becomes an invitation to reassess rather than a reason for shame. Less judgment, more curiosity, and the courage to question stories about success that were never designed to hold up under the weight they now carry.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Why Burnout Is a Generational Issue, Not a Personal Failure

01:15 Tess Brigham on Her Quarter-Life Crisis and Early Burnout

09:25 Why Millennials Experience Burnout Differently Than Other Generations

19:26 Student Debt, Financial Pressure, and the Burnout Equation

30:11 Mental Health, Boundaries, and What Gen Z Is Doing Differently

39:03 When Burnout Signals It’s Time to Reassess Your Path

Connect with Tess Brigham:

Visit Tess' Website

Follow Tess on Instagram

Connect with Tess on LinkedIn

Connect with Cait:

Initial Call with Cait

Burnout Recovery works better with support. UNFRIED is our small group (6 people max!) coaching program to help guide you through your recovery. Find out more here: http://bit.ly/unfried

If this episode resonated and you’re not sure where to go next, the FRIED Episode Finder can guide you to the next right listen: https://bit.ly/friedfinder

What if you could step into a room filled with the people who hold the keys to the big stages, the book deals, and the most powerful platforms for your voice? The Gateway Gathering Pitch Fest is a visibility accelerator for thought-leaders. Whether you’re ready to pitch or just want to discover what’s possible, join us January 13 – 15. Visit: https://bit.ly/friedgateway

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

What if you could step into a room filled with the people who hold the keys to the big stages, the book deals, and the most powerful platforms for your voice? The Gateway Gathering Pitch Fest is a visibility accelerator for thought-leaders. Whether you’re ready to pitch or just want to discover what’s possible, join us January 13 – 15. Visit https://bit.ly/friedgateway

Stress pushes high-achieving women toward alcohol and alcohol quietly erodes sleep emotional stability and clarity.

Cait Donovan welcomes back Casey McGuire Davidson, host of the Hello Someday podcast and a trusted voice for sober-curious women, to examine a pattern many women experience without fully naming. Alcohol is often positioned as relief, reward, and sophistication, yet over time it can leave women feeling more anxious, more reactive, and less resilient in their daily lives.

Rather than treating drinking as a moral issue or a personal failure, the focus stays on information and awareness. How does alcohol affect sleep and emotional regulation? What shifts when hormones change in midlife? How much of what feels like stress, burnout, or anxiety might be amplified by something we were told would help? Removing alcohol, even briefly, becomes a way to see your real baseline and understand what your body and nervous system are actually asking for.

This episode is an invitation to experiment with curiosity instead of judgment. What might you learn about yourself if you stopped numbing for a month? What becomes possible when rest feels deeper, moods feel steadier, and choices feel more conscious? Dry January is framed less as a challenge and more as a chance to gather clarity and decide what truly supports the life you are building.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Meet Casey McGuire Davidson

02:00 How Stress and Alcohol Reinforce Each Other

06:00 Alcohol’s Impact on Sleep, Anxiety, and Emotional Regulation

18:05 Perimenopause, Hormones, and Changing Alcohol Tolerance

23:55 A Practical and Sustainable Approach to Dry January

Connect with Casey McGuire Davidson:

Casey’s Website

Follow Casey on Instagram  

Connect with Casey on LinkedIn

Get The Free 30-Day Sober Guide To Quitting Drinking

Hire Cait to Speak:

Initial Call with Cait

If you’re tired and can’t quite name why, this is a good place to start. Cait’s free Core Values guide helps you figure out what’s draining you and what’s worth protecting. Grab it here: https://bit.ly/corevaluesfreebie

What if you could step into a room filled with the people who hold the keys to the big stages, the book deals, and the most powerful platforms for your voice? The Gateway Gathering Pitch Fest is a visibility accelerator for thought-leaders. Whether you’re ready to pitch or just want to discover what’s possible, join us January 13 – 15. Visit https://bit.ly/friedgateway

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Winter fear can feel like burnout recovery slipping away but this episode reframes fear and depletion as a natural part of winter rather than a sign of winter burnout or failure. 

In this #sarahshares episode, Sarah Vosen speaks directly to the quiet panic that surfaces when low energy and fear return during the darkest part of the year. When light fades and energy pulls inward, burnout recovery can feel fragile. Fear often replaces simple exhaustion, especially when the nervous system is already depleted. Sarah offers a grounding reframe. That fear is not proof you are backsliding. It is information. Winter exposes depletion more clearly, which can feel unsettling, but it also invites a different response.

Instead of pushing through or overriding low energy, the conversation centers on safety, rest, and conservation. What does safety actually feel like in your body? What helps you settle when fear is loud and rest feels out of reach? Winter is not asking for progress or productivity. It is asking for care, containment, and trust that restoration often begins when you stop fighting the dark.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Embracing Winter's Wisdom

05:06 Understanding Fear in Winter

09:47 Seeking Safety and Self-Care

17:10 Navigating Hibernation and Restoration

Related episodes you might want to listen to next:

Irrational Fears are a Sign of Depletion

Burnout and Sleep

Dig deeper:

Burnout isn’t a personal failure or a lack of resilience. It’s a signal that something in the system, expectations, roles, pace, or support, is out of alignment. Conversations like this one help surface the human experience of burnout, while the broader work continues to explore how organizations can respond more intelligently and sustainably.

To explore burnout, leadership, and sustainable performance through a workplace and organizational lens, connect with Cait Donovan: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: 

https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-minute overview: 

https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout recovery starts when you stop treating self-sufficiency as strength and learn how to ask for help without shame.

In this Coaching session, Sarah Vosen sits down with Samira, a longtime listener facing burnout rooted in over-responsibility, financial stress, and a habit of doing everything alone. Rest has started to bring back some energy, yet doubt remains. What if it is still not enough? What if needing support means something is wrong?

At the heart of this conversation is the realization that self-reliance often begins as protection. When early attempts to ask for help led to disappointment, independence became the safest path. Over time, that strategy can quietly turn into isolation and exhaustion. Sarah reframes resilience as something built through receiving rather than pushing harder and invites Samira to see that she can learn how to ask for help and build it as a skill.

They also explore how support works best when expectations are clear and realistic. Not everyone in our lives can meet every emotional need. Some people bring calm. Others bring practical relief. Releasing unmet expectations can soften resentment and make space for real support to land.

This episode invites reflection on long-held beliefs about strength and worth. What changes when asking for help feels neutral rather than shameful? What becomes possible when support is treated as nourishment rather than failure? Burnout recovery begins at the roots, and sometimes the bravest step is allowing yourself to receive.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Burnout Recovery and the Cost of Self-Reliance

03:09 Why Asking for Help Feels Unsafe

08:58 Letting Go of Unmet Expectations in Relationships

11:54 Asking for Help as a Skill That Builds Resilience

14:47 Restoring Emotional Roots to Heal Burnout

Links

Dive deeper:

Burnout isn’t a personal failure or a lack of resilience. It’s a signal that something in the system, expectations, roles, pace, or support, is out of alignment. Conversations like this one help surface the human experience of burnout, while the broader work continues to explore how organizations can respond more intelligently and sustainably.

To explore burnout, leadership, and sustainable performance through a workplace and organizational lens, connect with Cait Donovan: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: 

https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-minute overview: 

https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

AD: What if you could step into a room filled with the people who hold the keys to the big stages, the book deals, and the most powerful platforms for your voice? The Gateway Gathering Pitch Fest is a visibility accelerator for thought-leaders. Whether you’re ready to pitch or just want to discover what’s possible join us January 13 – 15. Visit https://bit.ly/friedgateway

AD: The right support changes everything. Our Director of Coaching, Sarah Vosen, combines expertise and compassion to walk beside you: https://caitdonovan.com/coaching

Are you burned out and lonely? That stops today! We know that burnout takes a different shape when the life you worked hard to build no longer feels like it belongs to you and you’re pushed to rebuild meaning from the inside out.

Cait welcomes back author and coach Hailey Paige Magee, whose work has supported thousands of burned out and lonely folks who are recovering people-pleasers and high achievers as they redefine their relationship with success. Their conversation focuses on the moment burnout stops looking like exhaustion and starts revealing a deeper misalignment. Hailey speaks candidly about the quiet collapse that happens when your identity no longer fits the life around you and the grief that rises when you can no longer pretend everything is fine.

The heart of the episode centers on stopping you feeling burned out and lonely by finding reconnection with community.

How do you return to community after a long stretch of self-protection? How do you stay rooted in yourself without slipping into performance or old habits? And what becomes possible when belonging has nothing to do with achievement? Cait and Hailey explore these questions and offer a grounded reminder that meaning grows through honest relationships, not algorithms or accolades.

#communitywellbeing, #burntoutandalone, #lonelieness

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Burnout, Misalignment, and Identity Collapse

06:02 Social Media, Success, and Loss of Purpose

12:02 Grief as a Turning Point in Burnout Recovery

14:56 Rebuilding Connection and Community

37:08 Evolving Identity and Rediscovering Meaning

42:06 From Me to We in the Next Phase of Recovery

Links

Previous episode with Hailey: https://redcircle.com/shows/e4c0db0a-98a4-47e6-a2b0-6a291469e1d6/ep/d8fec203-3b47-4c8a-9a30-edaf876d1316

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mis/match, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IZ7Ib-hllQA

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Many people mistake burnout for personal failure, but the real issue is the quiet mismatch between the energy you actually have and the expectations you keep pushing yourself to meet.

Sarah Vosen gets to the core of why so many burned-out high achievers feel defeated: the math of your life stopped working long before you noticed it. When your energy drops but your expectations stay at their old setting, even simple days feel impossible. The conversation challenges listeners to ask what they believe they “should” be able to do and where those beliefs came from in the first place. How often are you measuring yourself against a past version of you? And what changes once you base your plans on your real capacity instead of the fantasy of unlimited output?

This episode is an invitation to rebuild self-trust by telling the truth about what you can actually give right now. Burnout recovery begins when you stop assuming your worth hinges on productivity and start giving yourself permission to operate from reality. Sarah offers encouragement, clarity, and accessible next steps for anyone ready to release the shame of falling short and move toward days that feel doable again.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Understanding Burnout and Its Real Impact on High Achievers

02:55 How to Adjust Expectations for Better Burnout Recovery

05:45 Realistic Ways to Assess Your Energy, Time, and Capacity

09:13 Why Consistent Self-Care Supports Burnout Healing

11:54 How to Find the Right Support for Burnout Recovery

Links

Your team's energy and well-being are worth investing in. Hire Cait to speak at your company, association, or event: https://caitdonovan.com/speaking

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Fall can hit like a quiet emotional landslide as grief, guilt, and old heaviness rise to the surface and ask for release.

Sarah Vosen talks about why this season often feels heavier than we expect and how that weight points to emotion that never fully moved through the system. She highlights the way sadness, guilt, and that familiar tightness in the chest show up when the pace naturally shifts and the body finally has room to speak. What if those uncomfortable waves are your body reaching for relief instead of signaling something you did wrong? And how would your days shift if you treated that heaviness as guidance instead of something to outrun?

This episode offers a steady invitation back to release. Sarah focuses on the simple acts that help the body soften and recover its flow: tears that want to be felt, breaths that need more space, warmth when the cold settles in, hydration when everything feels dry, rest when your system begs for it, and the inner clarity that comes from paying attention to what you truly need. Fall isn’t a season for pushing harder; it’s a season for loosening your grip. Sarah gives listeners a grounded, compassionate framework for honoring that rhythm so they can move through this time with more ease and far less judgment.

Episode Breakdown:

00:02 Why Fall Triggers Grief, Guilt, and Emotional Burnout

03:10 How Chinese Medicine Explains Fall Emotions

06:55 How Unprocessed Emotions Create Seasonal Burnout

10:22 Deep Breathing Techniques for Emotional Release in Fall

13:41 Embracing Natural Cycles and Letting Go

Dive deeper:

Burnout isn’t a personal failure or a lack of resilience. It’s a signal that something in the system, expectations, roles, pace, or support, is out of alignment. Conversations like this one help surface the human experience of burnout, while the broader work continues to explore how organizations can respond more intelligently and sustainably.

To explore burnout, leadership, and sustainable performance through a workplace and organizational lens, connect with Cait Donovan: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: 

https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-minute overview: 

https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout doesn’t end with a mindset shift—it begins when you finally allow grief, emptiness, and small sparks of joy to coexist without needing to fix any of them.

Author and speaker Cyndie Spiegel joins Cait to talk about what it means to live inside the gray area, the space where both pain and beauty can exist at once. She shares how walking away from a high-profile fashion career led her to teaching, writing, and discovering the idea of microjoys: brief, accessible moments of light that don’t erase hardship but remind us life still holds goodness. Together, they unpack how black-and-white thinking fuels burnout, why forced gratitude doesn’t work, and how simple awareness can shift everything.

What if healing starts with noticing what else is true? What might open up when you stop chasing “better” and start paying attention to what’s already here?

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Introduction

02:00 Cyndie Spiegel’s Burnout Story in the Fashion Industry

08:35 Finding Purpose Through Yoga and Teaching

10:37 Writing A Year of Positive Thinking

16:08 The Birth of Microjoys

18:40 Finding Hope When Life Isn’t Okay

24:30 Living in the Gray: Holding Multiple Truths

32:54 Practicing Microjoys in Daily Life

39:21 Where to Find Cyndie Spiegel and Final Reflections

Connect with Cyndie Spiegel:

Cyndie’s Website

Follow Cyndie on Instagram

Connect with Cyndie on LinkedIn

Sign up to Cyndie’s Email List

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mis/match, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Most people think they’ve failed at change when they’ve actually just hit the part where being human takes over.

Cait Donovan is taking a closer look at why behavior change is so hard to maintain and why relapse isn’t a sign of weakness but proof that your brain is doing exactly what it’s designed to do. She explains how old habits never fully disappear, they just sit quietly, waiting for a moment of stress or fatigue to reappear. Change takes effort, repetition, and compassion for the part of you that’s still learning.

Cait shares how progress depends on context and patience. A new habit might feel strong at home but crumble at work, and that’s normal. The real work isn’t about erasing the old pattern but building trust in your ability to return to the new one again and again. This episode is a reminder that being human is not the problem, it’s the process.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Understanding Why Behavior Change Feels Impossible

01:39 How the Brain Builds and Keeps Old Habits

04:10 Why New Behaviors Don’t Stick in Every Environment

06:20 Relapse as a Normal Part of Behavior Change

09:01 Final Takeaways: Being Human Is the Process

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mis/match, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout doesn’t always look like collapse; sometimes it hides in the moments when you’re still performing, but your spark keeps flickering out, and that’s where this honest coaching session begins.

In this episode, Sarah Vosen sits down with Jennie, an attorney and mom unsure whether what she’s feeling qualifies as burnout. Together they unpack the World Health Organization’s markers of burnout—exhaustion, cynicism, and reduced efficacy—and what those look like in real life. Is it possible to feel functional yet fried? How do you know when your capacity is shrinking faster than you realize?

As Sarah guides Jennie through a clearer understanding of her patterns, practical steps begin to emerge: protecting space on the calendar, creating buffers between meetings, and rebuilding small habits that restore energy. The conversation also touches on the role of perimenopause in stress and recovery, giving Jennie a compassionate framework for why her old pace no longer fits.

The episode leaves listeners with a grounded reminder: burnout recovery isn’t about doing more, it’s about doing differently, one small boundary at a time.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 What Burnout Really Looks Like

04:10 Understanding the WHO Definition of Burnout

10:06 Small Doable Steps for Burnout Recovery

14:51 Setting Boundaries and Time Blocks That Stick

22:32 Learning to Control What You Can Control

25:14 Dropping Self-Judgment and Reclaiming Energy

34:54 The Connection Between Burnout and Perimenopause

39:36 Building a New Operating System for Sustainable Work

45:07 Grace, Compassion, and Real Recovery

Links

Download the Web of Causation Exercise to uncover the layers behind your burnout and begin creating your recovery plan: https://www.caitdonovan.com/freebie-web

Dive Deeper:

Burnout isn’t a personal failure or a lack of resilience. It’s a signal that something in the system, expectations, roles, pace, or support, is out of alignment. Conversations like this one help surface the human experience of burnout, while the broader work continues to explore how organizations can respond more intelligently and sustainably.

To explore burnout, leadership, and sustainable performance through a workplace and organizational lens, connect with Cait Donovan: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: 

https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-minute overview: 

https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Admitting you’re burnt out can feel like failure, but as Heather learns in this live coaching session, it’s actually the first brave step toward freedom.

In this coaching conversation, she opens up about the shame of slowing down and the fear that rest will undo everything she’s worked for. For years, she’s equated effort with worth, believing that if she just pushed a little harder, she’d finally feel secure. Now, even basic motivation feels impossible, and the idea of taking a real break feels terrifying. Through grounded, compassionate coaching, Sarah Vosen helps Heather untangle the shame that keeps her stuck and recognize that burnout isn’t a reflection of weakness, it’s what happens when capacity runs out but expectations don’t.

The turning point comes when Heather admits she needs more time than she’s willing to allow herself. That moment of honesty marks the real beginning of recovery. This episode is a reminder that stepping back isn’t quitting; it’s choosing to rebuild your life at a pace that actually sustains you.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Welcome to Fried: The Burnout Podcast

00:53 Live Coaching with Heather: Admitting Burnout

04:50 The Shame and Fear Behind Taking a Break

09:11 Capacity vs. Capability: The Core Burnout Distinction

15:17 When Burnout Becomes an Existential Crisis

20:24 Restoring Your Inner Ecosystem

22:24 Learning to Stop and Rest Without Guilt

25:07 Fear as a Symptom of Burnout

31:09 How Unconscious Coping Leads to Burnout

36:35 Taking the First Step Toward Recovery

41:01 Reframing Burnout as an Opportunity for Renewal

44:05 Reflections and Encouragement

Dive Deeper:

Burnout isn’t a personal failure or a lack of resilience. It’s a signal that something in the system, expectations, roles, pace, or support, is out of alignment. Conversations like this one help surface the human experience of burnout, while the broader work continues to explore how organizations can respond more intelligently and sustainably.

To explore burnout, leadership, and sustainable performance through a workplace and organizational lens, connect with Cait Donovan: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: 

https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-minute overview: 

https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout convinces you that rest should be enough, and when it isn’t, you assume you’re broken.

In this #straightfromcait episode, Cait shares how a shoulder injury revealed a missing step in her own recovery process. Two months of full rest left her pain-free but not ready. When her physical therapist handed her one-pound weights and she could barely lift them, she realized the injury had healed, but her strength hadn’t returned.

That moment reframed everything. Most of us focus on the pause — the sleeping, the pulling back, the stopping. But recovery isn’t just the absence of strain. At some point, rest has to turn into rebuild. Gently. Slowly. Without ego. This isn’t about going back to who you were before burnout, it’s about training for who you’re becoming.

If you’ve been wondering why life still feels heavier than it should, maybe nothing’s wrong with you at all. Maybe you’re not fragile, just not rebuilt yet.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 What Burnout Recovery Gets Wrong About Rest

01:19 The Shoulder Injury That Sparked a Realization

02:22 Physical Therapy and the Wake-Up Call of Weakness

03:06 Rest vs. Rebuild in Burnout Recovery

07:12 Nutrition, Movement, and Mental Habits That Restore Capacity

09:09 Recovery as a Foundation, Not the Finish Line

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mis/match, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout hides best inside people who love their work so much they don’t notice it draining the life out of them.

PGA coach and RGX founder Will Robins joins Cait to unpack how devotion to service can turn into slow-motion burnout, especially when you’re praised for being endlessly available. He shares how surviving the 2004 tsunami gave him purpose, but years later COVID thrust him into a different kind of survival mode, fielding nonstop crisis calls from golf pros worldwide. Passion became obligation, generosity became emotional labor, and saying yes became his default until resentment started to seep in. Together, he and Cait expose how burnout isn’t about workload—it’s about tension, expectations, and the belief that being needed equals being valuable.

They map a way back through honest boundaries, aligned priorities, and Will’s Scoring Method as a metaphor for life: stop swinging for perfection and focus on consistent, pressure-free plays. You'll hear practical language for saying no without guilt, a reframing of stress as a physical reaction rather than a personal failing, and a challenge to stop optimizing your recovery like another achievement project. If you're the “reliable one” who keeps muscling through, this episode invites you to build a life where people need you less, and love you more because of it.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Burnout and Purpose After Surviving the Tsunami

02:45 COVID Burnout and the Cost of Constant Service

08:04 Why High Performers Miss Burnout Signs

11:47 Burnout Culture in the Golf Industry and Beyond

17:31 Rebuilding Life with Faith, Health, and Family

21:02 Setting Boundaries Without Guilt

32:02 The Scoring Method for Life and Burnout

36:00 Mastering Emotional Regulation

Connect with Will Robins:

Will’s Website

Follow Will on Instagram

Connect with Will on LinkedIn

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mis/match, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Sometimes the next step is simply asking for help. Sarah Vosen is here to guide you through it: https://caitdonovan.com/coaching

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Control shows up early in Christy’s story — first as protection, then as identity, and eventually as exhaustion. She has spent years anticipating other people’s needs, convinced that staying ahead of every outcome would keep things safe. Instead, it left her overextended and unsure how to take up space without earning it through service.

In this real-time coaching session, Sarah helps Christy notice the cost of constantly shaping herself around other people’s comfort. She isn’t confused about what’s wrong, she’s simply never been given permission to stop carrying so much.

The turning point comes when she names one commitment she quietly resents: a year-long carpool obligation she agreed to out of pressure rather than choice. Renegotiating that responsibility becomes the first act of repair. It’s not about convenience. It’s about finally allowing reciprocity.

This episode offers an honest look at the earliest stage of burnout recovery, the moment you decide that exhaustion is no longer proof of goodness. One boundary. One ask. One hour of energy reclaimed.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Live Burnout Coaching with Sarah Vosen

01:15 Christy Realizes She’s Burned Out for the First Time

04:30 Control and Codependency as Burnout Fuel

09:00 Parenting Crisis and Emotional Breaking Point

16:00 The Tree of Life Exercise for Energy Awareness

23:45 Naming Resentment and the Carpool Boundary

29:00 Learning to Delegate Without Guilt

37:30 Choosing Discomfort That Leads to Recovery

40:00 Final Reflection: What Will You Prune from Your Life?

Dive Deeper:

Burnout isn’t a personal failure or a lack of resilience. It’s a signal that something in the system, expectations, roles, pace, or support, is out of alignment. Conversations like this one help surface the human experience of burnout, while the broader work continues to explore how organizations can respond more intelligently and sustainably.

To explore burnout, leadership, and sustainable performance through a workplace and organizational lens, connect with Cait Donovan: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: 

https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-minute overview: 

https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout recovery gets complicated as Sarah sits down with Janine, an anonymous guest who is more than halfway through medical leave but still unable to rest. She loves her team and takes pride in her work, yet the thought of returning to the same boss and culture fills her with dread. Even time away hasn’t quieted the anxious loop of questions: Should she go back? Ask for a different role? Step into something lighter? Or leave altogether? And how do you listen to the body’s warning signals when the brain insists you “should” push through?

Through thoughtful coaching, Sarah helps Janine notice how her nervous system responds to each option and what those reactions reveal about her deeper truth. The turning point comes when Janine recognizes she isn’t looking for more information, she’s been waiting for permission to trust herself. One small next step, like reading a book without interruption, becomes more than rest. It’s an act of self-leadership.

This conversation pulls back the curtain on the messy middle of burnout recovery. There’s no perfect plan or quick fix - just the slow work of honoring signals, taking honest steps, and remembering that rest isn’t earned, it’s allowed.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Real-Time Burnout Coaching with Sarah Vosen

02:11 Janine’s Burnout Story and Medical Leave Struggles

04:40 Recognizing a Toxic Work Environment

07:27 Should I Return to Work or Walk Away?

08:15 Financial Concerns and Early Retirement

12:10 Anxiety About Returning to the Same Boss

20:04 High Achievers and the Pressure to Recover Quickly

24:52 The Trap of Maximizing Leave Time

31:11 Brain vs. Body: Who Do You Trust?

35:03 Learning to Trust Intuition and Body Signals

40:08 Creating Safety Through Small Choices

45:15 Choosing Restorative Activities Over Productivity

Dive Deeper:

Burnout isn’t a personal failure or a lack of resilience. It’s a signal that something in the system, expectations, roles, pace, or support, is out of alignment. Conversations like this one help surface the human experience of burnout, while the broader work continues to explore how organizations can respond more intelligently and sustainably.

To explore burnout, leadership, and sustainable performance through a workplace and organizational lens, connect with Cait Donovan: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: 

https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-minute overview: 

https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Grammy Award–winning producer Barry Goldstein joins Cait Donovan to explore burnout and the healing power of music. Barry shares how chasing success in New York’s music scene drained the joy from his craft - until he began composing at the rhythm of a relaxed heart. That experiment sparked “acoustoceuticals,” music designed to calm the nervous system, restore heart-brain coherence, and reignite passion.

Together, Cait and Barry unpack why some music heals while other music agitates, how to use sound as “musical nutrition” throughout your day, and why your heartbeat may be the most powerful frequency of all. Burnout isn’t the end… it’s a chance to fan the flame back to life!

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Introduction and Guest Barry Goldstein

03:26 Burnout in the Music Industry: Barry’s Story

08:04 Rediscovering Passion Through Heart-Centered Music

09:25 Healing at 60 Beats Per Minute

20:25 Entrainment: How Music Syncs With the Heart and Body

30:46 Resonance vs. Dissonance in Burnout Recovery

42:09 The Healing Power of Mantras and Daily Music Practices

Connect with Barry Goldstein:

Barry’s Website

Follow Barry on Instagram

Connect with Barry on LinkedIn

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mis/match, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

What does burnout look like before it takes you all the way down? For Emily Slachetka, it showed up as constant overwhelm, unexpected tears, and the thought of leaving a job she once valued. She joined UnFried hoping for validation that her workplace was toxic. Instead, she discovered her real challenge was over-functioning.

Emily shares how she learned to separate capability from capacity, the unexpected relief of “life pruning,” and the daily practices that helped her rebuild balance - like meditation, clearer boundaries, and asking for help. She also reflects on realigning her life with core values, from choosing a home with green space to recognizing the value of rest and doing nothing.

How do you know when you’re taking on too much? What shifts when you ask for help early? And how might work feel different if more of us normalized being human? Emily’s story is a reminder that recovery doesn’t always mean dramatic change. It can begin with small, intentional choices.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Introduction: Emily Slachetka

02:07 Emily’s Burnout Story and Joining UnFried

05:59 Toxic Workplace or Personal Overfunctioning?

08:48 Capability vs. Capacity Explained

10:05 Life Pruning and Asking for Help

15:19 Listening to the Body’s Signals

22:13 The Value of Doing Nothing

23:14 Moving States with Burnout Protection in Mind

36:24 Reigniting Passion, Purpose, and Identity Beyond Work

Dive Deeper:

Burnout isn’t a personal failure or a lack of resilience. It’s a signal that something in the system, expectations, roles, pace, or support, is out of alignment. Conversations like this one help surface the human experience of burnout, while the broader work continues to explore how organizations can respond more intelligently and sustainably.

To explore burnout, leadership, and sustainable performance through a workplace and organizational lens, connect with Cait Donovan: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: 

https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-minute overview: 

https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Toxic bosses don’t only wear people down, they spark the very burnout cycles that drain whole teams. Cait Donovan talks with author and change-maker Mita Mallick about the damage bad leadership leaves behind and the toll it takes on both people and organizations. Mita shares personal stories, including her experience with a boss she nicknamed “Medusa,” whose intimidation and cruelty pushed her into anxiety and disengagement. That season of her career led to what she calls a “get out plan,” a way to take the energy of frustration and turn it into action through networking, reflection, and mapping a path forward. How do you know when it’s time to make your own plan, and what would change if you gave yourself permission to act before you hit the breaking point?

The conversation also turns to the harder truth that under pressure any of us can slip into toxic behaviors. Mita and Cait explore why leadership requires self-awareness, accountability, and vulnerability rather than surface-level fixes or quick answers. Drawing from her new book “The Devil Emails at Midnight,” Mita challenges us to rethink how we respond to unhealthy work cultures and to consider the responsibility we each carry in shaping them. What kind of workplace are you helping to build, and how might things shift if you took ownership of the way you show up every day?

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Introduction to Fried, the Burnout Podcast

00:57 Meet Mita Mallick: Author of The Devil Emails at Midnight

02:26 Burnout Story: Surviving “Medusa” the Toxic Boss

09:09 Creating a “Get Out” Plan to Escape Burnout

17:13 Urgency Culture and Toxic Leadership Patterns

27:01 Workplace Bias, Pregnancy Penalties, and Burnout

31:37 Talent Hoarding and Betrayal at Work

38:19 Building Self-Awareness and Better Leadership

Connect with Mita Mallick:

Mita’s Website

Follow Mita on Instagram

Connect with Mita on LinkedIn

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mis/match, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout shows up in many ways, but at its core it often signals a life out of alignment. Cait Donovan sits down with executive coach and author Jerry Colonna to explore what happens when outward success hides an inner collapse. Jerry opens up about the years he spent chasing achievement as a venture capitalist and how every new milestone left him feeling worse instead of fulfilled. What does it mean when the world applauds your accomplishments but your soul feels heavier with each step forward? And how do we begin to untangle the beliefs that keep us performing long after they’ve stopped serving us?

Jerry shares how radical self-inquiry became a way back to himself. Rather than a process of blame, it is a practice of curiosity, asking questions that cut through guilt and open space for conscious choice. He and Cait reflect on how early coping strategies like perfectionism may once have offered safety, yet can slowly erode well-being over time. They also look at the role of privilege and access in recovery, naming the tension between personal agency and systemic limits.

Jerry’s story of “Grandfather Boulder” is a reminder that listening itself can be an act of healing. Could paying attention to our own pain, to each other, to the systems around us, the beginning of change? This episode invites you to consider what alignment looks like in your own life and how the ongoing work of inquiry can open the door to both resilience and growth.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Welcoming Jerry Colonna

02:39 Jerry’s Burnout Story and Misalignment

08:03 Financial Success and the Burnout Trap

16:17 Radical Self-Inquiry as a Path to Healing

24:00 Choosing Life in the Depth of Burnout

30:06 Rewiring Beliefs and Making Conscious Choices

40:30 Personal Growth as an Act of Resistance

46:23 Grandfather Boulder and the Power of Listening

Links

Reboot: Authentic CEO Coaching and Leadership Development

Connect with Jerry Colonna:

Connect with Jerry on LinkedIn

Follow Jerry on Instagram

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mis/match, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Healing happens faster with guidance. Give yourself permission to ask for and receive help: https://caitdonovan.com/coaching.

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout recovery gets real as Sarah Vosen sits down with an anonymous guest who feels trapped by perfectionism, people-pleasing, and the voice of an inner critic that makes self-compassion feel out of reach. In this episode, she’s trying something different for the podcast: a real-time coaching session. Her guest “Kate” describes how burnout began with constant illness and eventually knocked her flat, leaving her exhausted and uncertain about how to move forward. Years later, Kate still feels caught in a loop of trial and error, trying new practices, hoping for change, and losing faith when nothing seems to last. How do you find the courage to say no before your body forces you to? And how do you begin to quiet the inner critic that insists you’ll never get better?

Through thoughtful coaching, Sarah helps Kate see the fear of saying no for what it is: a strategy that once kept her safe but now keeps her stuck. She offers a new way to look at recovery, like a scale that can slowly tip away from self-judgment and toward self-compassion with each small act of courage. Along the way, Kate begins to see how even the tiniest pieces of evidence, moments of asking for help, choosing rest, or protecting her needs, can start to shift the balance.

This conversation opens a window into the real work of burnout recovery. It’s messy and slow, but it’s also a practice of rediscovering your voice, setting boundaries that protect your energy, and remembering that even a flicker of hope is proof that change is possible.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Real-Time Coaching on Burnout Recovery

02:26 Kate’s Burnout Journey and First Signs of Collapse

05:09 Career Uncertainty and Feeling Stuck

10:52 Battling the Inner Critic and Self-Judgment

12:38 Fear of Saying No and People-Pleasing Patterns

14:13 Rediscovering Passion for Storytelling and Audio

20:08 Hyper-Independence and the Struggle to Ask for Help

24:02 The Core Loop: Avoiding “No” to Feel Safe but Staying Stuck

33:00 The Burnout Recovery Process and the Unfried Program

43:03 Practicing Self-Compassion During Setbacks

49:41 Building Evidence for Growth and Recovery

Links

Hailey Page Magee episode

Kristin Neff episode

Your Burnt Out Brain Is Mean, And A Liar episode

Dive Deeper:

Burnout isn’t a personal failure or a lack of resilience. It’s a signal that something in the system, expectations, roles, pace, or support, is out of alignment. Conversations like this one help surface the human experience of burnout, while the broader work continues to explore how organizations can respond more intelligently and sustainably.

To explore burnout, leadership, and sustainable performance through a workplace and organizational lens, connect with Cait Donovan: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: 

https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-minute overview: 

https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout reaches far beyond the office, touching every layer of health, purpose, and identity, and Dr. Jen Wagner joins Cait Donovan to uncover what true recovery really looks like. As Chief Health and Performance Officer at Canyon Ranch, Dr. Wagner brings both professional expertise and lived experience, sharing how her own burnout as a young physician and mother reshaped her path and deepened her commitment to helping others heal. Together, she and Cait explore why burnout isn’t just mental exhaustion but a full-body, whole-life disruption that can strip away joy, relationships, and meaning.

This episode shines a light on Canyon Ranch’s integrative model of care, where labs, glucose and cortisol monitoring, nutrition, mental health, and spiritual practices come together to give people the tools and support they need to rebuild. Recovery, they emphasize, is not an overnight solution but a 12 to 18 month journey of self-awareness, community, and purpose realignment. Along the way, they tackle the systemic pressures that push women leaders to the brink and the cultural belief that suffering through misery is a badge of honor. What emerges is a powerful reminder that joy and well-being are not luxuries but essentials, and that choosing recovery is one of the most important investments we can make in ourselves and the people we love.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Meet Dr. Jen Wagner and the Burnout Retreat

03:28 How Burnout Reshapes Body, Identity, and Purpose

04:35 Recovery vs. Prevention of Burnout

06:56 Medical Testing and Biomarkers That Matter

10:18 Integrative Care and Community at Canyon Ranch

13:53 Dr. Jen Wagner’s Personal Burnout Story

22:09 Inside the Burnout Retreat Experience

29:12 Long-Term Recovery and Ongoing Support

Connect with Dr. Jen Wagner:

Canyon Ranch

Canyon Ranch: Beat Burnout

Follow Canyon Ranch on Instagram

LinkedIn

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mis/match, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout recovery takes more than waiting for time to pass. It asks you to examine who you’ve been, who you want to be, and what kind of life will truly sustain you. In this #straightfromcait episode, Cait Donovan explores one of the questions she hears most often: how long does it take to heal from burnout? 

Drawing on her own experience, client stories, and survey results from her community, Cait shares why most people need 12 to 18 months to recover, with some taking longer when deeper shifts are involved. The process can be stretched by the challenge of letting go of a “dream job,” the demands of caregiving, or the fear of stepping into unfamiliar territory. Recovery unfolds in cycles where you make a change, work through the emotions that follow, and then move into the next phase. 

How do you handle the moments when your old identity no longer works? How do you adapt when your relationships change in ways you didn’t expect? This episode reveals why burnout pushes you toward a life that actually fuels you and why the journey, though demanding, is worth the effort.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 How Long Does Burnout Recovery Take

01:19 Typical Recovery Timelines and Survey Insights

02:32 Key Factors That Prolong Recovery

04:08 Caregiving Challenges and Boundary Setting

06:05 Emotional and Identity Shifts in Recovery

08:14 Why Burnout Requires a Life That Fuels You

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mis/match, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout can make every decision feel impossible. When you’re stuck in fear and second-guessing everything, how are you supposed to move forward in a way that actually feels right?

In this episode, Cait Donovan shares a tool she’s used for years to help people get unstuck: the “Worst Case Scenario” exercise. Instead of pushing fear aside, Cait walks you through what it looks like to write it down, face it head-on, and figure out what you’d do if the worst really did happen. What if the job burns you out all over again? What if you don’t take it and money runs out? What then?

This episode offers a different way to navigate those moments, one that makes space for fear without letting it take over. Cait also reminds us that support doesn’t have to come from big, obvious places. Sometimes it’s your local librarian. Sometimes it’s a Facebook group. There are more options than you think. If you’ve been feeling stuck and unsure what to do next, this is a place to start.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Introduction to FRIED. The Burnout Podcast

00:00 Burnout Recovery and Cait’s Mission

01:28 The Worst Case Scenario Exercise Explained

03:35 Burnout Fear Example: Job Decision After Leave

05:01 What to Do If the Worst Happens

08:11 How to Build a Personal Safety Net

10:10 Exploring Alternate Outcomes

12:04 Final Thoughts and Encouragement

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mis/match, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Burnout thrives in silence. This episode is your reminder that healing often starts with one simple but radical act: asking for help.

Sarah Vosen, Director of Coaching at Burn Bold, shares a personal #sarahshares about finding herself stuck in exhaustion despite doing everything she thought she needed to recover. As a coach and acupuncturist, she’s used to helping others untangle their burnout, but this time, she needed someone else to help her remember what works. That turning point led her back to a grounding Qigong-inspired practice called “pulling down heavens,” which uses breath, movement, and intention to bring energy back into flow. Sarah’s story is a powerful reflection on how easy it is to slip into hyper-independence and how much shifts when we let ourselves receive support. If you’ve been tired for too long, this episode is a gentle nudge toward replenishment.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Why Burnout Recovery Starts with Asking for Help

01:24 The Trap of Hyper-Independence and Self-Judgment

02:06 Why Even Coaches Need Coaches

03:54 How Refusing Help Fuels Burnout

04:39 Qigong and Daily Practices That Actually Work

06:14 Pulling Down Heavens: A Burnout Recovery Ritual

10:14 How to Make the Practice Stick

11:39 When It’s Time to Ask for Support

Links

Guided meditation:

https://open.spotify.com/episode/0WGHqwQAVbZEY1qLC9XyZL?si=bf0217195beb4b2f

Dive Deeper:

Burnout isn’t a personal failure or a lack of resilience. It’s a signal that something in the system, expectations, roles, pace, or support, is out of alignment. Conversations like this one help surface the human experience of burnout, while the broader work continues to explore how organizations can respond more intelligently and sustainably.

To explore burnout, leadership, and sustainable performance through a workplace and organizational lens, connect with Cait Donovan: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: 

https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-minute overview: 

https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Cait Donovan is back with a #straightfromcait episode that gets real about something most of us wrestle with quietly, how we soothe ourselves when things get hard, and what that looks like after burnout.

This time, Cait’s digging into her long-standing sugar habit. Not the occasional treat, but the reflex to reach for something sweet when emotions start to build. She thought she’d done the work. And in many ways, she had. But what happens when one old pattern refuses to budge? What if the thing you’re avoiding isn’t the habit itself but the discomfort underneath it?

With support from dietitian Sydney Green, Cait starts looking at her sugar story with a new kind of honesty, one that doesn’t involve shame or harsh rules. Instead of overhauling everything, she chooses one small shift: no more sugar in her coffee. That simple move starts a ripple effect, including tracking her blood sugar with a CGM and learning what her body’s been trying to say all along.

This episode is an invitation to ask yourself the hard questions with compassion. What have you been unwilling to change? What would it feel like to start small and let that be enough?

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Sugar, Self-Neglect, and Burnout Recovery

02:16 How We Trick Ourselves Into Thinking We’ve Done the Work

03:10 Unpacking Lifelong Food Patterns with Sydney Green

04:26 Why Starting Small Actually Works

06:13 Using a CGM to Understand Sugar’s Impact

07:26 Real Healing Begins with Small, Honest Steps

Links

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mis/match, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

If your brain screams ‘lazy’ every time you try to rest, it’s time to stop trusting a bully and start listening to the one part of you that never lies: your body. So many people in burnout recovery hear the same harsh inner dialogue. “You’re lazy.” “You should be doing more.” “You’ll never be enough.” But what if those thoughts aren’t reflections of reality, just echoes of a brain running on exhaustion and fear?

Sarah Vosen is back for another #sarahshares episode to unpack a powerful community poll that revealed just how mean our minds can be when we try to rest. She walks through what it means to recognize those messages as lies and gives guidance for tuning into your body’s truth instead. Because when the body says “I’m too tired,” it isn't a weakness. It’s wisdom.

This episode invites you to try a different approach - one rooted in self-compassion, small moments of rest, and the radical idea that your worth isn’t tied to your productivity.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 What Your Brain Says When You Try to Rest

03:02 The Lying Brain vs. the Truthful Body

07:09 How to Rest Even When Guilt Creeps In

08:13 Why Self-Compassion Is Key to Burnout Recovery

10:00 Sarah’s Personal Turning Point with Self-Kindness

13:03 Can Wearable Data Help You Trust Your Body Again?

Links

Listening to your body:

https://open.spotify.com/episode/7f3rMZ42rwnWW3c8kuAKk5?si=YSkz0JS0RTyOwWu6LN4XOA

Kristin Neff:

https://open.spotify.com/episode/5vHiMpzVHcOYRdvDXwbyE1?si=AmhF8nCERjm5zLBY2rKsFw

How to resolve exhaustion:

https://open.spotify.com/episode/0W65Yv1l2aOI7F5ZyebfXs?si=Eyt5XV8uS8ODyv7DxoJfeg

Dive Deeper:

Burnout isn’t a personal failure or a lack of resilience. It’s a signal that something in the system, expectations, roles, pace, or support, is out of alignment. Conversations like this one help surface the human experience of burnout, while the broader work continues to explore how organizations can respond more intelligently and sustainably.

To explore burnout, leadership, and sustainable performance through a workplace and organizational lens, connect with Cait Donovan: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: 

https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-minute overview: 

https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm

Imposter syndrome has a way of creeping in when we’ve spent so long meeting everyone else’s expectations that we forget what we actually want for ourselves.

In this episode, Cait Donovan reconnects with Nicole Kalil for a conversation about burnout, confidence, and the stories we tell ourselves when we’re doing all the right things but still don’t feel like we belong. Nicole shares what happened when she finally cleared space in her life and was left with a surprising sense of emptiness, a feeling that’s all too common but rarely talked about. What do you do when achievement no longer feels satisfying? How do you navigate that awkward in-between where you’re no longer burned out, but not quite sure who you are without the hustle?

Together, Cait and Nicole explore the deeper patterns behind imposter syndrome, including the habit of blaming yourself when things go wrong and dismissing your role when things go right. They talk about how women especially are conditioned to internalize failure, and how that mindset can make even well-deserved success feel like a fluke. They also raise an important question: when you say you don’t belong, is it because of the culture around you or because you haven’t figured out what belonging actually feels like for you?

This isn’t a step-by-step guide. This episode’s an invitation to pause, question what you’ve been carrying, and consider what it might look like to build confidence from a place of self-trust rather than constant achievement.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Welcome to FRIED: The Burnout Podcast

02:16 The Link Between Burnout and Feeling Underwhelmed

07:22 What Imposter Syndrome Really Means

12:28 Why High Achievers Struggle to Own Their Success

17:06 Recognizing Red, Yellow, and Green Light Phases

21:05 How to Manage Head Trash and Build Confidence

24:23 Gender, Expectations, and the Pressure to Perform

30:02 Is It a Toxic Workplace or Just a Bad Fit?

36:56 Separating Facts from Feelings

41:26 Rewiring Your Brain with Cognitive Reappraisal

47:11 Where to Find Nicole Kalil and Her Confidence Quiz

Links

Connect with Nicole Kalil:

https://www.instagram.com/nicolemkalil/

www.linkedin.com/in/nicolekalil

https://nicolekalil.com/confidencequiz

Connect with Cait:

Cait Donovan is a keynote speaker, author, and host of FRIED: The Burnout Podcast, specializing in burnout, mis/match, and sustainable performance at work. She partners with corporate leaders, teams, and professional associations through keynotes, workshops, and leadership sessions that treat burnout as data, not failure, to help organizations reduce burnout without blame or shame and build healthier, high performing cultures.

To bring Cait to your organization or event, book an inquiry call here: https://bit.ly/bookcait

Learn more about Cait’s speaking work: https://www.caitdonovan.com/speaking

Short on time? Watch this 3-min video: https://bit.ly/caitdreel2025

Burnout Recovery works better with support. UNFRIED is our small group (5 people max!) coaching program to help guide you through your recovery. Apply now! [http://bit.ly/unfried]

Podcast production and show notes provided by HiveCast.fm