Explorez tous les épisodes du podcast Decoding the Gurus
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| Mini Decoding: Back in the K-Hole | 29 Mar 2025 | 01:29:09 | |
In this very special episode, Matt and Chris, despite swearing off any further Dr. K content after their previous three-part series, find themselves bleary-eyed and once again tumbling into the familiar depths of the K-Hole. Yes, they’re back with Dr. K, everyone’s favourite enlightened Twitch non-therapy therapist, now emerging from a self-declared midlife crisis with some powerful new revelations. Chief among them: while enlightenment may not technically be for sale, you can certainly pay to “level up your propensity for it.” After years of humble-bragging about undercharging for his mental health guides, Dr. K has boldly pivoted to defending high-priced spiritual initiations. If you thought enlightenment involved effort, introspection, and maybe a bit of humility, think again—it turns out you can outsource your spiritual growth to a guru, who will do the grinding for you. Great news for Elon Musk. Join Matt and Chris as they machete their way through a jungle of surreal analogies—landscaping contracts, parental down payments, Bluetooth enlightenment, and monetised spiritual energy transfer—all in service of a worldview where the real obstacle to self-actualisation is your reluctance to wire $10,000 to a spiritually enriched craftsman for a golden amulet. So fill up your chakras, empty your critical thinking cup, and enjoy this trip through the mystic marketplace—where your spiritual awakening is just one overpriced relic away. Links
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| Gurometer: Naomi Klein | 23 Mar 2025 | 00:33:12 | |
In the wake of our Naomi Klein episode, the masses have spoken. And like the responsible Gurometricians that we are, we've taken your feedback to heart and thus open this episode with a series of scientific and spiritual recitations. Then it's straight back into the sweet science—and mystical art—of Gurometry, as we test how well it measures up to Naomi Klein’s anti-capitalist spirit. Fun for the whole family! P.S. Don't worry—Chris Langan’s Gurometer has not been forgotten and will be arriving very soon! The full episode is available for Patreon subscribers (1hr 4 mins). Join us at: https://www.patreon.com/DecodingTheGurus Gurometer: Naomi Klein 00:00 Introduction 01:29 Sponsor Shoutouts! 03:29 Naomi Klein Feedback 05:03 Podcast Format Limitations and Reading the Book! 11:37 Consistency in Standards of Evaluation 20:21 Evaluating the Arguments Independent of the Conclusions 24:53 The Importance of Disconfirming Evidence 26:28 Differing Definitions Cross-Culturally 29:36 The Gurometer 29:59 Galaxy Brainness 32:03 Cultishness 34:02 Anti-Establishmentarianism 38:12 Grievance Mongering 38:55 Self-Aggrandizement 41:29 Cassandra Complex 44:06 Revolutionary Theories 46:53 Pseudo Profound Bullshit 49:25 Conspiracy Mongering 53:57 Excessive Profiteering 54:48 Moral Grandstanding 56:04 Final Scores and Reflections 58:52 Quickfire Guru Bonus Points | |||
| Peter Thiel: The Techno-Apocalypse is Nigh | 04 Feb 2025 | 03:08:23 | |
In this episode, Matt and Chris tackle the big ideas—or at least the ones rattling around in Peter Thiel’s mind. Tech billionaire, venture capitalist, and political kingmaker, Thiel has long been a looming figure in Silicon Valley, known for his deep pockets, contrarian takes, and peculiar philosophical musings. But beneath the surface-level libertarian posturing, what does Thiel actually believe? And does it hold up to scrutiny? The decoders dig into Thiel’s recent interview on Uncommon Knowledge, where he waxes biblical about end times, interprets the katechon with all the confidence of a medieval theologian, and seamlessly blends venture capitalism with prophecies of the Antichrist. Along the way, they explore Thiel’s method of connecting historical dots with pure vibes, and his Jetsons Fallacy, the deep disappointment that the world looks more like The Office than a 1960s vision of the future. They dissect the Sensemaker Aristocracy surrounding him—with its reverent back-patting and strange mix of deference and obfuscation that turns tech moguls into prophets. They also highlight Thiel’s bizarre leaps in logic, from citing biblical prophecies to warning about one-world free-trade Communist government conspiracies and his confusing stance on technological progress—simultaneously lamenting stagnation while fearing we’re racing too fast toward Armageddon. Of course, no billionaire worldview would be complete without some COVID conspiracies, and Thiel delivers, crafting an elaborate Fauci Bioweapon Paradox in which the pandemic response was simultaneously overblown and also secretly justified because the virus was (obviously) engineered. So is Peter Thiel a visionary? A libertarian Cassandra? Or just a very wealthy man with a lot of half-formed ideas and a habit of mumbling them into microphones? Matt and Chris wade through the mess so you don’t have to. Stay till the end for the Revolutionary Leprechaun Theory of Western Civilization… if you dare. Links
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| Robin DiAngelo: Matt and Chris struggle with their fragility | 02 Nov 2022 | 03:07:41 | |
Racism is all around. It surrounds us and penetrates us; it binds white people together. And if you try to deny it, it only makes it stronger. That's Robin DiAngelo's thesis, anyway, and she calls this dark force (and the book that made her famous) White Fragility. You know you've got white fragility if you refuse to accept the truth of white fragility. Also, all white people have it. So that's pretty straightforward at least. How do you fight the curse of whiteness? Well, it's a lifelong journey of 'Doing the Work', but one thing's for sure: it starts with reading books like White Fragility and attending seminars well... like hers. DiAngelo's been out of the discourse recently, as far as we can tell, busy beavering away on new books like Nice Racism: How Progressive White People Perpetuate Racial Harm and dismantling white supremacy via corporate group therapy sessions. However, in our original show blurb, we promised to cover 'gurus from Jordan Peterson to Robin DiAngelo', so here we are. Now she's no longer this week's hot culture war topic that's getting people (...racists probably) all riled up, it's the perfect time to cross this particular Pokemon off our list. We listened to a lecture she gave in 2018, where she helpfully lays out the key aspects of her theory. There's so much in store for listeners this week. You'll be able to thrill to the anecdote of how DiAngelo herself was disgustingly racist to a colleague, be shocked as Chris once again references Northern Ireland's colourful history and tries to deflect his people's obvious guilt onto the English, be amazed as Matthew courageously confronts his settler-colonial privilege, and learn the real story of the first African American baseball player to cross the colour line (as told by DiAngelo). So join the intrepid duo as they embark on this neverending journey to interrogate their whiteness. And maybe - verrrry carefully - try to be just a little bit critical of DiAngelo's arguments without axiomatically proving themselves hopelessly racist. Listen in and judge for yourself! Links
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| Interview with Konstantin Kisin from Triggernometry on Heterodoxy, Biases, and the Media | 15 Oct 2022 | 02:05:58 | |
An interesting one today with an extended interview/discussion with Konstantin Kisin co-host of the Triggernometry YouTube channel and Podcast and author of An Immigrant's Love Letter to the West. Topics covered include potential biases in the mainstream and heterodox spheres, media coverage in the covid era, debate within the heterodox sphere, the dangers of focusing on interpersonal relationships, and whether the WEF is really using wokism to make everyone eat bugs and live in pods. It's fair to say that we do not see eye to eye on various issues but Konstantin puts in a spirited defence for his positions and there are various positions where a two-person consensus is achieved. Matt was physically present but he preferred to occupy the spiritual position of The Third for this conversation, given Chris' greater familiarity with Konstantin's output. Prior to the interview, we have an extended, somewhat grievance-heavy, opening segment in which we discuss 1) the recent damages awarded in the 2nd Sandyhook court case against Alex Jones, 2) Russian apologetics and the heterodox sphere, and 3) Institutional Distrust and Conspiracy Spirals. Dare we say this is a thematically consistent episode? Maybe... in any case, there should be plenty for people to agree or disagree with, which is partly why our podcast exists. So join us in this voyage into institutional and heterodox biases and slowly come to the dreaded conclusion that philosophers might be right about something... epistemics might actually matter. Links
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| Peterson, Murray & Pageau: Transcendent Tableware | 30 Sep 2022 | 01:00:38 | |
In this bitesize decoding, a conservative columnist, a religious icon carver, and a tortured ex-psychologist walk into a Daily Wire studio and try to hash out some solution of the meta-meaning-crisis. In an astounding twist it turns out it involves embracing traditional Christianity. Who could have guessed? Join us on Jordan’s religious powered rocket as we consider the esoteric mystery of tableware, how fiction is probably true, and try to uncover what’s the deal with atheist materialists anyway? In a nutshell, it's the same old drum that's being beaten: it only seems like science does better than religion at explaining things, because religion trumps science because God does causality in mysterious non-material ways. Maybe ways that have something to do with symbols and meaning or whatever. Ho hum - this is why it's a mini-decoding and not a full episode. It's more than OK to skip this one if you feel you've already got a handle on Jordan and Pageau's jam. But honestly, it's maybe all worth it to hear Pageau's explain 'vertical causation'. Try to follow the argument there, we dare you. Along the way Matt and Chris will also teach us valuable lessons like how to deal with road rage bullies or aggressive bull sharks and how if you really want to be a Christian it’s ok to go to mass. Links | |||
| Interview with Neil Levy on Intellectual Virtue Signalling | 27 Sep 2022 | 01:56:42 | |
Fellow decoders: a few weeks ago Chris and Matt were invited to virtually attend a lecture at Macquarie University that promised to be of interest for the podcast. And that lecture was presented by the philosophy professor Neil Levy on the intriguing topic of 'Intellectual Virtue Signalling'. That is the status-seeking advertising of what is commonly perceived as intellectual virtues. We found Neil's thesis extremely compelling, with clear applications to a lot of the stuff we observe week on and week out on DTG. So, naturally, we swallowed our pride and our eternal disdain for philosophy and begged Neil to grace our humble show with his presence. Neil kindly agreed and we proceeded to have an enjoyable conversation with our patented meandering waffle juxtaposed against Neil's careful philosophizing. Before the interview, we also spend a little bit of time spelling out our policy on being abusive to the gurus. Here it is in summary: Don't do it! Robust criticism, ok. Personal abuse/doxing, is not ok. Got it? Good! Prof. Levy holds a dual position at the Faculty of Philosophy at Oxford University. He publishes not only in practical ethics and moral philosophy but also across diverse topics in cognition, addiction, and pathology. Neil has also written a number of books, most recently: 'Bad Beliefs' is directly related to the podcast, and is available freely online! We heartily recommend this interview, and might even go so far as to say Neil has helpfully provided us with a bit of conceptual framework that undergirds some high-level stuff that's happening within and across the quantum circuits of the Gurometer. Thanks for that Neil! | |||
| Daniel Schmachtenberger, Jamie Wheal & Jordan Hall: Making Sense about Making Sense of Sensemaking | 14 Sep 2022 | 03:37:05 | |
It's finally here! In what has to be our most meta episode to date, Matt and Chris tackle the meta-philosophy / meta-spirituality / meta-science that is Sensemaking. You might say sensemaking is sense to the power of 2. But what is sensemaking, really? Well, that's a tricky question because as Jordan Hall says; no one can simply be told what sensemaking is. It is the escape hatch out of The Matrix, it is the finger pointing at the moon, it is a possibility space in an nth dimensional cube.... whatever the hell it is, some people are pretty sure it's the solution to all of humanity's problems. Exciting! So, since defining sensemaking is like trying to staple a jellyfish to a wall, it is very understandable that Jordan Hall, Jamie Wheal, and Daniel Schmachtenberger would take 2 hours and 40 minutes out of their busy schedule, and have a meta-conversation about this meta-topic, where they try to decipher exactly what this strange beast is and do some sensemaking about sensemaking. And it's even MORE understandable that Chris Kavanagh and Matthew Browne would take even longer out of their own schedules to try to analyse THAT discourse: sensemaking about sensemaking about sensemaking. Shifting to power notation for brevity, this episode is sensemaking cubed, which equals sense to the power of 4. How did we go? Well, sensemaking is like an elephant and everybody's got a piece of it. Chris is tweaking the tail, Matt's busy fondling the trunk, Daniel's inspecting the ears, and Jordan Hall is riding that bad boy, trampling poor Jamie Wheal and scaring all the monkeys. But we get there, we get there... So join us as we operate in 75 simultaneous paradigms, make not just sense but anti-nonsense, and discover what the difference really is between a puzzle and a photograph. Links
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| Interview with Helen Lewis on culture wars and religion, that Jordan Peterson interview, and gurus generally | 03 Sep 2022 | 02:16:58 | |
Today Chris and Matt are visited by Helen Lewis, a journalist, editor, and writer with what could very fairly be described as a rather distinguished career in those fields. Helen has previously worked at the New Statesman and is currently with The Atlantic. She has also served as a Women in the Humanities Honorary Writing Fellow at Oxford University and also on the steering committee for the Reuters Institute for Journalism at Oxford University. Her books include Difficult Women: A History of Feminism in 11 Fights. Helen's work covers a broad array of topics including politics, feminist issues, and contemporary/online culture. She is also known for a particular long-form interview which became a 'viral moment' when she sat down for a challenging discussion with one, Jordan B. Peterson. Most recently Helen has produced "The Church of Social Justice" for BBC4, which asks whether political movements might be taking the place of traditional religions in Britain. A question which never generates any controversy whatsoever. She is also working on an upcoming project that looks at internet gurus and the ecosystems they spawn. So, we were glad to take the opportunity to catch up and talk about the intersections with our rather idiosyncratic collection of interests. Join us as we try to decipher whether everything is a religion, if social justice requires a pope, and how exactly can we resolve ALL of those thorny culture war debates. We might not ultimately reach any satisfying answers but Helen does offer her one rule for life at the end of the interview! Also featured on this episode: our most defensive response to a review to date, and a segment on the dangers of JAQing off! Links
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| Interview with Dan Friesen from Knowledge Fight on Alex Jones, the Sandy Hook Trial, and conspiracy ecosystems | 27 Aug 2022 | 02:14:51 | |
A special crossover episode (long anticipated- at least by us) with one-half of the Knowledge Fight podcast. Specifically, we have Dan Friesen on to enlighten us about all things Alex Jones, the recent trial with the Sandy Hook parents, and to compare notes regarding gurus and conspiracy theorists. Not to mention to give Chris the chance to demonstrate his inner fanboy! Dan is a guy with an encyclopaedic knowledge of Alex Jones and some very astute insights into conspiracy psychology. In fact, Matt and Chris think he might be most accurately considered as something of a rogue anthropologist doing deep ethnographic observation of the InfoWars ecosystem. Dan, meanwhile, maintains he's just a guy! Either way, Dan and the Knowledge Fight podcast are definitely our kind of bag. We hope you too enjoy the conversation and there is plenty of Knowledge Fight episodes (700+) if this leaves you wanting more. Also, in this episode, we discuss Sam Harris' recent online travails, Jordan Peterson's appearance on Lex, and at the end of the episode, Matt finally learns what the podcast is really about! Links
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| John Vervaeke & Jonathan Pageau: Decoding the Demons | 21 Aug 2022 | 00:47:05 | |
Ahead of the forthcoming sense-making full course decoding of Jordan Hall, Daniel Schmactenberger, and Jamie Wheal (see here!), we offer a bite-sized morsel of sense-making to whet your episode. Here Matt and Chris engage in a 'short' session of gurunalysis, or guruology (if you prefer the original Latin). The subject of the gurunalysis is a conversation between the cognitive scientist & philosopher, John Vervaeke and the amateur theologian/icon carver, Jonathan Pageau. Specifically, we join these two as they apply sensemaking to delve deep into the spine-chilling world of demonology. Are demons real creatures, patterns of thought that resonant in collective cognition, or maybe both? And what about daemons, egregores, banshees, how do they fit in? Join us for this special mini decoding and find out! Links
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| Interview with Elgen Strait on the Unification Church and the assassination of Shinzo Abe | 20 Aug 2022 | 01:40:53 | |
This episode is a little bit of this and a little bit of that. The main portion of the episode features an interview with returning guest, Elgen Strait, host of the Falling Out podcast. Previously we've had Elgen on to talk about his life growing up as a second-generation member of Reverend Moon's Unification Church (the Moonies) and also to help us decode some historical lectures of Moon. This time he is back to talk about the recent assassination of the former Japanese prime minister, Shinzo Abe, and the role that the Unification church played in that event. Heavy stuff but it felt like an important topic to discuss given Elgen's expertise, Chris' location, and the theme of the podcast. But that's not all! Also in this episode, you get a slightly out-of-date update on Alex Jone's trial (which will be good preparation for a forthcoming interview with Knowledge Fight's Dan Friesen) and a mini-decoding of Lex Fridman and Joe Rogan's recent conversation. Consider this a coda to the techno monk episode, that perhaps gives a glimpse into the more sinister side of that somewhat endearing naivety. The next decoding episode we are back with the sensemakers and it's one you won't want to miss! Links
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| Special: Guru Right to Reply with Robert Wright | 31 Jul 2022 | 02:24:31 | |
As per Section 7, paragraph 3, item 2 in the Gurometer Constitution and User Manual states, "All covered gurus shall have a Right to Reply" and Robert Wright has taken us up on this invitation! Now, this provision is generally intended to allow the poor dears we cover a rejoinder to all the insults, smears, and canards we routinely employ in our 'take-downs'. But our coverage of Bob was almost entirely positive. As Bob says in this episode, "You liked me, you really liked me!". So, this was actually more of an excuse to catch up and tie off a few bows. Bob clarifies a few points on the more speculative frontiers of his worldview, and exactly what he means when he talks about potential teleologies in evolution. But the warm fuzzies and mutual back-patting in this interview quickly devolve into yet another bitter intra-podcast internecine feud about consciousness and whether it's 'spooky' or not. Matt accuses Chris of being a p-zombie, which he's done before, but since it's an ad-hominem par excellence, we can all agree it deserves more than one shake of the sauce bottle. Bob does his best to walk (Chris) Matt back from the precipice of madness but to no avail. Although we might possibly have failed, once again, to solve the ultimate mystery of the human condition, at least a good waffley time was had by all. In the original episode, we made only passing reference to our disagreements with Bob over international relations, and Syria in particular. The Russian invasion of Ukraine has happened in the interim, and this has been a big focus of Bob's output since then. So, we have at-it a bit on that, on the benefits and limits of deploying cognitive empathy, and we touch on Grayzone and Bellingcat and who's dis-informing whom. It's no secret we earnestly disagree with Bob on geopolitics. But it's most definitely one of those topics where decent people can disagree. Since he's a frood who Really Knows Where His Towel is, we always appreciate the chance to talk to him. And who knows, one day Matt and Chris might even be wrong about something!? If so, I'm sure the subreddit will let us know. Enjoy! Links
Your Gurometer Ratings! If you want to play along you can add your own scores for Jordan or any of our previous gurus here: And if you want to check the collected results: | |||
| The Wounded Bird Lex Fridman vs. The Evil Ukrainian Bot Farms | 22 Jan 2025 | 01:20:00 | |
In this episode, we look at a recently released segment by Lex Fridman, where he reflects on his interview with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky. We examine Lex’s self-presentation as a Christ-like figure—someone who is willing to suffer, feign naivety and ignorance, and even risk his life in the name of world peace—all while maintaining an eight-hour daily study regimen and enduring relentless, unfair attacks from Ukrainian bot farms and war-loving critics. Like true sensemakers, we also entertain an outlandish alternative hypothesis: what if Lex is, in fact, an arrogant and biased podcaster—dismissive of criticism, oblivious to his political leanings, and adopting a “wounded bird” persona to elicit sympathy from his audience? Join us as we sift through the Zelensky's (supposed) failures, the bot farms, and the wounded bird theatrics to determine whether Lex is a hero for peace—or just another podcaster lost in his own narrative. Sources
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| Recoding Jordan Peterson: Think again, Sunshine! | 24 Jul 2022 | 01:36:53 | |
Matt and Chris are back in the headspace of the Alchemical Lemon, Jordan Peterson, with what was supposed to be a shorter format decoding episode. You can judge for yourself how well that worked out! Nevertheless, this is still a 'recoding' episode of a previously decoded guru. For those interested, Jordan was covered way back in Episode 3 and jointly with Bret Weinstein in Episode 18. It seemed about time to dip back into the ineffable well of the undisputed master of metaphors given that he seems to have revived his old Agenda Insight persona (minus the Fedora). This time we find Jordan in a foul mood delivering some stern advice to the Christian Churches on how to attract and recruit young men. He's been on a bit of a roll recently (since joining the Daily Wire) and thus far has delivered unsolicited 'messages' to Christians, Muslims, and CEOs. The mind boggles at how much advice he will have provided and to how many groups before the year is out! So join the decoders for a (theoretically) condensed decoding of a paradigmatic modern guru on the rampage. Think we are kidding? Think again sunshine. Listen... NOW! Do it, before it is too late. Links
Your Gurometer Ratings! If you want to play along you can add your own scores for Jordan or any of our previous gurus here: And if you want to check the collected results: | |||
| *Patreon Preview* Lex and Haidt: Gurometer Ratings | 10 Jul 2022 | 00:46:57 | |
What's this? Another episode? Well, sort of... Providing both a tantalising peak behind the Patreon curtain and an apology for the delayed release, we decided to release this week's Gurometer episode to everyone. Witness the science (/art) of Gurometry in action, as we fire up the Gurometer(TM) to calculate the precise Guru-nature of a techno monk and a perturbed social scientist. If you want to play along you can add your own scores for Lex, Haidt, or any of our previous gurus here: And if you want to check the collected results: | |||
| Lex Fridman & Jonathan Haidt: The Techno Monk & The Social Scientist | 08 Jul 2022 | 03:03:43 | |
First, we apologise sincerely for the delayed-release. Matt and Chris have been busy beavers splicing together this decoding which proved particular gruelling for all sorts of uninteresting (but on-theme) technical reasons. But finally, the wait is over and the long-anticipated episode on AI-aficionado and popular podcast host, Lex Fridman, is here. Although as the title indicates this accidentally turned into a joint decoding episode of his guest, the 'heterodox' social psychologist, Jonathan Haidt. Lex is an interesting character and as such, for the decoding, two rather different pieces of content were selected: 1) a day-in-the-life video dairy and 2) one of his characteristic long-form interviews (with Haidt discussing social media). The format of a day-in-the-life video is perhaps inescapably cringey but it did give some unique insight into Lex's techno-monk lifestyle and his ongoing fascination/discovery of just how bad the Nazis & Hitler were. His interview with Haidt on the other hand was more substantial and covers a lot of tech-related issues that are genuinely complex and subject to an ongoing debate. Jonathan Haidt is a famous and well-regarded academic but also something of a controversial figure online in part because of his involvement in the dreaded 'culture wars'. In particular, Haidt co-wrote the influential book 'The Codding of the American Mind', founded 'Heterodox Academy', and is a vocal critic of 'wokism' and certain aspects of social media. We take a look at his arguments and try to discern whether he is a nuanced social scientist offering prescient warnings or a boomer shaking his fist at the kids these days? Join us and find out! Links
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| Interview with Nathan Allebach on Online Brands, Weird Twitter & that Steak Umms Account | 10 Jun 2022 | 02:06:45 | |
In a way, we're all managing our personal brand in the infosphere aren't we? But Nathan Allebach, in a far more tangible way, really does manage brands - not just his own, but also for companies. And in managing the Steak-Umm brand on twitter, he drew attention by being one of the first to adopt a personal, authentic, and informative style - covering topics far beyond the world of frozen processed steak. Far from providing the typical zero-calorie bland corporate platitudes, Nathan quickly drew attention by delivering substantial threads on weighty topics like conspiracism and online disinformation. He played a delicate game of being edgy without being snarky or combative, providing informative and positive intellectual fare, nourishing both the hearts and minds of twitter users everywhere. As a hardened and savvy longtime twitter user, he's got a good understanding of the weirdness of Being Online, and the various ways to do so. So, we were glad to have a chance to meat Nathan (virtually of course, not in the flesh), to get his insights on navigating the online world, on what it means to See and Be Seen there, and his personal approach to Doing It Right. He didn't share any Convenient Meat Recipes For Busy Professionals though, weirdly enough... Maybe we'll have to get him back for that. Links
Gurometer Want to help us rate the Gurus? You can enter your own scores for any Guru here! | |||
| Jaron Lanier: Fear of an Algorithmic Planet | 30 May 2022 | 01:54:42 | |
The season of tech is upon us! Hold on to your hats and press those non-fungible tokens tightly to your bosom, because we are getting into the thick of it. Matt and Chris kick things off with an exploration of tech pioneer Jaron Lanier. Sometimes referred to as the father of virtual reality, Jaron is a promising candidate for gurudom given his foreboding warnings of a bleak algorithmic future and a penchant for opening tech lectures barefoot with impromptu performances of exotic instruments. In short, he's a groovy guy and Matt digs that! Chris, being the sour lemon that he is, takes a little while to adjust to Jaron's particular style. Some Weinsteinian warning signs might be flashing but there really are eccentric and very clever people in the world... and Lanier might just be one of them? He certainly has a track record of critically commenting on techno-optimism and social media platforms for at least two decades. But some of his pronouncements seem a tad OTT and some recommendations a little hand-wavy... So how do the decoders square this particular dread-locked circle? Well, you're going to have to listen all the way to the end to find out. So, get yourself comfortable. Drink some coffee and pop some no-doze, and strap yourself in. Smash the Duck! Links
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| *Patreon Preview* Decoding Academia 8: Monkey see, Monkey do? | 24 May 2022 | 00:59:38 | |
Ahead of the Jaron Lanier episode a special preview episode of our ongoing Decoding Academia series. This week Matt and Chris take a look at a classic comparative study of social learning processes in chimpanzees and infants (Horner & Whiten, 2005). They discover the correct method to break into a puzzle box, that chimpanzees are sometimes more logical than people, and that popular idioms do not always house universal truths. For anyone interested in reading the paper it is available for free here. We will be back later in the week with our normal decoding episode. | |||
| Interview with Michael Inzlicht on the Replication Crisis, Mindfulness, and Responsible Heterodoy | 20 May 2022 | 02:11:32 | |
It's been a while but don't worry the DtG elves have been hard at work and a veritable bounty of content is on its way. The long-promised Jaron Lanier decoding is on its way next week, but this week the cross-overs continue as we are joined by Mickey Inzlicht, esteemed Psychologist, Research Excellence Faculty Scholar at the University of Toronto, and long term (retired) co-host of the Two Psychologists, Four Beers podcast. Mickey has now hung up his podcasting headphones but like an old prizefighter, we were able to lure him back into the limelight one last time with promises of unlimited booze and global fame. To keep Mickey from realising we could provide neither, we then subjected him to an unrelenting barrage of questions for almost two hours. Under our relentless questioning, Mickey gave up the goods on some precious long-buried information, including what it's like to work with Jordan Peterson, the details on his campaign to destroy introspection, and what he really thinks of the Gurus. We also manage to discuss some serious stuff like the state of contemporary psychology, the impact of the replication crisis, whether preregistration is always beneficial (it is, don't listen to Matt!), and to resolve the fundamental nature of the Self! Mickey is a wise egg, a funny guy, and a veteran podcaster and we really enjoyed this conversation so we hope you will too! Stick around at the end for some Tamler themed feedback and more pronunciation errors than you can shake a stick at. Back next week with Jaron Lanier! Links
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| Very Bad Gurus with David Pizarro & Tamler Sommers | 29 Apr 2022 | 02:15:40 | |
In the most ambitious crossover since the Fraggles met the Muppets, this week we have a special joint episode with moral psychologist David Pizzaro and famed philosopher and ghost detective, Tamler Sommers. Also known as the hosts of a small academic podcast Very Bad Wizards. Stealing the format of their show we have a culture war heavy intro section featuring discussion of Joe Rogan censorship, covid debates, Japanese maid cafes, and the great ghost debate of 2022. Following that we move on to an in-depth round-table discussion of the 2012 Paul Thomas Anderson movie 'The Master'. The movie explores the relationship between a wastrel and a cult leader and features performances by Joacquin Phoenix, Philip Seymour Hoffman, and Amy Adams. There is no denying it's an acting masterclass (and thematically relevant for the show!) but is it any good? Join us and help us as we attempt to decode with the wizards. Links
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| Interview with Timbah Toast on his Tim Pool Documentary & Scooby Doo Partisans | 23 Apr 2022 | 02:02:43 | |
This week's episode we have an extended interview with an independent decoder, the YouTube documentary maker, Timbah-on-Toast. A kindred spirit in many respects Timbah is perhaps the ultimate form of the 'I can't come to bed, someone is wrong on the internet' meme. He makes detailed videos analysing the content of a variety of internet pundits, especially those who are posing as something they are not. If you have not experienced one of Timbah's documentaries you should go do so now. He has an excellent 3-part series on Dave Rubin's interview techniques and another 4-part series breaking down the career of the propagandist founder of the Veritas Project, James O'Keefe. His most recent series, however, is looking at self-proclaimed milquetoast centrist fence-sitter, the eternal beanie wearing Tim Pool. We compare notes, delve into what makes Timbah motivated to do what he does, and discuss his Scooby Doo narrative arc. So join us as Chris meets a kindred consumer of irritating content and Matt continues to ponder if it's all just cloud castles and narcissism. Also featuring... a Weinstein World update, the standard banter quotient, and an abusive Patreon shoutout segment. Links
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| Reverend Sun Myung Moon: Absolute Decoding | 08 Apr 2022 | 01:46:43 | |
This week we return one more time to the disturbing world of Reverend Sun Myung Moon's Unification Church, also known as the 'Moonies', this time with a historical decoding episode. We are joined again this week by Elgen Strait, from Falling Out podcast, who helps us with a historical decoding of Reverend Moon's speeches and Moonie promotional material. Due to the subject matter we cannot promise a barrel of laughs but we hope this episode offers some useful insights into the approach of a genuine cult leader. It's also a useful comparison episode to see where there are parallels with the modern secular gurus we usually examine and where they diverge. So join us as we return to an imagined glory era of America in the 1950s (or was it 70s) when Absolute Sex & a God centred ideology was all anyone needed for a perfect society... at least according to Moon. Links
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| Supplementary Material 21: The emergency snake, thought = secularised prayer, and Love and War | 10 Jan 2025 | 00:48:00 | |
It's 2025, and the Gurusphere shows no signs of slowing down—so here we are, diving into some grim crossovers. This time, the bro-optimiser Andrew Huberman has teamed up with the chaos dragon himself, Jordan Peterson. Meanwhile, the ever-affectionate Lex Fridman finally scored an interview with Zelensky. Bret, however, remains preoccupied with Goliath's ongoing PsyOps. P.S. Matt broke his dongle so he's on the AirPods, we will be back to proper audio setup next episode. Supplementary Material 21 00:00 Introduction and Farewell to America 01:43 Memorable Encounters and Experiences 03:48 Oldering & the Destruction of the Self 08:35 The American Understander Issues his Verdict 12:07 The Pageau Brothers, Jesus' Laugh & The Emergency Snake 19:01 Bryan Johnson has concerns about Vaccines 21:48 The High IQ Crowd and Trump's Greenland Plans 27:44 The PsyOps Cyclops Strikes Again 37:15 Huberman X Peterson: Optimising Christianity 39:22 Secret Prayers and Bible Conversations 43:34 Thougt = Secularised Prayer 48:56 Huberman's Intelligent Design Argument for God 55:49 Christian Optimising Stack 01:07:56 Marc Andreessen on Vigor, Pride and Achievement 01:13:30 Faux Heterodoxy 01:19:24 Plain Steaks are the best! 01:24:47 Jordan Peterson's Diet Struggles 01:32:25 Lex Fridman's Interview with Zelensky 01:37:52 Lex plugs Rogan's comedy club 01:41:09 Elon Musk and Trump are anti-corruption! 01:44:27 Critique of Lex Fridman's Interview Style 01:46:07 Lex's dream and Russia's security guarantees 01:53:25 Lex's Strategic Naivety 02:05:12 Lex reads A LOT 02:11:40 Lex and Putin predictions 02:12:39 Lex will endure the attacks against him 02:14:56 Wrapping Up & Patreon Love Bomb The full episode is available for Patreon subscribers (2hrs 16 mins). Join us at: https://www.patreon.com/DecodingTheGurus Sources
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| Interview with Elgen Strait on growing up in the Moonies & cultish manipulation | 31 Mar 2022 | 01:31:22 | |
This episode is the first of two linked episodes in which we delve into the disturbing world of Reverend Sun Myung Moon's Unification Church also known as the 'Moonies'. Here in an interview episode we introduce Elgen Strait, host of the Falling Out Podcast which is "a podcast about leaving the Moonies and other cults, as told by the kids who grew up within them." The topic matter is serious and Elgen deftly introduces us to the manipulative cult dynamics he experienced first hand, as well as offering some broader information about how the Moonies craft their public image and raise funds. However, Elgen is a man after our own hearts and his dark sense of humour means that he can also enjoy a laugh at Moon's expense & enlighten us about Absolute Sex(!), a term that might mean something slightly different than you imagine. Our next episode will be guest co-hosted by Elgen as we take an excursion from the contemporary secular gurus and attempt to decode some historical recordings from a bonafide religious cult leader. This episode hopefully provides the foundations to better understand that decoding and we hope you 'enjoy' the discussion with Elgen as much as we did, despite the subject matter! Links
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| Interview with Julian Walker on Conspirituality, Conspiracies and (Global) Culture Wars | 26 Mar 2022 | 01:58:16 | |
Another interview episode - we've had a flurry recently but don't worry, we'll be returning to a good ol' fashioned decoding episode very soon. This week we just couldn't resist the opportunity to have a chinwag with our podcasting compadre Julian Walker, an eloquent writer on evidence-based & conspiracy matters and co-host of the Conspirituality podcast. Julian's a yoga instructor and (maybe even) a spiritual kinda guy, but has long opposed the conspiratorial, anti-science, and exploitative guru side of the yoga & 'health & wellness' communities. In short, he's a science-minded guy moving in spiritual and yoga circles, who is now directly involved in countering the endless proliferation of pseudoscientific & conspiratorial nonsense. So, Matt and Chris take this opportunity to pick Julian's brain about what's been going on over on the crunchy side of the aisle, how it relates (and even overlaps) with the secular gurus, and the cultural moment we're in more generally. Due to the backlog caused by lazy elves in the DTG editing bay, some of the references to the trucker convoy and whatnot are a bit outdated, nor will you hear any mention of Ukraine. But don't mind that! Julian's got a lot of insight to offer and we hope you enjoy listening to him as much as we did! Links
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| Interview with Josh Szeps, The Rumble from Downunder | 17 Mar 2022 | 01:42:33 | |
Hot on the heels of our Joe Rogan Trilogy, the big red phone at Decoder HQ rang with an intriguing proposal. Well, it was more of a DM, and it said, "Hi, love your show, would love to come on talk about Joe. Josh Szeps". "Josh Szeps?" we thought. "Who's that?" 5 mins of internet research later we found out it was none other than the voice of Olly the Kookaburra at the 2000 Sydney games! Well, we have to have him on, we thought. And as a bonus, he's also been on the Joe Rogan Experience where he famously gave him some real talk about COVID, vaccines, and the relative threat of myocarditis. In so doing Josh become, for a while at least, something of a reluctant hero to Joe Rogan cancel mobs everywhere. "Book him!" intoned Matt, decisively. "Right you are sir!" chirped Chris, obsequiously. Recollections of the specific events differ, but essentially just like that, podcast interview history was made. Josh Szepps has been an ABC journalist, panelist, TV and radio host, raconteur, and general opinionated and interviewer in Australia for donkey's years. He also has his own podcast, (Impossible) sorry Uncomfortable Conversations, which some say is pretty, pretty OK. Matt's been listening to him for years on the radio, so he tried not to be star-struck. While Josh managed (some would say too easily) to conceal his awe of Matt's towering intellect and impressive academic achievements. Chris meanwhile, knowing nothing of Australian culture and etiquette waffled on with his usual wild abandon. The conversation does include chat about the shiny-headed, supplement-infused, muscle master himself, but (fortunately) soon turns to broader discussion of disinformation, censorship, responsible heterodoxy, the general health of the info-sphere, and many, many more topics crucial to Saving our Civilisation! We argue constructively debate many topics including the impact of deplatforming and whether there is a need for greater editorial oversight (or if we are taking the first step to the Gulags). We don't see eye to eye on everything, but Josh is a super cool guy so enjoy some civility porn as we engage in the kind of debate that would make even the IDW superstars proud. Check it out! Links
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| James Lindsay & Michael O'Fallon: Eating bugs for Feminist Glaciology | 06 Mar 2022 | 03:15:57 | |
This is an important episode. 2022 you needs to realise what 2020 you could not and what 2030 you is ready to tell you. Confused? You will be. On this episode we tackle two gurus that we have treated separately: James Lindsay of New Discourses (episode 2) and Michael O'Fallon of Sovereign Nations (episode 13). O'Fallon hasn't changed much from our episode analysing him, aside from starting a conspiracy laden daily news show. But James... well... judge for yourself. On this episode you will learn many amazing facts, including how feminist glaciology is at the core of the Great Reset, that the NFL is now the Critical Race Football league, and how what 'it' is really all about is making people into pets who are driven by AI cars and eat bugs. For this excursion, Chris and Matt are joined for the second time by Aaron Rabinowtiz, host of Embrace the Void (@ETVPod) and Philosophers in Space podcasts, PhD student, and lecturer at Rutgers University. This means we have now had two back to back episodes with philosophers... and we really can't apologise enough. Links
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| Interview with Liam Bright on Scientific Orthodoxy, Reform Efforts & DTG's Philosophy | 03 Mar 2022 | 02:06:14 | |
Today we have a little mid-week treat, ahead of our next decoding episode, a discussion with the philosopher and Leverhulme Prize Winning Twitter sensation, Liam Kofi Bright. Liam is an Assistant Professor at the Department of Philosophy, Logic, and Scientific Method at a little known degree-mill called the London School of Economics. On this episode we have a wide ranging discussion revolving around the state of the Orthodoxy in modern scientific research, the viability of proposed reforms, and finally Liam decodes whether we are mindless defenders of the status quo or the true heirs of the Logical Positivists tradition. Along the way we also learn the three rules to master Twitter, what Open Science is all about, whether philosophers of science are good or bad, and what exactly 26+6 equals. Links
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| Interview with Virginia Heffernan on Edge, the dangers of Scientism, & Culture Wars | 26 Feb 2022 | 02:22:10 | |
On this week's show we have a broad ranging discussion with the well known journalist and author Virginia Heffernan. Virginia has written a bunch on the topic of technology, social media, scientism, and especially the Edge organisation. We discuss her research into Edge and related figures but also range further afield to cover debates in academia, the culture war and gurus, anthropology debates in the 90s, race & IQ rationalists, and other such topics. One short service note is that Matt is incognito for part of the conversation as he had a prior appointment so you will have to endure Chris functioning on his own but do not fear our intrepid psychologist re-emerges to offer some words of wisdom at the end. Also, the conversation with Virginia was recorded in advance of the events in Ukraine so no recent events are discussed (which is probably for the best). For those who want to do a bit more digging on the topics discussed, below are a bunch of related articles and you can also follow Virginia on Twitter (@page88) and check out her new podcast 'This is Critical' which encourages people to look critically at a wide array of topics, which is quite on brand for us! Links
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| Robert Wright: A Cosmic Journey Across the Bob-o-verse | 19 Feb 2022 | 02:40:44 | |
Matt and Chris finally leave the Rogan-verse behind, activate their Infinite Improbability Drive, and blast off for the Bob-o-verse. In an off-again / on-again, will they / won't they battle of wits, we outmanoeuvre Bob by covering an episode that he planned to record for our benefit, which we then explained we wouldn't cover because that would violate our rules, which he decided to record anyway, and we then decided it would be alright to cover because he thought we weren't going to cover it. Which one of us is playing 4-dimensional chess and who's playing Hungry Hippo? We're not sure. Robert Wright is a journalist, author, independent commentator, and podcaster. A stalwart of the public intellectual scene, he never joined the Intellectual Dark Web. How's that for a recommendation!? He's written and thought, or thought and then written about so many topics it's impossible to mention them all, but they span evolution, Buddhism, geopolitics, philosophy, and everything in between. But is he a guru? (Spoiler) Of course he is. Yes, definitely. But is he a good guru? Well, we're not going to tell you. You're going to have to tune in to find out. Chris and Matt are simple folk, but they do their best to wrap their heads around Bob's cosmic philosophy, which spans the fundamental algorithms of evolution, black holes, alternative universes, and how we should probably all be nice to one another if we want to create a global brain. You might think grokking those ideas would be like watching Koyaanisqatsi while tripping on ayahuasca, but actually it all makes sense. We think. But is it true? Is it real? Is Wright right? That my friends, is up to you to decide. But in this episode we will open the door.... (and possibly resolve the mystery of consciousness at the same time, turns out there was no problem all along). Links
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Coverart Thanks to Mark Ledwich (@mark_ledwich) and Elsa Jansen (@ElsaJansen) for the coverart this week! Contributions for coverart for upcoming episodes always welcome. | |||
| Interview: Debunking (Antivaxx) Funk with Dr Dan Wilson | 10 Feb 2022 | 01:15:33 | |
This week we speak to fellow traveller, kindred spirit, and vaccine misinformation debunker, Dr Dan Wilson. Yes, we know we've talked SO much about anti-vax rhetoric recently, and we hope the day will soon come when we can leave it all behind us, but friends, today is not that day. For more than a year, Dan's YouTube channel DebunkTheFunk has focused on rebutting COVID and vaccine misinformation from characters such as Geert Vanden-Bossche, Joseph Mercola and RFK Jnr. His recent episodes on Robert Malone and Peter Mc Collough have been an invaluable source for the decoders for our recent episodes. So of course we were delighted that Dan could come speak to us about what he does, what they do, and what kind of rhetorical tropes and tricks he sees from these characters. Dan seems to suffer from the same masochistic malaise we do, in feeling compelled to listen to some of the worst material available on the internet, so as to point out what's wrong with it. And he accomplishes that mission effectively, and most mysteriously for Chris and Matt, concisely as well. It's not all negative, because as well as talking about anti-vaxxers specifically, we all bask in our shared admiration for This Week in Virology, the kind of critical yet open-minded science communication show we'd all love to see a lot more of. We also talk about the kind of everyday epistemics that we can all practice to separate fact from fiction, and the kind of public engagement that genuine experts, researchers and scientists need to practice in order to take back the infosphere from snake-oil salesmen and attention-seekers of all kinds. It was an absolute pleasure to talk to Dan. We love what he does, and we hope he goes on doing it for a long time to come. We hope you enjoy it too, and we heartily recommend sharing DebunkTheFunk with friends, family and colleagues who have slipped down the conspiratorial rabbit-hole on COVID and vaccines. | |||
| Special: Joe Rogan 'Sorry, not Sorry' | 04 Feb 2022 | 01:09:03 | |
To cap off our impromptu mini-series focusing on the Rogan-verse we take a critical look at Joe's short (non) apology video responding to the Spotify controversy surrounding his recent episodes with Robert Malone & Peter McCullough. In it we get to see a charming Joe Rogan being humble and compromising, while standing firm to explain why his critics have got him all wrong. He's not some hardline anti-vaccine advocate with an agenda to spread covid misinformation, he's just a normal guy who likes to have interesting conversations and hear from both sides(tm) on controversial topics. Joe's certainly on the charm offensive and he's already won plaudits from the heterodox for doing the right thing but are these really deserved? And how well does what Joe says hold up when you look at it critically? We do what few will bother and compare & contrast how Joe describes what he does vs. what he actually does and says in his content. And we find a few discrepancies that seem worth mentioning. This will be our last dip into the Rogan-verse for the next while but we would encourage anyone who wants more to go back to our episodes on Rogan & Jocko Willink or the combined episode on Robert Malone & Peter McCullough. Whether you are a fan of Rogan or a critic, we hope you can find something useful in our critical evaluation and we will back soon with a full length decoding. Links
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| *Patreon Preview* Malone & McCullough: Gurometer Ratings | 28 Jan 2022 | 00:52:00 | |
This week a bonus Gurometer episode has sneaked out from behind the golden curtain of the DTG Patreon pay wall. We aren't out of the Rogan-verse yet. Our last task is to try and scientifically quantify the precise guru nature of the two good doctors using our patented Gurometer instrument. Are they guru wannabes, mid-tier, or high level? Join us to find out. Next week, we will be back with a full length guru episode! ...and for those who would like to see all the ratings of previous gurus, you can find those here. | |||
| Gurometer: Curtis Yarvin | 02 Jan 2025 | 00:17:17 | |
Back once again with the dark art of Gurometry, we turn our sights to the bad boy of Silicon Valley—the mulleted maestro, the edgy eejit, Curtis Yarvin. A legend in his own mind, but how does he rank on the Gurosity scale? Join us as we dissect his essence across 11 factors, from his revolutionarily mundane and incoherent ideas to his dazzling absence of charisma. Tune in as we feed this 'dark enlightenment' thinker into the Gurometer and reveal his true colours. The full episode is available for Patreon subscribers (34 mins). Join us at: https://www.patreon.com/DecodingTheGurus Curtis Yarvin: Gurometer 00:00 Introduction to Gurometry 02:27 Curtis Yarvin: The Man, The Myth, The Eejit 04:43 Galaxy Brainlessness 05:48 Cultishness 08:32 Anti-Establishmentarianism 09:55 Grievance Mongering 12:43 Self-Aggrandizement and Narcissism 13:30 Cassandra Complex 16:21 Revolutionary Theories 17:59 Pseudo-Profound Bullshit 19:43 Conspiracy Theories Galore 23:55 Moral Grandstanding 25:50 Gurometer Scores and Analysis 27:56 Bonus Point Attribution 34:03 Final Thoughts on Curtis Yarvin | |||
| Robert Malone & Peter McCullough: A litany of untruths | 13 Jan 2022 | 03:17:22 | |
Matt and Chris return to the Joe Rogan-verse much quicker than they would have liked to take a critical eye to two recent episodes (6 more hours!!!) offering controversial takes on Covid 19 and the dangers of vaccines. Yes, that's right more fear mongering, more global conspiracies, and more unrecognised heroes of science that Joe needs to promote to his large audience. In this case, we have Dr. Robert Malone, the *self-proclaimed* inventor of mRNA vaccines, and Dr. Peter McCullough, a cardiologist who was recently sued by his old hospital for using its name when promoting his covid theories. Both figures are well documented promoters of covid misinformation, including in various appearances on extreme right wing conspiracy sites like Alex Jones' InfoWars. Matt and Chris are no medical experts nor do they play them on podcasts (if you are looking for a point by point technical/medical debunking, we would recommend following the links at the bottom of these show notes). But what they are very familiar with are modern gurus and conspiracy theorists. So in this episode, after twenty plus episodes of calibrating the Gurometer(TM) with known gurus, they take it for a new test with these two maverick doctors. Applying the well-developed science of Gurometry(TM) to a novel dataset. How do they fare? Guess... Honestly, this is probably the darkest and most depressing episode we've done. It was not fun and we would really prefer to be talking about something else but here we are. Hopefully we will not be back soon... Links
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| *Patreon Preview* Decoding Academia #2: False Positive Psychology | 30 Dec 2021 | 00:59:16 | |
The New Year is upon us and the gurologists thought they should contribute to the holiday cheer in the only way they can... releasing a rambling podcast about academic minutiae! This is not a new guru episode, instead it is a preview of our Patreon bonus series 'Decoding Academia' in which we discuss research that has influenced us & we think is relevant for understanding the gurus (or in this case approaching research critically). The paper in question is a classic social psychology paper that slightly pre-empted the Replication Crisis with very timely warnings about lax methodological standards. The paper is titled 'False-Positive Psychology: Undisclosed Flexibility in Data Collection and Analysis Allows Presenting Anything as Significant' and is by Simmons, Nelson, & Simonsohn (2011). If you want to read the paper yourself it can be freely accessed here. It introduces the concept of 'Researcher Degrees of Freedom' and also statistically *proves* that listening to certain music can make you physically younger. How? Join us and find out! Finally... just a quick note to say Happy New Year from Chris & Matt! We will be back early next year with our Robert Wright episode and many gurus thereafter. | |||
| Joe Rogan: Just an average Joe? | 18 Dec 2021 | 03:07:14 | |
Joe Rogan is a world famous podcaster, a martial artist, a stand-up comedian, a MMA commentator, co-founder of the Onnit supplement company, the ex-host of Fear Factor, a long term friend of Alex Jones, and recently a major outlet for promoting 'alternative' Covid facts. And yet despite all these 'achievements' and his recent multi million dollar deal with Spotify many argue that a large part of Joe's appeal is that he is just a 'regular Joe'. Joe himself has said he's just a 'f**king moron' and that people should not take his opinion seriously... but does he mean it? Join Matt & Chris as they break out their dusty gym bags and enter the house of pain that is long form podcasting to try and imbibe the full Joe Rogan Experience. To aid in this glorious quest, the guys sought out the most testosterone laced JRE episode they could find and inevitable landed on a recent episode with ex-navy seal & motivational author, Jocko Willink. This is a man who everyday posts black and white photographs of his wristwatch at 4.30am with captions like 'Ready. Set. GET SOME' & 'Default: AGGRESSIVE'. If you think this means the episode will be covering the sexually arousing nature of armoured cars, the beauty of handcrafted knives, and how to revive the American manufacturing industry... you would be right. But that's not all. You will also discover surprising non-partisan 'facts' like how Tulsi Gabbad is the centrist messiah, George Soros is responsible for recent US crime waves, Nancy Pelosi is an assassin, and the Hunter Biden laptop story is the biggest story of the modern era. Oh and, of course, that Covid vaccines are dangerous and effective alternative treatments are being hushed up. Wait... what? So rev your engines, sharpen your handcrafted knives, and get ready to smash headfirst through brick walls of ignorance and faux expertise in this testosterone soaked episode as Matt & Chris refuse to acquiesce to the 'burden of civility'. P.S. Did Matt mention that he had to listen to 6hrs this week?!? Links
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| Special: Guru Right to Reply with Chris Williamson | 10 Dec 2021 | 01:47:36 | |
Listeners might remember Chris Williamson from our episode on Gad Saad. He was the former love island contestant who interviewed Gad and appeared to have taken an IDW turn. So while Matt & Chris focused their critical attention primarily on the master of irony, Gad Saad, they also raised a rather skeptical eye towards Chris Williamson as well. And listeners, they were not kind. Not at all... Nevertheless, Chris W. reached out and accepted our standing offer for any guru covered to come on to the show and respond to the criticisms we made. The result was an interesting and wide ranging exchange that covered issues such as what it's like for a non-specialist to interview famous academics, the incentives and pressures at play in the modern social media ecosystem, and how DTG commentary feels when you are on the receiving side! For fans of cringe comedy this episode might be particularly enjoyable as off-hand comments and cutting remarks are discussed and dissected for their fairness. But (spoiler!) everyone survives to the end. Chris (Kavanagh) also took a degree of pleasure in watching the alleged 'nice guy' of the podcast squirm over his cheeky remarks. All in all there is some nice symmetry, in that everybody had something to cringe about. But perhaps this dialogue will alchemically transform that cringe into spiritual gold, and we can all learn something and grow a little as people or podcasters? Or maybe not? Time will tell, ay? Have a listen and see what you think! P.S. Sincere apologies for the audio quality, especially on Matt's end. We recorded this at an ungodly hour of the morning and Matt was too zombified to select the good microphone. Or the DISC could have interfered with it... Something like that. Links | |||
| Decoding Academia: Matt on his ENTIRE research career *Patreon Sample* | 03 Dec 2021 | 01:03:59 | |
So, what even IS the deal with Matt? Is he a proper psychologist or does his past conceal something darker, aside from his bronzed skin-tone? Until now, he's been a mystery hidden in a enigma and wrapped within a svelte Australian shell. Well, enquiring minds need to know, so that's all about to change! Here it is - The Story of Matt. The ins, the outs, and the 'what-have-yous'. The false starts, the missed opportunities for fame, the many entry roles as a research 'shit-kicker', and his final glorious ascension to his ultimate form as a white haired tenured Professor. You'll learn why being an English language teacher is not a real job, how Matt could have been a contender in the massively lucrative and prestigious field of artificial intelligence, where all the fish live (under the sea, mostly), the powers and ideologies at play in gambling research, why Matt isn't impressed by Taleb's claims about fat tails, and so much more. You'll be left wondering, "How can one man, even if he is very ancient, do so much? Is he a polymath? Or does he just have a short attention span, and trouble holding down a job?" And finally, as an exercise for the listener, like Chris, you will be left to wonder "is convolve a real word?" Here it is: the backstory of Matt. Links
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| Brené Brown: Matt and Chris courageously embrace their vulnerability | 26 Nov 2021 | 02:10:51 | |
Brené Brown is an American professor, lecturer, author, storyteller researcher, and podcast host. She's made it her life's work to help people rise strong, brave the wilderness, and dare to lead - all through overcoming shame and embracing their own vulnerability. So naturally Chris and Matt - being the emotionally unavailable, culturally stunted and cynical gits that they are - bemoan all this positivity and do their level best to try and drag her down to their bitter and petty level. Can you get the secret to self-actualisation in a TED talk? Or is it more a sequence of inspirational quote memes strung together? Or are these things one and the same? Perhaps Professor Brown is honing in on universal psychological truths. Or alternatively, she might be an unwitting expression of American hyper-individualism and self-obsessed culture. Well, you're gonna get the Irish and Australian take on that. Thanksgiving is obviously the perfect time for the hosts to tell their US listeners that American culture sucks and that kids shouldn't follow their dreams but prepare to be cogs in the machine. No, no, they don't do that. Well... not entirely. Well, what do they say? What is there take? You'll have to tune in to find out! Links
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| Decoding Academia: Chris on Religion & Ritual *Patreon Sample* | 23 Nov 2021 | 00:54:09 | |
It had to happen eventually. As Matt and Chris listen week in and week out to the world's greatest gurus pontificating on the mysteries of the universe, it's only natural that the siren call of Galaxy Brain takes and revolutionary theories would prove too great. And so seeking to take advantage of the parasocial bonds they have scrupulously cultivated (and signal their value to the University of Austin) they are launching a new Patreon bonus series on 'Decoding Academia'. The first two instalments covering Matt & Chris' work & main research interests will be freely available to all. But for the deeper arcane knowledge that only true free thinkers would dare behold, you will need to smash through our Patreon 'Strategic Economic Barrier' or SEB. In this episode, Chris discusses the cognitive and evolutionary relevance of religion (what is it?, why is it?, and what is it good for?), rituals (what are they? why do we do them? and why are there painful ones?!?), & Gods (why do we care about them? Do we need them for religion). So take a breather from the culture war and enjoy some light academic waffle! We will be back on Friday this week with a full guru episode on Brene Brown! Links
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| Interview with Annie Kelly on Vaccines, Conspiracies, & Misinformation | 06 Nov 2021 | 01:44:21 | |
Dr Annie Kelly is a writer, researcher, and the British correspondent for the well and deservedly praised podcast QAnon Anonymous. Her PhD research was on digital anti-feminism and the kinds of ideas that float around certain 'tradcon', biological essentialist, or religiously motivated groups. She does research on antifeminism, new digital cultures, conspiracy theories and right wing extremism. Prompted by the resurgence in anti-vax sentiment, Annie's been looking into the history and sociology of vaccinations, and sees lots of interesting roots and themes for understanding what's going on right now. Her new podcast, "Vaccine - The Human Story" has been digging into precisely these issues, and so we had questions for Annie, lots of questions! The history of the germ theory of disease, the early use (and abuse) of vaccinations, and the panics, xenophobia and quack therapies - it's quite simply fascinating stuff, and we get a wonderful overview from Annie in this episode. Annie's work at QAA and elsewhere naturally focuses more on the extreme end of the spectrum, and while pulling no punches, she approaches what can be quite disturbing and confronting topics with a humour and empathy that is incredibly authoritative and reassuring. We talk about COVID and vaccines, but so much more, like the anti-feminist ideas that float around in the hinterland between athiesm and religiosity, pick up artists converting to Orthodox Christianity, and other weirdness. One of our most enjoyable and informative interviews - do check it out! Links
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| Special: Interview with Sam Harris on Gurus, Tribalism & the Culture War | 30 Oct 2021 | 03:06:09 | |
Sam Harris probably needs no introduction in our neck of the info-sphere as he is seemingly never far from the spotlight... or the occasional controversy. We’ve had some nice things to say about Sam, but we’ve also made some harsh criticisms, particularly regarding a short episode he released which seemed to suggest it was necessary to practice introspective meditation in order to fully understand why his political and culture war views were correct. Although we’ve never done a ‘proper’ episode on Sam, we have always stated that anyone we discuss is welcome to come on the show and discuss (or dispute) our charges – which is exactly what Sam is doing here! This interview is split into two sections. In the first, we discuss Sam’s app and whether it might encourage guru dynamics and the role of meditation and (non) self-awareness in forming an accurate political outlook. We put some of our criticisms to Sam especially regarding guru dynamics, issues of introspective verification of truth claims, and the potential for abusive practices and manipulation by gurus. In the second section, we turn to some of the more controversial topics that have sprung up around Sam over the years. Sam responds to proposals that he might be as tribal as the rest of us suckers, and he defends himself against accusations that he might have selective empathy and blind spots towards the rightish side of the political spectrum. We talk about tribalism and the potential distorting effects of personal relationships, as well as anthropologists, Islamism, wokism, right-wing extremism, and how political biases manifest themselves on the left and right. Although the format is an interview, it does get quite ‘debate-y’ at times. And it’s probably true that we don’t come to a grand reconciliation of views at the end. However, nobody storms off, so what you get is a frank and friendly but robust exchange of views. We hope you enjoy it. Links
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| Mikhaila Peterson: The Marvelous World of Meat | 26 Oct 2021 | 02:15:54 | |
The hosts are certainly in no position to criticise someone for what they eat, with Matt unable to resist a Fosters and shrimps on a barbie, and Chris subsisting entirely on potatoes and Guinness. But... neither host have yet attempted to live on an all meat diet. Which is a shame, because according to Mikhaila Peterson and many others, meat and only meat is what you need. Sure, it's on the edgier part of the fad diet spectrum. But according to proponents: inflammation, depression, chronic Lyme disease - you name it, meat cures it. In this episode you'll learn about the surprising diversity of customised, bespoke, and finely-tuned all-meat diets that are out there. You'll also learn more about Chris' two mortal enemies, the British and the Fish, and how Matt's snacking proclivities mean he is in perilous danger of becoming a fungus zombie. More substantively, Mikhaila provides an interesting entry point to dig a little deeper into the psychological, psychosomatic, and physical problems that lead people into adopting this kind of restrictive practice. Just as Jordan Peterson discussed the truly horrific and destructive powers unleashed by sipping apple cider, there seems to be a common theme of attributing HUGE and dramatic powers to dietary choices. All of which is connected to existential concerns about what we put into our body, magical thinking about health and wellness, heuristics about purity, and anxieties about personal control. Get ready for lots of anecdotal reasoning and emotional testimonies of those with meat based lived experience. Could an all meat diet be for you? Tune in, and find out! Links
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| Supplementary Material 20: Stolen Valour, Based Murder, and Eric Weinstein's Phonecall Problems | 27 Dec 2024 | 00:40:18 | |
In this end-of-year supplementary material, we unleash the hounds of war, battle through the discourse, and emerge alive but bloody and battered on the other side. Enlist now and join the fight. Supplementary Material 20 00:00 Introduction and Ethnographic Insights 01:38 Matt's Observations from Washington DC 05:50 Smithsonian Museums and Star Wars Memorabilia 07:48 Lego Creations and Gacha Collectibles 12:13 Social Media and Blue Sky 'Culture' 13:29 Matt's Contribution: Eric Weinstein's UFO Speculations 21:21 Graham Linehan, Andrew Doyle, Jordan Peterson & Recognising Past Errors 23:18 Jordan Peterson's Reflections on Vaccination 28:59 Huberman's Upcoming Vaccine Series 30:52 Taylor Lorenz and Stochastic Terrorism 32:31 The Hypocrisy of Glorifying Violence 36:29 The Problem with Political Violence 43:48 Tim Kennedy's Exaggerated Military Stories 55:09 Tim Kennedy's Response to Criticism 01:07:37 Prebunking Criticisms 01:17:20 Shane Smith at Vice is NOT A CONSPIRACY GUY 01:21:27 Final Thoughts on Populism and Vibes-Based Reasoning 01:25:18 Outro The full episode is available for Patreon subscribers (1hr 26 mins). Join us at: https://www.patreon.com/DecodingTheGurus Sources
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| Interview with Stuart Neil on SARS CoV-2 | 09 Oct 2021 | 01:59:44 | |
You might have noticed there's been a bit of talk recently about a certain virus. A virus that may or may not have a vaccine that is very safe and effective, that may or may not be curable via hydroxychloroquine, vitamin D and ivermectin. That may or may not have escaped from a certain Chinese lab.... Yes folks, we're talking about SARS CoV-2. And although it's technically not directly guru-related, these are topics that have sucked so many of our gurus in like a conceptual black hole. So, we were particularly happy that Dr. Stuart Neil was willing to talk to us and sort this stuff out. Stuart is a Professor of Virology at King's College London. He's a specialist in virus cell biology and immunology, antiviral restriction, and has studied HIV, Ebola, and most recently COVID. Stuart is passionate about helping to inform the public about the state of scientific knowledge on COVID, and is known for his many excellent twitter threads helping to provide summaries and combat the misinformation and conspiracy theories that surround these topics. In this episode, Stuart gives a nuanced and crystal clear summary of where the evidence is pointing on these COVID-related topics. Stuart's frank about what we do and we do not know on these topics. And with Matt and Chris, there's interesting discussions about the controversies surrounding THAT letter to the Lancet, how scientific publishing works, and how the 'scientific consensus' develops in a politically charged and highly dynamic situation. If you have friends or colleagues who are uncertain about what positions the evidence supports on COVID, then THIS is the guy and THIS is the episode you want them to listen to. Links This Week's Sponsor
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| Special Episode: Interview with Stuart Ritchie on Hunter Gatherers in the 21st Century, covid skeptics, and bad science | 24 Sep 2021 | 01:53:53 | |
This week we have an engaging interview with the scientist, author, and public science communicator Stuart Ritchie. Stuart wrote the excellent 'Science Fictions: Exposing Fraud, Bias, Negligence and Hype in Science' and is a prolific advocate fr better science and more nuanced public discourse. In this episode we start of by discussing Stuart's recently published review of Bret Weinstein and Heather Heying's new book 'A Hunter Gatherer's Guide to the 21st Century'. Was Stuart a fan and is now an acolyte of Weinsteinian lineage theory? Tune in to find out. Also, for those who enjoy 'challenging conversations', robust discourse, and regularly shop in the marketplace of ideas, there is an extended discussion on whether we have been a little bit too kind on the government and public health institutions. Stuart uses facts and logic and attempts to DESTROY us, so come and get your well earned vicarious catharsis but be prepared for plenty of postmodern deflection. We've learned from the best. Links
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| Jordan Hall: Sensemaking, or the superficial pitter-patter on the neocortex? | 11 Sep 2021 | 02:12:36 | |
This episode is about sense-making... if you are not sick of that term yet, trust us, you soon will be. To get things rolling, Matt and Chris launch the podcast with a pair of rants. Chris vents about the lab-leak theorists who plague his mentions and Matt gets triggered by US libertarian takes on the military dictatorship apparently taking over Australia. He needs to get his thoughts out there before the secret police come and drag him away. Then we get the point (relatively quickly this time - see, we're getting better!) and leap into a truly indulgent level of sense making meta dialogue. Matt and Chris talk about a conversation between David Fuller and Jordan Hall, who are themselves discussing another conversation that Jordan Hall had with someone called Brandon Hayes. Yes, in this episode, you'll be listening to a conversation about a conversation about a conversation. It's like a podcast version of Inception, including a large amount of ponderous and ambiguous dialogue - you'll have to dig deeper, engage your sense making muscles, and it'll maybe make sense once it's all over. Anyway, so Brandon Hayes is a 'Propertarian', which appears to be an anti-semitic, ethnonationalist 'philosophy' with fascist and eugenic elements created by an odd American man called Curt Doolittle, . Cool, cool... David Fuller is raising some very legitimate concerns, and pulling Jordan Hall up on what seemed to be a rather generous and pally interview he conducted with Brandon. But it's Jordan's responses that really sparked the interest of the duo. He responds and explains. Or does he? There's a lot of reflections on the co-participatory seeking of Truth, the importance of the conversational process, the transformative nature of challenging relationships, but no real interest in the actual content of what people believe and promote. In this framing, a conversation with an anti-semite who promotes a neo-fascistic ideology becomes primarily just a stepping stone on a spiritual journey of transformative self-growth. As Jordan says, the literal content is just the superficial pitter-patter on the neocortex. But he's interested in something deeper, ineffable. The language Jordan uses is a tour-de-force in guru-esque 'sensemaking'. In a linguistic sense, he's like the bastard lovechild of Jordan Peterson and Eric Weinstein. Anyway if that sounds good to you then tune in, check it out, and if you manage to stick it out all the way to the end you are rewarded by Chris and Matt mulling over the validity of a harsh one-star review. Links
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