Decoder is a show from The Verge about big ideas — and other problems. Verge editor-in-chief Nilay Patel talks to a diverse cast of innovators and policymakers at the frontiers of business and technology to reveal how they’re navigating an ever-changing landscape, what keeps them up at night, and what it all means for our shared future.
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Données mises à jour le 04/10/2026
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Hey everybody, it’s Nilay. We’ve got a little bonus drop for you today — I was recently interviewed about AI safety by Shumita Basu for Apple News In Conversation, and I enjoyed the conversation so much I asked if we could share it with you all.
We’ve actually got a few bonus drops coming up this month; we’ve been having a lot of great conversations lately, and we want to get them out to you on the news cycle. And of course, nothing is moving as fast as the AI safety news cycle. So enjoy this one, and we’ll see you next time.
Links:
Apple News In Conversation | Apple Podcasts
Inside the suddenly explosive world of AI safety | The Verge
Here’s what AI leaders are saying about Trump’s new safety plan | The Verge
One company is at the center of a wave of rogue AI attacks | The Verge
Microsoft AI CEO says AI threats are real, and Anthropic is making it worse | Decoder
Does AI need an antitrust exemption so it doesn’t kill everyone? | Decoder
Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder!
Credits:
Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.
Decoder is produced by Greg Ott, Kate Cox, and Nick Statt. The show is edited by Ursa Wright. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
How Utah locals fought Kevin O'Leary's AI data center
jeudi 1 octobre 2026 • Durée 44:44
Today I’m talking with Josh Dzieza, a longtime features writer here at The Verge, about a massive data center in Utah that does not exist, might never exist, and yet has already completely reshaped the politics of the entire state.
Josh just published a major feature this week on the struggling Stratos data center project in Utah backed by Shark Tank star Kevin O’Leary. So I invited Josh on the show to discuss what’s happening inside the AI industry’s infrastructure boom, inside the bipartisan backlash to data centers, and how the tech industry is running into the one obstacle it can’t seem to spend its way out of: local democracy.
Read the full interview transcript on The Verge.
Links:
The People of Utah vs. Kevin O'Leary | The Verge
Adams — burdened by data center fallout — ousted by voters | Salt Lake Tribune
‘Shark Tank’ star sued by opponents he claimed were foreign agents| NYT
Fox News apologizes for airing O’Leary claims about data centers | The Hill
Kevin O’Leary agrees to downsize massive Utah data center | The Verge
The biggest data center ever is becoming a huge problem in Utah | The Verge
America's data center future is Loudoun County's past | The Verge
The left and right agree on one thing: no data centers | Decoder
Decoder is a Signal Awards finalist in the Business category! You can vote to help us win here.
Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder!
Credits:
Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.
Decoder’s producers are Greg Ott, Kate Cox, and Nick Statt. This episode was edited by Ursa Wright. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
The SaaSpocalypse that wasn't, with Atlassian's CEO
lundi 28 septembre 2026 • Durée 01:16:26
My guest today is Mike Cannon-Brookes, who is co-founder and CEO of Atlassian. Atlassian is one of those companies that every other company runs on — it makes important platform tools like Jira and Trello. This means Atlassian is also right in the middle of the way AI is changing how all these companies work.
Or, if you buy the idea of the so-called SaaSpocalypse, AI might just build all of these tools for you, destroying this entire category of businesses. Obviously, Mike had a lot of thoughts pushing back on this narrative, so we spent time really digging in and talking through what AI is doing to enterprise software.
Links:
How Australia became the test bed for tech regulation | Decoder (2021)
Building a $45B company far from Silicon Valley’s ‘froth and bubbles’ | Semafor
Atlassian CEO Mike Cannon-Brookes on Atlassian and AI | Stratechery
How Atlassian shook off the 'SaaSpocalypse' for a big rally | IBD
Atlassian acquires The Browser Company, maker of the Arc browser | The Verge
Atlassian Co-CEO resigns, leaving Cannon-Brookes as sole chief | Bloomberg
Atlassian cuts 1,600 jobs amid AI push | Forbes
Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder!
Credits:
Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.
Decoder’s producers are Greg Ott, Kate Cox, and Nick Statt. This episode was edited by Ursa Wright. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinde
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Can Cloudflare save the web from AI?
samedi 26 septembre 2026 • Durée 01:18:12
Cloudflare discovered in June that bots already make up more than half of internet traffic — and CEO Matthew Prince says that bots could outnumber humans a thousand to one within five years.
That's a huge change to the internet, and if the web is going to keep existing, it needs a huge change to its business model. Can Cloudflare use its place in the ecosystem to direct the money back to the people who make content?
Read the full interview transcript on The Verge.
Links:
How I choose which Cloudflare employees to replace with AI | Wall Street Journal
Why Cloudflare CEO Matthew Prince is the internet’s unlikely defender | Decoder (2024)
Cloudflare will now block AI crawlers by default | The Verge
Patreon partners with Cloudflare to block AI crawlers | 404 Media
Sony and Warner sue Anthropic in latest AI music lawsuit | Billboard
Trump administration supports OpenAI in NYT copyright lawsuit | The Verge
Google Zero is here — now what? | The Verge (2024)
Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder!
Credits:
Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.
Decoder’s producers are Greg Ott, Kate Cox, and Nick Statt. This episode was edited by Kabir Chopra. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
I have some questions for Mark Zuckerberg
jeudi 24 septembre 2026 • Durée 23:11
It’s a big week for Meta. The company has its big Connect conference, and the new Muse AI agent appears to be an early hit. CEO Mark Zuckerberg has been doing a lot of interviews about it all — so of course we asked for him to be on Decoder. Meta declined, for whatever reason.
But luckily Mark just did a big interview with our friend and former colleague Alex Heath on the Sources podcast. So I figured we could highlight some moments from that conversation to point out some obvious gaps in what Mark is saying about Meta and hopefully inspire the next set of people who talk to him with some follow-up questions.
Read the full interview transcript on The Verge.
Links:
Mark Zuckerberg interview | Sources Podcast
How Meta got everything it wanted in secret data center deal | New York Times
Can you forget how you feel about Meta? | The Verge
Zuck doesn’t want to press pause on AI | The Verge
Meta glasses are a workplace menace | The Verge
Mark Zuckerberg doesn’t understand how to live | The Verge
Four takeaways from Mark Zuckerberg’s massive AI manifesto | The Verge
Meta says US states are seeking $1.4 trillion in penalties | Reuters
Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder!
Credits:
Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.
Decoder’s producers are Greg Ott, Kate Cox, and Nick Statt. This episode was edited by Ursa Wright. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Can John Ternus find Apple's next big thing?
lundi 21 septembre 2026 • Durée 58:26
Today, I’m talking with Bloomberg’s Mark Gurman, who is the world’s best-sourced Apple reporter. Earlier this month, Apple hosted its annual iPhone hardware event, and this event was special, for a number of reasons.
It was new Apple CEO John Ternus’ first major product launch. It was also the debut of the foldable iPhone Duo. So I wanted Mark on the show to explain why this event was so important, and how John Ternus’ Apple will look a lot different from Tim Cook’s.
Read the full interview transcript on The Verge.
Links:
Apple iPhone Duo launch event: the 5 biggest announcements | The Verge
The iPhone Duo is Apple’s first foldable | The Verge
Tim Cook’s CEO-like pay package shows he isn’t going anywhere | Bloomberg
Apple’s Phil Schiller steps down from running App Store | Bloomberg
Apple’s new CEO will need to soon overhaul his management team | Bloomberg
Apple’s Ternus takes the reins as CEO, with AI as job No. 1 | Bloomberg
Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder!
Credits:
Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.
Decoder is produced by Greg Ott, Kate Cox, and Nick Statt. This episode was edited by Eileen Felix. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Does AI need an antitrust exemption so it doesn't kill everyone????
samedi 19 septembre 2026 • Durée 46:14
The biggest story in tech right now is the spiraling debate about AI safety and regulation. The CEOs of all these companies have issued various calls to slow down development and develop regulation, including asking for antitrust exemptions so they can all coordinate on safety issues.
So to make sense of it all, I called Jonathan Kanter, the former antitrust chief for the U.S. Department of Justice in the Biden Administration. There's a lot going on, and we really got into the weeds of how all this regulation might work, and how it might interact with antitrust law, competition policy, and our relationship with China.
Read the full interview transcript on The Verge.
Links:
Is Big Tech’s AI slowdown a safety pact or a cartel? | The Verge
Inside the suddenly explosive world of AI safety | The Verge
Execs and politicians on slowing down AI development | The Verge
Microsoft AI CEO: AI threats are real, Anthropic makes it worse | The Verge
Lina Khan: We don’t need new laws to prosecute AI CEOs | Gizmodo
Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder!
Credits:
Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.
Decoder’s producers are Greg Ott, Kate Cox, and Nick Statt. This episode was edited by Ursa Wright. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Microsoft AI CEO says AI threats are real, and Anthropic is making it worse
jeudi 17 septembre 2026 • Durée 52:59
Today, I’m talking with Mustafa Suleyman, the CEO of Microsoft AI. As you’re no doubt aware, the biggest story in tech right now is the spiraling debate about AI safety and regulation. So I really wanted to talk to Mustafa about what he thinks is real and not in AI safety, whether the concept of alignment itself is up to the task, and whether this industry needs to slow down before it kills us all.
Read the full interview transcript on The Verge.
Links:
A warning about ‘model welfare’ | Mustafa Suleyman
Humanist AI Code of Conduct | Microsoft
Is Big Tech’s AI slowdown a safety pact or a cartel? | The Verge
A brief history of AI executives calling for regulation | The Verge
What execs and politicians are saying about slowing down AI development | The Verge
Anthropic CEO says it’s time to pump the brakes on AI | The Verge
Microsoft’s AI chief says superintelligence is near, but won’t take your job | Decoder (2026)
Mustafa Suleyman says conversational AI is the next web browser | Decoder (2024)
Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder!
Credits:
Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.
Decoder’s producers are Greg Ott, Kate Cox, and Nick Statt. This episode was edited by Kabir Chopra. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Adam Conover explains how YouTube ruined everything
lundi 14 septembre 2026 • Durée 01:05:05
Adam Conover is a familiar face to anyone who’s spent time on the internet. He got his start at CollegeHumor back in the day, before transitioning into cable TV with Adam Ruins Everything, then onto Netflix, and all the way back to YouTube again, where he posts videos and hosts a podcast.
That is exactly the kind of career path that fascinates me, and it also happens to touch on basically every major Decoder theme there is.
Read the full interview transcript on The Verge.
Links:
YouTube is making it harder to earn money on YouTube | The Verge
Adam Conover regrets shilling Sam Altman’s World | The Verge
Elon Musk is an idiot | Adam Conover
How HBO’s creatives survived corporate chaos | Decoder
YouTube’s Neal Mohan on the future for creators | Decoder (2021)
Banning Trump was the right decision, says Instagram’s Mosseri | Decoder (2021)
Ethics in journalism, with Ben Smith | Decoder
Hank Green will gladly take billionaires’ money for education | Decoder
Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder!
Credits:
Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.
Decoder’s producers are Greg Ott, Kate Cox, and Nick Statt. This episode was edited by Xander Adams. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Why the current tech backlash feels different
jeudi 10 septembre 2026 • Durée 54:35
We’re back with another Decoder mailbag special. This time, we focused on feedback to Nilay’s “software brain” video essay, our ongoing coverage of AI and Big Tech backlash, surveillance, interviewing politicians ahead of the midterms, and more.
Remember: we really do read every email, so please keep sending us your feedback, and letting us know what you think of our coverage and how we can improve.
Read the full interview transcript on The Verge.
Links:
How to win — and lose — Decoder | Decoder Mailbag (2026)
Nilay answers your burning Decoder questions | Decoder Mailbag (2025)
Answering your biggest Decoder questions | Decoder Mailbag (2024)
Sundar Pichai on AI, search, and the future of the web | Decoder (2026)
The people do not yearn for automation | Decoder
Bluesky’s new CEO wants a big tent, not a bubble | Decoder
New York Governor Kathy Hochul thinks AI should be ‘less evil’ | Decoder
Subscribe to The Verge to access the ad-free version of Decoder!
Credits:
Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.
Decoder is produced by Gregg Ott, Kate Cox, and Nick Statt and edited by Ursa Wright. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane.
The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices