While struggling with PTSD, social researcher Rebecca Huntley chose an unconventional and underground path to healing — MDMA therapy.

Rebecca Huntley is well known to many Australians for her formidable intellect and career as a broadcaster, an author and a social researcher.

But despite her impressive public-facing life, in private, Rebecca's trauma from a difficult upbringing refused to leave her.

At 50, she walked the Camino in Italy and realised that after 30 years of therapy, she was still living with a great deal of anger about what had happened to her as a child.

She decided to take a radical step to deal with her PTSD and her suffering. 

She had three sessions of MDMA therapy, delivered by an underground healer. 

The treatment changed Rebecca's life and her view of the world.

This conversation discusses therapy, trauma, psychedelics, drugs, parenting, grief, family, mothers, ancestry, fathers, family dynamics, domestic violence, going no contact, exploration and loss.

To binge even more great episodes of the ‘Conversation podcast’ with Richard Fidler and Sarah Kanowski go the ABC listen app (Australia) or wherever you get your podcasts. There you’ll find hundreds of the best thought-provoking interviews with authors, writers, artists, politicians, psychologists, musicians, and celebrities.

When Carolyn Blacklock's passport was confiscated from her in a foreign country she was faced with a scary reality that got wilder at every turn

Carolyn Blacklock's passport was taken from from her at the Port Moresby International Airport when she was trying to get on a plane back to Australia. It was at that moment she realised just how much trouble she was in. 

Carolyn, who had headed up the national power company in Papua New Guinea and worked for the World Back there, had faced charges of corruption after a change in government. 

When the court cleared her of any and all wrongdoing, she thought she would be able to leave the country, but still she was detained or threatened at every turn.

So, Carolyn set about getting herself out of PNG and back to Australia by any means necessary.

What ensued was a wild, nine-day journey travelling in a helicopter, in the boot of a four-wheel drive, in a tiny dinghy and on foot. 

While Carolyn did get herself out of PNG, she desperately misses the country she called home for more than a decade.

Carolyn's story explores escape, adventure, family, regional development, the Pacific, banking, diplomacy, corruption, governance, country Australia, Papua New Guinea, close neighbours, emigration, illegal immigration, politics and foreign affairs.

Kári Gíslason was 18 when he met a mysterious stranger called 'the Pirate' on the Greek island of Corfu. When he fled the island, he left behind a debt he promised to one day repay.

When Kári Gíslason was 18, he came to the island of Corfu as a stony-broke traveller. 

But he quickly found work in a little town: lime washing walls and working as a builder’s labourer.

The man who gave him the work was a mysterious figure known simply as ’the Pirate’.

At first, Kári thought it was a nickname given to him as a comic exaggeration of his former life as a ship’s cook.

But he received warnings from several people to get away from the Pirate.

And when the Pirate said he wanted Kári to sail with him across the Atlantic to deliver unnamed goods to Brazil, Kári began to plot his escape.

Andy McCarthy found passion for solar power as a high school dropout. He began one of Australia's biggest solar businesses, right in the heart of Victoria's coal country. But then a breakdown changed everything for Andy and his family

Andy McCarthy dropped out of high school in year 10. He was a highly energetic kid but found it difficult to latch onto any one thing for long.

Andy was happier out of school, and tried a whole lot of different jobs.

Then at 19, he connected his first solar panel and was suddenly fired up with a jolt of enthusiasm.

He set up a rooftop solar business right in the middle of coal country – in the LaTrobe Valley in Country Victoria.

Setting up a solar panel shop in a place surrounded by some of Australia’s biggest coal-fired power stations was always going to invite scepticism.

But Andy’s drive saw the business grow from a garage operation to one of the biggest employers in the area. 

At the height of his success though, Andy suffered a breakdown that landed him in hospital – and he realised he would have to change, along with the rest of the planet.

Andy's story covers themes of neurodivergence, ADHD, ADD, attention-deficit/hyperactivity disorder, climate change, solar power, solar panels, batteries, small business, education, schooling, success, environmental issues, the economy, economic development, regional Australia and industry.

In this two-part series, historian Paul Ham traces how our definition and understanding of the human soul has transformed over thousands of years. Humans have been probing their own invisible inner voice since the Stone Age. But where did the concept of the soul even come from? And is it really what separates the living from the dead?

Historian and writer Paul Ham has traced how our definition and understanding of the human soul has changed over thousands of years.

Human beings have been probing their own inner voice, what it means and how it makes us feel, since the Stone Age.

The human soul has long thought to be an invisible, inner essence that makes each of us distinctively different from the rocks and trees, and which also separates the living from the dead.

But where did it come from? Who invented the concept of the soul? And do we still believe in the soul as inextricably linked to the human spirit?

In this two-part series, Paul investigated first what the pre-modern world called 'the soul'. In this episode, he explores how the concept of the soul disappeared, and became 'the mind' in the modern era.

This episode touches on ancient history, philosophy, neurology, religion, death, epic storytelling, faith, exploration and memory.

When a devastating injury ended Jack Beaumont's career as a jet fighter pilot, he decided to become a spy, in the French Secret Service.

Jack Beaumont (not his real name) is a former intelligence operative and the author of several spy thrillers.

Jack grew up in a turbulent family in Paris and when he got older he decided to train as a jet fighter pilot with the French Air Force.

During a training dogfight at supersonic speed, Jack suffered a devastating injury that meant he could no longer fly jets, but he still wanted a job steeped in adventure and danger.

So he began piloting covert spy missions, and eventually became a spy with France's secret intelligence service: the DGSE, maintaining up to five secret identities as a time.

While he now lives in a beautiful part of Australia with his wife and family, Jack has struggled to leave behind the extreme hyper vigilance of his early working life.

This conversation discusses family dynamics, adventure, history, global politics, spies, military life and spycraft.

Dog behaviourist Laura Vissaritis uses science and psychology to better understand what our dogs really are telling us and how our behaviour influences theirs (R).

Laura is a dog behaviourist with qualifications in both animal behaviour and human psychology.

Dogs were the first animals to become domesticated, and over the centuries they've evolved from their wolfish origins to become more useful, attentive and appealing to us. 

Laura says that when a dog is displaying 'difficult' behaviours like too much barking, pulling on the lead, or jumping up, the first step in the process is often changing the behaviour of their human. 

She also believes with the increasing tendency in Australia to view our dogs as quasi-people has led to heavy expectations on many dogs, to which they can't always measure up.

This episode of Conversations explores dogs, pets, animal behaviour, animal psychology, fur babies, service dogs, psychology, co-dependence, animal rescue, death, grief and animal welfare.

To binge even more great episodes of the ‘Conversations podcast’ with Richard Fidler and Sarah Kanowski go the ABC listen app (Australia) or wherever you get your podcasts. There you’ll find hundreds of the best thought-provoking interviews with authors, writers, artists, politicians, psychologists, musicians, and celebrities.

As a young child, chunks of Brenda Matthews' early memories were missing until her biological mother told her the truth of what happened. Together they are slowly healing

Wiradjuri woman Brenda Matthews was stolen from her family, along with her six siblings, when she was two-years-old.

She came from a loving, hardworking, religious family.

She was fostered by an affectionate white family, and she blended into her new life happily.

After six years of living with them, she was told it was time to return “home” to her biological family — who she didn’t remember at all.

For most of her life, Brenda suppressed her memories of her white parents and their love and care. 

Then, as an adult, she worked up the courage to bring both sides of her family together, so they could all slowly heal.

This episode touches on family history, the Stolen Generations, memoir, life stories, ancestry, modern history, origin stories, personal stories, epic storytelling, reflection, grief, loss, exploration and memory.

The country music star remembers a childhood spent roaming the Nullarbor Plain, and the number one lesson she learned from her father.

Kasey Chambers started singing around the campfire as a little girl.

She and her family spent much of the year camping on the Nullarbor Plain, where her dad would hunt for foxes and rabbits.

Kasey and her brother Nash had a free range childhood, and went to sleep to the sound of their father's rifle as he worked through the night. 

Singing came naturally to Kasey, and she loved all the old country classics, as well as some Cyndi Lauper and Bruce Springsteen.

Kasey has spent her life making music and connecting with audiences. It’s what she believes she was put on the earth to do.

This episode of Conversations touches on motherhood, family, country music, Kasey Chambers, singing, songwriting, nature, childhood, parenting, co-parenting, divorce, re-partnering, gentle parenting, making music, recording music, guitar, banjo, mandolin, Slim Dusty, Tamworth Country Music Festival.

To binge even more great episodes of the ‘Conversations podcast’ with Richard Fidler and Sarah Kanowski go the ABC listen app (Australia) or wherever you get your podcasts. There you’ll find hundreds of the best thought-provoking interviews with authors, writers, artists, politicians, singers, psychologists, musicians, and celebrities.

Gina Chick, the winner of Alone Australia on her life as a creative, outrageous, nature-loving misfit who grew up to live through great depths of love, and grief (CW: discusses the death of a child).

In 2023, Gina Chick spent 67 days by herself, in the wilderness of Tasmania’s West Coast, surviving on worms, fish, and one unlucky wallaby.

After those 67 days, Gina became the first-ever winner of a reality show on SBS called Alone Australia, but her approach to the competition was very different from the other contestants.

For Gina, the wild was not an enemy to be overcome but a place with no hierarchy, where she feels completely herself.

It’s always been that way, since she was a 'weird' little girl with a rare affinity with birds and nature.

As an adult, Gina spent years inside Sydney’s queer club scene and working for an all-girl security firm, but life changed completely for Gina when she became a mother herself.

This episode of Conversations explores motherhood, parenting, reality television, Alone Australia, winner of Alone, hunting, survival, did Gina catch the wallaby? adoption, adoptees, Kiama, South Coast NSW, ADHD, birds, neurodiversity, bad boyfriends, debt, sexually transmitted debt, scent, pheromones, younger men, Oxford Street, survival, nightclubs, podium dancing, synaesthesia, breast cancer.

To binge even more great episodes of the ‘Conversations podcast’ with Richard Fidler and Sarah Kanowski go the ABC listen app (Australia) or wherever you get your podcasts. There you’ll find hundreds of the best thought-provoking interviews with authors, writers, artists, politicians, singers, psychologists, musicians, and celebrities.

Professor Ian Henderson has spent his career searching for new treatments in the fight against antibiotic resistance superbugs

Jeffrey Broadfield has made building his life. It has taken him around the world, and given him a place to belong.

Jeffrey Broadfield is a master maker who builds houses to his clients’ wishes and quirks, using carpentry to turn recycled Australian hardwood into dream homes.

It’s a craft Jeffrey says is dying.

He grew up in Griffith, NSW, where he learned to swim in the irrigation channel and entice next door’s chooks over into his house to play.

When he left school at 16, Jeffrey became interested in fitting and turning, but on the boring train ride to a factory job interview, a well-worn tie changed the course of his life.

This episode of Conversations covers bespoke, custom craftsmanship, an epic life story, families, travel, architecture, marriage, nature, theatre.

To binge even more great episodes of the ‘Conversations podcast’ with Richard Fidler and Sarah Kanowski go the ABC listen app (Australia) or wherever you get your podcasts. There you’ll find hundreds of the best thought-provoking interviews with authors, writers, artists, politicians, singers, psychologists, musicians, and celebrities.

From using fish eyes in ice cream, and not wasting the liver, to creating recipes with fish sperm, chef Josh Niland on his mission to revolutionise how we cook and eat fish. (R)

Chef Josh Niland is devoted to changing ideas about how we cook and eat fish in the Western world.

He believes that rather than eating just the fillet, we should aim to eat the whole fish, as we do nose-to-tail with animals. At his restaurants, he cooks with fish eyeballs, fish livers, fish heads, and milt (fish sperm).

A big part of Josh's philosophy is about making fishing more sustainable. He says fishers risk their lives every, so we're duty-bound to use as much of the catch as we can.

Josh's approach is winning him acclaim around the world. At 30, he won an award that is considered the Oscars of food writing, the James Beard Award, for his first book, The Whole Fish Cookbook.

His passion has its roots in his childhood and his own origin story. At 8 years old, Josh fell terribly ill, and during a long convalescence, realised exactly what he wanted to do when he grew up.

Today, Josh has several restaurants of his own.

This conversation discusses family of origin, family, ancestry, parenting, origin stories, personal stories, reflection, memoir, life story, exploration and family dynamics

The deserts of Saudi Arabia are still holding on to many ancient secrets, hidden inside burial tombs and mysterious monumental structures called mustatils. Dr Hugh Thomas is on an archaeological mission to solve some of these mysteries.

Hugh Thomas is an archaeologist who is fascinated by ancient mortuary practices and the secrets still hidden in the deserts of Saudi Arabia.

In the north west of the country, thousands of mysterious rectangular structures, built in the fifth millennium, are still standing.

They are monumental structures, up to 600m long, built from walls of rock and best viewed from the sky, where the chambers in which ritualistic killings took place, are clear. But who or what exactly motivated these ancient architects to build such things is not yet clear.

And crisscrossing the landscape around them are kilometres of pathways called 'funerary avenues' -- routes carved out by people and herds, punctuated by burial tombs that look like jewellery from the air.

This episode of Conversations explores ancient history, deep time, epic discoveries, the Middle East, Saudi Arabia, death and archaeology.

Ji Wallace was at the top of his career as a gymnast and acrobat when a terrible injury and surprising diagnosis brought him back down to earth, temporarily.

Ji was an energetic, only child growing up on a bush block in suburban Brisbane when his parents brought home a trampoline to keep him occupied.

Ji took to it so quickly, he learnt how to flip by that afternoon, and was a national champion in gymnastics just a couple of years later.

He managed to make a career out of bouncing around, representing Australia at the Olympics and then joining Cirque Du Soleil as an acrobat.

But a terrible injury, and then the news that he was HIV positive, set Ji on a different course, although he didn't let it keep him grounded. 

This episode of Conversations explores elite athletes, gymnastics, the Olympics, Brisbane 2032, parenting, coming out, the queer community, LGBT issues, andHIV and AIDS.

Psychiatrist Duncan McKellar wrote the report that triggered the Royal Commission into Aged Care Quality and Safety. He has seen how care changes when we take someone's life story into account.

Duncan McKellar is a psychiatrist specialising in the care of older people with dementia and serious mental health conditions.

When Duncan first started working with these patients, he was shocked to find elderly people tied to chairs and left in locked rooms.

His advocacy helped trigger the Royal Commission into Aged Care Quality and Safety and he devoted himself to running a very different kind of care facility — one where everyone’s story is understood and respected.

This episode of Conversations discusses aged care, elder abuse, older Australians, aging, Alzheimer's, dementia, aging population, family dynamics, grief.

Further information

Duncan's book An Everyone Story: Finding our way back to compassion, hope and humanity is published by Wakefield Press

Read more about Duncan and his daughter, Erin's musical A Box of Memories here.

To binge even more great episodes of the ‘Conversations podcast’ with Richard Fidler and Sarah Kanowski go the ABC listen app (Australia) or wherever you get your podcasts. There you’ll find hundreds of the best thought-provoking interviews with authors, writers, artists, politicians, singers, psychologists, musicians, and celebrities.

The late James Earl Jones grew up with a stutter and hardly said a word for years. After an English teacher intervened, he grew up to become one of the world's finest actors. (R)

Actor James Earl Jones died recently, at the age of 93.

When he was touring Australia in 2013 with a production of Driving Miss Daisy, Richard had the chance to sit down with him and ask him about his life.

Although we knew him for his magnificent voice,  James Earl Jones grew up with a stutter.

A stutter which was so severe that he hardly said a word for years. 

But after the intervention of an English professor, he decided to become an actor.

He grew up to become one of his generation's finest stage and screen actors, in films like The Hunt for Red October, Patriot Games and of course, in Star Wars.

This episode of Conversations explores Hollywood, film, cinema, stuttering, acting, Star Wars, cinema, obit, obituaries.

To binge even more great episodes of the ‘Conversations podcast’ with Richard Fidler and Sarah Kanowski go the ABC listen app (Australia) or wherever you get your podcasts. There you’ll find hundreds of the best thought-provoking interviews with authors, writers, artists, politicians, psychologists, musicians, and celebrities.

From sharks with wheels of teeth, to gargantuan sharks like the megalodon, palaeontologist John Long has traced the long and storied history of these oceanic hunters.

Sharks and humans have a complicated relationship.

We have long considered them monsters and super predators that should be eliminated for our own safety.

But sharks are much more than scary and fearsome.

The history of this incredible animal stretches back hundreds of millions of years.

From sharks with wheels of teeth, to the ascent of the super predators like the megalodon, palaeontologist John Long has traced the long and storied history of these hunters, asking how they've managed to survive extinction despite everything that's been thrown at them.

This episode of Conversations explores science, origin stories, ancient history, sharks, palaeontology, the ocean, climate change, megalodon, hunting and predators.

Further information

The Secret History of Sharks: The Rise of the Ocean's Most Fearsome Predators is published by Hachette

To binge even more great episodes of the ‘Conversations podcast’ with Richard Fidler and Sarah Kanowski go the ABC listen app (Australia) or wherever you get your podcasts. There you’ll find hundreds of the best thought-provoking interviews with authors, writers, artists, politicians, singers, psychologists, musicians, and celebrities.

Author and professor Anita Heiss on her parents' story of romance, and how she brings true history alive in her work.

Anita Heiss is a Wiradjuri woman, an author of many books and Professor of Communications at The University of Queensland.

She has described herself as a “concrete Koori with Westfield dreaming.”

Many of Anita's books focus on great love stories, and the inspiration for these romances came from the enduring, devoted love she saw between her parents – the very Austrian “Joe-the-carpenter”, and Elsie, a proud Wiradjuri woman.

Anita’s latest book goes back to the 1800s, bringing to life the brutal frontier wars in Bathurst, when martial law was declared.

This episode of Conversations discusses First Nations Australians, interracial relationships, Indigenous culture, colonisation, colonialism, family, origin stories, love stories, Australian history, ancestry.

For decades, Gideon Haigh and his mother were the only two people who really knew what happened on Jaz's last night. This year, it all poured out.

Gideon Haigh's brother Jasper was 17 years old when he died in a car crash.

Until this year, Gideon and his mother were the only two people who really knew what happened to Jaz on that tragic night.

Gideon has spent decades perfecting answers to questions about his brother — answers that never invited further discussion.

This year, something peculiar happened, and in 72 hours Gideon poured his pent-up recollections onto the page, to be turned into a book about the story of his brother, Jaz.

This episode touches on grief, family stories, loss, mothers, brotherhood, love, life, death, writing, reflection, secrets, storytelling, memoir, life stories, family dynamics and personal stories.

Irish journalist and author, Fintan O'Toole on how the Victorians changed the meaning of Shakespeare's plays, and how we can bring them back to life.

Fintan O'Toole is an Irish journalist and author who writes on politics and history for the New York Review of Books and the Irish Times.

He wants to change the way we think about Shakespeare's plays, because the way many of us are introduced to Shakespeare is wrong and boring.

Fintan says Shakespeare’s work is wrongly presented as a delivery system for simple moral instruction — a hangover from the Victorian era, which wanted to turn Shakespeare into a form of "mental muesli".

According to Fintan, the genius of Shakespeare is that his characters keep escaping narrow moral categories, just as people do in real life.

This episode of Conversations deals with Shakespeare's epic plays, life, death, betrayal, history, kings, royalty, motherhood, fatherhood, grief, life processes, making meaning of life and morality, Othello, Hamlet, Romeo and Juliet.

After a childhood spent trying to escape her father's booze-fuelled outbursts, Seana developed her own problem relationship with drinking. But by her mid-50s, Seana decided she had had enough.

Seana Smith grew up in a beautiful house in rural Scotland, and when things were good at home, they were wonderful.

But Seana’s father loved to drink, and his habit took over her family’s life.

Despite the fights, abuse and violence, Seana's mother couldn't bring herself to leave her husband, and so Seana found every excuse to get away -- from pony camp at 12 years old, to applying for boarding school without her parents' knowledge, and then to Oxford University.

Eventually Seana fell in love and ended up on the opposite side of the world, in Australia, where she started a family of her own.

But as she reached her mid 50s, Seana realised that the way she loved to drink meant she hadn’t really left home at all, and so she started her own journey of sobriety.

Seana's story deals with themes of alcoholism, substance abuse, problem drinking, dementia, family violence, sobriety, motherhood and getting sober.

Writer George Saunders on how famous short stories by writers like Chekhov, Tolstoy, Turgenev and Gogol are like miniature models of the world and how they can teach us to transcend our own limitations. (R)

For many years, author George Saunders taught a writing masterclass in upstate New York, in which he introduced students to the stories of the great Russian authors. 

Conversations with his students about writers like Tolstoy and Chekhov have given George some of the happiest moments of his life. 

George thinks the short stories written by these literary giants are like miniature models of the world—they show us what it's like to get lost in the snow on a winter's night, and how it feels to swim in a pond in the rain.

He says they can reveal so much to us about how we should live in this world and what we might want from the world and the humans in it.

This episode of Conversations discusses books, writing, literature, Russian literature, tertiary education, human connection, personal development, personal growth, Anna Karenina, epic books, origin stories, Steven Colbert's favourite author, the creative process, how to write, how to become a writer.

Claire Nelson hadn't told anyone where she was going, and her phone lost signal shortly into her hike. As an experienced bushwalker, she never dreamed an adventure would turn out like this. (R) 

Claire Nelson was hiking alone in Joshua Tree National Park in 2018, when she slipped on a stack of boulders and fell 25 feet to the ground.

The impact shattered Claire’s pelvis, and she couldn’t even raise herself on her elbows, let alone stand.

She could reach her phone, but in the middle of the Californian desert it was out of range.

Looking at the maps she'd downloaded, Claire realised she'd walked way off the trail, so there was no chance of another hiker coming by.

Day after day, Claire lay on her back in the scorching sun hoping she could last long enough for someone to realise she was missing.

This episode of Conversations touches on mothers, mountains, epic stories, deserts, hiking, solo adventuring, catastrophe, wilderness, big nature, injuries, Joshua Tree National Park, survival, rattlesnakes, coyotes, travel in the USA, travel insurance.

At the age of 18, Oceane Campbell tried to take her own life. She survived and fought her way back into life, becoming a midwife and a mother of three (CW: discussion of suicide, please take care when listening). (R)

Oceane Campbell has been very close with the raw stuff of life.

She's a midwife and a mother, so she's seen and experienced the power of birth many times over.

She has also been very close to death. At the age of 18, Oceane tried to take her own life.

After she survived, she began a painstaking climb back into living.

Oceane also slowly rebuilt her relationship with her mother, Cecile, and a few years ago they wrote a memoir of what had happened together.

As an adult, Oceane met and married her wife Sarah and retrained as a midwife.

She and Sarah now have three children of their own.

Recently Oceane was named as Newcastle's Woman of the Year for her work in midwifery and her advocacy for the LGBTQ+ community.

This conversation mentions family dynamics, families, mothers, origin stories, mothering, midwifery, self harm, life and death.

Content warning: Please take care when listening as this conversation mentions suicide and sexual assault.

Help is always available.

If you need to talk, 24/7 crisis support is available from Lifeline by calling 13 11 14.

You can also text with them and chat online with counsellors here

Toni Jordan grew up working in a T.A.B. with her cyclonic mother, and going to the greyhound races. Then she grew up to become a best-selling novelist. (R)

Toni Jordan is a best-selling novelist.

But she didn't grow up in a house full of books.

Her mum ran a T.A.B. and her dad trained greyhounds for a living.

Toni's mum was hardworking and hilarious, but she could also be hard to live with. 

All her life, Toni felt she had to look out for her mum.

But after Marg became a grandmother, Toni began to admire her in new ways.

This conversation talks about gambling, money, family dynamics, origin stories, parenting, mental health, writing, film, domestic violence and relationships.

Content warning: this episode of Conversations contains discussion about domestic violence and self harm.

Jon Owen's mum enrolled him in a computer science degree at University - expecting him to build a flourishing career; which he did. It just wasn't the one that everyone expected. (R)

Jon Owen came to Australia as a small child.

He survived playground racism at school, and became a high achiever.

His family expected him to excel at school and university and go on to a flourishing career.

And that's exactly what he did — in a way that nobody could have predicted.

Jon was near the end of his computer science degree when he chose a life of 'intentional downward mobility'.

He began working with the homeless, the addicted and the disenfranchised, and living with them too.

Today he's the Pastor and CEO at Sydney's Wayside Chapel in Kings' Cross.

This story is about family of origin, ancestry, life stories, disadvantage, drug use, children, faith, charity, social work, refugees, asylum seekers, Christianity, Jesus, family stories, family life, homelessness, caring, love, and downward mobility

After a stint being homeless and living in his car, Stephen Smith was working at David Jones Food Hall when one of his colleagues noticed his remarkable singing voice. A few years later, he became a tenor on the operatic world stage (R)

In 1882, thousands of sheep set off from a property in Western Victoria. Their destination was a huge station in the Northern Territory, land which a sheep had never set foot on. To get there, these animals and their drover battled drought, flood, famine and doubt.

Tom Guthrie is a winemaker and sheep farmer in Western Victoria, and is a descendent in a long line of enterprising farmers.

Almost 150 years ago, after surviving shipwrecks, fires and floods, Tom's ambitious great grandfather sent 11,000 sheep by foot to unseen land in the Northern Territory.

The journey took 16 months, and the sheep were led almost 3,500km by their drover, through drought, flood and famine.

It became the longest sheep drive in Australian history.

In recent years, Tom has had to call on his family's grit and resilience to get through the most unimaginable tragedy for a parent -- the loss of a child.

This episode of Conversations deals with family history, ancestry, farming, books, death of a child, Australiana, winemaking, colonisation, grief, fatherhood, death and the loss of a child.

Beloved Australian actor, Noni Hazlehurst looks back on her life on stage and screen.

Noni Hazlehurst has been on Australian TV screens and theatres for nearly 50 years.

She comes from a long line of performers. 

Noni's parents met while they were part of a touring Variety act in the UK, and her great grandfather was a famous child trapeze artist.

Keeping children company on Playschool was one of her best known roles, which she had for 24 years.

In Noni’s day, Playschool was recorded in one take, unless one of the presenters swore or was bitten by a rabbit.

This episode focuses on motherhood, acting, stage, screen, actors, Playschool, Better Homes and Gardens, vocation, life calling, trapeze, variety act, family, the Blue Mountains, characters, pretend, make-believe.

They're violent and scary, some of them are madmen and others are convicted killers, but the gangsters who control organised crime syndicates in Melbourne are mostly just stupid, according to veteran crime reporter John Silvester.

Veteran crime reporter John Silvester has been covering gangland wars, armed robberies and serial killers in Melbourne for almost half a century.

Over that time, the city has changed dramatically from a big town, where organised crime was isolated to suburbia, to a 24/7 global city with global city problems.

But one thing has stayed the same—the type of characters who run the seedy underbelly of Melbourne city.

Some of them are madmen, some are murderers, but according to John, most of them are too stupid to stop their egos getting involved in their business.

And so every 20 years, the same cycle of territory wars and gangland violence starts again.

John's latest book, Dark City, is published by Pan Macmillan

This episode of Conversations explores Melbourne, organised crime, gangs, mafia, triads, yakuza, underbelly, police, cops, serial killers, true crime, drugs, fatherhood, writing, books, Chopper Read, Carl Williams, Tony Mokbel.

Penny Moodie grew up consumed by catastrophic thoughts and developed habits to try to ward off impending doom. It turned out she had been living with obsessive-compulsive disorder. (R)

Penny Moodie grew up consumed by catastrophic thoughts and ideas - that her parents would die in a car crash, that her mother was not really her mother, or that she had somehow contracted HIV aids.

It's not unusual for children to worry about their parents and their own safety, but for Penny these anxieties went much further.

She thought she could ward off catastrophes by doing specific things, by developing compulsive behaviours and routines.

It turns out, Penny had been living obsessive compulsive disorder for more than 30 years before she was diagnosed.

Only recently has Penny been able to understand what she's truly afraid of, to discard her constant state of anxiety and to finally take joy in the simple pleasures of life.

This episode of Conversations explores mental health, mental illness, obsessive-compulsive disorder, anxiety, generalised anxiety disorder, OCD, late diagnosis, neurodiversity, behavioural disorder, therapy, habits, building good habits, simple joys.

When surf writer Tim Baker was diagnosed with Stage 4 prostate cancer, he had no idea how the hormones which saved his life would fundamentally change his experience of being a man (R).

Surf writer Tim Baker was in his early fifties when he was riding a very good wave in his life.

He had a job he loved as a surfing writer, a beautiful family, and he lived within walking distance of the beach.

But on a work trip to Los Angeles, Tim began to need to use the 'rest room' a lot more than usual.

Back in Australia, he went to see his doctor, then an oncologist who gave him some terrible news. He had Stage 4 prostate cancer and it had spread to his bones.

Tim has written a candid account of living with cancer, and some of the grim and rarely spoken about side effects of his life-saving hormone therapy; effects which have profoundly changed his identity and his relationships.

This episode of Conversations explores cancer, prostate cancer, testosterone, hormone treatment, surfing, masculinity, mortality, books, writing, manhood, aging, bone cancer, fatherhood, big waves, middle age.

Dasha Ross' most epic adventures were chartered with her larger-than-life husband John Pinder, including the time they managed a beachside hotel in Sri Lanka. Things did not go as planned.

Dasha Ross has lived a life full of adventures, from nude modelling in Sydney and making films in Brazil, to renovating a nightclub in Harlem with a baby on her hip.

But Dasha's biggest adventures were with her beloved husband John Pinder, including the time the two of them took up a surprising offer to revamp and manage a beachside hotel in Sri Lanka.

Things did not go as planned as they battled typhoons, demanding guests and a meddling, possibly murderous, manager.

This episode of Conversations explores epic adventures, cancer, the death of a loved one, grief, travel, Sri Lanka, Harlem, New York City, film production, journalism, film making, Brazil, marriage, amnesia, brain conditions, medical enigmas.

From Wollongong to London, via Alice Springs, this is writer Nikki Gemmell on her deeply romantic life, and how she defied expectations to become a famous author.

Writer Nikki Gemmell grew up the daughter of a coal miner who thought writers were a burden on society, while her mum taught Nikki that only success was worthy of love.

So Nikki went above and beyond to prove her beloved father wrong, and to get the attention of her mother through her achievements, publishing 20 books in the process, including the wildly successful The Bride Stripped Bare.

The mother of four children, Nikki has also been determined to live her own life and raise her own children very differently, being generous with her love and pride for her sons and daughter.

Content warning: Please take care when listening as this conversation mentions suicide.

This episode of Conversations explores romance, love, epic love, relationships, break-ups, divorce, menopause, peri-menopause, parenting, coal mining, the working class, education, books, writing, novels, children of divorce, adventure, fathers and daughters.

To binge even more great episodes of the ‘Conversations podcast’ with Richard Fidler and Sarah Kanowski go the ABC listen app (Australia) or wherever you get your podcasts. There you’ll find hundreds of the best thought-provoking interviews with authors, writers, artists, politicians, singers, psychologists, musicians, and celebrities.

Following the coup of 2021, Australian economist Sean Turnell received an email from a "secret friend", warning him he was being watched by Myanmar's military. Moments later, the police closed in on him.

Sean Turnell is an Australian economist with longstanding connections to Myanmar, the nation formerly known as Burma.

In 2016, Sean was appointed as senior economic advisor to the dissident Aung San Suu Kyi, who had become the country's prime minister after decades of military rule.

The country had another election, and democracy was cemented. 

But the military staged a coup in 2021, and Sean was arrested and charged with being a spy, and imprisoned in a sealed room the size of a shipping container.

For nearly two years, Sean struggled to keep his mind and body together, while his wife and the Australian government campaigned for his release.

This episode of Conversations touches on an epic life story, personal story, grief, memoir, reflection, death, modern history, an exploration of Myanmar, political history, Burma, civil war, prison, jail, death row, political prisoners.

Further information

Sean's memoir An Unlikely Prisoner and Sean's recollection of the economic rehabilitation program, Best Laid Plans: The inside story of reform in Aung San Suu Kyi's Myanmar are published by Penguin

To binge even more great episodes of the ‘Conversations podcast’ with Richard Fidler and Sarah Kanowski go the ABC listen app (Australia) or wherever you get your podcasts. There you’ll find hundreds of the best thought-provoking interviews with authors, writers, artists, politicians, singers, psychologists, musicians, and celebrities.

From the unforgiving tropics of the Kokoda track to Mt Everest, wilderness guide Steve Ellis has made a career teaching bushcraft and survival skills to civilians and Defence personnel – and along the way he has survived his share of life-threatening situations.

Steve Ellis' own first lesson in survival came very young.

He was just 6 years old when he got lost in the national forest near his family farm in central Victoria, but as Steve snuggled up to one of the working dogs for the night, he knew he'd be ok.

Steve has made a career of teaching bushcraft and survival skills to civilians and Defence personnel.

He's guided treks across freezing North American glaciers, and through the unforgiving tropics of the Kokoda track.

Steve never tires of the awe and wonder of the natural world and looking up at the night sky, particularly at his beloved Southern Cross, when he's far from the city lights.

This episode of Conversations explores mountaineering, avalanches, hiking, Mt Everest, fire, NORFORCE, Army, military, celestial navigation, food, family, war, military history, WWII, Anzac, Nepal, astronomy.

The hardship, cruelty and loneliness of the mission system during the Great Depression didn't crush Aunty Ruth Hegarty's spirit. She found her voice, God and her family. (R)

In 1929 during the Great Depression, Ruth travelled with her mother and grandparents to Barambah, later known as Cherbourg Aboriginal Mission. After being told someone there would help them find a new home, they soon discovered they weren't allowed to leave.

At 4 years of age, Ruth was separated from her family. She grew up as a dormitory girl, and was sent out to work as a domestic servant when she turned 14.

But the cruelty and loneliness of the mission system didn't crush Ruth's spirit.

Ruth found her voice, she found God, and she became a matriarch to five generations of descendants.

Content warning: this episode contains discussions about abuse, family violence, and Stolen Generations

This episode of Conversations explores Australian history, Indigenous history, the Stolen Generations, missions, the Voice referendum, the Great Depression, Cherbourg, domestic work, motherhood, grief, religion, Christianity, God, Faith.

Indian-Australian actor and playwright, Nicholas Brown on being cast as a villain, and what made him end his time in Mumbai for a different life back home.

Actor Nicholas Brown regularly appears on Playschool — cavorting with stuffed animals and singing about the solar system.

Back when he was growing up in Western Sydney there was no one who looked like him when he’d turn the telly on. 

Nicholas became the youngest student accepted to NIDA, straight out of school, but his career failed to launch in Australia.

So, he packed his bags, headed to Mumbai and became a Bollywood villain, working with the Brad Pitt of India and meeting producers who had gunshot wounds from their time in the industry.

But Bollywood wasn't the right fit, and when dear friends invited Nicholas home to Sydney to start a new project, he couldn't resist.

This episode of Conversations touches on epic life stories, personal stories, origin stories, mothers, fathers, grief, family dynamics, LGBTQI, Bollywood, Hrithik Roshan, NIDA, acting, reflection, identity and fatherhood.

Joh Jarvis was a high-flying boss when grief from a terrible loss began to overwhelm her. She tried therapy, exercise and healthy eating. Then she found Vedic meditation, and the experience was 'psychedelic'.

Joh Jarvis is a Vedic meditation teacher.

Every week, she travels into Rikers Island Prison — a notorious jail in New York City — to teach meditation to hardened criminals.

Joh grew up in Adelaide and had always wanted to live amidst the bright lights of New York.

After a stint as a bicycle courier, she worked her way up to management at the ABC.

As she approached 50, she had a well-paying job, a nice house, and strong connections with friends and family. 

But long-term grief had hollowed her out, and she asked herself, is this all there is?

Then she was introduced to Vedic meditation, and she says her first encounter was 'psychedelic'.

To binge even more great episodes of the ‘Conversation podcast’ with Richard Fidler and Sarah Kanowski go the ABC listen app (Australia) or wherever you get your podcasts. There you’ll find hundreds of the best thought-provoking interviews with authors, writers, artists, politicians, psychologists, musicians, and celebrities.

This episode touches on epic life stories, family dynamics, grief, loss, reflection, Vedic meditation, meditation, personal stories, origin stories, death, career, giving back, New York City, Rikers Island prison, incarceration, justice system, prison system, mindfulness and mantras.

Australian Gonzo author and documentary filmmaker John Safran has made a career out of getting into places he probably shouldn't be. He put his sanity on the line in his latest escapade — breaking into one of Kanye West's strange homes.

His latest slightly criminal expedition saw him squatting in a Hollywood mansion belonging to Kanye West.

John had seen a clip of the hip-hop mega star denying the Holocaust, defending Adolf Hitler, and claiming that Black people cannot be anti-Semitic because they are actually Jewish.

His week writing and snooping in this strange house, with no running water and a vulture in the roof, made John go increasingly loopy as he tried to understand what pushed this critically acclaimed artist from celebrity eccentric to seriously 'out there'.

This episode of Conversations explores celebrity culture, pop culture, Taylor Swift, Hollywood, anti-Semitism, Donda Academy, conspiracy theories, celebrity worship, hip-hop, street fashion,Jay Z, Kim Kardashian, Cornerstone Christian Church, UFOs, Black Hebrew Israelites, David Cole, holocaust deniers, revisionist history, racism, race relations, modern America, US election, Trump, Kamala Harris.

Antony Penrose grew up knowing little about his remarkable mother Lee Miller, who had studied with Man Ray in Paris, and become a model, a photographer, and a war correspondent. But then an unexpected find in the family attic changed everything. (R)

Lee Miller was a Vogue model, a photographer, and a war correspondent who studied in Paris with her lover, Man Ray, lived in Egypt, and captured some of the most searing images of the holocaust.

Recently she has become famous in pop culture for her glamour and her iconic photographic images. 

But there is much more to her story. 

Lee's son Antony grew up on a farm in East Sussex as the son of Lee and the surrealist painter Roland Penrose.

His relationship with his mum was often strained, as Lee was then struggling with PTSD and alcohol addiction. 

She eventually lifted herself out of her drinking and when she became sober, she swapped her camera for the kitchen and became an experimental chef of some renown in the last years of her life.

Soon after Lee's death at the age of 70,  Antony's wife made a chance discovery of thousands of photographic negatives and some of Lee's manuscripts in a family attic.

It became a rich seam of material for the family to begin to begin to understand Lee's multi-faceted life story.

Antony now devotes his working life to Lee's legacy. 

Some years ago he wrote an acclaimed biography of her called 'The Lives of Lee Miller'.

This episode of Conversations touches on new films, film recommendations, family legacy, epic life story, origin stories, Man Ray, WWII, the Holocaust, Lee Miller, motherhood, family, PTSD, war correspondence, war photography, Kate Winslet and Ellen Kuras.

Bhawani O'Brien's first name means "giver of life" in Tamil, which is ironic she says, because one of the greatest privileges of her life has been helping more than 100 people in their dying moments as a voluntary assisted dying practitioner.

Bhawani grew up in Malaysia with Sri Lankan parents, both of whom were doctors.

She was also expected to become a doctor, a lawyer, an engineer or an accountant. Luckily for her, she adored her father, and followed his footsteps into medical school without protest.

But after decades working as a GP, Bhawani had lost her purpose and also her beloved father, who died back at home in Malaysia while Bhawani was stuck behind locked borders in Western Australia.

Not long after his death, she found a random pamphlet in her pigeonhole at work.

It was about voluntary assisted dying, which became legal in WA in 2021, and it changed the course of Bhawani's professional and personal life.

This episode of Conversations explores death, grief, grieving, cancer, terminal illness, Neurodegenerative disorders, VAD, voluntary assisted dying, living wakes, euthanasia, palliative care, how to say goodbye, how to grieve, doctors, GP, medical fraternity, medical community, migration, multiculturalism, prejudice.

In 2024 Nate Byrne went from presenting the weather to making the news when he acknowledged live on air that he was experiencing a panic attack. Keeping cool under pressure is a skill Nate developed in his first career as a Naval Officer, and perhaps also from his days as a go-go dancer in a Perth nightclub.

Nate Byrne is the Weather Presenter on ABC News Breakfast.

In August this year Nate went from presenting the weather to making the news when he acknowledged, as he was broadcasting live, that he was experiencing a panic attack.

It's something that had been happening on many mornings for the past few years whenever Nate stood at one of his favourite places in the world: in front of the weather wall in the ABC TV studio.

Nate has decided this is just his body being 'a doofus' and has found a way to redirect his brain once the panic starts.

Keeping cool under pressure is a skill Nate developed in his first career as a Naval Officer… and perhaps also from his days as a go-go dancer in a Perth nightclub.

This episode of Conversations explores family, marriage equality, science, meteorology, TV Broadcasting, the weather, origin stories, weather forecasts, military history, World War Two, the navy, submarines, sea mines, naval mines, Arab Spring, and dancing.

Chef Ben Shewry grew up on a farm in New Zealand where his family grew or hunted most of their own food.

Ben was 10 when he started working in restaurants and his discovery of a second hand Thai cookbook eventually led him to Australia.

In 2015 Ben become the owner of Attica in Melbourne and turned it into one of the world's most acclaimed and innovative restaurants.

This episode of Conversations explores origin, family, ancestry, parenting, origin stories, Melbourne, personal stories, depression, mental health, reflection, memoir, life story, exploration, food, cooking, hospitality, aboriginal food, bush foods, restaurant, critics, butchery, baking, farming, hunting, fishing, diving and lockdown lasagne.

Legendary cook, author, food producer and educator Maggie Beer had a circuitous path to the food world, which began when she left school at 14. (R)

Legendary cook, author, food producer and educator Maggie Beer grew up in Lakemba in South-West Sydney, and got her first job when she was 14 years old.

Maggie had to leave school early to go out to work to help support her family after her father's business went bankrupt.

Although she had a varied working life over the next two decades, it wasn't until her mid-30s that Maggie found her purpose.

She and her husband, Colin, began a pheasant farm in South Australia's Barossa Valley, then added a farm gate shop and a restaurant.

After a few years of struggle, a review of their business changed everything.

Later, Maggie began her next chapter as a TV star on The Cook and the Chef and Masterchef.

Recently Maggie has been campaigning to improve the quality of food in aged care. This year she was recognised with an international TV host award for her work on ABC TV's Maggie Beer's Big Mission.

This episode of Conversations explores food, food inequality, farm to table, the Barossa, Western Sydney, aged care, nutrition, health and wellbeing, food for the soul, recipes, dinner recipes, home cooking, gastronomy, hospitality, chefs., family recipes.

Michael Visontay with the true tale of how fragments of a rare Gutenberg Bible were sold off, leaf by leaf, in New York in the 1920s, and how the sale of these books, chapters and verses changed the course of his own family.

Some years ago journalist Michael Visontay was researching his family history when he stumbled upon the story of a man named Gabriel Wells, who had been a New York book dealer at the height of the Roaring 20s. 

As a way to make fast money, Wells came up with a scandalous plan.

He bought a precious, ancient copy of the world's greatest book, the Gutenberg Bible, and began extracting leaves from it to sell off the individual pages. 

Wealthy buyers were willing to pay big money for the 'noble fragments', and Wells died a rich man.

More than a century later, Michael discovered an extraordinary link between the story of Gabriel Wells and his own family history. He then set out to track down the pages of the broken bible himself.

This episode of Conversations discusses rare books, the Holocaust, World War Two, refugees, the Iron Curtain, post-war migration, Hungary, Judaism, divorce, blended families, small business, love stories, family stories, origin stories, Anglicisation of names, Sydney, Kings Cross.

As Andrew Dwyer ventured further into the desert, he fell in love with the people and the landscape. He battled sandstorms, floods and isolation to serve fine foods under the stars.

When Andrew Dwyer was growing up in 1960s Melbourne, the city wasn't the foodie destination it is now, in fact it was often described as a "culinary wasteland".

But luckily for Andrew, his Czechoslovakian godfather and his Chinese stepmother introduced him to incredible flavours and cooking techniques from further afield.

At the same time, Andrew was bushwalking and skiing and falling in love with the outdoors.

Eventually, he combined his passion for wild places with his passion for good food.

Andrew started venturing further and further west, far into the Australian outback — and he took his fine foods with him.

This episode of Conversations explores travel, fine dining, food, cooking, camp cooking, travel, snow skiing, the Victorian Alps, good food, good weekender, travel recommendations, the Gibson Desert, Nothern Territory, South Australia, Adelaide, Australian Explorers, Giles, Pintupi 9, Indigenous tourism, tourism industry, foodies.

An impulse decision to buy a home in the rainforest results in a comedy of errors involving a python in the roof, an unexpected tax bill, two reality TV shows discussing bowel movements with Shane Warne. (R)

Akmal Saleh doesn't like the jungle or rainforests, or any of the animals in the jungle or rainforest. 

Akmal likes cafes and running water, which made the comedian's purchase of a cabin in the hills outside Byron Bay incredibly puzzling to those who know him. 

Looking for a place where their two dogs could run free, Akmal and his wife bought their remote cabin on an impulse.

After twelve days, they knew the tree-change, hippie lifestyle wasn't for them. 

What followed was a comedy of errors involving a python in the roof, carpet-eating rats, a half-finished home, an unexpected tax bill, two reality shows and discussing bowel movements with Shane Warne.

This episode of Conversations discusses sea changes, tree changes, impulse purchases, real estate, comedy, stand-up comedy, regional Australia, regional property market, buying property, I'm a Celebrity Get Me Out of Here, Selling Houses Australia, the rainforest, the Byron Bay Hinterland, northern NSW.

Athlete Gerrard Gosens didn't realise he was blind until his first day at primary school. His adventurous spirit led him to become a three time Paralympian, climb Mt Everest, swim the English Channel, and perform the rhumba on Dancing With The Stars.

This conversation talks about family life, family history, childhood memories, origin stories, training, medical procedures, surgery, mountaineering, mountains, cycling, open water swimming, parenting, genetic conditions, glaucoma, disability, charity, Stevie Wonder, chocolate, training, exercising, Paralympic sport, triathlon, indoor climbing, sepsis, team building, reality TV, and fundraising.