Explorez tous les épisodes du podcast And The Writer Is...with Ross Golan

Today’s guest is a three-time GRAMMY-winning singer, songwriter and producer behind some of country music’s biggest songs.

Across more than two decades, she’s built a career on honest stories, unmistakable songs and doing things her own way.

And The Writer Is… Miranda Lambert!

Recorded live at Casa Rosa in Nashville, Miranda joins Ross to tell the stories behind “Kerosene,” “Gunpowder & Lead,” “The House That Built Me,” “Mama’s Broken Heart,” “Vice” and “Tin Man.”

She shares how she co-wrote “Choosin’ Texas” with Ella Langley, why she gave Steve Earle half the credit for “Kerosene,” and why some of the most important songs in her set weren’t written by her.

And The Writer Is… is presented by Amazon Music and SONA.

Listen on Amazon Music: https://music.amazon.com/podcasts/bfeec5ec-e02d-43eb-917c-5d4e182eadb4/and-the-writer-is-with-ross-golan

CHAPTERS

00:00 Introducing Miranda Lambert

00:56 Writing Choosin’ Texas with Ella Langley

05:21 Finding New Song Ideas After So Many Albums

06:36 Chris Stapleton and a New Retro Sound

08:47 Songwriting Retreats and Creative Chemistry

16:35 Learning the Craft in Texas Honky-Tonks

21:37 Nashville Star and Her Mom’s Wake-Up Call

25:06 Casa Rosa: A Place for the Girls

27:30 Kerosene, Steve Earle, and Doing It Her Way

33:42 The Stories Behind Gunpowder & Lead

36:52 Revolution and The House That Built Me

42:24 Writing Over You with Blake Shelton

45:03 Mama’s Broken Heart and Outside Songs

49:49 Building Platinum

53:55 Somethin’ Bad with Carrie Underwood

57:54 The Weight of These Wings and Vice

1:02:55 Writing Tin Man

1:06:01 Wildcard, the Love Junkies, and Bluebird

1:08:47 Life Off the Road and Writing on Zoom

1:13:08 Palomino and a Changing Music Business

1:14:52 Letting Go of Expectations and Staying Yourself

Join the ATWI Patreon for monthly Zoom hangs, demo feedback, special guests and access to 200+ archived audio episodes: https://www.patreon.com/andthewriteris Subscribe for more conversations with the songwriters behind the songs.

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Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London and Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is the British singer-songwriter behind “Escapism.” and “WHERE IS MY HUSBAND!”

After seven years in a record deal without releasing her debut album, she went independent, landed a UK No. 1 and won six BRIT Awards in one night.

This is the story of how she found her own way to succeed—and brought her people with her.

And The Writer Is... RAYE!

In this episode, we get into:

• Signing a record deal at 17, having hits, and still being unable to release her debut album.

• The album called “too risky,” the partner who backed it, and “Escapism.” changing everything.

• Bringing her family and band into the success, and demanding fairer treatment for songwriters.

• Her full writing process, early “Click Clack Symphony.” demos, and nine hours on the “WHERE IS MY HUSBAND!” bridge. and much more.

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Join us on Patreon: patreon.com/andthewriteris

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association. Your support means the world to us.

PRS for Music — supporting songwriters, composers and publishers. Find out more: https://www.prsformusic.com/join

And @splice — the best sample library on the market. Period. Have you tried variations yet?

CHAPTERS

0:00 Intro

1:10 Making music and touring with her family

7:38 What happened to her grandfather's songs

9:49 Ad: PRS for Music

11:09 Ad: Splice 12:16

Ross's stolen-song story and the line between influence and theft

17:33 Who deserves a songwriting credit?

19:52 Why songwriters deserve fees and master points

25:29 The power to say no and protect your splits

28:50 Advice for young writers: choosing your battles and avoiding comparison

33:18 Writing her first song at seven

36:48 The BRIT School and finding her voice

42:21 Subscribe to And The Writer Is

42:50 Jazz freedom and her first music-industry reality check

47:13 The dance hits that came with conditions

48:17 Signing her record deal at 17

54:26 Seven years, hit records and still no debut album

56:33 Going independent and the Escapism. breakthrough

1:02:56 Ice Cream Man. and finding strength through music

1:08:15 The BRIT Awards night she still has not watched back

1:10:38 Making THIS MUSIC MAY CONTAIN HOPE. on her own terms

1:12:38 Playing the early Click Clack Symphony. demos

1:14:53 Why she writes with Auto-Tune

1:17:15 Title first: heels, lyrics and theatrical melodies

1:18:48 Nine hours on the WHERE IS MY HUSBAND! bridge

1:21:19 Getting bigger without trying to please everyone

1:23:30 Who is Suzanne? Picking a song for every mood

1:26:18 Her grandfather's poems in Fields

1:27:04 Opening for Bruno Mars

1:28:48 Closing: building a better music industry

CREDITS

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Edited by Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is the Swedish producer and songwriter behind "Problem," "Into You," "Love Me Like You Do," "No Tears Left To Cry," "Santa Tell Me," and "Unholy,".

He finally sits down with Ross for an And The Writer Is interview ten years in the making.

He taught himself to make music from a demo CD that came in a cereal box.

A radio singing contest got him discovered, and he signed a publishing deal at 17.

It then took him ten years to land his first real hit. He tells Ross how a year of playing FIFA with Shellback led to Wolf Cousins, and what Max Martin's famous "math" actually is.

If you've ever wondered how the biggest pop songs of the last decade actually get finished, this one's for you

And The Writer Is... Ilya Salmanzadeh!

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Try Variations in the Splice Sounds plugin. It makes new versions of any Splice sample with a different structure, key and BPM, and the original creators get paid every time.

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CHAPTERS

0:00 Cold open: what Max Martin's "math" really means

1:32 Welcome Ilya Salmanzadeh

3:12 What MXM is: "like Real Madrid signed me"

4:46 Jantelagen: why Swedes won't brag

9:57 Born in Iran, raised in Denmark

16:22 A cereal-box CD and teaching himself music

19:54 The hits: Problem, Into You, Unholy and more

21:32 Early influences: Tracy Chapman, Michael Jackson, hip-hop

24:50 Why the world's biggest pop writers live in Stockholm

27:14 Wanting to be an R&B artist

32:36 The radio singing contest that got him discovered

37:26 Ten years from publishing deal to first hit

39:09 Telemarketing and Apple tech support

43:08 The immigrant drive to prove he belongs

46:21 His first cut: the Bratz album

48:20 A year of FIFA with Shellback and the birth of Wolf Cousins

52:37 The MXM pop family tree

54:21 Competition vs. family inside MXM

58:40 Max Martin: "Why aren't you in LA?"

1:00:41 What Max Martin taught him about songwriting

1:03:13 "Problem": Savan Kotecha's original voice memo

1:08:59 The morning "Problem" hit #1 on iTunes

1:10:57 His father and the number he keeps seeing

1:14:31 Weeks on one pre-chorus: making "Into You"

1:21:55 "Love Me Like You Do" started as a Sunday hang

1:27:08 Producer vs. writer credits: "Bad Blood" and "Bang Bang"

1:31:42 His creative wavelength with Ariana Grande

1:32:23 "No Tears Left To Cry" breaking the pop rules

1:34:00 "God is a woman" was almost for Beyoncé and JAY-Z

1:35:48 Ariana Grande as a producer1:37:27 "Unholy": the hotel staff, Max and his daughter

1:44:20 When a release doesn't hit

1:47:11 14-hour days: how he finishes so much music

1:48:57 Chris Martin, Coldplay and the "mind movie"

1:52:17 Why he keeps working with new artists (Tate McRae, LISA)

1:54:53 "eternal sunshine" vs. "petal": the two-room process

1:56:54 "Santa Tell Me" and chasing a Christmas classic

1:59:24 Has Ilya finally proven his worth to himself?

And The Writer Is, hosted by Ross Golan, is a podcast about the songwriters, producers and artists behind the songs you love.

Instagram: instagram.com/andthewriteris

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London and Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today’s guest is a multi-platinum rapper and songwriter who took Compton to the charts and gave the world “My Hitta,” “Who Do You Love?” and “Big Bank.”

From his debut album My Krazy Life to collaborations with Drake, Nipsey Hussle, and Nicki Minaj, he’s built a catalog that’s done serious damage to club speakers. Now, with The Gentlemen’s Club, he’s getting personal and reminding everyone there’s a storyteller behind the hits.

And The Writer Is…

YG!

In this episode we go deep on:

- The inspiration behind his new album

- The Def Jam singles deal with five album options: "I could have sued everybody"

- What he'd tell an 18-year-old holding a label offer

- Why having a catalog doesn't mean you own it

- What a YG session looks like: tequila, "next beat," and a BPM in his head

- How "FDT" got made with Nipsey, and why Def Jam wouldn't release it

- The night Nicki said "don't put this out without me"

- "Who Do You Love?": three months, hook writers, and Drake telling him to do it himself

And much more...

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications.

Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, our Patreon!

Patreon.com/andthewriteris

And @splice — the best sample library on the market. Period.

Chapters

0:00 Intro

0:32 Hiring a "Hitman"

8:07 "Were you ever suicidal?" and the homies who said "same"

9:10 Chin up, chest out: what the streets never let you say

10:28 "2004," the song he cut from the album

24:31 Turning himself in while his song blew up, and the label that called his mom

27:31 Signing young: "I could have sued everybody"

28:24 Ross: athletes get rookie orientation, artists get "good luck"

34:57 What he'd tell an 18-year-old holding a label offer

39:40 The masters trap: you have a catalog, but you don't own it

41:30 What a session with YG actually looks like

47:39 Why he made Gentleman's Club: "they were playing with my name"

50:10 How "Hollywood" with Shoreline Mafia got made

53:51 How "FDT" happened with Nipsey, and why Def Jam passed

59:40 Meeting Nipsey: two different gangs, one mission

1:05:56 How do you stay brave when the people around you get killed?

1:10:59 The night "My Hitta" got made

1:13:03 "Big Bank": Nicki says don't put it out without me

1:18:15 What he knows at 36 that he didn't at 20: the streets don't love you back

1:27:20 "Who Do You Love?": three months and Drake's "you do the hook"

1:30:02 What makes a Mustard beat different

Credits Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London and Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today’s guest is a singer, songwriter, producer and dancer who has spent her career trusting her own instincts—and building a world around them.

From “2 On” to “Nasty” and “No Broke Boys,” Tinashe has kept releasing music through major-label deals, independent projects and viral breakthroughs.

She’s collaborated with artists including Calvin Harris, Charli xcx and Kaytranada, and joins us to talk about the journey behind it all.

And The Writer Is... Tinashe!

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications.

Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.Splice, the best sample library on the market, period.

and our lead sponsor, our Patreon page!

We're still giving away free Universal Audio Recording Gear in our next zoom hang.

Join us on Patreon: patreon.com/andthewriteris

CHAPTERS

0:00 Intro

0:46 Tinashe and Ross reconnect—back to The Stunners

3:48 “Deep in the Night”—the song she wrote at five

5:08 Tinashe’s French fry rankings

6:12 Child acting, Whoopi Goldberg, and moving to LA

9:11 Life in a girl group without creative control

11:22 Buying a microphone and building a bedroom studio

14:10 Getting signed—and expecting it to be easy

18:40 Join the ATWI Patreon

19:32 Splice: Sounds and Variations

20:39 Early Travis Scott sessions and being taken seriously in the studio

23:29 Recording 200 songs—and trusting the big producer’s opinion26:33 Trusting your gut and knowing when to leave a session

30:43 “2 On” takes off. What happens after the first hit?

36:03 Writing “2 On” in a garage with friends

37:37 Does having a hit teach you how to make one?

39:20 Leaving her label and rebuilding trust in her own ideas

43:29 What releasing music independently actually takes

46:10 Filming her own videos and building her visual world

48:14 How dancing shapes the way she writes songs

50:08 Working with a label again—and finding Ricky Reed

52:11 Getting the call from Calvin Harris

53:52 Why genre doesn’t define her music

55:19 “Nasty” takes off after she stops needing another hit

57:04 Why she won’t write for a TikTok trend

58:43 Charli xcx and finding freedom after early hits

1:00:41 The unexpected remix journey of “No Broke Boys”

1:03:31 Taking the Grammy off her lock screen after seven years

1:05:14 Making POPSTAR—and giving herself time to play

1:05:55 Which POPSTAR song fits every mood?

1:08:19 Claiming the pop star she’s always been

1:13:32 “Just don’t stop”—keep putting your music out

1:14:42 Her advice to young women in music: intuition

Credits

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London and Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today’s guest is one of the most unmistakable voices in modern pop — an artist, songwriter and producer who has built a career by making music that sounds like nobody else. Her catalog has passed two billion global streams. She’s played top billing at festivals including Coachella, Lollapalooza and Outside Lands, opened for Olivia Rodrigo, Lorde and Paramore, and collaborated with artists including Nile Rodgers, Beck, Dominic Fike and Sylvan Esso.

And The Writer Is... Remi Wolf!

In this episode, we get into

- The USC training that rebuilt her voice

- Waiting tables and taking Craigslist gigs while building a career

- The 30-minute session behind “Photo ID,”

- Industry lessons for every artist to take notes on...

and much more.

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Join us on Patreon: patreon.com/andthewriteris

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association. Your support means the world to us.

CHAPTERS

0:00 Intro

0:40 “You can’t teach tone” — how Remi found hers

2:13 USC: “We’re going to beat you down until you feel like you’re nothing”

6:15 Fourteen, busking the Bay Area, and writing songs in Chloe’s kitchen

13:40 “Carousel” — the first song she ever wrote

15:41 A substitute teacher, an apartment, and her first recording

18:05 Ski racer by day, songwriter by night

19:05 Meeting Jared Solomon at 15 — then finding each other again

21:07 Applebee’s on tour — and the road to sobriety

24:04 Rehab, writing Juno sober, and why clarity changed the songs

29:02 “It’s not ready” — why she refused to release music in college

30:22 Six songs in one week — the reunion that started everything

34:24 Restaurant shifts and Craigslist gigs: how she paid to keep making music

39:26 The Sofar show that led to her first manager

42:39 “I had no expectations” — making music before the industry got involved

45:28 35,000 decisions a day — what creative control actually costs

49:22 “You have to start protecting yourself”

51:34 What is the goal? Redefining success

56:51 Her first album rollout sober

59:21 Social media, warped expectations, and screaming into the void

63:22 “Photo ID,” TikTok, and the accident that helped it explode

66:40 “Photo ID” took 30 minutes — and she thought it was horrible

70:15 Her first professional topline session: “I was overcome with social anxiety”

72:11 Why I’m Allergic to Dogs worked during lockdown

74:56 Why Juno is called Juno

78:50 Hayley Williams and singing with another “belt queen”

82:25 Five years of nonstop touring — and finally hitting pause

87:15 “I Won’t Cry” — her favorite song she’s ever written

89:15 “I was sick of the uptempo shit” — writing 130 songs for Mud

90:49 Her first pitch session was for BTS

92:34 Which Mud song fits every mood

94:10 “I’m the happiest I’ve been in my life”

Credits

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is a musician's musician who co-founded The National, the Grammy-winning band behind Boxer, High Violet and Sleep Well Beast.

He co-wrote and produced Taylor Swift's folklore and evermore, including cardigan and willow. folklore won Album of the Year at the Grammys.

He worked on The Tortured Poets Department and produced Ed Sheeran's Subtract.

He's behind Gracie Abrams' I Love You, I'm Sorry and Noah Kahan's Porch Light.

In the last year alone, he's made records with Mumford & Sons, Florence + the Machine, Brandi Carlile, Sam Barber, Kevin Morby and Suki Waterhouse.

He's one half of Big Red Machine with Bon Iver's Justin Vernon.

And he built Long Pond, the Hudson Valley studio where many of these songs were made.

And The Writer Is... Aaron Dessner!

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Amazon Music for Songwriters. Your support means the world to us.

And SONA — Songwriters of North America. If you write songs, join them. They fight for us.

0:00 Intro

1:00 Cardigan, willow, Porch Light — and eight albums in a year

5:26 Why "I Love You, I'm Sorry" was never the single

7:27 Secretly rooting for the weird song

8:17 When a pop star needs a single right now

10:25 Don't fill the space: how he walks into a session

12:12 Long Pond and "you never make a mistake investing in your creativity"

17:24 Twin brothers and their dad's jazz drums

22:48 "We faked it": how The National got signed

26:48 Playing to no one — then 500 strangers in Michigan

30:05 "Did you lose yourself?"

33:14 When one bandmate starts writing hits for other people

35:38 On stage with Taylor: "You're playing a stadium. It's okay."

37:27 "Hey, it's Taylor": the text in 2020

40:34 The Dropbox folder — and cardigan by 3 a.m.

47:45 The thank-you note that became willow

51:49 Meeting Gracie Abrams — and 2–3 songs a day

57:47 How an instrumentalist became the storyteller's whisperer

1:01:11 Why his albums don't get shelved: finishing Prizefighter

1:04:23 Studio stories: Gracie, Brandi Carlile, Florence, Sam Barber

1:11:40 Noah Kahan arrives burnt out — and Porch Light

1:15:41 Live Q&A: finding the corners, his first key change

1:18:24 Advice for musicians with day jobs

1:20:07 What all the greats have in common

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is a Grammy-winning songwriter, bandleader and activist who has spent four decades inside the most famous name in reggae — but whose real story isn't the inheritance. It's the set of rules underneath it, the ones the family actually lives by, which turn out to have almost nothing to do with music.

And The Writer Is... Ziggy Marley!

Subscribe to our channel and follow us on socials @andthewriteris Every week we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association. Your support means the world to us.

And @splice — the best sample library on the market. Period.

Chapters:

0:00 He inherited a legacy and built a voice of his own

0:45 Why reggae heals

4:53 What makes the Marley family so consistent

6:43 Seven kids, and the family business that isn't music

8:36 Why the whole album is tuned to 432

12:32 The one song he left at 440

16:06 What makes this album different from the other fifteen

18:11 Finishing the songs before going into the studio

20:37 Why he wrote "Many Mourn For Bob" 45 years later

24:54 Umbrella or shadow: being a Marley

26:39 The funeral, and the drive to Nine Miles

30:54 NMPA + Splice

33:15 Breaking the four-bar on "Racism"

36:03 "It sounds light, but it's heavy underneath"

38:37 What "Beach in Hawaii" is actually about

43:37 How he found out "Tomorrow People" was a hit

46:14 The Melody Makers, and the line you don't cross

49:15 "Create your own space"

53:45 Advice to the next Marleys

55:27 "You can't just ChatGPT life experience"

59:12 "When the fridge was empty, I was happy"

1:00:26 "I know my value"

1:03:07 "It's always new. Still a kid."

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is an artist and songwriter whose career has taken him from teenage YouTube covers to working with Beyoncé, Tyler, The Creator, Brockhampton, Miley Cyrus and Jack Antonoff.

But this conversation is really about something bigger: How to build a career in music without losing yourself along the way.

Ryan talks about learning to trust his own taste, being grateful he never had a hit record, protecting what makes an artist special, and refusing to let success, algorithms or other people's expectations define him.

We also get into Boy in Jeans, Brockhampton, Tyler the Creator's unexpected DM, writing four songs on Cowboy Carter, the making of "Bruises Off the Peach," and his new album Sweet Fortune.

And The Writer Is... Ryan Beatty!

Subscribe for more conversations with the artists, songwriters and producers shaping music.

Follow us: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors:

NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association

Splice — the best sample library on the market. Period.

Chapters

0:00 Intro

1:36 The Greek, Hollywood Bowl & Pokémon evolutions

3:08 Being made fun of for singing

4:09 “I refuse to continue just being one thing”

8:32 Why being hard to define is freedom

9:52 How Ryan approaches a songwriting session

11:52 Teach people how to treat you

13:43 “I’m grateful I’ve never had a hit record”

14:12 What success feels like vs. what it looks like

20:08 “I didn’t feel smart enough to be a songwriter”

20:55 Boy in Jeans — finding his voice as a songwriter

26:42 Jack Antonoff and an unexpected Broadway placement

27:30 NMPA + Splice

29:19 His advice for artists going viral

31:55 The moment he decided to do it his way

34:06 Brockhampton, Kevin Abstract & finding confidence

37:05 Why Ryan never pitches songs

40:43 Tyler, The Creator’s unexpected DM

42:35 Dreaming of David, touring & burnout

44:52 Making “Bruises Off the Peach”

48:17 Finding his actual singing voice

50:30 Cowboy Carter — four songs, told nobody

54:30 Making Sweet Fortune & chasing timelessness

57:32 How he wants listeners to see themselves in his songs

59:36 Amy Allen, Clairo & making the studio a place of joy

1:04:25 “Doing this is scary for me”

Credits

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Edited by Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is the drummer who took punk out of the garage, put it on your radio, then on MTV, then on your body. But his real story isn't the discography. It's what he did with everything that was supposed to end him.

From a four-piece kit in Fontana to the center of the album cover, Travis carries three things simultaneously that most musicians never figure out how to hold at once: the craft of writing a drum part as a hook — singing it in his head before his hands ever get there; the conviction that no genre gets to own him, and no one else gets to write his ending; and the contrarian edge to ban Auto-Tune, editing, and drum samples from his own studio at the exact moment the rest of the industry is sprinting toward machine-clean.

And The Writer Is... Travis Barker!

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Join us on Patreon: patreon.com/andthewriteris

We're giving away 4 pieces of premium recording gear on zoom on August 25th! Join Patreon for details.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible. Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association. Your support means the world to us. And @splice — the best sample library on the market. Period.

CHAPTERS

0:00 Intro

1:51 Why the documentary sat for nine years

3:18 The producers pitch an ending: "Can you just walk onto a plane?"

4:51 Survivor's guilt: "They wouldn't want me to sit here and not fly again"

6:33 "The doc was dead to me" — and living your life like it's a movie

9:41 "I don't make beats." "Now you do. I need it in two days."

12:23 Beastie Boys, Bad Brains, Buck Owens — refusing the box

15:28 The drums are a hook, not a timekeeper

15:54 "That's not music" — the teacher who wouldn't teach him rock

17:25 How he actually writes a part: "I sing it in my head"

18:21 Learning the whole blink-182 set in an hour

21:29 Trash men in Laguna, and one store that sold their tape

22:52 The untitled album, and the day the process changed

25:57 The lyrics he wrote: "We'll have Halloween on Christmas"

27:15 "I Miss You" — the loop he had to convince them to keep

28:07 "You have to put your ego away to be a drummer who's a songwriter"

35:46 The burn center: "How am I going to play drums?"

36:25 The hand he couldn't feel, and why he told no one

43:20 "Too heavy for blink" — Boxcar Racer, and Mark

56:30 "There was no therapy for what happened"

1:10:19 What drummers should actually practice

1:19:29 AI: "I hate it" — no Auto-Tune, no editing, no samples

1:31:20 "All the Small Things" — the day Tom told him to open the valve

1:33:33 "Where's all the hits?" — the note that made Rock Show and First Date

1:35:15 "One More Time": writing about your own band breaking up

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London and Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is an artist most people meet through the bit: the deadpan internet, the cowboy suit, the one-sided war he's been waging with Harry Styles for a year that Harry Styles knows nothing about.

So this is the other version of him. A kid in Pittsburgh with a borrowed mic and beats ripped off YouTube, broke and failing out of school, who gets a message that Mac Miller loves a song off his first EP — and uses those three days in LA to convince his parents to let him drop out.

It's also one of the more honest conversations we've had about what the industry's upgrades actually cost you. Not the version where getting signed is the happy ending — the version where the nice studio, the engineer recording your vocals, and the A&R in your ear slowly make music that isn't yours. Chuck Timely & The Hourglass is what's on the other side of that: a record about time, made by someone who spent years trying to get his own back. And the only person who ever told him not to make it was his mother.

And The Writer Is... Role Model!

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association. Your support means the world to us.

And @splice — the best sample library on the market. Period.

They are also maybe the only ethical ai-integrated sample library and they pay creators for using their work in the new Variations update and beyond.

Chapters

0:00 Intro

2:00 The year-long war with Harry Styles that Harry Styles knows nothing about

2:41 Mac Miller and Odd Future on Vine are why he finally said yes to TikTok

3:33 The message about "Stolen Car" that came while he was failing out of school

15:01 "Did you scrub the internet?" — "Yes. Because I was embarrassed."

16:13 "I was trying to impress a label. I just made shitty music."

24:16 A 16-year-old in Portland, Maine, and an EP made entirely over email

25:44 The labels start calling: "I was a sitting duck"

27:01 The studio trap — how nice rooms take the music out of your hands

28:01 The two EPs he's blocked out: "I don't remember making that music"

28:54 Why he won't pitch songs to other artists

31:06 The 80s synth album they made for two months and scrapped

34:33 The two rules: no synths, no drum machines

35:06 His mom: "There's country in it? Your fans are gonna hate that."

37:39 "Sally," written in the 30 minutes a session ran short

42:09 "But who is Chuck?" — inventing Chuck Timely

47:12 Ross defines a good song: "This will piss off a lot of people"

53:10 What he'd say to Mac Miller

54:44 "Look at That Woman" started as a joke — and why the loose ones win

56:27 The permission Kansas Anymore gave other songwriters

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest wrote "The Climb." She also wrote "I Drive Your Truck," "Mine Would Be You," "Don't Think Jesus," and "Ain't No Love in Oklahoma." But her real story isn't the hits. It's the ten years before the first one, the five years after it when the phone stopped ringing, and what she figured out in between about how to actually last in this business.

From a dropped record deal and years as what she calls a washed-up artist nobody would write with, to Song of the Year, a Grammy nomination, and a run of hits she wrote while raising three kids under three. She carries three things at once that almost no writer figures out how to hold together: a working method she can actually teach, a conviction that this is a calling and not a job, and a refusal to write the safe version of anything.

And The Writer Is... Jessi Alexander!

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association. Your support means the world to us.

0:00 Intro

0:48 Her favorite non-songwriting songwriter trick

1:54 "How do you make unavailable country men emotional?"

5:33 The five songs on her Hall of Fame plaque

11:07 Pool halls and stick shifts: "that color is what I draw from"

12:42 The artist deal that fizzled — "I wasn't the artist type"

13:31 No man's land: "no one took me seriously, I was a washed-up artist"

14:01 The insane story behind writing The Climb: "just another damn day"

20:11 Bud Light, a guitar pull, and a British director

22:07 Being told The Climb would change her life "Sir, that doesnt happen to people like me"

28:08 Nashville still said No

30:38 Getting men to sing: long notes and the falsetto flip

31:44 "What part of their tool belt have they not used?"

34:32 The professor who told her to quit school

36:18 Her album, the mergers, and Redneck Woman

40:27 New mom: "they'll just put someone else in my spot"

45:30 Good mom or good at work — never both

46:16 2015 to 2020: "the water just turned off"

48:23 Advice for the writer whose phone stopped ringing

50:24 The song that rang every bell

57:21 Concept-first or melody-first: "I'm the director"

61:16 Songwriters own it. Screenwriters sell it.

64:16 Imposter syndrome and the Billy Strings answer

65:24 What makes Morgan Wallen great

69:46 "I don't like to not know where all the bodies are buried"

71:43 I Drive Your Truck (Crazy story)

74:37 Her granddad's truck in the driveway

75:44 "Call in the third. Call in the fourth. Call in the 10th."

76:46 No #1 party until they found him

80:36 The truck-song traffic jam they were worried sick about

85:38 "Keep your head down." Still the only answer.

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is a songwriter four albums deep, with a song that's been picking up new listeners for nine years and Mick Fleetwood playing on her latest record. But her real story isn't any of that.

From weekend stage camps in West London to opening Wembley for Taylor Swift five months after giving birth, she spent a decade releasing roughly one song a year into near silence. What kept her going wasn't a plan — it was a pair of collaborators who got nothing back for years and got up and made something every day anyway.

This is an honest conversation about what a long stretch of nobody listening actually feels like, and what happens when the proof finally shows up on a timeline you didn't choose.

And The Writer Is... Suki Waterhouse!

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association. Your support means the world to us.

And @splice — the best sample library on the market. Period.

They've developed a Sounds plugin that allows creators to actually get paid for derivatively generated work from their art, and they have paid out $100M+ to artists already since inception.

Chapters:

0:00 Intro

0:46 How's being a parent and doing music?

1:18 "Being a parent is only hard for good parents"

2:49 "The girl with the guitar" — how her daughter describes her job

4:30 Test-driving album demos on a toddler in her "no" phase

12:44 Somewhere Over the Rainbow — and losing to the girl who sang All Saints

14:38 The voice teacher who told her she was too skinny to sing

15:58 "I was angry. I had this huge fire in me."

16:42 The friend group that turned on her: "fuck this school, fuck these people"

26:45 "You walk through open doors" — model, actor, musician

28:56 "Brutally," 2016, and ten years of making things nobody heard

31:01 Advice to a young female artist: learn to produce, even basically

32:56 "I went hunting for my fucking tribe. And I found them."

35:54 Amy Winehouse at the pub, The Libertines, and a London scene that's gone

38:12 Backstage at a Jake Bugg show — meeting Natalie and Jules at eighteen

39:23 "They got zero back for years and years and years"

42:45 Extreme ADHD, a giant sitar, and a fight over a song

46:26 December 7th: flying to London for a song that didn't exist yet

47:16 The pact: "if we're not writing something brilliant, we're not carrying it on"

47:28 The worst audition of her life, in the dark

48:09 A Wurlitzer, a Mellotron, and the song that opens the album

1:01:39 "Good Looking" — top ten on TikTok, written nine years ago

1:05:53 Covid, Daisy Jones, and deciding to just make the record

1:06:32 Every label said no except Sub Pop

1:08:40 "It's nothing about what happens in the first week"

1:10:16 "Dangerous Woman" and a song that gains meaning over time

1:11:38 Daisy Jones: "my name wasn't on the list and I was fucking pissed"

1:16:24 "You're more envious of the check than the song"

1:26:14 What makes a good song — Beck, Elliott Smith, and roughness

1:29:26 Red Rocks with no ear monitors: "I was in insane debt"

1:32:04 Opening for Taylor Swift at Wembley

1:34:17 Hayley Williams: "this one's for Mr. Waterhouse"

1:37:02 A baby in March, a record in September

1:39:44 "When everyone goes a bit red — that's when you keep it in the song"

1:40:35 What to play driving at night, heartbroken, walking through London

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is one of the great voices of his generation — the theater kid who auditioned for American Idol with Michael Jackson, watched the judges' faces fall, and demanded a second song because he'd just quit his job and had no health insurance. But his real story isn't the voice. It's the game — the one Freddie Mercury wrote about, the one that picks your singles, writes your headlines, and decides who you are before you do.

And The Writer Is... Adam Lambert!

In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:

The AMA kiss that blew up a $500,000 single launch — "everyone was going, oh shit"

Quitting Wicked — and losing his health insurance — to audition, then refusing the judges' no

Why Kara DioGuardi 'busted his balls all season'

What Brian May says "Play the Game" was really about

Signed before the finale even aired: why losing Idol never mattered

and much more.

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association.

0:00 Intro

1:09 The album is out — why self-titled, "first name basis"

2:35 Meeting Pete Nappi through a pandemic song still in the vault

3:39 "Am I Okay" — written one week after the breakup

6:02 Singles made him "crazy" — the label picks that flopped: "I told you so"

7:04 Leaning into what fans expect vs. challenging them

8:16 Proud of the flops, indifferent to some hits

9:34 Theater kids: every album is a character, every record a world

11:28 The dystopian cover — "I want it blasted into the future"

13:55 Adam Lambert or Freddie Mercury? "I feel like it's me"

15:35 Coffee with Freddie — what Brian says "Play the Game" was really about

16:56 "The music industry is a big old game, isn't it?"

17:43 A college-DJ dad, a Sly Stone mom, and a kid screaming through the house

19:46 The Fiddler note where everybody went "oh, wow"

21:03 San Diego to LA at 19 — math knocked him off the college path

23:00 Weed, poetry, and GarageBand

25:49 Wicked: six months, burnt out, and a new plan

29:20 Inside the Idol machine — two camps, two agendas

32:49 The Burning Man epiphany that vanquished the fear

34:39 No job, no insurance, and judges who didn't get Rock With You

35:11 "I didn't really ask" — the second song that changed everything

36:22 Why Idol can't break artists anymore

38:04 Honey water: the whiskey story behind Kara DioGuardi's grudge

41:21 Justin Timberlake tells him to remake A Night at the Opera

42:06 Losing the finale — already signed before it aired

47:20 The blog photos drop: "Yeah, that's me. Get over it."

51:53 The AMA kiss and the $500,000 single

53:22 What Do You Want From Me — the P!nk demo

56:00 Singing uncredited on Avicii's "Lay Me Down"

59:03 "It takes a village — bring them with you"

60:26 Max Martin: "When you get on stage, I don't have to worry"

61:26 How Queen actually made the call

62:07 Trespassing hits #1 — a first he didn't know he'd made

62:48 The poster-child years: "the headline is that I'm gay, and no one's talking about the music"

66:11 Trespassing, the "bipolar album" — his half vs. the label's half

67:20 Two months with the Wolf Cousins — why his songs didn't make the cut

70:05 The Ghost Town gamble — "you've got to do something drastic"

72:44 Songs with no home — "throwing my ideas into space"

76:03 Velvet dies to Covid, two weeks in

76:52 A Telefunken, YouTube tutorials, and teaching himself Logic

77:51 The secret musical: 20 songs written over Zoom

82:45 Identity vs. brand — "the personality precedes the skill"

83:35 Songwriters don't get paid for their time — the union conversation

87:37 Giving his co-writers master points — "it's just classy, man"

88:28 Where the stage presence actually comes from

90:13 The hardest part of fame

93:06 "I nitpick the negative" — showing the uglier side for the first time

96:28 Is Ozempic killing LA nightlife?

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Edited by Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's episode is a rewind to our conversation with Benny Blanco.

To hear the rest of this episode, join our Patreon, where you'll find our full library of archived episodes with legends like Babyface, Shania Twain, Sabrina Carpenter, Benny Blanco, and many more. Members also get access to our monthly Writers Room on Zoom, where we play your demos and answer your biggest industry questions.

We hope to see you there.

Thank you for listening to And The Writer Is.

And The Writer Is...

is presented by the National Music Publishers' Association

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London and Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is the frontman of Bush, one of the defining voices of '90s alternative rock and the "feral," self-flagellating songwriter underneath them, who still claws through every blank page 30 years in and can't tell you how he does it.

From a broken home at 12 to painting dentists' offices after he'd already made 16 Stone, Gavin carries three things simultaneously that most rock legends never figure out how to hold at once: the craft of a lifelong student who still writes out scales to get better, the conviction to bet on analog human perspective in the age of AI, and the contrarian refusal to romanticize any of it — "it's a perpetual UFC octagon."

This is one of the more honest conversations about longevity, survival, and what it actually costs to keep creating after the era that made you has moved on — and buried some of the people who defined it. When the confidence and the insecurity are the same engine, who do you become?

And The Writer Is... Gavin Rossdale!

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association. Your support means the world to us.

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London and Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is Brittany Howard — four-time Grammy winner, the voice of Alabama Shakes, and one of the most singular artists of her generation. But her real story isn't the accolades or the sold-out rooms. It's a single-wide trailer, a junkyard full of animals, and a garbage truck — and a woman who never once chased any of it.

From a Cotton Patch trailer park to Paisley Park, Brittany built a career by refusing to do it the way you're supposed to. She carries three things simultaneously that most artists never figure out how to hold at once: an obsessive craftsman's ear (she'll stab an amp with a screwdriver to find a tone), an unbudging authenticity (she showed up to the deal that changed her life hungover, in her pajamas, in a mail truck), and a total indifference to the machine (0% involvement in her own charts, streams, and licensing).

This is one of the more honest conversations we've had about staying true to yourself in music.

And The Writer Is... Alabama Shakes!

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers Association. Your support means the world to us.

Timestamps

0:00 Intro

2:09 Is hunting for tone a fool's errand?

4:02 "Happy accidents" — taste vs. preference

6:22 Stabbing an amp with a screwdriver for the perfect tone

9:02 Born in a single-wide in Cotton Patch trailer park

10:53 "Are we rich now?" — a junkyard, 96 cats, 26 dogs

12:53 Picking up guitar out of necessity (she wanted to play bass)

17:00 Recording songs at 12 on Audacity, alone in the woods

18:45 The At the Drive-In shirt — meeting Zach

19:33 Mom: "I didn't know you could sing" / "Me either"

20:46 Her first song ever

28:59 The label meeting: hungover, in pajamas, in a mail truck

32:22 Writing "Hold On" in a garbage truck

33:27 Making up the whole song live on stage at The Brick

37:06 How a record deal did (and didn't) change how she lived

44:01 "Do I have any money?" — buying her first house

46:07 Meeting Shawn Everett & Blake Mills for Sound & Color

52:51 Talking to Prince on the phone — and his list of rules

54:17 Playing "Gimme All Your Love" with Prince — "did he change his mind?"

56:49 How Alabama Shakes came back together

59:15 Rapid fire + "Leave music to the people who love music"

Credits

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Edited by Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is one of the most recognizable faces of her generation — an actor whose voice you'd know in a single frame. But her real story isn't the one you've watched. It's the one she kept secret: for 20 years she's been a songwriter, and barely anyone — even people who know her — knew it.

This is one of the more honest conversations we've had about being underestimated — as an actor who "couldn't" really be a musician, and as a woman the industry assumed didn't write her own songs — and about what it costs to keep making things purely because you love them.

And The Writer Is... Zooey Deschanel of She & Him!

In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:

• Why she erased social media off her own devices
• The "industry plant" myth — why the industry "can't make anything happen" anymore
• Being told "you'll never make a record, no one will take you seriously" as an actor
• Her "secret agent" identity
• The misogyny she goes to bat against
• Her North Star she chases
• And much more...
• 
  

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Join our Patreon for special access, bonus conversations, demo playing opportunities, and guest hangs!

patreon.com/andthewriteris

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our lead sponsor NMPA for making these conversations possible.

NMPA is the National Music Publishers' Association. They fight for songwriters and they fight for this podcast, too.

Chapters

0:00 Intro

1:00 Meet Zooey Deschanel

1:51 Writing alone — and erasing social media to do it

4:49 Why the "industry plant" is a myth

6:37 "You'll never be taken seriously as a musician"

7:25 Her secret identity as a songwriter

11:15 How She & Him released with no name attached

13:01 "I Thought I Saw Your Face Today" — never a single, now #1 on TikTok

15:35 The story behind writing "I Thought I Saw Your Face Today"

17:24 Her dad, the records, and growing up musical

22:44 Brian Wilson, Gershwin, and the Great American Songbook

26:13 Five desert island albums

28:21 Why "A Hard Day's Night" beats the White Album

30:16 Teaching herself piano at six

32:46 Writing her first song at ten

38:42 "I identify as a songwriter, not an actor"

42:15 Dropping out of Northwestern

45:59 A word from our lead sponsor, NMPA

49:23 Finding her voice in the studio — the mic chain

51:56 Recording with Brian Wilson & the gifted mic

55:57 Why she never sold out — turning in finished records

67:03 The lonely sets where her first two records were written

69:35 Almost Famous & Cameron Crowe

72:50 "I'm allergic to selling myself"

76:19 Nobody believes a woman writes her own songs

79:00 Writing for other artists & how publishing splits really work

82:07 Why she loves writing Christmas songs

84:24 500 Days of Summer & music in film

88:36 The songwriting trick: "What if I am her?"

93:21 Dyslexia, reading scripts & why melody sticks

94:56 Why she doesn't do more theater

98:38 Staying clean through party-era Hollywood

100:50 M. Ward — 20 years, never one fight

109:57 Writing alone when everyone's afraid to

111:43 The biggest misconception about her

114:18 Finding your North Star

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Edited by Jad Saad

Watch on Spotify. If you're subscribed to Spotify Premium, you don't get any Spotify ads on our show.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest built an audience of millions before she was old enough to sign a record deal, turned a 30-minute crying freestyle into her debut single, and made one of Gen Z's defining breakup anthems out of a phrase that became its own internet language. But her real story isn't the viral fame or the streams. It's the part that plays like a runaway and teaches like a masterclass: how she left home at 17 to chase music, what it costs to become a person in public, and everything about the business nobody explains until you've already survived it.

And The Writer Is... Nessa Barrett!

In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:

• Why she ran away from home at 17 — a 4AM ticket, six school bags, cops on her trail — to make music

• The truth about "i hope ur miserable until ur dead": she didn't write it, it's not her favorite, and why she sang it anyway

• "pain" — the 30-minute freestyle she cried through in the booth that became her first single

• Why she can't record with Auto-Tune — and what she learned the first time someone handed her a finished song to cut

• Signing to Warner Records on Zoom during Covid — and the messy contract she had to escape first

• "All of my confidence comes from my fans" — the performer who still gets embarrassed easily

• The childhood trauma and the generational cycle she says she's trying to break

• Why she closes her eyes every time she records, and writes a song like she's building a movie

• The lowest point of her career — and how prayer, faith, and going back to her core brought her out of it

• "I've never loved my music as much as this — and I didn't know it could feel this way"

And much more...

🔓 Want in the room? We just launched our Patreon — monthly Zoom hangs where we listen to your demos and give feedback, hang with you directly, occasional guest drop-ins, and the full archive of 200+ audio episodes (Sabrina Carpenter, Lin-Manuel Miranda, Shania Twain, Babyface, and more).

https://www.patreon.com/andthewriteris

Watch on Spotify. Spotify subscribers get fewer ads on my video.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers Association. Your support means the world to us.

Chapters

0:00 Intro — her whole journey has been public

1:37 The cafeteria TikTok that blew up

2:48 A childhood with no stability

3:45 "A lot of trauma — that's what drove me here"

4:20 Why she chose to be open about her struggles

6:50 Music as her safe place + her dad's makeshift studio

9:22 Her first recording, at four years old

10:56 Walking into a real LA studio, terrified

12:21 Songwriting as a diary

14:17 The tell-all she might publish under an alias

17:30 Join the conversation on Patreon

18:21 Stage fright, bullying, and the voice crack

20:34 "All my confidence comes from my fans"

23:44 From cafeteria TikToks toward LA

28:59 Running away at 4AM — the plane ticket story

32:54 Landing at the Sway House at 17

34:54 First sessions, jxdn, and singing other people's songs

36:34 Why she can't record with Auto-Tune

38:07 NMPA: why publishers fight for songwriters

38:49 Learning to ask for what she wanted in the booth

42:24 "pain" — the 30-minute freestyle that became her first song

45:02 Signing to Warner Records on Zoom

50:19 The public breakup, and hearing old songs differently

51:32 "i hope ur miserable until ur dead" — singer vs. listener

54:07 The truth about who wrote her biggest song

55:50 Breaking away from the influencer label

59:06 Building a sonic world — writing like a movie

63:45 Why she closes her eyes every time she records

64:10 Five movies that shape her sound

65:12 Acting, directing, and what still scares her

68:16 The new era: falling back in love with music

70:18 Rapid fire

71:27 The lowest point — and how she came back

74:49 What younger Nessa would admire most

77:19 A message to her parents

78:55 "I've never loved my music as much as this"

79:31 TAPENOTES: Ross & Joe break down the episode

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Edited by Jad Saad

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is a Grammy winner, a two-time Billboard #1 artist, and one of the defining pop voices of the last decade. But her real story isn't the anthems or the awards. It's the part that plays like a rollercoaster and teaches like a masterclass: how she almost quit, what going #1 actually felt like, and everything about the music business nobody explains until you've survived it.

The press version skips the touring deficits, the depression at the top, and the moment in an Echo Park apartment when she nearly took a job at Smoothie King. The question underneath everything she says: once you stop chasing the metric and the moment — who do you become?

And The Writer Is... Lizzo!

In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:

• Why she wanted to quit music the day "Truth Hurts" went #1 — and the 2017 low point that was actually worse

• The touring economics no one explains: how you gross $1M and still finish the year in the red

• Why the indie grind that built her, in her view, no longer leads to the mainstream

• "She stopped giving a fuck about what we wanted" — Beyoncé's self-titled as a blueprint for artistic autonomy

• Why she only talks to people who buy her music — and what comment sections do to her nervous system

• The bumper-sticker hook theory — why "Truth Hurts" works when it breaks every rule

• Writing "About Damn Time": 83 versions of the chorus, and how the simplest line won

• Robert Glasper's lesson: there's no such thing as a wrong note

• Why good songs don't sound great at first — watching "Good as Hell" go from silly to gospel

• "I make whatever the f*** I want" — and why arriving at that sentence took everything before it

And much more...

🔓 Want in the room? We just launched our Patreon — monthly Zoom hangs where we listen to your demos and give feedback, hang with you directly, occasional guest drop-ins, and the full archive of 200+ audio episodes (Sabrina Carpenter, Lin-Manuel Miranda, Shania Twain, Babyface, and more).

[www.patreon.com/andthewriteris](https://www.patreon.com/andthewriteris)

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association. Your support means the world to us.

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Edited by Jad Saad

Post-Production VFX by Pratik Karki

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is a multi-Latin-Grammy-winning songwriter and producer with a wall of platinum records — and one of the few people in music willing to say the quiet part out loud. He came up as an actor and a rapper, moved to LA broke, stumbled into songwriting, and turned it into the kind of career most writers spend a lifetime chasing. He's also built one of the sharpest voices in the room as the host of his own show, Good Luck With Gino.

This is one of the most honest conversations we've had about how the music business actually works in 2026 — not the clean version, the real one. Why roughly 75% of working writers now survive on K-pop. How the pitch song quietly died and took the professional songwriter down with it. Artists taking songwriting credit on songs they didn't write — and exactly how labels split the writers up to play them against each other and shave points. Gino lays out the one rule every songwriter needs before their next cut, when it's worth standing on business, and when you "roll over like a dog" because the record's too big to lose.

And The Writer Is... Gino The Ghost!

In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:

• How he came up — actor, rapper, broke in LA, then stumbled into songwriting

• Treating every podcast episode like an album of singles

• Why ~75% of working writers now live off K-pop

• What pitch records used to be — Clive Davis, Barry Manilow & the lost art of outside songs

• The death of the professional songwriter (and why talent-show winners get nothing now)

• Artists taking credit for songs they didn't write — and how to combat it

• The "$15K buy-me-out" story & when to stand on business vs. roll over

• The split shakedown — how labels pit writers against each other, and the rule that beats it

• Why generosity makes you more money than being a prick

And much more...

🔓 This is only part of the conversation. The full extended, exclusive interview is on our Patreon — where Gino goes even further:

• The Bryan Cranston mindset that changed everything for him: "I don't need this role"

• The craziest stories he's ever had in the studio (the fight, the NDA, the booth writer)

• Drugs, weed, and vices — and why the "it makes me more creative" thing is a myth

• His no-apologies case for AI in music — and why he calls the backlash performative

• The synesthesia call-out nobody else will make

• How you actually break in (it's not the biggest rooms)

• Why songwriters deserve points and fees — and the fight to make it happen

Get the full uncut episode and every extended conversation at www.patreon.com/andthewriteris.

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

FINAL CHAPTER TIMESTAMPS (YouTube — public cut)

0:00 "Have you had to learn to be fearless?" — actor, rapper, broke in LA

0:39 Building the podcast — and why they resisted video for 200 episodes

2:35 The clip era: treating every episode like an album of singles

4:10 Music Monday–Friday, podcast at night — and learning Spanish for Latin music

5:15 Sessions in 2026: "I only do stuff I'm having fun doing"

5:42 Why ~75% of working writers now live off K-pop

7:19 What pitch records used to be — Clive Davis, Barry Manilow & outside songs

8:14 The death of the professional songwriter (and why talent-show winners get nothing)

10:24 Why artists should collaborate with professional writers

11:43 Artists taking credit for songs they didn't write — how to combat it

12:06 "Buy me out" — the $15K publishing story & when to stand on business

13:41 The split shakedown: how labels pit writers against each other

14:46 The rule every songwriter needs: talk first, start a chain

16:13 Why generosity beats being a prick once everyone's good

17:11 The craziest studio stories… (continued on Patreon)

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is a rising star who's risen so fast he's not really rising anymore — he's just a star.

From a bedroom in Luton playing $50 nylon-string covers and open mics playing for 4 people... Three years later: a billion streams, "Stargazing" on President Obama's summer playlist, two singles that took over pop radio before he'd ever made a debut album, and a debut album sourced from the notes he wrote in therapy that saved him.

He's proof that sometimes all you really need is a guitar, a work ethic, and a Taco Bell-poisoned night in Malibu to write a song people argue about in twenty languages.

And the writer is... Myles Smith!

If you've ever wanted something so badly you didn't think to ask what it would cost when it arrived — this is the conversation.

And The Writer Is... Myles Smith!

In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:

• Why he scrubbed every song he made before 2023 — and what "I didn't exist before 2023" actually means

• His advice for up and coming artists...

• The end-of-Covid breakdown at 18 that almost ended things — and the therapy notes that became My Mess, My Heart, My Life.

• Meeting Peter Fenn on the last day of a six-week US trip — and writing "My Home" in the first hour

• The Taco Bell food-poisoning night in Malibu that produced "Stargazing"

• The hidden cost of success on his relationships

• "Hey mom, I want to retire you" — and what she said back

And much more...

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association. Your support means the world to us.

CHAPTERS

0:00 Intro

2:21 My Mess, My Heart, My Life.

3:16 The pressure of being "right at the start of the journey"

4:35 "If you take away the hits, you could see where I really am"

4:54 "I wake up some days in a catastrophe"

6:01 The five albums he wore out

7:23 His mum, his absent dad, and a single-parent household

8:22 Singing in church with his grandma

11:41 First talent show: Fix You by Coldplay

13:01 The $50 nylon-string guitar that started it

14:02 Playing "Dream Girl" for his mum at 10

15:23 Growing up Black in Luton and the Labrinth Electronic album that broke his brain open

18:45 Open mics at 11 — his mum driving him to every one

20:18 Why open mics built him in a way the algorithm can't

21:43 "I was really lucky that I got to fail a thousand times"

22:30 The first real gig — 100 cap, 90 friends and family, indie band Bear with a Three

29:18 Covid, isolation, rock bottom

30:44 Therapy — and the notes that became the album

33:06 Trust issues, anxiety, the night at 18 he tried to "ctrl alt delete on life"

35:12 What he'd say to 18-year-old him

36:55 The videographer who pushed him to try TikTok

37:25 "I'm not trying that shit" — and the Sweater Weather cover that changed everything

40:24 How he paved his way onto an Amber Run tour with one recorded song

43:40 NMPA mid-roll

44:22 The day his career actually started: meeting Peter Fenn

46:08 "Music with other people is supposed to be fun" — Peter's first lesson

49:01 "My Home" — written in the first hour of meeting Peter

54:48 After Stargazing: "stuck in the future"

60:06 Brain scans, burnout, smiling through it all

62:30 "Hey mom, I want to retire you" — and what she said

63:31 The UK artists who don't love being famous — Ed Sheeran, James Bay, Niall Horan

66:12 Are you happy?

78:29 "I hated Niall Horan" — and why

80:11 Rapid fire

83:32 Meeting his wife with all this happening

85:00 The album as the closing of the first chapter

90:46 Pulling up the old voice memos

92:02 The Taco Bell night that became "Stargazing"

95:39 The biggest pinch-me moment of the last three years

98:06 Ross and Joe tape notes

Watch on Spotify. Spotify Premium users get no commercial breaks on our show.

CREDITS BLOCK

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Edited by Jad Saad

Post-Production VFX by Pratik Karki

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest came up in the biggest band in the world at seventeen, watched it pause at twenty-two, and built a solo career almost no one in his position has ever managed to sustain. From success, to tragedy, and back... This Irishman makes his triumphant return to the stage and our hearts with 'Dinner Party'.

And The Writer Is... Niall Horan!

He talks about Liam not as a tribute beat, but as a presence — what fires you up to walk on stage when somebody you love would still want to be there. After the band, after the loss, after four albums — who do you become?

In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:

- Coming off the 2024 tour that sold over a million arena tickets "without a big smash hit of the show"

- The twelve-week Southeast Asia backpacking trip that came right before "This Town"

- The story of songs like 'Heaven', 'Slow Hands', 'This Town', and Liam's song...

- Pushing One Direction's sound from "What Makes You Beautiful" toward "Story Of My Life"

- Going solo at twenty-three and being terrified the music was about to end

- Julian Bunetta's intervention on "End Of An Era": "this song is about Liam, we just don't know it yet"

- "Dinner Party," the new album, and the next world tour

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association. Your support means the world to us.

0:00 Intro

1:12 Straight back to the studio after the 2024 arena tour

2:13 Over a million tickets sold in 2024 — "and I just wasn't expecting it"

3:23 Meeting on the One Direction tour years ago — abandoned buildings, makeshift studios, 200 fans outside within the hour

5:46 The post-show ritual: shower, shorts, Netflix, no drinking

9:20 Concerts as events now — the fans build it before he arrives

10:08 "I grew up on Slow Hands" — Sombr and the new guard

14:34 Why the Irish footprint is so big — and why Irish men can't say it out loud

17:16 First concert was the Eagles at four — and his mom's Hotel California vinyl

18:44 How Niall's listening drove One Direction's sound toward "Story Of My Life"

24:58 Savan Kotecha asks: sticking to your guns when every era says chase the trend

27:43 "I don't think I'd be able to sell something else that doesn't come from me"

34:34 Going solo at twenty-three — and being terrified it was all going to end

35:32 How watching the other boys release first actually fired him up

40:05 "You can't chase Slow Hands" — the law Niall heard John Ryan name on this podcast

45:15 Why he went backpacking through Vietnam, Cambodia, Thailand and the Philippines after the band

46:39 Why Slow Hands taking twenty weeks to #1 was actually the goal

56:11 "The minute you think you're a household name, it's game over"

57:03 What The Voice actually did to his crowd

66:55 "Heartbreak Weather" — wanting to be the song that stands out, even at the cost of being safe

75:09 Writing Heaven at 1am in Joshua Tree — and John Ryan about to walk away

80:53 Liam Payne, and the song that wrote itself in five minutes once Julian said the thing nobody was saying

89:02 The lowest moment of his career — and it's not what you'd guess

93:36 The waterfall effect — the people you surround yourself with

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Edited by Jad Saad

Post-Production VFX by Pratik Karki

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is a Grammy Producer of the Year who's tied with Babyface for the only three-in-a-row run in the award's history — and whose real story isn't the trophies, the radio, or the run of hits. It's the decision he makes once every few years that almost no other producer at his level makes: which artist he'll spend the next decade building.

From frontman of touring indie band Steel Train to one of the most decorated producers of his generation, he built his career against almost every modern industry instinct.

This is one of the more honest conversations about what it actually takes to bet a decade of your career on one person. When you're quietly refusing the industry's playbook from inside the room — who do you become?

And The Writer Is... Jack Antonoff!

In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:

• The importance of finding your people

• Why "Album is God" — and what a single actually is

• The Sabrina Carpenter origin: a random run-in two weeks after a Bleachers show

• "Workaholics aren't disciplined. They're sad." — why he refuses all-nighters

• The "Getaway Car" bridge moment Taylor's documentary caught in real time

• 5 voices that feel like 100 — the "Please Please Please" vocal stack walkthrough

• The artists he's passed on who became stars — and why he doesn't regret it

• Why he writes his best on instruments he doesn't understand

And much more...

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers Association. Your support means the world to us.

And @splice — the best sample library on the market. Period.

CHAPTER TIMESTAMPS

0:00 Intro

1:10 Ross gave Jack his first co-writing session

2:42 The myth and folklore of the LA writing scene

8:02 "There's no proof more sessions makes you better"

10:08 What gives energy vs. what takes it

13:12 Body-of-work first, not single first

16:48 "Album is God. Singles are a long hallway to nothing."

17:58 The hit-song tour that sold 12 tickets

19:17 Sabrina, Chappell, Charli — the only lesson from artist development

22:35 Working with artists who already have the vision

23:33 Amy asks: how do you make something timeless?

25:40 Album tracks are like movie scenes — "Scarface doesn't fit in The Holiday"

26:55 How the sonic palette emerges (Mastermind, Tulsa Jesus Freak)

31:43 Bleachers — letting the band teeter

33:22 "I write my best on what I understand the least"

37:47 "Workaholics aren't disciplined. They're sad."

40:18 The "Getaway Car" bridge moment Taylor's documentary caught

41:28 Keeping it small even when the artist is the biggest in the world

44:24 Writing for yourself is how you reach more people

48:48 "Geniuses finish things"

52:01 Why he protects his circle from outside voices

54:37 What Producer of the Year three years in a row actually means

56:36 The producers Jack steals from (Jeff Lynne, Sam Dew)

61:17 5 voices that feel like 100 — "Please Please Please" stack walkthrough

64:10 Dyslexic, Adderall, the VS 840 zip-disk teen years

68:13 Authenticity is the only currency that lasts

68:57 When their song "March" became a MeToo women's marches anthem

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Edited by Jad Saad

Post-Production VFX by Pratik Karki

Watercolor by Michael White

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is a multi-instrumentalist, music educator, interviewer, producer, and songwriter. He is also one of the most influential independent music voices online. His real story isn't the channel he built after a 90-second video of his son's perfect pitch hit 80 million views overnight, it's his incredible value to the music community and the conversations he sparks online about the state of the music industry and his conversations with some of the biggest creators within it's orbit.

This is one of the more unflinching conversations we've had about what's actually happening to music. Two musicians from different generations of the same fight, working it out in real time. Where do you stand when the rules of the music industry keep changing under your feet?

And The Writer Is... Rick Beato!

In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:

• How getting dropped in 1999 built a YouTube empire 16 years later
• Why Ringo would be a co-writer of every Beatles song in 2026
• The Eli Mercer experiment: building a fully fake AI artist with Claude — and what happened when he uploaded it
• The NPR EDM stunt: 4 million monthly Spotify listeners, 6,300 followers, and what that math says about AI
• The 90-second video of his son's perfect pitch that hit 3 million views by 10pm and 80 million total
• "There's no two current artists with the gravity of Bob Dylan and Stevie Wonder" — and Ross's case for their modern counterparts
• Who is the Michael Jordan of pop music? Queen at 3 billion streams enters the chat
• Why Ross is still bullish on songwriting — and what the Music Modernization Act got right that the No Fakes Act needs to finish

And much more...

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers Association. Your support means the world to us.

Chapters

0:00 Intro

2:14 The beginning of Rick Beato's music career

3:11 The rollercoaster of an early music career

5:32 The Napster era and the dawn of digital recording

9:16 Producing Shinedown — and how "Simple Man" became the hit

10:54 Why "Yellow Ledbetter" was a B-side — and why bonus tracks are back

12:48 What country radio still gets right about hits

14:54 Inside Nashville sessions and the number triangle

17:28 The future of AI in music — and the No Fakes Act

21:20 The future of prompting and curating music

23:54 Would The Beatles be a four-way publishing split in 2026?

25:39 The modern music economy: are album tracks worthless now?

27:58 American writers are chasing global stars now

34:30 The Eli Mercer experiment: a fake artist built with Claude

36:52 The NPR EDM stunt and what it proved about AI on Spotify

41:18 4M monthly listeners. 6,300 followers. AI is winning the algorithm.

42:58 How Rick Beato built a YouTube empire

45:22 The "What Makes This Song Great" era

51:49 1984 vs now — and the search for a modern Bob Dylan and Stevie Wonder

54:18 Who is the Michael Jordan of pop music?

55:51 Queen at 3 billion streams — what counts as "biggest"

1:00:28 Golden, Blinding Lights, and what makes a 2020s standard

1:06:53 Songwriter similarities and the lawsuits that never happened

1:09:42 "Best era of pop music. Am I wrong?"

1:13:56 1998: how Clear Channel and Cumulus consolidated radio

1:20:14 The Music Modernization Act and what's actually next

1:24:54 Is the future of songwriting still bullish?

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Edited by Jad Saad

Post-Production VFX by Pratik Karki

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is a prolific producer behind Sicko Mode, Broccoli, Bad at Love, Kiss Me More, Laugh Now Cry Later, First Class, and APT. — but whose real story isn't the catalog. It's how most of those songs happened by accident.

A classically trained concert pianist who spent his teens grinding through Liszt and Prokofiev knuckle-busters, Rogét quietly became one of the most important producers in modern pop and hip-hop — and almost none of it happened the way he planned.

This is one of the more honest conversations about what mastery is actually for — what happens when a decade of preparation collides with a 9pm pull-up, a stock preset, and a flute sound turned on by accident. When the world keeps rewarding your simplest moves, who do you become?

And The Writer Is... Rogét Chahayed!

In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:

Years of grinding Liszt and Prokofiev — and a first big check from four major triads on a flute

The three-week run in 2016 that produced Broccoli, Skywalker, Bad at Love, and the seed of Sicko Mode

The Mr. Miyagi era under Doctor Dre's right-hand man — and a pajama meeting at Dre's hidden studio

Sicko Mode — made on a stock preset in a closet-sized vocal booth — and the moment he heard it open Astroworld

Kiss Me More — a 2-5-1 with a walk-down — and what jazz school actually trained him to do

Co-executive producing Jack Harlow's album from 4pm to 4am for a year — and how First Class came together

APT. — the song he forgot about until Bruno Mars mentioned it at a friend's barbecue

And much more...

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association. Your support means the world to us.

Chapters

0:00 Intro

2:12 "How does a classical pianist come up with the chords for Broccoli? By turning the keyboard on."

4:24 The 9pm Yachty pull-up and the original Korg stock piano

6:35 Hearing his flute everywhere — Macklemore, Drake's Portland

7:50 The early break that taught him how the music business actually works

13:39 "I believe in the good of the business — we can be the generation that watches each other's backs"

15:59 Lebanese father, Argentine mother, and a meet-cute at a gas station

17:00 Why his dad named him Rogét

19:35 Discovering jazz at 15 and the chord that opened the world up

24:14 College, hip-hop, and reading liner notes for Scott Storch and Ryan Leslie

33:30 Telling Eastern parents he was leaving Juilliard-track for hip-hop

37:03 Getting kicked out, teaching 25 piano students a week to survive

41:45 The Mr. Miyagi era — Mel-Man, strip-club errands, and getting hazed

46:17 The pajama meeting at Doctor Dre's hidden studio

50:08 His Lebanese dad hearing Broccoli on the radio

52:17 NMPA

54:36 Bad at Love — the beat he made and forgot

57:50 What is a songwriter? Rogét's answer

1:01:28 Skywalker, Hit-Boy, and the arpeggios that became the splish

1:04:00 Sicko Mode: a stock preset, a closet-sized vocal booth, and Travis pulling up

1:07:08 "Drake comes in and says 'Astro' and I lost it"

1:14:23 Laugh Now, Cry Later: a Big Sean intro session to a Drake single in a month

1:18:15 Kiss Me More: "the perfect riff" — a 2-5-1 with a walk-down, sped up

1:23:15 "Genius comes out of editing" — Miles vs. Dizzy and what jazz actually trains

1:24:54 First Class and a year co-EPing Jack Harlow's album from 4pm to 4am

1:30:39 APT. — the song he forgot until Bruno mentioned it at a barbecue

1:36:04 What he'd tell a 16-year-old version of himself in the Valley right now

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London and Jad Saad

Edit by Jad Saad

Post Production VFX by Pratik Karki

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Every week, And the Writer Is brings you the most important news moving through the music industry — straight, sharp, and no fluff. This week Ross Golan opens the weekly And The Writer Is… news update (week of April 20, 2026) by highlighting major chart wins:

• Swimf by BTS is #1 on the Global 200 for a fourth week
• Choose In Texas by Ella Langley holds #1 on the Billboard Hot 100 for a seventh week
• Her album Dandelion debuted at #1 on the Billboard 200

He teases an upcoming Stagecoach interview and notes a strong country music moment.

New music + industry highlights:

• Olivia Rodrigo dropped a new single Drop Dead, debuting at #1 on Spotify charts, co-written/produced by Dan Nigro
• The podcast re-released Dan Nigro’s episode to celebrate

Business + industry news:

• Paul Epworth sold his catalog for a massive (undisclosed) amount
• Streaming platform Deezer is now receiving 75,000 AI-generated tracks per day (44% of uploads), raising concerns about “AI slop”
• Splice introduced a new AI tool that pays sample creators, which Ross praises

Other updates:

• Massive Attack signed a new deal banning certain rules (brief mention)
• Miranda Lambert signed with MCA Nashville, signaling a major upcoming era

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is the Grammy Producer of the Year who built the two biggest pop breakthroughs of the last five years back to back — and whose real story isn't about the hits. It's about the three years he spent making nothing and the rule he wants every producer in the game to understand.

From indie rock frontman in As Tall As Lions to pop's most trusted collaborator, Dan built his career against almost every industry instinct. He carries three things at once that most producers never figure out how to hold: the commercial ear of someone who's had back-to-back Grammy runs with Olivia Rodrigo, the patience of a craftsman who sat on "Good Luck, Babe" for 18 months before it ever left his hard drive, and the conviction to say no — to every rushed demo, every session hop, every label note that doesn't serve the artist.

This is one of the more honest conversations about what it actually takes to build a superstar.

And The Writer Is... Dan Nigro!

In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:

• The three years he spent making nothing — and what finally broke it

• Why getting Chappell dropped from Atlantic was "the greatest thing that ever happened"

• "We're building like an icon here" — the real work behind Chappell Roan's rise

• Why Dan refuses to send demos

• 20 days with one artist, not 20 sessions with twenty

• Meeting Dua Lipa in 2014 — "this girl is a superstar"

• Artist development, finding your lane

• Writing good songs sucks — and why that's fine

And much more...

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishing Association. Your support means the world to us.

And @splice — the best sample library on the market. Period.

Chapter timestamps:

0:00 Intro

3:01 Why Atlantic dropping Chappell was "the greatest thing that ever happened"

4:16 Atlantic's note: cut one of the Pink Pony Club guitar solos

8:20 Self-releasing Karma, Naked in Manhattan, and building a label with Island

11:33 "We're building like an icon here" — Bowie, Madonna, the Chappell blueprint

13:13 What makes somebody "have it" — the gut call you can't fake

17:21 "There are no more superstars" — the article that pissed Dan off

19:34 20 days with one artist, not 20 sessions with twenty

21:27 Good Luck Babe's million rewrites — the "Good Luck Jane" era

22:59 Why Dan refuses to send demos — ever

24:54 18 months on the hard drive

26:01 Justin Tranter asks: how do you have the confidence to dive that deep?

28:04 Three years. Ended up with nothing.

33:12 The Madonna model — outside songs, finding your lane

43:21 Taking five months off after Olivia and Chappell

46:41 Steph Jones asks: rituals, guilty pleasures, happy accidents

51:43 Amy Allen asks: has your feeling ever been wrong?

52:58 "The most egotistical thing I've ever said" — never wrong about an artist

53:20 Meeting Dua Lipa in 2014 — "this girl is a superstar"

55:55 Vampire — and the label that thought it was "three songs in one"

62:39 People need to take more risks

63:37 Writing good songs sucks — and why that's fine

68:21 Five for five — As Tall As Lions, Sour, Guts, Amusement Records

70:31 The second-album mountain

72:58 Playing Olivia and Chappell for his daughter

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Edited by Jad Saad

Post-Production VFX by Pratik Karki

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Every week, And the Writer Is brings you the most important news moving through the music industry — straight, sharp, and no fluff. This week: a jury ruled Live Nation and Ticketmaster violated antitrust laws and operate as illegal monopolies, with a judge now weighing whether to force a breakup or sale. Max Lousada and Julie Greenwald — the A&R legends behind Warner's modern run — launched a new long-term international label with Sony Music investment and distribution. And Udio signed a licensing deal with Kobalt, becoming one of the first AI companies actually paying creatives for training on their work. Plus: D4vd arrested on murder charges and dropped by Interscope, Foster the People ink a new deal, and Ella Langley's "Choosin' Texas" holds the #1 song. Follow us on socials and don't miss our new episodes every Tuesday — the hottest conversations in music, with the people making it.

This week:

• Jury finds Live Nation and Ticketmaster violated antitrust laws — a judge will now decide whether to break them up
• Max Lousada and Julie Greenwald launch a new international label with Sony Music
• Udio signs a licensing deal with Kobalt — the first real AI-pays-creatives move of the cycle
• D4vd arrested on murder charges; Interscope removes him from their roster
• Foster the People sign a new deal
• Ella Langley's "Choosin' Texas" remains #1 song of the week
• Ross previews live episodes coming from Stagecoach and the week's Billy Corgan drop

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is the architect of alternative rock who sold 30 million albums and defined the sound of an entire generation — but whose real story begins after the hits stopped mattering to him.

From the suburbs of Chicago to the apex of 90s mainstream success, Billy Corgan built an empire. Then he spent the last 20 years quietly dismantling the idea that commercial success is the same thing as real value. He carries three things simultaneously that most artists never figure out how to hold at once: the ambition of someone who was never going to settle for the midwest, the technical genius of a classically-trained musician who produces every layer of his own work, and the philosophical rigor of someone willing to completely reimagine what success actually means.

This is one of the more unflinching conversations about what staying relevant actually costs — not the version that gets posted on socials, the version that gets lived in the real decisions you make about art, money, independence, and how you want to spend your time. When the gatekeepers are gone and nobody's controlling the narrative anymore, who do you become?

And The Writer Is... Billy Corgan!

In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:

• The trap of being defined by your greatest hits — and why he refuses it

• His father's failed music career, and the moment his dad finally understood

• Chicago's inward-facing indie scene and the cost of communities that don't believe in themselves

• How the value of artists gets assessed in rooms — and why that's broken

• What "influence" actually means vs. commercial success

• The gatekeepers are gone — what that really means for independent artists

• Owning 100% of your publishing and why that changes everything

• Building a new world where direct artist support is how things actually work

• Why legacy thinking is changing, and what comes next

And much more...

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishing Association. Your support means the world to us.

And @splice — the best sample library on the market. Period.

Chapter timestamps:

0:00 Intro

2:30 Why Billy doesn't prefer to talk about his hits, and how his legacy has adjusted

5:00 Dad's bitterness: you got lucky

6:30 Dad's realization "You're one of the best songwriters in the world"

8:00 Independent music, 'selling out', and Chicago's music scene

10:30 The touring economics of the 90's

13:15 Rigged charts and the beginning of Pop music

16:00 Representation of Rock music in the charts / award shows

19:30 Ross on the future of music in a digital world

20:30 Numbers mean nothing if no one gives a sh*t.

21:00 Pop vs Rock: The future of music

28:30 Women archetypes in music

38:21 Billy's advice: What you need to survive in the music industry

40:00 World building and songwriting advice

43:31 How to define your value as an artist in a commercial world

44:40 Billy's Batman story

49:00 Breaking 'Landmine' because of Courtney Love

51:50 How he meets Courtney Love

54:08 How he learned to play guitar

57:00 His guitar hero inspiration…

1:01:10 Meeting the band

1:03:20 Finding a world class drummer hiding in plain sight

1:07:05 Fighting for his band when no one believed in them

1:15:29 Keeping your mouth shut when it's not your session

1:16:02 Fight for your copyright. The band struggling with his sole writing credit

1:18:00 AI in music… and Billy's take on it

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Edited by Jad Saad

Post-Production VFX by Pratik Karki

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Every week, And the Writer Is brings you the most important news moving through the music industry — straight, sharp, and no fluff. This week: Maryland just passed the RAP Act, making it illegal to use rap lyrics as courtroom evidence, potentially setting the stage for federal law. Suno's licensing negotiations with Sony and Universal have stalled, leaving major AI royalty questions unresolved. And Pershing Square submitted a $64 billion bid for Universal Music Group, revealing just how undervalued the music industry is to outside investors. Plus: Ticketmaster's face value integration, HYBE's new Indian girl group audition, and moves at Warner. Follow us on socials and don't miss our new episodes every Tuesday — the hottest conversations in music, with the people making it.

This week:

• Maryland passes the RAP Act — rap lyrics can no longer be used as courtroom evidence
• Pershing Square submits a $64B bid for Universal Music Group
• Suno's licensing talks with Sony and Universal stall over AI royalties
• Ticketmaster partners with Cash or Trade on face value resale integration
• HYBE auditions for a new Indian girl group as Asian streaming dominance grows
• Myles Gersh promoted at Warner — the exec who signed Zach Bryan
• Taylor Swift resigns with Warner Chappell
• Lasso signs to Interscope Records

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Today's guest is the Irish troubadour who sold out arenas across the world and built one of the most durable careers in modern music, entirely on his own terms.

From Dublin street corners and busking for strangers to headlining Madison Square Garden, this conversation is about what that actually costs to build the slow, deliberate construction of a career that answers to no one, yet resonates with millions around the world.

He carries three things simultaneously that most artists never figure out how to hold at once: the ambition of someone who was never going to settle for Ireland only, the sensitivity of a songwriter who writes for his whole community, and the creative instincts of a kid who grew up on hip hop and folk and refused to let either one fully win.

This is one of the more honest conversations about what a creative life actually looks like from the inside — not the version that gets posted, the version that gets lived.

And The Writer Is... Dermot Kennedy!

In this episode of And The Writer Is...

We go deep on:

• His whole journey

• The moment he realized the audience could feel how hard he was trying — and why that was the problem • How to carry ambition, sensitivity, and creative instinct in the same body without one of them destroying the other

• Building an international career without a viral hit — and what that reveals about how the industry actually works

• The busking years, and the secrets for how he survived

• Why he deliberately toured smaller venues on his last run — and what that decision says about success

• Imposter syndrome, insecurity, and the reality of growing a career from 0-100.

And much more...

Hit subscribe and turn on notifications.

Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.

Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris

A special thank you to our sponsors...

Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishing Association. Your support means the world to us.

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Chapter timestamps:

0:00 Intro

3:30 The 3 Sides Every Creative Has to Balance

4:30 You Shouldn't Rinse Your Shows. It's a Sacred Thing.

5:00 What Dermot Beats Himself Up About On Stage

5:30 Anxiety After the Show Starts, Not Before

6:00 The Struggle of Being Lucky Enough to Have a Career

8:00 Childhood

9:00 "I Know I'm Good. But I Feel Very Insecure in Other Ways."

14:00 How Dermot Built a Career With No Algorithm and No Social Pressure

18:00 Why He Doesn't Play Music for People

19:19 How He Started Busking

20:15 Why Most People Couldn't Busk — and the Genius Who Changed Everything

21:00 The Importance of Branding When Selling Anything

22:00 How to Make Real Money Busking

26:00 How Dermot Built His Name and Started Playing Shows

29:00 Into the Music Business — and the Most Successful He's Ever Felt

31:00 Being Sought After and Avoiding Bad Record Deals

32:40 How to Build Out Your Team

36:00 A Note About Touring: Enjoy Where You're At

38:23 His Advice to His 15-Year-Old Self: Find Your Contentment

39:23 How Dermot Kennedy Built a Worldwide Fanbase

Credits:

Hosted by Ross Golan

Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad

Edited by Jad Saad

Post-Production VFX by Pratik Karki

Watercolor Art by Michael White

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.